00:02:03 maqu1na [~d4m@r186-52-126-140.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 00:02:50 lakatosi [~lakatosi@c3.uaic.ro] has joined #lisp 00:02:57 Hi 00:03:14 I feel silly comming here with questions like these, but 00:03:43 Does "do" word like setq or psetq? 00:04:00 When I'm stepping to the new value, that is 00:04:10 lakatosi: read the spec. 00:04:18 do is like psetq, do* is like setq 00:05:06 -!- lakatosi [~lakatosi@c3.uaic.ro] has left #lisp 00:05:30 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 00:11:30 replore_ [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has joined #lisp 00:13:56 -!- Memnoch [~Memnochxx@pool-108-41-92-128.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 00:16:17 -!- ASau`` is now known as ASau 00:18:17 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.123.248.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 00:18:28 Guthur: I want to disassemble the underlying method-function associated with the method object not the method object. 00:19:38 -!- tigranes [~user@static-50-53-75-48.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has left #lisp 00:20:53 -!- maqu1na [~d4m@r186-52-126-140.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:21:54 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 00:25:25 -!- nyef [~nyef@173-162-147-14-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:27:28 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 00:30:33 OK looks like (on SBCL) if i drill down far enough in *slime-inspector* on the method-object through %GENERIC-FUNCTION slot -> DFUN-STATE -> closure-object -> head of the cons cell -> SB-PCL::FAST-METHOD-CALL structure -> FUNCTION slot -> CODE slot I can look at something approximating the dissassembles source for the method-function. 00:34:28 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.1.128] has joined #lisp 00:35:26 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:35:27 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 00:38:24 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 00:38:51 cpc261 [~cpc26@fsf/member/cpc26] has joined #lisp 00:39:06 kennyd_ [~kennyd@93-138-43-219.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 00:40:20 -!- Noctifer [~Noctifer@82.113.121.36] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.24/20111107173218]] 00:40:40 -!- cpc26 [~cpc26@fsf/member/cpc26] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:41:06 what I find interesting is how closely SBCL's FAST-METHOD-CALL of a method-function disassembles as compared to an equivalent function object with equivalent declarations on the parameters 00:41:40 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-38-28.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:43:14 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.95] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:45:43 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has left #lisp 00:49:15 Sysop_fb [~bleh@108-66-160-34.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:50:28 -!- snearch [~snearch@g231108243.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 00:53:43 ozzloy [~ozzloy@unaffiliated/ozzloy] has joined #lisp 00:54:32 -!- hagish [~hagish@p5DCBD72D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:00:55 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.172.81] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:02:43 Taslem [40e9e315@gateway/web/freenode/ip.64.233.227.21] has joined #lisp 01:03:41 Any tips on remembering the difference between car and cdr? 01:05:17 Taslem: use first and rest instead? 01:05:41 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:05:46 ^ 01:06:23 -!- nialo` [nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 01:06:27 nialo [~nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 01:06:27 nialo- [nialo@ool-182d5684.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 01:07:01 -!- Neban [~neban@45.Red-83-61-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:11:56 -!- kennyd_ [~kennyd@93-138-43-219.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:12:35 -!- wishbone4 [~user@167.216.131.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:13:54 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 01:14:54 maqu1na [~d4m@r190-64-114-186.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 01:19:19 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 01:19:29 Taslem: a comes before d in the alphabet could be something you use. 01:20:22 -!- vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has quit [Quit: vervic] 01:20:39 plain memorization through use works too (: 01:21:34 antifuchs: doesn't that follow immediately after having something to remember the names by? 01:22:03 how do you learn your first language? 01:22:29 antifuchs: do you still remember? it took me quite some time to get the hang of it :) 01:22:36 hah 01:23:57 Anki flashcards! 01:24:03 the one true way to learn anything! 01:24:24 I think the answer is, whatever worked for you in the past (-: 01:25:00 I have a hard time understanding the problem of remembering CAR and CDR difference. It sounds a bit like "let f(x) and g(x) be two functions. THe problem: how to remember which is which?" 01:25:10 -!- Trystam is now known as Tristam 01:25:15 antifuchs: honoustly though, i do wonder what i was thinking when trying to mimic words. if it could be called thinking at all. perhaps it was mostly mimicing anything that i saw. 01:25:20 I sortof get why it'd happen, the names are pretty close 01:26:50 Just wondering if there was some memory trick. They're not nearly as descriptive as most other Lisp function names. 01:27:26 -!- Saeren [~saeren@mail.skepsi.net] has left #lisp 01:27:32 wait until you find rplacd and rplaca (-; 01:27:39 Taslem: they came from the names of the instructions on the ibm 370 for the first and second part of a word, IIRC (which i'm probably not) 01:27:42 Taslem: they perfectly describe what they're supposed to describe, i.e. "some entirely arbitatry names that come in pair" 01:27:52 Yeah, I know. 01:27:53 s/names/accessors 01:28:01 the alphabet thing is probably the easiest 01:28:15 but early names didn't have to make sense to anyone 01:28:49 car come first alphabetically before cdr. 01:29:16 Demosthenes [~demo@md62c36d0.tmodns.net] has joined #lisp 01:30:01 pnq [~nick@AC829FA4.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 01:30:40 If the actual problem is remembering CAR === FIRST, the idea that "my first car" makes more sense than "my rest car" can be useful. 01:31:29 also, iterating over a proper list using map and friends, you drive a CAR across the list (-: 01:32:28 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 01:32:57 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 01:35:11 car is only accidentally related to first. 01:35:50 A cons is a first class representation of an association from A to B. 01:36:03 A list can be constructed from such associations. 01:36:24 Thus, first can accidentally share the same structural requirements as car. 01:36:29 Vicfred [~Futaba@189.143.86.74] has joined #lisp 01:36:31 But the semantics are entirely different. 01:37:30 -!- jacius [~jacius@c-24-13-89-230.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:41:33 -!- pnq [~nick@AC829FA4.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:43:17 CrLF0710 [~crlf0710@114.96.73.238] has joined #lisp 01:43:33 Nauntilus [~Benji@ip68-231-176-93.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 01:43:40 Accidental relation is probably the best use case for memorizing anything (if it weren't accidental, it could be easier to rediscover than to remember). 01:47:15 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-18-202-173.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:48:59 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@md62c36d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:49:13 -!- davlap [~davlap@c-24-147-211-14.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 01:49:38 davlap [~davlap@c-24-147-211-14.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:52:20 -!- Yuuhi`` [benni@p5483B1BE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:53:18 -!- alvis [~alvis@tx-184-5-64-92.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:53:28 -!- davazp [~user@89.100.226.133] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:55:56 alvis [~alvis@tx-184-5-64-92.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 02:00:11 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:00:20 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 02:03:37 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:04:03 -!- urandom__ [~user@ip-176-199-8-241.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:04:27 rjj [~rjj@cpe-76-90-79-73.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:05:46 -!- elliottcable [~me@ell.io] has quit [Quit: best short-url ever. ] 02:06:07 elliottcable [~me@ell.io] has joined #lisp 02:06:45 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-162-253.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:07:39 i'm finding many of my backtraces in sbcl are useless... they all land in (SB-KERNEL:___, or foreign function etc. i can't trace it back to the line in my project... is it because the code is compiled without debugging info or something? 02:07:44 cpc262 [~cpc26@fsf/member/cpc26] has joined #lisp 02:08:28 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Quit: rpg] 02:08:33 emit: that shouldn't matter 02:08:36 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:08:42 emit: what version of sbcl are you running? 02:08:55 1.0.51 02:08:58 I recall older versions on mac os x giving really useless backtraces a while ago 02:09:32 can you paste a sample backtrace at paste.lisp.org? 02:09:39 (I'm getting mostly useful ones in 1.0.53) 02:09:45 emit: if you compile your function with C-u C-c C-c or file with C-u C-c C-k you might get more details. 02:09:58 I usually compile normally, then if I hit a hairy problem I recompile with C-u 02:10:01 -!- cpc261 [~cpc26@fsf/member/cpc26] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:10:29 sure, but it's not very illustrative: http://paste.lisp.org/display/126590 02:10:45 -!- davlap [~davlap@c-24-147-211-14.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 02:10:56 and that's the whole trace? that doesn't look right 02:11:04 yeah that's the whole thing 02:11:05 what platform is this? 02:11:09 i click --more-- and there's nothing 02:11:20 linux 02:11:45 That's pretty odd. 02:11:54 well i get that i'm passing an int where it expects a string but i dunno where 02:12:09 i will have to use the good old print to console here and there method... 02:12:15 emit: Try a newer SBCL. 02:12:21 ok, weird! I think a report about this should go to the sbcl-devel list if you can reproduce it in the latest (1.0.54) 02:12:31 Though I can't say I've seen that with 1.0.51 or any other SBCL on Linux. 02:13:53 same 02:14:11 ok i'm upgrading to 1.0.54... 02:14:34 Demosthenes [~demo@md62c36d0.tmodns.net] has joined #lisp 02:14:40 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 02:15:29 oh i found where it's happening at least 02:15:46 actually, i can just do (string= "?" 2) in the repl and it will give that error 02:16:20 Wacky. 02:16:28 clearly i understand the error :P but i shouldn't have to comb through my code line by line to find it :P 02:17:23 doing a full distro upgrade along with sbcl update... gonna take a while 02:17:28 emit: No, and normally you wouldn't have to. The backtrace you get is not what people usually get. 02:17:33 that is linux/x86, right? 02:17:39 Don't get SBCL from your distro. 02:17:46 x64 02:17:55 i should use clbuild or whatever it is? 02:18:20 ok i'll look into it 02:18:37 -!- Taslem [40e9e315@gateway/web/freenode/ip.64.233.227.21] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:18:37 Get it from www.sbcl.org 02:20:11 the backtrace looks like it is plain x86 02:20:21 oh, wait, no, it doesn't 02:24:08 wait i just realized i'm 'injecting' the functions from emacs/slime with c-c c-c.. how would sbcl know anything about the source file (like the line number) when it breaks? sometimes the file isn't even saved, it's still in the modified state. 02:24:38 ok well i guess a backtrace of function names isn't impossible 02:25:37 emit: it does know 02:25:44 if it's in a file 02:25:51 or a buffer 02:26:03 oh really? wow 02:27:22 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 02:30:41 hydrogenesis [~hdg@124.205.102.34] has 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02:51:32 -!- dagda [~dagda_@c-98-245-158-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:51:50 dagda [~dagda_@c-98-245-158-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:57:51 weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.lain.pl] has joined #lisp 02:57:53 hello 02:58:02 sorry for OT, but you guys will know 02:58:12 what to use for smoothing jitter in data points? 02:58:22 -!- Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has left #lisp 02:58:36 xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has joined #lisp 02:58:42 it's for face recognition jitter 02:59:01 when the face is moved, it "drifts" along a given point 02:59:33 nevermind... 02:59:36 -!- weirdo [sthalik@kronstadt.lain.pl] has left #lisp 03:03:17 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@md62c36d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:03:42 Demosthenes [~demo@md62c36d0.tmodns.net] has joined #lisp 03:07:19 -!- hydrogenesis [~hdg@124.205.102.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:08:19 -!- csdserver [~csdserver@unaffiliated/csddesk] has quit 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[~user@50.92.212.231] has joined #lisp 07:00:06 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 07:06:53 RomyEatsDrupal_ [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 07:06:57 -!- RomyEatsDrupal_ [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] 07:07:53 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-191-149.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:09:11 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:10:45 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:13:08 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-103.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:17:16 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:20:14 ducatii [~dukatii@pool-74-110-3-223.bflony.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 07:29:11 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 07:29:21 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:31:36 good morning 07:32:49 -!- jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:33:28 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 07:33:47 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:41:42 I found difference between keywords and symbols confusing, for example, why keyword :output is used in open instead of symbol 'output? 07:43:19 what's the canonical way of telling sbcl which external format to use? 07:43:32 (good morning, btw) 07:45:04 -!- ducatii [~dukatii@pool-74-110-3-223.bflony.east.verizon.net] has left #lisp 07:45:47 -!- Cryotank2011 [~Cryotank2@c-24-17-62-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Cryotank2011] 07:49:34 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 07:49:35 schaueho: sb-impl::*default-external-format* 07:50:34 Bribek [~Bribek@0xc3d7f214.ynoenxr1.ras.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 07:50:34 If found this variable, too. But: Is setting an internal variable really the canonical way? 07:50:47 also: https://bugs.launchpad.net/sbcl/+bug/659107 07:50:50 osa1: because you cannot shadow a keyword 07:51:29 osa1: (symbolp :output) => t. Keywords are convenient because they evaluate to themselves, and since they are in the keyword package reading them won't clutter other packages with symbols 07:51:31 cmm: what do you mean by shadow? do you mean because a keyword always evaluate to itself? 07:51:46 -!- am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.178] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:52:00 Vivitron: cmm: great, thanks 07:52:49 osa1: you may want to read up on the package system before deciding to become confused by its features :) 07:52:50 osa1: shadowing as in "having a symbol with the same name in my own package" 07:53:00 the bug report suggests that the external format might also been picked up from the system locale 07:53:06 but I don't see that 07:53:39 schaueho: the external format is picked up from the system locale once (at startup) and assigned to sb-impl::*default-external-format* 07:53:49 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 07:54:39 schaueho: I'm not sure setting this variable is "canonical", but there is no other way to override the default :) 07:54:58 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:55:03 hmm, is there maybe some interaction with slime? Because I don't see that effect. 07:55:28 how you "don't see" it? what's the value of LANG or LC_ALL? 07:55:46 does reader macros beginning with # have special name? 07:55:48 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:56:03 schaueho: and do you set it *outside* SBCL? setenv in the running SBCL won't affect anything 07:56:47 sry, my mistake 07:57:03 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-024.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 07:57:11 I was under the impression I had LANG set to de_DE.utf-8, when in reality it's set to C 07:57:13 my bad 07:58:39 actually, it's set to de_DE.utf-8 on the console, but after X is started it's C. Weird. 07:58:54 *schaueho* goes hunting down locale mangling on his system 08:01:22 pon1980 [~pon@195-67-88-105.customer.telia.com] has joined #lisp 08:03:07 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-tmaefcopfwnnqsmt] has joined #lisp 08:03:26 am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.178] has joined #lisp 08:04:13 what is "fbound" in apropos's output? 08:04:31 osa1: it means the symbol names a function 08:04:33 http://l1sp.org/cl/fbound 08:04:50 "bound" refers to variables, "fbound" to functions. 08:05:03 http://l1sp.org/cl/fboundp rather (-: 08:05:07 oyep 08:05:10 *yep 08:05:27 I getting "Not found - /cl/fbound" in the link 08:05:41 yeah, it should have been fboundp. 08:06:02 thanks 08:06:03 hey, one of the few pages with a Pronunciation section (: 08:07:02 heidymadia [~saasten@61.247.42.167] has joined #lisp 08:08:58 daschel [~berner@93.216.213.13] has joined #lisp 08:09:23 does reader macros beginning with # have special names? 08:09:54 I'm trying to use weblocks with lisp. how can i enable threading? 08:10:04 err, I'm trying to use weblocks with clisp. how can i enable threading? 08:10:30 osa1: the mechanism is called dispatch macro character 08:10:52 daschel: the clisp implementation doesn't support threads. 08:10:54 daschel: "NOTE: Weblocks requires a Common Lisp implementation that supports threads" http://trac.common-lisp.net/cl-weblocks/wiki/ObtainingAndInstalling 08:11:14 hi antifuchs! still up that late? 08:11:15 I think sbcl or clozure cl should work, htough 08:11:17 hi flip214! 08:11:38 -!- bwright [~bwright@c122-106-254-100.belrs3.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:11:43 yeah, I was just calling bank austria about a screwup on their part (-: 08:12:01 but I'm off to bed in a few minutes (: 08:12:02 I see, nothing new in the east ;) 08:12:07 hahaha indeed 08:12:11 thanks guys. that's what i thought you were going to say. all the web searches said similar things but they were older entries so i thought they might be out dated 08:12:35 yeah, clisp is probably going to remain thread-free for a while longer (: 08:13:28 i've only been coding in lisp for about 3 months, so can you suggest either sbcl or ccl over the other when coming from clisp? 08:13:50 depends what your OS is - sbcl works very well on linuxes (and increasingly well on os x) 08:14:03 clozure cl is at home on the mac, and runs more stable on windows 08:14:25 ubuntu 08:14:33 nostoi [~nostoi@94.Red-79-151-106.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:14:34 then I recommend sbcl (: 08:14:36 YuleAthas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 08:14:38 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:14:54 it generates very fast code, and many people here use it 08:16:07 ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has joined #lisp 08:16:28 i tried sbcl a few minutes ago for just a second. i may have it set up wrong but it seemed rather incomplete. i couldn't scroll through previous commands with the up key or go move the cursor backwards inline. is there something im missing? 08:16:31 lovesan [~lovesan@188.122.237.157] has joined #lisp 08:16:38 yeah ((: 08:16:44 everyone uses slime :) 08:16:56 slime is where it's at 08:17:26 daschel: you could at least linedit ... that gives history and so on 08:17:37 comes with an excellent debugger and inspector UI, and then there's history and completion on the REPL 08:17:39 but of course, swank + slime/slimv is better 08:17:53 ah ha, i was just testing it raw to get a feel for it 08:18:22 yeah, raw is  raw (: 08:19:49 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:19:58 daschel: emacs or vim user? 08:20:00 mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has joined #lisp 08:20:10 emacs => slime, vim => slimv 08:20:28 ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has joined #lisp 08:20:35 neither 08:20:39 i was using eclipse 08:20:41 uh ok ... 08:20:43 with cusp 08:21:21 i know i run the risk of getting banned by saying that 08:21:24 :) 08:21:38 does anyone update cusp anymore? 08:21:46 it was a pretty great concept back in the day (: 08:21:55 no, and it was becoming more of a headache as time went on 08:22:19 at first i thoroughly enjoyed it. i found emacs to be claustrophobic 08:23:21 but small thinks started sticking out, like having to reload libraries every time, annoyingly ineffectual parenthesis completion, blah blah 08:23:35 but it looks like im going back to emacs now 08:23:49 -!- lovesan [~lovesan@188.122.237.157] has left #lisp 08:25:06 cool - for paren completion, check out paredit, by the way 08:25:30 adds a few pretty useful editing/navigation commands to emacs (and makes sure parens are balanced at all times) 08:27:12 -!- tensorpudding_ [~michael@99.32.59.66] has quit [Quit: tensorpudding_] 08:27:24 -!- am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:27:34 tensorpudding [~michael@99.32.59.66] has joined #lisp 08:27:34 good night (: 08:27:39 i shall. 08:27:54 anyway, everything is up and running appropriately so im off. thanks for the help 08:31:10 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 08:31:51 -!- jlaire [~jlaire@80-248-244-32.cust.suomicom.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:33:30 jlaire [~jlaire@80-248-244-51.cust.suomicom.fi] has joined #lisp 08:36:42 Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 08:36:56 -!- daschel [~berner@93.216.213.13] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:37:07 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.32.59.66] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:37:15 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 08:40:29 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:44:13 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-98-105.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 08:44:14 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-98-105.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Changing host] 08:44:14 insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 08:49:33 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has joined #lisp 08:50:53 -!- mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:52:55 is there a common lisp function to pass a parameter to a function, then pass it's result to another functions .. and return the last result? 08:53:59 aerique [310225@xs8.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 08:54:46 osa1: IIUYC (let ((r (func1 parameter))) (another r) r) ? 08:55:00 or just (func2 (func1 parameter)) 08:55:13 depending on what the "last" result is ... 08:55:56 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:55:56 flip214: I want to call a function with a parameter, then call the same function with it's result .. for about 50 times? 08:56:26 (loop for v = parameter 08:56:30 repeat 50 08:56:34 oh, sorry 08:56:52 (loop for v = parameter then (func v) repeat 50 finally return v) ? 08:58:44 -!- nostoi [~nostoi@94.Red-79-151-106.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 08:59:42 osa1: make one! 09:02:13 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@173-166-201-129-memphis.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:04:44 kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has joined #lisp 09:09:35 ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has joined #lisp 09:10:20 Yuuhi [benni@p5483AF04.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:11:27 -!- quasisane [~sanep@c-24-218-184-186.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:13:37 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 09:13:43 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 09:13:44 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has joined #lisp 09:14:15 shin_getter [~baka@125-228-173-43.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 09:15:58 -!- YuleAthas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:18:38 ; wow, paste.lisp is the worst paste site I've ever seen. why do I need username to paste code? 09:19:43 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-063-190.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:20:49 because it normally sends the name in a message to the channel 09:21:09 but that part doesn't work at the moment anyways. it's a string, pick any name 09:21:19 Demosthenes [~demo@173-166-201-129-memphis.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 09:21:30 daschel [~berner@93.216.213.13] has joined #lisp 09:21:35 -!- daschel [~berner@93.216.213.13] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:22:42 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 09:22:57 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 09:23:16 good morning lispers 09:25:13 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 09:27:40 when I have a concatenated stream, and I need closing, do I have to close each of the concatenated streams, or closing the concatenating stream is enought ? 09:28:12 *enough 09:31:17 -!- sacho_ [~sacho@95-42-103-191.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:31:47 2 questions, I wrote same function in 2 different forms, first on is not working but second one is, can anyone explain why? http://paste.lisp.org/display/126593 and second, how would you solve the problem in my paste? 09:32:21 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:33:52 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:34:49 osa1: macroexpand (doto ...) form in your first function, and you'll see the problem immediately 09:35:06 -!- kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:35:06 chrnybo [~user@148.122.202.244] has joined #lisp 09:35:47 YuleAthas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 09:35:59 How do you pretty-print a string containing XML? 09:36:00 osa1: you can "fix" your DOTO to make it work in the first case, but then it will stop working in the second one. 09:36:52 akovalenko: how? by deleting funcalls in DOTO ? 09:37:04 yes 09:37:39 -!- flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:37:45 flip214 [~marek@86.59.100.100] has joined #lisp 09:37:45 -!- flip214 [~marek@86.59.100.100] has quit [Changing host] 09:37:45 flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has joined #lisp 09:37:51 akovalenko: or I can pass my functions to DOTO with #' in my first function, right? 09:37:56 yes 09:38:30 akovalenko: didn't work 09:38:51 osa1: paste your new code 09:39:16 akovalenko: http://paste.lisp.org/display/126594 09:39:59 osa1: (#'replace-fn ...) 09:40:11 osa1: and yes, it looks weird. And it *is* weird. 09:40:15 akovalenko: I think what I want is a function, not a macro, right? because when I'm using macro, I'm passing my functions without evaluating them 09:40:49 osa1: for the task at hand, I think you need a hash table of characters and substitutions :) 09:40:56 -!- mikecsh [~mikecsh@113.28.74.33] has quit [Quit: mikecsh] 09:41:27 hagish [~hagish@p5DCBD72D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:41:55 akovalenko: I wanted to find a general solutions for this kind of problems. what I want is passing a value to a function, then passing it's result to another function ... etc 09:42:08 and it didn't work with #'replace-fn 09:42:24 osa1: there's alexandria:compose (function which returns a function) 09:42:40 kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has joined #lisp 09:43:51 osa1: ah, your labels doesn't mean what I expected to (I should have more attention..) 09:45:20 osa1: (doto string ((replace-fn "&" "&")) ((replace-fn...))) ;; something like this 09:46:44 -!- replore_ [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:46:46 akovalenko: nope :) 09:47:34 vervic [~vervic@chello080109071009.14.15.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 09:49:38 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 09:50:32 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 09:51:40 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:52:00 osa1: well, if you removed funcall, put it back 09:52:17 add^_ [~add^_^@h99n3c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 09:53:02 akovalenko: no I didn't remove. whatever, it shouldn't be that hard, I think I'm doing something essential wrong 09:53:12 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 09:53:25 good morning everyonbe 09:55:53 osa1: your LABELS should be (labels ((replace-fn (from to) (lambda (str) ...)))) 09:56:41 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 09:57:33 osa1: and then you won't need extra level of parens in (doto ...) form 09:57:59 akovalenko: right, thanks :) 09:58:15 how I forgot this lambda.. 09:59:45 osa1: annotated your paste - http://paste.lisp.org/+2POI/1 10:00:36 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-43-219.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 10:01:24 jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has joined #lisp 10:03:16 Is #1=(#1#) a legal expression? #1=#1# certainly isn't. 10:04:21 easye: #1=(#1#) is legal. 10:04:29 easye: first should be ... a cons cell, where the car points to itself 10:04:31 dehun [~user@djgames.com.ua] has joined #lisp 10:05:38 hi Blkt 10:08:39 can anybody tell ma is closing a concatenated stram also closes it's sub-streams, please ? 10:08:51 hi fe[nl]ix 10:09:03 kiuma: yes we can. No it doesn't. 10:09:18 akovalenko, thanks :) 10:09:29 hi kiuma 10:10:06 akovalenko, is it necessary closing a concatenate stream itself then ? 10:10:29 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-aybfhnbhcjpfzvrc] has joined #lisp 10:10:48 kiuma: when you close a concatenated stream, it becomes closed. (is it what you ask?) 10:11:50 and if I never close it, is there any issue ? 10:11:55 akovalenko: I think he wants to know if there's a resource leak if he doesn't. 10:12:02 right 10:12:23 ah, I see. I don't expect it to happen in any sensible implementation. 10:12:33 ok 10:12:54 steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 10:13:34 anway writing an event based http server seems to play ping-pong with bytes between read and write function 10:13:46 *functions 10:14:04 -!- teggi [148b9232@gateway/web/freenode/ip.20.139.146.50] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:14:21 and I need a lot of pointers and 'pins' 10:18:42 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-207-119.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 10:19:39 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 10:21:08 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-21-69.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:25:13 -!- xjiujiu [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:26:46 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 10:29:55 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:31:08 X99 [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has joined #lisp 10:33:07 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-024.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:34:05 quasisane [~sanep@c-24-218-184-186.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:35:06 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-020.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 10:37:03 snearch [~snearch@g231104083.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 10:37:07 tfb [~tfb@92.40.37.183.threembb.co.uk] has joined #lisp 10:38:08 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-chzhwidbomkbmsod] has left #lisp 10:38:27 daniel_ [~daniel@p5082AB1B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:39:47 -!- daniel___ [~daniel@p5082AA51.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:40:56 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:44:26 agumonkey [agumonkey@8.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 10:46:02 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-155.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:47:57 -!- snearch [~snearch@g231104083.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 10:52:27 -!- Zhivago [~zhivago@li49-59.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:53:09 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-020.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:53:24 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 10:58:48 -!- Salamander_ is now known as Salamander 10:59:59 -!- SsvRrwQ [~user@50.92.212.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:00:13 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-018.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 11:03:40 tcr1 [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 11:05:15 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 11:06:14 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:09:45 brendn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has joined #lisp 11:11:00 -!- brendn is now known as brendyn 11:15:23 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-018.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:17:44 -!- Vicfred [~Futaba@189.143.86.74] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:20:03 -!- heidymadia [~saasten@61.247.42.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:24:23 leo2007 [~leo@123.123.255.217] has joined #lisp 11:24:30 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 11:24:44 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 11:31:10 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 11:33:34 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-064-177-007.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 11:38:28 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 11:42:36 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:43:24 -!- Modius [~user@cpe-70-123-128-240.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:50:16 Modius [~user@cpe-70-123-128-240.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:51:21 akovalenko: I just issued a bug with which I had to provide a program/repo to demonstrate it. It's what I consider, in a way, the ultimate relevant stability test, a web server being heavily hit with requests. 11:53:48 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.1.128] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:54:44 Modius: ok, thanks for reporting 11:55:23 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 11:56:51 I need to test Lispworks against that too. . . 11:57:39 teggi [~teggi@123.21.169.138] has joined #lisp 11:57:50 I'm very antsy today - my first day at new job - I just quit my enterprise/manager/lame job of almost 6 years to work as a *real* programmer again. 11:58:57 with a paycut? 11:59:04 Actually, a big pay increase 11:59:11 oh, nice 11:59:19 Enough to make me give up work-at-home 11:59:42 you were working as a manager from home? 11:59:49 -!- tali713 [~tali713@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:59:53 I never said I was effective 11:59:55 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:00:00 The team was distributed anyway. 12:00:05 heh, ah, ok 12:01:07 what were you maanaging? and what are you programming now? lisp? 12:01:59 Haha, no lisp. Technically, generally .net at both places; but the old job was turning more into enterprisey SoX prod support, the new one dev in startuppy/entertainment stuff. 12:02:56 well then, enjoy the new job :-) 12:02:58 Actually, I take that back - I'd have enough cred to be able to sneak Lisp in for certain server-test cases; but I'd be the only one who knowns it. 12:03:14 hehe, that's the spirit 12:04:43 it lways works like that, especially in small places where the focus is to get the job done, choose what works best and before you know it, everyone is using it. 12:04:56 akovalenko's work makes it about 1000x easier to sneak something like that in. 12:05:41 Can't just casually sneak in Lispworks subscriptions to casually interested other punters. 12:06:10 server testing you say? like http benchmark? or what are you testing? 12:06:44 I mean writing clients that unit-test the servers in various ways, as clients - from a functionality more than load standpoint. 12:07:18 ok, what kind of servers? 12:07:23 q0tw4 [~RSumin@46.164.135.35] has joined #lisp 12:07:29 Game stuff, long story 12:07:37 ah, ok 12:08:24 *eMBee* was wondering it it was something he could use too 12:08:28 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@119.201.52.190] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:08:51 setmeaway [setmeaway3@119.201.52.190] has joined #lisp 12:09:08 but i am more oriented on the traditional web stuff 12:09:12 nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has joined #lisp 12:11:23 -!- YuleAthas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:13:48 *eMBee* is still wondering if he can find a way to use lisp on his project 12:20:17 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 12:21:36 nyef [~nyef@64.134.64.89] has joined #lisp 12:24:35 -D 12:24:54 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 12:27:51 how can I convert an int to string? (coerce 1 'string) doesn't work 12:28:26 osa1: princ-to-string is one way 12:29:02 -!- nyef [~nyef@64.134.64.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:29:30 H4ns: ok, thanks. do you know any other ways? 12:29:59 jacks- [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 12:31:03 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.162.163] has joined #lisp 12:32:35 -!- CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:32:47 -!- shin_getter [~baka@125-228-173-43.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:33:18 slime-who-calls doesn't seem to work for methods. is that normal? 12:33:54 -!- DGASAU` is now known as DGASAU 12:34:31 eMBee: what kind of project ? 12:34:51 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-88-12-35.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:36:59 jacks-: what do you mean ? 12:37:53 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.162.163] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:39:02 kilon: a collaboration platform. 12:39:35 eMBee: any link with details ? will it be in lisp ? 12:39:43 davlap [~davlap@c-24-147-211-14.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:40:34 -!- ASau [~user@95-26-89-189.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:40:34 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-88-12-35.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:40:37 not yet, working on the website now. it is not in lisp 12:40:51 eMBee slime-who-calls lists callers when I pass it a function, but gives me "no references found" for a method 12:41:01 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-88-12-35.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:41:08 ok 12:42:37 -!- X99 [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:44:20 that was for fe[nl]ix not embee 12:44:21 i have been wondering about making it scriptable with lisp, but the appeal is limited as it is already scriptable in other languages, so adding lisp wouldn't only be interresting for people who are already using lisp 12:45:43 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 12:46:43 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 12:46:57 CrazyThinker [~CrazyThin@unaffiliated/crazythinker] has joined #lisp 12:47:58 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:47:59 can someone check if slime-who-calls works for generic functions as well 12:48:32 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-155.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:48:33 jacks-: it does work for me. 12:50:38 -!- saeftl [cbauerm@pestilenz.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:50:56 -!- nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:51:12 ok, must be my setup then 12:52:42 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.196] has joined #lisp 12:52:42 eMBee: well if I judge from scriptfu in gimp , the lisp syntax is not very popular amongst newcomers and non coders 12:53:44 johnstorey [~johnstore@adsl-99-39-151-16.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 12:53:45 even learning equality in common lisp makes me scratch my head :D 12:53:45 jacks-: Look into swank-$impl.lisp, and try to run swank-backend::find-definitions (or similiar) yourself 12:54:11 kilon: Maybe because you learn it for the first time? 12:54:37 -!- tcr1 is now known as tcr 12:55:20 tcr: yes I do, and no its the first time any language make me scratch-head over equality, and I have learned many of them 12:55:25 does "container for other objects arranged in a Cartesian coordinate system" mean getting an element is taking constant time? (I'm asking for arrays) 12:55:49 kilon: Yes but maybe it's the first time you actually learn about equality 12:56:31 why ? only lisp use equality ? 12:56:47 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:57:12 I think not 12:58:48 It's the same problem with C I suppose, compare int, struct, array, ... 12:59:19 In C it's easy ... but look at eg. PHP: ==, !==, ===, etc. etc. 12:59:22 Well then my question is what do you find hard about it in Lisp that you did not find hard in other languages 12:59:51 And my guess is that you haven't really thought much about how it works in other languages 12:59:52 lisp does have too many equality predicates. 12:59:59 but in practice, it is not a problem. 13:00:01 I may be wrong of course :-) 13:00:14 silenius [~silenius@i59F708B0.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 13:00:25 that 1 != 1.0 13:00:44 unless i am using equalp 13:01:08 (= 1 1.0) => T 13:01:10 well that's more about implicit data coercion 13:01:31 BlankVerse [~pankajm@117.197.237.201] has joined #lisp 13:03:00 daimrod: hmm , yeah i forgot about = 13:03:01 And that it works e.g. in C has more to do that the floating point scheme in use has an exact representation for integer values 13:03:35 and I'm not enough of a C programmer to say, but I can easily imagine it not to be the case for large long values 13:04:59 my point is that it takes more time to digest all the information that most other languages I learned 13:05:11 mvillene1ve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 13:05:14 but i am getting there , slowly :D 13:05:15 osa1: that doesn't imply. 13:05:48 osa1: notice the standard doesn't often specify asymptotic complexities for operations. 13:05:53 -!- duomo [~duomo@cpe-67-248-14-24.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 13:05:55 C and C++ are arguably even messier in this regard. for example 1u > -1 returns false 13:06:08 osa1: however, due to competitive pressure, AREF is O(1) in all big implementations. 13:06:12 Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has joined #lisp 13:06:50 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: quit?] 13:06:56 osa1: such a container could be implemented as a quad-tree and be O(log(n)) instead of O(1)... 13:07:12 pjb: ok, thanks. I'm trying to implement some data structures in common lisp. I'll use arrays then 13:07:16 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 13:07:39 -!- mvillene1ve is now known as mvilleneuve 13:08:25 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 13:10:16 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:10:22 felideon [~user@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 13:13:05 zhivago [~zhivago@li49-59.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 13:13:13 -!- zhivago is now known as Zhivago 13:15:17 duomo [~duomo@cpe-67-248-14-24.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:17:45 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-tmaefcopfwnnqsmt] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:21:17 nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:23:08 Neban [~neban@45.Red-83-61-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:24:37 -!- Modius [~user@cpe-70-123-128-240.austin.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 13:25:55 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@117.197.237.201] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:26:16 nyef: hi 13:28:11 ejbs [~user@d83-183-51-82.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 13:31:15 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@173-166-201-129-memphis.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:32:07 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:34:13 shin_getter [~baka@125-228-170-235.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:36:08 -!- Nauntilus [~Benji@ip68-231-176-93.tc.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:36:23 X99 [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has joined #lisp 13:40:51 -!- Bribek [~Bribek@0xc3d7f214.ynoenxr1.ras.tele.dk] has quit [] 13:42:33 -!- X99 [~quassel@218.77.14.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:42:46 ... did I forget to disconnect last night? 13:42:52 G'morning all. 13:44:16 Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.21.249] has joined #lisp 13:45:12 *eMBee* nods at kilon re scriptfu 13:47:45 *eMBee* doesn't understand the problem with equal, having different levels of equality feels quite natural, simply because there is a need to make a difference at times, so there needs to be a way to address that... 13:48:06 One Size Fits Many 13:48:13 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has joined #lisp 13:48:34 situ [~quassel@223.180.37.211] has joined #lisp 13:48:41 All men are EQUAL, but no two men are EQ. 13:49:13 -!- duomo [~duomo@cpe-67-248-14-24.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:49:36 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:49:36 hehe 13:49:37 Okay, who the hell decided that it would be a good idea for the MacBook Pro to only have two USB ports? 13:50:01 two usb ports ought to be enough for everybody 13:50:18 get a "hub" 13:50:27 eMBee: Tell that to an external keyboard, wacom tablet, and an iPhone charger. 13:50:52 nyef: however, twins are EQL. 13:51:09 pjb: Okay, I'll buy that. 13:51:28 pjb: Well, for some twins. 13:51:49 identical twins 13:51:58 Right, so-called "identical" twins. 13:52:29 Well non-"identical" are not twins,_just babies grown in the same womb. 13:52:37 -!- johnstorey [~johnstore@adsl-99-39-151-16.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Nodding off now.] 13:52:43 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-88-12-35.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:52:47 I have fundamental (ie. genetic) definitions for my words... 13:53:08 + at the same time :-) 13:53:16 So GATAGA means what? 13:53:35 some form of baby talk? 13:53:47 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:54:09 pjb: No limitation for "at the same time"? 13:54:58 nyef: yes, I added it later, otherwise you have brothers. 13:55:11 which is just what non-"identical" twins are. 13:55:58 As opposed to "non"-identical twins. 13:55:59 pjb: Siblings, surely? 13:56:21 Zygomatic twins. 13:56:40 ... that's something to do with the eye socket, right? 13:57:03 "my brother and I were born to the same woman at the same time, and yet we are not twins (identical or otherwise)" 13:57:03 (homozygote vs heterozygote, I suppose) 13:58:49 there were born on different dates. 13:58:51 they * 13:59:04 Time travel. 13:59:10 Different fathers? 13:59:29 situ: Different dates at the same time? Really? 13:59:40 Ectopic male pregnancies? 14:00:10 This conversation has gotten even sillier than it was when it began. 14:00:12 2011-12-19 23:59 and 2011-12-20 00:01. 14:00:18 I just guessed. 14:01:04 pjb: Go one better, 24:00 and 00:00. d-: 14:01:11 I thought it's a puzzle or something. 14:01:26 (Legal by ISO 8601, two different dates for the same time.) 14:02:46 coyo [~unf@pool-71-164-238-90.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:02:49 -!- coyo [~unf@pool-71-164-238-90.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 14:02:49 coyo [~unf@unaffiliated/bandu] has joined #lisp 14:05:49 -!- ejbs [~user@d83-183-51-82.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:06:00 -!- situ [~quassel@223.180.37.211] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:06:12 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@242.Red-88-24-175.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:06:51 lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002129144054.mbb.telenor.dk] has joined #lisp 14:07:58 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has joined #lisp 14:08:43 saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA07D2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 14:08:47 ; Upgrading ASDF package from version 2.019 to version 2.011? a downdrade? 14:09:13 chenbing: Under what circumstances does that happen? 14:11:53 (ql:quickload "asdf") ;just it 14:12:25 Interesting. Why would you do that? 14:12:44 (asdf:asdf-version) ;"2.011" 14:13:23 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:13:38 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 14:13:52 hmm Xach I am reviewing some knowledge bases about asdf and quiclisp. I want to rewrite a manual for myself 14:14:25 chenbing: As short-term guidance, I suggest "don't try to quickload asdf". 14:14:32 It is at best unnecessary. 14:15:30 -!- tcr [~tcr@178-83-229-138.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:17:33 Okay 14:18:23 -!- katesmith_ is now known as katesmith 14:26:13 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:27:46 tali713 [~tali713@c-75-72-193-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:29:18 Nauntilus [~Benji@wsip-68-14-222-194.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:30:27 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:35:31 mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has joined #lisp 14:35:37 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has joined #lisp 14:36:26 EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.19.108] has joined #lisp 14:37:17 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:37:51 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 14:39:47 -!- agumonkey [agumonkey@8.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:39:47 -!- jacks- [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has quit [Quit: Chateando desde http://webchat.redmundial.org (EOF)] 14:40:22 _nix00 [~Adium@180.172.40.16] has joined #lisp 14:40:24 agumonkey [agumonkey@8.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:27 -!- sipo [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 14:41:10 gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 14:41:22 kwmiebach_ [kwmiebach@31-222-138-133.static.cloud-ips.co.uk] has joined #lisp 14:41:34 nitro_id_ [~nitro_idi@122x221x184x68.ap122.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:41:41 -!- ace4016 [~ace4016@99-120-69-226.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:41:41 Atomsk [~ace4016@99-120-69-226.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:41:43 dehun` [~user@djgames.com.ua] has joined #lisp 14:41:44 ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 14:41:57 cods_ [~cods@tuxee.net] has joined #lisp 14:42:00 Xach (ql:update-all-dists) prompts "1 dist to check." That is latest quicklisp.Since I have installed some packages. How can Quicklisp says "1 dist to check"? 14:42:27 -!- cods [~cods@rsbac/developer/cods] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:42:29 -!- cods_ is now known as cods 14:42:42 -!- cods [~cods@tuxee.net] has quit [Changing host] 14:42:42 cods [~cods@rsbac/developer/cods] has joined #lisp 14:42:50 1 dist means the "quicklisp" dist 14:43:10 osa1__ [~sinan@141.196.28.129] has joined #lisp 14:43:30 -!- osa1__ [~sinan@141.196.28.129] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:43:49 ericeatsbrains_ [~ericeatsb@173-164-222-106-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:44:20 -!- kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:44:53 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:44:56 DrForr [~jgoff@li165-209.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 14:45:05 trigen [~trigen@ec2-46-51-179-218.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 14:45:05 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 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has joined #lisp 14:59:35 does common lisp standard say anything about integer sizes? 15:00:25 Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has joined #lisp 15:00:25 osa1: It does. 15:00:54 nyef: where can I see what it says? 15:01:23 Specific sections, or just a pointer to the hyperspec? 15:01:49 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/session] has joined #lisp 15:01:49 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:01:50 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/session] has quit [Changing host] 15:01:50 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-hdyggyxwgvqoeumh] has joined #lisp 15:02:00 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Excess Flood] 15:02:22 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:02:31 nyef: I'll implement some data structures in common lisp and I want to know which one should I use, integers and some bit tricks, or (make-array :element-type 'bit)? 15:03:31 -!- gz [Clozure@clozure-123267BA.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: gz] 15:03:52 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 15:04:19 I usually use integers. 15:05:13 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.87.49] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:05:13 The array stuff will tend to be slower, especially if your integers can be declared to fit within a machine word or a fixnum or such. 15:05:33 with quick-slime-helper, I am forced to ansnser a question like "slime version *** " and "swank version ***) ,is slime-swank should be same version number? 15:05:37 lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.87.49] has joined #lisp 15:08:31 and even if there's an efficient implementation of bit-vector i don't think there's an efficient way to get a fixnum out of it 15:09:46 nyef: how can I create fixnums? 15:10:13 osa1: A fixnum is an integer within a certain (implementation-dependent) range. 15:10:32 Required to be at least (signed-byte 11), or so. 15:11:06 Fixnum width varies based on implementation, and possibly within an implementation. 15:11:14 I thought it was (signed-byte 16) minimum. 15:11:29 Really? 15:11:38 Must be mixing it up with the limit on array-total-length, then. 15:12:04 SBCL has 30-bit fixnums on most backends, and can have 61-bit, 62-bit, or 63-bit fixnums on x86-64. 15:12:26 (Previously limited to 61-bit, currently defaulting to 63-bit.) 15:12:42 BlankVerse [~pankajm@117.197.246.132] has joined #lisp 15:13:54 ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has joined #lisp 15:13:59 Greetings lispers 15:14:35 ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has joined #lisp 15:14:40 Greatings ThomasH 15:14:49 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.153.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:15:04 (integer-length most-positive-fixnum) return 62, where are 2 bits gone? 15:15:14 tag 15:15:19 drdo: what tag? 15:15:26 can you help me with a closure problem please ? http://paste.lisp.org/display/126601 15:15:53 There's no closure here. 15:16:00 osa1: One bit is for the fixnum tag, the other is for the sign bit. 15:16:02 osa1: To know it is a fixnum 15:16:02 kiuma: special variables are special. 15:16:14 osa1: Have a look at (integer-length most-negative-fixnum). 15:16:16 pjb, ? 15:16:52 You're using dynamic binding, so there's no closure. 15:16:52 kiuma: Special variables don't get closed over. 15:17:10 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-77-193.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:17:18 kiuma: Which means, variables defined via DEFVAR, DEFPARAMETER, or any of the variations on (DECLARE SPECIAL). 15:17:45 nyef: I thought in 2's complement representation, sign bit is included in negative numbers, so shouldn't it be 63 in negative numbers? (it returns 62) 15:18:23 kiuma: that's the reason why special variables should be named with stars... 15:19:10 ... I forget. 15:19:14 but how could I do the dynamic binding 15:19:32 You are doing dynamic binding. 15:19:49 As long as the symbol has been declared special, all its bindings are dynamic. 15:20:22 osa1: The other bit is the tag 15:20:47 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:21:27 pjb, then How could I call funcall so that it's printed "*X* is 1" ? 15:22:48 dynamically. 15:23:01 ? 15:23:05 See http://paste.lisp.org/display/126601#1 15:23:17 (let ((*x* 1)) (funcall ...)), surely? 15:23:30 the first is lexically, where you have a closure and the answer is you cannot. The second is dynamically, like nyef shows. 15:24:13 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:24:26 pjb, I understand thanks. And I'm understand I'm a bit fried with my code 15:25:28 I need a rework.... again :( 15:25:51 -!- chenbing [~user@122.233.180.9] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:27:11 mmm... is funcall an overridable method ? 15:27:33 It's not a generic function. 15:29:01 I think I have to extend my thread-pool then 15:29:07 But nobody prevents you to (shadow 'funcall) (defgeneric funcall (f &rest args) (:method (f &rest args) (apply 'cl:funcall f args))) 15:29:11 (describe 'funcall) 15:29:44 heh cl-markdown doesn't even appear to have a simple usage example 15:30:07 kilon: http://www.nhplace.com/kent/PS/EQUAL.html 15:31:02 chenbing [~user@122.233.180.9] has joined #lisp 15:31:36 hi, with quicklisp-slime-helper, Should I purge the slime comes from debian apt? 15:34:02 chenbing: i found that was the easiest way. you can probably prioritize the load path to make it work with both 15:34:30 otherwise i would have version mismatches here and there between distro slime and ql swank 15:35:00 I just couldn't start slime now... 15:36:27 did you add those two lines dumped by quicklisp-slime-helper to .emacs... 15:38:10 yes. "(load (expand-file-name "~/quicklisp/slime-helper.el")) 15:38:10 (setq inferior-lisp-program "/usr/bin/sbcl")" 15:38:39 but I find /usr/bin/sbcl dispears!! only "/usr/local/bin/sbcl"..... 15:40:02 Check slime-lisp-implementations 15:41:15 davazp [~user@89.100.226.133] has joined #lisp 15:41:15 ernestas [~ernestas@ernestas.net] has joined #lisp 15:41:35 well. /usr/local/bin/sbcl works. I just confused 15:41:44 johnstorey [~johnstore@12.208.167.194] has joined #lisp 15:43:06 cl-who been superseded by anything? 15:46:29 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:48:54 -!- Neban [~neban@45.Red-83-61-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 15:48:59 Neban [~neban@215.Red-83-42-45.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:51:03 ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has joined #lisp 15:51:41 -!- chenbing [~user@122.233.180.9] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:54:03 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-77-193.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:54:30 -!- ernestas [~ernestas@ernestas.net] has left #lisp 15:54:59 chenbing [~user@122.233.180.9] has joined #lisp 15:56:04 dagda [~dagda_@np34.co.returnpath.net] has joined #lisp 15:57:05 -!- pnathan [~Adium@98.145.116.190] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:57:33 -!- hagish [~hagish@p5DCBD72D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:58:24 oGMo: for me, it's superseded by COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.HTML-GENERATOR.HTML, but I must be the only one to use that... 15:58:52 oGMo: have a look at https://gitorious.org/com-informatimago/com-informatimago/blobs/master/common-lisp/html-generator/html-generators-in-lisp.txt 15:59:16 pjb: checking 15:59:33 oGMo: I'm currently not actually generating HTML in my hunchentoot instance, but I expect I'll do something based on chandler's xml-mixed-mode and templating magic. 16:00:13 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-77-193.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:03:35 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:44 lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-194-148.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:03:44 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-194-148.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:03:44 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 16:03:45 yeah in this case all i need is something fairly simple that generates html, not for a webapp or anything 16:04:21 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:04:39 html-generator would be more ideal for the latter since it seems to have DOM-like capabilities 16:04:41 -!- aerique [310225@xs8.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: ...] 16:05:40 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-188958.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 16:05:46 You could also consider using FORMAT. d-: 16:06:05 heh, simple, not ugly 16:06:20 With a couple of macro. 16:06:26 (and i don't mean formatting symbols, but mixing html into strings in code) 16:06:27 The DIY approach. 16:06:45 sure but that's essentially cl-who 16:09:05 ISF [~ivan@201.82.172.81] has joined #lisp 16:09:47 There are different approaches, and each may be more or less adapted to the specific need of the application. 16:10:13 You may even consider xmls for dom-like, building the html as a sexp, and then outputing it. 16:10:49 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-188244.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 16:12:04 -!- gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:12:05 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-188958.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:13:54 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-77-193.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:15:03 yeah 16:15:07 thanks 16:17:14 -!- ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 9.0/20111212185108]] 16:17:21 RomyEatsDrupal_ [~stickycak@dyn-160-39-33-144.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 16:20:27 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:20:28 -!- RomyEatsDrupal_ is now known as RomyEatsDrupal 16:22:32 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:23:23 -!- pon1980 [~pon@195-67-88-105.customer.telia.com] has left #lisp 16:23:55 lispmeister [~fix@AStDenis-551-1-98-189.w80-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:27:27 saeftl [cbauerm@pestilenz.org] has joined #lisp 16:31:01 pjb: in my defpackage I've added (:shadowing-import-from #:cl #:funcall) then in my utils.lisp I've set (defgeneric funcall (f &rest args) (:method (f &rest args) (apply 'cl:funcall f args))). but when I call (require :kuma) I've this condition "FUNCALL already names an ordinary function or a macro." 16:31:30 kiuma: shadowning-import-from doesn't do what you believe. 16:31:38 Use :shadow instead. 16:32:01 k 16:33:20 -!- _nix00 [~Adium@180.172.40.16] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:33:42 -!- osa1 [~sinan@141.196.28.129] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:34:27 dl [~download@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 16:34:33 xan_ [~xan@161.Red-79-148-232.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:34:38 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-hdyggyxwgvqoeumh] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:35:42 pjb: same result http://paste.lisp.org/display/126606 16:37:30 do I need to use an eval-when ? 16:38:42 deepfire [~deepfire@80.92.100.69] has joined #lisp 16:39:21 am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.178] has joined #lisp 16:39:30 kushal [~kdas@117.201.102.79] has joined #lisp 16:39:30 -!- kushal [~kdas@117.201.102.79] has quit [Changing host] 16:39:30 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 16:41:15 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-160-39-33-144.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 16:41:41 -!- kilon_alios is now known as kilon 16:42:13 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:42:49 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:42:54 kiuma: wfm: http://paste.lisp.org/display/126606#1 16:44:36 mmm... strange 16:45:29 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:45:51 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:46:10 nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-186-111.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:47:47 it's even stranger, let me do one check more 16:48:15 Try (delete-package :kuma) first. 16:49:22 now it works, thanks 16:52:41 The value # is not of type (OR FUNCTION SYMBOL). when called inside thread-pool package. how can I do ? (it's a nightmare :( ) 16:53:21 I defined a method funcall for class callable 16:54:01 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:54:12 -!- teggi [~teggi@123.21.169.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:54:35 you should export your funcall from kuma and use it in thread-pool. 16:55:02 Is there a way to convert a bitvector into a vector of octets (without making a vector and setting the bits on each integer) ? 16:55:24 not in the standard. Perhaps in an implementation dependant way. 16:55:45 unless you mean (map 'vector 'identity bit-vector). 16:56:06 no of course i don't mean that :P 16:56:35 What bit order would you want? What byte order would you want? 16:57:07 There's no way to make it implementation independent without losing a lot of optimization opportunities on bit-vectors. 16:57:52 So, using an implementation dependant API, you would get implementation dependant results anyway. I don't see how that could be useful. 16:58:09 -!- Neban [~neban@215.Red-83-42-45.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:58:41 #*0000000100000010 you could get #(128 64) #(64 128) #(1 2) #(2 1) or something else. 16:59:13 i want #(1 2) 16:59:14 :P 16:59:23 drdo: then you should program it yourself. 16:59:27 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:59:38 Sure i can do it, just asking if there was an efficient way to do it 16:59:51 #(128 64) would be perfectly expectable... 16:59:55 The best i can do is actually loop and set each bit individually 17:00:07 Neban [~neban@245.Red-79-156-36.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 17:00:09 pjb: It's not hard to support all four.. 17:00:39 you might be interested in http://www.pipeline.com/~hbaker1/BitSearch.html 17:00:45 drdo: bit vectors are optimized for storing bits in a vector space-efficiently. no convenience intended )-: 17:00:58 -!- tfb [~tfb@92.40.37.183.threembb.co.uk] has quit [Quit: sleeping] 17:01:18 I too have tried to convert a bit vector into something (anything!) else that would be useful 17:01:22 but no such luck 17:01:26 wedgeV [~wedge@static-96-239-100-26.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:01:36 -!- gz [Clozure@clozure-2E21CFB1.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: gz] 17:01:39 antifuchs: yes, but in most architectures, doing what i want is doing nothing at all 17:02:01 right (: 17:02:09 you can just take the bitvector and there's your octet vector 17:02:34 might get lucky with implementation-internal things but there is nothing standard that allows this conversion, AFAIK 17:03:50 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@EM114-51-186-111.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:04:27 antifuchs: nah, i'll just write it portably, this is really not performance sensitive at all 17:05:42 zipace [~hi@unaffiliated/zipace] has joined #lisp 17:10:42 wishbone4 [~user@167.216.131.126] has joined #lisp 17:11:10 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 17:11:15 pjb, but it is kuma that is using thread-pool. Maybe I should extend thread-pool ? 17:11:38 -!- nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:12:10 -!- silenius [~silenius@i59F708B0.versanet.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:12:47 fe[nl]ix: How's DNS in iolib? 17:13:09 kiuma: definitely. You must ensure that the libraries that funcall your strange object use your very own funcall, not cl:funcall. 17:13:26 ok 17:13:33 sacho_ [~sacho@90.154.203.123] has joined #lisp 17:13:43 fortunately thread-pool is my baby :) 17:18:18 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-103.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:18:37 SegFaultAX|work [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 17:20:58 -!- Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:21:23 Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #lisp 17:22:34 mathrick [~mathrick@83.1.168.198] has joined #lisp 17:26:05 -!- lispmeister [~fix@AStDenis-551-1-98-189.w80-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:28:25 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-026.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 17:30:46 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:35:52 -!- Neban [~neban@245.Red-79-156-36.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Neban] 17:36:59 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.130.95] has left #lisp 17:37:22 -!- sacho_ [~sacho@90.154.203.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 17:38:14 ddp_ [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 17:38:52 EarlGray^ [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has joined #lisp 17:38:56 -!- EarlGray^^ [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:42:06 -!- ddp [~ddp@anon-132-148.relakks.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:42:06 -!- ddp_ is now known as ddp 17:43:41 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:43:52 -!- nepnux [~wildnux@cpe-72-182-70-190.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 17:44:15 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:47:31 -!- antgreen [~user@70.50.66.140] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:47:42 RomyEatsDrupal_ [~stickycak@dyn-160-39-33-144.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 17:48:56 tensorpudding [~michael@99.32.59.66] has joined #lisp 17:49:21 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-74-64-122-182.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:49:53 -!- RomyEatsDrupal_ is now known as RomyEatsDrupal 17:50:01 -!- Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:52:27 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:54:04 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:58:23 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:59:11 Noctifer [~Noctifer@89.204.130.248] has joined #lisp 18:01:54 -!- davazp [~user@89.100.226.133] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:02:12 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:03:00 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 18:04:55 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-188244.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:05:07 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has left #lisp 18:05:35 -!- aperturefever [20164@ninthfloor.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:06:09 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:08:53 antgreen [~user@70.50.66.140] has joined #lisp 18:09:12 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-321535.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 18:14:46 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 18:19:16 -!- saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA07D2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:20:03 saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA11EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 18:22:44 rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has joined #lisp 18:25:38 -!- xan_ [~xan@161.Red-79-148-232.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:29:38 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-49-14-228.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:31:30 chp [~user@dyn-carl-201-101.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 18:35:45 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 18:39:39 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 18:44:27 realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 18:44:48 ly- [~ly_@unaffiliated/ly-] has joined #lisp 18:47:26 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:52:49 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 18:53:41 -!- shin_getter [~baka@125-228-170-235.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:55:23 francogrex [~user@109.130.147.89] has joined #lisp 18:57:03 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.147.89] has left #lisp 18:58:36 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:59:10 drdo: can you be more precise? Many people successfully use nameservice features in iolib. 18:59:19 including me. :) 18:59:47 I can't even figure out how to use multiplexing 19:00:00 the included examples are pretty good. 19:00:05 as I recall. 19:00:06 I need asynchronous everything 19:00:37 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-064-177-007.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 19:02:20 it supports epoll and kqueue on systems that have such features. 19:02:31 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:03:09 Fade: Can you point me to the relevant example for dns? 19:04:07 iolib/examples/tutorial 19:04:34 I can only find lookup-hostname 19:04:54 I suggest an approach of 'read and extrapolate' 19:04:57 what are you trying to do? 19:05:12 Looking up dns records 19:05:18 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:05:19 A only really 19:07:10 realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 19:07:37 (iolib.sockets:lookup-hostname "www.google.com") 19:07:48 that blocks 19:08:04 fire it off in a thread 19:08:15 ... 19:08:40 The whole point of multiplexing is not having to do that 19:10:22 Hmm, for some reason epoll is not in iolib.multiplex:*available-multiplexers* 19:11:57 rjj [~rjj@cpe-76-90-79-73.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:13:51 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:13:54 I've only used the multiplexer in conjunction with a socket 19:14:22 the echo example in the tutorial is pretty canonical for that use. 19:15:53 I see now how to use it with sockets 19:16:20 No idea why epoll isn't available though, i'm running a recent linux 19:16:36 which iolib are you using? 19:16:39 from quicklisp? 19:16:41 quicklisp 19:16:58 I know there are features in git that haven't made it to quicklisp. 19:17:04 the rawsockets code in particular. 19:17:33 drdo: I have no idea whether IOLIB has its own (custom) dns client; if it uses getaddrinfo/gethostbyname, then it's *always* blocking (no way to fix it). 19:17:42 Damn, drakma blocks too 19:17:47 CL-USER> iolib.multiplex:*available-multiplexers* 19:17:50 ((1 . EPOLL-MULTIPLEXER) (3 . SELECT-MULTIPLEXER)) 19:17:58 I only get select 19:18:00 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 19:18:07 this is a fairly recent ubuntu machine /w iolib from git. 19:21:56 -!- q0tw4 [~RSumin@46.164.135.35] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:22:16 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.172.81] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:23:37 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:24:47 -!- vervic [~vervic@chello080109071009.14.15.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: vervic] 19:24:55 sipo [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:24:57 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:28:33 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:29:13 -!- rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has quit [Quit: rpg] 19:30:02 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-026.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:31:05 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 19:31:12 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4db578b9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:32:08 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@117.197.246.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:34:34 sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 19:37:37 hydo [~hydo@174-24-170-129.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:38:17 YuleAthas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 19:38:19 -!- rjj [~rjj@cpe-76-90-79-73.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:41:23 Taslem [40e9e315@gateway/web/freenode/ip.64.233.227.21] has joined #lisp 19:45:18 -!- [SLB] [~balthasar@unaffiliated/slabua] has quit [Quit: [ Close the World, Open the nExt ]] 19:46:38 -!- benny [~benny@i577A33F3.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:47:38 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-160-39-33-144.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 19:51:43 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:52:15 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 19:53:38 -!- saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA11EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:54:12 -!- am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:55:17 [SLB] [~balthasar@unaffiliated/slabua] has joined #lisp 19:56:54 osa1 [~sinan@141.196.163.108] has joined #lisp 19:57:44 -!- sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:58:07 Is there a Lisp function to\ determine if a given object is a number? 19:58:15 sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 19:58:16 probably numberp 19:58:25 Thanks 19:58:35 functions that end in -p are usually predicates 19:58:40 Taslem: notice: (and (numberp #C(2 3)) (numberp 3/4) etc. 19:58:45 as symbolp and numberp 19:59:28 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.181] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:00:02 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.173.79] has joined #lisp 20:01:55 Arsonide [~Arsonide@99-152-148-99.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:02:01 Guthur [~user@212.183.140.58] has joined #lisp 20:02:25 I count nine symbols in :CL with names that end in #\P that are not predicates. 20:03:03 Do you include digit-char-p? 20:03:14 No, I do not. 20:03:42 digit-char-p is a predicate that happens to return a generalized boolean useful for its value above and beyond its simple truth. 20:03:49 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 20:04:29 I can just see it now. (defun LOOP (room) "Returns true if ROOM is a bathroom." ...) 20:05:00 nyef: I find the same count. 20:06:02 saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA1112.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 20:07:43 I found one more... 20:08:18 nyef: I've got: (exp step loop sleep map vector-pop pop pprint-pop GENTEMP remprop) 20:08:34 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:08:36 (defun MAP (person) "Returns true if PERSON is married to PA") 20:08:42 realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 20:09:14 dlowe: "Returns true if STATE is Massachusetts." 20:09:21 hehe I was looping myself and for some reason I could not see what cl:ODDP was, immediately 20:09:24 even better 20:09:28 it looked odd 20:09:45 looping/looking 20:09:56 -!- Noctifer [~Noctifer@89.204.130.248] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:10:29 "Return true if PERSON-2 was formerly married to PERSON-1." 20:10:34 saschakb_ [~saschakb@p4FEA0586.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 20:11:01 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@ppp-71-133-87-187.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:11:07 Only other one that seems reasonable to make a predicate from is POP. 20:12:27 -!- antgreen [~user@70.50.66.140] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:13:32 how does concatenate on vectors working? does (concatenate 'vector #(1 2 3) #(4 5 6)) copy all elements of first and second sequence? 20:13:40 -!- saschakb [~saschakb@p4FEA1112.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:14:49 Yes. 20:15:13 concatenate always produce a freshly allocated sequence, contrarily to eg. append. 20:15:19 -!- EarlGray^ [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:15:41 EarlGray^ [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has joined #lisp 20:15:48 How would I write a function that takes f and g and returns a function that evaluates (f (g x))? 20:17:06 (lambda (f g) (lambda (x) (funcall f (funcall g x)))) 20:17:15 Beat me to it 20:17:58 pjb: looks like append doesn't work on vectors 20:18:14 osa1: indeed. I said sequence. lists and vectors are sequences. 20:18:14 I wonder if anyone has created a mkalias macro 20:18:24 append only works on lists. 20:18:38 Cosman246: defalias perhaps. 20:18:48 pjb: so how can I append vectors? 20:18:54 With concatenate. 20:19:22 milanj [~milanj_@93-87-152-91.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 20:19:32 -!- Arsonide [~Arsonide@99-152-148-99.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:19:40 Apparently, defalias is present in Emacs Lisp 20:20:11 osa1: If you really need to append something, maybe you should be using a list. 20:20:44 -!- sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:21:15 sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 20:23:05 -!- Taslem [40e9e315@gateway/web/freenode/ip.64.233.227.21] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:25:37 easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has joined #lisp 20:26:58 Is there a way to get the output of a string stream without also clearing that stream? I mean I can immediatly rewrite the content to the stream but that seems wrong. get-output-stream-string doesnt mention anything 20:27:58 Yes, get-output-stream-string says: This operation clears any characters on string-output-stream,... 20:28:10 So, no, there's no way. 20:28:41 harumph... I was hoping for some other, less well documented function, that dwim 20:29:27 Ah, the debugging is done 20:29:32 bobbysmith007: you could use a broadcast-stream to two string streams. 20:29:54 antgreen [~user@70.50.66.140] has joined #lisp 20:30:02 I have to say, while debugging a function, trailing ones parens is really helpful 20:30:05 *one's 20:30:29 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 20:30:40 Cosman246: use paredit. 20:30:47 paredit? 20:31:04 I'll look it up 20:31:23 The four first hits on google... 20:31:58 i understand 20:32:19 -!- chp [~user@dyn-carl-201-101.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:32:49 thanks pjb, reasonable idea, but I dont think will solve my specific problem 20:33:42 What's your problem? 20:34:11 I want to collect bits of string then get the output mulitple times. The answer probably lies in using and writing to an adjustable array rather than a string stream 20:34:50 eg: collect a bit, read what I have collected, collect a bit more etc 20:34:54 You can memoize get-output-stream-string. 20:35:14 Do you want to collect the whole at the end? 20:35:16 -!- saschakb_ [~saschakb@p4FEA0586.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20:35:40 yes each time I look at the collected output I want it to be the total output accumulated 20:36:15 Then yes, put the bits you get in an adjutable array. 20:36:16 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:36:38 thanks much for the help 20:47:22 ISF [~ivan@201.82.172.81] has joined #lisp 20:50:16 eTarap [~chatzilla@roa76-6-82-238-233-207.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 20:52:54 ASau [~user@95-26-89-235.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 20:53:10 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:53:11 ramkrsna_ [~ramkrsna@122.169.34.199] has joined #lisp 20:54:31 -!- dcrawford_ [~dcrawford@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:54:45 -!- foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:56:45 pspace [~andrew@li324-213.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 20:57:07 SsvRrwQ [~user@50.92.212.231] has joined #lisp 21:06:58 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-016-071.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 21:12:00 -!- hydo [~hydo@174-24-170-129.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 21:12:55 benny [~benny@i577A258E.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 21:14:27 deech [~user@71-11-140-18.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 21:16:00 Hi all, I am more familiar with pure functional programming in Haskell and finding myself interested in CL also. Looking at CL implementations I can't find any concurrency support besides mutexes etc. Am I missing something? 21:16:08 ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 21:16:35 deech: check bordeaux-threads 21:17:45 and http://www.cliki.net/admin/search?words=parallel 21:17:45 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 21:19:17 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 21:19:29 Cowmoo [~Cowmoo@cambridge-vxty.basistech.com] has joined #lisp 21:23:14 deech: At any rate, you might expect CL threads to be rather more heavyweight than Haskell threads. 21:23:34 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:23:53 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 21:24:40 -!- SsvRrwQ [~user@50.92.212.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:26:54 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 21:27:27 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-044.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 21:27:41 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:30:32 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Client Quit] 21:30:48 does Nikodemus be on IRC? I assume he is still working on the threading stuff from the crowdfunding campaign 21:31:05 He's on and off. 21:31:26 what's his nick? 21:31:37 The incredibly hard-to-remember "nikodemus". 21:31:58 Optionally suffixed with some number of underscores. 21:32:00 hehe, I might have to write that down 21:32:27 I thought he was mostly finished with the threading stuff, though? 21:32:27 -!- pspace [~andrew@li324-213.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:32:35 Didn't most of it get landed a while back? 21:33:09 sacho_ [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 21:33:21 not sure, I thought this was up to date > http://random-state.net/log/3523852985.html 21:33:30 which seems to say there is still a bit to go 21:33:40 though quite a bit has gone in as well 21:34:07 how can I see documentation of a generic function? (documentation func 'generic-function) didn't work 21:34:24 generic functions are function. 21:34:33 (documentation 'func 'function) 21:35:33 pjb: thanks, what are some important symbols that (documentation ..) can get as it's second parameter? 21:35:49 -!- sacho [~sacho@90-154-146-229.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:35:59 t 21:36:26 osa1: they're documented in clhs documentation 21:36:57 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 21:39:13 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 21:39:53 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:40:10 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 21:42:13 Neban [~neban@245.Red-79-156-36.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 21:42:22 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Client Quit] 21:42:56 I'm sure this is fairly basic, but I'm not able to think straight right now. I have a class precedence list, and I want to truncate it at a particular class. Suggestions? 21:43:12 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:43:22 subseq. 21:43:37 (subseq cpl 0 (position particular-class cpl)) 21:44:00 Good enough, I suppose. 21:44:16 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:44:31 gkeith_lt [georgekeit@nat/google/x-lcwhnovremmyupsf] has joined #lisp 21:44:37 My line of thought was going on the "let's setf the cdr of the element containing the class... can I safely mutate the CPL or do I need to copy it...?" 21:44:41 Thanks. 21:45:18 There's nsubseq in COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.CESARUM.UTILITY. 21:45:23 -!- ramkrsna_ [~ramkrsna@122.169.34.199] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:46:20 It looks like the CPL shouldn't be modified directly anyway. 21:46:54 And the result from POSITION had to be bumped by one, because I wanted to include the last class. 21:47:35 foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 21:47:42 nyef: beware of nil. 21:48:17 tfb [~tfb@restormel.cley.com] has joined #lisp 21:48:25 How so? 21:48:35 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:48:49 I know, absolutely, that this one class will be in the CPL. 21:48:53 if the particular-class is not in the cpl. 21:49:00 ok 21:49:19 (Because the class in question is ERROR, and the function is only ever called from within a handler for ERROR.) 21:49:32 -!- johnstorey [~johnstore@12.208.167.194] has quit [Quit: Nodding off now.] 21:52:11 petercoulton [~petercoul@cpc1-midd16-2-0-cust160.11-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 21:52:23 vert2 [vert2@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-mzvyyvzpdlpoohsv] has joined #lisp 21:52:27 -!- vert2 [vert2@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-mzvyyvzpdlpoohsv] has quit [Client Quit] 21:52:45 urandom__ [~user@ip-88-152-209-39.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #lisp 21:52:46 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has joined #lisp 21:54:05 nyef: Thanks for the input, I am aware that CL threads are more heavy-weight, I am more interested in abstractions for shared-state concurrency. 21:55:48 ravster [~user@184.175.28.107] has joined #lisp 21:55:51 Hello all 21:56:13 Hello 21:56:18 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:55 I also notice that there's a CL-STM library out there. Has anyone used it? 21:59:22 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@dyn-207-10-140-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 22:00:07 Could someone help me with a problem I have in reading and processing a file? I don't have any clue as to why the loop's body isn't being executed. 22:00:21 deech: SBCL has a lock-free queue implementation, as well as mailboxes, btw. Don't know if that's the sort of thing you're looking for. 22:00:41 ravster: How much code is involved? 22:00:42 ravster: Paste it. 22:00:48 ravster: Not here. 22:00:50 Don't paste in the channel, use paste.lisp.org. 22:00:53 -!- Nauntilus [~Benji@wsip-68-14-222-194.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:00:57 nyef: Cool, I'll look into it. Thanks! 22:00:59 That's what I meant. 22:02:39 mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has joined #lisp 22:03:28 hmm, paste.lisp.org is hanging at the submit page. 22:03:44 ravster: It went through, go to the main page. 22:04:38 oh, okay. Weird. I thought it would give me a direct link or something. Sorry about that. 22:05:52 Basically I want to put the file's data into *ARRAY*, but it doesn't do that. 22:05:52 -!- mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:06:01 -!- Cowmoo [~Cowmoo@cambridge-vxty.basistech.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:06:04 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.112.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:06:06 ravster: I am amazed that that even evaluates. 22:06:12 ? 22:06:52 ravster: paste.lisp.org does that when the bot is offline. 22:07:29 I feel like this is the part where I'm told I'm being an idiot :o 22:07:51 ravster: That is a very inventive use of loop, for sure. 22:08:10 oh? 22:08:51 Wait, you're doing a REPEAT (LENGTH *ARRAY*), but also using VECTOR-PUSH on the array? 22:09:11 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 22:09:24 And you already have iteration control in the use of FOR LINE = (READ-LINE FILE NIL)... 22:09:47 (Which returns NIL when the file is at its end, thus terminating the loop.) 22:09:55 oh, shoot. (length *array*) returns 0 when the array is empty, doesn't it? 22:10:07 wow. 22:10:22 Yup. 22:10:33 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 22:10:54 And your INITIALLY and FINALLY clauses are fairly useless beyond the debugging output... 22:11:34 that was dum. I'll use (array-dimension *array* 0) instead. 22:11:34 You're using VECTOR-PUSH rather than VECTOR-PUSH-EXTEND? 22:11:44 Or do you already know how many lines are in the file? 22:11:48 length doesn't work on arrays. Only on sequences. 22:11:54 -!- ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has left #lisp 22:12:08 pjb: It's a vector, it's just /called/ *ARRAY*. 22:12:33 nyef: yeah, the file has way more entries than I want to use, so i'm just using the repeat clause to limit the amount of entries put into *array*. 22:12:43 Ahh. 22:12:51 pjb: Sorry, i'll change the name of that right now. 22:12:58 Okay, it's still a little sketchy, but it should do the job I guess. 22:13:41 -!- Neban [~neban@245.Red-79-156-36.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:14:04 nyef: is there a better way to do it? Make it more easy to understand than just mashing together a few control clauses? 22:14:49 ravster: Order your clauses roughly in order of INITIALLY, REPEAT, FOR, FINALLY) 22:15:04 ravster: WITH goes before initially 22:15:20 ... Does it really? 22:15:28 The grammar is a bit finicky, as I recall. 22:16:10 nyef: The grammar is finicky, I might have REPEAT in the wrong spot. 22:17:33 I usually don't use REPEAT with FOR. 22:17:59 Before I cobble together my version of this loop, is someone else already doing that? 22:18:32 I'm not. 22:18:55 ThomasH: well, I only put the initially and stuff for debugging, I'm going to get rid of it once this works 22:19:11 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 22:19:57 Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has joined #lisp 22:21:31 snearch [~snearch@g231104083.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 22:22:14 Neban [~neban@168.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:22:48 okay, so here is the new one with all the debug statements removed. http://paste.lisp.org/+2PP7/1 . It works, as in it fills up the vector. 22:23:39 ravster: I just annotated my untested version. That is what I would expect to see. It has no error checking. You should check for the file, the end of file, etc. 22:24:20 ravster: Woops, all of the 'temp's in the make-instance need to be replaced with split-line 22:25:52 ravster: And rather than push the data onto a vector, I'd probably just collect it into a list. 22:25:57 ThomasH: okay 22:26:54 That looks really good. thank you. 22:27:19 I will put some error-checking code in their too 22:27:26 Good deal. 22:27:45 Thanks nyef , ThomasH, pjb 22:28:33 Hello! 22:28:50 Do I read it right that there's no support for operations over file directories in the standard? 22:28:56 Am I missing anything? 22:29:05 ASau: "over"? 22:29:18 There is the DIRECTORY function. 22:29:18 CRUD operations, basically. 22:29:27 and ENSURE-DIRECTORIES-EXIST. 22:29:41 I'm interested in removal function in particular. 22:29:43 There is no delete-directory 22:30:04 Hm. 22:30:04 I think that might be in cl-fad but I don't recall. It is in quicklisp. 22:30:15 Alright. 22:30:28 Under some file system semantics it is reasonable. 22:30:44 That is, quicklisp has an implementation of delete-directory ported to each supported implementation. 22:31:17 -!- lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:31:50 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-016-071.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:32:06 On the other hand, it isn't convenient that conventional "CRUD" set of operations is incomplete. 22:32:41 ASau: do you have an implementation in mind where cl-fad doesn't work? 22:33:18 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: G'night all.] 22:33:53 I need to get acquainted with cl-fad first :) 22:34:28 onembk [~onembk@np34.co.returnpath.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:35 duomo [~duomo@cpe-67-248-14-24.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:37:19 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 22:38:31 johnstorey [~johnstore@12.208.167.194] has joined #lisp 22:39:36 steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 22:40:20 -!- osa1 [~sinan@141.196.163.108] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:43:58 lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has joined #lisp 22:48:50 -!- urandom__ [~user@ip-88-152-209-39.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:50:43 eTarap_ [~chatzilla@roa76-6-82-238-233-207.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 22:51:29 -!- eTarap [~chatzilla@roa76-6-82-238-233-207.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:52:19 -!- eTarap_ is now known as eTarap 22:52:42 -!- YuleAthas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:55:44 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:57:29 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: mstevens] 22:57:43 pspace [~andrew@li324-213.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 23:01:53 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:03:39 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h99n3c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: add^_] 23:06:35 -!- EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.19.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:07:39 jsoft_ [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 23:07:53 -!- snearch [~snearch@g231104083.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 23:11:32 wedgeV_ [~wedge@static-96-239-100-26.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:11:51 -!- wedgeV_ [~wedge@static-96-239-100-26.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:13:26 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.140.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:13:30 -!- wedgeV [~wedge@static-96-239-100-26.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:13:31 -!- onembk [~onembk@np34.co.returnpath.net] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 23:13:48 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:13:53 -!- lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002129144054.mbb.telenor.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:14:38 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:14:38 -!- Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:14:52 steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 23:14:59 onembk [~onembk@np34.co.returnpath.net] has joined #lisp 23:15:11 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-45-143.cascadeaccess.com] has joined #lisp 23:16:16 Vicfred [~Futaba@189.143.86.74] has joined #lisp 23:16:52 -!- dagda [~dagda_@np34.co.returnpath.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:16:53 -!- onembk [~onembk@np34.co.returnpath.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:19:46 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@242.Red-88-24-175.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 23:19:47 aperturefever [20164@ninthfloor.org] has joined #lisp 23:20:50 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:21:07 -!- [SLB] [~balthasar@unaffiliated/slabua] has quit [Quit: [ Close the World, Open the nExt ]] 23:22:09 -!- benny [~benny@i577A258E.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:22:18 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp