00:00:22 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: quit?] 00:01:45 -!- tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:03:49 -!- Noctifer [~Noctifer@wrzb-4d004669.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:04:16 -!- vervic [~vervic@vie-91-186-155-147.dsl.sil.at] has quit [Quit: vervic] 00:04:25 Noctifer [~Noctifer@wrzb-4d004669.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:17 bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:52 urandom__ [~user@p548A22C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 00:08:01 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: zzz] 00:08:58 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A22C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:11:03 tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 00:15:42 any users of the zeromq CL binding, cl-zmq, I am getting a "Interrupted system call" on receiving socket. 00:16:06 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h169n4c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: add^_] 00:16:26 I am implementing the parallel pipeline pattern from the guide 00:17:32 there is no signal interrupt with a mundane worker 00:18:16 otakutom_ [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 00:18:37 the worker I want to implement is using drakma to fetch a csv file from the web, and then fare-csv to parse into a sexp form 00:18:50 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:21:32 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has joined #lisp 00:22:07 -!- pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:23:06 slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has joined #lisp 00:24:02 -!- Brucio-39 is now known as homie 00:26:54 -!- Teth [~caius@cpe-184-58-4-1.woh.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 00:30:29 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.2.151] has joined #lisp 00:31:49 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA21A6B.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:35:31 just found with that the signal interrupt will happen with the mundane worker as well, if it runs long enough 00:37:09 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:39:47 waveman [~tim@203-214-39-56.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 00:40:37 -!- tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:40:45 Guthur: at the OS API level, that error is normal and basically means "the kernel got distracted, try again" 00:41:15 I don't know if you should be seeing it above the lib level, though 00:41:17 -!- pavelludiq is now known as pavelpenev 00:41:26 alvis [~alvis@tx-184-5-64-92.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 00:41:46 I have a vague memory of running into a similar issue with zeromq and .net binding on Mono 00:42:15 -!- kennyd_ [~kennyd@78-0-206-50.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:43:03 looks like intended behavior 00:43:13 it should be reasonably safe to automatically restart 00:43:50 the lib is not taking care of that unfortunately 00:44:27 and the zmq internals are getting into a mess, I am not using the latest and greatest though 00:44:33 probably should build from source 00:44:34 yes, that appears to be intended behavior 00:44:38 it should be reasonably safe to automatically restart 00:45:30 not an option, like I said the zeromq internals are in a mess 00:45:38 ...after the interrupt 00:45:49 urandom__ [~user@p548A4B7E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 00:47:16 kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-80-1.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 00:50:58 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-195-2.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 00:51:40 Guthur: what version of zmq are you using? 00:52:22 2.0.10 00:52:32 that's ancient 00:52:43 it has many issues (using asserts all over the place) 00:52:45 yeah, I thought I might get a way with it 00:52:47 try latest stable 00:52:48 2.1.11 00:53:13 i'm using 2.1.9 myself 00:53:16 no such issues 00:55:39 oh actually it was 2.1.10 00:55:47 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-155.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:55:47 it's what is in the debian backports 00:56:04 xristos: what lisp are you using 00:59:00 j2_ [5f10fe0b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.16.254.11] has joined #lisp 00:59:38 -!- j2_ [5f10fe0b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.16.254.11] has quit [Client Quit] 01:00:16 i'm using python ;p 01:05:12 you mean cl-python ? 01:06:24 probably just python, I know the python binding would get a lot more love than the CL one 01:07:29 this is really not nice, it doesn't even return from the foreign recv func so that I can retry 01:07:33 -!- sellout [~Adium@pool-98-114-58-126.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:08:33 is SBCL being a little too pedantic about it in some way? 01:10:08 nicdev [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:15:18 I do ZMQ in SBCL all day long, and an interrupted syscall coming out of a zmq call is super-safe to restart 01:16:01 -!- Noctifer [~Noctifer@wrzb-4d004669.pool.mediaWays.net] has left #lisp 01:16:13 I have wrappers around zmq:send/recv that just retry until they succeed or fail for any reason other than that 01:17:21 pferor [~user@unaffiliated/pferor] has joined #lisp 01:23:48 -!- spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 01:24:45 sshirokov: ah indeed 01:25:20 I thought because it wasn't returning the errno something was fubar, just need the right handling 01:25:27 Also, zmq:poll can throw them out 01:25:41 Depending on your binding you may be able to tell it to shut up 01:26:38 yep, I'm just going to silent try again 01:33:32 -!- gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-24-222-40.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:35:55 -!- nicdev [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:38:09 -!- otakutom_ [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:38:46 -!- rswarbrick 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-!- pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 02:46:53 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:50:19 pnq [~nick@AC8187B3.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 02:53:29 otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 02:57:47 -!- davazp [~user@89.100.226.133] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:09:22 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:13:09 -!- ddp [~ddp@anon-136-131.relakks.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:16:31 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 03:21:53 smoogy [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 03:23:29 -!- JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:24:30 teggi [~teggi@113.172.61.228] has joined #lisp 03:25:28 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:29:42 Hi fellow lispers. I just added db and other macros as shortcuts with a feature that the variables that start with "ignore" have a declare ignore inserted for them so sbcl will not complain they are not used - any comments? http://pastebin.com/21WkJ73t 03:30:00 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:30:09 ... added to my personal utilities.lisp file. 03:35:06 otakutom_ [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 03:37:47 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:37:51 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:40:07 JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 03:40:11 gaidal [~gaidal@223.198.225.45] has joined #lisp 03:44:05 -!- dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:49:18 zzach [~zzach@dslb-178-009-254-168.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:44 -!- zzach1 [~zzach@dslb-094-221-126-205.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:58:01 slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has joined #lisp 04:02:53 monxxx [~monx@74.72.177.65] has joined #lisp 04:06:35 -!- smoogy [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has quit [Quit: Chateando desde http://webchat.redmundial.org (Ping timeout)] 04:08:07 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:11:48 -!- syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-106-118.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:48:06 felideon [~user@weston-69.65.92.95.myacc.net] has joined #lisp 04:50:28 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-224-202.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:54:07 -!- Shaftoe [~Moe111@modemcable037.54-22-96.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: Shaftoe] 05:00:33 NihilistDandy [~NihilistD@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:03:14 wh [~wh@112.91.81.82] has joined #lisp 05:03:39 -!- wh is now known as Guest81358 05:03:52 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-64-92.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:04:07 zophy [~zophy@host-5-150-220-24.midco.net] has joined #lisp 05:05:23 how can i determine the environment of a lisp image as far as seeing which packages are loaded ? 05:05:34 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:05:52 list-all-packages? 05:05:58 -!- monxxx [~monx@74.72.177.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 05:06:39 sounds like a winner 05:07:51 Bike, yes, thanks for the tip 05:08:03 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@223.198.225.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:08:15 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-122-89.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 05:08:35 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:09:06 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp0217.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 05:09:49 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-103-193.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:09:49 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 05:17:54 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.130.95] has quit [Quit: rme] 05:18:15 coderdad [~coderdad@ip68-97-195-24.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:22:29 -!- coderdad [~coderdad@ip68-97-195-24.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:23:36 hba [~hba@189.130.178.126] has joined #lisp 05:25:51 gaidal [~gaidal@223.198.250.32] has joined #lisp 05:26:58 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:30:28 -!- pnq [~nick@AC8187B3.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:30:46 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.172.81] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:43:06 -!- felideon [~user@weston-69.65.92.95.myacc.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 05:47:27 nicdev [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:48:54 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 05:53:59 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 05:54:23 chenbing` [~user@122.233.181.160] has joined #lisp 05:54:40 -!- nicdev [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:57:29 -!- chenbing [~user@122.233.179.205] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:03:46 mjsobota [~mjsobota@c-50-129-228-62.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:05:24 -!- mjsobota is now known as michael 06:05:52 -!- michael is now known as michaels 06:06:14 -!- michaels is now known as michaeljs 06:07:19 -!- michaeljs is now known as register 06:07:24 -!- register is now known as michaeljs 06:08:34 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 06:09:05 -!- michaeljs is now known as michael 06:09:10 -!- michael is now known as michaeljs 06:09:24 -!- michaeljs is now known as mjsobota 06:11:34 dtw [dtw@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 06:17:51 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@cpe-65-28-172-255.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 06:19:38 -!- Guest81358 [~wh@112.91.81.82] has quit [Quit: ] 06:21:07 -!- wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-139-168.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:21:14 -!- kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:21:20 wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 06:21:43 -!- homie [~Brucio-39@xdsl-78-35-139-168.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:21:44 -!- NihilistDandy [~NihilistD@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 06:22:17 kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has joined #lisp 06:24:05 xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has joined #lisp 06:26:09 -!- pferor [~user@unaffiliated/pferor] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:26:37 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 06:27:01 pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 06:28:12 -!- syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:32:21 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:33:29 -!- chenbing` [~user@122.233.181.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:33:53 chenbing` [~user@122.233.181.160] has joined #lisp 06:34:27 Cosman246 [~cosman246@207.239.114.206] has joined #lisp 06:34:32 Hey, guys 06:34:36 I don't have much time right now 06:34:39 but SLIME is broken 06:34:47 it can't open because it can 06:34:54 '*can't find ASDF 06:35:36 nicdev_ [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:35:53 -!- nicdev_ is now known as nicdev 06:36:20 http://paste.lisp.org/display/126788 06:36:47 Once I sign off, please annotate--I'll be on a plane in a few minutes 06:37:29 does anyone have any help? 06:43:34 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:45:09 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 06:46:58 OK-never mind 06:47:04 A reinstall of quicklisp helped 06:49:50 -!- Cosman246 [~cosman246@207.239.114.206] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:52:43 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@CPE0013f7c06a42-CM0013f7c06a3e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: Kron awayyy!] 06:52:46 chromaticwt [~user@67-41-15-81.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:52:47 ghosTM55 [~ghosTM55@li279-245.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 06:54:20 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:55:34 guest_ [~guest@c-24-34-195-237.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:58:00 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.181] has joined #lisp 07:00:27 parabolize [~gyro@c-75-71-247-61.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:03:44 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@223.198.250.32] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:06:28 wadexing [~wadexing@219.234.141.122] has joined #lisp 07:07:54 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has joined #lisp 07:10:43 -!- kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:10:46 wh [~wh@112.91.81.82] has joined #lisp 07:10:55 -!- wh [~wh@112.91.81.82] has quit [Client Quit] 07:11:04 wh [~wh@112.91.81.82] has joined #lisp 07:11:10 -!- wh is now known as Guest15995 07:11:31 kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has joined #lisp 07:25:05 me345 [~me345@adsl-71-131-128-130.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:26:06 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-122-89.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 07:27:12 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has joined #lisp 07:27:12 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has quit [Changing host] 07:27:12 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 07:27:54 -!- mjsobota [~mjsobota@c-50-129-228-62.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: mjsobota] 07:35:32 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:36:17 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-30.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:42:32 -!- yoklov [~user@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:43:04 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:45:40 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 07:47:23 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Disconnected by services] 07:47:23 attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has joined #lisp 07:49:08 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:02:55 -!- attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:02:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 08:03:33 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:04:48 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:10:10 avarghese [abe_v@123.236.196.213] has joined #lisp 08:11:26 -!- avarghese [abe_v@123.236.196.213] has quit [Client Quit] 08:14:44 francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has joined #lisp 08:16:15 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has joined #lisp 08:16:16 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-409947.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 08:16:17 Hi, please see this: http://paste.lisp.org/display/126789 the lisp is a direct translation of perl, but the answers differ why? sbcl 0.49763718 while perl: 0.4976372549019611 08:23:51 -!- JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:24:42 -!- chromaticwt [~user@67-41-15-81.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:26:49 -!- ghosTM55 [~ghosTM55@li279-245.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:28:22 -!- hba [~hba@189.130.178.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:28:31 francogrex: these are the same answer: 0.497 ! 08:29:23 francogrex: http://www.exploringbinary.com/the-four-stages-of-floating-point-competence/ "What Every Computer Scientist Should Know About Floating-Point Arithmetic" : http://docs-pdf.sun.com/800-7895/800-7895.pdf 08:29:23 08:29:25 pjb-: yes but I meant the decimal points 08:29:35 ok 08:30:37 pjb-: I assumed his question was why the results were different, not why they were imprecise. 08:30:41 (setf *read-default-float-format* 'double-float) 08:38:23 that sounds likely! 08:38:30 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 08:43:05 yes it's because of that then 08:45:44 -!- wadexing [~wadexing@219.234.141.122] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:48:19 chromaticwt [~user@67-41-15-81.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 08:51:57 mmmmd [~tasty@adsl-99-133-161-100.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 08:53:43 -!- bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:01:33 dRbiG [drbig@insomniac.pl] has joined #lisp 09:02:12 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:14:06 -!- mmmmd [~tasty@adsl-99-133-161-100.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Not that there is anything wrong with that] 09:14:19 mmmmd [~tasty@adsl-99-133-161-100.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 09:17:28 tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 09:27:44 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 09:28:47 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.123.251.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:33:40 -!- me345 [~me345@adsl-71-131-128-130.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:34:57 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-102-93.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: agh] 09:35:16 francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has joined #lisp 09:36:33 -!- otakutom_ [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:36:50 otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:40:28 -!- Guest15995 [~wh@112.91.81.82] has quit [Quit: ] 09:44:31 -!- dtw [dtw@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: ...] 09:45:02 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.2.151] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:47:04 kami` [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has joined #lisp 09:47:09 Good morning. 09:47:19 -!- kami` is now known as kami 09:48:47 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:49:27 Is there a function like copy-structure which creates a deep copy? 09:49:50 No. 09:49:58 It doesn't have to be portable. 09:49:59 that would require defining "deep copy" for arbitrary objects. 09:50:04 which isn't meaningful 09:50:06 anyone knows of a new lisp to scm translator? I found this one: www.inf.ufsc.br/~func/dean/SchemeSupport/schemify.scmCached but it's ratrher old 09:50:13 Read: http://www.nhplace.com/kent/PS/EQUAL.html and do it yourself. 09:50:27 ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has joined #lisp 09:50:50 pjb: thank you. I did read that one. 09:50:55 www.inf.ufsc.br/~func/dean/SchemeSupport/schemify.scm 09:51:17 I'm porting old code which contains a deep-copy function. 09:51:32 It seems to copy arbitrary structs 09:52:06 then you should copy that function and hope as hard as you can that it's got well-defined and intentional behavior 09:52:10 By copying not only the struct but also the content of the slots 09:52:27 kami: what about circular structures? 09:52:36 kami: anyways, you have to implement it yourself. 09:53:11 pjb, Ralith: thank you 09:53:22 isnt thats how deep copy works anyway ? 09:53:47 by being poorly and/or arbitrarily defined? generally. 09:54:16 no i mean copying values , that are not referenced 09:54:36 "shared referenced" 09:55:57 osa1 [~sinan@88.243.249.245] has joined #lisp 09:57:41 kami: your deep-copy will have a problem: there's no standard way to find what the copy function is for a given structure. (defstruct point (:copier duplicate-point) x y) 09:58:03 kami: (defstruct (point (:copier duplicate-point)) x y) ; I mean. 10:00:26 hi 10:00:29 pjb: hi 10:00:33 Hi! 10:03:05 -!- mmmmd [~tasty@adsl-99-133-161-100.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:13:24 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 10:14:40 drwho [~drwho@c-68-81-125-196.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:19:06 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.129.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 10:20:00 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:20:29 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.182.158] has joined #lisp 10:21:31 -!- sellout [~Adium@pool-98-114-58-126.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:26:49 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-83-83.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:26:49 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.102.71.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:28:39 -!- EyesIsAsleep is now known as EyesIsServer 10:28:49 -!- benny [~benny@i577A2ADA.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:28:58 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-155.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:29:00 mmmmd [~tasty@adsl-76-254-6-25.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 10:29:05 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:30:33 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:32:13 -!- waveman [~tim@203-214-39-56.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:32:39 rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 10:34:39 -!- kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:34:55 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 10:37:56 ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has joined #lisp 10:40:02 fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-19-208.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 10:41:51 velov [~velov@91.207.42.52] has joined #lisp 10:43:14 -!- wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:48:23 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082B498.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:50:27 -!- daniel_ [~daniel@p5B326E1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:50:33 homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 10:55:08 tcr1 [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 10:55:08 -!- tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:05:05 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:09:16 add^_ [~add^_^@h169n4c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 11:11:39 -!- SHODAN [~shozan@c-a1b5e253.011-86-73746f30.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:11:47 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:12:35 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a3b1b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 11:13:37 ngz [~user@23.78.199.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 11:15:06 -!- kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:17:02 kpal [~kpal@217-12-69-129.sibtele.com] has joined #lisp 11:17:55 leo2007 [~leo@123.123.251.104] has joined #lisp 11:17:59 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-409947.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:18:06 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.145] has joined #lisp 11:19:15 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-409947.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 11:20:30 spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 11:22:39 francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has joined #lisp 11:23:44 -!- _nix00 [~Adium@116.228.89.171] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:28:10 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 11:28:45 mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-132-25-70.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 11:29:49 -!- guest_ [~guest@c-24-34-195-237.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has left #lisp 11:32:57 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 11:36:28 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:37:21 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:37:45 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:44:16 does common lisp have a generic get function? like setf? 11:45:58 What do you mean by a "get function" 11:45:59 ? 11:46:08 For example, do you mean accessors for slot values? 11:46:40 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 11:46:59 osa1: no. The whole idea is that the "get function" looks like what you pass to setf 11:47:16 (setf (aref a 1) 2) vs (aref a 1) 11:47:28 i was told setf is not a function btw 11:48:12 You can implement a generic getter. (with it's associated setter). 11:49:39 pjb: but... why? 11:49:53 -!- X-Scale [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:50:40 So that when you change your data you don't have to change the code. 11:50:59 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 11:51:07 you mean data-container 11:51:41 oh, containers. right. 11:52:22 after evaluating (in-package :my-package), defining my functions with same name with common-lisp standard functions gives warnings, and when I ignore and define, I'm overriding functions in cl package, does anyone know why? 11:53:03 osa1: you're :using the cl package, which imports all the exported symbols from cl 11:53:03 because you wanted that? 11:53:07 osa1: see for example: http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/browse_frm/thread/82718221ab08acaa/c5dc91b57b35b82b?hl=en&q=%22-%3E%22+defun+cond+setf+gethash+aref+group:comp.lang.lisp+author:pascal+author:bourguignon#c5dc91b57b35b82b 11:53:32 dlowe: do I use :cl package after evaluating (in-package ..) ? 11:53:38 osa1: (defpackage :my-package (:use :cl) (:shadow :car :cdr :cond ...)) 11:53:49 osa1: when you write your own functions with the same name, you're trying to redefine cl:function, not my-package:function 11:53:59 use shadow to be able to define your own symbols with the same name. 11:54:00 osa1: and that's disallowed 11:55:09 zanahorio [~hahehihoh@53.132.60.178.dynamic.mundo-r.com] has joined #lisp 11:55:21 -!- zanahorio [~hahehihoh@53.132.60.178.dynamic.mundo-r.com] has left #lisp 11:55:23 dlowe: then why I'm defining new packages if I can't define functions without overriding functions from other packages? 11:55:37 pjb: or he can extend stock functions with his own classes right?(are many of those generic functions?) 11:55:42 osa1: SHADOW!!!!!!!!! 11:55:59 mcstar: there are a few generic functions in CL, yes. 11:56:06 pjb: thanks 11:56:37 osa1: When you say "(defun cdr () ...)" and you have imported CL, it's the same as "(defun cl::cdr () ...)". And that would be overriding the definition of the common lisp basic function. 11:56:44 That's why it isn't allowed... 11:56:55 As everyone else said, shadow the symbol 11:57:12 rswarbrick: does defining like (defun my-package::cdr () ...) solve the problem? 11:57:17 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:57:31 osa1: you mean you haven't tried it? 11:57:32 did you guys follow this year's AiChallenge(Ants)? 11:57:43 what do you think about the lispers? 11:57:57 osa1: anyway, seems like you're trading one problem for another there 11:58:01 mcstar: I don't think about the lispers 11:58:02 dlowe: didn't solve anything 11:58:25 osa1: nod. without shadowing, my-package::cdr is the same as cl:cdr 11:58:31 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 11:58:32 maybe I should read a chapter about common lisp packages 11:58:34 osa1: You should make sure you understand exactly what my-package::cdr refers to 11:58:39 Yep, seems wise :-) 11:58:46 probably there were many newbies there 11:59:26 paratrechina came 61st, thats not bad 12:00:35 i used c++11, i only used common lisp in the beta-phase, turned out im not that great in it 12:03:47 what a sparkling dialog... 12:04:00 anyway, it was a great contest 12:04:18 Guthur [~user@host86-148-186-247.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 12:04:26 mcstar: yeah, I was impressed by the design of the contest 12:04:51 what was your bot called? 12:05:05 mcstar: I didn't have the time to enter 12:05:17 maybe next time 12:05:49 I doubt that I'll ever prioritize a contest over my own projects. 12:06:12 -!- rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has quit [Quit: Toodle doo!] 12:06:37 the return on time invested just isn't there for me 12:07:15 well, it was important for me to see where i stand with this whole programming thing 12:07:42 mcstar: so where do you stand? 12:08:11 i dont think im too bad/stupid, so im gonna pursue this art-form 12:10:35 mcstar: well CL is a very nice palette 12:10:43 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 12:11:04 once you learn more how to combine the elements 12:12:16 true, but theres little chance you can do that professionally 12:14:13 btw, there is one interesting fact 12:14:27 well, if you only program when at work you will most likely find yourself doing more paper work than actual programming 12:14:42 Oleg_Ovcharenko beat the best lisper and haskeller in ocaml 12:14:54 and he just "learned" this language for the contest 12:16:02 mcstar: they has probably got a lot of languages under this belt which often makes getting to grips with new languages a lot easier 12:18:35 ive read your last sentence a couple of times, yet its meaning eludes me 12:19:21 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-195-2.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:20:50 oops yes 12:21:36 show really read: he has probably got a lot of languages under his belt,... 12:21:42 show/should 12:22:26 not really, he is kind of young, has some delphi and c++ background 12:23:08 hehe, well maybe he's just a natural then 12:23:27 yep 12:23:28 *Guthur* has never tried OCAML 12:23:50 i just read an article about why it sucks, so i went with haskell :D 12:24:30 I am sure there is articles about why Haskell sucks as well 12:25:11 i tried to find them, with not much success 12:27:39 pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 12:27:45 -!- spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 12:28:41 nanobyte [~nanobyte@2001:c08:3700:ffff::b45] has joined #lisp 12:29:38 -!- chromaticwt [~user@67-41-15-81.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30:52 attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has joined #lisp 12:30:52 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Disconnected by services] 12:30:55 -!- attila_lendvai1 is now known as attila_lendvai 12:30:55 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.154.64] has quit [Changing host] 12:30:55 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 12:36:17 urandom__ [~user@p548A46C1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:36:21 and articles about why lisp sucks 12:36:58 Stroustrup got one thing right: there are languages that people complain about, and there are languages nobody uses 12:37:48 XD 12:38:26 -!- homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 12:40:09 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-19-208.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:40:27 -!- xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:40:34 smoogy [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 12:40:38 hello 12:41:28 hi, smoogy 12:41:42 xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has joined #lisp 12:42:56 how can I call base class method? 12:43:04 homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:43:15 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:43:29 from the overridden version of that method 12:43:39 smoogy: (call-next-method) 12:44:32 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:45:03 woh, i finally got into beirc with multiple join 12:45:08 thanks dlowe 12:45:18 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 12:45:19 spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 12:45:30 but the tab pane layout is sucking, it's soo long and extending into the non visible parts of my screen ...... 12:45:39 lol 12:46:14 and another thing is the scroll-to-bottom thing not working 12:46:19 -!- spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Client Quit] 12:47:04 francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has joined #lisp 12:49:22 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:49:23 a lot of complaints about CL, in articles, seem to be levelled at the community 12:49:56 the sour lisper is quite famous 12:50:07 in what way ? 12:50:26 a pack of lone wolfs! 12:51:11 it's true that people seem like they'd rather make something of their own than contribute to an existing project 12:51:34 not sure if that's a lisp thing or just a bigger problem with fewer people 12:52:42 they have said that the lisp community is not very tolerant of newbies 12:52:59 hehe 12:53:08 I think there is both an element of truth and FUD to it 12:53:24 i have seen worse channels 12:57:43 KaZ- [~amir@76.89.182.137] has joined #lisp 12:59:30 I think much of that is from the c.l.l atmosphere 13:00:28 that and lisp's counter-cultural image attracts cranks as well as the curious 13:01:58 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04ea5d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 13:02:13 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 13:02:27 _nix00 [~Adium@114.92.103.100] has joined #lisp 13:04:21 -!- ngz [~user@23.78.199.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:06:19 how can I restart list interpreter used by SLIME? 13:06:45 ,restart 13:06:45 lisp* 13:07:13 pjb: what is , ? 13:08:05 WHat it is: a comma. 13:09:44 pjb: so what should I do with it to restart lisp interpreter used by SLIME? sorry I'm new at emacs 13:10:15 CrazyWoods [~crazywood@220.160.188.36] has joined #lisp 13:11:45 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 13:11:55 osa1: so you should type ,restart 13:12:54 danishman [~kvirc@0x5da0ec2a.cpe.ge-0-1-0-1104.ronnqu1.customer.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 13:17:40 ...while in the REPL 13:17:48 buffer 13:18:09 osa1 are you in *SLIME repl* or *inferior-lisp* ? 13:18:10 spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 13:18:15 benny [~benny@i577A765F.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 13:18:51 smoogy: SLIME repl, ,restart is worked 13:19:50 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@122.172.204.37] has joined #lisp 13:19:50 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@122.172.204.37] has quit [Changing host] 13:19:50 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has joined #lisp 13:20:19 ngz [~user@23.78.199.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 13:23:37 how can i tell if im crank or curious? 13:23:48 in slime 13:24:49 good question. there should be a quantitative test 13:25:12 dlowe: re one-man projects: maybe they are still learning lisp? and feel better doing it alone... 13:25:24 mcstar: hope 13:25:26 er. nope 13:25:43 bri4n [~bri4n@89.40.124.31.static.netlog.ro] has joined #lisp 13:26:06 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-409947.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:27:52 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h169n4c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:28:40 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-408393.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 13:28:53 on a sidenote, i came across this: http://mitpress.mit.edu/SICM/book-Z-H-1.html 13:29:03 i was very much surprised 13:29:09 add^_ [~add^_^@h26n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 13:29:17 im considering reading it 13:31:10 let me hilight the co-author: Gerald Jay Sussman 13:32:01 -!- pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:32:11 mcstar: on a slightly related noted, if you get time check out this vid... 13:32:13 http://www.infoq.com/presentations/We-Really-Dont-Know-How-To-Compute 13:32:41 Sussman talks about the use of programming in teaching mathematic heavy subjects 13:32:53 though that is not the main topic of the talk 13:33:16 Guthur: thx for the site 13:34:19 pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:35:46 can I setf (ldb ...) ? 13:37:10 osa1: you should consult the clhs 13:37:28 mcstar: actually I've just tried and it worked but I'm not sure if there are portability problems 13:38:20 if its in the spec, there wont be those issues, and from the top of my head there shouldnt be portability issues 13:38:47 osa1: yes, you can 13:39:49 -!- bri4n [~bri4n@89.40.124.31.static.netlog.ro] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:43:47 -!- pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:43:58 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181138064.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 13:45:43 pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:45:53 -!- ASau [~user@95-27-174-189.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:48:00 kenanb [kenanb@176.54.202.75] has joined #lisp 13:48:03 dtw [~dtw@62.237.32.210] has joined #lisp 13:48:12 can I use `list` as type specifier in defmethods? 13:48:24 osa1, yes. 13:48:38 But it's class specifier. 13:52:49 bri4n [~bri4n@89.40.124.31.static.netlog.ro] has joined #lisp 13:53:13 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.17.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:53:34 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:53:43 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04ea5d.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 13:53:49 -!- KaZ- [~amir@76.89.182.137] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:56:55 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@72.19.54.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:57:33 Happy new year, lispers 13:58:42 happy new year 13:58:57 year of what is it thereover now ? 14:00:00 thereover? 14:00:24 erm, ok i thought china... 14:00:28 lol 14:01:14 homie: dragon 14:01:29 oh, if anyone insist on local timezone, there are 6-12 years 14:04:01 just a wish:-) 14:04:21 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:05:54 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a3b1b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:06:55 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-155.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:07:24 -!- kenanb [kenanb@176.54.202.75] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 14:07:32 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181138064.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:08:04 btw you can distinguish chinese name and japanese name by numbers of Vowel, tow are chinese,>=4 are japanese =3 uncertain 14:09:07 so nakamula is a japanese roman word 14:11:16 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-190.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:15:08 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:15:37 nialo [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 14:15:48 Aiwass [~aiwass@188.26.222.224] has joined #lisp 14:17:22 hi, is there a good article on writing linux daemons,that can be used with clisp? I can't find anything concrete 14:17:23 Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has joined #lisp 14:19:56 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04ea5d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 14:21:07 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 14:22:34 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 14:22:52 rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 14:25:12 pjb-` [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 14:25:33 ska [~s|k|a@93.126.216.86] has joined #lisp 14:25:59 -!- ska is now known as Guest57089 14:26:06 -!- pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:26:09 Aiwass: you mean creating a lisp program to run as a daemon ? 14:27:10 yes 14:27:20 Aiwass: there is no article like that 14:27:38 using screen seems to be popular work around, no? 14:27:53 H4ns: every day. what's up? 14:28:05 there was something for sbcl 14:29:26 but probably using screen is ok too 14:29:44 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:29:55 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 14:31:29 -!- pjb-` [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:31:38 pjb-` [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 14:33:27 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-385851.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 14:35:09 Aiwass: i use screen, but there's also detachtty. i also remember seeing a post or a library which ought to help with something of the likes, yes. i forgot where it was though. i always use screen 14:36:02 *Xach* vaguely remembers something called sb-daemon 14:36:05 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-408393.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:40:29 -!- kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-385851.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:41:18 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-411412.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 14:43:52 or you could just use the same posix calls to daemonize the process 14:44:01 it's not magic 14:45:06 dlowe: thing is, not everyone knows those posix calls. i wouldn't know how to use them... i guess that's what sb-daemon (or similar) does 14:45:47 Kron_ [~Kron@CPE0013f7c06a42-CM0013f7c06a3e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 14:45:56 I note that daemonization on github was just forked :p 14:46:07 http://www.cliki.net/swank-daemon 14:47:51 well, I could try posix calls 14:47:52 -!- velov [~velov@91.207.42.52] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:47:57 I used them in C 14:48:03 dlowe: the documentation seems a bit, russian? 14:48:04 velov [~velov@91.207.42.52] has joined #lisp 14:48:35 madnificent: heh. I just saw it pass my rss feed reader 14:50:31 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:50:42 otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:51:16 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 14:52:12 tyson1 [~Ian@bas1-toronto06-2925210014.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 14:53:49 gensym [~user@dslc-082-082-103-174.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 14:55:40 -!- Aiwass [~aiwass@188.26.222.224] has left #lisp 14:57:32 -!- xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:57:33 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04ea5d.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 14:59:29 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:04:00 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:05:38 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:06:10 -!- osa1 [~sinan@88.243.249.245] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:06:34 osa1 [~sinan@88.242.78.237] has joined #lisp 15:07:05 -!- nicdev [~user@c-76-24-21-219.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:11:31 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:12:41 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:13:19 otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:14:10 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:14:30 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-195-2.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 15:16:21 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:16:41 -!- Guest57089 [~s|k|a@93.126.216.86] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 15:17:21 what does ".. bytes consed" mean in (time ...)'s output? 15:17:30 -!- tyson1 [~Ian@bas1-toronto06-2925210014.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:17:52 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:18:20 == "bytes of memory allocated in heap" 15:18:39 osa1: people are often interested how much allocation (and, implicitly, garbage collection) has happened when timing. "consed" means "heap allocation which will need to be reclaimed eventually by the garbage collector" 15:19:11 -!- danishman [~kvirc@0x5da0ec2a.cpe.ge-0-1-0-1104.ronnqu1.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.1.3 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 15:20:07 thanks 15:20:09 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 15:20:47 -!- pnq [~nick@AC813F96.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 15:20:55 -!- spearalot [~spearalot@c83-248-111-48.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 15:20:56 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [] 15:22:24 kenanb [kenanb@176.54.202.75] has joined #lisp 15:22:45 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:27:17 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:32:36 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:34:05 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined 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[~velov@91.207.42.52] has quit [Quit: Get MacIrssi - http://www.sysctl.co.uk/projects/macirssi/] 16:28:47 kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has joined #lisp 16:30:40 Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #lisp 16:30:58 tcr [~tcr@95-88-46-7-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 16:32:47 danishman2 [~test@188.183.159.158] has joined #lisp 16:33:41 pferor [~user@unaffiliated/pferor] has joined #lisp 16:34:02 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 16:34:35 pjb, Ralith: while I was searching for code which accesses structs, I found http://www.n-a-n-o.com/lisp/save-object-10.2.lisp which contains an abstraction layer for finding the copier etc. 16:35:36 Would it be useful to extract that part from the object saving part? 16:35:47 Or maybe someone did that already? 16:38:02 -!- gozek_ is now known as gozek 16:39:11 -!- danishman2 [~test@188.183.159.158] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:39:21 nha 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has joined #lisp 19:13:43 bri4n [~bri4n@89.40.124.31.static.netlog.ro] has joined #lisp 19:13:50 is it a good choice to use lisp to doing GUI develop? 19:13:57 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:15:45 -!- mjejwa [~me345@adsl-71-131-128-130.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:17:23 -!- situ [~quassel@223.191.71.150] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:17:31 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:17:59 CrazyWoods I had good experience with CommonQt 19:18:43 -!- meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:19:16 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 19:19:29 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.172.61.228] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:20:16 I used Qt in C++ and python before, it was like a breath of fresh air that in CL I don't have to restart the program or close the windows to make changes 19:21:21 linmin_ [~linmin@180.168.30.174] has joined #lisp 19:21:28 -!- osa1 [~sinan@88.242.78.237] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:21:31 smoogy [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 19:21:53 -!- tyson1 [~Ian@CPE0017c521d8a2-CM001225d72fa4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has left #lisp 19:23:08 kennyd, so what would be easy to do GUI develop, python or lisp? 19:24:21 schmx [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 19:24:24 hello. why do :after :before and :around have no affect in this test code? 19:24:24 I'd use Tcl/Tk if I had to. 19:24:25 azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has joined #lisp 19:24:31 CrazyWoods: Depends what you're doing and how well you know each language. Kennyd's comment about having to close windows is important though: it's a right pain if you have to do 15 gui actions to trigger a bug with C code... 19:25:13 Actually I must have a closer look at ltk one day  McCLIM seems to be a wonderful thing but somewhat bitrotten/dusty/unfinished. 19:25:26 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:25:59 antoszka: All three, I fear. :-( 19:26:10 Yeah 19:26:39 rswarbrick, i newer for lisp, so just consider about which one would suitable for my project 19:27:47 Well, it really depends. If you don't know much lisp, it's going to take you a while to get anything working. But that's probably true of any language. And if you want to be a black belt programming ninja (un)like me, you probably want to learn lisp at some point. 19:27:47 CrazyWoods: What Lisp are you planning to use? 19:28:07 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-96-241-99-101.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:28:29 (hint: Emacs lisp is probably not the correct answer) 19:28:52 Although it comes with a nice builtin GUI, which even has a built in editor :-) 19:28:54 -!- azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:29:23 antoszka, maybe clojure :) 19:29:55 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:30:02 CrazyWoods: Hey, just use Java and swing :-) 19:30:05 can someone tell me what's going on in this test code, why is only cat method called?: http://paste.lisp.org/display/126802 19:30:20 are there some one would like to help me about this, i have a java version, i want to know if it's easy to use lisp to do such a things 19:30:21 racket has a nice builtin gui toolkit (it's a scheme and not a lisp, if you care about that distinction) 19:30:27 CrazyWoods: In that case stick to what Java gives you, but then this is probably not the best place to ask. 19:30:52 smoogy: You probably want format T ? 19:30:53 i see 19:31:31 smoogy: The return values of :before and :after methods get discarded, I think. 19:31:38 CrazyWoods: what kind of application are you trying to make 19:31:43 oh right.. I am just returning string 19:32:25 heh that's what happens when you're learning new things, you miss the most basic unrelated things 19:32:37 smoogy: If this is a mockup of something that really does return a string, consider using an around method and concatenating with (call-next-method). 19:32:47 yoklov`, a game editor like RPG maker 19:33:05 And you already have java code written? 19:33:43 yes, but just a rough version 19:33:49 do you have java env? 19:34:03 Clojure is certainly your best bet, as it runs on the JVM and can talk to the java code that you've already written. 19:34:30 rswarbrick ok what I want is have a drawable class. in the print-object for it I want to call draw-object for the object in question to draw it on screen if I am using SLIME repl, and regular print-object that just prints to a stream otherwise. how to best handle this? 19:34:40 clojure not armed bear? 19:34:48 (not used any of these tbh) 19:35:00 Clojure has a better interop, from what i've heard 19:35:15 this class will be inherited by all drawable objects, images, shapes etc 19:35:15 yoklov`, have you ever use it? 19:35:50 can I avoid having to check if I'm in SLIME or terminal in every single print-object method? 19:35:59 CrazyWoods: Yes to Clojure, no to armed bear. Talking to/instantiating java classes is trivial in clojure 19:36:47 how complete / usable armed bear really is? especially in comparison to clojure or a scheme in java? 19:37:16 CrazyWoods, for such applications I'd use tcl/tk (not lisp, but easy). 19:37:41 gravicappa: Ltk is a Lisp interface to tk 19:37:52 puchacz: I don't really know, but from what I've heard Clojure is the best lisp on the JVM, it also seems to be the most popular, and is gaining popularity. 19:37:53 From what I've seen easy. 19:38:07 Tcl/Tk is very easy, but also somewhat ugly 19:38:28 rswarbrick am I making sense? you probably didn't read my messages from the last couples of days. I'm using swank:eval-in-emacs to draw common lisp images etc in emacs buffer once they are printed in the repl 19:38:32 smoogy: Hmm, what do you mean by "draw it on screen"? As in with some graphical tool kit? 19:38:36 Ah! 19:38:38 Right. 19:39:36 Why not do it with a dynamic variable? Have a separate method on each object that it should be defined for called something like emacs-draw. 19:39:47 Oh, sorry, I mean: 19:40:14 yoklov`, i want so know which one would be easy 19:40:36 Well if you already have gui code written in java, clojure is easy as you can just use your existing code. 19:40:37 yoklov`, meaning doing less things i don't mind learning a new language 19:40:37 Define text-draw and emacs-draw for each object when you would normally override print-object. Then have a method on print-object for your base class that does the dispatch based on whatever. 19:40:43 Maybe a dynamic variable or something. 19:40:47 Does that sound plausible? 19:41:01 i am not sure what you mean by a dynamic variable 19:41:05 (this is a cool idea, by the way) 19:41:18 yoklov`, http://www.mapeditor.org/ 19:41:19 I mean a special variable: (defvar *i-am-in-emacs* nil) 19:41:20 yeah I was inspired by DrRacket 19:41:24 like this one 19:42:10 I am checking if emacs is running like this: swank::*emacs-connection* 19:42:19 smoogy: The idea is that dispatching on "whether I'm in slime" is difficult with standard method dispatch and this trick allows you to avoid it 19:42:26 Ah, fair enough: use that one! :-) 19:42:26 X-Scale [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #lisp 19:43:09 So you'd have the code: (if swank::*emacs-connection* (emacs-draw ob) (text-draw ob)) in your base class's print-object 19:43:58 Incidentally, I'd still have an override variable: if things go screwy with the Emacs interface, you probably want to be able to switch it off to work out what's going on! 19:44:21 You also have the problem of things like the slime inspector isn't going to work with this scheme: 19:44:23 I kind of wanted to allow overriding print-object for other classes, as that's the standard CL way to affect how the object is printed. so that it all works transparently and doesn't bother someone who isn't using emacs. would that be possible? 19:44:50 so print-object would just print to stream, like it usually does 19:45:04 Well, this would have that effect: the base class's print object would just call the text-draw function. I think? 19:45:32 CrazyWoods: Honestly the difficulty of learning lisp far offsets the difficulty of making a gui in any toolkit. Tcl/Tk is very easy but has the downside of not being especially pretty or configurable (from what i recall, at least). Clojure is easier if you just interop with your existing java classes, however doing gui's from scratch in clojure is more difficult, as Clojure has no classes so subclassing requires a different, less 19:45:32 obvious, mechanism. 19:45:37 (a user of your library would just have to redefine printing slightly oddly. And if they didn't use emacs, it wouldn't even matter if they didn't realise) 19:45:38 yeah but then someone has to override text-draw method, and not the print-object method like it's usually done 19:45:44 ^^ 19:45:52 pnq [~nick@AC81A1F8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 19:45:57 Only if they want the cleverness to work. 19:46:04 ok let me try to process all that 19:46:33 Thinking about it, there might be a hacky trick based on an around method on the base class, but I think it would be significantly more fragile. 19:47:45 yoklov`, what do you thing about using python? 19:48:05 smoogy: Ah, to avoid breaking Slime's inspector, you could also check that the output stream is *standard-output* before punting to emacs-draw in the base class. 19:48:15 yoklov`, are there other language you are good at except lisp/ 19:48:15 (I *think* that would work) 19:48:22 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 19:49:04 rswarbrick I see, let me test 19:49:06 CrazyWoods: Are you sure that what you're trying to ask is on-topic on this channel? 19:51:14 osa1 [~sinan@88.242.78.237] has joined #lisp 19:51:33 rsworbrick, sorry 19:51:56 :-) Heh, and your IRC client doesn't have tab completion, I see! 19:52:13 Or he doesn't use it. 19:52:17 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.123.251.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:52:27 Sorry - didn't mean to sound grumpy, but it's not clear that regulars on #lisp are going to be able to give you helpful answers to your questions. 19:52:38 Maybe for different questions........ :-) 19:52:45 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:53:18 rsworbrick, maybe i am looking for experience programmer to give me some advice :) 19:53:34 Ah, I'll shut up then... 19:53:42 rswarkrick, by the way IRC client with tab completion? 19:54:04 what are you using 19:54:08 xchat 19:54:53 rswarbrick: :) 19:55:07 irssi here 19:55:08 Congratulations... :-) 19:55:13 erc ftw! 19:55:30 Ah, but I like the blinking icon in the taskbar 19:55:49 (and used to use rcirc) 19:55:55 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:56:11 erc is the one that serves the channel with an occasional fuckup of all nicks pasted? 19:56:18 Or was it rcirc? 19:56:27 antoszka: ERC 19:56:35 p_l|backup: hah 19:56:39 Haha, I just like having it be part of emacs. 19:56:53 Prevents me from having too many programs open simultaneously. 19:56:55 I keep to irssi because it runs nicely in screen 19:57:10 I keep my irc session in screen in irssi on my router. 19:57:15 might finally sit down and mod it a little, I'd like dabbrev-mode :) 19:57:30 hahah, right? 19:57:31 p_l|backup: I tried that, but kept cocking it up and once spammed three channels before getting kicked from each. While asleep. 19:57:47 (that being irssi) 19:58:00 Interesting. 19:58:16 -!- dtw [~dtw@62.237.32.210] has quit [Quit: Children of Bodom @ Oulu, Finland] 19:58:17 Will irssi run in *ansi-term*? Maybe that would give you both :-) 19:59:10 irssi always sounded like the best client, i'm not really a hardcore enough IRC user to care that much though. 19:59:14 maybe my question is off topic of this channel, if some one like to give me advice or talk with me, i'll pleasure use IM PM me :) 19:59:32 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:59:57 yo puchacz 20:00:24 p_l|backup: hi, what's up? 20:00:51 puchacz: Cze. 20:01:03 Cze :) 20:01:17 New Year's Eve at Emacs? 20:01:19 nothing much, got kind of booted out of the only machine in home that can play Magicka or TF2, so went back to IRC 20:03:09 New Year's Eve at The Shell. 20:03:41 -!- yoklov` [~user@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has left #lisp 20:04:29 :) 20:04:32 Z Shell ;) 20:09:41 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 20:09:49 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 20:11:41 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:11:45 -!- Mekanik [~vov@91.79.117.156] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 20:12:27 LiamH [~healy@pool-96-241-99-101.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:31 slyrus [~chatzilla@207.189.195.44] has joined #lisp 20:12:44 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 20:14:01 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:15:43 -!- kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-318738.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:17:01 *p_l|backup* wonders if Steamworks would cooperate with CCL or SBCL 20:17:20 Didn't someone recently make a new Lisp benchmarking or profiling tool of some sort? I can't remember who or what it was called. 20:17:46 "micro" something or other, maybe? 20:19:05 Ah, I think it was microbench: https://github.com/nikodemus/microbench 20:19:33 kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-191-245.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 20:21:27 p_l|backup: What's Steamworks? 20:22:55 -!- smoogy [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:30:43 phax [~phax@adsl-68-73-150-63.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 20:30:43 -!- phax [~phax@adsl-68-73-150-63.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has quit [Changing host] 20:30:43 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 20:30:58 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 20:31:12 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:17 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:37:35 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:39:31 yoklov [~user@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has joined #lisp 20:44:49 -!- eulyix [~charles@host86-128-235-61.range86-128.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: To iterate is human, to recurse divine] 20:47:23 phax [~phax@adsl-68-73-150-63.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 20:47:24 -!- phax [~phax@adsl-68-73-150-63.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has quit [Changing host] 20:47:24 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 20:47:52 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-162-253.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:52:18 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 20:56:52 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:00:42 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 21:05:11 azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has joined #lisp 21:12:09 -!- nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-43-53.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:12:14 kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-13-192.w86-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 21:13:36 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 21:16:45 troussan [~user@c-24-245-13-197.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:17:50 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 21:17:58 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-191-245.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:18:13 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:18:41 -!- troussan [~user@c-24-245-13-197.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:26:45 -!- snearch [~snearch@g231226223.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:28:12 -!- Kvaks [~kvaks@139.158.189.109.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:28:36 -!- CrazyWoods [~crazywood@220.160.188.36] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:34:57 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 21:36:00 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:39:09 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:41:58 Kvaks [~kvaks@139.158.189.109.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 21:42:10 -!- bieber [~quassel@162-78.97-97.tampabay.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:51:56 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:52:56 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:53:56 what sould I pass to usocket:socket-send's "buffer" parameter? I'm tring (coerce "a-string" 'simple-array) but doesn't work 21:56:13 replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 21:58:50 -!- parabolize [~gyro@c-75-71-247-61.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:59:39 v0|d [~user@93.94.250.121] has joined #lisp 21:59:48 -!- osa1 [~sinan@88.242.78.237] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59:52 happy new year! 22:00:33 parabolize [~gyro@c-75-71-247-61.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:00:41 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:02:02 -!- azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:03:19 -!- Snaffu [~Snaffu@oh-69-34-16-39.sta.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:03:22 syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-106-118.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:12:00 wingie [~wingie@c-5eeaaa34-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has joined #lisp 22:12:05 -!- wingie [~wingie@c-5eeaaa34-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has left #lisp 22:17:30 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 22:22:13 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:31:01 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 22:34:07 Kron [~Kron@CPE0013f7c06a42-CM0013f7c06a3e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 22:34:33 -!- Kron is now known as Guest37326 22:37:07 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@CPE0013f7c06a42-CM0013f7c06a3e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:38:52 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 22:40:11 poincare101 [~Dhaivat_P@CPE-65-27-96-82.new.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:40:43 What would be a good way to learn lisp? (books, tutorials, etc.) I'm good with math, and I get recursion. 22:41:19 http://gigamonkeys.com/book 22:41:23 poincare101: Practical Common Lisp is an excellent introduction. It's a book, but freely available online. 22:41:28 then go hack 22:41:30 Ah, see sykopomp's answer... 22:41:44 (both of them!) 22:42:11 rswarbrick: sykopomp thanks :) 22:42:15 is "land of lisp" any good? 22:42:31 Yep, I hear so. I'd still recommend PCL first. 22:42:51 It is 22:43:13 But, frankly, play with a repl for a few hours along with a book and you'll make your mind up about whether you want to know more. 22:43:15 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:43:23 (and a text editor, obviously) 22:45:08 I really like scheme 22:45:12 I thought I'd try common lisp 22:45:26 I started with CL 22:45:28 Cool, you've got a good head start. 22:45:30 I'm going through SICP 22:46:10 But, whatever happens, try to *do something* with it. You can always ask questions if/when you get stuck, and it's a good incentive to keep going. 22:46:35 antoszka: Steamworks is the SDK behind Steam 22:46:53 rswarbrick: yeah, thanks 22:47:05 poincare101: Pretty much the only thing I really wouldn't recommend as a beginner project is something calling out to C or the like. There are memory management issues and it's just about the only way to bugger up your lisp image enough to restart... :-) 22:47:13 European art music helps 22:47:13 ddp [~ddp@anon-136-131.relakks.com] has joined #lisp 22:47:14 (er, to have to restart, that is) 22:47:39 Heh, I'm listening to BBC radio 6 at the moment. It's getting steadily stranger this evening, it seems... 22:47:57 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:50:55 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:53:15 rswarbrick: I enjoy the Polovtsian Dances 22:59:42 saint_cypher [~rjspotter@c-76-126-70-224.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:59:56 Radio 6? 22:59:58 :-) 23:00:07 We're on strange electronica at the moment, I think. 23:01:18 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a3b1b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 23:03:12 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.202.138.67] has joined #lisp 23:03:18 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.202.138.67] has quit [Client Quit] 23:07:48 codelurker [~codelurke@c-65-96-208-17.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:07:55 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:12:10 -!- codelurker [~codelurke@c-65-96-208-17.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:12:48 osa1 [~sinan@88.242.78.237] has joined #lisp 23:16:19 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@79.Red-88-7-134.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 23:16:43 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 23:18:35 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-167-170.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 23:20:53 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-167-170.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 23:21:30 replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 23:22:40 syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 23:25:47 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw298122.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:26:22 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-167-170.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 23:27:41 Guthur [~user@host86-160-244-253.range86-160.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 23:29:08 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a3b1b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:31:39 -!- nialo` [nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 23:32:37 otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 23:35:46 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h26n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: add^_] 23:35:58 nialo` [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 23:36:52 azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has joined #lisp 23:41:42 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:42:59 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-30.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:16 -!- azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:46:33 azurelysium [~androirc@121.157.225.71] has joined #lisp 23:50:01 chromaticwt [~user@67-41-15-81.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:52:28 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:56:17 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@zaq771a4b1b.zaq.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:56:22 -!- Guest37326 [~Kron@CPE0013f7c06a42-CM0013f7c06a3e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: Kron awayyy!] 23:57:07 with cxml is there a way to filter out empty text-nodes?# 23:58:51 Guthur: with stp, you can map over all the nodes and remove the ones you want from the graph.