00:07:21 -!- githogori [~githogori@216.207.36.222] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:07:40 phao [c8eb8302@gateway/web/freenode/ip.200.235.131.2] has joined #scheme 00:08:02 -!- rramsden [~rramsden@s64-180-62-209.bc.hsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:13:40 -!- ckrailo [~ckrailo@208.86.167.249] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 00:35:29 -!- ignis_ [~quassel@cpe-66-74-76-152.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:35:39 DrAfk [~duck@216.186.151.63] has joined #scheme 00:36:12 -!- DrAfk is now known as DrDuck 00:39:36 Hi 00:39:56 Is it possible to define define-record (srfi-9) with syntax-rules? 00:41:47 My guess is that it's not possible, because define-record creates new identifiers and syntax-rules would hygienize them. 00:42:12 But I may be wrong. 00:43:12 hmm 00:43:19 -!- pyrony [~epic@office1.klout.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:43:25 is there any standard scheme (r4rs) way to define define-record? 00:44:15 -!- aisa [~aisa@c-68-35-164-105.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: aisa] 00:44:48 r4rs? Why not r5rs? 00:46:08 pjb: the answer would still be no ... 00:46:37 -!- copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 00:47:23 I use chicken 00:47:26 which supports r4rs 00:47:28 AFAIK, yes, the answer would still be no. 00:48:11 Or perhaps we can make a transformer that expands to an eval form. 00:48:54 doesn't chicken support r5rs? 00:49:00 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #scheme 00:52:37 DT``: not sure, I don't think it does 00:53:18 CHICKEN produces portable, efficient C, and supports virtually all of the R5RS Scheme language standard including many enhancements"" 00:53:20 it does 00:55:09 phao: Since DEFINE-RECORD-TYPE does not introduce any new identifiers, it can be (and is IIRC) implemented with SYNTAX-RULES 00:55:35 what I think is interesting with define-record is the 00:55:38 ? function 00:55:55 (define-record date year month day hour minute second) gives me the procedure date? 00:56:11 that's why I like define-record 00:56:16 otherwise I'd use vectors 00:56:18 and make wrappers 00:56:19 hehe 00:59:02 -!- gcartier [~gcartier@modemcable041.134-82-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:04:37 pjb pasted "eval in syntax-rules in r5rs" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122147 01:05:28 phao: it seems to work, in mzscheme in r5rs. So using eval you should be able to evaluate all the definitions generated for define-record. 01:05:55 pyrony [~epic@107.24.206.28] has joined #scheme 01:07:14 right 01:07:32 mbohun [~mbohun@ppp115-156.static.internode.on.net] has joined #scheme 01:08:08 it's be good if I could program my transformer 01:08:13 get the expression and return another one 01:08:26 it'd** 01:10:54 ignis_ [~quassel@cpe-66-74-76-152.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:10:54 -!- ignis_ [~quassel@cpe-66-74-76-152.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:11:25 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 01:13:18 -!- tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:13:54 Ahh 01:13:56 now I remember 01:14:05 chicken is not r6rs hehe 01:14:15 That said, define-record of r7rs expects the user to give all the symbols that are defined, so they don't need eval, they can use syntax-rules directly. 01:15:05 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 01:15:15 I never though of using using eval to help define macros 01:15:41 Well, it works in the test I made in mzscheme, but it might not work everywhere. 01:15:50 seriously 01:15:56 ? 01:16:08 -!- turbofail [~user@c-107-3-149-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:16:15 the problem with eval in scheme, is that it expects an environment, and only the null-environment and scheme-report-environment give portable environments. 01:16:21 Unfortunately, they're useless for our purpose. 01:17:01 I used (interaction-environment), but when compiling a file, or when loading it, it might be in a different environment. So it might not work. 01:17:20 in chicken 01:17:23 I can do stuff like this 01:17:27 phao: Yes, basically Scheme is a useless language. You need a specific implementation to do anything useful. 01:17:32 Check the documentation. 01:17:49 (define-syntax (lambda (a b c) ...)) and if I recal correctly 01:18:06 (define-syntax name (lambda (a b c) ...)) and if I recal correctly 01:18:17 a has the list structure of the expression 01:18:27 and you have to return a new expression to be used otherwise 01:18:32 instead*** 01:18:41 I liked that. 01:19:01 Well, that's totally not r5rs. 01:19:08 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #scheme 01:19:13 yes 01:19:25 I'm not sure if it's exactly that 01:19:28 but it's something like that 01:20:32 jcowan [~John@cpe-74-68-112-189.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:24:49 coi 01:24:50 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:26:51 xwl_ [~user@nat/nokia/x-izaobbfxctmpapes] has joined #scheme 01:30:20 phao: pjb's `eval' hack is extremely broken, you'd do yourself a favor if you can unsee it. 01:30:57 I've already heard that using eval is one of the worse things one can do 01:31:14 and probably, the person should be doing something else 01:31:25 but I don't know why, and I can see how it'd be useful sometimes 01:31:39 Not really, there are places where you should use eval, but the rule of thumb is that you should be experienced enough to *know* which uses are fine. 01:31:55 right 01:32:03 For the purpose of any such macro, using `eval' is extremely broken. 01:32:41 (Roughly speaking, the only uses of `eval' that are fine are in cases where you implement a kind of a repl.) 01:33:23 Well, that'd be a solution: implement a sane language in which you can write macros easily. 01:33:56 Forth looks good for that purpose. 01:34:42 phao: (In case you missed this, pjb is just spewing flames now.) 01:35:01 phao: The issue with "eval" is that the identifiers in the code being evaluated are not bound in the context which they appear to be bound in. "Eval" runs in an empty lexical scope and with global identifiers bound according to the environment specified by the second argument, which is opaque. 01:41:30 foof: (chibi loop) doesn't support let? (which is documented here http://mumble.net/~campbell/scheme/foof-loop.txt , I don't know how much of it applies to chibi's loop) 01:41:34 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 01:42:21 -!- pyrony [~epic@107.24.206.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:44:58 thx people 01:45:03 -!- phao [c8eb8302@gateway/web/freenode/ip.200.235.131.2] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:55:46 Checkie [14695@unaffiliated/checkie] has joined #scheme 02:08:40 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-49-168.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:08:40 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:09:28 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:10:20 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-49-168.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 02:27:27 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 02:36:51 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-131-30.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:43:10 pyrony [~epic@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 02:44:03 ckrailo [~ckrailo@pool-173-57-102-171.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:48:56 Here's something slightly irritating: a paper I'm reading defines Pab as the nodes adjacent to a and b minus a and b; and Uab as the nodes in all undirected paths between a and b minus a and b. 02:49:28 It then goes on to reference the intersection between Pab and Uab; isn't Uab always a superset of Pab, though? And isn't the intersection of Pab and Uab always Pab? 02:49:38 No. 02:49:40 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:49:47 Damn; I knew there was some subtlety. 02:49:54 Take a node n which is adjacent to a but not on any path toward b. 02:50:05 That would be in Pab but not Uab. 02:50:39 Ah, of course; indeed, indeed. 02:50:45 Adjacent nodes are directly connected to the reference node. Nodes on a path not necessarily. 02:51:09 a-c-d-e-b Pab = {c,e} Uab={c,d,e} 02:52:12 And adjacent nodes aren't necessarily on a path: 02:52:12 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:52:23 z-a-c-b, z is adjacent but not on a path. 02:53:28 Right, right; the intersection of Pab and Uab is of course those adjacent nodes that "point" between a and b. 02:54:43 Or: a's gateways to b plus b's gateways to a. 02:55:14 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 02:56:19 Right; that's a good analogy. 03:00:29 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-146-61.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:00:59 The question of course, is how to know there's a path from a to b, if you don't know the global topology of the net, but have only local information. ;-) 03:01:45 RIP 03:04:13 It's the internet. Of course there's a path from a to b! (Unless a or b is in China.) 03:08:12 (Or North Korea) 03:09:17 That's only because there are no such a or b in North Korea. 03:09:22 Andy "Tom" Wingo sent out about 50 or more emails about R7RS today. I've disposed of 18 or so. 03:09:32 Fifty!? 03:09:48 One per bug/complaint/issue, roughly. 03:10:52 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 03:13:34 That's somehow better that one huge thing, which will create a never-ending thread, and where many comments will be ignored by mistake. 03:13:34 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:13:45 -!- ckrailo [~ckrailo@pool-173-57-102-171.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 03:21:28 I agree. 03:22:28 OK. Fifty nits picked, then! That sounds more reasonable. 03:22:44 -!- gnomon [~gnomon@CPE0022158a8221-CM000f9f776f96.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:23:20 Some are more than nits. 03:24:04 ckrailo [~ckrailo@pool-173-57-102-171.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 03:24:15 gnomon [~gnomon@CPE0022158a8221-CM000f9f776f96.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 03:27:19 -!- pyrony [~epic@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:31:46 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 03:32:03 gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #scheme 03:32:28 -!- pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-d9bfdeba.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:32:40 pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-4dbecaf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 03:33:51 Is there something "between" a SRFI and a report? Andy suggests we add WHEN and UNLESS to the report. As they are i) trivial ii) very common, I would rather not have them in the report nor in a SRFI. Something like in a "Useful Appendix"? 03:34:19 (Which may be updated, why not.) 03:35:09 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Quit: rpg] 03:37:26 Why not in the report? 03:37:27 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:37:47 Lots of things in the report are trivial. length is trivial, but it's also commonly used. 03:38:26 jcowan: To keep the report concise. 03:38:45 Two bits of syntax will add maybe 1/4 page. 03:38:59 Also, the report is not easy to update 03:39:01 R5RS is 50 pages, the current draft is 67. 03:39:05 But, hum, yeah 03:39:16 True, but these particular things are very stable. 03:39:32 I don't even see a reason for putting them in a module: the smallest possible Scheme should have no trouble supporting them. 03:40:06 Btw, how many of the 21 schemes you (?) reported have them by default? 03:40:24 I was quite suprised to see gambit doesn't have them 03:44:07 -!- shardz [~samuel@ilo.staticfree.info] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 03:44:44 shardz [~samuel@ilo.staticfree.info] has joined #scheme 03:48:23 tizoc: No, it doesn't, I was never quite convinced of the need. 03:49:39 -!- ymasory [~ymasory@c-76-99-55-224.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:50:34 If you have a use case I could probably be convinced :) 03:51:55 pyrony [~epic@99-105-56-162.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 03:52:46 Axioplase_: Chibi does not have them at all - I tend to use if+begin or cond. 03:53:08 Well, I try to avoid non-functional programming to begin with :) 03:53:31 `while` and `until` should never be implemented in any Scheme. 03:54:04 foof: Well, say, (when debug (print foo) (print bar) (print qux)) 03:54:14 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 03:55:38 or (define (bogo-sort! vec) (unless (sort? vec) (shuffle! vec) (bogo-sort! vec))) 03:55:39 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:56:06 I actually wrote the later a couple of days ago. 03:56:24 As far as while and until are concerned, I never used them, nor felt the urge to 03:57:06 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 03:59:34 I often feel the urge to use them. 03:59:34 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:02:25 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@76.226.219.151] has joined #scheme 04:05:58 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has joined #scheme 04:06:08 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.238.191] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:06:08 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 04:09:56 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.43.104] has joined #scheme 04:17:36 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 04:18:34 -!- aidalgol [~user@114-134-7-23.rurallink.co.nz] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 04:19:44 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:19:44 foof: Why shouldn't while and until loops be implemented? 04:25:08 Axioplase_: Chicken, Kawa, SISC, STklos, Scheme 9, and the R6RS implementations support when; Gauche, MIT, Gambit, Bigloo, Scheme48/scsh, SCM, Larceny in R5RS mode, and SSCM don't. 04:26:16 ymasory [~ymasory@c-76-99-55-224.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:26:53 -!- preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:28:35 Hum. That's even less than I thought 04:28:55 R6RS includes Chez and Guile 2.0 04:29:35 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 04:31:46 preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has joined #scheme 04:32:23 githogori [~githogori@c-24-7-1-43.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:34:14 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 04:37:58 jcowan: They require side-effects to terminate. 04:38:28 zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 04:40:10 Scheme does not eschew side effects. 04:40:52 After all, foof-loop provides them. 04:41:23 No, foof-loop is purely functional! 04:42:33 -!- ymasory [~ymasory@c-76-99-55-224.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:42:58 No, I mean provides WHILE and UNTIL. 04:44:07 -!- zorblek [~morganmay@50-47-169-35.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:45:12 Oh, it provides syntax by that name which has no relation to the macros you propose, and which neither implies nor encourages mutation. 04:46:56 (define (while test body) "We do not encourage mutation of your body through genetic tests!") 04:56:04 -!- jcowan [~John@cpe-74-68-112-189.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:58:50 bokr [~eduska@109.110.42.21] has joined #scheme 05:01:33 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:02:19 -!- pearle [~pearle@blk-224-181-222.eastlink.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:04:35 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.43.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:06:06 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:06:08 sasm [~sasm@50-54-253-93.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #scheme 05:06:31 gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #scheme 05:08:35 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:19:23 -!- sasm [~sasm@50-54-253-93.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Remote host closed 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[~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:47:15 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has joined #scheme 06:53:47 -!- cafesofie [~cafesofie@ool-18b97779.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:55:57 Nisstyre [~nisstyre@infocalypse-net.info] has joined #scheme 06:57:10 tippenein [~chatzilla@c-24-245-21-197.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 07:00:04 -!- Nisstyre [~nisstyre@infocalypse-net.info] has quit [Client Quit] 07:04:31 Nisstyre [~nisstyre@infocalypse-net.info] has joined #scheme 07:13:22 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 07:13:59 kuribas [~user@d54C43D8A.access.telenet.be] has joined #scheme 07:17:00 -!- MengZhang [~wsxiaoys@221.239.199.158] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:19:14 -!- ckrailo [~ckrailo@pool-173-57-102-171.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 07:19:45 wingo [~wingo@90.164.198.39] has joined #scheme 07:22:54 -!- bokr [~eduska@109.110.42.21] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:25:17 superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-110-188.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #scheme 07:37:47 mmc1 [~michal@salm-office-nat.tomtomgroup.com] has joined #scheme 07:48:01 minsa [~minsa@c-24-5-121-157.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 07:49:09 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159903.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #scheme 07:50:57 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-182-17.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:04:26 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159903.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:05:34 rudybot: (apply + '(1 2)) 08:05:35 lewis1711: your sandbox is ready 08:05:36 lewis1711: ; Value: 3 08:05:48 rudybot: (apply or '(#t #f)) 08:05:49 lewis1711: error: eval:1:7: or: bad syntax in: or 08:05:55 what's with that? 08:07:03 or is a macro? 08:07:14 is it? hmm 08:07:23 rudybot, (or #t (display "this is not displayed")) 08:07:24 DT``: your sandbox is ready 08:07:24 DT``: ; Value: #t 08:09:01 I'd like to use it on a list though. humm. maybe fold 08:09:17 rudybot: (fold or #f '(#t #t #f)) 08:09:17 lewis1711: error: eval:1:6: or: bad syntax in: or 08:09:45 (foldl ( (x _) x) #f list) 08:09:59 so it's a macro? 08:10:01 you can't use a macro as a procedure. 08:10:08 yeah. 08:10:23 OR and AND are macros 08:10:26 hmm. is there any reason why? it's a macro in gambit as well by the looks of it 08:10:27 `or' does short circuiting. 08:10:31 ah 08:10:41 and so does `and'. 08:10:52 are there procedure equivalents 08:11:01 (could just lambda it up I guess..) 08:11:02 lewis1711, probably your implementation has something like ormap/andmap or any/some/all. 08:11:40 -!- wingo [~wingo@90.164.198.39] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:14:16 TSPL seems to suggest that the or macro uses conds in disguise 08:14:21 somehow 08:16:21 DT``: (any (lambda(x) (eq? x 'lol)) '(lol rofl)) 08:16:31 whoops, sorry DT``. thought you were the bot :D 08:16:44 lewis1711, ; Value: #t 08:16:49 ^_^ 08:16:53 lewis1711: AND and OR usually use IF behind the scenes. 08:17:15 rudybot, (syntax->datum (expand-once #'(or #t #f))) 08:17:17 DT``: ; Value: (let ((or-part #t)) (if or-part or-part (or #f))) 08:17:29 this is what `or' does (in Racket, at least). 08:40:49 -!- pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-4dbecaf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: "Neue config in Irssi aktivieren ;)"] 08:41:20 pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-4dbecaf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 08:50:16 Sgeo__ [~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 08:52:00 -!- vk0 [~vk@ip-23-75.bnaa.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:53:42 -!- Sgeo_ [~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:53:54 vk0 [~vk@ip-23-75.bnaa.dk] has joined #scheme 08:57:25 gremset_ [ubuntu@117.192.110.221] has joined #scheme 08:58:11 -!- gremset [ubuntu@117.192.98.7] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:00:42 -!- no-name- [~no-name@11.228.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has quit [] 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joined #scheme 12:50:58 -!- DT`` [~Feeock@net-93-149-56-178.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:52:00 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 12:56:18 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 12:58:12 wingo [~wingo@194.56.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #scheme 12:59:13 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:02:49 -!- misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:03:44 ymasory [~ymasory@c-76-99-55-224.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 13:04:07 DT`` [~Feeock@net-93-149-75-77.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has joined #scheme 13:04:27 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:09:31 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:11:03 stepnem [~stepnem@176.119.broadband10.iol.cz] has joined #scheme 13:11:33 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:12:19 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:15:26 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Excess Flood] 13:15:55 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:20:19 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:23:32 amoe [~amoe@cpc1-brig13-0-0-cust658.3-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #scheme 13:24:13 eli: what did you mean here? http://lists.scheme-reports.org/pipermail/scheme-reports/2011-May/000886.html 13:24:14 http://tinyurl.com/69nj8zj 13:25:19 I get that you think counting implementations is bogus, but racket does actually support >2-arg string=?, right? 13:30:25 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:30:25 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:30:52 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:33:28 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 13:34:07 -!- xwl [~user@123.108.223.27] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:34:28 -!- samth_away is now known as samth 13:35:57 rudybot, eval (require racket/string) 13:35:58 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:35:58 samth: your sandbox is ready 13:35:59 samth: Done. 13:36:09 rudybot, eval (string=? "foo" "foo" "foo") 13:36:09 samth: ; Value: #t 13:36:15 amoe, so yes 13:36:20 -!- mejja [~chatzilla@c-0eb9e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 4.0.1/20110413222027]] 13:36:22 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 13:36:50 samth: yeah, I know. I just didn't really get Eli's point with the mail... 13:38:32 I guess he is analogizing the testing of features across multiple implementations to (apply string=? list-of-scheme-implementations) 13:38:47 was a bit over my head though, lol 13:40:32 does scheme have a core set of functions from which the whole language can be made? if so...what are they?:) 13:40:58 lewis1711, your question is not precise enough to give a useful answer to 13:41:15 (a) the lambda-calculus is turing complete 13:41:42 (b) lots of forms provide new expressive power in the sense of felleisen's paper 13:42:02 but those aren't always functions (eg, set!) 13:42:35 (c) with macros, it's possible to reduce scheme to a small set of core syntactic forms 13:42:56 but some of the procedures those forms rely on are fundamental and can't be implemented in the language 13:47:52 ah yes, I forgot about macros 13:47:55 anyway sleep time now 13:47:59 -!- lewis1711 [~lewis@125-239-253-151.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has left 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[Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:53:07 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-146-61.vinet.ba] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:58:01 -!- ymasory [~ymasory@frank.ldc.upenn.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:00:27 foof: IIUC, when Chibi is compiled statically, all bindings defined from C code are added to the global environment, right? If so, I'd like to fix this -- could you give me some hints how one would go about it? 16:02:12 (I have a vague idea involving a registry of statically compiled library initializers, and change the `include-shared' module form to use that in static builds instead of being a no-op) 16:02:39 *rotty* needs to go shopping (modules are hard ;-), BBL 16:04:33 -!- kuribas [~user@d54C43D8A.access.telenet.be] has left #scheme 16:04:38 That's correct, and I consider compiling in the modules statically a fairly minor feature so am not too excited about making that any more complicated than it needs to be :) 16:05:11 pyrony [~epic@office1.klout.com] has joined #scheme 16:05:32 -!- alaricsp [~alaric@geniedb.hotdesktop.biz] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:07:23 alaricsp [~alaric@94-194-200-54.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 16:08:05 foof: in my context, compiling statically is the only option; and having the bindings injected in the global namespace breaks otherwise-working code. 16:08:12 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-146-61.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 16:08:14 HG` [~HG@p5DC04DAF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 16:08:45 so, IMHO, it "needs to be" a tad more complicated. 16:11:07 as an example, I have recently added the `(chibi ast)' module to my build, as it's needed for SRFI 99. This introduced a global `lambda?' binding, which broke a module of mine, which happend to reference `lambda?' from inside a procedure, which was defined later in that module. 16:12:03 all that having the effect that my `lambda?' wasn't called anymore, leading to a slightly obscure bug. 16:12:13 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-131-30.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:13:16 foof: so, if I can provide a patch that doesn't complicate things too much, would you be willing to accept it? 16:17:07 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-146-61.vinet.ba] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:17:29 -!- superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-110-188.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: superjudge] 16:20:03 foof: re: loop's let, for now my use case for it is just avoiding the extra level of indentation, nothing else 16:22:28 jewel [~jewel@196-215-88-79.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 16:24:31 foof: ah, one more thing, a fix for C string escapes in your `fmt' library: 16:30:45 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[~gravicapp@ppp91-77-182-160.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 20:00:23 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 20:02:44 -!- Checkie [14695@unaffiliated/checkie] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:07:04 rudybot: eval (values 1 (list (values 1 2 3)) 3) 20:07:05 leppie: your sandbox is ready 20:07:05 leppie: error: context expected 1 value, received 3 values: 1 2 3 20:07:46 I wish my scheme could do that :( 20:08:05 Does anyone here know of a sexp->css package? 20:08:51 ecraven: I believe I did see something on Hacker News in the last 2 months, but it was for some shorthand form of CSS 20:09:21 -!- minsa [~minsa@24.5.121.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:10:34 leppie: What would you expect it to do? 20:11:36 ecraven: http://www.nongnu.org/scss/ ? 20:13:14 edw: multiple values are simply wrapped in a record in IronScheme, meaning for me to be 100% correct, I would need to check for that record type on every evaluation :( 20:13:57 not efficient 20:14:41 And not entirely sensical, IMO. 20:14:51 ijp: thanks! 20:15:19 If a sequence of multiple values is a first class value, then... My head just exploded. 20:15:33 peterhil [~peterhil@a91-152-135-21.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 20:16:30 rdd [~user@c83-250-52-16.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #scheme 20:19:10 another alternative is to just emit invalid bytecode and let the CLR runtime explode 20:20:18 or maybe just write it in C/ASM and become the 47th Scheme implementation in C 20:23:56 there must be more than 47 ... 20:24:35 not that does it properly ;] 20:28:37 -!- ymasory [~ymasory@128.91.39.26] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:33:04 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:38:26 -!- EM03 [~dfsdfdsf@unaffiliated/em03] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:40:34 -!- djcb [~user@a88-112-253-18.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:40:48 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:45:05 tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 20:45:23 EM03_ 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