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03:03:58 segmond [~segmond@adsl-108-73-160-91.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 03:04:18 kanru [~kanru@118-163-10-190.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 03:07:51 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-50-159-9-43.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:08:01 beingAwesome [~Thunderbi@106.66.201.14] has joined #lisp 03:10:21 -!- frkout [~frkout@101.110.31.120] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:10:31 -!- bgs100 [~bgs@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: bgs100] 03:10:54 frkout [~frkout@101.110.31.250] has joined #lisp 03:11:32 pyx [~pyx@unaffiliated/pyx] has joined #lisp 03:11:44 -!- pyx [~pyx@unaffiliated/pyx] has quit [Client Quit] 03:12:25 -!- beingAwesome [~Thunderbi@106.66.201.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:12:28 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@110.151.12.84] has joined #lisp 03:14:37 *jaimef* ponders why vectometry is not in ql 03:17:32 drewc [~drewc@S0106c8d71945c789.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 03:24:30 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has 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timeout: 264 seconds] 04:00:13 blahzik [~anonymous@cpe-66-60-237-123.cmts1.phonoscopecable.net] has joined #lisp 04:01:45 frkout_ [~frkout@101.110.31.120] has joined #lisp 04:04:00 burtdirt [~user@c-174-63-121-163.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:04:49 -!- frkout [~frkout@101.110.31.250] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:05:01 -!- therik [~therik@212.50.110.108] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:05:32 -!- burtdirt [~user@c-174-63-121-163.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 04:05:49 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 04:05:52 da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@217.112.245.18] has joined #lisp 04:09:33 abunchofdollarsi [~abunchofd@l33t.csail.mit.edu] has joined #lisp 04:10:17 -!- da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@217.112.245.18] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:10:59 pjb, do you still think that linc was a good idea? I've been interested in doing some structured editing of C files and I hacked together a prototype using clang; but it's complicated and brittle. I now think that using paredit and c in s expressions is a better idea. But the generated code needs to be idiomatic. 04:12:47 -!- percopal [~percopal@207-38-203-110.c3-0.43d-ubr2.qens-43d.ny.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: percopal] 04:13:16 -!- nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:14:22 burtdirt [~karim@c-174-63-121-163.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:17:11 jimmyy [~jimmyy@111.69.52.154] has joined #lisp 04:17:53 -!- blahzik [~anonymous@cpe-66-60-237-123.cmts1.phonoscopecable.net] has quit [Quit: blahzik] 04:18:04 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 04:20:10 -!- Denommus [~user@unaffiliated/denommus] has quit [Quit: going to sleep] 04:20:39 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 04:20:55 percopal [~percopal@207-38-203-110.c3-0.43d-ubr2.qens-43d.ny.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 04:21:10 -!- percopal [~percopal@207-38-203-110.c3-0.43d-ubr2.qens-43d.ny.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Client Quit] 04:24:30 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 04:25:22 -!- DalekBaldwin [~user@ip68-231-209-84.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:26:06 DalekBaldwin [~user@ip68-231-209-84.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 04:29:18 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:31:25 nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 04:31:51 -!- fridim_ [~fridim@65.93.77.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:34:26 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 04:37:03 -!- justinmcp [~quassel@198.199.115.124] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 04:38:10 justinmcp [~quassel@198.199.115.124] has joined #lisp 04:43:58 stardiviner [~stardivin@unaffiliated/stardiviner] has joined #lisp 04:46:36 hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.195.243] has joined #lisp 04:54:45 Can use astyle to get idiomatic indentation/spacing. 04:55:36 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@111.69.52.154] has quit [] 05:08:06 -!- drewc [~drewc@S0106c8d71945c789.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:09:08 drewc [~drewc@S0106c8d71945c789.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:11:13 Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-51-197.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 05:14:34 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:15:01 zajn [~zajn@108.205.50.54] has joined #lisp 05:15:04 -!- jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 05:16:00 -!- segmond [~segmond@adsl-108-73-160-91.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:16:50 segmond [~segmond@99.102.148.159] has joined #lisp 05:18:08 jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has joined #lisp 05:24:34 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:26:46 seggy [~segmond@adsl-108-67-103-183.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 05:29:13 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:30:31 -!- 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#lisp 06:06:47 da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@c18.adsl.tnnet.fi] has joined #lisp 06:06:57 -!- macin [0e8bb972@gateway/web/freenode/ip.14.139.185.114] has left #lisp 06:07:37 -!- seggy [~segmond@adsl-108-67-103-183.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:07:44 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@110.151.12.84] has quit [Quit: Disconnecting -- bye] 06:08:03 macin [0e8bb972@gateway/web/freenode/ip.14.139.185.114] has joined #lisp 06:08:06 sevostyanov [~sevostyan@193.104.110.23] has joined #lisp 06:08:14 -!- lyanchih [~lyanchih@202.39.219.19] has quit [Quit: lyanchih] 06:09:39 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.205.121] has joined #lisp 06:10:59 -!- da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@c18.adsl.tnnet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:14:34 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@111.69.52.154] has quit [] 06:19:07 lyanchih [~lyanchih@202.39.219.19] has joined #lisp 06:19:57 zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 06:20:06 seggy [~segmond@adsl-108-67-102-249.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 06:22:54 frkout_ [~frkout@101.110.31.120] has joined #lisp 06:23:13 -!- segimondu [~segmond@adsl-108-67-100-144.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:23:41 abunchofdollarsi: indeed, linc would be a nice tool in a lisper toolbox. There's also linj, and as I mentionned, we have half-baked sexpifications of several other languages. 06:24:35 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:24:43 abunchofdollarsi: ideally, we'd have a tool box that would be able to parse and generate any other (popular) language. So when you have to maintain alien code, you'd load it in emacs, see it and edit it as lisp code, and save it back to the barbaric form. 06:25:12 ggole [~ggole@124-148-123-228.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 06:25:33 abunchofdollarsi: and adding to the toolbox translators and other semantic tools (if only lisp macros), we lispers could even be highly productive in those lower languages. 06:25:53 segimondu [~segmond@adsl-108-73-162-222.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 06:26:34 -!- frkout [~frkout@101.110.31.250] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:26:54 ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has joined #lisp 06:27:28 -!- gigetoo [~gigetoo@c83-250-61-4.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:28:17 gigetoo [~gigetoo@c83-250-61-4.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 06:28:43 pjb, right; needs to be as seamless as possible with everyone else who isn't privy to our voodoo. Convincing everyone to use a code formatter would trivialize some of it (ie, "gofmt is doing it!"). Going to work on a simple prototype then take another look at what you had built. 06:29:00 -!- seggy [~segmond@adsl-108-67-102-249.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:29:08 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 06:29:11 The SC project seems pretty mature; but their focus isn't on generating idiomatic code. 06:29:35 cl made into a shen? 06:30:27 -!- frkout_ [~frkout@101.110.31.120] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:31:02 frkout [~frkout@101.110.31.250] has joined #lisp 06:32:14 clicc tries to generate maintainable C code. 06:33:11 But you opted to work on something new? 06:33:44 jimmyy [~jimmyy@111.69.52.154] has joined #lisp 06:33:57 -!- nightfly [sage@destiny.cat.pdx.edu] has left #lisp 06:34:08 nightfly [sage@destiny.cat.pdx.edu] has joined #lisp 06:36:58 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:39:19 -!- macin 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Connection reset by peer] 07:26:26 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 07:27:30 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-190-94.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 07:29:49 JamesMoriarty [~James@185.3.35.34] has joined #lisp 07:30:49 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:31:01 Hi friends :-) 07:35:39 przl [~przlrkt@p5DCA3565.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:40:08 hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 07:42:01 -!- JamesMoriarty [~James@185.3.35.34] has quit [Quit: jmIrc-m v0.35f by Archangel (http://jmirc-m.net.ru/)] 07:44:49 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:46:00 -!- nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 07:46:06 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5DCA3565.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:46:43 -!- lyanchih 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#lisp 08:24:32 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 08:26:26 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-29-227.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:26:54 yacks [~py@122.179.102.149] has joined #lisp 08:29:22 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:29:23 pjb, were you thinking of somehow using the EBNF to do the conversion? 08:29:26 ck`` [~ck@dslb-094-219-236-112.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 08:30:12 -!- nostoi [~nostoi@253.Red-79-154-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 08:30:25 Code_Man` [~Code_Man@2a02:1205:c69d:5f80:223:54ff:fe38:82c2] has joined #lisp 08:34:32 zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 08:36:47 zoek1 [~zoek1@187.135.7.164] has joined #lisp 08:39:59 macobo [~netrunner@40.82.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #lisp 08:40:54 hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 08:42:52 beingAwesome [~Thunderbi@106.66.196.229] has joined #lisp 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12:46:49 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:48:59 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:49:38 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-29-227.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:52:58 hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 13:02:56 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141572 any idea how I can solve this simple cl-ppcre problem? 13:04:31 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 13:04:49 -!- _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:bd2c:2122:b6f4:9077] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:05:31 the problem is, \\ will produce a backslash, so replace-all doesn't see the \&, so, does that force me to use the replacement function way instead, or is there a simple way around that sticks to using a replacement string? 13:06:10 oh. wait. got it. 13:06:46 -!- ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:08:59 _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:7034:6ce:d8be:15a8] has joined #lisp 13:09:46 annotate with the solution for future generations 13:11:08 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141572#1 13:11:17 YONA1 [~canaima@186.167.242.142] has joined #lisp 13:11:21 mindCrime__ [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:11:29 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-51-197.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:11:46 -!- mhd [~mhd@cpe-76-170-71-237.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 13:12:03 mhd [~mhd@cpe-76-170-71-237.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:12:09 -!- mindCrime_ [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 13:12:17 Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-51-197.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 13:13:39 przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has joined #lisp 13:13:41 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [] 13:15:05 -!- YONA1 [~canaima@186.167.242.142] has left #lisp 13:15:16 i need to use multiple forms for the "else" of an (if) form, and dont want to wrap them in aseparate function. should i use lambda, progn, or what is the preferred approach here? 13:15:44 progn would be the obvious choice. 13:16:06 Assuming that you mean something like (if a b (progn (c) d)) 13:16:21 AdmiralBumbleBee [~derpderp@pool-173-65-191-69.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:16:54 chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has joined #lisp 13:18:26 Start with PROGN, and don't be surprised if you end up with a LET. In particular, don't be surprised if you end up with a COND instead of an IF after all. 13:18:49 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has quit [] 13:19:10 -!- misv_ [~ms@c-b977e255.033-162-7673741.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:19:43 -!- mindCrime__ is now known as mindCrime 13:23:36 misv [~ms@c-b977e255.033-162-7673741.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 13:24:42 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 13:25:26 ok, how can i simplify this? seems a bit too much duplication: http://paste.lisp.org/display/141574 13:26:36 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:26:49 -!- przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:27:02 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 13:27:10 izirku [~IceChat9@sys-its-g56vnw1-yev.cc.unt.edu] has joined #lisp 13:27:22 -!- mindCrime [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 13:29:31 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:29:45 axion: where's the 'then' part? 13:30:00 ? 13:30:08 in the cond, i mean 13:30:16 -!- mhd [mhd@clozure-5FC6C61C.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout] 13:31:23 (cond ((or ) )) 13:32:38 -!- mhd [~mhd@cpe-76-170-71-237.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:32:43 you probably don't need the cond there at all 13:32:53 oops right 13:33:07 other than that it looks fine 13:33:39 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 13:34:06 ok good thanks 13:34:41 usual CL style would be to call the predicate POOL-INVALID-P instead of POOL-INVALID? 13:34:43 np 13:34:53 Adlai [~Adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 13:35:52 mindCrime [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:36:33 deepak [~chatzilla@117.212.55.109] has joined #lisp 13:37:38 sandbender1512 [~none@CPEc8fb26470b29-CMc8fb26470b26.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 13:37:38 axion: you might want to ASSERT the individual values to be not zerop, depending on your error-handling needs. 13:37:57 (not zerop, or integerp, or whatever else) 13:38:29 -!- askatasuna [~askatasun@OL171-182.fibertel.com.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:38:33 what do you mean? 13:38:45 i never used assert...i can look it up 13:39:21 (assert (integerp (read-from-string-port))) 13:39:27 something along these lines. 13:40:29 <|3b|> shouldn't call read-from-string on user-provided data 13:40:39 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575 does this seem like reasonable lisp code to others? 13:40:40 True. 13:41:03 axion: better use PARSE-INTEGER 13:41:13 |3b|: its typed in a form that will always be a string 13:41:17 html 13:41:23 eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-52-18-182.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 13:41:32 <|3b|> axion: string isn't the problem, #. and #() and such are 13:42:00 hmm 13:43:21 yzzyx`: that looks rather dense 13:43:30 yzzyx`: so no. not reasonable. 13:43:47 H4ns: any pointers on how I can improve it? 13:44:24 Just, break it into more functions? 13:44:28 yzzyx`: if you think that the code is correct, maybe add some documentation that describes what it does? 13:44:44 yzzyx`: or make it more obvious what it does by refactoring 13:45:06 yzzyx`: format nil, reverse, values, a macro, lambdas, all that together make the thing hard to follow for me. 13:45:35 yzzyx`: i'd start with a function that constructs the regex. 13:46:02 yzzyx`: also, why let*? and put a space behind your function name in defun 13:47:09 let*, good question! let me move that mapcar out of the format, though note it does need to build the args list, so would defining it in an flet be rational? 13:47:31 <|3b|> yzzyx`: i'd return strings from parse-route for arg names rather than symbols, and let the macro intern them 13:47:51 yzzyx`: if you make the function global, it is much easier to test. 13:47:54 <|3b|> either that or name the function so it is more obviously just part of the macro and not intended for others to call 13:48:04 |3b|: i see what you mean, and i fixed it. how would i catch if special characters are included in the other strings though? 13:48:19 it fails on # for the strings now 13:48:46 <|3b|> axion: not sure what you mean 13:49:08 well i changed it to: (not (integerp (parse-integer port :junk-allowed t))) 13:49:13 thanks all, let me attempt to clean this up. 13:49:35 yzzyx`: also lose the push in the mapcar 13:49:40 but the other conditions, not the required integer, will fail if a "#" is typed in 13:49:42 przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has joined #lisp 13:49:46 duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 13:50:27 H4ns: just take two runs over the thing for clarity? 13:50:33 yzzyx`: generally, if i read "mapcar", i read "no side effects" and a destructive operation inside of the lambda does not suit that thinking. 13:50:37 (and not to use side effects in a map) - yeah 13:51:41 yzzyx`: it does not seem as if efficiency is a concern - and you could always return the symbol rather than pushing it sideways. 13:51:51 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 13:52:10 -!- segimondu is now known as segmond 13:52:33 h4ns, efficiency is not really important here, no, if you had that many routes the overhead was causing startup delays, you have bigger problems :) 13:53:00 yzzyx`: right. i'd say clarity wins. 13:53:37 ok, let me have another run at this. thanks for your help. 13:53:51 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 13:53:58 Adlai [~Adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 13:54:16 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Client Quit] 13:54:41 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 13:55:14 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 13:56:03 <|3b|> axion: (every 'digit-char-p port) might be better, since you don't actually use the value there, and probably don't want to allow extra junk at the end 13:56:21 Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has joined #lisp 13:57:08 i mean if i enter "#" in for name on the web form, i want to catch it and prevent it. as well as other special characters 13:57:55 -!- macobo [~netrunner@40.82.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:00:54 KarlDscc [~localhost@p578FC10E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 14:01:47 *|3b|* would probably say just write a regex to check them against with cl-ppcre 14:03:06 -!- przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:04:14 -!- yacks [~py@122.179.102.149] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:04:15 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 14:05:57 pranavrc [~pranavrc@122.174.14.134] has joined #lisp 14:05:57 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@122.174.14.134] has quit [Changing host] 14:05:57 pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has joined #lisp 14:07:44 Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has joined #lisp 14:09:19 -!- da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@c18.adsl.tnnet.fi] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:09:53 da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@c18.adsl.tnnet.fi] has joined #lisp 14:11:24 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:13:58 -!- da4c30ff__ [~da4c30ff@c18.adsl.tnnet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:14:15 macobo [~netrunner@2001:bb8:2002:3400:c218:85ff:febe:1e6d] has joined #lisp 14:14:50 harish_ [~harish@175.156.125.137] has joined #lisp 14:16:08 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575#1 there, I've cleaned it up a bit more and added a few comments and docstrings, how does it look now? 14:16:41 davazp [~user@177.Red-83-63-237.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:17:06 -!- schoppenhauer [~schoppenh@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Quit: Adé] 14:17:38 -!- duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:17:43 (excluding silly calling them sometimes path-segments and sometimes path-elements...) 14:18:01 duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 14:19:46 duggiefr_ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 14:20:14 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575#2 renamed for sanity. 14:21:08 yzzyx`: looks ok to me. Why no space between the name of the function and the argument list? 14:21:09 GoZoner [~GoZoner@guest-184.vonkarman.net] has joined #lisp 14:21:48 prxq: argh, h4ns pointed that out, no reason other than my formatting style is a bit crappy. 14:22:47 duggief__ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 14:22:52 -!- Code_Man` [~Code_Man@248-213.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:23:09 -!- duggief__ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:23:28 duggief__ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 14:23:34 -!- duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:23:38 -!- karupanerura is now known as zz_karupanerura 14:24:18 The only other question i have, is how would I concisely implement get-route-variables without using loop? 14:24:32 segv- [~mb@95-91-211-245-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 14:24:35 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:25:53 aeth_ [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #lisp 14:26:34 -!- duggiefr_ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:27:00 yzzyx`: it looks fine. you could have route-variable-string-p and do (mapcar #'string-upcase (remove-if-not #'route-variable-string-p path-segments)) or something. 14:27:26 schoppenhauer [~schoppenh@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 14:27:28 -!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:27:33 -!- aeth_ is now known as aeth 14:28:17 Xach: ah, i see, yes, that would work. at bare minimum it's probably worth defining the predicate to avoid the code duplication. thanks. 14:28:31 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@92.247.23.10] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 14:28:59 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:33:24 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575#6 final version. Thanks for the feedback everyone. 14:34:07 yzzyx`: if i may make another remark: 14:34:21 h4ns, please do! 14:34:47 yzzyx`: i find cond to read harder if there is a mix between (condition expression) and (conditionexpression). i'd recommend using either of the two consistently. 14:35:43 H4ns, right, I hadn't considered that, let me fix that, too. 14:37:25 <|3b|> yzzyx`: use &body instead of &rest for the body of a macro, smart editors will use that to indent them differently 14:37:41 |3b|: oh, nice. 14:39:27 *|3b|* would also spell out "pattern" rather than abbreviating it 14:40:05 vaporatorius [~vaporator@124.Red-83-37-68.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:57 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575#8 with everything applied, and a few more docstrings. 14:41:03 -!- Kruppe [~jcp@laforge.cs.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:46:16 matko [~matko@ip82-139-125-221.lijbrandt.net] has joined #lisp 14:46:55 yzzyx`` [~yzzyx@host86-173-68-125.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 14:47:47 Acherontius [~user@204.116.186.34] has joined #lisp 14:48:32 cgore [~cgore@cgore.com] has joined #lisp 14:49:32 Thanks for your help everyone. 14:49:33 -!- specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:33 -!- ConstantineXVI [sxltrs@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:feae:8909] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:49:34 -!- wilfredh [sid159@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pkeqlyqprabfhlwu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:49:34 -!- yzzyx` [~yzzyx@host86-173-68-125.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:34 -!- adsisco [sid25204@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wounshlonsuumteb] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:49:35 -!- Validus [~Anonymous@cpc9-walt14-2-0-cust205.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:49:35 -!- hugod [~user@69.157.171.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:37 -!- |3b| [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:37 -!- mordocai [mordocai@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe70:b749] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:38 -!- deepak [~chatzilla@117.212.55.109] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 27.0/20140127194636]] 14:49:38 yzzyx`: why do you return the route arguments as strings "suitable to intern" rather than returning symbols right away? 14:49:39 yzzyx`: STRING-UPCASE takes a :START parameter 14:49:39 you could use that instead of subseq 14:49:39 yzzyx`: i'd either return the original names (i.e. lower case or mixed case or whatever) or symbols, but not something half-converted 14:49:39 mordocai [mordocai@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe70:b749] has joined #lisp 14:49:39 |3b| [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has joined #lisp 14:49:40 sohail [~sohail@75-119-248-79.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 14:49:41 -!- sohail [~sohail@75-119-248-79.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Changing host] 14:49:41 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 14:49:41 adsisco [sid25204@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session] has joined #lisp 14:49:41 -!- adsisco [sid25204@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session] has quit [Changing host] 14:49:41 adsisco [sid25204@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-loktboedhfmqcfbe] has joined #lisp 14:49:42 ConstantineXVI [sxltrs@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:feae:8909] has joined #lisp 14:49:46 -!- nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-rxkdsbyyzzcccteu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:50:19 specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 14:50:21 nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-bfuttxydripetulf] has joined #lisp 14:50:33 -!- MasseR [~masse@82.192.74.13] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:51:34 -!- specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:51:40 specbot [~specbot@common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 14:51:41 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #lisp 14:51:57 hugoduncan [~user@69.157.171.126] has joined #lisp 14:51:59 wilfredh [sid159@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session] has joined #lisp 14:52:01 -!- wilfredh [sid159@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session] has quit [Changing host] 14:52:01 wilfredh [sid159@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-asxlxtgbujxxojul] has joined #lisp 14:52:59 Validus [~Anonymous@cpc9-walt14-2-0-cust205.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #lisp 14:54:23 percopal [~percopal@63.65.76.38] has joined #lisp 14:55:30 ThePhoeron [~thephoero@CPE68b6fcc5ca13-CM68b6fcc5ca10.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 14:55:53 H4ns: that was in response to someone not liking interning things early on when I coughed up the messy version, but since really it's just a helper function and would be private to the package, yes, i might as well. 14:56:09 Xach: :start? that is so neat. Thanks :) 14:56:34 yzzyx``: i had to look it up! usually i see it when people do (parse-integer (subseq x 42 45)) or similar. 14:56:43 parse-integer takes offsets too. 14:57:09 developernotes [~developer@173-29-199-75.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 14:57:23 cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has joined #lisp 14:57:45 fridim_ [~fridim@173.231.115.58] has joined #lisp 14:58:30 Xach: aww, start doesn't do what you think :/ 14:58:47 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@138.23.59.87] has joined #lisp 14:58:49 (string-upcase "foo" :start 1) => "fOO" 14:59:21 ok sorry 14:59:22 or at least, it doesn't do what I thought it would do (and thus i still have to use subseq) 14:59:35 no problem! at least i now know :start exists... 14:59:38 *Xach* got too excited about a parse-integer parallel 14:59:43 hehe 15:00:11 przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has joined #lisp 15:00:36 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:53 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 15:01:37 -!- jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:03:30 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 15:03:46 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:04:07 http://paste.lisp.org/display/141575#9 15:04:16 with the interning. 15:04:39 I'm not sure if this route macro is really a good idea in practice, since it'll probably confuse editors. Would people look at it and think it was a macro for macros sake? 15:05:12 what's the name of the library that aims to portably implement CL in CL? 15:05:22 sicl 15:05:37 -!- wheelsucker [~wheelsuck@ip68-105-66-161.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:05:58 -!- przl [~przlrkt@62.72.64.50] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:06:16 hm, looks dead, last commit in 2011? Or did it move? 15:06:34 beach is back 15:06:43 https://github.com/robert-strandh/SICL 15:06:44 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 15:06:55 oh, common-lisp.net project is misleading. 15:06:59 someone should delete or update it 15:07:03 there was also the b-monkey version, sacla 15:07:09 sacla is pretty dead for real, though 15:07:11 "and this time it's personal" 15:08:02 Also, it's not in quicklisp -> doesn't exist. :) 15:09:11 it's easy to pull stuff from github ;/ 15:09:44 foom: booo! 15:10:20 someone should add a "beta" quicklisp server/dist thing that enumerates CL github repositories for easy access 15:10:24 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 15:10:45 senj [~senj@unaffiliated/senj] has joined #lisp 15:10:47 -!- macobo [~netrunner@2001:bb8:2002:3400:c218:85ff:febe:1e6d] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:10:57 How would that be different than the existing "beta" quicklisp thing? 15:11:10 isn't that just quicklisp? or is there a second dist now 15:11:46 I think something that pulled from github could have fresher things that might not work together 15:11:51 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:11:58 potentially 15:12:09 there's also an alpha preview of the next dist update 15:12:12 Xach: yeah, that would be the tradeoff, but caveat emptor 15:12:15 *Xach* must publish one this morning 15:12:15 or whatever 15:12:18 ah 15:13:33 Wizord [~Wizord@95.69.158.175] has joined #lisp 15:13:50 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 15:14:16 jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:14:32 -!- qiemem [uid14911@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ckukzigebuuhxdyo] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:14:57 I've never thought I would like anything lisp-related, but because of Mathematica language being almost lisp, I can eaily extract data for my 3d renderer 15:15:00 qiemem [uid14911@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rgidrhdhylvlkshq] has joined #lisp 15:15:01 http://i.imgur.com/XSDU9s6.png 15:15:41 (yes, I ) 15:15:46 Kruppe [~jcp@laforge.cs.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 15:16:36 That is a screenshot of text code. I would be less unhappy with offtopic stuff if it came with a pretty picture. 15:16:37 Why did you think that? 15:17:17 Xach: wait a sec 15:17:29 No thanks. Keep it to yourself, unless you've got a picture made with Common Lisp. 15:17:50 scheme is no-go? :D 15:18:17 Scheme is not what this channel is about... 15:18:19 askatasuna [~askatasun@181.30.10.50] has joined #lisp 15:18:22 This channel is for Common Lisp. 15:18:28 okay, have a nice day 15:18:31 -!- Wizord [~Wizord@95.69.158.175] has left #lisp 15:18:38 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.158.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:19:06 ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has joined #lisp 15:19:36 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@138.23.59.87] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:25:02 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-139-5.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 15:28:02 -!- KarlDscc [~localhost@p578FC10E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:28:13 Karl_Dscc [~localhost@p578FC10E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 15:29:25 -!- hugoduncan is now known as hugod 15:29:51 -!- GoZoner [~GoZoner@guest-184.vonkarman.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 15:29:55 -!- hugod is now known as Guest82416 15:31:26 -!- chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:32:14 chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has joined #lisp 15:32:19 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:33:19 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 15:34:45 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@98.255.30.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:36:03 hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 15:39:11 -!- ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@78.162.16.1] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:39:46 ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@li283-143.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 15:43:00 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:45:09 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [] 15:45:23 hmm.. I should just be able to go into a new emacs session, connect to slime, open a .lisp file and invokeslime-compile-and-load-file, right? 15:45:26 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 15:45:27 Malice [~Malice@94-229-220-135.static.espol.com.pl] has joined #lisp 15:45:46 Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has joined #lisp 15:46:23 because if i (load) the file from a fresh image, it works, but if i try to load it through slime-compile-and-load file, i get "undefined function" messages everywhere... 15:50:02 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 15:51:16 -!- Ethan- [~Ethan-@60-248-176-37.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:52:17 What kind of undefined function messages? 15:52:28 it's a message about my function being undefined in a macro expansion 15:52:30 You might get that if you are using macros before defining them. 15:52:43 i tried compile-file and it gives the same error, so actually scratch my comment about load 15:52:50 Ok, that makes sense. Compiling is different from loading. 15:52:51 it's definitely something up with my file, not a bug in slime 15:53:17 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-51-197.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:53:19 If you want the functions to be available at compile time, you have to compile and load them ahead of time (e.g. in a different file) or wrap them in (eval-when (:compile-toplevel :load-toplevel :execute) ...) 15:53:40 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 15:54:02 -!- Malice [~Malice@94-229-220-135.static.espol.com.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:54:06 Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has joined #lisp 15:54:22 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:54:34 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-52-18-182.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:56:28 ah, right, okay, so let me get this clear in my head. I have a bunch of defuns, a defmacro, and then at the bottom of the file, I use my macro (which uses the previous functions). this is failing because the macro use is not able to find the definition I have just written, because the function is compiled and has gone (somewhere, a fasl most likely), but is not available to the macroexpander. Does this sound correct? 15:57:34 (I am aware of things like ASDF, but this is just a simple throwaway lisp file) 15:58:13 yzzyx``: yes, defun does not make the function available at compile-time, but the macro must be expanded at compile time. 15:58:32 see http://l1sp.org/cl/defun starting at "defun is not required..." 15:58:46 So use eval-when to ask it to be made available at both compile-time and run-time. 15:59:20 Right, okay, yeah, that all seems perfectly reasonable. Thanks for clearing that up. 16:00:49 -!- Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:52 -!- nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-bfuttxydripetulf] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:01:13 Adlai [~Adlai@gateway/tor-sasl/adlai] has joined #lisp 16:01:27 nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-herafykjcnbdvjuz] has joined #lisp 16:04:31 xan_ [~xan@80.224.236.106.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 16:05:34 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 16:06:40 yep, an eval-when (:execute) has made both me and sbcl much less confused. 16:09:17 -!- zickzackv [~faot@port-92-198-30-130.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:10:17 paul0 [~paul0@177.16.144.88] has joined #lisp 16:10:34 Using all three of :compile-toplevel :load-toplevel :execute is the best way to avoid surprises in the future. 16:11:11 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-198-255-198-157.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:12:15 Right. Is there a sensible way to reload a particular asdf system in a running session? 16:12:57 (asdf:oos 'asdf:load-op :blah :force t) ? 16:13:06 It may suffice just to (asdf:load-system "the-system"). It will check file modification times. 16:13:26 But it depends on if you need to undo some old state or not. 16:13:30 -!- jewel [~jewel@105-236-210-247.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:13:46 -!- Guest82416 [~user@69.157.171.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:13:53 Even though you can undo almost everything, sometimes the quickest thing to do is restart lisp from scratch. 16:14:59 heh, that's exactly what I've been doing. While the REPL is wonderful, it has the annoying tendency to trick me into thinking the code I'm looking actually works. 16:15:05 looking at* 16:15:30 oleo: thanks. 16:15:49 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:16:26 hugod [~user@69.157.171.126] has joined #lisp 16:16:45 yw 16:17:01 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-50-159-9-43.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:17:15 -!- duggief__ [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:22:01 -!- loke_ [~elias@2400:d803:7342:f91a:b4dc:5e4c:b80f:4d97] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:23:01 JuanitoJons [~jreynoso@fixed-203-69-5.iusacell.net] has joined #lisp 16:23:46 atgreen [~green@207.112.112.168] has joined #lisp 16:24:00 -!- cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:28:20 gendl [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:29:01 aftersha_ [~textual@h-243-81.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 16:29:47 sirdancealot [~koo5@194.228.11.172] has joined #lisp 16:30:14 -!- gendl [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:34:02 loke_ [~elias@2400:d803:7342:f91a:516c:2d91:2a45:d1bb] has joined #lisp 16:34:09 -!- kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:34:23 -!- senj [~senj@unaffiliated/senj] has quit [Quit: Sleep Now] 16:34:53 senj [~senj@unaffiliated/senj] has joined #lisp 16:36:06 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 16:36:34 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@128.120.119.107] has joined #lisp 16:37:18 -!- paul0 [~paul0@177.16.144.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:37:28 GoZoner [~GoZoner@guest-184.vonkarman.net] has joined #lisp 16:45:53 so, i've not been using CL for a bit, since I upgraded to debian wheezy. i was wondering, is quicklisp still considered the way to go, even on debian? i notice the number of CL debian packages does not seem to be increasing 16:46:37 I don't think debian is a great option for getting CL libraries. I'm not sure what's going on with it, whether it's getting better or what. 16:47:57 Xach: no, there are not a lot of CL libraries packaged for Debian. So, is QL generally recommended here then? 16:48:00 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:48:00 faheem: Yes. 16:48:33 I'm starting again on wheezy, so seems like a good time to re-evaluate 16:48:42 Odin-: ok. 16:48:49 faheem: In the past, it wasn't just the low volume -- libraries were often out of date, and they were tied into an infrastructure that seemed to cause more problems than it solved. 16:48:51 -!- GoZoner [~GoZoner@guest-184.vonkarman.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:49:02 Some people seemed to be happy with it, but not many that I could tell. 16:49:14 Generally speaking, Debian packages are good for C/C++ code and for deployment of various other stuff. 16:49:28 Xach: yes, i see. you are talking about the cl debian packaging, right? 16:49:32 yes 16:49:38 i am fond of quicklisp 16:49:53 Xach: Really? I thought you hated it. 16:50:03 Xach: right. if not much is packaged for debian, then it is not that useful anyway. 16:50:04 Xach: Workload and expense and all that. ;) 16:50:18 whether the packaging is good and up to date or not 16:50:21 No way! I like it 16:50:44 so, the community has now standardized on quicklisp? 16:50:53 are there any alternatives? 16:51:05 faheem: none of them are any good. 16:51:14 H4ns: ok, thanks 16:51:17 faheem: i think some other linux distros are better at packaging up lisp libraries 16:51:37 H4ns: none of the alternatives to QL, you mean? 16:51:42 Xach: Like? 16:51:42 faheem: yes. 16:51:55 gentoo perhaps? 16:52:15 GoZoner [~GoZoner@137.79.197.70] has joined #lisp 16:52:32 faheem: Quicklisp is pretty much the standard way to get Lisp code now it would seem, yes. 16:52:47 Not sure. Maybe gentoo. I've just heard advocates of their favorite system saying that they have up-to-date stuff where debian doesn't. 16:52:49 faheem: Incidentally, there is a cl-quicklisp package in Debian, but it doesn't do much... 16:52:50 ok, i'll give it another try. someone once said that i could report QL problems here. Is that still the case? 16:53:00 debian is my favorite system, but i use quicklisp to get libraries 16:53:06 faheem: sure, here, or in #quicklisp 16:53:19 Odin-: yes, i just installed that -> cl-quicklisp. 16:53:36 is there any reason not to use the QL debian package? 16:53:38 -!- cpc26 [~cpc26@fsf/member/cpc26] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:53:40 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-50-159-9-43.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: innertracks] 16:53:44 If there are problems with it, I can't help you. 16:53:52 And I like to help. 16:53:53 paul0 [~paul0@177.16.144.88] has joined #lisp 16:54:09 Xach: ok. and I am talking to the author of quicklisp I presume? 16:54:18 that's me 16:54:23 Xach: Last I knew, it really just provided the quickstart file. 16:54:34 I recommend getting the quickstart file from http://beta.quicklisp.org/quicklisp.lisp 16:54:46 Then load it with (load "quicklisp.lisp") in your favorite CL implementation. 16:54:46 Xach: ok, i'll try that. thanks. 16:55:27 shridhar [Shridhar@nat/redhat/x-mcjabrdvohpobdtc] has joined #lisp 16:55:28 Xach: ok 16:56:07 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@176.62.101.37] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 16:56:17 is that how most people do this? so, nobody using the ql debian package? 16:56:45 faheem: The Debian package only includes the quickstart file. :p 16:56:59 Odin-: ok. 16:57:21 Odin-: yes, so I see. 16:58:24 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:59:00 -!- Kruppe [~jcp@laforge.cs.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 16:59:12 v0|d`` [~user@static-40-37-68-212.sadecehosting.net] has joined #lisp 16:59:16 judging the readme, this binary package doesn't buy one much. wonder why it is spackaged 16:59:23 -!- v0|d` [~user@static-40-37-68-212.sadecehosting.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:59:26 In a REPL: 16:59:27 (load #p"/usr/share/cl-quicklisp/quicklisp.lisp") 16:59:29 hmm 16:59:59 ok, trying the upstream version then 16:59:59 Code_Man` [~Code_Man@2a02:1205:c69d:5f80:223:54ff:fe38:82c2] has joined #lisp 17:00:24 faheem: If I had to guess, one part of it would've been trying to kick the rest of Debian's CL packaging a bit. 17:00:57 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:01:02 Odin-: not quite following. "kick the rest ... a bit"? 17:01:03 you use the quicklisp.lisp when you install it the first time 17:01:11 after it you use the quicklisp/setup.lisp file 17:01:13 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 17:01:22 oleo: after that i assume it sits in the image? 17:01:34 -!- ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@li283-143.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:01:41 oleo: what is quicklisp/setup.lisp ? 17:01:50 matija [~user@188-230-151-39.dynamic.t-2.net] has joined #lisp 17:02:18 faheem: The installed location. See quicklisp.org 17:02:28 Odin-: ok 17:02:53 any plans to move this out of beta? 17:03:07 faheem, you first download a quicklisp.lisp file from quicklisp.org, after loading it in your image and installing it you get the dir structure quicklisp in your home dir 17:03:26 -!- aftersha_ [~textual@h-243-81.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 17:03:32 faheem: eventually 17:03:57 oleo: ok. is there any option where to put it, or is that hardwired? 17:03:58 next time you start your image you use the setup.lisp file in that quicklisp/ dir to load quicklisp which does not reinstall it.... 17:04:01 -!- _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:7034:6ce:d8be:15a8] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:04:07 Xach: ok 17:04:13 faheem: you can put it anywhere you like at installation time, or just rename the place you installed it after the fact. 17:04:15 oleo: ok, i'll try it 17:04:25 Xach: ok, thanks 17:05:19 _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:281c:caf6:40c0:e857] has joined #lisp 17:05:19 you can retain the quicklisp.lisp for other purposes..... 17:05:27 for later re-use or some such.... 17:05:49 -!- aftershave [~textual@h-243-81.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 17:05:59 i do backups from time to time anyway.... 17:06:08 aftershave [~textual@h-243-81.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 17:06:13 oleo: ok. 17:06:16 Harag [~Thunderbi@ti-224-104-169.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:06:24 Kruppe [~jcp@laforge.cs.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 17:06:24 for my quicklisp/ dir and any other worthfull scripts 17:06:35 nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 17:06:41 for questions, is this channel or #quicklisp better, or does it not matter? 17:07:31 If it is very quicklispy and not very common lispy, i suggest #quicklisp. 17:07:47 btw, i have a CCL debian package that the Debian ftpmasters are ignoring. Is there anyone here who happens to care? 17:07:50 Email also works in a pinch 17:08:16 Xach: not clear on the quicklispy vs common lispy distinction. 17:08:18 faheem: I try never to get lisp stuff from debian. I think many people here feel the same way. Someone, somewhere may care! 17:08:30 Xach: bummer 17:08:35 beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-142-79.w90-38.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:08:51 Good evening everyone! 17:08:57 hej beach :) 17:09:04 p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:09:08 i can put the initial quicklisp.lisp file anywhere? 17:09:27 faheem: yes. 17:09:37 Xach: ok, thanks 17:10:28 H4ns: Is there currently a person I can ask to give me permission on the home directories and files of McCLIM and SICL on cl.net? 17:10:46 foom: I updated the SICL page for you on common-lisp.net :) 17:10:47 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 17:10:56 herobeach 17:11:46 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 17:12:01 *beach* finally remembered his password on cl.net. 17:13:10 p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:13:41 -!- michael_lee [~michael_l@113.132.82.66] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:14:10 was it herobeach ? 17:14:14 (: 17:14:32 Not quite! :) 17:14:41 oofya [~user@24.20.187.81.in-addr.arpa] has joined #lisp 17:15:37 how do you increase the number of decimal places returned by math functions, e.g. SQRT 17:15:56 oofya: Hand it a double float as argument. 17:16:50 -!- GoZoner [~GoZoner@137.79.197.70] has quit [Quit: Gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 17:17:37 -!- arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-zhbijcyklqlcqvpt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:19:17 beach: how do you write a double float? 17:19:42 use `d' as the exponent marker. 17:19:50 (sqrt 234.234d0) 17:19:53 for example 17:20:23 beach: thanks 17:20:24 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:20:29 oofya: Anytime! 17:20:32 Hmm. 17:21:15 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:22:05 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 17:22:26 I wonder if there's a sensible way of dealing with computable numbers for "intermediate representation". 17:22:49 Seems doubtful. So horribly, horribly general. 17:24:25 Odin-: Not sure I understand what you want to do. Explain a bit more! 17:24:30 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 17:25:29 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:25:56 hi beach 17:27:10 beach: how can you generate double floats programmatically? Say I want to compute the square root of every integer between 1 and 1000, treating them all as double floats? 17:27:37 (coerce i 'double-float) 17:27:38 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-flrcpazfzfvysdyc] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:27:44 clhs coerce 17:27:44 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_coerce.htm 17:27:59 beach: fab 17:28:11 beach: Well, you know what the computable numbers are? 17:28:16 yes 17:28:37 GoZoner [~GoZoner@137.79.197.70] has joined #lisp 17:29:30 You want a representation for each one of them? 17:29:47 [potentially] 17:31:09 The logarithmic and trigonometric functions all deliver computable numbers when given computable numbers for input IIRC. It's thus theoretically possible to do a sequence of those calculations, and then get an arbitrary accurate result. 17:31:15 The inefficencies, of course, are mindboggling. 17:31:21 -!- GoZoner [~GoZoner@137.79.197.70] has quit [Client Quit] 17:31:50 Odin-: OK, I understand a bit more. I have no solution for you though. :) 17:32:07 Sorry, just brought on by the "get more decimals by using a larger finite representation" comment. :) 17:32:18 Yes, I see that now. 17:32:34 (Which does rounding twice, instead of the once that can (in theory) be done.) 17:33:06 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@91.176.59.158] has joined #lisp 17:33:11 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@91.176.59.158] has quit [Changing host] 17:33:12 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 17:33:21 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:33:55 k-stz [~user@HSI-KBW-095-208-250-005.hsi5.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 17:34:25 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@107.201.5.56] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:35:19 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 17:37:28 slyrus [~chatzilla@107.201.5.56] has joined #lisp 17:37:56 beach: thanks. I was actually hoping that its implementation of format would be simple to modify to preserve primitives (e.g. numbers/string parts) instead of formatting everything to a string. But its impl is unfortunately quite complicated as well, and it doesn't look very easy to make that change. 17:38:34 foom: Sorry about that! :) 17:40:00 beach: heh. beach: my use-case wasn't what you were aiming for, of course. :) 17:40:03 I think I may want to just only support a subset of format to make my life simpler. 17:40:03 -!- matko [~matko@ip82-139-125-221.lijbrandt.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:40:37 foomat! 17:40:44 Heh! 17:40:45 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:41:04 p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:41:06 foom: What do you mean by "preserve primitives"? 17:41:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-24-109.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:42:10 (log "I have ~D entries" 5) -> (list ) 17:42:40 Denommus [~user@unaffiliated/denommus] has joined #lisp 17:42:41 I see. 17:42:49 QwertyDragon [~chatzilla@pool-173-76-7-69.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:21 ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@88.231.35.97] has joined #lisp 17:44:25 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@107.201.5.56] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:46:40 cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has joined #lisp 17:46:46 pierre1_ [~pierre1@179.218.154.208] has joined #lisp 17:47:32 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:49:59 -!- Nshag [~shag@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:50:38 Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 17:51:34 -!- kanru [~kanru@118-163-10-190.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:55:08 -!- jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:57:30 it's fun that (at least) sbcl lets you use a literal nul for a name your source code. :) 17:59:05 (defvar |*^@*| 0) ;; where ^@ is actually the single character NUL, not two characters 17:59:46 jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has joined #lisp 18:01:02 -!- ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@88.231.35.97] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:02:00 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-24-109.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:02:07 -!- nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-herafykjcnbdvjuz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:02:22 nydel [nydel@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-xcqclgqkiifagikf] has joined #lisp 18:02:37 -!- drewc [~drewc@S0106c8d71945c789.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:04:27 -!- davazp [~user@177.Red-83-63-237.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:08:34 drewc [~drewc@S0106c8d71945c789.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 18:09:21 mhd [~mhd@164.sub-70-211-28.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 18:09:31 -!- uzoZzzleeping is now known as uzo 18:12:19 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:14:17 -!- mhd [~mhd@164.sub-70-211-28.myvzw.com] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 18:15:47 -!- jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:16:04 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:18:06 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@c-24-18-244-51.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:18:24 -!- bocaneri [~bocaneri_@about/linux/staff/sauvin] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:18:59 -!- jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:19:28 -!- nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: bai] 18:19:46 jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has joined #lisp 18:21:48 _paul0 [~paul0@187.112.64.24] has joined #lisp 18:21:59 -!- paul0 [~paul0@177.16.144.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:22:22 ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@88.231.35.97] has joined #lisp 18:23:14 jasom [~aidenn@ip70-191-80-19.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 18:31:20 foom: all implementations allow it but abcl. 18:31:38 #\nul is a character like any other. 18:32:05 jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:33:00 -!- pierre1_ [~pierre1@179.218.154.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:34:04 The quicklisp instructions say to do -> (quicklisp-quickstart:install) 18:34:04 pjb: yea, it's just...surprising to allow in source code. 18:34:16 after downloading quicklisp.lisp 18:34:36 but one needs to first load the quicklisp file, right? 18:34:39 nope. What's surprizing and error prone, is to not allow it because it's used as a string terminator. 18:34:58 foom: the bizarre and crazy is not inside here, it's outside! 18:35:04 -!- _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:281c:caf6:40c0:e857] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:35:28 faheem: "To install Quicklisp, download quicklisp.lisp and load it." 18:35:36 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 18:35:38 not nul in particular 18:35:46 all control characters 18:35:48 _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:6c2d:cc71:d8f:3e81] has joined #lisp 18:36:09 you shouldn't be allowed to use literal control characters in a source file. 18:36:26 Yeah, stupid newlines 18:36:29 And tabs 18:36:48 (And page breaks, in some cases.) 18:36:52 jasom: so, the (quicklisp-quickstart:install) is after the loading step, right? 18:36:57 faheem: yes 18:37:05 jasom: ok, thanks 18:37:18 faheem: IIRC it will prompt you to run (quicklisp-quickstart:install) when you load the quicklisp.lisp file 18:37:22 -!- jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:37:25 foom: there shouldn't be any control code amongst characters. Again, the bizarre and crazy is to mix the character type with the control type. 18:37:30 jasom: it does 18:37:44 (both a fundamental defect of ASCII, and the reason why it was so successful). 18:38:09 foom: but also remember that ASCII is meant for Information Interchange, not for data storage. :-p 18:38:27 does (quicklisp-quickstart:install) hop on to the network? it seems to be just hanging 18:38:48 foom: some encodings map codes 0-31 to some useful graphic characters, cf. eg. MacRoman. 18:38:51 faheem: yes it uses the network 18:39:13 Uh huh. 18:39:17 But Unicode extended Iso-8859-1 which extended ASCII, so we're left with those so called "control" characters. 18:39:23 jasom: hmm, don't see any network activity. i'll wait 18:39:47 i suppose it is probably trying to fetch cache information 18:39:59 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:40:03 ; Fetching # 18:40:09 ^^^ you should see something like that 18:40:19 Sure, I remember in the DOS days, when the output driver interpreted the control characters, but there were also characters mapped to those codes, which you could only use by poking them directly into the screen's memory buffer, or something like that. 18:40:34 But now we have unicode, and you don't have to worry about that anymore. 18:40:35 0 and 1 were smiley faces I think 18:40:36 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 18:40:46 faheem: It should be pretty quick, it set up almost instantly on a rasberry pi under ccl for me the other day. 18:40:57 jangle [~jimmy1984@c-76-100-229-244.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:42:28 faheem: if you have a proxy on your network, and you don't tell quicklisp about it, quicklisp not work. 18:43:20 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:45:23 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 18:47:28 msmith1 [~msmit297@23.31.147.162] has joined #lisp 18:48:59 *Xach* just updated the faq with links to the recent authenticating proxy post 18:49:51 jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:49:54 -!- zoek1 [~zoek1@187.135.7.164] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 18:50:47 foom: for more fun, use #\Line_Separator instead of #\Newline :-) 18:51:32 faheem: if you interrupt it, what is at the top of the stack? 18:51:56 Hi all. Can someone tell me what I am missing? http://paste.lisp.org/+318Q 18:52:08 snits [~snits@inet-hqmc02-o.oracle.com] has joined #lisp 18:52:46 simple regex problem 18:53:08 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:53:19 msmith1: that's not the interface of scan-to-strings. maybe register-groups-bind would be closer to what you want. 18:53:36 or you could use the second value of scan-to-strings 18:53:53 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 18:54:18 msmith1: http://paste.lisp.org/+318Q/1 18:55:28 msmith1: the answer is to use the REPL with subexpressions. 18:55:33 Build your code bottom up! 18:56:40 yzzyx``, Xach : no, no proxy. 18:57:05 Xach: dumb question, but how do i interrupt it? 18:57:16 varjag [uid4973@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mnaoikafgturmbgy] has joined #lisp 18:57:27 Ctrl-C 18:58:04 this is from inside slime/swank. is that a problem? 18:58:29 and yes, it is just hanging. i'll try the command line 18:59:48 ok, i'm confused. I first ran (load #p"/usr/local/share/common-lisp/quicklisp/quicklisp.lisp") in CCL 19:00:13 It told me to run (quicklisp-quickstart:install) as expected 19:00:29 When I did so, it threw an error: 19:00:30 ? (quicklisp-quickstart:install) 19:00:30 > Error: Quicklisp has already been installed. Load #P"/home/faheem/quicklisp/setup.lisp" instead. 19:00:34 > While executing: QUICKLISP-QUICKSTART:INSTALL, in process listener(1). 19:01:11 pjb, Xach: yeah I guess that was easy enough to see if run from the repl 19:01:26 -!- jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:01:58 hmm, maybe the quicklisp install in the home directory is a one-time thing, independent of implementation? 19:02:03 if so, the docs should mention it. 19:02:04 pnpuff [~ln@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 19:03:02 faheem: yes, once you've installed quicklisp on say, ccl, it doesn't need to be installed again for sbcl or clisp, for e.g. 19:03:19 You might want to run ql:add-to-init-file on those other lisps, though. 19:03:54 -!- pnpuff [~ln@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 19:04:05 yzzyx``: Does the (quicklisp-quickstart:install) pull a bunch of stuff off the network too? or just write some files to the home directory? 19:04:36 if so, suppose the network fails, would it notice subsequently? 19:04:37 no idea. it does "magic". at the end of it i got some files in the home directory. 19:04:44 yzzyx``: ok 19:04:54 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-142-79.w90-38.abo.wanadoo.fr] has left #lisp 19:05:12 yes, looked like it pulled down some stuff from beta.quicklisp.org 19:05:16 but suppose it didn't. 19:05:46 so, one should not run (quicklisp-quickstart:install) from inside an slime repl? 19:05:59 it worked ok on the cl with ccl 19:07:09 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:08:49 not sure, i've not tried that, I've always set it up outside of slime. I've had it say that "quicklisp is already installed" when i was installing it on openshift (my configuration problem). In that situation, rm'ing the quicklisp directory allowed me to have another shot. 19:09:52 it's possible it entered a restart and for whatever reason couldn't display it to you within slime, and now everything's gone to pot. 19:09:57 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:11:44 yzzyx``: it's possible. it didn't show anything 19:11:50 in slime, that is 19:12:23 faheem: i've never set it up (for ccl) outside of slime well (except when building VM with packer) 19:12:33 adrians [4ac80791@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.200.7.145] has joined #lisp 19:12:40 try doing an rm -rf ~/quicklisp and then load it from the command line, that might at least rule out slime being the eater of messages. 19:13:09 Any cl-ppcre experts around? 19:13:42 jack_rabbit [~jack_rabb@c-24-7-197-106.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:13:55 Are there any tools for aiding in porting code from cltl1 to ansi CL? 19:14:16 wow, there's any such code still left? 19:14:25 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:16:09 zickzackv [~faot@p5DDB0F23.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 19:17:04 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-175-2-214.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:17:54 zajn [~zajn@108.205.50.54] has joined #lisp 19:18:53 foom: clicc 19:20:16 optikalmouse [~omouse@69-165-245-60.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 19:21:03 -!- ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:21:30 huh, never heard of it before; how is it different than clisp, which also compiles lisp to C? 19:21:41 foom: clisp doesn't compile lisp to C 19:21:49 foom: clisp compiles lisp to bytecode 19:22:21 davazp [~user@177.Red-83-63-237.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 19:22:29 ecl compiles lisp to C, but ecl is a common lisp environment; I want something suitable for cross-compilation 19:22:51 Oh, yes, ECL. 19:24:29 -!- ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@88.231.35.97] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:25:07 ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@li283-143.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 19:25:15 I was hoping to use clicc plus emscripten to run common-lisp code in the browser 19:25:19 Well, when you use clisp to bootstrap sbcl, clisp compiles to native code 19:25:30 all right, sbcl running over clisp. 19:25:58 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:26:16 That's like saying "When you use gw-basic to push machine-code into ram, gw-basic compiles to native code..." 19:26:18 -!- ck`` [~ck@dslb-094-219-236-112.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:26:49 pnpuff [~ln@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 19:26:49 On a von-neumann architecture, any language capable of outputing arbitrary binary data can output native code 19:27:05 there's nothing intrinsic to clisp that compiles to byte code: the clisp compiler is a single source file, you can run any other compiler on clisp. 19:27:08 If you could compile to JS directly, instead of a VM in JS, you could reuse JS's gc and other nice things like that. 19:27:30 ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has joined #lisp 19:27:36 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 19:27:39 pjb: so clisp could be easily modified to compile to machine code? 19:27:53 And it's so easy to compile to JS directly: you only have to implement 25 special operators, and perhaps revise 69 macros. 19:28:04 prxq: Of course. 19:28:13 It even has a JITC. 19:28:30 is there an easy way to catch errors in hunchentoot and redirect them to slime as a restart? 19:28:32 pjb: last I checked, there was no CL implementation that was trivially portable to javascript; are you suggesting clisp is? 19:28:55 I'm suggesting that it shouldn't be too hard to write a trivially portable CL implementation. 19:29:00 jasom: can't you compile to LLVM using ECL and then porting to emscripten? 19:29:20 pjb: I use the fact that one doesn't exist as empirical evidence that it's hard 19:30:31 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:30:34 Denommus: maybe; "LLVM" isn't really a target as much as an IR since most compilers output machine-specific things to the bytecode 19:30:58 bhyde: to be clear -> "i've never set it up (for ccl) outside of slime". so you have always run it inside slime? 19:31:10 Denommus: and then you still have to quantify when ECL will want to invoke a C compiler, since you don't have one available at runtime 19:31:53 pjb: you also need to implement a lot of primitive functions. 19:32:15 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:32:22 faheem: it is extremely rare that I fire up lisp from the command line, so it really wouldn't occur me to setup quicklisp in that way 19:32:49 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:33:24 adrians: probably better to just ask your question than to make us all examine whether or not we are cl-ppcre experts 19:34:27 bhyde: ok, so from inside slime should be no problem then. wonder what i was doing wrong 19:34:45 bhyde: thanks 19:34:53 well, I'd like to bind to named capture groups so that I can extract a bunch of matches in one shot from a smallish string. The regex I'm using is comprised of several alternations. 19:35:04 Denommus: also I'd bet good money that ECL generates things like "setjmp" that aren't supported in emscripten 19:35:10 yzzyx``: I assume you read about *CATCH-ERRORS-P* in the hunchentoot manual? 19:35:36 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 19:35:51 I've tried the following: 19:35:53 (register-groups-bind (FID-A FID-B) ("(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5}))" "zA12598 zBthe flag is blue") (list FID-B FID-A)) 19:36:10 bhyde: yes, i found that, but it doesn't appear to be working for me, do i need to restart hunchentoot for it to work? 19:36:39 I was hoping that both FID-A and FID-B would be bound, but only FID-A is 19:37:18 yzzyx``: sorry, i don't recall it's been a long while. i think there maybe another aspect r. threads and dynamic binding io etc. you might peak at *inferior-lisp* :) 19:37:31 again, this is using cl-ppcre... 19:37:43 ah, wait, yeah, you're right, i'm probably setting *catch-errors-p* in the wrong thread... 19:39:24 adrians: I get an error parsing that regex 19:39:34 Character 'F' may not follow '(?< 19:39:39 jasom: makes sense. What about that project that intended to create a CL to LLVM compiler? Who was doing it? 19:39:41 with cl-ppcre? 19:40:21 yzzyx``: i don't know if there is a search UI for these - http://lists.common-lisp.net/pipermail/tbnl-devel/ - but that's the mailing list 19:40:21 Denommus: not aware of that; there was one that would let you compile individual functions with llvm in sbcl 19:40:24 adrians: yes 19:40:43 let me check it - had to reformat it for here and might've messed things up 19:41:13 @#@#% 19:41:18 didn't have allow-named-registers on 19:41:28 bhyde: great, thanks. seems inferior-lisp is showing nothing interesting, and *catch-errors-p* is not broken... time to grovel around the archives 19:42:13 adrians: I think it is expected that only one half of an alternation will bind its registers, right? 19:42:19 adrians: how does perl handle something like that? 19:42:51 adrians: I believe you need to keep matching, I think you essentially match the first hen stop. Still not sure it would work even then 19:42:57 no, my expectation is that all, but not with that regex - let me give you another 19:43:10 register-groups-bind (FID-A FID-B) ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA12598 zBthe flag is blue") (list FID-B FID-A)) 19:43:20 yzzyx``: might help: https://www.google.com/#q=site:lists.common-lisp.net+*catch-errors-p*+hunchentoot+debug 19:43:59 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:53 -!- zickzackv [~faot@p5DDB0F23.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:45:05 -!- cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:46:26 fiveop [~fiveop@p5DDC79F5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 19:46:28 adrians: again each register is in a different side of an alternation 19:46:37 adrians: I think you are going to be happier with all-matches / all-matches as strings. Alternatively you can use filters: http://weitz.de/cl-ppcre/#filters 19:46:38 -!- jangle [~jimmy1984@c-76-100-229-244.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: jangle] 19:47:07 I'm getting errors when I try to run (load #P"/home/faheem/quicklisp/setup.lisp") inside sbcl now 19:47:26 do-register-groups might do what you want 19:48:09 adrians: cl-ppcre:parse-string might be useful 19:48:13 (cl-ppcre:do-register-groups (a b) ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA123598 zBthe flag is blue") (print (or a b))) 19:48:18 bobbysmith007: the problem is that in the string I'm searching, there will usually be only a subset of the full set of matches possible and their order will be indeterminate 19:48:43 so if I don't use named groups, things get messy 19:49:27 of course, I could break down the compound regex and apply each alternation in sequence, but this is what I'd like to optimize 19:49:28 adrians: don't forget you still need to map named-groups to register numbers; register-groups-bind doesn't bind based on the name 19:49:44 *bhyde* muses that he uses esrap rather than cl-ppcre as surprising amount 19:49:45 jasom: it seems to 19:50:07 proche [~proche@95.215.140.33] has joined #lisp 19:50:12 nop0x07bc [~pon1980@h107n8-aepv-d7.ias.bredband.telia.com] has joined #lisp 19:50:29 adrians: then I think you definitely want to use filters... they allow you to execute arbitrary code during the execution of the regexp 19:50:45 adrians: oh, so it does. I learned something new today 19:51:53 jasom: the problem I'm seeing is that the search stops after one alternation is matched instead of keeping on going 19:51:57 how strange, if i invoke hunchentoot:maybe-invoke-debugger with a condition, it works, but if i (error X), it doesn't. hunchentoot:maybe-invoke-debugger itself is responding well to changing *catch-errors-p*. 19:52:16 ustunozg_ [~ustunozgu@88.231.35.97] has joined #lisp 19:52:17 adrians: yes, it stops after one match. That's what match does 19:52:21 bobbysmith007: I'll give that a go if I can't do what I need with the register binding 19:52:23 nug700 [~nug700@71-37-219-192.phnx.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:29 is there some portable way of getting the current working directory? 19:52:36 using cl-fad, perhaps? 19:53:11 adrians: (cl-ppcre:do-register-groups (fid-b fid-a) ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA123598 zBthe flag is blue") (print (list fid-a fid-b))) 19:53:42 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 19:53:43 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 19:53:43 I was just going to mention that function 19:54:07 jasom: tried it, but I guess I don't know what I'm doing, because it didn't seem to work 19:54:26 (uiop:getcwd) 19:54:27 adrians: did you see what my example printed? 19:54:37 faheem: uiop 19:55:00 -!- jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:55:13 -!- ustunozgur [~ustunozgu@li283-143.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:55:28 jasom: yes, looks kind of like what I want - have to figure out how I get the right bits from that 19:55:48 mk2 [~martin@p57AE6ACD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 19:56:00 I guess I just get the whole set of matched lists and pick out the non-nil ones 19:56:57 jasom: thanks for the help 19:57:17 jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has joined #lisp 19:57:30 adrians: (let ((result nil)) (cl-ppcre:do-register-groups (fid-b fid-a) ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA123598 zBthe flag is blue" result) (when fid-b (push (cons :fid-b fid-b) result)) (when fid-a (push (cons :fid-a fid-a) result)))) 19:57:36 bhyde: , jasom thanks 19:57:38 -!- davazp [~user@177.Red-83-63-237.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:57:46 -!- pnpuff [~ln@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 19:58:26 adrians: you can probably write a macro to generate something along those lines fairly easily 19:58:33 jasom: the names are swapped - is that just a mixup? 19:58:37 aha, duh, i was overloading handle-request rather than acceptor-dispatch-request, now everything is peachy again. 19:58:55 adrians: and if you use a plist instead of an alist then you can destructuring-bind it 19:59:09 I mean the values are bound to the incorrect names 19:59:12 Is there a fast way to read 16Mbytes of complex double-float from a file into an array? I tried read-sequence but with-open-file will not work with (complex double-float) as element-type. (I'm using SBCL) 20:00:23 adrians: it does appear that register-groups-bind does not match based on name 20:00:34 hmm 20:00:37 adrians: so it's just because I had fid-a and fid-b in the wrong order on do-register-groups 20:00:55 cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has joined #lisp 20:00:59 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:01:00 adrians: again, you ought to be able to write a macro that maps the names to numbers and generates the bindings correctly 20:01:53 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 20:02:05 -!- ggole [~ggole@124-148-123-228.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [] 20:02:31 *jaimef* hunts for a portable recursive directory handling 20:03:30 jasom adrians: that would seem to be what the doc is implying when it says "the scanner doesn't capture any information about named groups you have to store the second value returned from CREATE-SCANNER yourself" 20:03:45 http://weitz.de/cl-ppcre/#*allow-named-registers* 20:05:39 jasom: I'm not sure what they're proposing - does it mean that I have to map the names of the capture groups that the binding function outputs to numeric values so that I can then use the correct ordinal value when doing a register-groups-bind? 20:06:15 bhyde: thanks, but I'm using that flag - without that you can't even have named groups 20:06:52 -!- chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:07:21 adrians: the link was to make it easier to find the bit I quoted about the limit on scanning 20:08:07 nipra [~nipra@122.177.181.178] has joined #lisp 20:08:31 -!- nop0x07bc [~pon1980@h107n8-aepv-d7.ias.bredband.telia.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 20:10:22 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:11:09 bhyde: BTW, thanks for the heads-up on esrap 20:11:42 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:13:17 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:15:18 adrians: http://paste.lisp.org/+318R 20:15:32 adrians: there's a first stab at a macro to bind named registers 20:15:54 adrians: note that you need to make sure cl-ppcre:*allow-named-registers* is bound to t at macroexpand time 20:16:08 (that could be incorporated into the macro, I suppose) 20:16:17 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 20:16:26 sohail [~sohail@75-119-248-79.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 20:16:26 -!- sohail [~sohail@75-119-248-79.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Changing host] 20:16:26 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 20:19:03 jasom: thank for that - is the signature of that macro expected to be the same as for register-groups-bind? 20:19:26 not at all 20:19:44 (bind-named-registers ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA123598 zBthe flag is blue") (list fid-b fid-a)) 20:19:55 adrians: a nice thing about esrap is that you can develop bottom up in the repl: 20:20:02 (defrule za (and "zA" (string 6)) (:lambda (x) `(za ,(parse-integer (second x))))) 20:20:07 (parse 'za "zA123456") 20:21:55 jasom: was the macro supposed to work as is or this is just a suggestion? I'm not getting the two named groups output... 20:22:34 adrians: it works like register-groups-bind except the name of the variables bound is the name of the named-registers 20:23:02 bhyde: that looks good/interesting 20:23:21 *bhyde* thinks jasom is currently writing bind-named-registers :) 20:23:47 so this: "(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" (NIL "12") is the expected output? 20:23:56 that's what I got 20:24:45 adrians: yup. Just pointing out that register-groups-bind doesn't bind based on the name of the registers. The macro I posted does 20:25:10 sunwukong [~vukung@catv-86-101-32-210.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 20:25:31 jasom: ok, but it wasn't meant to bind to all names then? 20:25:51 adrians: it doesn't change the way regexes match, no. 20:26:37 ok, got it - I guess I should be able to use something like it with do-register-groups to get all matches, no? 20:26:54 -!- proche [~proche@95.215.140.33] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:27:45 adrians: yeah. I would just take the source for do-register-groups and modify it. On the other hand, bhyde is right that you probably want to actually parse things, not hack something together with regexes 20:28:31 jasom: I understand - I'll take a look at esrap too 20:29:02 jasom, bhyde: thanks to both of you - much appreciated 20:30:19 bhyde: do you recommend esrap-liquid over plain esrap? 20:30:31 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 20:32:05 adrians: http://paste.lisp.org/+318R/1 <-- do-named-registers 20:32:45 anyway adrians neither one of those macros is debugged or really tested much at all; just what I wrote off the top of my head (and I'm not much of a macrologist) 20:33:01 -!- jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 20:33:18 jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has joined #lisp 20:35:02 jasom: with the same args as for the other macros, I only get nil output 20:35:19 mk2: with-open-file will give you a stream of characters or integers/bytes (for binary file formats), and the caller is expected to do it's own interpretation of those elementary elements 20:36:00 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:36:13 but I can probably figure out what to do from what you provided - I'm a total CL noob, but I think I should manage 20:36:29 (let ((result nil)) (do-named-registers ("(?:(?:zA(?\\d\\d))|(?:zB(?.{5})))+" "zA123598 zBthe flag is blue" result) (when fid-a (push (cons :fid-a fid-a) result)) (when fid-b (push (cons :fid-b fid-b) result)))) 20:36:43 ASau [~user@46.115.130.182] has joined #lisp 20:37:42 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 20:38:18 nop0x07bc [~pon1980@h107n8-aepv-d7.ias.bredband.telia.com] has joined #lisp 20:40:36 Today I installed quicklisp 20:40:48 Why did I wait so long? 20:40:52 jasom: nice! 20:40:55 Congratulations! You are the 10,000th installer! You win! 20:41:12 is there a way to walk a filesystem recursively? 20:41:19 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 20:41:31 cool 20:41:35 :D 20:41:47 jaimef: not a portable way. 20:42:18 zimri-lim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has joined #lisp 20:43:35 -!- zimri-lim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:44:08 zimri-lim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has joined #lisp 20:44:34 jaimef: IOLib does it for the unixes it supports 20:44:57 __prefect [~prefect@koln-4d0dde91.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 20:45:04 yeah that all requires bordeaux-threads 20:45:12 OT: what is proper plural of unix (unices, unixen unixes...) 20:45:37 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 20:46:15 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-188-180.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:46:26 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 20:46:57 Xach given android is linux I can use the *nix approach 20:49:11 whartung [~whartung@wsip-70-183-27-154.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:49:26 *jasom* didn't think iolib relied on bordeaux-threads 20:49:48 -!- alezost [~user@128-70-206-28.broadband.corbina.ru] has left #lisp 20:49:55 hmm double checking 20:50:08 It doesn't load it on my system 20:50:20 -!- __prefect [~prefect@koln-4d0dde91.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:50:51 waa [~waa@189-31-254-246.ctame700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #lisp 20:51:41 -!- zajn [~zajn@108.205.50.54] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:54:43 -!- MoALTz [~no@user-31-175-247-158.play-internet.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:57:03 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-109-193-013-113.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: conversation terminated because session stopped] 20:57:46 -!- cory786 [~cory@CK-Laptop.wifi.utoledo.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:58:38 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 20:58:47 hi, I tried: (puri:parse-uri "http://aviation-safety.net/database/dblist.php?field=typecode&var=107%&cat=%1&sorteer=datekey&page=1") 20:58:52 and I got parse error 20:59:07 bhyde: don't know if you missed my question re. esrap vs esrap-liquid. Do you recommend the latter? 20:59:16 -!- Code_Man` [~Code_Man@2a02:1205:c69d:5f80:223:54ff:fe38:82c2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:59:39 Parse error:Non-hexidecimal digits after %: %c%c. 20:59:41 what's up? 20:59:51 -!- k-stz [~user@HSI-KBW-095-208-250-005.hsi5.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has left #lisp 21:01:00 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: innertracks] 21:01:09 MightyJoe [~joe@189.224.229.242] has joined #lisp 21:01:24 puchacz: %& <-- that ought-not occur in a URI 21:01:39 jasom: thanks, so it is a valid error 21:01:41 Does anyone know if there's a lisp library something allong the lines of a 'tinyclim'. 21:03:15 Asking because there's minimal presentation package bundled in schemata (ICanCAD) which I'm thinking of extracting and making into a library. 21:03:23 -!- waa [~waa@189-31-254-246.ctame700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:03:29 But didn't want to go to the effort if it's already been done. 21:03:45 gmcastil [~user@70-59-23-72.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:04:01 -!- JuanitoJons [~jreynoso@fixed-203-69-5.iusacell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:08:20 bgs100 [~bgs@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 21:08:20 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.205.121] has joined #lisp 21:08:31 -!- ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:09:34 zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 21:09:41 slyrus [~chatzilla@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 21:11:44 adrians: sorry, i went for a walk about. i've never considered esrap-liquid :) 21:13:58 -!- adrians [4ac80791@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.200.7.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:14:27 zajn [~zajn@2607:f140:400:a002:7848:2884:7f7b:a413] has joined #lisp 21:14:43 -!- ThePhoeron [~thephoero@CPE68b6fcc5ca13-CM68b6fcc5ca10.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:16:53 ThePhoeron [~thephoero@CPE68b6fcc5ca13-CM68b6fcc5ca10.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 21:17:46 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 21:19:21 jasom: I added the dependency on bordeaux-threads years ago 21:23:21 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:24:42 matko [~matko@ip82-139-125-221.lijbrandt.net] has joined #lisp 21:25:48 -!- nipra [~nipra@122.177.181.178] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:26:37 RazLaptop3 [~Intertric@c-50-140-3-247.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:27:15 Is it possible to compile lisp code in ClozureCL into a .dll to use in a C or Python program? 21:28:06 RazLaptop3: perhaps better asked on #ccl. 21:28:13 pjb, ahh ok thanks 21:28:49 -!- _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:6c2d:cc71:d8f:3e81] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:29:55 _8680_ [~8680@2002:4404:712c:0:2cf5:8a4c:b6bc:24a0] has joined #lisp 21:31:36 mindCrime_ [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 21:31:45 -!- mindCrime [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:32:18 -!- jaimef [jaimef@166.84.6.60] has quit [Excess Flood] 21:33:13 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:33:16 waa [~waa@189-31-254-246.ctame700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #lisp 21:33:43 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@p5DDC79F5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 21:33:45 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:33:54 jeti` [~user@p57AECDCA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 21:34:32 -!- mindCrime_ [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:34:50 mindCrime_ [~prhodes@rrcs-98-101-159-194.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 21:37:23 -!- mk2 [~martin@p57AE6ACD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #lisp 21:38:19 Natalia30 [~Natalia30@67.221.255.55] has joined #lisp 21:39:19 jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has joined #lisp 21:39:45 -!- Natalia30 [~Natalia30@67.221.255.55] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:43:52 fe[nl]ix: when I do an (asdf:load-system :iolib/os :verbose t) it doesn't show bordeaux-threads being loaded... 21:43:57 theseb [~cs@74.194.237.26] has joined #lisp 21:44:07 -!- add^_ [~user@m176-70-197-33.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:44:17 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:44:26 RazLaptop3: I believe ecl allows building .dlls that can be loaded into C 21:47:33 duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has joined #lisp 21:47:45 There *may* be some reasons schemers prefer macro hygeine but i prefer CL's defmacro with gensym....that is just as safe right? 21:48:03 (when used wisely/appropriately) 21:48:22 theseb: it's more complicated than that 21:48:42 theseb: (defmacro foo () `(bar)) (labels ((bar () ...)) (foo)) 21:48:49 -!- RazLaptop3 [~Intertric@c-50-140-3-247.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:49:58 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-50-137-36-57.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:50:01 zeroish [~zeroish@135.207.141.202] has joined #lisp 21:50:22 theseb: Denommus's example is solved in CL basically by having packages; if you locally redefine functions in other packages, then you better know what you're doing 21:50:30 jasom: it's :iolib/sockets that depends on bordeaux-threads 21:50:53 fe[nl]ix: right, and I was suggesting functionality in iolib/os 21:52:15 theseb: to see why scheme has macro hygeine, remember that scheme doesn't have packages like common-lisp's packages and it's also a lisp-1 so (defun foo () ...) (defmacro bar () (foo)) (defun baz (foo) (bar) ...) <-- in a lisp-1 without packages you're in trouble 21:53:39 now the same problem comes up in lisp-2 (though more rarely), so just being a lisp-2 isn't enough to have sane macros, but the package system solves the problem in a way that makes sense 21:53:57 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-91-224.w83-199.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3-dev] 21:54:01 zimrilim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has joined #lisp 21:54:41 -!- matija [~user@188-230-151-39.dynamic.t-2.net] has left #lisp 21:54:45 is the (foo) in the macro supposed to be quoted? 21:54:53 Bike: yes 21:55:02 ok, makes sense. 21:56:32 -!- zimrilim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has left #lisp 21:56:34 zimrilim [~quassel@12.250.157.102] has joined #lisp 21:57:33 hopefully if you use FLET or LABELS to shadow a function in your own package, you know about it when you write the macro, and if you FLET or LABELS to shadow a function in someone elses' package, you know what you're doing well enough for macros that rely on the definition of it to still work. 21:57:39 -!- ASau [~user@46.115.130.182] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:58:12 -!- developernotes [~developer@173-29-199-75.client.mchsi.com] has quit [] 21:58:23 But the people who went through all those gyrations for hygenic macros in scheme aren't stupid, with the way scheme treats symbols, "just use gensym" isn't enough for safe macros 21:58:44 -!- zajn [~zajn@2607:f140:400:a002:7848:2884:7f7b:a413] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59:11 With the way common-lisp treats symbols, "just use gensym" *is* enough (with my above "hopefully..." statement as the caveat) 21:59:44 what does scheme do differntly? 21:59:46 <|3b|> CL also forbids local or global redefinition of functions in CL package, which also reduces the cases where it might be a problem 22:00:11 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.205.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:00:27 |3b|: It does, but that's kind of hand-wavy since lots of software depends on semantically equivalent definitions of functions in their libraries as well 22:00:59 "just use gensym" is enough, if you use it for local variables and local functions. 22:01:22 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:02:00 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 22:02:42 nightfly: I'm not a scheme expert (or even beginner) but my understanding is the reader interns all symbols to a global namespace. 22:04:46 jasom: if i'm not mistaken....gensym protects from variable collisions...what remains is protection from people doing stuff like redefining builtin symbols right? 22:05:13 ASau [~user@46.115.130.182] has joined #lisp 22:05:39 jasom: isn't that what all your examples boil down to? 22:05:51 theseb: builtins and non-builtins 22:06:11 It is perfectly valid that I might want a local variable and name it the same thing as some function that some macro I call uses 22:06:18 and it need not be builtin 22:06:44 What remains is not ever accidentally using a global name for a local variable 22:06:57 jasom: yea 22:07:03 that's a better way to say it 22:07:28 and that's essentially impossible if you have only one namespace. 22:08:04 i'm writing my own lisp strictly for my own purposes so it seems i can just live with that "risk" and remember to be careful w/ my local var names no? 22:08:25 is that so bad? 22:08:49 defmacro is just soooo much easier conceptually than having to learn/implement hygeine 22:08:51 theseb: I personally think it's a Bad Idea, since it will eventually run into problems, but lots of small lisps do it 22:09:17 hy has this problem, for example 22:09:21 nisstyre [~yourstrul@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 22:10:03 -!- ASau [~user@46.115.130.182] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:10 I'm not sure the history of when this was addressed in the common-lisp ancestry, but I'm sure people were writing programs in LISP for years and just lived with the risk 22:10:41 you could also just implement syntax for "global binding of", and use that in macros as appropriate. 22:10:51 the odds of collision are much smaller with a lisp-2 since flet and labels are more rare 22:10:51 jasom: but that real ultimate ideal solution is namespaces....ok thanks 22:10:57 poor-man's-hygeine. 22:11:50 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:13:10 foom: that does make not-possible the times when you want to locally replace all calls to an fdef (even those emitted by a macro) 22:13:28 but I suppose you can macrolet too to work around that 22:14:08 jasom: it only makes it impossible if the macro wants it to be impossible, which is the point. 22:16:19 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-246-18-219.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:16:35 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:17:58 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 22:18:11 ndrei [~avo@83.142.149.227] has joined #lisp 22:18:33 ASau [~user@46.115.130.182] has joined #lisp 22:19:37 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:20:20 -!- duggiefresh [~duggiefre@64.119.141.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:22:20 -!- LiamH [~healy@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:22:55 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:24:07 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:24:28 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:25:03 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:25:25 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:25:56 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:26:30 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:26:34 -!- emma [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:26:51 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:27:07 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:27:12 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:27:18 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:27:51 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:28:13 jasom, foom: say..i just thought of something.... 22:28:15 emma [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:28:37 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:28:49 jasom, foom: why not just make it against the allowed syntax to redefine global predefined vars? 22:29:11 -!- robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:29:13 jasom, foom: i.e. make it an error to try to make a local var have same name as a lisp function....won't that solve the problem cleanly? 22:29:18 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:29:41 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:30:18 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:30:20 CL does that (you can't redefine CL:CAR for example) 22:30:41 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:31:04 <_death> pjb: that brain post made me laugh.. then shriek with horror as I realized it's full of ~'s as well 22:31:22 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:31:40 -!- jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:32:11 jimmyy [~jimmyy@124.150.50.136] has joined #lisp 22:33:46 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 22:34:21 -!- nand1` [~user@c-71-202-128-245.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:35:25 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@128.120.119.107] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:40:27 Alfr [~Unknown@g225071173.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 22:47:49 when quicklisp downloads stuff off the net, where does it store it? i thought /home/user/quicklisp, but after deleting from there, it seems to get it without downloading. 22:47:57 knob [~knob@cvx-ppp-66-50-133-113.coqui.net] has joined #lisp 22:49:54 <_death> it's likely you're looking for ~/.cache/common-lisp 22:49:55 -!- innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: innertracks] 22:50:22 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:51:39 cheryllium [~chatzilla@128.237.220.14] has joined #lisp 22:52:17 _death: right, i forgot it gets stored per implementation 22:52:21 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.224.236.106.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:52:41 presumably this can be used even if the original implementation is removed 22:53:27 KCL [~quassel@50.13.169.64] has joined #lisp 22:53:32 <_death> it's just where fasls go 22:54:14 _death: right 22:55:42 -!- marsbot is now known as marsam 22:56:20 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:56:22 -!- Jayk97 [~quassel@50.13.169.64] has quit [Ping timeout: 253 seconds] 22:56:23 pierre1_ [~pierre1@179.218.154.208] has joined #lisp 22:59:08 jangle [~jimmy1984@pool-108-15-111-28.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:59:37 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:00:10 -!- senj [~senj@unaffiliated/senj] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:00:27 -!- marsam is now known as marsbot 23:02:25 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 23:05:47 -!- sunwukong [~vukung@catv-86-101-32-210.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:07:52 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 23:08:04 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Client Quit] 23:08:25 -!- innertracks 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23:17:07 Sgeo [~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 23:17:16 duggiefresh [~duggiefre@c-24-60-1-249.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:20:33 hiyosi [~skip_it@126.73.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 23:20:56 MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-74-100-140-127.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:22:02 -!- duggiefresh [~duggiefre@c-24-60-1-249.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:22:13 -!- dandersen [~user@unaffiliated/dandersen] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:23:05 Code_Man` [~Code_Man@2a02:1205:c69d:5f80:223:54ff:fe38:82c2] has joined #lisp 23:23:13 _death: ~ is a normal character in lisp; (flet ((~ (x) (1- x))) (let ((~ 2)) (~ (* ~ ~)))) -> 3 23:29:22 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ed-uluka.dyn.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:30:37 <_death> pjb: I was thinking FORMAT :) 23:36:02 innertracks [~Thunderbi@c-24-17-64-212.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:41:58 -!- ndrei 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