00:00:09 functors, lambda, whathave you all it's canonical C++ rendering 00:00:49 Forgetaboutit: we should stop discussing this here, but there are lots of valid reasons for to make "x += something" inside of a lambda and expecting the outer x to be modified 00:02:09 Denommus: CL is better anyway and Java is stupid ;) 00:02:14 it took more time, but it looks like I have the same deadlock with send :blockp nil and recv :blockp t 00:02:16 http://common-lisp.net/project/fare-memoization => 404 00:02:27 jasom: all of cl.net is down 00:02:31 I can push it to github. 00:02:34 wait a minute... 00:02:40 Fare: see drewc's comment from 3 minutes ago 00:04:11 Forgetaboutit: funnily enough, you don't really need to use (incf x) inside of a lambda in CL. Specially if you care about immutability 00:04:24 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@ucrwpa1-fs-37-214.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 00:04:40 there are other ways of getting a value declaratively 00:04:46 https://github.com/fare/fare-memoization 00:04:59 Denommus: for example? 00:05:17 drewc: fare-memoization was on my user site, not any particular project site 00:05:24 maybe I should move it to qitab 00:05:29 drewc: nevermind, projects work 00:06:10 orthecreedence [~kvirc@70-36-236-51.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:20 oops 00:07:07 drewc: it was the gitweb link from cliki for fare-memoization that wasn't working 00:07:40 ok good, phew. 00:08:13 sykopomp, herep ? 00:08:14 Forgetaboutit: for example, if you want the sum of all elements in a list, instead of getting it imperatively with x=0; for(i=0;i for about 30 more seconds 00:08:22 I can send you a collection of backtraces, if you're interested 00:08:28 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 00:08:29 Fare: all of cl-net is not down ... project pages are up and the mailing lists are started to work as we;; 00:08:36 well* 00:08:39 drewc: congrats 00:08:50 Fare: I updated the cliki page for fare-memoization to point to github 00:08:51 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.119] has joined #lisp 00:09:01 jasom: thanks 00:09:06 Forgetaboutit: using immutable data and declarative syntax is often prettier, more readable, has less side-effects, and works better on a concurrent system 00:09:14 Fare: Shoot me a backtrace and a small example. I'll take a look. Is this CCL? 00:09:21 http://common-lisp.net/projects/asdf/ has always been up ... so I wonder why fare-memoization is not?! 00:09:23 yes, CCL 00:10:03 drewc: apparently it used the gitweb hosting, but didn't have a project page? 00:10:06 drewc: or something? 00:10:09 not sure I can make a small example. I'll try to setup a minimal quux-hunchentoot server and pound it, to see if I can reproduce 00:10:12 Denommus: you're right. I learned to ignore loops from Ruby, which helped me a lot to get going with Lisp 00:10:26 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 00:10:56 there is no /fare-memoization in /project at all ... 00:11:06 Fare: did that URL work before? 00:11:06 drewc: it was under ~frideau/ 00:11:22 all the user directories are currently non-working 00:11:51 Forgetaboutit: sometimes you want a loop, but that doesn't mean that you want it imperatively :) 00:12:04 ah, right ... ok, so we want ~/frideau to work ... because it used to, yes? Can do. 00:12:31 Forgetaboutit: I think it is even easier to use declarative syntax in Lisp than it is in Ruby 00:12:38 or rather http://asdasd/~frideau I guess ... ok 00:12:50 -!- mc40 [~mc40@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: mc40] 00:13:13 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 00:13:55 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 00:14:55 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host176.186-125-106.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:16:04 Fare: http://common-lisp.net/~frideau/ 00:16:18 k0001 [~k0001@186.153.77.177] has joined #lisp 00:16:40 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@erudite.anarchism.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:18:07 Denommus: that might be the case :) 00:18:55 Denommus: I liked most about Ruby that method chaining is so easy, I ended up using it all the time 00:22:01 Denommus: CL confused me at first with map, mapc, mapcar and so on 00:24:10 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.212.253.159] has joined #lisp 00:24:55 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:25:17 Forgetaboutit: yup. I also loved Ruby. But when I started to learn Common Lisp, I almost instantly saw that everything Ruby was doing was to hide all Lisp's power in an ALGOL syntax. And while it is "easier" to a beginner (in the sense that most developers are more used to an ALGOL syntax), the fact that I could the raw power of the language in Common Lisp was much more attractive 00:25:20 -!- breakds [~breakds@wifi-116.cs.wisc.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:27:25 Denommus: Couldn't agree more, I feel the same way. Syntax never scared me of language, but the names of some functions are just confusing. I hope this will be fixed some day 00:28:14 Denommus: For example, I still don't the difference between `setq' and `setf'. 00:28:24 yes, someday you will not be confused by the names ... does that count as a fix? :) 00:28:27 Denommus: *don't understand 00:28:39 drewc: I guess^^ 00:29:09 setf is a macro for setting to generalized "places". setq changes the value of a variable (bla bla symbol macros). setf expands into (something equivalent to) setq in the obvious case. 00:29:48 and setq expand to setf in a non-obious case :) 00:29:52 for example, if you want to change the value of a slot using an accessor, you can simply (setf (accessor object) new-value). You can't do the same with setq 00:30:02 as a general rule, you should stick with setf 00:30:17 This is my current strategy :) 00:30:53 Can you tell an example of where I'd have to use `setq'? 00:31:11 as a more general rule, you could do your code purely functional and not using setf or setq at all. But that's up to debate 00:31:19 you don't have to use setq anywhere. 00:31:59 setq is vestigal case, afaik 00:32:28 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 00:32:57 as for the function names, I don't think they'll change, unless somebody create another language (I guess that's what Clojure and Arc are trying to do, anyway). But they're not /that/ confusing. Even Ruby borrowed some of them (like map) 00:33:20 so `setq' is redundant? 00:33:51 well (setf foo ...) has to expand into /something/ 00:34:14 (let ((list (list 1 2))) (symbol-macrolet ((first (car list))) (prog1 list (setq first 3)))) => (3 2) ;; setq needs setf , so use setf and be done with it :) 00:35:00 Forgetaboutit: effect of looong age :) 00:35:14 In fact setq can be ignored 00:35:31 I would say it's a side-effect of being a standard 00:36:12 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:36:28 ok, thanks for the clarifications :) 00:37:02 In a perfect world, there would only be one obvious function/macro/..., but I can live with that ;) 00:38:20 perhaps there is, perhaps there is. 00:38:28 gah, I wrote the worlds slowest arithmetic expression parser in smug 00:39:42 sykopomp, are your semaphores on the C heap or the Lisp heap? 00:39:43 jasom: get it even slower with sleep, close the source and send it to guiness 00:39:47 in the latter case, that could explain it 00:40:09 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:40:26 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:40:32 jasom: are you still using the old SMUG where it is always "indeterminate"? 00:40:35 I did (=or (lowest-priority-binop-expr) (next-lowest-priority-binop-expr)...etc) 00:40:42 drewc: no, I'm just stupid 00:41:06 jasom: fair enough, I often am stupid with parsers myself. 00:41:50 drewc: (1) first parses as "Oh, well maybe this is '(1)||something', nope, maybe it's '(1)&&something'" and so on and so forth 00:42:15 drewc: since it's naive no-lookahead 00:42:47 jasom: yup ... monparsing.org has a whole section on that and other performance particulars 00:44:11 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:44:38 drewc: I'm trying to think of how to left-factorize this... I'm sure someone has done it before 00:45:40 what is does not have, because gofer is lazy, is a way to find out what is spinning. If it was lazy, I could easily see where/when it fails and backs up ... or why it keeps looping over and over ... but instead, I simply have to notice that it is taking a while and using all my CPU :| 00:45:45 (time (funcall (plush-parser::arithmetic-expr) "(1)")) =>454.680878 seconds of total run time (447.814922 user, 6.865956 system) 00:45:54 innovative 00:45:58 *drewc* is working on a parser now that spins at the end 00:46:19 drewc: I just manually wrote a tracer that I can insert into the parser 00:47:07 -!- Tordek_ is now known as Tordek 00:47:16 drewc: https://gist.github.com/anonymous/5341964 <-- primitive, but works 00:47:38 drewc: then just (tracer "something" (=let* ...)) 00:49:26 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:49:38 I suppose I could parse out all of the operators and operands, and then build the parse tree by recursively removing the left-most highest-priority operator, but that's a lot less pretty code :( 00:49:59 tenawa [~user@c-98-201-84-26.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:50:27 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:52:00 drewc: also you *really* don't want to see the last tokenizer I wrote with smug; it has a side-effect and relies on the fact that there will be no backtracking across that side-effect 00:52:32 well, https://raw.github.com/drewc/smug/master/doc/monparsing.org and the paper that I org-ified is mostly about that ... how to parse ops and parse the language the paper is written in ... 00:52:36 KDr2 [~KDr2@111.161.70.16] has joined #lisp 00:54:10 ... and when I have issues with what I am doing parser-wise, I read that paper again and usually solve things 00:54:48 So, heh, that is all I can recommend at this point :) 00:55:33 mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-163-43-88.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:56:00 drewc: oh, the raw is much better; what's wrong with githubs org-mode support? 00:56:20 pbgc 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quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:55:37 sykopomp [~sykopomp@crlspr-24.233.190.221.myacc.net] has joined #lisp 04:55:37 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@crlspr-24.233.190.221.myacc.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:55:37 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 04:55:43 cdidd [~cdidd@95-26-22-234.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 04:56:11 lukas__ [~lukas@194.228.13.139] has joined #lisp 04:56:51 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 04:57:38 cinolt [4247579e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.71.87.158] has joined #lisp 04:58:06 I'm trying to write a procedure that manipulates a list as follows: http://pastebin.com/ZJ7c8ed2 Can somebody provide some pointers? I'd gratifactorially appreciate said assistance. It operates hard-codedly on the + symbol, FYI. 04:59:06 cinolt: that is scheme, so please go to #scheme. i don't know if they do homework help, though. 04:59:20 H4ns: Well it's not homework for one, and nobody answered on Scheme. 04:59:35 I'll accept a Common Lisp explanation, since the two languages are similar from what I know. 05:00:22 cinolt: (defun split (thing list) (let ((right (member thing list))) (values (ldiff list right) (cdr right))) does it once, I think. 05:00:41 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 05:08:23 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [] 05:08:35 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:12:58 <|3b|> if it isn't homework, CL answer would be "use the split-sequence library" 05:15:15 and the belief that scheme and cl are so similar that the answer would basically be the same is misguided. 05:15:34 I didn't even think of split-sequence. ugh. 05:16:16 H4ns: Agreed. Sorry for my ignorance. 05:16:18 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:17:47 -!- cinolt [4247579e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.71.87.158] has left #lisp 05:18:41 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:18:55 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 05:19:17 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:20:51 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has joined #lisp 05:21:08 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:21:22 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 05:23:42 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:23:45 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 05:25:18 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 05:27:03 Is there some setting for "git gui" so that it ignores whitespace, eg. because of re-indentation when adding a LET somewhere? 05:28:09 I even defined gitattributes and a specific diff command for lisp files, but git gui seems to ignore that setting. 05:28:21 -!- FareWell [fare@nat/google/x-jiitjtoejvmuicbw] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:29:00 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vxhujkdaqqclvbzb] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:29:56 -!- erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: erikc] 05:32:32 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75cc24.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 05:33:11 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:34:06 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.129.113.189] has joined #lisp 05:35:26 -!- freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 05:35:42 freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has joined #lisp 05:36:34 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 14:22:15 ccl-logbot 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timed out] 15:22:50 anyone know whether or not google's location API has changed recently? cl-geocode doesn't seem to work anymore locally. 15:24:37 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 15:25:57 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 15:25:57 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 15:25:57 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:29:13 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: casion] 15:31:50 ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has joined #lisp 15:32:20 *madnificent* looks at writing his own for the different API which google offers now (presuming the api of cl-geocode was deprecated earlier on) 15:35:55 -!- EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: EvW] 15:36:13 -!- Denommus [~user@201.75.85.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:37:10 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 15:37:10 -!- sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Changing host] 15:37:10 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 15:39:26 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 15:39:39 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [Client Quit] 15:39:54 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:41:39 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:44:25 stupid, i can paste to mcclim listener but not directly to climacs....have to copy paste back from listener to climacs.... 15:44:34 stuff i copy from the browser.... 15:45:48 -!- daniel` [~user@74-134-242-5.dhcp.insightbb.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:46:06 *madnificent* mentally prepares for writing a new common lisp google geocode thing. if anyone knows of something other than cl-geocode to exist, ping me please :) 15:46:07 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-37-38.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:46:22 -!- dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:47:25 sykopomp, herep 15:47:31 FareWell: pong 15:49:17 *sykopomp* -> lunch, will read when back 15:50:06 notori0us [~irc@osuosc/notori0us] has joined #lisp 15:50:47 hi everyone! Newbie question: I installed a package from debian's repository (cl-irc, to be specific), and when I do (require :cl-irc) it doesn't quite work 15:51:05 notori0us: please use quicklisp 15:51:06 specifically, ``a file with the name cl-irc does not exist'' 15:51:12 notori0us: 1) you probably won't want to use debian's lisp packages 15:51:15 notori0us: http://beta.quicklisp.org/ 15:51:22 H4ns: ah, so I read that somewhere. Thank you for the pointers! 15:51:27 require doesn't load asdf systems 15:51:34 *notori0us* goes off to read more things 15:51:37 notori0us: 2) you don't want require 15:52:33 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:53:31 mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 15:54:13 -!- Kruppe [~user@CPE602ad0938e9a-CM602ad0938e97.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:56:08 jasom: so, I should just alias my sbcl to what loads quicklisp at start? 15:56:10 Tuxedo [~tuxedo@bas3-cooksville17-3096516824.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:56:25 notori0us: install sbcl from a sane source (say sbcl.org), it's easy. install quicklisp from beta.quicklisp.org. load libraries by using (ql:quickload :cl-irc) 15:56:40 jasom: use (ql:add-to-init-file) 15:56:46 oops. 15:56:53 notori0us: that was for you, sorry jasom 15:57:02 read the instructions from quicklisp just..... 15:57:03 notori0us: basically, follow the instructions closely. 15:57:05 notori0us: when you load quicklisp.lisp, it will inform you about how to install it so it's loaded automatically and how to use it :) 15:57:08 it's all out of order hints here..... 15:57:24 haha thanks guys 15:57:37 LiamH [~none@aes048148.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 15:58:43 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:59:15 talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 16:03:05 ryankarason [~rak@cpe-76-189-227-224.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:04:10 notori0us: you'll probably also want (ql:quickload :quicklisp-slime-helper) 16:04:43 -!- LiamH [~none@aes048148.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:06:39 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:08:25 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:08:32 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 16:08:34 -!- sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Changing host] 16:08:34 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 16:10:52 fancy 16:10:56 thank you guys 16:12:42 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 16:14:57 -!- Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:15:14 -!- FareWell [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:15:35 sure wish cl-who was nicer to me today.. 16:16:09 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has joined #lisp 16:16:32 -!- Henesy [~h3n3sy@adsl-75-17-76-112.dsl.peoril.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:16:51 like it working sanley with macros .. 16:17:08 PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has joined #lisp 16:17:19 zorkmoid: what's the issue? 16:17:25 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:17:57 jasom: i want a macro that expands into a cl-who markup form, which is used later in some code .. kinda tricky to get it right ... 16:18:51 zorkmoid: you can do that, or you can write a function that just writes to the stream by invoking cl-who itself 16:18:54 nyef [~nyef@c-76-119-183-159.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:18:59 Hello all. 16:19:06 jasom: mm... 16:19:19 -!- freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 16:19:21 Did I see a boston lisp meeting scheduled for tomorrow, and is that actually on, or merely on the calendar? 16:19:32 jasom: not worky for me... maybe it is getting late 16:19:39 nyef: it's on! 16:19:52 Where, and where's the announcement? 16:19:53 freiksenet [~freiksene@freiksenet.com] has joined #lisp 16:20:11 nyef: on boston-lisp and bost-lisp-announce. 6:30 at the star room at the stata center. mary chungs after. 16:20:35 what's the concensus on decent feature test platform? 16:20:50 Xach: And will you be there, and if so are you interested in a copy of Interactive Programming Environments? (Barstowe, et alia, I believe) 16:22:08 zorkmoid: I've found myself having to use the dreaded 'eval' when trying to use cl-who with lhtml-type markup which isn't known until runtime. 16:22:14 i'm not sure if that applies to your current situation. 16:23:24 nyef: alii 16:24:25 zorkmoid: I made an example of this somewhere but now can't find it.. 16:24:56 jasom: would be useful ... 16:25:01 gendl: I often see hugely contorted code because cl-who's evaluation model is misunderstood. long story short: it's as simple as possible, probably much simpler than you keep expecting it to be. 16:25:07 nyef: yes and maybe! 16:25:16 fe[nl]ix: Hunh. I've always seen it as "et al." or "et alia", but "et alii" makes a certain amount of sense. 16:25:47 -!- sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has quit [] 16:25:48 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:25:50 Xach: Okay, I have the book somewhere around, having made a point of not leaving it in NH, so if I can find it by then I should have it with me. 16:25:55 przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has joined #lisp 16:26:16 zorkmoid: https://gist.github.com/joekarma/5311681 here's an example of how it's done in yaclml, and how I would do it on cl-who (see my comment) 16:26:33 gendl: tried that, was so ugly ... not because of eval but for other silly reasons. 16:27:07 5am or stefil 16:27:08 hrmmm 16:27:19 nyef: hooray 16:27:26 never understood what people have against eval ... though it can lead to some ... interestingly fun stuff. 16:27:27 fmeyer [~fmeyer@200-150-182-201.static-corp.ajato.com.br] has joined #lisp 16:27:51 zorkmoid: invoking the compiler at runtime just seems so extravagent 16:28:56 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:29:04 zorkmoid: Using EVAL makes it much, much harder to reason about how code behaves. Plus, it's expensive. 16:29:10 Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 16:29:16 quazimodo: 5am 16:29:23 everything is expensive depending on what you do. :-) 16:29:41 -!- mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: mc40] 16:29:50 and i define expensive as "shows up in my profiling results" 16:30:01 -!- EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:31:13 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 16:31:42 So... WITHOUT-INTERRUPTS is expensive, and everything else is free? 16:31:44 is there a good CL library for using CL as a replacement for bash? I know of trivial-shell and sbcl's built in run shell command, but for something to replicate the ease of file redirection etc? 16:32:26 I don't think there is one 16:32:26 k0001 [~k0001@host81.181-1-202.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 16:32:30 ahungry: there used to be shelisp, but i don't know to what it was renamed. i wrote a bunch of helpers when i needed to use the shell and haven't seen something that perfectly integrates so far. 16:32:43 something similar to (shell (print "hello") > "/tmp/filename.log") would be ideal 16:32:48 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 16:32:51 breakds [~breakds@wifi-116.cs.wisc.edu] has joined #lisp 16:33:01 vs using the big with-open-file block, same with piping 16:33:06 ok thanks guys, i'll do some digging into shelisp 16:33:28 Hrm. Might be able to do something clever with a custom REPL... 16:33:38 ahungry: what's wrong with (with-open-file (*standard-output* "/tmp/filename.log" :direction :output) (print "hello")) 16:33:44 iolib/os:create-process can do many of those things, sans the shell syntax 16:33:46 ahungry: the project was taken over, renamed, and actually made to work. but it's not as close to lisp as you seem to want it to be. 16:33:46 Or, yeah, a SHELL macro with some brains to it. 16:34:20 jasom: nothing is wrong with it, but for shell scripts it would be easier for non-lisp users to follow a more similar to bash syntax 16:34:26 jasom: you forgot :if-exists :supersede 16:34:30 mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 16:34:44 stassats`: I have no-clobber enabled in bash, so no I Didn't 16:34:53 calling ">" for write to file and overwrite if it exists, and ">>" for append to end of file or create if not exists 16:34:58 stassats`: that would be >| 16:35:02 is just much cleaner I think 16:35:38 ahungry: if you don't need it to actually run in a subprocess that should be pretty easy to write 16:35:57 jasom: i don't use bash, your argument is invalid 16:36:00 maybe that'll be my next hobby project 16:36:03 i use zsh here myself 16:36:08 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:36:14 stassats`: ahungry asked for similar syntax to bash; so it is valid 16:36:59 ahungry: if you want really close to bash, you can try https://github.com/jasom/plush but that doesn't support running lisp statements inline yet 16:37:24 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 16:37:32 jasom: fasls in the repository 16:37:34 it's also very slow 16:37:38 fe[nl]ix: thanks 16:38:05 and fix the .asd 16:38:53 fill in those fields 16:39:05 and add a valid LICENCE file 16:39:09 fe[nl]ix: you mean "Specify license here" isn't a valid license? 16:39:24 Does anyone have a practical use for (XLIB:PROCESS-EVENT *display* :HANDLER #'LIST) in CLX, or is it just useful as a proof-of-concept, and one should use a different handler in actual practice? 16:39:27 without that, I'm not even allowed to read the code 16:39:51 what's a good license for lisp these days? MIT? 16:39:56 how many first borns does jasom have right on, now? 16:40:27 jasom: I think most lispers use that 16:40:33 jasom: llgpl, bsd, and boost are decent 16:40:45 sambio [~sambio@unaffiliated/sambio] has joined #lisp 16:41:35 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-6-168.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:42:10 oGMo: Has LLGPL ever been tested? 16:42:16 *jasom* doesn't care what anyone does with it as long as they don't sue me 16:42:18 pkhuong: have any of them? heh 16:42:40 Man, LtU has been down all morning  how am I supposed to get anything done? 16:42:44 and there's no way to stop people from suing me, so it doesn't matter to me too much what license I use 16:43:36 ahungry: FYI the suggestion for plush is not serious; it's a toy project that I wrote that may or may not ever get finished 16:45:13 ellusioner [ellusioner@c-951ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 16:46:26 IIRC no GPL variant has ever had a decision in court made; just settlements 16:46:31 oGMo: 3-clause BSD definitely has. I think 2-clause BSD and MIT have been OKed by a boatload of legal teams. 16:47:09 Everyone (i.e. defendants as well) seems to agree on GPL as well. 16:47:25 bhyde [~bhyde@c-76-118-23-40.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:47:38 pkhuong: all the defendants on GPL agree about is that it's cheaper to publish their source (or switch to non-GPL code) than to go to court 16:48:36 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.89.199] has joined #lisp 16:49:27 pkhuong: GPL/LGPL have at least that, either they're valid or they're not and you default to copyright restrictions .. LLGPL just adds a stated exception 16:49:43 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 16:49:58 But huge swaths of law have little in-court legal precedent for similar reasons; I was on the board of an HOA for a while and it was disturbing how often the advice from our lawyer was "Depending on how a judge decides things, you could lose a case by doing X, or you could lose by doing ~X and either way you can get sued; my best guess is that X will be how the courts interpret the law" 16:49:58 if you're hesitant, use something else, but definitely avoid LGPL/GPL if you want other people to use your stuff 16:49:59 oGMo: utterly not reassuring for someone who wants to use your code. 16:51:36 -!- ryankarason is now known as rk[sun] 16:55:26 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:55:51 fe[nl]ix: you're better off not reading my code anyway; it's quite ugly 16:56:36 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 16:56:43 fe[nl]ix: though the shell glob to pcre parser is perhaps an exception. 16:56:54 I use GPL code by preference. 16:57:18 s/GPL/AGPL3/ 16:57:19 So if you want your code to be used, license it under AGPL3. 16:57:24 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 16:57:32 can we skip that? 16:58:37 i like agpl 16:58:41 oh look it's another licensing discussion in #lisp 16:59:08 lol 16:59:08 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-249-60.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:59:46 -!- ck_ [~ck@dslb-146-060-027-165.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:00:03 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-249-60.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:00:21 Anyways, you'll get my code for a non-AGPL3 license only over my dead body and if I don't have heirs. :-) 17:02:51 FareWell [fare@nat/google/x-pxeahkxnkmddmtap] has joined #lisp 17:03:21 agpl ? 17:03:22 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vxecjdrtquwcoyuh] has joined #lisp 17:03:22 wth 17:03:28 -!- nalaginrut [~nalaginru@59.40.37.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:03:49 If someone finds *any* of my code on github profitable then I will be quite surprised; it's just a dumping ground for all my useless projects 17:04:25 wbooze: IIRC AGPL is GPL with an additional clause to prevent the whole "Oh look, if it's a webapp running on a server, I can modify it all I want and not have to give anyone the source" 17:04:49 which one is that jasom you speak of ? 17:05:05 i mean your project 17:05:30 had to rejoin sorry, didn't get what was talken about.... 17:05:40 foeniks [~fevon@p5091F61B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:05 wbooze: we were just talking about licenses and I was saying I don't care about the licenses for stuff on github since none of that is particularly good 17:06:14 *my stuff on github 17:07:51 well, if you want to make your own license, nobody is holding you back....but when it comes to say a hassle....you're on your own.... 17:07:53 wbooze: and I interpreted your agpl ? wth as not knowing what the agpl was 17:08:15 -!- davazp [~user@92.251.159.187.threembb.ie] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:08:37 err yes that too, i didn't know of agpl, only lgpl..... 17:09:00 wbooze: I just added MIT to one that fe[nl]ix noticed didn't have a license file, and my reason for picking it is that it seems to be the default for lisp stuff (it's almost like lisp is associated with MIT in some way...) 17:09:22 jup :) 17:09:29 -!- foeniks [~fevon@p5091F61B.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 17:10:03 jasom: just put a licence on all the code you publish, and let others judge its usefulness :) 17:10:30 *jasom* should make a quickproject template to start with MIT license 17:12:41 *jasom* realized that anybody who judges me by github will think he's a really bad lisp programmer rather than a middling C programmer 17:13:14 -!- mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:14:53 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@200-150-182-201.static-corp.ajato.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:14:55 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:15:24 i fixed the scroll behaviour in beirc's main loop, but somehow not sufficiently...everytime i hop to a line above some pages....i get back to the bottom as soon as any event happens like someone joining the channel....lol 17:15:53 makes scroll back pretty hard....but the original scroller was not correct anyway..... 17:16:28 it would not hold on to the bottom anyway.....even if i scrolled to the bottom by hand.... 17:17:31 mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:19:01 easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 17:19:12 and the bloody eldoc functionality is offby1 too in climacs....lol 17:19:25 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 17:19:42 closing parens works now but the reporting on what form it's closing is off by 1 17:20:17 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-cozjytadgghzzdrx] has joined #lisp 17:20:17 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-cozjytadgghzzdrx] has quit [Changing host] 17:20:18 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 17:22:22 ogamita: yeah, because AGPLv3 is a great way to not to business 17:22:33 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:22:38 madnificent: nooo stahp 17:22:43 *madnificent* stahps 17:23:12 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Client Quit] 17:23:58 jasom: can't you be both? 17:24:21 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:24:41 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:26:07 cl-geocode is already taken, what is another sane name for a library which talks to the google geocoding api? 17:26:19 google-geocode seems to long and tedious to type 17:26:25 cl-google-geocode 17:26:25 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:26:38 trivial-google-geocode 17:26:51 that's all _worse_ :P 17:27:07 i'd just go with cl-google-geocode, personally. 17:27:07 so google-geocode is good enough, i presume 17:27:23 goocle-geocode 17:27:39 You can always use a local nickname in software that's using it. 17:27:43 -!- nkkarthik [~nkkarthik@63.251.54.158] has left #lisp 17:27:45 i could also go for geocode-v3, as it's the api version 3... not sure 17:27:57 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 17:28:00 |google's-watching| 17:28:12 foom: you can't /always/ use a local nickname, afaik package-local-nicknames (at least) aren't standardised 17:28:20 cl-foundyou 17:28:29 prxq: you win 17:28:38 leo2007 [~leo@111.161.47.175] has joined #lisp 17:28:45 heh 17:29:28 *madnificent* kind-of likes foundyou too. though it doesn't shout maps or geocode 17:29:44 madnificent: Package nicks are rocking on the implementations that I care about (or maintain) 17:30:40 ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@fsf/member/chibapet] has joined #lisp 17:33:10 pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 17:33:22 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-215-183-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 17:33:36 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:34:46 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:37:48 exist a way to convert a decimal number with a decimal point to a binary number with a binary point by means of format? (format nil "~B" 26) --> "11010" , but (format nil "~B" 26.5) --> "26.5" instead of 11010.1 . thx 17:38:41 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:39:22 H4ns: ping 17:39:24 -!- weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:41:41 -!- mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:42:47 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:43:12 -!- ellusioner [ellusioner@c-951ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Hihi] 17:43:27 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 17:44:20 pnpuff: Yes, but you basically get to write your own function to convert it the way you want to. 17:44:38 mc40 [~mc@dab-bhx1-h-1-5.dab.02.net] has joined #lisp 17:46:24 -!- mc40 [~mc@dab-bhx1-h-1-5.dab.02.net] has quit [Client Quit] 17:46:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.204.232] has joined #lisp 17:46:49 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.204.232] has quit [Changing host] 17:46:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 17:47:28 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-76-118-23-40.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 17:47:37 weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has joined #lisp 17:48:25 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:49:13 -!- two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:49:42 rme [~rme@50.43.190.179] has joined #lisp 17:50:28 przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has joined #lisp 17:50:55 mc40 [~mc@dab-bhx1-h-67-1.dab.02.net] has joined #lisp 17:55:52 fe[nl]ix: ack 17:58:12 H4ns: I hit a problem with drakma and cl+ssl 17:58:35 -!- vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:58:48 drakma writes an adjustable (unsigned-byte 8) array to a cl+ssl stream, which signals an error because it's not a simple-array 17:59:17 that has been fixed 17:59:19 fe[nl]ix: that's a bug in cl+ssl which is fixed in trunk 17:59:33 good 17:59:37 -!- leo2007 [~leo@111.161.47.175] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:00:20 good thing that bug was here, otherwise it would've worked and the other bug, which is silent, would manifest itself 18:00:24 yay for bugs! 18:06:50 Fare: where to get recent version of asdf? the cl.net git repo doesn't seem to be working 18:07:10 http://l1sp.org/asdf/asdf.lisp has a recent version 18:07:45 Xach: thanks 18:10:26 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:11:34 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.126.217] has joined #lisp 18:12:52 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 18:13:07 Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-10-198.dsl.mweb.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:13:43 Corvidium [~cosman246@24.56.241.224] has joined #lisp 18:14:12 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has joined #lisp 18:14:43 -!- scoofy [~scoofy@catv-89-135-71-167.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:15:56 przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has joined #lisp 18:20:17 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:21:07 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:21:20 -!- redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 18:23:21 vhost- [~vhost@li540-47.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 18:23:21 -!- vhost- [~vhost@li540-47.members.linode.com] has quit [Changing host] 18:23:22 vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has joined #lisp 18:23:28 -!- erikc [~erikc@209.20.28.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:25:19 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:25:22 -!- protist [~protist@242.173.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:27:18 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:27:26 ASau [~user@p4FF9673F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:28:30 AeroNotix [~xeno@abod176.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 18:29:09 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has joined #lisp 18:29:21 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:31:12 -!- mc40 [~mc@dab-bhx1-h-67-1.dab.02.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:35:12 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:35:16 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:35:59 scoofy [~scoofy@catv-89-135-71-167.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 18:36:13 -!- nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:38:04 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 18:41:57 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:43:14 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 18:46:39 blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 18:47:14 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has joined #lisp 18:47:20 kliph` [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 18:47:36 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.172.53.76] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:49:18 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:50:42 -!- crus0e [~crus0e@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: crus0e] 18:51:35 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:47 blackwol` [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 18:52:37 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 18:53:52 pierpa` [~user@host29-93-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 18:54:50 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:55:36 -!- blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:56:44 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-161-201.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:57:09 redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 18:57:51 leo2007 [~leo@111.161.47.175] has joined #lisp 18:58:07 Myk267 [~myk@unaffiliated/myk267] has joined #lisp 18:58:09 is there already some simple package to have repls in threads that I may programmatically send commands to? 18:58:26 minion: lparallel? 18:58:27 lparallel: No definition was found in the first 5 lines of http://www.cliki.net/lparallel 18:59:16 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has joined #lisp 19:00:23 normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:00:38 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:01:04 crus0e [~crus0e@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 19:05:14 -!- benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:05:53 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-93.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:08:42 nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has joined #lisp 19:11:53 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:14:15 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:15:03 -!- zorkmoid [c2ed8e11@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.237.142.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:15:17 -!- dan64 [dan64@dannyadam.com] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 19:16:40 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 19:16:58 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 19:17:58 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-187-74.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 19:18:36 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:22:08 -!- easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Outta here?] 19:22:58 davazp [~user@92.251.159.187.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 19:23:08 dnolen [~user@212.23.236.122] has joined #lisp 19:23:10 -!- davorb [~davor@194.47.245.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:24:15 nyef: once again i have no AIMA 19:24:19 -!- teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:25:16 davorb [~davor@hallonpaj.df.lth.se] has joined #lisp 19:27:20 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-215-183-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [] 19:28:14 Xach: Fair enough. 19:29:06 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 19:30:27 -!- scoofy [~scoofy@catv-89-135-71-167.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:30:32 ISF [~ivan@189.61.222.251] has joined #lisp 19:31:00 I am wandering AIMAlessly 19:33:41 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:34:26 easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 19:35:23 nha_ [~prefect@koln-5d815063.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:36:18 :D 19:38:21 -!- pnpuff [~pnpuff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:39:53 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:43:20 PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has joined #lisp 19:43:44 -!- PuercoPop is now known as Guest75921 19:47:31 -!- Guest75921 [~user@190.222.252.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:49:42 -!- easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Outta here?] 19:49:45 araujo_ [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 19:51:10 -!- araujo_ [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:51:41 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75fb4e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:52:04 hi 19:52:11 I'm having difficulties to compile sbcl. 19:52:20 Ralt: What's the trouble? 19:52:20 getting nothing but errors 19:52:50 well, running install.sh throws errors like "Can't open output/prefix.def" 19:52:51 Ralt: When I want to compile SBCL, I download a binary of sbcl from www.sbcl.org, then i use that to compile the sources. What approach did you take? 19:52:58 oh. 19:53:05 so you need sbcl to compile sbcl? 19:53:17 I just unzipped the sources and ran "sh install.sh" 19:53:17 usually, yes 19:53:17 Ralt: not strictly, but I find it the easiest way. 19:53:55 -!- davazp [~user@92.251.159.187.threembb.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:54:00 meh, "run-sbcl.sh" requires "make.sh" first, but "make.sh" fails because it can't find sbcl. 19:54:02 Ralt: when downloading source packages, you usually have to build before installing. 19:54:05 what a vicious circle... 19:54:16 you need to download a binary first 19:54:53 yeah, looks like I'll just run apt-get install sbcl, then run make.sh + install.sh. 19:55:11 just looks weird to have sbcl to install sbcl... 19:55:26 That might work, but it can work better to use the binary from www.sbcl.org. 19:55:39 It depends on how old sbcl is via apt, and whether it drags in a lot of other unwanted stuff. 19:56:00 Ralt: try to build gcc or clang next tim. They both need C++ compilers, and it works best when they're building themselves. Same for SBCL; it needs a CL implementation, preferably itself. 19:56:03 Ralt: if all you want is sbcl, you can just get it from www.sbcl.org and use the binary. I often do that. Compiling the latest is not a great treat. 19:56:37 pkhuong: yeah, I guess it's logic. 19:56:41 Xach: alright, doing that. 19:58:47 dlowe is probably almost done with his cool apt repo(s) with all the latest lisp implementations 19:59:04 -!- stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:59:04 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:59:10 *dlowe* coughs. 19:59:23 alright 19:59:28 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:59:31 downloading the linux binary went like a charm. 19:59:39 super! 19:59:50 is someone going to participate to LispNYC? 19:59:57 I wish. It turned out to be more annoying to set up than I had initially considered. 20:00:05 http://lispinsmallprojects.org/ 20:00:15 dlowe: drat. maybe i'll look at it sometime too. 20:00:27 i need to set up something for personal use, anyway 20:00:30 Xach: I got hung up on making build vms 20:00:36 dlowe: ouch 20:00:53 teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has joined #lisp 20:01:06 mc40 [~mc40@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 20:01:28 killerboy [~mateusz@195.225.68.249] has joined #lisp 20:01:33 It was just consuming more time than I had, unfortunately 20:01:39 -!- mc40 [~mc40@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Client Quit] 20:01:56 *Xach* can relate 20:02:00 mc40 [~mc40@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 20:03:03 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 20:03:29 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:04:33 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:05:44 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:05:50 Are there any lisp meetings in Seattle? 20:05:53 or around the area? 20:06:01 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:06:15 There was once SeaFunc but I don't know if that's still going, or lispy at all. 20:06:33 Ralt: there's a spurious apostrophe on that page 20:07:23 definitely. 20:08:07 Ralt: did you find it already ? 20:08:15 Corvidium: There was a Vancouver lisp meeting of some sort, I hear that that's at least on the same side of the continent... 20:08:28 Bike_ [~Glossina@63-230-173-174.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:08:41 Don't know if there's been a meeting there any time recently, though. 20:08:42 fe[nl]ix: well, it's quite obvious 20:09:05 > that met it's goals 20:11:28 -!- Bike [~Glossina@67-5-253-220.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:11:58 easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 20:12:16 -!- expez [~expez@expez.com] has quit [Quit: expez] 20:12:31 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vxecjdrtquwcoyuh] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:12:48 -!- FareWell [fare@nat/google/x-pxeahkxnkmddmtap] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:12:52 Joreji [~thomas@80-164.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 20:13:49 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 20:15:41 Denommus [~user@201.75.85.87] has joined #lisp 20:16:03 I feel like a carpenter that must use a stone as his tool, instead of a hammer :( 20:17:02 -!- pierpa` [~user@host29-93-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:17:07 xificurC [~xificurC@adsl-dyn236.78-98-85.t-com.sk] has joined #lisp 20:18:49 PuercoPo` [~user@190.222.252.106] has joined #lisp 20:19:32 you're having to program in C or Java? 20:19:40 -!- PuercoPo` is now known as PuercoPop` 20:20:25 -!- PuercoPop` is now known as PuercoPop 20:21:15 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Quit: spacefrogg] 20:21:53 You... don't have enough good, strong string or similar to tie the rock to a stick properly? 20:22:46 Hell, for that matter, you don't have the tools available to make yourself a proper wooden mallet? 20:24:13 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:24:27 nyef: in C, do you have strong strings? (; 20:24:31 (to mix metaphors) 20:24:56 I distinctly remember reading about a "fucked string" type in C, does that count? 20:25:02 -!- easy-iPad [~easyipad@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Outta here?] 20:25:39 antifuchs: I sometimes think of using ropes instead (: 20:25:59 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.126.217] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:26:35 -!- Joreji [~thomas@80-164.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:26:44 araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 20:26:44 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Changing host] 20:26:44 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 20:26:58 also, (to mix metaphors even more) using strings to build your tools sounds like the wrong abstraction. You should be using structures (: 20:27:23 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:28:02 but everything is made up of strings. Or possibly branes. 20:29:11 GuglielmoS [~guglielmo@ppp-78-106.21-151.libero.it] has joined #lisp 20:29:15 a cosmologist appears! 20:30:25 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has joined #lisp 20:31:06 -!- answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:59 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:32:19 -!- GuglielmoS [~guglielmo@ppp-78-106.21-151.libero.it] has quit [Client Quit] 20:32:49 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 20:33:00 mrm [~user@94.41.225.169.dynamic.ufanet.ru] has joined #lisp 20:33:37 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:33:46 -!- nullman` [~nullman@c-75-73-150-26.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:33 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:48 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 20:36:16 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 20:36:50 expez [~expez@expez.com] has joined #lisp 20:37:33 adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 20:37:36 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:38:27 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:39:37 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 20:40:55 the ql package is known the moment I start slime (added to init file). It isnt known though when I run sbcl --load foo.lisp with foo.lisp referencing the ql package. How can I fix this? 20:42:08 --load your initfile first? 20:42:31 xificurC: packages have to be defined before you try to use them. Load the ... yeah what nyef says :) 20:42:56 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host81.181-1-202.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:43:13 yes, I always complain about having to program in Java. But it IS painful, I must rant! 20:43:15 xificurC: and your initfile will likely be ~/.sbclrc (i typed stuff and didn't want to repeat drewc) 20:43:27 Or --load the quicklisp setup file, whate... Oh, neat! I just found out why my current environment is pulling FASLs from the wrong place: It's pulling QUICKLISP from the wrong place. 20:43:36 Denommus: please don't, you make my probably future look bleak. 20:43:43 in fact, I'm ranting because I'm reading some Paul Graham essays. It makes me... dream 20:44:06 -!- fsvehla [~fsvehla@h081217181184.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Quit: fsvehla] 20:44:09 Denommus: the place for ranting is #lispcafe 20:44:30 fe[nl]ix: didn't knew this one 20:45:40 anyway, I was thinking about something the last few days 20:46:57 oh. Ok, there is a clpython 20:47:25 im sorry im still lost, this is the first time im trying this. could someone possibly write the commands (s)he'd type? 20:47:32 Paul Graham's McCarthy Shrugged 20:47:55 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 20:47:56 xificurC: sbcl --load ~/quicklisp/setup.lisp --load foo.lisp 20:48:04 At least Java 8 is getting lambdas. 20:48:07 xificurC: sbcl --load ~/.sbclrc --load foo.lisp 20:48:13 xificurC: That's two options, right there. 20:48:47 Shinmera: bad lambda implementation. You can't have flow control, you still need interfaces, you can't change references of outer variables inside of lambdas 20:49:01 nyef, thanks 20:49:02 Welp. 20:49:08 Shinmera: in practice, it's almost exactly equal as a anonymous class, except it has type inference 20:49:26 At least it's a step forward, I guess? 20:49:57 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abon37.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:50:06 I really don't know why lambdas weren't part of the initial Java standard. 20:50:10 pierpa [~user@host244-218-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 20:50:14 pierpa` [~user@host244-218-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 20:50:20 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abon37.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Client Quit] 20:50:45 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has joined #lisp 20:50:53 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abon37.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:51:05 Shinmera: I can think of two reasons. First, everything in Java must be encapsulated by a class, so anonymous functions (and first-class functions) are alien to this design in general 20:51:08 Shinmera: because Java was courting the C people to a managed language and didn't want any hidden (i.e. not marked with new) heap allocation. Realpolitik by Gosling and Steele to move the vast majority of programmers halfway. 20:51:14 Shinmera: Java was built for mediocre programmers 20:51:17 wow im really bad at this, I just keep getting errors. 20:51:19 the second reason is because of how Java handles references 20:51:23 *drewc* is going to go over to #java and #arc and see if they are talking about CL there 20:51:49 Makes sense in context, I suppose. 20:52:05 -!- ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:52:11 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:52:24 changing the subject, is there ANY news about mocl? 20:52:32 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abod176.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:53:27 Denommus: yes! the author is speaking at ECLM 20:53:29 -!- bolcselo [~x@pool-108-45-77-30.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:53:57 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:54:09 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:54:09 oh, I can't be there :( 20:54:31 That's not the kind of can-do, positive attitude Paul Graham would expect. 20:54:58 Try "CL is so baroque, who would WANT to go?" 20:55:04 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 20:55:12 if you guys can hand me money for going, this attitude may change instantly :) 20:55:24 *Xach* has grown too punchy, adios! 20:55:27 -!- Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has left #lisp 20:55:34 ok :( 20:55:42 How much money, exactly? 20:56:20 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 20:56:21 I'm kidding. It's a matter of money and time. I don't think I could convince my bosses to go to a meeting about an alien language that nobody in my city knows about besides me 20:56:29 Henesy [~h3n3sy@adsl-75-17-76-112.dsl.peoril.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:56:52 -!- rme [rme@6D10F4DD.4CC8819B.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Quit: rme] 20:56:52 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.190.179] has quit [Quit: rme] 20:57:01 Hmm, you could hand it in as a "valuable working experience extension" 20:57:16 :V 20:58:21 has there been any indication of how mocl is tackling the no JIT restriction? 20:59:29 erikc: I don't know about this restriction, could you give me a preview? 20:59:57 -!- mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Parting is such sweet sorrow...] 21:01:50 Denommus: on iOS you cannot get write + exec access to pages simultaneously, so writing a conventional JIT isn't possible (Safari is a privileged exception to this rule) 21:02:08 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:03:17 ... Can you change an RW- page to an R-X page, though? 21:03:24 erikc: I don't think mocl is a JIT. It cross-compile into C before being compiled to native code, as far as the description goes 21:05:33 nyef: yes, but many JITs assume RXW: https://twitter.com/migueldeicaza/status/48517553395466240 21:05:37 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 21:06:11 -!- clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has left #lisp 21:06:27 Sure, but if you CAN change the permissions that way, and you're designing your JIT from the ground up to begin with... 21:07:07 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-249-60.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:07:44 nyef: I don't think so (modulo jailbreak). No JIT is an explicit restriction. 21:08:52 hello. i am currently trying to implement a protocol that splits one socket-stream into multiple "substreams" which are sent package-wise. i guess the best possibility to encapsulate this is using gray-streams. but then my problem is that I do not quite get how nonblocking-io is realized using gray streams. 21:08:56 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 21:10:01 -!- nha_ [~prefect@koln-5d815063.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:10:19 pkhuong: something happened around iOS6: it's a gray area: https://gist.github.com/scarnie/855607 but i haven't tried anything 21:10:30 thanks for the help guys 21:10:42 -!- xificurC [~xificurC@adsl-dyn236.78-98-85.t-com.sk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:10:45 schoppenhauer: The only gesture towards non-blocking I/O in the Common Lisp spec (and thus, indirectly, the Gray Stream spec) is STREAM-LISTEN. 21:11:08 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has joined #lisp 21:11:31 (The classic CL multiprocessing model is impressively broken by modern standards.) 21:11:53 nyef: I see, so the listen-function, if applied to multiple streams, just polls? 21:12:29 -!- milkpost [~dec@192.133.84.6] has quit [Quit: [Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/]] 21:12:48 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:13:25 Approximately, yes. On the whole, you might want to look carefully at integrating with another non-blocking I/O setup above and beyond what stock CL provides. 21:13:37 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:13:43 nyef: well, I also looked at IOlib, but I am not sure whether this has user-definable streams 21:13:52 I hear good things about iolib, but I have no idea if it's appropriate for what you're doing. 21:14:10 fe[nl]ix: Care to weigh in? 21:14:24 milkpost [~dec@192.133.84.6] has joined #lisp 21:14:30 -!- sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:15:53 nyef: well, I will then look at iolib. but it seems that this is a lot more low-level, that is, for user-defined streams, I will probably have to use pipes 21:16:27 As I said, I have no idea if it's appropriate or not. 21:19:02 -!- Forgetaboutit [~sammy@p4FFA74D5.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 21:19:46 ok, thx anyway. 21:19:50 anybody else maybe? 21:20:05 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@95-26-22-234.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:21:42 -!- kliph` [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:23:46 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:26:38 flip214_ [~marek@86.59.100.100] has joined #lisp 21:26:59 (well, if so, please highlight me :3 ) 21:27:39 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 21:28:11 froggey_ [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 21:28:20 sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 21:28:21 Yamazaki1kun [~bsa3@jetalone.facefault.org] has joined #lisp 21:28:45 bege_ [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 21:28:52 PaulHarr1s [~smoothop@cor.ms] has joined #lisp 21:28:53 ether0_ [~ether0@72.22.83.65] has joined #lisp 21:28:57 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Disconnected by services] 21:29:06 -!- froggey_ is now known as froggey 21:29:51 francisII [4f0c5c6f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.12.92.111] has joined #lisp 21:30:01 hello 21:30:47 hello 21:30:48 have some questions. someone can help? 21:31:03 hello shoppenhauer 21:31:09 general rule in irc: don't ask whether you can ask, just ask, francisII 21:31:22 -!- weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:31:30 snafuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has joined #lisp 21:31:39 ah yes sure friend shoppehnauer 21:31:53 do you know clozure? 21:32:00 yes 21:32:18 -!- RenJuan [~juan@cpe-76-180-168-166.buffalo.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 21:32:20 sbryant_ [freenode@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has joined #lisp 21:32:24 well, i am trying to trace a function but it do not 21:32:32 Neptu_ [~Neptu@252.67.24.31.static.mrfriday.com] has joined #lisp 21:32:38 *drewc* is not 'you' in this sense it seems... shame ;) 21:32:51 nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 21:33:06 ok, sry, can't help you with that. maybe somebody else can. 21:33:29 oh yes thank you. and tell me do you know sbcl? 21:33:34 -!- stardiviner [~stardivin@218.74.179.64] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- rvirding [uid5943@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rxnfcysymawkksua] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- sbryant [~freenode@caladan.boot.sh] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- rking [~rking@unaffiliated/rking] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- Neptu [~Neptu@252.67.24.31.static.mrfriday.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- ether0 [~ether0@72.22.83.65] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- PaulHarris [~smoothop@cor.ms] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- Yamazaki-kun [~bsa3@jetalone.facefault.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:34 -!- flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:33:35 -!- snafuchs is now known as antifuchs 21:33:36 -!- sbryant_ is now known as sbryant 21:34:05 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:34:48 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:35:29 casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:36:16 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:36:29 shoppehnauer do you kbow sbcl? 21:36:34 know 21:36:49 in sbcl debugger when you press v, does it highlight the entire function or current sexp? (looks like my sbcl bugged again after package upgrade) 21:36:53 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:37:06 nan_` [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 21:37:55 nan i dont know this. i dont have used debugger yet 21:38:11 i am trying to find the best free common lisp 21:38:13 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:38:26 nan_: depends on your debug level. 21:38:33 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 21:38:34 -!- nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:39:26 tekai [~tekai@f054126127.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 21:39:27 -!- dnolen [~user@212.23.236.122] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:39:38 srcerer_ [~chatzilla@dns2.klsairexpress.com] has joined #lisp 21:39:43 pkhuong: i am testing same code with both sbcl and ccl with debug declarations enabled (as in sbcl manual), ccl highlights the current sexp but sbcl doesnt 21:40:12 maxm-- [~user@openchat.com] has joined #lisp 21:40:32 nan, do you know how to trace a function in ccl? trace do not works vwry well 21:40:49 stardiviner [~stardivin@218.74.179.64] has joined #lisp 21:41:43 francisII: didn't play with ccl much, i am mostly using sbcl 21:41:50 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-238-224.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:41:57 wormphle1m [~wormphleg@c-24-6-156-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:41:58 rking [~rking@unaffiliated/rking] has joined #lisp 21:41:58 should be same i think 21:42:08 -!- strobegen [~strobegen@64.120.223.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:42:08 -!- maxm- [~user@unaffiliated/maxm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:42:08 -!- wormphlegm [~wormphleg@c-24-6-156-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:42:14 -!- srcerer [~chatzilla@dns2.klsairexpress.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:42:21 -!- srcerer_ is now known as srcerer 21:42:23 sure nan, what is for you the best free common lisp? 21:43:13 strz [~strobegen@64.120.223.138] has joined #lisp 21:43:16 -!- strz is now known as strobegen 21:43:27 -!- luis [~luis@nhop.r42.eu] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 21:43:27 francisII: sbcl looks great but i had some problems on Archlinux, since official arch packages buggy, you need to compile yourself 21:43:56 francisII: and ccl looks great too though i didn't play with it more than an hour 21:44:21 -!- talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:45:07 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:45:08 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:45:12 ah yes nan, sbcl look great so ccl. i tryed a lot of lisp but i have not sure yet 21:45:21 i usec allegro express too 21:45:25 used 21:45:26 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.213] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:45:43 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:45:43 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:45:44 do you know allegro express nan? 21:46:09 nan_`: works here. 21:46:10 weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has joined #lisp 21:46:21 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:46:22 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:46:32 francisII: i know about them but haven't used it 21:46:51 pkhuong: works here you mean it highlights sexp? 21:46:55 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:46:56 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:46:57 i found a nice ide, lispide, do you know? 21:47:20 francisII: i use emacs/slime 21:47:24 schoppenhauer: what do you mean by "package-wise" ? 21:47:31 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:47:32 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:47:39 nan_`: yes. 21:47:52 fe[nl]ix: [length1, data1] [length2, data2] ... 21:48:03 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:48:03 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:48:04 fe[nl]ix: that is, I have to split this stream 21:48:12 -!- NimeshNeema [uid2689@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lreekxadckeehuqg] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:48:34 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:48:35 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:48:37 i currently look at iolib. well, they have a pipe-syscall, but it seems not to be exported by default 21:48:41 ah yes, but i dont like. tell me nan, do you used scheme sometimes? 21:48:42 pkhuong: then it is probably update related 21:49:06 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:49:07 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:49:15 nan_`: nope. 21:49:41 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:49:41 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:49:43 francisII: i am quite new to lisp and only used CL so far 21:49:55 fe[nl]ix: and I thought it might be a good idea to provide gray streams for these substreams. 21:49:58 pkhuong: oh you are also on arch? 21:50:15 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:50:15 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:50:22 bolcselo [~x@pool-108-45-77-30.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:50:27 schoppenhauer: I'm its author, and pipe() is indeed exported. just make sure you use iolib HEAD 21:50:49 fe[nl]ix: hm. i use the thing that quicklisp installs. 21:50:50 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:50:50 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:50:58 fe[nl]ix: not the correct one? 21:51:06 ah yes nan. do you know the book "land of lisp", nana? 21:51:07 *drewc* is quite new to lisp as well ... was born 20 years after '58 after all :D 21:51:22 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:51:24 -!- techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 21:51:26 schoppenhauer: no, that's quite old 21:51:48 fe[nl]ix: ok. then I'll use a newer one. but then, is using pipes for this the right thing anyway? 21:51:49 nan_`: nope. It might be arch related. However, it's extremely unlikely that their messing around with our build script would cause source location to work for functions, but not source forms. 21:52:00 techlife [~jimmy@123.130.6.89] has joined #lisp 21:52:24 francisII: just glanced a bit, looks sweet 21:52:43 schoppenhauer: it depends on what you want to do with the data. how do you want to process it ? 21:52:58 sure nan, i am searchig something for graph theory 21:53:05 fe[nl]ix: read/write 21:53:21 do you know graphviz, nan? 21:53:30 pkhuong: well sbcl-git doesn't even compile right now and official sbcl again borked and doesn't give much debugging information, same problem i recently had 21:53:43 francisII: no idea, what is it? 21:54:01 nan_`: sbcl-git doesn't build? There's an issue on your end. 21:54:06 -!- milkpost [~dec@192.133.84.6] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:54:15 fe[nl]ix: but only inside one process, usually (well, maybe in multiple threads). not sure whether this is overkill. 21:54:22 a package for graph. i read on land of lisp how to use it 21:54:31 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:54:43 I don't know what you mean by official, but there has been no change to source locations in a while. 21:54:55 but i dont have used yed. first must find a good lisp system one time for all 21:54:55 pkhuong: sbcl-git i mean the AUR package sbcl-git 21:55:34 pierpa`` [~user@host7-213-dynamic.35-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 21:55:54 pkhuong: official is the package you get with pacman -S sbcl 21:56:22 Ah, so not the git, and not the official binary. I don't know what madness currently afflicts the arch people, if any. 21:56:30 fe[nl]ix: is the ubuntu-package libfixposix-dev ok to use? 21:56:54 anyway i use windows nan? what do you use? 21:57:02 francisII: sbcl and ccl great lisps IMO and you should really give emacs/slime a try :) 21:57:09 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:13 francisII: archlinux 21:57:50 pkhuong: i complained about it a month ago but no response 21:57:57 -!- pierpa` [~user@host244-218-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:57:57 -!- pierpa [~user@host244-218-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:58:05 you right nan, i have fedora but do not use it. i really must do a try to ccl and sbcl 21:58:15 schoppenhauer: no 21:58:22 meh 21:58:31 nan, with windows i am a little limited i guess 21:58:46 Do I remember rightly that someone else was working on an NES emulator in Lisp? 21:58:53 schoppenhauer: I've made my own up-to-date repository 21:59:00 fe[nl]ix: ok 21:59:13 fe[nl]ix: i will use the git-version 21:59:33 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 21:59:36 nyef: I saw the text before I saw your name, as was about to say 'nyef is working on such a thing' ... 21:59:57 nyef: redline6561. 22:00:11 Haven't actually worked on mine in years... 22:00:13 francisII: emacs is a platform itself so, if you use emacs on windows it should ease the pain 22:00:20 Ah, cool. How far along is it? 22:00:56 schoppenhauer: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.lisp.iolib.devel/422 22:00:59 ah yes nan, i must try this too. nan, what must do to answer win : 22:01:08 with 22:01:13 nyef: the 6502 works, and the graphic chips "need a little more work", but already enough for a garbled up Mario intro screen. 22:01:17 -!- weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.misaki.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:01:27 -!- Neptu_ is now known as Neptu 22:01:57 schoppenhauer: what Ubuntu version do you use ? 22:02:00 -!- mc40 [~mc40@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: mc40] 22:02:29 Hrm. What about controller input and audio? 22:02:29 fe[nl]ix: 12.04. but I will try to compile it myself first. 22:03:17 schoppenhauer: better use the repository 22:03:28 that way you'll get the updates too 22:04:27 antgreen [~green@209.118.250.254] has joined #lisp 22:07:20 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:07:23 nan what i must do to answer this way "nickname:" 22:08:34 nan_`: I feel it is sort of a pain to use Emacs in Windows 22:08:45 there are some encoding problems I never manage to solve 22:08:51 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 22:10:00 -!- macrobat [~fuzzyglee@h-8-92.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:10:03 nyef: hey there! 22:10:19 Denommus: it was years ago i tried emacs on windows but then i was a VC monkey so didn't use it much, i am clueless how well it works on windows now 22:10:39 nyef: my attention has been on other things for the last few weeks. the input is fairly close to being done, audio isn't started. 22:10:49 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 22:11:03 nyef: nrom mapper is done, mmc1 close to done, nametable mirroring just isn't finished. 22:11:18 So, sounds like some games might almost be playable? 22:11:18 *drewc* only used emacs on windows once ... in '98 .. it worked fine then, so 15 years later, it may work again! 22:11:37 nyef: once the input is hooked into the main loop and graphics bugs fixed, yes. 22:11:58 nyef: patches *very* welcome. especially from folks that know how to optimize such things. I'm learning as I go. :) http://github.com/redline6561/famiclom 22:12:01 Some games are playable even with graphics bugs, you know. d-: 22:12:12 it certainly works 22:12:26 it just doesn't work as smoothly as in Linux 22:12:40 haha. true. on the bright side, 6502 core (cl-6502), rom processing (romreader), and the ppu/input (famiclom) are 1600 lines of code total at the moment. rendering is pretty slow unfortunately. 22:12:41 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 22:14:02 Hrm... Is there a test suite in use for the 6502 core? 22:15:09 nyef: absolutely. see https://github.com/redline6561/cl-6502/blob/master/tests/opcodes.lisp 22:15:20 It's Klaus Dorfmann's test suite. 22:15:23 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 22:15:55 And some part of me is looking at your PPU implementation and going "oh, god, where's the bankswitching?" 22:16:31 Is this a per-scanline PPU implementation, less granular, or more granular? 22:17:00 (You need at least scanline granularity for SMB1 to work right, due to the way it implements the status bar at the top of the screen.) 22:17:20 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:17:36 Per-scanline. It's derived from pcwalton's sprocketnes implementation but I missed some things and haven't had the time to sit down and go through things. 22:17:50 -!- Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:18:12 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 22:18:50 ... Fixed mirroring? (it's either H or V the way you have it, and I'm rusty enough with this that I forget which.) 22:20:15 nyef: I think it's H and SMB needs V mirroring. Hence some of the glitches. 22:20:17 Ouch, your scrolling / address stuff is clearly wrong. 22:20:40 Yeah, I need a weekend to just sit down with the NES dev docs and get the system in my head. 22:21:23 This is my first time dealing with issues this low-level. I have a handle on the 6502 but the PPU I'm still getting my head around, clearly. 22:21:53 I'd offer up the DarcNES sources for perusal, but I have no idea if they're still available online. 22:22:09 pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has joined #lisp 22:22:11 I've been peeking at TENES by ahefner now and then along with sprocketnes as mentioned. 22:22:24 arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has joined #lisp 22:22:30 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:22:41 I wonder if I have the NETH sources anywhere to hand? I don't remember how far I got with it. 22:23:07 rme [~rme@50.43.190.179] has joined #lisp 22:23:27 What was NETH? 22:23:33 -!- erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: erikc] 22:23:59 NETH was my attempt at writing an NES emulator in Lisp, several years ago. 22:24:08 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-187-74.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:24:14 As I said, most of the bugs are because my conceptual model for the PPU isn't there so I ought to just stare at docs for a while. 22:24:19 nyef: oh neat. how far did you get? :) 22:24:27 As I said, I forget. 22:24:38 Nowhere near as far as I did with DarcNES, but that was in C and assembler. 22:24:56 Sure. 22:26:29 In fact, NETH was about my second or third project in CL, certainly my second emulator in CL, and the CPU core design was rather cringe-worthy in retrospect. 22:26:53 Ooh. Found a neth.tgz tarball. 22:27:10 nyef: I seem to remember that in detail ... it may have been around my first lisp project for that matter 22:27:22 what was your first project drewc? 22:28:03 And my PPU implementation is substantially complete, except for the little bit with the actual rendering logic. 22:28:12 All of the control logic exists, though. 22:28:20 redline6561: Still working on it now! a web based database frontend application. 22:28:29 -!- adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:28:33 Any chance you could post it publicly? :) 22:28:56 redline6561: http://www.lisphacker.com/temp/neth.tgz 22:29:02 drewc: common-lisp.net by chance? 22:29:08 (Provided that drewc hasn't killed my hosting or anything...) 22:29:17 dan64 [dan64@dannyadam.com] has joined #lisp 22:29:22 Got it. Thanks. 22:29:44 redline6561: nope, not at all. did not even use cl-net 'til I owned it tbh 22:30:43 nyef: not on purpose! I may have though... but having not heard about it from you, likely did not. 22:32:26 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:34:46 dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has joined #lisp 22:36:36 If homework counts as a "first project" I think mine was an A* search for a highschool AI class 22:38:41 Nah, more for self-directed projects. My first actually successful lisp project was, itself, an emulator. Well, a disassembler which spawned a CPU core and then needed some I/O devices, but that's how things go sometimes. (-: 22:39:16 -!- sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:40:17 Highschool? I programmed in Turing, Pascal and C ... did not discover lisp 'til many years after I dropped out :) 22:40:24 nyef: i'll take a look at that tarball if you don't mind (already downloaded) 22:40:33 oh! and BASIC for my PET 22:40:36 nan_`: Feel free. 22:40:44 nyef: *cheers 22:40:48 drewc: it was an AI class and so it "had" to be in lisp 22:42:01 though all they taught us for lisp was a 1 page tutorial plus a link to the hyperspec 22:42:18 jasom: there were no AI classes at my high school ... not very many computer-based courses either . I did have to do AI, but only because I wanted to and did the course outline on the first day ... and it was a C ... ugh. 22:43:46 and part of the 1 page tutorial was GET which I haven't used since 22:44:52 jasom: heh ... when was the hyperspec out ... '94 or so? Regardless, 92-96 was my high-school time, so likely was not known by the teachers ... 22:45:02 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:45:18 Though I remember LISP on .. was it Xenix? 22:46:28 *drewc* actually got a contract from one of his computer teachers in '95 ... CGI application for UofT ... my first real contract! :) 22:46:32 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-230-173-174.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:46:49 -!- ASau [~user@p4FF9673F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:48:17 Bike [~Glossina@67-5-215-119.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:48:44 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:49:51 Wow, it's been twelve years and eight days since the last release of DarcNES. 22:50:20 bye friends 22:50:24 -!- francisII [4f0c5c6f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.12.92.111] has left #lisp 22:50:42 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 22:50:50 Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has joined #lisp 22:51:41 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:54:31 -!- arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:57:47 -!- pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 22:58:14 nyef: Time for another release, obviously. Can't just let the software die! ;) 22:59:59 mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 23:00:35 Given that I accidentally deleted the source control repository shortly after that release? Yes. Yes, I can. 23:03:27 impulse [~impulse@bas3-toronto48-1176314458.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 23:04:08 arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has joined #lisp 23:07:10 drewc: this would have been '98 23:07:17 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:07:22 *jasom* is young 23:08:04 hehe 23:09:21 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 23:09:45 KDr2 [~KDr2@123.122.99.143] has joined #lisp 23:09:46 -!- arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:10:04 then at some point in college I mentioned to my dad I was using lisp for some stuff and he said "What a coincidence, I've been working through PAIP" 23:10:31 one of these day's I'll be a step ahead of my him and will be astonished 23:12:20 -!- tekai [~tekai@f054126127.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: zZZ] 23:12:27 syrinx [~quassel@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 23:12:36 arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has joined #lisp 23:13:02 zophy [ceb02321@gateway/web/freenode/ip.206.176.35.33] has joined #lisp 23:13:50 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abon37.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 23:14:20 greetings fellow lispers 23:14:24 this is a java script snippet --> $( "#dialog" ).dialog(); how do i write this in parenscript ? 23:14:46 Okay, time for me to get out of here. 23:14:48 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-76-119-183-159.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: G'night all.] 23:15:23 zophy: $ is a function, so however you call a function in javascript... 23:16:49 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-93.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:16:59 -!- leo2007 [~leo@111.161.47.175] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:17:27 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: no future] 23:17:54 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:18:16 -!- Corvidium [~cosman246@24.56.241.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:18:19 *jasom* has never used parenscript but would guess it's something like (funcall (@ ($ "dialog) dialog)) 23:18:26 -!- KDr2 [~KDr2@123.122.99.143] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:18:41 except I dropped a quote and a # signe 23:18:48 -!- arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18:55 maybe (funcall (@ ($ "#dialog") dialog))? 23:18:58 arrdem [~user@resnet-46-203.dorm.utexas.edu] has joined #lisp 23:19:42 nialo` [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 23:19:44 yours_truly [~yours@mc-191-248.IPReg.mcmaster.ca] has joined #lisp 23:20:08 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:20:24 -!- yours_truly [~yours@mc-191-248.IPReg.mcmaster.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:21:01 Corvidium [~cosman246@24.56.241.224] has joined #lisp 23:21:02 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 23:22:18 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:23:19 sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 23:23:22 rvirding [uid5943@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nhvawirsaaukxfof] has joined #lisp 23:23:33 zophy: I think what I pasted works, and I know this one does (I checked it): (funcall (ps:getprop ($ "#dialog") 'dialog)) 23:24:18 -!- breakds [~breakds@wifi-116.cs.wisc.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:24:29 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 23:24:33 _8david [~user@port-212-202-134-139.static.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 23:25:02 zophy: though now reading the reference, the chian method might be better: (ps:chain ($ "#dialog") (dialog)) 23:25:35 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:26:08 -!- _8david` [~user@port-212-202-134-139.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:27:28 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 23:27:32 jasom: yes, i just found that also 23:28:47 parenscript actually looks reasonably nice; this is the first time I've looked at it before 23:29:00 I hardly ever do any js coding so never really needed to 23:29:58 NeverMined [~never@adsl-69-209-232-120.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 23:30:02 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:31:20 jasom: ah '98 .. still my favorite year ever ... that is when 15 Polson Street in Toronto (G2Net) started a proper underground house music warehouse party scene... good times were had indeed :) 23:32:42 house, house music 23:33:33 NeverMined: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8HASH8BtLE :) 23:33:45 merci 23:34:43 -!- bitonic [~user@176.27.227.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:34:56 and if you are like me, play this at the same time, 'cause it is accapella :D 23:34:59 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO9KEKnnlKs 23:35:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:35:18 (sorry #lisp about being offtopic, will stop now) 23:36:15 -!- CampinSam [~user@24-176-103-21.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:36:28 the original core to the lisp community has some similarities to the house music core 23:37:24 frankie knuckles and some of those guys spin at one of the bars(clubs) i go to lately again 23:37:49 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 23:38:57 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-31-79.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:39:03 omg, really!!? I have not seen him spin in like 10 years ... since I moved away from Toronto. The west coast scene has not been great until recently. 23:39:27 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 23:40:06 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:40:18 some friends used to go to the warehouse--but it was before my time. they re-opened a warehouse II at one point, but that didn't last long 23:40:29 But when I say "I prefer Garage to House", housers will know exactly what I am talking about .. like "SBCL over CLISP" for lispers :D 23:41:46 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 23:41:57 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 23:42:25 -!- Denommus [~user@201.75.85.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:42:35 -!- sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:42:37 alternative communities sometimes have room for a spectrum of individuals. there's also the fact that some of the early lisp guys also had interest in sythesizing, sampling, processing music 23:43:12 jasom: from '98 IIRC : "Cevin Fisher - The way we do it" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR1dmPV7D5g 23:43:18 -!- mc40 [~mc@host86-148-31-142.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: mc40] 23:43:19 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 23:43:46 *drewc* is still off topic, but we got to keep this thing going, like the way we used to do it ... 23:44:48 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Client Quit] 23:45:05 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 23:45:20 -!- zophy [ceb02321@gateway/web/freenode/ip.206.176.35.33] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:45:23 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:46:00 jack is the one who built lisp machines ;) 23:46:30 pierpa``` [~user@host169-215-dynamic.46-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 23:46:40 NeverMined: very true. That is certainly was has made the broad spectrum of lisp communities very interesting to be involved with... the 'unique' individuals that have interests related to mine 23:46:44 -!- cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:47:18 cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has joined #lisp 23:48:22 -!- pierpa`` [~user@host7-213-dynamic.35-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:48:28 *drewc* used is/was/has because he did not check what he was typing since he was groovin to tunes ... and no compiler to error. 23:48:29 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.190.179] has quit [Quit: rme] 23:49:26 sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 23:49:40 NimeshNeema [uid2689@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hrvjqkaemqwcaaib] has joined #lisp 23:50:40 house is still fairly active here..given nights at given clubs, in chicago. or some songs thrown in now and then or djs switching in, changing the venue from grunge or whatever, to house 23:50:44 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.98.218] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:51:38 -!- Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:53:00 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:54:19 when lisp had quite a critical creative mass, unfortunately boston-area's club scene hadn't caught on to that element of house and tech music (even if nyc down the coast had)--and they weren't into that seattle thing then either like kurt cobain--whose producer was actually from the midwest 23:56:00 -!- pierpa``` [~user@host169-215-dynamic.46-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:56:15 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-7-81.prtc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:56:33 knob [~knob@66-50-7-81.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 23:57:13 the cities wind up with creative pockets sometimes that don't always cross-fertilise into the other realms. some of the geek musicians would play at university events and some were even known around the country/world within those circles, but didn't perform in the local clubs 23:57:52 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-173-79.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 23:58:26 Well, I live just off the West Coast of Canada now, which really has not had a 'great' house scene until recently ... but last year it started to really pick up ... and two days before new years eve, a DJ said this is the best spot in the world for his scene atm. So things are looking up, and so underground scene has always existed. 23:59:01 from krunk (or dub or d&b) i meant before, rather than from 'grunge', to house. they'll interleave djs at the clubs sometimes 23:59:09 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 23:59:32 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:59:58 Kruppe [~user@CPE602ad0938e9a-CM602ad0938e97.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp