00:43:49 ccl-logbot [~ccl-logbo@setf.clozure.com] has joined #scheme 00:43:49 00:43:49 -!- names: ccl-logbot clog ASau` stormbrew RageOfThou snizzo headius replore _schulte_ Cosman246 Dulak shardz amgarching joyfulgirl cswords__ lonstein amoe Neban toekutr ijp freakazoid fgudin githogori pchrist pygospa jao REPLeffect jrapdx xpololz bytbox turbofail jonrafkind otakutomo MichaelRaskin priv_cooper soveran hkBst Adrinael tauntaun stchang joast drdo sphex penryu brendyn XTL tali713 rostayob masm twem2 asumu araujo elliottcable ozzloy metasyntax|work 00:43:49 -!- names: rixed_ acarrico evhan pjb Belaf eno Khisanth ve stepnem incubot arbscht rotty_ certainty rotty koeskoes zbigniew aoh kephas shachaf cky DGASAU preflex SHODAN dRbiG ecraven snarkyboojum pothos riverswain X-Scale cataska SeanTAllen Nisstyre wtetzner exobit pranq snorble leppie dotemacs dsmith GoKhlayeh devn mornfall markski1beck EvanR em foof elly eMBee Pepe_ confab peterbb Precious1etals tltstc Nshag ruru qu1j0t3 saccadewrk eli pyro- samth surrounder 00:43:49 -!- names: aking antoszka _p4bl0 djanatyn Euthydemus Guest48950 jrslepak_ danking felipe gnomon whitequark dnm gf3 mario-goulart klutometis xian yosafbridge tessier tonyg tizoc inimino ttvd roderic C-Keen DerGuteMoritz fbs zedstar gabot rapacity Obfuscate teiresias ft ineiros erg micro z0d weinholt ray moll offby1 daedric duncanm Axioplase_ ToxicFrog framling aidy Razz astertronistic alaricsp poucet_ finnrobi_ levi` cmatei muep ski rudybot fds aehrisch macrobat 00:43:49 -!- names: Intensity 00:44:00 _schulte_: (compiler optimization) Ruby's metaprogramming practically consists of executing Ruby code to alter state of global objects, not the direct AST manipulation 00:44:27 and there is nothing around like a Ruby compiler which can do metaprogramming 00:46:06 <_schulte_> I don't understand how your proposal would differ from rubinious 00:46:33 _schulte_: Rubinius does not emit static code. It only has JIT 00:46:53 i.e. it is an heavily optimized interpreter 00:47:27 you can very well do interesting things at runtime like redefining Fixnum#+ (or something equally disastrous), and it has to account for that 00:47:59 <_schulte_> oh I see, well best of luck, my only advice would be to work closely with the rubinious devs as they probably have the most relevant expertise (as they're already doing byte-compilation, even if only just in time) 00:49:05 actually, I think that you're right 00:49:13 I just have to add codegen to rubinius 00:49:40 (and, obviously, a way to store AST of a function alongside of it, it that's not implemented yet) 00:49:48 because it has all the other features 00:50:07 you might as well use ruby_parser to do the sexps 00:50:12 it has a (thoroughly tested) stdlib defined on top of primitives 00:50:14 it's basically the same and works on any impl 00:50:30 headius: ruby_parser won't do the eval/apply step for me. rbx will 00:50:46 well, you've lost my interest then :) 00:50:54 huh? 00:51:07 I'd want something that works on any ruby myself 00:51:23 hmm 00:51:45 the dev of jruby has successfully launched rbx on jruby 00:51:54 i.e. replaced jruby's stdlib with rbx one 00:51:58 after bootstrapping 00:52:10 I'm the dev of jruby 00:52:15 oh. 00:52:20 and that's only a limited prototype 00:52:41 in theory their compiler chain could be made to work on jruby though...if it didn't depend on their parser 00:53:12 look, here is the problem: to have codegen, you need to have a Ruby-only stdlib made on top of primitives 00:53:19 I can just take it from rbx and use anywhere 00:53:40 to have metaprogramming, I need to have a Ruby interpreter which state I can closely examine 00:54:01 "closely" as in "getting AST of any methods, including builtins" 00:54:02 so you intend to also emit String, Array, etc behavior 00:54:06 yes 00:54:16 I will need that anyway 00:54:22 honestly, I think you're including too much if you want to use rbx core unmodified 00:54:48 ruby's core classes are really big 00:54:52 I will remove any unreferenced methods from the code 00:55:05 so, if you don't use strings, the String class won't be there 00:55:14 if you don't use **, it won't get included 00:55:32 it is just a matter of finding connectivity islands in a graph 00:55:39 that will be a neat trick...how static are you planning to make this? 00:55:53 have you heard of the project called "laser"? 00:55:58 yes, I did 00:56:15 that's an interesting project, but unfortunately it failed to consume any code I've provided to it 00:56:35 some really weird errors with really (hundreds of lines) big backtraces 00:56:35 oh really? 00:56:47 yes, tried on several of my small projects 00:56:56 jruby also has an IR compiler, but it's not normally exposed to ruby 00:57:09 basic blocks, optimizers...eventually inliners and static compilation 00:57:16 in development 00:57:29 I'll make llvm do the hard job for me, at least most of it 00:57:56 jruby's compiler may be good for java, but I doubt it is for machine code 00:58:15 so, here is what we get 00:58:21 rbx's core can be pulled anywhere 00:58:24 llvm-ffi too 00:58:27 whitequark: have you looked at mirah at all? 00:58:32 turbofail: yes I did 00:58:39 whitequark: our IR could output other stuff 00:58:40 it's just a syntax for Java 00:58:43 right now it's just IR and an interpreter 00:59:01 it claims to be a bit more than that 00:59:17 turbofail: unfortunately, no JVM could fit into an ARM with 256k of ROM and maybe 32k of RAM, and I want to run on that 00:59:20 mirah could be more, but it isn't now 00:59:56 While we talk about mirah, can you declare abstract classes, statics etc... in it? 01:00:20 I remember it lacking some Java features. 01:00:24 headius: maybe I will be able to use jruby's IR as an intermediate stage 01:00:26 whitequark: ah i missed that part 01:00:26 we need to add that :) 01:00:31 whitequark: that's what I was thinking 01:00:44 I know the guys working on the IR are excited about the possibility of using it for other than JVM 01:00:59 headius: it's roughly the same task to generate the llvm IR directly from AST or from jruby IR 01:01:03 the latter may be even simpler 01:01:06 Neban: wouldnt' be hard to add, but it's not there yet 01:01:10 it eventually will be, I hope 01:01:32 It's what turns me out of all the JVM alternate languages. 01:01:48 well, jruby's pretty solid 01:01:52 but it's a different sort of beast 01:01:52 (ie: mirah, Xtend (no abstract classes), Ceylon and Scala (no static), etc) 01:02:04 headius: how well does jruby work with that rbx hack? 01:02:04 mirah is intended to do everything java can 01:02:14 Well, yes, I'm only talking about statically-typed ones. 01:02:16 it's just hard to work on that and jruby 01:02:33 whitequark: I only made it work for a few core classes 01:02:36 JRuby is pretty much great, baring the lack of continuations which I don't use much anyway in Ruby. 01:02:47 rbx has so many primitives now it's really hard to run any of their core classes elsewhere 01:02:58 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #scheme 01:03:07 I was doing it for Hash, which is mostly primitive free 01:03:09 -!- RageOfThou [~RageOfTho@users-151-202.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:03:17 headius: on the other hand, if I could retrieve AST from ruby code loaded into jruby, I could just load rbx's stdlib supplementaly 01:03:30 that would work 01:03:34 headius: i.e. do the eval/apply loop in native JRuby, and codegen from rbx's stdlib 01:03:36 -!- Neban [~neban@168.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 01:03:43 Neban [~neban@168.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 01:03:51 then I won't be able to extend stdlib classes 01:04:04 but it's still quite good 01:04:43 https://gist.github.com/1504064 01:04:48 headius: how do you think, how hard will it be to add a feature of saving AST somewhere within the function to JRuby ? 01:04:48 ruby is ruby is ruby 01:05:00 saving in the function? 01:05:10 oh, like method(:blah).ast 01:05:14 not hard, probably 01:05:21 run in interpreted mode and you could implement such a feature in ruby 01:05:39 iirc you have the same parser as mri (and rbx) 01:05:44 so the ast should be basically the same 01:07:04 https://gist.github.com/1504072 01:07:09 everythign in jruby is inspectable 01:07:18 we just don't expose it most of the time 01:07:26 oh. that's good 01:08:18 can I load something in a sandbox? 01:08:39 i.e. substitute an anonymous module for a toplevel one, and then inspect the contents 01:08:48 to get the AST of rbx's stdlib 01:10:18 on the other hand, it probably does not execute anything, so a simple JRuby.parse could work as well 01:11:32 hmmm 01:11:34 yeah perhaps 01:11:40 right 01:11:46 just parse it and you could go from there, really 01:12:16 anyway, that's not really helping with a ruby-agnostic option either :) 01:12:19 but it's there 01:12:45 headius, I can get the same AST with ruby-parser on rbx and mri 1.9, afaik 01:12:52 and I can get the different AST on jruby 01:12:54 -!- xpololz [~xpol@50.80-203-124.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:13:07 yes 01:13:16 well ruby-paresr will work on jruby too, of course 01:13:34 I'm not sure how ruby-parser gets its AST 01:13:51 pure-ruby lexer and parser 01:13:58 I have a slight suspiction that it gets the source location from interpreter 01:14:01 it doesn't get it from live code, it's an offline parser 01:14:27 yeah, that's it. 01:14:52 it's still fine if I'm not going to support eval() 01:15:22 because then I just run all the toplevel code, wait until it changes the global state, then capture it 01:15:34 and as I only have [g,i,c]vars and methods left 01:15:45 I can capture the variables and capture the AST of methods 01:15:51 hm 01:16:11 I wonder if ruby-parser can return the AST of method defined via define_method 01:19:39 headius: there's a problem with that. 01:19:50 well, there's a lot of problems with a pure-ruby core 01:19:52 I quite definitely need to examine the state of interpreter 01:20:04 and only parse_tree can do that, not ruby_parser alone 01:20:11 and parse_tree does not even work on 1.9.3 01:20:13 for one, unless your compiler is amazing at optimizing, you're going to be orders of magnitude slower than native impls 01:20:24 headius: first: LLVM is 01:20:32 second: HM type inference 01:20:45 HM can be problematic with subclasses 01:20:59 and if you want it to be real ruby, there's a lot of cases that will be very hard to infer 01:21:10 yes, of course 01:21:28 that's why I have three levels of fallback 01:21:42 inline > method-call > method-hashtable 01:21:51 things like Fixnum#+ will be inlined 01:21:57 there are several other projects out there to do full system type inference for ruby...if that's what you want to do you might want to start with them instead 01:22:11 diamondback ruby, for one...I think it's written in ocaml 01:22:24 when I certainly know that a certain variable has a certain class, I compile in a method call to the implementation 01:22:49 and finally, when I can't infer anything meaningful, I just fall back to method hashtable invocation, like MRI does all the time 01:24:02 well, it certainly sounds exciting :) 01:24:12 DRuby is in ocaml, yes. It looks very interesting 01:24:30 but I think that such a thing should be implemented in Ruby 01:24:37 I may borrow some ideas, through. 01:24:51 -!- acarrico [~acarrico@pppoe-68-142-54-129.gmavt.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:25:59 acarrico [~acarrico@pppoe-68-142-54-129.gmavt.net] has joined #scheme 01:33:42 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:43:18 -!- Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:48:02 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:50:55 -!- Neban [~neban@168.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Neban] 01:51:09 -!- bytbox [~s@129.2.129.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:53:16 -!- samth [~samth@punge.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:53:23 bytbox [~s@129.2.129.231] has joined #scheme 02:11:25 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:12:51 -!- bytbox [~s@129.2.129.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:14:31 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 02:14:39 -!- freakazoid [~seanl@out-mpk.corp.tfbnw.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:14:55 bytbox [~s@129.2.129.231] has joined #scheme 02:22:20 masm1 [~masm@2.80.159.152] has joined #scheme 02:23:49 -!- masm [~masm@bl19-166-174.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:28:40 -!- priv_cooper [~priv_coop@c-24-15-4-172.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:37:41 -!- masm1 [~masm@2.80.159.152] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:49:11 Riastradh, what is the FM principle? 02:49:18 Certainly not frequency modulation. 02:53:36 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:05:10 -!- githogori [~githogori@216.207.36.222] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:06:21 freakazoid [~seanl@c-67-164-106-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 03:07:51 -!- jrapdx [~jra@74-95-41-205-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:22:14 jrapdx [~jra@c-76-105-198-230.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 03:28:04 EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.19.108] has joined #scheme 03:29:09 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has left #scheme 03:37:45 teurastaja [~teurastaj@modemcable136.81-177-173.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 03:39:56 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 03:40:08 it almost seems like the communitys in a coma and wakes up once or twice a year 03:40:25 is there nothing going on? 03:40:51 yeah mccarthy died, get over it! 03:40:59 hello? 03:41:30 mikecsh [~mikecsh@113.28.74.33] has joined #scheme 03:42:02 It's best not to judge the pulse of #scheme by the topic, since I've only ever seen it changed thrice 03:42:42 i judge it by code share 03:43:15 im looking for an open source project. seems like schemes not popular 03:43:39 -!- headius [~headius@71-210-151-185.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: headius] 03:43:41 It's never exactly been Java 03:44:41 popular... http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html 03:46:01 how did logo get so high? 03:52:56 -!- joyfulgirl [~ivy@unaffiliated/joyfulgirl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:56:38 object-orientation.............. 04:07:09 -!- freakazoid [~seanl@c-67-164-106-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 04:07:44 headius [~headius@71-210-151-185.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 04:10:37 Operaist2 [~OperaIst@ppp-124-120-21-125.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #scheme 04:10:48 how do i say (if (something) do nothing..? 04:11:42 (if (not (something)) do something) :P 04:11:46 drwho [~drwho@c-68-81-125-196.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:11:49 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 04:12:20 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #scheme 04:12:46 is that the way people do it? 04:12:50 or is it a trick answer 04:13:18 well it was a joke of sorts, but it is how I would do it 04:13:28 of course, im not to well versed in scheme 04:13:43 ok 04:13:48 I'd use 'unless', but (if (not ...) ...) is perfectly fine 04:14:04 what does unless do ? 04:14:24 oh yeah, unless is the same 04:14:31 (unless test body ...) = (if (not test) (begin body ...)) 04:14:49 it's a stylistic choice, mostly 04:15:23 oh cool 04:16:09 it's not in r5rs, but your scheme probably provides it, and if not, is trivial to define 04:17:33 githogori [~githogori@c-50-131-15-16.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:18:08 how many schemes are there? 04:18:36 too many 04:28:02 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 04:30:52 woonie [~woonie@nusnet-199-161.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has joined #scheme 04:35:42 Operaist2 : has a partial list 04:37:54 partial list? 04:37:56 you mean () 04:39:40 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:40:34 freakazoid [~seanl@c-67-164-106-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:42:58 -!- turbofail [~user@c-107-3-149-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:44:00 Operaist2 : er, hm, sorry. wrong link. it should be 04:47:34 Cosman246 [~cosman246@198.134.90.180] has joined #scheme 04:47:42 -!- Cosman246 is now known as Cos|Airport 04:53:26 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:57:04 how do i define nil if my scheme doesn't have it? 04:57:08 is nil ()? 04:57:11 or '() 04:57:53 rudybot: (define nil ()) 04:57:54 freakazoid: your sandbox is ready 04:57:54 freakazoid: error: #:1:12: #%app: missing procedure expression; probably originally (), which is an illegal empty application in: (#%app) 04:58:03 rudybot: (define nil '()) 04:58:03 freakazoid: Done. 04:58:26 rudybot: (length nil) 04:58:27 freakazoid: ; Value: 0 04:59:55 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 05:03:32 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 05:03:40 (define-syntax unless (syntax-rules () [(_ predicate do-this do-that ...) (if (not predicate) (begin do-this do-that ...))])) 05:03:43 for your reference 05:04:21 rudybot: '() 05:04:21 teurastaja: your sandbox is ready 05:04:22 teurastaja: ; Value: () 05:04:39 rudybot: ''() 05:04:39 teurastaja: ; Value: (quote ()) 05:04:45 rudybot: '''() 05:04:45 teurastaja: ; Value: (quote (quote ())) 05:05:32 get it? 05:05:47 rudybot: () 05:05:47 teurastaja: error: #:1:0: #%app: missing procedure expression; probably originally (), which is an illegal empty application in: (#%app) 05:06:49 rudybot: is that mean person tormenting you? 05:06:50 *offby1: The St. iGNUcious bit was pretty good too. I'm glad I got to see it in person. 05:07:05 rudybot: (define call/cc call-with-current-continuation) 05:07:05 teurastaja: Done. 05:07:14 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #scheme 05:08:00 rudybot: (call/cc call/cc) 05:08:01 teurastaja: ; Value: # 05:09:36 -!- ijp [~user@host31-53-125-246.range31-53.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: invoking sleep continuation] 05:09:49 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:11:48 rudybot: (call/cc (lambda (k) (call/cc (lambda (c) (k c))))) 05:11:48 teurastaja: ; Value: # 05:12:06 im trying to create an infinite loop 05:13:02 rudybot: (call/cc (lambda (k) (call/cc (lambda (c) (k c))) c)) 05:13:02 teurastaja: ; Value: # 05:13:09 hmm.... 05:13:46 im not thinking straight sleep pills dont help i should go 05:13:57 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:14:42 -!- teurastaja [~teurastaj@modemcable136.81-177-173.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:17:33 rudybot: (let loop () (loop)) 05:17:33 *offby1: your sandbox is ready 05:17:43 *offby1: error: with-limit: out of time 05:18:42 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 05:19:38 what is the name of variable i should use in lambda? 05:22:49 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:25:15 -!- penryu is now known as HomedPenryu 05:27:14 Operaist2 : you can use any (valid) name(s) you like for the parameter(s) 05:28:27 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:29:26 -!- EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.19.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 05:30:12 Operaist2: "Fred". 05:32:08 I recall that I've seen a paper on realtime-friendly garbage collection in embedded world somewhere, but I can't find it 05:32:25 maybe someone here will remember 05:34:55 -!- HomedPenryu is now known as penryu 05:49:10 -!- Operaist2 [~OperaIst@ppp-124-120-21-125.revip2.asianet.co.th] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 8.0/20111115184056]] 05:49:35 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:51:35 -!- Cos|Airport [~cosman246@198.134.90.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:59:49 zaz777 [~zaz@c-75-73-230-12.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:59:50 -!- zaz777 [~zaz@c-75-73-230-12.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:01:16 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #scheme 06:01:31 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:01:42 i have come to give you guys the library you've always wanted: https://bitbucket.org/tarballs_are_good/scheme-random/src/73eba5731f70/caddadaddr.scm 06:01:42 http://tinyurl.com/7asmdyn 06:02:00 http://codepad.org/26V18FQv 06:03:40 zaz777 [~zaz@c-75-73-230-12.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:04:47 dan23094 [~dan23094@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:05:11 strange order :) 06:06:36 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 06:06:39 -!- zaz777 [~zaz@c-75-73-230-12.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 06:07:31 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:07:48 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 06:12:06 zaz777 [~zaz@c-75-73-230-12.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:17:23 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #scheme 06:25:27 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-103.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 06:29:15 realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-211-86.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 06:49:36 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:55:17 -!- preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:55:34 preflex_ 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[~OperaIst@ppp-124-120-21-125.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #scheme 08:58:25 is there a way for mit/scheme to be more precise with error message? 09:04:13 -!- tali713 [~tali713@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:15:24 Operaist2: you can see details about the error message on MIT/Scheme by going into the debug mode when an error occurs 09:16:26 ok 09:17:50 thx 09:18:20 bokr [~edka@109.110.33.190] has joined #scheme 09:21:43 snizzo_ [~Claudio@host218-238-dynamic.51-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 09:23:09 -!- snizzo [~Claudio@host55-30-dynamic.21-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:24:59 -!- replore [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:29:07 djcb [djcb@nat/nokia/x-bdclgmfeoylnuawh] has joined #scheme 09:31:00 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #scheme 09:31:01 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Client Quit] 09:31:17 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[~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #scheme 10:32:00 -!- Operaist2 [~OperaIst@ppp-110-168-70-179.revip5.asianet.co.th] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 8.0/20111115184056]] 10:36:09 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:58:26 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:59:40 -!- brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:03:13 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #scheme 11:08:53 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:09:32 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #scheme 11:13:48 brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has joined #scheme 11:13:49 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 11:16:36 tupi [~david@139.82.89.24] has joined #scheme 11:19:18 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 11:20:12 add^_ [~add^_^@h87n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #scheme 11:24:37 -!- SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bchnqrwnlzstfujz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:28:49 -!- tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:33:45 tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has joined #scheme 11:33:59 hm 11:34:08 I've been looking at the lambda calculus notation 11:34:12 and then it dawned on me 11:34:19 it's just lisp without any of the parentheses 11:34:42 *most, maybe 11:38:50 -!- ASau` [~user@95-25-38-176.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:40:57 -!- brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:42:43 SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pkhjshmaalilyipk] has joined #scheme 11:44:34 ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #scheme 11:47:23 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:47:28 -!- ahinki_ is now known as ahinki 11:47:55 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:48:44 brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has joined #scheme 11:48:57 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 11:55:54 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h87n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: add^_] 11:59:07 whitequark: well, it's lisp that's a notation for lambda-calculus. We represent expressions with symbolic lists. The parentheses are here to delimit the lists. 11:59:37 whitequark: see http://www.informatimago.com/develop/lisp/small-cl-pgms/aim-8/aim-8.html 11:59:52 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 12:00:27 Cos|Airport [~cosman246@65.14.229.26] has joined #scheme 12:06:54 -!- Cos|Airport [~cosman246@65.14.229.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:07:44 -!- brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 12:18:57 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 12:29:10 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:32:13 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 12:32:29 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:38:31 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #scheme 12:44:01 wingo [~wingo@184.174.165.119] has joined #scheme 12:53:09 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has 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16:34:35 -!- djcb [djcb@nat/nokia/x-bdclgmfeoylnuawh] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:41:39 tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 16:45:05 irulan_ [41b79ffe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.183.159.254] has joined #scheme 16:45:44 so can engines as listed in 3ed edition scheme book by dyvbig be used to write servers that utilize multiple cpu machines? 16:46:01 so my program is not stck on 1 cpu 16:46:34 No. 16:47:20 what do schemers use to ensure that multiple cpus are used by a program? 16:49:57 Not much. In Racket you can use futures, and I think there is a nonzero chance they may be spread across CPUs. Aside from that...you can use multiple processes. 16:50:48 It's probably up to the scheduler in the OS you're running... 16:50:56 unix mofo, do you use it! 16:51:26 Partially, xpololz. It is also up to the program to request it from the operating system, and no Scheme that I know of -- other than Racket -- knows how to do that. 16:51:38 so if I had say a scheme based database and webserver combination, I could just use processes to allow the program to under high load use all available cpus 16:51:43 I wouldnt be stuck on 1 16:52:29 Maybe. 16:52:44 so say chicken or scsh would have trouble? 16:53:04 irulan_: well, as Riastradh already said, you can just have multiple processes behind a load balancer 16:53:20 Scsh has lots of trouble. I don't know what state Chicken is in these days. 16:53:28 ok but say my scheme database has 1 set of data 16:53:43 could queries hit it from different processes on different cpus? 16:53:54 trouble? why? 16:54:14 Nobody maintains scsh and it's broken. 16:54:34 shoot, it seems to be working ok here on openbsd 16:54:41 Try it on a 64-bit system. 16:54:49 heh 16:55:06 Also, `seems to be working' is a very different beast from `works reliably'. 16:55:17 I wonder if chicken works on 64bit hmmm I seem to remember during 1 compile it had amd64 option 16:55:21 hm 16:55:25 irulan_: it does 16:55:26 heh 16:55:45 so what scheme is your favorite Riastradh ? 16:55:45 it only has green threads though 16:56:00 -!- freakazoid [~seanl@c-67-164-106-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:56:02 green threads stuck on 1 cpu right? 16:56:07 bugger 16:56:22 irulan_: 1 process, yes 16:56:39 irulan_: are you sure your program is cpu-bound though? 16:56:44 no 16:56:49 :-) 16:56:54 lol 16:57:01 but once my new websies takes off 16:57:11 I will need all the cpu power I can get 16:57:17 ;) 16:57:23 ah dreams are fun 16:57:41 so ok what then do schemers do when they want to use all these cpus 16:57:54 write N programs that talk to one another? 16:57:57 or? 16:58:12 I think you are optimizing prematurely there then! also, what happens if all you machine's cores are completely loaded? 16:59:01 Most Schemers don't write high-throughput network or database services. 16:59:35 <_schulte_> so the answer to "want to use all these cpus" is "they dont"? 16:59:40 -!- masm [~masm@bl19-159-152.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 17:00:04 The truly Schemish answer would be `they write their own Scheme'. 17:00:55 bark bark tree 17:01:46 <_schulte_> I seem to remember that scheme was originally developed to support message passing systems, and then they realized that the message-passing code was the same as the continuation code. So it seems like there should be a natural message-passing system 17:02:38 Like e-mail. 17:02:42 That's ancient history that is not about interprocess communication so much as a computational model. 17:03:30 ...or erlang 17:03:54 <_schulte_> http://code.google.com/p/termite/ <- erlang-style message passing over Gambit Scheme 17:04:18 mosh has something like that too 17:04:37 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 17:05:58 woa 17:06:06 is there a cpan of scheme? 17:06:26 No, although there are lots of aborted attempts to shallowly mimic it in one broken way or another. 17:06:27 I remember something about APL in scheme.... 17:06:34 *ijp* vomits 17:07:02 irulan_: the biggest implementations have their own mini cpan-like thing. 17:08:15 chicken-install seems slik, love the linenoise readline in like 300 lines of code 17:08:45 also see http://lists.scheme-reports.org/pipermail/scheme-reports/2011-September/001494.html 17:08:45 http://tinyurl.com/cqfnk62 17:09:37 the linenoise extension is just a thin FFI wrapper around the C library 17:12:42 irulan_: what do you intend to use scheme for? 17:14:23 maybe simple website 17:14:38 database 17:17:01 http://wiki.call-cc.org/eggref/4/linenoise I don't see anything about linenoise piggy backing on readline 17:19:05 it is a FFI wrapper around the linenoise library, not readline 17:19:06 that's because it uses the linenoise C library 17:24:09 -!- astertronistic [~astertron@ip68-8-234-179.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:25:26 ddp [~ddp@anon-158-86.relakks.com] has joined #scheme 17:31:45 djcb [~user@a88-112-255-94.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 17:33:31 https://github.com/antirez/linenoise I am so schooled 17:33:35 ha ha 17:33:52 hilarity 17:35:37 Thanks to an efficient implementation of continuations, the thread system is very efficient and can support millions of concurrent threads 17:35:51 woa gambit-c does seem kinda awesome 17:36:01 now if one has that many threads..... 17:36:11 will they take a lot of memory? 17:36:33 No, that's the point -- the memory overhead of a Gambit thread is very small. 17:37:09 Of course, if each thread is performing some CPU- or memory-intensive computation, then of course they'll occupy lots of resources. 17:37:23 I mean it sounds like even on 1 cpu, an astounding amount of computtion could take place 17:37:42 can gambit utilize multiple cpu? 17:38:45 That you can easily have a million threads in Gambit does not mean you can easily have a million threads each making substantial progress on its own heavy computation all the time. 17:39:14 Most of those threads will be blocking on I/O, either with the outside world or with one another. 17:40:27 can a thread on cpu 2 communicate with a thread on cpu1? 17:41:35 Yes -- provided (unless there have been recent developments in Gambit that I don't know about) that the two threads are in different Gambit processes, and are communicating over a wire such as a socket. 17:44:12 irulan_: if you really need mutiprocessor support for webapps, why don't you use something like nginx for load balancing and all those fancy stuff? 17:44:28 (assuming you'll ever need it) 17:45:05 well ok 17:45:12 say I use nginx 17:45:15 and sqlite 17:45:30 wouldnt my scheme app need to try and use all cpu 17:45:37 in order to process dynamic content? 17:45:46 or would I fork 17:45:55 *DerGuteMoritz* hits the troll buzzer 17:47:10 homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-192-114.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 17:49:04 masm [~masm@2.80.159.152] has joined #scheme 17:49:50 DerGuteMoritz: That's pretty cool; I'll have to implement one of those with a little Arduino thing that propagates the hit to Freenode. 17:50:21 klutometis: cool, I would buy one :-) 17:50:27 klutometis: freenode would explode 17:50:56 Preferably one that looks like this: . 17:50:56 http://tinyurl.com/7xxeno4 17:58:00 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 17:59:20 -!- jrapdx [~jra@c-76-105-198-230.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:59:25 -!- woonie [~woonie@175.156.234.213] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 18:13:51 choas [~lars@p5795C070.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 18:20:17 freakazoid [~seanl@out-mpk.corp.tfbnw.net] has joined #scheme 18:25:43 cow-orker [~foobar@pogostick.net] has joined #scheme 18:29:58 snizzo [~Claudio@host113-1-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 18:35:18 ijp` [~user@host86-173-114-170.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 18:37:35 -!- ijp [~user@host86-177-158-108.range86-177.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:48:42 andyjpb [~andyjpb@84.93.148.83] has joined #scheme 18:51:02 turbofail [~user@c-107-3-149-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 18:59:28 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-396790.home.otenet.gr] has joined #scheme 19:04:08 -!- Neban [~neban@65.Red-88-18-194.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:04:15 Neban [~neban@65.Red-88-18-194.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 19:04:15 -!- tltstc [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: tltstc] 19:05:04 it's from Brookstone, so you know it's good 19:08:09 -!- andyjpb [~andyjpb@84.93.148.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:16:09 pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #scheme 19:18:30 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 19:18:35 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:23:29 -!- snizzo [~Claudio@host113-1-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:29:35 -!- choas [~lars@p5795C070.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:29:37 EbiDK [3e6b71f5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.107.113.245] has joined #scheme 19:30:30 -!- Neban [~neban@65.Red-88-18-194.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Neban] 19:30:55 -!- pygospa [~Pygosceli@kiel-4d066df4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:31:07 pygospa [~Pygosceli@kiel-4dbeca94.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 19:35:18 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 19:38:05 ddp_ [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #scheme 19:41:29 -!- ddp [~ddp@anon-158-86.relakks.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:41:29 -!- ddp_ is now known as ddp 19:42:08 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Quit: bye] 19:52:02 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:59:13 JoelMcCracken [~user@pool-72-77-104-147.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 20:01:01 jrapdx [~jra@74-95-41-205-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #scheme 20:05:59 offby1: What is Brookstone, by the way; is Brookstone where you scratch your first-world itch for worthless shit? 20:06:13 :) 20:08:15 its a place that caters to a better class of people 20:08:19 with free time and money 20:09:03 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-396790.home.otenet.gr] has left #scheme 20:10:11 -!- EbiDK [3e6b71f5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.107.113.245] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:10:49 irulan_: For some value of "better", I suppose; i.e. "Hummer-better". 20:11:22 Case in point: . 20:12:38 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:18:29 r\x00t [~r\x00t@modemcable136.81-177-173.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 20:19:39 whats the difference between fold and reduce? 20:21:38 hah 20:21:46 where's cky 20:21:49 High speed remote control vehicle is race-ready out of the box! 20:22:04 im teurastaja btw 20:23:00 snizzo [~Claudio@host113-1-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #scheme 20:24:13 i know reduce is a variant of fold but i still dont get it 20:27:24 is the next r7rs meeting going to produce a final standard or a draft? 20:29:29 why all this secrecy? 20:29:37 when? 20:30:29 they are waiting for obama experiment to end 20:30:56 experiment? 20:31:08 of course not 20:31:18 but what experiment? 20:31:32 -!- tom_i [~thomasing@ingserv.demon.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:36:03 kk` [~kk@77.107.164.131] has joined #scheme 20:36:03 -!- kk` [~kk@77.107.164.131] has quit [Changing host] 20:36:03 kk` [~kk@unaffiliated/kk/x-5380134] has joined #scheme 20:36:47 3rd question: is there an open source scheme project that is not simply a scheme compiler/interpreter? 20:38:31 4th question: anyone around? 20:42:34 r\x00t: Did you see ? Reduce is a trivial optimization on fold where f is expensive; fold is more general. 20:43:33 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:43:47 ddp [~ddp@anon-136-137.relakks.com] has joined #scheme 20:44:29 i read 20:44:38 but whats the difference? 20:48:10 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:50:17 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:52:46 Fold is an iteration construct; reduce is an extension of a binary operation G x G ---> G to an n-ary operation G^n ---> G. 20:56:43 what can you do with fold that you can't do with reduce 20:58:32 ijp`` [~user@host86-171-128-198.range86-171.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 20:58:34 Compare (fold cons '() l) and (reduce cons '() l). 20:59:24 how is reduce defined 20:59:49 -!- ijp` [~user@host86-173-114-170.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:00:25 (reduce f identity '()) = identity; (reduce f identity (list x0 x1 ... xn-1 xn)) = (f x0 (f x1 (... (f xn-1 xn)...))). 21:00:39 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 21:00:48 isnt that the definitino of foldr? 21:00:50 (fold f init (list x0 x1 ... xn)) = (let* ((state init) (state (f x0 state)) (state (f x1 state)) ... (state (f xn state))) state) 21:00:53 No. 21:00:56 ASau [~user@93-80-123-145.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 21:01:09 -!- pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:01:19 (fold-right f init (cons x0 (cons x1 (... (cons xn '()) ...)))) = (f x0 (f x1 (... (f xn init) ...))) 21:01:42 Fold-right replaces the list structure (cons, nil) by a structure of your choice (f, init). 21:02:39 Eh, I mixed up reduce and reduce-right; reduce, rather, is (f (f (... (f x0 x1) ...) xn-1) xn), and reduce-right is what I wrote above. 21:03:02 ok yes the first argument differs between reduce and fold 21:03:33 as in the first argument to the first redux 21:04:38 Fold takes a step function X x S ---> S and turns it into an n-fold iteration of a step function X^n x S ---> S. 21:05:03 I don't find such explanations illuminating.. 21:07:15 Oops -- I forgot to state that (reduce f identity (list x)) = x, and likewise with reduce-right. 21:07:55 The point is that with reduce, you're always working with the same domain of things: the elements of the list, the identity of the reduction, and the output of the reduction are all supposed to be the same kind of thing. 21:08:36 The operator you pass to reduce just combines two such things into one. For example, it might add two numbers, or multiply them, or it might merge two sorted lists; what you get out is still a number, or a number, or a sorted list. 21:09:02 i find this explanation illuminating 21:09:25 well technically there is no constraint on the function you pass to reduce to return something in the same domain 21:09:30 Not so with fold: the state is not necessarily the same kind of thing as the elements of a list, and the combining function you give to fold steps from one state to the next, given an element of the list to drive the transition. 21:10:16 Cosman246 [~cosman246@64.134.188.7] has joined #scheme 21:10:48 Yes, jonrafkind, of course you can supply arbitrarily horrible procedures to fold and reduce that make arbitrarily little sense. But if you do that, the use of fold or reduce won't help to illuminate the idea you're trying to express in your program. 21:11:16 psh 21:11:22 -!- ijp`` is now known as ijp 21:13:27 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 21:13:29 -!- tuubow [~adityavit@c-69-136-107-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:16:30 wingo [~wingo@184.174.165.119] has joined #scheme 21:18:05 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:22:48 Riastradh: are you a professor who uses scheme? or a scheme developer? 21:23:55 annodomini [~lambda@c-76-23-156-75.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:23:55 -!- annodomini [~lambda@c-76-23-156-75.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 21:23:55 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 21:23:56 -!- irulan_ is now known as gavino 21:24:08 -!- gavino is now known as gavino_irulan 21:25:07 Sigh. I was afraid of that. You've gotten a little better at disguising your mannerisms, I suppose. 21:25:28 I am learning a suprising amount. 21:26:34 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 21:28:22 -!- EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.19.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:32:48 I apologize if i was rough in the past Riastradh 21:37:53 -!- JoelMcCracken [~user@pool-72-77-104-147.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:38:07 pothos_ [~pothos@114-36-227-26.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 21:39:43 -!- pothos [~pothos@114-36-229-64.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:41:10 -!- pothos_ [~pothos@114-36-227-26.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:41:27 pothos [~pothos@114-36-227-26.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 21:44:13 -!- pothos [~pothos@114-36-227-26.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:44:28 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has left #scheme 21:44:31 pothos [~pothos@114-36-227-26.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 21:47:09 There was once a farce by Moliere, I think, called "The Repentent Troll:" it centered around a troll-become-netizen who was nevertheless punished by our IRCop and saviour for this hypocritical conversion. 21:47:49 Section 9.11. Multitasking with Engines Engines are a high-level process abstraction supporting timed preemption [6,10]. Engines may be used to simulate multiprocessing, implement light-weight threads, implement operating system kernels, and perform nondeterministic computations. The engine implementation is one of the more interesting applications of continuations in Scheme. 21:49:31 I am not repentant so much as misunderstood. I see things from linux admin perspective so think in ram cpu disk speeds and resource efficiency. I know not much about programming except that I am dawn to lisp and dont like perl python 21:50:26 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-151-233.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 21:50:39 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:51:49 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-192-114.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:55:24 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:00:01 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 22:09:25 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-181-108.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:12:29 ijp` [~user@host86-171-128-198.range86-171.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 22:13:09 -!- ijp [~user@host86-171-128-198.range86-171.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:16:27 -!- ijp` is now known as ijp 22:26:37 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 22:32:36 -!- sphex [~nobody@74.127.215.20] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:32:52 sphex [~nobody@74.127.215.20] has joined #scheme 22:34:13 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:44:46 anyone here run a website with scheme? 22:48:21 -!- snizzo [~Claudio@host113-1-dynamic.24-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:51:00 -!- bweaver [~user@host-68-169-175-226.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:51:23 gavino_irulan: Ran a bunch; some in production. 22:51:37 land of lisp explains how to set up a web server 22:51:47 :) 22:54:56 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-151-233.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:55:31 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:59:10 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 23:01:19 I got that book 23:01:23 havent read it 23:01:24 yet 23:01:54 I think my nitpick pedantic personality is not compat with nature of programming and not knowing every lil thing 23:02:09 I always have questions as I go along... 23:02:50 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 23:05:21 -!- amoe [~amoe@host-78-147-97-39.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 23:06:43 amoe [~amoe@host-78-147-107-99.as13285.net] has joined #scheme 23:07:18 -!- bytbox [~s@129.2.129.231] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:08:01 there is a youtube song for that book too, it rocks. 23:11:42 cool comix 23:11:44 :) 23:15:06 yeah 23:15:28 it's a pretty creative book 23:17:59 It seems some languages are optimal for certain things, like lisp doesn't do file n shell stuff well--I find bash or tcl much easier for tasks on a unix box. 23:21:31 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 23:23:33 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:24:14 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-151-202.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:24:16 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 23:25:42 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-151-202.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 23:27:22 -!- mmc [~michal@178-85-131-65.dynamic.upc.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:29:43 Newbie question here 23:30:12 How should I get Emacs to communicate with Racket? 23:32:03 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-71-129-63-252.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 23:35:19 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:36:05 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 23:36:28 rjcks [~richard@124.225.78.177] has joined #scheme 23:37:47 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-71-129-63-252.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 23:37:52 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-71-129-63-252.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:37:53 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 23:39:57 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 23:42:40 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-71-129-63-252.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:43:18 -!- gavino_irulan [41b79ffe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.183.159.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:46:49 -!- kk` [~kk@unaffiliated/kk/x-5380134] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:47:02 (setq scheme-program-name "racket"), then M-x run-scheme should be enough 23:47:46 You could write a swank for racket. 23:47:50 you might find the information at http://docs.racket-lang.org/guide/Emacs.html?q=emacs helpful 23:47:58 I'd also recommend geiser 23:48:09 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: HG`] 23:53:18 Thanks 23:53:23 can you use slime for scheme? 23:53:31 Quack just didn't seem to be working, you se... 23:53:32 *see 23:54:04 chromaticwt: some schemes 23:54:40 Oh wait, never mind