00:04:10 -!- davazp [~user@83.46.0.116] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:09:27 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:10:48 SharkBrain [~gerard@210.48.104.34] has joined #scheme 00:16:03 -!- jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 00:16:35 -!- pjb [~t@99.Red-79-149-19.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:17:27 pjb [~t@160.Red-88-30-106.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 00:18:55 saccade_ [~saccade@209-6-54-113.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #scheme 00:26:10 -!- sstrickl [~sstrickl@nomad.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Quit: sstrickl] 00:42:12 uman [~uman@unaffiliated/uman] has joined #scheme 00:45:55 csmrfx [csmr@xob.kapsi.fi] has joined #scheme 00:47:12 Is (() () () ()) supposed to be a list of null lists? How to? (mzscheme 4.1.15) 00:47:52 (I found this old book...) 00:48:09 sorry... what's the question? 00:48:19 -!- masm [~masm@bl7-38-107.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:48:40 rudybot: eval '(() () () ()) 00:48:46 chandler: your scheme sandbox is ready 00:48:46 chandler: ; Value: (() () () ()) 00:49:14 Ah yes. Needs the good old ' 00:49:52 you can also write (list (list) (list) (list) (list)) 00:49:56 -!- saint_cypher [~saint_cyp@adsl-99-2-72-93.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:50:33 rudybot: eval (every null-list? '(() () () ())) 00:50:34 I shan't 00:50:36 karme: your sandbox is ready 00:50:36 karme: error: reference to undefined identifier: every 00:50:50 -!- elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has quit [Quit: unicode time] 00:52:18 (require srfi/1) 00:54:07 *csmrfx* slaps whoever named that srfi with a greasy tomato salmon for not being clear 00:54:47 rudybot: eval (require srfi/1) 00:54:48 karme: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: require in module: 'program 00:56:18 (car hotdog) 00:57:50 rudybot: eval (require srfi/1) 00:58:08 rudybot: eval (every null-list? '(() () () ())) 00:58:08 chandler: ; Value: #t 00:58:11 ==> WHITE-BREAD-BUN 00:58:19 *chandler* wonders what kind of sandbox karme has 00:59:16 Is there a key => value datatype in scheme? 00:59:30 assoc list 00:59:31 aka hash? 00:59:33 I'd like to be able to return a list that I can easily pull :header form, or :body 00:59:33 hash table 00:59:35 Yea 00:59:45 Associative list, heh 00:59:49 Or hash table 01:00:20 Why did karmes eval fail but chandlers worked? 01:01:04 seangrove: file:///usr/share/plt/doc/reference/hashtables.html 01:01:38 BW^- [Miranda@151.81.35.242] has joined #scheme 01:01:44 anyone here knows Bigloo's I/O? 01:02:07 csmrfx: Thanks, I'll look that up 01:02:08 wow.lol. http://docs.plt-scheme.org/reference/hashtables.html 01:02:17 my utf-8 encoded unicode chars get lost in its text processing, i'm thinking about how to work around it 01:02:18 Heh, that's easier, thanks ;) 01:02:29 bigloo in itself can handle utf-8 byte code sequences for text content at least 01:02:49 -!- mario-goulart [~user@67.205.85.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:03:14 seangrove, caveat: that's PLT doc, not Gambit 01:03:47 Daemmerung: Ah, I only see mentions of assiociative lists in the gambit manual, mostly when talking about tables 01:05:16 -!- bweaver [~user@75-148-111-133-Chattanooga.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:05:49 Oh, I c 01:06:05 elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has joined #scheme 01:06:26 make-table et al 01:06:34 So whats the diff in scheme repl between "car l" and "(car l)" ? 01:06:56 The former are two symbols, the later is a single list. 01:07:14 or the former are two identifiers, the latter a single combination 01:08:25 Somehow car procedure gets evaled differently in a list 01:08:38 It must be mahic! 01:08:41 csmrfx: not at all. 01:08:56 rudybot: eval car 01:09:03 pjb: your sandbox is ready 01:09:03 pjb: ; Value: # 01:09:12 rudybot: eval (car '(1 2)) 01:09:13 pjb: ; Value: 1 01:09:23 see, in both case, it's #. 01:09:26 rudybot: eval (car) 01:10:19 no expectatios, huh 01:10:38 No, rudybot just got wedged again. 01:10:55 incubot: (let ((a (list 1 2))) (car a)) 01:10:55 1 01:11:06 incubot: (car) 01:11:06 Error: bad argument count - received 0 but expected 1: # 01:12:17 # incubot: eval every 01:13:19 eval (set-car! '(1 2) 3) 01:13:24 -!- rudybot [~luser@offby1.xen.prgmr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:13:31 -!- elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:13:54 incubot only recognizes eval requests when they began with a left paren 01:14:09 incubot: (begin every) 01:14:09 # 01:14:18 ah solved. 01:14:33 incubot: eval (every null-list? '(() () () ())) 01:14:33 #t 01:14:37 -!- BW^- [Miranda@151.81.35.242] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:14:43 Daemmerung: hm, why only leftparen beginning ones? 01:14:50 rudybot [~luser@offby1.xen.prgmr.com] has joined #scheme 01:15:03 elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has joined #scheme 01:15:05 Why not? 01:15:36 incubot: help 01:15:39 Actually, I can't remember the real implementation off-hand but some coffee may help... 01:15:50 See, incubot has a greater mission. 01:15:54 I suppose thats what interest me. What happens, with '(car l)' that doesnt happen with 'car l' 01:15:54 incubot: What is best in life? 01:15:57 No sign of life 01:16:11 incubot: eval (help) 01:16:12 Error: unbound variable: help 01:16:19 csmrfx: (car l) is a combination that is, a function call. 01:16:40 csmrfx: car l are just two variables, that the repl happens to evaluate in sequence. 01:16:47 karme: Again, don't use `eval' with incubot. It doesn't do what you think it does. 01:16:55 -!- morphir [~morphir@84-52-234.12.3p.ntebredband.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:17:11 Daemmerung: ok - you wanted to take a look at its source 01:17:15 Ok so, a list... is checked for a match with function, where vars/symbols are just... expressed? 01:17:23 csmrfx: it's the same difference as between { f(x); } and { f,x; }, if you know C 01:17:23 karme: ? 01:17:46 pjb not enough 01:18:13 pjb not what I meant anyway. I want to understand scheme accurately. 01:18:32 Daemmerung: well rudybot announces its git repo - thought incubot maybe does, too 01:18:35 wish/hope/watever 01:19:30 csmrfx: the rule is simple enough: if it's a symbol, then get its value. If it's a list, then if the first element denotes a syntax, then interpret that syntax, otherwise evaluate the elements of the lists, and call the result of the first element with as arguments the results of the others. 01:20:01 csmrfx: there's nothing else to learn about lisp or scheme. That's the only thing you need to learn. This is the whole language. 01:20:12 csmrfx: if you keep reading your book you'll pick this up though osmosis 01:20:47 csmrfx: this can be expressed as one page of code: a scheme interpreter is one page of scheme code. 01:20:50 -!- uman [~uman@unaffiliated/uman] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:22:03 -!- Skewb [~Skewb@83.231.81.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:22:17 -!- pjb [~t@160.Red-88-30-106.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has left #scheme 01:22:21 pjb [~t@160.Red-88-30-106.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 01:22:23 -!- Sergio`_ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:22:38 Sergio`_ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #scheme 01:22:40 ok, just interested in building a model 01:23:06 morphir [~morphir@84-52-234.12.3p.ntebredband.no] has joined #scheme 01:23:31 (mental model) 01:23:56 See: http://academic.evergreen.edu/curricular/fofc00/eval.html and SICP. 01:24:07 Whats the interpreter file called, then? 01:25:04 What file? 01:25:23 That has the interpreter you mentioned 01:25:27 main.ss? 01:25:39 This is a mathematical construct! 01:25:57 Do you ask the file of Zemerlo Fraenkel axioms? 01:26:12 need more Fraenkel 01:26:18 You may ask the _paper_. 01:26:18 *moar, sorry 01:26:21 Mine is calle GORILLA.BAS 01:26:23 Probably not! 01:26:29 Daemmerung: of course i meant: "i wanted to take a look at its source" 01:26:31 It is AIM-8, by John McCarthy. 01:26:41 I must have been optimistic in reading your comment. 01:26:57 karme: Ah. Ask klutometis the next time he's around - it's his bot. 01:26:58 But SICP has a more modern presentation. 01:27:25 Daemmerung: ok, thanks 01:27:36 Here is AIM-8: http://www.informatimago.com/develop/lisp/small-cl-pgms/aim-8/index.html 01:27:55 So, the code for what the interpreter does to derive if it should start a function or output symbols isn't in one file thats one page of scheme. 01:28:30 It's like asking for the file of a theorem. 01:28:48 You may find the demonstration of a theorem in a given page of a given math book. 01:29:02 Or possibly in a file, if you happen to have the book in a file. 01:29:16 Perhaps you want to see the source of your implementation? 01:29:26 No. I am asking for the piece of code that returns different result for input "car l" and "(car l)". Not theorem at all. Yes, implementation. 01:29:30 But most implementations don't have an interpreter but a compiler, so it would be different. 01:29:49 Read the AIM-8 paper, or the SICP book. 01:29:52 In repl I assume its an interpreter. 01:30:03 That is not a safe assumption. 01:30:09 It will be easier to understand it than to plunge into the depths of a specific implementatio. 01:30:30 a REPL is interactive, but it's most probably NOT an interpreter. 01:30:49 Can you read the SICP. I always thought it had to be 'done' but never had the time. 01:30:56 csmrfx: what do you expect to find in that piece of code? it won't help you understand scheme at all (at least not until you're well into chapter 4 of SICP or similar) 01:31:21 csmrfx: anyways, what you're asking for is also on the page whose URL I gave you above. 01:31:30 It is expected that you follow the urls given! 01:31:49 Lol what I asked. How does scheme differentiate between function call and symbol list or whats that called 01:31:52 See: http://academic.evergreen.edu/curricular/fofc00/eval.html and SICP. 01:32:04 This is written here ^ 01:32:21 I can see the fnords 01:32:22 and in SICP, and in AIM-8, everywhere... 01:33:22 Ok, nice. 01:34:20 Ok I c. 01:34:51 csmrfx: it's probably better if you ask your question again after you've read SICP, otherwise you're just running around in circles (i.e. the lisp implementation of scheme linked above just pushes the abstraction one layer further down) 01:35:33 Maybe. But that kind of thinking is elitist. 01:36:31 There's also the formal semantics of r5rs: http://www.schemers.org/Documents/Standards/R5RS/HTML/r5rs-Z-H-10.html#%_chap_7 01:36:36 -rudybot:#scheme- http://tinyurl.com/yeu8quw 01:38:00 In section 7.2.3, you can see: [] = ... and [( *)] = ... 01:38:55 -!- elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:39:09 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@dhcp-212-241.cs.dartmouth.edu] has quit [Quit: copumpkin] 01:43:50 elly [~elly@unaffiliated/elly] has joined #scheme 01:44:00 ah, thank you, sir 01:45:17 A bit more than I expected. I'll take a small byte and return to it later... 01:47:55 -!- Dark-Star [Darkstar@p57B55CAE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 01:48:05 -!- karme [~user@HSI-KBW-078-043-001-160.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:59:16 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-173-88-196-177.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:04:21 howcome empty lists are not equivalent? eqv? 02:05:10 copumpkin [~copumpkin@c-75-69-96-50.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 02:05:36 er? 02:05:45 rudybot: eval (eqv? '() '()) 02:05:51 ...or not 02:05:53 anyway 02:05:57 > (eqv? '() '()) 02:05:57 #t 02:05:59 elly: error: with-limit: out of time 02:06:41 incubot: (eqv? '(()) '(())) 02:06:42 #f 02:06:57 incubot: (eq? '(()) '(())) 02:06:57 #f 02:07:06 that's not the same as an empty list :P 02:07:12 incubot: (eq? '() '()) 02:07:12 #t 02:07:18 those are both distinct nonempty lists, each containing one element 02:07:19 Ok, I cheated a little 02:07:25 the fact that the element is the same is irrelevant :P 02:09:59 Whats the current equivalent of 'lat?' 02:10:46 depends... what does that do? 02:11:21 hm, I think it tests if all items in a list are 'atoms' 02:11:28 -!- Daemmerung [~goetter@64.146.161.228] has quit [Quit: Smoove out.] 02:11:35 -!- rickmode [~rickmode@cpe-76-167-41-163.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:11:45 that'd be (andmap atom? lst) 02:11:53 except atom? doesn't exist, so you'd need to write that 02:12:11 I have, yes 02:12:28 rickmode [~rickmode@cpe-76-167-41-163.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:15:27 hehe silly me lat? is on the page 02:16:42 hm, I better put this weird book down. gnight 02:16:48 -!- csmrfx [csmr@xob.kapsi.fi] has left #scheme 02:19:24 phnglui_ [~phnglui@cpe-76-181-155-131.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:20:23 -!- phnglui [~phnglui@cpe-76-181-155-131.columbus.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:20:31 -!- phnglui_ is now known as phnglui 02:24:22 jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has joined #scheme 02:27:17 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:28:58 jcowan: I'm skeptical that destructuring lambda lists occupy a sensible middle ground between ordinary lambda lists and true pattern-matching utilities. 02:30:32 Well, the existing situation is debatably already a middle ground in that dotted lists imply a limited destructuring. 02:30:35 In particular, except for macro lambda lists and other macro-related processing, my attempts to use them via DESTRUCTURING-BIND have resulted in pain eventually. 02:33:53 Daemmerung [~goetter@64.146.161.228] has joined #scheme 02:34:22 It is a limited destructuring in that the argument list is destructured - once. The essential difference in my mind is that the creation of this list is (usually) implicit, and so it's OK for the destructuring of this one list to be implicit as well. 02:39:53 -!- jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 02:40:21 In particular, this form of destructuring allows the implementation to avoid consing an argument list in many circumstances, while still retaining the flexibility of accepting a variable number of arguments. 02:40:49 Do you know if any Scheme implementations perform that optimization? 02:41:03 It's on my TODO list for chibi. 02:41:06 -!- foof` is now known as foof 02:41:09 The optimization of not consing a list for ((lambda (x y z) ...) 1 2 3) ? 02:41:38 I would imagine that most do, but perhaps my expectations are too high. 02:41:56 No, the optimization of not consing dotted lists for typical let-optionals* style usage. 02:42:54 Other than implementations that provide special lambda list syntax for optionals, no. 02:43:02 That isn't quite what I was referring to, though. 02:43:09 OK 02:44:08 I was specifically thinking of dotted lists, since that's much more clearly a pattern destructuring than simple application of arguments. 02:44:14 incubot: eval (eval eval) 02:44:14 Error: illegal non-atomic object: # 02:46:30 A procedure (lambda (x y z . l) ...) called as (f 1 2 3) obviously requires no list to be consed. This is the benefit I was referring to, which (as far as I can tell) does not have a corresponding case for destructuring within arguments. 02:47:51 ... Or perhaps it does: (let ((f (lambda ((x y)) ...))) (f `(1 ,z))) 02:48:55 I'm not exactly sure how one would go about exploiting that, however. It seems to me that you'd have to know the lambda list at compile time, whereas the typical method of immediate arguments does not require such foreknowledge. 02:55:00 rudybot: uptime 02:55:00 offby1: I've been up for twenty-one hours; this tcp/ip connection has been up for one hour 02:55:04 rudybot: eval (+ 2 3) 02:55:09 *offby1* grinds teeth 02:55:27 I thought you didn't have any of those, only dentures? 02:55:36 Or are the dentures a gag pair for hilarious throwing events? 02:55:41 -!- bipt [bpt@cpe-075-182-095-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:55:59 shh 02:56:18 offby1: error: with-limit: out of time 02:56:42 sepult` [~user@xdsl-87-78-100-221.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 02:59:24 -!- sepult [~user@xdsl-87-78-170-54.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:02:11 parolang [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has joined #scheme 03:05:54 -!- rickmode [~rickmode@cpe-76-167-41-163.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: rickmode] 03:07:21 -!- morphir [~morphir@84-52-234.12.3p.ntebredband.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 03:11:22 arcfide [arcfide@adsl-99-137-203-171.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 03:19:44 bipt [bpt@cpe-075-182-095-009.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 03:22:46 jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has joined #scheme 03:24:19 arcfide: Do you think you could add the XML-RPC extension to Trac? 03:39:02 -!- arcfide [arcfide@adsl-99-137-203-171.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:39:04 -!- jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 03:40:05 -!- Dawgmatix [~Dawgmatix@c-76-124-9-27.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:54:46 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:55:43 adu [~ajr@pool-71-191-173-96.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 03:58:06 jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has joined #scheme 04:00:04 arcfide [arcfide@adsl-99-31-12-2.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 04:00:44 Hrm, it doesn't look like my messages went through. 04:00:58 foof: Did you send me an email about it? 04:01:03 I've been a bit behind on reading through the emails this week, but I'm going to be going through them tonight if I can, which means you should get your backups by tomorrow. Now is as good a time as any to throw in some extensions if you want them. 04:01:12 In other news, I now have Paredit like auto-parenthesis completion and smart indenting for NEdit! 04:01:40 Heathen! Philistine! 04:02:30 arcfide: No, but I was going to request it, and Arthur beat me to it. 04:02:46 I haven't seen any messages from you. 04:04:52 -!- luz [~davids@189.122.90.116] has quit [Quit: Client exiting] 04:06:26 chandler: Heathen? What fer? 04:06:36 foof: You mean emails to the list? 04:06:47 foof: Not for the past 150 messages, at least. :-) 04:07:06 I've had to scale back on the amount of bantering and bickering I do, but I would be talking more, if I had read all the messages by now. :-) 04:07:11 Oh, you said it didn't look like your messages went through... did you mean on IRC? 04:07:17 Yeah. 04:07:26 I still have 72 unread in my Scheme filter. 04:07:29 -!- xwl [~user@124-168-127-20.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:07:56 I figure Jcowan and Joe have things handled as far as the Top Level and Phasing thread go. 04:07:57 *arcfide* chuckles. 04:08:29 I'm working on refining and improving my understanding of all the issues involved in modules, and I've been meeting with the local language gurus on the topic. 04:09:19 xwl [~user@124-168-127-20.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #scheme 04:09:31 arcfide: Joe is no more, Tom Lord scared him off. 04:09:32 arcfide: For your decadent choice of editor. 04:09:48 foof: Oh really? 04:09:57 That's unfortunate. 04:10:05 myu2 [~myu2@161.90.128.210.bf.2iij.net] has joined #scheme 04:10:21 I'm surprised it took this long. 04:11:21 Mssrs. Lord and Harvey scared me off before I even started! 04:11:49 er, stick an "e" in there where it goes. 04:13:06 Before you estarted? Are you espanish? 04:13:40 "estarted" is the rarely-used antonym of "estoppeled". 04:13:51 But no; I meant to stick it in "Mssrs." 04:14:39 (Forming "Messrs.", if I have to spell it out.) 04:22:00 chandler: What's wrong with NEdit? :-P 04:22:47 Other than Motif? 04:23:55 What's wrong with Motif? Wait, don't answer that. What's wrong with using Motif programs? 04:24:45 Besides, you should know that I use Motif for more than just NEdit. :-) 04:25:40 jonrafkind [~jon@c-98-202-82-46.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:25:43 Well, other than containing everything that's wrong with X without any of the various hacks and mitigations that have gone into making it tolerable over the last decade? 04:26:40 "A stated design goal of Motif was to give the X Window System the window management capabilities of HP's circa-1988 window manager and the visual elegance of Microsoft Windows. We kid you not." - The UNIX-HATERS Handbook (and I know it's a good day when I get to refer to the handbook twice!) 04:35:59 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has left #scheme 04:37:59 hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@64.134.146.34] has joined #scheme 04:41:05 saint_cypher [~saint_cyp@c-76-126-70-224.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:05:01 pavelludiq [~quassel@87.246.14.89] has joined #scheme 05:10:15 Is it illegal to put a (local ) in an [else ] statement? 05:10:39 I... don't see why it would be? 05:10:50 Thanks 05:11:51 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@pantagruel.mccme.ru] has joined #scheme 05:12:12 (local ) in an [else ] statement? 05:12:14 yeah... (cond (else (local ((define x 1)) (+ x 1)))) 05:16:09 foof: that is terrible. 05:19:38 offby1` [~user@q-static-138-125.avvanta.com] has joined #scheme 05:20:06 parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has joined #scheme 05:20:08 -!- hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@64.134.146.34] has quit [Quit: hadronzoo] 05:21:29 foof` [~user@FL1-118-110-51-236.osk.mesh.ad.jp] has joined #scheme 05:21:34 -!- foof [~user@FL1-118-110-51-236.osk.mesh.ad.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:21:34 -!- alexsuraci [~alexsurac@pool-71-188-133-67.aubnin.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:21:34 -!- offby1 [~user@pdpc/supporter/monthlybyte/offby1] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:21:34 -!- Mr_Awesome [~eric@c-98-212-139-181.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:21:55 Sergio`__ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #scheme 05:22:25 -!- parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:23:30 -!- parolang [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:23:51 alexsuraci [~alexsurac@pool-71-188-133-67.aubnin.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 05:24:00 -!- myu2 [~myu2@161.90.128.210.bf.2iij.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:24:49 parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has joined #scheme 05:25:41 -!- Sergio`_ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:27:37 Sergio`_ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #scheme 05:27:55 Mr_Awesome [~eric@c-98-212-139-181.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:30:07 -!- SharkBrain [~gerard@210.48.104.34] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:32:11 -!- parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:32:37 parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has joined #scheme 05:37:38 hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@ppp-70-251-78-128.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #scheme 05:43:24 -!- Sergio`__ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:48:11 Sergio`__ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #scheme 05:50:15 Sergio`_1 [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #scheme 05:51:42 -!- Sergio`__ [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Client Quit] 05:51:43 -!- Sergio`_1 [~Sergio`@a89-152-187-26.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Client Quit] 05:51:57 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@pool-151-205-123-229.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:57:28 copumpkin_ [~copumpkin@c-75-69-96-50.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:00:14 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@c-75-69-96-50.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:00:14 -!- copumpkin_ is now known as copumpkin 06:07:08 Khisanth [~Khisanth@pool-141-157-238-16.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 06:11:32 toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-105-129.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 06:13:03 -!- xwl [~user@124-168-127-20.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:14:05 xwl [~user@124-168-127-20.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #scheme 06:16:21 -!- hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@ppp-70-251-78-128.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:17:09 -!- bipt [bpt@cpe-075-182-095-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:17:17 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:21:21 hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@ppp-70-251-117-44.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #scheme 06:25:13 -!- saint_cypher [~saint_cyp@c-76-126-70-224.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:25:41 myu2 [~myu2@161.90.128.210.bf.2iij.net] has joined #scheme 06:27:42 -!- parolang` [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:43:03 das64 [~das@adsl-67-124-39-87.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 06:44:27 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@c-98-202-82-46.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:45:47 -!- C-Keen [ckeen@pestilenz.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:45:56 Is there functions in scheme (mzscheme or mit-scheme) that act similarly to the apropos or documentation functions in Common Lisp? 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You awake? 09:04:07 Yeah, it's 6pm over here :) 09:04:46 -!- foof` is now known as foof 09:09:43 foof: Okay, great. 09:10:13 I think I have working Trac backups now, and I have set up my own backup to IU's servers. 09:10:37 great! 09:33:41 -!- drwho [~drwho@c-98-225-208-183.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:35:21 karme [~user@HSI-KBW-078-043-001-160.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #scheme 09:35:24 -!- tltstc [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:42:22 TR2N [email@89.180.142.81] has joined #scheme 09:55:56 -!- phao [~phao@189.107.135.51] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:00:12 skld [~skld@unaffiliated/skld] has joined #scheme 10:01:37 -!- Zuu [~Zuuo@h207.natout.aau.dk] has quit [] 10:01:57 alaricsp [~alaric@217.205.201.45] has joined #scheme 10:06:45 -!- arcfide [arcfide@adsl-99-186-236-186.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net] has left #scheme 10:10:01 -!- jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has quit [Remote host closed the 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reset by peer] 17:27:33 jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 17:27:58 -!- reynard [~alan@n1121181054.netvigator.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:29:07 hadronzoo_ [~hadronzoo@ppp-70-251-81-42.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #scheme 17:29:09 -!- hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@adsl-209-30-58-205.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:29:09 -!- hadronzoo_ is now known as hadronzoo 17:29:13 :-) 17:29:39 whee! 17:35:04 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:36:41 -!- karme [~user@HSI-KBW-078-043-001-160.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:36:53 amca [~amca@CPE-121-208-82-97.cqzr1.cha.bigpond.net.au] has joined #scheme 17:47:51 parolang2 [~user@8e4a01246100775874c4f448e9887093.oregonrd-wifi-1261.amplex.net] has joined #scheme 17:58:26 -!- jewel [~jewel@41.29.227.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:02:49 rdd [~user@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has 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has joined #scheme 19:19:35 tltstc [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 19:20:48 Dawgmatix [~Dawgmatix@c-76-124-9-27.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 19:22:10 -!- xwl [~user@124-168-127-20.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:28:28 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-173-88-196-177.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 19:36:25 la la la 19:36:37 *wingo* proxies for duncanm 19:44:02 -!- Blkt [~user@net-93-146-150-17.t2.dsl.vodafone.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:47:23 Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has joined #scheme 19:55:14 -!- wingo [~wingo@81.39.163.133] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:02:11 -!- davazp [~user@83.46.0.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:02:35 HG` [~HG@xdslec231.osnanet.de] has joined #scheme 20:03:01 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:03:30 *Daemmerung* triples the length of his Scheme scripts by converting them to .BAT files 20:03:37 Daemmerung: yay! 20:03:41 jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 20:03:48 I feel the powar. 20:03:54 triple the...fun? 20:04:00 Triple the disk space! 20:04:24 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:06:06 triple the cache misses! 20:06:14 lisppaste: url 20:06:14 To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/scheme and enter your paste. 20:06:14 lisppaste: Do that again and you will be silenced! 20:06:30 uh, eli: that ^ 20:06:59 Daemmerung pasted "Real ultimate power" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/95663 20:08:11 Daemmerung: D: 20:08:24 Daemmerung: we're revoking your Scheme license 20:08:38 wingo [~wingo@81.38.179.58] has joined #scheme 20:08:38 Why write four lines when I can write forty? 20:08:41 turn in your badge and .emacs 20:08:49 NOOOOOOO 20:08:54 THEY BE STEALIN MY EMACS 20:09:02 Did you write a translator to generate those .BAT? 20:09:11 Otherwise, yes, turn in your badge and .emacs. 20:09:32 -!- alvatar [~alvatar@158.127.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:09:34 Cut and paste, baby. 20:13:01 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:14:24 elly: Is the world safe again? 20:14:31 eli: not sure, is it? 20:14:45 I don't know, I do see spamming still. 20:14:53 And what's the problem with what Daemmerung wrote? 20:14:55 no, I mean the bot yelling at lisppaste 20:15:14 Well, the question is whether that protection is no longer needed or not. 20:15:19 oh 20:15:22 well, hm 20:15:32 I did disable the whole thing though, it's easy to turn back on if needed. 20:15:34 the ircd7 upgrade prevents the POST flooders from doing their thing 20:15:37 ah, okay 20:16:24 Daemmerung: The only obvious problem I see is with `:end' appearing in the Scheme part -- that would be a problem, right? 20:16:39 It's ; :end, so it's safe 20:16:41 Daemmerung: it's a comment 20:16:44 er, eli: 20:16:51 schmir [~schmir@p54A903B4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 20:17:31 You're both missing my point: if the *scheme* had `:end', then the batch file part would try to jump *there*, right? 20:17:34 -!- jengle [~9598170a@gateway/web/freenode/x-epnmgwfbsoljeypd] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:17:36 -!- sloyd [sloyd@station457.vo3.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 20:17:46 yes, it would 20:17:50 "so don't do that" 20:18:14 I am definitely missing your point, eli. 20:18:35 Too much .bat trampolining on my part, perhaps. 20:19:01 Daemmerung: if ':end' appears in the scheme script, the batch file interpreter will jump there instead 20:19:20 I will to demonstrate. 20:19:27 http://tmp.barzilay.org/x 20:19:37 -!- pavelludiq [~quassel@87.246.14.89] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:19:57 "so don't do that", eli :P 20:20:07 Ah. Right. Wot elly said. 20:20:31 elly: Not good enough. See mime. 20:20:44 you could call it :aewjruiawwh3984hwau3d or something, Daemmerung 20:21:12 I could -convert the Scheme.... 20:21:14 thus pushing the problem a little further away :P 20:21:19 you could /not/ do that 20:22:57 I'll use a symbol that I know that nobody will ever write, like :if-only-all-the-r7-committee-members-could-be-as-wise-as-tlbh 20:23:35 wouldn't tlbh write that? 20:23:42 D'oh!! 20:24:19 Also, R7 will always emit that to any (GENSYM). So no good. Need a better plan. 20:25:14 :P 20:25:29 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 20:27:02 sloyd [sloyd@station457.vo3.net] has joined #scheme 20:27:18 -!- amca [~amca@CPE-121-208-82-97.cqzr1.cha.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: work] 20:27:50 Actually, the batch file "syntax" is bad enough which plays out in this case -- open parens of any kind, percent signs, random binary jumk are all ignored. 20:28:04 It looks like this is done only after a goto. 20:28:25 The only thing that confuses it is a NUL character. 20:28:40 Maybe also IRC 20:28:43 No. 20:30:20 -!- schmir [~schmir@p54A903B4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:30:59 jonrafkind [~jon@204.99.164.63] has joined #scheme 20:31:12 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has joined #scheme 20:31:26 20:31:37 blah blah blah 20:33:23 Oh, I found a better way. 20:34:20 Daemmerung annotated #95663 "Tramp that doesn't require a-conversion" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/95663#1 20:35:33 Very nice. 20:36:01 -!- Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:36:01 "/b" is new to me. What I get for RTFM for once. 20:36:36 Daemmerung: I'll add that to the guide page on scripts, if you don't mind. 20:36:49 Please do so. 20:37:48 At some point I'll cook up a Powershell trampoline (posh having significantly less retarded lexing rules than .bat). But not today. No need for now. 20:38:24 jao [~jao@37.Red-88-6-172.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 20:40:10 Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has joined #scheme 20:40:15 is tlbh tom lord brian hervey? :) 20:40:58 That would be telling. 20:42:00 It would also be "backbiting," which isn't very nice of me. I should desist. 20:43:05 *wingo* rummages around for the hairshirt 20:43:34 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@204.99.164.63] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:43:55 http://wingolog.org/archives/2010/02/26/guile-and-delimited-continuations 20:45:01 -!- toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-105-129.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:45:39 SharkBrain [~gerard@222-152-107-233.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #scheme 20:46:25 Whoop whoop indeed. You're in Barcelona? 20:46:55 yep 20:47:08 wingo: Nice. 20:47:08 http://www.mobileworldcongress.com/ 20:47:16 <-- wanted to attend 20:47:23 bipt [bpt@cpe-075-182-095-009.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 20:47:34 yeah, only 600+ euros, just to walk the floor :P 20:49:03 -!- Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:50:52 -!- luz [~davids@139.82.89.70] has quit [Quit: Client exiting] 20:50:54 Daemmerung: Any reason for the explicit `-u' 20:51:21 jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 20:51:46 Daemmerung: Also `%0.bat' seems fragile -- isn't that in danger of turning to "foo.bat.bat" if I use the full name? 20:52:23 -!- HG` [~HG@xdslec231.osnanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:52:47 It is fragile. 20:53:01 Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has joined #scheme 20:53:17 And the answer is ... ? 20:53:33 batch files are themselves necessarily fragile 20:53:34 42 20:53:58 wingo: the delimited-continuations explanation is disturbing :P 20:54:02 I have never ever ever seen anybody use the full name of a batch file. 20:54:27 elly: is it wrong? 20:54:33 I have no idea 20:54:40 I had never encountered the concept before 20:54:44 ah really 20:54:45 And the reason for the -u was, I was converting from some v360 era code that used -r. 20:54:46 Daemmerung: That seems like a likely way that a batch file would invoke another batch file. 20:54:59 eli: via call 20:55:23 elly: i discussed how i came to the concept itself in http://wingolog.org/archives/2010/02/14/sidelong-glimpses 20:55:31 links to several papers there 20:55:45 it's both new and old 20:55:56 I am comfortable with the concepts, use, and implementation of call/cc, I think 20:56:21 sure, but delimited continuations are different 20:56:29 strictly more powerful, actually 20:56:41 eli: It works just fine wihtout the explicit -u 20:56:49 iiuc plt scheme implements call/cc in terms of delimited continuations 20:57:02 Daemmerung: I had a bad flashback. 20:57:10 wingo: It is. 20:57:10 To the 360 era? 20:57:19 Daemmerung: No, to hacking batch files. 20:57:30 There used to be an install script that did some hairy stuff. 20:57:42 eli: That's why I'm cheerfully hoping never to write another one. 20:57:42 Anyway, if you ignore the hair, and assume Windows NT 20:57:48 then the answer is %~f0 20:57:59 AH! I was looking for that. 20:58:17 I personally suspect I will never use Windows 95 again. 20:58:40 IIRC WindowsME is also in the same non-nt category, no? 20:58:47 YUC. 20:59:11 what ungodly concoction are you people brewing 20:59:38 Windows batch file trampolines. 21:00:19 eli: "%MZSCHEME%" "%~f0" %* 21:00:30 jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has joined #scheme 21:01:14 You mean that the quotes are needed? 21:01:31 Daemmerung annotated #95663 "less pathname damage" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/95663#2 21:01:31 I'm pretty sure that Daemmerung should be put to death for this 21:01:46 eli: The quotes are indeed needed. 21:02:22 elly: What's so wrong about that?? 21:03:15 with Daemmerung being put to death for writing a polyglot scheme/batch program? nothing! 21:03:55 Three little lines at the top of the file, and it's Scheme turtles from there all the way down. 21:04:38 *eli* completely agrees 21:04:57 With that, it's at the same scale of most unix trampolines. 21:05:09 -!- melba [~blee@unaffiliated/lazz0] has quit [Quit: melba] 21:05:25 *elly* mutters something uncomplimentary about trampolines as a concept 21:05:50 What would you use instead? 21:05:58 I'm not sure, actually 21:07:18 I did this for a while in a Scheme inferior-buffer, but Scheme kept holding handles on my generated files. So I farmed it out into a batch file, where I knew that the Scheme process would die die die once it was done. 21:07:31 IIRC, there was some kernel extension which allowed you to execute arbitrary files based on their suffix. 21:07:42 And there is also something that does that in good shells. 21:07:56 But it's still uglier than trampolines, IMO. 21:08:01 A set of which cmd.exe is not a member. 21:08:07 (good shells) 21:08:36 Actually, cmd.exe can do that via windows -- 21:08:47 Yes, but it requires registry hackery. 21:08:58 at some point I considered adding some new suffix that would execute mzscheme accordingly, but gave up on that. 21:09:12 Which I did not want to require. Makes it less likely that I can give my "batch" file to anybody else. 21:09:13 It's just the idea of renaming a file to make it executable that sounds pretty bad. 21:09:21 Yes, that too. 21:09:42 (As if I weren't marginal enough already by requiring mzscheme....) 21:10:34 *Why* does it need to be a batch file...? 21:11:18 What else would it be? 21:11:45 I develop at the CLI, I'm on Windows. 21:12:14 I can fart around in posh, but I'd rather Scheme. Batch is the shortest way there. 21:12:24 Imagine all the people / Writing wrapper scripts 21:12:27 szgyg [~luni@dsl5401A06F.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #scheme 21:13:43 -!- snorble [~snorble@s83-179-14-105.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:14:06 Well I guess you could say it's its own wrapper script 21:14:36 snorble [~snorble@s83-179-14-105.cust.tele2.se] has joined #scheme 21:18:25 Jafet: That's what all shell trampolines do. 21:19:16 That reminds me, how does scheme interact with #! ? 21:19:23 I've wondered occasionally. 21:20:16 -!- SharkBrain [~gerard@222-152-107-233.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:20:27 I see that r6rs proposes a mechanism. 21:21:11 hm... is fluid-let no longer in PLT/ 21:21:12 *? 21:21:40 or, more usefully: what did it get replaced with? 21:21:45 parameters 21:22:08 okay 21:23:21 there's still a fluid-let in the "mzscheme" legacy language, apparently 21:23:37 okay, parameterize is what I wanted 21:25:24 -!- Jafet [~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:26:05 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #scheme 21:28:12 -!- Mr_Awesome [~eric@c-98-212-139-181.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:33:14 tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 21:33:39 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #scheme 21:34:23 hello. is it possible with r5rs-scheme to determine whether a variable is currently defined or not? 21:34:29 -!- tltstc [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:34:40 schoppenhauer: AFAIK no. 21:35:20 rickmode [~rickmode@cpe-76-167-41-163.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 21:35:32 That is, dynamically. You can always do static analysis on the sources to know that. 21:35:42 Via syntax-rules 21:35:45 pjb: my current problem is that I have to determine whether something was done yet or not ... 21:36:03 schoppenhauer: you need to do the bookkeeping yourself. 21:36:04 pjb: and i wanted to do this by setting some global flag 21:36:32 (define things-done '()) (push 'this things-done) (push 'that things-done) (member? 'this things-done) 21:36:55 Or would that be push! rather... 21:37:43 pjb: the problem is: the things to be done are in a file which must be loaded via (load ...) [which causes problems anyway, but well ...], and thus, when being in some other file, i cannot always define this flag. 21:37:59 -!- szgyg [~luni@dsl5401A06F.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.8/20100202165920]] 21:38:35 Daemmerung: should get a scsh on windows running, then :) 21:38:45 schoppenhauer: Common Lisp would give more freedom for this kind of things. 21:39:00 schoppenhauer: otherwise I'll repeat that you can always do static analysis of the sources. 21:40:16 pjb: hm. normally, I get an error-message when accessing undefined variables. maybe I could use some sort of error-handling? i have to write code compatible to mzscheme and petite. can this be done with them? 21:40:31 schoppenhauer: also, you asked for r5rs, but there may be some implementation specific introspection API. 21:40:45 error handling is not specified by r5rs. 21:40:57 -!- saint_cypher [~saint_cyp@adsl-99-2-72-93.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:41:11 schoppenhauer: With mzscheme, you can use (namespace-mapped-symbols) 21:41:45 pjb: my task is to write r5rs-compliant code whenever possible. but if it isnt possible, it should at least be compatible with these two. 21:42:35 saint_cypher [~saint_cyp@adsl-99-2-72-93.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 21:43:20 eli: thank you. unfortunately, seems that this doesnt work under petite :/ 21:44:19 schoppenhauer: perhaps you can special-case via cond-expand 21:44:33 surely petite offers comparable apis. 21:46:48 In Chez he wants `environment-symbols' it seems. 21:52:29 -!- Edico [~Edico@unaffiliated/edico] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 21:53:35 Daemmerung: ok. seems like (environment-symbols (interaction-environment)) does about the same as (namespace-mapped-symbols) (at least for my purposes). thanks 21:53:50 is there any way to determine which scheme-dialect I use? 21:55:58 something like conditional evaluation? (cond-expand seems to be specific, at least it doesnt work under petite and mz) 21:57:46 http://homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/wadler/papers/free-rectypes/free-rectypes.txt is interesting reading 21:57:47 -rudybot:#scheme- http://tinyurl.com/62s2nh 22:00:19 -!- tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:00:52 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:00:54 toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-137-111.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 22:01:42 tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 22:04:15 -!- hadronzoo [~hadronzoo@ppp-70-251-81-42.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Quit: hadronzoo] 22:06:37 -!- alexsuraci [~alexsurac@pool-71-188-133-67.aubnin.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:39 -!- metasyntax` [~taylor@75-149-208-121-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.1.92.1] 22:08:46 SharkBrain [~gerard@118-93-23-48.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 22:24:42 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 22:28:28 jcowan_ [~jcowan@cpe-98-14-172-204.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 22:28:50 -!- jcowan [~jcowan@2620:0:1003:1005:21a:a0ff:fe13:f0c0] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:28:55 -!- jcowan_ is now known as jcowan 22:29:34 Kusanagi [~Lernaean@unaffiliated/kusanagi] has joined #scheme 22:38:08 WG1 is now a healthy adolescent, having gone from the babbling stage to the sulking stage. 22:38:18 -!- tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:39:39 tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 22:40:49 congratulations maybe! 22:41:13 o/~ and many more? o/~ 22:57:25 -!- tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: tltstc`] 22:57:49 tltstc` [~tltstc@cpe-76-90-95-39.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 23:06:48 -!- wingo [~wingo@81.38.179.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:08:24 -!- bipt [bpt@cpe-075-182-095-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:10:01 ah, wingo! 23:10:06 and sigh, no Taylor 23:11:07 ben_m [~ben@chello084113058207.12.vie.surfer.at] has joined #scheme 23:15:04 alexsuraci [~alexsurac@pool-71-188-133-67.aubnin.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 23:19:34 -!- choas [~lars@p5B0DD322.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:19:45 mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 23:19:49 hey y'all 23:20:03 hey mheld 23:20:48 what's up? 23:21:09 bobert [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 23:22:03 WG1 is like bear-baiting 23:22:14 inhumane and dangerous, but potentially fun to watch 23:23:17 -!- bobert [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has left #scheme 23:24:06 When I look for a function, do I first look if my implementation has it in some library, do I look if there's an SRFI for it, or do I look if R6RN has it? 23:25:27 I'm mainly confused because in PLT, you can require each of these things 23:26:53 id probably go with implementation, then srfi, then r6rs 23:27:35 I would've done the reverse, good thing I asked 23:27:35 derrida [~derrida@unaffiliated/deleuze] has joined #scheme 23:28:21 ben_m, it's all about what you might want to port to 23:28:42 if you're just using PLT, then the order jonrafkind suggested is right 23:29:03 ive never used r6rs libraries with non-r6rs programs.. how does that work out? 23:29:08 incubot: mewling and puking 23:29:12 Same kind of people who'd come together and find out how much they can drink before puking or so. 23:30:56 incubot: pokey and mowgli 23:30:59 Sorry I wasn't able to help more. :-) 23:38:00 Is there an Emacs Mode for Scheme that provides autodoc in the minibuffer? 23:38:54 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:40:24 -!- hotblack23 [~jh@p4FC5B6CF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:43:56 ben_m, geiser 23:44:39 ben_m, http://gitorious.org/geiser 23:44:56 Testing! 23:45:24 That does look amazing, thanks. 23:46:19 np 23:48:39 -!- morphir [~morphir@84-52-234.12.3p.ntebredband.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:48:45 -!- attila_lendvai [~ati@catv-89-134-66-143.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 23:50:47 Quetzalcoatl_ [~godless@cpe-71-72-235-91.cinci.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 23:54:03 -!- Dawgmatix [~Dawgmatix@c-76-124-9-27.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:59:37 *Daemmerung* puts the kettle on