2015-01-23T00:00:04Z stassats: pkhuong_: what will happen if it's interrupted?
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2015-01-23T00:02:23Z stassats: then a bad thing can happen with initial-thread-function too, DX or pinned
2015-01-23T00:04:47Z stassats: though pretty unlike that a GC will happen
2015-01-23T00:10:58Z stassats: can it just wait on the semaphore in the unwind-protect cleanup?
2015-01-23T00:12:01Z stassats: and what happens when unwind-protect cleanup is interrupt?
2015-01-23T00:13:10Z stassats: ah wait, with-system-mutex does indeed have without-interrupts, so, nothing to worry about
2015-01-23T00:13:50Z stassats: (can we have interrupts but without-unwind?)
2015-01-23T00:14:06Z stassats: probably not worth it
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2015-01-23T14:36:39Z stassats: 5 commits later, seems to have replicated yesterday's thread consing reduction
2015-01-23T14:37:16Z stassats: twice less consing, no consing in the new thread until it returns
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2015-01-23T14:40:53Z flip214: does a function store its compile-timestamp? would like to know whether to re-generate some cache.
2015-01-23T14:41:31Z stassats: it doesn't
2015-01-23T14:42:15Z stassats: maybe the debug information does with some optimization settings
2015-01-23T14:42:21Z stassats: but you shouldn't really touch that part anyway
2015-01-23T14:42:49Z flip214: I could embed a #.( ) form somewhere, though ;)
2015-01-23T14:44:44Z stassats: debug source does store it, but it's not useful to you
2015-01-23T14:45:16Z Krystof: (sb-kernel:%code-debug-info (sb-di::fun-code #'foo)) ; use with caution
2015-01-23T14:45:39Z stassats: "Lock on package SB-DI violated when interning FUN-CODE while in"
2015-01-23T14:46:13Z stassats: (sb-c::debug-source-compiled (sb-introspect::function-debug-source #'foo)) => 3631013104
2015-01-23T14:46:15Z stassats: ;;; don't use
2015-01-23T14:46:37Z Krystof: sorry, sb-disassem::
2015-01-23T14:46:47Z Krystof: but yes, these are excitingly internal ways of getting hold of things
2015-01-23T14:48:07Z Krystof: I am also reminded of http://www.advogato.org/person/wnewman/diary/6.html
2015-01-23T14:49:06Z stassats: i noticed recently a branch which tries to unite them
2015-01-23T14:49:57Z stassats: https://github.com/sbcl/sbcl/tree/debugectomy_branch
2015-01-23T14:49:58Z stassats: i think
2015-01-23T14:50:28Z stassats: it says "merge DEBUG-FUN, COMPILED-DEBUG-FUN, and BOGUS-DEBUG-FUN."
2015-01-23T14:50:38Z stassats: not sure if that's what i think it is
2015-01-23T14:51:53Z stassats: doesn't look like it
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2015-01-23T19:35:06Z Krystof: stassats: are you done?
2015-01-23T19:35:17Z stassats: yes
2015-01-23T19:35:22Z Krystof: it slightly belatedly occurs to me that it's freezeish time
2015-01-23T19:35:34Z Krystof: totally submerged in work :(.  Anyone want to do a PhD with me?
2015-01-23T19:35:48Z stassats: i've been suspecting a freeze
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2015-01-23T19:36:46Z stassats split things into 5 commits so that it's easier to bisect
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2015-01-23T19:38:42Z stassats: next project on a similar line: figure out why just ./run-sbcl.sh goes through one GC
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2015-01-23T19:39:28Z stassats: seems to be happening with safepoints only
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2015-01-23T20:07:49Z scymtym: stassats: why is it possible to dx-flet initial-thread-function and pass it to different thread? is it because the parent thread resumes only after i-t-f made a tail-call (therefore no longer accessing any closed-over values) to the trampoline function which signals the semaphore?
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2015-01-23T20:11:00Z stassats: scymtym: tail call, the semaphore and without-interrupts make it possible
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2015-01-23T20:12:28Z scymtym: ok, thanks
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2015-01-23T20:26:41Z pkhuong: Krystof: I can find an unsuspecting victim or two
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2015-01-23T21:32:32Z stassats: some weird interference of self calls with code locations
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2015-01-23T21:44:13Z stassats: gotta love age old bugs surfacing after something gets changed
2015-01-23T21:46:16Z nyef: Mmm. Had that happen a time or two myself.
2015-01-23T21:47:11Z stassats: fun maps are still a mystery to me
2015-01-23T21:47:27Z stassats: lp 1413850
2015-01-23T21:47:27Z specbot: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1413850
2015-01-23T21:47:36Z stassats: talking about this, see the comments
2015-01-23T21:48:36Z nyef: Ouch.
2015-01-23T21:51:10Z stassats: this might be a good chance to get better acquainted with fun-map and compiler debug funs
2015-01-23T21:51:50Z nyef: Have fun with that. I'm going to go back to trying to figure out how to talk to this PCI bridge.
2015-01-23T21:52:56Z nyef: (I have another node coming on about Monday, and I'd at least like Linux running in UP before it gets here. SMP would be a bonus.)
2015-01-23T21:55:08Z stassats: something wrong happens with the assumption that the saved arguments will be available after the self call
2015-01-23T21:56:02Z stassats: because in (defun foo (x a) (full-cal x) (foo x a)) you can see that X and A are pushed to the stack and not loaded / reloaded again when self-calling FOO
2015-01-23T21:56:30Z stassats: so, in the case of (defun foo (x a) (full-cal x) (foo x 10)) A is actually not saved, but it thinks that it is
2015-01-23T21:56:49Z nyef: ... While you're there, if you see anything obvious to be done for https://bugs.launchpad.net/sbcl/+bug/1099500 it might be nice to get that one fixed.
2015-01-23T21:57:02Z nyef: (Yes, that one is my fault.)
2015-01-23T21:57:12Z stassats: yeah, i occasionally remember that one
2015-01-23T21:57:43Z nyef: I remember breaking CLX and a number of other systems for a month while causing that one.
2015-01-23T21:58:16Z stassats: there's another problem uncovered by the new arg-count checking as well, the arguments are not yet stashed into their destination and the locals assume that they are already live producing garbage
2015-01-23T21:58:50Z stassats: (CONS 1) [tl,external] => Locals: SB-DEBUG::ARG-1 = #<FUNCTION CONS> SB-DEBUG::ARG-2 = 70368532689324
2015-01-23T21:59:11Z stassats: not new, just more visible
2015-01-23T22:00:33Z stassats: i wonder if this thing can also be triggered with let-conversion, not self calls
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2015-01-23T22:02:28Z stassats: it can
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2015-01-23T22:03:20Z stassats: (defun foo (a x) (break "~a" x) (flet ((bar (x y) (print y x))) (declare (notinline bar)) (bar a 1)))
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2015-01-23T22:04:57Z stassats: not let-conversion, local-call flavor
2015-01-23T22:05:07Z stassats: so, local calls make for bugs fun maps
2015-01-23T22:05:24Z stassats: nyef: now, that seems similar to the bug you mentioned
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2015-01-23T22:14:57Z stassats: weird, so when remove notinline, both vars get saved, and restored, even when X is not ever used again
2015-01-23T22:16:40Z nyef: stassats: The difference is that the bug I mentioned is that the variable storage information isn't correctly reflected in the map: The debugger decides that a variable is closed-over if its value is a VALUE-CELL, which makes it impossible to debug functions that manipulate VALUE-CELLs properly.
2015-01-23T22:17:26Z stassats: nyef: but the common theme is "it's pretty broken"
2015-01-23T22:17:41Z nyef: Well, yes. That's true.
2015-01-23T22:17:57Z nyef: An awful lot of stuff to do with the debugger is pretty broken, IMO.
2015-01-23T22:18:00Z stassats: it doesn't seem to get the lifetime right
2015-01-23T22:18:20Z stassats: and that part is really murky for me
2015-01-23T22:18:26Z stassats: lifetime analysis + fun maps
2015-01-23T22:19:27Z stassats: probably it sees that nothing is written to that location, and it's not saved: it must be still in the register!
2015-01-23T22:26:44Z stassats: and the layout of compiler-debug-fun-blocks is not explained
2015-01-23T22:26:52Z stassats: well, just as i am accustomed to
2015-01-23T22:27:23Z stassats: i guess it's time to take a break from this madness
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2015-01-23T23:16:09Z Quadrescence: stassats, what's the status, if any, of threading on sbcl/arm
2015-01-23T23:16:31Z stassats: blowing in the wind
2015-01-23T23:17:12Z Quadrescence: Does that mean "non-existent", "not being worked on", "being worked on but is a huge pain", or what?
2015-01-23T23:17:29Z stassats: not being worked on, not being planned on being worked on
2015-01-23T23:17:32Z stassats: and non-existent
2015-01-23T23:17:38Z Quadrescence: Okay, thanks for the info.
2015-01-23T23:18:01Z stassats: well, it's planned for "sometime in before the heat death of the universe"
2015-01-23T23:18:12Z stassats: or maybe hoping that arm11 will die
2015-01-23T23:19:06Z stassats: or however you refer to the 32-bit arm
2015-01-23T23:19:25Z nyef: Too bloody few registers. ONE too bloody few registers. /-:
2015-01-23T23:20:31Z stassats: so, a better project would be an arm64 port
2015-01-23T23:20:35Z stassats: with swee 32 registers
2015-01-23T23:20:37Z stassats: sweet
2015-01-23T23:21:17Z Quadrescence: That might be cooler and nicer, but can we expect arm64 to gain ubiquity at all in the "embedded" market?
2015-01-23T23:21:40Z stassats: SBCL isn't really good for small embedded
2015-01-23T23:22:06Z foom: iphone is already 100% arm64.
2015-01-23T23:22:31Z stassats: this year we'll see more android 64 bit things, because larger numbers sell better
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2015-01-23T23:22:54Z foom: also because the chips are becoming widely available
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2015-01-23T23:23:35Z stassats: now, a phone with 8GB of ram
2015-01-23T23:24:15Z foom: I just want a phone that has a battery that lasts 2 days
2015-01-23T23:28:19Z stassats: nyef: static space could be accessed through the thread register
2015-01-23T23:28:45Z stassats: it also can be immediate encoded, although that will require registers to build up intermediate values
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2015-01-23T23:42:04Z stassats: what about c13 system register?
2015-01-23T23:42:29Z stassats: it's probably used by libc
2015-01-23T23:43:13Z Quadrescence: I added a bounty for native threads on SBCL: http://www.stylewarning.com/blog/bounties
2015-01-23T23:44:02Z stassats: "to some extent"!
2015-01-23T23:44:34Z stassats: it's on par with the ppc port, sans threads
2015-01-23T23:44:45Z stassats: basically the best supported port beside X86oids
2015-01-23T23:45:12Z Quadrescence: Do all tests pass?
2015-01-23T23:45:31Z stassats: yes, save for the breakpoints, which are not used by anyone
2015-01-23T23:45:35Z p_l: btw, as soon as I arrange for RunAbove to up my quota, I might setup a buildhost for ppc{32,64}le
2015-01-23T23:46:04Z Quadrescence: stassats, Wait, are we talking about compiling to ARM, sans threads?
2015-01-23T23:46:07Z stassats: i test sbcl regularly on big endian ppc
2015-01-23T23:46:13Z Quadrescence: The threads were the "to some extent" bit
2015-01-23T23:46:36Z stassats: well, everything that is there works
2015-01-23T23:46:49Z p_l: stassats: Well, I can't get big-endian till more hw arrives on market, but I can get a little-endian PPC64 VPS :)
2015-01-23T23:47:12Z stassats: isn't le ppc more exotic?
2015-01-23T23:48:49Z p_l: stassats: funnily enough, not anymore
2015-01-23T23:49:12Z p_l: while all major chips were switchable for some time, it appears that main push for linux on ppc is going to be in le mode
2015-01-23T23:49:45Z stassats: hasn't linux been working for ibm for ages?
2015-01-23T23:50:06Z stassats: nyef: what do we use LR for?
2015-01-23T23:50:08Z p_l: stassats: IBM hw is switchable, so it's a non-issue
2015-01-23T23:50:27Z stassats: hardware, but the environment has been big endian
2015-01-23T23:50:43Z p_l: le-only firmware is actually an easy differentiator between AIX-capable and incapable hw
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2015-01-23T23:53:00Z p_l: and apparently IBM's S8xxL series are little-endian only
2015-01-23T23:53:54Z p_l: hopefully other openpower machines will have BE-capable hw
2015-01-23T23:54:18Z stassats: can't say i'm excited about PPC
2015-01-23T23:55:49Z p_l: I am a bit, the new Power8 hw looks a) awesome b) actually approachable in pricing
2015-01-23T23:58:36Z stassats: power8 doesn't seem to have great single threaded performance, at least in the configuration i tested