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Y), where X is a symbol from CL fails when PPRINTing 07:22:05 i wonder whether testing for more lengthy improper lists will reveal more failures 07:26:47 indeed 07:29:00 writing a test with improper sublists of various lengths and depths would be harder 07:35:47 damn, even without errors and improper lists, pprint prints wrong, like '(flet flet 10) as (FLET FLET10) 07:36:04 writing an automated test for this is harder again 07:37:07 can somebody spot a mistake here? "~:<~^~W~^ ~@_~:<~@{~:<~^~W~^~3I ~:_~/SB!PRETTY:PPRINT-LAMBDA-LIST/~1I~:@_~@{~W~^ ~_~}~:>~^ ~_~}~:>~1I~@:_~@{~W~^ ~_~}~:>" 07:37:47 <|3b|> what's it supposed to print? 07:38:08 (FLET FLET 10) 07:40:44 ooh 07:40:46 strangely, when call (pprint '(FLET FLET 10)), it prints a newline before 10 07:40:47 you know what would be neat? 07:41:16 an automatic format-string -> pretty-printing-code -> format-string converter 07:41:34 the first step exists in FORMATTER, somewhat... 07:42:06 <|3b|> newline before 10 seems reasonable 07:42:07 but when i call (SB-PRETTY::pprint-flet *standard-output* '(flet flet 10)) it prints (FLET FLET10) 07:42:13 so you could debug monsters like that by doing "M-x common-lisp-replace-format-with-code" or something :) 07:42:36 hum 07:42:46 nikodemus: M-x slime-format-string-expand 07:43:05 which produces an equally monstrous monster 07:43:07 it exists? wow 07:43:31 *|3b|* was wondering how hard it would be to put minibuffer hints for format strings 07:43:34 nice, now we just need the inverse :) 07:43:55 nikodemus: it just macroexpands FORMATTER 07:44:08 re. difference: i'm pretty sure pprint-flet expects to be called on a pretty-stream which pprint provides 07:44:28 s/pprint/output-pretty-object/ 07:44:44 alright, least thing to worry about 07:47:28 fixed all linear improper lists errors 07:51:03 imporper sublists don't appear to fail 08:36:28 Kryztof [~user@84.40.217.82] has joined #sbcl 08:36:29 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Kryztof 08:36:46 -!- Posterdati [~tapioca@host187-229-dynamic.3-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:41:50 Posterdati [~tapioca@host187-229-dynamic.3-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #sbcl 08:59:05 the signals.impure.lisp sleep-many-interrupts test fails for me here on a single-processor x86, single-threaded build. ticks ends up being 1.9, which looks suspiciously like 1.5 plus 4 * 0.1 (and messing around with n seems to indicate that indeed sleeping for more 0.1 bits in the timer function adds more to the total time) 08:59:14 what is meant to happen? 09:03:52 *|3b|* fails to find that test 09:06:18 last test in signals.impure.lisp for me 09:07:18 <|3b|> :bug-640516 is last here, git sha1 is 137b4d09b88273bbd3a4295d8c98a5dad4e75ec7 09:08:23 *Kryztof* fetches 09:08:35 ok, serves me right for doing development on an ancient tree 09:09:12 "Remove the invalid :sleep-many-interrupts test" 09:09:14 ok, problem solved 09:09:45 <|3b|> yeah, that sounds like it would help :) 10:00:54 -!- Kryztof [~user@84.40.217.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:25:32 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@87-95-80-152.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 10:25:46 nikodemus [~nikodemus@87-95-80-152.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #sbcl 10:25:46 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o nikodemus 10:27:08 -!- edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-078-043-123-191.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 10:35:19 edgar-rft 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[~cmm@bzq-79-179-219-170.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 18:17:15 nikodemus [~nikodemus@188-67-156-31.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #sbcl 18:17:15 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o nikodemus 18:18:52 are uninterned symbols somehow special? 18:21:02 how so? 18:21:15 (defconstant +foo+ (if (boundp '+foo+) +foo+ (make-symbol "foo"))) and (defun test (x) (eql x +foo+)) 18:21:18 should be compiled 18:21:23 (test +foo+) => NIL 18:21:55 let me think 18:24:17 ah, right. externalization 18:25:25 the rules say that the loader will construct a "similar" object 18:25:49 at compile-time defconstant gets the initial (make-symbol "foo") constructed 18:26:14 TEST references it, and the constant is externalized, and dumped to file 18:26:36 so you can't rely on constants ever being eql? 18:27:04 you can, but you need to be pretty careful about it 18:27:21 the same test works if +foo+ is a string 18:27:28 using interned symbols is the easiest and most foolproof way 18:28:36 but i /am/ surpised that sbcl did that here 18:28:54 i'm not really convinced that SBCL is right here 18:30:07 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-219-170.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:30:21 i'm pretty sure this is legal 18:30:31 i'm not 100% sure it is required, though 18:31:34 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-191-178.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 18:32:22 but that makes constants virtually unusable besides for things that are naturally EQL 18:32:57 that's the way it has always been 18:33:26 well, i thought that making sure that it's EQL during compile and load-time was enough 18:34:03 if you add (defun foo () +foo+) to that file, then (test (foo)) => T, guaranteed 18:35:01 because identity is respected, so both +foo+s in TEST and FOO get the same fresh symbol on load 18:36:39 why +foo+ doesn't get it? 18:36:43 but we actually have a bunch of code in the compiler that is supposed to keep track when a constant came from a DEFCONSTANT reference, and then use the constant on load when allowed -- which is why i would have expected the initial case to give T as well 18:37:14 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-191-178.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:37:27 good question 18:39:04 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-221-160.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 18:46:55 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@188-67-156-31.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:47:04 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:48:39 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-221-160.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:50:25 nikodemus [~nikodemus@188-67-156-31.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #sbcl 18:50:25 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o nikodemus 18:50:39 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-181-210-107.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 18:54:17 stassats`: funny. i remember adding ref-%source-name for dealing with this sort of things, but now it's only used in xref 18:54:28 i wonder if i misremember, or if it had to be backed out 18:55:08 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-181-210-107.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:56:09 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-181-208-32.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 18:58:45 hm, ok, so details are different than what i remember, but the code seems to be there 19:00:05 aha! symbols are among the "trivial" constant types, so they don't get the cleverness 19:00:35 hm 19:00:38 actually 19:00:56 i think i know why that must be 19:01:27 -!- tsuru`` [~charlie@adsl-98-87-50-155.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:01:29 (defconstant +foo+ ...) ; etc, as before 19:01:30 tsuru``` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-29-142.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #sbcl 19:01:45 now, (intern +foo+ :cl-user) 19:01:52 import, rather, not intern 19:02:29 but that symbol referenced via +foo+ in the compiled file must still be an uninterned symbol 19:02:58 since they are different symbols 19:04:34 that too, but also because a literal symbol moving to a different package between compile and load would violate similarity rules (nicknames provide an escape hatch to some degree, but doesn't help uninterned symbols at all) 19:06:34 i wonder if dumping an uninterned named constant symbol as (if (symbol-package (symbol-value ')) (make-symbol ) (symbol-value ')) would be kosher... 19:06:42 a bit too magical, maybe... 19:08:44 anyways, if you want to use a guaranteed-EQ defconstant, then *in SBCL* the BOUNDP trick in DEFCONSTANT, and using eg. (list t) as the value will work -- but relying on that isn't portable 19:10:19 otoh, you might as well go for defglobal, or l-t-v/constantp if it *really* matters. 19:10:37 yeah 19:10:53 or use an interned symbol :) 19:14:03 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-181-208-32.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:14:09 i wouldn't use a defconstant in any case, but it would be less surprising if it could work 19:14:29 and that's actually an excerpt from On Lisp, i believe 19:15:50 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-192-16.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 19:16:00 (not that it's exemplary, but people might find it less surprising if it were to work, unless it's too much to make it) 19:16:55 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@188-67-156-31.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:17:25 nikodemus [~nikodemus@188-67-156-31.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #sbcl 19:17:26 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o nikodemus 19:17:29 (assuming some condition that allows termination, obviously) 19:18:28 in my mind we proably want to inline all of those, except possibly the outermost, and we don't want to inline any of them recursively 19:21:00 blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4575fc51.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #sbcl 19:22:41 when building sbcl using the `--with-' option style, is the proper syntax to get threads: --with-:SB-THREAD ? 19:23:52 just use --fancy :) 19:24:20 or if you want to specify individual features, it's with-sb-thread 19:24:22 I suppose that's *one* solution .. 19:24:22 oops 19:24:38 --with-sb-thread 19:25:40 obviously INSTALL needs to clarify this 19:25:55 k - thanks. was just suggesting an addition to the doc 19:26:36 guess I type too slowly ... thanks again. 19:27:17 nikodemus: inline what? 19:27:38 also, yes, inlining the first level of recursion is a classic that does a lot of good. 19:28:02 Actually, I'd like to see: inline on the first level and specialise the inner calls. 19:31:33 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-192-16.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:32:21 looking at the code that my patch generates, i'm not too enthused with it 19:33:05 sure, it gets things working without bloating them beyond all recognition, but... the results are still a bit meh 19:33:16 the way we analyse recursive code is bound to suck, actually. 19:33:29 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-222-27.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 19:33:46 exactly 19:34:24 and... I don't think we can make it not-suck without blowing up compile times. 19:37:14 http://paste.lisp.org/display/128756 19:38:40 how would you fix it if compile-times weren't an issue? 19:39:44 wait a second, wtf? 19:40:08 old sbcl does fine with that, it's my patch that messes it up 19:41:36 we'd need to cleanly separate inference and transformation 19:41:53 (or track both lower and upper bounds on static types) 19:42:21 start the inference on argument types with the static types of arguments in non-recursive call forms. 19:42:31 And iteratively widen that. 19:45:32 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-222-27.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:47:04 i can see iterative widening blowing up compile times, but how would separating inference and transformation do that? 19:47:05 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-216-82.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #sbcl 19:48:01 nikodemus: we need to separate inference and transformation because transforming on overly tight static types will yield code that's just plain wrong. 19:48:20 i'm all for separating them :) 19:48:32 our current "let's do it all at once" model has caused me nothing but pain 19:48:54 but i don't see how just doing the separation would blow up compile times 19:49:24 well, we'd probably end up iteratively going through infer-until-fixpoint/transform 19:49:48 and that's slower than infer-and-transform-until-fixpoint[-or-I-get-bored] 19:50:47 well, but we could have a compilation-speed toggle to make it infer-until-fixed-point[-or-bored]/transform :) 19:51:29 can't abort early if we start with underapproximations 19:51:49 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-179-216-82.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:52:33 we can widen under-approximations a lot to accelerate convergence, though. 19:52:46 Still, that's a nearly 100% rewrite of IR1 19:53:06 yeah 19:53:25 (or first do a conservative version, then see if we can quickly converge from underapproximation) 20:08:51 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75c511.pool.mediaWays.net] has 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