00:00:20 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:00:42 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 00:01:54 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:01:59 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 00:02:54 -!- Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:06:05 pavelpenev: So which HTML generator on that long list is the good one (in your opinion)? 00:06:50 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 00:06:52 redline6561: 00:06:58 oops sorry 00:06:59 Aethaeryn: I use madnificent's sexml 00:11:30 ah 00:12:49 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:14:20 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:14:54 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 00:17:10 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 00:17:42 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 00:19:19 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 00:24:02 hello there lispers. i am having an issue trying to load "quicklisp.lisp" into clisp 00:24:09 http://pastebin.com/wiNpbSb2 00:24:31 if anyone has seen such an error or has any ideas, help would be greatly appreciated. 00:24:36 The hardware info is important. 00:24:43 ah right 00:25:05 I use CLISP all the time with no problems on Linux AMD64 00:25:09 + quicklisp 00:25:44 i am running on an ARM system. 512MB of RAM (it is the Raspberry Pi model B) 00:25:55 thanks Xach . 00:27:01 ARMv6 to be more precise (if that matters) 00:32:42 Does anyone use Parenscript for their JavaScript? Unfortunately, if I use the browser as a client, I will need to write a lot of client code for my game, not just server code, even though the game is styled like a board game. 00:33:09 Right now I'm just going to try to do a simple Risk clone (of which there are probably hundreds, if not thousands) just to get used to the various libraries. 00:33:24 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@108.87.21.0] has joined #lisp 00:35:16 MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-173-67-109-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:35:23 x_ [~x@pool-108-45-77-30.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:35:28 I'm basically wondering how AJAX could be done in Lisp. 00:35:34 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:35:44 -!- x_ [~x@pool-108-45-77-30.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:36:15 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.148.204.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:36:16 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 00:37:17 -!- ravster [~ravi@71-19-174-130.dedicated.allstream.net] has left #lisp 00:40:24 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 00:40:55 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 00:41:44 In order to get dynamic updating of the game content without the user having to do any actions, I think that means that some interchange format is necessary to collect data from the server, requested on the page via some language that compiles to JavaScript like Parenscript, right? 00:43:46 So it looks like Parenscript would be ideal if the server is written in Common Lisp. Does anyone with experience know if this would be the case or not? 00:44:08 Aethaeryn: we let the server handle the logic, and let the client handle the display. we've used raw javascript (with enyo), but you may be well-served with parenscript. in order to send and receive information in a remotely nice way, we built intercom, which is just some comet library. 00:46:20 madnificent: From what I've read, Parenscript should be able to use JavaScript libraries, right? So something like Comet could be usable in parenscript? Letting the server handle the logic seems ideal for games to prevent cheating. 00:46:24 if you can build enough abstractions, parenscript is likely well worth the hassle. i never got round to implementing enough of those in the past, so my parenscript-experience has been suboptimal. there is certainly something to say for using it. 00:47:01 Aethaeryn: yes, you can access them. sometimes, you may want to build a lispy wrapper for the library though. 00:47:52 Aethaeryn: Comet is a concept which allows bidirectional, long-standing, communication between server and client (thereby overcoming some of the limitations of the HTTP protocol). 00:48:07 My logic behind using Parenscript is that I'd probably use something that compiles to JS anyway, such as CoffeeScript. JavaScript seems... messy, and thus could introduce all sorts of bugs if I write enough of it, which I probably would have to if I want to move beyond a simple Risk clone. 00:48:19 Since it's a game, ideally all sorts of client-side display fanciness could be written, e.g. animations. 00:49:55 Aethaeryn: it's certainly a good thing to try and use parenscript. don't give up on it too hastily. some initial effort is needed, but there should be gain in the longer run. 00:50:09 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 00:51:15 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:52:21 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 00:54:44 -!- agumonkey [~agu@147.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:57:07 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 00:57:29 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 00:58:10 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:00:37 chameco [~samuel@cpe-67-246-131-254.stny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:03:13 spacefro1 [~spacefrog@drsd-4db3e6f3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 01:04:14 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: casion] 01:06:06 -!- spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:08:36 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.216.200.191] has left #lisp 01:09:32 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:14:49 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.216.200.191] has joined #lisp 01:15:48 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 01:16:31 -!- walter|rtn [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 01:26:14 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:26:48 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:38:36 elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has joined #lisp 01:38:40 http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=254789 01:38:46 wrong channel 01:44:50 walter|r [~walter@ip-64-134-101-130.public.wayport.net] has joined #lisp 01:54:03 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:00:01 -!- dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has quit [Quit: dreish] 02:01:35 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:04:23 Strigoides [~Strigoide@60-234-213-126.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 02:05:08 so all dead here 02:05:45 Busy hacking. 02:06:03 *Xach* publishes April quicklisp dist update, hopes he hasn't screwed up massively 02:08:59 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 02:12:14 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@76.178.163.213] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:13:04 Vicfred [~anon@187.206.19.165] has joined #lisp 02:13:12 tiglog [~topeak@61.149.226.8] has joined #lisp 02:13:23 -!- tiglog [~topeak@61.149.226.8] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:13:37 tiglog [~topeak@61.149.226.8] has joined #lisp 02:14:57 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-100-197.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:15:36 is it possible to learn lisp for someone who is lazy person ? 02:17:52 elkng: yes, but that doesn't mean it doesn't involve a lot of work, it just gets spaced out over 4 years instead of just one. 02:18:12 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.106.209] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:21:00 joshe [~joshe@opal.elsasser.org] has joined #lisp 02:21:53 elkng: Sure. A lazy person could also learn to not be lazy anymore. 02:23:56 Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 02:25:14 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:26:15 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 02:28:10 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.216.200.191] has left #lisp 02:29:05 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:29:15 -!- Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:32:03 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 02:33:06 -!- tiglog [~topeak@61.149.226.8] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:37:33 -!- dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:46:18 p_nathan [~vlion@w142148.wireless.fsr.net] has joined #lisp 02:46:37 -!- p_nathan [~vlion@w142148.wireless.fsr.net] has left #lisp 02:46:40 p_nathan [~vlion@w142148.wireless.fsr.net] has joined #lisp 02:48:37 cdidd 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[~b1rkh0ff@31.176.135.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:24:27 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:25:12 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:25:31 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 05:29:48 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 05:29:57 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-255-222.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:32:27 bsilbaugh [~user@pool-173-66-196-27.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:32:42 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 05:33:15 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:34:15 -!- bsilbaugh [~user@pool-173-66-196-27.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 05:37:44 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:37:51 Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:23 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.135.14] has joined #lisp 05:41:05 -!- [1]papyrus [~papyrus@42.82.178.61] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Wibbly Wobbly IRC] 05:42:51 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.216.200.191] has joined #lisp 05:44:05 Guthur [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:44:11 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:44:52 is it possible to give a flet dynamic-extent? 05:46:09 Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:46:25 I tried (flet ((foo (x) ...)) (declare (dynamic-extent (function foo))) ...) 05:46:28 but no go 05:48:49 what do you mean no go? 05:49:30 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:49:54 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 05:49:54 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 05:49:54 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 05:50:15 probably easier with some code, two seconds 05:50:21 ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has joined #lisp 05:50:55 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@216.1.187.162] has joined #lisp 05:52:57 this is basically what I am after: http://paste.lisp.org/display/136818 05:53:52 that's not dynamic extent, that looks like you wanted a dynamically bound function 05:54:10 dynamic extent just means the function won't exist outside that dynamic area, not that it's dynamically bound, it's just an optimization thing 05:54:40 yeah suspected I was mixing the two 05:54:53 any way to get what I am after 05:55:08 you could do: (defvar *foo*) (defun foo (x) (funcall *foo* x)) (defun bar (x) (foo x)) (defun foobar (y) (let ((*foo* #'print)) (bar y))) 05:55:47 Yeah I actually had that solution at one point, the funcall requirement was just annoying me 05:56:10 oh wait 05:56:26 yeah wrap it in another defun, sorry didn't read well enough 05:56:44 umm might work, hides the funcall well enough 05:56:47 dtw [~dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has joined #lisp 05:56:49 cheers boke 05:56:54 umm bike 05:56:55 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.106.209] has joined #lisp 05:58:09 dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has joined #lisp 05:58:28 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.176.4] has joined #lisp 05:58:49 zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:59:13 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.176.4] has left #lisp 06:04:54 -!- p_nathan [~vlion@w142148.wireless.fsr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:05:27 -!- sbryant [freenode@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:05:52 -!- sshirokov 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[Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:13:37 -!- alama [~jessealam@stgt-5f729d40.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 08:16:43 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:24:41 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:26:08 rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.92.72] has joined #lisp 08:26:13 -!- leo2007 [~leo@110.172.225.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:29:48 on [~on@207.Red-83-45-138.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:30:05 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.216.200.191] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:30:10 -!- on is now known as Guest79392 08:31:33 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-255-222.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 08:36:11 is there an operator (other than dolist) that does (op (e expr1 expr2 ...) operatorions-on-e)? basically dolist without the list. 08:38:32 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:38:58 Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 08:40:12 nan_: I have no clue what you're trying to describe. 08:41:08 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:41:48 i am asking if there is an equivelant of (dolist (e (list a b c)) ...)? maybe something like (each e (a b c) ...) 08:43:40 nan_: map? 08:45:01 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:46:06 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-255-222.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:46:46 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:47:21 Wow, I did not expect to come across this on today's reddit. http://www.reddit.com/r/lisp/comments/1ceehz/lisp_is_too_powerful/c9gpybd?context=2 08:47:31 hitecnologys: http://paste.lisp.org/display/136821 08:50:25 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 08:51:24 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:52:20 -!- nan_ [~user@46.197.112.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:52:49 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 08:55:10 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 08:55:38 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:57:12 (By "today", I mean "contemporary".) 08:58:29 -!- Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 08:59:55 Aethaeryn: I believe you're in the minority of online lispers for deeply caring about styling issues on the hyperspec. 09:02:01 That doesn't mention the css, but it does mention the lack of a search box. 09:02:33 pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 09:02:46 Aethaeryn: and C-c C-d h. 09:02:53 Yes, it mentions that as well. 09:03:10 nan_ [~user@46.197.112.181] has joined #lisp 09:03:42 przl [~przlrkt@p5B298293.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 09:03:55 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 09:05:03 what is "C-c C-d h" for ? 09:05:30 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B298293.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:06:34 elkng: it's "hotkey" for "search symbol under the cursor in clhs" in slime. 09:06:57 so its for slime, not for emacs ? 09:06:59 elkng: slime is advanced lisp mode for Emacs. 09:07:55 to run slime one used: "A-x slime" ? 09:08:22 elkng, M-x, metakey 09:08:35 elkng: actually, "M-x slime" (there's no such modifier like A) but you can always rebind it. 09:08:41 przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 09:09:17 hitecnologys: I mean "Alt-x" 09:09:25 "A" is short for "Alt" 09:09:42 elkng: emacs doesn't know what alt is. 09:09:43 A is alt. 09:09:53 elkng: alt is really just a binding for meta. 09:10:03 or does anyone have keyboard with "Meta" key ? 09:10:03 of course it does. It knows what hyper and super are as well. 09:10:17 It does? 09:10:25 CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #lisp 09:10:32 Wow, I thought that it receives only meta. 09:10:38 Cool. 09:10:39 Ener2 [~enerccio@158.194.169.56] has joined #lisp 09:11:04 I am trying to load asd from working directory, but I still get the error about missing component... 09:11:26 CL-USER> (si::getcwd) 09:11:28 #P"/media/home/home/enerccio/clext/cl-hooks-0.1.0/" 09:11:29 CL-USER> (asdf:operate 'asdf:load-op 'cl-hooks) 09:11:36 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:13:06 Ener2: you should try pushing your directory to asdf:*central-regisrty*. 09:14:09 Ener2: do you use quicklisp? 09:14:11 elkng: Some keyboards have meta on them. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/47/Space-cadet.jpg 09:15:02 pkhuong: no, but this only has asdf package, I think 09:15:04 AeroNotix [~xeno@aboo145.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 09:15:27 Aethaeryn, this is ancient, 'Symbolics', :) 09:15:28 Ener2: if you used quicklisp, you could copy the directory to local-projects and everyting would work. 09:15:34 elkng: take a look at http://blog.makezine.com/2009/02/05/lisp-machine-keyboard-close-up/ 09:16:13 "rubout"? 09:16:28 asdf has to know where to find asd files, and doesn't use the current directory by default. 09:16:41 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.164] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 09:17:09 pkhuong: I see, I thought it worked with cwd 09:17:20 now I get missing component error, but at least its something 09:19:06 cl:loading (or C-c C-k in slime) the asd file might work, but that's an implementation accident that I'm told is going away very soon now. 09:19:44 -!- Flame_Alchemist [~Flame_Alc@host77-99-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:22:08 hmm, I am trying to use quicklisp, but I get undefined function quicklisp-quickstart:install 09:22:14 (load "~/quicklisp/setup.lisp") 09:22:15 (quicklisp-quickstart:install) 09:22:31 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:23:48 Ener2: might wanna brush up on them copy-pasting skills. 09:24:02 Ener2: http://www.quicklisp.org/beta/#installation 09:25:34 Ener2: you've to load quicklisp.lisp file. (If is the first time you install Quicklisp) 09:25:36 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 09:25:41 Ener2: quicklisp-quickstart:install installs quicklisp. quicklisp/setup.lisp loads quicklisp in the lisp environment once quicklisp is installed. If quicklisp is loaded, ql:add-to-init-file edits your implementation's init files to load QL automatically. 09:26:19 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:26:21 hmm then I already have quicklisp 09:26:52 in my home directory that is 09:29:04 hmm 09:29:16 shouldnt quicklisp download all missing components? 09:29:26 PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 09:29:43 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest47072 09:30:01 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:30:22 I'm afraid Xach isn't omniscient yet. 09:30:25 -!- Guest47072 is now known as PuercoPop` 09:30:26 (aaa:bbb) you get not undefined function quicklisp-quickstart:install 09:30:38 sorry aaa:bbb :) 09:30:55 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 09:31:08 -!- PuercoPop` is now known as PuercoPop 09:31:20 well I get 09:31:23 Component ASDF-SYSTEM-CONNECTIONS not found 09:31:24 [Condition of type ASDF/FIND-SYSTEM:LOAD-SYSTEM-DEFINITION-ERROR] 09:32:33 well I guess I have to do it manually 09:32:35 Ener2: quickload will download and install components in its database if you use quickload. 09:33:00 If you use asdf directly, you get to handle all the details yourself. 09:33:17 hmm 09:33:23 it downloads other stuff 09:33:31 it was just that system-connections 09:34:20 cods [~cods@rsbac/developer/cods] has joined #lisp 09:36:36 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 09:37:41 Ener2: what get you with : (typep (require "asdf" ()) 'null) ? 09:38:13 T 09:38:15 -!- Fullma [~fullma@ram94-2-82-66-69-246.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:38:31 Ener2: ok.. 09:38:33 Fullma [~fullma@ram94-2-82-66-69-246.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 09:40:14 przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 09:40:41 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:40:52 davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 09:42:42 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:42:49 not like it will load :( 09:42:51 Object (EQL PROGN) is not a valid specializer 09:44:01 davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 09:45:52 You might want to try on another implementation. CCL's or SBCL's CLOS are probably better tested. 09:46:20 eql specializer works fine for my classes 09:46:35 but maybe its progn? 09:47:08 weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has joined #lisp 09:48:08 What is the actual defmethod? 09:51:46 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:52:04 no idea 09:52:11 the callstack is in call-with-macroexpand-progress 09:52:24 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-100-197.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:55:24 araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 09:55:25 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Changing host] 09:55:25 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 09:56:08 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:56:09 kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-77-77.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 10:02:57 astertronistic [~astertron@ip70-181-235-122.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:03:48 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.135.14] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:07:31 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:10:03 ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 10:12:55 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 10:14:29 harryfoobar42 [~harryhero@dslb-094-223-154-145.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:15:06 hello everybody i'm lisp beginner and has some questitions 10:15:32 "lisp beginner", how many questions ? 10:16:25 just one for this moment 10:16:50 i have this statment : (cadr '( A ( B C D ))) 10:17:19 and i get ( B C D) 10:17:27 and not B 10:17:36 why ? 10:17:53 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:18:42 harryfoobar42: because that is what (car (cdr '( A ( B C D ))) must return 10:18:44 ok i see it 10:19:25 yes its a list in the list 10:19:44 so i have to use caadr 10:19:47 to get B 10:20:29 davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 10:24:35 Thra11 [~Thra11@87.114.154.60] has joined #lisp 10:28:09 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [] 10:29:29 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 10:29:55 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:30:01 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has joined #lisp 10:31:14 -!- Guest79392 [~on@207.Red-83-45-138.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:31:19 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:33:36 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.217.164] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:33:37 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has quit [Client Quit] 10:34:21 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:34:34 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 10:36:19 PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 10:36:36 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest64878 10:37:26 arbscht_ [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 10:38:09 -!- Guest64878 is now known as PuercoPop 10:38:24 -!- macrobat [~fuzzyglee@h-199-47.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 10:40:01 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:41:08 harryfoobar42: nothing wrong with learning c[ad]+r, but anything but car, cdr, cadr or cddr in production code makes me cringe. 10:41:37 -!- _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 10:41:48 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-227-049.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 10:43:26 _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 10:44:27 -!- arbscht_ is now known as arbscht 10:44:36 -!- MoALTz [~no@host86-142-160-154.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:44:44 H4ns: ok so i have to use other functions ? 10:45:10 harryfoobar42: use other data structures 10:45:28 -!- ioa [~ioa@dynamic2-249-007.usc.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:45:49 harryfoobar42: like objects, arrays, structs, plists, there are plenty. 10:46:30 talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 10:46:41 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:47:02 H4ns: good to know 10:50:47 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:51:56 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 10:52:08 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:53:22 H4ns: How many years program ?you in lisp 10:53:30 H4ns: How many years program you in lisp ? 10:53:45 harryfoobar42: about 12 years now, i think. 10:55:21 H4ns: wow ! so you are a lisp-guru 10:55:44 harryfoobar42: not at all. 10:56:12 harryfoobar42: it takes more than a mere 12 years of application programming to become a lisp guru :) 10:56:15 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:56:55 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:57:23 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:58:39 H4ns: yes guru was the wrong word i mean pro. Do you program lisp at your job? 10:58:57 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 10:59:06 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:59:17 harryfoobar42: yes. 10:59:36 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:59:36 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:59:45 is stallman a lisp guru ? 10:59:50 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 11:00:39 *rszeno* not anymore, :) 11:00:48 He is a stall guru. 11:01:33 pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 11:03:44 Ramirez57 [~Ramirez57@c-174-54-148-204.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:05:02 spacefro1 [~spacefrog@drsd-4db3e6f3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 11:05:04 wow, you use lisp at your job? Do other programmers there use it as well, or do you just get to choose what you use to get things done? 11:05:09 Hydan [~hydan@159.149.broadband12.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 11:05:55 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 11:06:13 most of our stuff is written in ruby, but "we want to use lisp more" 11:06:40 wow, that's cool to know there are groups of developers that want to use lisp 11:06:59 rather than just lone programmers that know how to use it effectively 11:07:26 well, effectively i'm a lone programmer :) 11:07:34 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 11:07:45 I didn't think people cared about lisp this much 11:07:49 :| 11:07:57 and i'd not conclude from my job that there is something like a notable market for lisp jobs. 11:08:05 there are a few, but they are rather rare. 11:08:38 I tried learning LISP, but it's confusing to me 11:09:02 Ramirez57, is a tool, not a social cause, :) 11:09:16 learning lisp is very different at first, although it depends on what language you are coming from 11:09:35 I do most of my programs in Assembly 11:09:56 yeah, that would take adjustment 11:11:19 in lisp there are also crazy concepts people are doing with macros. I don't feel comfortable with macros. 11:11:48 Macros are fantastic 11:12:02 if implemented correctly anyway 11:12:21 marcos are fantastic if used properly 11:13:19 but I don't want to see code, which uses them like a basic building block, that sounds just unreadable and unmaintable. 11:15:18 "sounds". right. 11:15:32 sounds as if you don't have a lot of experience with macros. :D 11:17:32 macros are the best thing in this universe after alcohol 11:19:04 H4ns: or maybe I have just too much "professional" experience to know, that "clever code" normally sucks. I would really like to force all "clever" programmers to stop writing code, because they normally are those who produce code which can't be maintained. 11:19:34 fantazo: why should it be unmaintable? 11:19:50 fantazo: are you trying to say that macros are too clever to be used properly? 11:19:56 are functions unmaintainable to you too? 11:20:07 macros are simply black boxes, abstractions 11:21:19 H4ns: nope. but they can easily be misused. 11:21:38 fantazo: as can function. 11:21:39 s 11:21:48 agreed. 11:22:00 or every other concept 11:22:09 not as badly as macros though 11:22:10 oop, exceptions, whatever. 11:22:12 (defun sub (a b) (+ a b)) 11:22:58 astertronistic: why? 11:23:23 nan_, ? 11:23:32 when a function is wrong it typically doesn't work the way you think it should 11:23:45 may i make a suggestion? all of you who think macros are "bad", just use a programming language that does not have them. thank you. 11:23:46 so all you have to do is fix the function, and then the code that uses it starts to work 11:24:06 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:24:14 astertronistic: so will macros, if you have evaluated code, and if you have compiled, you have to recompile, duh 11:24:14 java designers used that excuse for operator overloading (can be misused) after that simple sentence i never looked a single line of java code 11:24:14 newbie hour? 11:24:14 H4ns, copy and paste is everywhere, :) 11:24:22 or if a function's interface doesn't quite work it isn't that hard to change it 11:24:30 and echo adjustments 11:24:37 rszeno: it was an example for function misuse :) 11:24:37 Does JAVA even have macros? 11:24:45 but with macros, the code you write is more directly involved 11:24:51 Ramirez57: no, its too much for programmers after all 11:25:15 if you change a macro, all the code you've written using the macro needs to be transformed 11:25:28 Ramirez57: at some points I was disappointed there were not even c preprocessor macros... 11:25:33 and if the macro isn't well designed, a lot of time a labor might need to be redone later 11:25:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:25:46 astertronistic: what redone? 11:25:47 due to dependence on the broken constructs created with them 11:25:51 you just recompile.... 11:26:03 Ener2: C had bad macro implementation. 11:26:22 if you change interface, you have to change everything, but still, so you would need to do it with functions 11:26:29 Ramirez57: sure, but it is at least *something* 11:26:39 functions are more modular than macros though 11:26:46 data flows in and out of them 11:26:53 minion: chant 11:26:54 MORE MODULAR 11:26:55 with macros, code flows in 11:27:09 astertronistic: not every change to the macro code results in syntactic incompatibility with older uses of the macro 11:27:35 I guess it's not change so much 11:27:52 but the consequence creating and investing in a broken design 11:28:11 it seems easier to do when you can write any macro you want 11:28:33 and experiment with whatever you want, 11:28:37 astertronistic: so why use classes too? just copypaste codes for every "class" 11:28:46 astertronistic: lisp programmers also tend to develop intuition for coming up with syntax that may be extended if necessary.. but yes, incompatibility may occur, like it does with other language constructs 11:30:22 Macros can define variables unlike functions which should not... 11:30:43 Ramirez57: which you should not :) 11:30:51 -!- Hydan [~hydan@159.149.broadband12.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:30:54 use proper gensyms and it is fine 11:30:57 astertronistic: also, if you want to talk about functions.. many times a fix to a bad design does not result in changing just one function, but a whole slew of them 11:31:05 Kenjin_ [~kenjin@193.136.207.69] has joined #lisp 11:32:11 Ener2: Are you saying not to define vars in a macro? 11:32:20 astertronistic: whereas with macros, sometimes you can come up with a declarative syntax that's close to your problem domain and so is more resistant to change, as it hides the details of how to solve it 11:32:37 Ramirez57: no, do not define variables that are possible to reference outside the generated code 11:32:48 that's true 11:32:56 again, same blackbox abstraction principle 11:33:46 if you need to, however, then use it transparently, ie user of macro will provide the variable name 11:34:06 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:34:10 same as every macro is already doing in cl, ie (dotimes (x 5 11:34:28 Exactly what I mean. The user should expect the variable to be defined after usage. 11:34:38 Ramirez57: but why? 11:34:43 user should not care... 11:34:51 it is transparent for him 11:35:33 Flame_Alchemist [~Flame_Alc@host77-99-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 11:35:59 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:36:15 I should learn about LISP macros before I run my mouth about macros more 11:36:30 a few hours ago i needed a simple construction that took me a few seconds to write with a macro, if i were still using c++ not being able to that simple thing would haunt me for years. i think one needs that kind of experience to understand how important macros are 11:37:04 nan_: can you provide concrete example? could be useful to know it ;) 11:37:22 nan_: Well C++ does have #define, of course, it's not as great as other macro implementations 11:37:35 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136821 11:37:43 Ramirez57: unfortunately, define is not even turing complete... 11:37:55 Ener2: ^ 11:37:55 cant use it for much but copypaste reduction 11:38:03 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:38:04 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 11:38:32 Ener2: another 10 seconds and now it supports multiple values 11:38:58 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 11:39:52 seems like dolist combined with map 11:39:54 nice 11:40:07 I've forgotten: is there an established convention to name error conditions with -ERROR suffix? 11:40:24 dtw: no 11:41:11 Ok, thanks. 11:42:35 dtw: although empirically there's a good chance it'll have that suffix 11:44:02 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 11:48:44 in my current env it's about 60% 11:50:29 I think I've used it pretty much. Just started wondering if this is a guideline that is actually written somewhere. 11:52:18 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:56:43 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:56:53 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 11:58:21 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:59:04 what are the main CL implementations? 11:59:15 I was thinking sbcl, clisp, abcl, allegro cl 11:59:25 is that somehow right? 11:59:43 ecl, lispworks 11:59:53 and ccl and cmucl 12:00:10 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.106.209] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:00:15 thanks :-) 12:00:17 soon hopefuly mocl 12:00:25 mocl? 12:00:32 mobile CL 12:01:37 nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 12:01:39 they were working on a CL for iphone/android... 12:02:23 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.76] has joined #lisp 12:02:51 arrk13 [~arrakis24@dslb-178-006-216-162.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 12:03:02 hello 12:03:46 when I connect to a lisp image running a swank server, is there a way to temporarily disable the repl of that image? 12:04:17 what do you mean? 12:04:21 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-24-211.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:04:23 when i connect i get a repl in emacs, and a repl in the terminal where i started the image. 12:04:39 detachtty? 12:04:56 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 12:04:59 well, no, I'd like to keep the output, but just disable the input. 12:05:28 (loop) :) 12:05:50 or maybe add sleep there 12:05:51 I'd like to direct the output from emacs to the terminal but I dont want input in the terminal to go to the repl. 12:06:28 hm, would sleep there then run in a different thread or would it block the slime connection too? 12:06:44 maybe you can redirect stdin 12:07:25 do you know how, if I want to do it from the repl and only temporarily? 12:08:03 I jsut want to tell the image running in the terminal "no please dont register any input". 12:08:10 arrk13: the swank server runs in a diff thread if you use spawn style 12:08:24 okay. 12:08:25 leo2007 [~leo@110.172.225.137] has joined #lisp 12:09:36 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:10:04 -!- Kenjin_ [~kenjin@193.136.207.69] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:10:11 arrk13: I suppose you can set *query-io* 12:11:20 (and/or *terminal-io*) 12:11:40 hmm, putting it to sleep does the job, kind of. but ideally I'd like to turn this on and off fromthe slime repl. 12:11:41 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:11:55 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:12:24 is there a way to send stuff from slime to the repl running in the terminal? 12:12:54 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 12:12:55 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 12:13:20 I've never done it that way so can't help you there 12:13:47 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 12:13:56 okay, thanks anyway, putting the terminal to sleep does the job for now. ;) 12:14:37 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:14:51 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:15:42 munge [~user@ip72-209-237-151.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 12:18:09 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-77-77.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:18:44 if you'd recommend a list of resources to get your way around CL, which would they be? 12:18:51 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 12:18:54 PCL, docs website, etc 12:19:17 I'm trying to make a simple webpage grouping all of these, so that beginners can easily know where to start 12:20:03 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:20:18 HyperSpec? 12:20:19 Ralt: http://www.cliki.net/Getting%20Started 12:21:18 yeah.... I want to make something "pretty" :) 12:21:49 a new CSS for cliki? :> 12:21:51 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@87.114.154.60] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 12:22:11 Thra11 [~Thra11@87.114.154.60] has joined #lisp 12:22:52 arrk13: open a screen session with for example "screen -S lisp" and run a CL implementation , after in the REPL : (load "/path-to-your/swank-loader.lisp"), after that (swank-loader:init) and after (swank:create-server :port 4005 :dont-close t) , after "screen -d" to detach and "screen -r PID" to reattach. Good lucky! 12:24:16 hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.217.164] has joined #lisp 12:24:23 arrk13: of course: read http://www.cliki.net/SLIME-HOWTO ! 12:26:03 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:27:43 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 12:29:11 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:29:44 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-227-049.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 12:30:56 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 12:33:37 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:33:48 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-71.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:35:18 arrk13: sorry but (C-a d, C-a C-d) do detach from the screen session running swank server in a lisp session and "screen -list" to find the PID of the session. 12:36:15 pnpuff: when I detach, will the output from emacs be sent to the terminal where I detached? 12:36:26 sure... 12:37:19 agumonkey [~agu@97.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 12:37:26 ok, I'll try that, thanks. 12:37:40 arrk13: try to detach a terminal in witch you type "ping www.google.it > /dev/null 2>&1 &" and after in another terminal type "ps aux | grep ping" :) 12:37:50 if you meant that you want to see the output at a different time (say when you're re-attached), then my first guess at what you wanted (detachtty) applies 12:38:11 arrk13, why don't you try to use elisp interface with processes? 12:38:36 detachtty also has a dribble file option, though I've not used it in anger 12:39:23 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:40:10 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 12:40:57 Kenjin_ [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 12:40:59 przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 12:42:42 pnpuff: I tried this, but the output goes to the detached screen, not to the terminal itself. 12:43:53 what I am looking for is how to disable the repl functionality temporarily, but still have the lisp image running in the terminal. 12:44:11 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:45:04 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 12:46:17 arrk13: paste on http://paste.lisp.org/ the commands you're using... 12:47:09 nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 12:47:48 I'm not using any, thats what I asked in the first palce: how to send output from the emacs slime repl to the terminal where the lisp image was started. 12:49:14 -!- Kenjin_ [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:49:24 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.106.209] has joined #lisp 12:50:42 leoc [~leoc.git@p5DDB8430.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 12:51:30 arrk13: i think you can create a new special variable before launching swank, and setting it's value to *standard-output*. writing to that stream should write to the terminal, i'd assume. 12:52:45 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:52:54 arrk13: maybe detachtty + tail -f dribble-file 12:53:04 MoALTz [~no@host86-142-160-154.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 12:54:00 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:56:49 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:57:14 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:57:17 MoALTz_ [~no@host86-142-160-154.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 12:57:35 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:58:17 KDr2 [~KDr2@36.45.100.17] has joined #lisp 12:59:12 -!- MoALTz [~no@host86-142-160-154.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:59:49 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 13:01:41 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:01:41 arrk13: if you use emacs + slime to connect (with M-x slime-connect) to the swank server running on a lisp image in a virtual console your REPL it's only the *slime-repl "the name of your CL implementation"* listed in your emacs buffers list. 13:03:16 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:03:25 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:03:52 DrCode_ [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 13:04:48 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:04:54 -!- KDr2 [~KDr2@36.45.100.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:05:58 -!- DrCode_ is now known as DrCode 13:07:54 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:11:09 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:11:40 kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-77-77.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 13:12:57 -!- MoALTz_ is now known as MoALTz 13:16:56 alesguzik [~alesguzik@178.120.19.196] has joined #lisp 13:19:11 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 13:20:05 -!- ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:20:27 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 13:21:15 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 13:23:10 Kenjin [~kenjin@193.136.207.69] has joined #lisp 13:26:47 macrobat [~fuzzyglee@h-199-47.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 13:27:08 [6502] [4e0cffe5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.12.255.229] has joined #lisp 13:27:29 <[6502]> yo 13:27:34 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:28:10 <[6502]> why does (let ((x 0)) (decf x (setf x 1))) evaluate to 0 and not -1? 13:29:27 because x is set to 1, then decremented by 1 13:30:51 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:31:05 <[6502]> adeht: so when considering left-to-right evaluation of decf form the x is just the place but not the value 13:31:42 6502: yes.. the evaluation is not the usual evaluation rule, hence decf being a macro 13:32:04 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 13:32:21 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 13:32:44 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:33:16 6502: if decf received just the value of X, then what could it do to modify the binding? 13:33:17 dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 13:33:56 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 13:34:59 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:35:14 RenJuan [~juan@cpe-76-180-168-166.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:36:36 <[6502]> adeht: javascript x = 0; x -= (x = 1) returns -1. The same happens in python (using a function to set x, assignment is not an expression for python). In C++03 is undefined behavior. I've to think about implications of this difference... 13:37:25 Aiwass [~user@188.27.117.186] has joined #lisp 13:38:19 [6502]: yes, special forms and macros call forms may change arguments order of evalutation... 13:38:25 <[6502]> adeht: I'm not saying it doesn't make sense. It's just different. Clearly setf has to receive more than the value, but the point is when the value is extracted 13:38:26 [6502]: you're trying to compare a language where the order of evaluation of the subexpression is defined (in almost all cases) vs. languages where it's not. 13:38:31 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 13:39:01 6502: javascript is not a good source for deriving expectations.. 13:40:20 <[6502]> the subtlety is that the "place" part is evaluated first, but the value for the computation is extracted later 13:40:29 *[6502]* is not sure subtlety is a word 13:42:00 <[6502]> pjb: python and javascript both strictly evaluate in left-to-right order 13:42:04 (let ((i 0) (v (vector 1 2 3))) (decf (aref v (incf i)) (setf i 1)) v) 13:42:07 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:42:49 or even: (let ((i 0) (v (vector 1 2 3))) (decf (aref v (incf i)) (incf i)) v) 13:42:58 use macroexpand ;-) 13:43:09 -!- Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:43:20 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:47:00 Patzy [~something@lns-bzn-51f-81-56-151-137.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 13:50:11 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-83-61-64.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:50:35 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:52:09 6502: what js does is equivalent (setf x (- x (setf x 1))).. but decf is more like (setf x (let ((d (setf x 1))) (- x d))) 13:53:08 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:53:13 or to make it even clearer, (let ((d (setf x 1))) (setq x (- x d))) 13:53:26 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 13:55:12 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.106.209] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:55:23 lduros` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:56:42 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:57:33 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:57:44 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:58:08 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: supernova explosion] 13:58:18 Re-L [~Arttt@11-209-202-46.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 13:58:32 ravster [~ravi@71-19-174-130.dedicated.allstream.net] has joined #lisp 13:59:13 <[6502]> adeht: I'd say that if x is a simple variable (incf x d) is (setf x (+ d x)) and not (set x (+ x d)) because if d has side effects they're applied before taking the value of x into account 14:00:29 Harag [~Thunderbi@105.226.67.188] has joined #lisp 14:02:10 <[6502]> adeht: so in a sense (incf x d) evaluates x neither before nor after... but before for the place and after for the value 14:04:36 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:04:54 -!- elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:05:15 <[6502]> adeht: I always thought as (incf x d) being the same as (setf x (+ x d)) except for evaluating x only once (for example when x is (aref v (foo)) ), but this is not correct 14:06:21 elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has joined #lisp 14:07:06 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:13:15 When using a sb-concurrency:queue with byte arrays, when dequeueing the contents of the queue show some empty byte arrays, which I suppose are the dequeued items. Is this expected behaviour? 14:13:39 "when dequeueing, ..." 14:13:41 fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has joined #lisp 14:15:46 Let me add that queue and dequeue operations take place in different threads 14:18:06 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:19:01 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:19:46 -!- fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has left #lisp 14:20:55 tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has joined #lisp 14:21:09 davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 14:22:19 6502: no, (incf x d) where x is a variable and d is an arbitrary expression is like (let ((e d)) (setq x (+ x e))) 14:28:34 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:29:53 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 14:33:25 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:33:48 ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 14:34:07 -!- ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:34:16 ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 14:34:44 axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:34:45 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:35:12 <[6502]> adeht: if x is a variable that is the same as (setq x (+ d x)), no? 14:36:26 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:10 Hans [~zypeh@124.82.54.34] has joined #lisp 14:39:15 6502: yes.. but the general version looks much like mine.. whereas your version assumes commutativity in this case 14:40:21 <[6502]> adeht: oh, ok true. I checked a bit of macro expansions and that's exactly what happens with sbcl 14:41:15 hi 14:41:26 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 14:42:30 Hans: Hello 14:42:37 [6502]: try (let ((x 0)) ((lambda (d) (+ d x)) 1)) 14:43:19 Kenjin, first time walking here :) 14:43:21 casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:43:35 *Xach* hopes not to get confused with H4ns 14:43:41 indeed 14:44:14 <[6502]> pnpuff: 1, what's so strange about it? 14:44:39 *Hans* and H4ns ......... 14:45:43 [6502]: nothing , now try: ((lambda (x) ((lambda (d) (+ x d)) 1)) 0) 14:45:53 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:45:56 isnt this the same? 14:46:00 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-000-158.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 14:46:01 let is lambda... 14:46:09 unless its somehow implementation optimized 14:46:25 ener2: not in CL 14:46:42 adeht: no? 14:47:31 Ener2: try (special-form-p 'let) and (special-form-p 'lambda) 14:47:45 Ener2: transform this: (let ((&optional 123) (x 321)) (list &optional x)) 14:48:11 adeht: hmm, I dont think let can have &optional? 14:48:19 although I suppose 14:48:19 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:48:23 its just a symbol 14:48:39 (123 321) 14:48:57 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:49:07 <[6502]> H/\ns, H/-\ns, H@ns, H^ns, /-/@|\|z 14:49:28 Ener2: now try: (macro-function 'let) and (macro-function 'lambda) 14:49:33 |-|@|\|Z 14:49:50 pnpuff: lambda is special operator, not a macro, no? 14:50:05 Ener2: lambda is a macro 14:50:31 hmm, isnt lambda macro just expansion to lambda, or something like tha 14:50:34 t 14:50:36 I dont remember i 14:50:39 Ener2: but it's irrelevant to the point I was trying to make 14:50:55 Ener2: no, (lambda (x)) expands to (function (lambda (x))) 14:51:04 Ener2: and function is a special operator 14:51:08 yeah thats what I meant 14:52:15 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-227-049.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:53:00 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:53:26 fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has joined #lisp 14:53:27 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:54:32 -!- fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:55:02 well, canonically, let was lambda, or rather macro that expanded to lambda, but I suppose CL arglist changes that for CL 14:56:13 fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has joined #lisp 14:56:58 pierpa` [~user@host76-53-dynamic.50-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 14:57:19 -!- pierpa` [~user@host76-53-dynamic.50-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:57:52 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:57:58 it wasn't even in scheme iirc.. where you could have (lambda (x . y) (list x y)) 14:58:15 pierpa` [~user@host76-53-dynamic.50-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 14:59:00 well, I suppose there you could have let->lambda transform (but not the other way) 14:59:12 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:59:34 -!- alesguzik [~alesguzik@178.120.19.196] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:01:53 Ener2: but you may be interested in http://home.pipeline.com/~hbaker1/MetaCircular.html 15:04:11 -!- [6502] [4e0cffe5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.12.255.229] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:04:31 -!- Aiwass [~user@188.27.117.186] has left #lisp 15:06:29 interesting 15:06:37 with that you can reduce number of special forms 15:07:18 Ener2: nah usually some other operator is chosen to be special 15:07:39 Ener2: but you can of course in theoretical lisp use just lambda for everything :) 15:08:08 how would you do throw/catch with only lambda? :P 15:08:24 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 15:08:56 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:09:55 yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:09:56 Ener2: wouldn't like to try.. but see lambda calculus for proof :) 15:10:06 -!- yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:10:06 yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has joined #lisp 15:12:54 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 15:13:29 eskatrem [~user@81.60.148.69.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 15:15:13 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 15:15:45 bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has joined #lisp 15:19:54 PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 15:19:58 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.red-83-61-64.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:16 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest28375 15:20:35 adeht: sure... homoiconicity is one of the most interesting properties of Lisp ! 15:20:38 doomlord [~doomlod@host31-52-58-47.range31-52.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 15:21:06 -!- Guest28375 is now known as PuercoPop 15:21:46 -!- _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 15:22:25 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has quit [Quit: o7] 15:23:48 _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 15:24:07 tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has joined #lisp 15:26:22 Ener2, using cps, http://www.mathstat.dal.ca/~selinger/papers/krivine-2up.ps 15:27:22 -!- _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Client Quit] 15:27:41 _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 15:27:48 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-000-158.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:31:08 -!- leo2007 [~leo@110.172.225.137] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 15:31:35 leo2007 [~leo@110.172.225.137] has joined #lisp 15:33:25 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:34:00 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:35:15 lduros`` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:35:27 knob [~knob@66-50-126-195.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 15:35:52 -!- lduros`` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:36:38 -!- lduros` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:40:11 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-027-207.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 15:44:31 hitecnologys1 [~hitecnolo@46.233.231.63] has joined #lisp 15:46:28 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.217.164] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:48:12 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 15:54:40 -!- Hans [~zypeh@124.82.54.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:55:22 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:55:32 PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 15:55:53 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest70668 15:59:33 rrradical [~rrradical@209-6-197-118.c3-0.smr-ubr2.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 16:03:14 -!- Guest70668 [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:04:07 oudeis [~oudeis@62-90-110-122.barak.net.il] has joined #lisp 16:05:28 Is there a way to update all local quicklisp dists? 16:05:54 -!- hitecnologys1 is now known as hitecnologys 16:05:55 feedback welcome: http://gettingstartedwithcommonlisp.com/ 16:07:23 hitecnologys: (ql:update-all-dists) is one way. but 99.998% of people have only one dist. 16:07:41 Xach: thanks. 16:07:41 Ralt: it's...empty? 16:07:51 hm, no :| 16:08:00 maybe dns hasn't updated for you 16:08:10 Ralt: i see a big title and subtitle followed by empty space 16:08:19 oh, scroll down 16:08:24 or click on the menu links 16:08:39 zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:56 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:09:51 Ralt: The documentation about the hyperspec is inaccurate. it's not specific to one implementation. and the term "method" means something specific in CL. 16:10:21 -!- harryfoobar42 [~harryhero@dslb-094-223-154-145.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:10:34 Xach: isn't it specific to lispworks? 16:10:49 Ralt: no. 16:10:56 I should probably leave it to the first sentence 16:11:04 alright, I thought so. 16:11:09 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-237-157.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 16:11:31 And it's not really a documentation, it's just specification. 16:11:33 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 16:12:02 It defines how functions should behave, not how they actually do. 16:12:17 maybe a link to On Lisp (i've not seen better coverage of macros) and a sidenote about slimv under tools 16:12:30 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.red-83-61-64.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:12:48 https://github.com/Ralt/gettingstartedwithcommonlisp 16:12:57 Btw, I suggest adding Lisp In A Box to the links. 16:13:02 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.red-83-61-64.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:13:16 pull requests welcome :P but let me note that :) 16:13:17 Why? 16:13:40 hitecnologys: Is Lisp in a Box actively maintained? I had the impression that it was abandoned. 16:13:41 Wuh, what is that new "pusle" stuff on github? 16:13:52 -!- youlysses-Zzz is now known as youlysses 16:14:00 Xach: I didn't tracked this, maybe. 16:14:15 pusle? 16:14:28 Ralt: on the left of rep navigation bar. 16:15:08 PuercoPo` [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 16:15:20 Looks like heartbeat for me. 16:15:41 oh yeah 16:15:44 you can click on it. 16:15:51 Already did. 16:15:55 it's fun. 16:15:56 Looks weird. 16:16:01 kinda looks like the Graph tab 16:16:16 Yep, that what I thought. 16:16:17 Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 16:17:04 Looks like it should to give a stranger quick report about repository state. 16:17:09 Okay, stop offtopic. 16:17:12 Sorry. 16:17:47 it's irc, where offtopic is kind. 16:17:52 king. 16:18:12 Lol 16:19:06 I just hope with this website that I'm showing beginners that lispers can make pretty websites 16:19:28 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:21:06 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-027-207.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:26:13 dionmarcill [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has joined #lisp 16:26:37 howlandlr [~mlb@cpe-075-181-039-236.carolina.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:27:57 -!- dionmarcill [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has quit [Client Quit] 16:28:00 seymour [~great_che@42.109.76.188.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 16:28:29 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:34:08 I think it needs some refinement to be something I'd be comfortable recommending to someone. 16:34:44 Ralt: a beginner is interested not only from the "graphical anspect". Why there is no one reference to Malcolm Douglas McIlroy in your site? 16:36:45 pnpuff: graphical aspect is not the only thing, I'm just saying it generally lacks in the lisp world. 16:37:05 Xach: like, what? 16:37:11 Yuuhi [benni@p5DC6231E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 16:37:48 well, it's pretty sparse. 16:39:05 Yup. that's the point 16:39:13 well, I guess there should be some more stuff 16:39:16 -!- nan_ [~user@46.197.112.181] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:39:25 but I don't know what; and I don't want it to become bloated 16:39:41 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 16:40:24 is there a clever work around if i want to subscribe to a common-lisp.net hosted mailing list at this time? 16:41:04 Odin- [~sbkhh@erudite.anarchism.is] has joined #lisp 16:41:44 sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:41:49 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:42:02 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:42:15 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@216.1.187.162] has joined #lisp 16:44:14 -!- PuercoPo` is now known as PuercoPop 16:45:40 -!- ravster [~ravi@71-19-174-130.dedicated.allstream.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:46:29 drichards [~user@c-98-232-26-203.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:47:12 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 16:52:38 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.231.63] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 16:53:30 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:54:01 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:54:06 bhyde: (replying to self)  the mailman email IF doesn't work, so don't bother with that. 16:54:16 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@erudite.anarchism.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:54:56 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 16:55:01 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:57:06 Odin- [~sbkhh@erudite.anarchism.is] has joined #lisp 16:58:59 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 16:59:35 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:01:32 ehu [~ehu@87.212.22.167] has joined #lisp 17:01:55 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 17:04:10 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:08:52 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:08:53 whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.61.151] has joined #lisp 17:09:21 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 17:10:59 zickzackv [~faot@p54BECD43.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 17:15:08 -!- seymour [~great_che@42.109.76.188.dynamic.jazztel.es] has left #lisp 17:15:42 bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 17:16:18 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 17:17:38 -!- ellusioner [ellusioner@c-051ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Hihi] 17:18:50 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:19:44 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:21:51 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 17:21:59 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:22:49 hello #lisp 17:23:19 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:06 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@193.136.207.69] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:26:47 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 17:27:31 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@216.1.187.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:27:49 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:27:53 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.162] has joined #lisp 17:27:56 -!- arrk13 [~arrakis24@dslb-178-006-216-162.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #lisp 17:27:56 nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:28:31 hello wbooze ! 17:28:35 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@216.1.187.162] has joined #lisp 17:29:39 Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 17:31:04 hello pnpuff, how are you today? 17:32:07 przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 17:32:22 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:32:26 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 17:32:28 Ralt: my humble suggestion is try write a site like http://readscheme.org/ for CL, or maybe a book better than "Lisp in Small Pieces". 17:32:37 wbooze: well thx. 17:32:56 -!- Regis__ is now known as GOMADWarrior 17:33:44 the latter is quite a tall order 17:35:26 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:35:31 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@216.1.187.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:36:31 -!- sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:36:32 pnpuff: the point is to be for beginners. And to be pretty, not to hurt eyes when opening the site :P 17:37:03 -!- fchurca [~fchurca@190.51.113.175] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:38:20 Ralt: beginners are not dumb, so you maybe have to encourage curiosity... 17:38:56 beginners are not dumb, but they're easily scared if you start recommending scientific-like papers 17:39:45 I don't know the world you live in, but the titles are scaring me even though I'm familar with lisp and the functional world 17:39:56 I'm exagerating a little bit, but you get the idea 17:41:10 -!- leo2007 [~leo@110.172.225.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:43:20 Ralt, imo people who are scared by scientific papers are not using lisp and functional programming languages, :) 17:44:07 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:44:29 rszeno: I think you're wrong 17:44:58 and it's an issue that you think like this 17:45:13 lisp isn't supposed to be for the elites programmers who read and write scientific papers 17:46:01 and I think your opinion is pretty much what causes lisp community to be so unpopular 17:46:28 plenty of people are using functional programming languages without being maths guys 17:46:59 and on this note, good bye :) 17:47:07 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:47:15 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 17:47:15 in order to use a language you need to understand basics about it, is possible to do this with lisp without using it blindly? 17:48:13 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:48:42 i don't know what "elite programmer" means 17:49:15 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@62-90-110-122.barak.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:49:24 same here, :) is all about understanding or not plus desire to do this 17:50:48 Ralt, there are plenty of things to be done for common lisp documentation 17:52:31 having a book like "learn you some erlang for great good" would be nice 17:53:01 there seems to be a book like that for haskell aswell 17:53:28 Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 17:53:56 guaqua: Land of Lisp? 17:54:03 there are also quite a few books for beginning lisp out there. just finished reading the "A Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation" 17:54:24 land of lisp is funky. should get a copy of it. haven't read it :/ 17:54:52 someone before was complaining about clhs: check out http://lamberta.github.io/minispec/index.html 17:55:01 this is weird  http://paste.lisp.org/+2XKQ 17:55:49 Ralt: absolutely no. I listen to Franz Liszt even if I do not know play the piano as him. :) 17:55:50 guaqua: it's not bad, but it is slightly overhyped IMHO. 17:56:01 okay 17:56:08 you recommend getting a copy or not? 17:56:17 it might be hard to get it from the library, though :) 17:56:17 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:57:12 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-161.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 17:57:30 -!- zickzackv [~faot@p54BECD43.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:59:19 -!- Posterdati [~antani@host230-237-dynamic.20-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:00:29 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:34 guaqua: Oh, if you have spare cash for a book, get it. It has it's moments :) 18:00:40 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:01:06 -!- rrradical [~rrradical@209-6-197-118.c3-0.smr-ubr2.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:02:26 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:03:42 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 18:03:46 toekutr [~user@32.sub-174-253-225.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 18:05:19 -!- toekutr [~user@32.sub-174-253-225.myvzw.com] has left #lisp 18:09:13 -!- dtw [~dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:09:22 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:09:52 -!- walter|rtn [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:11:31 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:12:20 -!- spacefro1 [~spacefrog@drsd-4db3e6f3.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:13:04 Posterdati [~antani@host183-239-dynamic.16-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 18:13:48 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:15:23 -!- Regis__ is now known as GOMADWarrior 18:18:02 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:20:41 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:21:01 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:21:37 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:22:29 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:23:56 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:24:51 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:25:35 is there a function in CL that returns the number of bits set in an integer? (popcount?) 18:25:59 flip214_: logcount. 18:26:10 bhyde: read the documentation. "replacement can be a string which may contain the special substrings "\&" for the whole match, "\`" for the part of target-string before the match, "\'" for the part of target-string after the match, "\N" or "\{N}" for the Nth register where N is a positive integer." 18:26:36 You need to triple escape (: 18:26:49 pkhoung  yeah, i was just reading that  18:27:08 pkhuong: ah, thanks. 18:27:39 walter [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:27:39 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:27:50 (cl-ppcre:regex-replace-all "'" "'hi'" "\\\\'" ) works 18:27:50 and one that says _which_ bit is set, ie. LSB ==> 0, 1 ==> 1, 2 ==> 2, 4 ==> 3, etc.? 18:28:19 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 18:29:53 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 18:29:58 PuercoPop [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 18:30:22 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest952 18:32:26 flip214_: integer-length? 18:33:48 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:35:00 -!- Guest952 [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:37:17 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:37:17 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:39:29 gabnet [~gabnet@ACaen-652-1-194-14.w83-115.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 18:41:46 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:41:52 pkhuong: that would work for the highest bit, right. 18:42:06 PuercoPo` [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 18:42:09 hmm I think you actually want haulong :D 18:42:24 can someone show me an example of string designators in action? 18:42:30 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 18:43:02 erg: (in-package #:foo) 18:43:02 or for sadists - (cl-ppcre:regex-replace-all "'" "'hi'" "\\\\\\&" ) --> "\\'hi\\'" 18:43:12 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:44:00 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 18:44:41 flip214_: and then you have to code a little bit if you want something else. (logxor x (1- x)). 18:45:35 bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has joined #lisp 18:45:37 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.162] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:46:04 adeht: what does that line do? 18:46:45 -!- Re-L [~Arttt@11-209-202-46.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:47:07 clhs in-package 18:47:08 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_in_pkg.htm 18:47:42 but specifically why make an uninterned symbol the package name 18:48:50 -!- PuercoPo` [~user@190.41.173.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:48:51 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:48:56 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 18:50:27 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:52:37 erg: the package name is a string.. with CL's defaults, it would be "FOO".. people use symbols here for aesthetic purposes (some weirdos use a value different from :upcase for readtable case.. ignore them).. an uninterned symbol satisfies another aesthetical urge, not to clutter the environment 18:52:40 erg - string designators are a sloppy bit of the design. back in the day there was more enthusiasm for automatically coercing things until it "just worked" so if a function needed a symbol and you gave a string you might just coerce it. The string designators are the same kind of thing chars, symbols, and strings are all coerced into a string in the places were a string designator is allowed. You could just ignore them entirely and pass t 18:52:41 string in all cases  but  they remain popular when working with packages and the symbols they import/export  why?  well for good by esoteric reasons having do do with the reader''s handling of case coercion when making symbols  thus you see (defpackage #:my-cool-package ) where the uninterned symbol #:my-cool-package is used to designate the name of the package (package names are strings), and the actual package name wi 18:52:42 depend on how the reader decides to handle the case for that symbol (by default it will make the symbol name 'MY-COOL-PACKAGE") 18:53:14 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:53:29 bhyde: you say "sloppy" I say "convenient" 18:54:07 :) 18:54:27 thanks for the explanation! 18:57:45 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:16 they are used for more things.. for example some people would write (defstruct (door (:conc-name dr-)) knob-color width material) .. where dr- is a symbol designating a string to be used as a prefix for the accessor names (yes, example from hyperspec) 18:58:17 -!- gabnet [~gabnet@ACaen-652-1-194-14.w83-115.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:58:32 bhyde: I don't think string designators are about coercing everything until it works as much as convenience for functions that users will interface with directly, rather than programmatically. 18:58:33 -!- CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:59:02 adeht: interesting pt 18:59:42 does lisp have the equivalent of private definitions? symbols that you dont export 18:59:43 dionmarcill [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has joined #lisp 19:00:00 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:00:12 pkhuong: i guess, though it implies a segregation of functions into two classes which is kind of out of character in lisp 19:00:15 for instance, factor has IN: wut so foo is in wut.private 19:00:28 erg: symbols by default are not exported from the package they're interned in (if they are interned).. unless it's keyword 19:00:31 CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #lisp 19:00:31 erg: if you don't export a symbol, it's not exported 19:01:50 bhyde: no, that's why we have both in-package and (setf *package*). 19:02:16 -!- dionmarcill [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has quit [Changing host] 19:02:16 dionmarcill [~maden@unaffiliated/maden] has joined #lisp 19:03:11 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:03:43 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:04:17 pkhuong: i find it distressing that find-symbol takes a package designator which includes string-designator, but then i spent too many years find tuning code to run fast as C or better 19:04:53 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:05:01 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:05:16 and you think that a test to see whether the package designator is a package or a string designator is what makes find-symbol slow? 19:07:20 sw2wolf [~czsq888@222.209.241.145] has joined #lisp 19:08:07 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:08:36 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 19:09:18 -!- Flame_Alchemist [~Flame_Alc@host77-99-dynamic.6-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:09:56 erg: if you want finer control of symbol interning and use, check out Kaz Kylheku's pkg thingy: http://www.kylheku.com/cgit/lisp-snippets/tree/pkg.lisp 19:09:59 pkhuong: i thought you were arguing that the symbol designators are used in cases that don't tend to effect runtime much. but yes I would prefer to have the performance close to the metal 19:10:08 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:10:59 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:11:09 adeht: i'm trying to design/implement a package system for factor. we have the start of a design here https://gist.github.com/jckarter/3440892 and someone today mentioned they like defpackage 19:11:34 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 19:11:36 so i figured i should learn about defpackage so i dont repeat its mistakes or miss out on a better way of doing things 19:11:46 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 19:12:21 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:13:05 erg: so yeah.. also a good idea to read Kylheku's text.. and the many c.l.l threads about packages :) 19:13:25 -!- tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:15:03 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 19:15:21 erg: one thing you should understand is that the CL package system is not a module system 19:15:47 -!- arrdem_ is now known as arrdem 19:16:39 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 19:17:06 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:17:27 erg: if you don't know CL, this may be a good explanation of the terms in its context: http://weitz.de/packages.html 19:17:43 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-95.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:17:52 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:18:39 i know some CL but all the syntax that it supposedly doesnt have trips me up #: etc 19:18:47 bhno. I'm arguing that symbol designators are used when the symbol designator will be typed in by a human rather than generated by code, so the convenience is worth the potential confusion. 19:18:54 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:19:18 bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has joined #lisp 19:19:22 maybe an explanation it's only a big whole number... or not? 19:21:25 interesting factoid: UNINTERN's previous name is REMOB 19:21:39 (and I disagree that find-symbol is slowed down by support for package designators) 19:22:29 adeht: where did you get that ? 19:22:38 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 19:23:00 fe[nl]ix: http://cl-su-ai.cddddr.org/ 19:23:30 erg: why didn't you read chapter 2 of the hyperspec? 19:23:34 humbug__ [~humbug@cpe-74-69-103-78.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:23:36 fe[nl]ix: but it also makes sense if you know about obarrays :) 19:24:26 pjb: aint nobody got time to read chapter 2 of the hyperspec 19:24:35 I've read it. Several times. 19:24:38 *erg* goes to read chapter 2 of the hyperspec 19:25:24 -!- Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:25:34 milosn_ [~milosn@user-5af5096d.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #lisp 19:25:46 fe[nl]ix: more specifically, #140 at http://cl-su-ai.cddddr.org/msg00008.html 19:26:30 "Consider changing BUTTAIL back to LDIFF" Yes 19:26:33 hahaha 19:26:51 I'd add another T 19:27:06 :-) wow 19:27:50 -!- milosn [~milosn@user-5af5074a.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:29:53 -!- doomlord [~doomlod@host31-52-58-47.range31-52.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:37:45 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 19:37:59 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:38:42 tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has joined #lisp 19:39:28 bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has joined #lisp 19:44:09 Kenjin [~kenjin@2.80.255.222] has joined #lisp 19:46:41 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 19:49:17 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105.226.67.188] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:49:44 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-161.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:50:03 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-161.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 19:51:05 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:51:07 Mandus [~aasmundo@128.39.36.106] has joined #lisp 19:51:14 Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:54 DonMartin [~donmartin@p5B2202C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 19:53:07 PuercoPo` [~user@190.222.218.144] has joined #lisp 19:53:29 -!- Strigoides [~Strigoide@60-234-213-126.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:57:02 -!- dionmarcill [~maden@unaffiliated/maden] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:57:31 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:58:40 -!- DonMartin [~donmartin@p5B2202C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 19:58:57 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:59:04 DonMartin [~donmartin@p5B2202C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 20:00:17 -!- DonMartin [~donmartin@p5B2202C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Client Quit] 20:00:27 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 20:01:31 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:02:17 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:03:34 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:07 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:05:28 -!- astertronistic [~astertron@ip70-181-235-122.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:08:35 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:09:42 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:11:58 joekarma [~joekarma@70-36-57-169.dyn.novuscom.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:23 two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:14:21 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:16:07 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@222.209.241.145] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:16:10 -!- bolcselo [~x@pool-108-45-77-30.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:17:42 sw2wolf [~czsq888@222.209.241.145] has joined #lisp 20:19:22 doomlord [~doomlod@host31-52-58-47.range31-52.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 20:20:14 -!- CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 20:20:15 is lisp a good choice for android app development? i know next to nothing about android and would like to learn, but am most comfortable with CL...much moreso than java anyway. 20:20:19 -!- cmm- [~cmm@bzq-79-182-100-51.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:20:28 Bike_ [~Glossina@63-229-135-233.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:20:38 start with java 20:20:39 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-182-100-51.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:20:50 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:21:02 i use java at work all the time and just dread it 20:21:04 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:21:06 there's an android port of maxima so there has to be a CL that's fairly complete and conforming 20:21:09 i cant stand working in it tbh 20:21:43 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:22:06 you can compile ecl for android.. but it's quite bare bones for now, especially if you don't know the platform 20:22:34 Bike__ [~Glossina@65-100-32-101.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:22:43 ok 20:22:53 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-34-73-31.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:23:15 wth, how do you get rid of the process-exited messages from sb-ext:run-program ? 20:23:30 -!- Bike__ is now known as Bike 20:25:21 -!- Bike_ [~Glossina@63-229-135-233.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:25:37 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:26:27 CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #lisp 20:26:44 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:26:45 what messages 20:27:32 # messages 20:27:47 That's not a message, it's a return value. 20:27:50 i used (values) tho....at the end of defuns and so... 20:30:31 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 20:30:39 -!- doomlord [~doomlod@host31-52-58-47.range31-52.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:32:06 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:33:19 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:35:22 wbooze: are you doing something like: (run-program "/bin/ls" (list "-al") :output *standard-output*) in the REPL ? 20:35:53 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5B29829F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:35:56 (progn (run-program "/bin/ls" (list "-al")) (values)) => ; no values 20:36:00 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:36:00 wait 20:37:31 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136834 20:37:57 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:38:25 Your code is horrible. 20:40:21 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136834#1 20:40:28 indented now 20:40:53 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@222.209.241.145] has left #lisp 20:41:08 It's still horrible. But if you want the command to return (values), have it do so, after the com-msg call. 20:41:27 Bike: it's only a whole number. An integer is not less horrible than another integer. :) 20:41:43 Bike ? 20:42:03 (define-beirc-command [...] (com-msg (target) (format nil "~s" s)) (values)) 20:42:44 pnpuff: Don't be disingenuous. 20:43:21 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:43:29 (defun program-output-as-string (program &rest args) (with-output-to-string (s) (sb-ext:run-program program args :output s))) 20:43:54 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:43:57 use that function, and there's no need to use format/values anywhere 20:44:17 -!- Ener2 [~enerccio@158.194.169.56] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:44:43 sorry got disconnected 20:44:51 didn't get after i typed Bike? 20:45:11 I suggested (define-beirc-command [...] (com-msg (target) (format nil "~s" s)) (values)), and adeht suggested (defun program-output-as-string (program &rest args) (with-output-to-string (s) (sb-ext:run-program program args :output s))) 20:46:26 which brings me to suggest something is foul hereover then cause i used your suggestion too Bike, and still i get those messages.... 20:48:03 aha 20:48:09 ok, got it 20:48:38 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-237-157.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:49:05 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136834#2 20:49:13 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:49:18 -!- Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-222-103.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:49:36 at least use let instead of the setq 20:49:55 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-031-020.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:21 Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-222-103.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:30 -!- otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:50:52 otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has joined #lisp 20:51:03 ok done 20:52:00 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136834#3 20:54:09 -!- PuercoPo` is now known as PuercoPop 20:55:43 -!- elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:56:03 zolk3ri [~Zol1ka@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has joined #lisp 20:56:44 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abon98.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:56:55 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 20:57:31 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 20:58:00 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-4d0dc396.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:58:27 Corvidium [~cosman246@24.56.241.247] has joined #lisp 20:58:32 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:58:42 I created a function `regex-replace-all-to-list' which can be used to replace parts of strings with things (not just strings). Useful when, e.g., linkifying text. The function works as intended, but I feel my code is very inelegant & ugly. I was hoping someone could offer their advice on how to make the code less smelly: https://gist.github.com/joekarma/5430913 20:59:19 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@aboo145.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:59:29 -!- sambio is now known as Abr1I 20:59:56 -!- zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:59:58 -!- Abr1I is now known as Guest92644 21:00:17 -!- Guest92644 is now known as sambio 21:01:18 -!- maxm [~user@unaffiliated/maxm] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:03:47 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [] 21:04:01 Abr1I_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 21:04:12 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:04:18 -!- Abr1I_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Client Quit] 21:04:43 zolk3ri1 [~Zol1ka@catv-89-132-196-182.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 21:04:59 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 21:07:00 -!- zolk3ri [~Zol1ka@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:07:22 Abr1I_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 21:09:04 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-031-020.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:09:09 Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 21:09:54 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.76] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:11:00 -!- pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:12:22 sambio_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 21:13:17 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:13:30 Abr2l [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 21:14:16 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 21:14:36 -!- Abr1I_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:15:02 -!- Abr2l [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has left #lisp 21:15:06 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:17:19 -!- sambio_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:18:24 -!- CampinSam [~CampinSam@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:18:26 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:20:26 in re Gist, does it turn out to be actually useful to combine git and pastebin? 21:20:33 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:21:41 Goheeca [d5c001cc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.192.1.204] has joined #lisp 21:22:07 I find it useful when it's automatic 21:22:18 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:22:43 Do I need anything special to use sb-concurrency? Tried it on both package and system definitions with no luck? I'm getting system not found. 21:24:17 Abr1I_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 21:24:38 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 21:24:41 -!- eskatrem [~user@81.60.148.69.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:24:44 -!- Abr1I_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Client Quit] 21:24:55 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:25:11 sambio_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 21:25:19 joekarma: https://gist.github.com/joekarma/5430913#comment-819009 looks like an improvement to me.. but I would avoid scan-to-ranges altogether and use all-matches as is 21:25:38 argh 21:26:05 joekarma: comment != code in gist :( 21:26:19 hehe no problem I'll just indent it in emacs 21:26:29 thank you 21:27:16 -!- ehu [~ehu@87.212.22.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:27:23 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136836 21:27:35 you can create code blocks in gist comments too, https://help.github.com/articles/github-flavored-markdown#syntax-highlighting 21:27:52 cheers, thanks 21:28:07 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:28:21 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d002766.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 21:29:22 joekarma: replacement-text isn't a very good name btw 21:29:22 limadita [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 21:30:02 replace-text-with-string-or-callback? 21:30:06 -!- sambio_ [~sambio@host116.190-228-67.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:30:42 francogrex [~francogre@91.182.187.116] has joined #lisp 21:30:55 joekarma: replacement-object could be better 21:32:54 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.162] has joined #lisp 21:33:14 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c28f5.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:33:15 -!- francogrex [~francogre@91.182.187.116] has quit [Client Quit] 21:33:19 oops, just noticed a serious problem with my scan-to-ranges function as well, should return (list (cons 0 end-pos)) not (list target-string) 21:33:50 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:34:38 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 21:35:11 -!- limadita [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:35:56 scan-to-ranges is imo the ugliest part of the code, so I definitely agree that if it could be done away with altogether the code could look a lot better 21:36:33 sambio_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 21:38:53 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:40:37 -!- sambio_ is now known as sambio 21:40:40 -!- sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Changing host] 21:40:40 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 21:42:40 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:43:05 bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has joined #lisp 21:43:22 Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 21:43:33 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:44:08 -!- Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:44:10 Kenjin: http://www.sbcl.org/manual/#Contributed-Modules 21:44:10 ravster [~ravi@71-19-174-130.dedicated.allstream.net] has joined #lisp 21:49:19 axion_ [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 21:49:54 Regis__ [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 21:50:26 -!- whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.61.151] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:50:35 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 21:51:40 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:53:23 -!- Goheeca [d5c001cc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.192.1.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:54:41 -!- agumonkey [~agu@97.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:54:44 ldionmarcil [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has joined #lisp 21:54:45 -!- howlandlr [~mlb@cpe-075-181-039-236.carolina.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:54:55 -!- ldionmarcil [~maden@dsl-66-36-130-105.mtl.aei.ca] has quit [Changing host] 21:54:55 ldionmarcil [~maden@unaffiliated/maden] has joined #lisp 21:55:49 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:56:16 -!- leoc [~leoc.git@p5DDB8430.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:59:20 adeht: thanks. Funny I was reading the sb-concurrency stuff just below and missed that :P 22:00:43 adeht: Is the require explicitly needed? Shouldn't a (use :sb-concurrency) in defpackage work? I've seen it in some libraries 22:00:55 or :dependes-on in defsystem 22:02:26 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:02:37 PuercoPo` [~user@190.222.218.144] has joined #lisp 22:03:20 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.222.218.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:04:33 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: kpreid] 22:05:16 Kenjin: personally I save my own sbcl core with often-used systems already loaded. in a public sbcl-specific library I suppose I'd use (eval-always (require :sb-concurrency)) or maybe asdf has something for it 22:05:26 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:06:51 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 22:07:04 adeht: I've seen like this https://github.com/austinhaas/message-stream/blob/662774126b9fb3904e443989885a9fbceef1dd50/test/package.lisp 22:07:24 this assumes the module is already loaded 22:08:01 it relies https://github.com/austinhaas/message-stream/blob/662774126b9fb3904e443989885a9fbceef1dd50/message-stream.asd#L6 22:08:09 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 22:08:24 *relies on.. maybe that works 22:08:39 I'll give it a try 22:08:49 I tried both, but not together :p 22:09:35 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:09:42 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 22:09:48 adeht: It's not working for me 22:10:12 -!- axion_ is now known as axion 22:11:18 Kenjin: so have (eval-when (:compile-toplevel :load-toplevel :execute) (require :sb-concurrency)) before your defpackage [for the record: this is ugly.. I bet there's a better way] 22:11:43 hum. Strange. In OS X, :depends-on #:sb-concurrency is enough. Not on my Ubuntu VM though. 22:12:06 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:12:33 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:12:35 Kenjin: maybe asdf is (not-)configured with the right contrib dir 22:13:42 Kenjin: for me (asdf:component-pathname (asdf:find-system "sb-concurrency")) returns #P"/usr/local/lib/sbcl/sb-concurrency/" which is right 22:15:03 OS X finds it fine. Not so much Ubuntu 22:15:35 did you compile sbcl yourself? 22:16:03 os x yes. Ubuntu installed it from package manager. 22:16:18 that's probably the issue 22:16:54 you know my next suggestion then :).. anyway, sleepytime 22:17:00 -!- p_nathan [~vlion@76.178.163.213] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:17:14 adeht: thanks again. 22:17:16 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.162] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:17:47 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 22:19:31 davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 22:21:43 -!- rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.92.72] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:21:55 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 22:32:43 youlysses [~youlysses@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 22:34:28 agumonkey [~agu@97.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:32 LiamH [~none@96.231.225.69] has joined #lisp 22:37:16 Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has joined #lisp 22:41:03 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.138] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:41:22 setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.138] has joined #lisp 22:43:01 Hum. So I recompiled sbcl on ubuntu and "WARNING! Some of the contrib modules did not build successfully or pass" => sb-concurrency 22:43:05 -!- talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:43:14 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 22:44:53 It seems its a known issue, with various possible causes. 22:47:57 -!- zolk3ri1 [~Zol1ka@catv-89-132-196-182.catv.broadband.hu] has left #lisp 22:50:57 milosn [~milosn@user-5af50bb9.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #lisp 22:51:33 -!- yacks [~py@180.151.36.168] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:51:42 -!- milosn_ [~milosn@user-5af5096d.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:57:16 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.150.191.103] has joined #lisp 22:59:47 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:01:05 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 23:02:32 -!- nialo [nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:03:01 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 23:03:41 Seems 1.1.6 compiles fine. Solved! 23:04:38 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:06:16 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-186-70.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:06:31 -!- Corvidium [~cosman246@24.56.241.247] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:06:48 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:08:37 firefux [firefux@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe96:d915] has joined #lisp 23:11:50 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:15:10 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 23:15:40 -!- munge [~user@ip72-209-237-151.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: foobarbaz] 23:18:31 -!- PuercoPo` [~user@190.222.218.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:24:46 -!- Vicfred [~anon@187.206.19.165] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:25:39 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:26:26 -!- firefux [firefux@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe96:d915] has left #lisp 23:28:59 whist [~whist@c-98-232-204-76.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:29:18 PuercoPo` [~user@190.41.173.174] has joined #lisp 23:31:54 -!- tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:33:31 -!- SHODAN [~shozan@fsf/member/shodan] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:36:08 Shozan [~shozan@fsf/member/shodan] has joined #lisp 23:39:39 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.236.131.threembb.ie] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:39:43 -!- LiamH [~none@96.231.225.69] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:41:53 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:42:04 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 23:45:58 tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has joined #lisp 23:50:01 ASau` [~user@p5797F52C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 23:51:13 -!- ASau [~user@p4FF97886.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:55:34 Bacteria [~Bacteria@dyn-130-194-155-36.its.monash.edu.au] has joined #lisp