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has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:15:26 Bike_ [~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu] has joined #sbcl 04:16:32 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 04:22:31 -!- scymtym_ [~user@ip-5-147-115-29.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:45:49 zulu_inuoe_ [~quassel@71.47.78.155] has joined #sbcl 05:50:20 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 06:30:33 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #sbcl 06:33:34 zeto28 [~user1@p4FC7587C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #sbcl 06:59:10 fisxoj [~fisxoj@24-212-142-77.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #sbcl 06:59:14 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@24-212-142-77.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:16:31 -!- asedeno [~asedeno@66.102.14.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:18:19 asedeno [~asedeno@66.102.14.24] has joined #sbcl 07:20:55 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #sbcl 07:21:07 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:26:27 -!- zeto28 [~user1@p4FC7587C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #sbcl 07:33:56 -!- asedeno [~asedeno@66.102.14.24] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:02:11 zmyrgel [~zmyrgel@a91-153-150-75.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #sbcl 08:21:50 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:42:32 perhaps (sleep 0) or sb-thread:thread-yield should be used instead of short sleeps on windows, since the shorterst sleep is 10-15ms 09:47:42 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-150-44.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 10:10:44 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 10:15:02 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:17:49 -!- oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-150-44.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:18:38 oleo 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has joined #sbcl 13:48:20 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 13:52:22 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:03:34 LiamH [~none@96.231.216.85] has joined #sbcl 14:36:46 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:01:12 -!- zulu_inuoe_ [~quassel@71.47.78.155] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:17:52 got :application-type :gui for slad working on windows 15:21:32 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 16:02:42 michael_lee [~michael_l@219.145.47.251] has joined #sbcl 16:07:58 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #sbcl 16:08:33 leuler [~user@p548F97C1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #sbcl 16:20:08 -!- michael_lee [~michael_l@219.145.47.251] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:20:44 michael_lee [~michael_l@219.145.47.251] has joined #sbcl 16:27:42 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When I try to install sbcl-1.1.12 on FreeBSD-9.2 with threading I see "WARNING! Some of the contrib modules did not build successfully or pass their self-tests. Failed contribs:" sb-concurrency 261.90 real 159.84 user 677.89 sys. 03:05:16 Part of the build log that seems relevant is here: http://ftfl.ca/misc/problem_sbcl.txt 03:36:41 jrm: seems to be a timing issue 03:37:50 Is there way to increase the timeouts? 03:38:43 -!- christoph_debian [~christoph@ppp-46-244-187-204.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:40:10 This is on an i5-2520M CPU @ 2.50GHz, so I wonder if there is an underlying problem. 03:46:18 -!- LiamH [~none@96.231.216.85] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:46:52 jrm: scheduler foibles, most likely. 03:49:03 OK, thanks pkhuong, I'll see what I can find. 03:49:36 I really wouldn't worry too much about this. 03:50:18 Well, the port fails to install. Perhaps there is a way to set it to ignore the warning. 03:51:44 touching test-passed.test-report in obj/asdf-cache/sb-concurrency should do it. 03:52:09 christoph_debian [~christoph@ppp-88-217-51-245.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #sbcl 03:52:37 michael_lee [~michael_l@113.139.51.73] has joined #sbcl 03:53:09 *jrm* is trying that. 03:54:53 well.. you guys got the regalloc changes. I expect to be caught up in dissertation stuff until the 13th and probably later. 04:19:10 -!- scymtym_ [~user@ip-5-147-115-29.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:24:25 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:58:18 -!- oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-150-233.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:27:29 thanks, pkhuong, and good luck :) 06:55:10 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #sbcl 06:58:45 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #sbcl 07:00:47 prxq [~mommer@x2f65761.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #sbcl 07:21:24 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:20:04 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:34:07 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #sbcl 08:46:12 -!- michael_lee [~michael_l@113.139.51.73] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 09:05:20 poglesbyg_ [~poglesbyg@pc39-143.eduroam.uib.no] has joined #sbcl 09:08:30 -!- poglesbyg_ [~poglesbyg@pc39-143.eduroam.uib.no] has quit [Client Quit] 09:13:41 michael_lee [~michael_l@113.139.51.73] has joined #sbcl 09:34:48 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.207.143] has joined #sbcl 10:06:23 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.207.143] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:08:36 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 10:13:26 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:23:40 -!- ASau [~user@p54AFFA8B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:30:50 -!- kludge` [~comet@unaffiliated/espiral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:36:28 kludge` [~comet@unaffiliated/espiral] has joined #sbcl 10:44:13 ASau [~user@p54AFFA8B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #sbcl 10:47:09 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:04:50 hlavaty [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has joined #sbcl 11:16:07 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.114.139] has joined #sbcl 11:30:32 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #sbcl 11:56:11 -!- milosn_ [~milosn@user-5af50ef2.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:57:07 eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-52-52-176.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #sbcl 11:57:29 -!- kludge` [~comet@unaffiliated/espiral] has quit [Disconnected by services] 11:57:42 -!- foom [~jknight@2620:15c:6:14:be30:5bff:fedf:6db6] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:57:44 -!- reb [user@nat/google/x-ylcjtvtfjtorvgmx] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:57:45 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 11:57:46 foom [~jknight@2620:15c:6:14:be30:5bff:fedf:6db6] has joined #sbcl 11:57:52 kludge` [~comet@unaffiliated/espiral] has joined #sbcl 12:02:01 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:08:17 milosn [~milosn@user-5af50598.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #sbcl 12:13:42 ltt_ [~ltt_@143.106.196.220] has joined #sbcl 12:36:39 ltt__ [~ltt_@pvpn-143.home.unicamp.br] has joined #sbcl 12:37:02 -!- ltt_ [~ltt_@143.106.196.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:40:26 -!- pkhuong [~pkhuong@modemcable086.239-37-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:41:02 pkhuong [~pkhuong@modemcable086.239-37-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #sbcl 12:42:14 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:53:31 -!- scymtym [~user@2001:638:504:2093:baca:3aff:fe83:e736] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:18:50 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.114.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:24:54 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #sbcl 13:30:56 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #sbcl 13:46:25 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 13:51:01 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:52:44 -!- ltt__ [~ltt_@pvpn-143.home.unicamp.br] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 14:14:52 can't load ironclad 14:15:19 or rather, it's very slow 14:16:13 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 14:17:21 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.114.139] has joined #sbcl 14:18:14 20 seconds on slower laptop CPU, vs 38 seconds on a faster desktop CPU 14:18:29 the faster is using the new regalloc thingy, that is 14:21:24 check by setting the variable to :greedy and recompiling/loading ironclad? 14:22:37 that doesn't seem so bad, i just borked it first by interrupting to see what takes it so long and continuing: it failed with a out-of-bounds error in regalloc 14:26:59 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:33:26 brown [user@nat/google/x-ehkylzzsisozqzwb] has joined #sbcl 14:33:50 -!- brown is now known as Guest6735 14:34:24 -!- Guest6735 is now known as reb 14:36:55 segv- [~mb@95-91-240-229-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #sbcl 14:49:04 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-186-103.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 15:15:08 drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has joined #sbcl 15:27:11 scymtym [~user@2001:638:504:2093:baca:3aff:fe83:e736] has joined #sbcl 19:31:48 ccl-logbot [~ccl-logbo@setf.clozure.com] has joined #sbcl 19:31:48 19:31:48 -!- names: ccl-logbot nyef Vivitron heddwch Bike angavrilov drmeister oleo yacks danlentz milosn christoph_debian scymtym psilord kludge` Posterdati daimrod InvalidCo fe[nl]ix Blkt Munksgaard minion antoszka xymox @Krystof ivan`` fikusz reb joshe pkhuong pchrist flip511 luis- ams Tribal pegu jaimef hzp nicdev ferada specbot Subfusc jsnell_ redline6561 bege zmyrgel foom |3b| gko brucem asedeno 19:33:08 Hello all. 19:34:55 I just have a quick code review request for adding an external format, commit at http://repo.or.cz/w/sbcl/nyef.git/commitdiff/221206c096caa26186cce82da6db2e746cf7ccc6 (sans NEWS update). 19:35:39 (I'll probably post to sbcl-devel for feedback on it later if nobody pipes up here.) 19:35:55 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:39:46 nyef: looks fine to me 19:40:11 first person to notice a problem with the encoding gets to write the test cases :) 19:41:54 The first problem I noticed was that the file I had was in mac-roman. Who the heck uses mac-roman these days? The second problem I noticed was that not only did SBCL not support it, but flexi-streams didn't either. 19:43:01 So I should just slap a NEWS entry in there and commit? I found your notice of no freeze period this month. 19:43:14 please be my guest 19:43:23 Okay, thank you. 19:52:00 And committed. 20:03:27 ho ho ho 20:39:11 ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has joined #sbcl 21:20:28 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 21:22:25 -!- ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 21:29:12 ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has joined #sbcl 21:36:32 sdemarre [~serge@45.184-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #sbcl 21:40:30 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@ip68-106-18-79.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:56:16 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:16:05 zilitor [~nick@cpe-70-112-15-188.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #sbcl 22:17:09 -!- sdemarre [~serge@45.184-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:17:26 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:19:18 hi all, getting an error using caveman2: http://pastebin.com/s1B0nCZf 22:19:47 looks like it boils down to: "OSICAT" does not designate any package 22:20:03 anyone have any ideas how to resolve this? 22:23:04 have you specified that your app depends on osicat? 22:25:46 no, probably not. let me try adding it 22:28:28 do you know a good tutorial where i can learn this basic stuff? such as how to add a package? 22:43:34 "If the local system depends on software that is available through Quicklisp, the dependencies will be automatically loaded. " 22:43:47 Read that here: http://www.quicklisp.org/beta/index.html 22:44:06 kind of sounds like osicat should automatically be loaded 22:44:36 that is using (ql:quickload...) btw 22:50:23 zilitor: ask #lisp 22:58:25 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 23:18:07 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 00:11:16 -!- ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 00:12:12 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:12:55 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 00:15:27 ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has joined #sbcl 00:17:37 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:58:35 -!- ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 01:08:49 michael_lee 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has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:27:31 slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has joined #sbcl 17:37:24 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 17:46:12 -!- ltbarcly [~textual@pool-108-42-99-156.snfcca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 17:49:46 nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-134-244.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #sbcl 17:49:52 Hello all. 17:50:33 Does anyone remember why lisp_memory_fault_error() is so desperately lame? ISTR it being a kludge due to backtrace on some platforms, but I'm really not certain. 17:53:16 hi nyef 17:54:36 nyef: the backtrace kludge is why we allocate(d?) interrupt contexts with mmap on darwin and never release them. 17:55:03 I think l_m_f_e is a quick hack to avoid heap allocation of the fault address. 17:55:05 Okay, I knew there was some reason why we had a backtrace kludge. 17:55:25 Isn't the fault address available in the signal context anyway? 17:55:54 And didn't the original cause of the backtrace thing for for darwin get fixed? 17:57:49 -!- Bike [~Glossina@75-175-69-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:58:05 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:59:04 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-88-50.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #sbcl 18:15:25 mailorg [~mailorg@193.105.154.40] has joined #sbcl 18:19:54 -!- mailorg [~mailorg@193.105.154.40] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:27:34 tatusy [~tatusy@91.210.103.47] has joined #sbcl 18:27:34 -!- tatusy [~tatusy@91.210.103.47] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:38:40 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 18:39:51 davazp [~user@170.Red-83-63-202.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #sbcl 18:42:04 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:44:32 No, seriously, why don't we have an interrupt context when we get a memory fault? 18:47:32 -!- davazp [~user@170.Red-83-63-202.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:47:53 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:51:17 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 18:51:54 slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has joined #sbcl 18:56:05 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 19:12:49 -!- luis` is now known as luis 19:41:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@147.30.99.154] has joined #sbcl 19:41:55 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@147.30.99.154] has quit [Changing host] 19:41:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #sbcl 19:51:10 -!- oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-160-36.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:59:25 Umm... Why is monitor_or_something() defined as never_returns (monitor.h)? It's designed to be able to, and I'm in a situation where I'm going to want it to. 20:09:01 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-160-36.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 20:33:56 ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has joined #sbcl 20:36:09 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:37:39 slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has joined #sbcl 20:45:53 -!- ltt_ [~ltt_@201.75.216.14] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 20:52:23 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 20:54:48 Oh, for the love of GC invariants, it's HOW easy to allocate a code-component on a non-CODE_PAGE_FLAG page?!? 20:56:07 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:57:19 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:05:46 |--------------------------- this easy --------------------------| 21:05:51 (evening, nyef) 21:06:08 Evening. 21:07:35 This is an almost embarrassingly large hole in the GC page type logic. The only saving grace is that it's currently used as a heuristic more than anything else, even if I AM trying to change that. 21:25:35 hey nyef, whatcha working on? 21:25:46 More precise conservative GC. 21:30:35 I've got something that shouldn't break, and should provide slightly tighter bounds than what we're currently running, and I now know WHY I'm having trouble refining it further. 21:31:00 I'm just verifying that the weaker approach actually does work. 21:41:10 And it survives a build, which is a good start. 21:44:39 cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 21:44:54 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.222.238] has joined #sbcl 21:46:37 nice 21:46:47 any progress on the arm port? 21:48:25 No, I've done barely any SBCL internals hacking this past half-year and more. 21:48:47 On the upside, I've at least THOUGHT about it once or twice recently. 21:49:16 sbcl on an odroid3 sounds like it would be neat 21:50:13 Honestly, the arm port is well down on my list of priorities for free lisp hacking at the moment. 22:05:31 -!- haxx [~Rob@69.77.176.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:08:15 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: computation disconnected into paranoid something] 22:25:51 We're still not in code freeze, and won't be until at least mid-January, right? 22:26:06 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:26:53 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.222.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:36:00 right 22:36:46 -!- jrm2 is now known as jrm 22:36:46 -!- jrm [~jrm@Dynamic34-29.Dynamic.Dal.Ca] has quit [Changing host] 22:36:46 jrm [~jrm@freebsd/hacker/jrm] has joined #sbcl 22:41:36 Hunh. It just occurs to me that if we had the ability to do a precise backtrace, we could pick out the return addresses from the stack directly, and use a more-conservative version of preserve_pointer() for them, and the less-conservative version for everything else. 22:41:55 It's a bit of a killer "if", though. 22:45:45 haxx [~Rob@69.77.176.98] has joined #sbcl 22:51:31 And pushed. 22:59:54 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #sbcl 23:03:05 -!- haxx [~Rob@69.77.176.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:04:24 haxx [~Rob@69.77.176.98] has joined #sbcl 23:15:17 -!- haxx [~Rob@69.77.176.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:37:44 wbooze [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-128-236.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 23:38:05 -!- oleo is now known as Guest12800 23:38:45 -!- Guest12800 [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-160-36.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:39:17 -!- wbooze is now known as oleo 23:47:36 haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has joined #sbcl 00:05:03 if we had precise backtraces, we could have a stack map 00:16:56 And if we had a stack map, we could use it to produce precise backtraces, surely? 00:18:11 On the other hand, we'd also have to work with the stack map for alien code as well. 00:19:16 Hrm. Actually, just found the brief version of my notes on this, and they indicate a shortcut to not require an alien stack map. 00:24:57 dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 00:35:16 pkhuong: Would you happen to know what would be involved in producing a stack map? 00:35:54 I haven't gone back and checked yet, but ISTR that that was one of the big unknowns that I hadn't figured out when I was originally looking into this stuff. 00:44:25 hi nyef. 00:44:35 Hello dto. 00:44:36 a merry holiday to you and all the sbcl peeps :) 00:44:43 Same to you. 00:45:04 hows it going? 00:45:24 Tolerably well at this point. 00:45:48 that sounds vaguely good! 00:46:03 -!- cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:46:24 I'm on semi-vacation right now, so I don't have a lot of paying-work stuff in my head, and I've been trying to figure out what to do over the short-to-mid term (say, up to six months out), and it seems to be weighted towards open-source lisp stuff again, finally. (-: 00:47:21 hey that's great! 00:47:31 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 00:48:17 what sort of projects? 00:49:33 Filing down the worst of the rough edges that I've encountered while trying to get paying work done using Lisp. 00:52:16 Also writing about my experiences and some of the various things that I've written (the more generic bits, rather than anything that'll expose a business model or key technical infrastructure). 00:52:49 that's cool. and the secret particle robotics lab stays secret 00:52:51 :) 00:53:29 im eventually hoping to develop and sell a game 00:53:50 but its apparently quite difficult to do so in todays mega glut choked indie market 00:55:02 "Indie" these days seems to still involve a decent chunk of budget. 00:55:27 yeah and backers/publishers and all that 00:55:33 sounds familiar doesnit it 00:55:39 HOWEVER imma stay PURE 00:56:39 nyef: I have a branch that allocates first boxed, then unboxed slots (and then DX alloc) on the stack. 00:57:40 pkhuong: Does it include a map of which boxed slots are live at any given time, where the D-X area starts, and which registers are live-boxed? 00:57:41 nyef: so the stack map would consist of two small integers. Otherwise, we could change the stack alloc logic to only have boxed or unboxed (or don't care) values at each offset, and we'd need a bitmap 00:58:10 nyef: no, it's just the boxed/unboxed layout. 00:58:32 (so yeah, it does include DX) 00:58:33 The other option would be, since x86-64 has enough registers, to partition the register set and move to separate control and number stacks. 00:59:09 I'm interested in testing stassats's theory that the issue is just stale pointers 00:59:28 Which issue? 00:59:37 re conservativeness 00:59:43 which should be easy to erase. Insert some tiny VOPs post-regalloc. 01:01:07 i.e., what if our conservativeness woes are completely unrelated to unboxed values? Sure, it'd be nice not to pin stack refs, but killing stale pointers would already be pretty good. 01:02:29 There are a few aspects to conservativeness that, independently, would be nice to kill. And if we nail them all, we end up with a precise collector anyway. 01:04:02 Stale pointers really shouldn't be a problem if we don't allow random untagged values to pin entire pages even if they're straightforward to detect as unboxed data. 01:04:07 for a more precise map, I think it only makes sense on safepoint builds 01:04:45 all the test cases I see on lp are stale pointers, not lucky untagged values 01:05:00 Hrm. 01:05:20 But stale pointers would also affect the precise GC ports. 01:05:39 Only not as badly, because the precise GC ports don't pin easily. 01:05:52 except when the stale pointer is to a huge array. 01:06:35 So, stale pointer reduction is generally a win, even if we had a precise GC. That's a good angle to work on. 01:06:42 non-CGC ports have it worse too, because I failed to port smaller stack frames to !x86 (we fail to memmove the &more vector in the right order) 01:07:15 Hah! Non-x86oid ports are still at risk of having the &more vector overwritten if an interrupt comes in at a bad time. 01:07:53 nyef: oh i have a question about the code snippet you wrote that modifies a windows exe to attempt to not have a 2nd console window open. did you ever experience that to work? when i tried it, no window opened at all, i.e. no console, but game wouldn't start 01:08:22 No, I've never actually tried it. 01:08:23 just call a function with a lot of &rest arguments but few stack-allocated TNs and watch it fail. 01:09:13 dto: I believe stas pushed a fix some time ago, along with an option to do it in slad. 01:09:32 dto: TL;DR: non-console apps don't have standard streams. 01:09:50 pkhuong: Ugh. Sounds like a general audit is in order there. I should be able to scare up PPC, SPARC, and MIPS systems for testing if necessary, though I'm not sure how up-to-date any of them would be. 01:10:20 nyef: they're all borked. 01:11:25 pkhuong: what's slad 01:11:32 pkhuong: awesome to hear about that! 01:11:36 dto: save-lisp-and-die. 01:11:40 ah. thanks. 01:11:59 Mmm. Well, I'm not going to be able to focus on them for at least another week, purely in terms of hardware availability... And even then it's not likely. /-: 01:12:21 stas might have fixed PPC, thanks to gcc's farm. 01:12:38 pkhuong: hey. i converted everything to CLOS and multimethods, and now 2x0ng runs just as smoothly as before :) plus, i have been building up the forest simulation thing. i just made this new vid a short while ago. http://blocky.io/clos.ogv 01:12:54 i think the clos implementation seems pretty fast 01:13:01 i tested the game with high object counts, etc 01:13:55 I think our CLOS is slow at defining new stuff and calling (effective) methods for the first time. 01:14:02 EQL specialisers are also not ideal 01:14:44 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 01:15:35 yes i've heard it caches the effective method. that's cool. i'm using more multimethods and :after methods and stuff, i'll let you know if i experience any performance issues. 01:15:46 but thus far seems great! 01:15:46 Anyway, getting back to conservatism, I should be able to reduce the (already pretty low) incidence of lucky integers a bit more by making CODE_PAGE_FLAG more of an invariant (these pages only contain code, and code is only contained in these pages). From there, we'd probably pin the code pages anyway, and if we had a stack map we could reduce the number of pinned pages significantly. 01:16:24 pkhuong, nyef i'll be afk but, happy holidays to you :) 01:16:38 dto: thank you, happy new year to you (: 01:17:01 dto: Indeed. Happy holidays. I'm grabbing down that video now, it's been a while since I've seen any lisp gaming stuff. (-: 01:17:24 nyef: I'm working on !lisp stuff (LP solvers), but I'm still hoping to hack in a mark/sweep for everything but the nursery. 01:18:25 Oh, right. Mark/sweep. Where was I with that? 01:19:06 nyef: noprob. i'll be back in a bit, let me know if you have any thoughts. 01:19:15 I was at: I find no simpler way than to hook in the scavenging function. 01:19:28 Ooh. I have an angle on more precise GC even without fixing up the CODE_PAGE_FLAG noise. 01:20:07 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:20:11 you mentioned ~6 months ago that you were thinking of switching to mostly *not* copying with the pinning machinery 01:20:53 That can't've been right. 01:21:20 Oh, right. If a page is still mostly-live, then just pin it and replace the dead objects with "free space" objects. 01:21:27 right. 01:21:48 That's still in my list of possible hacks, but it does require markbits. 01:24:18 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 01:24:23 I'm also stuck on writing an allocator for the mark/sweep heap. Perhaps I could just keep the current infrastructure for free allocation pages and only compact the nursery, without trying to reuse < page-size free space. 01:24:36 -!- echo-area [~user@111.196.4.0] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:26:09 cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 01:26:38 *nyef* sighs. 01:27:12 I don't particularly feel like porting dlmalloc in, for example. 01:27:20 I keep hitting M-a when I want to "select all" because of spending so much time on a mac. /-: 01:27:37 (and also not sure how to make it play well with coresave) 01:27:53 Yeah, I've got a list of things that could be done to improve the core files. 01:28:13 Sparse core files, more information in the page tables, have genesis output a page table, and so on. 01:28:38 nyef: forgot one thing. in the video , the scrolling stutters a bit once or twice, but that's the video capture , not th egame 01:29:24 another hopefully simple hack is to allocate unboxed pages from the end of the heap. 01:29:43 dto: It looks quite neat. 01:30:10 pkhuong: How about separate per-thread unboxed allocation regions instead of mixing boxed and unboxed values in the same nursery? 01:30:11 nyef: hey thanks :) 01:30:11 or at least chunks that grow geometrically. The page protection swiss cheese is really hard on OSes. 01:30:28 nyef: meh. large allocations skip the per-thread region. 01:30:36 True enough. 01:30:43 small ones can be moved when GCing the nursery. 01:30:54 Oh, and the problem with allocating at the end of the heap is that we don't have sparse core files. 01:31:08 And you can't move objects from pinned pages. 01:31:16 nyef: eventually (: 01:31:54 re code files, we could also have another directory entry 01:33:00 Sparse cores would require more page-table data, but is the more general solution. We've already had one bug due to non-contiguous dynamic space in core files. 01:33:13 ah, ok. 01:46:42 dto: If you're still around, could you tell me if you run into trouble with GC pauses in your gaming work? 01:48:11 nyef: sure 01:48:36 So, GC pauses are a problem for you? 01:48:40 i've never had any problem with it in 2x0ng, 01:48:44 or any of my other games 01:48:45 Ah, okay. 01:49:01 How many Lisp threads are you using for these games? 01:49:09 just one, 01:49:31 Okay, thank you. 01:49:55 in 2x0ng i tend to create the whole level at once and then discard it when i make the next one. 01:50:37 there's a slight pause when doing that, but it's very very brief. like 300 ms 01:50:48 I strongly suspect that I get bit, badly, by GC pauses when I have "too many" threads, which implies that the nastiness is in the stop-the-world synchronization. With your game scenario, you're probably getting fairly good locality from the generational aspect of the collector. 01:50:49 and that includes the actual generation, 01:51:11 yeah i bet you're right. 01:52:09 i did a lot of testing to make sure repeated creation of large levels didn't eat memory. so i know that the gc is happening, and it doesn't seem to take much time. but i am doing it in big chunks. 01:52:37 i still cons a lot in general but nothing bad ever happens. 01:57:41 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:58:35 pkhuong: I'd noticed that you'd favorited my tweet about Melange. Let me know if you look at it in a serious way. 02:05:09 Do Java implementations tend to have "boxed immediate" data, or does it tend to be all object references? 02:09:02 Hrm... Looks highly likely. Damn. 02:12:09 echo-area [~user@182.92.247.2] has joined #sbcl 02:14:45 java has static primitive types. everything else is boxed. 02:15:48 brucem: sure 02:16:59 pkhuong: So either an object is boxed or unboxed, and all fields in a boxed object are references to other objects? 02:17:44 (Or, alternately, the compiler knows ahead of time whenever it's pulling a pointer or immediate data?) 02:20:25 konservy [~konservy@91.210.101.137] has joined #sbcl 02:29:01 -!- konservy [~konservy@91.210.101.137] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:51 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #sbcl 02:36:16 nyef: the latter. 02:36:27 Okay, thanks. 02:36:34 (Damn.) 02:37:39 I'm thinking about software read barriers again, and I have a scheme which would work for Java, is two instructions typically executed for the barrier, one of which is a conditional branch that usually isn't taken. 02:38:05 The equivalent for SBCL would be four instructions, two of which are branches, one of which would be taken depending on the data being read. 02:38:09 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-88-50.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:38:21 do tell (I'm still sad that my one-instruction write barrier sucks ;) 02:38:38 (Okay, there'd be a third/fifth instruction which could conditionally trap.) 02:38:55 I'm looking at an Azul-style "not-marked-through" bit in the address. 02:39:28 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-88-50.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #sbcl 02:39:45 So, have a TLS-allocated slot that contains a mask for the NMT bit. TEST, JNZ/JZ, done. 02:40:12 If you want the "evacuated page" trap as well, also TEST the pointer target. 02:40:17 why can't the NMT bit be constant, or, at least, global? 02:40:52 Because you want to flip the GC phase for each thread separately instead of stopping the world. 02:41:42 What's your one-instruction version? 02:42:17 Oh, write barrier. Hrm. 02:42:17 for writes: mark cards with BTS in a table of 2^32 bit. 02:42:27 That'd do it, I guess. 02:43:01 adds around 10 cycles/write, sadly. 02:43:40 Mmm. That's not wonderful. 02:44:22 ... Core relocation was one of the projects suggested for GSOC 2013? I thought we almost had that working? 02:45:02 "almost." famous last words. 02:45:20 As in, supposedly it just needed forward-porting? 02:45:22 I'd rather see a project end early than fail. 02:49:00 I trust motivated people to find more stuff to do 02:54:14 Fair enough, I guess. 02:55:51 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:59:30 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:00:33 slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has joined #sbcl 03:01:22 -!- haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:08:52 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 03:10:19 haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has joined #sbcl 03:13:14 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:23:48 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-16.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #sbcl 03:27:12 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #sbcl 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timeout: 246 seconds] 13:30:27 cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 13:33:05 jrm [~jrm@Dynamic34-29.Dynamic.Dal.Ca] has joined #sbcl 13:33:37 -!- jrm [~jrm@Dynamic34-29.Dynamic.Dal.Ca] has quit [Changing host] 13:33:37 jrm [~jrm@freebsd/hacker/jrm] has joined #sbcl 13:35:19 [1]cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 13:36:57 -!- cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:36:57 -!- [1]cneira is now known as cneira 13:47:41 -!- cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:51:00 xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has joined #sbcl 13:54:58 nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-134-244.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #sbcl 13:56:01 -!- xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:56:09 G'morning all. 14:03:24 hi nyef 14:10:23 Any commit message where I can say "approximately 1/pi" in reference to function size can't be all bad. (-: 14:17:19 xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has joined #sbcl 14:24:44 -!- xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:30:21 xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has joined #sbcl 14:39:18 -!- xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:43:41 dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 14:52:40 xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has joined #sbcl 15:03:18 -!- xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:15:50 -!- zmyrgel [~zmyrgel@a91-153-150-75.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:39:59 -!- dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:50:30 chesnokoff [~chesnokof@91.210.102.181] has joined #sbcl 15:57:46 dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 15:59:23 cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 16:01:45 -!- chesnokoff [~chesnokof@91.210.102.181] has quit [K-Lined] 16:10:01 edgar-rfx [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #sbcl 16:10:52 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 16:10:52 nyef: what are your feelings on a C backend? Codegen could be restricted to emitting subroutine threaded code. 16:18:43 (strict safepoints means we don't have to deal with untagged roots) 16:21:01 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.222.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:23:06 -!- Guest59300 [user@nat/google/x-ffynhjkywauhxavo] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:23:07 Guest59300 [user@nat/google/session] has joined #sbcl 16:23:07 -!- Guest59300 [user@nat/google/session] has quit [Changing host] 16:23:07 Guest59300 [user@nat/google/x-slismwxnhaoxlhyy] has joined #sbcl 16:23:12 Trying to horn in on the ECL market? 16:23:47 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:23:47 -!- foom [~jknight@2620:15c:6:14:be30:5bff:fedf:6db6] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:23:59 -!- |3b| [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:24:02 -!- Guest59300 [user@nat/google/x-slismwxnhaoxlhyy] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:04 foom [~jknight@2620:15c:6:14:be30:5bff:fedf:6db6] has joined #sbcl 16:24:07 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #sbcl 16:24:24 I'm thinking "why bother", but I'm sure you have at least some justification for it. 16:25:39 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 16:26:11 -!- dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:28:30 easier to bootstrap a port. 16:28:41 not C backend as in generating C 16:29:05 but as in VOPs are just shims that call out to C. 16:30:28 Let me think about that one. My initial thought is that it's not a great advantage, but I'm having trouble articulating why. 16:30:50 eventually, I expect the backend will be better suited to LLVM trickery than current native backends: LLVM code has similar restrictions to C. 16:31:32 How about a bytecode backend instead? 16:31:48 what's the difference? the threading method? 16:32:06 I like subroutine threading because it's easy to mix in native codegen bit by bit. 16:32:18 There is that. 16:33:16 Still massively unconvinced, given the typical overhead for a call-to-c. 16:33:25 with VOPs? 16:33:50 does that mean that the port would naturally look quite like it respects the platform abi? 16:33:56 Krystof: yes. 16:34:17 Krystof: erh, well.. more naturally than current ports anyway 16:34:29 :) 16:34:56 "to SBCL, all Lisp code is inside one platform-ABI function call" 16:36:20 so, wait, what isn't written in C in this model? We still need MOVE vops implemented ourselves, right? 16:36:30 I'm thinking functions could stick all their local state in (on stack or otherwise DX) memory, and VOPs can just emit a regular C call. 16:38:04 we need call_into_lisp, and enough lisp-side understanding of register layout (and agreement with GC) 16:38:29 I don't think we need to handle registers, except for arg passing. 16:39:41 and if we're careful about our calling convention, Lisp functions will look like C functions that happen to *only* call more functions. 16:39:51 Feedback request time! Please comment on http://repo.or.cz/w/sbcl/nyef.git/commitdiff/68e3d97d6d9aaf4ba279b6e99ab24d7679270857 thank you. (-: 16:40:04 what about multiple return values? Everything returns a struct? 16:40:34 Krystof: thread local vector? 16:40:57 same for arguments. Just pass thread local state as an explicit C argument. 16:42:07 next you'll tell me that we can make the memory image an ELF object 16:42:09 nyef: looks a lot better to me. 16:42:25 Krystof: that would be nice ;) 16:44:31 nyef: n.b., I'm not talking about emitting sb-alien stuff or going through call_into_c, but rather about mangling the port's internals to be compatible with the C ABI and have VOPs only emit C-style call sequences. 16:45:22 pkhuong: With your stack map stuff, if we can get a precise backtrace on x86oids, we can convert them to use the precise-gencgc method of pinning objects, and then we can relocate the actual object references on the stack, bringing the conservatism down to the interrupt contexts and... Well, actually, we could even patch the return addresses. Hunh. 16:45:36 pkhuong: I have to say I think it would be hilarious 16:46:23 nyef: yup. But I don't grok our backtrace issues 16:46:31 and I vaguely remember some issue with NLX 16:47:13 Right. I'm adding it to my to-investigate list, especially since it ONLY has to work for x86oids at the moment. 16:47:37 void call_into_lisp (thread_t *thread, void (*initial_function)(thread_t *thread)); 16:47:53 certainly beats trying to work out what the difference between Thumb and ARM mode is 16:48:29 Krystof: oh boy. heh. And working with the cross product of all FP capabilities. 16:56:15 -!- foom [~jknight@2620:15c:6:14:be30:5bff:fedf:6db6] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:08:55 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:10:26 pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has joined #sbcl 17:18:54 DeadTrickster [~dead@62.122.188.214] has joined #sbcl 17:21:20 xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has joined #sbcl 17:21:40 Okay, I'm going to commit these changes to the conservative GC logic. Even if they're likely not a speed win, they're definitely an accuracy win. 17:22:48 Krystof: would you happen to have interesting instances of box-constrained least-squares fit? 17:27:41 -!- xymox [lechuck@unaffiliated/contempt] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:38:04 -!- echo-area [~user@114.254.103.29] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:40:18 pkhuong: do you have a thesis in search of a problem? 17:40:44 echo-area [~user@114.254.103.29] has joined #sbcl 17:45:02 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:52:26 -!- danlentz [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:52:28 danlentz_ [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 17:59:47 no. I have an interesting program in search of a problem. 18:00:18 Strong enough for LPs, but made for constrained LS. 18:03:03 -!- danlentz_ [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:03:37 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 18:07:44 [1]cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 18:09:55 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has quit [Quit: Ping timeout: ] 18:10:51 -!- cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:10:51 -!- [1]cneira is now known as cneira 18:17:46 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:23:07 -!- Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:24:02 -!- specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:24:08 specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has joined #sbcl 18:24:11 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:24:57 danlentz [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 18:27:24 slyrus [~chatzilla@udp047553uds.hawaiiantel.net] has joined #sbcl 18:29:42 dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #sbcl 18:35:17 -!- echo-area [~user@114.254.103.29] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:36:00 echo-area [~user@114.254.103.29] has joined #sbcl 18:41:50 -!- ivan`` [~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:44:14 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 18:44:57 ivan`` [~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001] has joined #sbcl 18:55:04 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:56:41 Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has joined #sbcl 18:56:41 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Krystof 18:59:54 -!- Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:00:35 Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has joined #sbcl 19:00:35 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Krystof 19:02:54 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #sbcl 19:04:33 Hm, what about semibox? I have applications of NNLS everywhere 19:04:35 -!- dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-251.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:04:58 works as well. 19:05:24 Most of mine are a mix of unconstrained and non-negative. 19:08:34 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 19:26:26 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:36:40 so, yes, I have problems that involve NNLS. (Estimation of note composition of audio spectra). I don't know how many "lots" of variables would be, but around log10(nvar) ~ 4-6 19:36:46 what do you want to sell me? 19:40:10 |3b| [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has joined #sbcl 19:40:25 why handcode the logic of a VOP as C instead of LLVM bytecode? 19:40:42 You could still send the bytecode for each VOP through the linker individually and call it out of line if you really had to. 19:40:49 But whenever compiling something whose VOPs all have LLVM versions already, you can then skip the out-of-line calls and assemble the whole thing as one function. 19:41:17 Krystof: ok, that's interesting (: 19:42:12 hzp: LLVM is heavy and not that fun to work with. I'd rather avoid it for a fresh port; this can be easily be tweaked afterward. 19:44:07 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 19:45:31 Krystof: an accelerated parallel coordinate descent method. 19:46:13 It's adaptive to the sparsity of the constraint matrix, and doesn't get stuck when a single directional derivative has a huge Lipschitz constant. 19:47:06 pkhuong: Looking at gencgc.c again, at around line 2355 there is a call to code_page_p() for a large_object page where the lowtag is LIST_POINTER_LOWTAG. It's trying to pick off the case of a pointer to beyond the end of a "shrunk" object, but surely we can simply disallow list pointers to large_object pages here? 19:47:35 nyef: sounds right to me. 19:47:37 (Mind you, I wouldn't build IR by calling a gazillion of funny C++ functions. Cross-compilation should assemble in pure lisp anyway, so just write bitcode files from Lisp, and use the minimal amount of the C++ calls at runtime needed to load the stuff later.) 19:48:09 hzp: we'd need some more hooks in the GC too. LLVM doesn't do PIC 19:48:15 (at runtime) 19:49:01 nyef: otoh, can't we just look at the first object in the large object page? There should never be more than one large object/allocation. 19:49:39 This is post-shrink, pre-GC, so no. There's still a possible tail of (0 . 0) CONSes. 19:49:51 Krystof: an implementation of http://arxiv.org/abs/1312.5799. 19:49:55 nyef: but they're dead. 19:50:02 My point exactly! 19:50:14 I admit I haven't thought much about little functions being garbage collected and stuff. The JIT doesn't generate good code anyway, so you'd always keep all bitcode in memory, and when saving a core file, compile it all into one sbcl.so using the non-JIT compiler. 19:50:25 The GC doesn't know it yet, and we're picking off the case of a conservative root trying to hold one of them live. 19:50:39 nyef: so instead of disallowing lisp pointers, it's even simpler to only allow pointers to the first object in a large allocation? 19:50:45 *list pointers 19:51:31 Not quite, but disallowing list pointers would fail because of the possibility of large-object code-objects. 19:51:37 hzp: you can switch the JIT to O3 level if you want. 19:51:46 -!- nicdev [~user@kilimanjaro.rafpepa.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:52:04 nicdev` [~user@kilimanjaro.rafpepa.com] has joined #sbcl 19:52:44 Ah, I can pick the case off in valid_conservative_root_p(), after dealing with the code-object case. 19:53:49 Hrm. Or not. 19:55:26 Going to have to think about this a little bit, but being able to get rid of code_page_p() would be a clear win. 19:55:51 pkhuong: maybe it's gotten fancier since I last looked... 19:57:11 haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has joined #sbcl 19:57:24 it is too close to new year's day for me to understand that 19:57:45 I will note, though, that I have just had a prospective part-time PhD student approach me with interests in compilers, threads and C++ 19:57:59 I wonder if he would like to implement a C++ backend for SBCL... 19:58:20 Krystof: surprisingly simple code. I'm hoping to port this from CL to C + threads some time next year. 19:58:54 How about a C++ front-end for SBCL, used for easier alien bindings? 19:59:08 hzp: llvm has been eliminating differences for a while (they don't really care about runtime compilation times). They're even working on bundling in regular assemblers for __asm__ 19:59:32 nyef: now that, I want to use clang for. Looks like a ~1 month job ;) 20:00:19 Put it on the list for GSoC '14? 20:00:38 it was for '13. 20:00:45 Okay, fair enough. 20:01:25 It was probably in one of the parts that I looked at and said "not interesting to me", so I didn't read it in depth. (-: 20:21:05 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:31:53 "may be further described if there is interest" 20:32:12 a forward-looking project manager would probably say something like "let's get the GSoC14 list in place now" 20:32:21 but I haven't written my blog entry for today yet 20:32:41 milosn_ [~milosn@94.12.79.143] has joined #sbcl 20:33:40 -!- milosn [~milosn@94.12.79.143] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 20:38:43 drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #sbcl 20:48:59 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 20:58:52 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:59:21 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 20:59:47 -!- haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:05:53 haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has joined #sbcl 21:33:19 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:34:37 -!- haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:47:48 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@ip24-250-59-12.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:17:46 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:20:58 -!- edgar-rfx [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: execution discontinued into perpetual damage] 22:34:53 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:52:32 haxx [~Rob@135-23-80-105.cpe.pppoe.ca] has joined #sbcl 22:57:29 -!- cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:00:00 cneira [~cneira@pc-33-7-104-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #sbcl 23:12:00 Hunh. I'm just looking over my old notes and there's a bit "If we tighten up the preliminary test logic so that we always know that we wish to pin going into maybe_adjust_large_object() then...", and that happens to be precisely what I've just done.