00:09:43 annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 00:09:43 -!- annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:09:43 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 00:12:05 jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 00:30:24 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 00:32:24 -!- ASau [~user@95-26-92-70.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:33:32 lewis1711 [~lewis@222-155-31-117.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #scheme 00:35:23 http://paste.pocoo.org/show/303365/ I don't understand the distinction between these two functions 00:35:37 nothing 00:35:49 the second is syntactic sugar for the first one 00:36:27 right. I saw it written in a book and thought it was pretty redundant 00:42:20 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-140-116-252.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:47:13 woot, I just "made up" my first bit of scheme that did something other than print out square roots 00:48:39 now write a MMORPG! 00:49:22 actually half considering using scheme as a scripting language 00:49:38 for a roguelike thing I never seem to finish 00:50:21 scheme was supposed to be the scripting language of choice for gnu 00:50:42 other than gimp i dont know what projects use it (well emacs uses emacs lisp..) 00:51:05 -!- Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:51:17 yeah there's guile or some such 00:51:20 yea 00:51:30 annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 00:51:30 -!- annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:51:30 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 00:52:09 do all schemes allow you to use "", or is that just a racket thing? it's very pretty 00:53:05 i guess a lot of them don't 00:53:15 it just matters if the scheme can read utf-8 and do something with it 00:53:42 ah. I guess utf-8 would be very implementation specific 00:55:22 i dont think scheme requires implementations to read in utf-8 (or any unicode mode) 00:55:27 at least r5rs 00:56:39 groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has joined #scheme 01:00:08 -!- peddie [~peddie@XVM-107.MIT.EDU] has quit [Quit: peace!] 01:01:00 peddie [~peddie@XVM-107.MIT.EDU] has joined #scheme 01:03:57 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 01:04:14 annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 01:04:22 -!- annodomini [~lambda@c-65-96-220-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 01:04:22 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 01:07:39 exbctel [9a145bb2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.154.20.91.178] has joined #scheme 01:07:59 -!- exbctel [9a145bb2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.154.20.91.178] has left #scheme 01:22:36 Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-27-34-218.bois.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 01:29:07 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:29:24 Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 01:29:38 is there something like lambda-syntax; such that i can do, say, ((lambda-syntax )) without having to name the thing? 01:30:58 No, but in some systems (MIT Scheme, riaxpander) you can do ((let-syntax ((foo ...)) foo) ...), so you could define (lambda-syntax ...) to expand into (let-syntax ((x ...)) x). 01:32:47 Riastradh: good idea; something like that had occurred to me. interesting, though, that there's no precedent; are niladic macros rare? 01:33:21 Oh, niladic macros? What would you do with those? 01:34:43 ASau [~user@95-26-92-70.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 01:36:00 exactly: i'm (ab)using define-for-syntax to define a list of foreign datatypes; and using macros as a convenient mechanism to define foreign constructors and translation tables. 01:36:10 the convenience macros are niladic. 01:37:51 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 01:38:37 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:39:45 e.g. given, say, CS_INT, CS_BINARY; they define a make-CS_INT*, make-CS_BINARY*, sizeof-CS_INT, sizeof-CS_BINARY, etc. (ugly, i know.) 01:39:52 Niladic hygienic macros are probably useless. I can't think of anything I'd want to do with them. 01:40:57 (Not counting identifier syntax.) 01:41:29 am I right in thinking that scheme makes no distinction between operators and functions? they're both procedures? 01:41:55 What's an "operator"? 01:42:18 + / - * usually 01:42:19 Correct, there is no such thing as an "operator" per se in scheme 01:42:36 good. the concept of operators always irritated me. 01:42:50 There are procedures named things like +, -, etc. which happen to do what you might expect, though :) 01:42:51 parentheses, i think, are the closest thing we have to "operators"; but they do refer to x in (x 1 ...) as being in the "operator position". 01:42:59 Those are ordinary functions. There are some other things traditionally called "operators" that are syntax, e.g. `and' and `or'. 01:43:37 hmm 01:43:54 q.v. 01:46:29 chandler: couldn't we say that `(' is a prefix operator; and `)', postfix? 01:46:48 ha 01:47:59 We call the position of `foo' in (foo x y z) the `operator position', and we call `foo' an operator. 01:48:25 `foo' might be an expression itself, or it might be a special operator, naming a macro or primitive syntax. 01:49:03 (The positions of the `x', `y', and `z' are called `operand positions', and we call `x', `y', and `z' the operands.) 01:51:44 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-78-35-171-89.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:51:44 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-35-171-89.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:58:17 are scheme lists linked lists, or this implementation-dependent? 01:58:30 They are linked lists. 01:59:16 theyre made up of pairs, the car of the pair points to an element, and the cdr of the pair points to the next pair 01:59:43 aha 02:00:00 oh, it says that right here in the next section, my bad:) 02:07:07 -!- summersault [~george@189.107.132.152] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:08:47 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-11-168.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:11:51 summersault [~george@189.107.132.152] has joined #scheme 02:18:30 -!- turbofail [~user@adsl-99-50-22-193.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:19:57 -!- Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:23:00 -!- summersault [~george@189.107.132.152] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:25:10 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 02:25:19 dfkjjkfd [~paulh@145.120.22.32] has joined #scheme 02:25:36 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has joined #scheme 02:25:59 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 02:28:53 -!- drdo [~user@2.208.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:28 drdo [~user@2.208.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #scheme 02:35:03 Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 02:35:49 bzzbzz_ [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 02:39:45 Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has joined #scheme 02:40:43 danking_ [~danking@zerowing.ccs.neu.edu] has joined #scheme 02:41:30 -!- Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:41:48 puddingpimp_ [bpcchha@118-93-191-204.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 02:42:09 tonyg_ [~tonyg@navarone.ccs.neu.edu] has joined #scheme 02:43:35 ravi [~ravi@118-92-129-45.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 02:43:44 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:43:44 -!- danking [~danking@zerowing.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:43:44 -!- puddingpimp [pftdgid@118-93-191-204.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:43:44 -!- chemuduguntar [~ravi@118-92-129-45.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:43:44 -!- tonyg [~tonyg@navarone.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:54:27 Riastradh [debian-tor@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 02:55:07 -!- kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.238.3.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:01:22 -!- yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li14-39.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me] 03:07:05 hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw501177.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 03:30:23 -!- hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw501177.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:33:38 -!- ravi is now known as chemuduguntar 03:33:44 -!- Bridge|A is now known as Bridge| 03:34:43 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #scheme 03:39:23 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Client Quit] 03:42:13 -!- Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-27-34-218.bois.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:52:35 timj__ [~timj@e176193093.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #scheme 03:56:05 -!- timj_ [~timj@e176193044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:58:01 -!- lewis1711 [~lewis@222-155-31-117.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has left #scheme 04:03:41 smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #scheme 04:09:55 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-193.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:12:55 -!- acarrico [~acarrico@pppoe-68-142-43-164.gmavt.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:30:46 xuan [~xuan@123.139.96.113] has joined #scheme 04:37:40 hello,I am newer. 04:38:46 can I use emacs to edit and run scheme?is there any tutor for that? 04:39:29 I use Edwin before,but I want to try emacs 04:45:02 -!- xuan [~xuan@123.139.96.113] has left #scheme 04:53:36 -!- pygospa [~pygospa@kiel-4d066f3c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:55:13 pygospa [~pygospa@kiel-4d067e41.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 04:55:44 DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has joined #scheme 04:59:14 -!- smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: smtlaissezfaire] 05:16:33 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:28:04 xuan [~xuan@123.139.96.113] has joined #scheme 05:37:22 -!- groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has quit [Quit: groovy2shoes] 05:41:30 -!- DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:44:46 smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #scheme 05:46:01 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-233-135.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:56:57 yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 05:57:50 groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has joined #scheme 06:01:33 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has joined #scheme 06:01:59 -!- groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has quit [Client Quit] 06:13:58 nilg [~user@85.239.138.109] has joined #scheme 06:14:31 -!- yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me] 06:14:42 yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 06:17:51 -!- Bridge| is now known as Bridge|A 06:25:14 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 06:31:03 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:40:34 minsa [~minsa@c-24-5-121-157.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:41:05 -!- xuan [~xuan@123.139.96.113] has left #scheme 06:44:03 -!- smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: smtlaissezfaire] 06:49:59 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-11-168.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 06:51:30 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-208.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:59:49 smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #scheme 07:00:04 DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has joined #scheme 07:00:51 Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-158-125.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 07:31:10 -!- smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: smtlaissezfaire] 07:31:13 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:35:12 kar8nga [~kar8nga@k-224.vc-graz.ac.at] has joined #scheme 07:36:15 smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #scheme 07:38:12 -!- smtlaissezfaire [~smtlaisse@user-387hbid.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Client Quit] 07:49:21 mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 07:53:23 -!- mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:53:23 -!- incubot [incubot@klutometis.wikitex.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:07:07 -!- DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:10:39 mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 08:19:08 -!- mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:42:50 -!- kar8nga [~kar8nga@k-224.vc-graz.ac.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:47:42 kar8nga [~kar8nga@k-224.vc-graz.ac.at] has joined #scheme 09:01:42 -!- kar8nga [~kar8nga@k-224.vc-graz.ac.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:14:37 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 09:35:09 Oejet [~oejet@212.45.122.120] has joined #scheme 09:48:07 mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 09:52:19 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:13:09 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:18:50 HG` [~HG@85.8.74.252] has joined #scheme 10:19:21 nmg [~nick@dsl78-143-206-229.in-addr.fast.co.uk] has joined #scheme 10:28:56 what's wrong ? : (let ([x 'a]) (list a)) 10:29:41 incubot: (let ([x 'a]) (list a)) 10:30:21 -!- nilg [~user@85.239.138.109] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:37:10 -!- HG` [~HG@85.8.74.252] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:39:05 mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 10:42:28 mathk [~mathk@lns-bzn-30-82-253-189-161.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 10:43:33 kar8nga [~kar8nga@78.104.81.221] has joined #scheme 10:47:10 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-140-116-252.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 11:00:25 turns out r5rs doesn't support that, the [ 11:00:50 -!- puddingpimp_ is now known as puddingpimp 11:05:21 jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-208.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 11:08:03 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:10:45 nilg [~user@85.239.138.109] has joined #scheme 11:11:16 morning, schemers. 11:16:21 -!- annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Quit: annodomini] 11:20:54 zhulikas [zhulikas@3e6b7b31.rev.stofanet.dk] has joined #scheme 11:21:52 can you suggest me a scheme compiler/interpreter for linux? 11:22:02 I need something for SICP lectures 11:23:52 anyone? 11:25:21 MIT/GNU Scheme or Racket + the sicp packages at http://planet.plt-scheme.org/ 11:25:58 thanks 11:26:00 but really any implementation will do for 90% 11:26:24 yeah I just do not know which one to pick 11:27:39 if you want me to choose for you, Racket 11:29:30 uhm 11:29:37 Racket is a programming language. <-- this doesn't sound very well 11:31:16 it's main programming language is slightly different than standard scheme, so they rebranded it 11:31:43 or slightly different and very extended I should say 11:32:10 but with the sicp package it acts exactly as SICP expects 11:33:07 -!- drdo [~user@2.208.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:38:19 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:39:35 racket has some different sicp packages 11:39:41 i counted three 11:41:11 mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 11:44:55 -!- mathk [~mathk@lns-bzn-30-82-253-189-161.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:50:07 mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.197] has joined #scheme 11:51:19 -!- Euthydemus [~euthydemu@vaxjo7.80.cust.blixtvik.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:56:52 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:57:23 mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 11:59:42 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Client Quit] 12:04:07 ok, i got racket running, thanks 12:15:42 Yay! 12:16:41 femtoo [~femto@95-89-197-196-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #scheme 12:17:14 mathk_ [~mathk@lns-bzn-22-82-249-93-50.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 12:19:36 choas [~lars@p5792CD0F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 12:20:29 -!- mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:20:29 -!- mathk_ is now known as mathk 12:32:55 alaricsp [~alaric@relief.warhead.org.uk] has joined #scheme 12:42:36 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-52.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 12:51:55 -!- jao [~user@75.Red-79-145-118.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 12:51:55 jao [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #scheme 12:57:26 -!- femtoo [~femto@95-89-197-196-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:57:32 -!- Caleb-- [~caleb@109.64.6.190] has quit [] 12:59:33 Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.175.41] has joined #scheme 13:00:33 dzhus [~sphinx@95-24-188-184.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 13:01:19 -!- dzhus [~sphinx@95-24-188-184.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:03:18 bitweiler [~bitweiler@adsl-99-40-236-82.dsl.stl2mo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 13:03:52 dzhus [~sphinx@95-28-205-189.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 13:04:19 good day 13:08:29 DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has joined #scheme 13:08:57 -!- dfkjjkfd [~paulh@145.120.22.32] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:11:30 oh, hello sun shine 13:16:13 Gmind: off work today hopefully I can build larceny 13:16:35 another new Scheme implementation ? 13:16:56 not new, but yes 13:17:21 will you build it in .NET ? :P 13:18:18 no, on netbsd 13:22:07 (eq? (+ Girl MakeUp ) (Dangerous) ) 13:23:40 dzhus89 [~sphinx@95-27-69-167.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 13:24:24 hat is so not true 13:24:28 that, even 13:24:38 I have applied makeup before without becoming more dangerous 13:24:43 -!- dzhus [~sphinx@95-28-205-189.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:24:45 =)) oops 13:24:52 I forgot u r girl 13:25:34 this channel become dangerous from now =)) 13:26:46 :P 13:27:39 -!- dzhus89 [~sphinx@95-27-69-167.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:27:49 what make a girl come to Scheme programming ? 13:28:07 what make a girl come to programming ? 13:28:16 that's more general question :D 13:28:18 what make a boy ask stupid questions? 13:28:31 Bremner: Curious 13:28:31 bremner, girls 13:28:41 Gmind: to answer that question, ask yourself: "What makes a boy come to Scheme programming?" 13:29:51 elly: sorry, it's because in my country, there are very few. So I feel a bit suprised 13:30:04 ( I mean a little) 13:30:30 in 25 people class we have only one girl on our computer science course 13:30:30 there are not many female programmers in the US either, as far as I know 13:30:47 the answer to your question, zhulikas, is that I like it 13:30:55 @zhuilkas: that's what I am talking about =)) my class has no girl 13:31:08 ls 13:31:16 argh, speaking of stupid 13:31:27 maybe that girl in our class is smart. After all image how much attention she gets... 13:31:34 imagine* 13:31:57 so that may have been a smart move to choose CS studies 13:32:46 by that reasoning, jumping into the gorilla cage carrying an armload of bannanas is smart. 13:33:23 that's certainly unique 13:33:27 =)) 13:33:31 hehe, yes :) 13:35:31 in our school Woman day, only lucky class has girl to make something special, others just have gays to do so =)) 13:36:02 masm [~masm@bl15-233-135.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 13:36:03 haha :D 13:36:33 what 13:36:43 that's not how gender works :P 13:36:52 so Elly, your class is lucky 13:36:56 ;) 13:37:03 I don't have a class 13:37:17 oh =.=!, you graduated ? 13:37:23 yes, a while ago 13:37:28 I have a job now 13:38:34 woow...i seem to be very young here ..:-s 13:39:47 elly: is your job related to Scheme ? :P 13:41:59 no :P 13:42:04 I wish it was 13:42:14 I spend most of my days writing C 13:42:22 which is not so bad, as it goes, but isn't Scheme 13:42:26 >. (just in my view) 13:42:46 I do not mind it :) I am doing interesting stuff 13:43:57 which is...? 13:44:06 kernel and driver hacking 13:44:28 elly: Nice :D 13:44:36 *zhulikas* rethinks his understanding of 'interesting stuff' 13:45:09 I thought for example game programming is interesting stuff 13:45:44 @elly: Linux kernel ? 13:45:49 zhulikas: it depends on the person 13:45:57 sure 13:46:41 Cool 13:47:18 I got a chance to make hello world in kernel mode too, somewhat interesting 13:47:18 Gmind: yes, linux kernel 13:49:18 "Funny in the Head", schemers have some humor 13:51:31 -!- Oejet [~oejet@212.45.122.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:52:37 bitweiler: yeah :D 13:57:36 wish I could collect all peoples here birthday to analysis the relation between their personalities and the programming language they work :P 13:57:48 (in) 14:02:21 drdo [~user@2.208.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #scheme 14:04:24 tupi [~david@186.205.37.15] has joined #scheme 14:05:34 can anyone suggest me more resources like SICP? Resource, which teaches not a specific language, but computer science in general 14:06:20 zhulikas: how about htdp.org ? 14:06:38 I think it's more pretty for beginner ( like me ) 14:07:59 well, I have some experience in programming, but as I see my knowledge is almost worthless comparing with stuff taught in SICP 14:08:02 nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-20-62.w86-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 14:08:29 -!- kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-46-120.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:08:55 I haven't read SICP much, but for some skim reading, I see that SCIP got a lot in Math solving :P 14:09:24 which my Discrete Math teacher touch me most 14:09:34 I wish I could know Scheme sooner 14:09:54 so I can solve some thing when I was learning DM 14:10:02 I see that programming in one way or another is math solving 14:10:26 so I find such resource as SICP very attractive 14:10:38 r u a teacher ? 14:10:47 why would you think so? 14:11:19 no. I'm not :) 14:13:05 :) 14:13:21 I'm just more into theoretical computer science than into programming. At least it looks like for me, because solving difficult algorithms is much more enjoyable for me than programming real-life programs. 14:14:10 I'm on the first year in university btw 14:16:17 so noone can suggest a decent resource in computer science which is more about science than about programming? :( 14:17:09 groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has joined #scheme 14:21:02 -!- DrDuck [~duck@66-168-225-64.static.mtgm.al.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:21:32 zhulikas: the library! :-=) 14:21:35 may be "Introduce to Software Engineering 14:24:33 zhulikas: why don't u come to ACM competition ? 14:24:44 that's certainly your favor place :P 14:25:04 zhulikas: HtDP http://www.htdp.org/ 14:25:26 elly: that's what I suggested =)) . A sweet guide 14:25:50 Hope my ordered book won't be worst than htdp 14:25:53 oh, okay, I didn't see 14:26:22 elly: is this your real name ? :P 14:27:29 Gmind, maybe I will try it next year :) 14:27:41 -!- mathk [~mathk@lns-bzn-22-82-249-93-50.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:28:39 tokam [~tokam@p57B8EA99.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 14:28:53 what does this funny error message tell me? 14:28:54 foldr : third argument must be of type , given list 14:30:32 zhulikas: or OS and NW are both related to computer science too 14:30:58 tokam: can you show us the code? 14:32:00 I fixed this is was cs 14:32:07 cos I had a weird wrong list as param to a function. 14:32:20 are you intressted in the code eitherway to fix the error message? 14:32:32 which scheme are you using? 14:32:43 HTPD -> advanced with lambda 14:32:49 HTDP 14:33:36 -!- alaricsp [~alaric@relief.warhead.org.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:34:17 -!- nilg [~user@85.239.138.109] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:35:35 nilg [~user@85.239.138.109] has joined #scheme 14:40:43 -!- minsa [~minsa@c-24-5-121-157.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:40:57 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #scheme 14:45:56 Oejet [~oejet@212.45.122.120] has joined #scheme 14:49:25 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:51:55 -!- Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.175.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:03:37 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 15:03:54 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Client Quit] 15:04:12 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 15:05:26 Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.175.41] has joined #scheme 15:05:52 -!- tokam [~tokam@p57B8EA99.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:10:53 araujo [~araujo@190.38.50.25] has joined #scheme 15:10:53 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.38.50.25] has quit [Changing host] 15:10:53 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #scheme 15:18:12 if I ever leave this Script alive ... 15:26:21 mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.98] has joined #scheme 15:26:22 -!- mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.98] has quit [Client Quit] 15:26:32 mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.98] has joined #scheme 15:27:27 Gmind: A more constructive question to ask elly is, "G'day, do you miss Australia?" 15:27:51 =)) 15:27:58 lol cky , can you do 1st ? 15:28:03 (/me still remembers the banners at Sydney airport, "G'day, welcome home". Awwww.) 15:28:07 cky: :) 15:28:12 *cky* is a New Zealander, but I still greet everyone with g'day. 15:28:20 My workmates now mimic my greeting when they see me. 15:28:21 :-P 15:28:28 elly: :-) 15:28:30 mathk_ [~mathk@lns-bzn-22-82-249-93-50.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 15:28:36 *Gmind* lol 15:28:58 elly: So, there's the question...do you miss Australia? I miss New Zealand a fair bit. 15:29:12 *Gmind* are cky & elly workmate ? 15:29:16 Gmind: No. 15:29:35 oops, so that 's how "/me" 15:29:51 Hahahahaha. 15:29:53 :P 15:31:40 that's very friendly 15:31:51 What's very friendly? G'day? Yep. 15:32:02 -!- mathk [~mathk@194.177.62.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:32:02 -!- mathk_ is now known as mathk 15:32:09 elly: how do u feel about cky greeting =)) ? 15:32:26 cky: From Gmind : Gday 15:32:29 =)) 15:32:40 (just my humor) 15:34:04 Gmind: G'day is the standard greeting used in Australia and New Zealand; it's a bit like hey or hi in other English-speaking countries. :-P 15:34:31 really ? 15:34:32 cky: honestly? no 15:34:52 so it belong to culture 15:34:57 cky: Australia is a surprisingly backward place - I wouldn't be able to marry my primary partner there, for example 15:34:59 like "OhayO" 15:35:39 (same-sex marriage is federally illegal in Australia) 15:35:43 primary... so secondary could be from Australia I assume... 15:35:53 elly: =)) 15:35:59 oh 15:36:05 elly: did you mean you are l.. ? 15:36:06 that changes everything 15:36:48 elly: ...most states in the US won't let you either, but you can move to New Zealand! 15:37:00 elly: Technically there's no same-sex marriage in New Zealand either, but they do have civil unions. 15:37:51 ;)) 15:38:01 elly: (If you're in a state in the US with same-sex marriage and/or civil unions, yay you!) 15:38:16 cky: or I could stay in MA :) 15:38:23 elly: :-D 15:38:34 Gmind: my primary partner is also female, yes 15:38:35 I would love to move to Boston. 15:38:41 cky: if elly went to New Zealand, would you change your sex for her ? :D 15:38:42 Or, thereabouts. 15:38:57 Gmind: ...what kind of question is that?! I'm married, BTW. 15:39:15 :P 15:39:19 cky: Boston is a wonderful city 15:39:28 'LGBT capital of the east coast' 15:39:29 cky: just joking , sorry that I don't know you got married :P 15:39:42 elly: That would be a huge part of the appeal for me. 15:39:50 elly: Just like why I love San Francisco too. 15:40:08 Gmind: "Got" married? In a week and a half we'd have been married 4 years. 15:40:13 :-P 15:40:21 well, I don't expect to meet too many people that is elder than me ( or even got married ) 15:40:26 Gmind: I'm 30. 15:40:47 (Though, every year since 24, I celebrate my 24th birthday. :-P) 15:41:02 that's nice 15:41:38 I haven't made any celebs from around 10 years 15:42:23 *elly* is 21 15:42:23 (in fact, I like to be silent in my birthday , peacefully ) 15:42:58 *Gmind* is 20 15:43:11 Younguns. :-P 15:44:16 *zhulikas* is 19 15:44:31 yay ! 15:44:35 *zhulikas* is the youngest! 15:44:42 Hahahaha. 15:45:03 I went to university at 16, and I was the youngest in my class for pretty much all of my degree. 15:45:18 Obviously, that was a long time ago. 15:45:25 you have some special powers or what? 15:45:46 Is boredom a special power? ;-) 15:46:05 hardworking and non-procrastinating is. 15:46:13 Well, I'm neither of those. 15:46:30 I slept through many of my lectures because I spent too much time online the night before. :-P 15:47:03 -!- Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.175.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:47:14 I started my degree with a CS major, then got too bored by the second year and changed my major to statistics. 15:47:25 cky: loss :P 15:47:30 *elly* was CS+Math 15:47:38 I <3 stats; I actually got to work on the R interpreter for my honours project. 15:47:45 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-140-116-252.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:47:51 You know, the stats programming language that was created at University of Auckland? :-P 15:47:55 I do, yes 15:47:58 :-D 15:49:08 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-20-67.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:49:38 And I remember Ross telling me about how R was internally implemented like Scheme, with closures and cons cells and all that, and I was like, Scheme, what's that? :-P 15:49:59 mmm, scheme 15:50:03 :-D 15:50:10 I picked up scheme when I was 12 or so 15:50:36 Lucky you. :-) I wish I was more open-minded back then. 15:50:50 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-93.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 15:51:30 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-208.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:51:37 jewel_ [~jewel@196-210-134-54.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 15:54:24 I wish I was interested in programming when I was 12 :( 15:54:53 Caleb-- [~caleb@109.64.6.190] has joined #scheme 15:55:04 me too, I wasn't interested until I was 20 15:55:13 such a loss. 15:55:21 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-20-67.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 15:55:28 I was interested in BASIC when I was 12. 15:55:53 If only I had a time machine, I would go back and show myself all the cooler things. 15:55:59 hehe :) 15:56:26 I wouldn't even pick computer science 15:56:31 my family couldn't afford computers when I was younger 15:58:57 I'd give my mother the lambda papers to read to me in the womb. 15:59:02 what would you pick 15:59:21 Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has joined #scheme 15:59:47 math, or music 15:59:57 *bitweiler* chuckles 16:00:16 they have a lot in common ;) 16:01:02 I'm just hoping the build works out 16:04:51 dzhus [~sphinx@93-80-178-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 16:07:36 annodomini [~lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has joined #scheme 16:14:06 darn, I should have grab some beer while I was out earlier 16:14:16 mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 16:14:42 :P 16:14:45 that's right 16:15:40 -!- nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-20-62.w86-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:16:07 hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw305048.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 16:16:12 listening to PS: I love you OST 16:19:23 homie [~user@xdsl-78-35-141-10.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 16:22:44 wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-35-141-10.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 16:24:06 -!- mmc [~michal@cs27120227.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:24:09 (boolean? (love you me) #t) 16:24:51 that does not look right 16:26:01 kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.238.3.145] has joined #scheme 16:26:39 :P ya ,I am trying to learn this by associating things with real life 16:26:44 can you fix it ? 16:26:46 Gmind, I'm sorry to say, but you fail at love 16:27:16 *bitweiler* grins 16:27:29 BOOLEAN? only takes one argument, I think 16:27:30 zhulikas: u're right , my GF left me for last 5 months, god, it's been 5 months 16:28:03 why the hell have I brought this up... 16:28:19 alaricsp [~alaric@relief.warhead.org.uk] has joined #scheme 16:28:34 elly: I though (love you me) return boolean ? oops... os it should be (eq? (love you me ) #t) 16:29:26 "=" and "eq?" are equally or the same ? 16:30:07 its easier to take math for examples 16:30:17 love is too complicated :D 16:31:19 Zhulikas: :P ya, but what emotion you have got in the past will even make you remember it longer than what you learned by math logic 16:31:38 (i mean *whatever) 16:32:24 yeah :) 16:34:00 *cky* learnt assembly, then C, at 14. But had no exposure to Scheme till my 20s. Such a shame. 16:34:13 (map (lambda (x) (eval-price x)) quote ( desk lamp car lappy dog )) 16:34:40 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@pD951FA6C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 16:34:46 cky, you make me feel stupid 16:34:52 stop that 16:34:59 Gmind: eq? and = are different. = is for numeric comparisons. eq? is for identity comparison (well, I'm sure it's not called that in the Scheme world, but in Java, it's equivalent to ==). 16:35:00 cky: it's cool that you learnt Asm 1st =)) 16:35:05 I must admit that 16:35:13 Gmind: I didn't. I learnt Quick Basic even earlier than that. 16:35:24 Gmind: But that's irrelevant to my programming career, unlike assembly and C. 16:36:46 elly: (map (lambda (x) (eval-price x)) quote ( desk lamp car lappy dog )) can return another list if the item in my list is define earlierm, can't it ? 16:37:49 Gmind: Your question makes no sense at all. 16:38:35 mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 16:38:56 *Gmind* when I was a child , I played with Lego and Robot 16:39:13 cky: :)) 16:39:29 cky: is that too ambitious ? 16:40:08 so what am asking is if I define those "item" my list , then make that function 16:40:27 will it return me another list of items price ? 16:40:49 Let me see if I understood your question. You want to know if "map" returns a new list? (It does.) 16:44:29 -!- kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.238.3.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:45:11 cky: IF : those items in my list is defined earlier 16:47:44 Okay, let's try reinterpreting the question. :-) 16:48:02 If you were to run: (map eval-price '(desk lamp car lappy dog)), then the result would be the same as: 16:48:20 (list (eval-price 'desk) (eval-price 'lamp) (eval-price 'car) (eval-price 'lappy) (eval-price 'dog)) 16:48:25 Is that that you're asking? 16:49:09 and can I get those values into another list ? 16:49:17 Those values _are_ in a new list. 16:59:55 sajith [~sajith@117.196.151.203] has joined #scheme 17:00:41 I want my "eval-price" to return me "Car" value 17:00:47 ws [wswieb@akson.sgh.waw.pl] has joined #scheme 17:01:16 can I define it like : (define eval-price (lambda (x) (number? x) x) 17:02:00 oops (define eval-price (lambda (x) (eq? (number? x) #t) x)) 17:02:08 -!- groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has quit [Quit: groovy2shoes] 17:02:37 You never need to compare a predicate with #t or #f. 17:04:06 will this work ? (define eval-price (lambda (x) (x) x)) 17:04:19 No, unless x is a function. 17:04:49 -!- vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.107.172] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:06:55 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-45-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:07:37 -!- kar8nga [~kar8nga@78.104.81.221] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:08:45 acarrico [~acarrico@pppoe-68-142-43-164.gmavt.net] has joined #scheme 17:09:00 this could return me the price (define eval-price (lambda (x) (eq? (number? x) #t) x)) 17:09:03 but 17:10:00 but what? 17:11:36 (define (show-price your-item-list) (map (lambda (x) (eval (eval-price x))) your-item-list)) 17:11:43 this won't return me a list of price 17:11:46 you do not need an eval there 17:11:54 and you do not need (eq? (number? x) t) 17:11:55 instead, it return a list of (car .... ) 17:11:56 er, #t 17:12:19 the eq? is just to make sure it's number :P 17:12:21 if (number? x) is #t, then (eq (number? x) #t) will be #t as well, and if (number? x) is #f, then (eq (number? x) #t) will be #f as well 17:12:41 so just do (define (eval-price x) (if (number? x) x (error "not number"))) 17:12:43 Gmind: and if it's not a number what do you do? 17:12:58 I won't return it 17:13:10 in my list 17:13:10 Yes, you returned it. 17:13:18 :( 17:13:27 Gmind: So, you want to use "filter" instead of "map", I gather? 17:13:30 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-45-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:13:47 cky: Who knows. Gmind keeps being totally inconsistent. 17:14:03 pjb: god, u r right :( it still return the value 17:14:12 perhaps it would help if you explained your overall goal in words 17:14:24 ok 17:14:30 that maybe easier 17:14:30 pjb: Indeed. 17:14:32 :P 17:14:50 I want to give my function a list of item 17:15:03 the price of each item is defined earlier 17:15:36 so now the function should get a list of items , then return a list of price 17:15:54 (defun prices-of-items (lambda (items) (map item-price items))) 17:16:04 like : input: ( car desk ...) => ( 10000 400 ...) 17:16:07 pjb: defun is a swearword in #scheme. :-P 17:16:12 Oops. 17:16:15 s/defun/define/ 17:16:21 I've got CL fingers. 17:16:24 Hehehehehe. 17:17:28 can use lambda with a list too ? 17:17:32 :O 17:17:34 rudybot: (define prices '((car . 10000) (desk . 400) (|#scheme| . priceless))) 17:17:37 cky: your racket sandbox is ready 17:17:38 cky: Done. 17:17:39 -!- ws [wswieb@akson.sgh.waw.pl] has left #scheme 17:17:52 rudybot: (map cdr prices) 17:17:52 cky: ; Value: (10000 400 priceless) 17:18:11 Gmind: you can pass any kind of object as argument to a function. 17:18:22 nice 17:18:29 cky: (define item-price cdr) perhaps, but never (map cdr prices)! 17:18:41 pjb: Fine. :-) 17:19:23 rudybot: (define item-price cdr) 17:19:23 cky: Done. 17:19:28 rudybot: (map item-price prices) 17:19:28 cky: ; Value: (10000 400 priceless) 17:19:34 pjb: Better? :-P 17:19:44 cky: yes. But your prices are really items. 17:19:57 Each item being defined by a name and a price. 17:20:01 (define item-prices prices) 17:20:05 rudybot:Q (define item-prices prices) 17:20:05 cky: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: Q in module: 'program 17:20:08 rudybot: (define item-prices prices) 17:20:09 cky: Done. 17:20:15 rudybot: (map item-price item-prices) 17:20:15 cky: ; Value: (10000 400 priceless) 17:20:55 (define make-item cons) (define item-name car) (define item-price cdr) (define items (list (make-item 'car 10000) (make-item 'desk 400) (make-item '|#scheme'| 'priceless))) 17:25:17 what does it mean to show me # ? 17:25:27 Gmind: It means it's a procedure. 17:25:50 rudybot: (list + - * / values map car cdr) 17:25:51 cky: ; Value: (# # # # # # # #) 17:26:41 pjb: I am trying to do this by 'map' 17:27:41 (define (eval-price x) x) 17:27:44 (define (show-price your-item-list) 17:27:46 (map (lambda (x) (eval (eval-price x))) your-item-list)) 17:27:48 pgimeno [~pgimeno@195-5-95-34.usul.arrakis.es] has joined #scheme 17:27:52 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-45-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:28:01 oops bypass that 'eval' 17:28:17 (define (show-price your-item-list) 17:28:19 (map (lambda (x) (eval-price item) your-item-list)) 17:29:00 item is not bound there 17:29:09 I suspect you just want: (map eval-price your-item-list) 17:29:17 yep 17:29:20 :D 17:30:24 but ridiculous 17:30:53 (map eval-price list-items) return all the items 17:30:59 not its price 17:31:02 =)) 17:32:24 groovy2shoes [~guv@unaffiliated/groovebot] has joined #scheme 17:33:10 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #scheme 17:34:47 that is because eval-price isn't returning the price of the item 17:34:57 (define (eval-price x) x) just returns the item itself 17:35:02 what do your items look like? 17:36:30 look like (define car 1000) 17:36:59 isn't that variable 'car' got the value '1000' ? 17:37:30 car is a function. 17:37:37 It takes a dotted pair and returns its first slot. 17:37:49 rudybot: eval car 17:37:49 cky: ; Value: # 17:38:10 rudybot: (car '(1 . 2)) 17:38:10 cky: ; Value: 1 17:38:40 =.=! oh.... I used the wrong example in scheme 17:38:56 Gmind: You should use an associative list or a hash to hold your items and their prices. 17:39:22 Gmind: My example, of using (define item-prices '((car . 10000) (desk . 400) (|#scheme| . priceless))) is an example of an associative list. 17:39:52 Gmind: You can use functions like (in this case) assq to look up an item in the alist. 17:40:06 (alist == associative list) 17:40:39 what if I define each item , then add them into a list ? 17:40:50 erAbuelo [~debianjok@unaffiliated/erabuelo] has joined #scheme 17:40:52 (or the user input each item ) 17:41:06 hi 17:41:29 Gmind: You can easily add items to an alist...the same way you add items to a list. 17:41:46 ciao 17:41:48 -!- erAbuelo [~debianjok@unaffiliated/erabuelo] has left #scheme 17:41:50 Gmind: Except that with an alist, you add a dotted pair, rather than any arbitrary thing. 17:42:32 can someone recommend a very simple (in code length and common functions used) substring finding function? 17:43:20 pgimeno: Sure. SRFI 13. 17:43:29 rudybot: (use srfi/13) 17:43:29 cky: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: use in module: 'program 17:43:34 rudybot: (require srfi/13) 17:43:34 cky: Done. 17:43:52 rudybot: (string-index "supercalifragilisticexpialidocious" "cali") 17:43:52 cky: error: Second param is neither char-set, char, or predicate procedure. # "cali" 17:43:59 Oh, whoops. 17:44:04 *cky* RTFMs. 17:44:20 It's called STRING-CONTAINS. 17:44:44 Gmind: what you should note is that it does not matter how you define your items and how you find the price of an item. 17:44:51 Riastradh: Thank you. 17:44:59 rudybot: (string-contains "supercalifragilisticexpialidocious" "cali") 17:44:59 cky: ; Value: 5 17:45:22 What matters is that you define the functions (make-item name price), (item-name item) --> name, (item-price item) --> price. 17:45:30 Gmind: then you can write: (define items (list (make-item 'car 10000) (make-item 'desk 400) (make-item '|#scheme'| 'priceless))) 17:45:40 Gmind: and (map item-price items). 17:46:08 thanks cky, but that's a bit overkill - is there a simpler one? 17:46:19 Euthydemus [~euthydemu@vaxjo7.80.cust.blixtvik.net] has joined #scheme 17:46:52 pgimeno: string-contains is overkill? What? 17:47:37 yes, I want it for inclusion in a GIMP script, and GIMP doesn't have that embedded. I want the code to be the shortest possible. 17:47:47 Can you be more specific about what you want to do, pgimeno? 17:48:59 Riastradh: something like: (contains-substring layername "(combine)") which just returns #t or #f would be enough for me 17:49:37 pgimeno: string-contains actually will do that job already: it returns an index if found, else #f. 17:50:59 yes I know, but it's not very brief - this one I made is shorter, I was wondering if it was possible to make an even shorter one: http://pastebin.com/se1W7XWS 17:51:44 *cky* pukes at all the set!s in the code. 17:52:34 sorry, I'm not used to Scheme at all 17:53:58 I'll see if I can cook up something. It's probably worse (in terms of performance) than string-contains, but, if you wanted concise, that's what you'll get. 17:55:13 rudybot: (display "Hello") 17:55:14 Gmind: your sandbox is ready 17:55:14 Gmind: ; stdout: "Hello" 17:56:23 heck, can I get some define in rudybot ? 17:56:23 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 17:57:57 cky: thanks, I'm targeting for concise and common functions used if possible (and no SRFI to include) - performance is not an issue as long as it doesn't take more than 0.1 seconds per call for short (max 64 chars) strings 17:58:16 rudybot: (unless ( > x 1000) ( display (+ x 1))) 17:58:17 Gmind: error: reference to undefined identifier: x 17:58:47 oh.. :D 17:59:55 rudybot: (define x 3) 17:59:56 elly: your sandbox is ready 17:59:56 elly: Done. 18:00:02 rudybot: (unless (> x 1000) (display (+ x 1))) 18:00:03 elly: ; stdout: "4" 18:02:36 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-20-67.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [] 18:04:45 :P 18:08:26 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has joined #scheme 18:11:17 pgimeno: http://paste.lisp.org/display/117577 18:11:34 This version doesn't return an index, just #t or #f. 18:12:08 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-20-67.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 18:13:43 My strategy is similar to that employed by most implementations of (C) strstr. 18:13:55 Some implementations will search for the first 2 characters, though, not just the first. 18:15:54 thank you very much! 18:21:26 femtoo [~femto@95-89-197-196-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #scheme 18:25:46 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@42.Red-217-125-2.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:26:46 seems after build larceny it would have install into somewhere on the system besides the build directory, but it didn't :( 18:28:23 bitweiler: did you type "make install"? That's the conventional incantation 18:29:49 nope, I had to use larceny and nasm to build, so I followed the build instructions, but your right 18:31:52 no, your left 18:32:26 offby1: I compiling the r6rs-mode now, just thought it was strange the build instructions and the readme files doesn't mention it 18:33:01 *shrug* 18:33:17 I have either never built larceny at all, or else it was so long ago that I don't remember anything about it 18:33:30 funny in the head 18:34:42 http://i.imgur.com/eqDAc.jpg 18:36:05 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:41:55 pgimeno: :-) 18:42:16 nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-16-251.w86-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 18:42:28 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-52.vinet.ba] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:43:54 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-91.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 18:44:26 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #scheme 18:45:26 *elly* tries to figure out how to convince racket to require something both for-syntax and not 18:45:27 pgimeno: I'm no Scheme expert by any means, however, using "named let" is a much more common way to write loops. 18:45:42 mmm, named let 18:45:49 elly, (require (for-syntax foo) foo) 18:45:51 pgimeno: You can see in my function that I have two named lets, named "outer" and "inner". 18:45:54 elly: Indeed. 18:46:00 if you are in racket use the `for' stuff instead of named lets 18:46:26 jonrafkind: for? Is that anything like foof-loop? 18:46:34 yea i think its somewhat close 18:46:39 I see. 18:46:46 *cky* still has to learn foof-loop. 18:47:20 -!- pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:50:19 rudybot : (display '( a: 1 b:2)) 18:51:06 rudybot: '(a: 1) 18:51:06 Gmind: ; Value: (a: 1) 18:51:49 rudybot: eval (display '( a: 1 b:2)) 18:51:50 jonrafkind: your sandbox is ready 18:51:50 jonrafkind: ; stdout: "(a: 1 b:2)" 18:53:03 rudybot: eval (display '(a . 1)) 18:53:04 Gmind: ; stdout: "(a . 1)" 18:54:29 rudybot: (for/list ([i (in-range 10)]) (+ i (* i 3))) 18:54:29 offby1: your scheme sandbox is ready 18:54:29 offby1: ; Value: (0 4 8 12 16 20 24 28 32 36) 18:55:20 rudybot: (for/fold ([result '()]) ([i (in-range 10)]) (cons (if (even? i) (/ i 2) (add1 (* i 3))) result)) 18:55:20 offby1: ; Value: (28 4 22 3 16 2 10 1 4 0) 18:55:29 cky: ^^ 18:55:35 offby1: Fancy. 18:55:53 Schmancy. 18:56:37 rudybot: (for/list ([i (in-range 10)]) (if (even? i) (/ i 2) (add1 (* i 3))) 18:56:37 jonrafkind: error: eval:1:0: read: expected a `)' to close `(' 18:56:39 rudybot: (for/list ([i (in-range 10)]) (if (even? i) (/ i 2) (add1 (* i 3)))) 18:56:39 jonrafkind: ; Value: (0 4 1 10 2 16 3 22 4 28) 18:56:48 rudybot: (reverse (for/list ([i (in-range 10)]) (if (even? i) (/ i 2) (add1 (* i 3))))) 18:56:49 jonrafkind: ; Value: (28 4 22 3 16 2 10 1 4 0) 18:56:53 hooray! 18:57:31 is there a way to get racket to be more verbose with errors than 'compile: unbound identifier in module in: char'? 18:57:39 hahahaha no 18:58:00 i highly recommend writing down the errors and what they mean 18:58:10 there is a wiki coming to racket Sometime Soon (TM) in which I will start doing this 18:58:24 elly: What kind of information are you looking for? 18:58:35 chandler: where in the module that identifier appears, for one 18:58:38 a line number would be good 18:58:57 hm i thought it did give you line numbers.. 18:58:57 I'd also like to know which identifier is unbound, since it claims something in char is unbound 18:59:02 nah, no line number 18:59:08 but for that it might be good to file a bug report 18:59:10 `char' is the unbound identifier. 18:59:16 since showing line numbers there might be not too difficult 18:59:31 chandler: where is it unbound, though? I have char defined in this module 18:59:35 DrRacket will highlight the offending identifier. Not sure how you can get it without that. 19:00:14 hm 19:00:15 Hm. I get line numbers. 19:00:16 foo.rkt:3:0: compile: unbound identifier in module in: foo 19:00:41 okay, with a bit of experimentation, the problem is that I am using `char' in a macro invocation of a macro in a different module 19:01:10 and I suspect the lack of line numbers are because of a syntax->datum 19:01:25 supply some more syntax objects for context to it 19:01:32 yeah 19:01:35 Oh. That'd do it. You'd confuse DrRacket with that too. 19:01:54 I think I need to not syntax->datum in the first place, which probably involves syntax-case instead of match 19:02:47 oh yes.. dont use match on syntax objects 19:03:04 yeah... the inspiration for this was http://shaurz.wordpress.com/2008/03/11/haskell-style-parser-combinators-in-scheme/, which does use match on them :P 19:03:05 http://tinyurl.com/ysphwg 19:03:18 I will rewrite this later with syntax-case 19:03:34 Actually, I suspect it's datum->syntax that's really causing problems. 19:03:56 chandler: well, quasisyntax 19:04:17 I will figure out how to rewrite this later 19:04:23 Does quasisyntax turn symbols into identifiers? 19:04:32 http://www.leptoquark.net/~elly/pc.rkt 19:04:35 rudybot: eval #`#,'foo 19:04:35 "I don't know" 19:04:35 chandler: your racket sandbox is ready 19:04:36 chandler: ; Value: # 19:04:54 anyway, off to get food 19:04:57 elly, you can use syntax-parse to do that kind of stuff I think 19:05:19 rudybot: eval (begin (define (foo) 1) (define-syntax bar (lambda (stx) #`(#,'foo))) (bar)) 19:05:19 chandler: ; Value: 1 19:05:22 Huh. 19:06:03 jonrafkind: There's nothing there that can't be done trivially with syntax-case, I don't think. 19:06:33 i suppose, it might be easier with syntax-parse though 19:06:50 I still don't think so. It looks trivial. 19:07:22 Actually, I don't even see why this is a procedural macro at all. 19:11:36 -!- mmc [~michal@cs181178061.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:17:37 *Gmind* asking himself if anyone here like both LISP/SCHEME 19:18:24 also ask if anyone likes both C/C++, and emacs/vi 19:19:51 jonrafkind: Wow. Them's fightin' words. :-P 19:20:31 :P 19:20:37 C/C++ doesn't really matter 19:20:41 can mix them all 19:20:49 Gmind: C/C++ is fighting words for any real C or C++ practitioner. 19:21:09 Gmind: C and C++ are different languages, so saying C/C++ means you don't know either language. 19:21:32 what kind of reasoning is that? 19:21:39 lisp/scheme.. those are different languages too 19:22:06 jonrafkind: I don't like seeing Lisp/Scheme either, unless something applies to both. (And that's one instance where seeing C/C++ is okay, if something applies to both.) 19:22:11 But, few things apply to both. 19:22:22 you lost me 19:22:40 cky: isn't C++ a extension of C ? 19:23:11 jonrafkind: So, some people talking about "libraries for C/C++", which is ludicrous in most cases: it's either designed for C or C++; if it's designed for both, that means someone wrote a language binding for either one or both. 19:23:18 Gmind: It's not quite as simple as that. :-) 19:23:33 s/talking/talk/ 19:23:34 if its designed for C you can use it in C++.. 19:23:40 jonrafkind: Not very idiomatically. 19:23:42 i frequently use C libraries in my C++ programs 19:23:55 You generally have to create C++ bindings for C libraries for them to be used idiomatically in C++. 19:24:10 big deal 19:24:29 Such libraries are actually designed for C, not "C/C++". 19:24:29 most people screw up c++ bindings anyway, id rather write my own 19:24:34 Hahahahaha. 19:25:40 I wrote a C++ binding for MPFR for OMGWTF (the C++ coding contest run by The Daily WTF). :-P 19:26:00 It's not the most...standard bindings. It's designed to be quite WTF. :-P 19:27:06 Gmind: Technically, many C programs can be compiled with a C++ compiler with little or no changes. 19:27:17 Gmind: However, the idioms of C and C++ coding are very different. 19:27:22 =.= it seem to be a 'Must' to separate everything in my words for schemer 19:27:49 should again be ( C ) (C ++ ) 19:27:54 Gmind: Many experienced C++ programmers will puke at seeing C++ code written in C style. 19:28:07 (And code written in C++ style cannot be compiled with a C compiler, so that's moot.) 19:28:29 right =)) 19:28:35 how about minGW ? 19:28:39 -!- dzhus [~sphinx@93-80-178-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:28:40 What about MinGW? 19:28:58 ya, on linux I knew that gcc and g++ are different 19:29:00 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:29:30 I'm not talking about the compilers. I'm talking about what's "customary style" for both languages. 19:29:35 :-) 19:29:58 Same deal as CL vs Scheme. Idiomatic CL is very, very different from idiomatic Scheme. 19:30:20 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #scheme 19:30:46 To pick one example, in Scheme, loops are customarily done using tail recursion. In CL, explicit looping is customary. 19:32:32 cky: u learnt both ? 19:32:47 Both C and C++? Yes. Both CL and Scheme? No. 19:33:03 I like scheme until "trying to make a list of variable" confused me 19:33:39 Gmind: I think the best thing you can do to learn a language is to read quality code written in that language. 19:33:48 Gmind: Make a real effort to understand the code. 19:33:59 You will then hopefully start to grasp how things are done in that language. 19:34:09 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:34:15 =.= can't blame on my effort , because all my sleepless night are for learning Scheme 19:34:30 Only Scheme 19:34:37 That's fine, but you said you were getting frustrated. I'm trying to show you a new way to learn that's less frustrating. 19:35:04 Do you understand the concept of "immersion learning"? 19:35:07 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-91.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:35:13 I think that's the best way to learn a (natuarl) language. 19:35:21 *natural 19:36:50 cky: explain plz 19:37:01 Okay. So, suppose you want to learn Chinese. 19:37:18 Immersion learning means you live in a Chinese-speaking community, who does not speak Vietnamese (or whatever your native language is). 19:37:31 You learn simply by observing what people say. 19:38:01 That's how babies learn to speak. :-P 19:38:10 It's also a remarkably effective way for adults to learn, too. 19:38:49 =.= 19:38:52 oh.. 19:39:02 that's what I am doing 19:39:17 thanks for the explaination 19:39:21 :-) 19:39:44 ( wonder if you define that from me =)) ) 19:40:01 Hmm? 19:40:53 another effective way to learn: MIDTERMS 19:41:01 ok, i lie :P 19:41:24 Gmind: I like both scheme & lisp 19:41:48 s/lisp/common lisp/ 19:41:51 is there a big difference? 19:42:12 :-s 19:42:44 Caleb--: i starting to like scheme more for it's simplisticy 19:43:07 I can write a AI bot in F# in 2 days even when I have just started learning the language, but in Scheme, I can't do that fast =.=! seriously 19:43:48 Gmind: how long have you been coding in F# 19:43:57 pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #scheme 19:44:12 bitweiler : till now or at the moment I make the bot ? 19:45:20 Gmind: I bet you use alot of the standard libaries of the the lang F# and didn't write every single lib yourself 19:46:14 bitweiler : :P To accomplish the goal, I haven't needed to do that 19:46:46 Gmind: so, I guess F# seemed closer to a language you already new. 19:46:50 I know we can make our own libs in Scheme , extend it ourselves 19:47:07 I dunno ... 19:48:07 I did programming in a lot of languages to find what fit myself 19:48:27 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 19:48:29 if nothing else, it uses infix operators instead of prefix notation 19:48:56 *cky* pukes at infix notation. (Not really.) 19:49:31 *Gmind* has joined the room 19:50:09 *Gmind* has joined the room and laughing ... 19:51:38 bremner: maybe, but I don't see any close 19:53:14 *Caleb--* does all his math in postfix 19:53:17 prefix* 19:54:26 -!- Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has left #scheme 19:55:05 Caleb--: :-P 20:01:24 Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has joined #scheme 20:04:39 -!- Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has quit [Quit: Gmind] 20:09:41 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@pD951FA6C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:09:58 Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has joined #scheme 20:10:23 "Scheme is an easy language to learn once you get over your fear of parentheses. " => =)) 20:12:42 /part #scheme 20:13:10 -!- bitweiler [~bitweiler@adsl-99-40-236-82.dsl.stl2mo.sbcglobal.net] has left #scheme 20:13:18 lol 20:15:07 heiz [~heiz@92-100-175-160.dynamic.avangarddsl.ru] has joined #scheme 20:15:10 have just knew Common Larceny is Scheme on .NET 20:15:20 bitweiler: r u working on this ? 20:16:27 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@pD9E269DB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 20:16:32 Gmind: bitweiler left the channel. 20:17:18 Hi! http://pastie.org/1368535 Please look at code. There are two examples. They are very similar, but I find it very strange. 20:18:14 heiz: quote is syntax. You should not try to redefine it. 20:18:32 why? It's not prohibited 20:18:33 heiz, you are at the repl, right? 20:18:37 yes 20:18:39 heiz: Even if some Scheme implementations won't explicitly forbid it, it's still bad form. 20:18:45 -!- Gmind [~Gmind@113.190.163.233] has left #scheme 20:18:46 the repl has very strange semantics with definitions 20:18:52 ok 20:18:55 if you want consistent behavior use a module (are you in racket?) 20:19:00 yes 20:19:13 theres a guide page on the repl and definitions.. hold on 20:19:15 thanks for answers 20:23:20 I'm a bit confused. I try this code not in repl and got the same results. 20:24:40 Are there any hints in scheme specification how such situations must be resolved? 20:25:30 Not as far as I know, but Scheme implementations are well within their rights to error out if you redefine quote, lambda, define, etc. 20:28:42 imran_sr [~imran@75-18-254-4.lightspeed.uncyca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 20:29:47 mjgoins [~mjgoins@ool-18599e06.static.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 20:29:47 wbooze` [~user@xdsl-78-35-168-82.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 20:30:19 -!- hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw305048.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:31:53 DrDuck [~duck@146.229.119.183] has joined #scheme 20:31:57 homie` [~user@xdsl-78-35-168-82.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 20:32:20 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-35-141-10.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:32:43 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-78-35-141-10.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:33:03 -!- 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