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Only expressions. 2014-10-08T00:42:49Z pjb: (even if it's true that some expressions may return no value or undefined values). 2014-10-08T00:43:51Z pjb: What does r5rs say about if? http://www.schemers.org/Documents/Standards/R5RS/HTML/r5rs-Z-H-7.html#%_sec_4.1.5 2014-10-08T00:43:52Z rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/a5jafsk 2014-10-08T00:46:06Z cam: Ok, pjb, expressions then. 2014-10-08T00:51:37Z Beluki quit (Quit: Beluki) 2014-10-08T00:53:43Z pjb: This is important, because syntactically, you can use any expression for any subexpression. There is a lot of orthogonality. 2014-10-08T00:53:43Z pjb: This let you compose the expressions as you want. 2014-10-08T00:54:14Z pjb: For example, one exception is define, which can only appear at the toplevel or at the beginning of a . 2014-10-08T00:54:33Z pjb: (Common Lisp is much more orthogonal for that). 2014-10-08T01:01:52Z jlongster quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-10-08T01:06:10Z mario-goulart: A `define' form is not an expression. 2014-10-08T01:19:16Z omefire1 quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-10-08T01:36:39Z tobik quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-10-08T01:37:44Z tobik joined #scheme 2014-10-08T01:40:41Z omefire1 joined #scheme 2014-10-08T01:46:37Z davexunit joined #scheme 2014-10-08T01:47:47Z juanfra quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-10-08T01:49:11Z juanfra joined #scheme 2014-10-08T01:50:58Z hjolt joined #scheme 2014-10-08T02:09:47Z mutley89 quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-10-08T02:25:08Z hjolt quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-10-08T02:26:29Z jlongster joined #scheme 2014-10-08T02:28:53Z kongtomorrow joined #scheme 2014-10-08T02:31:00Z frkout_ joined #scheme 2014-10-08T02:31:33Z acarrico quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-10-08T02:34:05Z frkout quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-10-08T02:35:24Z kongtomorrow quit 2014-10-08T02:36:11Z kongtomorrow joined #scheme 2014-10-08T02:36:59Z davexunit quit (Quit: Later) 2014-10-08T02:56:08Z theseb joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:06:14Z hjolt joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:11:36Z hjolt quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2014-10-08T03:12:03Z kongtomorrow quit 2014-10-08T03:17:29Z arrdem is now known as caar 2014-10-08T03:17:47Z caar is now known as arrdem 2014-10-08T03:23:52Z oleo is now known as Guest34103 2014-10-08T03:24:10Z Guest34103 quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-10-08T03:25:29Z oleo__ joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:28:17Z b4283 joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:38:04Z zacts: hi 2014-10-08T03:38:23Z zacts: so (define ls-a '(cons 1 '(2 3))) 2014-10-08T03:38:31Z zacts: (define ls-b '(cons 1 '(2 3))) 2014-10-08T03:38:45Z zacts: (define ls-c ls-a) 2014-10-08T03:38:55Z zacts: (eq? ls-a ls-b) => #f 2014-10-08T03:39:04Z zacts: (eq? ls-a ls-c) => #t 2014-10-08T03:39:08Z zacts: hm.. 2014-10-08T03:39:36Z zacts: so ls-c is the same data object as ls-a, but ls-a is not the same data object as ls-b? 2014-10-08T03:39:54Z zacts: what are the implications of this? 2014-10-08T03:46:27Z yacks quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-10-08T03:49:02Z yacks joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:50:51Z hjolt joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:53:05Z theseb: zacts: your iphone may look exactly like my iphone but are they the SAME iphone? 2014-10-08T03:53:52Z theseb: zacts: there's a difference between comparing attributes and comparing *identities* 2014-10-08T03:59:01Z bhrgunatha joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:59:32Z chaotic_good joined #scheme 2014-10-08T03:59:46Z chaotic_good: ah but for a scheme of a better design 2014-10-08T04:03:35Z MichaelRaskin quit (Quit: MichaelRaskin) 2014-10-08T04:07:10Z bhrgunatha quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 32.0.3/20140925003805]) 2014-10-08T04:18:15Z cam: Why can't I use variables inside of a let, in the description of following variables? 2014-10-08T04:20:01Z jeapostrophe quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-10-08T04:30:37Z theseb quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-10-08T04:33:05Z mrTapir quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-10-08T04:33:09Z pjb: cam: your question, I don't understand. 2014-10-08T04:33:22Z pjb: cam: You can use variables inside a let. 2014-10-08T04:33:28Z pjb: (let ((x 42)) x) 2014-10-08T04:34:25Z turbofail: cam: let* is what you want 2014-10-08T04:35:39Z pjb: Ah, you meant you wanted to use variables in the initialization expression of the following variables defined in the same form. 2014-10-08T04:37:13Z kongtomorrow joined #scheme 2014-10-08T04:37:26Z Vutral joined #scheme 2014-10-08T04:37:47Z pjb: cam: http://www.schemers.org/Documents/Standards/R5RS/HTML/r5rs-Z-H-7.html#%_sec_4.2.2 2014-10-08T04:37:50Z rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/olbrbbh 2014-10-08T04:38:02Z pjb: cam: you should read the whole r5rs document. 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I won't even consider anything else but feel free to spell it out :) 2014-10-08T19:53:48Z _zacts_: brainf*ck 2014-10-08T19:53:52Z _zacts_: it was a joke 2014-10-08T19:54:16Z BW^-: mhm 2014-10-08T19:55:06Z BW^-: guys 2014-10-08T19:55:11Z BW^-: I have a calling for you: 2014-10-08T19:55:20Z BW^-: Go and write an excellent users' and implementors' guide to the macro systems 2014-10-08T19:55:21Z BW^-: all of them 2014-10-08T19:55:33Z BW^-: as I see it, that is the biggest single need the Scheme community at large has 2014-10-08T19:55:36Z BW^-: they're too undocumented 2014-10-08T19:55:53Z BW^-: sure there's the papers but those seeded the idea, they're not really users' or implementors' docs 2014-10-08T19:56:13Z amgarching joined #scheme 2014-10-08T19:57:03Z vanila: BW^-, I think the syntactic-closures paper is a really really good start 2014-10-08T19:58:33Z amgarchIn9 quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2014-10-08T20:00:44Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-10-08T20:01:18Z BW^-: vanila: yeah but there's more htan it 2014-10-08T20:01:37Z vanila: oh yeah definitely 2014-10-08T20:01:51Z vanila: I would appreciate resources on this too 2014-10-08T20:02:21Z vanila: Right now I just have syntactic-closures, I kind of see how you would do syntax-rules in terms of it but not 100% sure 2014-10-08T20:03:08Z BW^-: vanila: yeah then there's that R6RS system too.. 2014-10-08T20:03:10Z BW^-: how was it called 2014-10-08T20:03:27Z BW^-: it's like a bigger heavier variant of syntactic closures 2014-10-08T20:03:48Z BW^-: i mean, one reason you need a concise document describing all this stuff, is also in order to understand *why* you *don't* need it 2014-10-08T20:03:51Z vanila: There's a reference implementation of syntax-rules 2014-10-08T20:03:55Z BW^-: which is extremely important in decisionmaking and discussions 2014-10-08T20:03:56Z BW^-: discourses 2014-10-08T20:03:59Z vanila: but I have't totally understood it, just skimmed it 2014-10-08T20:04:04Z BW^-: which? 2014-10-08T20:04:59Z vanila: http://mumble.net/~campbell/darcs/riaxpander/ 2014-10-08T20:05:11Z BW^-: right. 2014-10-08T20:05:22Z guampa quit (Write error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-10-08T20:05:22Z civodul quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-10-08T20:05:23Z MouldyOldBones quit (Write error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-10-08T20:05:23Z kazimir42 quit (Write error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-10-08T20:06:24Z BW^-: vanila: what's that heavier one called? 2014-10-08T20:06:51Z joneshf-laptop joined #scheme 2014-10-08T20:07:31Z vanila: I don't know 2014-10-08T20:08:36Z davexunit quit (Quit: Later) 2014-10-08T20:09:36Z drdanmaku joined #scheme 2014-10-08T20:09:52Z wingo quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-10-08T20:11:11Z BW^-: ahh 2014-10-08T20:11:14Z BW^-: vanila: syntax-case! 2014-10-08T20:11:20Z BW^-: so 2014-10-08T20:11:27Z vanila: oh yeah 2014-10-08T20:11:35Z BW^-: the docs someone writes should be about define-macro , define-macro with alias, pattern macros, syntactic closures and syntax-case 2014-10-08T20:11:39Z BW^-: no less!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2014-10-08T20:11:54Z BW^-: and also have a discourse on the issues with implementing hybrid expanders. 2014-10-08T20:12:45Z gravicappa quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-10-08T20:13:42Z vanila: BW^-, an idea might be to get the papers scheme implementors have written and write from that 2014-10-08T20:17:42Z stamourv: BW^-: The best intro to macros, hands down: http://www.greghendershott.com/fear-of-macros/ 2014-10-08T20:18:22Z BW^-: vanila: yeah 2014-10-08T20:18:34Z BW^-: stamourv: ok thanks will have a check 2014-10-08T20:18:45Z BW^-: ok - thanks guys. gtg. 2014-10-08T20:19:12Z BW^-: stamourv: yeah that looks like the most comprehensive guide i've seen til now. 2014-10-08T20:20:26Z BW^- quit (Quit: Miranda IM! 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