00:00:51 something to do with the .. 00:02:47 defsystem iolib.base has :pathname "base/" but the .asd is not in there 00:03:01 works for me 00:03:21 and the read-file-form should compute the pathname to read from the pathname of the .asd file 00:03:24 that's why I'm basing off the component-pathname. 00:03:38 why not the pathname of the component? 00:03:45 -!- duko [~duko@cpe-76-174-26-24.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:04:09 because I'm putting a relative pathname in a file and I expect it to be computed relative to the file itself 00:04:30 but sure I can do the component-pathname of the component-system if you think it's less confusing 00:04:38 ok 00:04:39 -!- zacts [~user@unaffiliated/lcc] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:05:21 did you figure the class-for-type issue? Can you introspect at the REPL? 00:05:30 I'd like to know if those two symbols are EQ 00:05:57 yes, I figured it out, it was my mistake 00:06:06 jynnantonix [~textual@140.247.0.103] has joined #lisp 00:06:26 I eliminated iolib-source-file from the inheritance list of iolib-grovel-file without replacing it with asdf:cl-source-file 00:06:36 and the result was no longer subtype of asdf:component 00:06:45 so class-for-type ignored it 00:07:19 oh, ok. 00:07:38 there is still way too much fishiness in define-package 00:09:53 Wow, ECL has the ,@,@ bug too. 00:10:00 fe[nl]ix, what do you think of (d:asdf-debug) ? 00:10:19 lmj: my first implementation of `, had the ,@ ,@ bug 00:10:33 unless it ran in pessimized mode 00:10:37 What's the ,@,@ bug? 00:10:48 ``(foo ,@,@nil) is one case 00:10:49 not handling ,@,@ properly 00:11:34 my current implementation of ` is just an adaptation of the common ones around there -- just with guaranteed pattern matching abilities. 00:11:44 It should read an expression that rethrns (foo) right? 00:12:08 pjb: right, CCL and ECL evaluate to (LIST* 'FOO) => FOO 00:12:09 It seems they all do that: Clozure Common Lisp --> (LIST* 'FOO) CLISP --> (CONS 'FOO (APPEND)) CMU Common Lisp --> `(FOO) ECL --> (LIST* 'FOO) SBCL --> `(FOO) 00:12:30 Would someone have a few minutes to explain to me what a "place" as an argument to GET-SETF-EXPANSION? Eg: (get-setf-expansion '(setf (values a b))) doesn't work and but (let (a b) (setf (values a b) (values 1 2)) (list a b)) does and so (setf (values a b)) should be a "place". 00:12:32 sbcl is correct 00:12:52 pjb: (list* 'foo) is foo 00:12:58 drmeister: (values a b) is a place. 00:13:43 Bike: Oh, thanks. 00:13:47 drmeister: try (get-setf-expansion '(values a b)) instead 00:14:09 (list* 'foo) => foo 00:14:17 Bike: That's the ticket. 00:14:18 that's a bug. 00:14:24 list* should return a list 00:14:30 pjb: eh, no it doesn't, check the spec 00:14:50 (list* 1) => 1 00:15:02 Right. 00:15:08 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:15:09 Since it's the last argument :-) 00:15:13 fe[nl]ix, pushed. 00:15:15 Argh: Compiled code is generating a different (and wrong) result from interpreted code. 00:15:29 pjb: I never run out of arguments. 00:15:30 So indeed, there are a few bugs. 00:15:52 Fare: I'm not sure what to think, I don't know what that is 00:15:54 Fare: http://paste.lisp.org/+2VVG 00:16:04 It's the oldest bug report on CCL trac, 6 years. Probably older. Marked minor. 00:16:14 :-) 00:16:21 pjb: btw, my "solution" for Clisp so far has been more or less the delete-package you suggested, with some guards, and the fact that you can't just delete a package that's being used. 00:16:22 drmeister: eh? 00:17:06 fe[nl]ix, I just renamed resume to run-resumed-program and do-resume to resume-image 00:17:12 makes more sense to me. 00:17:18 Fare: Yep, one may need a recursive delete package :-) 00:17:19 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:17:35 Bike: I'm working on my compiler - it has a bug. Compiled (get-setf-expansion '(values a b)) returns # 00:17:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:17:54 drmeister, what are your input and output languages? 00:18:09 why yet another CL compiler? 00:18:10 Fare: (component-pathname (component-system ret)) doesn't work either, that still contains whatever is specified as :pathname inside the defsystem 00:18:27 is that bad? 00:18:30 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-255-105.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:18:49 Fare: No good reason. 00:18:50 what seems to work is (slot-value ret 'asdf/system::source-file) 00:19:31 nah. 00:19:38 What about system-source-directory? 00:19:40 Fare: Its a Common Lisp compiler written in Common Lisp and C++ and it generates LLVM-IR. 00:20:20 Fare: I wanted a compiler that I understood and could interface smoothly with C++ libraries. 00:20:44 If nobody knows of a project in quicklisp that simultaneously defines a WITH-FOO macro and a CALL-WITH-FOO function, then I'll submit my implementation. 00:20:44 drmeister, there was a cool presentation at last ILC on how to generate C++ code that fits the lisp style, and have the C++ templates automatically optimize the common cases where static type information is present. 00:21:17 Fare: Is it online? 00:21:19 A one-macro project. 00:21:29 lmj: what was that LOL book already? Let Over Lambda 00:21:50 drmeister, go look at the pages for the latest ILC 00:21:54 Fare: that works :) 00:22:02 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 00:22:40 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:23:01 Fare: Was it Scheme to C++ simple translator? 00:23:44 yup 00:23:48 iirc 00:24:19 zmisc [ad78e2ad@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has joined #lisp 00:24:47 worstadmin [~worst@174.141.213.0] has joined #lisp 00:24:51 I remember people giggling during that presentation :) 00:25:03 it was kind of fun, considering it's C++ 00:25:15 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:27:59 -!- LiamH [~none@96.231.220.53] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:29:41 If someone has suggestions about the syntax for defining WITH-FOO and CALL-WITH-FOO I'd appreciate hearing them. My implementation designates variables with :vars. There may be something better. (https://gist.github.com/4526900) 00:29:44 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:30:02 segmond__ [~segmond@99.102.150.23] has joined #lisp 00:30:48 miql_ [~miql@ip98-165-235-27.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 00:33:30 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:33:35 -!- segmond_ [~segmond@adsl-99-103-188-204.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:34:03 lmj`: syntax? DEFMACRO and DEFUN/DEFGENERIC/DEFMETHOD is a lot easier to understand and use then your DEFWITH, so ... first I need to know what the point of DEFWITH is, and why a whole language/syntax is required. 00:35:47 (defun call-with-foo (fn) ...) (defmacro with-foo (&body body) `(call-with-foo (lambda () ,@body))) <--- syntax I know and <3 :) 00:36:08 -!- milosn [~milosn@user-5AF50394.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:36:37 drewc: the purpose becomes more apparent after frequent use. I have 10 defwith's in just one file. When I change it to 20 defuns and defmacros, I like it less. 00:36:59 milosn [~milosn@user-5AF50394.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #lisp 00:37:26 Also, when defwith is not available, the urge to skip writing call-with-foo is great, especially for simple things. 00:37:43 An argument could be made on stack traces alone. 00:38:30 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:38:51 well, why do you have so many? 00:39:06 -!- Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:39:08 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 00:39:32 Fare: still here ? 00:39:39 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-255-105.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 00:39:45 -!- drewc [~drewc@50.7.166.100] has left #lisp 00:39:52 -!- MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-173-67-109-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 00:39:58 drewc [~drewc@50.7.166.100] has joined #lisp 00:40:53 drewc: why shouldn't I? 00:41:38 the 10 I mentioned are in a test suite; lots of setting up / tearing down. 00:43:14 well, that seems like a lot of WITHs and CALL-WITHs ... but not enough to design a new language around ... so at this point, I will shut the fubar up, because I have no good answer without a decent understanding. 00:43:36 drmeister: interfacing smoothly with C++ is something that will be similarly hard whether you use LLVM or SBCL :) 00:43:40 *p_l* looked into it 00:43:45 fe[nl]ix, kind of 00:43:50 I stopped when faced with exceptions 00:44:50 at some point, you figure out that the big problems are semantic discrepancies 00:45:03 p_l: I've got exception handling working. 00:45:40 Fare: something's wrong with call-with-muffled-uninteresting-conditions 00:45:45 drmeister: for which compiler, and have you tested what happens when you end up with two libs compiled with different ones? ;D 00:45:58 because sb-int:package-at-variance is in the list, but it doesn't get ignored 00:46:21 -!- jynnantonix [~textual@140.247.0.103] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 00:46:27 ... ooops, way to late, I have to wake up early 00:46:28 cya 00:46:51 Fare: OTOH, (handler-bind ((sb-int:package-at-variance #'muffle-warning)) (asdf:load-system :iolib.base)) works 00:47:03 p_l: I haven't tested it extensively but it looks like it should work. I use the C++ personality function and throw C++ exceptions and store boxed common lisp objects within them. 00:48:32 -!- zmisc [ad78e2ad@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has quit [Quit: Switching to a native IRC client] 00:50:58 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@78.96.108.212] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:53:32 zmisc [zmisc@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has joined #lisp 00:54:13 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 00:55:08 djuber [~user@c-76-16-60-176.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:55:17 -!- zmisc [zmisc@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has quit [Client Quit] 00:58:44 -!- segmond__ is now known as segmond 01:00:09 (let ((*uninteresting-compiler-conditions* '(sb-int:package-at-variance))) ...) doesn't ? 01:00:29 ebobby [~fms@189.170.27.127] has joined #lisp 01:02:17 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:02:30 zmisc [zmisc@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has joined #lisp 01:05:02 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.89.5] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:08:09 aha, interesting 01:08:43 ASau` [~user@46.115.57.80] has joined #lisp 01:08:50 Fare: if I specify :around-compile, the compilation seems to take another path where with-controlled-compiler-conditions isn't used 01:09:03 if I remove it, all goes well 01:09:32 does that mean I should explicitly use with-controlled-compiler-conditions in my :around-compile ? 01:11:24 no, even if I put with-controlled-compiler-conditions in the compilation hook, I still get the warning 01:11:58 -!- ASau [~user@46.115.44.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:14:39 uh oh 01:14:57 that's weird 01:15:09 yes, very 01:16:05 in perform-lisp-compilation, the with- is inside the around-compile thunk 01:16:23 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:16:37 what warning do you get? the package-at-variance? 01:16:50 can you trace match-condition-p ? 01:17:19 how are you trying to bind the conditions? 01:17:35 we've been using (variants of) that code for years at ITA / google 01:18:54 match-condition-p never gets called 01:19:13 especially since sb-int:package-at-variance is already in the default list 01:19:54 -!- bitonic [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:20:40 trace uninteresting-condition-p ? 01:22:22 note that there are two variants in actual use in asdf, with-controlled-compiler-conditions and with-controlled-loader-conditions 01:22:55 -!- guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:23:36 carl_the_doorman [~carl_the_@24.111.9.10] has joined #lisp 01:23:39 2: (ASDF/LISP-BUILD:MATCH-ANY-CONDITION-P # NIL) 01:23:39 2: ASDF/LISP-BUILD:MATCH-ANY-CONDITION-P returned NIL 01:24:19 somehow *uninteresting-conditions* is NIL there 01:24:54 it's globally NIL 01:25:32 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:26:06 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:28:32 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 01:29:15 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:29:36 Yuuhi`` [benni@p5483A4F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 01:30:09 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-130-197.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:30:14 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:30:48 -!- Bike is now known as Bicyclidine 01:31:27 regarding the load-source-op thing, I see it's a bad mix of old and new methods 01:31:46 -!- Yuuhi` [benni@p5483926B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:32:06 Guthur [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 01:32:44 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 01:32:52 which is disconcerting. 01:33:07 see comparing to NIL ? 01:33:11 what are you binding? 01:33:27 are you binding lisp-build:*uninteresting-compiler-conditions* ? 01:33:32 no 01:33:58 oh, I must bind it 01:34:18 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 01:34:21 oops :( 01:36:50 -!- Sean-Der [~sean@NW1-DSL-74-215-64-154.fuse.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.9.2] 01:41:15 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 01:42:17 what did you think you'd do with it? 01:42:22 You can set it, too 01:42:57 Fare: I changed the around-compiler wrapper to bind asdf/lisp-build:*uninteresting-conditions* but it's still NIL 01:45:50 -!- pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:46:55 pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has joined #lisp 01:50:44 Fare: http://paste.lisp.org/+2VVH 01:50:50 -!- lmj` [~lmj`@c-71-234-73-232.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 01:51:42 Fare: even though I have http://paste.lisp.org/+2VVH/1 01:51:50 kanru [~kanru@111-249-140-105.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 01:53:41 I was vastly overreporting fishiness on all imports 01:55:01 so were you satisfied with (system-source-directory (component-system c)) ? 01:55:43 NO NO NO 01:55:53 don't bind *uninteresting-conditions* 01:56:02 please bind *uninteresting-compiler-conditions* 01:56:09 and *uninteresting-loader-conditions* 01:56:16 (normalize-version version (system-source-directory ret)) works fine 01:56:22 (which is appended to the former) 01:56:24 ok 01:57:51 Fare: still doesn't work, see the trace in the first paste 01:58:56 s,asdf/lisp-build:*uninteresting-conditions*,asdf/lisp-build:*uninteresting-compiler-conditions*, 01:59:38 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:59:38 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 02:01:22 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 02:05:11 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.212.202.30] has joined #lisp 02:05:34 Fare: doesn't work 02:06:17 the only thing I can make work is the handler-bind in perform 02:10:11 which perform? 02:10:23 all of them 02:10:39 compile-op, load-op and load-source-op 02:13:33 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:13:37 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:17:29 I don't know what you're doing wrong 02:17:32 or me 02:17:40 will have to think about it next week 02:18:00 right now I see how there is excessive fishiness, even after filtering obvious non-fishy stuff 02:19:21 I've lost all of my custom elisp extensions I've wrote for emacs :/ 02:19:25 Suckage :( 02:20:40 -!- Guest54088 is now known as asciilifeform 02:21:25 will teach you about backups 02:21:26 -!- worstadmin [~worst@174.141.213.0] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:21:48 I backed most of my stuff, backup integrity is my problem 02:22:08 the backup medium seems to have degraded quite rapidly 02:22:23 i backup to github 02:22:30 good call 02:22:35 keep multiple backups! 02:22:53 should have been running rsync on my vps 02:22:56 Does anyone here use ECL? 02:23:29 drmeister: why do you ask? 02:24:10 I'm trying to figure out a few things about its build process. 02:24:20 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:25:20 Maybe 'use' isn't what I'm looking for - more like 'develops with'. 02:25:40 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:25:52 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:25:54 you won't get far with finding the right qualifications, just ask your question 02:26:40 drmeister: i want to use ECL build stumpwm, but failed and i have to use clisp now 02:27:17 I'm building ECL to figure out what order it loads lisp source files when it builds itself. 02:27:34 sw2wolf: What is stumpwm? 02:27:58 a window manager. I don't think it works with ECL's CLX, or something. 02:27:59 LiamH [~none@96.231.220.53] has joined #lisp 02:28:13 I've found what looks like the load order but it appears to be missing a lot of files. 02:29:50 I'm downloading a fresh install - maybe I messed it up. 02:30:20 fe[nl]ix, ok, next iteration 02:30:42 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:30:43 stassats, if/when you retry, I'm interested in your asdf/package::*record-fishy-package-changes* 02:31:02 but I believe I can already understand that I'm doing too much frobbing in certain cases 02:31:54 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:32:18 it should be OK to import a few extra symbols if they are part of a recycled package. 02:33:13 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:33:57 drmeister: just leave for a while. stumpwm is a window manager deveoped using CL. Even if it declares supporting ECL, ECL cannot run stumpwm 02:34:23 sw2wolf: Thanks - I'm new here. 02:36:49 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 02:38:45 z1pher [~yaaic@184.151.127.147] has joined #lisp 02:44:34 whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.46.92] has joined #lisp 02:46:21 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 02:46:44 -!- sirdancealot1 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:50:24 -!- z1pher [~yaaic@184.151.127.147] has quit [Quit: Yaaic - Yet another Android IRC client - http://www.yaaic.org] 02:50:47 -!- whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.46.92] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:51:51 I backup to rsync.net, and my server, and my usb stick, and my rasberry PI ... all unison'd together where needed. Something about water vapour forming something ... 02:52:39 and i was scrolled up, so that was directed towards zmisc ... 02:52:41 -!- carl_the_doorman [~carl_the_@24.111.9.10] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:52:45 my bad 02:54:20 loading asdf caused oom killer to wake up 02:56:25 Fare: http://paste.lisp.org/display/134610#1 02:59:45 sirdancealot1 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 03:00:37 -!- werwerwer [~1@158.181.220.211] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:02:58 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:04:38 stassats: that's clean -- it means you loaded all these packages and there was no fishiness 03:04:47 Here's what's confusing the heck out of me with ECL. It compiles the file "assert.lsp" before it compiles "clos/conditions.lsp". "assert.lsp" uses the RESTART-CASE macro which is defined in "clos/conditions.lsp". 03:04:56 tps_ [~tps_@hoasb-50dd08-36.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 03:05:37 drmeister, what is this being compiled in? 03:05:38 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 03:05:57 it could be using a bootstrap CL. 03:06:10 Bicyclidine: This is when ECL is bootstrapping. 03:06:34 Bicyclidine: I'm trying to bootstrap my own compiler and I'm using the ECL Common Lisp source code. 03:07:25 drmeister: well, does it actually use restart-case, or just have it in an expansion or something? 03:08:00 also, I just renamed the symbols to *package-fishiness* and *all-package-fishiness* 03:08:18 drmeister, are you hacking ECL? 03:08:56 drmeister, yay for circular dependencies. 03:09:04 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:09:05 Bicyclidine: It appears to be using restart-case in several functions. I can't compile "assert.lsp" because I don't have a restart-case macro defined yet in my boostrap sequence. 03:09:19 It was actually nice to break up ASDF and see there were no such circularities, modulo a few hooks. 03:09:20 hm, weird. 03:09:43 drmeister, put it in a separate file 03:09:50 Fare: I've "borrowed" the ECL lisp code and I'm hacking it and compiling it on my C++ kernel. 03:10:42 what is your general strategy? 03:13:09 old school lisps tend to have circular/leaky bootstrapping processes. It may well be using the host's macro definition while building itself. 03:13:19 (under the assumption that it's self-hosted) 03:13:27 Fare: Just that. Steal ECL Common Lisp Code (I'm keeping headers and GPL - don't worry). Hack the cr*p out of it and get it to run on my kernel. 03:14:39 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:14:58 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:15:10 segmond_ [~segmond@adsl-108-73-162-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 03:16:14 I've compiled about a dozen ECL source files in addition to my compiler and I'm running into what appear to be cyclic dependencies. 03:18:47 -!- segmond [~segmond@99.102.150.23] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:18:56 -!- two- [~1@67.171.131.23] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 03:19:26 stassats, if/when you get your image in a state where packages are messed up, please try to send me the values of those variables. Thanks! 03:19:41 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:19:57 drmeister, I mean how does the code you generate differ? what strategy do you use? 03:19:58 how about now? 03:20:14 (eq 'asdf/component::relative-pathname 'asdf/interface::relative-pathname) is still nil 03:20:20 still? 03:20:23 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 03:20:25 pkhuong: That's probably what's going on. (sigh) 03:20:39 it never was T 03:21:12 Fare: I'm using LLVM as the backend to generate native code. 03:21:19 adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:21:24 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:21:30 Fare: Is that what you are referring to? 03:21:57 sure, but do you use interesting code analyzes or data representations or execution models? 03:22:24 stassats, where does that matter? 03:22:25 Fare: Just what LLVM gives me. 03:22:52 Fare: anything that tries to use asdf::relative-pathname 03:22:58 as a slot name 03:23:07 people shouldn't use slot names 03:23:11 but ok, I'll export that 03:23:13 because asdf::relative-pathname => 'asdf/interface::relative-pathname 03:23:25 and 'asdf/component::relative-pathname is the slot 03:23:30 Fare: you tell me 03:24:09 any other slot names you care about? 03:24:22 -!- pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 03:24:26 (pushed the export of this one and others from component) 03:24:30 i care about none of them 03:24:38 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:24:46 so why is it a bug? 03:24:52 is there code in the wild that cares? 03:24:54 because somebody else is using them 03:25:09 pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has joined #lisp 03:25:40 ok 03:26:10 I probably should export from the various subpackages of asdf each and every surviving symbol that was once in ASDF. 03:26:27 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 03:26:32 please tell me how things work for you at this point 03:26:50 -!- galdor [galdor@78.193.58.122] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 03:27:04 so, now i can't load asdf.lisp because of the stock sbcl asdf 03:27:20 galdor [galdor@78.193.58.122] has joined #lisp 03:27:47 uh? I load my asdf without trouble on top of the stock sbcl asdf.... 03:27:59 s/can't load/can't use/ 03:28:35 when i use (require 'sb-bsd-sockets) it complaints about package conflicts 03:29:44 -!- pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:30:52 (require 'sb-bsd-sockets) tries to load stock asdf 03:31:09 i load the latest asdf.lisp into a bare sbcl 03:31:14 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:31:58 pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has joined #lisp 03:31:59 -!- adelgado1 [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:32:36 so, asdf tries to upgrade itself 03:32:51 i see ASDF/UPGRADE:UPGRADE-ASDF in the backtrace 03:34:00 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:34:07 i can solve that by moving contrib/asdf away... 03:35:31 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:35:32 yes, asdf always tries to upgrade itself first, because afterwards it's too late. 03:36:13 which contrib/asdf is that? 03:36:18 sbcl/contrib/asdf 03:36:41 if there's an asdf in your source registry, it must be the one your want to use, more recent that the one in your implementation 03:36:43 this upgradibility caused me more problems than it solved... 03:36:45 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:36:46 -!- sw2wolf is now known as sw2wolf{away} 03:37:12 the asdf in sbcl shouldn't be a problem: there's no .asd with it. 03:37:26 so it shouldn't try to load *that* (which would be a big fail) 03:37:30 there is 03:37:43 there is an asdf.asd in there? 03:37:47 yep 03:37:48 -!- seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:38:06 I strongly recommend against that in implementations --- that's a big no no 03:38:19 the .asd is not in git 03:39:02 maybe the source-registry should allow for blacklists? 03:39:18 ok, it's pulled by the ./pull-asdf.sh file 03:39:24 stassats, that might be an artefact of some process to keep the official asdf in synch with the one in sbcl 03:39:43 oh well, then you need a more recent asdf somewhere in your source-registry 03:39:48 sawgij [~sawjig@gateway/tor-sasl/sawjig] has joined #lisp 03:40:06 well, since the latest asdf appears to be working, i can go back to using the good old asdf again 03:40:10 and/or the pull-asdf.sh should remove or rename the .asd files after its job is done 03:40:21 thanks a LOT for your support. 03:40:37 -!- pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:40:46 Gooder` [~user@218.69.12.194] has joined #lisp 03:41:22 And I'll go back to making sure that asdf works with all the code in quicklisp, via cl-test-grid 03:43:26 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:43:54 before anyone uses the API, vote for name: 03:43:59 resume image? 03:44:02 restore image? 03:44:06 restart image? 03:44:10 resurrect core? 03:44:23 reincarnate dump? 03:44:25 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:44:27 rise-from-your-grave 03:44:31 seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:44:48 -!- kanru [~kanru@111-249-140-105.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.50.1] 03:45:53 pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has joined #lisp 03:48:15 two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:48:27 Fare: explain what it does exactly... all those names say something different to me :) 03:50:30 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:50:39 if I have a two dimensional array, is there a way I can access a "row" like a vector or a one dimensional array? 03:50:45 Well, it's a hook on which to push functions that must be run every time your image is restarted 03:51:01 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:07 e.g. consulting TMPDIR so setup *temporary-directory* 03:51:17 ebobby: there's row-major-aref 03:51:21 -!- pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:51:29 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:34 and displaced vectors. 03:58:03 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 04:04:24 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:04:28 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 04:05:40 Fare: startup function hook? 04:05:45 -!- forrest__ [~forrest@rrcs-64-183-255-247.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: forrest__] 04:06:33 *drewc* thinks that name names what it does :) 04:06:50 gnul0ver [~jonrugel@fsf/member/gnul0ver] has joined #lisp 04:08:22 or, something involving startup ... it is not a restore/resurrect etc because it does do the shutdown thing at all, it is for starting ... unless I am mistaken of course, in which case my name makes no sense at all. 04:09:59 pjb` [~t@AMontsouris-651-1-228-221.w86-212.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 04:11:57 pjb-v [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has joined #lisp 04:12:22 -!- pjb [~t@AMontsouris-651-1-2-62.w90-46.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:14:25 -!- Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:14:53 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 04:17:34 caoliver [~chatzilla@24-236-215-112.dhcp.trcy.mi.charter.com] has joined #lisp 04:17:52 -!- LiamH [~none@96.231.220.53] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:18:18 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-255-105.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 04:18:29 svs_ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has joined #lisp 04:24:40 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:26:48 tcr 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[~AlbireoX@76.78.130.225] has joined #lisp 05:04:28 -!- Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 05:05:29 -!- stopbit [~stopbit@c-68-50-168-116.hsd1.dc.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:06:22 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.88.205] has joined #lisp 05:11:21 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 05:11:23 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 05:12:06 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 05:17:34 -!- zmisc [zmisc@pdpc/supporter/student/zmisc] has left #lisp 05:23:34 -!- AlbireoX [~AlbireoX@76.78.130.225] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:23:52 -!- alec [~alec@68-185-207-130.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:25:49 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:27:07 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 05:27:15 -!- mcspiff [~user@bas16-ottawa23-1096764570.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:31:41 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:34:53 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.25.83] has joined #lisp 05:34:53 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.25.83] has quit [Changing host] 05:34:53 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 05:36:20 -!- Bicyclidine [~Glossina@67-5-245-201.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:37:03 alec [~alec@68-185-207-130.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has joined #lisp 05:38:12 Bicyclidine [~Glossina@67-5-245-201.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:38:39 Hi, If I have a lambda expression as a cons inside a variable - how do I convert it into a function object? 05:38:51 eval, compile 05:39:11 oh, or (coerce variable 'function) 05:39:28 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:39:50 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 05:40:18 Got it. 05:40:24 Thank you very much 05:41:37 -!- alec [~alec@68-185-207-130.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has quit [Client Quit] 05:41:50 -!- Gooder` [~user@218.69.12.194] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:44:35 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:47:08 Just three special operators left to implement. 05:48:31 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 05:50:22 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:50:31 alec [~alec@68-185-207-130.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has joined #lisp 05:50:39 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 05:52:39 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 05:56:00 -!- svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@broadband-95-84-141-55.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:56:39 Bacteria_ [~Bacteria@dyn-49-127-22-226.its.monash.edu.au] has joined #lisp 05:56:49 -!- Bacteria_ [~Bacteria@dyn-49-127-22-226.its.monash.edu.au] has quit [Client Quit] 05:57:59 -!- hydan [~user@ip-89-102-13-27.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:59:20 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@dyn-130-194-155-36.its.monash.edu.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:04:25 echo-are` [~user@182.92.247.2] has joined #lisp 06:05:06 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:06:12 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 06:09:10 -!- echo-area [~user@182.92.247.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:12:20 Global macro functions are stored in the (symbol-function) of a symbol right? They don't have their own slot - correct? 06:12:56 -!- miql_ [~miql@ip98-165-235-27.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:13:16 symbol-function does retrieve something for macros (and special operators), and can be set to override macros, and stuff. whether the symbol actually has a "slot" is up to you, i'm pretty sure. 06:14:07 Bicyclidine: Thanks - in my system they are just functions with a MACRO attribute and I put them in the symbol-function slot of their symbol. 06:15:02 I'm implementing code-generation for MACROLET. 06:19:08 -!- echo-are` [~user@182.92.247.2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:20:01 echo-area [~user@182.92.247.2] has joined #lisp 06:24:05 -!- karupanerura [~karupaner@www5325uf.sakura.ne.jp] has quit [Excess Flood] 06:26:33 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:26:33 agumonkey [~agu@211.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 06:27:06 karupanerura [~karupaner@www5325uf.sakura.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 06:27:35 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 06:27:55 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 06:28:59 duko [~duko@cpe-76-174-26-24.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 06:29:54 I'm using defclass to access and add information to a database using postmodern 06:29:54 duko, memo from pjb: read http://miller.emu.id.au/pmiller/books/rmch/ then conclude that a asd file covering the whole project is better than a asd file that depends on other asd files for subprojects. ( 06:30:46 and I'm having difficulty converting the data I'm getting into json 06:31:19 when I retrieve the data using postmodern, type-of returns 'cons' 06:31:59 if I loop through the information each of those is type-of 'account' 06:32:06 which is the name of the defclass 06:32:34 I'm using json and when I call (json:to-json (account-get-all)) 06:32:36 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:32:45 er, I'm usins jsown 06:33:01 and (jsown:to-json (account-get-all)) causes an error 06:33:12 -!- ebobby [~fms@189.170.27.127] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:33:59 ykm [4627b034@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.39.176.52] has joined #lisp 06:34:45 'there is no applicable method for the generic function jsown:to-json when called with arguments account-get-all 06:35:10 should I be focusing on the type to identify my problem? 06:35:14 duko: paste.lisp.org <-- please paste enough so that your question may be answered. 06:35:37 drewc ok one moment 06:35:41 duko: i haven't used jsown, but it looks like you'll need a to-json method on account. 06:35:55 f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has joined #lisp 06:36:43 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 06:36:45 and what Bicyclidine said ... no applicable method means no applicable method ;) 06:37:24 it looks like jsown will accept a list 06:37:33 Yes, but not an account. 06:37:36 but type-of does not return list for me 06:37:45 ok 06:37:54 CONS is a subtype of LIST. 06:38:14 so CONS here is indicative of a LIST? 06:38:20 Sure. 06:39:05 objects can be of more than one type. 06:39:26 they are only of one type, but they can inherit from other types. :-) 06:39:57 there's no inheritance involved here... 06:40:30 (list (listp nil) (consp nil) (null nil)) => (T NIL T) 06:40:36 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 06:41:23 duko: actually LIST is just the union of CONS and NULL (that is, the type containing only NIL). pretty simple. type-of probably isn't what you want here. 06:42:41 Bicyclidine: what do you think I should be using to identify these values? 06:43:29 duko: usually i'd just look at them in the repl? 06:43:31 does 'eyes, use your eyes' count as a response? 06:43:38 if you have a lot it might be useful to bind *print-length*. 06:43:40 -!- Bicyclidine is now known as Bike 06:43:56 nikodem [~mikey@user-46-112-14-36.play-internet.pl] has joined #lisp 06:45:06 -!- eli [~eli@racket/eli] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:45:36 drewc for many reasons its often useful to know how the environment identifies things 06:45:40 _d3f [~freedo@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 06:45:43 Bicyclidine thanks 06:47:20 which 'environment' are we talking about, and which identity? that is the issue here. types are not classes, but classes are types... and IDENTITY does not know either really. 06:47:36 drewc: huh? 06:47:49 duko: I'm not sure what you mean either. 06:48:20 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@87.115.6.31] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:48:31 I called it first 06:48:51 type-of / class-of ? 06:48:59 clhs first 06:48:59 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_firstc.htm 06:49:00 -!- sw2wolf{away} is now known as sw2wolf 06:50:30 cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 06:51:03 drewc are trying to give me a headache? 06:51:19 -!- duko [~duko@cpe-76-174-26-24.socal.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 06:51:35 (type-of '(1 2 3)) => cons (class-of '(1 2 3)) => # in CLISP 06:51:49 Is that relevant? 06:52:22 type or class is not so dividable 06:52:51 Classes can serve as type specifiers. It's not that hard. 06:54:23 but type cannot server as Class, right ? 06:54:52 s/server/serv 06:54:58 s/server/serve 06:55:16 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:55:19 well CONS (the symbol) is a type specifier but not a class. 06:56:01 then what's the # ? 06:56:09 A class named cons. 06:57:00 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 06:57:13 A class names cons is NOT the type specifier CONS ? 06:57:14 -!- caoliver [~chatzilla@24-236-215-112.dhcp.trcy.mi.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:57:30 One is a class and one is a symbol. 06:58:03 what's the contents of the symbol ? 06:58:25 What do you mean contents? 06:59:21 what used to implement the symbol, i.e. C 's strucure ? 06:59:39 mrSpec [~Spec@87-207-172-93.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined #lisp 06:59:39 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@87-207-172-93.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Changing host] 06:59:39 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:59:42 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Client Quit] 07:00:07 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:00:17 That's implementation-dependent, and irrelevant... 07:00:28 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 07:00:40 ok 07:02:31 (deftype my-type () T) <--- now everything is a my-type. That is not a class at all, it is a TYPE. 07:02:38 (find-class 'my-type) => ERROR 07:03:26 cfy` [~ilisp@220.191.186.26] has joined #lisp 07:03:45 ebobby [~fms@189.170.27.127] has joined #lisp 07:03:48 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:04:02 sure, type is NOT class 07:04:29 *drewc* knows that D-Wave uses CL to talk to their quantum computer ... and is wondering how it represents symbols now. 07:05:00 -!- cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:05:20 jeti [~user@p54A1E7E4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:05:27 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:05:30 Probably the same as a traditional implementation, since they only use the qubits for annealing? But that's no fun :P 07:06:12 what's qubits ? 07:06:26 QUantum BIT. 07:06:33 yeah, well, they happen to be local ... a local transit busride from here, with EA sports nearby as well ... so I may have to pay a visit :) 07:06:50 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-130-197.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 07:07:04 I only know about them from Scott Aaronson yelling about them, so I'm not too excited... nice to hear they use lisp though. 07:07:23 (for those who play FIFA, a lot of the crowd chants are me and the Vancouver Southsiders) 07:07:53 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:08:23 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 07:09:07 Yeah, I am not very excited about them either, but, heh .... they are local, so I probably should speak with them again. local, lisp and quanta ... hard to go wrong really. 07:09:28 Yeah, yeah. 07:10:07 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:11:10 I was at their IPO for that matter ... that was a while ago 07:12:17 findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 07:12:30 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.180.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:14:40 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 07:18:06 reckler [~reckler@ppp118-208-42-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:18:42 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:21:09 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:24:55 iamedu [~iamedu@201.141.174.100] has joined #lisp 07:25:00 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-ijzsvylnvriddidf] has joined #lisp 07:25:00 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-ijzsvylnvriddidf] has quit [Changing host] 07:25:00 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 07:27:37 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d01043f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:27:46 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 07:30:02 myx [~myx@pppoe-211-174-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 07:30:39 kiuma [~kiuma@static-217-133-17-91.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #lisp 07:32:12 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:32:36 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@176.97.27.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:33:22 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 07:34:19 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 07:37:08 -!- Blkt [~user@82.84.175.154] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:38:02 svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@2a02:6b8:0:40c:d84c:b93b:84e5:3a29] has joined #lisp 07:42:01 Thra11 [~thrall@87.115.6.31] has joined #lisp 07:42:29 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:44:59 tcr [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 07:50:36 -!- svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@2a02:6b8:0:40c:d84c:b93b:84e5:3a29] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:51:09 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-66-151.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:51:12 svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@dhcp-219-238-wifi.yandex.net] has joined #lisp 07:53:58 Ralt [~Ralt@eup38-1-82-247-184-72.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 07:54:09 przl [~przlrkt@p54BF977F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:58:42 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-qffccnagmvialavw] has joined #lisp 08:00:17 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:01:35 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 300 seconds.] 08:02:16 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 08:02:16 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 08:02:32 varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 08:04:19 guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has joined #lisp 08:05:27 -!- iamedu [~iamedu@201.141.174.100] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:05:47 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BF977F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:07:57 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 08:08:20 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:08:31 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 08:11:42 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has joined #lisp 08:12:42 -!- qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:14:00 -!- f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:14:55 How can I check if a file exist or not, like equivalent if [ -f /etc/SuSE-release ] in Bash? 08:14:58 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 08:16:22 f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has joined #lisp 08:17:49 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 08:19:26 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:20:54 nostoi [~nostoi@175.Red-79-157-93.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:21:01 impaktor: probe-file: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_probe_.htm 08:22:02 -!- f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:22:28 f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has joined #lisp 08:22:37 impaktor: http://weitz.de/cl-fad/#file-exists-p 08:23:11 impaktor: I'd prefer to use the latter library. 08:23:12 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:23:40 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:26:51 aerique: although file-exists-p is not available on all Lisp implementations ....I can confirm for sbcl 08:27:38 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:27:56 jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has joined #lisp 08:28:07 tcr1 [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 08:28:42 impaktor: try using probe-file, returns a valid pathname if file is found else returns nil 08:29:24 thanks. 08:32:38 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:35:59 FYCouch [~key@unaffiliated/key] has joined #lisp 08:36:05 re 08:36:08 any APL programmers? 08:36:16 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 08:36:25 ... stassats, I think, made APL in CL reader macros 08:36:42 ? 08:37:04 do you... need APL something? 08:37:17 -!- tcr [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:38:02 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-224-139.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 08:38:27 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:38:39 i wanted to find out what trancendental functions means 08:38:51 that's math. 08:39:13 Means it's not a finite-degree polynomial. 08:39:25 er, with algebraic coefficients. 08:40:30 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9xAKttWgP4 08:40:32 look at that 08:40:45 Bike: can you explain it in plain language? 08:41:26 yes, but it may take some time. Can I /msg you? 08:41:36 sure, and thank you 08:42:22 -!- spacefrogg^ is now known as spacefrogg 08:42:39 anyone familiar with the maxima source code? 08:43:07 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 08:44:50 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has quit [Client Quit] 08:47:19 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-185-82-146.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:49:06 -!- cfy` is now known as cfy 08:49:06 -!- cfy [~ilisp@220.191.186.26] has quit [Changing host] 08:49:07 cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 08:49:29 -!- guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:50:30 guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has joined #lisp 08:50:58 Cymew [~user@fw01d.snowmen.se] has joined #lisp 08:51:43 -!- guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Client Quit] 08:52:02 guaqua [gua@hilla.kapsi.fi] has joined #lisp 08:53:56 Krystof [~user@81.174.155.115] has joined #lisp 08:55:53 PauK [pauk@stdev.org] has joined #lisp 08:57:01 -!- PauK is now known as pauk 08:57:07 -!- pauk is now known as borodust 08:57:19 -!- borodust [pauk@stdev.org] has quit [Client Quit] 09:00:04 bniels [~niels@p4FD6F34B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:00:10 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:00:43 eataix [~eataix@unaffiliated/eataix] has joined #lisp 09:01:12 tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 09:01:25 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-66-151.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:02:23 -!- jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:04:00 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 09:04:09 does cl have a built-in predicate that always returns true? 09:04:20 (constantly t) 09:04:32 -!- svs_ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:04:56 Bike: perfect! thanks 09:05:30 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.212.202.30] has left #lisp 09:06:20 kubatyszko [~kubatyszk@pw126253008153.6.panda-world.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:06:37 hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 09:06:37 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 09:06:37 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:06:41 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:07:08 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:07:45 -!- kubatyszko [~kubatyszk@pw126253008153.6.panda-world.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: kubatyszko] 09:07:51 jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has joined #lisp 09:09:09 duko [~duko@cpe-76-174-26-24.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 09:09:35 -!- Bike [~Glossina@67-5-245-201.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:09:55 -!- nostoi [~nostoi@175.Red-79-157-93.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 09:10:52 peterhil [~peterhil@cs78247138.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 09:10:55 -!- FYCouch [~key@unaffiliated/key] has left #lisp 09:11:07 I've been looking at the jsown source here: 09:11:10 https://github.com/madnificent/jsown/blob/master/writer.lisp 09:12:05 and what I see is that where ':obj' is not the car item in the list, (list-to-json list) is called 09:12:25 and this calls (to-json agains the items in the list 09:13:36 I created a 'to-json' defmethod to be used with the defclass related list I'm sending as paramters to to-json 09:14:01 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:14:26 my to-json method is not found by jsown 09:14:50 but I'm able to coll this method directly on items in the same list that I pass to jsown using a for loop 09:15:17 -!- chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:15:27 would anyone have any suggestions for me? what could I be doing wrong? 09:16:43 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:17:52 I'm using this defclass in a package 09:18:02 paste the code 09:18:28 should I be trying to make the defclass and slot names available globally? 09:18:42 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 09:18:45 ok one moment... 09:19:23 I am able to encode these to json but I would like to use this defmethod class because this technique seems new and interesting to me 09:19:27 well, they should probably be exported from your package if you intend them to be used. 09:19:44 the defclass is being exported 09:20:42 you should look at this, if you haven't already: http://weitz.de/packages.html 09:20:42 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:21:07 ok thanks 09:22:05 the lisp package system seems to cause a lot of consternation for people coming from other languages. 09:22:10 -!- ebobby [~fms@189.170.27.127] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:22:37 would you tell me though.. 09:23:05 is this a normal thing to create ones own method that would be called 09:23:13 yes 09:23:16 rather than another method that is provided by a library? 09:23:29 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 09:23:32 -!- hkBst__ is now known as hkBst 09:23:36 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:23:39 jsown:to-json would use my own 'to-json' method... 09:23:40 it's normal in common lisp. it may or may not be how the original lib author intended his system to be (ab)used. :) 09:23:44 this seems strange 09:24:14 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:24:45 bitonic [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 09:26:48 well, good luck. my time in front of the computer has come to an end for another day. 09:27:59 good night Fade 09:28:00 thank you 09:28:33 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-130-197.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:29:37 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:31:37 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7549f9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 09:31:50 kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-164-14.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 09:35:08 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 09:35:08 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 09:35:08 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:38:18 any ideas why the "a" variable has such a strange content? Just a debugging flaw? http://paste.lisp.org/display/134593 09:39:36 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #lisp 09:41:32 -!- svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@dhcp-219-238-wifi.yandex.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:45:48 gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-61-102.dyn.bashtel.ru] has joined #lisp 09:46:15 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7549f9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:46:37 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-224-139.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:46:50 flip214: try (break a) instead of just (break) 09:47:21 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 09:47:26 my guess is that the register or whatever that was used by the variable has been reused by something else at the point break is reached 09:49:09 the output is correct - just wondered about the debug output. 09:49:27 jdz: (break a) => Value of A in (BREAK A) is 2, not a (OR (VECTOR CHARACTER) (VECTOR NIL) BASE-STRING FUNCTION). 09:49:52 clhs break 09:49:52 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_break.htm 09:49:56 just the debug output mangled ... with both sbcl 1.1.1, 1.1.3. thanks, never mind 09:50:01 flip214: yeah, my bad 09:50:17 should have been (break "~S" a) 09:51:44 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 09:51:50 -!- cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:52:11 why? we saw that the value is correct ;) 09:52:59 yeah, never mind me 09:53:10 something's fishy in debugger prolly 09:53:20 maybe #sbcl knows 09:56:09 -!- f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:56:50 -!- robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 09:59:50 There's a slime package in both ELPA, and el-get, which one should one use? 10:01:00 the one from qicklisp or git 10:02:14 -!- jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:03:09 -!- qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:04:21 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:07:07 -!- duko [~duko@cpe-76-174-26-24.socal.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 10:07:18 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:09:21 jimmyy [~jimmy@218.59.116.38] has joined #lisp 10:09:32 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:11:45 -!- qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:11:47 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:11:48 MrWobbleson [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:12:29 -!- MrWobbleson [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:12:48 -!- astertronistic [~astertron@ip70-181-235-122.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:13:31 -!- jimmyy [~jimmy@218.59.116.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:13:45 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:16:38 ykm: i don't understand you, the cl-fad library is supposed to be cross-implementation 10:18:50 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 10:19:51 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:20:11 -!- Cymew [~user@fw01d.snowmen.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:20:21 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:21:51 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:21:52 rudi [~rudi@1x-193-157-244-146.uio.no] has joined #lisp 10:22:51 svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@dhcp175-196-red3.yandex.net] has joined #lisp 10:24:17 MrWobbleson [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 10:24:44 -!- MrWobbleson [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:24:48 -!- qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:25:39 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 10:25:52 aerique: refer to PCL, chapter 15 under section "Testing a Files Existence" 10:26:12 qNemo 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has joined #lisp 12:05:06 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84ebd3.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:09:15 -!- jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:09:35 jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has joined #lisp 12:09:55 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 12:14:07 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:19:30 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.70] has joined #lisp 12:20:57 -!- levabalkin [~levabalki@89.46.143.44] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:22:01 nielsb [~niels@p4FD6CEEC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:23:03 papyrus32 [70a230ce@gateway/web/freenode/ip.112.162.48.206] has joined #lisp 12:23:09 hi 12:23:42 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@87.115.6.31] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:23:53 i am studying lisp and emacs . i have a question about emacs. 12:23:56 http://flylib.com/books/en/2.27.1.126/1/ 12:24:44 papyrus32: #emacs is more appropriate. 12:25:04 -!- bniels [~niels@p4FD6F34B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:25:16 ah..nobody there. 12:27:08 ah.. my mistake. thanks. 12:27:14 -!- papyrus32 [70a230ce@gateway/web/freenode/ip.112.162.48.206] has quit [Client Quit] 12:27:31 spearalot [~car@194.218.229.107] has joined #lisp 12:28:04 -!- nielsb [~niels@p4FD6CEEC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 12:28:56 add^_ [~add^_@m37-3-63-237.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 12:30:58 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:32:08 bitonic [~user@dyn1223-155.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 12:33:51 green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 12:33:58 -!- green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Client Quit] 12:34:33 green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 12:35:11 -!- green_ is now known as antgreen 12:35:23 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:35:28 -!- Vutral 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[~acrid@2602:4b:a2d6:8f00:74bf:ea63:6f6e:649a] has joined #lisp 15:26:33 -!- svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@dhcp175-196-red3.yandex.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:30:23 -!- Posterdati [~antani@host106-212-dynamic.10-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:31:11 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:32:44 any slime people here? please take sldb-break-at-start for SBCL from https://bugs.launchpad.net/sbcl/+bug/876376. thanks! 15:35:33 cl-ppcre::scan has a compiler-macro that looks whether the RE is a constant. 15:36:19 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 15:36:25 But it doesn't work for (LET ((#:GENSYM "aaa")) (m-v-b (...) (cl-ppcre:scan #:GENSYM) ...)). Any ideas? 15:36:40 that's not a constant. 15:36:56 you could just do the precompilation yourself. 15:36:58 yes, it won't work in this case 15:37:01 flip214: just use create-scanner in your macro expansion 15:39:48 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:40:59 H4ns: would that help? create-scanner has a similar compiler-macro, too 15:41:20 And I don't see why that wouldn't be constant ... there's nothing between the LET and the SCAN. 15:42:21 constant by the clhs's definition, that is, not depending on the environment 15:43:01 flip214: hm. i'm not sure, now that i think about it 15:43:22 And I don't see a compiler macro on create-scanner. just do (let (([gensym] (load-time-value (create-scanner "aaa")))) ...) 15:43:52 flip214: that implementation of sldb-break-at-start also enables traces 15:44:15 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-102-242.w92-149.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 15:46:18 fantasticsid [~user@216.240.135.188] has joined #lisp 15:46:33 -!- sellout- is now known as sellout 15:48:48 -!- smazga [~acrid@2602:4b:a2d6:8f00:74bf:ea63:6f6e:649a] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.2.1] 15:50:45 -!- Cymew [~user@fw01d.snowmen.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:51:45 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has joined #lisp 15:52:02 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:52:27 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:52:41 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:55:26 helmetk_ [~textual@cancerbero.eii.us.es] has joined #lisp 15:56:04 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 15:56:37 -!- helmetk_ is now known as helmetk 15:57:15 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:57:15 -!- sawgij [~sawjig@gateway/tor-sasl/sawjig] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:58:42 stassats: but it's better than nothing, ie. better than now. 15:59:10 Bike: but every SSA compiler would *love* the gensyms! 15:59:27 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 15:59:50 flip214: talk to clhs constantp, not me 15:59:52 I cannot be sure that the RE is immutable ... perhaps there's a `(:register ,(function...)) call somewhere, so (load-time-value) would be wrong. 16:00:29 cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has joined #lisp 16:00:37 Bike: (let ((a "a")) (print (constantp a))) => T 16:00:37 no, it won't be wrong 16:00:40 Is the actual string constant? All the l-t-v does is get ppcre to create the scanner once from the string 16:00:46 ase [~se@ip56583baa.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #lisp 16:00:47 (constantp "a") is t indeed 16:01:12 flip214: (constantp 'a) => NIL 16:01:20 (unless you have (defconstant a ...) somewhere) 16:01:23 if you look carefully, (load-time-value (create-scanner)) is what ppcre compiler-macros are expanding to 16:01:51 Bike: ah, sorry, you've got the l-t-v *outside* of create-scanner. yes, but if there's a function that uses specials, they won't have the correct value. 16:02:51 flip214: the result of create-scanner is what actually results in any function calls, no? 16:04:29 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:38 If you're just dealing with strings, i don't think (create-scanner [string]) is ever going to give you functionally different results from the same string, nor rely on calling any external functions at scanner creation time. But maybe I don't know the vagaries of perl well enough. 16:06:04 cataska` [~user@210.64.6.233] has joined #lisp 16:06:14 stop overthinking it, just use load-time-value and forget about it 16:06:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:06:43 it's using load-time-value and not ,(create-scanner ...) because functions are not dumpable to fasls 16:07:05 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:07:39 Bike: for simple strings you're right. But I'm not sure whether some dynamically computed value might get used in my macro. 16:07:51 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:07:55 -!- cataska [~user@210.64.6.233] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:10:09 you have constantp, don't use create-scanner unless it's a constant 16:11:52 Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has joined #lisp 16:12:29 normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:13:16 stassats: if constantp would work in this case I wouldn't have to put that in my macro, no? 16:13:55 no, you're just confused 16:14:00 -!- fantasticsid [~user@216.240.135.188] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:14:42 carbocalm [~user@38.99.165.166] has joined #lisp 16:16:06 stassats: my macro uses ONCE-ONLY. Where should I check for CONSTANTP - before or after that? 16:16:30 you're checking during expansion, not in the expansion, so it shouldn't matter? 16:16:47 lil_lexer [~quassel@31-16-48-138-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 16:17:22 flip214: http://paste.lisp.org/display/134626 16:20:41 sykopomp` [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 16:21:12 http://codepad.org/CBWbMVP6 16:21:12 http://codepad.org/rTx7HUjh 16:21:12 why is the scheme one slower? 16:21:12 (i couldnt find why it is so slower than the python one) the algorithm is basically the same. 16:21:24 (i know it is *clisp* chan). 16:21:35 Tau: then you should have started in #scheme 16:21:35 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-84-44-208-214.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:21:39 but i'm wondering whether it would be slower if it were #clisp too*. 16:21:50 and it's a common lisp channale 16:21:52 i mean clisp. 16:21:53 not clisp 16:22:00 stardiviner sure. 16:22:03 stassats sure. 16:22:09 stassats that is what i meant. 16:22:18 clisp is just an implementation of common lisp 16:22:25 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:22:25 stassats sure. 16:22:28 and one of the slower ones 16:22:43 stassats but would it take as long as it takes for scheme with the most common common lisp implementations? 16:22:53 (for scheme common implementations) 16:22:57 i mean. 16:22:59 why don't you try that for yourself? 16:23:02 i'm currently using guile. 16:23:18 -!- sykopomp` is now known as sykopomp 16:23:37 stassats i'm trying to understand why it is slower than python. i guess it is something related to tail recursion optmizations. 16:23:57 it's specific to that scheme implementation 16:24:01 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:24:11 if you tried another one, it might be faster. 16:24:13 zolk3ri [~Zol1ka@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has joined #lisp 16:24:27 hi 16:24:33 bike apparently not. i tested with both guile and mit-scheme. 16:24:37 i got convergent results. 16:24:40 real 2m54.515s 16:24:40 user 2m54.367s 16:24:40 sys 0m0.088s 16:24:45 this one is for mit-scheme. 16:24:48 you are using the worst algorithm ever Tau 16:25:00 lool 16:25:06 stassats: thanks, will try. 16:25:06 -!- rob7n8h [~rob7n8h@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:25:08 Tau: what's that supposed to prove? 16:25:08 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:25:10 zolk3ri i have implemented three algorithms. the first one is incredibly optmized. 16:25:29 zolk3ri the third one(the last one which i gave you is the slowest one) it takes 42 seconds in python. 16:25:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:25:58 bike nothing to one who don't know enough or isn't interested to discuss it. 16:26:10 +s 16:26:53 note to self: fuck linux 16:26:53 no need to get snippy. 16:26:56 bloatware crap. 16:27:09 and now we're off topic. 16:27:12 lool 16:27:17 Tau: maybe it's slower because it's a different algorithm? 16:27:19 Archlinux... wifi-menu 16:27:24 gotta be kidding me it doesn't even work 16:27:28 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 16:27:32 i don't see that the scheme one is computing until a square root 16:27:40 as opposed to the python's one 16:27:42 I had to do it with the ol' iwconfig and ifconfig wlan0 up... which works perfectly of course. 16:27:46 stardiviner both, the python and scheme version use the same algorithm. 16:28:03 stassats except for the fact that i'm using tail recursion in the scheme one. the python one uses a for to iterate. 16:28:18 well, the fact is that they're not 16:28:19 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:28:21 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:28:22 Tau: Oh, yes, you have the Scheme one computing the square each time, as opposed to the Python one which ust iterates up to the square root. 16:28:35 stassats i think that computing the square root is slower than using expt in python. 16:28:46 But you're only doing it once. 16:28:52 stassats if you want i can change that so it will be probably 10s faster (in python). 16:28:55 jesus christ's leg on bike. 16:29:11 Bike hmm 16:29:15 Tau: .... you speak to me twice .... 16:29:19 Bike it might influence. 16:29:22 stassats: ARGGG ... the (load-time-value) is good and nice, but it doesn't work with *ALLOW-NAMED-REGISTERS* ... 16:29:31 what? 16:29:32 stardiviner i was talking to stassats . 16:29:34 Tau, wait for the C version, it will execute in less than a second. 16:29:39 bike lemme try changing that 16:29:40 hold on 16:29:41 Tau: (5:27:46 PM) Tau: stardiviner both, the python and scheme version use the same algorithm. 16:29:43 I'm not sure. 16:30:07 flip214: what are you talking about? 16:30:24 Tau: this is why it's important to not just assume that it's tail recursion or whatever. 16:31:09 rob7n8h [~rob7n8h@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:35 stassats: "If this value is true (the default is NIL), CL-PPCRE will support (?"") ...." 16:31:57 just by sheer luck it did work up to now ... 16:32:13 flip214: well, you need to set it before you run create-scanner 16:32:24 bike i'm testing it hold on 16:32:28 bike but yeah. 16:32:48 Tau: what is the point of this test? 16:33:11 Bike 16:33:13 (5:27:09 PM) Tau: zolk3ri it isn't an algorithm related question you moron. 16:33:13 (5:27:19 PM) Tau: zolk3ri it is a question related to your shitty lisp implementations. 16:33:45 great. forget i bothered talking. 16:34:04 zolk3ri you are lying. i haven't said that. 16:34:10 lol 16:34:13 bike i was just trying to understand. 16:34:25 bike i'm testing this new algorithm. 16:34:29 this one uses sqrt. 16:34:37 Tau: trying to understand what, though? 16:34:38 Joreji [~thomas@92-038.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 16:34:44 bike why i'm having divergent results. 16:35:17 "divergent results"? You mean why CPython and mit-scheme execute roughly the same algorithm at different speeds? 16:35:52 bike yes. 16:36:49 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 16:36:54 well, discounting any number of differences in algorithm, execution environment (including nonobvious things like caching), etc., then obviously because they have different optimization strategies, because they're different programs. 16:37:05 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-84-44-208-214.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:37:15 http://codepad.org/KBXBQJ3X 16:37:16 nothing much to test there. 16:37:18 bike this one is sqrt. 16:37:22 bike uses sqrt* 16:37:34 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 16:37:35 bike but it calls sqrt at each iteration. 16:37:41 ffs dont post it as python 16:37:48 Tau: broken still 16:37:48 (i cant get rid of it) 16:37:51 Tau: So it's still wrong and you're wasting my time? 16:38:03 bike what? 16:38:33 bike how would you write that algorithm using recursion? 16:38:33 Do you not understand the obvious differences you're going to get between computing a square root once and computing a square root two hundred thousand times? 16:38:39 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-84-44-208-214.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:38:44 bike i do know those differences. 16:38:54 so, you know why it's slower 16:38:57 I'd write it using iteration. In Scheme that would ust amount to using a named let after computing the square root. 16:38:59 stassats i know. 16:39:01 case closed. 16:39:10 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:39:13 in CL (defun is-prime (n) (loop for i from 2 to (isqrt n) do (when (zerop (mod n i)) (return nil)) finally (return t))) 16:39:14 stassats but, i'm trying to understand a way to implement that algorithm using recursion. 16:39:29 (define (is-prime n) (let ((max (sqrt n))) (let iter ...))) 16:39:38 take the first paste, put a LET around the whole body, bind a variable to a the result of the square root 16:39:39 well, isqrt. whatever. 16:40:16 stassats oh. nice. 16:40:46 the "recursion" here is really just a loop, so you don't even need to think of it any differently from the python version. 16:40:48 so, where do we read another useless post on comparing apples to oranges? 16:40:49 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:41:08 -!- rob7n8h [~rob7n8h@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:41:30 bike i was trying to figure out how to do it with recursion (without loops) really. 16:41:43 i didnt know i could put a function definition inside a let. 16:41:48 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:41:50 Tau: With tail recursion, (let iter ...) will compile to a loop. 16:42:04 bike yeah. i see it now. i was looking for that. 16:42:16 I would use an auxiliary function 16:42:37 (but i wasn't aware of the (let (define func thing. 16:43:17 -!- helmetk [~textual@cancerbero.eii.us.es] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:43:18 you are missing a parenthesis 16:43:21 Tau 16:43:35 ops, and more than one! 16:43:40 stassats man 16:43:54 stassats would i be asking a lot if you wrote this? 16:44:01 yes 16:44:16 http://codepad.org/CBWbMVP6 <--- i cant see how i would put a let outside the iter func and still the code works. 16:44:28 -!- green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:44:47 you just put and will work 16:45:01 rob7n8h [~rob7n8h@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:45:04 It's the magic of lexical scope. 16:45:27 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 16:45:44 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:45:47 green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 16:46:02 Tau: also, i ust tried a CL version roughly similar to http://codepad.org/CBWbMVP6 and it took a little over a second. 16:46:16 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 16:46:29 oh, no, missed a zero. gotta be fair. 16:46:51 smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has joined #lisp 16:47:06 So, 23 seconds. 16:48:12 -!- frost_ [~frost@95.168.107.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:48:39 I'm still not sure what you hope to get out of translating an iterative algorithm to a half-assed recursive version, though. 16:49:04 it's not recursive, though, it's iterative too 16:49:08 bike there should exist a way to do it recursively. 16:49:17 but with tail recursion. 16:49:32 which is just iteration. 16:50:12 Tau: did you wrap that let already? 16:50:29 stassats lol 16:50:30 funny 16:50:32 stassats i cant see how 16:50:34 in gcc the same code is 16:50:38 0.030 16:50:39 Tau: did you write that code? 16:50:39 looool 16:50:41 seconds 16:50:44 yourself 16:50:46 -!- lil_lexer [~quassel@31-16-48-138-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 16:51:12 -!- snits [~snits@174-17-112-107.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:51:23 -!- smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:52:05 because i don't believe you did, if you can't add a simple let binding 16:52:46 snits [~snits@inet-hqmc04-o.oracle.com] has joined #lisp 16:52:52 -!- green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:53:26 btw 16:53:27 (5:24:07 PM) Tau: why don't you try that for yourself? 16:53:27 (5:24:09 PM) Tau: this guy is an ass. 16:53:28 looool 16:53:29 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@178.77.6.46] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:53:52 zolk3ri: you're a good friend 16:54:12 X-Scale [email@2001:470:1f14:135b::2] has joined #lisp 16:54:42 -!- rudi [~rudi@1x-193-157-244-146.uio.no] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 16:54:57 stassats you mean using let ((r (sqrt n))? 16:55:01 well 16:55:04 that one is possible. 16:55:14 but using the first code with let i think is impossible. 16:55:26 you think? 16:55:56 well, since you're such an expert in scheme, i shall refrain from helping 16:55:56 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:56:06 lmfao 16:56:18 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:57:09 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 16:57:15 stassats k 16:57:17 stassats: tau needs help man, he wants to know why lisp sucks and python rocks 16:57:18 lemme try this one 16:57:19 iLogical [~iLogical@189.123.205.243] has joined #lisp 16:57:45 Tau: http://slexy.org/view/s21nvuUf7T 16:57:51 zolk3ri its possible to express everything with recursion. 16:58:01 Tau 16:58:04 check the link 16:58:04 and the result 16:58:05 for each algorithm that is iterative should exist a recursive one. 16:58:07 you fucking idiot. 16:58:09 just d o it. 16:58:11 even python sucks 16:58:14 :p 16:58:18 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:58:50 zolk3ri you are idiot not me. 16:58:57 it took 42 seconds in python for you 16:58:57 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 16:58:57 right? 16:59:47 theinvsblman [~user@abot8.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 16:59:53 hi 17:00:01 tau is mad 17:00:02 can you both go to #kindergarten or something? 17:00:45 ^ 17:01:05 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:01:30 why stassats? 17:01:44 because you act like children 17:01:52 how come, stassats? 17:02:05 how do childrens act like? 17:02:26 zolk3ri: that's a good question. I vote for kicking you and Tau. 17:02:26 stassats: it's just tag team trolling. Best just ignore them and wait for the kickban. 17:02:54 meh 17:03:09 i vote for baning zolk3ri . i'm not acting like child at all. 17:03:14 -!- qNemo is now known as qptain_Nemo 17:04:02 Btw stassats I'm curious about s omething 17:04:03 (5:52:06 PM) stassats: because i don't believe you did, if you can't add a simple let binding 17:04:05 how is t hat relevant? 17:04:56 -!- theinvsblman [~user@abot8.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has left #lisp 17:06:10 -!- ft [efftee@shell.chaostreff-dortmund.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:06:42 green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 17:06:57 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@189.123.205.243] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:07:48 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:08:22 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:08:26 stassats there is no way to add let binding without changing the algorithm. 17:08:31 kilon [~kilon@unaffiliated/thekilon] has joined #lisp 17:08:40 wrong 17:08:41 -!- spacefrogg is now known as spacefrogg^ 17:08:43 http://codepad.org/q0EraxxT 17:08:55 stassats if you meant that, it is not the first algorithm that i have shown here. 17:09:26 stassats http://codepad.org/04EirF1p 17:09:31 well, that's the point, this version computes the sqrt once instead of a billion times. 17:10:01 use exact-integer-sqrt 17:10:30 bike this one is faster. 17:11:20 ...yes, that's the point. 17:11:52 bike but its still slower than the python one. 17:12:03 Tau: http://slexy.org/view/s21nvuUf7T 17:12:10 and this is way faster than python 17:12:21 42 s in python, 42 ms in C 17:12:26 bike and the scheme one is more optmized once i dont try to divide 'even' numbers against the supposed prime one. 17:12:34 so you should forget scheme and python too. :p 17:12:58 -!- snits [~snits@inet-hqmc04-o.oracle.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:14:40 Tau: yes, they are not the same optimizer and you are going to get different results. You apparently don't get this somehow, so can you go off with zolk and use a remotely good algorithm intead of bothering with all these meaningless tests? 17:14:46 Tau: that's a weird way to run it 17:15:14 Bike, why me? 17:15:15 use guile sol-5.scm instead 17:15:32 and put (write (+ 2 (find-sum 2000000))) 17:16:04 bike the last code that i have shown is more optmized than the python code. 17:16:13 bike the last code is slower than the python code. 17:16:20 bike if i optmize the python code it will be 10s. 17:16:29 Tau, still not 42 ms. 17:16:30 bike beating scheme in 30 seconds probably. 17:16:32 zolk3ri: you used a sieve, and know tau from elsewhere or whatever. 17:16:38 Tau: does this contradict anything I said? 17:16:42 bike i have implemented a sieve too. 17:16:45 bike for this problem. 17:16:50 it takes 7 min LOOL 17:17:02 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:17:14 Bike, yeah I know him but I've told him many times to forget Scheme and Python. Also yeah I told my friend to code it in C quickly and show Tau how slow Python is. 17:17:15 http://codepad.org/bJDFVyUT <-- this isnt a sieve. 17:17:19 this was my first algo. 17:17:20 stassats, you're an op, right? I'm sorry for prolonging this. 17:17:29 Bike: nope, i'm not 17:17:35 damn. 17:17:45 i guess they were banned from #scheme, and have nowhere else to go 17:17:57 http://codepad.org/S6fVdSxX <-- this implements a sieve (i couldnt compute it). 17:18:03 stassats: I'm not banned there. 17:18:17 stassats come on. i haven't offended anyone. 17:18:22 stassats i just made questions. 17:18:28 bad questions 17:18:31 stassats it is okay if bike or other people just don't like them. 17:18:33 and off-topic questions, at that 17:18:50 stassats people are always allowed to ignore questions i think. 17:18:56 you shouldn't compare programming languages if you can't write programs in them 17:19:06 Tau: no, that's not how it works 17:19:17 stassats i'm learning scheme yet. 17:19:21 i picked up it last week. 17:19:27 <|3b|> Tau: this channel is about common lisp, not scheme 17:19:29 ft [efftee@shell.chaostreff-dortmund.de] has joined #lisp 17:19:29 well, keep learning then 17:19:36 stassats i'm not *comparing* them. i'm just trying to find a way to improve my code. 17:19:52 read books 17:19:58 Watch porn. 17:20:05 stardiviner whats this channel for at all then? 17:20:07 well 17:20:10 Tau: SICP, little schemer, seasoned schemer 17:20:10 anyway stassats . 17:20:16 i'm not going to discuss it with you. 17:20:21 <|3b|> also, does that python code handle arbitrarily large integers? if not, that may be some of the speed diffference 17:20:22 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 17:20:36 stassats i just came here with a question, i thought htere could exist someone interested to discuss/help etc. 17:20:38 Tau: http://slexy.org/view/s21nvuUf7T 17:20:41 its okay if no one is interested. 17:21:11 zolk3ri everyone knows you just copied this shit from some site that shows projecteuler solutions. 17:21:28 My friend made it. 17:21:41 But that is obviously irrelevant. 17:21:43 zolk3ri & Tau: please stop 17:22:00 Tau: first, #scheme is the place, and i'm sure they will be willing to help if you ask sensible questions 17:22:05 zolk3ri has been being mean and offensive with me. i have done nothing to him. 17:22:18 stassats i asked there but no one answered. 17:22:30 i asked on #guile though. 17:22:36 not on #scheme. 17:22:42 Tau, I've told you to use Common Lisp and forget Scheme, I've told you to post your Scheme code as Scheme and not Python, I've told you that your implementation sucks. 17:22:48 You keep ignoring all this, man. 17:22:57 And yet you wonder why it's slow, why it's fucked and such. 17:23:31 zolk3ri why are you capitalizing letters? do you think it makes you sound more important kkk 17:23:33 And about being offensive, meh. Change the way you look at my sentences. 17:23:41 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:23:41 Tau, nope. 17:23:55 Tau: fwiw, the latest scheme version you pasted runs much faster for me than python 17:24:18 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:26:15 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:26:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:58 stassats interesting. 17:28:05 Tau: please stop. go bicker somewhere else 17:28:17 fe[nl]ix why are you trolling me, dude? 17:28:34 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o fe[nl]ix 17:28:38 -!- Tau [~Euler@186.194.53.225] has left #lisp 17:29:30 AeroNotix [~xeno@abom169.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:30:26 -!- green_ [~green@dsl-207-112-125-99.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:32:47 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:35:10 bitonic [~user@dyn1222-129.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 17:36:51 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 17:37:00 fe[nl]ix: Hi can you help me implement a GirvanNewman algorithm in Common Lisp? 17:38:21 gigamonk_ [~textual@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 17:38:45 fe[nl]ix: HELLO? 17:39:57 Keshi: I'm not interested 17:40:03 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:40:30 fe[nl]ix: Why cobber? 17:41:27 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@static-217-133-17-91.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:42:07 -!- nilsi [~nilsi@c83-253-22-138.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:42:29 asdasdasd [bc788c23@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.120.140.35] has joined #lisp 17:42:40 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:43:37 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:44:21 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #lisp 17:44:29 fe[nl]ix: HELLO???!!! 17:44:29 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 17:44:46 hammond [~abner@unaffiliated/portrait] has joined #lisp 17:44:47 haven't you heard the man? he's not interested 17:44:54 is zolkeri in? 17:45:01 Is this troll day today on #lisp? 17:45:18 antoszka: it is 17:45:21 hi Keshi 17:45:37 hi hammond 17:45:57 what's up? 17:46:03 join #lispcafe 17:46:26 -!- stardiviner [~stardivin@122.236.246.61] has quit [Quit: my website: http://stardiviner.dyndns-blog.com/] 17:46:28 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:47:57 stassats: Yeah, it is most like people gravitate to certain channels and a link forms between those channels and channels like this. 17:48:05 stassats: I really need help implementing it though. 17:48:59 -!- asvil [~user@ns.osvtl.spb.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:50:04 -!- carbocalm [~user@38.99.165.166] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:51:45 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-237-124.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 17:51:59 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-61-102.dyn.bashtel.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:52:00 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:52:01 -!- Joreji [~thomas@92-038.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:53:38 -!- maxm- is now known as maxm 17:54:49 -!- jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:55:06 jimmyy [jimmyy@218.59.116.38] has joined #lisp 17:56:12 -!- bondar [~rukugu@41.72.193.86] has quit [] 17:56:17 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:56:30 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 17:59:04 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.88.205] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:59:29 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn1222-129.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:01:24 nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 18:02:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:03:34 bitonic [~user@dyn1222-129.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 18:06:34 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:10:05 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 18:12:03 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 18:12:24 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-204-75-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 18:13:42 cic_ [~connolly@Catnip.AI.SRI.COM] has joined #lisp 18:14:17 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:14:50 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 18:15:01 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 18:15:12 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:15:39 drmeister [a6895816@gateway/web/freenode/ip.166.137.88.22] has joined #lisp 18:15:55 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:16:54 Can I paste a small chunk of code (4-lines) and ask a question about it? 18:17:10 drmeister: use paste.lisp.org to paste it 18:17:25 but other than that, if it's common lisp code, yes 18:17:36 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-164-14.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:18:52 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7549f9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 18:19:07 Ok, I put it at http://paste.lisp.org/+2VVO. 18:20:12 The question is: Why would someone assign to the "form" variable twice in a let* - is there any good reason or can I rename one of them? 18:20:46 why not? 18:20:48 drmeister: the first "form" gets used in the "type" and "var" bindings. 18:20:51 just consider what it would look like as nested lets. 18:20:57 there's nothing wrong with doing it twice 18:21:28 drmeister: essentially they don't need the first "form" in the body of the let*, but they do need it for binding "type" and "var" 18:21:36 przl [~przlrkt@p54BF977F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 18:21:38 <_death> drmeister, I'd rename it 18:21:39 -!- pjb`` is now known as pjb 18:21:46 Is it equivalent to two nested lets or does the second assignment overwrite the memory of the first one? 18:22:21 drmeister: it's equivalent to two nested lets; the bindings happen in order for a let* 18:22:30 <_death> drmeister, if not re-factor to make it clearer.. 18:22:45 drmeister: there's no concept of memory in CL 18:22:54 Jasom: I see that, thanks. 18:23:01 drmeister: actually, in general (let* ((a b) (c d) (e f))) is like (let ((a b)) (let ((c d)) (let ((e f)) ... 18:23:01 it's compiler's job to make sure the semantics are correct 18:23:26 stassats: No concept of memory - I'll have to ponder that. 18:23:28 drmeister: (let* ((a 4) (b a) (a 9)) (list a b)) => (9 4) 18:23:36 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:23:40 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 18:23:57 drmeister: actually that's not too uncommon for a language; even the C standard has no concept of memory. 18:24:01 kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-164-14.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 18:24:03 stassats: I solved my (function (setf XXXX)) problem yesterday - there was a trivial 2-line solution. 18:25:06 the compiler can reuse the same memory location even if you give a different name to the second variable 18:25:28 frost_ [~frost@95.168.107.131] has joined #lisp 18:26:15 stassats: I see. Currently I have a one-to-one memory-slot-to-let* binding. This is the first time I've seen code where the let* binding duplicated a target symbol. 18:26:18 <_death> jasom, of course C has the concept of memory 18:26:40 _death: read the ISO C standard. The word "memory" does not appear in any normative section. 18:27:01 *jasom* has won more than a single pub bet this way 18:27:03 stassats: C90 defines pointer arithmetic, which implies a serial concept of memory (for the heap at least). 18:27:06 <_death> jasom, you may want to read it yourself.. for example section 7.20.3 18:27:11 stassats: Or let me modify that. My interpreter doesn't have a problem with it. The compiler threw an error when it noticed I was reusing a target symbol. 18:27:11 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:27:25 drmeister: well, your compiler is wrong, unfortunately. 18:27:34 Keshi: why are you telling me this? 18:27:40 Bike: It's an easy fix. 18:27:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:27:42 kofno_ [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:21 stassats: Oh probably because I mistook you and jasom. 18:28:25 ok 18:28:49 stassats: Blamed zolk3ri. 18:28:52 * blame 18:28:54 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:28:57 lol wtf 18:29:06 zolk3ri: Oh, I am blaming you. 18:29:08 _death: /me is reading it. Not seeing anything about memory, other than in the title of the section. 18:29:23 <_death> jasom, the title is "Memory management functions" 18:29:27 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 18:29:47 well, there's ##c 18:29:50 <_death> jasom, if malloc isn't about memory, what is it about 18:30:03 _death: continue in a different channel? 18:30:24 heh, free could conformingly be a no-op, couldn't it. 18:30:34 <_death> jasom, nope.. I made my argument and don't really care if you accept it or not :) 18:30:46 k 18:31:11 One other question: #+nil (XXXX) is a way to comment out (XXXX) right? 18:31:26 right 18:31:48 would stop working one an implementation named NIL will be released 18:31:52 s/one/once/ 18:32:11 Newest Implementation of Lisp 18:32:51 jasom: Yes, and what more is pointer arithmetic, as I said, implies a serial concept of memory in C. It probably even implies additive structure and some other formal nonsense about measuring memory, but who cares. 18:33:44 drmeister: #-(or) is better IMO 18:33:52 -!- _death is now known as adeht 18:34:04 surely you mean #+(or) 18:34:14 stassats: yes 18:34:18 typo 18:34:56 jasom: Is that because there are no features listed in #+(or)? 18:35:06 drmeister: Exactly. 18:35:42 Can anyone recommend a nice, clean implementation of CLOS for a new CL compiler? 18:36:01 Keshi: i don't think you can (conformingly) do anything arithmeticy with pointers except for ones to arrays 18:36:06 drmeister: the one in AMOP 18:36:16 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 18:36:23 drmeister: AMOP is the only one I've seen, and I looked for a bit 18:36:24 There's PCL in ailabs repository. 18:36:41 A few free implementations used it as base for their CLOS. 18:36:47 Bike: You navigate the whole space using it. 18:36:53 Bike: You mean CLOSETTE? That's the one I'm starting to use - excellent. 18:37:00 http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs/project/ai-repository/ai/lang/lisp/oop/clos/pcl/0.html 18:37:10 Bike: Even C++, you can use that kind of thing for copy constructors and things where memory is stack allocated. 18:37:11 closette is a subset. 18:37:13 AFAIK 18:37:23 closette is a subset but it could be good to build on. 18:37:25 Bike: This is not ##c++ or ##c though. 18:37:50 thanks pjb closette is the best I had found so far! 18:38:02 *jasom* even googled for "clos implementation" and didn't find that one 18:38:05 Keshi: well, i'm curious now, but you're right, this isn't the place 18:38:43 Bike: Yeah, I am in ##c too and that channel is normally active. Someone will know there for sure. 18:38:46 pjb: I'm a little confused. In the AMOP appendix is a CLOS implementation - I thought it was called CLOSETTE. I downloaded it from somewhere on the internet and it mostly loads into my interpreter but needs COMPILE - so I added that. 18:38:59 My copy of AMOP is at home so I can't check it. 18:38:59 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Quit: Some days you're the pigeon, some days the statue...] 18:39:29 drmeister: like he said, closette is a subset of CLOS, you'll need to add to it to get full CLOS. like iirc it doesn't have method combinations? 18:39:31 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:40:00 pjb: I copied the pcl link - I'll check it out later. 18:40:01 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@gray-29.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has joined #lisp 18:40:01 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@gray-29.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has quit [Changing host] 18:40:01 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 18:41:19 drmeister: also see "Efficient Method Dispatch in PCL" and pretty much anything pascal costanza has written 18:41:42 Bike: Noted - I'll look into it. Does anyone know where a full copy of CLOS from AMOP is stored? 18:41:48 getting new CLOS and MOP implementations to work correctly is a pain 18:42:19 Bike: Thanks - I'll check out "Efficient Method..." 18:44:20 How about portable implementations of RESTART-CASE and HANDLER-CASE? I've got CATCH/THROW and UNWIND-PROTECT working properly now. 18:44:55 PCL being Portable Common Loops, here? 18:45:05 yep 18:45:40 drmeister: sbcl's even are mostly portable, since they're just defined in terms of restart-bind and handler-bind 18:47:08 -!- arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-oaimeqnytytbxtnl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:47:20 -!- nikodem [~mikey@user-46-112-14-36.play-internet.pl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:48:08 -!- Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:48:30 Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 18:48:54 mau_ [mau@2400:8900::f03c:91ff:fe70:e7d7] has joined #lisp 18:49:30 Bike: And RESTART-BIND and HANDLER-BIND are macros that are defined in terms of CATCH/THROW and UNWIND-PROTECT right? I'll dig into the SBCL code. 18:49:56 You folks are really helpful - thank you. 18:50:29 drmeister: dynamic binding and block/return-from iirc, but i think that's separated from foo-case's implementations anyway 18:50:38 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:51:05 svetlyak40wt [~svetlyak4@broadband-95-84-141-55.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has joined #lisp 18:51:13 nikodem [~mikey@user-46-112-14-36.play-internet.pl] has joined #lisp 18:51:49 Bike: BLOCK/RETURN-FROM is fine as well. I'll dig into it later. 18:52:04 Blkt [~user@82.84.175.154] has joined #lisp 18:58:36 cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-67-35.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 18:59:30 -!- bjorkintosh [~bjork@ip68-13-229-200.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:59:49 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:00:36 -!- cryptic [~cryptic@pool-71-125-31-38.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:00:44 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn1222-129.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:01:18 cryptic [~cryptic@pool-71-125-31-38.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:04:30 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 19:04:32 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 19:05:06 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 19:06:06 pegu [~user@c242C76D9.static.as2116.net] has joined #lisp 19:06:06 s 19:07:33 Thra11 [~thrall@87.115.6.31] has joined #lisp 19:08:21 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:09:12 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 19:09:18 -!- redline6561_ [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 19:10:04 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d01043f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:10:50 drmeister: you won't find easily portable implementations. Check http://home.pipeline.com/~hbaker1/MetaCircular.html and SACLA and SICL, and otherwise, check the sources of the various free implementations. Most of them are written mostly in CL, and while a lot of their code is implementation specifric, they also have a bunch of CL implemented in more or less conforming CL. 19:10:57 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@188.250.11.113] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:11:48 drmeister: in any case, even code in SACLA or SICL is specific to their own, and may need adaptation for your implementation. 19:12:46 pjb: I've been lifting stuff from SACLA - it's great. I just took a closer look at SICL last night - it looks like I could use some of that as well. 19:13:09 redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 19:13:20 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BF977F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:13:34 -!- frost_ [~frost@95.168.107.131] has quit [Quit: frost_] 19:13:34 pjb: I've removed all cyclic dependencies from my boot process - usually by hand expanding macros and putting the expanded code back into the boot process. 19:14:20 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has joined #lisp 19:14:22 pjb: Sometimes I define simpler versions of the macros early and then redefine them once the system has booted further. 19:16:54 jynnantonix [~textual@140.247.0.103] has joined #lisp 19:18:36 mcsontos_ [~mcsontos@77.240.184.15] has joined #lisp 19:18:49 snits [~snits@inet-hqmc08-o.oracle.com] has joined #lisp 19:19:04 -!- gigamonk_ [~textual@50.1.48.145] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 19:19:50 pnpuff 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[Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:04:14 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:20 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:04:37 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 20:06:14 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-105.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:06:16 gridaphobe [~user@128.54.50.38] has joined #lisp 20:06:32 pjb: m( (taoufik) 20:07:16 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:07:49 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 20:08:21 I am afraid im turning into a LOOP programmer as opposed to a Lisp programmer. 20:08:23 :/ 20:09:52 unintern is your friend :D 20:09:52 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:10:00 ebobby: use do / do* 20:10:18 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:10:39 prxq: \o/ 20:11:05 :) 20:11:40 I rather use recursion (when is not too much of an overkill) or something like that but I seem to be able to 'visualize' stuff in LOOP faster. Most probably my... heritage from other languages. 20:11:54 oh boy 20:12:19 lol 20:12:57 -!- rpg [~rpg@23-25-144-217-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:13:09 "there's a way, it works alright, it's easier for me, but i'd rather use something more arcane instead" 20:13:14 for god knows what reason 20:13:16 ebobby: this isn't a confession booth, chill 20:13:30 pardon me father for i have looped 20:13:50 I just seem to be getting affected by the loop disdain that I seem to read about everywhere. 20:14:22 ebobby, again I am reminded by that classic usenet post: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.lang.lisp/9SKZ5YJUmBg/Fj05OZQomzIJ 20:14:24 don't read nonsense like that 20:14:36 well, if you run into concrete problems, or have actual reason to worry about those problems, then you can start worrying. until then just go with the flow 20:15:01 that might be because unafflicted (unaffected ?) programs don't write about their lack of disdain. 20:15:04 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 20:15:56 or just use tagbody 20:16:22 yes, goto is a popular and uncontroversial replacement idiom :P 20:16:59 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:17:02 lol 20:17:02 eli [~eli@racket/eli] has joined #lisp 20:19:32 Well, this seems to be a bastion of sense then. 20:20:51 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.180.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:22:25 hmm 20:23:05 stassats: is there a way to explicitly destroy some Qt object inside CL (especially WebPage or even QApplication) ? 20:23:14 #_delete 20:23:28 hmm 20:23:49 will deleting QApplication delete all other widgets ? 20:24:14 which are children, yes 20:24:19 *anonus* hearing audio from HTML5 video from coursera after he closed WebView and called #_delete for *qapp* 20:24:20 but why do you want to delete it? 20:24:53 wow, it closed at least 20:24:58 after a 3-4 minutes 20:25:25 now delete says about dead object *qapp* 20:25:54 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:25:55 -!- rdqfdx [~rdqfdx@78.90.88.244] has quit [Quit: terminated!] 20:26:09 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d01043f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:26:55 *anonus* trying to firugre out a workaround for strage behaviour of WebView after second run 20:27:03 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:27:12 don't run it twice 20:27:15 that's my workaround 20:27:40 it is not the lisp way - to restart whole system 20:27:55 Demosthenex [~Demosthen@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has joined #lisp 20:29:18 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:29:52 -!- foones [~pablo@190.174.208.91] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:36:22 CatMtKing [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:39:58 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Quit: Some days you're the pigeon, some days the statue...] 20:40:07 mathrick [~mathrick@193.59.74.111] has joined #lisp 20:40:07 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:40:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:41:23 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-239-105.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:43:02 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:43:39 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 20:44:00 -!- Jambato [~Jambato@2a01:e35:2f15:c40:211:d8ff:fe7d:2c4a] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:44:32 -!- Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 20:46:23 normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:50:22 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.160.220.111] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 20:51:08 tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.160.220.111] has joined #lisp 20:54:01 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.148.207.107] has joined #lisp 20:55:31 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:56:35 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.160.220.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:56:35 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 20:58:12 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 21:00:24 what should ``(foo ,@,@nil) do? 21:00:29 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 21:01:21 clhs ` 21:01:22 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/02_df.htm 21:01:49 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@gray-47.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has joined #lisp 21:01:49 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@gray-47.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has quit [Changing host] 21:01:49 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 21:02:17 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-237-124.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:02:32 francogrex [~user@109.134.227.146] has joined #lisp 21:02:47 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:03:01 what do you think of an implementation that doesn't even compile the ansi tests? 21:03:24 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:03:32 nothing 21:03:58 why you should say: it sucks, a total failure 21:03:58 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 21:04:24 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:34 francogrex: or maybe a work in progress? 21:04:47 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 21:05:31 jasom: a work in progress is one that has many failures, but one that doesn't even begin to compile them is a total washout 21:06:24 francogrex: is it advertised as a working cl implementation? 21:07:05 stassats: ``(foo ,@,@nil) => `(foo) I think since `(foo ,@bar) -> (foo . bar) 21:07:54 stassats: dot context error, I guess (: 21:08:15 pkhuong: i'm leaning towards an error of some sort 21:08:20 H4ns: yes I can name 'names': both clisp and especially the commercial corman lisp fail to start 21:08:38 (eval ``(list . ,,@nil)) => LIST on some implementations, (LIST) on others 21:09:24 francogrex: and you're sure that you know how to run the ansi test suite? 21:09:24 jasom: I don't see how that follows. `(foo ,@nil) => '(foo) does. 21:09:34 -!- knob [~knob@76.76.202.244] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:10:32 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:10:59 pkhuong: oh, you're right ``(foo ,@,@nil) => `(foo . ,@ nil) => syntax error 21:10:59 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:11:13 H4ns: sure, done many times successfully with sbcl, cmucl, ecl 21:11:19 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:12:04 francogrex: interesting. clisp is usually not known to be non-compliant, so maybe you want to get in touch with the maintainers to sort out the problem. 21:12:32 francogrex: other than that, i never found clisp to be troublesome at all. it ran all the cl libraries that i needed at the time. 21:13:08 H4ns: there's quite a number of subtle issues, actually. Some of them fixed by forcing strict ANSI mode. 21:13:24 -!- Demosthenex [~Demosthen@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:13:40 allambiccus [~allambicc@dynamic-adsl-84-220-112-240.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #lisp 21:13:46 -!- allambiccus [~allambicc@dynamic-adsl-84-220-112-240.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:14:02 pkhuong: quite possibly. i'm not using clisp anymore, but it is not because of those subtle issues :) 21:14:23 pnpuff [~Eternit@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 21:14:40 but, it should still start. francogrex, what is the problem exactly? 21:14:48 H4ns: They make you work all day but they don't pay you or let you go. :) 21:15:40 H4ns: me too I love clisp. I use it to debug a lot, it has a very good debugger. Corman is a disappointement 21:17:55 Bike: READ from #: # has no external symbol with name "CHAR-INT.2" 21:18:14 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:19:33 -!- _d3f [~freedo@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Quit: ~ The Gnu went back to savannah ~] 21:20:44 jeti` [~user@p54A1E4D3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 21:21:12 with Corman it is even more shameful: (defparameter *uninterned-symbols* (list '#:nil '#:t '#:foo '#:||)) An error of type UNBOUND-VARIABLE was detected in function #< COMPILED-FUNCTION: #xDE9F58 > 21:22:46 i don't think i have the context to make sense of any of that. 21:24:17 -!- jeti [~user@p54A1E7E4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:25:48 the first form where clisp fails ok you don't have the context unless you run the tests, but the second form: (list '#:nil '#:t '#:foo '#:||) Corman doesn't recognize that as a correct lisp form.. I mean come on! 21:27:17 well where's the UNBOUND-VARIABLE or compiled function or anything? 21:27:36 -!- pnpuff [~Eternit@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Quit: .] 21:29:54 I don't know! that what it says as the error, without further elucidation, the backtrace is not helpful either 21:32:33 anyway Corman is somehow weird in that it runs only on win32 and only in compiler mode (no interpreter) 21:34:34 i don't think ccl has an interpreter either. but, maybe you should focus on clisp, since people actually use it? 21:35:03 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abot26.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 21:35:13 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 21:35:26 -!- jynnantonix [~textual@140.247.0.103] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 21:36:35 Bike: yes, I was used corman just recently because it has a nice functionality to directly embed assembly code into lisp functions 21:37:09 francogrex: the interpreter is a relatively recent addition to SBCL as well. 21:37:26 jynnantonix [~textual@140.247.0.103] has joined #lisp 21:38:00 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.23.125.180] has joined #lisp 21:38:14 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abom169.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:41:23 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.148.207.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:41:23 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 21:41:23 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:41:41 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-201-95.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:43:20 akenisuto [~akenisuto@5.158.182.28] has joined #lisp 21:45:17 f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has joined #lisp 21:46:43 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:46:47 robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:48:02 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:48:51 Demosthenex [~Demosthen@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has joined #lisp 21:49:20 -!- robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:49:27 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:49:37 robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:49:54 the interpreter has been in for something like 6.5 years. even for sbcl that's hardly recent 21:50:17 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:52:04 jsnell: relative to common-lisp, it's recent 21:52:15 And compared on how much it's used. 21:52:36 If you added a routine twenty years ago, and never used it, it'd still be recent. 21:53:59 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:54:02 -!- akenisuto [~akenisuto@5.158.182.28] has quit [Quit: Bye] 21:54:46 jasom: Common Lisp is barely 18 years old. 21:56:26 not even old enough to drink in the US (: 21:57:14 CMUCL was barely of drinking age when SBCL grew an interpreter. 21:57:39 -!- kofno_ [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:58:24 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:59:07 pkhuong: only the official standard as a whole, most of it is much older 21:59:41 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-204-75-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [] 21:59:44 You don't say. 22:01:00 :D 22:01:25 milosn_ [~milosn@user-5AF50D67.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #lisp 22:03:51 -!- milosn [~milosn@user-5AF50394.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:04:34 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:04:56 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 22:05:10 -!- gridaphobe [~user@128.54.50.38] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:05:22 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 22:05:30 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:06:19 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:03 gridapho` [~user@128.54.50.38] has joined #lisp 22:08:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-181-83.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:08:18 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abot26.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 22:10:42 -!- francogrex [~user@109.134.227.146] has left #lisp 22:10:57 -!- ISF [~ivan@189.61.220.247] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:11:52 ISF [~ivan@189.61.220.247] has joined #lisp 22:12:34 -!- gridapho` [~user@128.54.50.38] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:13:36 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:16:44 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.96.129] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:17:15 gridaphobe [~user@128.54.50.38] has joined #lisp 22:21:27 -!- gnul0ver [~jonrugel@ip72-201-76-204.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:23:15 -!- mcsontos_ [~mcsontos@77.240.184.15] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:25:33 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 22:26:59 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-67-35.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:27:30 cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-67-35.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 22:28:10 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:28:34 What would be the best way to somehow "attach" to a running lisp to get it to load a file? I'm trying to have a "server" lisp which needs to periodically be told to re-load a configuration or somesuch. 22:29:11 jack_rabbit: have it run a swank server. 22:29:13 jack_rabbit: sockets? 22:29:18 So you just have to M-x slime-connect to it. 22:29:51 Well if I just wanted to run an sbcl script that caused the lisp to update, I'd have to use sockets then? 22:30:16 You'd use whatever you've configured swank to use. Sockets, pipes, whatever. 22:30:21 It really doesn't matter. 22:30:31 pjb, I can use swank without slime in emacs, though? 22:30:43 Sure. 22:30:56 Cool. I'll try that out. 22:30:57 Just type (ql:quickload :swank) (swank:create-server) and that's it. 22:31:24 Swank is just a REPL for whatever you send to it, right? 22:31:42 then you can connect to the server in emacs with M-x slime-connect. or if you don't want emacs you could look at how swank works and write your own minimal communication program. 22:31:54 The alternative is to start your lisp in detachtty or in screen, detach them, and when you want to load something connect to the computer, reattach to the tty pr screen, and give your commands. 22:32:20 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-67-35.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:32:56 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:33:31 -!- ase [~se@ip56583baa.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:33:41 I'll have to look at swank. I want something where I can just type ./update-server or something at the prompt. The alternative would be an (loop (eval (read ...))) on a socket stream. 22:33:56 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:35:56 axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:36:01 jack_rabbit: or you can run a web server in the lisp 22:36:23 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:36:23 then publish a url which does your desired action 22:36:44 then from command line you can use something like wget to send the request to your server 22:36:59 although running a whole web server in the lisp just for one command might be a bit overkill... 22:37:26 or if you want an interactive login to the lisp (without needing emacs), run a telnet server in the lisp. 22:37:27 as apposed to a whole IDE? 22:38:53 jasom: there's always the classic SIGHUP handler. 22:38:55 i don't find the idea of remote updating to be really enticing 22:38:57 new [~eamon@subtlepath.org] has joined #lisp 22:39:07 Rax 22:39:51 many code changes will require restarting the whole image to ensure proper updating 22:40:08 you could use scriptl for this too actually 22:40:19 -!- nikodem [~mikey@user-46-112-14-36.play-internet.pl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:40:21 it runs a tiny server and has wrappers specifically for command-line interaction 22:40:29 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 22:40:39 i'd just connect with ssh, restart the thing 22:40:46 you can run scripts with ssh too 22:41:04 -!- zolk3ri [~Zol1ka@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:41:32 i thought the main problem was actually talking to the lisp, or is there an ssh implementation in CL? 22:42:01 no, i'm just discarding the idea of updating code by loading it on top of existing 22:42:09 you could restart, though i'm not sure why you'd want to, unless you're concerned about symbol garbage or old definitions or something 22:42:30 for example, your old code defines a method for initialize-instance, the new doesn't 22:42:35 just loading the new code won't help 22:42:39 sure 22:43:08 you'd have to write elaborate update programs 22:43:31 Depends on how often you restart your lisp image when developing. I don't do that often. More often, it's because of slime than because of my code. 22:43:35 hrm 22:44:19 i do on a regular basis when i'm trying to make sure everything actually loads from a cold start 22:44:20 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 22:44:37 what i'd do, have a script that restarts SBCL in a loop, on each start up it loads code a new 22:44:58 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:44:59 or just have sbcl exec itself heh 22:45:03 push new code with git, run an ssh script which will kill the current sbcl instance, it'll be restarted by a loop 22:46:16 -!- kilon [~kilon@unaffiliated/thekilon] has quit [] 22:46:29 cdidd [~cdidd@128-72-204-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 22:46:37 Joreji [~thomas@72-228.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 22:47:02 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 22:48:53 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has joined #lisp 22:48:59 oGMo: the script can also double as a watchdog 22:50:21 who watchdogs the watchdog 22:50:39 a watchcat 22:51:12 findiggle2 [~kirkwood@67.40.30.237] has joined #lisp 22:52:39 snearch [~snearch@f053010157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 22:52:51 And a watchmouse to watch the watchcat? 22:53:37 -!- findiggle1 [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:57:03 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:59:06 -!- Joreji [~thomas@72-228.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:03:18 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 23:03:48 oGMo: the BMC. 23:04:18 -!- ebobby [~fms@189.170.27.127] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:04:20 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5d84f6dd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 23:04:44 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:08 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 23:05:20 Joreji [~thomas@72-228.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 23:07:31 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:09:15 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 23:14:29 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:17:49 -!- stopbit [~stopbit@static-108-48-124-82.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:18:56 -!- segv- [~mb@dslb-094-223-000-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: segv-] 23:19:16 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:19:31 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 23:19:38 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7549f9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 23:21:14 -!- add^_ [~add^_@m37-3-63-237.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: The Garbage Collector got me...] 23:22:29 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 23:23:55 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:25:47 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl6-50-240.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 23:26:18 -!- paul0 [~paul0@177.96.48.107] has quit [Disconnected by services] 23:26:25 stassats: I have genworks.com running in a loop 23:26:50 a bash script "safe-start" that runs the actual start script in an infinite looip 23:26:52 loop 23:26:58 bubo [~bubo@91.224.149.58] has joined #lisp 23:26:59 inspired by mysql's safe_start 23:27:13 so if the server dies for any reason it just pops back up 23:27:21 Now I find out that for the past week or so, 23:27:26 it's been dying every 5 minutes 23:27:44 because of a sleeping thread which tries to wake up and update some stuff every 5 minutes 23:27:52 francisl_ [~flavoie@199.84.162.167] has joined #lisp 23:27:53 crashing something 23:28:09 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.239] has joined #lisp 23:28:27 so that's been going on, and I never noticed it 23:28:35 it's still doing it. I have to get around to fixing that ;) 23:30:02 ahahaha http://twitter.com/DanaDanger/status/290947612373286912/photo/1 23:30:53 awesome :) 23:31:26 she's one of the people at twitter who are spearheading replacing the last bits of ruby infra with scala, AIUI (: 23:31:35 pretty brills 23:31:59 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:31:59 -!- francisl_ is now known as francisl 23:32:13 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:33:39 -!- f03lipe [~f03lipe@186.205.212.50] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:34:39 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:35:00 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 23:35:24 Giulii [~canaima@190.200.153.160] has joined #lisp 23:35:45 brandonz_ [~brandon@199-188-193-145.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined #lisp 23:36:40 <_schulte_> any pointers to best-practices when reading/writing from/to a hash across multiple threads 23:36:46 Hi 23:37:23 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.162.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:40:47 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 23:44:07 Posterdati [~antani@host106-212-dynamic.10-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 23:44:43 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@128-72-204-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:45:07 cdidd [~cdidd@128-72-204-179.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 23:45:37 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:46:45 _schulte_: don't, find a lock-free implementation, go for a synchronised one, lock. 23:50:27 -!- myx [~myx@pppoe-211-174-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:52:16 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-185-82-146.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:52:51 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 23:53:57 bitonic [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 23:55:44 -!- Giulii [~canaima@190.200.153.160] has left #lisp 23:58:59 Jubb [~ghost@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:59:23 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.70] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]