00:16:55 humasect [~humasect@d24-235-185-182.home1.cgocable.net] has joined #scheme 00:34:47 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-38-111.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:37:33 -!- humasect [~humasect@d24-235-185-182.home1.cgocable.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:41:19 -!- rostayob [~rostayob@host217-42-35-248.range217-42.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 01:03:00 drwho [~drwho@152-123-174-206.gci.net] has joined #scheme 01:18:30 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:18:57 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 01:20:39 -!- mister_m [~mattosaur@c-98-193-90-178.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:49:16 -!- kniu [~kniu@pool-71-182-240-4.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:52:56 dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:56:06 -!- masm [~masm@bl16-182-210.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:15:43 -!- copumpkin is now known as Ukdo 02:17:03 -!- Ukdo is now known as copumpkin 02:20:30 groovy2shoes [~cory@unaffiliated/groovebot] has joined #scheme 02:20:54 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [] 02:38:28 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-184.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 02:40:25 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-157-2.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:43:44 -!- groovy2shoes [~cory@unaffiliated/groovebot] has quit [Quit: It is now safe to turn off your groovebot.] 03:01:16 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:47:33 offby1: yes 03:53:38 -!- jao [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:53:49 bfgun [~b_fin_g@r190-135-6-238.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 03:57:23 -!- bfig [~b_fin_g@r190-135-30-142.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:04:59 -!- GoKhlaYeh [~GoKhlaYeh@135.51.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:11:00 "deanna" is a funny name for a cat; like "kevin" 04:12:10 What, you've got something against using "people" names for pets? 04:12:19 Perhaps it's a temporary condition, like Salem Saberhagen? 04:12:58 *cky* thinks about naming the next pet Eric in offby1's honour. :-) 04:13:58 Or name it Barak Hussein Obama, assuming he's been condemned to be a cat for 100 years :-) 04:14:17 Since when is being a cat a "condemnation"? 04:14:37 For witches and warlocks it is. 04:14:52 I see. 04:26:44 I wanted to name my cats Sam and Dean after the protagonists on Supernatural, but they're both girls so we went with Samara and Deanna. 04:29:48 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:29:49 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:31:44 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:37:45 -!- chumdicks is now known as pushp0p 04:55:06 ah 04:55:26 cats are more fun to name in pairs. I always wanted to name a pair of cats Mick and Keith. 04:55:45 The two neighbourcats that visit me now are named Pip and Frodo. 04:56:08 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:58:14 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #scheme 04:58:19 albert-sicp [~albert-si@adsl-71-156-44-252.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 05:00:59 tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has joined #scheme 05:18:20 -!- albert-sicp [~albert-si@adsl-71-156-44-252.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:27:05 :) 05:30:09 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:34:29 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-184.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 05:43:05 albert-sicp [~albert-si@71.156.44.252] has joined #scheme 05:50:19 -!- albert-sicp [~albert-si@71.156.44.252] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:04:48 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:09:42 albert-sicp [~albert-si@adsl-71-156-44-252.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 06:10:30 -!- jrslepak [~jrslepak@c-71-233-151-135.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:24:59 tupi [~david@189.119.153.154] has joined #scheme 06:25:38 -!- tupi [~david@189.119.153.154] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:30:19 kniu [~kniu@pool-71-182-240-4.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 06:41:10 jewel [~jewel@196-215-88-26.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 07:00:09 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:09:10 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 07:17:08 -!- albert-sicp [~albert-si@adsl-71-156-44-252.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:23:54 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-222-19.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 07:32:29 araujo [~araujo@190.73.44.29] has joined #scheme 07:32:38 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.44.29] has quit [Changing host] 07:32:38 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #scheme 07:33:38 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 08:24:09 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:35:13 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:44:08 good morning everyone 08:46:13 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:48:07 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 08:53:09 -!- woonie [~woonie@175.156.211.52] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:57:56 porco [~porco@125.33.80.199] has joined #scheme 09:03:39 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:05:11 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 09:06:08 dzhus [~sphinx@95-25-98-202.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 09:21:04 -!- 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[~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 10:08:07 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:10:06 -!- mmc1 [~michal@178-85-131-65.dynamic.upc.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:15:08 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:16:56 rostayob [~rostayob@host217-42-35-248.range217-42.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 10:17:02 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:21:15 yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 10:21:29 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:22:43 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:27:14 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:27:48 copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 10:27:54 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:28:36 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:33:42 mmc1 [~michal@178-85-131-65.dynamic.upc.nl] has joined #scheme 10:34:37 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:36:31 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:38:22 BW^- [~Miranda@pc2532.fiberlink.suceava.rdsnet.ro] has joined #scheme 10:39:21 what (in math in general or in scheme), what would you call a number that maybe starts with - , then has one or more digits (at least a 0), a dot, and then one or more more digits (at least a 0)? as a general word, internally it could get to be represented both by bignum and flonum, depending on the size 10:47:28 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:49:30 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 10:52:09 -!- hba [~hba@189.130.16.123] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:57:38 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:57:40 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:58:05 copumpkin 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[~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:36:37 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 14:37:26 -!- albert-sicp [~albert-si@adsl-71-156-44-252.dsl.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:40:56 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:41:49 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-88-26.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:44:32 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 14:54:25 jewel [~jewel@196.215.168.240] has joined #scheme 14:57:09 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:58:31 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 15:01:17 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@2.133.36.211] has joined #scheme 15:01:18 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@2.133.36.211] has quit [Changing host] 15:01:18 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #scheme 15:06:14 pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #scheme 15:07:29 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:09:24 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:10:31 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 15:10:45 leo2007 [~leo@222.130.137.80] has joined #scheme 15:21:29 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:21:49 -!- snizzo [~quassel@host108-45-dynamic.7-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:22:54 Is there a standard way of providing "internal" functions in the implementation, to assist the standard library? 15:23:17 E.g. I want to write a string->number and number->string by folding on a digit->number and number->digit function that will be internal 15:23:30 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 15:23:59 GoKhlaYeh [~GoKhlaYeh@135.51.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #scheme 15:25:41 porco [~porco@125.33.83.239] has joined #scheme 15:31:01 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 15:36:04 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:36:07 -!- BW^- [~Miranda@pc2532.fiberlink.suceava.rdsnet.ro] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 15:37:32 eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 15:37:39 -!- eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:37:39 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 15:40:48 untrusted [~user@stgt-5f71a857.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 15:46:00 scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-228-148-240.inter.net.il] has joined #scheme 15:49:43 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:52:06 eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 15:52:07 -!- eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:52:07 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 15:59:32 -!- bfgun [~b_fin_g@r190-135-6-238.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:04:36 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:05:33 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 16:08:43 bytbox [~s@129.2.129.226] has joined #scheme 16:08:45 HG` [~HG@dsbg-d9bb1b2c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 16:09:21 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-d9bb1b2c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:09:42 HG` [~HG@dsbg-d9bb1b2c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 16:11:43 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:12:19 bfgun [~b_fin_g@r190-135-35-185.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 16:13:26 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 16:14:45 Also, is it just me or is (list->string l) just (apply string l) ? 16:15:51 Seems so, yes. 16:16:15 (define (list->string l) (apply string l)) ; one less primitive to implement, N-1 to go! 16:16:30 Yah 16:19:38 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:21:26 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 16:27:21 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-191-127.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 16:27:22 -!- scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-228-148-240.inter.net.il] has left #scheme 16:32:53 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:34:27 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 16:35:53 ijp` [~user@host86-178-196-224.range86-178.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 16:36:01 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-191-127.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 16:36:48 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-d9bb1b2c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:37:49 -!- ijp [~user@host86-168-33-252.range86-168.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:40:14 choas [~lars@p4FDC57B5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 16:43:05 I'd implement it the other way: 16:43:14 (define (string . chars) (list->string chars)) 16:43:23 Yes, I was just thinking that. It'd avoid a call to apply. 16:43:28 *nods* 16:46:33 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:48:29 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 16:50:37 ijp`` [~user@host86-177-158-11.range86-177.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 16:52:04 -!- ijp`` is now known as ijp 16:52:09 -!- ijp` [~user@host86-178-196-224.range86-178.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:54:51 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:56:23 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:01:54 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:01:57 I quite like apply, though 17:02:09 It's a small implementation hack and still tail-calls for me :) 17:02:33 eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 17:02:38 -!- eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 17:02:38 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:03:26 Also I already implemented string natively 17:04:58 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:08:37 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:10:27 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:12:37 -!- untrusted [~user@stgt-5f71a857.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:14:09 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:15:37 -!- rostayob [~rostayob@host217-42-35-248.range217-42.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 17:19:30 -!- choas [~lars@p4FDC57B5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:21:22 LeoNerd: Does your apply handle, say, 2 million arguments? 17:22:59 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-210-191-79.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:23:26 rudybot: (define twomil (make-list 2000000 '())) 17:23:27 cky: your sandbox is ready 17:23:28 cky: Done. 17:23:35 rudybot: (apply append twomil) 17:23:36 cky: ; Value: () 17:23:40 Very nice. 17:23:44 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:24:10 rudybot: (car (make-list 2000000 ' ())) 17:24:11 *offby1: ; Value: () 17:24:14 *offby1* rubs chin 17:24:33 On Guile: 17:24:33 people keep pointing out functions that I didn't know about. Like "make-list" e.g. 17:24:35 scheme@(guile-user)> (define twomil (make-list 2000000 '())) 17:24:37 scheme@(guile-user)> (apply append twomil) 17:24:39 :2:0: In procedure #:2:0 ()>: 17:24:41 rudybot: (define list-1e6x1 (make-list 2000000 1)) 17:24:42 pjb: your r5rs sandbox is ready 17:24:42 pjb: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: make-list in module: 'program 17:24:53 :2:0: Throw to key `vm-error' with args `(vm-run "VM: Stack overflow" ())'. 17:24:57 rudybot: (apply + list-1e6x1) 17:24:58 pjb: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: list-1e6x1 in module: 'program 17:25:01 leppie [~lolcow@196-210-191-79.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 17:25:02 cky: surprising. 17:25:05 Does wingo know? 17:25:15 offby1: I think Guile is "designed that way". 17:25:25 pjb: you gotta "init" or "init racket" first, to get out of r5rs mode 17:25:30 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:25:32 offby1: Many Scheme implementations that call functions through the stack will blow up that way. 17:25:36 Ok, but I want to stay in r5rs. :-) 17:25:38 *the CPU stack 17:26:45 (define list-1e6x1 (make-list 2000000 1)) 17:26:49 rudybot: (define list-1e6x1 (make-list 2000000 1)) 17:26:51 cky: your sandbox is ready 17:26:51 cky: Done. 17:26:58 rudybot: (apply + list-1e6x1) 17:26:58 cky: ; Value: 2000000 17:27:01 Nice. 17:27:18 rudybot: (define million-man-march (make-list (expt 10 6) (cons "I'm a man" "and I'm marching"))) 17:27:19 *offby1: my linux console is 1280x1024 (same as X) and uses the terminus font (same as I use in my urxvts in X) 17:27:31 rudybot: I say, are you making fun of me? 17:27:31 *offby1: lol, was never a friend of it but the people in #clojure are telling me it's the way to go :P 17:27:43 *offby1* shakes head sadly 17:28:07 rudybot: eval (define million-man-march (make-list (expt 10 6) (cons "I'm a man" "and I'm marching"))) 17:28:07 *offby1: Done. 17:28:17 rudybot: (time (length million-man-march)) 17:28:17 *offby1: ; Value: 1000000 17:28:18 *offby1: ; stdout: "cpu time: 4 real time: 6 gc time: 0\n" 17:28:25 rudybot: (time (shuffle million-man-march)) 17:28:29 *offby1: error: with-limit: out of memory 17:28:33 *offby1* wanders off 17:29:38 -!- leo2007 [~leo@222.130.137.80] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.4.1] 17:30:29 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:30:30 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.200.45] has joined #scheme 17:30:33 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-210-191-79.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:34:49 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 17:35:05 leppie [~lolcow@196-210-191-79.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 17:38:13 -!- porco [~porco@125.33.83.239] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:39:54 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:40:37 Fun with Ruby (to see how the above code stacks up with other languages ;-)): 17:40:41 irb(main):001:0> def sum *items 17:40:43 irb(main):002:1> items.reduce(:+) 17:40:45 irb(main):003:1> end 17:40:47 => nil 17:40:49 irb(main):004:0> sum 1, 2, 3 17:40:51 => 6 17:40:53 irb(main):005:0> sum *1..2000000 17:40:55 Segmentation fault 17:41:33 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:48:04 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:49:14 Python survives a lot better: 17:49:16 >>> sum(*xrange(1, 2000000)) 17:49:18 1999999000000 17:49:27 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:51:02 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:54:44 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:55:03 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #scheme 17:55:41 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 17:56:44 asynchrony [~user@adsl-98-65-183-148.dab.bellsouth.net] has joined #scheme 17:57:44 is there ever a good reason to use (letrec ...) to bind non-procedures? 17:59:09 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:00:10 -!- bzzbzz_ [~franco@modemcable023.13-56-74.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:02:19 asynchrony: lazy recursive objects 18:03:21 rudybot: eval (require srfi/41) 18:03:21 ijp: your sandbox is ready 18:03:21 ijp: Done. 18:03:30 rudybot: eval (letrec ((s (stream-cons 1 s))) (stream->list (stream-take 10 s))) 18:03:30 ijp: ; Value: (1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1) 18:03:34 ijp: Isn't "lazy" still a procedure behind the scenes? :-P 18:03:44 depends how nitpicky you want to be 18:05:03 asynchrony: and if you're using a letrec already, there's no harm in using it for non functions at the same time 18:05:04 eh, stream-cons must be a macro, no? 18:05:08 choas [~lars@p4FDC57B5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 18:05:09 yes 18:05:27 so its still binding a plain old function :) 18:05:47 asynchrony: Exactly my point. :-) 18:06:29 well, the stream data structure itself isn't 18:07:09 but the promises in its fields are likely functions 18:08:12 tupi [~david@187.80.33.18] has joined #scheme 18:08:17 ok, circular objects then 18:08:18 the important bit is that it isn't evaluated immediately 18:08:24 I guess thats kind of compelling 18:08:43 https://gist.github.com/1746935 for a more complex example of recursive data 18:09:10 (assuming the example actually works, and I haven't made a fool of myself :) 18:09:28 its so much easier to write an IR that restricts letrec to functions 18:09:57 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:10:04 yes, hence the whole 'fixing letrec' thing 18:10:27 rudybot: help 18:10:27 ijp: bug ..., help [], version, quote, source, url, seen , uptime, init [], eval ..., give ..., apropos ..., desc , doc , later "tell" ... 18:10:52 damn, no google functionality 18:11:09 I need to write a bot that has Googling. 18:11:22 My home channel used to have such a bot, but it died a while ago. 18:11:27 So no more in-channel Google. :-( 18:11:44 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 18:11:45 rudybot: should we replace you with a scheme-enhanced fsbot? 18:11:45 ijp: we find coffee expensive in Greece too ;) 18:11:56 Adamant [~Adamant@71-22-233-28.gar.clearwire-wmx.net] has joined #scheme 18:11:57 -!- Adamant [~Adamant@71-22-233-28.gar.clearwire-wmx.net] has quit [Changing host] 18:11:57 Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has joined #scheme 18:12:37 ijp: I might just write a Guile IRC bot that initially provided seen, later tell, and google. 18:12:44 ijp: Then later, once I get sandboxing sorted out, eval too. 18:13:51 asynchrony: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.72.9024 18:14:25 ijp: Oooh! 18:14:28 *cky* must read that. 18:15:16 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #scheme 18:15:31 cky: don't make the mistake I made ... make it testable from the groun up 18:15:33 ground 18:15:35 *offby1* grumbles 18:15:54 rudybot is if I recall correctly the third major version -- I rewrote it twice -- and it's _still_ a pain in the ass to test 18:15:56 offby1: Thanks for the tip! I must bear that in mind. 18:16:09 -!- kniu [~kniu@pool-71-182-240-4.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:17:55 ijp: thanks! Ive been wanting to read this paper for two days now and didnt know it existed! 18:21:41 -!- tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:23:53 zmv [~zmv@186.204.150.191] has joined #scheme 18:27:10 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:28:48 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 18:33:32 CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-98-217.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #scheme 18:38:11 dnolen [~user@p72-0-226-202-static.acedsl.com] has joined #scheme 18:38:34 kniu [~kniu@pool-71-182-240-4.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 18:40:58 add^_ [~add^_^@m90-141-44-229.cust.tele2.se] has joined #scheme 18:40:59 jrslepak [~jrslepak@c-71-233-151-135.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 18:41:57 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:43:50 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 18:46:27 aune_ [~Arne@h-152-28.a163.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #scheme 18:48:26 -!- aune_ [~Arne@h-152-28.a163.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Client Quit] 19:00:24 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:01:55 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 19:07:49 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:08:34 -!- CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-98-217.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:09:51 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 19:12:08 -!- asynchrony [~user@adsl-98-65-183-148.dab.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:13:00 tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has joined #scheme 19:15:43 -!- bfgun is now known as bfig 19:16:27 -!- Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has quit [Quit: Adamant] 19:22:35 CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-98-217.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #scheme 19:24:03 -!- tupi [~david@187.80.33.18] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:29:00 -!- zmv is now known as ed_is_better 19:29:11 -!- ed_is_better is now known as zmv 19:30:08 -!- zmv is now known as notzmv 19:48:34 -!- asumu [~at@2001:470:b:b7:1e6f:65ff:fe23:c3d4] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 19:49:31 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:51:19 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 19:55:00 asumu [~at@2001:470:b:b7:1e6f:65ff:fe23:c3d4] has joined #scheme 20:03:44 -!- pygospa [~Pygosceli@kiel-5f77bc00.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 20:03:53 pygospa [~Pygosceli@kiel-5f77b2ca.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 20:07:30 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:10:09 -!- jewel [~jewel@196.215.168.240] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:13:40 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:14:25 -!- tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:15:32 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 20:21:41 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:23:27 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 20:26:16 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-191-127.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:27:21 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-210-223.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 20:29:09 rostayob [~rostayob@02d99acf.bb.sky.com] has joined #scheme 20:32:00 copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 20:42:35 Gosh, some people are picky! :-P http://stackoverflow.com/a/9152623/13 20:43:22 (They want to implement arbitrary-level c[ad]+r without having to use an outer wrapping macro.) 20:44:31 Ohoho... you can put inner defines in a define-syntax like that? :) 20:49:07 Yes. 20:49:08 why the hell do people want that anyway? 20:49:50 ijp: I have no idea. 20:49:59 But it's written now. And the OP still isn't happy. Stuff them. :-P 20:50:19 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:50:46 Beyond about cadddr it's usually nicer to use list-ref anyway, I think. Saves you having to count how many 'd's there are 20:50:50 ijp: At least it gave me a little practice at writing macros. :-P 20:50:55 LeoNerd: Indeed. 20:51:10 And if your data structure is such that it requires you to cadddadaadr then perhaps you should write a named accessor? :) 20:51:42 cadddadaadr.. jesus. 20:52:04 ((c a 2d a d 2a d r) sexp) 20:52:13 ((c a 2 d a d 2 a d r) sexp) ;I mean 20:52:13 -!- pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:52:20 Hehe 20:52:24 Hahahahaha. 20:52:47 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #scheme 20:52:55 If you (define a car) (define d cdr) (define (r x) x), you can even give a functional definition of c. 20:53:50 Indeed. 20:54:13 rudybot: (define a car) (define d cdr) (define (r x) x) 20:54:13 pjb: first off, i'm reading about john mccarthy's paper via paul graham, he mentions 7 primitive operations: ... quote, atom, eq, car, cdr, cons and cond ... yet wikipedia for scheme under the heading "minimalism" says Fundamental forms: define, lambda, if, quote, unquote, unquote-splicing, quasiquote, define-syntax, let-syntax, letrec-syntax, syntax-rules, set! 20:54:20 rudybot: (define a car) 20:54:20 pjb: your r5rs sandbox is ready 20:54:20 pjb: Done. 20:54:25 rudybot: (define d cdr) 20:54:26 pjb: Done. 20:54:30 rudybot: (define (r x) x) 20:54:30 pjb: Done. 20:55:12 BTW, is it usual to have an (the?) identity function somewhere handy? I quite often find a need for (define (id x) x) 20:55:16 which is what I usually call it 20:56:40 you can just use values, though I prefer to have an 'id' myself 20:56:45 values? 20:56:57 rudybot: eval (map values '(0 1 2 3)) 20:56:57 ijp: ; Value: (0 1 2 3) 20:57:16 Hrmmmm 20:57:50 LeoNerd: (define (values . x) (call-with-current-continuations (lambda (k) (apply k x)))) 20:57:58 Oh... so... I do'nt have 'values' or 'call-with-values' yet... 20:58:00 *call-with-current-continuation 20:58:15 Been thinking about them. How does it interact with "regular" function calls? 20:58:23 LeoNerd: Exactly the same way. 20:58:29 I'm quite used to the idea of list-returning functions.. Perl has those. 20:58:39 rudybot: (define (c . op) (cond ((null? (cdr op)) (car op)) ((integer? (car op)) (if (< (car op) 1) (apply c (cddr op)) (lambda (x) ((cadr op) ((apply c (cons (- (car op) 1) (cdr op))) x))))) (else (lambda (x) ((car op) ((apply c (cdr op)) x)))))) 20:58:39 pjb: Done. 20:58:40 LeoNerd: MV != lists. 20:58:44 rudybot: ((c a 2 d r) '(1 2 3 4)) 20:58:45 pjb: ; Value: 3 20:59:02 LeoNerd: Returning a list is still returning a single value; MV is returning arbitrary numbers of values. :-) 20:59:05 cky: Yah.. I mean "Perl's idea of" list-returning functions. Functions that just return multiple values. 20:59:08 Yes 20:59:09 LeoNerd: I would (define identity (lambda (x) x)) 20:59:15 LeoNerd: Right. 20:59:38 But what happens if caller and callee disagree on the 'values' idea.. 20:59:51 Does a lack of "values" just appear as one value? 20:59:53 some people do disagree with the whole multiple values concept 21:00:21 yes, x == (values x) 21:01:18 And vice-versa.. do the additional values get lost? 21:01:49 what happens when there is a conflict between the number returned and expected is implementation specific 21:01:54 Righty 21:02:17 dropping additional values or adding extra nils is the CL approach 21:02:25 quite a few scheme's also do this 21:02:35 s/e's/es/ 21:02:39 Not quite worked out how I'll implement that 21:02:47 I suppose I -cooould- just implement it as a perl list return 21:05:19 But then that'll get annoying when I get around to doing continuations. Hrm.. :/ 21:06:09 -!- woonie [~woonie@nusnet-184-66.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:07:09 I'd leave it till after you've implemented continuations 21:07:19 Yeah.. that sounds easiest 21:07:59 rudybot: no work is good work 21:07:59 ijp: I never did understand sci-fi interfaces where things are moving all over the screens like crazy. How exactly do you do any useful work like that? 21:08:39 hmm, that didn't come out quite like it sounded in my head 21:10:58 '(no work) is (good work)' will have to suffice 21:11:09 You never see people really working in movies. 21:11:35 For example, when you see programmers, they're not working, they're having sex or dancing with heavy music. 21:11:44 And magically, the program is done when they're finished. 21:12:07 nuu.. they build the source code off camera, and then compile it while they are banging 21:12:08 works for me 21:12:21 cause you never see a gui program in a movie 21:12:22 *ijp* wishes 21:12:22 ^. 21:12:33 heh. 21:13:07 In a non-Hollywood movie, you'd see a bug, a programmer finding it, correcting it, recompiling and running the debugged program. 21:13:35 Perhaps the tracking of a hard bug would take the whole movie. 21:14:08 We could make a thriller out of bugzilla ! :-) 21:15:34 "With 24 hours to go before release day, only one man can fix the threading issues in time" 21:16:20 *ijp* starts ringing up D list celebrities who need the money 21:16:48 And there could be a market for derived products: CDs with the buggy software, programmer t-shirts, etc. 21:17:33 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:21:11 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:39:25 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has left #scheme 21:44:30 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:53:29 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:02:00 -!- notzmv is now known as zmv 22:05:29 YokYok [~david@AClermont-Ferrand-651-1-203-234.w83-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 22:11:16 doodle77 [~doodle77@user-12ld96f.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #scheme 22:13:49 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-222-19.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:19:09 -!- mmc1 [~michal@178-85-131-65.dynamic.upc.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:24:11 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-105-164.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 22:34:01 -!- dzhus [~sphinx@95-25-98-202.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:34:12 \o/ Improved my parser quite a bit; ./Build test gone down from 7.3sec to 4.7sec 22:34:36 Reader! Reader! :-P 22:36:49 Returning undef rather than using exception semantics for backtrack 22:41:14 YokYok_ [~david@AClermont-Ferrand-651-1-56-114.w90-0.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 22:43:41 -!- YokYok [~david@AClermont-Ferrand-651-1-203-234.w83-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:04:44 -!- choas [~lars@p4FDC57B5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:13:23 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme