00:04:00 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:06:02 -!- francisl_ [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Quit: francisl_] 00:06:56 -!- surrounder [~surrounde@095-096-032-026.static.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:07:00 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-38-170.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:07:02 -!- spiderweb [~lcc@unaffiliated/lcc] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:07:47 surrounder [~surrounde@095-096-032-026.static.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 00:09:44 Krystof: Thanks. 00:11:31 -!- francisl [~anonymous@199.84.162.167] has quit [Quit: francisl] 00:12:00 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.162.167] has joined #lisp 00:13:40 zophy [~sy@24.111.9.10] has joined #lisp 00:14:52 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 00:16:10 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.162.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:19:26 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:24:55 stassats: it's possible to do with an AMD desktop CPU, but you need to make sure the BIOS supports it. 00:25:41 yrk: you might want to consider not using md5 for storing passwords in favor of e.g. pbkdf2 00:25:43 i know, but i'm not a fan of AMD 00:26:39 *jasom* had so much trouble figuring out which motherboards could handle ECC that he just went with a xeon 00:26:51 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 00:27:56 It was like $200 more than going AMD so not a huge deal 00:28:13 I'm not a starving college student anymore 00:28:37 jasom: AMD is now, because of you! 00:29:17 If they wanted me to buy their kit, they should have made it easier to figure out which motherboards could do ecc 00:29:20 -!- cromwell__ [~quassel@24-158-227-141.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 00:29:38 cromwell [~quassel@24-158-227-141.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has joined #lisp 00:30:39 sw2wolf [~czsq888@220.166.238.20] has joined #lisp 00:31:29 agumonkey [~agu@27.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 00:31:51 -!- cromwell [~quassel@24-158-227-141.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:34:22 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@72-48-145-180.static.grandenetworks.net] has quit [] 00:37:08 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-024-068.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:37:37 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 00:38:27 and``_ [~and``@cpc16-cmbg17-2-0-cust555.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 00:38:29 user123abc [~sally@c-67-171-79-251.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:41:23 -!- and`` [~and``@cpc16-cmbg17-2-0-cust555.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:41:23 -!- and``_ is now known as and`` 00:48:16 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:49:09 -!- gridaphobe [~user@128.54.49.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:49:25 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:50:47 jasom: I already salt and repeat with md5, so I doubt that I'd get a huge security increase from that. I do realize that md5 is a bit old though 00:51:59 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:53:05 -!- Blkt [~user@82.84.188.5] has quit [Quit: good night!] 00:56:55 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 00:57:12 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-141-188.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:57:42 -!- amado [~amado@187.209.62.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:58:14 EventHorizon [~asdf@107-200-38-103.lightspeed.tulsok.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:58:52 -!- [SLB] is now known as [SLB]` 00:59:50 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:01:28 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 01:05:38 -!- Kvaks [~kvaks@62.16.128.193] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:07:15 francisl [~anonymous@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 01:09:21 amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has joined #lisp 01:09:22 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] 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[~someone@c-76-121-128-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:14:37 -!- ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 02:15:08 ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has joined #lisp 02:19:35 cromwell [~quassel@24-158-227-141.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has joined #lisp 02:19:44 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:20:23 -!- cromwell is now known as perman 02:20:59 -!- perman [~quassel@24-158-227-141.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:22:15 -!- Rinaldo [~someone@c-76-121-128-34.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:31:04 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.240.176.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:31:35 samrat [~samrat@49.244.91.74] has joined #lisp 02:31:47 -!- Forty-3 [~seana11@96.241.56.222] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:33:48 -!- bitonic` [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:34:36 echo-area [~user@182.92.247.2] has 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quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:08:42 xan__ [~xan@80.174.78.136.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 03:10:18 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.251.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:11:10 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 03:11:29 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 03:12:18 -!- Daisy [~Daisy@c-3d42e555.143-16-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:12:45 Daisy [~Daisy@c-3d42e555.143-16-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 03:15:52 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 03:16:37 i don't think there is a way to know inside compute-effective-slot-definition whether a slot-option was supplied to a direct-definition or not, is there? 03:18:07 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:20:31 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 03:20:46 short of having passed-p slots and setting them in initialize-instance 03:21:13 zerowaitstate [~dwaites@ppp-70-254-44-53.dsl.lgvwtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 03:21:28 where are the MOP-heads when you need them? 03:21:30 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:21:48 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 03:23:32 -!- blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:23:36 another option seems to set initforms of the direct-slot-definitions slots to something like #:dummy, and then check for it and do all the defaulting in compute-effective-slot-definition 03:24:50 or even '(#:dummy actual-initform) 03:25:04 nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 03:26:24 sw2wolf [~czsq888@220.166.238.20] has joined #lisp 03:26:53 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:27:45 kanru` [~kanru@118-163-10-190.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 03:28:14 -!- samrat [~samrat@49.244.91.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:30:25 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:33:55 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 03:34:29 cfy` [~cfy@218.75.27.165] has joined #lisp 03:34:44 -!- cfy` [~cfy@218.75.27.165] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:38:50 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 03:40:02 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.153.37.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:42:15 when with the latter, seems to work fine 03:43:07 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.153.37.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has joined #lisp 03:43:10 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 03:44:03 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 03:48:36 hydandata [~user@ip-89-103-110-14.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 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#lisp 04:14:45 k0001 [~k0001@host225.190-136-195.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 04:15:37 robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:20:42 -!- nan_` [~user@46.197.116.88] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:35:29 -!- SunMoonStar [~maks@ool-457f5814.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:36:18 -!- ChibaPet [~Thunderbi@fsf/member/chibapet] has quit [Quit: ChibaPet] 04:36:38 ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@fsf/member/chibapet] has joined #lisp 04:37:30 -!- bind [~bind@5ED5B26C.cm-7-6c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:38:43 springz [~springz@123.151.195.1] has joined #lisp 04:39:23 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@220.166.238.20] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:39:41 sw2wolf [~czsq888@220.166.238.20] has joined #lisp 04:42:24 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Quit: reboot] 04:42:49 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:43:34 -!- pirateking-_- [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has quit [Quit: pirateking-_-] 04:46:07 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:46:15 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 04:46:15 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:46:15 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has joined #lisp 04:48:22 emacs-dwim [~user@cpe-67-241-1-145.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:49:59 -!- francisl_ [~flavoie@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: francisl_] 04:49:59 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:50:03 dodo_ [~dodo@50.117.114.6] has joined #lisp 04:50:19 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 04:50:19 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:50:19 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has joined #lisp 04:50:50 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:52:18 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 04:53:15 recently there was an article comparing libraries that generate docs from lisp package definitions and/or docstrings, does anyone have a link to that? 04:54:46 bananagram [~bananagra@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:55:35 benny [~user@i577A8DEA.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 04:56:56 nevermind, found it: https://sites.google.com/site/sabraonthehill/lisp-document-generation-apps 04:58:00 it's the answer-your-questions time 04:58:07 -your-own- 05:00:14 so quiet here compared with #racket and #haskell :) 05:00:30 let's keep it that way 05:00:41 i think so 05:05:22 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Quit: brb] 05:05:41 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:05:41 -!- 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[~kennyd@78-1-141-188.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 06:28:00 -!- francisl [~anonymous@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: francisl] 06:30:27 _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has joined #lisp 06:34:03 -!- linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917310.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 06:34:03 is there a degress->radians function builtin to cl? 06:34:10 *degrees 06:34:22 clhs pi 06:34:22 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_pi.htm 06:34:48 it's just a multiplication. 06:35:09 Bike: i know 06:35:46 i also knowi can build my own easily 06:35:57 (defun degress->radians (degress) (* degress pi 1/180)) ; now there is. 06:36:09 well, i don't think there'a anything built in for it. system functions use radians exclusively far as I know 06:36:24 Bike: right - that's what i wanted to know - thanks! 06:36:48 cl-svg uses degrees. 06:36:59 probably cause svg 1.1 does... 06:37:29 i suppose it's useful to have exact angles. 06:40:30 exact as in integer? 06:40:38 yeah. 06:41:29 oh, no, svg uses floats regardless apparently. 06:41:37 -!- zxq9 [~zxq9@FL1-111-169-176-119.okn.mesh.ad.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:41:58 or rather i meant rational 06:43:18 but many things in geometry are not rational, like pi, sqrt(2), so, i guess there isn't much of a point 06:44:21 interestingly, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rational_trigonometry 06:44:46 yeah, i was going to mention that, but it's a bit exotic for graphics, as of yet at least 06:45:36 so is lisp! 06:46:06 obviously we need a competing lisp-vector-graphics 06:46:48 k0001 [~k0001@host133.190-136-197.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 06:47:26 nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 06:47:51 bind [~bind@D4B2749A.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #lisp 06:47:58 let's name it HD-vector-graphics, though 06:48:16 would sell like hotcakes! 06:49:56 (defun deg-rad (deg) (* deg /180)) 06:51:05 nydel [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:51:40 -!- user123abc [~sally@c-67-171-79-251.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:51:42 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host133.190-136-197.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:53:21 a built-in function to turn a number into a string? 06:54:06 princ-to-string 06:54:06 -!- Bike [~Glossina@67-5-240-27.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:54:10 (string 1234) gives an error 06:54:33 H4ns: thank you kindly, i appreciate it! 06:54:56 Bike [~Glossina@207-224-23-226.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:55:22 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 07:02:20 pirateking-_- [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has joined #lisp 07:02:42 nydel: you can also use format,like (format nil "~a" 1234) 07:04:10 -!- p_l is now known as p_l|work 07:06:02 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 07:06:07 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:06:41 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has quit [Quit: gigamonkey] 07:07:46 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 07:09:43 foom [jknight@nat/google/x-qoecvjmbdhbuless] has joined #lisp 07:09:46 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:12:53 -!- p_nathan [~anunknown@75.87.250.229] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:14:30 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:15:32 nydel: write-to-string, princ-to-string's cousin, also takes a :radix argument (should you need it). 07:15:54 and many other arguments 07:16:42 segv-: :radix is rarely useful, perhaps you mean :base? 07:17:28 stassats: yup, that's what i mean. thanks. 07:17:30 thanks cfy segv- stassats ... i didn't realize format would do that 07:17:55 and it's :radix in parse-integer, how convenient! 07:18:06 nydel: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/22_cb.htm and http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/22_cc.htm 07:18:07 the things i know about format could fill a book, the things i don't could fill the rest of my life 07:18:39 nydel: well, it's actually simple 07:19:06 stassats: format is simple!? 07:20:12 nydel: compared to some other stuff?... yes 07:20:19 nydel: well, of course 07:20:21 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-8-177.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:20:33 And while the syntax isn't best, I find the power of format to be sometimes refreshing 07:21:44 well, maybe pprint-logical-block stuff is hard, other stuff in format is straightforward 07:22:22 niels1 [~niels@p4FD6C04B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:22:28 just read the specs, and you'll know all there's to know about it 07:22:33 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 07:22:33 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 07:22:33 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 07:23:00 slime-format-string-expand makes it seem a lot simpler 07:24:25 if only the specs didn't use single letters to refer to parameters 07:27:03 pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has joined #lisp 07:27:38 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:28:08 slime arglist display for format directives would be really helpful there 07:29:11 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:30:11 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 07:30:13 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:30:31 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 07:30:31 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:30:58 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 07:32:06 that actually can be written in a couple of evenings, anyone up to the challenge? 07:32:39 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:33:42 what would that do, like have "mincol padchar commachar comma-interval" pop up if the point's at ~[]d? 07:33:43 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:34:00 right 07:34:20 with mincol highlighted 07:37:11 paolo_m [~user@2-228-95-110.ip190.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:40:12 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 07:40:26 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@108.87.20.77] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 07:42:00 might be a good way to learn how slime works, but right now i know barely anything so it would probably take me a while. 07:42:49 agumonkey [~agu@27.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 07:43:45 -!- sweet_kid [~Unknown@unaffiliated/changednicks] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:44:23 -!- rotty [rotty@de.xx.vu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:44:32 rotty [rotty@de.xx.vu] has joined #lisp 07:44:35 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [] 07:44:51 -!- am0c [~am0c@am0c.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:44:51 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[~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: nforgerit] 09:37:13 -!- zophy [~sy@24.111.9.10] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:37:54 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 09:38:35 limetree [~user@194-218-167-2.customer.telia.com] has joined #lisp 09:47:34 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-uhctuwechevmihdr] has joined #lisp 09:51:04 nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 10:00:32 shwouchk [~shwouchk@unaffiliated/shwouchk] has joined #lisp 10:00:33 hello 10:00:34 shwouchk, memo from pjb-v`: you could use cl-stepper to trace a function running in a thread, but you would have to add locks on output (or just redirect the tracing to a thread-specific stream, which is already designed for). cl-stepper is in (ql:quickload :com.informatimago.common-lisp). 10:00:54 pjb, thanks 10:01:51 -!- Joreji [~thomas@82-054.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:02:26 can I suppress the compilation noted about not being able to optimize stuff? 10:03:25 also, what does this mean?: style-warning: The function has an odd number of arguments in the keyword portion. 10:04:02 schoppenhauer: keyword arguments come in "pairs" composed of :keyword value 10:04:43 odd number of arguments means that something is wrong with the arguments 10:05:15 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:05:41 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 10:06:10 p_l|work, but I called with an even number! for example (I got a warning on this line): (display-add-shape win *edge-list* :color color) 10:07:43 check the arglist for display-add-shape 10:07:48 maybe macroexpand it, even 10:08:02 did check 10:08:47 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-233-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:09:08 p_l|work, (defmethod display-add-shape ((win the-window) edges &key (color nil) (update nil)) ... 10:10:53 shwouchk: are you sure you're checking the right function? 10:11:13 can I somehow unbind a function? I think maybe it is warning me because of an older version 10:11:22 -!- jasom [~aidenn@ip70-191-80-19.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:11:28 fmakunbound 10:11:50 bitonic` [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 10:11:52 but it's rare that you need that 10:12:36 jasom [~aidenn@ip70-191-80-19.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:13:02 -!- ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 10:13:25 changing the arglist of a GF in SBCL being one of them 10:13:32 ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has joined #lisp 10:13:37 cases when it's needed, that is 10:14:23 I would have expected evaluating a defgeneric form for that GF to do it without fmakunbound 10:14:26 jdz, and this is exactly what I did 10:14:40 mal_, indeed, I did as well 10:14:45 mal_: have you tried it before talking? 10:15:20 no, I don't have sbcl handy on this machine 10:15:31 jdz, fmakunbound worked 10:15:39 no warning anymoer 10:15:41 anymore 10:16:31 now, is there a way to suppress "unable to optimize" notes that litted the compilation output? 10:17:11 shwouchk: don't ask compiler to optimize what it cannot 10:17:18 shwouchk: or provide the information it needs 10:18:12 jdz, I am not! I have this set: (declaim (optimize (debug 3) (speed 0) (space 0) (compilation-speed 0))) 10:18:59 shwouchk: well, then apparently it is not your code the compiler is complaining about, right? 10:20:09 jdz, the compiler complains about the functions defined in this file (where I have the declaim) 10:21:04 jdz, actually, you are right 10:21:19 yes, it is complaining about foreign function calls 10:21:33 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.172.62.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:22:44 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 10:23:59 jdz, all the more reason for me to want to hide the notes 10:25:43 does the compilation actually fail (with no fasl created) when I'm told in slime it did, or does it just say that when there were warnings but actually create a fasl? 10:26:06 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-38-170.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:26:35 shwouchk: http://www.sbcl.org/manual/Controlling-Verbosity.html, and :around methods on the systems that are chatty 10:26:44 shwouchk: why don't you check? 10:27:23 jdz, good question. Seems like it does create the fasl 10:27:40 H4ns, thanks 10:32:45 kmels [~kmels@frbg-5f732ad9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 10:32:50 -!- paolo_m [~user@2-228-95-110.ip190.fastwebnet.it] has left #lisp 10:35:33 Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 10:37:22 -!- tfb [~tfb@fw-tnat.cambridge.arm.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:38:13 -!- H4ns [hans@netzhansa.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:41:53 Xizor [~Xizor@c83-252-198-185.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 10:43:10 -!- Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:44:24 -!- pjb-v` [~t@voyager.informatimago.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:45:07 nan_ [~user@46.197.116.88] has joined #lisp 10:47:22 -!- Odyessus [~odyessus@chello080109062130.15.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 10:48:09 H4ns [hans@netzhansa.com] has joined #lisp 10:49:40 gravicappa 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[~kpal@janus-nat-128-240-225-120.ncl.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 13:39:22 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Quit: home] 13:41:14 -!- francisl [~anonymous@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:42:01 francisl [~anonymous@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 13:45:09 Yuuhi [benni@p5483ABBB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:45:40 -!- niels2 [~niels@p4FD6EBB3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 13:48:13 -!- tfb [~tfb@fw-tnat.cambridge.arm.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:50:13 Raptum [~Raptum@168.8.27.4] has joined #lisp 13:53:36 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:53:51 I see there's quite a few lisp compilers out there, any decent cross-platform ones you guys/gals would recommend? 13:54:09 Raptum: sbcl, clozure cl 13:54:32 ah, good. i was leaning towards SBCL already 13:54:36 thank you. 13:55:24 -!- Guest74869 [~lizzin@c-24-14-148-164.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:56:20 lizzin [~lizzin@c-24-14-148-164.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:56:44 -!- lizzin is now known as Guest21446 13:58:06 is there a portable compiler or interpreter for windows? 13:58:07 Raptum: clozure supports some platforms that SBCL doesn't. ECL and CLISP have tendency to run even in weird places 13:58:32 SBCL's support is afaik still experimental on windows, CCL works fine on windows with any recent version? 13:58:38 s/\?// 13:59:12 portable as in, usb drive portable 14:00:04 Raptum: I think all of the open source ones work at that 14:00:28 just the usual cases of having to make sure you have right paths for stuff running outside of the directories they are stored 14:00:37 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 14:00:54 -!- kpal [~kpal@janus-nat-128-240-225-120.ncl.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:01:03 well i am just trying to install it on my school network 14:01:04 Forty-3 [~seana11@pool-72-66-104-130.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:01:28 oho. clozure just might work 14:01:39 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Client Quit] 14:01:50 is there any particular reason clozure and clojure have such similar names? 14:02:00 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 14:02:03 outside of also being similar to closure? 14:04:23 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:04:36 auganov [~user@77-254-179-15.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #lisp 14:04:46 one last question; what would be preferable for a schemer migrating to clisp? 14:05:49 Raptum: no idea about name similarity outside of the "closure" thing 14:05:55 as for migrating... no idea 14:06:08 Practical Common Lisp is pretty good walkthrough over CL 14:06:17 to start from scratch, or just peruse a reference and documentation 14:06:34 alright. i think i will go with PCL. 14:06:42 Raptum: please do not say "clisp" when you mean commmon lisp. clisp is an implementation of common lisp. if common lisp is too long for you, use cl. 14:06:57 H4ns: alright. 14:07:04 Raptum: when coming from scheme, try to forget as much as you can :) 14:07:14 haha ok 14:07:18 Raptum: in particular, unlearn "recursion is for everything" 14:07:32 BTW, what's the general feelings about "Land of Lisp"? (I have no idea how it relates to schemers...) 14:07:53 Sorry if that's derailing... 14:08:03 I just read it and loved it 14:08:33 -!- whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.10.77] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:10:44 it seems quite good, but I haven't read in-depth into it 14:12:25 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 14:13:37 -!- francisl [~anonymous@bas6-montreal45-2925066520.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: francisl] 14:13:45 does CL have as good support for creating DSLs as scheme? 14:14:17 Raptum: when you say "support for creating DSLs", do you mean "does it have macros?" 14:14:17 yes 14:14:28 does it have macros that function similarly 14:14:37 SHUPFS [~hercules@S0106001111de1fc8.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 14:14:51 Raptum: not quite. they are not hygienic, but cl lovers usually see that as being an advantage. 14:15:20 H4ns: ah. i'm sure i can get used to it 14:20:19 -!- Raptum [~Raptum@168.8.27.4] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:21:07 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:21:20 -!- Xizor [~Xizor@c83-252-198-185.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:22:04 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@unaffiliated/Buglouse] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:25:54 -!- auganov [~user@77-254-179-15.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:26:38 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 14:27:44 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:28:18 -!- renard_ [~renard@cw-svc0.chezwam.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:28:36 tensorpudding [~tensorpud@108.87.20.77] has joined #lisp 14:29:10 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 14:29:17 renard_ [~renard@2a01:e0b:1:150:ca0a:a9ff:fef1:a847] has joined #lisp 14:29:49 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-toddqgqfqkfnwgui] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:34:23 -!- kilon [~user@unaffiliated/thekilon] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:34:26 Buglouse [~Buglouse@unaffiliated/Buglouse] has joined #lisp 14:35:30 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.20] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:37:08 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.10] has joined #lisp 14:41:42 -!- Upasna is now known as sweet_kid 14:42:06 -!- bind [~bind@D4B2749A.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:42:15 "empty your mind" 14:42:40 neoChat [~Admin@cpc7-newc14-2-0-cust817.gate.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 14:42:41 http://www.neochat.co.uk - New chat community, make it your new home!!! 14:42:41 that's a lolapalooza 14:42:43 -!- neoChat [~Admin@cpc7-newc14-2-0-cust817.gate.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #lisp 14:43:41 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:45:19 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:45:36 Kenjin [~josesanto@2.81.200.72] has joined #lisp 14:45:42 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 14:47:42 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 14:48:44 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 14:50:46 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:51:55 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 14:54:02 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has joined #lisp 14:54:14 tfb [~tfb@fw-tnat.cambridge.arm.com] has joined #lisp 14:54:50 abeaumont [~abeaumont@113.Red-83-49-116.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:55:20 can I have nested ifs in a loop? 14:55:52 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Quit: francisl] 14:56:52 nm 14:56:55 apparently I can 14:57:02 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 14:57:07 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:58:04 -!- leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has quit [Client Quit] 14:58:24 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 14:58:26 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has joined #lisp 14:58:42 yes you can indeed 14:59:07 -!- dabr [~dabr@62-2-164-173.static.cablecom.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:59:09 -!- leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has quit [Client Quit] 14:59:49 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has joined #lisp 14:59:50 antgreen [~user@dsl-207-112-126-76.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 14:59:53 mr_vile [~carnage@9ch.in] has joined #lisp 15:00:36 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:01:36 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Excess Flood] 15:01:44 -!- leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has quit [Client Quit] 15:01:59 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:02:10 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has joined #lisp 15:02:49 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 15:04:10 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:05:42 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 15:06:03 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 15:06:29 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Client Quit] 15:06:44 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d002f27.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:07:23 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 15:07:59 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:11:08 -!- Joreji [~thomas@87-200.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:11:29 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:18:22 normanrichards [~normanric@72-48-145-180.static.grandenetworks.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:56 axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:21:49 -!- Cymew [~user@fw01d.snowmen.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:21:59 pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has joined #lisp 15:22:24 Raptum [~Raptum@168.8.27.4] has joined #lisp 15:24:41 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 15:25:01 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:25:12 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-229-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:26:05 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:26:27 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:26:32 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-90-138.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:29:35 urandom__ [~user@ip-88-152-215-192.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #lisp 15:30:04 peterhil- [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has joined #lisp 15:31:12 -!- peterhil- [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:31:57 findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:32:32 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:32:56 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 15:32:56 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 15:32:56 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:32:58 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:35:12 Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 15:37:45 whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has joined #lisp 15:37:53 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has left #lisp 15:38:17 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:40:22 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 15:40:24 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:41:05 findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:41:07 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 15:41:14 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:41:19 Hello everyone 15:41:51 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 15:41:53 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:42:25 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 15:42:32 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:42:34 what is with the strange function names in CL? (mapcar mapc aref etc. 15:42:35 ) 15:42:38 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:42:46 Raptum: they're historical 15:42:52 shin__ [~shin@ip-31-13-228-40.ip.daticum.com] has joined #lisp 15:43:00 browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 15:43:26 francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has joined #lisp 15:43:32 i'm used to car and cdr, but moving from scheme to CL and map being mapcar, it just feels weird; i'm sure it'll come up in the book though 15:43:38 http://paste.lisp.org/display/133984 15:44:10 -!- shin__ [~shin@ip-31-13-228-40.ip.daticum.com] has left #lisp 15:44:18 the sbcl profiler show that the two functions culd be optimlized 15:44:29 I know remove-duplicates is slow 15:45:36 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-164-252.w109-222.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:46:08 but how to replace T0 that is a sort of histogram maker it counts and bins data 15:46:28 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:47:03 asedeno_work [asedeno@nat/google/x-ajapgqssnqoidyzi] has joined #lisp 15:47:15 Raptum: why is reduce called inject in ruby(i think thats what it's called)? it's a different language. 15:47:25 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:47:51 well the two languages have a common origin, i just wondered where the difference came in 15:48:55 pavelpenev: ruby has both inject() and reduce() 15:49:01 pavelpenev: Do exactly the same thing. 15:49:10 Raptum: Common Lisp is descendent from maclisp, scheme is it's own thing, if they have a common heritege, it's far older than both of them. 15:49:28 cdidd [~cdidd@128-68-180-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 15:49:42 pavelpenev: okay, thanks :3 15:52:36 Raptum: you can argue that those xml based languages are lisps and have a common origin with common lisp with the same success :) 15:53:00 oh, i don't mean to argue against the change; i just wondered why it happened 15:53:05 Raptum: specifically one of CL's design goals was to make it not be too hard to port large existing bodies of code. Scheme did not have that constraint 15:53:39 So a lot of CL's names are because people did not want to change a lot of already-crufty code... 15:53:59 Raptum: it happened because the creators of scheme didn't create a lisp descendant, but instead a lisp inspired language. 15:54:24 gffa [~unknown@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 15:54:34 gotcha 15:55:17 also, of course, it is very important to use traditional names. CL is like the church latin of lisps :-) 15:55:28 they changed setq to set!, and defun to (define foo (lambda ...)) 15:55:33 i do like latin. 15:56:26 Raptum: also notice that there is more that just mapcar in lisp: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_mapc_.htm 15:56:32 that's why CL is upper case of course. No lower case in 10AD 15:57:08 ha 15:57:11 Raptum: there is also map, which is a bit different: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_map.htm 15:59:03 Raptum: http://hyperpolyglot.org/lisp 15:59:07 tfb: it is good, i believe, to be a bit more precise in this case: cl is case sensitive, but it _reads_ in upcase by default 15:59:53 gensym: oh, thanks 16:01:01 it seems pretty compiler-specific for many things, but it has plenty of good stuff 16:01:04 gensym: I see that page makes the mistake I just mentioned, "are identifiers case sensitive? -> no" is wrong. 16:02:01 also "identifier characters" and so on. It confused the reader with the language, 16:02:08 case upcaseing happens in the reader, |foo| is a different identifier than FOO. 16:03:32 Raptum: also note that many idioms you might have picked up from scheme do not apply to CL at all. 16:03:46 i'm aware 16:04:05 Of course one of the tragedies of CL is that although it will print roman numerals, it don'w by default read them. 16:04:09 'tis why i picked up a book that just teaches it from scratch 16:04:15 pavelpenev: i just skimmed the page 16:04:28 That's actually the only thing I would change about CL: default number format should be roman numerals 16:04:30 however i think i found coming from haskell to scheme to CL easier than i probably would have haskell to CL 16:04:35 Raptum: what's compiler-specific? 16:04:53 oGMo: just the terminal commands and whatnot 16:05:12 command-line flags and such 16:05:17 oh, sure heh 16:05:42 tcr [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 16:05:43 other non-Standard(tm) things are too, but many good packages abstract the differences 16:06:15 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:06:58 Raptum: this is my favorite example to prove that scheme and cl are very different in their idioms: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3195982690560792@naggum.net.html 16:07:21 scheme is a perfectly valid lisp, but definitely different than CL 16:16:44 is there a `format` directive that consumes an argument but doesn't send it to the output stream 16:17:02 basically just discards the next argument 16:17:13 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:18:27 clhs ~* 16:18:27 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_cga.htm 16:19:02 H4ns: thanks 16:19:15 bjorkintosh [~bjork@ip68-13-229-200.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:19:39 nydel [~jo@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:21:09 -!- nydel [~jo@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:21:13 nydel0g [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:21:19 -!- nydel0g is now known as nydel 16:24:57 Xizor [~Xizor@c83-252-198-185.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 16:27:55 is it possible to set format characters, such as that ~Fx automatically means "#\Escape[xm" where x is a number? ideally i want to print to terminal in color but i want special ~x things (are they called directives?) to designate each color - anyone know what i need to look at for this? 16:28:05 Alice3 [~Alice@cpc3-grim12-0-0-cust856.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 16:28:34 clhs ~^ 16:28:35 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_cib.htm 16:28:42 nydel: I've done this before. It's best to just make your own formatter that does the replacement 16:28:52 rather to bend format to do it 16:30:02 is there a directive like ~^ but used to operate only on the first element of a list? 16:30:22 if there is Raptum i'd like to know it 16:30:48 peterhil` [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has joined #lisp 16:30:49 dlowe: this is what i'm doing right now, if you wouldn't mind taking a look: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1399989/ 16:31:36 Raptum: You mean to do something like (format t "~{~A~@^~}" some-list) instead of (format t "~A" (car some-list))? 16:31:48 dlowe: it works perfectly but i feel like there's a better way to write the color-print thing for my everyday commonlisp folder 16:32:34 clhs ~@ 16:32:34 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_c.htm 16:32:45 stlifey_ [~stlifey@59.35.103.32] has joined #lisp 16:33:37 i want to format the cdr of a list with ~t4 preceding each element 16:33:38 Raptum: Actually, the @ is just a modifier on ~^, but I just made up ~@^ in that case. 16:34:21 Raptum: Then why not ~{~A~^~T4~}? 16:35:02 Raptum: And do you mean ~4T? 16:35:02 nydel: this is what I did: http://paste.lisp.org/display/133985 16:35:11 smazga [~acrid@li336-165.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 16:35:16 sellout: wouldn't that apply ~t4 to all but the last element? 16:35:17 -!- stlifey [~stlifey@59.35.103.164] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:35:43 yes, ~4t, excuse me 16:35:45 Raptum: But if you want it before all but the first, that's the same as wanting it after all but the last, no? 16:36:07 You want it between every element. 16:36:13 how can I see the definitions of internal functions like count-if for example? is it by using disassemble? 16:36:14 herp derp 16:36:16 But you probably also want a ~% in there, I'm guessing. 16:36:20 i just brainfarted 16:36:25 yes, that's what i want. thanks. 16:36:44 jrajav [~jrajav@167.68.114.6] has joined #lisp 16:37:09 AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 16:38:08 peterhil- [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has joined #lisp 16:38:14 Cannot disassemble natively compiled function # but sbcl does it, the output is hard to read 16:39:04 -!- whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:39:05 dlowe: this looks much more comprehensive. could you write for me an example, how to call your (colorize) to write hello in Escape[31m ? 16:39:42 (colorize "&rhello" cxn) 16:39:59 francogrex: Which impl is telling you you can't? 16:39:59 q 16:40:08 cxn is another part of the program. there are multiple levels of color support there 16:40:12 ups, wrong window 16:40:21 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:41:03 dlowe: this is great - i think a lot of people would love to have this. thanks so much 16:41:06 francogrex: And by hard-to-read, do you mean it's in assembly? You're not going to get back the defining form. 16:41:27 oh yes, one last question: how can you remove the first element inside ~{~}? 16:42:01 francogrex: If you want to see the source, and you're using SLIME, M-. should get you there. 16:42:14 Raptum: check out ~* 16:42:17 whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has joined #lisp 16:42:30 i'd use ~* but it skips every other element 16:42:30 Raptum: Why don't you pass in (cdr my-list) as the argument? 16:42:43 because it's a nested list 16:43:01 i should probably use a map or something 16:43:50 sellout: the source would be in asm for example, or lisp or C... 16:43:56 xscc [~xscc@113.200.85.65] has joined #lisp 16:44:19 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:45:05 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:45:06 -!- Raptum [~Raptum@168.8.27.4] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:09 dlowe: do you have the dependent function definitions handy, account-of & ansi-level-of? if it's inconvenient thats okay, but i'm interested to see them, if they're close by 16:46:15 francogrex: I'm not sure what you're asking/saying. 16:46:30 nydel: they're just accessors 16:47:43 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:48:00 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:48:00 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-124-178.tc.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:48:00 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has joined #lisp 16:48:53 -!- xscc [~xscc@113.200.85.65] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 16:49:43 -!- whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:50:55 -!- browndawg [~prajjwal@117.201.180.35] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:51:28 -!- Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:51:45 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 16:51:47 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:53:51 -!- yates [~user@nc-71-54-138-0.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:53:51 browndawg1 [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 16:53:51 -!- browndawg1 [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has left #lisp 16:53:51 -!- nydel [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:53:51 -!- foom [jknight@nat/google/x-qoecvjmbdhbuless] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:53:57 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has joined #lisp 16:54:04 foom [jknight@nat/google/x-bxsgdezglsliyraj] has joined #lisp 16:54:07 nydel [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:54:11 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 17:00:16 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:00:25 -!- foom [jknight@nat/google/x-bxsgdezglsliyraj] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:00:25 -!- senj [~senj@S01060026f3e14440.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:00:54 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 17:01:07 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@unaffiliated/Buglouse] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:01:39 foom [jknight@nat/google/x-xogjdmzqidxfcdxm] has joined #lisp 17:02:14 mattrepl [~mattrepl@129.174.124.49] has joined #lisp 17:02:38 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:03:22 AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:03:46 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 17:05:05 sellout: me neither really! I am trying to take a cl code and translate it to something else 17:05:31 like javascript 17:07:24 Slivka [~Slivka@31.40.53.196] has joined #lisp 17:07:59 -!- Guest90004 [user@nat/google/x-fzisjnxnagymajgx] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:08:00 -!- amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:08:00 -!- sshirokov [sshirokov@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:08:00 Buglouse [~Buglouse@176.31.24.226] has joined #lisp 17:08:00 amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has joined #lisp 17:08:00 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@176.31.24.226] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:08:00 -!- amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 17:08:01 sshirokov [sshirokov@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has joined #lisp 17:08:04 amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has joined #lisp 17:08:31 -!- spacefrogg is now known as spacefrogg^ 17:08:43 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@167.68.114.6] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:09:18 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 17:09:32 -!- Viaken [~david@projecthq.biz] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:10:02 Buglouse [~Buglouse@unaffiliated/Buglouse] has joined #lisp 17:11:06 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 17:11:23 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-38-170.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:11:49 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-157.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 17:12:24 whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has joined #lisp 17:12:51 -!- paolo_m [~user@2-228-95-110.ip190.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:13:27 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:13:31 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 17:13:41 Viaken [~david@projecthq.biz] has joined #lisp 17:13:44 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 17:15:04 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d002f27.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 17:16:04 AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:17:04 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Quit: francisl] 17:20:24 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:20:36 -!- moore33 [~moore@ABordeaux-153-1-12-105.w92-146.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:21:14 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:21:22 whism [~user@c-76-126-149-247.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:21:24 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 17:22:31 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-210-0-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 17:22:51 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 17:22:54 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 17:23:33 AeroNotix [~xeno@cgo79.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:25:08 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.145] has joined #lisp 17:28:44 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 17:29:03 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:31:23 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:32:44 ferada [~ferada@dslb-088-069-039-183.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 17:33:04 moore33 [~moore@ABordeaux-153-1-71-216.w83-205.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:34:25 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.121.60] has joined #lisp 17:35:40 -!- _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has quit [Quit: ~ The Gnu went back to savannah ~] 17:36:01 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Quit: am0c] 17:36:10 am0c [~am0c@am0c.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #lisp 17:37:19 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:38:11 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-38-170.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:38:20 _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has joined #lisp 17:43:52 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:55 ikki [~ikki@187.240.178.219] has joined #lisp 17:47:34 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:49:18 bind [~bind@D4B2749A.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #lisp 17:51:00 ok here is a more tangible question, what is a better way to do this tabulation instead of looping 2 loops: http://pastebin.com/3UD8c9Kf 17:51:45 Bike [~Glossina@207-224-23-226.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 17:51:50 how do i run it? 17:52:33 -!- [SLB] is now known as [SLB]` 17:52:35 just a second i will give an example of the data 17:52:47 francogrex: can you sort the lists? That would let you do it much more efficiently 17:53:52 maxed is an integer like 800 ... observed and background are list of numbers like (1 45 47 454 454 74 10 34 ...) 17:54:07 jasom: I can sort copies of the lists 17:54:40 speed is what i'm after 17:55:08 not at the expense of the accuracy of course ;) 17:55:12 Once they are sorted, you can just walk the list and find the position of the firstt element less than 30,60,etc. 17:55:18 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@static-217-133-17-91.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:55:31 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 17:55:38 francogrex: a description of what you're actually doing would be helpful as well 17:56:53 stassats: yes I have a list of values (those are distances from an origin interms of time 17:57:12 and I want to have a mobile window 17:57:40 It looks like you are making a histogram, right francogrex? 17:57:43 a what? 17:57:44 scanning the region from 0 to say 800 and count/bin 17:58:16 jasom: yes a histogram, but iteratively, the bins are not fixed as you see they are "mobile" 17:58:23 what's mobile? 17:59:06 francogrex: in your example, they are of fixed size 30, right? 17:59:10 the so called bins, they're not just 0 30 60 ... but they can go more 0 to 30 then 0 to 60 then ... then 30 to 60 etc 17:59:24 jasom: that's a minimum size 17:59:44 a minimum width of a window but they can go up to a maximum 18:00:08 -!- _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has quit [Quit: ~ The Gnu went back to savannah ~] 18:00:44 "maxed" so it could be 0-30 or 0-800 all combinations really 18:00:50 Ralt_ [~Ralt@89-92-204-200.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 18:01:07 -!- whitedawg [~suraj@122.179.52.230] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:01:08 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 18:01:12 -!- Ralt_ [~Ralt@89-92-204-200.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:01:35 for i from j below maxed by 30" << you see 18:01:50 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:01:58 probably there is no other way than 2 loops 18:02:11 what would you do with the resulting data? 18:02:30 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 18:02:50 and why are you afraid of two loops? 18:02:58 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-90-138.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:04:14 I am using it for a scan test: http://www.biomedware.com/files/documentation/clusterseer/KScan/About_Kulldorffs_Scan.htm 18:04:50 not afraid stassats, I did a profiling and this is the step that takes most of the time 18:05:10 which step exactly? 18:05:42 binning the data (the function I posted) 18:07:13 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 18:08:33 that and another function that uses remove-duplicates http://pastebin.com/7mLMrGCn but that's expected because remove duplicates is known to be slow 18:08:44 Blkt [~user@82.84.188.5] has joined #lisp 18:08:55 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.121.60] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:09:00 I meant remove-if 18:09:08 remove-if is not known to be slow 18:09:31 then is it the nth s ? 18:09:55 I would suggest building a range tree 18:10:04 -!- tcr [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:10:50 i would suggest to use more abstractions, it'll be at least easier to reason about it 18:10:55 good evening everyone 18:11:00 ok 18:11:13 -!- peterhil- [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:11:17 i.e. for your data, just a binary search tree, which can be built in n log n time; then you can do range queries in O(log n + k) time 18:11:43 Krystof: for the binning 18:11:46 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:12:11 ok, I'll read a bout it I have an algorithm book somewhere 18:13:10 francogrex: you blame NTH and not (reduce #'max background)? 18:13:21 yes that too 18:13:48 i like the way you say "too" 18:13:49 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:16:13 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 18:16:45 mainly? 18:17:10 -!- egnarts-ms [~smsmfk@195.160.233.181] has left #lisp 18:18:03 performance of nth is just irrelevant compared to (reduce #'max background) 18:18:12 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 18:18:48 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:19:43 ok 18:19:50 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 18:20:58 -!- and`` [~and``@cpc16-cmbg17-2-0-cust555.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:21:15 and`` [~and``@cpc16-cmbg17-2-0-cust555.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 18:22:25 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:23:06 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:23:16 PCChris [~PCChris@dhcp-199-74-100-93.res-hall.northwestern.edu] has joined #lisp 18:24:17 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:24:19 -!- amado [~amado@209.99.3.216] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:25:27 -!- whism [~user@c-76-126-149-247.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #lisp 18:25:34 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:28:51 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:30:59 jrajav [~jrajav@167.68.114.6] has joined #lisp 18:31:02 -!- francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.1.2 $Revision: 1.796.2.4 $ (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:38:18 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-152-1.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:38:22 amado [~amado@187.209.15.110] has joined #lisp 18:39:24 -!- nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: nforgerit] 18:41:00 varjagg [u4973@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-chqucngalwfkjzkg] has joined #lisp 18:41:42 wakeup [~max@xdsl-89-0-160-91.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:41:43 Hi 18:41:53 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@72-48-145-180.static.grandenetworks.net] has quit [] 18:42:01 how do I create streams? Is this only possible via gray streams? 18:42:40 clhs stream 18:42:40 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/t_stream.htm 18:43:50 wakeup: yes, gray streams is the way 18:43:55 daimrod: that's not really helpful, is it? 18:43:59 daimrod: is? 18:44:00 it 18:44:04 ... 18:44:13 thanks stassats 18:44:18 some implementations have something called simple-streams 18:44:24 minion: trivial-gray-streams 18:44:25 trivial-gray-streams: No definition was found in the first 5 lines of http://www.cliki.net/trivial-gray-streams 18:44:44 I want o be portable 18:44:55 then trivial-gray-streams is the way to go 18:45:06 basically I just want a bidirectional character/binary stream 18:45:23 have you considered using flexi-streams? 18:45:29 minion: flexi-streams 18:45:30 flexi-streams: No definition was found in the first 5 lines of http://www.cliki.net/flexi-streams 18:46:19 whats the difference? 18:46:38 well, it provides bivalent streams, not sure about bidirectionalness 18:46:43 spiderweb [~lcc@unaffiliated/lcc] has joined #lisp 18:46:45 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:47:03 or by "character/binary" you didn't mean "at the same time"? 18:47:09 no 18:47:11 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.228.4] has joined #lisp 18:47:30 I thought I could use gray-streams with MAKE-TWO-WAY-STREAM 18:47:38 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.10] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:47:54 so you want an in-memory stream to be used like a buffer? 18:48:17 a FIFO 18:49:18 yup 18:50:02 i defined a method for the #'initialize-instance generic function specializing on the name. how can i remove it from my image now? 18:50:24 axion: C-c I #'initialize-instance in slime 18:50:28 remove the desired method 18:50:33 without emacs trickery :) 18:51:04 it's not trickery 18:51:11 clhs remove-method 18:51:11 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_rm_met.htm 18:51:21 axion: enjoy 18:51:50 well, that's most helpful, the hardest part would be finding the method 18:52:10 stassats: right. that's why emacs is good, but he don't want that 18:52:21 but you can install slime in less time than to figure how to use find-method 18:52:28 nydel0g [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 18:52:32 btw i am using slimv for slime in vim 18:52:45 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@129.174.124.49] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 18:52:49 axion: do you expect pity? :) 18:52:50 does it have an inspector? 18:53:04 fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:55:55 axion: i'm sorry, i did not mean to be rude. removing a particular method is an involved process, and without a user interface, it is rarely worth the trouble. slime gives a ui that makes it possible, but i personally just restart my lisp if i really need to get rid of a method. 18:56:23 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:23 -!- PCChris [~PCChris@dhcp-199-74-100-93.res-hall.northwestern.edu] has 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-!- fihi09` [~user@pool-96-224-33-198.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- Demosthenex [~Demosthen@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- Adeon [~tryffelit@109.73.169.52] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- The_third_man [~The_third@irc.tocards.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- sbryant [freenode@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- nicdev [user@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fedf:4986] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:24 -!- dlowe [dlowe@digital.sanctuary.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 18:56:40 axion: you might also be able to remove the class and recompile it. i'm not 100% sure, but i think that will remove all methods specialized on the class as a side effect. 18:57:18 mrSpec [~Spec@89-78-118-138.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined #lisp 18:57:18 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@89-78-118-138.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Changing host] 18:57:18 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 18:58:27 brandonz_ [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:41 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 19:00:34 -!- leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:01:53 Buglouse [~Buglouse@176.31.24.226] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 asedeno_work [asedeno@nat/google/x-mkdkxuxwbhcfauqv] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 PCChris [~PCChris@dhcp-199-74-100-93.res-hall.northwestern.edu] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 and`` [~and``@cpc16-cmbg17-2-0-cust555.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Bike [~Glossina@207-224-23-226.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-157.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 sshirokov [sshirokov@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Yuuhi [benni@p5483ABBB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 fihi09` [~user@pool-96-224-33-198.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Demosthenex [~Demosthen@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 Adeon [~tryffelit@109.73.169.52] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 The_third_man [~The_third@irc.tocards.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 sbryant [freenode@2600:3c02::f03c:91ff:fe93:e02d] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 nicdev [user@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fedf:4986] has joined #lisp 19:01:53 dlowe [dlowe@digital.sanctuary.org] has joined #lisp 19:02:00 thanks for the help guys. i think i'll finally switch to emacs 19:02:00 pirateking9_9 [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has joined #lisp 19:02:23 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@176.31.24.226] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 19:02:34 rotty_ [rotty@de.xx.vu] has joined #lisp 19:03:35 i just did a slimv shortcut to unintern the method under cursor, and it totally crashes ccl everytime 19:05:42 gridaphobe [~user@wireless-mobilenet-169-235-186-158.bulk.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 19:06:42 initialize-instance? why would you think that it's a good idea? 19:07:14 it's like poking your eyes out and complaining why can't you see a thing 19:07:44 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 241 seconds] 19:07:44 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 241 seconds] 19:07:44 -!- rotty 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19:11:55 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:12:16 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:12:17 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:12:17 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:12:21 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:12:40 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:12:40 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:12:40 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:12:44 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:12:45 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:13:03 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:13:08 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:13:19 need flexi-streams afterall since gray-streams only defines an interface, and not actual streams? 19:13:28 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:13:33 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:13:48 no, that's not correct 19:13:53 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:13:58 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:14:18 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:14:23 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:14:40 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:14:45 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:14:53 But it says I need to define methods if I want to create a character stream 19:15:08 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:15:08 last thing I want to do 19:15:13 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:15:25 can someone bad Quix0te ? :) 19:15:29 ban* 19:15:32 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:15:37 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:15:56 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:15:56 you're not making sense 19:16:01 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:16:21 (not the ban thing, the method thing) 19:16:22 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:16:27 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:16:36 A character input stream can be created by defining a class that includes FUNDAMENTAL-CHARACTER-INPUT-STREAM and defining methods for the generic functions below. 19:16:38 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1ca4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:16:42 (quote) 19:16:47 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:16:53 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:16:57 yes, what's wrong with it? 19:17:03 are you not allowed to created methods? 19:17:07 from the gray-streams issue 19:17:12 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:17:12 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:17:12 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:17:17 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:17:19 how do you expect your streams to work otherwise? by magic? 19:17:19 Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 19:17:33 By methods they mean the primitive input/output methods like read-char 19:17:36 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:17:41 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:17:59 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:17:59 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:17:59 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:18:04 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:18:07 yes, that's right, what makes you uneasy about that? 19:18:21 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:18:25 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:18:38 well that means the actual streams are not implemented 19:18:42 ju their interfaces 19:18:45 just* 19:18:46 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:18:46 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:18:46 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:18:52 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:18:52 you lost me there 19:19:08 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:19:13 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:19:31 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:19:32 never mind 19:19:35 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:19:40 the class + interface = that's what a stream is 19:19:57 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:19:57 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:19:57 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:20:00 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:20:04 for me a stream is omething I can READ from 19:20:08 or PRINT to 19:20:09 pavelpenev: not always. (setf (readtable-case *readtable*) :invert) (eq 'FOO '|foo|) --> T / <17:02:08> case upcaseing happens in the reader, |foo| is a different identifier than FOO. 19:20:21 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:20:25 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:20:44 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:20:48 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:20:55 what would it mean "to implement a stream" if not "write methods which would do the desired work" 19:21:05 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:21:09 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:21:12 I don't wantto implement a stream 19:21:19 wakeup: so, once you define your streams, you would be able print and read 19:21:22 print and read use read-char and write-char 19:21:28 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:21:28 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:21:28 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:21:32 Ill use flexi-streams its ok 19:21:33 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:21:40 man, are you confused or what 19:21:53 flexi-streams is not for defining your streams 19:21:53 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:21:58 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:22:09 it's just a set of already defined streams (by using gray streams) 19:22:16 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:22:17 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:22:17 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:22:20 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:22:28 unless they already provide the functionality you need, then by all means, just use flexi-streams 19:22:41 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:22:41 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:22:41 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:22:46 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:22:55 if you don't want to implement streams, then what do you want to do? 19:23:28 ok sorry I was confused 19:23:32 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:23:32 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:23:32 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:23:36 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:23:56 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:23:56 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:23:56 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:24:00 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:24:18 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:24:18 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:24:18 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:24:23 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:24:33 isn't there a library that provides character and binary in-memory streams? 19:24:35 zophy [~sy@24.111.9.10] has joined #lisp 19:24:43 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:24:43 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:24:43 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:24:48 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:24:55 what kind of in-memory streams? 19:25:14 Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has joined #lisp 19:25:14 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@75.108.91.76] has quit [Changing host] 19:25:14 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:25:18 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:25:33 Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has joined #lisp 19:25:34 -!- Quix0te [~Quix0te@unaffiliated/quix0te] has quit [K-Lined] 19:26:11 buffered? 19:26:16 clhs with-input-from-string 19:26:16 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_w_in_f.htm 19:26:31 no not that 19:26:34 buffering is not a very good description of streams 19:26:44 concurrent? 19:26:49 can you say which operations you want to do on your streams? 19:26:52 The usual operator to create streams is CL:OPEN. 19:27:40 wakeup: a pipe, so to say? 19:27:42 do you want to have a stream, do (write-char #\a stream) and then (read-char stream) would return #\a? 19:27:49 bananagram [~bananagra@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:27:57 if so, it's dead easy to implement with gray streams 19:28:04 basically: (let ((dream-stream ...)) (make-thread (lambda () (write 'foo))) (read)) => 'foo 19:28:13 unless you have panic attacks when defining methods, that is 19:28:22 er I meant print instead of write 19:28:28 wakeup: there's with-output-to-string and with-input-from-string for character streams. There's nothing for binary streams. And there's with-input-from-byte-vector and with-output-to-byte-vector in com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.stream 19:29:23 do you want streams or just a queue? 19:29:28 H4ns: yes a pipe 19:29:31 But the later doesn't produce a CL:STREAM, but a BVSTREAM, and that can only be used with BVSTREAM-READ-BYTE/BVSTREAM-WRITE-BYTE, not with CL:READ-BYTE or CL:WRITE-BYTE. But it's conforming! :-) 19:29:33 streams 19:29:39 I am writing a piping DSL 19:30:05 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 19:30:07 ASau [~user@46.115.56.136] has joined #lisp 19:30:07 well, whatever, if you think that you want streams, then gray-streams is what you will use 19:30:20 Non buffering pipes mean threads. 19:30:46 So you're way outside of the standard anyways, and indeed, you need to use Gray-Streams to implement something like a pipe. 19:31:01 ok I see 19:32:51 if you were using only SBCL, you could just use sb-concurrency:queue 19:33:24 or lparallel.queue if you want portable queues 19:33:25 I m not 19:33:46 well I really just need streams 19:33:54 are you sure? 19:34:00 allegro has pipe streams, maybe you want to use their api as the model: http://www.franz.com/support/documentation/8.2/doc/operators/excl/make-pipe-stream.htm 19:34:39 wakeup: what are you really doing? 19:35:04 H4ns: are lparallel.queue lock-free? 19:35:14 http://www.franz.com/support/documentation/8.2/doc/os-interface.htm#pipe-op-bookmarkxx 19:35:23 thats what I am looking for, I think 19:35:25 stassats`: i think with a recent commit, they are 19:35:48 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 19:35:50 -!- Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:35:51 -!- nydel0g [~nydel@ip72-197-245-1.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: quit] 19:36:04 wakeup: pipes are good if you have multiple processes. for communicating within one lisp, they are very wasteful 19:36:24 Joreji [~thomas@93-186.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 19:36:25 stassats`: writing a little macro that looks like this (pipe (print 12) (read)) => 12, and basically pipes the *standard-output* from form one to the *standard-input* of form two. 19:37:12 basically bash pipes fr CL 19:37:15 wakeup: why serialize the data if you can also pass it in its native form? 19:37:29 H4ns: think of parsers 19:37:46 H4ns: or all the weird UNIX tools 19:37:55 wakeup: first step: lexical analysis. then you don't have text anymore. 19:38:09 wakeup: reimplement unix in lisp? what an awful idea. 19:38:11 -!- Vicfred [~Grothendi@189.143.207.177] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:38:25 H4ns: it's not a question of waste, it's a question of API. 19:38:53 If you have bodies of codes that use READ and WRITE or PRINT, with pipes you can connect them together. 19:39:19 pjb: of course. if you have such bodies of codes. 19:39:37 pjb: i'm kind of thinking that such bodies do not deserve to exist. 19:39:38 But right, we don't have that much lisp code, at least compared to unix or java :-) 19:39:54 if you had a lisp os, you could pass data along the pipes instead of just text 19:39:56 H4ns: then you're wrong 19:40:03 wakeup: thank you! 19:40:15 H4ns: was a pleasure 19:40:35 *jasom* doesn't see why streams of bytes are superior to streams of objects 19:40:42 It's indeed easier to implement queues. (enqueue q data) ; (dequeue q) --> data 19:40:58 which is not the point 19:41:00 jasom: why streams at all? we can call functions directly! 19:41:21 there are a LOT of unix programs that work with stdio 19:41:32 ad I want to use them effectively in lisp 19:41:37 whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.39.45] has joined #lisp 19:41:38 yes its UNIX kludge 19:41:57 wakeup: oh, that's completely different; you want to run an external program and the it's stdout as a stream? There are ways to do that 19:42:03 just implementation specific 19:42:05 Well, that could be useful if we had a C compiler able to compile current linux programs, so you can embed and reuse some of them in a lisp image :-) 19:42:43 But first you'd have to write a LLVM backend generating lisp code, to target clang to CL. 19:42:50 jasom: no I want to be able to make ones *standard-output* the *sandard-input* of another 19:43:18 wakeup: fork, dup, exec? 19:43:19 antonv [5d7d31f9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.249] has joined #lisp 19:43:21 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.180.35] has left #lisp 19:43:38 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.9.2] 19:43:38 or just call shell? 19:44:05 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 19:44:35 maybe I want the mechanism to work for lisp code as well as external programs? 19:46:26 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1ca4.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:46:41 ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-76-3.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:47:06 socketpair combined with threads and binding *standard-output* might do that; 19:47:10 -!- p_l|work is now known as p_l 19:47:31 *jasom* doesn't remember how binding dynamic variables works with threads 19:48:14 ebobby [~fms@173.228.63.34] has joined #lisp 19:48:20 -!- brandonz_ [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:48:37 what about just (let* ((process (sb-ext:run-program "/bin/cat" () :input :stream :output :stream :wait nil)) (stream (make-two-way-stream (sb-ext:process-output process) (sb-ext:process-input process)))) (write-line "foo" stream) (finish-output stream) (read-line stream))? 19:48:56 stassats`: that's deadlockable 19:49:50 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:49:53 stassats`: if the output from cat fills up the output buffer while you are writting to the input buffer, game over. 19:50:28 stassats`: it's bad form to write to and read from the same commands' pipes from the same thread of execution 19:50:28 I guess I could implement a portable version of allegros PIPE 19:51:02 jasom: it's not like i propose a verbatim code to reuse 19:51:27 -!- whitedawg [~whitedawg@122.179.39.45] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:51:43 k0001 [~k0001@host172.190-137-202.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 19:52:18 -!- ferada [~ferada@dslb-088-069-039-183.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:54:05 wakeup: is that what you want to do? 19:54:11 the snippet i showed 19:54:22 no 19:54:26 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:55:03 wakeup: if what you want to do is plugability of lisp and non-lisp pipes, you'll just have to use pipes for that. 19:55:41 wakeup: then what do you want? can you give a concrete example? 19:55:44 wakeup: you could serve all your lisp pipes using lisp threads and use external processes for non-lisp pipes. no problem with that. 19:57:45 And as soon as you have real threads, you can indeed use posix pipes to connect them, even within the same process. 19:57:58 pjb: that is what i meant to say 19:57:58 Now of course, it becomes even less efficient, going thru the kernel 20:00:38 rainyman [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:00:45 -!- rainyman [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:00:59 CatMtKing [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:02:19 -!- bananagram [~bananagra@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:02:49 -!- CatMtKing [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:03:05 CatMtKing [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:03:06 -!- fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:04:19 i need a lisp to ada code converter 20:04:27 really? 20:04:36 :D 20:04:43 *jasom* has a new quote of the day 20:04:45 zophy: are you prepared to pay for it? 20:05:16 H4ns, thanks for the proposal, but no 20:05:41 I dreamt about a ruby to CL compiler one, that produced way more readable code than the source and also does some static analysis 20:05:45 i proposed? 20:06:03 just to show matz that he's wrong 20:07:35 zophy: then you will have to do it yourself. 20:07:55 or just realize the silliness of the idea 20:08:06 zophy: out of curiosity, why do you need that? 20:08:10 zophy: happily for you, you will only have to translate to ADA the 25 special operators. All the rest are macros that expand to them, and functions that are written in lisp in most CL implementations. 20:09:02 pjb: those may not be representable in ada, short of writing a lisp-interpreter 20:10:05 That you have to implement in any non-lisp program anyways. 20:10:21 (Greenspun's Tenth Law). 20:11:49 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Quit: francisl] 20:12:25 wakeup: http://paste.lisp.org/display/133991 20:12:40 (specific to sbcl, requires iolib.sockets) 20:13:49 sbcl makes (let) bindings of special vars be thread-local; I'm not sure if other implementations do that 20:14:13 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:15:03 they do 20:17:00 -!- gridaphobe [~user@wireless-mobilenet-169-235-186-158.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:17:01 oh, and you'll want to add with-open-stream around the whole thing 20:20:58 lufu [~user@5.254.129.4] has joined #lisp 20:21:16 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@aqx252.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has 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reset by peer] 21:21:31 lichtblau [~user@port-92-195-127-233.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 21:24:57 -!- tali713 [~talifree@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 21:28:14 -!- ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-76-3.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:28:50 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-157.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:30:44 nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 21:31:04 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.228.4] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:32:07 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1ca4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:37:44 prxq [~prxq___@mnhm-590c1ca4.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 21:38:12 -!- rdqfdx [~rdqfdx@78.90.88.244] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:40:51 francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has joined #lisp 21:41:17 -!- dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:42:01 ngz [~user@118.97.199.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 21:43:11 dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has joined #lisp 21:43:36 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@167.68.114.6] has quit [Quit: I tend to be neutral about apples] 21:46:52 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:47:41 ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-76-3.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:48:56 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 21:50:20 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:53:07 Hmm is C-c C-g bound in some often used packages? I'm looking for a prefix keybinding for log4slime integration thats unused 21:53:21 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:53:34 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 21:54:28 -!- alagabes [~me@scheme.qwpx.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:54:40 alagabes [~me@scheme.qwpx.net] has joined #lisp 21:55:13 rjmt__ [~uid1@46-65-55-86.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 21:57:17 robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:00:12 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:00:29 -!- ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-76-3.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:00:47 kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:03:49 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-38-170.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:04:15 francogrex [~user@109.130.11.61] has joined #lisp 22:04:45 maxm-: Don't you want to ask that in #emacs? 22:06:25 hmm actually yea 22:06:36 -!- nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: nforgerit] 22:07:37 -!- lufu [~user@5.254.129.4] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:49 *maxm-* finally put his hacks together into a proper minor mode, with blackjack and keybindings 22:08:41 cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #lisp 22:09:37 -!- rjmt__ [~uid1@46-65-55-86.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:09:39 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:46 rjmt__ [~uid1@46-65-55-86.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 22:12:40 pnkbst [~user@unaffiliated/pnkbst] has joined #lisp 22:14:52 qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has joined #lisp 22:16:25 -!- kofno [~kofno@cpe-24-165-213-150.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:18:30 character pipe: ready 22:21:56 -!- add^_ [~add^_@m90-141-61-139.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: add^_] 22:22:41 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.121.60] has joined #lisp 22:24:36 francogr` [~user@109.130.12.200] has joined #lisp 22:25:18 -!- francogr` is now known as francogrex` 22:25:55 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.11.61] has quit [Disconnected by services] 22:26:03 -!- francogrex` is now known as francogrex 22:26:32 -!- Xizor [~Xizor@c83-252-198-185.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:29:46 seangrove [~user@69-12-252-222.dedicated.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 22:32:00 -!- prxq [~prxq___@mnhm-590c1ca4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:32:36 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:33:32 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:35:09 agumonkey [~agu@27.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:11 -!- wakeup [~max@xdsl-89-0-160-91.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:36:24 Raptum [~cdh473@50.96.154.23] has joined #lisp 22:36:48 -!- Raptum [~cdh473@50.96.154.23] has quit [Client Quit] 22:37:05 Raptum [~cdh473@50.96.154.23] has joined #lisp 22:38:26 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:39:58 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-091-089-000-047.hsi2.kabelbw.de] has quit [Quit: brain damage] 22:41:34 talifree [~talifree@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:42:07 -!- talifree is now known as tali713 22:46:24 -!- k0001_ [~k0001@host185.186-125-102.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:48:11 k0001 [~k0001@host131.190-224-50.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 22:49:54 -!- _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:50:10 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 22:51:56 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:55:55 -!- zophy [~sy@24.111.9.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:57:47 Blkt [~user@82.84.188.5] has joined #lisp 22:58:07 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.12.200] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:58:22 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-233-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:59:02 any recommendations on an html parser? particularly one that parses html5 and can parse html fragments? 22:59:45 sirdancealot8 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 22:59:57 -!- Bike [~Glossina@207-224-23-226.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:00:16 Bike_ [~Glossina@207-224-23-226.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:00:25 robot-beethoven: I think cxml's html parser might work 23:00:34 (so far, I believe it's the best one we've got) 23:02:17 -!- rjmt__ [~uid1@46-65-55-86.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:03:19 -!- Posterdati [~antani@host45-237-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Excess Flood] 23:03:43 Posterdati [~antani@host45-237-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 23:04:00 pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has joined #lisp 23:04:31 Jubb [~ghost@pool-96-241-84-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:04:44 smiller [62ca1959@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.202.25.89] has joined #lisp 23:04:44 antifuchs: thx, i'll give it a try 23:04:58 best of luck with it (: 23:05:46 bitonic [~user@5e09a749.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 23:08:00 setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.133] has joined #lisp 23:10:33 antifuchs: i doubt it, html5 isn't xml 23:10:49 madnificent: neither is html 23:11:03 and cxml still parses it (it's the parser from the closure web browser) 23:11:16 does cxml do sgml? 23:11:24 (html5 is worse than html) 23:11:39 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-170-92.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:12:17 uh 23:13:26 trebor_home [~email@dslb-088-069-128-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 23:13:36 no clue. haven't had to parse sgml in a good long time (emphasis good) 23:14:11 h3x3d1 [~h3x3d@37.204.46.127] has joined #lisp 23:14:13 -!- h3x3d1 [~h3x3d@37.204.46.127] has left #lisp 23:14:49 nforgerit [~nforgerit@HSI-KBW-149-172-198-162.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 23:15:09 jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:15:38 Does anyone here have experience using cl-png? 23:15:46 Ralt_ [~Ralt@89-92-204-200.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 23:16:48 -!- ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 23:17:17 ArmyOfBruce [~bruce@waywardmonkeys.com] has joined #lisp 23:17:46 I'll just ask. I have a problem. png:decode always returns an image with only three channels. It ignores the alpha of the images it decodes, so if I decode and then write an image, the newly written image does not contain the transparency of the original. 23:19:37 SunMoonStar [~maks@ool-457f5814.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 23:20:58 robot-beethoven: I've never tried it but there is https://github.com/copyleft/cl-html5-parser 23:21:02 shwouchk_ [~kosta@bzq-82-81-159-215.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 23:21:07 tcr [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:21:08 hello 23:21:36 hi 23:21:37 Raptum, memo from pjb: Common Lisp is even better than scheme for DSL, because it has reader macros. 23:21:37 Raptum, memo from pjb: You can run old LISP programs in CL, much less easily in Scheme, because scheme creators made an effort to normalize the names, and didn't try to be compatible with legacy lisps. See: http://www.informatimago.com/develop/lisp/com/informatimago/small-cl-pgms/wang.html 23:21:45 oh jegus 23:26:40 What does this cryptic message mean? (let* form looks fine to me): error: The LET* binding spec (CROSSING POINTS NIL) is malformed. 23:27:18 shwouchk_: the let* form most certainly isn't fine. lisppaste it. 23:27:52 Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@187.240.178.219] has joined #lisp 23:28:29 some_user [~user@h-139-221.a176.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 23:28:50 -!- ngz [~user@118.97.199.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:29:08 liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has joined #lisp 23:29:33 pkhuong, http://paste.lisp.org/display/133994 23:29:58 -!- Jubb [~ghost@pool-96-241-84-33.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:31:43 yates [~user@nc-71-54-138-0.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 23:31:49 Hi, I've got a little question: I'm writing a thin API wrapper for reddit in CL and I've got a REDDIT-THREAD class; each REDDIT-THREAD object will have a slot which contains a bunch of REDDIT-COMMENTs (from 0 to about 3000). Each REDDIT-COMMENT is associated with a unique identifier. You probably do not know this unique identifier a lot of times and are just reading the actual contents of the comments most of the time. Should I store 23:31:49 these comments in a hashtable, array or regular list? I'm kinda torn between the 3 of them and wanna know what other people think 23:32:57 in cl-svg, shouldn't (transform ((transformation)) (draw blah1)(draw blah2)(draw blah3)) apply the transformation to each of the draws? 23:33:17 -!- Ralt_ [~Ralt@89-92-204-200.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:33:31 shwouchk_: yeah, it's wrong. you put three things in one binding! 23:33:39 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 23:34:00 it is only applied to the last draw. 23:34:56 some_user: reddit comments are threaded, so ypu probably want a Comment to hold its children, so it'll all work as a tree 23:34:57 -!- tali713 [~talifree@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 23:35:49 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.121.60] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:36:05 some_user: you may start with the simplest data structure you can use (probably alist), abstract away its details, and only in the end do some benchmark and find the right one (by replacing the api implementation with its particular details) 23:36:42 some_user: at least SICP said that :) 23:36:50 sorry PCL 23:37:02 some_user: as Blkt points out: the usage dictates te structure. if you're 'just reading' comments, a simple list is more than likely enough 23:37:34 zophy [~sy@24.111.9.10] has joined #lisp 23:38:29 Tordek: That's true, I should look into that. Also, yeah, as Blkt said, I would personally mostly be reading comments so why not just have it in a regular list? Point is that I want other people to be able to use it too, so I wanted some input on what sounded the best. Thanks for the tree idea though, I had completely forgot about that. 23:40:21 I may also simply have a CHILDREN (and PARENT) slot containing a list of these unique identifiers... 23:40:27 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.32.82] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:40:50 -!- cheier [~Thunderbi@64.129.86.8] has quit [Quit: cheier] 23:41:00 -!- shwouchk_ [~kosta@bzq-82-81-159-215.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 23:41:13 shwouchk_ [~kosta@bzq-82-81-159-215.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 23:41:52 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:42:31 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 23:42:33 wakeup [~max@xdsl-89-0-160-91.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 23:43:21 juiko [~user@pc-39-16-161-190.cm.vtr.net] has joined #lisp 23:43:52 Doesn't TRIVIAL-GRAY-STREAMS follow the issue properly? Because it doesn't define the default methods for STREAM-WRITE-STRING etc... 23:43:56 Bike, missed a hyphen there... just noticed. Thanks! 23:44:34 anyoe know about transforms in cl-svg? 23:44:34 -!- juiko [~user@pc-39-16-161-190.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:37 anyone? 23:45:17 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:45:47 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 23:47:11 -!- francisl [~flavoie@199.84.164.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:49:52 "I'll take cl-svg transformations for $100, Alex." 23:51:13 Sorry yates, maybe try StackOverflow? 23:52:47 some_user: that's an idea - thanks. 23:53:46 pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has joined #lisp 23:55:34 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:55:35 -!- segv- [~mb@dslb-094-222-248-056.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: segv-] 23:56:18 -!- turbolen1 is now known as turbolent 23:56:20 juiko [~user@pc-39-16-161-190.cm.vtr.net] has joined #lisp 23:56:29 is there a macro like push but that pushes only when the object is not nil, or do I need to write my own? 23:57:13 -!- some_user [~user@h-139-221.a176.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:57:20 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 23:57:28 -!- liweinan [~liweinan@222.130.232.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:58:41 nothing standard, no, it's a one-liner though 23:59:28 -!- agumonkey [~agu@27.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]