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ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T02:02:45Z beach: jusss: Listen to me please: When yo present code for someone to read, and it is not properly indented, people will have to count parentheses in order to understand your code, which is not polite. Furthermore, when you name your functions bla and bla2, you force people to guess what you intend with the functions. Again, it is not polite. 2014-12-04T02:03:11Z beach: jusss: You are asking people to spend a lot of time helping you when you are not making any effort to help them help you. 2014-12-04T02:03:21Z jusss: beach: sorry 2014-12-04T02:03:46Z beach: axion: Are we supposed to guess the warnings? 2014-12-04T02:04:10Z axion: The binding of SB-C::Y is not a REAL: NIL 2014-12-04T02:04:13Z axion: twice for that 2014-12-04T02:07:02Z beach: axion: Are you sure you pasted that right? There is a ) missing. 2014-12-04T02:07:33Z beach: axion: On the line where array-dimensions is called. 2014-12-04T02:07:36Z axion: yes after the first line 2014-12-04T02:07:40Z axion: sory i have that 2014-12-04T02:08:00Z beach: axion: So, how could this have worked at all. 2014-12-04T02:08:03Z beach: ? 2014-12-04T02:08:15Z axion: i have that missing paren...i pasted wrong 2014-12-04T02:08:34Z axion: not sure how it was removed, i'll annotate if need be 2014-12-04T02:08:39Z beach: When I add that parenthesis, I get no warnings. 2014-12-04T02:08:39Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:09:11Z axion: odd. i even started a new image to be sure 2014-12-04T02:09:36Z beach: I have optimize set to (speed 0) (debug 3) by default. You? 2014-12-04T02:09:53Z beach: Not sure that's what it is, but it could be a difference. 2014-12-04T02:10:26Z beach: jusss: Let's start by figuring out why you don't have the right indentation, and we will go from there. 2014-12-04T02:10:37Z beach: jusss: You are using Emacs and SLIME, yes? 2014-12-04T02:10:40Z axion: beach: whatever is the default 2014-12-04T02:11:05Z axion: beach: http://paste.lisp.org/display/144569#2 2014-12-04T02:11:15Z beach: axion: Another difference could be the SBCL version. I am just guessing since I don't get any warning. 2014-12-04T02:12:10Z jusss: beach: yes, I'm using emacs and slime 2014-12-04T02:12:38Z beach: jusss: And how did you start writing the code? Did you load a file? Or did you just type in a new Emacs buffer? 2014-12-04T02:13:19Z beach: axion: I have no explanation for that. It doesn't seem to be a problem with your code since I don't get it. 2014-12-04T02:13:34Z axion: the odd part is a similar function works fine 2014-12-04T02:13:43Z axion: or rather, compiles fine 2014-12-04T02:13:56Z |3b|: beach, jusss: indentation is probably broken due to tabs 2014-12-04T02:14:03Z zmisc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T02:14:11Z beach: |3b|: How so? 2014-12-04T02:14:17Z jusss: beach: just M-x slime 2014-12-04T02:14:41Z beach: So you typed this code in the *slime repl* buffer? 2014-12-04T02:14:42Z |3b|: beach: that paste seems to have tab characters in it, it was probably indented assuming they are 2 characters wide 2014-12-04T02:14:54Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:14:54Z zmisc quit (Client Quit) 2014-12-04T02:15:11Z beach: |3b|: How strange. What platform would have that? 2014-12-04T02:15:20Z |3b| supposes it could just be missing a repl prompt though 2014-12-04T02:15:23Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:15:31Z beach: Yeah, that's what I am thinking. 2014-12-04T02:16:09Z beach: jusss: Do the following. After you started SLIME, load a file called bla.lisp or whatever you want to call it. Then type the code there and indent it. 2014-12-04T02:17:04Z axion: if i replace the (array-dimensions) with just '(10 10) it compiles without warnings 2014-12-04T02:17:32Z echo-area joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:17:52Z beach: axion: I am just barely awake so I don't see a problem. Maybe someone else can see some. 2014-12-04T02:19:10Z beach: jusss: I am thinking you just typed your code in the *slime-repl ...* buffer, right? 2014-12-04T02:19:13Z stepnem quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:21:52Z axion: beach: ok, what version of sbcl are you using? 2014-12-04T02:22:06Z beach: 1.2.5 2014-12-04T02:22:19Z axion: i will upgrade, thanks 2014-12-04T02:22:40Z beach: Yeah, it's probably best to try that first. 2014-12-04T02:23:03Z |3b| gets a warning on 1.2.5.85 2014-12-04T02:23:38Z axion: heh 2014-12-04T02:23:44Z wjiang joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:24:17Z foom quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:24:20Z vinleod joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:25:18Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T02:25:22Z |3b|: which is arguably correct, in the general case where it doesn't know you have a 2d array (or if you don't assume the compiler is smart enough to figure out a 2+d array means both variables are bound to fixnums) 2014-12-04T02:25:27Z beach: I get the same when I do sbcl --no-userinit 2014-12-04T02:25:53Z beach: I mean, I get warnings. 2014-12-04T02:26:07Z axion: so what would be the proper way to handle this? 2014-12-04T02:26:14Z |3b|: for x below (or w 0) would avoid warnings and possibly be more correct 2014-12-04T02:26:18Z beach: So that means it differs according to optimize settings or something. 2014-12-04T02:26:30Z |3b|: (if you already know it is 2d array, it just avoid the warnings) 2014-12-04T02:27:23Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:27:25Z beach: |3b|: I don't understand your argument. 2014-12-04T02:27:50Z |3b|: beach: if the array weren't created right there, you couldn't be sure W and H are not nil 2014-12-04T02:28:10Z beach: |3b|: Sure, but I don't see how that justifies a warning. 2014-12-04T02:28:26Z |3b|: loop for x below NIL isn't valid 2014-12-04T02:28:41Z |3b|: and it is just a style warning 2014-12-04T02:28:45Z jumblerg joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:29:12Z White_Flame quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T02:29:26Z beach: Yeah, OK, but I still don't think it is justified. 2014-12-04T02:29:49Z beach: axion: Anyway, I can reproduce it when I have the default optimize settings. 2014-12-04T02:30:04Z beach: axion: What if you set the optimize levels like I have them? 2014-12-04T02:30:10Z beach: axion: Do you still get it then? 2014-12-04T02:30:13Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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Isn't that overkill? 2014-12-04T02:31:14Z vowyer_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:31:41Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:31:41Z frkout_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:32:00Z |3b|: looks like debug 2 makes it go away 2014-12-04T02:34:15Z frkout quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:34:24Z BitPuffin quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:34:34Z jleija joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:35:35Z axion: beach: my distro stopped upgrading sbcl at 1.2.2 but they provide the build script for 'their way' with patches and such. they want me to see if it builds the new version, because it hasn't been updated in 4 months 2014-12-04T02:35:49Z vowyer_ quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2014-12-04T02:35:57Z vowyer joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:36:14Z beach: Got it. 2014-12-04T02:36:30Z beach: jusss: Did you faint? 2014-12-04T02:36:54Z foom joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:37:02Z towodo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:37:44Z axion: indeed it fails to build some contrib modules 2014-12-04T02:38:14Z axion: or rather, only asdf 2014-12-04T02:39:13Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T02:43:50Z harish quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T02:45:03Z JuanDaugherty joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:49:31Z jusss: beach: http://paste.lisp.org/display/144570 2014-12-04T02:49:48Z beach: jusss: Excellent! 2014-12-04T02:50:26Z beach: jusss: So, what's the problem? 2014-12-04T02:50:28Z jusss: beach: I input it in lisp-mode 2014-12-04T02:50:33Z jusss: not slime 2014-12-04T02:50:34Z beach: Yes, good. 2014-12-04T02:50:50Z jusss: beach: print-atom2 undefined 2014-12-04T02:51:11Z beach: jusss: Yes, you put your two functions in the same file, and then you compile the entire file. 2014-12-04T02:53:03Z beach: jusss: Once you have your two functions in the file, you can type C-c C-k to compiler the entire file. 2014-12-04T02:53:45Z beach: "to compile" 2014-12-04T02:55:08Z blahzik quit (Quit: blahzik) 2014-12-04T02:56:16Z beach: jusss: You also need to give some feedback, such as "OK, I will try that" or "I think I will do that tomorrow" or "I have no idea what you are saying". Otherwise, we don't know whether you left or working or fainted or something else. 2014-12-04T02:56:30Z jusss: beach: in *slime-repl sbcl* press C-c C-k ? or *scratch* 2014-12-04T02:56:43Z beach: In the buffer where the functions are defined. 2014-12-04T02:57:05Z jusss: beach: sorry, my english is not good 2014-12-04T02:57:17Z henesy joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:57:44Z beach: jusss: Your English will improve over time. 2014-12-04T02:59:10Z jusss: beach: C-c C-k is not defined... 2014-12-04T02:59:34Z jusss: beach: I input two function in a function ,it's ok? 2014-12-04T02:59:49Z beach: jusss: Two functions in the same FILE. 2014-12-04T02:59:52Z cpc26_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T02:59:53Z beach: not in a function. 2014-12-04T02:59:59Z beach: Did you start SLIME? 2014-12-04T03:00:06Z jusss: beach: yes 2014-12-04T03:00:17Z cpc26 quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T03:00:23Z beach: Then C-c C-k should be defined. We need to find out why this is not the case. 2014-12-04T03:00:46Z beach: How did you install SLIME? 2014-12-04T03:01:26Z jusss: beach: I input the function is *slime-repl sbcl*,and press C-c C-k ,tip it's not defined 2014-12-04T03:01:40Z jusss: s/is/in 2014-12-04T03:02:05Z frkout_ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T03:02:07Z beach: jusss: No. Type the functions (both) in a buffer in Lisp mode. Not in the *slime-repl ..." buffer. 2014-12-04T03:02:19Z frkout joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:02:33Z beach: jusss: Then, in that same buffer where the functions are defined, type C-c C-k. 2014-12-04T03:03:09Z jusss: beach: get the master-slime.zip from github. and decompress it , config .emacs ,I'm using emacs 24 for windows, not cygwin 2014-12-04T03:03:22Z beach: Oh. 2014-12-04T03:03:32Z beach: You always want to use Quicklisp. 2014-12-04T03:04:06Z beach: After installing the Lisp system, use Quicklisp to install SLIME. 2014-12-04T03:04:17Z jusss: oh 2014-12-04T03:05:08Z beach: jusss: Can I assume you know about Quicklisp? 2014-12-04T03:05:28Z jusss: beach: I will search it 2014-12-04T03:05:49Z theos joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:05:51Z beach: jusss: There is a system in Quicklisp called (I think) quicklisp-slime-helper that will install SLIME for you. 2014-12-04T03:05:59Z kapil__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:06:29Z beach: jusss: When you install it, it gives you a few lines of code that you need to add to your Emacs startup file. I don't know Windows, so I don't know what it's called. 2014-12-04T03:06:39Z beach: On GNU/Linux, it is .emacs. 2014-12-04T03:08:04Z jusss: beach: I can't find quicklisp for win 2014-12-04T03:08:29Z beach: It is not OS dependent as far as I know. 2014-12-04T03:08:37Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:08:37Z beach: It is just Lisp code. 2014-12-04T03:08:48Z yuikov quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T03:08:55Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:08:55Z beach: http://www.cliki.net/quicklisp 2014-12-04T03:09:43Z Joreji quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T03:12:01Z jusss: I download the quicklisp.lisp, and how I can load it? which environment 2014-12-04T03:12:11Z jusss: emacs ? sbcl? 2014-12-04T03:12:18Z beach: sbcl. 2014-12-04T03:12:25Z beach: Start SBCL without SLIME. 2014-12-04T03:13:16Z beach: jusss: It is describe here: http://www.quicklisp.org/beta/ 2014-12-04T03:13:37Z jusss: yes, I load it in slime 2014-12-04T03:13:58Z beach: No, don't use SLIME to load it. 2014-12-04T03:14:08Z beach: Load it WITHOUT SLIME. 2014-12-04T03:14:14Z jusss: I see 2014-12-04T03:15:44Z towodo quit (Quit: towodo) 2014-12-04T03:16:12Z beach: The next thing (as that website says) to do is: (quicklisp-quickstart:install) 2014-12-04T03:16:21Z beach: But you can probably read that yourself now. 2014-12-04T03:16:30Z frkout quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T03:16:46Z jusss: I see 2014-12-04T03:16:57Z frkout joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:17:07Z beach: What you need next is to install SLIME: (ql:quickload "quicklisp-slime-helper") 2014-12-04T03:18:02Z beach: jusss: You will get a message saying something like: "Please add the following code to your Emacs startup file." 2014-12-04T03:19:22Z beach: jusss: I need to go away for half an hour or so. I think you have enough things to work with and try out. 2014-12-04T03:22:45Z Nilby joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:23:22Z jusss: I will try 2014-12-04T03:24:25Z joshe joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:26:17Z Nilby: Is there an normal idiom for defining accessors for a sub-object given the containing object? 2014-12-04T03:33:28Z nand1 quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T03:37:27Z vowyer quit (Quit: C-x C-c) 2014-12-04T03:38:03Z nand1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:43:36Z gendl_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:44:23Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:46:10Z yuikov quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T03:48:43Z beach: Nilby: If I understand you right, then just define such accessors explicitly with DEFGENERIC and DEFMETHOD. 2014-12-04T03:48:57Z c53100_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T03:50:45Z beach: Nilby: (defmethod offspring-names (person) (mapcar #'name (offsprings person))) 2014-12-04T03:52:27Z c53100 quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T03:52:58Z gendl_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T03:59:17Z pnpuff quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T03:59:25Z jusss: beach: I installed slime-helper by quicklisp, and config .emacs like it tips, start another emcas and M-x slime into *slime-repl sbcl* buffer,then press C-c C-k, still it's undefined 2014-12-04T04:00:26Z beach: You don't press C-c C-k in the *slime-repl ...* buffer. 2014-12-04T04:00:37Z beach: You press it in the buffer where the functions are defined. 2014-12-04T04:01:13Z beach: It should be a buffer in Lisp mode. 2014-12-04T04:03:25Z jusss: beach: in *scratch* buffer? 2014-12-04T04:03:27Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:03:31Z beach: No 2014-12-04T04:03:43Z beach: Load a file: C-x C-f stuff.lisp 2014-12-04T04:03:55Z beach: Now you have a buffer called stuff.lisp in Lisp mode. 2014-12-04T04:04:07Z Nilby: beach: Thank you. That's what I did, but I was just wonder if there was some customary way people do it. 2014-12-04T04:04:29Z beach: jusss: That buffer is associated with the file stuff.lisp. 2014-12-04T04:04:35Z Longlius joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:04:37Z PuercoPop: *scratch* is for emacs lisp code, you can get one for lisp code with M-x slime-scratch, but you can't C-c C-k (which is compile-file) if that buffer is not tied to a file. 2014-12-04T04:04:47Z beach: jusss: You now type your code in that buffer. 2014-12-04T04:05:22Z c53100_ quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:05:54Z beach: PuercoPop: Good point. 2014-12-04T04:06:25Z beach: jusss: Once you have your code in the buffer stuff.lisp, C-c C-k should work. 2014-12-04T04:06:35Z beach: If it doesn't, there is something else that is seriously wrong. 2014-12-04T04:07:08Z jusss: beach: yes,I got a file stuff.fasl 2014-12-04T04:07:15Z beach: Great! 2014-12-04T04:07:20Z beach: Now you are in business. 2014-12-04T04:07:34Z beach: The FASL is already loaded. 2014-12-04T04:07:42Z beach: (I think) 2014-12-04T04:07:45Z beach: Can't remember. 2014-12-04T04:08:18Z jusss: beach: yes 2014-12-04T04:08:21Z beach: jusss: I can't believe I am reading the SLIME manual for you. 2014-12-04T04:08:49Z beach: Yes, C-c C-k is slime-compile-and-load-file 2014-12-04T04:08:52Z jusss: beach: I can use print-atom directly now 2014-12-04T04:09:16Z beach: You should be able to test it from the *slime-repl...* buffer now. 2014-12-04T04:09:18Z Bike: you were talking to this person two hours ago before i fell asleep. 2014-12-04T04:09:28Z drmeister: beach: Hello - where's the HIR --> MIR transformation code? 2014-12-04T04:09:40Z beach: drmeister: It's not in there yet. 2014-12-04T04:09:50Z drmeister: How do you transform one graph into another one? 2014-12-04T04:10:03Z beach: drmeister: Because I haven't figured out how to make it implementation-configurable. 2014-12-04T04:10:28Z drmeister: Or if I wanted to modify some HIR nodes to add info to them - should I want to do that? 2014-12-04T04:10:41Z beach: You an do that if you want. 2014-12-04T04:10:57Z zacharias_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:11:06Z beach: drmeister: There should be a file called something like graph-transformations if you want to modify the graph. 2014-12-04T04:11:19Z jusss: beach: thanks 2014-12-04T04:11:28Z beach: jusss: All working now? 2014-12-04T04:11:35Z jusss: beach: yes 2014-12-04T04:11:39Z beach: Great! 2014-12-04T04:11:52Z beach: Bike: I consider it an investment in time. 2014-12-04T04:13:05Z beach: drmeister: And you can use CHANGE-CLASS on HIR nodes. 2014-12-04T04:13:06Z drmeister: Intermediate-representation/graph-modifications.lisp? 2014-12-04T04:13:11Z beach: Yeah. 2014-12-04T04:13:36Z beach: drmeister: Or you can define a subclass of a HIR node, and have COMPILE-AST generate that instead. 2014-12-04T04:13:37Z zacharias quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:14:29Z drmeister: CHANGE-CLASS - wow, you can do that in a graph? All of the links to that object remain valid? 2014-12-04T04:14:39Z beach: Yes. 2014-12-04T04:15:18Z beach: Some transformations I do will CHANGE-CLASS to NOP-INSTRUCTION. 2014-12-04T04:15:31Z beach: Then I have a general pass to remove all NOPs. 2014-12-04T04:15:54Z beach: ... rather than putting complex graph-changing code in each transformation. 2014-12-04T04:17:30Z jusss is now known as jusss-away 2014-12-04T04:17:41Z drmeister: My closed over environments at runtime are linked lists of vectors of objects. I refer to them using two integers, one to indicate how many links to follow and the second to indicate the index in the vector. 2014-12-04T04:18:00Z beach: Sounds reasonable. 2014-12-04T04:18:13Z drmeister: Straight out of L.I.S.P. 2014-12-04T04:18:36Z beach: Yes, great book. Especially the English verson. 2014-12-04T04:18:40Z beach: version. 2014-12-04T04:18:53Z dagnachew quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1) 2014-12-04T04:20:21Z drmeister prefers it in it's original Klingon. 2014-12-04T04:20:43Z drmeister: its its its damn it. 2014-12-04T04:21:07Z drmeister: My right little finger has a mind of it's own 2014-12-04T04:21:08Z beach: minion: Thwap for drmeister. 2014-12-04T04:21:08Z minion: drmeister: have a look at Thwap: THWAP! http://www.angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif and http://www.angryflower.com/itsits.gif (see also: http://www.unmutual.info/misc/sb_itsits.mp3 ) 2014-12-04T04:22:16Z drmeister: I get Thwapd every other week. 2014-12-04T04:22:37Z beach: Here? Oh, didn't know. Sorry. 2014-12-04T04:23:59Z beach: drmeister: Today, I will work on the local SPECIAL declarations. 2014-12-04T04:24:10Z beach: drmeister: LET and LET* have the same problem. 2014-12-04T04:24:19Z drmeister: Excellent. 2014-12-04T04:25:31Z bb010g joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:25:35Z beach: If you want to start playing with HIR-to-MIR, think that there will be a function HIR-TO-MIR that takes and INSTRUCTION and an object representing the implementation. 2014-12-04T04:25:55Z beach: Each implementation supplies methods for CAR-INSTRUCTION, etc. 2014-12-04T04:25:57Z zmisc quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:26:02Z zmisc2 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:26:19Z beach: They turn those instructions into instances of the ones you find in the MIR directory. 2014-12-04T04:26:19Z lyanchih_ quit (Quit: lyanchih_) 2014-12-04T04:26:27Z drmeister: I was more curious how you transform one graph into another. I thought maybe I should transform the HIR into my own MIR before I lower it to LLVM-IR. 2014-12-04T04:26:28Z beach: Like memory reference and such. 2014-12-04T04:26:46Z beach: Yeah, you probably should. 2014-12-04T04:27:04Z beach: I was just telling you so that you can do it in a way that is compatible with what Cleavir will do. 2014-12-04T04:27:19Z drmeister: Right! When in doubt... add another level of indirection. 2014-12-04T04:27:50Z kushal joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:28:06Z beach: To transform the graph, use the operations INSERT-INSTRUCTION..., CHANGE-CLASS, etc. 2014-12-04T04:28:45Z drmeister: Does every HIR node get transformed? 2014-12-04T04:28:50Z beach: No 2014-12-04T04:28:55Z drmeister: Ah - good. 2014-12-04T04:29:06Z beach: Not ASSIGNMENT for instance. 2014-12-04T04:29:48Z beach: Not ENTER of FUNCALL either in this step. 2014-12-04T04:31:33Z Nilby quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:31:50Z protist joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:32:03Z drmeister: Good, I was thinking I might want to insert one instruction right under ENTER to allocate a frame if there is a set of closed over bindings that are needed by an inner function. 2014-12-04T04:32:20Z drmeister: Does that sound sensible? 2014-12-04T04:32:35Z beach: Let me think... 2014-12-04T04:32:47Z drmeister: a frame on the heap. 2014-12-04T04:33:03Z beach: Yes, I think you are right. 2014-12-04T04:33:35Z drmeister: Each function would generated at most one frame on the heap. 2014-12-04T04:33:43Z beach: And then you need to turn references to such variables into memory references. 2014-12-04T04:34:47Z drmeister: Yeah - I would use two integers (depth,index) to indicate the specific binding. 2014-12-04T04:35:23Z beach: That will have to be made explicit, unless you do it as a function call. 2014-12-04T04:35:44Z beach: I guess you can turn it into a function call first, and optimize later. 2014-12-04T04:35:46Z drmeister: I'm not sure what you mean by explicit 2014-12-04T04:36:14Z beach: load environment from memory, check index, if 0, access the vector, if not, loop. 2014-12-04T04:36:59Z drmeister: I see. 2014-12-04T04:37:17Z beach: MIR is supposed to be abstracted operations that can be executed in one instruction on must computers. The operation on the static runtime environment is not such an operation. 2014-12-04T04:37:22Z s00pcan quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:37:56Z zmisc2 is now known as zmisc 2014-12-04T04:38:01Z beach: So either you make a MIR loop that does the job, or else you call a function. 2014-12-04T04:38:28Z bgs100 quit (Quit: bgs100) 2014-12-04T04:38:34Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:40:44Z beach: If you do a MIR loop, then the register allocator might be able to cache some frame references or sublists in registers or on the stack. 2014-12-04T04:41:18Z drmeister: I could hard-code it as well. Every function would have a pointer to its closed-over runtime environment. I call it a RENV. Binding (0,1) would mean (aref RENV 1). Binding (3,1) would be (aref (parent (parent (parent RENV))) 1) 2014-12-04T04:41:55Z beach: True. 2014-12-04T04:42:00Z Harag joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:42:06Z beach: No loop should be required. My bad. 2014-12-04T04:43:19Z BitPuffin quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:43:20Z beach: Ultimately, what I want to do is to turn those PARENT operations into cache-able memory references. 2014-12-04T04:43:46Z drmeister: So I could transform each reference to each binding as an input or an output into something like (aref (parent RENV) 2) 2014-12-04T04:43:54Z beach: Then the global value numbering algorithm will eliminate duplicates. 2014-12-04T04:44:27Z beach: Yes, that should work. 2014-12-04T04:44:34Z drmeister: What is a cache-able memory reference? 2014-12-04T04:44:35Z beach: But it would have to be expressed in MIR. 2014-12-04T04:44:53Z beach: drmeister: One that doesn't have to be reloaded each time, because it is always the same. 2014-12-04T04:45:36Z beach: Taking the parent of the runtime environment is a memory load, but it will always give the same result. 2014-12-04T04:45:54Z beach: But the global value numbering algorithm doesn't "know" that. 2014-12-04T04:46:12Z beach: It must assume that some other thread might change the contents at any time. 2014-12-04T04:46:18Z drmeister: But these frames are on the heap, they could be anywhere and they can move. 2014-12-04T04:46:36Z drmeister: The garbage collector will be moving them around. 2014-12-04T04:46:39Z s00pcan joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:46:41Z beach: If they move, the GC should update the register that points to them. 2014-12-04T04:47:36Z drmeister: Hmm, actually pointers on the stack pin objects on the heap. 2014-12-04T04:47:40Z beach: If your GC can't do that, you just don't generate cache-able memory refernces. 2014-12-04T04:47:43Z beach: references. 2014-12-04T04:48:28Z drmeister: I'm still not sure what a cache-able memory reference is - it sounds valuable though. 2014-12-04T04:49:05Z beach: It is a memory reference that is guaranteed to load the same value, given the same address. 2014-12-04T04:49:50Z beach: Easy enough? 2014-12-04T04:50:31Z beach: Accessing memory is slow, so if you have several such memory accesses, the global value numbering algorithm can eliminate most of them. 2014-12-04T04:50:51Z beach: It will access memory once, and then keep the value in a register. 2014-12-04T04:51:09Z jlongster joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:51:14Z beach: Normally, accessing the parent of the runtime environment is such an operation. 2014-12-04T04:51:24Z drmeister: Yes, it sounds easy, but I'm missing the point. 2014-12-04T04:51:29Z beach: Once the runtime environment is created, its structure doesn't change. 2014-12-04T04:51:35Z jlongster quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T04:51:37Z drmeister: Yes, I get that. 2014-12-04T04:51:56Z beach: What part of "accessing memory is expensive" do you not understand? :) 2014-12-04T04:52:14Z drmeister: The structure being the number of entries at each level and the number of levels. The actual vectors will move around but all the pointers will be updated. 2014-12-04T04:52:36Z beach: Normally, yes. 2014-12-04T04:52:52Z drmeister: No, I understand that accessing memory is very expensive. 2014-12-04T04:53:13Z beach: So compare (+ (aref (parent (parent (parent RENV))) 1) (aref (parent (parent (parent RENV))) 2) to.. 2014-12-04T04:53:33Z beach: (let ((temp (parent (parent (parent RENV))))) (+ (aref temp 1) (aref temp 2))) 2014-12-04T04:54:10Z drl_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T04:54:19Z drmeister: Ohhhh, now I see... now it's clear... I was blind but now I see... 2014-12-04T04:54:28Z beach: Whew! 2014-12-04T04:54:57Z vhost- quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T04:55:46Z drmeister: So calculate the absolute address of each closed-over-runtime-environment binding like (3,2) into a register and then use that register/absolute address as long as the function is alive? 2014-12-04T04:56:42Z beach: Yes, but normally it will be automatic. Just generate the memory reference each time, and the global value numbering algorithm will do the rest. 2014-12-04T04:56:52Z drmeister: Or just address of the start of each RENV level - put that in a register and reference into it with the second index. 2014-12-04T04:57:12Z drmeister: What's the global value numbering algorithm and where can I get one? 2014-12-04T04:57:38Z beach: I will implement a few in Cleavir. 2014-12-04T04:57:50Z beach: It's part of the MIR optimization package. 2014-12-04T04:57:54Z drmeister: It will happened after HIR though. 2014-12-04T04:58:03Z beach: Yes, at the MIR level. 2014-12-04T04:58:18Z drmeister: What does it do? 2014-12-04T04:58:30Z drmeister: Numbers global values? 2014-12-04T04:59:09Z beach: It identifies computations that have already been done, and lets you eliminate most of them by keeping the result of the first one in a register. 2014-12-04T04:59:52Z beach: You can Google for "global value numbering" and "partial redundancy elimination" 2014-12-04T05:01:05Z beach: drmeister: It is great if you want to learn about stuff like that, but I definitely intend to supply those transformations in Cleavir. 2014-12-04T05:02:55Z splittist_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:03:22Z beach: drmeister: Actually, LLVM should have them too. 2014-12-04T05:03:43Z _8hzp joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:02Z rk[1]_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:06Z tokenrov1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:14Z Borbus_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z drmeister: Ah. I think I implemented something like that in my automatic differentiation code. 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z drmeister: So you apply that to HIR? 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z grungier quit (Excess Flood) 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z drmeister: This all sounds very useful. I hope you implement the general HIR->MIR conversion scheme soon. I'd love to use some of that. 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z splittist quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z hzp`fi quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T05:04:46Z tokenrove quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:47Z yorick quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:47Z rk[1] quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:47Z oconnore quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:47Z Borbus quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:47Z farhaven quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:04:49Z oconnore joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:49Z yorick_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:04:53Z splittist_ is now known as splittist 2014-12-04T05:04:54Z ivan\ quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:05:13Z beach: It is all in MIR. 2014-12-04T05:05:22Z vlnx quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:05:22Z killmaster quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:05:22Z finnrobi quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:05:33Z beach: drmeister: Memory references and address calculations must be explicit for it to work well. 2014-12-04T05:05:34Z killmaster joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:05:56Z finnrobi joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:06:15Z beach: drmeister: I am afraid I can't do everything immediately. 2014-12-04T05:06:33Z lg188_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:06:51Z j0ni_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:06:52Z farhaven joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:07:20Z beach vanishes for half an hour or so. 2014-12-04T05:08:04Z GR: :( 2014-12-04T05:08:56Z hyoyoung_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z lg188 quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z alchemis7 quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z drmeister: http://llvm.org/docs/Passes.html#gvn-global-value-numbering 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z j0ni quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z drmeister: So if you have the same set of instructions in different places in the functions code, this optimization will remove all but one and put the result in a register? 2014-12-04T05:09:24Z hyoyoung quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:10:12Z vhost- joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:10:14Z oconnore quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:10:16Z araujo quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:11:00Z alchemis7 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:11:09Z ivan\ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:12:13Z araujo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:13:09Z vlnx joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:13:17Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2014-12-04T05:13:22Z lyanchih joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:14:06Z salv0 quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T05:14:11Z oconnore joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:15:10Z salv0 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:16:22Z grungier joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:20:01Z jasom: drmeister: that's the basic idea of GVN; same idea as CSE 2014-12-04T05:21:05Z blahzik joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:25:19Z mishoo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T05:29:12Z chu quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T05:29:37Z blahzik quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 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#lisp 2014-12-04T09:34:32Z ist157: thanks! 2014-12-04T09:34:37Z ist157 left #lisp 2014-12-04T09:35:36Z Harag1 quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T09:39:21Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:42:38Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T09:43:58Z Harag joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:45:46Z lg188_ quit (Quit: Reconnecting) 2014-12-04T09:45:53Z lg188 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:46:24Z vinleod quit (Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]) 2014-12-04T09:46:48Z zacharias joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:46:52Z zacharias quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T09:46:52Z zacharias joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:47:28Z kuanyui joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:49:20Z munksgaard quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T09:49:53Z oudeis quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2014-12-04T09:50:11Z Harag1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:51:21Z jusss joined #lisp 2014-12-04T09:51:29Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-12-04T09:52:34Z Zag quit (Disconnected by services) 2014-12-04T09:58:39Z Lowl3v3l quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T10:02:32Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:05:03Z pjb: axion: you should also use paredit, which helps a lot in maintaining a correct indentation why typing new code. (along its other structural editing features). 2014-12-04T10:05:33Z pjb: s/axion/jusss/ sorry. 2014-12-04T10:06:04Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:07:28Z pt1_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:08:12Z pt1_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:08:29Z pt1 quit (Read error: No route to host) 2014-12-04T10:08:38Z pt1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:12:10Z jusss: pjb: paredit is editor? 2014-12-04T10:14:06Z fridim_ quit (Read error: No route to host) 2014-12-04T10:14:28Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:15:05Z gabriel_laddel joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:15:20Z oudeis joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:15:23Z splittist: jusss: paredit is a mode for emacs. http://www.emacswiki.org/ParEdit 2014-12-04T10:15:55Z fridim_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:16:08Z jusss: splittist: i see 2014-12-04T10:16:45Z lyanchih quit (Quit: lyanchih) 2014-12-04T10:17:53Z splittist: jusss: this is a better link http://danmidwood.com/content/2014/11/21/animated-paredit.html 2014-12-04T10:20:21Z Cymew joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:22:36Z psy_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:22:39Z pt1_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:22:39Z pt1_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:22:39Z pt1 quit (Read error: No route to host) 2014-12-04T10:22:54Z rivrkeepr joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:23:05Z pt1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:23:34Z echo-area quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:24:42Z jewel: paredit is fantastic 2014-12-04T10:29:09Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:29:09Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T10:29:09Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:30:38Z robot-beethoven quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2014-12-04T10:30:44Z loke_ quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T10:35:13Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:36:49Z ggole joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:40:57Z drdanmaku quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2014-12-04T10:41:12Z someon is now known as someone 2014-12-04T10:45:27Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-12-04T10:45:34Z kcj joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:46:22Z przl joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:46:46Z chu joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:46:52Z chu quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T10:46:52Z chu joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:47:05Z adlai: clhs examples for restart-case have the :interactive function calling (format t ...); shouldn't it be using *query-io* ? 2014-12-04T10:47:18Z pjb: Yes, it would be better. 2014-12-04T10:47:28Z mrpanda joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:47:43Z pjb: Also, remember to call finish-output before read or read-line :-) 2014-12-04T10:49:03Z hiato joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:49:10Z pjb: adlai: you could write a query-io stream with gray-streams, that would display a window with output, and get user interaction for input, closing the window upon validation. Then you could notice the breakage of a lot of libraries… 2014-12-04T10:50:13Z mrpanda left #lisp 2014-12-04T10:52:14Z splittist: are there a lot of libraries that use query-io (and make assumptions about an impoverished unix-like version of such)? 2014-12-04T10:52:47Z nee joined #lisp 2014-12-04T10:52:57Z pjb: I don't think so. I believe I'm the only one to use *query-io* for interactive queries. 2014-12-04T10:58:51Z maxpeck quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T10:59:12Z adlai: pjb: https://github.com/slime/slime/pull/204 2014-12-04T11:00:09Z pjb: I would use :junk-allowed nil 2014-12-04T11:00:23Z pjb: Ah, it's the default, ok. :-) 2014-12-04T11:00:40Z munksgaard joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:01:30Z pjb: beware that tagbody returns nil 2014-12-04T11:01:31Z adlai is making it default to (1+ port), because that's what he does manually 2014-12-04T11:02:02Z pjb: Yes, you could add a restart use-next-port :-) 2014-12-04T11:05:52Z jussss joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:05:57Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:06:46Z maxpeck joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:06:52Z maxpeck quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T11:06:52Z maxpeck joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:07:56Z jusss quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:10:10Z Harag1 quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:11:11Z psy_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:11:38Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:11:53Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T11:11:53Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:13:01Z schaueho joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:16:41Z JuanDaugherty quit (Quit: Hibernate, etc.) 2014-12-04T11:18:09Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-12-04T11:20:24Z corni joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:26:03Z tharugrim quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2014-12-04T11:27:03Z tharugrim joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:27:33Z hiyosi joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:30:26Z EvW joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:31:43Z chu quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2014-12-04T11:32:12Z jussss quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:34:11Z wjiang quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T11:34:25Z kuanyui quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:35:07Z adlai: luis, pjb: https://github.com/slime/slime/pull/204#commits-pushed-fd51fee 2014-12-04T11:42:49Z BitPuffin quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:45:03Z Shinmera quit (Quit: しつれいしなければならないんです。) 2014-12-04T11:45:21Z EvW quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T11:45:29Z EvW1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:46:36Z wchun quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T11:47:39Z bullone_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:48:15Z yuikov quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T11:54:59Z lifenoodles quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:55:01Z luis: adlai: socket-quest, eheh 2014-12-04T11:55:52Z luis: adlai: that looks good! does it work? :) 2014-12-04T11:56:09Z adlai: luis: it works, although I just noticed that I forgot to rebase, so please hang on a minute... 2014-12-04T11:56:17Z przl quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T11:56:46Z adlai: ok, it should be a fast-forward now 2014-12-04T11:57:03Z gabc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T11:57:46Z luis: adlai: extra points if you add a ChangeLog entry! 2014-12-04T11:57:52Z adlai: ah 2014-12-04T11:58:45Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T12:00:18Z lifenoodles joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:02:18Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:03:58Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:05:11Z przl joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:05:13Z pt1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:06:17Z Beetny quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:11:46Z c53100 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:16:16Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:18:59Z BaconOverflow joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:20:30Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:21:41Z pnpuff_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:25:06Z pnpuff quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:27:16Z corni quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:27:18Z Harag joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:27:42Z psy_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T12:29:11Z pnpuff_ is now known as pnpuff 2014-12-04T12:31:53Z rivrkeepr quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T12:32:08Z pnpuff_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:34:48Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:35:17Z pnpuff quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:37:42Z hiato quit (Quit: The great inequality of life: nothing > money) 2014-12-04T12:44:10Z luis wants a "fast-forward merge" button in GitHub :) 2014-12-04T12:45:44Z ConstantineXVI joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:47:14Z luis: adlai: do you know about "C-x 4 a"? (just checking) 2014-12-04T12:47:39Z adlai does now 2014-12-04T12:47:54Z luis: aka M-x add-change-log-entry-other-window 2014-12-04T12:48:02Z luis: it does all the hard work for you 2014-12-04T12:49:07Z adlai: although it's amazing what a kill ring and kmacro-edit-lossage can do in a pinch 2014-12-04T12:49:47Z c53100 quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T12:54:34Z kuanyui joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:55:04Z luis: That function is keen on telling me that I use the mouse one click too much! 2014-12-04T12:55:58Z resttime quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T12:56:18Z resttime joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:56:40Z adlai: luis: https://github.com/slime/slime/pull/204/files#diff-0 2014-12-04T12:56:47Z Lowl3v3l quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T12:56:48Z kcj quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T12:57:11Z Lowl3v3l joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:57:45Z towodo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:58:08Z luis: damn, that's a big ChangeLog 2014-12-04T12:58:14Z luis: okey, thanks :) 2014-12-04T12:58:33Z doki-worry joined #lisp 2014-12-04T12:59:02Z tokenrov1 is now known as tokenrove 2014-12-04T12:59:20Z luis: merged! 2014-12-04T13:00:04Z adlai: :D 2014-12-04T13:00:24Z mvilleneuve joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:01:36Z resttime quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T13:01:41Z drl quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:01:59Z resttime joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:02:07Z drl_ quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:07:15Z towodo quit (Quit: towodo) 2014-12-04T13:07:46Z thawes joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:11:19Z adlai: http://paste.lisp.org/+33JW 2014-12-04T13:11:40Z hitecnologys_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:11:55Z Xach: So Many Swanks 2014-12-04T13:12:14Z julianb joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:14:32Z hitecnologys quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:14:32Z hitecnologys_ is now known as hitecnologys 2014-12-04T13:14:35Z _5kg_ quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:15:29Z pnpuff_ quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:15:34Z doki-worry quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:15:55Z psy_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:21:30Z JuanDaugherty joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:21:31Z eudoxia joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:22:41Z yorick_ is now known as yorick 2014-12-04T13:23:22Z necronian quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:23:31Z luis: minion: chant! 2014-12-04T13:23:31Z minion: MORE SWANKS 2014-12-04T13:25:54Z necronian joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:29:22Z henesy quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:36:29Z hugod quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:38:59Z jusss joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:39:54Z TDog quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:44:10Z Shinmera joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:46:46Z pranavrc quit 2014-12-04T13:47:46Z joast quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-12-04T13:48:21Z dxtr quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T13:51:25Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:53:42Z davazp joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:54:00Z loke_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:54:49Z davazp quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T13:56:22Z bullone_ quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2014-12-04T13:56:29Z davazp joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:57:58Z eschulte joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:58:15Z _5kg_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T13:59:25Z eschulte: Anyone know if swig has cffi interface files for C++ std libraries? I don't see any in my swig 3.0.2 install but I'm hoping (praying) that some exist somewhere... 2014-12-04T14:00:12Z eudoxia: i very much doubt it 2014-12-04T14:00:25Z eudoxia: oGMo: how's cl-autowrap for c++ coming along? cc eschulte 2014-12-04T14:01:01Z eschulte: That looks like a nice option, but sadly being LLVM-only makes it unusable for me 2014-12-04T14:01:08Z julianb quit (Quit: Goodbye) 2014-12-04T14:01:13Z eschulte: also, I didn't see mention of C++ in the README 2014-12-04T14:01:43Z eudoxia: well, being LLVM-only guarantees a bug-free parser that won't choke on obscure things 2014-12-04T14:02:14Z Denommus joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:02:14Z eschulte: yeah, I fully understand the design decisions, just regret the consequences for me personally :) 2014-12-04T14:02:37Z eudoxia: yeah llvm-anything is a pain 2014-12-04T14:03:09Z yeticry quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T14:03:16Z Denommus quit (Client Quit) 2014-12-04T14:03:35Z jewel quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T14:05:21Z yeticry joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:05:51Z resttime quit (Quit: resttime) 2014-12-04T14:06:05Z hugod joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:07:41Z yrk joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:07:48Z gravicappa joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:08:10Z yrk quit (Changing host) 2014-12-04T14:08:11Z yrk joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:09:11Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:09:25Z Denommus joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:09:53Z joast joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:11:00Z davazp quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2014-12-04T14:11:23Z hiyosi quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com) 2014-12-04T14:11:50Z dxtr joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:13:10Z sol__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:13:59Z _leb joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:17:17Z rick-monster joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:18:33Z Xach: I think there will be a number of projects temporarily dropped from Quicklisp this month 2014-12-04T14:18:39Z Xach: Hopefully temporarily. 2014-12-04T14:19:35Z hzp`co`uk: lazy slackers neglecting their projects? 2014-12-04T14:19:53Z hzp`co`uk: (how afraid should I be right now?) 2014-12-04T14:20:11Z Xach: I'm not sure. I think the russian github block might be involved, partly. 2014-12-04T14:20:32Z eudoxia: that was only a few days ago though 2014-12-04T14:21:19Z Xach: I reported bugs a few days ago 2014-12-04T14:22:06Z s00pcan quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T14:22:40Z rick-monster: ha - just fired up my looping midi sequencer project for first time using CCL on a little ARM device on my lunchbreak 2014-12-04T14:24:07Z przl quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2014-12-04T14:25:25Z s00pcan joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:26:56Z drdanmaku joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:27:23Z shortCircuit__ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T14:28:09Z usrj joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:28:40Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:30:57Z josemanuel joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:32:42Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:33:21Z xaaabk joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:34:05Z hiyosi joined #lisp 2014-12-04T14:34:08Z _leb quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com) 2014-12-04T14:35:52Z przl joined #lisp 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seconds) 2014-12-04T16:18:57Z gigetoo quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:18:57Z ssake quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:18:57Z Fade quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:18:57Z wormphlegm quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:18:57Z Anarch quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:19:10Z gigetoo_ is now known as gigetoo 2014-12-04T16:20:03Z nydel quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T16:20:56Z yuikov quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T16:20:56Z kalzz joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:21:59Z redeemed quit (Quit: q) 2014-12-04T16:22:08Z hiato joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:22:38Z chameco quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:22:46Z dxtr joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:22:48Z chameco joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:24:39Z Alfr quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T16:27:54Z jasom: hmm I'm trying to find the CLHS referrence for the fact that it's illegal to rebind symbols in the common-lisp package 2014-12-04T16:28:53Z |3b|`` joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:29:08Z oudeis joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:29:40Z ggole: It might be linked from 2014-12-04T16:29:42Z ggole: clhs shadow 2014-12-04T16:29:42Z specbot: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_shadow.htm 2014-12-04T16:30:38Z c74d quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T16:30:48Z ggole: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/11_abab.htm 2014-12-04T16:31:00Z BaconOverflow quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2014-12-04T16:31:04Z ConstantineXVI quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:31:32Z jasom: ggole: thanks 2014-12-04T16:32:10Z innertracks joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:33:43Z atgreen quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2014-12-04T16:34:22Z Joreji joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:39:00Z Denommus` quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T16:39:24Z Alexandre joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:39:42Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T16:41:16Z Alexandre quit (Client Quit) 2014-12-04T16:47:15Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 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2014-12-04T17:08:04Z bullone_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:08:08Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:09:51Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T17:10:37Z K1rk_ quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:11:18Z bullone_ is now known as bullone 2014-12-04T17:11:30Z blahzik joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:12:18Z beach joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:12:25Z beach: Good evening everyone! 2014-12-04T17:12:40Z hlavaty: good evening 2014-12-04T17:12:45Z gabc: Hello 2014-12-04T17:12:58Z gravicappa quit (*.net *.split) 2014-12-04T17:13:05Z hlavaty: ok iterate from darcs works, only that tarball was obsolete 2014-12-04T17:13:26Z splittist: Good evening, beach! 2014-12-04T17:15:34Z Xach: jasom: there's a handy mnemonic: "when binding cl symbols, is what you wanna do, don't for-get about 11.1.2.1.2!" i guess it's more of a jingle than a mnemonic. 2014-12-04T17:16:04Z beach: gabc: Are you new here or did you just change your nick? 2014-12-04T17:16:11Z blahzik quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:16:13Z gabc: I change my nick. 2014-12-04T17:16:28Z K1rk joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:16:36Z beach: drmeister: Around? 2014-12-04T17:16:41Z gabc: Zag was taken, and I never really put a though about it. Until yesterday, where the dude came and wasn't happy about it :D 2014-12-04T17:17:09Z drmeister: beach: Yeah - but I have to run to teach a class in a few minutes. 2014-12-04T17:17:32Z beach: drmeister: OK, we'll talk after I have had dinner, watched TV, and slept. 2014-12-04T17:17:50Z tharugrim quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:19:02Z tharugrim joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:19:03Z bullone quit (Quit: Updating details, brb) 2014-12-04T17:19:33Z drmeister: I pulled your updates and I've set up code to make it easier to generate HIR from my source code and pause at any point and run tests, generate/display the graphviz graphs etc. 2014-12-04T17:19:50Z Bike: hee, you should have disassemble show a graph. 2014-12-04T17:19:53Z bullone joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:19:55Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T17:20:03Z beach: drmeister: Great. 2014-12-04T17:20:27Z beach: Bike: Nice idea! 2014-12-04T17:20:32Z drmeister: Bike: I'm going to do that - I'll add options to generate all intermediate forms and graphs. 2014-12-04T17:20:43Z drmeister: Thanks. 2014-12-04T17:21:22Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:22:07Z protist quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2014-12-04T17:22:14Z drmeister: I set it up so I can stick :pause-hir in my source code as a top level form and it will put the most recent form, ast and HIR in *form*, *ast*, and *hir*. 2014-12-04T17:22:43Z beach: Yeah, I can see how that would be helpful. 2014-12-04T17:23:22Z beach: drmeister: I believe I fixed the issues. I also reworked the code for turning LET and LET* into ASTs. I might have introduced some other problems, of course. 2014-12-04T17:23:38Z drmeister: No sweat - I'll check it out. 2014-12-04T17:23:40Z mishoo quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:23:48Z drmeister: I think we have a system going here. 2014-12-04T17:23:56Z beach: Looks that way. 2014-12-04T17:25:47Z mindCrime joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:25:59Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:26:44Z beach: What I need to do is to define a subclass of standard-class, then put a method on INTIALIZE-INSTANCE for that class that removes the accessor specifications before calling the next method, and instead add those accessors explicitly. 2014-12-04T17:27:12Z bb010g quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2014-12-04T17:27:41Z przl quit (Quit: leaving) 2014-12-04T17:27:44Z beach: These are bootstrapping issues. Those are always fun. 2014-12-04T17:28:36Z beach: The fun thing here is that the subclass in question will be called ... standard-class, because it will be in a different first-class global environment. 2014-12-04T17:29:53Z EvW joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:30:45Z splittist: can you know what the accessor specifications are? Or are you only interested in removing those you'll replace? (The latter, presumably.) 2014-12-04T17:30:49Z radioninja quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:30:51Z jdz: Xach: that mnemonic reminded me of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6jnFbcu85c 2014-12-04T17:31:16Z jasom: Xach: hah, I like it 2014-12-04T17:31:34Z Natch quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T17:31:35Z beach: splittist: It is straightforward. The argument :direct-slots is a list of canonical slot specifications, so the format is well known. 2014-12-04T17:32:03Z beach: I need to capture all of them I think, which is also the easiest thing to do. 2014-12-04T17:32:17Z oudeis quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2014-12-04T17:33:08Z beach: If I let the normal INITIALIZE-INSTANCE method do it, it would create generic functions with names in the host global environment. I need to make sure they create them in the target first-class global environment. 2014-12-04T17:33:16Z zacharias joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:33:46Z beach: ... and, yes, I use an Emacs abbrev "fcge" for first-class global environments. 2014-12-04T17:35:20Z splittist: (: 2014-12-04T17:35:57Z Joreji quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T17:37:56Z Joreji joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:38:10Z splittist: beach: do you need to do the same for reinitialize-instance? 2014-12-04T17:39:10Z beach: I don't think so, because this stuff is only for phase 1 of bootstrapping. Once I get to phase 2, I should be able to use the SICL CLOS implementation fully. 2014-12-04T17:39:15Z Pixel_Outlaw joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:41:57Z jasom: Is it possible to tell ASDF to dynamically bind a value for compilation of a file? 2014-12-04T17:42:08Z Pixel_Outlaw left #lisp 2014-12-04T17:42:24Z beach: Time to go fix dinner. 2014-12-04T17:42:27Z beach left #lisp 2014-12-04T17:43:10Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2014-12-04T17:45:23Z zacharias quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T17:45:29Z loz joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:46:01Z Denommus joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:48:05Z ghard joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:48:43Z genii joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:51:46Z hiyosi joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:56:04Z kanru joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:56:56Z harish joined #lisp 2014-12-04T17:57:07Z harish quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T18:00:39Z kanru quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:06:30Z joneshf-laptop quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T18:13:56Z goglosh joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:15:11Z Denommus quit (Quit: reboot) 2014-12-04T18:17:50Z drewc: jasom: :around-compile ? 2014-12-04T18:17:50Z minion: drewc, memo from dlowe: your smug documentation is woefully outdated 2014-12-04T18:19:26Z sword` joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:22:32Z Natch joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:22:48Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:23:00Z sword quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:25:24Z pt1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:25:54Z mishoo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:27:13Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:31:49Z zmisc quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:36:46Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:37:13Z EvW joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:38:20Z rtra quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T18:41:05Z william3 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T18:43:23Z rtra joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:44:14Z MoALTz joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:44:30Z drewc: dlowe: given that my documentation is all in doc and the most recent commit 'till now was "Dec 2, 2014", I might say you are completely wrong. However since you left that memo, I added a "[[file:doc/tutorial.org][tutorial.org]]" link. 2014-12-04T18:44:40Z zmisc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:45:11Z dlowe: README.txt says "see smug.org" 2014-12-04T18:45:11Z oudeis joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:45:40Z drewc: yup. 2014-12-04T18:45:59Z Denommus joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:46:02Z zacharias joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:46:05Z dlowe: I looked at smug.org. It was wrong. 2014-12-04T18:46:11Z drewc: and I added a "[[file:doc/tutorial.org][tutorial.org]]" l 2014-12-04T18:46:16Z drewc: so, again ... 2014-12-04T18:46:27Z drewc: " given that my documentation is all in doc and the most recent commit 'till now was "Dec 2, 2014", I might say you are completely wrong. However since you left that memo, I added a "[[file:doc/tutorial.org][tutorial.org]]" link." 2014-12-04T18:47:03Z drewc: If you that link i not enough, well, I suggest looking elsewhere for docs :) 2014-12-04T18:47:11Z drewc: s/i/is 2014-12-04T18:47:21Z drewc glares at keyboard 2014-12-04T18:47:37Z dlowe: seems like an unnecessary level of redirection is all. 2014-12-04T18:47:55Z dlowe: but it's not wrong now. 2014-12-04T18:48:35Z dlowe: though I still couldn't figure out how to get from old smug to new smug. 2014-12-04T18:48:49Z drewc: ok, how about I get rid of smug.org, readme.txt, and never document anything beyond the tutorial.org? does that make sense to you? 2014-12-04T18:48:57Z rhllor joined #lisp 2014-12-04T18:51:32Z drewc: OR: or have not use or worked on 'old smug' since like early 2011 and it was never released.. if you have an issue with defining functions that you use from old smug via (defun =old () (.new)) ... let me know the problems. 2014-12-04T18:52:49Z dlowe: I didn't mean to offend, and it was only for that dumb printf library, which at one time worked with the smug bundled with quicklisp. 2014-12-04T18:53:22Z drewc: which smug, which quicklisp, when? 2014-12-04T18:53:44Z drewc: (I have never released it) 2014-12-04T18:53:51Z Xach: smug from quicklisp is from github.com/drewc/smug 2014-12-04T18:54:13Z drewc: Xach: from when? 2014-12-04T18:54:23Z Xach: master, monthly 2014-12-04T18:54:23Z drewc: and from the master branch? 2014-12-04T18:55:25Z drewc: Xach: how about I release it, make a release branch that works and is supported... will you use that rather than master? 2014-12-04T18:55:42Z hiato quit (Quit: The great inequality of life: nothing > money) 2014-12-04T18:55:50Z Xach: Sure. 2014-12-04T18:56:46Z Xach: I https://github.com/quicklisp/quicklisp-projects/issues/173 is the issue Fade opened to request smug. 2014-12-04T18:58:10Z rhllor quit (Quit: rhllor) 2014-12-04T18:58:18Z drewc: Xach: thanks! 2014-12-04T18:59:54Z drewc: 8th of june 2011 ... makes sense. A week later I was in the hospital for 2 months and it rehab for 6 months... no coding involved. 2014-12-04T19:00:02Z drewc: s/it/in 2014-12-04T19:00:09Z drewc glares at himself 2014-12-04T19:01:08Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T19:02:04Z drewc: Xach: I take it I have 'till 2015 to make the release? OR: what is the deadline? 2014-12-04T19:02:28Z Xach: drewc: I am going to make a new dist update on Sunday. 2014-12-04T19:02:37Z Xach: I try to do an update on the first weekend of each month. 2014-12-04T19:02:41Z Xach: Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. 2014-12-04T19:03:15Z drewc: Xach: damn you! The busiest time of my life has been this week and now I have just added more tasks! 2014-12-04T19:03:19Z drewc: :P 2014-12-04T19:03:50Z Xach: (ql:who-depends-on "smug") => nil 2014-12-04T19:03:54Z Xach: I could also just remove it for now 2014-12-04T19:03:56Z asimov42 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:04:09Z zacharias quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:04:56Z drewc applied for a job this week, first time in 15 years.... took a lot more time than it did when I was 21! 2014-12-04T19:06:13Z lacedaemon is now known as fe[nl]ix 2014-12-04T19:06:30Z drewc: Xach: don't bother ... the smug .asd contains nothing at this point anyway, so depends-on :smug is pointless. 2014-12-04T19:07:55Z theseb quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T19:07:59Z asimov42 quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:08:19Z drewc: and, heh, I like smug and it is uses by fade and dlowe 2014-12-04T19:08:27Z drewc: used 2014-12-04T19:08:37Z drewc stops typing and has some coffee 2014-12-04T19:10:18Z RedEight joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:10:35Z Adeon is now known as MaryPoppins 2014-12-04T19:10:39Z Denommus quit (Quit: rebooting) 2014-12-04T19:11:27Z rswarbrick joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:12:56Z pt1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:15:31Z CrazyWoods quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:15:32Z |3b|`` is now known as |3b| 2014-12-04T19:16:41Z CrazyWoods joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:17:33Z sdemarre joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:17:56Z Denommus joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:19:25Z White_Flame joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:21:35Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:25:15Z jasom has switched to esrap for anything that only needs to operate on strings 2014-12-04T19:25:30Z jasom: I still use smug for anything that needs to operate on something that isn't strings 2014-12-04T19:26:03Z jasom: I suppose I would use it as well if I ever had an ambiguous grammer to parse, but my fix for that is to just disambiguate it 2014-12-04T19:26:18Z drewc: Fade and dlowe and jasom! yay! :) 2014-12-04T19:26:26Z Xach: the horrible burden of Users 2014-12-04T19:26:39Z drewc: Oh ... I am using it as well. 4 at least! 2014-12-04T19:27:15Z Xach: an albatross of users? 2014-12-04T19:28:34Z jasom: and I don't think I'm currently using the quicklisp version, FWIW 2014-12-04T19:28:52Z drewc: dlowe: and, FWIW, if you search for "dlowe" here : https://github.com/drewc/smug/blob/fdf4fb489b043b48b42841a7ca407eef71400300/doc/tutorial.org 2014-12-04T19:29:19Z drewc: in specific : https://github.com/drewc/smug/blob/fdf4fb489b043b48b42841a7ca407eef71400300/doc/tutorial.org#task-list 2014-12-04T19:29:31Z Xach: printf ist tot 2014-12-04T19:29:42Z radioninja joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:30:16Z Aiwass joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:30:18Z drewc: dlowe: you can see that "Patch printf.lisp to use this code" is part of my tasks. 2014-12-04T19:30:42Z Aiwass quit (Client Quit) 2014-12-04T19:31:08Z Lowl3v3l quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T19:36:23Z madmalik joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:37:20Z drewc: dlowe: and, heh, here is smug using its own parse/org to take the .org file and make a .html from it : 2014-12-04T19:37:23Z drewc: https://rawgit.com/drewc/smug/master/doc/smug.html 2014-12-04T19:38:56Z drewc: http://rawgit.com/drewc/smug/master/doc/smug.html <--- better to use http is seems. 2014-12-04T19:39:50Z innertracks joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:40:01Z drewc: dlowe: regardless, that is bleeding edge, self tested, literate 'weave' of the source code source. 2014-12-04T19:40:28Z dlowe: drewc: very cool stuff. 2014-12-04T19:40:44Z innertracks quit (Client Quit) 2014-12-04T19:41:30Z sdemarre quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:41:47Z drewc: dlowe: I hope it is up-to-date enough for you :P 2014-12-04T19:42:11Z dlowe: drewc: it's quite good. Thank you. 2014-12-04T19:43:27Z drewc: dlowe: (and to back up ... no offense taken... it seem our Canadian politeness is taken as 'trolling' or 'anger' by a lot of outsiders eh?) 2014-12-04T19:44:11Z dlowe: I took as neither, but I'd prefer not to unsettle at all. 2014-12-04T19:44:53Z drewc: no worries, I was happy to have some feedback and a simple fix did 2014-12-04T19:45:02Z drewc: "Solve" the isse 2014-12-04T19:45:17Z drewc: so, thanks! 2014-12-04T19:45:18Z arenz quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:46:20Z rtra quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T19:46:21Z jasom: drewc: yeah, I'm still using the version where the prefix is = rather than . 2014-12-04T19:46:24Z jasom: so =let* =prog1 2014-12-04T19:47:33Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:48:21Z drewc: jasom: I have not used that since June 8 2011 it seems ... but since I never released it and did not work on it for over a year, did other stuff with monads and interfaces, and decided on #\., well ... :| 2014-12-04T19:48:52Z drewc: jasom: and there is one massive issue with the = prefix IMNSHO .. 2014-12-04T19:48:53Z jasom: drewc: I have no active projects currently using it, so feel to break the API whenever 2014-12-04T19:49:36Z drewc: #"=string= .. really? #'=char= ... really? 2014-12-04T19:50:41Z ggole quit 2014-12-04T19:50:54Z drewc: jasom, dlowe: well, FWIW, I would love and graciously accept a patch that makes a smug/= packages that takes all the (aref 2014-12-04T19:50:58Z drewc: errr 2014-12-04T19:52:06Z drewc: (aref (symbol-name symbol) 0) 2014-12-04T19:52:44Z drewc: and interns the subseq with a #\= prefix instead 2014-12-04T19:53:39Z drewc: given that there are only 4 users, and 3 seem to use the #\=, It can be done! :) 2014-12-04T19:54:29Z drewc: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIoTpkM5N64 <--- Talking Canadian ... Sorry eh! 2014-12-04T19:54:59Z oleo is now known as Guest54174 2014-12-04T19:56:22Z bullone quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2014-12-04T19:56:41Z oleo__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:56:54Z corni joined #lisp 2014-12-04T19:57:07Z drewc: jasom, dlowe: eg https://github.com/drewc/smug/blob/master/pure/dot.lisp 2014-12-04T19:57:41Z Patzy quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:57:58Z Guest54174 quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2014-12-04T19:58:25Z Patzy joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:00:25Z zmisc quit (Quit: Using IRC from a phone is a bad idea.) 2014-12-04T20:00:47Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:01:35Z oleo__ quit (Quit: Verlassend) 2014-12-04T20:02:27Z ghard quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:02:44Z ghard joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:07:50Z oleo__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:08:08Z oleo__ is now known as oleo 2014-12-04T20:12:46Z jumblerg joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:14:13Z blahzik joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:14:58Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:15:23Z drewc quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:16:37Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:17:45Z chu joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:18:14Z MoALTz quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T20:19:23Z mrSpec quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T20:20:39Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:24:39Z blahzik quit (Quit: blahzik) 2014-12-04T20:24:43Z kell0gs joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:24:57Z kell0gs: hey fellas, anyone wanna help me with some basic LISP 2014-12-04T20:25:03Z kell0gs: i will give you a footrub 2014-12-04T20:27:44Z eudoxia joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:27:47Z Xach: kell0gs: This channel is for Common Lisp. What's up? 2014-12-04T20:28:13Z kell0gs: heyo i'm a noob needing some help making a function. 2014-12-04T20:28:57Z Vutral quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:29:38Z kanru joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:30:25Z drewc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:30:27Z shka joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:30:33Z shka: hi 2014-12-04T20:30:49Z shka: i want to create array of lists 2014-12-04T20:31:21Z shka: however, if i use :initial-element key i will get array filled with pointers to exactly the same list 2014-12-04T20:31:35Z shka: not what i would want to do 2014-12-04T20:32:00Z shka: should i use (copy-sequence (list :foo :bar)) or something? 2014-12-04T20:32:17Z fridim_ quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:33:01Z Grue``: it should be array of different lists with identical contents? 2014-12-04T20:33:09Z Grue`` is now known as Grue` 2014-12-04T20:34:47Z klltkr quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:35:05Z Xach: shka: you could use (map-into (make-array 42) (lambda () (list :foo :bar))) 2014-12-04T20:35:12Z drewc quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:35:41Z CrazyWoods quit (Quit: leaving) 2014-12-04T20:35:58Z pllx_ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:36:15Z yano quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T20:36:43Z klltkr joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:36:44Z Grue`: make-array can't cons up new lists by itself 2014-12-04T20:36:54Z shka: Xach: thanks! 2014-12-04T20:37:14Z drewc joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:38:38Z Vutral joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:41:01Z Grue`: to save memory you can create array with :initial-element so lists share structure, but when you have to modify one of them, put a fresh list in there if the cell contents are EQ to initial-element 2014-12-04T20:41:10Z Xach: COW 2014-12-04T20:41:13Z Grue`: but this depends on usage conditions 2014-12-04T20:43:16Z goglosh quit (Quit: leaving) 2014-12-04T20:43:46Z dlowe: if you're building the lists in the array, you can just specify NIL as the initial element, then (push x (aref array y)) 2014-12-04T20:47:00Z sheilong joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:47:04Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T20:48:10Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T20:49:45Z EvW1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:50:13Z White_Flame: Loop has no facility to collect results into an array as it does a list, right? 2014-12-04T20:50:35Z cyphase quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:50:35Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:50:52Z Xach: no 2014-12-04T20:51:04Z drewc: White_Flame: (let ((list '(1 2 3 4))) (make-array (length list) :initial-contents list)) = #(1 2 3 4) 2014-12-04T20:51:19Z White_Flame: right 2014-12-04T20:51:32Z drewc: if the memory use does not matter 2014-12-04T20:51:44Z drewc: which it usually does not. 2014-12-04T20:51:44Z JuanDaugherty quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T20:51:47Z kell0gs: http://pastebin.com/pUJsL8Mv i'm trying to make this filter function to return the list with all instances of "the" removed, but it keeps returning the whole string without thme removed 2014-12-04T20:51:51Z dlowe: (coerce (loop for i upto 5 collect i) 'vector) 2014-12-04T20:51:56Z kell0gs: not sure where i went wrong 2014-12-04T20:52:03Z dlowe runs into the night laughing maniacally 2014-12-04T20:52:05Z White_Flame: dlowe: right, was just pulling up that syntax, too 2014-12-04T20:52:25Z cyphase joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:52:25Z drewc: dlowe: I even have a .COERCE parser :) 2014-12-04T20:53:14Z kanru quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:54:58Z pllx_ quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2014-12-04T20:55:03Z Grue`: kell0gs: it returns the whole STRING? 2014-12-04T20:55:20Z kell0gs: yeah unchanged 2014-12-04T20:55:22Z drewc: dlowe: it did not seem to make it to the tutorial, but .MAKE-SEQUENCE does the coerce. 2014-12-04T20:55:37Z drewc: http://rawgit.com/drewc/smug/master/doc/smug.html#Function_MAKE-LIST_MAKE-SEQUENCE 2014-12-04T20:55:41Z White_Flame: kell0gs: it works for me: (filter '("a" "the" "b")) -> ("a" "b") 2014-12-04T20:55:55Z ehu joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:55:59Z Grue`: yeah i can't see how it can ever return a string 2014-12-04T20:56:16Z Grue`: but the algorithm seems correct 2014-12-04T20:56:40Z kell0gs: i think this in part due to my poor understanding of lisp 2014-12-04T20:56:49Z kell0gs: my professors sample output has this: 2014-12-04T20:56:56Z Grue`: what's your input and output exactly? 2014-12-04T20:56:56Z rk[1]_ is now known as rk[1] 2014-12-04T20:57:14Z kell0gs: (filter '(the cat went up the tree)) => (cat went up tree) 2014-12-04T20:57:21Z White_Flame: those are symbols, not strings 2014-12-04T20:57:36Z White_Flame: check-for-the should do (eq 'the item) 2014-12-04T20:57:37Z schaueho quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T20:57:48Z Grue`: (equalp "the" 'the) => NIL 2014-12-04T20:57:59Z drewc: and it returns a list regardless of the contents, not a string 2014-12-04T20:58:34Z nydel joined #lisp 2014-12-04T20:58:36Z kell0gs: ahh i see 2014-12-04T20:58:38Z kell0gs: let me try that then 2014-12-04T20:58:51Z drewc: and I would use (string-equal "the" (string str))) 2014-12-04T20:59:22Z White_Flame: drewc: if the input is symbols, then (string str) -> "THE", not "the" 2014-12-04T20:59:28Z drewc: because of packages and symbols and strings and "The" '(|The|) etc) 2014-12-04T20:59:28Z kell0gs: my prof says we are only allowed to use "COND, EQUAL (or EQUALP), CONS, CAR and CDR" for this assignment :^) 2014-12-04T20:59:42Z Grue`: string-equal is case-insensitive unlike equal 2014-12-04T20:59:47Z drewc: White_Flame: string-equal 2014-12-04T20:59:52Z White_Flame: ah, yes 2014-12-04T20:59:59Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T21:00:01Z Grue`: kell0gs: (equal 'the str) 2014-12-04T21:00:25Z Grue`: oh wait, you can't use QUOTE, you're screwed then ;) 2014-12-04T21:00:26Z fikusz quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T21:00:29Z White_Flame: kell0gs: The main source of the misunderstanding is that there are no strings in this example 2014-12-04T21:00:42Z ans_ is now known as ans 2014-12-04T21:00:45Z White_Flame: so "str" isn't a very good parameter name in check-for-the, given that info 2014-12-04T21:00:59Z francogrex joined #lisp 2014-12-04T21:01:16Z kell0gs: yeah true. thats me being a scrub 2014-12-04T21:01:24Z fikusz joined #lisp 2014-12-04T21:01:28Z kell0gs: thanks everyone, i got it wroking how it should now :D 2014-12-04T21:01:58Z White_Flame: yay 2014-12-04T21:02:38Z Grue`: (the symbol 'the) 2014-12-04T21:05:53Z loz quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T21:09:05Z towodo quit (Quit: towodo) 2014-12-04T21:09:39Z towodo joined #lisp 2014-12-04T21:10:38Z pppp2 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T21:14:09Z radioninja quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 2014-12-04T21:17:00Z pppp2 quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T21:18:02Z towodo quit (Quit: towodo) 2014-12-04T21:19:49Z rswarbrick quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2014-12-04T21:20:19Z kell0gs quit (Quit: Leaving) 2014-12-04T21:20:49Z TDog joined #lisp 2014-12-04T21:23:01Z Joreji quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T21:23:08Z ehu quit 2014-12-04T21:23:52Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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Is there something special about defun(s)? Why isn't it just LISP-EVAL-EXPRESSION or LISP-EVAL-SEXPR ? 2014-12-04T22:17:05Z genii quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T22:17:06Z drmeister: I ask because it seems like it's trying to tell me something. 2014-12-04T22:17:37Z fe[nl]ix: (use the force, drmeister) 2014-12-04T22:18:04Z yuikov joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:18:04Z Bike: slime hermeneutics, oh boy 2014-12-04T22:18:04Z drmeister: Oh, now you are just piling on the mysteries. 2014-12-04T22:18:43Z drmeister: Well, this is inferior-lisp hermeneutics. 2014-12-04T22:18:51Z fe[nl]ix: Eleusinian, certainly 2014-12-04T22:18:52Z drmeister files away that word for later use. 2014-12-04T22:19:03Z Bike: seriously though, don't think it's important 2014-12-04T22:19:43Z drmeister: Ok, so it's just a weird choice of function name whose meaning has been lost in time? 2014-12-04T22:19:44Z Bike: if you look at the docs it just says it evals a toplevel form 2014-12-04T22:19:53Z Bike: probably 2014-12-04T22:20:00Z Bike: i mean presumably it's because most toplevel forms are defuns 2014-12-04T22:20:30Z drmeister: Great. I don't have slime working yet so I'm still using inferior-lisp. 2014-12-04T22:21:06Z drmeister: I'm trying to figure out how to get my emacs to support both or let me switch between them. 2014-12-04T22:21:32Z fe[nl]ix: bribe it with some high-quality bits 2014-12-04T22:22:15Z yuikov quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T22:26:12Z Grue`: in emacs speak "defun" means top-level function, even for non-lisp modes 2014-12-04T22:26:13Z drmeister: Hmm, M-RET is not programmed - I just found the key to bind to lisp-eval-defun 2014-12-04T22:26:49Z drmeister: Like here come de-judge? 2014-12-04T22:26:53Z drmeister: Another era. 2014-12-04T22:27:10Z Xach: ha 2014-12-04T22:27:20Z Xach carbon-dates drmeister 2014-12-04T22:28:34Z xrash joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:28:53Z Grue`: e.g. C-M-a is called beginning-of-defun but is not lisp-specific 2014-12-04T22:34:27Z matko joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:34:35Z matko quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-12-04T22:34:54Z matko joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:38:20Z maxpeck quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T22:39:23Z josemanuel quit (Quit: Saliendo) 2014-12-04T22:45:19Z JuanDaugherty quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-12-04T22:46:15Z Denommus` joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:47:13Z drewc just used a unicode symbol for his macro name and he likes it!!! 2014-12-04T22:48:13Z Denommus quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-12-04T22:48:20Z fourens claps. 2014-12-04T22:51:30Z c53100 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:56:38Z Davidbrcz joined #lisp 2014-12-04T22:57:46Z pillton: drewc: The README for your smug project says to go to smug.org, but that takes me to carolinacomputerforensics.com. Is this right? 2014-12-04T22:58:25Z drewc: pillton: imagine if .org was replaced with .html 2014-12-04T22:58:34Z drewc: does that give you a hint? 2014-12-04T22:58:51Z pillton: Hah 2014-12-04T22:58:54Z pillton: Idiot. 2014-12-04T22:58:58Z pillton: I even use ORG! 2014-12-04T22:59:14Z drewc: :) 2014-12-04T22:59:23Z pillton: Sorry. 2014-12-04T23:00:18Z drewc: and although the readme does not (yet) say so, http://rawgit.com/drewc/smug/master/doc/smug.html is a decent start 2014-12-04T23:01:23Z pillton makes a sticky note with "speak only after 2 cups of coffee" on it. 2014-12-04T23:06:10Z drewc1 joined #lisp 2014-12-04T23:09:55Z drewc quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-12-04T23:10:17Z sol__ quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-12-04T23:10:48Z sol__ joined #lisp 2014-12-04T23:12:43Z drewc1 pours himself his 3rd cup ... it is 3pm PST after all, time to renew the caffeine intake 2014-12-04T23:13:08Z jumblerg joined #lisp 2014-12-04T23:13:10Z vinleod quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-12-04T23:16:57Z ehu quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T23:16:59Z atgreen joined #lisp 2014-12-04T23:19:17Z Davidbrcz quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-12-04T23:21:02Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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