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This channel is about Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:46:42Z stara: Yes Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:46:46Z beach: Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:47:03Z beach: This channels is dedicated to the programming language named Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:47:10Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T03:47:13Z stara: I have download compiler GNU Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:47:40Z arescorpio joined #lisp 2017-06-05T03:47:41Z beach: stara: That's probably the worst implementation of Common Lisp that you could have chosen. 2017-06-05T03:47:49Z vtomole: clisp? 2017-06-05T03:47:58Z schoppenhauer joined #lisp 2017-06-05T03:48:13Z beach: vtomole: GNU CLISP is different from GNU Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:48:22Z beach: The latter is a AKCL derivative. 2017-06-05T03:48:54Z stara: Sorry, I have: GNU CLISP 2.49 2017-06-05T03:49:15Z beach: stara: That's different from GNU Common Lisp. 2017-06-05T03:49:20Z beach: stara: Most people here recommend: SBCL, CCL, ECL, CLISP in roughly that order. 2017-06-05T03:50:45Z beach: stara: What is your plan? Start programming in Common Lisp? 2017-06-05T03:51:01Z beach: stara: Emacs comes with your OS if you are using a reasonable one. 2017-06-05T03:52:10Z beach: stara: Once you have your Common Lisp implementation installed, download Quicklisp and use Quicklisp to install slime-helper. Then you should be fine. 2017-06-05T03:52:57Z stara: Whether compiler GNU CLISP 2.49 is wrong? 2017-06-05T03:53:33Z beach: Nothing wrong. But few people here use it, so if you have specific questions, most people here will not know the answer. 2017-06-05T03:53:41Z mejja quit (Quit: \ No newline at end of file) 2017-06-05T03:54:05Z beach: stara: CLISP was unmaintained for a long time. Only recently have people again started maintaining it. 2017-06-05T03:54:20Z stara: What is different from other compilers? 2017-06-05T03:54:36Z beach: stara: Different implementations have different characteristics. CLISP does not compile to native code. 2017-06-05T03:55:24Z stara: So, what compiler do you recommend? 2017-06-05T03:55:30Z beach: stara: SBCL is probably the one generating the fastest code. CCL generates good code, and the compiler is faster than SBCL. ECL is excellent for embedding Common Lisp into programs written in C. 2017-06-05T03:55:51Z beach: stara: I told you, most people here recommend SBCL, CCL, ECL, CLISP roughly in that order. 2017-06-05T03:56:50Z beach: stara: I personally don't recommend anything, because I am only using SBCL so I don't know how good the others are. 2017-06-05T03:56:57Z stara: OK, What text editor do you recommend? 2017-06-05T03:57:06Z vtomole: emacs 2017-06-05T03:57:06Z beach: Definitely Emacs. 2017-06-05T03:57:10Z Bicyclidine quit (Quit: Bye) 2017-06-05T03:58:15Z stara: OK, but How to integrate it with the compiler? 2017-06-05T03:58:34Z beach: stara: You need to start reading what I wrote. 2017-06-05T03:58:41Z beach: stara: Emacs comes with your OS if you are using a reasonable one. 2017-06-05T03:58:49Z beach: stara: Once you have your Common Lisp implementation installed, download Quicklisp and use Quicklisp to install slime-helper. Then you should be fine. 2017-06-05T03:59:11Z beach: stara: SLIME is what turns Emacs into a Common Lisp IDE. 2017-06-05T04:00:03Z beach: stara: https://www.quicklisp.org/beta/ 2017-06-05T04:00:20Z yangby quit (Quit: Go out for a walk and buy a drink.) 2017-06-05T04:00:22Z vtomole: stara: If you have a debian you can "sudo apt-get install slime. It installs an outadated version i think.. but it works. 2017-06-05T04:00:45Z stara: I'm on windows. 2017-06-05T04:00:52Z beach: stara: Bad choice. 2017-06-05T04:01:51Z beach: stara: Plus, this is freenode, which is dedicated to free and open-source software, so you won't get as much help with a proprietary operating system as you would with a free one. 2017-06-05T04:03:44Z beach: stara: I suggest you buy a commercial Common Lisp implementation such as LispWorks. Then you get a perfectly integrated IDE that works very well on Windows. 2017-06-05T04:05:13Z stara: What I have to install quicklisp to windows? 2017-06-05T04:05:27Z stara: How* 2017-06-05T04:06:25Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:08:22Z quazimodo joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:08:33Z stara: I have: emacs-25.2.exe and GNU Clisp 2.49 installed. 2017-06-05T04:09:01Z borei joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:09:33Z rumbler31 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:12:10Z stara: https://thepasteb.in/p/xGhmNDQngAXiM 2017-06-05T04:12:40Z vtomole: stara: Your life (and ours) will be so much easier if you did this on a Linux distribution. Do you have a hypervisor like Virtualbox or Qemu installed on your computer? 2017-06-05T04:14:51Z stara: I not want have virtualbox or OS - linux now. 2017-06-05T04:14:58Z p9s_ quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:15:10Z Harag joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:15:31Z p9s joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:15:32Z whoman quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T04:16:08Z rumbler31 quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:17:16Z jleija quit (Quit: good night everyone) 2017-06-05T04:21:43Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:24:38Z shifty joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:26:56Z LiamH quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T04:28:54Z sz0 quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2017-06-05T04:30:55Z borei quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:32:30Z test1600 quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T04:32:57Z test1600 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T04:36:07Z pjb quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T04:43:44Z safe quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T04:44:19Z manuel__ quit (Quit: manuel__) 2017-06-05T04:50:48Z stara quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T05:03:54Z fkac joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:23:29Z brendyn quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2017-06-05T05:23:45Z megalography quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T05:24:23Z pseudo-sue joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:25:13Z xsddz joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:28:21Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:29:11Z pseudo-sue quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2017-06-05T05:30:16Z karswell` quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T05:31:37Z karswell` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:32:32Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2017-06-05T05:33:18Z pjb joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:35:59Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:37:52Z shka joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:40:00Z pjb quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T05:41:12Z damke_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:47:05Z damke_ quit (Quit: quit) 2017-06-05T05:47:35Z damke joined #lisp 2017-06-05T05:49:05Z arescorpio quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T05:52:44Z vtomole quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T05:53:14Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2017-06-05T06:00:43Z Balooga joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:06:33Z shka quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2017-06-05T06:11:18Z vlatkoB joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:12:24Z sondr3_ quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T06:21:04Z adolf_stalin quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T06:37:51Z EvW joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:49:25Z test1600_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:49:51Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T06:49:57Z ryan_vw`` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:06Z vert2 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:06Z Balooga quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:06Z Lowl3v3l quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z test1600 quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z p9s quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z froggey quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z vert2_ quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z ryan_vw` quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z raynold quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z Bock quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:07Z nowhere_man quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:08Z RichardPaulBck[m quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:08Z M-Illandan quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:08Z thorondor[m] quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:08Z Khisanth quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z dschoepe quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z jerme_ quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z tfb quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z shenghi quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z gbyers quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z alms_clozure quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:09Z adulteratedjedi quit (*.net *.split) 2017-06-05T06:50:10Z jerme__ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:10Z adulteratedjedi_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:11Z shenghi1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:12Z froggey_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:16Z nocaberi joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:16Z jerme__ is now known as jerme_ 2017-06-05T06:50:17Z nowhere_man joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:22Z p9s joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:25Z dschoepe joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:35Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:54Z khisanth_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:50:57Z Balooga joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:51:06Z alms_clozure joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:51:08Z gbyers joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:51:20Z tfb joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:51:30Z raynold joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:51:36Z nocaberi is now known as Bocaneri 2017-06-05T06:52:59Z dmitigr joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:55:05Z RichardPaulBck[m joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:55:30Z xsddz left #lisp 2017-06-05T06:55:41Z thorondor[m] joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:55:46Z Balooga quit (Quit: Balooga) 2017-06-05T06:55:50Z M-Illandan joined #lisp 2017-06-05T06:58:38Z dmitigr: hello all! Anybody use EWW browser to read the HyperSpec? I faced a problem when behind a proxy -- EWW opens find URLs like http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_mk_pkg.htm but reports the error 400 (bad request) when I'm trying to open URLs with a hash part, e.g. http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_mk_pkg.htm#something-here. How it can be solved, does anybody knows? 2017-06-05T06:59:01Z dmitigr: find = fine 2017-06-05T07:03:25Z angavrilov joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:11:29Z shka joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:11:37Z dmitigr: well, workarounded it by using a local copy of the HS 2017-06-05T07:13:56Z mishoo_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:16:22Z pookleblinky quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T07:18:07Z pookleblinky joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:23:23Z jdz joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:25:12Z pseudo-sue joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:26:28Z ryanwatkins joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:29:35Z pseudo-sue quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T07:39:06Z ttt72 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:41:14Z xaotuk joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:44:50Z quazimodo quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T07:46:09Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:47:09Z ryanwatkins quit (Read error: No route to host) 2017-06-05T07:47:20Z ryanwatkins joined #lisp 2017-06-05T07:48:27Z xaotuk quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T07:58:17Z 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C is pretty unique among languages about its handling of memory. 2017-06-05T12:34:31Z _death: in theory you could implement such a thing, with implementation-specific code 2017-06-05T12:35:58Z _death: maybe it means just constructing an appropriate array-header 2017-06-05T12:37:02Z deba5e12 quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T12:37:09Z antismap quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T12:37:11Z _death: (and it should also be a weak array) 2017-06-05T12:37:35Z antismap joined #lisp 2017-06-05T12:38:11Z shka: well, i don't think it even has sense in garbage collected language 2017-06-05T12:38:21Z orivej joined #lisp 2017-06-05T12:38:58Z _death: why? it's similar to a displaced array with different element-type 2017-06-05T12:39:30Z shka: well, ok 2017-06-05T12:39:31Z _death: if the implementation supports specialized arrays for (unsigned-byte 8) and (unsigned-byte 32) 2017-06-05T12:39:41Z shka: hmmm 2017-06-05T12:39:44Z dlowe: that's what I was saying - the C FFI could probably handle it 2017-06-05T12:40:11Z _death: yes.. but that'd likely be slow 2017-06-05T12:40:11Z dlowe: but you'd need specific memory mapping which isn't going to be portable 2017-06-05T12:40:21Z _death: sure, this whole approach is not portable :) 2017-06-05T12:40:40Z shka: well, we could check how manadb handles this stuff 2017-06-05T12:40:41Z dlowe: slow? really? I would expect it to compile down to similar asm 2017-06-05T12:40:55Z shka: but that would be slow (MOP) approach 2017-06-05T12:41:04Z jackdaniel: some implementations had direct casts of arrays 2017-06-05T12:41:18Z jackdaniel: I saw CLX using that for genera and some other implementation 2017-06-05T12:41:27Z _death: dlowe: hopefully.. I remember some years ago I was surprised that LDB worked well.. that was after some optimizations were added to SBCL 2017-06-05T12:41:30Z jackdaniel: but not somethin present in current implementation I'm aware of 2017-06-05T12:41:43Z jackdaniel: for sure it's not part of the CL standard 2017-06-05T12:42:16Z jackdaniel: implementations° 2017-06-05T12:48:54Z pookleblinky left #lisp 2017-06-05T12:49:09Z yangby quit (Quit: Go out for a walk and buy a drink.) 2017-06-05T12:49:36Z harlequin78[m] quit (Quit: Bridged client killed) 2017-06-05T12:50:03Z rpg quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T12:50:47Z deba5e12 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T12:51:05Z zzkt[m] quit (Quit: Bridged client killed) 2017-06-05T12:51:45Z mishoo joined #lisp 2017-06-05T12:52:07Z astronavt[m] left #lisp 2017-06-05T12:52:33Z deba5e12: hey, sorry to have disappeared mid convo, there. my vpn crapped out. saw the answer to the union question, though. in this particular case, it wouldn't be a big deal to just parse the data into a vector of bytes and then again into a vector of words, since it'll just be a one-off cost, but it does seem like the sort of thing that'd be worthwhile to implement, even if it means mucking about with cffi or 2017-06-05T12:52:39Z deba5e12: sbcl internals. 2017-06-05T12:55:26Z shka: deba5e12: ah, this is actually simpler case 2017-06-05T12:55:51Z shka: deba5e12: string is just vector of chars 2017-06-05T12:56:08Z deba5e12: oh, i meant words, as in 32 or 64 bit integers 2017-06-05T12:56:09Z _death: with cffi you don't need to do much.. since its mem-aref takes the type 2017-06-05T12:56:16Z shka: riiiiight 2017-06-05T12:56:17Z shka: ok 2017-06-05T12:56:22Z deba5e12: right, yeah, it'd be trivial enough with mem-aref. 2017-06-05T12:56:52Z deba5e12: i'll hack together something with that. i'm already pulling cffi in for this project. 2017-06-05T12:57:26Z _death: you can also write similar accessors for CL arrays.. both approaches do conversion 2017-06-05T12:57:58Z deba5e12: cool beans. that's just what i'm looking for. 2017-06-05T12:58:16Z wheelsucker quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T12:58:34Z _death: that is the portable way 2017-06-05T12:59:01Z adolf_stalin joined #lisp 2017-06-05T12:59:11Z _death: seems it's good enough since implementations don't provide the nonportable way 2017-06-05T12:59:20Z deba5e12: but by "conversion" you mean that it just reads the memory differently, right? the way i'm doing it now involves a clumsy converter function that builds words out of sequences of n bytes. 2017-06-05T12:59:41Z deba5e12: which is pretty trivial and all, but involves more steps than i'd like inside a tight loop. 2017-06-05T13:00:18Z _death: you'll need to look at cffi code.. 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You compile as you write your program, part by part, while keeping the whole Lisp compiler in memory during that time. 2017-06-05T14:35:33Z phoe: You have a running read-eval-print loop that you can type expressions into, and they get compiled automatically. 2017-06-05T14:35:42Z rumbler31 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T14:35:54Z phoe: This is very unlike C or Java where you first compile your program with an external compiler and then run the resulting binary. 2017-06-05T14:35:56Z dlowe: stara: emacs is the text editor, sbcl is the compiler 2017-06-05T14:36:13Z dlowe: stara: so you need both 2017-06-05T14:37:01Z stara: OK, but How to connect it together? 2017-06-05T14:37:03Z dlowe: stara: then you can set them up to talk with each other with a program called slime 2017-06-05T14:37:12Z dlowe: that runs on emacs 2017-06-05T14:37:29Z dlowe: (and sbcl, but slime will start that for you) 2017-06-05T14:38:32Z dlowe: stara: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnWVu8VVDbI 2017-06-05T14:39:20Z dlowe: that video covers installation 2017-06-05T14:39:32Z dlowe: then this covers how you can use slime to program lisp: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_B_4vhsmRRI 2017-06-05T14:47:45Z stara: And I can have something like this on notepad ++ instead emacs? 2017-06-05T14:48:08Z stara: Notepad++ + compiler. 2017-06-05T14:48:13Z phoe: stara: n++ has no integration with the lisp REPL. 2017-06-05T14:48:16Z phoe: there is no plugin for it. 2017-06-05T14:48:37Z phoe: Atom has a Slime REPL, Geany has a WIP one too - ask jasom for it. 2017-06-05T14:48:39Z phoe: jasom: ^ 2017-06-05T14:50:21Z dlowe: There's no reason it couldn't have a plugin 2017-06-05T14:50:49Z dlowe: maybe you could write it and enjoy all the resulting fame and fortune 2017-06-05T14:51:33Z phoe: ^ 2017-06-05T14:51:46Z phoe: (I'd love to have a n++ REPL plugin) 2017-06-05T14:51:55Z stara: Is it possible to connect by nppexec lisp or not? 2017-06-05T14:52:01Z dlowe: Yes. It's possible. 2017-06-05T14:52:04Z dlowe: Start writing code. 2017-06-05T14:52:27Z jameser quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2017-06-05T14:52:27Z rippa joined #lisp 2017-06-05T14:52:41Z ebrasca joined #lisp 2017-06-05T14:52:49Z dlowe: Is it easy to connect? No, probably not. 2017-06-05T14:53:26Z stara: OK, thanks. 2017-06-05T14:56:29Z rory joined #lisp 2017-06-05T14:57:25Z madrik joined #lisp 2017-06-05T14:58:00Z sellout-1 quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T14:58:08Z damke joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:00:43Z damke_ quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:07:50Z stara quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T15:13:00Z teggi joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:16:59Z phoe: BKNR.DATASTORE question. How can I create the store only when the program starts but not when the file is compiled? 2017-06-05T15:17:04Z phoe: EVAL-WHEN :EXECUTE? 2017-06-05T15:18:02Z ttt72 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:19:27Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:21:14Z Xach: phoe: what is the program in this case? 2017-06-05T15:22:25Z phoe: Xach: it is a server. 2017-06-05T15:22:35Z sellout- joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:22:53Z phoe: Hm. Perhaps an even simpler thing. 2017-06-05T15:23:05Z phoe: I put the store-creating line in the server's init function. 2017-06-05T15:23:41Z sellout-1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:23:53Z kimpira joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:23:56Z phoe: I got confused because BKNR.DATASTORE uses a MAKE-INSTANCE method that autorebinds the *STORE* variable. 2017-06-05T15:24:56Z phoe: (which I find somewhat silly, but eh) 2017-06-05T15:25:08Z pjb joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:25:23Z sellout- quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T15:27:54Z sellout-1 quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T15:30:44Z dtornabene quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T15:34:32Z dtornabene joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:34:57Z dtornabene quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T15:35:22Z dtornabene joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:42:31Z schaeffer joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:42:32Z sellout- joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:43:04Z kmb joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:44:40Z python47` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:47:27Z dmitigr quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:47:48Z python476 quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:47:56Z raynold joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:55:21Z nosefouratyou joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:55:31Z damke_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:58:41Z damke quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:58:41Z emacsomancer quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T15:58:42Z sondr3 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:59:23Z knusbaum joined #lisp 2017-06-05T15:59:50Z knusbaum1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:00:23Z yeticry_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:00:30Z knusbaum1 quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T16:00:53Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:01:15Z knusbaum1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:01:34Z mrottenkolber joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:01:55Z borei joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:03:16Z yeticry quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:03:28Z knusbaum quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:05:59Z stara joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:06:56Z stara: How is shortcut compile in emacs? 2017-06-05T16:07:31Z stara: What is the shortcut in emacs which compiles? 2017-06-05T16:07:36Z quazimodo joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:08:37Z rory left #lisp 2017-06-05T16:11:37Z Bicyclidine: C-c C-k you mean? 2017-06-05T16:12:05Z gingerale joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:12:13Z phinxy joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:13:12Z stara: I write C-c C-k and not connected write. ;\ 2017-06-05T16:13:44Z stara: Is written not connected. 2017-06-05T16:16:56Z Bratishka joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:18:01Z stara: https://image.ibb.co/j7Vy3F/emacs.png 2017-06-05T16:18:05Z stara: Why not work? 2017-06-05T16:21:18Z Bicyclidine: Seems like you don't have your lisp implementation connected. Did you run M-x slime or what? 2017-06-05T16:21:31Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:24:29Z knusbaum1 quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T16:24:36Z stara: Ctrl Ctrl+M+x? 2017-06-05T16:25:38Z Bratishka: Just Meta + x 2017-06-05T16:26:46Z knusbaum joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:26:49Z shka_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:27:21Z stara: I have alt+x. 2017-06-05T16:27:56Z Bratishka: Alt = Meta 2017-06-05T16:28:05Z stara: What to write then? 2017-06-05T16:28:20Z Bratishka: Em. Heh. 2017-06-05T16:28:22Z Bratishka: slime 2017-06-05T16:28:41Z beach: I think I must have wandered into #VeryBasicEmacs. 2017-06-05T16:29:14Z brendyn quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:30:14Z stara: Bratishka, work! Very, very thanks. ;) 2017-06-05T16:31:41Z Bratishka: In order to execute S-expression you can type C-x C-e 2017-06-05T16:32:16Z damke joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:35:04Z damke_ quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:35:10Z shrdlu68 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:35:47Z shrdlu68: Have you guys seen this? http://winestockwebdesign.com/Essays/Lisp_Curse.html 2017-06-05T16:36:36Z Bicyclidine: probably. 2017-06-05T16:37:18Z mrottenkolber quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:38:43Z stara quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T16:39:55Z beach: shrdlu68: Writings like that are best ignored. They make so many false statements and they pretend they have somehow obtained consensus about the goals of Lisp. 2017-06-05T16:40:35Z beach: shrdlu68: This particular one has the implicit assumption that it is an absolute goal for Common Lisp to be used by as many people as possible. 2017-06-05T16:42:11Z hhdave quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:51:30Z theBlackDragon joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:53:07Z madrik: I have a pre-ANSI 3rd edition of /Winston and Horn/. Is it worth learning from? Will I have to unlearn or relearn a lot? 2017-06-05T16:53:22Z drcode quit (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5 - http://znc.in) 2017-06-05T16:53:45Z beach: It is probably going to be pretty bad. 2017-06-05T16:53:55Z beach: The accepted coding style has changed a lot. 2017-06-05T16:54:00Z GGMethos joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:54:31Z beach: Plus that modern Common Lisp code uses classes and generic functions a lot, and those features weren't available before. 2017-06-05T16:55:41Z drcode joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:56:15Z beach: I have only the second edition, but it is pretty bad. 2017-06-05T16:56:20Z shka_: hello 2017-06-05T16:56:46Z shka_: how does named-readtables:in-readtable works, exactly? 2017-06-05T16:57:14Z madrik quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:57:21Z shrdlu68: beach: I've noticed Lisp is a rather popular topic on HN. 2017-06-05T16:57:46Z madrik joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:58:00Z Bratishka quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T16:58:11Z shrdlu68: Usually it's someone writing an expose of lisp features. 2017-06-05T16:58:17Z python47` quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T16:58:37Z Bratishka joined #lisp 2017-06-05T16:58:53Z dlowe: it's due to HN's pg roots 2017-06-05T16:59:38Z dlowe: and every time it comes up, it follows the "lisp is great, except that it's terrible" pattern of pg's posts 2017-06-05T17:00:02Z shka_: well, i would want to believe that's because what people around are interested in… 2017-06-05T17:00:17Z madrik: beach: Thanks. 2017-06-05T17:01:21Z dlowe: A huge number of people are very interested in talking about lisp. 2017-06-05T17:01:39Z dlowe: As the 425 people in this channel will attest to. 2017-06-05T17:01:40Z madrik: Would you say that Touretzky's book /A Gentle Introduction/ is still good? 2017-06-05T17:01:49Z dlowe: madrik: yes, it's quite good. 2017-06-05T17:02:07Z madrik: dlowe: Thanks. 2017-06-05T17:02:13Z shka_: well, personally i think that lisp was a single, most important idea in history of programming languages 2017-06-05T17:02:24Z shka_: there is a plenty to talk about… 2017-06-05T17:02:36Z dlowe: A much smaller number of people are interested in working in lisp, and those are the people who are going to move the needle. 2017-06-05T17:02:39Z shka_: for instance, how named readtables actually works xD 2017-06-05T17:03:00Z shka_: yes, i'm trying to make better tool for documenting lisp code 2017-06-05T17:03:15Z shka_: and i have library for data structures 2017-06-05T17:03:23Z shka_: anybody is welcome to commit 2017-06-05T17:03:25Z madrik: shka_: And to think that without Steve Russel implementing McCarthy's idea on a machine, Lisp might just have been a mathematical formalism. 2017-06-05T17:03:55Z shrdlu68: madrik: Someone would have tried, sooner or later. 2017-06-05T17:03:57Z dlowe: shka_: that wasn't a personal accusation, but an observation of the general 2017-06-05T17:04:04Z shka_: madrik: well, it took two kinds of genius to get this thing together 2017-06-05T17:04:22Z dlowe: there's also an unfortunate amount of misinformation out there that no amount of effort will fix :/ 2017-06-05T17:04:24Z shka_: dlowe: i know, i'm just trying to motivate people to help me :D 2017-06-05T17:04:56Z python47` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:05:19Z shka_: both McCarthy and Russel had very significant minds 2017-06-05T17:05:38Z ttt72 quit (Quit: ttt72) 2017-06-05T17:06:19Z madrik: AFAIK, besides Paul Graham's /ANSI Common Lisp/ and Peter Seibel's /Practical Common Lisp/, what are the other post-ANSI books that can function as introductory material? 2017-06-05T17:06:42Z madrik: I get that Norvig and Keene are not properly called introductory. 2017-06-05T17:06:59Z dlowe: Norvig's PAIP can totally be used as an intro book 2017-06-05T17:07:18Z Bratishka quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:07:19Z dlowe: you'll be learning interesting things about constraint solvers, too 2017-06-05T17:07:44Z shka_: madrik: Land Of Lisp is cool 2017-06-05T17:07:51Z madrik: dlowe: I think I saw that term while skimming through /Winston and Horn/. 2017-06-05T17:07:57Z madrik: It looked interesting. 2017-06-05T17:08:01Z shka_: and comic at the webpage is funny 2017-06-05T17:08:18Z shka_: also 2017-06-05T17:08:28Z shka_: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HM1Zb3xmvMc 2017-06-05T17:08:45Z shka_: this alone makes it awesome :P 2017-06-05T17:09:26Z arrdem joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:11:36Z madrik: shka_: Nice. 2017-06-05T17:11:51Z shka_: yeah :-) 2017-06-05T17:12:08Z shka_: and book is actually good 2017-06-05T17:12:23Z shka_: and quite funny at times 2017-06-05T17:14:35Z shka_: though it goes into functional programming which you may or may not like 2017-06-05T17:14:57Z Synchro: hi 2017-06-05T17:15:10Z shka_: Synchro: hello 2017-06-05T17:15:10Z Synchro: please I've got a problem with linux poll... 2017-06-05T17:15:21Z Synchro: I did 2017-06-05T17:15:59Z Synchro: a (c-poll pollfd-pointer 1 -1) 2017-06-05T17:16:15Z Synchro: using cffi foreign-funcall 2017-06-05T17:16:27Z quazimodo quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T17:16:36Z Synchro: using POLLPRI event 2017-06-05T17:16:58Z Synchro: but c-poll always return -1 even if I change the timeout value 2017-06-05T17:17:42Z dlowe: Synchro: did you check errno? 2017-06-05T17:17:50Z Synchro: dlowe no 2017-06-05T17:18:01Z dlowe: Synchro: check errno to see what the error is. 2017-06-05T17:18:09Z manuel__ quit (Quit: manuel__) 2017-06-05T17:18:10Z Synchro: how? 2017-06-05T17:19:01Z vlatkoB_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:19:59Z deba5e12 quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:20:24Z dlowe: Synchro: the cffi documentation suggests (cffi:defcvar ("errno" +error-number+ :read-only t) :int) 2017-06-05T17:20:35Z dlowe: with the caveat Note that accessing errno this way won’t work with every implementation of the C standard library 2017-06-05T17:21:45Z deba5e12 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:22:27Z vlatkoB quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:25:26Z damke_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:25:38Z Colleen quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:28:06Z damke quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:28:53Z Synchro: dlowe: ok 2017-06-05T17:29:53Z m00natic quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T17:34:52Z drcode quit (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5 - http://znc.in) 2017-06-05T17:38:11Z damke joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:41:03Z damke_ quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:47:46Z orivej quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2017-06-05T17:49:00Z Kaisyu joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:49:41Z drcode joined #lisp 2017-06-05T17:55:19Z madrik quit (Quit: Goodbye.) 2017-06-05T17:58:46Z varjag joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:03:17Z karswell` quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T18:05:41Z enzuru joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:11:10Z sukaeto: re: ANSI Common Lisp as an introduction - IMO, it's a good introduction to Lisp for someone with prior programming experience. 2017-06-05T18:12:14Z sukaeto: it's also got a listing of most (all?) of the functions, special forms, etc defined by the spec along with Graham's commentary 2017-06-05T18:12:24Z sukaeto: that being said, I wouldn't give it to a non programmer to start out 2017-06-05T18:12:35Z DGASAU quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T18:14:27Z sukaeto: ... and madrik already left anyway. Guess I should've checked for that first (or even addressed them directly). 2017-06-05T18:14:37Z DGASAU joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:21:06Z damke_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:21:31Z antismap` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:23:36Z damke quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:23:36Z antismap quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:24:16Z antismap` quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T18:24:57Z antismap joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:24:58Z antismap quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T18:25:57Z antismap joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:25:57Z arbv quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:26:38Z arbv joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:31:10Z kmb quit (Quit: kmb) 2017-06-05T18:32:46Z AJavaIdiot joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:33:18Z python47` left #lisp 2017-06-05T18:35:05Z adulteratedjedi_ is now known as adulteratedjedi 2017-06-05T18:35:32Z shrdlu68 left #lisp 2017-06-05T18:36:45Z gingerale quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T18:42:08Z DGASAU quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T18:42:31Z DGASAU joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:42:33Z arbv quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:43:27Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:43:39Z arbv joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:44:15Z jasom: minion: tell madrik about gentle 2017-06-05T18:44:15Z minion: madrik: please look at gentle: "Common Lisp: A Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation" is a smoother introduction to lisp programming. http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/LispBook/ 2017-06-05T18:44:38Z jasom: oh, he's gone. minion still did what I asked though 2017-06-05T18:47:25Z vtomole joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:48:53Z sellout-1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:51:55Z sellout- quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T18:53:11Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:53:57Z sellout-1 quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T18:57:28Z stara joined #lisp 2017-06-05T18:57:50Z DeadTrickster quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:01:12Z hyperreal left #lisp 2017-06-05T19:03:44Z vtomole quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:04:11Z ebrasca quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:05:23Z damke joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:07:17Z Colleen joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:07:23Z damke_ quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:08:12Z Colleen quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T19:11:13Z Xach: Baggers: http://report.quicklisp.org/2017-06-05/failure-report/cepl.sdl2-ttf.html#cepl.sdl2-ttf failure related to CLAMP 2017-06-05T19:11:50Z Xach: beach: http://report.quicklisp.org/2017-06-05/failure-report/mcclim.html#mcclim-bezier - don't know what's up in this case 2017-06-05T19:11:53Z Colleen joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:12:23Z Xach: Baggers: http://report.quicklisp.org/2017-06-05/failure-report/varjo.html#varjo.import also having trouble 2017-06-05T19:12:52Z Colleen quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T19:14:09Z spacepluk joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:15:31Z Colleen joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:16:01Z damke quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:16:12Z DGASAU quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2017-06-05T19:16:38Z DGASAU joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:19:21Z Bocaneri is now known as PhillySteen 2017-06-05T19:20:03Z PhillySteen is now known as Bocaneri 2017-06-05T19:20:52Z Baggers: Xach: Thanks. Odd though 2017-06-05T19:21:23Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:23:54Z nosefouratyou quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:24:00Z Baggers: Xach: ah, ok I see why. Fixes will be pushed within the hour 2017-06-05T19:24:21Z Xach: phew! 2017-06-05T19:25:25Z stara: This is oryginal documentation common lisp? http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Front/X_Master.htm 2017-06-05T19:31:42Z teggi quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:32:02Z duckqlz quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:33:41Z duckqlz joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:35:07Z EvW joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:35:22Z kmb joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:36:00Z prole joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:38:16Z Xach: stara: that is a web version of the specification of common lisp 2017-06-05T19:38:35Z kolko quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:39:28Z stara: Where is manual common lisp? 2017-06-05T19:39:39Z prole is now known as serviteur 2017-06-05T19:39:41Z nosefouratyou joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:39:47Z nosefouratyou quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:40:12Z stara: Variables, function, class, loops, arithemtic operators, assignment operators, strings, int, float? 2017-06-05T19:40:22Z dlowe: it's all there 2017-06-05T19:41:21Z sellout- joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:42:07Z nosefouratyou joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:43:07Z stara: NIL mean false, T mena true? 2017-06-05T19:43:13Z stara: T mean true? 2017-06-05T19:43:30Z pjb: anything non NIL means true. 2017-06-05T19:43:36Z pjb: (if 0 'true 'false) #| --> true |# 2017-06-05T19:44:04Z pjb: stara: but indeed, we use T as true by default. 2017-06-05T19:44:45Z stara: OK. 2017-06-05T19:45:12Z kolko joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:45:18Z phinxy quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T19:46:11Z duckqlz quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T19:49:31Z orivej joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:50:57Z sellout- quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:51:40Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T19:54:38Z phinxy joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:54:57Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T19:58:42Z Kaisyu quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2017-06-05T19:59:27Z stara: (format nil "~@(how is ~:(BOB SMITH~)?~)") 2017-06-05T19:59:32Z stara: Why this return: 2017-06-05T19:59:38Z stara: ; no value 2017-06-05T19:59:46Z stara: CL-USER> 2017-06-05T20:00:43Z Bicyclidine: it ought not to. 2017-06-05T20:01:16Z sellout- joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:03:47Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T20:04:35Z shka_ quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T20:04:58Z stara: Something with the compiler wrong? 2017-06-05T20:05:17Z antoszka: stara: What compiler is that? It should return a string. 2017-06-05T20:05:23Z stara: Should be: "How is bob smith?" 2017-06-05T20:05:38Z antoszka: Yeah, without any side effects, I think. 2017-06-05T20:06:26Z stara: SBCL. 2017-06-05T20:07:35Z stara: Already just OK. 2017-06-05T20:07:50Z antoszka: OK. 2017-06-05T20:08:17Z stara: Strange Emacs. 2017-06-05T20:10:22Z pierpa joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:10:39Z antoszka: Emacs happens to act strange. 2017-06-05T20:11:47Z luna-is-here joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:12:01Z shka_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:14:59Z whoman joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:15:41Z vlatkoB_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T20:17:18Z luna-is-here quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2017-06-05T20:17:25Z Bicyclidine: Can CCL with the OS X app store be used with SLIME? 2017-06-05T20:17:30Z Bicyclidine: s/with/from/ 2017-06-05T20:17:56Z hannah_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:18:51Z jackdaniel: I can't see a reason it wouldn't - swank is written in CL (+ implementation-specific bits) 2017-06-05T20:18:52Z sellout- quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T20:20:03Z hannah_ is now known as luna-is-here 2017-06-05T20:20:53Z rippa quit (Quit: {#`%${%&`+'${`%&NO CARRIER) 2017-06-05T20:21:27Z heurist quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T20:21:37Z Bicyclidine: Well, yes, but I can't find an executable 2017-06-05T20:21:44Z Bicyclidine: dx86cl64 pops open a window 2017-06-05T20:23:01Z jackdaniel: you may load start-swank.lisp from slime directory 2017-06-05T20:23:11Z jackdaniel: and do slime-connect from emacs (port 4005) 2017-06-05T20:23:42Z jackdaniel: if you don't want a window, then I don't know, but there might be a flag like --no-gui 2017-06-05T20:24:15Z Bicyclidine: i mean, yeah, i'd rather just spawn ccl as an inferior lisp 2017-06-05T20:25:21Z Bicyclidine: "Currently, it's not possible to use the Mac App Store version of Clozure CL as a command-line program." oh well then 2017-06-05T20:25:35Z Bicyclidine: i have... no idea why that would be the case though 2017-06-05T20:26:22Z stara quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T20:28:59Z antoszka: Bicyclidine: isn't that because of the Apple Store's aversion to programs that have a powerful evaluator? 2017-06-05T20:29:10Z Bicyclidine: but it's already ccl 2017-06-05T20:30:41Z heurist joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:36:20Z defaultxr joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:36:24Z mejja joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:37:07Z luna-is-here left #lisp 2017-06-05T20:37:19Z Baggers: Xach: That should be it. A little late as a wanted to squash a few style warnings in other projects 2017-06-05T20:41:28Z antismap quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T20:42:53Z slyrus_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:44:09Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:44:35Z manuel__ quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T20:46:10Z antismap joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:48:36Z shifty quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T20:55:16Z ceevusee joined #lisp 2017-06-05T20:59:04Z xaotuk joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:08:19Z ceevusee quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:08:27Z Xach: Baggers: cheers! 2017-06-05T21:08:48Z ceevusee joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:11:29Z Herbstkind quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T21:12:07Z BlueRavenGT joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:12:18Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T21:13:52Z rumbler31 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:14:08Z ceevusee quit (Max SendQ exceeded) 2017-06-05T21:14:47Z ceevusee joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:16:08Z shka_ quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T21:18:31Z ceevusee quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:20:23Z dcluna joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:22:23Z ceevusee joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:22:46Z Bicyclidine quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T21:29:21Z angavrilov quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:31:19Z ceevusee quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:32:43Z pjb: (format nil "~@(how is ~:(BOB SMITH~)?~)") #| --> "How is bob smith?" |# ; works for me. 2017-06-05T21:32:49Z pjb: (in all implementations). 2017-06-05T21:33:59Z pjb: You could use Clozure CL.app to save an image that would just have the CLI REPL. 2017-06-05T21:34:12Z pjb: But it'd be simplier to just fetch ccl already. 2017-06-05T21:35:49Z neoncontrails quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T21:36:47Z RedEight joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:43:10Z xaotuk quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T21:43:39Z krasnal joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:45:48Z mrottenkolber joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:48:21Z FreeBirdLjj joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:49:32Z xaotuk joined #lisp 2017-06-05T21:53:16Z FreeBirdLjj quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 2017-06-05T21:59:35Z pve quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:01:48Z mishoo quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:07:32Z wildbartty_ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:07:45Z ceevusee joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:08:06Z prxq joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:08:27Z daniel__ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:12:08Z dtornabene quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:12:34Z netizen9285 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:13:02Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:13:08Z nirved quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:13:17Z Bicyclidine joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:14:12Z sz0 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:14:18Z quazimodo joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:15:12Z rumbler31 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:15:50Z neoncontrails joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:15:51Z Baggers quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T22:15:53Z daniel__ quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:15:53Z Bicyclidine quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T22:15:56Z netizen9285 quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T22:16:07Z Bike joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:16:47Z _rumbler31 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:18:05Z DGASAU` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:18:11Z DGASAU quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:20:13Z DGASAU` is now known as DGASAU 2017-06-05T22:20:50Z _rumbler31 quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:21:07Z Jesin quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T22:21:43Z heurist` joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:24:29Z heurist quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:24:53Z MrSleepy joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:25:57Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:26:00Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2017-06-05T22:26:00Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:26:25Z adolf_stalin joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:28:07Z slyrus__ joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:29:02Z bungoman quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T22:29:27Z slyrus quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:29:32Z slyrus__ is now known as slyrus 2017-06-05T22:30:18Z d4ryus1 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:33:14Z d4ryus quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:37:37Z ryanwatkins quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T22:45:50Z xaotuk quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:50:30Z knusbaum quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:50:43Z gabriel_laddel_p joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:51:19Z gabriel_laddel_p: Is there some way to define a DEFSETF so when I setf a slot it will also do ,@body? 2017-06-05T22:51:39Z gabriel_laddel_p: SETF the slot using, eg SLOT-VALUE 2017-06-05T22:52:14Z Bike: what is body? 2017-06-05T22:52:45Z gabriel_laddel_p: Bike: I also need it to update some other slots on the object at the same time (they serve as a cache for the value in question) 2017-06-05T22:53:23Z Bike: well, assuming you just want some arbitrary code to execute, you can just define methods on slot-value and/or the accessor 2017-06-05T22:53:33Z Bike: :after probably 2017-06-05T22:53:54Z gabriel_laddel_p: Bike: is there an example of this somewhere? 2017-06-05T22:54:23Z gabriel_laddel_p: What I really want to write is (defsetf (slot-value 'foo) ...) 2017-06-05T22:54:27Z phinxy quit (Quit: Leaving) 2017-06-05T22:54:44Z Bike: that's not going to happen, defsetf is a macro-level mechanism 2017-06-05T22:55:55Z Bike: (defclass foo () ((bar :accessor bar) (cache :accessor cache))) (defmethod (setf bar) :after (new-value (object foo)) (update-cache (cache object) new-value)) 2017-06-05T22:56:08Z Afterlith[m] is now known as SovereignBleak 2017-06-05T22:56:18Z gabriel_laddel_p: Bike: Thank you 2017-06-05T22:56:26Z SovereignBleak is now known as Afterlith[m]1 2017-06-05T22:56:40Z Bike: note that if you do this then a (setf slot-value) will bypass it, so you could define a method there as well if you want 2017-06-05T22:56:50Z orivej quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T22:57:32Z Bike: (and something like standard-instance-access will always get around it, but that puts you in footshooting territory anyway) 2017-06-05T22:58:02Z gabriel_laddel_p: Bike: but if I define a (defmethod (setf slot-value bar) :after (new-value (object foo)) ...) that will work in all cases? 2017-06-05T22:58:28Z gabriel_laddel_p: And is what I just sent even the right syntax? And what should I be reading to _know_ the correct syntax? 2017-06-05T22:58:35Z Bike: it will work for slot-value and for accessors, yeah 2017-06-05T22:58:41Z Bike: clhs slot-value 2017-06-05T22:58:41Z specbot: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_slt_va.htm 2017-06-05T22:58:46Z Bike: will tell you the arguments 2017-06-05T22:58:49Z gabriel_laddel_p quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T22:59:00Z gabriel_laddel_p joined #lisp 2017-06-05T22:59:03Z gabriel_laddel_p quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T22:59:15Z Bike: (defmethod (setf slot-value) :after (new-value object slot-name) ...) 2017-06-05T22:59:50Z Bike: and the syntax for defmethod is in the clhs as well, of course. :after is what's called a qualifier 2017-06-05T23:01:32Z Afterlith[m]1 is now known as Afterlith[m]2 2017-06-05T23:06:19Z Afterlith[m]2 is now known as Afterlith 2017-06-05T23:08:25Z kmb quit (Quit: kmb) 2017-06-05T23:08:37Z LiamH quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T23:10:40Z Afterlith is now known as Sovereign_Bleak 2017-06-05T23:15:13Z jleija joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:17:48Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T23:23:38Z mejja quit (Quit: \ No newline at end of file) 2017-06-05T23:31:34Z prxq quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T23:32:10Z knusbaum joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:33:01Z _rumbler31 joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:34:19Z cromachina joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:34:37Z AJavaIdiot quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 53.0.3/20170518000419]) 2017-06-05T23:36:41Z rumbler31 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T23:36:55Z gabriel_laddel_p joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:37:02Z gabriel_laddel_p: Ugh. Got kicked before. 2017-06-05T23:37:05Z dcluna quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T23:37:12Z [X-Scale] joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:37:31Z _rumbler31 quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2017-06-05T23:37:34Z gabriel_laddel_p: Have been googling around, cannot find the DEFMETHOD form for (defmethod (setf slot-value foo) :after (new-value (object bar))...) 2017-06-05T23:37:45Z gabriel_laddel_p: Am reading SBCL sources & hyperspec, but no luck thus far 2017-06-05T23:38:04Z Xach: gabriel_laddel_p: there isn't anything like that. you can look into slot-value-using-class. 2017-06-05T23:38:08Z Xach: that is not standard though. 2017-06-05T23:38:27Z X-Scale quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2017-06-05T23:38:28Z [X-Scale] is now known as X-Scale 2017-06-05T23:39:40Z Xach: accessors are preferable in most cases 2017-06-05T23:40:32Z gabriel_laddel_p: Xach: Thanks. I use slot-value all over the place though b/c my tooling makes it easy to get the slot name, as I hate the whole reader/writer/accesor divide 2017-06-05T23:40:45Z ryanwatkins joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:40:49Z Xach: I love it. 2017-06-05T23:40:53Z Bike: oh, my mistake 2017-06-05T23:41:40Z gabriel_laddel_p quit (Client Quit) 2017-06-05T23:43:33Z knusbaum quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2017-06-05T23:43:56Z nzambe quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client) 2017-06-05T23:44:46Z nzambe joined #lisp 2017-06-05T23:45:26Z scymtym quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2017-06-05T23:55:00Z slyrus_ quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2017-06-05T23:56:53Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)