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2015-04-11T00:30:03Z axion: how can i check if a 2d array is empty? ...i have the literal #2A(())
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2015-04-11T00:31:33Z Bike: (some #'zerop (array-dimensions array))?
2015-04-11T00:32:04Z Bike: oh, or (zerop (array-total-size array))
2015-04-11T00:32:31Z axion: that'll work, thanks :)
2015-04-11T00:33:27Z didi: Sorry, I had to leave earlier. Have CL a function for copying files?
2015-04-11T00:34:14Z Bike: no. there are ones in cesarum, uiop, ql-util, and alexandria, among others i imagine.
2015-04-11T00:34:25Z didi: Bike: Thank you.
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2015-04-11T00:52:28Z Posterdati: Xach: ok, my circuit simulator works again :)
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2015-04-11T02:38:35Z dkcl: I need to get some sleep, but I'll just let you know that SBCL is not building in OpenBSD -- http://paste.lisp.org/+35E5
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2015-04-11T03:29:10Z emaczen: jackdaniel: what are the version requirements for running ECL on android?
2015-04-11T03:29:19Z emaczen: I can't seem to find anything on SF or gitlab
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2015-04-11T03:29:56Z beach: Good morning everyone!
2015-04-11T03:30:37Z emaczen: morning beach
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2015-04-11T03:54:14Z drmeister: Hi beach
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2015-04-11T03:54:59Z beach: drmeister: What's up?
2015-04-11T03:55:26Z drmeister: I'm in Los Angeles airport about to board a plane in 15 min and I'm trying to figure out how to add a THROW-AST node.
2015-04-11T03:55:51Z drmeister: I think I figured out what was wrong with my JITted non-local exits.
2015-04-11T03:55:54Z beach: Why would you add such an AST.
2015-04-11T03:55:56Z beach: ?
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2015-04-11T03:56:50Z drmeister: It looks like I need to use "invoke" to call functions that throw C++ exceptions.
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2015-04-11T03:57:37Z drmeister: Currently I only use "invoke" if an UNWIND-INSTRUCTION generates a landing-pad within a function.
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2015-04-11T03:58:48Z drmeister: So I need to use "invoke" to get THROW to work.  I can control whether I use "call" or "invoke" if I have a THROW-INSTRUCTION but I can't do it with a regular function call.
2015-04-11T03:58:58Z drmeister: Do you have any better suggestions?
2015-04-11T03:59:28Z beach: I am sorry, I don't know whether you are talking about Common Lisp THROW or C++ THROW.
2015-04-11T03:59:45Z beach: Common Lisp throw can be implemented with existing mechanisms.
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2015-04-11T04:00:52Z beach: I also don't understand whether the THROW-AST and the problem with the JITed non-local exits are related.
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2015-04-11T04:03:22Z drmeister: No - the problem with the JITed non-local exits looks like some kind of bug with LLVM JITted code not working with exception handling properly.
2015-04-11T04:03:27Z drmeister: When I compile this:   (clasp-cleavir:cleavir-compile 'cthrow '(lambda () (throw 'foo 'cbar)))
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2015-04-11T04:04:05Z drmeister: And then evaluate this:    (catch 'foo (cthrow))     - exception handling fails.
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2015-04-11T04:05:02Z drmeister: Common Lisp THROW currently expands as the macro:   (defmacro throw (tag result-form) `(core:throw-function ,tag ,result-form))
2015-04-11T04:05:31Z drmeister: When I look at the generated code the call to CORE:THROW-FUNCTION uses the llvm instruction "call".
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2015-04-11T04:06:02Z drmeister: When I go in and hand edit the llvm code and convert the "call" to an "invoke" and hand write a landing pad - that code works!
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2015-04-11T04:06:38Z drmeister: I've been banging my head against a wall for a week to figure out why it wasn't working.
2015-04-11T04:06:40Z beach: So you are planning to introduce a new AST in order to implement a single function correctly?
2015-04-11T04:07:17Z drmeister: This "solution" is absolutely bizarre - there is no indication in the itanium zero-cost exception handling documentation that this is necessary.
2015-04-11T04:07:30Z drmeister: You got it.
2015-04-11T04:07:41Z beach: I wouldn't do such a thing.
2015-04-11T04:07:55Z Bike: wait, you're targeting itanium?
2015-04-11T04:08:03Z drmeister: What else am I going to do?   I need this to work - I have lost so much time to this stupid problem.
2015-04-11T04:08:06Z beach: Just write the one function with whatever means necessary.
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2015-04-11T04:08:30Z drmeister: It's not writing the function.  It's writing how the function is called.   That's a much harder problem to control.
2015-04-11T04:09:12Z beach: What about the caller of the function that calls it?  Does it have to use "invoke" as well?
2015-04-11T04:09:19Z drmeister: Bike: LLVM C++ exception handling uses https://mentorembedded.github.io/cxx-abi/abi-eh.html
2015-04-11T04:09:21Z beach: In that case, you must use "invoke" everywhere.
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2015-04-11T04:09:48Z drmeister: beach: That's the weird thing - No, the caller doesn't need to use "invoke" - it's not transitive.
2015-04-11T04:09:56Z beach: then write two functions.
2015-04-11T04:10:09Z beach: One function that calls the next one using "invoke".
2015-04-11T04:10:11Z beach: Problem solved.
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2015-04-11T04:10:42Z drmeister: beach: That's the kind of idea that I needed to hear.
2015-04-11T04:11:06Z Bike: the x86 abi is called itanium...? man, i don't get computers.
2015-04-11T04:11:10Z drmeister: I wonder if that will work?
2015-04-11T04:11:24Z drmeister: It's a heck of a lot easier to implement than what I was about to do.
2015-04-11T04:11:32Z beach: If you can't make it work that way, you need to use "invoke" everywhere.
2015-04-11T04:11:56Z drmeister: beach: The BClasp compiler uses "invoke" everywhere - I think that's why I didn't see this problem until now.
2015-04-11T04:12:15Z drmeister: But that involves a lot of extra landing-pads and they slow down non-local exits.
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2015-04-11T04:13:14Z beach: Well, either you can make it work with two functions or you have to use "invoke" everywhere as far as I can tell.
2015-04-11T04:13:28Z drmeister: The nice thing about Cleavir is it is very judicious about where it uses "invoke" and the number of landing-pads that are generated are minimized.
2015-04-11T04:14:13Z drmeister: No - once I got it to work by hand editing the LLVM-IR I was able to set up a series of transitive function calls that will use "call" - they worked fine.
2015-04-11T04:14:28Z ggole: Bike: eh?
2015-04-11T04:14:56Z Bike: eh what?
2015-04-11T04:15:18Z drmeister: It's like you need the first one to be "invoke" to "prime" the exception handling - I don't know what's going on - I've got a couple of people in the LLVM developers mailing list following my exploits - I plan to take this up with them once I've nailed down what's going on.
2015-04-11T04:15:20Z ggole: Which x86 ABI is that?
2015-04-11T04:15:42Z Bike: the c++ exceptions thing drmeister linked
2015-04-11T04:15:53Z drmeister: LLVM JITted code and exception handling is a pretty dark corner of the LLVM universe.
2015-04-11T04:16:45Z ggole: Oh, there's a C++ ABI document that (iirc) happened to lift some of the details from work that was done for Itanium back when that was a thing
2015-04-11T04:17:05Z ggole: I guess it's that
2015-04-11T04:17:19Z drmeister: I'll bang on it on the plane and see if I can get that throwFunction invokes the realThrowFunction to work.   That will be a real head scratcher if it does.
2015-04-11T04:17:47Z drmeister: I could still be wrong about what is going on.
2015-04-11T04:17:53Z ggole: There's no such thing as the x86 ABI, though. Conventions differ widely on that platform.
2015-04-11T04:18:17Z beach: You will scare your fellow passengers.  You are expected to work on some slide show for a product introduction or something.
2015-04-11T04:18:19Z Bike: yeah, i meant "the x86 c++ exception handling api linked above"
2015-04-11T04:18:38Z ggole: Righto, I read that a bit too literally.
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2015-04-11T04:18:45Z drmeister: Here's the definitive page relating to LLVM and exception handling:  http://llvm.org/docs/ExceptionHandling.html
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2015-04-11T04:19:08Z drmeister: http://llvm.org/docs/ExceptionHandling.html#itanium-abi-zero-cost-exception-handling
2015-04-11T04:19:41Z Bike: of course i'm only assuming it's x86 because drmeister probably is not writing for itanium
2015-04-11T04:20:28Z drmeister: Bike: I'm writing for x86-64
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2015-04-11T04:21:02Z drmeister: I have to board a plane for a red-eye to the east coast.  beach - thanks for that suggestion - I'll tell you how it turns out.
2015-04-11T04:21:13Z beach: Have a nice flight.
2015-04-11T04:21:21Z drmeister: Bye guys
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2015-04-11T04:58:24Z emaczen: Can anyone help me with ECL and android? I've got the SDK, NDK, and I ran the ./configure/make scripts for ECL, but when I run ./configure.android I get a configure error that says "The program ECL-MIN is not installed in your system."
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2015-04-11T05:35:23Z axion: is there a format directive like ~a except to not consume the argument if it is NIL?
2015-04-11T05:35:46Z axion: i would like nothing in the result string if it's NIL
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2015-04-11T05:36:38Z Bike: clhs ~[
2015-04-11T05:36:38Z specbot: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_cgb.htm
2015-04-11T05:36:43Z Bike: something with that and ~*, probably
2015-04-11T05:36:50Z axion: thanks Bike
2015-04-11T05:37:03Z Shinmera: ~@[~a~]
2015-04-11T05:37:18Z Shinmera: That will consume the argument, but not print it.
2015-04-11T05:38:01Z axion: perfect, thanks
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2015-04-11T06:32:20Z jackdaniel: emaczen: ecl to cross-compile requires ECL on host system, but I think that it should be built. I'm not sure since I didn't work on this one
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2015-04-11T07:00:50Z Shinmera: Does anyone know if someone has written CL bindings to gstreamer?
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2015-04-11T07:17:02Z emaczen: jackdaniel: I'm having trouble getting the ./configure.android script to run... so I don't know if I am even at the point that you are talking about yet...
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2015-04-11T07:17:26Z emaczen: jackdaniel: Could you or your one of your teammates, perhaps post more information about getting ECL running in Android?
2015-04-11T07:18:50Z jackdaniel: emaczen: did you follow README.android?
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2015-04-11T07:21:13Z jackdaniel: I can ask Evrim to elaborate more about it, but I think that it would be better to write to mailing list CC'ing evrimulu at gmail
2015-04-11T07:23:58Z emaczen: jackdaniel: yep, and I'll do that tomorrow -- I'm headed to bed.
2015-04-11T07:24:01Z emaczen: night all.
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2015-04-11T07:25:26Z jackdaniel: and regarding android-9 - it is to support older android boards
2015-04-11T07:25:42Z jackdaniel: like gingerbreed or whatever (/me isn't much of android guy)
2015-04-11T07:28:13Z jackdaniel: but it's 19, hm, idk why, maybe typo
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2015-04-11T07:52:04Z jackdaniel: any abberv for concatenating symbols?
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2015-04-11T08:04:59Z jackdaniel: (intern "abc") returns |abc|, but it's not the same as 'abc  - I'm trying to write defclass-plus from CL-cookbook, but not sure how to define function copy-,classname
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2015-04-11T08:05:23Z jackdaniel: or similar things, which make symbol from concatenating name of class and some prefix/suffix/whatever
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2015-04-11T08:07:47Z |3b|: jackdaniel: by default, the reader converts to uppercase before interning things
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2015-04-11T08:10:45Z jackdaniel: |3b|: oh, (eql (intern "ABC") 'ABC) works! thank you :-)
2015-04-11T08:10:51Z |3b|: alexandria has a few functions for building symbols like that, though generating symbols is hard to make completely general/predictable
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2015-04-11T08:11:23Z jackdaniel: yes, it's more of exercise then actual need (as I said, I'm studying CL-cookbook right now, and it's one of CLOS exercises)
2015-04-11T08:11:32Z |3b|: people might configure reader to not convert to upper case, or run a "modern mode" lisp with lower-case symbols (which isn't technically conformant CL, but some people prefer it anyway)
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2015-04-11T08:12:44Z |3b|: or consider what happens if you are in package FOO and try to create a symbol based on a symbol in BAR. creating new symbol in either FOO or BAR could make sense, so at least some people will guess wrong when using it
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2015-04-11T08:43:58Z Shinmera: (read-from-string "foo") will do 'the right thing', but that's not the best solution in many cases either.
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2015-04-11T08:53:07Z jackdaniel: when i got it right with intern and using uppercase i switched to use alexandria symbolicate
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2015-04-11T11:31:59Z drmeister: Does slime auto completion support where I type the symbol and it proposes packages for the symbol as well as symbols?
2015-04-11T11:33:38Z drmeister: I haven't tried any ac systems in slime but whichever one does the above I'll put work into getting it to work with slime/clasp
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2015-04-11T11:57:41Z luisp:  /close
2015-04-11T11:58:15Z luisp:  /close
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2015-04-11T11:59:12Z luisp:  
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2015-04-11T12:01:32Z pjb: beach: is it something that happened to you? Did you scare passengers by programming?
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2015-04-11T12:02:24Z pjb: My trick is to use a flight simulator in an airplane or a train simulator in a train and tell that I'm the stealth pilot :-)
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2015-04-11T12:08:34Z pjb: jackdaniel: use (symbol-name 'abc) to check!
2015-04-11T12:09:35Z pjb: Shinmera: read-from-string WILL NOT do the right thing, since it uses the *package* binding at run-time, while 'foo uses the *package* binding at read-time.
2015-04-11T12:09:48Z pjb: and they obviously can be different.
2015-04-11T12:10:32Z Shinmera: Right.
2015-04-11T12:11:26Z Shinmera: But neither will INTERN unless you pass it a package, so it's a similar situation.
2015-04-11T12:11:35Z pjb: sure.
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2015-04-11T12:46:34Z beach: pjb: Never tried that one.
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2015-04-11T12:46:52Z beach: pjb: I just observe what others do, and it is certainly not what I want to do.
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2015-04-11T13:35:21Z k-stz: google code jam has started, you can still participate: http://code.google.com/codejam "you may use any programming language to solve a Code Jam problem, using any development environment or text editor"
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2015-04-11T13:53:39Z hydan: what would be the correct way to create vector inside loop from the collected values? i.e. lines multi-line file, where lines are like 1 2 3 converted to #(1 2 3), end result being something like (#(1 2 3) .. #(1 2 3)) but the line length being unknown and not constant.
2015-04-11T13:54:00Z hydan: s/i.e. lines/i.e. lines in/
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2015-04-11T14:00:49Z pjb: hydan: http://paste.lisp.org/+35EL
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2015-04-11T14:06:04Z pjb: There's a problem when trying to read text files with the lisp reader: it is not specified how the newline (or spaces and tabs for that matter) are read when reading an object.  Therefore, using (read-delimited-list #\newline stream) is actually non-conforming! the newline is never seen by read-delimited-list, because it is eaten by read.
2015-04-11T14:06:40Z pjb: Therefore, for such line-based text files, we have to read the line, and then read the lisp objects from the line (or parse it, split it, etc).
2015-04-11T14:10:01Z hydan: pjb: what if the number of things on the line is known (and so newline is not an issue)? should I MAKE-ARRAY and then push (read)s onto it?
2015-04-11T14:10:34Z pjb: Yes, you could do that.  an array with a fill-pointer.  Even if the length is not know, you can make an adjustable array with a fill-pointer.
2015-04-11T14:10:58Z pjb: But eg. if you have a maximum length of 1024, then you cannot have more than 512 elements, so happily, those arrays are bounded.
2015-04-11T14:12:28Z pjb: hydan: the question is what size is this file?  eg. stream-to-string-list will copy the whole file in strings.  split-sequence will make another copy of all the "words", before read-from-string parses them and extract the data.
2015-04-11T14:13:00Z pjb: If your file is bigger than your RAM, then you need to use other ways to process the file, record by record, or block by block.
2015-04-11T14:13:21Z pjb: It's a lost art, actually, with those big RAM we have nowadays.
2015-04-11T14:14:26Z hydan: pjb: yeah, was using read to speed things up a bit, also cannot use split-sequence. but the files are not that big actually, in fact just parsing STDIN for something like 1k lines.
2015-04-11T14:14:50Z ehu: pjb: is the art lost because of the big ram, or is the ram this big because not enough programmers mastered the art?
2015-04-11T14:15:15Z pjb: If you have files that can fit the RAM, you can read them whole, with read-sequence, and then use read-from-string with :start and aref to test for #\newline.
2015-04-11T14:15:16Z hydan: pjb: would that be the reason why most so-called "modern" text editors bail on files that are larger than couple of MiBs I wonder..
2015-04-11T14:15:32Z pjb: hydan: definitely.
2015-04-11T14:15:51Z k-stz: hydan: for a simplistic, less efficient, solution: (apply #'vector <collected lines>)
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2015-04-11T14:16:35Z pjb: hydan: and once you have the whole file in the RAM, you can first count the elements, to allocate the arrays, and then parse them to fill it.
2015-04-11T14:17:01Z pjb: (you may also do that by reading the file twice).
2015-04-11T14:17:42Z pjb: Notice also that reading files will put them in system cache memory, so, apart from the awkward API, reading them twice should be about as good (you just get the syscall overhead).
2015-04-11T14:18:30Z hydan: k-stz: yep, that is what I needed to do! but glad I asked here anyway, always learn something new.
2015-04-11T14:18:46Z hydan: pjb: maybe I should take a look at emacs/climacs source to see how they do it..
2015-04-11T14:20:07Z hydan: pjb, k-stz thanks for insightful replies.
2015-04-11T14:20:43Z k-stz: hydan: your welcome :)
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2015-04-11T14:25:36Z k-stz: hydan: just in case, this is what it would look like in a loop, ignore the UPTO's there: (loop for file-datastructure upto 5 collect (apply #'vector (loop for read-line upto 5 collect read-line)))
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2015-04-11T14:36:06Z drmeister: beach: Sadly - setting up "throwFunction" to "invoke" "reallyThrowFunction" didn't work.   I think I'm encountering a bug in how JITted code interacts with the exception handling machinery.  It's behaving as if a JITted function breaks unwinding across the JITted function.
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2015-04-11T14:41:55Z drmeister: I've been getting some advice from the llvmdev mailing list but it hasn't been too helpful.   I think you can count on one hand the number of people in the world who have done what I'm doing and worked with the LLVM JIT machinery in the way that I am.
2015-04-11T14:43:08Z drmeister: Everything works except if an error is signaled in Clasp and I try to invoke an interactive restart -->   crash
2015-04-11T14:45:24Z drmeister: I'm rerunning the test that I tried two days ago where I rewrite by hand the LLVM-IR code to convert the "call" that fails into an "invoke" and landing-pad.
2015-04-11T14:46:57Z drmeister: If it works then the only way I see moving forward is to add a THROW-AST and THROW-INSTRUCTION (that takes some work) and converting UNWIND-INSTRUCTION to "invoke" the function that throws the C++ Unwind exception rather than "call"ing it (currently compiling).
2015-04-11T14:49:14Z drmeister: I have a bunch of primitive functions written in C++ and I can control if they are "call"ed or "invoke"d.   Normal function applications are always "call"ed unless the "call"s are converted to "invoke"s if there are UNWIND-INSTRUCTIONs with successors within the calling function.
2015-04-11T14:50:09Z drmeister: Subverting the latter mechanism to "invoke" normal function applications would probably require another AST node and instruction - I think it's clearer to add a THROW-AST and THROW-INSTRUCTION.
2015-04-11T14:52:11Z brucem: drmeister: hmm ... "It's behaving as if a JITted function breaks unwinding across the JITted function." ... that sounds interesting.
2015-04-11T14:52:53Z brucem: drmeister: do you link against the system libcxx or do you have the ability to build your own and link against it?
2015-04-11T14:53:01Z drmeister: That's why I was asking you about it yesterday or the day before - I was curious if you had encountered anything like this?
2015-04-11T14:53:47Z brucem: drmeister: well, we don't JIT ... we're currently all AOT.
2015-04-11T14:53:58Z drmeister: brucem: I don't know and I don't think I'll find a solution there.  If I COMPILE-FILE the code and load it - it works fine.
2015-04-11T14:54:27Z brucem: drmeister: but .. I've dabbled in the unwinding part of exception handling before. compile-file generates a .so / .dylib and dlopens it or what?
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2015-04-11T14:55:18Z drmeister: Yes on the last question - COMPILE-FILE generates a .bc file, and a .dylib (essentially); either one works.
2015-04-11T14:55:55Z drmeister: I can load them both and they both work.   I'm just setting up to confirm all of this again.  I'll update you if anything changes.
2015-04-11T14:56:14Z brucem: drmeister: which JIT infrastructure are you using? MC or ORC?
2015-04-11T14:56:35Z drmeister: As far as I know the only JIT infrastructure available now is MCJIT
2015-04-11T14:56:42Z drmeister: What is ORC?
2015-04-11T14:56:47Z brucem: the new hotness.
2015-04-11T14:57:02Z drmeister: Really?   Jeeze - blink and you'll miss changes to LLVM.
2015-04-11T14:57:02Z brucem: It is on HEAD but not sure who is using it outside of Apple.
2015-04-11T14:57:06Z drmeister: Investigating...
2015-04-11T14:57:23Z brucem: nah, MCJIT is fine for now and is the understood path.
2015-04-11T15:00:17Z brucem: drmeister: when you do JIT stuff, I'm wondering if it is looking for CFI data or what not when it is trying to unwind and perhaps not finding it for some reason.
2015-04-11T15:00:36Z ehu: Announced start of migration of the common-lisp.net CVS repositories.
2015-04-11T15:03:20Z drmeister: Alright - ORC looks like "something to watch" rather than "ditch MCJIT and switch".
2015-04-11T15:03:53Z drmeister: What is "CFI data"?
2015-04-11T15:04:02Z drmeister: brucem ^
2015-04-11T15:04:10Z brucem: drmeister: correct on ORC.
2015-04-11T15:04:39Z brucem: drmeister: CFI is a subset of DWARF used to encode call frame information ...
2015-04-11T15:05:03Z drmeister: I don't know - I'm flummoxed as to what is going wrong.
2015-04-11T15:05:03Z brucem: drmeister: http://refspecs.linuxbase.org/LSB_3.1.0/LSB-Core-generic/LSB-Core-generic/ehframechpt.html
2015-04-11T15:05:27Z brucem: drmeister: well, that's why I was wondering if you could build & link against a custom libcxxabi (although I said libcxx above)
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2015-04-11T15:07:16Z brucem: drmeister: This isn't all as magic as it seems ... you just have to be able to get at it in the right way and that's sometimes tricky. It might just be that the unwinder isn't finding the data that it needs.
2015-04-11T15:08:17Z drmeister: Right - I wish I knew more about how it worked.   I'm starting to get a little more insight into it by single stepping through the disassembled code when I throw an exception.
2015-04-11T15:11:13Z drmeister: I hacked my COMPILE command so that rather than compile a form and JIT it - COMPILE will load a bitcode file and JIT it.  That way I can generate an LLVM module in a bitcode file and hand edit it and see what changes change the behavior.
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2015-04-11T15:12:03Z brucem: drmeister: so, the response from Kaylor on the list is talking about the same thing as me.
2015-04-11T15:14:34Z drmeister: Right - so I put a breakpoint on  RuntimeDyld::registerEHFrames()
2015-04-11T15:15:13Z drmeister: The arguments to that function were the same whether I set up the code in a way that works (old Clasp compiler) vs when it doesn't (Cleavir/Clasp compiler).   I didn't know where to go from there.
2015-04-11T15:16:00Z drmeister: It does get called when Clasp JITs a function - there is no doubt about that, but no EHFrames are registered either way.   I wasn't sure what to make of that.
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2015-04-11T15:19:32Z irc-learner: (loop repeat t do (print "hello"))
2015-04-11T15:19:49Z pjb: repeat takes an integer.
2015-04-11T15:19:59Z pjb: (loop (print "hello")) is an infinite loop.
2015-04-11T15:20:05Z pjb: (loop :do (print "hello")) is an infinite loop too.
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2015-04-11T15:20:36Z irc-learner: (loop always (print "hello")) ?
2015-04-11T15:20:45Z pjb: Is different.
2015-04-11T15:20:57Z pjb: Try: (loop always (print nil))
2015-04-11T15:21:27Z irc-learner: (print nil ) must be false
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2015-04-11T15:21:35Z pjb: it is.
2015-04-11T15:21:54Z irc-learner: But "hello" is true
2015-04-11T15:21:57Z pjb: yes
2015-04-11T15:22:20Z irc-learner: so (loop always (print "hello")) must be true
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2015-04-11T15:22:46Z irc-learner: but Lisp is not haskell and since print is not pure ...
2015-04-11T15:23:15Z pjb: I would not consider it a good form, since it's essentially an unexpected infinite loop.
2015-04-11T15:23:15Z Shinmera: (loop always (print "hello")) cannot yield a value because it never terminates.
2015-04-11T15:23:21Z irc-learner: There is not close world assumption in Lisp, since this is not logic programming, like in prolog
2015-04-11T15:23:37Z jackdaniel: http://paste.lisp.org/display/146977 <- any obvious flaws there? it's excercise from cl-cookbook - defclass with a few functions
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2015-04-11T15:23:49Z irc-learner: But logically (print "hello") is true
2015-04-11T15:24:07Z irc-learner: and always will be true unless you redefine print to change its semantic
2015-04-11T15:24:39Z pjb: print could signal a condition.
2015-04-11T15:24:48Z irc-learner: I wonder if clojure could consider such thing to be true, in case there was something similar to loop
2015-04-11T15:24:52Z Bike: jackdaniel: direct-slots is probably not just a list of symbols
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2015-04-11T15:25:33Z irc-learner: Some of the packages in quicklisp are really short, for example group-by
2015-04-11T15:25:46Z Bike: also not sure why you'd want this since it's just pseudo defstruct, but whatever
2015-04-11T15:25:51Z pjb: irc-learner: why are you insisting on infinite loops?  are you crazy?  are you God?
2015-04-11T15:26:10Z jackdaniel: Bike: I don't, just did excercise from cl-cookbook (training)
2015-04-11T15:26:27Z irc-learner: some infinite loop could be avoide if we could use something like (demonstrate that this is always true for induction)
2015-04-11T15:26:30Z irc-learner: with induction
2015-04-11T15:26:50Z pjb: You could write a macro for that.
2015-04-11T15:26:56Z Bike: jackdaniel: i mean, defclass slots is usually something like (defclass foo () ((bar :initarg :bar))) so that will break when you use it for &key.
2015-04-11T15:27:51Z jackdaniel: Bike: yeah, forgot about that. Would it be correct to write something like (if (atomp slot) slot (car slot)) ?
2015-04-11T15:28:03Z pjb: Yes.
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2015-04-11T15:28:09Z Bike: yeah, i guess so.
2015-04-11T15:28:18Z pjb: I would rather write (if (consp slot) (car slot) slot), but yours is good too.
2015-04-11T15:28:24Z SAL9000: jackdaniel: (alexandria:ensure-car slot)
2015-04-11T15:29:03Z jackdaniel: o, since I use alexandria already this sounds best fit
2015-04-11T15:29:17Z jackdaniel: thanks all :)
2015-04-11T15:29:48Z irc-learner:  I was learning the basic of irc, in #ruby I learned about /join /nick /part /quit, something more to learn?
2015-04-11T15:30:05Z Bike: to stay on topic
2015-04-11T15:30:20Z jackdaniel: ^_^
2015-04-11T15:30:27Z pjb: irc-learner: /topic
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2015-04-11T15:34:47Z irc-learner: thanks jpb, /topic is my new work for today
2015-04-11T15:35:10Z irc-learner: word
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2015-04-11T15:36:01Z irc-learner:  by for now, thanks
2015-04-11T15:36:19Z irc-learner: By the way, I am not God (not at the moment for what I can say and see ))
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2015-04-11T15:36:49Z pjb: :-)  I was just wondering if you had eternity before you to wait for the result.
2015-04-11T15:37:10Z irc-learner: Not, just control-c, I am a little inpatient
2015-04-11T15:37:23Z irc-learner: eternity is too long to wait for hello
2015-04-11T15:38:04Z jackdaniel: I will wait for your greeting for eternity - sounds almost romantic ;)
2015-04-11T15:38:05Z irc-learner: I imagine a good compiler could say that (print "hello") is always true, but Lisp is about secondary effect (whatis the correct word?)
2015-04-11T15:38:27Z pjb: side effects.
2015-04-11T15:38:29Z pjb: Indeed it is.
2015-04-11T15:38:57Z irc-learner: waiting for eternity is a contradictory term, I suppose is something like (if nil hello wait)
2015-04-11T15:38:57Z pjb: If you wrote (loop always t), it could and will probably generate code such as (tagbody :start (go :start)).
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2015-04-11T15:39:24Z beach: drmeister: You do what you need to do in order to make it work of course.  I insist that if you normally do calls and if there is a way to use invokes in the middle of those calls, you should be able to write a function that does it, rather than introducing all that additional infrastructure.  And given what you said, there seems to be no guarantee that it would work anyway.
2015-04-11T15:40:38Z irc-learner: isn't a little selfish to do  (tagbody :start (go :start)), seems that you are always looking to your own gut (what's the word for ombligo?)
2015-04-11T15:41:10Z pjb: It's just the way infinite loops are implemented in your computer.
2015-04-11T15:41:39Z irc-learner: Haskell has something like botton for that (I seem to recall=
2015-04-11T15:41:41Z pjb: Try: (disassemble (lambda () (loop))) and compare with (disassemble (lambda () (tagbody :start (go :start))))
2015-04-11T15:42:13Z pjb: and (disassemble (lambda () (loop always t))) ; in ccl they're all the same.
2015-04-11T15:42:18Z Shinmera: pjb: Just macroexpanding the LOOP will show it nicely too. At least on SBCL.
2015-04-11T15:42:35Z Bike: haskell has a bottom type, but that doesn't mean haskell programs always halt
2015-04-11T15:42:39Z irc-learner: If I want an infinite loop I would use (loop while t) it seems standard practice to announce that it never finish
2015-04-11T15:42:48Z pjb: in CL you write: (loop)
2015-04-11T15:43:56Z pjb: irc-learner: notice that: (defvar *t* t) (bt:make-thread (lambda () (loop always *t*))) is not an infinite loop: you can (setf *t* nil) when you want it to finish.
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2015-04-11T15:43:59Z irc-learner: We all know that the halting problem is not an easy one, there is no algorithm to solve that problem in general
2015-04-11T15:44:13Z beach: drmeister: In other words, I strongly recommend against introducing new ASTs and instructions until you understand what it takes to make your thing work in LLVM.
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2015-04-11T15:45:55Z irc-learner: pjf what is bt:
2015-04-11T15:46:05Z pjb: bordeaux-threads
2015-04-11T15:46:10Z irc-learner: I use sbcl mostly
2015-04-11T15:46:24Z pjb: nonetheless.
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2015-04-11T15:46:47Z pjb: irc-learner: lesson in irc: notice this is #lisp, not #sbcl.
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2015-04-11T15:47:03Z drmeister: beach: Catch-22 - I can't really tell if this (add THROW ast/instruction nodes and a "throw" primitive that I set up as requiring "invoke" vs "call") will work in production until I try it.  Once I set this up then I can switch the primitive back and forth between requiring "invoke" or "call" and that will definitively tell me if this is the solution.
2015-04-11T15:47:08Z irc-learner: (use-package :sb-bsd-threads) (mapcar #'join-thread (loop repeat 40 collect (make-thread (lambda (expt 10 8) count t ))))
2015-04-11T15:47:25Z pjb: irc-learner: nope.
2015-04-11T15:47:40Z pjb: Never use implementation specific packages directly. Use portability libraries like bordeaux-threads.
2015-04-11T15:47:40Z Bike: ASTs are syntax, yes...? I thought this core:throw-function thing was a... function.
2015-04-11T15:47:52Z drmeister: I'll set up this code so that I can take it back out again - I'm getting pretty adept at adding the chain of functions and node types to support new AST nodes in Cleavir.
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2015-04-11T15:48:04Z Bike: Does sbcl actually have a separate package for _bsd_ threads?
2015-04-11T15:48:05Z irc-learner: what are the main difference between bt and sbcl-threads? are they cosmetic or profound?
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2015-04-11T15:48:14Z pjb: none.
2015-04-11T15:48:17Z beach: drmeister: Like I said, you do what you need to do.
2015-04-11T15:48:24Z pjb: just bordeaux-thread works in other implementations as well.
2015-04-11T15:48:26Z Bike: they are profound: sb-thread only works on sbcl
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2015-04-11T15:49:07Z drmeister: I appreciate your advice and I know what you are saying.  I don't like this any more than you do.  I shouldn't need to do anything here - it should just work.
2015-04-11T15:49:09Z irc-learner: ECL is gone, Clis is almost gone, if you extrapolates perhaps there will be only one (like the film of Sean Connery)
2015-04-11T15:49:21Z pjb: where is ecl gone?
2015-04-11T15:49:24Z pjb: what is clis?
2015-04-11T15:49:41Z drmeister: That being said - I've lost a week now to this stupid problem and I am beyond being frustrated.
2015-04-11T15:49:45Z Bike: why are these people always so hard to understand
2015-04-11T15:49:53Z irc-learner: ecl maintainer went out, I think there is a new one, but I don't know the current state of affairs.
2015-04-11T15:50:07Z pjb: irc-learner: then why are you propagating fud?
2015-04-11T15:50:09Z Shinmera: Bike: I wish I knew.
2015-04-11T15:50:11Z irc-learner: clisp
2015-04-11T15:50:25Z pjb: clisp has currently much less open bugs than sbcl.
2015-04-11T15:50:35Z pjb: an order less.
2015-04-11T15:50:44Z irc-learner: Yes clisp is a very nice implementation, but not active group
2015-04-11T15:50:50Z pjb: so what?
2015-04-11T15:50:53Z beach: jackdaniel: It appears that irc-learner doesn't know that you are maintaining ECL.  You must make more publicity about it.
2015-04-11T15:51:36Z irc-learner: I read planet.lisp and there was a post about a new maintainer, I just don't remember his/her name, is jackdaniel?
2015-04-11T15:51:38Z beach: pjb: "fewer".  "fewer" things, "less" stuff.
2015-04-11T15:51:54Z pjb: Right, sorry.
2015-04-11T15:52:09Z irc-learner:  I wonder if clips could be easily ported to javascript
2015-04-11T15:52:17Z pjb: probably not.
2015-04-11T15:52:19Z irc-learner: clisp (sorry typing)
2015-04-11T15:52:19Z drmeister: Bike: I'll translate:  "The ECL Common Lisp implementation is gone (irc-learner is incorrect on this point), Clisp is almost gone (again incorrect). If you follow this trend then perhaps at some point in the future there will be only one implementation of Common Lisp - as in the movie "The Highlander" where there could only be one dude running around who
2015-04-11T15:52:19Z drmeister: lived forever and cut people's heads off".
2015-04-11T15:52:21Z pjb: clips is a big system.
2015-04-11T15:52:29Z pjb: also, I'm not sure the sources of clips are available.
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2015-04-11T15:52:47Z pjb: Ah, yes, they are: http://clipsrules.sourceforge.net/
2015-04-11T15:53:00Z drmeister thinks by the time he got that out - everyone else had figured it out as well.
2015-04-11T15:53:17Z irc-learner: drmaister good, nice formulation!
2015-04-11T15:53:30Z irc-learner: Highlander so high that their head was cut off
2015-04-11T15:53:47Z irc-learner: Perhaps a little humour is toleared here?
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2015-04-11T15:53:55Z pjb: yes, a little.
2015-04-11T15:53:57Z Bike: humor is fine if it's readable
2015-04-11T15:54:06Z irc-learner: (set readtable true)
2015-04-11T15:54:36Z Bike: okay, readable and also funny
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2015-04-11T15:54:38Z beach: irc-learner: Less noise would be appreciated.  Especially if it consists of incorrect statements.
2015-04-11T15:54:40Z irc-learner: (setf (readtable  *allow-humour*) t)
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2015-04-11T15:55:22Z irc-learner: What about the trunk of ECL?
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2015-04-11T15:55:37Z pjb: ecl is on git nowadays. There's no trunk anymore.
2015-04-11T15:55:46Z irc-learner: there was another Lisp (kioto lisp ?)
2015-04-11T15:55:49Z drmeister: irc-learner: Yes, you must make your movie references more clear - your reference "like the film of Sean Connery" led everyone to believe that you were referring to "Zardoz" - which makes no sense at all.
2015-04-11T15:55:53Z pjb: irc-learner: https://gitlab.com/groups/embeddable-common-lisp
2015-04-11T15:55:58Z beach: ... incorrect statements AND incomplete questions.
2015-04-11T15:56:11Z irc-learner: drmeister you must be a movie expert!
2015-04-11T15:56:17Z pjb: Outland is also a film of Sean Connery :-)
2015-04-11T15:56:28Z Bike: i actually thought james bond.
2015-04-11T15:56:33Z pjb: irc-learner: we're all are nowadays, there's imdb.com
2015-04-11T15:56:40Z pjb: s/'re//
2015-04-11T15:57:00Z irc-learner: drmeister is about C++ and Lisp?
2015-04-11T15:57:16Z irc-learner: when will it be ready, for coffee?
2015-04-11T15:57:32Z beach: irc-learner: Less noise please!
2015-04-11T15:57:38Z kephra: irc-learner, easy port: emscripten + clisp
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2015-04-11T15:58:04Z irc-learner: kephra: Has someone tried that: emscripten + clips, does it work?
2015-04-11T15:58:13Z kephra: dont know
2015-04-11T15:58:23Z drmeister feels pretty strongly that "Zardoz" is the definitive "that movie with Sean Connery".
2015-04-11T15:58:33Z Bike: you might be right, but i haven't seen it.
2015-04-11T15:58:40Z beach: OK, have fun.
2015-04-11T15:58:42Z kephra: drmeister, Zardoz was a nice movie
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2015-04-11T15:58:43Z Bike: just something about evil penises.
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2015-04-11T16:00:01Z irc-learner: quicklisp is a nice way of using libraries
2015-04-11T16:00:21Z irc-learner: I would like many thing to be as easy to use as quicklisp: quicload and quickuse
2015-04-11T16:00:51Z irc-learner: But perhaps not so much to be quick laid-off,
2015-04-11T16:01:25Z k-stz enjoyed zardos but thought it was an obscure film; also only today realized that it stared sean connery
2015-04-11T16:01:49Z k-stz: anyone still remember why it was called zardos? :D -- sorry offtopic
2015-04-11T16:05:39Z irc-learner:  What's the future of Lisp?
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2015-04-11T16:07:43Z irc-learner: How can I earn 100 dollars with Lisp in an hour?
2015-04-11T16:08:10Z Shinmera: By leaving this channel.
2015-04-11T16:08:36Z irc-learner: and the 100 dollars?
2015-04-11T16:08:58Z irc-learner: What kind of application do you develop Shinmera?
2015-04-11T16:09:43Z jackdaniel: hmm, I'll do more noise, when I'll accomplish goals set for next release
2015-04-11T16:09:52Z jackdaniel: (:
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2015-04-11T16:10:24Z irc-learner: I remember someone called something like shinmera in clojure, try clojure, but know is powered by a different person, possible is someone else
2015-04-11T16:10:28Z jackdaniel: also, there will be open logo competition for ECL with voting and lasers ;)
2015-04-11T16:11:31Z irc-learner: jackdaniel, I hope you give ecl a good impulse. I remember there was Stella a lisp that compiles to java and C++ but the authors didn't get money, they were on powerloom
2015-04-11T16:11:57Z irc-learner: I think one of the author is now at google, Mark watson make some application in powerloom but nothing more heard about it
2015-04-11T16:11:59Z jackdaniel: to java *and* c++? what a strange goal
2015-04-11T16:12:32Z irc-learner: It was a tool to be used in an expert system to be developed and available in many scenarios
2015-04-11T16:13:20Z irc-learner: The code was developed in an US university, google for Stella lisp, I think it was a good project, but more funds were needed (I imagine=
2015-04-11T16:14:27Z irc-learner: I google for it: and here is : STELLA - Lisp-style Symbolic Programming with Delivery in Common-Lisp, C++ and Java  from http://www.isi.edu/isd/LOOM/Stella/
2015-04-11T16:14:53Z irc-learner: drmeister could take some code from it, on join the authors
2015-04-11T16:15:03Z irc-learner: it could acellerate the process
2015-04-11T16:15:17Z irc-learner: (I imagine my English must be very bad
2015-04-11T16:16:34Z irc-learner: Perhaps my influence is not good for this group, since beach went away, I must be an evil influence here, perhaps to go out is the best thing to do now
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2015-04-11T16:17:37Z jackdaniel: chill, you just talk alot ;D beach isn't on channel *all* the time
2015-04-11T16:18:20Z irc-learner:  beach is zach?
2015-04-11T16:18:40Z Bike: beach is not xach.
2015-04-11T16:18:48Z irc-learner: my fingers can idle!, who is beach?
2015-04-11T16:19:15Z irc-learner: can't
2015-04-11T16:20:27Z irc-learner: jackdaniel sounds like a licour mark to me: Jack Daniel's is a brand of Tennessee whiskey and the highest selling American whiskey in the world
2015-04-11T16:20:54Z emaczen: anybody using ECL for android? jackdaniel: I'll post on the mailing-list soon (I just woke up)
2015-04-11T16:21:11Z jackdaniel: well, my first name is Daniel, and I really anjoy jackdaniels whiskey, hence my nick
2015-04-11T16:21:14Z jackdaniel: ;)
2015-04-11T16:21:29Z irc-learner: don't drink too much, for ecl sake!
2015-04-11T16:22:12Z irc-learner: ecl: exquisite curative licours with lisp particles to elevate your sould
2015-04-11T16:23:30Z jackdaniel: I believe ECL needs a lot of development, but it's pretty stable and codebase is really well maintained. It needs more candies and fireworks, to attract people to it. Therefore when it will be refreshed it needs more marketing, or noise as beach pointed out.
2015-04-11T16:23:31Z irc-learner: Perhaps I have abused the lisp hospitality of this group, I must go with my insane humor sense to somewhere else, pjb must be programming his next infinite long name application
2015-04-11T16:24:20Z jackdaniel: I'm out for now o/
2015-04-11T16:24:23Z irc-learner: The best thing of ecl is that C is everywhere
2015-04-11T16:24:48Z irc-learner: I am going out too, by everyone, I go o/ (what's that?)
2015-04-11T16:24:58Z irc-learner: bye
2015-04-11T16:25:17Z jackdaniel: I wouldn't call it "best thing", but it's coherent to ECL, to be interoperable with C
2015-04-11T16:25:55Z irc-learner: clojure use java interoperability as a good selling point, take note
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2015-04-11T16:26:35Z irc-learner: drmeister C++ lisp is also using C++ as a selling point (selling in an ideal sense)
2015-04-11T16:26:57Z jackdaniel: clojure isn't CL unfortunately
2015-04-11T16:27:24Z emaczen: jackdaniel: how long should it take for a registration email for the ecl-list?
2015-04-11T16:27:28Z jackdaniel: but ABCL is implementation you might be interested (it's the java one )
2015-04-11T16:27:50Z jackdaniel: I'm not sure, but it should be about 15 minutes tops
2015-04-11T16:28:27Z emaczen: Okay, I'll be more patient then :)
2015-04-11T16:28:30Z jackdaniel: if you'll have problems with this, send mail to me (jackdaniel at hellsgate dot pl), and I'll forward it
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2015-04-11T16:28:33Z irc-learner: ABCL was, for a long time, a very slow lisp, with very little actitivy and an (incierto) future (incierto: don't know what would happen in its future)
2015-04-11T16:29:05Z jackdaniel: I really have to go, I have meeting today and I'm after training, so need to take shower
2015-04-11T16:29:10Z jackdaniel: bb now, for real! :P
2015-04-11T16:29:29Z irc-learner: Smelling well, is essential!!
2015-04-11T16:29:51Z irc-learner: bb now, I have a delicous thing to eat
2015-04-11T16:30:02Z irc-learner: delicious  thing to eat
2015-04-11T16:30:05Z ehu: irc-learner: how long ago was that with ABCL?
2015-04-11T16:30:41Z irc-learner: some years
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2015-04-11T16:32:14Z irc-learner: I part with /part  thanks to #lisp, nice people hear.
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2015-04-11T16:32:46Z ehu: hmm. as far as I remember from the testimonials, it was rock solid for some of its users for years already when I took over in -- can't remember. I think in 2008
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2015-04-11T16:34:05Z ehu thinks that if irc-learner goes that long back with common lisp, he might be more of an irc-teacher
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2015-04-11T16:39:01Z Walex: kids of today, all this common lisp newfangled stuff. Interlisp forever! :-)
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2015-04-11T16:48:57Z JuanDaugherty: cl is like 25 yo at least
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2015-04-11T16:49:57Z JuanDaugherty goes to look at date on ancient copy of CLtl
2015-04-11T16:50:50Z JuanDaugherty: '90 (2nd ed)
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2015-04-11T17:06:02Z jackdaniel: hm, I'm one year older :D
2015-04-11T17:06:15Z jackdaniel predates CL ;-)
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2015-04-11T17:10:52Z JuanDaugherty: and the lang was pretty stable at that point, there was a lotta birthin b4 that
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2015-04-11T17:20:37Z emaczen: jackdaniel: I still haven't received an email from the ECL list
2015-04-11T17:20:44Z emaczen: For registration
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2015-04-11T17:25:45Z jackdaniel: emaczen: hmm, I'm leaving now, but please send me email if you won't receive confirmation e-mail (have you checked spambox?), and I'll forward it when I'll have access to computer
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2015-04-11T17:27:12Z jackdaniel: I have no access to administrative interface of mailing list, I think I should write to Jose Garcia to ask about such credentials
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2015-04-11T19:24:25Z emaczen: with drakma:http-request -- is there a way I can look at the actual http request being sent? I'm having some trouble with sending an OAuth header via the :additional-arguments keyword argument
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2015-04-11T19:29:53Z ehu: emaczen: I use wireshark to look at the actual requests.
2015-04-11T19:29:59Z ehu: (and responses)
2015-04-11T19:30:40Z BWV1006a is now known as selauraspira
2015-04-11T19:30:48Z Shinmera: The manual tells you how right away http://weitz.de/drakma/
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2015-04-11T19:32:04Z emaczen: Shinmera: I see, thanks I overlooked this
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2015-04-11T20:29:28Z merdam: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cqy4-vCo0M
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2015-04-11T21:10:15Z _1_jain: hi
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2015-04-11T22:24:18Z Xach: H4ns: I'm getting a 404 for yason.tar.gz
2015-04-11T22:25:26Z dim: hi Xach, wanted to ask if clozure is also contributing to sbcl?
2015-04-11T22:28:44Z dim: well time to sleep here anyway, ttyl!
2015-04-11T22:28:50Z Xach: dim: Not that I know of.
2015-04-11T22:28:54Z dim: gn common lispers
2015-04-11T22:28:57Z Xach: n8
2015-04-11T22:29:01Z dim: Xach: was about your previous tweet, ok
2015-04-11T22:29:02Z dim: thx
2015-04-11T22:29:08Z Xach: which tweet?
2015-04-11T22:29:14Z Xach: (keeping you up another 30 seconds)
2015-04-11T22:29:23Z dim: the sbcl improvement on the file lines in the reader
2015-04-11T22:29:37Z dim: skimmed through it then forgot to look who did it
2015-04-11T22:29:44Z dim: then easier to ask here I suppose ;-)
2015-04-11T22:30:23Z Xach: i read the commit RSS and like to point out neat things
2015-04-11T22:30:29Z Xach: i'm not sure who made that patch
2015-04-11T22:30:45Z dim: anyway, can't work on my compiler anymore, braindead, and tomorrow's soon enough
2015-04-11T22:30:53Z Xach: douglas katzman, a googler, who has done a ton of work on sbcl lately
2015-04-11T22:31:00Z dim: oh, a googler
2015-04-11T22:31:14Z dim: might be related to Google Flights then
2015-04-11T22:31:30Z Xach: or maybe he just really loves sbcl
2015-04-11T22:31:37Z Xach: <3
2015-04-11T22:32:11Z dim: well their 20% is basically only spent on strategic open source projets that Google actually need, so I would bet practical use cases internally
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2015-04-11T22:32:46Z dim: of free time (free as in unpaid, then, I guess)
2015-04-11T22:32:53Z water-watered is now known as firewood
2015-04-11T22:32:58Z dim: but really, gn ;-)
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2015-04-11T22:45:08Z x1n4u: gn8 and happy codeing everyon
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2015-04-11T22:46:33Z scymtym: Xach: is there a variation of http://l1sp.org/cl/list that redirects directly to the function instead of the list of "meanings"?
2015-04-11T22:47:16Z scymtym should have chosen a different example to make that sentence less confusing
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2015-04-11T22:51:46Z Petit_Dejeuner: Like this? http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_list_.htm
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2015-04-11T22:52:47Z Bike: with the l1sp.org shortening, presumably
2015-04-11T22:55:39Z scymtym: if possible, yes
2015-04-11T22:57:01Z Xach: scymtym: hmm, let me check
2015-04-11T22:57:15Z scymtym: Xach: thank you
2015-04-11T22:57:39Z Xach: scymtym: no, sorry.
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2015-04-11T23:02:31Z scymtym: Xach: no worries, thanks anyway
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2015-04-11T23:17:46Z pjb: Xach:  (directory #P"/home/test/quicklisp/**/com.informatimago.tools.source.asd") returns  (#P"/home/test/quicklisp/dists/quicklisp/software/com.informatimago-20150407-git/tools/com.informatimago.tools.source.asd") but (ql:quickload :com.informatimago.tools.source) says Component :COM.INFORMATIMAGO.TOOLS.SOURCE not found
2015-04-11T23:17:47Z pjb:  
2015-04-11T23:17:52Z pjb: Xach: what would be wrong?
2015-04-11T23:18:11Z pjb: This is with cmucl-20f.
2015-04-11T23:18:16Z pjb: on x86-linux
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