00:13:59 eoin_ [~eoinmorga@99-150-244-106.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 00:16:11 Scheme/emacs newbie here, how can I configure my .emacs to autoindent scm files? Right now new-line just returns hard left. 00:23:56 -!- main [~main@aeom59.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:33:32 tab usualy intend according to the active mode 00:50:53 Gooder`` [~user@218.69.12.194] has joined #scheme 00:51:20 -!- eoin_ [~eoinmorga@99-150-244-106.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:54:57 -!- Gooder` [~user@45.155.200.192.client.dyn.strong-in144.as13926.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:00:15 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:11:27 -!- Triclops256|away is now known as Triclops256 01:11:36 Gooder``` [~user@218.69.12.194] has joined #scheme 01:11:48 -!- Gooder`` [~user@218.69.12.194] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:16:52 amitp [~amitp@c-24-23-138-160.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 01:33:28 -!- bipt [~bpt@cpe-173-095-170-102.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:40:53 -!- b4283 [~b4283@198.199.102.93] has quit [Ping timeout: 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15:24:49 gcartier [~gcartier@modemcable010.136-201-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 15:26:52 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-166-251.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:33:22 pierpa`` [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 15:34:37 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-166-251.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 15:40:04 walter|r [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 15:43:04 -!- walter [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:48:37 When can two numerically equal (`=') inexact numbers lead to different results when passed to any standard R5RS or R7RS-small/draft-9 function other than `eq?' ? 15:48:57 (Or any composition of these functions.) 15:50:28 Oh, maybe something with negative and positive zero. 15:50:40 jao [~jao@85.59.0.245] has joined #scheme 15:50:43 -!- jao [~jao@85.59.0.245] has quit [Changing host] 15:50:43 jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #scheme 15:55:37 pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 15:55:38 -!- ecloud_ [~quassel@cm-84.208.147.184.getinternet.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:55:57 -!- walter|r [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:57:25 ecloud_ [~quassel@cm-84.208.147.184.getinternet.no] has joined #scheme 16:00:21 -!- bjz [~brendanza@125.253.99.68] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 16:00:43 walter|r [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 16:04:19 rszeno [~rszeno@86.125.231.3] has joined #scheme 16:09:26 -!- jrapdx [~jrapdx@c-98-246-145-216.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:08 taylanub: did you mean eqv? 16:24:43 hmm, actually, that might not even make a difference to the issue I am thinking of 16:24:57 I did mean eqv?. 16:25:11 Er. 16:25:41 I did mean eq?. I know that eq? could differentiate two = numbers, but nothing else if they are =, except maybe if they are positive and negative zero and such. 16:26:16 well, eq? isn't defined at all on numbers 16:26:19 I think positive and negative zero are the leading example of two numbers that are = but can yield different results when passed as arguments to some functions. 16:26:31 Oh, well then that part of my question is redundant. 16:26:57 and eqv? uses the definition of = when both have the same exactness 16:27:08 Well, apparently not ... 16:28:10 My confusion arises from the standard saying that two inexact numbers are non-eqv? when "either they are not both NaN and are numerically unequal (in the sense of =), or they do not yield the same results (in the sense of eqv?) when passed as arguments to any other procedure that can be defined as a finite composition of Schemes standard arithmetic procedures which does not result in a NaN value." 16:28:29 anyway, IIRC the definition of = is that no numeric operation can distinguish them, though I'd need to check the standardsese 16:28:37 And I thought the second clause is redundant, but I think it is for negative and positive zero and possibly some similar corner-cases. 16:29:03 I think +0.0 and -0.0 are = even though they can yield different results when passed to some functions .. lemme check. 16:29:14 not that any of this matters in practice, since the standard is apparently a loose suggestion 16:31:41 It says 0.0 and -0.0 are non-eqv?, but doesn't seem to explicitly mention =. It says the one should listen to IEEE 754 though; does that one clarify the issue ? 16:32:10 Ah wait, found it. 16:32:40 Page 35, right column .. "They do not distinguish between inexact zero and inexact negative zero." 16:33:02 ("The" includes `=', among the less-/greater-than etc. functions.) 16:33:30 So that's it then, 0.0 and -0.0 are = but not eqv?. 16:33:45 yes 16:34:06 And Guile already does this, neat. 16:34:22 rudybot: (eqv? 1 1.0) 16:34:23 ijp: your sandbox is ready 16:34:24 ijp: ; Value: #f 16:34:26 Any idea if Guile will care for R7RS-small, by the way ? 16:34:37 don't know, don't care 16:34:55 You're so faithless. :P 16:35:10 experience is a hard, but thorough, teacher 16:43:53 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 16:47:02 miql [~miql@ip68-98-19-126.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #scheme 16:50:34 -!- yacks [~py@180.151.36.168] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:56:05 -!- hopfrog [~quassel@pool-108-39-216-117.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:57:10 -!- finnrobi_ is now known as finnrobi 17:11:15 youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 17:11:38 jrapdx [~jrapdx@c-98-246-145-216.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:14:24 LAMMJohnson [~ja@user-5af4385c.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #scheme 17:21:28 youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 17:23:03 -!- youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:25:36 -!- gcartier [~gcartier@modemcable010.136-201-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:29:37 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:31:54 some-dude [43ba8933@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.186.137.51] has joined #scheme 17:38:43 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 17:40:33 -!- jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:46:25 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:46:25 kobain [~kobian@unaffiliated/kobain] has joined #scheme 17:49:00 youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 17:51:05 -!- jeapostrophe [~jay@racket/jeapostrophe] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:52:40 youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 17:54:35 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:58:28 -!- youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:10:59 -!- newtothis [~chatzilla@77.127.4.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:16:13 przl [~przlrkt@p5B298250.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 18:20:06 trusktr [~trusktr@c-76-114-26-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 18:23:32 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-179-67.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 18:25:32 -!- ggherdov [uid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pjsuaoilxshjosju] has quit [K-Lined] 18:32:42 ggherdov [uid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wngpofmpwlxgjtiy] has joined #scheme 18:42:09 es917 [~es@pool-71-106-162-5.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 18:45:12 -!- some-dude [43ba8933@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.186.137.51] has left #scheme 18:50:13 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #scheme 18:51:37 -!- hiroakip [~hiroaki@77-20-192-229-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:57:02 eoin_ [~eoinmorga@99-150-244-106.lightspeed.sndgca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 18:59:52 Can anybody help me with this error? I can't figure out why the usual format for defining an expression doesn't work. http://pastebin.com/qup6qD4K 19:00:46 parenjitsu [~user@adsl-184-42-4-7.dab.bellsouth.net] has joined #scheme 19:01:31 can anyone recommend a (reasonably portable) pretty printer library? 19:06:58 eoin_: https://github.com/skeeto/brianscheme/blob/master/slib/genwrite.scm 19:08:01 sorry, that was meant for parenjitsu ;p 19:09:01 eoin_: extra parenthesis specifically at ((define (improve-gues y) ... 19:09:24 leppie: thanks! 19:11:51 -!- taylanub [tub@p4FD911F1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:12:20 taylanub [tub@p4FD91878.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 19:13:04 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:13:56 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 19:15:18 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-166-251.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 19:18:13 -!- ecloud_ [~quassel@cm-84.208.147.184.getinternet.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:19:24 ohhh i understand I think. The functions should be defined as closed sexp's before the body, and then they can be used within the body of the top level method itself 19:20:05 ecloud_ [~quassel@cm-84.208.147.184.getinternet.no] has joined #scheme 19:20:15 like that: (define (f x) (define (square x) (* x x) (square x)) 19:20:19 right? 19:20:24 eoin_: no, they are all part of the body 19:21:01 like (define (f x) (define (square x) (* x x)) (square x)) 19:22:19 so the body of a function can be more that one sexp? because (define (square x) (* x x)) is a closed list and (square x) is another closed list 19:22:33 eoin_: yes 19:23:05 ok thank you very much for your help, it's tough to find beginner resources for scheme... 19:23:42 eoin_, what do you use for learning? 19:24:19 I'm reading through SICP right now 19:26:40 and you feel confortable with it or seems hard to understand? 19:26:43 eoin_: good for you 19:27:56 -!- ggherdov [uid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wngpofmpwlxgjtiy] has quit [Changing host] 19:27:56 ggherdov [uid11402@unaffiliated/ggherdov] has joined #scheme 19:27:56 -!- ggherdov [uid11402@unaffiliated/ggherdov] has quit [Changing host] 19:27:56 ggherdov [uid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wngpofmpwlxgjtiy] has joined #scheme 19:27:58 eoin_: if you are experienced with other programming languages, reading the R5RS spec should be good 19:29:55 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B298250.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:32:50 I am 18 and working an internship where I use mainly java and some php, so its kind of hard to understand because its so different 19:34:24 in java i write out everything I want to do and then break it down chronologically, where as in lisp the applicative-order evaluation makes me think of it as a series of cascading returns 19:35:27 true to some extent 19:36:19 this is a list of books, http://community.schemewiki.org/?category-texts 19:38:36 i would probably use Teach-Yourself-Scheme, http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/dorai/t-y-scheme/t-y-scheme-Z-H-1.html#node_toc_start or HtDP, http://www.htdp.org/2003-09-26/Book/curriculum-Z-H-1.html#node_toc_start 19:38:37 http://tinyurl.com/yt27tq 19:39:37 are those better for learning the basics than SICP? 19:40:02 antono [~antono@shelr.tv] has joined #scheme 19:41:55 hard to say, imo depend of what you feel is easy to undersand from your point of view, 19:42:21 i will read the first ch. of HtDP and see if it clicks better with me and go from there 19:43:06 take a look to other one and try few untill you feel is ok, :) 19:43:52 also keep in mind that some books are old and some things are changes and depend of what scheme you use 19:44:06 s/changes/changed/ 19:44:20 i have the MIT implementation so its probably as close as it will get 19:45:11 -!- pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:45:11 -!- pierpa`` [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:45:53 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:46:09 pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 19:46:42 przl [~przlrkt@p5B298250.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 19:46:44 two more things, maybe you know but just in case each define can be distinct, you don't need to wrap them 19:52:00 second ou know, identation help a lot, probably not the best way to do it but i should indent your code like this http://f54476820c916adc.paste.se/ 19:52:11 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B298250.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:00:13 -!- ecloud_ [~quassel@cm-84.208.147.184.getinternet.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:01 -!- kuribas [~user@d54C430B0.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:07:50 przl 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