00:02:33 -!- gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:04:29 Arbamisto [~Arbamisto@192.188.108.71] has joined #lisp 00:05:31 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:10:42 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 00:11:30 -!- docAvid [~user@74-94-233-157-Michigan.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:12:13 docAvid [~user@74-94-233-157-Michigan.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 00:17:21 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:17:39 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 00:19:41 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:19:56 FACEFOX [~facefox@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:21:57 saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA10F1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 00:23:38 machine2 [~machine4@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:25:01 -!- pnq1 is now known as pnq 00:25:43 -!- Arbamisto [~Arbamisto@192.188.108.71] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:26:00 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-108-110.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 00:29:49 *maxm-* feels like a person who suddenly forgot how to walk his first time in lispworks ide 00:31:45 zulu_inuoe [~zulu_inuo@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:34:32 In CL-WHO, I want to conditionally include an XML attribute.. Anyone know a way to accomplish this? 00:35:51 -!- osa1 [~sinan@88.251.170.35] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 00:36:54 The reason I want to do this is because for an HTML drop-down (select) the presence of the 'disabled' attribute signals that it is disabled, and its absence that it is enabled (very stupid imho) 00:37:19 -!- dnolen [~user@p72-0-226-118-static.acedsl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:37:27 O.o 00:38:13 Hi pnathan ;) 00:38:29 Hi! Do I know you perchance? 00:38:50 heroku-cl-example 00:39:11 Ahh, okay. :-) 00:39:40 I was wondering if you tried something with create-folder-dispatcher-and-handler or create-static-file-dispatcher-and-handler 00:39:58 create-folder- 00:40:42 yeah I'm playing around with that also. I'm not that familiar with hunchentoot. But its a good opportunity to change that :P 00:41:25 -!- EarlGray [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:41:54 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.159.184] has joined #lisp 00:42:26 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:43:17 Yeah. I am not sure /why/ it isn't working. I am reluctant to blame hunchentoot. It's possible that the Heroku environment is too limited to allow hunchentoot to serve static content. I had to insert some calls to 'ls' and 'getcwd' to figure out where it lived. 00:43:19 any lispworks users? Is the preference to use use slime/swank with it, rather then its IDE? 00:43:39 seems (asdf:test-system) does not work from IDE, because :stefil needs :swank 00:43:43 -!- zulu_inuoe [~zulu_inuo@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has left #lisp 00:44:15 maxm-: you can safely use swank from the IDE 00:44:17 pnathan: does it work on your machine? 00:44:35 fe[nl]ix: so I just quickload it and do start-server? 00:44:39 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-48-223.cascadeaccess.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:44:58 *maxm-* setup is a mess with everything custom.. This will take a while to setup right 00:45:04 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 00:45:20 maxm-: that too, but I was thinking that you can just load swank and use stefil from within the IDE 00:45:35 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-48-223.cascadeaccess.com] has joined #lisp 00:46:53 Kenjin: I tried to get it set up on my box, but didn't get too far, I got tied up with getting templating live. Half a few minutes... 00:46:59 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-159-148.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:48:14 pnathan: what kind of issues did you ran into? 00:48:18 fe[nl]ix: if you feel like I'm asking to much just say so, but I just wanted some quick tips.. 1) is it just me, or internal debugger kind of meh? seems sldb is better 2) is there any way to run without gui? I'm looking at command line arguments (for personal edition), and can't see that option 00:48:38 pnathan: test-compile and test-run work fine for me 00:49:06 maxm-: the personal edition doesn't come with a non-IDE image 00:49:38 fe[nl]ix: also whats the "industry practice" of developing with it, use it as *inferior-lisp-program* and just run slime from emacs? Or start gui first, then load swank there, then connect from emacs? 00:49:43 as for the debugger, I can't remember, it's been too long since I've used it 00:49:47 what command are you using? for test-compile & test-run 00:50:30 maxm-: I think most LW buyers use the IDE 00:50:51 you just ran that from the example app root 00:51:09 maxm-: that's the impression I got at conferences 00:51:16 fe[nl]ix: I would kind of prefer to make my lib work nicely with IDE if that what all users have then 00:51:23 thanks for the info 00:51:27 *run 00:51:47 Kenjin: Oh, from the buildpack. half a moment 00:51:53 yeah ;) 00:52:30 something like ../heroku-buildpack-cl/bin/test-compile from heroku-cl-example 00:52:48 assuming they are in the same folder 00:53:15 if you have the correct implementation binary for your arch, should be fine 00:56:33 Ah test-compile has a hardcoded path. foo. I should fix that sometime 00:57:03 pnathan: yeah 00:57:09 -!- saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA10F1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 00:57:22 I just kept it, cause I was hammering at getting sbcl and hunchentoot running :P 00:57:32 Also, test-compiles fails, it tries to suck down a 64-bit sbcl instead of using my (osx) sbcl. I was able to fire up hunchentoot and replicate the issue, so it must be my ignorance of setting up the handlers right 00:57:51 yeah 00:58:09 Er, replicate isn't right: both local and remote dies; local says resource not found, remote says 404 00:58:28 you should change the compile script to use a local tarball for instance 00:59:08 Oy. I will go off and hammer on figuring out how to make hunchentoot talk static pages 00:59:13 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 00:59:27 I have something like this 00:59:28 http://paste.lisp.org/display/128414 00:59:43 for testing 00:59:56 are there other than clisp lisp compilers for linux ? 01:00:31 elkng: yes. SBCL is the most popular and possibly best supported when it comes to linux, Clozure CL also works great 01:00:55 ECL is quirky, but ECL is quirky on all platforms 01:01:42 there's also CMUCL, and various commercial compilers: Scieneer CL (SCL, developed from CMUCL), Allegro CL, LispWorks 01:02:09 is clisp bad ? 01:02:53 not really, but is rarely used 01:03:05 SBCL also has better slime support, iirc 01:03:47 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:04:31 I started off using sbcl, but have been most interested in ccl lately 01:04:45 I've never seen a good high level comparison of the two... 01:04:53 but then, I've never asked in #lisp! so... 01:05:29 presence of maintainers aside, why do people choose one over the other? 01:08:00 IIRC, CCL has good OSX bindings. 01:08:09 speed, threading support, easy of interop with OS (Clozure wins for me when it comes to OSX and Win32, for example) 01:08:55 antonv [5d7d31e8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.232] has joined #lisp 01:12:22 Kenjin: Got it figured out. Most of the bug can be traced to a PEBKAC error. I think the first parameter in create-folder-dispatcher-and-handler might need a trailing / though. 01:12:40 zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 01:12:56 -!- zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Changing host] 01:12:56 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 01:14:57 pnathan: :) 01:18:09 Farzad [~farzadbek@46.225.100.46] has joined #lisp 01:19:12 what is more popular "ANSI Common Lisp" or "Scheme" ? 01:20:10 pnathan: yeah works for me too :9 01:20:12 :) 01:20:17 elkng: this channel is about Common Lisp 01:20:23 Scheme is #scheme 01:20:46 and asking which one is more popular is too much of a flamebait to get good results 01:21:08 -!- mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-132-33-164.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:21:12 elkng: why don't you ask in #java, I bet they're impartial. 01:22:59 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 01:26:15 Kenjin: I added a comment to the issue, feel free to close it or add an example or what-have-you. :-) 01:27:24 pnathan: awsome ;) thanks 01:27:31 np! 01:27:33 -!- pnathan [~Adium@75.87.255.164] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:28:09 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Quit: Be back later] 01:29:47 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:30:05 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 01:32:59 do "clisp" and "SBCL" understand both "ANSI Common Lisp" or "Scheme" ? 01:34:35 elkng: no, they are *CL* implementations, not Scheme 01:34:38 two different languages 01:43:44 -!- brendyn [brendyn@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:fedf:65b4] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:44:24 brendyn [brendyn@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:fedf:65b4] has joined #lisp 01:45:09 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.159.184] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:47:21 *maxm-* hacked his repl to a) always pop in the bottom window.. b) remember its height 01:47:42 sweet releif 01:54:09 dabd [~dabd@a79-169-214-13.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 01:56:12 jake__ [~jake@63.249.57.43] has joined #lisp 01:56:35 -!- loktigon [~loktigon@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:56:43 loktigon [~loktigon@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:59:01 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:00:25 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 02:01:06 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:01:51 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483D5D1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 02:03:40 jlongster [~user@pool-173-53-25-16.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:04:26 -!- felideon [~felideon@184.105.242.75] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:05:50 gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 02:06:37 -!- BrianRice [~water@174-21-120-125.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:07:25 felideon [~felideon@184.105.242.75] has joined #lisp 02:07:49 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 02:10:29 -!- lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:20:08 nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has joined #lisp 02:21:25 -!- Sgeo [~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:22:19 Sgeo [~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 02:24:59 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:28:52 lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has joined #lisp 02:33:11 -!- loktigon [~loktigon@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [] 02:33:49 loktite [~loktite@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:35:28 p_l: nonetheless, the correct answer to elkng is yes. Yes, clisp AND sbcl both understand cl OR scheme. 02:35:53 both a or b is meaningless, so obviously you must interpret the both to be in reference to clisp AND sbcl. 02:36:36 -!- loktite is now known as loktight 02:38:28 -!- pnq [~nick@AC816F60.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:42:46 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@31.24.92.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:43:29 zulu_inuoe [~zulu_inuo@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:44:13 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 02:44:44 leo2007 [~leo@114.249.196.82] has joined #lisp 02:53:54 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 02:57:34 -!- askatasuna [~askatasun@190.97.54.87] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 02:59:12 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.1.16] has joined #lisp 03:01:23 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:01:46 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@cpe-76-183-91-176.tx.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:04:11 wildnux 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[~nitro_idi@EM114-51-135-70.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:22:38 nitro_id_ [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-135-70.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:22:51 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-135-70.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:32:34 c_arenz [~arenz@HSI-KBW-109-193-252-079.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 09:34:51 anyone having problems with lispbuilder on macs, especially Lion, I get failed windows draws, it seem lispbuilder is broken in macos, sbcl fails to use sdl and ccl seems to fail to fully draw a window, with infinite spinning wheels and a smaller apple icon appear near the bigger etc , i have reported in lispbuilder code google issue page but i got no response and I was wondering if any of you has found a solution 09:35:37 also anyone have experience with ccl objc bridge on macos, how good it is ? I am about to investigate that option to , to completely bypass sdl 09:36:52 dto [~user@pool-72-70-40-118.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 09:39:23 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 09:41:10 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 09:47:47 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:58:59 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:59:16 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 10:04:07 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Disconnected by services] 10:04:33 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 10:06:47 ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has joined #lisp 10:13:28 zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 10:13:50 -!- zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Changing host] 10:13:50 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 10:30:06 -!- Vicfred [~Futaba@201.102.56.131] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:34:28 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-398252.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:35:45 kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-35.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 10:38:06 Kenjin [~josesanto@2.80.247.25] has joined #lisp 10:43:04 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:43:13 some new lisp UI stuff http://blocky.io/blocky-lightning-talk-7.ogv 10:43:18 gaidal [~gaidal@h164n1-m-sp-d4.ias.bredband.telia.com] has joined #lisp 10:53:23 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-33-22.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:55:07 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.1.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:58:17 Odin- [~sbkhh@214-106-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is] has joined #lisp 11:02:05 vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has joined #lisp 11:04:31 dto: cool stuff ;) 11:05:29 -!- drwho [~drwho@216-122-174-206.gci.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:05:41 drwho [~drwho@216-122-174-206.gci.net] has joined #lisp 11:06:08 Kenjin: thanks :) 11:06:13 it's really Getting There 11:07:52 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:11:23 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@HSI-KBW-109-193-252-079.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:11:55 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-43-2.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:17:28 -!- dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:21:56 *maxm-* loves the feeling of everything just sliding into its assigned place after months of working on sub-modules 11:24:14 dfox [~dfox@rei.ipv6.dfox.org] has joined #lisp 11:27:08 -!- EarlGray [~mitra@ts-18.volia.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:30:35 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-211-99.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:36:51 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-226.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 11:38:48 I avoid that feeling by working on sub-systems while working on the super-system. 11:41:00 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081BB36.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:41:22 mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-132-33-164.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 11:42:23 phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 11:42:24 -!- phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Changing host] 11:42:24 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 11:42:58 -!- vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:44:02 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 11:51:00 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:51:27 DGASAU` [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 11:52:11 that ogv video is cool. what is that exactly? written in lisp? 11:53:35 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188526.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 11:53:56 albacker: http://blocky.io/ 11:54:03 that's what i was browsing 11:54:21 never seen a visual language. 11:54:32 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: ramkrsna] 11:54:37 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-92-224.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 11:55:07 -!- nitro_id_ [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-135-70.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:56:20 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-35.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:57:48 Guthur [~user@host86-150-156-18.range86-150.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 11:59:08 EarlGray [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has joined #lisp 12:01:48 man after through blocky draft documentation, CL community top %1 project should be markdown -> html thing that does lisp and REPL syntax highlighting 12:01:54 albacker: yep, CL 12:03:08 maybe something sledgehammery kludgy, like using emacs to load lisp and REPL snippets into temp buffer with appropriate major mode, then generate html based on fontlock.. Or borrow paste.lisp.org highlighter 12:04:06 documentation looks so much more professional/cooler when all examples are properly syntax colored 12:05:10 dto: did you used org mode to generate that? 12:07:08 -!- anonus [anonymous@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:fedf:2cc7] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:09:19 -!- kilon_alios is now known as kilon 12:11:36 maxm-: which page are you referring to 12:11:55 oh 12:12:02 sorry, didn't see top line 12:12:11 dto: http://blocky.io/reference.html 12:12:13 yeah theres a link to the little bit of code 12:12:17 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@100.Red-88-11-23.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 12:12:41 maxm-: https://github.com/dto/blocky/blob/master/doc.lisp 12:12:46 org-mode indeed. 12:13:38 *maxm-* tried using org-mode for log4cl manual, but quickly gave up, with 50% of screen space taken by #+begin_src/#+end_src lines.. For now using markdown 12:14:28 dto: nice job 12:15:13 ivan-kanis: on the docs or the video 12:15:15 dto: funny how different codebases sometimes converge on similar shortcuts.. I did not really look inside your code before, but reading the manual, I have lots of very similar shortcuts, but in completely different domain 12:15:18 ivan-kanis: thanks :) 12:15:26 dto: the video 12:15:37 maxm-: what do you mean by shortcuts? 12:15:50 ivan-kanis: it's rapidly approaching usability 12:16:56 dto: looks like squeak on lisp 12:16:59 dto: ie mine is trading, but I have globals for current world/instrument/account/series/order, and all the methods default to use these, so you can ad-hoc develop strategies by just doing (lambda () (> close open) (go-long)) 12:17:34 oh interesting 12:17:36 different terminology but for some reason feels very simular to how you control game objects 12:18:23 ivan-kanis: that's very much intended, and you can save/load the system image in a somewhat similar way 12:18:24 -!- drwho [~drwho@216-122-174-206.gci.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:18:42 drwho [~drwho@216-122-174-206.gci.net] has joined #lisp 12:18:47 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 12:21:58 m7w [~chatzilla@31.24.92.105] has joined #lisp 12:23:00 i'll keep y'all posted about Blocky 12:33:35 -!- killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 12:35:25 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.33.63] has joined #lisp 12:35:25 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.33.63] has quit [Changing host] 12:35:25 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 12:36:08 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:36:23 zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 12:39:48 zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has joined #lisp 12:40:42 -!- metaphysician [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:43:22 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 12:44:03 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-92-224.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 12:44:48 kpal [~kpal@5ac28f67.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 12:45:49 -!- kpal [~kpal@5ac28f67.bb.sky.com] has quit [Client Quit] 12:49:28 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:50:43 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 12:51:37 vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has joined #lisp 12:53:05 francogrex [~user@109.130.129.200] has joined #lisp 12:53:24 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:53:29 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 12:53:36 the links in http://www.cliki.net/machine%20code seem inactive. i'm looking for a portable debugger 12:53:41 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 12:54:37 something like http://www.cliki.net/common-db maybe 12:56:02 *maxm-* gave up on source level debugging in SBCL, other then "go to current frame source location" 12:56:41 lispworks debugger (based on personal edition) is not much better, but thats based on 30 minute 1st time user session with it 12:57:28 maxm-: how about this? http://www.cliki.net/conium 12:57:48 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.159.184] has joined #lisp 12:58:33 francogrex: have not seen it before, but worth checking out because of the author (if its same lichtenblau who did commonqt) 12:59:45 but it seems to be only swank "cleanup/modernizatin" does not say it added any features 13:00:05 yes it's swank related 13:00:23 *francogrex* is trying it out 13:00:59 francogrex: I remember reading article about allegro debugger, and how hard it was to get lisp debugging experience to a simular state as lets say stepping through java with eclipse, but I'm not sure if it was about ongoing project, or do they actually have it implemented 13:01:55 francogrex: you can browse allegro site for their debugger info, then give us a report :-) 13:03:02 MaxLanar [~user1@vai69-2-82-229-207-48.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 13:03:28 I will. just want to test this one first. Since there are no examples or test I am reading the src 13:05:57 francogrex: http://www.franz.com/services/conferences_seminars/source-level-debugger_webinar_2-25-10.lhtml <= Allegro debugger/stepper video and slides 13:05:59 anonus [anonymous@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:fedf:2cc7] has joined #lisp 13:06:07 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:07:47 eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:07:53 -!- eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 13:07:53 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 13:08:12 Yuuhi [benni@p5483CFB2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:10:26 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188526.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 13:10:51 good stuff, material to go through 13:11:19 arnsholt_ [~arne@80.203.170.54] has joined #lisp 13:11:32 rlb3`` [~user@204.62.13.112] has joined #lisp 13:12:31 -!- zfx [~zfx@host86-166-93-7.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Changing host] 13:12:31 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 13:12:42 EarlGray^ [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has joined #lisp 13:13:06 hmm allegro debugger is kind of pretty good 13:13:06 Munksgaa1d [~philipm@tyr.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 13:13:13 gigamonkey_ [~gigamonke@adsl-99-155-194-223.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:13:27 axion1 [~axion@cpe-67-242-80-89.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:13:29 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 13:13:53 jjkola_ [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has joined #lisp 13:14:22 wondering if its possible to disable step-by-step macroexpansion, and just continue running until "current form" in original source changed 13:14:35 MoALTz [~no@host-92-2-120-173.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 13:14:42 Xach_ [~xach@cpe-67-255-229-229.maine.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:14:51 kaol_ [kaol@piperka.net] has joined #lisp 13:19:13 -!- zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:13 -!- EarlGray [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:13 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-188526.home.otenet.gr] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:13 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:13 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@adsl-99-155-194-223.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:13 -!- jjkola [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-80-89.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- rlb3` [~user@204.62.13.112] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- PECCU [~peccu@ZU204061.ppp.dion.ne.jp] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- arnsholt [~arne@54.80-203-170.nextgentel.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- Munksgaard [~philipm@tyr.diku.dk] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:14 -!- kaol [kaol@piperka.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:19:15 -!- gigamonkey_ is now known as gigamonkey 13:19:15 someone here has been hired by Allegro not so long ago... maybe he knows all the hidden tricks 13:20:02 -!- kaol_ is now known as kaol 13:20:30 PECCU [~peccu@ZU204061.ppp.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 13:20:30 zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has joined #lisp 13:20:30 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 13:20:43 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:21:24 -!- FACEFOX [~facefox@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:22:09 -!- machine2 [~machine4@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:23:12 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-203.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:25:46 lol "and here we defined a variant of foo called bar" 13:26:27 machine2 [~machine4@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:28:04 FACEFOX [~facefox@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:31:42 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@100.Red-88-11-23.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:31:48 -!- axion1 is now known as axion 13:33:49 hagish [~hagish@p5DCBEF31.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:38:39 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 13:39:26 -!- treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:39:38 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:40:36 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.129.200] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:40:43 bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:8a53:8940:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has joined #lisp 13:51:51 http://vimeo.com/36579366 13:52:02 albacker: what's that? 13:52:20 it's not lisp-related but programming-related 13:52:38 can you describe it in a single sentence? 13:53:00 killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has joined #lisp 13:53:26 -!- cafesofie [~user@ool-18e4c9a0.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:53:28 he makes an interpreter for javascript for gui apps and algorithms, with a cool output so whenever you changed something on the code you could see animation of the the ouput (how it changed). 13:53:36 it's very cool, you can't describe it in a sentence.. 13:53:53 "cool" in javascript is "ordinary" in lisp 13:54:08 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:54:19 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 13:54:25 it is nothing compared to lisp-coolness, but it's different. dto was making something "similar" but for lisp i think. 13:54:30 treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has joined #lisp 13:54:51 ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.42] has joined #lisp 13:55:03 he talks about principles on ideas more than the code (javascript, lisp, c, etc.) he talks about the idea of creating ideas. 13:55:05 meta-idea 13:59:25 fiveop [~fiveop@186.221.140.240] has joined #lisp 14:03:44 -!- osa1 [~sinan@88.251.170.35] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 14:04:19 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:05:09 -!- elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:05:31 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 14:06:23 Vivitron [~user@pool-173-48-170-228.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:07:02 elkng [~elkng@93.88.221.1] has joined #lisp 14:07:02 -!- elkng [~elkng@93.88.221.1] has quit [Changing host] 14:07:03 elkng [~elkng@unaffiliated/elkng] has joined #lisp 14:08:06 Xach_: is there not in quicklisp a uri parser lib that supports user info? 14:08:54 -!- hagish [~hagish@p5DCBEF31.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:09:09 hagish [~hagish@p5DCBEF31.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:09:23 rme [~rme@50.43.128.217] has joined #lisp 14:11:59 \ 14:12:01 stassats: that video does have some things that could (easily?) be added to SLIME that might be worth toying with. 14:12:02 albacker: Watched it. I find him to be incredibly obnoxious 14:12:13 BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:12:19 loke, yeah, his talking is kinda weird. 14:12:22 He finishes up by comparing himself (or as a successor to) people like Doug Engelbart and Alan Kay 14:12:26 hahaha 14:12:30 sykopomp: i couldn't watch it, the speaker put me to sleep 14:12:30 haven't finished it yet. 14:12:36 That just completely negated the cool things he showed before 14:12:43 he's talking about richard stallman and the guy that invented the mouse 14:13:22 Yeah. He puts himself right up there together with them. 14:13:23 that's true, he could have been kinda modest and i'd like the video more, he thinks of himself as some kind of guru.. but what he showed at the beginning is very cool 14:13:25 stassats: the interesting thing is that he compiles+loads code as it gets written, and added a widget for modifying numbers by dragging up and down. 14:13:36 albacker: yep 14:14:05 sykopomp: i don't find that useful (the former) 14:14:05 sykopomp: well yeah, but it's javascript. No compilation. Essentially it's just reloading the functions on change 14:14:29 We do the same in Slime, (OK, we have to press C-c C-c, but I see that as a benefit) 14:14:40 stassats: in the very narrow case of working graphically, it means you can, in a way, animate your changes easily to compare-and-contrast quickly. 14:14:56 sykopomp: yes. For that specific purpose, it's very useful. 14:15:11 C-c-c doesn't make it less quick 14:15:21 stassats: never said it didn't. 14:15:46 stassats: You can't quite -animate- it with C-c-c. 14:16:08 stassats: Like I said. I'd like to have control when my code gets inserted into the runtime. For graphical parameters, that's perfectly fine, but for anything else youd have some seriously corrupt runtimes on your hand if you did that 14:16:18 what do you mean by -animate-? 14:16:21 -!- devhost [~devhost@174.143.148.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:16:34 stassats: he's talking about the case where the output of your code is graphics 14:17:00 take the "cloud movement speed" variable, and animate so you see the result immediately on the screen 14:17:09 stassats: this is strictly interesting (afaict) when dealing with graphical programs where it's useful to see the changes as they happen. 14:17:23 loke: and C-c C-c works fine with that 14:17:26 sykopomp: could be useful in audio too, perhaps 14:17:26 being able to quickly bounce between 2-3 different options is much more useful there. 14:17:38 that, too. 14:17:55 stassats: C-c-c is not -quite- that responsive. 14:18:15 i did that with lispbuilder sdl, i had a loop which was calling a function, i changed it, C-c C-ced it 14:18:32 sykopomp: you should type faster, then 14:18:33 I did that, too 14:18:39 devhost [~devhost@174.143.148.179] has joined #lisp 14:18:41 and it still wasn't as responsive as what this guy showed. 14:18:43 I mean, beyond a couple of small examples that seem mostly useful for graphical applications, it just looks like he greenspunned slime :) 14:18:59 -!- bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:8a53:8940:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:20:23 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:20:48 sykopomp: what is greenspunning? 14:21:24 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 14:21:59 hmm inserting graphics into slime existed for ages 14:22:17 ie (pnl-graph (whatever ...)) pops the picture 14:22:23 its called slime-repl-images or something 14:22:30 *maxm-* used to use it all the time 14:23:12 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 14:23:16 that's not quite what this is... 14:23:29 -!- devhost [~devhost@174.143.148.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:24:39 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 14:26:38 hmm actually I wonder if I wrote them? I don't remember writing them, but they not in slime cvs 14:26:56 anyone else has contrib/slime-repl-pictures and contrib/swank-repl-pictures.lisp 14:27:01 devhost [~devhost@174.143.148.179] has joined #lisp 14:27:52 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081BB36.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:28:16 -!- albacker [~eni@unaffiliated/enyx] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:28:24 found it http://patrickcollison.com/blog/2008/06/pictures-in-the-slime-repl 14:32:18 sykopomp: i think i can get emacs to do his funky slider. although, really only useful if you love to stick tons of magic constants through your code 14:32:55 dto: that's the other thing. I think a 'proper' game would have that in data files/databases somewhere. 14:33:21 most likely, it's just something that you can/should build for the purposes of your application. 14:33:36 (urrite) 14:33:43 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:34:12 The graphics in the REPL seems pretty cool. Sad that it's not been made into a proper generic module. 14:35:22 -!- maxm- [~user@openchat.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:36:15 tomodo [~tomodo@gateway/tor-sasl/tomodo] has joined #lisp 14:36:29 you can be the one! 14:37:30 I could! 14:38:35 http://www.heropress.net/2012/03/sad-but-true.html 14:38:41 By the way 14:39:37 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-229-154.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:42:58 -!- klaushbo [~user@cpe.atm2-0-1121036.virnxx11.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:43:16 -!- vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:48:13 dtw [dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has joined #lisp 14:48:39 -!- kuzary [~who@gateway/tor-sasl/kuzary] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:49:05 -!- BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:49:07 vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has joined #lisp 14:49:10 asdfhjkl [~bob@i5E879AE1.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 14:51:43 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:52:41 > real men don't cry 14:52:50 sure is feminist mind control in here 14:52:54 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 14:55:31 I like how they equate a film for mormon girls with a Leone/Eastwood western as if the audiences for those two things were even remotely the same in order to force a punchline that obviously was written first in search of a joke. 14:55:51 nice deconstruction 14:56:08 -!- dto [~user@pool-72-70-40-118.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:56:21 -!- hefner [~hefner@c-69-255-57-56.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: meh] 14:57:15 that's very much off-topic 14:58:07 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@cpe-67-249-228-147.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 14:58:16 -!- zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has quit [Quit: ] 14:58:38 you're off topic 14:59:07 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 15:04:21 -!- tomodo [~tomodo@gateway/tor-sasl/tomodo] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:04:36 -!- Xach_ is now known as Xach 15:04:48 -!- Xach [~xach@cpe-67-255-229-229.maine.res.rr.com] has quit [Changing host] 15:04:48 Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has joined #lisp 15:06:54 -!- treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 15:08:22 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:09:47 -!- EarlGray^ is now known as EarlGray 15:09:57 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 15:11:25 MoALTz_ [~no@host-92-8-159-70.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 15:12:53 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:13:56 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 15:14:44 maxm- [~user@openchat.com] has joined #lisp 15:15:07 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-2-120-173.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:16:53 metaphysician [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 15:20:04 -!- KDr2 [~kdr2@123.122.98.145] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:20:18 Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.22.190] has joined #lisp 15:21:17 -!- metaphysician [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:25:19 -!- benny [~benny@i577A3D9A.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:26:27 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:27:23 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@186.221.140.240] has quit [Quit: humhum] 15:28:03 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 15:29:17 -!- killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:32:16 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 15:34:49 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:36:09 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 15:36:29 -!- ehu` is now known as ehu 15:37:00 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 15:38:39 bloody clisp and its type declaration peculiarities 15:39:08 i have to write (declare (_type_ my-declaration x)) 15:39:17 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.159.184] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:39:20 where my-declaration is a deftype defined type 15:39:38 gh0ul [~grim@188.27.101.96] has joined #lisp 15:39:59 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:40:29 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:40:47 you can write (declare (integer x)), but not (declare (class x)), what kind of stupidity is that? 15:41:24 I am in the habit of always using (type ...) even for fixnum, integer, etc. 15:41:42 i'm in a habit of ignoring clisp 15:41:44 stassats`: the standard doesn't state otherwise, does it? 15:41:49 besides, it doesn't do anything with declarations 15:42:15 stassats`: it does! clisp complains when you use them inappropriately ;) 15:42:24 madnificent: 3.3.3.1 says it should be valid 15:43:03 Xach: l1sp.org is awesome 15:43:31 stassats`: you didn't mean a specific clos class with (class x) ? 15:43:41 madnificent: no, cl:class 15:44:05 then clisp deserves a beating 15:44:19 I'm starting to learn LISP. I have a tiny bit of previous experience, but limited to emacs and stumpwm configuration. 15:44:24 Now, question: 15:44:33 ANSI Common Lisp or Practical Common Lisp 15:44:37 PCL 15:44:41 ? ( also, hello everyone :) ) 15:44:50 and hello 15:44:54 i've known for a long time tat it didn't support (integer 0 5) specifiers, but that CLASS isn't valid is news to me 15:45:30 *madnificent* doesn't understand why it doesn't support (integer 0 5) it doesn't sound particularly complex to support if you don't enforce it 15:45:54 gh0ul: PCL 15:46:01 no contest 15:46:08 Majority, albeit small, wins 15:46:24 gh0ul: PCL 15:46:33 madnificent: the goal of clisp is to be as obnoxious as possible 15:46:35 gh0ul: 90% or more of this channel will pick PCL, i think 15:46:50 another 9% will pick Land of Lisp 15:46:53 That's great then, since I already started with it :D 15:47:01 Oh, haven't heard of that one 15:47:13 stassats`: i dislike it in general, but it has a small memory footprint and it actually runs CLFSWM better than any other implementation i've tried it on (being SBCL/CCL/ECL) 15:47:18 But I guess I'll stick to one since multiple initial sources are sure to confuse me 15:47:42 I dislike Land of Lisp's approach and acronym, but it seems to really work for some people 15:47:45 madnificent: here's a dime, buy yourself some real memory 15:47:48 managed to install slime+sbcl, I'm set to go. Wrote my first mode-line module today (for stumpwm) 15:47:50 kind of like vim 15:48:05 Has anyone ever used LISP for web work? 15:48:14 Like a LISP + MYSQL backend? 15:48:17 gh0ul: quite a lot of people 15:48:25 stassats`: ahm, yes no... what i hate is that crashes less often and is more responsive under CLISP than under SBCL. i had noticed the same with running STUMPWM under CLISP 15:48:26 (it's where I plan on getting eventually since I'm a web dev) 15:48:38 gh0ul: no one has made lisp all caps since the 60s, though 15:48:46 stassats`: also, i do lack memory in my current box, that's right :) 15:48:48 madnificent: i was referring to the memory footprint concern 15:49:00 dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:49:18 if you plan on running multiple processes or virtual machines, memory footprint can translate to $$$ at scale 15:49:23 stassats`: but still, don't you find it odd that clisp does something better, regardless of memory? it's worse at everything else, it seems. not a particularly interesting discussion though 15:49:32 gh0ul: let me know when you're starting out with web dev stuff 15:49:58 dlowe: It's how I'm used to type it. Will quit it, I'd hate for this to make sound *that* old (even though I'm sure there are some seniors amongst you people) 15:50:13 madnificent: the fact may be in that clisp uses xlib written in c, not clx 15:50:17 dlowe: SBCL has a fixed overhead, or so it seems. when we load our database in it, it performs quite ok. when using 10+GB of memory in one image, the other 150MB isn't that important :) 15:50:23 hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279584440.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:50:50 stassats`: thanks! it may sound odd, but i really like to have some form of motivation as to why it could be. and this makes sense. 15:51:12 madnificent: sure, I'm just pointing out that even on modern hardware, memory isn't *always* a non-concern 15:51:17 granted 15:53:15 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 15:53:25 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 15:53:38 -!- FACEFOX [~facefox@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:54:00 if i'd want a smaller memory footprint (and a fast implementation), i'd use a 32-bit ccl 15:54:23 FACEFOX [~facefox@pool-74-111-197-200.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:55:24 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 15:57:30 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:58:19 a bare repl seems to consume less memory than 64-bit clisp 15:58:35 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-229-154.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:59:10 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-229-154.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:59:15 killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has joined #lisp 16:02:43 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:03:12 Sebboh [~hobbes@unaffiliated/sebboh] has joined #lisp 16:03:40 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-229-154.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:03:42 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:49 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 16:03:56 I'm in a REPL, it's ABCL. Can I get a list of parameters and functions that I've defined so far? 16:04:15 I also happen to be in slime, but, I'd like to know how to do it progmatically. 16:04:29 no 16:04:35 (I'd also like ot learn to spell, but, eh.) 16:04:56 the typical mode of operation is to define your functions in files, but you can programmatically get symbols by package with do-symbols 16:06:18 BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:06:30 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 16:07:07 -!- killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:08:16 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-047-027.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:43 -!- gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [] 16:09:21 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:11:55 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-321563.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 16:13:33 and ECL bails out outright upon encountering compound type-specifiers without TYPE 16:13:44 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:14:15 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 16:14:45 -!- kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188526.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:14:54 As I curiosity project I have been doing a sandbox Common Lisp eval bot for IRC. I have heard some people say it's not possible - and maybe they are right - but it didn't stop me from trying. I think an eval bot for subset of CL would be useful here. Maybe you can spot security problems. 16:14:56 clbot [~clbot@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 16:15:04 ,pi 16:15:05 => 3.141592653589793d0 16:15:14 pcavs [~Adium@c-65-96-169-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:19 we do not welcome such thing here 16:15:20 ,(loop) 16:15:21 ;; DISABLED-FEATURE: The feature LOOP is disabled. 16:15:37 -!- clbot [~clbot@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has left #lisp 16:15:42 stassats, OK. 16:15:55 ,*package* 16:15:55 dtw: i agree with stassats. what would that be useful for? 16:16:06 H4ns, teaching newbies. 16:16:10 because it turns everything into a mess by everyone trying to outclever it 16:16:45 ,(+ 1 3) 16:17:02 dtw: what is the advantage of such a bot compared to pasting something to paste.lisp.org? 16:17:13 H4ns, faster input and output. 16:17:16 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 16:17:23 dtw: do it in a different channel. 16:17:24 #haskell has a bot like that, doesn't it 16:18:01 i don't like writing programs in one line in an IRC prompt 16:18:29 mgodshall [~quassel@74-36-216-127.br1.hzl.pa.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 16:18:36 for short one-liners (+ 1 3) => 10 was always sufficient 16:18:53 c_arenz [~arenz@HSI-KBW-109-193-252-079.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 16:20:36 Those who want to try for a while join #lisp-eval 16:20:53 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:22:12 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 16:23:15 From the CLHS: do-symbols (var [package [result-form]]) declaration* {tag | statement}* 16:23:48 How do I read that? There's more data that is missing from my paste: fonts are used. 16:25:12 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:25:22 Sebboh: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/lw51/CLHS/Body/01_dab.htm 16:25:53 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:26:02 if you know Backus-Naus form already, it's easy to pick up 16:26:05 Anyway, different question... if I edit a file and (load) it repeatedly, don't I run the risk of ended up with a real mess of defined symbols? Unintended consequences? 16:26:10 I don't. 16:26:17 naur 16:26:40 perhaps the issue with an eval-bot in #lisp is that we mainly don't need to show how to do little things, but that we try to examine the spec when something seems off. 16:26:56 Sorry, I typed that 'Anyway' before I saw your answer. Thank you, reading that now. 16:27:23 Sebboh: wikipedia has a description of the backus-naur form 16:27:37 Sure. 16:27:39 Sebboh: in practice, you don't end up 16:27:48 eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:27:52 -!- eno [~eno@adsl-70-137-133-209.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:27:52 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 16:33:00 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 16:33:00 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 16:33:07 pnq [~nick@ACA24F7F.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 16:34:55 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:37:20 treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has joined #lisp 16:37:54 Froward [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has joined #lisp 16:38:59 -!- BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:39:05 TDT [~user@102.207.43.66.sta.southslope.net] has joined #lisp 16:39:14 Ragnaroek_ [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:39:14 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-047-027.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:40:23 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@HSI-KBW-109-193-252-079.hsi7.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:42:12 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 16:42:52 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081BB36.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:42:56 -!- Ragnaroek_ is now known as Ragnaroek 16:43:32 -!- treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:54:34 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:55:10 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 16:56:33 *pjb* is so sad #lisp has become a bot free zone. 16:56:40 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 16:56:43 *pjb* would like clbot. 16:57:01 *H4ns* would rather want to have the real bots back 16:57:43 -!- ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:58:29 -!- jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:59:25 What those "real bots" can do? #lisp-eval will have clbot for about an hour for you to try. 16:59:45 dtw: the real bots were witty and useful 17:00:19 Like? 17:00:25 dtw: a cl evaluator is what everyone here has on their own computer. i don't see the point of having them in the channel. 17:00:32 dtw: like witty and useful 17:00:35 H4ns: to avoid copy and pasting. 17:00:43 jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has joined #lisp 17:01:01 pjb: that does not scratch my itch 17:01:12 i can evaluated in my head 17:01:15 evaluate 17:01:21 It does mine and some other peoples. I'm using a modified /eval here. 17:01:44 stassats`: what you evaluate in your head is not evaluated in the head of the newbies. 17:01:59 i don't care about newbies 17:02:17 We need to deal with them expendiently. 17:02:30 I'd write a bot to answer newbie questions automatically if I had more time. 17:03:10 pjb: there is no need to spill our own place with example code and responses to that. it is pretty much accepted that we don't want pastes in the channel, and an eval bot is in the same league. 17:03:16 well there is fsbot in #emacs 17:03:28 ivan-kanis: and there is an eval bot in #haskell 17:03:36 (so i hear) 17:03:49 but yeah I feel it's a bit noisy at time 17:04:16 bah, CFFI breaks LOOP on ECL 17:04:55 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:05:42 rather, ECL breaks a LOOP in ECL 17:06:27 H4ns: which makes me think I should write a erc filter to fetch lisppastes automatically and insert them in the erc buffer 17:06:36 no, the first one was correct 17:07:38 i really hate that you can't write (loop for z while y for b ...) 17:07:55 Yes. 17:07:58 a bot that asks people to read books 17:08:11 samebchase: minion was good at it 17:08:19 heh 17:08:43 What happened to the old bots? 17:08:54 they became... disconnected 17:09:12 benny [~benny@i577A207F.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 17:09:50 -!- solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has quit [Quit: solussd] 17:10:51 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.172.36.30] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:15:09 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:16:53 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:16:57 loktight [~loktite@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:17:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:17:49 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:17:56 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 17:23:08 stassats`: ok, I've read up on BNF. Good news: already knew how to read it, just didn't know that the form had a name. 17:23:58 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.45.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:24:15 man [options ...] name [names ...] 17:25:15 From the CLHS: do-symbols (var [package [result-form]]) declaration* 17:25:16 {tag | statement}* 17:25:44 What does result-form mean? 17:25:47 nialo` [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:00 a form which be returned eventually 17:26:03 read the fine print 17:26:18 -!- nialo- [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:26:23 it's the form to be evaluated to generate the result of the do-symbols 17:26:51 ...Shouldn't do-symbols do that? 17:26:58 Obviously I'm missing something. 17:28:35 I've got a package named CL-USER or COMMON-LISP-USER, right? Would someone be so kind as to give me an example that uses do-command on that package, and I'll go ponder that for a while. 17:28:53 ack. s/do-command/do-symbols/ 17:30:23 (do-symbols (symbol 'cl-user) (print symbol)) 17:30:54 and the package is named COMMON-LISP-USER, CL-USER is a nickname 17:31:50 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:32:52 -!- ironChicken [~richard@195.3.137.108] has left #lisp 17:34:47 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA24F7F.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:35:05 -!- MoALTz_ [~no@host-92-8-159-70.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:35:45 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:39:19 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 17:39:46 morning 17:40:09 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 17:43:37 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@69-91-252-216.dsl.colba.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:43:59 lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.87.250] has joined #lisp 17:47:26 dnolen [~user@p72-0-226-118-static.acedsl.com] has joined #lisp 17:49:02 gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:49:20 -!- Fare [~Fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:49:25 dto [~user@pool-72-70-40-118.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:49:30 loktite [~loktite@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:50:04 -!- loktight [~loktite@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:50:34 slyrus: good evening ;-) 17:53:06 Skola [~bas@5352A3FB.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #lisp 17:54:13 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 17:56:10 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:59:50 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:59:54 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 18:00:03 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 18:04:17 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:05:00 -!- MaxLanar [~user1@vai69-2-82-229-207-48.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:05:02 solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has joined #lisp 18:08:46 -!- dtw [dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has quit [Quit: (signal 'dtw:sleep)] 18:09:58 albacker [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 18:09:59 -!- albacker [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Changing host] 18:09:59 albacker [~eni@unaffiliated/enyx] has joined #lisp 18:12:38 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has joined #lisp 18:13:39 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-173-48-170-228.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:13:56 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188157.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 18:15:51 -!- ace4016 [~ace4016@cpe-024-074-197-085.ec.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: brb] 18:15:56 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-321563.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:16:06 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-399565.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 18:19:08 -!- kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188157.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:20:24 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-399565.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:25:01 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:25:42 ace4016 [~ace4016@cpe-024-074-197-085.ec.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:22 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:28:32 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@pool-71-252-145-78.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:29:56 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.168.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:31:01 adu [~ajr@pool-72-83-26-98.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:31:33 Frowardly [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has joined #lisp 18:34:54 -!- Froward [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:38:01 -!- vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.41.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:38:43 Vicfred [~Futaba@201.102.56.131] has joined #lisp 18:42:32 -!- albacker [~eni@unaffiliated/enyx] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:43:22 foregam [~mkk@79.124.84.16] has joined #lisp 18:43:35 -!- dto [~user@pool-72-70-40-118.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:46:19 Hi, has anyone had any success running the Genera emulator from unlambda.com? 18:48:28 -!- Sebboh [~hobbes@unaffiliated/sebboh] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:49:20 kmcorbett [~kmcorbett@173-9-35-41-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:48 foregam: yes. 18:52:07 foregam: although i had trouble saving images last time i tried. 18:55:26 I'm stuck with a huge white screen. 18:56:25 foregam: with nothing on it? 18:56:41 pjb: my group has written a bot with a pretty simple plugin architecture that has some features like url shortening/tagging. 18:56:44 foregam: or with the "enter current date and time prompt"? 18:56:55 Yes. Nothing on it. 18:57:01 I was intending to release it, but was waiting until we got a paste feature cut. 18:57:07 Booting from MIT.vlod kind of works 18:57:18 foregam: did you read this: http://www.cliki.net/VLM_on_Linux 18:57:28 Yes I did 18:57:29 Fade: well it looks like theimportant part is the monitoring and automatic reconnection of the bot to the channels it should be on. 18:57:49 cl-irc is a little peculiar. 18:58:04 kind of a half clos system 18:58:08 By "kind of" I mean some HTTP component fails to start up properly 18:58:12 reconnection is still a problem. 18:58:14 so I get to a prompt 18:58:31 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-33-22.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 18:58:34 I can :Define Site there 18:58:53 but it fails with "Unable to find site foo" 18:59:27 cl-irc needs to be revisited, which is also on a todo list 19:00:49 -!- gh0ul [~grim@188.27.101.96] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:01:34 Booting from vanilla Genera-8-5.vlod goes straightly white screen. 19:02:39 etenil [~user@93-96-0-153.zone4.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:02:41 Hi all 19:03:13 I'm toying with a small parser for lisp, and I'm a bit confused about backquote reader macro 19:03:39 My understanding is that the backquote is quoting anything that follows it 19:03:46 etenil: `x = (my-package:backquote x) 19:04:00 but then what's the difference with quote? 19:04:04 etenil: ,x = (my-package:comma x) ,@x = (my-package:unsplit-comma x) 19:04:21 yup I know about the , and @ 19:04:26 etenil: `(a ,b) == (list 'a b) '(a b) = (quote (a b)) 19:04:44 etenil: comma doesn't have meaning inside quote, only inside backquote. 19:04:47 pjb: you're going a bit fast for me ;) 19:05:06 ok so 'a and `a are basically the same thing 19:05:08 etenil: if there's no comma, backquote is like quote. 19:05:17 mmh 19:05:21 (equal `(a b) '(a b)) 19:05:28 ah ok 19:05:41 But when there are commas, backquote expands to a list construction expression. 19:06:06 -!- solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has quit [Quit: solussd] 19:06:09 ok 19:06:23 solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has joined #lisp 19:06:33 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:07:12 so the only interest of backquote is the use of comma and @ 19:07:17 makes more sense now 19:07:55 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 19:09:16 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:09:33 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 19:10:26 treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has joined #lisp 19:10:45 -!- solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:11:22 -!- kmcorbett [~kmcorbett@173-9-35-41-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quit] 19:12:03 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Client Quit] 19:12:17 ebobby [~fms@50-0-172-141.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:14:07 froggey_ [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 19:14:26 rvrebane [~rvrebane@valjapaas.vkhk.ee] has joined #lisp 19:14:39 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:14:44 -!- froggey_ is now known as froggey 19:17:15 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 19:20:14 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-177-79.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:21:21 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:21:41 Vivitron [~user@pool-173-48-170-228.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:22:15 Is there a standard way to turn a pathname into a string the host OS will understand? 19:22:19 osa1 [~sinan@31.140.21.66] has joined #lisp 19:24:49 Neronus: namestring 19:25:02 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483CFB2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:26:10 df_ thanks 19:26:39 The result of namestring is actually implementation-dependent. 19:27:58 -!- treyka [~treyka@85.234.199.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:28:10 mensch_ [~mensch@c-67-189-240-148.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:28:12 Yuuhi [benni@p5483CFB2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:28:35 Yes. The canconical form it uses is implementation-dependent (according to the spec) 19:28:55 -!- foregam [~mkk@79.124.84.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:28:56 Some implementations provide a function to produce a string suitable for use as a native namestring. On ccl, this is ccl:native-translated-namestring. I believe sbcl has sb-ext:native-namestring, which does a similar thing. 19:30:27 -!- etenil [~user@93-96-0-153.zone4.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:31:13 solussd [~solussd@108.167.2.53] has joined #lisp 19:31:19 tomodo [~tomodo@gateway/tor-sasl/tomodo] has joined #lisp 19:32:31 kuzary [~who@gateway/tor-sasl/kuzary] has joined #lisp 19:38:45 -!- gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:40:20 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:41:40 bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:8a53:8940:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has joined #lisp 19:41:50 dru1d [~lukasz@ip-82-177-172-217.net.azartsat.pl] has joined #lisp 19:42:35 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 19:43:04 or if you have the freedom then you can use pathnames in iolib 19:44:08 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:46:56 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-173-48-170-228.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:48:45 Anyone using Postmodern with PostgreSQL on SBCL 1.0.55? I'm getting this from a saved image http://paste.lisp.org/display/128422 19:51:52 Kenjin: if there's a connection cache, try to clear it before saving an image. 19:51:53 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [] 19:53:03 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 19:53:19 -!- maxm- [~user@openchat.com] has left #lisp 19:53:41 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:55:16 maxm- [~user@openchat.com] has joined #lisp 19:55:28 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-402770.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 19:55:43 pkhuong: how can I check if there is a connection cache? 19:58:10 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-68-51-88-12.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 20:03:42 -!- TDT [~user@102.207.43.66.sta.southslope.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:34 mathrick_ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 20:05:11 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:05:20 Kenjin: read the documentation? 20:07:09 pkhuong: ;) 20:07:50 (clear-connection-pool). 20:08:53 pkhuong: found it. thanks ;) 20:10:34 and remember to kill any toplevel connection. 20:12:35 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:13:36 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-226.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:13:51 wildnux [~wildnux@pool-71-252-145-78.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:15:50 tiglog [~topeak@118.186.129.169] has joined #lisp 20:15:53 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@24.130.4.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:16:56 s0ber_ [~s0ber@114-36-235-126.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 20:17:22 -!- seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:17:45 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:19:07 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.137.25] has joined #lisp 20:19:10 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@114-36-231-170.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:19:14 -!- s0ber_ is now known as s0ber 20:21:10 Phoodus [~foo@ip72-223-116-248.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:23:54 rtoym [~chatzilla@24.130.4.105] has joined #lisp 20:25:04 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 20:25:10 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Client Quit] 20:26:35 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-72-83-26-98.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 20:27:10 lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-234-209.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:27:11 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-234-209.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 20:27:11 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 20:27:36 -!- housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has quit [Quit: Terminated with extreme prejudice - dircproxy 1.0.5] 20:28:17 pkhuong: I'm only using top-level connection. I'm calling (disconnect-toplevel) and (clear-connection-pool) on the image before setting up the connection 20:28:30 still having the same issue 20:29:13 I'd do that before saving an image. 20:29:43 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:30:14 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:30:24 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:31:42 pkhuong: I'll try that 20:32:22 -!- Frowardly [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:32:47 Frowardly [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has joined #lisp 20:37:55 pkhuong: error message improved: "No database connection selected." 20:38:54 Kenjin: now re-connect in the new instance. 20:39:33 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-48-223.cascadeaccess.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:39:33 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:39:51 I'm using (apply #'postmodern:connect-toplevel (db-params)) 20:40:06 where db-params returns a list with database, user, pass and host 20:40:08 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-48-223.cascadeaccess.com] has joined #lisp 20:40:48 gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:41:01 -!- bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:8a53:8940:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:41:31 -!- Guthur [~user@host86-150-156-18.range86-150.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:41:39 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:41:44 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:42:00 mathrick_ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 20:44:01 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:44:52 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:45:44 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[~loktite@c-98-202-2-109.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:26:54 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.156.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:26:54 -!- rme_ is now known as rme 21:27:03 -!- rme [rme@E5E822D2.F26E1912.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 21:28:31 Anybody knows how to determine what encoding is used in cmd.exe on MS-Windows (in particular from a CL program)? 21:28:57 There doesn't seem to be any environment variable like LC_ALL or TERM there 21:28:59 albacker [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 21:28:59 -!- albacker [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Changing host] 21:28:59 albacker [~eni@unaffiliated/enyx] has joined #lisp 21:30:17 -!- osa1 [~sinan@31.140.21.66] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:30:29 -!- asvil [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:31:04 gabnet [~gabnet@85.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 21:32:48 -!- gabnet [~gabnet@85.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:33:28 realitygrill [~realitygr@wsip-174-70-27-140.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:33:31 -!- mgodshall [~quassel@74-36-216-127.br1.hzl.pa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: gurgle gurgle] 21:36:33 Seems #+ccl(#_GetACP) is the answer. 21:36:34 I like the Banks reference realitygrill. 21:36:51 hah, thanks 21:39:38 pnq [~nick@AC82C748.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 21:41:49 -!- mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-132-33-164.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Quit: mcstar] 21:43:37 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082AE70.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 21:45:16 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:45:35 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5082A368.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:52:23 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p5081AD22.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:52:28 slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-76-254-41-146.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:53:17 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.137.25] has quit 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Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 22:24:10 redsky [~vigil@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 22:26:51 totzeit [~kirkwood@c-71-227-253-228.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:27:20 BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:28:31 -!- totzeit [~kirkwood@c-71-227-253-228.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:29:08 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:31:30 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.108.77] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:33:02 rme_ [~rme@50.43.154.40] has joined #lisp 22:33:02 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-35-53-175.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:33:53 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.146.151] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:33:54 -!- rme_ is now known as rme 22:34:19 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 22:34:24 -!- rme [rme@45ABB5FE.20EC5E68.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 22:34:26 Froward [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has joined #lisp 22:34:57 -!- albacker [~eni@unaffiliated/enyx] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:35:00 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-190-99-234.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:09 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@100.Red-88-11-23.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 22:36:37 -!- Frowardly [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:38:31 Does anyone know of an ncurry (integer indexed curry) ? I'm sure it's not too tricky to implement but I'm both a noob and lazy. eh... I guess that sounds like a homework question, but it isn't. it's for have a closure builder I'm trying to improve: 22:38:48 (defun functional (this-function &rest other-functions) (lambda (&rest closure-args) (apply this-function (mapcar (rcurry #'apply closure-args) other-functions)))) can do some fun things if I use ncurry instead of rcurry 22:40:50 well, ncurry plus a dolist 22:41:50 what does ncurry do? 22:42:58 -!- BeWhy [~chatzilla@c-76-124-138-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:43:43 curry returns a function with some arguments preapplied. lcurry and rcurry do this by appending arguments: 22:43:50 (defun rcurry (fn &rest args) #'(lambda (&rest args2) (apply fn (append args2 args)))) 22:44:13 pinc0de [~pinc0de@cpc1-hudd8-0-0-cust362.4-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 22:44:28 Instead of appending from the left or right, ncurry uses an integer index to preapply any argument of the function to be curried 22:44:51 only one argument? 22:44:52 Sadly the only google hits I'm seeing are for some java extension 22:45:26 one at a time would be fine, yeah. Could write a wrapper on top of that to do multiple, easy 22:45:26 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-172-196.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:45:40 (defun ncurry (n arg fun) (lambda (&rest args) (apply fun (append (subseq args 0 n) (list arg) (subseq args n))))) 22:46:46 pjb: thanks, will try that 22:47:01 What sort of functions would you use ncurry with? Wouldn't it make more sense to write the function to use keyword arguments and then use curry? 22:47:10 Well, built-in functions I guess. 22:47:16 Or others that aren't designed with curry in mind 22:47:37 Sgeo: yes, precisely. Keywords work fine with lcurry or rcurry but I don't want to write keyword wrappers for all the preexisting functions I want to curry 22:49:27 with: (defun ncurry (n arg fun) (lambda (&rest args) (apply fun (append (subseq args 0 (min n (length args))) (list arg) (subseq args (min n (length args))))))) 22:49:27 -!- Arbamisto [~Arbamisto@192.188.108.71] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:49:46 Arbamisto [~Arbamisto@192.188.108.71] has joined #lisp 22:50:03 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@86-002.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:50:24 -!- Farzad [~farzadbek@46.225.101.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:52:18 urandom__ [~user@p548A46C2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 22:52:50 pjb: http://paste.lisp.org/display/128425 22:55:45 Thanks guys. eager to tinker with that, but sadly wife is insisting we go out to dinner immediately. 22:56:49 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-190-99-234.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:57:24 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:10:17 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:11:55 -!- rme [rme@ACA26270.ED8853D8.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:12:14 rme_ [~rme@50.43.143.186] has joined #lisp 23:13:05 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.154.40] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:13:06 -!- rme_ is now known as rme 23:15:00 -!- rme [rme@51153323.DEB6CE53.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:15:09 rme_ [~rme@50.43.135.70] has joined #lisp 23:15:50 -!- dru1d [~lukasz@ip-82-177-172-217.net.azartsat.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:18:04 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.143.186] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:18:05 -!- rme_ [rme@D7BFEEAC.80B03224.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:18:27 rme [~rme@50.43.132.81] has joined #lisp 23:18:42 KDr2 [~kdr2@123.122.111.177] has joined #lisp 23:18:47 antonv [5d7d31e8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.232] has joined #lisp 23:19:23 -!- rme_ [~rme@50.43.135.70] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:20:38 -!- tomodo [~tomodo@gateway/tor-sasl/tomodo] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:20:54 -!- rme [rme@358AA5D.BB195282.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:22:50 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.132.81] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:24:58 -!- killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 23:25:08 killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has joined #lisp 23:25:48 -!- killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:25:54 killown [~geek@unaffiliated/killown] has joined #lisp 23:31:44 yates [~user@184.76.132.252] has joined #lisp 23:32:31 is there a nice way in slime to rename a function and have all call sites get renamed? 23:32:32 -!- gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:32:36 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-402770.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:32:52 gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:33:12 There is slime-who-calls, which'll help you find all the references. 23:33:14 rme [~rme@50.43.156.68] has joined #lisp 23:34:07 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:34:11 unfortunately, that doesn't seem to work with CCL. 23:34:31 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 23:36:10 -!- rme [rme@495DE492.F26E1912.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:37:35 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.156.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:37:56 -!- KDr2 [~kdr2@123.122.111.177] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:38:30 rme [~rme@50.43.154.7] has joined #lisp 23:40:55 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82C748.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:41:07 rme_ [~rme@50.43.155.77] has joined #lisp 23:41:17 -!- rme [rme@A8F719C0.ED8853D8.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:43:03 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.154.7] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:44:05 -!- rme_ [rme@A20A375A.4E81D677.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Ping timeout] 23:45:02 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:45:44 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@195.225.68.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:46:01 -!- rme_ [~rme@50.43.155.77] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:46:21 is clisp=cmucl? 23:46:32 yates: No. 23:46:39 They are two separate implementations of Common Lisp. 23:46:47 but isn't clisp also by cmu? 23:47:06 kpreid [~kpreid@cpe-67-249-228-147.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:47:19 oh, i think i'm wrong on that. the answer is no, correct? 23:47:19 yates: No. 23:47:22 right 23:47:34 -!- Froward [~uh-oh@64.134.69.62] has quit [Quit: even in laughter, the heart of Snorlax is sorrowful. and the end of that mirth is heaviness.] 23:48:29 is one (clisp vs. cmucl) considered "better" than the other? 23:51:20 SBCL is a fork of CMUCL that's one of the fastest runtime & popular 23:51:48 CLISP's strength is its ability to run pretty much anywhere 23:52:49 -!- gridaphobe [~user@cpe-74-68-151-24.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:53:07 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 23:55:04 Hunh, Alexandria doesn't seem to compile on ECL  23:55:53 ECL is the second impl (CLISP being the first) that complained about LOOP body preceding a FOR form. 23:56:02 CLISP just warned, though. ECL barfs. 23:56:34 I thought that was one of the pluses of LOOP  eliminating the loop-and-a-half issue common in other langs. 23:58:29 rme [~rme@50.43.148.189] has joined #lisp 23:59:32 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp