00:01:42 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 00:02:21 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 00:02:29 KDr2 [~KDr2@123.120.157.87] has joined #lisp 00:03:27 Xach: POIU found missing dependencies in salza2. Also in lisp-interface-library. 00:07:36 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:08:19 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:09:09 anthony_d [6bcd21be@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.107.205.33.190] has joined #lisp 00:10:51 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 00:12:29 -!- bitonic [~user@151.225.36.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:13:11 doesthiswork [~Adium@75.87.251.5] has joined #lisp 00:18:05 -!- scoofy [~scoofy@catv-89-135-71-167.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [] 00:19:41 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has joined #lisp 00:20:07 adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 00:21:13 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.160.220.61] has joined #lisp 00:21:47 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:22:37 Czechton_ [~Czechton@client0513.vpn.ox.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 00:22:52 -!- _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:23:33 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:24:02 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 00:24:04 -!- anthony_d [6bcd21be@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.107.205.33.190] has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 00:24:10 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.23.125.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:24:10 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 00:24:45 -!- adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:25:25 -!- Czechton [~Czechton@cpc4-oxfd23-2-0-cust877.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:25:39 -!- Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@177.224.212.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:29:42 arrsim [~user@mail.fitness2live.com.au] has joined #lisp 00:33:26 anthony_d [6bcd21be@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.107.205.33.190] has joined #lisp 00:33:44 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.170.27.threembb.ie] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:34:00 -!- KDr2 [~KDr2@123.120.157.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:35:22 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 00:35:40 -!- youlysses [~jsgrant@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:36:19 youlysses [~jsgrant@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 00:36:42 -!- ISF [~ivan@189.61.222.251] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:37:08 cffi complains regarding cl+ssl using FOO instead of either (:pointer (:struct foo)) or (:struct foo). What's the legacy meaning that it defaults to? 00:37:26 I'm trying to fix cl+ssl, but it's not obvious how 00:37:28 -!- anthony_d [6bcd21be@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.107.205.33.190] has quit [Client Quit] 00:37:33 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:37:37 maybe someone who understands it should do it. 00:37:45 and/or issue a tutorial 00:38:08 and/or the warning message should suggest which to use to preserve previous semantics 00:40:43 can a cffi expert look at cl+ssl/bio.lisp 00:40:49 and tell me how to fix it? 00:40:51 -!- Bike [~Glossina@65-100-32-70.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:40:56 I can do the grunt work, but need guidance 00:41:08 everything said in #sbcl 00:41:20 it doesn't apply 00:41:21 at all 00:41:30 there is no mem-aref involved 00:41:56 Fare: whats poiu? sounds like rotated xcvb 00:41:57 Bike [~Glossina@65-100-32-70.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 00:41:59 good evening all. 00:42:01 that's not the only thing that was said in #sbcl 00:42:15 but plenty of foreign-slot-value on things that might actually be pointers. 00:42:38 use '(:struct name) for foreign-slot-value 00:43:09 will it work it foo was passed as a :pointer from a defcallback? 00:43:19 yes 00:45:16 then I don't understand the model at all. That's not how C works. 00:45:34 zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:46:50 foreign-slot-value is like -> 00:46:50 normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has joined #lisp 00:46:57 Sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 00:47:14 Fare: I sent Anton a pull request 00:48:07 fe[nl]ix, thanks 00:48:13 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 00:48:16 Fare: CFFI is like a subset of C with only * and ->, and no immediate values 00:48:23 speaking of him :) 00:48:30 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:48:31 fe[nl]ix, you fixed it already somewhere? what repo / branch? 00:48:43 antonv: I sent you a pull request for cl+ssl 00:48:47 cffi now has immediate values, in form of plists 00:48:55 Fare: https://gitorious.org/cl-plus-ssl/cl-plus-ssl/merge_requests/6 00:49:04 fe[nl]ix, thanks 00:49:06 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-184-177-188-2.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:49:12 fe[nl]ix: thanks (gitorious notifications do not work for me for some reason) 00:49:49 antonv: if you go to the project page, is the "Watch" button on or off ? 00:50:00 fe[nl]ix: on 00:50:12 which i don't know who would want to use 00:50:26 frkout [~frkout@124x35x85x74.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 00:50:28 antonv: it says "Watch" ? 00:50:36 -!- pierpa [~user@host28-20-dynamic.53-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:50:54 fe[nl]ix: says Unwatch 00:51:00 -!- GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:51:08 weird 00:51:21 you should move to github 00:51:44 gitorious is way behind on quality nowadays 00:52:06 fe[nl]ix: maybe 00:52:18 reviewing the merge request 00:52:51 -!- agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:53:43 fe[nl]ix: why this change? 00:54:37 it's in the commit message 00:55:05 Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has joined #lisp 00:55:07 the latest CFFI release has undergone some type system changes 00:55:10 new CFFI type refenrece style.. 00:55:47 is it pure cosmetical, or fixes something? 00:56:23 antonv: cffi will never shut up about it 00:56:40 necessary for adding support for structs-as-values 00:57:18 which some libraries use 00:57:25 ok 00:57:27 applied 00:57:30 thanks 00:57:37 thank you 00:58:03 gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:01:16 -!- frkout [~frkout@124x35x85x74.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:03:31 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 01:04:45 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 01:06:12 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:09:01 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 01:09:38 -!- ered [~ered@75-101-56-39.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:10:10 ered [~ered@75-101-56-39.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 01:10:54 has something changed in how to use cffi-grovel:grovel-file ? 01:11:31 daniel [~user@74-134-242-5.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 01:11:50 not that I remember 01:11:51 somehow, it's trying to compile my the .lisp file as if it were a lisp file, rather than using process-op... 01:11:55 -!- daniel is now known as Guest43134 01:12:19 -!- spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:12:22 comment correcting me: http://dharmaprogramming.wordpress.com/ 01:12:51 I gotta leave now, so I'll update the post with informations from the comments on the blog 01:13:08 or is it known not to work with asdf 3 ? 01:13:17 http://paste.lisp.org/display/136739 here's a little trivial function that isn't tail recursive, and, at first glance, there's no easy way to make it 01:13:30 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:13:46 however, it can be made so by exploiting a list zipper. is this a common pattern in lisp? 01:14:14 try #scheme 01:14:31 goodbye 01:14:35 Fare: it definitely works here 01:14:57 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:15:04 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@2.80.229.94] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:16:23 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:18:20 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-34-56.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 01:18:58 tordek: It's trivially tail recursive if accumulate the list. 01:19:04 er, if you. 01:20:43 -!- Bike [~Glossina@65-100-32-70.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:20:56 Bike [~Glossina@174-25-38-57.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 01:21:07 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 01:22:41 -!- Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-34-56.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:22:44 Question: if I write some code to run in slime-repl-shortcut-eval, will that properly interact with the debugger? When I try, it seems like it hangs instead of throwing me into SLDB.... 01:23:25 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-38-57.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 01:24:31 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:25:56 spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 01:26:14 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-38-57.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:26:25 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 01:27:43 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.217.198.245] has joined #lisp 01:27:44 pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has joined #lisp 01:27:58 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:32:11 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:32:15 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-54-20.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 01:32:43 fe[nl]ix, where is an example of using it properly? has that changed recently? 01:33:04 frkout [~frkout@124x35x85x74.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 01:35:10 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-38-57.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:39:05 wgl [~wgl@209.242.26.41] has joined #lisp 01:42:49 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 01:45:06 -!- dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:45:41 Why doesnot #'in-package work in ~/.clisprc ? (ql:quickload :utils) ((in-package :utils) 01:46:02 What surprising thing occurs? 01:46:15 the system might not have a package by that name 01:47:12 Bike: it is loaded successfully as i can use functions in utils 01:47:23 with utils:Foo 01:47:31 So, what ... surprising ... thing ... occurs? 01:47:33 -!- two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 01:47:43 "does not work" is not a useful description. 01:47:45 The *package* is NOT utils 01:48:05 in the repl or in the file? 01:48:16 repl 01:48:21 clhs load 01:48:21 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_load.htm 01:48:26 *package* is rebound by load 01:48:34 bye 01:48:37 -!- wgl [~wgl@209.242.26.41] has left #lisp 01:49:07 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:49:44 (ql:quickload :utils) (in-package :utils) who execute "load" ? 01:49:54 I think the problem has to do with swank-asdf causing asdf to be loaded when it shouldn't. 01:50:01 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:50:33 the (in-package :utils) is the last line in ~/.clisprc 01:51:04 You don't understand what rebinding means. 01:51:27 who rebounding ? 01:51:30 dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has joined #lisp 01:51:45 load rebinds *package* 01:52:37 yeah, but #in-package can change *package* when executed manually in repl 01:52:52 Yes, but you did it in .clisprc, which is loaded. 01:53:46 no, it's not swank, but something is causing asdf to be loaded more than should. I blame the asdf guy. 01:54:31 Bike: during loading the #'in-package in ~/.clisprc cannot change *package* ? 01:54:34 -!- loke [~loke@203.127.16.194] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:54:40 Fare: that's what i usually do, and then it turns out someone else is to blame! 01:54:45 Not the global *package*, no. that's what rebinding means 01:55:35 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: casion] 01:55:39 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 01:56:01 then i cannot use #'in-package in ~/.clisprc 01:56:09 loke [~loke@203.127.16.194] has joined #lisp 01:57:21 KDr2 [~KDr2@111.161.70.16] has joined #lisp 02:00:01 -!- dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has quit [Quit: dreish] 02:00:02 ok, looks like a bug in poiu. I blame the poiu guy. 02:00:18 nan_` [~user@46.197.112.181] has joined #lisp 02:00:42 -!- nan_ [~user@46.197.112.181] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:03:51 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:05:18 -!- frkout [~frkout@124x35x85x74.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:12:52 Fare: aren't you the poiu guy? 02:13:05 yeah 02:13:33 and it looks like the bug is in your implementation, for I cannot reproduce the race condition with lparallel's. 02:13:48 lparallel has channels, too? 02:13:52 and the ccl primitives look robust enough 02:13:57 they call them "queues" 02:14:18 and don't expose them as well 02:14:49 oh well. Sorry if it caused you grief. :\ 02:16:04 wuyun [~root@63.223.125.73] has joined #lisp 02:16:12 meh 02:16:26 SNAFU 02:16:50 you might want to look into it, though 02:17:24 I do. I'm still a bit baffled by where the gap would be, but I'm not entirely surprised it's there. 02:17:32 I'm also using lparallel because it was suggested I shouldn't reimplement my own thread-pooling. 02:17:48 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:18:05 yeah, I mostly just copied mine from an existing lib, at the time. 02:18:22 before the golden days of quicklisp, when extra dependencies were a sin. 02:19:00 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 02:20:06 *loke* loves these golden days of QL 02:23:26 cades [~mac@59-124-92-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 02:23:52 -!- EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:30:09 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:15 axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:37:32 I bet the original POIU didn't have this bug and I introduced in while rewriting because I didn't grok antifuchs' subtle code. 02:37:46 -!- Sambio is now known as sambio 02:38:09 -!- dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:38:45 ah, new error! progress!! 02:41:04 aha, and it's a bug in cffi-grovel, at least on asdf3. 02:44:22 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:45:20 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-77.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:46:57 Given a condition object, can I print its stack trace? (simplar to Java's Throwable.printStacktrace()?) 02:47:11 no 02:47:19 ouch 02:47:50 loke: try trivial-backtrace 02:47:56 Bike: it doesn't 02:48:11 Bike: It only prints the stack trace at the point of calling the function 02:48:38 so, call it at the point you want 02:48:43 But... perhaps I can use HANDLER-BIND and call trivial-backtrace:print-backtrace in there? At that point the stack hasn't been unrolled yet, yes? 02:48:50 well, yes, but that should still be relevant by the tie you're handling a condition 02:48:57 right 02:49:25 I was using HANDLER-CASE. It seems as though the handler there is called _after_ the stack is unwond, yes? 02:49:59 yep. 02:50:04 Nice. 02:50:10 "n this case, the dynamic state is unwound appropriately (so that the handlers established around the expression are no longer active), and var is bound to the condition that had been signaled." 02:52:08 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:52:43 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-77.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 02:54:32 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:54:41 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-54-20.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 02:54:54 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 02:56:45 fe[nl]ix, do you prefer pull requests on github? https://github.com/cffi/cffi/pull/25 02:57:39 so is quicklisp the sexual revolution of common-lisp, making us more promiscuous? 02:58:36 or is it the opposite, allowing us to share code without DNA being duplicated everywhere instead of staying where it should? 02:59:26 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.224.236.4.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:01:45 Henesy [~h3n3sy@adsl-75-17-77-0.dsl.peoril.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 03:02:25 -!- GNUtori0us is now known as notori0us 03:04:03 Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 03:06:12 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:06:50 nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has joined #lisp 03:09:03 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:09:40 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 03:13:31 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:13:46 Fare: Where it "should"? 03:13:53 Fare: That sounds very racist to me :-) 03:14:03 what's the correct way to override the cffi:define-foreign-library of a library? especially when the same file (say in cl+ssl) does the cffi:use-foreign-library ? 03:14:39 simplest way of course is to edit the file. 03:15:57 Fare: I believe that's the only way? 03:16:30 create a symlink 03:17:20 Speaking of cl+ssl, how can I get in touch with a maintainer of it? 03:17:34 jl_2 [~jl_2@174-16-222-121.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:21:55 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:27:20 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:27:50 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:29:31 -!- nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:34:51 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@120.154.70.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:36:38 the next step after quicklisp is a something like perl's cpan so that it is not only easy to get things, it is easy to discover things you didn't know you needed. 03:41:04 -!- wuyun [~root@63.223.125.73] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:41:36 doesthiswork: cliki serves that function, to a point 03:41:43 -!- nalaginrut [~nalaginru@61.14.130.226] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:41:49 doesthiswork: but Xach has talked about doing something more targeted 03:42:54 wuyun [~root@199.68.198.213] has joined #lisp 03:44:30 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:44:37 I've been wanting a way to search the description and license fields of QL packages 03:44:38 I've looked through the libraries on cliki but I don't have a good idea of the relative usefulness of different libraries except for those that I've seen mentioned on people's blogs 03:44:53 also, a way of getting a list of licenses for dependencies 03:45:12 I.e. even if a library I use is BSD-licenseced, I need to make sure no dependencies have GPL 03:46:34 -!- erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: erikc] 03:46:45 loke: that should be automatable 03:47:29 jasom: It should, but it isn't. 03:48:24 ZombieChicken [~weechat@unaffiliated/forgottenwizard] has joined #lisp 03:51:37 -!- Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-222-103.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:52:54 Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-222-103.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:54:07 loke: I know Xach has made a script that will generate a manifest of all .asd's required by a given package 03:54:19 loke: from there it's simple to get the licenses; so I would say it is automatable 03:54:54 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.150.178.55] has joined #lisp 03:55:06 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:56:15 -!- ZombieChicken [~weechat@unaffiliated/forgottenwizard] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 03:59:04 (mapcar (lambda (sys) (ignore-errors (asdf:system-license (asdf:find-system sys)))) (cdar (asdf:component-depends-on 'asdf:compile-op (asdf:find-system :drakma)))) sort of worked except most of the dependencies don't appear to have the right slot... 04:00:50 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 04:08:04 Today's beautiful Google Translate of pac-jp correspondence: 04:09:01 "MUREX like Karim // We Thank you for your help. Is Terashi SCSK // Thank you of the following, your professor. // At this time we will close this issue. // I will be over. // Get time from your busy schedule and, // Thank you all! 04:09:24 It's poetry. :-) 04:12:13 Strigoides [~owen@60-234-213-126.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 04:15:27 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:16:24 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:20:00 -!- rking [~rking@unaffiliated/rking] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.1-dev] 04:21:24 rking [~rking@unaffiliated/rking] has joined #lisp 04:23:30 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:24:08 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.220.76] has joined #lisp 04:24:09 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.220.76] has quit [Changing host] 04:24:09 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 04:24:38 -!- paddymahoney [~paddymaho@198-84-186-52.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:32:02 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has joined #lisp 04:33:44 how do I create a merge request on gitorious? 04:37:36 -!- ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:42:52 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 04:44:19 Oh, I just realised that my previous post was to the wrong channel 04:44:22 sorry abouyt that 04:44:35 -!- Henesy [~h3n3sy@adsl-75-17-77-0.dsl.peoril.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:45:17 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 04:45:33 asvil [~user@91.151.182.61] has joined #lisp 04:45:49 agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 04:48:40 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:51:51 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p549C5E75.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 04:53:35 I know it's a bit off-topic but I'm a bit desperate. 04:53:47 Has anyone implemented a plugin system using dlopen? 04:54:22 I'm trying to create CL fasl files using dynamic libraries but when I load them into my image they don't link to existing symbols and they fail to run properly. 04:55:45 Or does anyone know a good IRC channel for gear-head questions about linking and ELF binaries? 04:56:23 Existing symbols? 04:56:49 Yes, global ELF-type symbols, not CL symbols. 04:57:27 For instance, I have a Lisp class that stores almost everything, it has one global instance "_lisp". 04:58:01 If I load the executable, everything works and talks to _lisp. If I load a dynamic library with a bunch of compiled CL code in it, it doesn't see "_lisp" ---> CRASH 04:58:03 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.241.189] has joined #lisp 04:58:54 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.150.178.55] has quit [Quit: Bye] 04:59:30 I'm told by several web pages that if I compile the executable with -export-dynamic that external symbols in the executable should be used by dynamic libraries that are loaded into it. Nuh uh! 04:59:43 Hm, I would guess your dynamic library isn't properly set to have the image in its dependencies... I don't think I know enough though. Maybe ask ##c? 05:00:27 «If you use "dlopen" to load a dynamic object which needs to refer back to the symbols defined by the program, rather than some other dynamic object, then you will probably need to use [-export-dynamic] when linking the program itself.» 05:00:38 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:00:48 Harag [~Thunderbi@105.226.65.109] has joined #lisp 05:02:33 Was that a quote from a manual page somewhere? Because yes, that is what I've been reading. 05:02:43 Yeah, man ld. 05:03:32 Do you have the libraries set to look at the program for symbols, though, is what i guess i'm asking. 05:03:50 Right, so part of the problem may be that some symbols are defined in dynamic libraries that are automatically loaded into the executable. My _lisp symbol is like that. I want them all to feed forward into the plugins/kernel that I load after the executable starts. 05:05:10 I'd like to know what as well. How do I tell a library to look back at the program for symbols. Usually they look back for undefined symbols and define them. 05:05:48 What I'm trying to do is more like the plugin system in Python. 05:06:47 It was suggested to me in the #llvm chat room that I pass a structure with every pointer that I want the plugin to have access to to the plugin when it initializes. I have a lot of pointers. 05:06:49 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p549C5E75.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:06:52 Fare: how do I get at poiu again (i'm on different machine, have to re-install) 05:06:54 My suggestion is to avoid stuffing about at the linkage level. 05:07:32 Zhivago: I'd love to, what else can I do though? 05:07:35 git clone git@github.com:fare/poiu.git 05:08:09 *Fare* fixes bugs in qres found by poiu 05:08:29 I'd define a function like 'start' or something in your module, and then have the main program call it upon linkage via dlsym, passing in whatever environmental stuff is required to look things up like symbols and so on. 05:08:44 i see.. the common-lisp.net page for QITAB is quite up 05:09:18 Then the module can stash that whatever it likes and look up the functions it needs to look up, and use them to hook itself in by interning whatever symbols it uses. 05:09:43 Probably 'intern' is the main thing you need for coordination. 05:09:49 POIU shows a countdown of about 2000 Lisp files... yuck 05:09:50 syrinx_ [~quassel@ip68-1-175-223.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:09:50 -!- syrinx_ [~quassel@ip68-1-175-223.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 05:09:50 syrinx_ [~quassel@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 05:10:10 Zhivago: Yeah, at least then I'd have control. I've been keeping the environment stuff in one class as much as possible. The problem has been that I had to create a NIL and UNBOUND instance for every class (350 classes) so that C++ can dereference NIL and UNBOUND values without segfaulting. 05:10:30 Why isn't that handled by interning? 05:11:18 Zhivago: It's not handled by interning, it's low-level C++ nuts-and-bolts stuff. 05:11:44 There's no need for incompatibility there. 05:11:59 Symbol nil = intern("NIL") or whatever 05:12:24 Then you'll have a reference to the cannonical nil symbol, which can also be an external singleton or whatever. 05:12:40 intern("COMMON-LISP", "NIL"), rather, I guess. 05:13:41 -!- syrinx [~quassel@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:14:36 -!- syrinx_ is now known as syrinx 05:14:43 -!- syrinx is now known as syrinx_ 05:14:50 Fare: http://paste.lisp.org/display/136740 05:14:56 Lets say I declare a fixnum in C++, I say Fixnum_sp x; Then if I want to set x to nil I say x = _Nil(). Now if I dereference x to check if its null I can say: x->null(). 05:15:47 What if you want to set x to "hello" 05:15:54 When I dereference x it needs to return a pointer to an Fixnum_O instance that represents the NIL instance of Fixnum_O. 05:16:01 and you have 3 1/3 minutes to provide further instructions 05:16:10 otherwise this node will be offline until tomorrow zzzz 05:16:26 Oh the hoops C++ people jump through to avoid pointers 05:16:34 Bike: Then you say T_sp x = Str_O::create("Hello"). You use the base class if you want polymorphism. 05:16:36 drmeister: That sounds ... um ... problematic. 05:16:56 drmeister: What I"m getting at is, why pick out NIL? 05:16:56 drmeister: You're planning on having one nil instance per type? 05:17:02 Zhivago: Why? It works fine. It's C++. 05:17:08 gendl, is that with poiu 1.30.3 ??? 05:17:15 Zhivago: Planning? I already have. 05:17:24 sounds like that's still the bug from 1.30.2 05:17:29 let me make sure... 05:17:29 Well, you'll now have to produce some insane mapping between the NIL symbol and these per-type intsances. 05:17:35 git pull to update 05:17:48 -!- nan_` [~user@46.197.112.181] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:17:51 Zhivago: It's handled by my smart pointer class. 05:18:10 -!- syrinx_ is now known as syrinx 05:18:27 And it's pretty lightweight. 05:18:30 o ya it's pulling the poiu from an old asdf, sorry... 05:18:32 How does it know which symbol is NIL? 05:18:46 drmeister: answer my question? 05:20:01 ahem. 22 seconds spent in traverse itself? gotta fix whatever is wrong, there 05:20:07 Bike: What, why pick out NIL? Because Fixnum_O::_nilInstance == every other _nilInstance. 05:20:12 225MB allocated, too 05:20:17 for 2000 files, but still. 05:20:23 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-128-221.w92-156.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 05:20:28 well, not an old asdf, it's 2.33.3, but it's pulling the poiu from within asdf instead of the separately git clone'd one (because apparently i failed to git clone one)... 05:20:32 I had to do the same thing with UNBOUND - it works. 05:20:46 drmeister: That doesn't really answer my question. Why allow morphing every type into a NIL but not into other types? 05:21:04 I'm not sure I understand the question. 05:21:11 I'll optimize later. 05:21:29 It's also a little different from how I'm explaining it. There is a single value for NIL in the smart_pointer. 05:21:53 There is a NIL instance for every class so that I can dereference a NIL pointer to any class. 05:22:05 drmeister: Like why allow Fixnum_O to be a NIL instead of forcing use of the generic T_sp 05:22:47 Oh, that - because Fixnum_sp x needs to be able to have a NIL value sometimes. 05:22:48 Presumably this allows for neater tagging semantics. 05:23:51 When I need polymorphism I use T_sp. When I don't I use specific classes like DoubleFloat_sp or HashTable_sp 05:23:59 Fare: i'm seeing *poiu-version* "1.30" 05:24:04 in poiu.lisp at the top 05:24:09 It lets the compiler do some of the work type-checking. 05:24:12 but i just git cloned it 05:24:31 gendl, oh -- I might not have pushed to all repos 05:24:45 details, details... 05:24:52 I can always say Fixnum_sp x; T_sp y; y = x; 05:24:56 thanks 05:25:01 pushed 05:25:23 -!- syrinx [~quassel@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:25:32 ya ok, 1.30.3. i'll try it now. 05:25:34 Or for downcasting I use: Fixnum_sp x; T_sp y = x; Fixnum_sp z = y->as(); 05:25:37 syrinx [~quassel@ip68-1-175-223.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:25:37 -!- syrinx [~quassel@ip68-1-175-223.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 05:25:37 syrinx [~quassel@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 05:26:03 The only expensive operation there is ->as() because it requires dynamic_downcast. 05:27:15 it's getting farther than last time... 05:27:26 That's really why I use classes other than T_sp, to avoid constant down casting. 05:27:56 all my systems have :serial t, so i'm not sure how much speedup imma get 05:28:20 welp, it seems to have finished. 05:28:31 i'll to a (time ) comparison now with non-poiu 05:30:17 gendl, there's still inter-system parallelism then 05:30:30 right, i noticed a little bit of that 05:30:50 but lemme see how many CPUs this vm is configured with... 05:31:17 3. 05:31:27 *Fare* faints. nity nite. 05:31:36 night 05:31:53 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 05:31:53 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 05:31:54 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 05:35:42 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-aomcdazzzscpvxom] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:36:34 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:36:43 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 05:36:45 weird time results: http://paste.lisp.org/display/136741 05:37:14 non-poiu is half the real time 05:37:21 but 7x cpu time 05:37:25 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:22 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.133.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 05:40:25 -!- teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:40:42 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 05:42:17 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:43:19 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 05:44:04 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 05:46:12 teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has joined #lisp 05:47:13 -!- breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 05:47:56 bind [~bind@D57DEC5A.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #lisp 05:51:59 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.251] has joined #lisp 05:52:02 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:52:28 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 05:53:47 -!- xos [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:53:55 CrazyWoods [~nowolfer@125.77.218.228] has joined #lisp 05:56:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.220.76] has joined #lisp 05:56:49 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.220.76] has quit [Changing host] 05:56:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 05:57:57 -!- vsync is now known as thoughtfulness 05:58:03 -!- thoughtfulness is now known as vsync 05:59:24 pegu [~user@cF469BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has joined #lisp 05:59:44 Any ideas how to translate $(document).ready(function() { $("#nav").hover(function(){ ...} }, function () { } ) into lisp so that parenscript gives the correct result? I cannot seem to make it work. 06:00:59 just remember $ is a function 06:02:14 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 06:02:57 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 06:03:01 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [] 06:04:03 -!- Guest43134 [~user@74-134-242-5.dhcp.insightbb.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:05:37 MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-173-67-109-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 06:06:41 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:08:07 are there cpu are design special for lisp? 06:08:30 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.241.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:08:46 if you live in the 80s, maybe? 06:09:06 some of the old machines are still working, surely 06:09:09 CrazyWoods: several. see kogge's "architecture of symbolic computers" 06:10:19 CrazyWoods: if you speak german: http://metalisp.it-marks.com/php/meta/download/dissertation_lohse.pdf 06:10:40 (well, you just need to _read_ it actually) 06:10:40 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:11:29 H4ns: thank you 06:12:43 CrazyWoods: i must add that from a performance perspective, none of these architectures make sense today. lisp on general purpose cpu runs circles about every single one of them. 06:13:20 CrazyWoods: they're nice as an intellectual exercise, and maybe as a path towards end-to-end verified lisp systems. 06:13:48 H4ns: is that necessarily so, or is that just an outcome of decades of lost development? 06:14:16 "x86s are great lisp machines" as they say 06:14:19 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:15:04 -!- agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:15:24 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:15:28 snowylike: a lot of the special magic done back then is not really necessary, IMO 06:16:17 they let you run fast without much work done by compiler, I guess 06:17:59 it seems to me like memory management was one of the more important things these machines did 06:18:03 is that right? 06:18:24 snowylike: there was some support, but I heard stories of people running without GC because it was so slow 06:18:38 supposedly the K-Machine would have had better one had it been released 06:19:04 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:19:53 there was some extra hw support for GC, but not that much it seems, and just as important was direct support for things like tagged data or using double-issue tricks to avoid performance slowdown if you didn't have specialized types 06:21:18 also, with possible exception of that scheme cpu (read: I haven't studied it), all of those were heavily microcoded machines, to the point that when VLM was published, they called it essentially "Ivory microcode for Alpha" 06:21:31 tcr [~tcr@46-126-110-164.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 06:21:32 mh 06:22:35 p_l: do you mean the "lambda the ultimate opcode" thing? 06:22:35 K-Machine was IMO most interesting... but never surfaced 06:22:41 One of the things that I think that lisp systems tend to do poorly is compartmentalization, like erlang light weight processes. 06:22:42 Bike: no 06:22:50 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.251] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 06:23:10 Putting things in smaller boxes can make memory management much simpler in many cases. 06:23:16 Zhivago: no one put any work into that once Lisp Machines died out, it seems 06:23:35 Yeah. It's a pity. And the lisp machines didn't do a very good job of it, iirc. 06:24:16 Zhivago: I meant Lisp Machines as the one environment that might make people look into it - on other platforms, you were building single-purpose applications so people didn't care because underlying OS provided separation 06:24:30 -!- spacefrogg^ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:24:42 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.217.198.245] has left #lisp 06:25:08 Erlang is IMHO closer to VLM or Inferno running on top of another system 06:25:21 Joreji [~thomas@65-136.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 06:25:56 Ah. I mean separation at the application level, as erlang does. 06:26:21 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.251] has joined #lisp 06:26:31 Zhivago: yes, I know - it's just that Erlang as a whole essentially includes its own operating system running within the host 06:26:54 and I don't think the original use of Erlang involved it being hosted on top of anything like normal OS 06:26:58 -!- freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 06:27:01 Sure, and lisp systems pretty much do the same. 06:27:12 freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has joined #lisp 06:27:17 That doesn't address the issue of 'plays well with others', but that's a separate issue. 06:28:09 -!- breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 06:28:15 Zhivago: VLM, sure, SBCL and such, not really IMHO. But it's interesting thing I'd like to one day play with, except I always see the doom of "write a CL implementation" when I look there 06:28:54 Sure. I wouldn't recommend writing new CL implementations. 06:29:05 I think CL is pretty much a dead end at this point. 06:29:50 Zhivago: I find the prospect of doing a completely new language an even deader end, not without some gimmick 06:30:25 (and no, I am not going to run in JVM or .NET or compile to JS, so it would be in the "pretty much fucked" area) 06:30:39 Why not? 06:30:57 cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #lisp 06:31:21 Why do you give a damn about the underlying machine of an implementation? 06:31:36 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e30b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 06:32:24 p_l: why not compile to llvm? That's the new hotness. 06:39:50 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-77.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:41:56 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-128-221.w92-156.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:43:36 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:44:14 Forgetaboutit [~sammy@s15731961.onlinehome-server.info] has joined #lisp 06:47:15 Zhivago: I care about a) dealing with JVM or .NET (both are annoying to me even when just *using* stuff running on them, though .NET a bit less) 06:47:33 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 06:47:34 teggi [~teggi@123.20.24.160] has joined #lisp 06:48:30 b) Running on JS... meh, the main reason for "hotness" to people would be to stick it into browser or V8, and frankly speaking I'd have to emulate yet another VM on top of that to get the results I want 06:48:48 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 06:48:49 There's always jsasm. :) 06:48:51 sykopomp: LLVM by itself doesn't do much, except maybe give people false sense of speed 06:49:09 Zhivago: asmjs* 06:49:12 woooo 06:49:23 Zhivago: yeah, and x86 emulator in JS, yes. Not a real-world use case, IMO 06:49:35 p_l: gecko is about as good or better than v8 these days anyway. 06:50:09 sykopomp: doesn't change much, other than the fact that it doesn't suck memory so much :) 06:50:26 gecko is webscale 06:50:32 *SNRK* 06:50:46 is your new language webscale 06:51:12 see, I don't do well with buzzwords these days 06:52:02 I was more interested in taking bits of SBCL and building up an application server that I could play around with various compartmentalization methods and experiment with GCs than pander to that 06:55:22 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 06:56:39 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: mental blackout] 06:56:49 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@195.180.2.195] has joined #lisp 06:58:41 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 07:00:01 whist [~whist@c-98-232-204-76.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:01:37 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@195.180.2.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 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joined #lisp 11:42:59 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:43:51 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:45:08 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@93-80-129-99.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:46:56 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:47:02 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:48:26 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:49:30 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 11:49:46 btw, regarding "compiling to JS" and such... "it's less than 3kB!" I see for a set of several JS+CSS libs, and I think: "+1s to load time, +3s to load time, +2s to load time, and that's all before accounting for SYN-dropping!" 11:51:10 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:52:50 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 11:53:38 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:55:23 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@108.Red-88-23-188.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:55:45 _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 11:55:50 Thra11 [~Thra11@87.114.143.175] has joined #lisp 11:56:04 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 11:57:56 Harag [~Thunderbi@105.226.65.109] has joined #lisp 11:59:30 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@194.141.47.12] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:00:55 baggers [c2b06999@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.176.105.153] has joined #lisp 12:01:20 zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:01:36 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 12:01:41 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:02:36 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 12:06:08 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:07:18 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:07:31 -!- kanru` [~kanru@93.Red-79-147-88.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:10:31 -!- ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:10:31 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 12:13:21 ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has joined #lisp 12:13:24 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 12:14:23 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 12:14:51 LiamH [~none@129-2-129-147.wireless.umd.edu] has joined #lisp 12:15:02 -!- davazp [~user@31.200.155.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:16:36 clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:18:12 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-5-56.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:19:05 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 12:22:51 davazp [~user@31.200.155.22] has joined #lisp 12:23:33 -!- nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:26:19 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:26:58 yusup [~yusup@58.100.53.130] has joined #lisp 12:27:14 pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 12:29:23 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30:57 -!- teggi [~teggi@123.20.24.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:31:14 -!- yusup [~yusup@58.100.53.130] has quit [Client Quit] 12:32:04 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105.226.65.109] has quit [Quit: Harag] 12:33:35 -!- benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:33:58 -!- Guest86759 [~on@139.Red-81-38-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:34:25 naryl [~weechat@46.182.24.168] has joined #lisp 12:39:01 agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 12:42:13 -!- nilsi [~nilsi@c83-253-22-138.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:42:22 -!- yacks [~py@180.151.36.168] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:42:24 cades [~mac@60.245.65.197] has joined #lisp 12:44:08 scoofy [~scoofy@catv-89-135-71-167.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 12:44:13 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 12:45:06 kanru` [~kanru@54.Red-83-44-206.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:45:33 KDr2 [~KDr2@114.243.237.175] has joined #lisp 12:47:16 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 12:48:00 -!- baggers [c2b06999@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.176.105.153] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:48:48 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:49:38 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:49:56 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-52-220.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 12:52:18 drmeister [~drmeister@mobile-166-147-109-052.mycingular.net] has joined #lisp 12:53:07 natechan [~natechan@c-71-56-124-186.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:53:43 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 12:54:27 benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has joined #lisp 12:55:10 btw does SBCL have it's own irc channel? 12:55:24 #sbcl@freenode 12:55:29 p_l: thank you 12:56:20 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 12:56:24 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 12:58:24 fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 12:58:47 -!- cades [~mac@60.245.65.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:59:28 -!- ryoshu [~ryoshu@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:59:57 ryoshu [~ryoshu@83.143.102.212] has joined #lisp 13:01:09 -!- az [~andre@kettu.znaider.de] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 13:02:08 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 13:04:10 -!- natechan [~natechan@c-71-56-124-186.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 13:05:51 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:06:03 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:06:44 dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:09:07 cades [~mac@60.245.65.197] has joined #lisp 13:09:53 vrossi [~vrossi@58-7-152-48.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 13:10:53 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:11:02 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@mobile-166-147-109-052.mycingular.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:11:37 yacks [~py@180.151.36.168] has joined #lisp 13:15:29 normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has joined #lisp 13:16:45 -!- Knirr [~Knirr@c-da4ae555.143-16-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:16:51 nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has joined #lisp 13:16:53 -!- cades [~mac@60.245.65.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:17:05 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [Client Quit] 13:23:01 -!- knob [~knob@76.76.202.244] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:24:34 cades [~mac@60.245.65.194] has joined #lisp 13:25:13 -!- nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:26:18 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 13:26:24 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-dvvhcvyovunwtugd] has joined #lisp 13:26:32 good morning 13:26:53 -!- cades [~mac@60.245.65.194] has quit [Client Quit] 13:27:07 -!- varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:28:50 ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:28:54 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 13:32:53 -!- LiamH [~none@129-2-129-147.wireless.umd.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:33:13 antgreen [~green@out-pq-195.wireless.telus.com] has joined #lisp 13:33:19 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 13:37:43 enymo [~user@67.137.177.90] has joined #lisp 13:38:11 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 13:40:49 -!- fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: Bye.] 13:43:21 Denommus: good morning. 13:43:22 fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 13:44:26 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-128-221.w92-156.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:44:52 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-164-112.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:45:44 -!- vrossi [~vrossi@58-7-152-48.dyn.iinet.net.au] has left #lisp 13:47:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:47:31 -!- bind [~bind@D57DEC5A.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 13:48:46 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:50:43 Sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 13:51:35 guys, I don't like a lot the way I represent regexps on cl-ppcre (with strings) 13:52:01 Denommus: why? 13:52:11 I mean, if I want to find a \ I must type "\\\\". This could be better 13:52:21 -!- ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:52:43 ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:52:57 Denommus: look at cl-interpol if you're bothered enough 13:53:31 truman [~AndChat18@31.144.167.85] has joined #lisp 13:53:53 -!- truman [~AndChat18@31.144.167.85] has quit [Client Quit] 13:55:23 -!- rudi [~rudi@1x-193-157-205-6.uio.no] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 13:57:24 I also made a tiny reader macro that makes a perl-like syntax 13:57:47 Denommus: http://dlowe.net/blog/ 13:57:58 Yow. Last post 2007. 13:58:03 -!- ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:58:16 *Xach* sheds a tiny tear 13:58:19 You can "maybe next week" some things for a long time 14:00:41 dlowe: wow, this is almost what I had in mind 14:01:04 ok, it is what I had in mind 14:01:59 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-004-251.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 14:03:49 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:05:01 GOMADWarrior [~Regis@189.34.44.144] has joined #lisp 14:05:18 Do take a look at cl-interpol, though. It's a bit more lispy. 14:05:19 bioevolgenec1 [~bioevolge@athedsl-4505925.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 14:06:40 -!- bioevolgenec [~bioevolge@unaffiliated/bioevolgenec] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:06:43 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 14:07:47 minion: chant 14:07:47 MORE LISPY 14:07:55 NEVER LISPY ENOUGH 14:08:37 anybody know what the recommended way to use both css-lite and parenscript into a package is - apparently - both want to export % 14:09:15 bhyde: use :import-from instead of :use in your defpackage 14:09:28 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:09:48 You can choose to use one, the other, or neither via shadowing-import-from or shadow, too. 14:10:06 chapter 7 in my package book covers it in detail 14:10:21 Xach: you have a book? This is the first I've heard of it 14:10:23 if you want lispy, don't use perl syntax for cl-ppcre, it has a s-exp syntax 14:10:25 *bhyde* "why can't we all just get along?" 14:11:19 dlowe: it is somewhat flawed in that it hasn't been written yet 14:11:39 i don't mind saying that this is covered in chapter 7, though, as long as you don't mind it changing later. 14:12:37 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:12:54 -!- fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: I was watching my other computer for too long.] 14:13:01 ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:13:03 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 14:13:18 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:13:19 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:13:34 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 14:13:37 Xach: at least that's the only flaw at this stage ;) 14:14:49 -!- pierpa [~user@host28-20-dynamic.53-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:08 pierpa [~user@host28-20-dynamic.53-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 14:15:52 -!- Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:16:52 PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has joined #lisp 14:16:56 Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has joined #lisp 14:19:18 -!- kanru` [~kanru@54.Red-83-44-206.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:22:00 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 14:22:13 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:22:52 -!- silenius [~silenius@g230190173.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:24:04 dnolen [~user@cpe-72-225-195-95.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:24:13 -!- bioevolgenec1 [~bioevolge@athedsl-4505925.home.otenet.gr] has left #lisp 14:24:46 cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-98-38.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 14:25:05 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-128-221.w92-156.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 14:26:05 Xach: when are you next in Boston? 14:26:41 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:28:49 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:29:31 fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 14:31:23 kanru` [~kanru@201.Red-88-12-18.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:31:45 Fare: may 6 through 10 14:32:04 are you interested in hearing gbyers speak? 14:32:13 I will try to invite him that week, then. 14:32:22 -!- zajn [~zajn@c-67-182-61-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:32:23 silenius [~silenius@g229078081.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 14:32:33 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:32:33 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:32:40 If it's convenient for him 14:32:50 *Xach* doesn't want to inconvenience a coworker 14:33:07 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:33:18 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:34:01 Kent seemed 60% ready to present something 14:34:20 oh was he? 14:34:27 can he be 100% ready in June? 14:34:37 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 14:34:38 I kind of reserved May for my ASDF talk already 14:34:53 and if gb is coming, that'll be two meetings in May 14:35:29 *Xach* is unlikely to go to both Madrid and Boston in June 14:36:30 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 14:39:42 drmeiste_ [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 14:39:53 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:40:57 rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:58 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:41:07 rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:41:51 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-dvvhcvyovunwtugd] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:42:02 ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has joined #lisp 14:42:08 -!- asvil [~user@91.151.182.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:44:48 daniel` [~user@74-134-242-5.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 14:46:20 krrrcks [~krrrcks@46.182.19.96] has joined #lisp 14:47:53 -!- antgreen [~green@out-pq-195.wireless.telus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:48:28 abeaumont [~abeaumont@108.Red-88-23-188.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:49:07 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-72-225-195-95.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:50:30 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-umqguwrllncklsfk] has joined #lisp 14:51:04 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-128-221.w92-156.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 14:51:04 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 14:52:50 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:53:09 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 14:53:20 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:53:25 -!- KDr2 [~KDr2@114.243.237.175] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:53:37 -!- drmeiste_ [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:53:44 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 14:54:30 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 14:55:38 -!- xificurC [xificurC@nat/ibm/x-mhesdwdtefxaqfyf] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:55:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has joined #lisp 14:55:55 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has quit [Changing host] 14:55:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 14:56:29 css-lite:make-css-var is a confused puppy 15:00:51 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:02:08 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 15:05:36 -!- rk[aft] is now known as ryankarason 15:06:04 rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:06:41 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:06:54 Bike [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:07:44 frkout [~frkout@80.112.147.124.dy.bbexcite.jp] has joined #lisp 15:07:45 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 15:08:10 -!- frkout [~frkout@80.112.147.124.dy.bbexcite.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:08:15 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:08:31 -!- PaulHarr1s is now known as PaulHarris 15:08:36 frkout [~frkout@113.37.230.101] has joined #lisp 15:08:44 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:08:54 sellout- [~Adium@70.96.9.235] has joined #lisp 15:08:55 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:09:10 -!- frkout [~frkout@113.37.230.101] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:09:14 frkout_ [~frkout@80.112.147.124.dy.bbexcite.jp] has joined #lisp 15:09:15 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 15:09:41 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:09:53 is there a way to make slime save the command history at each command and not when slime-disconnect is called ? it's quite annoying to loose the history when I shutdown the computer with emacs/slime still running (always) 15:09:59 f 15:11:02 shutting down the computer? what a barbaric way! 15:11:39 well my bed is about 2 meters away from my computer, and I like to sleep in quiet :) 15:11:46 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 15:11:48 and I already have a soekris running H24 15:11:59 that's what suspend is for! 15:12:13 never worked correctedly in any machine I ever had 15:12:37 *stassats* has been lucky, all his machines work/worked perfectly with suspend 15:12:59 it's a shame i hear about so many people experience problems 15:13:30 yeah, for some people (like me) even hybernate works 15:13:38 or is it hibernate? 15:14:02 it's too slow 15:14:36 well, faster than normal booting 15:14:51 i think it's called save-linux-and-die 15:14:54 is there a built-in which returns the first N elements of a sequence (or list, if it only exists under that qualification)? 15:15:10 madnificent: subseq? 15:15:15 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has joined #lisp 15:15:34 H4ns: sounds like it, thanks 15:16:30 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:16:45 smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has joined #lisp 15:17:21 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has joined #lisp 15:17:21 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has quit [Changing host] 15:17:21 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 15:17:31 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:18:19 adding to the previous: or, if (>= N (1- (length list))), the first (1- (length list)) elements. that's why subseq didn't match and why i asked here in the first place. 15:19:04 make that (>= N (length list)), i used N as the number of elements 15:19:08 (subseq seq 0 (min (length seq) n) 15:19:08 teggi [~teggi@123.20.50.51] has joined #lisp 15:19:09 naturally 15:19:30 stassats: so no built-in? (it's trivial, i know that) 15:19:47 subseq and min are built-in 15:20:13 which is irrelevant 15:20:32 galdor: Hibernate and suspend is what finally drove me to MacOSX for laptops. Closed hardware FTW. 15:20:57 madnificent: (loop for n below for e in collect e) 15:21:26 -!- notori0us is now known as czl 15:21:35 H4ns: i'm more inclined to use stassats's version. 15:21:48 thanks for ensuring i didn't skip over something in the CLHS! 15:21:49 madnificent: because it is less efficient? 15:22:29 s/less efficient/nuts 15:22:42 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:22:48 nuts? 15:23:00 well, he's using lists 15:23:42 and? 15:23:54 no, that would not be the reason. it's closer to the semantics of subseq, giving me the correct type of sequence. which, indeed, isn't necessary, unless i factor it out into a separate function. 15:23:57 antgreen [~green@out-pq-232.wireless.telus.com] has joined #lisp 15:24:04 and walking the whole list to just get the first elements 15:24:41 jdz: i don't see a problem 15:25:29 good, we can move on with our lives 15:25:31 anyway, the list isn't big. having to sort it first will overshadow the walking. 15:26:16 i don't see why simple code would be called "nuts" 15:26:20 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has joined #lisp 15:27:47 (ldiff list (nthcdr n list)) 15:30:35 +1 15:30:42 that's not nut 15:30:43 s 15:31:13 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:31:45 Any help what to do with FORMAT calls if I need them in parenscript? manual LOOP and + for string concatenation? 15:32:01 i would choose (subseq seq 0 (min (length seq) n)) any day 15:32:44 flip214_: as in: you want the format to be executed in the javascript runtime? 15:33:16 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:33:37 madnificent: yes ... converting some data into a string 15:33:39 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 15:33:42 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:33:54 -!- fightback [~david@163-116.199-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: Bye.] 15:34:48 that would be an amusing google summer of code project ... adding format et. al. to parenscript 15:36:17 I'm now trying to use FORMATTER 15:36:25 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:37:04 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:37:22 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:37:24 Is there a way to get FORMATTER to return the form, not a compiled function 15:37:32 nope 15:37:34 formatter won't help you 15:37:36 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 15:37:58 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:38:07 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:38:20 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:38:51 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:39:41 sb-format::%formatter does help a bit ... 15:40:05 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:40:21 -!- frkout_ [~frkout@80.112.147.124.dy.bbexcite.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:40:55 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:40:56 flip214_: i'd be surprised if what you want is possible, perhaps an alternative format-like language can help you out... :/ 15:41:11 -!- czl is now known as notori0us 15:41:15 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:41:17 on sbcl: (macroexpand `(formatter "~a")) => #'(LAMBDA (STREAM &OPTIONAL (#:FORMAT-ARG1702 (ERROR 'SB-FORMAT:FORMAT-ERROR :COMPLAINT "required argument missing" :CONTROL-STRING "~a" :OFFSET 1)) &REST SB-FORMAT::ARGS) (DECLARE (IGNORABLE STREAM)) (BLOCK NIL (PRINC #:FORMAT-ARG1702 STREAM)) SB-FORMAT::ARGS) 15:41:25 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:41:27 that doesn't looke like it's good for parenscript 15:41:40 stassats: try (sb-format::%formatter) instead. a small step only, but ... 15:41:50 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:41:58 WRITE-STRING and so on would need to be translated, too ... 15:42:02 try instead? instead of what? 15:42:06 hmmm. looks bad for now, I guess. 15:42:09 instead of FORMATTER 15:42:48 no, i'd use (macroexpand `(formatter "~a")) instead 15:43:01 hmmm, thanks anyway. running out of time for now; I'll look at the backlog later, if there are any ideas. 15:43:02 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:43:20 -!- ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:43:40 sunw [~user@163.5.220.9] has joined #lisp 15:43:59 stassats: FORMATTER returns a compiled function, and this won't work anyway. 15:44:01 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:44:12 -!- bitonic is now known as wallabee 15:44:19 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:44:27 i showed you the result of (macroexpand `(formatter "~a")) 15:44:34 -!- wallabee is now known as bitonic 15:44:53 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:44:54 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:45:07 -!- bitonic is now known as rostayob 15:45:11 /me must stop wasting time looking at format implementations 15:45:11 -!- rostayob is now known as bitonic 15:45:25 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 15:45:27 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 15:45:31 doesthiswork [~Adium@75.87.251.5] has joined #lisp 15:45:44 ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has joined #lisp 15:45:53 hitecnologys1 [~hitecnolo@46.233.219.4] has joined #lisp 15:46:22 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:45 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@176.62.117.64] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 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15:59:36 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:00:11 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:00:27 asedeno [asedeno@nat/google/x-mrmpgvwswoznwuyk] has joined #lisp 16:00:30 TuckerD [~tucker@c-98-216-148-67.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:01:10 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:01:32 -!- dalecooper [~chris@xdsl-89-0-225-220.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: dalecooper] 16:01:53 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:01:58 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:02:43 -!- asedeno [asedeno@nat/google/x-mrmpgvwswoznwuyk] has quit [Client Quit] 16:03:11 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:03:19 asedeno [asedeno@nat/google/x-moxlyuctlwwlrgoi] has joined #lisp 16:03:31 sunw` [~user@163.5.218.222] has joined #lisp 16:03:49 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:03:57 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:03:59 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:04:06 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:04:16 nydel [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:04:38 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:04:41 -!- zickzackv [~faot@port-92-198-30-130.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:05:12 is there a package or method to help me load a large spreadsheet (.csv) file into some sort of lisp object? 16:05:26 -!- sunw [~user@163.5.220.9] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:05:56 -!- Odyessus [~odyessus@guest-wlan.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Excess Flood] 16:06:00 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:06:34 -!- SanderM [~quassel@2001:610:180:1:e2cb:4eff:fe41:41d] has 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Connection reset by peer] 16:23:49 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:23:50 nydel: there are some CSV parsing libraries around. 16:24:20 madnificent: thank you, i'm looking on cliki now 16:24:30 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:32 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:24:57 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:25:24 nydel: i turned out using fare-csv, it wasn't any hassle to use 16:25:35 nydel: i haven't studied the alternatives though 16:26:08 -!- rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: rpg_] 16:26:13 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 16:26:17 madnificent: i'll try to quicklisp that, thank you 16:26:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:27:27 -!- bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:28:03 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:29:07 bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 16:29:08 nydel: you're welcome. good luck 16:29:13 -!- jandres [~user@90.Red-80-38-219.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has left #lisp 16:29:38 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:30:57 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has joined #lisp 16:30:58 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:31:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:32:07 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 16:32:39 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:32:40 -!- silenius [~silenius@g229078081.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:32:41 -!- teggi [~teggi@123.20.50.51] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:32:45 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:32:49 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:33:45 -!- hitecnologys1 [~hitecnolo@46.233.219.4] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys1] 16:35:03 -!- breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:38:24 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 16:38:41 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:39:49 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:40:48 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:40:52 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has joined #lisp 16:42:11 /join #esoteric 16:43:18 -!- TuckerD [~tucker@c-98-216-148-67.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:45:33 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:46:08 oudeis [~oudeis@62.219.152.214] has joined #lisp 16:46:18 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:35 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:47:42 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:48:19 ... There are alternatives to fare-csv? Why would anyone bother? 16:48:29 (Yes, yes, I know that most of them were written first.) 16:48:49 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:49:04 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:49:56 Shinmera [~linus@188.155.176.171] has joined #lisp 16:50:35 Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 16:51:51 Bredokk [~bredokk@sedna.tilb.sze.hu] has joined #lisp 16:52:28 hi all 16:52:38 -!- kanru` [~kanru@201.Red-88-12-18.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:52:44 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-164-112.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:53:45 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757405.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:54:01 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:54:04 i am searching for a good documentation about evolution algorithms 16:54:52 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-164-112.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:54:54 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 16:54:57 nyef: it might not be the worst exercise for learning simple parsing with lisp. though that might not warrant the release of the resulting parser. 16:54:59 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:55:03 ... Genetic programming, or something else? 16:55:07 madnificent: True enough. 16:55:16 nyef: yes :) 16:55:34 genetic programming 16:55:52 -!- leo2007 [~leo@111.161.47.175] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 16:55:59 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:56:20 Mmm. Can't really help you with that, I'm afraid that I'm more a fan of intelligent design when it comes to these things. (-: 16:56:36 are there books about genetic programming in lisp? i've done some genetic programming in it and it wasn't exactly complex (it was really nice, really), however i used different resources. 16:56:36 nyef: :D 16:56:50 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 16:57:00 coders R gods! 16:57:46 -!- agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:58:36 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 16:59:06 thanks guys :) 16:59:08 bredokk: John R. Koza. 1992 "Genetic Programming: On the Programming of Computers by Means of natural selection" 16:59:26 doesthiswork: thanks a lot 17:00:06 agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 17:00:15 it's the start of the genetic programming field, it is still good, and yes the examples are in lisp. 17:01:50 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:01:51 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:01:57 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:02:12 thanks! i found it in pdf :) 17:02:28 doesthiswork: oooh, nice! 17:03:00 enymo [~user@67.137.177.90] has joined #lisp 17:05:00 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:05:10 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:05:57 -!- Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 17:06:33 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:06:34 has anybody worked with spatial-trees (the cl-library)? 17:06:44 I do not really get what the functions there do. 17:06:53 Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 17:07:17 -!- [1]JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:07:18 stokachu [~stokachu@50.58.87.197] has joined #lisp 17:07:18 I was actually looking for some implementation of quadtrees, but r*-trees are good as well (though overhead) 17:07:20 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:07:43 schoppenhauer: spatial-trees is pretty nice 17:08:10 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:08:20 AeroNotix [~xeno@abny54.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:08:31 oGMo: well, I actually need it for efficiently searching for points on a plain which are near to some given point 17:08:32 it's not super efficient in terms of consing, but i've had no issues and i've thrown a fair amount of boxes at it 17:08:53 and somehow, I don't quite get how to use it for this 17:09:15 schoppenhauer: it should easily support that, that's what i use it for heh .. and try the variants .. i think i found the greene tree to be the fastest in practice 17:09:33 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:10:00 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:10:31 oGMo: well, can you tell me which methods are for inserting/searching? I don't quite get it, I would expect something like an insertion function which I can pass two coordinates. and a search-function which i can pass a rectangle or so. 17:10:52 mm .. been awhile but it just looks like (spatial-trees:insert rect *tree*) .. if you want points, make rects that are 0x0 17:10:53 it probably has such things, and I am just to stupid to find them. 17:11:12 schoppenhauer: look at the public symbols and package definition 17:11:25 slime and completion should help there 17:12:54 oGMo: there is an insert-method. but it wants a tree. 17:12:56 delete, insert, search, and make-spatial-tree .. you can specify a function to make-spatial-tree that gets used to extract/calculate/etc the rectangle 17:13:01 oGMo: which is what confuses me. 17:14:53 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:14:55 Hey folks, I was on yesterday asking about using unix shared libraries as FASL files. I got it all to work - it's as fast and great as I hoped it would be'. 17:15:27 how do you go about eval-when? 17:15:37 The issue was I'm on OS X and dynamic libraries on OS X are very different from dynamic libraries on Linux. 17:15:56 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:15:57 stassats: Build a top-level function that deals with side-effects of loading, presumably. 17:16:32 stassats: I think Movitz might have had that as well. Or maybe one of the other implementations. 17:16:39 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:16:41 stassats: If the eval-when has :load-toplevel then it generates code into the fasl file, otherwise - not. 17:17:21 Umm... is that the right use of :load-toplevel? 17:17:26 and load-time-value 17:17:42 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:18:03 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:18:35 oGMo: slime is not helpful here. the signature of the generic is "object tree", but all definitions I find declare the class of "object" as "tree" 17:18:41 -!- protist [~protist@83.172.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 17:19:05 nyef: I think so - isn't it? 17:19:06 schoppenhauer: sec, let me whip up an example 17:21:41 You're right, I'm mixing it up with :execute. 17:22:20 drmeister: so, how are load-time-value and closures handled? 17:23:28 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@62.219.152.214] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:23:46 schoppenhauer: https://gist.github.com/rpav/a490917ddf098c036216 17:23:56 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has joined #lisp 17:23:58 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has quit [Changing host] 17:23:58 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 17:24:13 not the best/nicest whatever, but it's the basics 17:24:29 oGMo: ok. i didn't notice that rectangles have their own namespace. 17:24:50 it's called package 17:25:00 i found that specifying :rectfun as a generic function was almost entirely necessary .. one that specializes on whatever struct/object/etc you insert, and also just on rectangles so you can query directly 17:25:22 -!- cades [~mac@1-169-146-50.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:25:45 oGMo: well, thank you. 17:25:59 np 17:26:05 stassats: well. it is also a namespace, isn't it? 17:26:23 clhs glossary/namespace 17:26:23 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/26_glo_n.htm#namespace 17:26:52 if you want to cause least confusion, why not be specific? 17:27:08 stassats: A package defines a namespace 17:27:13 especially considering that package has less letters than namespace 17:27:16 stassats: that's what it sais 17:27:22 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 17:27:23 schoppenhauer: it is called package nevertheless. 17:27:55 H4ns: I wanted to point out that it was an own namespace. 17:28:06 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 17:28:15 H4ns: because that was the relevant part of information in that case 17:28:20 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:28:35 no, the relevant information for CL programmers is "package" 17:28:54 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 17:28:59 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:29:13 a matter of opinion 17:29:21 schoppenhauer: thinking about it in those terms will probably confuse you when it comes to understanding other things 17:29:34 -!- easye` [~user@50-192-159-219-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:29:45 schoppenhauer: it's not opinion, it's the matter of efficient communication 17:30:09 the function isn't actually "in" the package, but it does happen to be fbound to a symbol in that package 17:30:20 -!- freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 17:30:43 you don't say "an ordered multiset of characters" instead of "a string", do you? 17:30:48 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:30:55 freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has joined #lisp 17:31:12 stassats: Given that (ARRAY NIL) is a string... 17:31:25 a tuple of letters? 17:31:35 nyef: but NIL is a subtype of character 17:32:15 a vector with element-type .. never mind 17:32:15 oGMo: that's not abstract enough 17:32:15 True, but it's also a subtype of INTEGER. 17:32:15 omg. what happened to #lisp in the last years? there hasn't been so much nitpicking a few years ago. 17:32:36 schoppenhauer: there's been nitpicking as long as i remember 17:32:44 schoppenhauer: At least one of us got their paws on a copy of "Mathematics Made Difficult". 17:32:45 there was no nitpicking until you started to say that it's better to use namespace instead package 17:33:12 lol 17:33:22 well, c.l.l is also not the same anymore :/ 17:33:27 rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 17:34:49 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:35:01 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:35:01 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:36:15 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:37:18 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:37:40 schoppenhauer: In CL (and many other programming languages) namespace refers to things like the function namespace  whether functions share the same names as variables, etc. CL has about a half-dozen namespaces. You can create new namespaces in CL, but packages do not do it. C++ is the only language that comes to mind that uses namespace to refer to the concept of modules/packages/components. 17:37:48 attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has joined #lisp 17:37:48 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Disconnected by services] 17:37:51 Kenjin [~kenjin@2.80.241.50] has joined #lisp 17:37:58 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:38:21 sellout-: clojure 17:38:25 sellout-: k 17:38:35 sykopomp: Oh! Damn that Rich Hickey! 17:38:45 it's also common terminology in JavaScript land 17:39:01 though I think 'modules' is more common. 17:39:03 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:39:11 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:39:12 sykopomp: because it doesn't have a real module system 17:39:27 which one? 17:39:31 JS 17:39:44 -!- sellout- [~Adium@70.96.9.235] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:39:46 it has several. 17:39:52 mostly libraries. 17:39:55 es6 has them built in. 17:39:56 JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 17:40:01 Denommus` [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has joined #lisp 17:40:04 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 17:40:21 and I'd say CommonJS and AMD are more than "just libraries", fwiw. 17:41:50 -!- ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has left #lisp 17:41:59 ejbs [~user@h-240-50.a176.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 17:42:15 sykopomp: don't dilute my JS-bashing! 17:42:18 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:42:20 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:42:31 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:42:38 nilsi [~nilsi@c83-253-22-138.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 17:42:39 stassats: JS is pretty great. 17:42:56 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:43:43 -!- ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:43:55 sykopomp: Why? 17:44:18 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:44:18 ejbs: the answer is out of scope of #lisp 17:44:48 Oh. 17:46:22 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:46:48 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 17:47:03 somewhat within the scope is that I like JS a lot in the context of being a Lisper. I think there's a lot of lispy culture of turning the language into what you need it to be, and it supports my preferred style of developing CL apps fairly well (I even wrote a library to support CLOS-style genfuns that mixes fine with the built-in object system) 17:47:32 I don't generally like languages that aren't CL :) 17:47:57 -!- aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:48:09 *jasom* likes a good DSL regardless of whether or not its written in lisp 17:49:27 aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has joined #lisp 17:50:21 ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has joined #lisp 17:51:06 -!- stokachu [~stokachu@50.58.87.197] has quit [Changing host] 17:51:06 stokachu [~stokachu@ubuntu/member/stokachu] has joined #lisp 17:52:01 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@2.80.241.50] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:52:44 k0001_ [~k0001@host207.190-224-59.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 17:53:30 Corvidium [~cosman246@D-173-250-159-8.dhcp4.washington.edu] has joined #lisp 17:53:38 actually a mediocre DSL is often better for quick-and-dirty than a good general-purpose language 17:54:50 being deployed on billions of devices takes "i like/dislike it" out of the question 17:55:45 oudeis [~oudeis@2.55.124.200] has joined #lisp 17:55:59 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host29.190-224-49.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:56:00 does anyone here use CLOS in a purely functional fashion? 17:56:20 that is, by returning new instances when running methods, instead of changing the state? 17:56:29 how well does this go? 17:57:00 Denommus`: there's a performance hit, but it works fine 17:57:06 except for backtracking, why would you want to do that? 17:57:37 Denommus`: returning new instances and discarding old ones makes the garbage collector cry 17:57:53 Denommus`: particularly if you have varying lifetimes and object sizes 17:58:04 "FP solves all the problems, including world hunger" is not acceptable answer 17:58:24 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 17:58:50 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 257 seconds] 17:59:08 I'm just asking, not really considering 17:59:49 Some things are naturally modeled by operations on immutable objects that return fresh instances. These things work well in a "functional" style, even in CLOS. But you can have SLOT-VALUE when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. 18:00:30 nyef: but standard-instance-access is faster! 18:01:02 And where is STANDARD-INSTANCE-ACCESS in the hyperspec? 18:01:10 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:01:11 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:01:29 pavelpenev [~quassel@46.237.126.203] has joined #lisp 18:02:51 clhs glossary/Metaobject Protocol 18:02:51 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for glossary/Metaobject Protocol. 18:02:58 (Speaking of, and backing up a week or so, I did end up being able to send multiple WWW-Authenticate headers with Hunchentoot. And to do so using only external symbols, no less. But I did need (SETF SLOT-VALUE).) 18:02:59 specbot: dummy 18:03:22 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has joined #lisp 18:03:22 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has quit [Changing host] 18:03:22 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 18:04:13 -!- sunw`` [~user@163.5.218.136] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:04:15 clhs glossary/metaobject protocol 18:04:15 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/26_glo_m.htm#metaobject_protocol 18:04:22 rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:04:42 i should make it into an equalp hashtable 18:04:56 -!- rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:05:02 -!- attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@92.46.23.135] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:05:04 rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:05:17 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:05:32 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:05:38 Why is STANDARD-INSTANCE-ACCESS faster? stassats 18:05:47 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:05:52 because it has levels of indirection 18:05:53 Oh, that reminds me, I'm apparently still "in charge" of a couple of clnet mailing lists that I don't really want. 18:06:52 lisppaste-devel, lisppaste-cvs, lisppaste-announce, and clx-devel. 18:07:39 normanrichards [~normanric@166.137.122.28] has joined #lisp 18:11:10 -!- habva2013 [~habva2013@ti0125a380-0772.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:11:14 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:11:46 cades [~mac@1-169-146-50.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 18:12:10 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:12:13 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.133.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:12:26 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:14:12 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:14:23 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:14:36 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-164-112.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:15:33 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 18:16:04 -!- Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 18:16:10 -!- youlysses [~jsgrant@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has left #lisp 18:16:12 abend_ [~quassel@75-148-54-130-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:16:54 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@2.55.124.200] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:17:40 clhs b-n 18:17:40 boole-nor: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_b_1_b.htm 18:18:08 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:18:17 nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has joined #lisp 18:18:35 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:19:43 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-135-176.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:22:16 -!- cades [~mac@1-169-146-50.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:22:37 clhs b-n 18:22:38 -!- specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:22:38 -!- minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:22:42 oops 18:23:45 oh gods, The function BORDEAUX-THREADS:MAKE-THREAD is undefined. 18:24:07 Umm... Yeah. Aren't the bots supposed to be on a single-thread system? 18:24:14 I know that they at least used to be. 18:24:15 nope 18:24:32 well, a single bot runs in a single thread 18:24:46 but there can be multiple bots in a single instance 18:25:06 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 18:25:11 *stassats* should update the quicklisp used by the bots 18:25:28 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 18:25:54 -!- nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:25:56 i manged to hang screen 18:27:07 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:27:11 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:27:36 How do you hang screen? 18:27:46 it unhung itself already 18:27:59 Ah. Connection trouble, maybe? 18:28:26 cl.net seems to be suffering from search bots hitting what they shouldn't be 18:28:35 that may caused it to be slower than usual 18:29:01 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:29:16 Ah. 18:30:25 *stassats* does (ql:update-all-dists) and waits for something to break 18:30:39 Did QL get updated? 18:31:14 easye: Changes from quicklisp 2012-04-07 to quicklisp 2013-03-12: 18:31:23 i would say, yes, it got update from a year ago 18:31:35 updated 18:31:40 Wow. That's a big u[date. Good luck 18:33:07 Heh. I did an update from 2011-something a while back, for a largely clean-sheet development project with a lot of cribbing from a past project. Stuff broke, mostly to do with Hunchentoot. 18:33:13 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:33:25 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:33:44 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:35:02 and looks like cl.net has common-lisp-controller 18:35:26 *stassats* applies --no-sysinit 18:36:42 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:36:51 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:37:40 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 18:39:10 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has joined #lisp 18:39:12 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:39:31 youlysse` [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 18:40:03 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:41:18 -!- Dalek_Baldwin1 [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:42:03 great, quicklisp can't handle :depends-on "iolib/multiplex" 18:42:17 -!- nydel [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: quit] 18:43:10 i guess just :iolib would do 18:43:38 Kruppe [~user@j2petkovich.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 18:43:46 -!- ejbs [~user@h-240-50.a176.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:44:21 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@166.137.122.28] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:44:26 you need ASDF >= 2.29 18:44:56 Time to rebuild your SBCL and ql:update-client ? 18:45:11 sbcl has 2.26 18:45:28 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 18:45:36 Hence "and ql:update-client". 18:45:36 "iolib" does just fine, and even works with iolib-0.7.3 in quicklisp 18:45:53 i don't think ql:update-client updates asdf 18:45:53 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:46:02 DBordello [~DBordello@unaffiliated/dbordello] has joined #lisp 18:46:04 -!- xristos is now known as xristos` 18:46:05 stassats: if you're only using sockets, then 0.7.3 should be fine, the API hasn't changed 18:46:10 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:46:11 What's your opportunity cost? 18:46:25 nyef: my opportunity cost is that i called it 15 minutes ago 18:46:48 Can anybody point me in the right direction for autocad related lisp questions? 18:46:57 Fair enough. 18:47:15 dang, cl.net is really slow 18:47:19 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:47:36 DBordello: did you try already scribd ? 18:47:37 DBordello: FreeNode is for open-source software 18:47:51 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 18:47:55 DBordello: there were many autocad stuff i saw..... 18:48:02 wbooze, I have not, I'll check it out. 18:48:06 fe[nl]ix, fair enough 18:48:10 ok 18:48:10 ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has joined #lisp 18:48:59 stassats: I got called away. LOAD-TIME-VALUES are handled by a startup function in each module that creates all of the load-time-values in an array at run-time. 18:48:59 -!- youlysse` [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:49:13 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:49:23 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:49:47 -!- DBordello [~DBordello@unaffiliated/dbordello] has left #lisp 18:49:49 and closures? 18:51:26 It's been a while since I wrote the closure code - my functions can contain an environment and I just create functions with environments bound to them on the fly. 18:51:26 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has joined #lisp 18:51:37 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:56 i mean top-level closures (let ... (defun ...)) 18:52:12 It's an issue I'll have to revisit soon. I just learned about "variable escape analysis" and I need to use it. 18:52:49 almost 10 minutes, and it's still compiling dependencies 18:53:22 stassats: So (let ... (defun ...)) is compiled as a thunk (function with no arguments) that creates an augmented environment (the LET) and associates it with the function from the DEFUN. 18:54:15 drmeister: You're learning a lot from this project, aren't you? 18:54:22 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:54:31 nyef: Yes... yes I am. 18:54:46 sbcl getting only 25% CPU doesn't help 18:54:46 what's the project? 18:54:50 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:54:52 which is a virtualized CPU 18:55:10 doesthiswork: A Common Lisp compiler written in C++ that interoperates with C++. 18:55:21 And uses LLVM as the back-end. 18:55:24 -!- davazp [~user@31.200.155.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:55:27 sounds fun 18:55:43 and quicklisp stopped printing dots 18:56:17 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:56:48 oh, i accidentally started lisppaste, well, it will read all the pastes until tomorrow at that rate 18:56:58 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:57:43 sellout- [~Adium@70.96.9.235] has joined #lisp 18:58:50 -!- Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:59:17 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 18:59:22 Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has joined #lisp 18:59:33 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:59:44 talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 19:00:32 minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:00:38 minion: welcome back 19:00:41 thanks! 19:00:54 specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:00:59 clhs b-n 19:00:59 [1]habva2013 [~habva2013@ti0125a380-0772.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 19:01:00 -!- minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:01:00 -!- specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:01:14 -!- Blice_ is now known as Blice 19:01:52 -!- k0001_ [~k0001@host207.190-224-59.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 19:02:28 Hey, how do CL implementations deal with LOADing files that may be in a variety of locations? Something like searching the PATH environment variable? 19:02:55 if specbot were here, i'd say "clhs *d-p-d*" 19:03:18 It looks like I can do whatever I want with REQUIRE to resolve the argument to a physical path but LOAD only has *default-pathname-defaults*. 19:03:32 exactly 19:03:33 Isn't *d-p-d* just one path? 19:03:49 indeed 19:04:06 For REQUIRE, you might look into something about... "module provider hooks", I think it was...? 19:04:17 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:04:25 So LOAD can just access files in the path *d-p-d* or you give it absolute pathnames. 19:04:37 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:04:41 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 19:04:44 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:04:48 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 19:04:54 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:04:59 If I want to search a variety of directories for a file I use REQUIRE - correct? 19:05:09 no 19:05:16 you use ASDF 19:05:48 I use a list of candidate locations and PROBE-FILE explicitly. 19:06:02 drmeister: REQUIRE is ill-specified 19:06:15 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:06:22 nyef: probe-file? why not (load "fil" :if-does-not-exist nil)? 19:06:33 nyef: better what stassats said 19:06:41 nha [~prefect@65.172.24.27] has joined #lisp 19:06:49 I typically want to compile it before loading. 19:06:54 drmeister: except in the case that you provide either a lookup function or a logical pathname 19:07:25 specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:07:25 minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:07:26 And, actually, I lied. I tend to know where the files I want to load are explicitly. 19:07:33 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:07:38 clhs load 19:07:38 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_load.htm 19:07:41 clhs b-n 19:07:41 Matches: boole-nor, boole-nand, bit-not, bit-nor, bit-nand. 19:07:47 now, that's better 19:07:51 clhs LoAd 19:07:51 load: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_load.htm 19:07:51 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:08:21 bah, i'm sorting the matches the wrong way 19:08:42 oh, very cool 19:09:07 clhs b-n 19:09:08 Matches: boole-nor, boole-nand, bit-not, bit-nand, bit-nor. 19:09:11 -!- weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has left #lisp 19:09:12 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:09:22 sorry 19:09:32 what's it with lispdoc.com? 19:09:32 nyef: (some (lambda (f) (load f :if-does-not-exist nil)) files) 19:10:02 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 19:10:13 francogrex [~user@38.213-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 19:10:16 fe[nl]ix: Clever, but doesn't cover the "compile-before-load" case well. 19:10:51 clhs l-n-n-s-f 19:10:51 Matches: least-negative-normalized-short-float, least-negative-normalized-single-float. 19:11:19 you can make a maybe-compile-before-load function that behaves like cl:load 19:11:27 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:11:33 I think Faré has one in ASDF 19:11:41 clhs l-n-n-s-f 19:11:41 Matches: least-negative-normalized-short-float, least-negative-normalized-single-float. 19:11:43 two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:11:48 damn it 19:11:59 how are these supposed to be sorted? it seems fine as is. 19:12:09 I'll have to learn about ASDF at some point. 19:12:10 oh, it was sorted ok 19:12:10 stassats: What's the problem with that output? 19:12:12 clhs b-n 19:12:12 Matches: bit-nand, bit-nor, bit-not, boole-nand, boole-nor. 19:12:17 -!- abend_ [~quassel@75-148-54-130-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 19:12:17 yeah 19:12:24 clhs l-n-s-f 19:12:24 Matches: least-negative-short-float, least-negative-single-float. 19:12:55 clhs *d-p-d* 19:12:55 *default-pathname-defaults*: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_defaul.htm 19:13:27 clhs p-n 19:13:27 Matches: package-name, package-nicknames, parse-namestring, pathname-name, pprint-newline. 19:14:12 Okay, enough messing with the new toy for me. (-: 19:14:17 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@46.237.126.203] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:14:22 didn't it do that before? 19:14:33 the spec lookup is written from scratch 19:14:39 the old one was horrendous 19:15:24 it's a general spec matcher, reads data from a file 19:15:26 does it just use slime completions now? 19:15:38 oh, yeah, it let you look up parts of the ieee float spec and such didn't it 19:15:50 specbot: help? 19:15:50 To use the specbot bot, say somethinglike "database term",where database is one of ("clhs", "r5rs", "cocoa", "elisp", "lp", "ieee754", "ppc", "posix", "man", "cltl2", "cltl2-section") and term is the desired lookup. 19:15:54 You got rid of the loop of doom? 19:15:56 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:16:03 abend_ [~quassel@75-148-54-130-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:16:13 r5rs let-syntax 19:16:14 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for let-syntax. 19:16:22 i think only clhs is converted to the new system 19:16:42 which new system? 19:16:43 nyef: yes, replaced with https://github.com/stassats/lisp-bots/blob/master/specs/cl.lisp 19:16:44 minion: More posix! 19:16:46 posix me harder 19:16:46 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for me harder. 19:17:14 ehu: this system: https://github.com/stassats/lisp-bots/blob/master/spec-lookup.lisp 19:17:23 minion: more help! 19:17:24 help me harder 19:17:40 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:17:45 Bike: no, it just abbreviates *default-pathname-defaults* into *d-p-d*, then puts *d-p-d* into a hashtable 19:17:54 if there's already a match, it makes it into a list 19:18:11 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:18:21 huh. 19:18:33 clhs boole-n 19:18:33 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for boole-n. 19:21:19 the old doom of loop: https://github.com/stassats/lisp-bots/blob/ac03961f94089a9599db8e5d704ae3b7ffedc4df/clhs-lookup.lisp#L69 19:21:41 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:21:45 -!- Denommus` [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:21:55 that's quite doomy indeed 19:22:21 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 19:22:45 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:23:11 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:23:15 -!- francogrex [~user@38.213-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:23:42 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:24:07 clhs ~< 19:24:07 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_ceb.htm 19:24:17 -!- nilsi [~nilsi@c83-253-22-138.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:24:22 that isn't handled 19:24:48 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.241.189] has joined #lisp 19:28:04 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-21-199.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:28:32 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:28:53 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:30:10 I think my patch for that is almost 10 years old now? 19:30:27 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:31:22 aged like fine wine, no doubt. 19:32:08 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 19:32:21 rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:32:43 francogrex [~user@38.213-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 19:32:47 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-220-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:32:48 -!- rpg_ [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:32:59 rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:34:44 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:35:21 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:35:52 knobo [~user@81.175.44.217] has joined #lisp 19:36:00 Can I use hunchentoot as a proxy? 19:36:10 I want to rewrite some of the queries 19:36:15 For debugging. 19:36:35 -!- specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:36:36 -!- minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:37:06 tcr1 [~tcr@46-126-110-164.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:38:11 -!- ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:39:39 minion [~minion@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:40:01 specbot [~specbot@50.7.166.114] has joined #lisp 19:40:08 clhs ~< 19:40:09 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_ceb.htm 19:40:14 bummer 19:41:24 clhs ~< 19:41:24 Matches: ~ clhs ~ http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_cfb.htm 19:42:52 though clhs has special pages for things like list, maybe adding an optional list/function would be useful 19:42:53 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 19:43:08 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:43:30 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:46:44 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has joined #lisp 19:47:53 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@67.23.204.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:49:56 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:50:01 liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:51:16 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:51:17 I am trying to cvs dpownload this project: http://common-lisp.net/project/jnil/ 19:51:56 but no luck, who takes care of the common-lisp.net can you please check whether it's configured correctly? 19:51:59 common-lisp.net cvs ist tot 19:52:10 hmm 19:52:28 RIP 19:53:01 any other way, I don't think it's in ql 19:53:21 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:54:23 there is a snapshot here but god knows what it is http://jnil.org/snapshots/ 19:55:43 -!- liweina__ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:56:10 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 19:57:16 cades [~mac@1-169-146-50.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 19:58:19 Xach: can you merge the salza2 pull request? 19:58:32 who wants to fix the cl.net cvs? 19:58:59 francogrex: do you know how to setup the cvs pserver? 20:02:24 Fare: unfortunately not 20:02:36 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:03:10 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:03:32 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 20:03:35 Maybe if nobody wants to run cvs pserver, just put everything in a tarball on the webserver? 20:03:56 People can convert 'em to git if they're still useful. 20:04:16 and btw that link http://jnil.org/snapshots/ I referred to befor has something called jnil (lisp and java) but not the "real" Jnil it's something else 20:04:35 foom: yes tarballs would be good 20:04:57 so, clhs now has type suffixes 20:05:00 clhs list/f 20:05:01 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_list_.htm 20:05:04 clhs list/t 20:05:04 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/t_list.htm 20:05:07 pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 20:05:08 clhs //v 20:05:09 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_sl_sls.htm 20:05:56 clhs list 20:05:57 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_list.htm 20:06:05 oh, fancy. 20:06:09 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:06:15 clhs list is the old way 20:06:21 clhs //f 20:06:21 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_sl.htm 20:06:56 -!- cades [~mac@1-169-146-50.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:07:31 t for types and classes, r for restarts, v for constants and varaibles, f for functions and accessors, s for a special operator, m for macros 20:08:32 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 20:08:40 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p549C5437.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:08:47 -!- Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:09:10 clhs // 20:09:10 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_sl_sls.htm 20:09:16 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:09:22 foom: that works as usual 20:09:36 *stassats* thinks about adding something like: see clhs::cons 20:09:36 liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has joined #lisp 20:09:48 i.e., parsing in the middle of messages 20:10:35 clhs also shouldn't cause arbitrary messages to be interpreted as queries 20:10:35 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for also shouldn't cause arbitrary messages to be interpreted as queries. 20:11:23 stassats: Operative term being "shouldn't", I presume? (-: 20:11:45 i actually don't know how to handle it, since 20:11:54 clhs glossary/metaobject protocol 20:11:54 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/26_glo_m.htm#metaobject_protocol 20:11:59 can contain spaces 20:12:26 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.7] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:12:51 how about (clhs glossary/metaobject protocol)? bracketing is the lisp way! 20:13:02 (no) 20:13:10 (aww) 20:13:46 well, if it was in a loop of doom, i could just condition on glossary/ 20:13:48 ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has joined #lisp 20:13:51 but it's supposed to be general 20:13:57 -!- Shinmera [~linus@188.155.176.171] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:14:00 -!- pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:14:17 maybe add an optional function :looks-like-valid-query to the spec file format 20:14:36 -!- liweinan_ [~liweinan@222.130.233.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:14:46 -!- sellout- [~Adium@70.96.9.235] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:15:25 Ener2 [~enerccio@158.194.169.56] has joined #lisp 20:15:58 are there any specifications for lisp, in case someone would like to make a lisp implementation? 20:16:20 there's CLHS 20:16:20 francogrex: asedeno tells me he did setup cvs pserver on cl.net -- what are you failing with? 20:16:30 sellout- [~Adium@70.96.9.235] has joined #lisp 20:16:35 but you should think twice about making a new CL implementation 20:16:39 Ener2: there is an ISO specification, but the CLHS is based off of the same 20:16:52 ISO? that'd be ANSI 20:17:07 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:17:15 stassats: you're right 20:17:16 jasom: is it somewhere available online? 20:17:20 INCITIS 226-1994 20:17:24 clhs list 20:17:25 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_list.htm 20:17:32 Ener2: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=clhs&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&ved=0CEwQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lispworks.com%2Fdocumentation%2FHyperSpec%2FFront%2FContents.htm&ei=1LFtUbLuGIGZiQLxkoGABA&usg=AFQjCNEOImcgEYGbz7KBffTqGchHgTOqQQ&bvm=bv.45218183,d.cGE 20:17:36 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:17:47 Well, there must be an ISO Lisp standard too, surely! 20:17:53 okay google messed up my link 20:17:56 is that good for implementation though? like all classes everything 20:17:56 http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Front/Contents.htm 20:18:06 Ener2: it has everything in the standard 20:18:17 Fare: something like that: ADDRESS=anonymous@common-lisp.net:/project/jnil/cvsroot 20:18:17 and then cvs -z3 -d :pserver:anonymous:$ADDRESS co jnil 20:18:50 -!- Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:18:54 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:18:54 fds: there's islisp 20:19:21 francogrex, on its way... setgid issue probably 20:19:23 jasom: thx 20:19:40 exactly Fare setgid issues 20:20:09 Ener2: see also this though http://www.cliki.net/Gray%20streams 20:20:20 not part of the standard, but is a de-facto standard 20:21:26 and some sort of method for calling to/from your native platform is expected, where that makes sense 20:21:50 Ener2: talk to drmeister about how much work it is to implement one from scratch though 20:22:44 *grumble* 20:22:50 davazp [~user@31.200.155.22] has joined #lisp 20:23:11 even drmeister reused huge portions of ecl 20:23:24 Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 20:23:40 gid 999 on the old cl.net was group svn. On the new box it's group mlmmj. 20:25:08 My ears are burning, what's up? 20:25:41 drmeister: Ener2 is asking about making a lisp implementation 20:26:45 Ah, unless you are single or have a very, very understanding wife - don't try it. 20:28:27 writing a new implementation ? 20:28:41 Joreji [~thomas@66-041.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 20:29:35 A new implementation is a massive time investment, even if you crib as much code from elsewhere as you can. 20:32:04 I am hosting the ECL Common Lisp code ~25,000 lines (running it on my new C++ core). It's taken me about a year ~8 hours a day. 20:33:21 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 20:33:27 I wrote a CL interpreter and then exposed the C++ LLVM interface to it and then wrote a CL compiler that generates LLVM-IR which is JIT compiled into native code. 20:33:54 fe[nl]ix: something crazier 20:33:59 writing whole lisp machine :) 20:34:32 you don't "write" a machine 20:34:49 Ener2: You might consider implementing hardware to run an existing LispM software image. 20:34:50 well, not per se, but kernel which will run lisp 20:34:52 TuckerD [~tucker@c-98-216-148-67.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:35:00 clhs list 20:35:02 well you could write it out in a hardware description language 20:35:11 hm 20:35:21 I have the kernel itself, now its about putting in the implementation 20:35:53 nan_ [~user@46.197.112.181] has joined #lisp 20:37:11 clhs list 20:37:11 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_list.htm 20:37:15 clhs is awesome 20:37:20 clhs is_awesome 20:37:21 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for is_awesome. 20:37:30 clhs glossary/metaobject protocol 20:37:30 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/26_glo_m.htm#metaobject_protocol 20:37:32 works 20:38:15 stassats: Is now a good time to suggest an offline, automated, test suite? 20:38:51 who would be writing it? 20:39:04 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:40:01 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-52-220.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:40:02 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:40:20 You would, as you find that you need to test random small responses from the bots to certain inputs? 20:40:34 only once 20:41:44 Famous last words. 20:41:57 the rest of the testing will be completed by the automated online random tests: #lisp users 20:41:59 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-37-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:43:04 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:43:21 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: rpg] 20:43:25 clhs Europe/London 14:15 20:43:38 drmeister, what kind of type analysis / optimization does your implementation have? 20:43:45 do you run the pfdietz tests? 20:44:04 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 20:44:33 fe[nl]ix: the validator is: (lambda (string) (or (eql (search "glossary/" string :test #'char-equal) 0) (not (find #\Space string)))) 20:44:53 Fare: I don't have type optimization or variable escape optimization yet - I have added tagged pointers to prepare for FIXNUM in tagged pointers 20:45:25 -!- cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:45:49 elisp is not validated 20:45:49 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for is not validated. 20:46:00 because it uses the old way 20:46:18 and i don't care enough for elisp to fix that 20:46:36 cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has joined #lisp 20:49:04 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:49:30 La0fer [~Laofers1@66.85.140.163] has joined #lisp 20:49:32 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 20:49:54 What are pfdietz tests? 20:50:12 ansi tests 20:50:39 Haven't run them yet. Maybe by the fall. 20:50:52 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:51:06 -!- ryankarason is now known as rk[aft] 20:53:13 I'm still wrestling with CLOS - bootstrapping CLOS is a bloody complicated process. 20:53:25 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-umqguwrllncklsfk] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:53:53 It's made especially more complicated when you try and merge a C++ class hierarchy with a CL class hierarchy. 20:53:57 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abod134.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:55:30 -!- ellusioner [ellusioner@c-8e1ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Hihi] 20:55:49 Although when I finally realized that it all hinges on the class-precedence-lists it became easier. 20:56:24 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abny54.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:57:08 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abod134.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Client Quit] 20:57:28 AeroNotix [~xeno@abod134.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:57:28 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:57:48 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 20:58:24 doomlord [~doomlod@host31-52-58-47.range31-52.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 20:59:59 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e30b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:01:33 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:03:10 *stassats* is not sure whether to add title retrieval for launchpad queries 21:03:18 the delay may be as high as 2 seconds 21:03:36 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:27 -!- davazp [~user@31.200.155.22] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:05:11 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:05:42 Bike [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:07:36 minion: memo for sw2wolf: there's no such thing as #'CL:IN-PACKAGE. CL:IN-PACKAGE is a macro. 21:07:36 Remembered. I'll tell sw2wolf when he/she/it next speaks. 21:07:58 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 21:08:14 dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 21:08:39 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-64-86.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 21:08:56 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 21:09:06 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.241.189] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:09:15 minion: memo for sw2wolf: that's why there's a -p package option to clisp. 21:09:15 Remembered. I'll tell sw2wolf when he/she/it next speaks. 21:09:59 -!- clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:10:20 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:10:40 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-42-96.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 21:10:44 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 21:10:55 ASau` [~user@p4FF9657F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 21:10:57 -!- [1]habva2013 [~habva2013@ti0125a380-0772.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:11:21 weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has joined #lisp 21:11:53 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:12:05 loke: also have a look at manifest.lisp at: http://fossil.nasium-lse.ogamita.com/nasium-lse/artifact/ca229c462dcf420c4497020b3d4b795f0c0e4efb 21:12:20 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 21:13:16 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-116.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 21:13:59 -!- ASau [~user@p5797EF08.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:14:47 drmeister: yes, someone has implemented a plugin system using dlopen. For example, a few versions ago, Xcode was able to load new method definitions as a category into an application running with the debugger, so you could correct it on the fly. 21:15:11 pjb: I got it working. 21:15:16 Good :-) 21:15:27 It's really nice and fast. 21:16:06 I now have two kinds of fasl files. One is LLVM bitcode and the other is native code in dynamic libraries (bundles). 21:17:27 do you use mac for develop? 21:18:19 Yes. Mac. 21:18:20 ... my employer overpays enough for the hw with just Intel's markup, adding Apple markup would mean no upgrades ever 21:18:30 ;) 21:18:34 -!- Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:18:42 But we keep it running on linux as well. 64-bit OS/X, 32-bit linux. 21:19:24 -!- sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:20:57 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.251] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 21:21:09 p_l: irc urls are written as: irc://irc.freenode.org/#sbcl 21:25:14 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@87.114.143.175] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 21:25:39 *pjb* once wrote a quadtree implementation. In C++ 21:26:36 -!- agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:27:27 schoppenhauer: despite all my efforts to keep it the same :-( Let's just killfile heavily. <19:33:21> well, c.l.l is also not the same anymore :/ 21:28:03 is it the "rehashing of old discussions" time? 21:28:47 -!- enymo [~user@67.137.177.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:31:28 if i want to modify a function after passing to another function, what would be the preferred way? enclosing it with a lambda? (some-fn #'(lambda () (fn-i-want-to-modify))) 21:31:34 sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 21:31:51 (some-fn 'fn-i-want-to-modify), if you mean redefinition 21:32:01 what does it mean, to modify a function? 21:33:04 modify i mean: modify and recompile in slime then i want "some-fn" use this instead 21:33:13 so redefinition 21:33:39 nan_: why do you want to do that? 21:35:14 stassats: well i got a function in some package which takes functions and calls this functions in a loop forever, and i want to be able to modify things in those functions 21:35:27 stassats: yes, it's the reading the backlog time. 21:35:40 stassats: happily, it's done. I'm synchronuous now :-) 21:35:58 unfortunately, this won't last, given current day work :-( 21:36:57 nan_: (some-fn #'(lambda () (fn-i-want-to-modify))) would not work if fn-i-want-to-modify was in the same compilation unit or declared inline. 21:36:58 nan_: i misread your question 21:37:18 nan_: use the symbol. 21:37:23 -!- Ener2 [~enerccio@158.194.169.56] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 16.0.2/20121027181922]] 21:37:34 Bike works great! 21:37:40 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p549C5437.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:38:01 cool 21:38:09 -!- francogrex [~user@38.213-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:38:24 valeryz [~user@220-87-95-178.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 21:39:55 pjb: i never thought about symbols as i was passing this function to a function in another package, but it works. 21:40:18 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:40:48 stassats: it is probably my fault as i have hard time expressing myself 21:41:20 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:43:28 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has joined #lisp 21:44:11 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 21:44:23 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-004-251.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:45:51 -!- knobo [~user@81.175.44.217] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:46:42 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:47:17 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:49:58 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:51:01 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:54:58 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 21:55:18 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host 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[~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 22:08:00 -!- jdz [~jdz@85.254.212.34] has quit [Excess Flood] 22:08:01 is usocket still using svn? 22:08:36 jdz [~jdz@85.254.212.34] has joined #lisp 22:10:18 yes 22:10:38 JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 22:13:01 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:21:20 I have patches for CCL, which seems broken 22:21:27 is it maintained? 22:21:34 yes 22:21:38 my previous patches don't seem to have made it 22:21:53 sending a new one -- or should I merge them all into one? 22:22:00 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-214.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:24:19 -!- talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:24:34 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 22:24:57 -!- nyef 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