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Yes. 16:20:56 No. 16:21:06 (Yes, that's correct. No, it's not inefficient.) 16:21:42 well, I guess you lose access to free variables if the internal definition isn't nested? 16:21:54 Yes. 16:22:53 (why isn't it inefficient? Is evaluation of procedure definitions fast?) 16:23:03 or is having access to free vars just considered superimportant? 16:23:15 well, I guess it *is* superimportant... 16:23:20 The definition happens, but that doesn't necessarily cost anything. For example, in (define (f x) (define (g) x) (g)), the compiler can reduce this to (define (f x) x) without changing the semantics. 16:23:57 o_o 16:24:42 it can reduce it to... the identity function? 16:24:49 Most internal procedures do not manifest in any costly way at run-time. For example, the procedure implied by (let ((x 5)) ...) -- that is, if you expand it to ((lambda (x) ...) 5) -- isn't going to cost extra memory for free variables (in any nontrivial Scheme implementation). 16:24:57 Sure, because that's what it is. 16:25:15 rudybot: eval (begin (define (f x) (define (g) x) (g)) (list (f 1) (f 'foo) (f "tommylommykins"))) 16:25:16 Riastradh: your sandbox is ready 16:25:16 Riastradh: ; Value: '(1 foo "tommylommykins") 16:25:32 Time for me to turn into a pumpkin now. 16:25:33 *poof* 16:25:51 jao [~jao@208.Red-193-153-230.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 16:25:54 -!- jao [~jao@208.Red-193-153-230.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:25:54 jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #scheme 16:26:11 oh 16:26:19 tommylommykins: A lot of compilers also perform lambda-lifting, which essentially turns internal definitions into top-level definitions that take what used to be their free variables as arguments. 16:26:20 *tommylommykins* misread the original definition of g 16:26:28 thanks though :) 16:26:49 so that's what lambda lifting is. 16:27:03 for the purposes of not having to reevaluate the inner proc definition each time? 16:27:12 I didn't bother to find out ever since I learned the term during last ICFP. :) 16:27:45 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has quit [Quit: MichaelRaskin] 16:27:51 tommylommykins: Mostly to be able to compiler it better. 16:27:58 s/compiler/compile/ 16:28:27 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 16:29:49 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:29:55 -!- fgudin [fgudin@odin.sdf-eu.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:31:13 -!- Cromulent [~Cromulent@cpc1-reig5-2-0-cust251.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 16:33:47 Riastradh: tommylommykins?! 16:34:43 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:35:59 *add^_* laughs at rudybot 16:36:17 maybe with? 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[~aaron@108-200-63-17.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 23:21:57 sethalve_ [~user@headache.hungry.com] has joined #scheme 23:25:13 -!- pierpa [~user@host111-221-dynamic.52-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:25:53 -!- sethalves [~user@headache.hungry.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:26:21 -!- sethalve_ is now known as sethalves 23:29:44 -!- BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@72.49.0.102] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:34:27 BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@72.49.0.102] has joined #scheme 23:35:05 I know it isn't complete yet, but does anyone know of any scheme implementations that is working to support rsr7? 23:36:06 Chibi, Chicken, Gambit, Sagittarius. 23:36:40 Thanks 23:37:03 I assume Kawa will adopt it too. 23:48:47 jcowan: you sure about gambit? that's good news to me. I have been following the mailing list and I hadn't read anything about it 23:51:50 also, r7rs-small is complete, right? modulo a few very minor details 23:52:31 (as in, more subtle than typical implementation deviations anyway) 23:53:15 -!- StephenS [~StephenS@xshellz/founder/StephenS] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:53:44 -!- ericmathison [~ericmathi@172-15-249-133.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:54:02 -!- mmc1 [~michal@j212142.upc-j.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:56:19 StephenS [~StephenS@premiumus.xshellz.com] has joined #scheme