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When I try: 01:45:30 (ql:quickload '(:cl-opengl)) 01:45:32 I get: 01:45:36 ; caught ERROR: 01:45:37 ; (during compile-time-too processing) 01:45:37 ; "GL" is a package name, so it cannot be a nickname for "CL-OPENGL". 01:47:04 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 01:47:11 paroneayea: Are you also loading CLX, then? 01:47:18 Deathaholic [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 01:47:28 -!- Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:47:29 ski_: not intentionally, but possibly :) 01:47:34 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: 1993] 01:47:35 er, sykopomp 01:48:01 paroneayea: try restarting your lisp and doing a clean load of cl-opengl :) 01:48:07 ok :) 01:48:42 sykopomp: hm, ok, now it works! 01:48:44 thanks :) 01:50:15 cl-opengl plays with clx? hrm 01:51:01 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:54:44 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 01:54:48 anvandare [~anvandare@dD5770CE8.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 01:59:08 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:08:29 Sa[i]nT [~SAINT@fl-67-235-178-42.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 02:10:49 one more dumb thing, since I'm very new to common lisp packaging 02:11:30 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:11:59 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:12:26 I'm running stumpwm out of ~/devel/stumpwm/, however when I tried to do (asdf:load-system 'blocky) it failed in that 'The name "STUMPWM" does not designate any package.' 02:12:50 so I guess I'm not sure how to make things available for asdf so that it doesn't complain when I do this seemingly unrelated thing :) 02:12:52 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 02:15:32 -!- Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:16:21 cfy [~cfy@125.123.18.108] has joined #lisp 02:16:21 -!- cfy [~cfy@125.123.18.108] has quit [Changing host] 02:16:21 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 02:16:45 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 02:17:07 I'm really not sure why it'd be looking for that though. 02:23:32 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-129-121.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 02:25:16 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 02:25:22 aha, I see! It was because of things in my ~/.cache/ :) 02:25:28 I wiped them and compilation continued. 02:33:07 tsuru [~charlie@50.9.237.217] has joined #lisp 02:34:13 paroneayea: was ist los? 02:34:28 ah ok 02:34:33 Xach: yeah, got it working 02:34:43 I'm on to new problems! ;) 02:36:07 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:36:39 violence [~nobody@94-194-9-178.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 02:38:25 my friends say i'm not a lisper because i use paredit 02:39:00 is this true 02:39:40 those aren't your real friends 02:40:08 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 02:40:12 -!- nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 02:40:14 They're probable imaginary. 02:40:43 what do they mean, i don't get it 02:40:55 ask them 02:41:23 good point 02:41:26 thanks! 02:41:28 -!- violence [~nobody@94-194-9-178.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has left #lisp 02:42:23 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:42:32 _cdx_ [~cdouglas@203-206-182-133.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 02:42:58 kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has joined #lisp 02:45:41 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:50:38 -!- edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has left #lisp 02:50:58 edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 02:51:15 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 03:09:56 jtrol [~sophie@115.172.196.136] has joined #lisp 03:10:05 -!- jtrol [~sophie@115.172.196.136] has left #lisp 03:14:44 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 03:15:23 daniel___ [~daniel@p508293AA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 03:17:13 -!- daniel__1 [~daniel@p50829356.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:21:35 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 03:23:38 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 03:25:11 gko [~gko@211.21.137.140] has joined #lisp 03:25:40 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-fndsawqctnbrokne] has joined #lisp 03:30:07 does xcvb recognize dependencies introduced by macros? 03:31:36 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-155-92.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:32:31 orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has joined #lisp 03:35:59 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:39:40 -!- kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:40:14 any yaclml users around? 03:40:28 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 03:40:44 i've used it a bit. 03:41:10 used the templating language at all? 03:41:29 no, I haven't worked with TAL 03:43:15 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:43:21 damn. 03:57:48 -!- mjonsson [~mjonsson@38.109.95.133] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:02:17 talcl seems to have a few users in Gainesvill 04:07:12 -!- orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:08:41 tritchey [~tritchey@64.134.227.31] has joined #lisp 04:10:15 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-sifilemkbrrtbilh] has joined #lisp 04:10:15 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-sifilemkbrrtbilh] has quit [Changing host] 04:10:15 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 04:13:20 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 04:15:14 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 04:16:17 orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has joined #lisp 04:17:14 -!- Deathaholic [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:21:32 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:21:55 leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.66] has joined #lisp 04:22:03 sanjoyd 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[~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 05:14:10 *austinh* is going crazy trying to figure out what is spawning a "worker" thread 05:17:23 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 05:18:10 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 05:18:33 -!- sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Defragging my brain.] 05:19:23 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 05:21:34 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:22:19 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Quit: rpg] 05:22:36 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:23:37 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-guewevlhfuomsvzf] has joined #lisp 05:24:47 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.131.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:26:13 -!- wormphlegm [~wormphleg@c-50-131-44-231.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:26:37 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 05:26:54 wolfpython [~wolf@49.74.112.158] has joined #lisp 05:28:34 blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:28:41 -!- EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:29:44 *austinh* found the bug, can now relax for the night 05:29:46 -!- a7p [a7p@9.83.238.89.in-addr.arpa.manitu.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:30:15 ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:31:16 ArchMonkey__ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:31:19 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:31:32 a7p [a7p@9.83.238.89.in-addr.arpa.manitu.net] has joined #lisp 05:31:45 ArchMonkey___ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:33:32 zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 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[~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:10 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:40:54 -!- Krystof [~user@csrhodes.plus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:43:11 Kryztof [~user@csrhodes.plus.com] has joined #lisp 05:43:43 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.215.176] has joined #lisp 05:44:04 -!- edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 05:48:10 optikalmouse [~user@bas1-toronto07-1176122586.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 05:48:12 j ##php 05:48:23 ...forgot a slash there, how embarrassing. 05:50:54 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 05:51:33 heh 05:51:45 php, the new lisp 05:56:08 manuel_: but is PHP an *acceptable* lisp? 05:57:05 yeah, well, not really i guess 05:57:06 :} 05:57:27 So much for trolling. Too obvious? :) 06:01:22 hajovonta [zhbdp@usloft1077.serverloft.de] has joined #lisp 06:01:34 waaaaaargh_ [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d871ee8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 06:02:40 er 06:04:01 Astrology [~chris@122.237.37.192] has joined #lisp 06:05:16 -!- waaaaargh [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87e33e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:09:09 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-178.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 06:09:15 -!- wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-131-178.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 06:09:57 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has joined #lisp 06:13:43 jfleming: ...I'm going to pour hot coffee on myself because PHP is an acceptable lisp ;-) 06:14:47 optikalmouse: you go right ahead and do that. It might help shock you back to your senses :P 06:16:11 -!- superflit [~superflit@71-33-184-33.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: superflit] 06:17:20 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-18-2-240.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:18:53 -!- ASau [~user@93-80-104-193.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: off] 06:21:55 jdz [~jdz@host97-111-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 06:23:10 -!- EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:24:12 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.215.176] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 06:25:41 hba [~hba@187.171.205.97] has joined #lisp 06:29:53 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@46-116-140-125.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 06:33:12 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-178-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:34:27 -!- blumbri [~blumbri@c-67-181-176-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:36:45 Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 06:37:09 -!- jdz [~jdz@host97-111-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:38:53 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:39:44 good morning 06:42:01 tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has joined #lisp 06:42:20 EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 06:43:02 -!- gko [~gko@211.21.137.140] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:43:55 -!- _cdx_ [~cdouglas@203-206-182-133.perm.iinet.net.au] has left #lisp 06:44:09 ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 06:46:00 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-155-92.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:46:25 blumbri [~blumbri@c-67-181-176-186.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:51:33 -!- Astrology [~chris@122.237.37.192] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 06:52:57 -!- lony [~lony@hoas-fe3ddd00-245.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:53:19 varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 06:56:34 lony [~lony@hoas-fe3ddd00-245.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 06:57:33 -!- wolfpython [~wolf@49.74.112.158] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:59:06 waaaaargh__ [~waaaaargh@agsb-4d0494cd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:02:46 -!- waaaaaargh_ [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d871ee8.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:03:22 orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has joined #lisp 07:11:13 katesmith_ [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 07:11:13 katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 07:11:13 -!- katesmith_ [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 07:11:13 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 07:11:13 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 07:11:13 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 07:12:39 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:13:28 e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-oyivhnevdofmnrux] has joined #lisp 07:15:22 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 07:18:12 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:18:57 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 07:23:20 -!- topeak [~topeak@61.149.227.202] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:23:28 -!- hba [~hba@187.171.205.97] has quit [Quit: leaving] 07:24:42 -!- EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:25:19 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has left #lisp 07:26:46 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-178-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:26:57 -!- betta_y_omega [~betta_y_o@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 07:27:21 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 07:28:39 betta_y_omega [~betta_y_o@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 07:31:09 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:32:45 any cl-routes users around? 07:32:45 alama [~jessealam@86.93.35.187] has joined #lisp 07:35:25 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:37:44 -!- optikalmouse [~user@bas1-toronto07-1176122586.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:37:51 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:38:26 Ralith: I've used that a small bit 07:38:28 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:39:41 flip214: can you paste an example or even just give a few hints as to how to get a trivial demo hooked up to hunchentoot? 07:39:57 there seems to be a lot of steps involved and absolutely no docs 07:40:51 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:41:31 or even how to use it in any context, if you haven't worked with hunchentoot; at least I'd have somewhere to start 07:41:48 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has joined #lisp 07:42:57 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 07:43:20 Hmmm, sorry ... I just found out that I seem to have misremembered ... I've used restas, not cl-routes 07:43:30 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.37.192] has joined #lisp 07:44:07 :/ 07:44:28 -!- blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:45:34 -!- markskilbeck [~user@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:45:59 If it's that bad ... why not use something else? restas is not that bad IMO 07:46:13 and should be similar enough 07:46:33 Digging into restas should give you a rough idea of the machinations necessary to hook cl-routes up to hunchentoot, though. 07:46:34 restas is a very large package which itself uses cl-routes. 07:46:45 pinterface: I started there, but restas does things in very strange ways. 07:47:49 http://paste.lisp.org/+2NYH has a (very) rough start yoinked from something I've been working on. 07:48:34 :D 07:48:35 thanks! 07:50:24 DGASAU` [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 07:50:31 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:50:39 why (setf (symbol-function ...) ...)? 07:50:46 oh, wait, nvm. 07:50:49 obvious. 07:51:27 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has joined #lisp 07:55:44 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:55:54 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 07:56:17 -!- ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:57:27 -!- DGASAU` [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 07:57:42 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 07:58:15 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 07:58:28 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 07:58:30 EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 07:59:57 davidh` [~user@g225129252.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 08:00:26 -!- davidh` is now known as davidh 08:00:50 -!- alama [~jessealam@86.93.35.187] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:04:23 slash_ [~unknown@p54A8D690.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:05:32 ignas [~ignas@217067203062.itsa.net.pl] has joined #lisp 08:06:28 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@p57921C37.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 08:06:35 -!- silenius [~silenius@pD4B9EC11.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:08:15 Jamamooga [~Jason@74-95-42-29-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 08:09:15 MoALTz [~no@host-92-8-252-103.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 08:09:42 pinterface: I thought I'd share my take on that: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/466974/ 08:12:57 -!- ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has quit [Quit: brb] 08:13:30 any glaring errors? 08:13:50 I'm not sure if my magic arguments are a great idea or not. 08:16:44 Well, they do have the advantage of fewer places for typos to cause a problem. ;) 08:17:21 it's certainly fun to use 08:17:24 -!- Jamamooga [~Jason@74-95-42-29-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has left #lisp 08:20:39 blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:21:15 -!- gonzojive [~gonzojive@178-83-238-199.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 08:26:20 -!- EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:34:55 -!- benny [~benny@i577A8A92.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:35:23 I'm on a 64bit archlinux system. I downloaded acl82express and it appears to be 32bit. Is there a 64bit version? 08:35:46 macrobat: not the personal one 08:35:54 ok 08:36:09 macrobat: it will work fine on multilib system, or with old bin32/lib32 packages from before multilib 08:36:14 spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 08:36:51 how? recompile allegro? 08:37:39 no 08:38:04 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:38:29 hm 08:38:35 I wonder why hunchentoot isn't showing backtraces 08:38:44 it works "out of the box", though you might need to write a wrapper script to point to correct 32bit gtkrc file (so you don't load a theme engine that is compiled for 64 bit) 08:39:05 -!- katesmith_ is now known as katesmith 08:39:31 what libs does allegro need? 08:39:51 Anyone know of a package that will inspect the documentation strings for a package and turn it into something I can point a webbrowser at? 08:40:19 just glibc? 08:41:38 Ralith: have you set hunchentoot:*catch-errors-p*? 08:41:56 jdz: it's set by default 08:41:59 -!- tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:42:09 jdz: it shows the errors themselves, but not the backtraces. 08:42:10 Ralith: have you set it to nil? 08:42:13 no. 08:42:41 also, oddly, *show-lisp-backtraces-p* is interned but not bound 08:44:31 dacoda [~user@gate.cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #lisp 08:45:17 macrobat: glibc, gtk2&co and that was all, I think 08:45:53 jdz: should I? 08:47:03 Ralith: well, if after reading the documentation for the variable it is what you want, then yes 08:47:47 jdz: it seems to be that I should be seeing a backtrace with it set to t. 08:47:59 Ralith: see where? 08:48:16 in the error page 08:48:40 Ralith: then you probably need *show-lisp-backtraces-p*( 08:49:00 jdz: I already tried setting that to true, despite it not actually being a variable. 08:49:24 though it is interned. 08:49:42 then the documentation is out of sync 08:50:04 indeed 08:50:06 which is why I asked here 08:50:07 great, allegro starts! 08:50:14 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl5-138-98.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 08:52:21 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl5-138-98.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Client Quit] 08:56:06 benny [~benny@i577A20A2.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 08:56:38 -!- lhnz [~lhnz@188-223-83-48.zone14.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:59:18 -!- Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:59:33 ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 09:02:00 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-fndsawqctnbrokne] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:08:30 -!- Sa[i]nT [~SAINT@fl-67-235-178-42.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:09:19 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-237-209.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:09:30 -!- orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:12:09 mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-134-0-42.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 09:12:51 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 09:13:40 kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-15-69.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 09:20:46 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-scfwmxpzjgzffdeu] has joined #lisp 09:21:57 orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has joined #lisp 09:24:00 Ralith: _Where_ do you expect to see the backtraces? 09:24:27 serichsen: printed underneath the error message itself on the error page. 09:25:16 Ralith: I get backtraces in the message.log file. 09:25:25 ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 09:26:34 serichsen: does your hunchentoot have *show-lisp-backtraces-p* defined? 09:27:51 Ralith: One moment, please. 09:32:07 Ralith: no, it is unbound. 09:32:27 hm 09:32:34 it's just an exported symbol 09:32:36 maybe this functionality was removed. 09:32:36 weird. 09:32:41 yeah, looks like it 09:35:16 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:36:06 gavino [47bd073a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.71.189.7.58] has joined #lisp 09:36:09 hi 09:39:23 xan_ [~xan@65.Red-83-39-56.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 09:39:32 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-scfwmxpzjgzffdeu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:43:46 jpop [~jpop@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 09:44:54 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 09:45:37 is there a quote-like construct that automatically evaluates symbols? (something ((x 0) (0 y))) should become `((,x 0) (0 ,y)). I know I can use list but it's pretty verbose for nested structures about this 09:46:53 jpop: Why not use the quasiquotes? 09:48:17 you mean `((,x 0) (0 ,y))? 09:48:36 jpop: Yes. 09:49:03 silenius [~silenius@pD4B9EC11.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:50:26 i have a lot of sub-lists, it would look nicer without commas 09:52:32 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-pdpnxgzbzoyjrzjb] has joined #lisp 09:52:32 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-pdpnxgzbzoyjrzjb] has quit [Changing host] 09:52:32 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 09:52:49 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:53:53 am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.83] has joined #lisp 09:54:24 jpop: You would have to define your own recursive macro. 09:55:23 anyone know offhand the CL analog of what would be expand-file-name in elisp? 09:55:31 and it could look like that? (my-macro ((0 0) (x y))) ? 09:56:12 jpop: Yes, why not? 09:56:55 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-otpjgxqsvnbxnrbn] has joined #lisp 09:57:26 I don't know, just asking 09:58:42 algal: what should it do? does PROBE-FILE fit the need? 10:01:49 -!- davidh [~user@g225129252.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:02:16 jdz: Needs to turn "~" into an absolute path to a home dir. I'm generating a relative path (~/.cl-doc/package/package.html) on my filesystem, and I want to turn it into an absolute path so I can build a URL (file:///Users/name/.cl-doc/package/package.html). 10:02:38 algal: some implementations handle ~ in pathnames 10:03:07 algal: if not you can use USER-HOMEDIR-PATHNAME 10:03:10 jdz: yeah, SBCL does. But the problem is that web browsers need absolute paths for the file:// URL. 10:03:43 eyes_ [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has joined #lisp 10:04:13 algal: so, doesn't PROBE-FILE do what you want? 10:04:23 -!- eyes_ is now known as EyesIsMine 10:04:36 algal: or just TRUENAME 10:04:59 davidh [~user@g225019074.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 10:05:23 yup, that's it!. Thanks. I still need to get the hang of the basic i/o libs 10:05:33 anyone here try hunchentoot? At first groping try I can not get it to serve static files... 10:05:46 I used quicklisp to install it. 10:06:07 gavino: create-static-file-handler? 10:07:20 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:08:08 I've just realised we are doing binding generators all wrong. 10:08:45 gavino: create-static-file-dispatcher-and-handler 10:09:01 We are using offline batch tools like SWIG..what we should be doing is interactive ones. An elisp function that takes a C function signature appart and inserts the cffi equivalent into a buffer. 10:10:46 C++ function signature parsing is a sufficently complex task with so many corner cases, it's best to have a human guide it interactively. 10:11:06 gavino: You then add that handler to the *dispatch-table*. 10:11:31 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 10:11:59 yvdriess [~Beef@soft85.vub.ac.be] has joined #lisp 10:12:06 ..but then you have to generate C scaffolding as well to get in there. 10:12:48 Is the dispatch table sort of like name based virtual hosts? 10:13:23 It processes the URL and matches the string against a table of possible operations? 10:13:50 How do I 'create' this reate-static-file-handler? 10:13:50 ZabaQ is it only C++ that SWIG is having issues with or C too? I wanted to give it a try one of these days 10:14:35 gavino: you read the documentation. 10:15:43 What's a simple, efficient way to associate and retrive a constant integer with a class? 10:15:51 (yes, a class, not an instance thereof) 10:16:22 Ralith: create a table mapping from classes to integers? 10:16:30 rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 10:16:30 -!- ignas [~ignas@217067203062.itsa.net.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:16:56 jdz: a hash table? Isn't there any way to associate it with the class object itself? 10:17:37 kennyd: Mostly C++. 10:17:37 Ralith: well, you can put the number in the property list of class name 10:17:44 that works, I suppose 10:17:50 There's also :allocation :class 10:17:54 ZabaQ: C is a much simpler beast to parse. 10:18:30 pinterface: ? 10:19:06 ooh. 10:19:08 looks promising 10:19:22 -!- slash_ [~unknown@p54A8D690.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:19:55 Ralith: you need an instance to access an :allocation :class slot. that's why most people use special variables instead. 10:19:59 -!- H4ns`` is now known as H4ns 10:20:12 oh. 10:20:14 damn. 10:21:14 no way to associate/retrieve info with the class object itself? 10:21:30 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 10:21:52 Ralith: if you want to associate arbitrary information with the class, you have to create your own metaclass. 10:22:59 that's what I was originally googling for, but I wasn't having much luck finding a gentle intro to the process 10:24:22 Ralith: well, if you're not comfortable defining your own metaclasses, i'd suggest just using the plist of class name 10:24:45 I'm interested in *becoming* comfortable 10:24:49 Ralith: just define a sane interface, so that later you can change to the metaclass approach 10:24:52 I'm in no particular hurry 10:25:14 and learning more about CLOS interests me 10:25:35 well, you just define a class that inherits from standard-class, add your number slot in there 10:25:55 and then, when defining your application classes, just pass that class as a :metaclass option 10:26:09 Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has joined #lisp 10:27:31 plus a validate-superclass specialization? 10:29:32 doesn't seem to be working :/ 10:29:54 oh right 10:29:55 Ok so its all laid out in the docs? k 10:29:57 wrong package 10:33:09 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-otpjgxqsvnbxnrbn] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:33:29 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 10:34:31 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:36:49 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:39:48 ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 10:40:29 ArchMonkey__ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 10:42:07 ArchMonkey___ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 10:42:39 yakov [~yakov@ip-83-149-3-223.nwgsm.ru] has joined #lisp 10:42:40 -!- ArchMonkey [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:42:40 -!- ArchMonkey___ is now known as ArchMonkey 10:44:02 -!- ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:44:50 -!- ArchMonkey__ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:46:59 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 10:49:09 markskilbeck [~user@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 10:49:52 zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.18] has joined #lisp 10:51:32 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-iqujavmjveikikpw] has joined #lisp 10:51:41 -!- tsuru [~charlie@50.9.237.217] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:51:43 kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-hwnhucspiabtmqrd] has joined #lisp 10:51:43 -!- kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-hwnhucspiabtmqrd] has quit [Changing host] 10:51:44 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 10:52:39 -!- blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:53:22 Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has joined #lisp 10:54:18 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:55:09 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:55:33 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-guewevlhfuomsvzf] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:56:07 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 10:56:07 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:57:52 Hmm, I can't reach http://www.indiegogo.com/ - can you? 10:58:27 Looks like my DNS is failing me. 10:58:35 Xach: I can reach it. 10:58:43 http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://www.indiegogo.com/ 10:58:53 flip214: I gave that a try and the result was unsatisfying. 10:59:06 ok 10:59:17 8.17.85.205 10:59:21 sorry for bothering 10:59:47 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-joblzrzbszzsmdla] has joined #lisp 11:01:47 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-140-118.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:02:24 level3 seems to be eating my packets on the way to the nameserver. 11:03:12 might be a countermeasure against using a "wrong" dns server, like one that isn't censored ;) 11:03:56 works here 11:04:00 tusen tack 11:04:42 -!- yakov [~yakov@ip-83-149-3-223.nwgsm.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:05:20 google is handling a big man in the middle attack at the moment 11:05:31 so it's possible level3 pulled some plugs 11:06:10 doh 11:06:13 its up here 11:06:19 ignas [~ignas@217067203062.itsa.net.pl] has joined #lisp 11:07:14 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 11:07:37 Tapioco [~quassel@host140-230-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 11:08:07 hi people 11:11:40 -!- Tapioco [~quassel@host140-230-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:15:34 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-140-118.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 11:17:24 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 11:18:35 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: algal] 11:19:43 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-iqujavmjveikikpw] has left #lisp 11:21:34 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.155.225] has joined #lisp 11:22:32 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-140-118.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:23:17 alama [~jessealam@n138138.science.ru.nl] has joined #lisp 11:23:50 rise and shine 11:25:11 edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 11:26:57 what's that one package with all the optimized 3D math primitives? 11:27:13 <_3b> sb-cga? 11:27:20 thanks 11:28:31 pnq [~nick@ACA227A1.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 11:28:53 <_3b> (not particularly optimized on non-sbcl lisps though, and not even all the way optimized on sbcl) 11:28:56 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-joblzrzbszzsmdla] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:29:54 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.18] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:32:32 taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has joined #lisp 11:37:20 oudeis [~oudeis@62.219.154.220] has joined #lisp 11:38:44 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C911.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:38:47 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-178-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:40:30 -!- alama [~jessealam@n138138.science.ru.nl] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 11:41:19 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 11:42:00 -!- nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev] 11:42:51 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 11:43:05 alama [~jessealam@n138138.science.ru.nl] has joined #lisp 11:49:00 Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 11:49:35 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 11:49:41 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:52:00 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181056239.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 11:52:23 Any ideas? I've got a file with a few test expressions (assert), using a macro that expands into multiple threads etc. 11:52:54 when just running the form via swank it works fine, 10 out of 10 - (load "...") makes the form fail, 10 out of 10 times 11:53:30 blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:53:33 doesn't depend on current package (via swank), running the code before (via progn) doesn't make it crash via swank, etc 11:53:47 seems to be a race that can only be triggered when using (load) 11:53:49 any ideas? 11:53:50 <_3b> loading in swank or compile+load? 11:54:01 <_3b> C-c C-l vs C-c C-k or C-c C-c 11:54:17 sending (load "...") via swank, resp. sending the form via swank 11:54:24 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has left #lisp 11:54:38 _3b: slimv user here, your key bindings don't tell me anything ;) 11:55:11 <_3b> ah 11:55:22 <_3b> well, could try (load (compile-file ...)) 11:55:38 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:55:41 <_3b> rather than trying to eliminate that possibility from the other direction :) 11:56:15 trying compile+load 11:56:26 Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has joined #lisp 11:57:11 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-188-77.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 11:57:49 <_3b> other guesses would be different printer or optimization setting 11:57:53 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-140-118.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 11:58:14 <_3b> or printing to different streams (with possibly different encodings) 11:58:22 -!- jpop [~jpop@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 11:58:34 might be a hang ... list-all-threads shows the REPL and one of my threads waiting for "World Lock" now 11:58:54 the only output was the result .... only the debugging uses streams 11:59:23 well, any ideas how to debug that if it doesn't happen via the REPL? 11:59:40 (apart from sprinkling (format) statements .... something more elegant?) 12:00:05 <_3b> does it break with LOAD in plain repl from cmd line? 12:00:14 (and yes, this is already an (assert) in the bad code path ... but as I said, seems to be a race) 12:00:27 trying plain load ... 12:01:09 shows the bug, too 12:01:12 hmmm 12:01:21 -!- nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev] 12:01:39 <_3b> no error messages or debugger output? 12:02:19 yes, I get the debugger .... but it's a race, when the debugger starts then its because of a failing assert, so too latttttttttttttte 12:02:34 sorry, key repeation because of latency and xpra 12:02:35 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 12:02:54 <_3b> well, see if (sb-thread:release-foreground) will give you a debugger to play with 12:03:10 <_3b> assuming it wasn't actually the debugger there and not helpful already :) 12:03:34 the strange thing is that this is an un-initialization ... which should only be called once, but with (load) seems to be done twice in the same thread 12:04:06 the macroexpand-all shows only one possible call ... 12:04:16 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:04:44 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 12:07:02 eyes_ [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has joined #lisp 12:07:06 -!- EyesIsMine [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:07:06 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:07:52 <_3b> this is sbcl, right? 12:08:14 yes 12:08:26 well, I'll keep looking ... 12:09:44 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:10:27 flip: if you do a lot of printing 12:10:34 swank intercepts the streams 12:11:00 and i think it has a lock, so printing acts as a (with-critical-section) kind of code 12:11:03 Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has joined #lisp 12:11:27 so try to eliminate printing, or set your *standard-output* to the original one, not swank one 12:11:38 *maxm* had to hunt a lot of threading stuff in his CILK stuff 12:12:46 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 12:14:30 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:14:39 well, there was _no_ printing before hunting the bug ... 12:15:01 hmm did you try without-gcing? or setting bytes-consed-between-gcs to a really high value? 12:15:16 my debug output function has its own lock, but that doesn't change the fact that it only crashes when using (load) 12:15:24 maxm: no, that's a good idea 12:15:26 will try 12:16:12 *maxm* found that when hunting race conditions between threads, when you have 2 scenarios where bug exists in a) and not in b), is due to to scenario b) is serializing threads in some way. For example by logger having a lock, or due to GC or some other stuff 12:16:30 -!- gavino [47bd073a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.71.189.7.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:16:33 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:16:59 do you start your stuff from the main body, ie from toplevel? 12:21:10 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:22:08 -!- alama [~jessealam@n138138.science.ru.nl] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:22:46 -!- blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:25:02 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 12:26:50 agravier [~agravier@bb219-74-172-250.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 12:27:35 Hello people 12:27:46 I have a SLIME question 12:28:01 agravier: what's up? 12:28:07 maxm: I just do ,ed in slimv ;) which does a swank:eval-repl or something like that 12:28:17 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:28:43 Xach, when I C-c C-c a s-exp, I'd like to see the result, preferably in the Slime REPL 12:29:06 But it doesn't do that 12:29:39 The inferior-lisp buffer also doesn't contain the output of the evaluation 12:30:38 M-Ret sends the last expression to repl 12:31:03 agravier: There are different keys to do actions that display the result in the minibuffer 12:31:07 it's evaluated in the repl buffer, though, so it's not quite as convenient as it could 12:31:07 Not for me, is there something I miss? 12:31:50 C-x C-e evaluates last expression and shows result in minibuffer 12:32:02 Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has joined #lisp 12:32:20 I try C-x C-e, thanks 12:32:26 agravier: What expression are you C-c C-c'ing? I see the result in the REPL. 12:32:28 nikodemus: M-Ret doesnt work for me - i use quicklisp's slime-helper 12:32:51 C-xC-e does the trick, good enough for me :) 12:33:01 misoczki [~misoczki@2001:660:3013:3:222:19ff:fe24:d155] has joined #lisp 12:33:09 Thank you nikodemus and Xach 12:33:16 oh, M-Ret appears to be a local hack 12:33:32 I'll add the command to my cheat sheet 12:34:11 Care to share the M-RET trick if not too complex? 12:35:27 Xach: anything, really, it gives "Compilation finished, no error". May be because I use CLisp? 12:38:22 agravier: Perhaps. I use SBCL and if I compile e.g. (print 'foo) i see FOO in the repl. 12:41:18 Xach: Indeed, different behavior. I only can get "Compilation finished. (No warnings) [0.00 secs]" incl. with your example. 12:42:00 -!- eyes_ is now known as EyesIsMine 12:43:01 <|3b|> C-c C-c compiles/loads not evaluates, so that is the expected outputr 12:43:29 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.104.251] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:43:31 <|3b|> C-c C-e and C-M-x evaluate, and print results to minibuffer 12:43:47 Loading a compiled form usually evaluates it... 12:44:05 <|3b|> right, but it doesn't return anything 12:44:16 Return? 12:44:22 It should have side effects, though. 12:44:47 <|3b|> if it has any, they should happen, yes 12:44:54 zomgbie [~jesus@212095007106.public.telering.at] has joined #lisp 12:45:34 <|3b|> so you can start threads or print things 12:46:51 <|3b|> oh yeah, C-c I at the beginning of a form is another interesting way to evaluate things... that dumps results into slime inspector 12:49:39 Thanks |3b| for the info. I got that, my slime works well, I'm the dysfunctional part of the install :) 12:52:39 -!- easyE [z3LkYHs3xa@panix2.panix.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:52:41 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:55:24 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@212095007106.public.telering.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:56:13 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:02:12 Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:04:11 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA227A1.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:05:12 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-165-188.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:07:42 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@62.219.154.220] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 13:08:59 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 13:09:42 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:10:20 gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:13:29 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:16:43 pjb: hi 13:17:54 Posterdati: poke 0,0 13:19:26 pnq [~nick@ACA2631A.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:20:57 noooooooooooooooo 13:21:09 flip214: so my ROM disappear 13:21:22 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:214:22ff:fe45:5204] has joined #lisp 13:22:58 yes, you're on your own now 13:23:30 :( 13:24:40 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 13:25:35 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.202.190] has joined #lisp 13:27:42 flip214: sys64738 13:30:52 is there a way to get the current source position or something like that? I'd like to see in a backtrace which part of the macroexpansions might be the problem 13:31:37 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:33:07 nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 13:33:14 perhaps I should just wrap each &body in a flet that's named by a textual representation of the content? then it should be visible in the backtrace ... 13:36:54 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 13:39:04 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2631A.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:39:12 tsuru [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:30 -!- rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:39:53 kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has joined #lisp 13:45:33 gaaah 13:45:40 my SBCL is doing that thing where it refuses to give a backtrace 13:45:46 on some code that is SBCL-specific 13:46:29 are you using some hyper-modern gcc with some not-quite-so-hypermodern sbcl on x86? 13:46:39 probably 13:46:40 ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has joined #lisp 13:47:14 tritchey [~tritchey@64.134.227.31] has joined #lisp 13:47:57 nikodemus: i ran into a problem with sbcl from git. if you try to do a shallow clone for speed, it might not be able to build because of how it tries to scrape out a version expression. 13:48:55 Ralith: you might need to recompile with -fno-omit-frame-pointer 13:49:47 Kaid [~Kaid@123.149.197.134] has joined #lisp 13:52:49 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:53:06 Xach: hey, how do I get the raw binary data of the complete png from a png instance in zpng? 13:53:18 -!- dacoda [~user@gate.cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Quit: Bye.] 13:53:25 image-data doesn't quite seem to be it 13:54:08 Ralith: you'd have to write it out. i don't remember if there's an interface for writing to a stream, but you could write it to an in-memory flexi-stream. 13:54:24 Ralith: I'm assuming you mean a fully formed PNG file? 13:54:33 -!- agravier [~agravier@bb219-74-172-250.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Thanks for the help] 13:54:37 Xach: yes. 13:55:08 I'd use with-output-to-string, but this is binary data 13:55:09 Ralith: in that case, you could use zpng:write-png-stream and a flexi binary output memory stream. there's nothing built-in. 13:55:31 What will you do with it when you have it? 13:55:49 send it out over http 13:56:01 via hunchentoot 13:56:27 which seems, at least as I'm using it, oriented around having a complete reply sequence. 13:56:57 Ralith: you can also ask hunchentoot to give you a stream to write the response to. 13:57:13 oo 13:57:15 how do I do that? 13:57:24 and is that compatible with (setf (content-type*) ...)? 13:57:24 Ralith: i forgot, let me look in the manual 13:57:28 Ralith: yes. 13:57:30 :D 13:57:53 Xach: in the meantime, flexi-stream solution works great, thanks :) 13:58:01 Ralith: http://weitz.de/hunchentoot/#send-headers 13:59:03 perfect! 13:59:21 easyE [MjG6j6Pvh7@panix2.panix.com] has joined #lisp 13:59:43 works beautifully, thanks :) 14:02:12 -!- nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:02:40 HET2 [~diman@cpc12-cdif12-2-0-cust276.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 14:03:14 is there a recommended library for working with trees? i need stuff like create node, add child, search for an element etc. 14:03:34 There is a library called TREES that seems promising 14:04:42 HET2: there are a lot of different kinds of trees, and a lot of different ways to implement a given kind of tree. 14:05:16 pjb: the '('foo, '('bar, 'baz)) kind of tree 14:05:23 HET2: you could have a library of generic algorithms, or just use: (defstruct tree label children). 14:05:35 -!- joast [~rick@76.178.187.139] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:05:37 HET2: (defstruct (tree (:type list)) label children). 14:05:42 Xach: where did you find that? 14:06:01 HET2: i just knew about it. 14:06:05 pjb: i know how to implement a tree. i just don't want to keep doing it if there is tested and comprehensive code fo rit 14:06:08 froydnj is a pal o mine 14:06:15 Xach: ah :) 14:06:30 HET2: read again what I wrote. 14:06:51 whee, this is awesome, the png loads as it generates 14:07:06 pjb: "library of genetic algorithms" sounds like a bofh excuse 14:07:26 HET2: generic, not genetic. You clearly have a reading problem ... 14:07:29 ah 14:07:37 yeah it happens 14:08:00 Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.111.211] has joined #lisp 14:08:16 HET2: see http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/msg/b8d9376744b4ebb1 and http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/msg/0c66e597e08be90d 14:08:23 HET2: also, study SICP. 14:09:03 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 14:09:07 pjb: you seem to have this rare skill of pointing out the obvious without actually addressing a question 14:10:38 woah... I had no idea Edi Weitz was behind other things apart from Hunchentoot, like cl-ppcre, drakma 14:10:48 nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 14:11:16 loke: we call it ediware. 14:11:22 sykopomp: :-) 14:11:23 HET2: For example, I have a library that implements Left Leaning Red Black Trees. And I have a library containing the walk-tree function of the post referenced above. 14:11:25 Xach: thanks for the TREES pointer. unfortunately it seems to cater for binary trees only as far as i can tell 14:11:27 <_schulte_> pjb: try looking with quicklisp 14:11:35 I've been heavily using Hunchentoot lately. I love it. 14:12:00 sykopomp: unfortunately, ediware was taken on github, so it is named edicl there :/ 14:12:16 H4ns: I am speechless. 14:12:18 <_schulte_> https://gist.github.com/1180975 14:12:19 _schulte_: indeed, (ql:quickload :COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.CESARUM) (use-package :COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.CESARUM.LLRBTREE) 14:12:21 coulda named it ediwarez 14:12:21 how dare they. 14:12:48 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@123.16.111.211] has quit [Client Quit] 14:13:12 HET2: that's also a problem, few libraries gather generic algorithms. Also, few algorithms are really generic, they apply in general to specific data structures. 14:13:16 milanj [~milanj_@93-86-22-71.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 14:13:33 -!- jasom [~aidenn@ip98-182-25-247.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:14:18 HET2: Hence what's taught in algorithms and data structure. It's not the specific use of specific libraries, but general concepts that you can use to derivate particular data structures and algorithms for specific uses. Nothing that is put in a library. 14:14:33 jasom [~aidenn@ip98-182-25-247.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:17:32 genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has joined #lisp 14:18:43 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has joined #lisp 14:24:09 yesterday I experienced quiet sbcl death: it just exited w/o anything written to the output. how would I go about debugging this? it's the sbcl-with-contrib-win32-1.0.51.11.mswinmt.929-1177a10-x86-64 fork 14:24:21 strace 14:24:24 if it's reproducible... 14:24:34 i was running it within emacs/slime, and nothing appeared anywhere in the inferior-lisp or slime logs 14:24:37 Oh, on MS-Windows... 14:24:37 pjb: win32! 14:24:50 and no, it's not reproducible 14:25:01 or.. I think what made it crash was an infinite recursion = stack overflow 14:25:06 i can try it now 14:25:48 You could suggest Nikodemus to publish an IndiGoGo goal of improving sbcl on MS-Windows. 14:25:58 pjb: what's that? 14:26:16 crowfounding. 14:26:19 http://www.indiegogo.com/SBCL-Threading-Improvements-1 14:26:20 joast [~rick@76.178.187.139] has joined #lisp 14:26:21 indeed: (defun f (x y) (f x (f (1+ x) (1+ y)))) 14:26:26 (f 3 4) crashes it rather quickly 14:27:06 Yes, on some plateforms, one can set up things so that a signal is received when a stack overflow occur. It might be harder or impossible on MS-Windows. 14:27:15 So the implementation would have to be slower to avoid them. 14:27:32 yeah, on linux i get dropped into ldb 14:27:48 pjb: hmm, should be doable with structured exception handling 14:28:39 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 14:28:58 and a recipe for intercepting/growing the stack : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315937 14:29:50 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 14:30:19 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [] 14:30:26 alama [~jessealam@86.93.35.187] has joined #lisp 14:30:59 -!- alama [~jessealam@86.93.35.187] has quit [Client Quit] 14:31:06 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:31:33 ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:35:37 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 14:37:56 -!- hajovonta [zhbdp@usloft1077.serverloft.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:38:42 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 14:39:29 SBCL is telling me " failed AVER: (NULL CURRENT)" when I try to compile a certain function 14:39:34 any ideas wtf? 14:41:38 Ralith: try http://random-state.net/log/3522555395.html 14:43:34 ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:03 :/ 14:45:37 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 14:45:38 that's my second impl bug in as many days 14:45:45 urandom__ [~user@p548A426F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:54 Ralith: you sure writing conforming code? 14:46:06 Ralith: hit this recently, this may be from a macro destructively modifying its arguments 14:46:30 *Ralith* nods and fiddles 14:46:43 *_3b* suspects sbcl devs would like a bug report even if it isn't conforming code 14:46:45 jdz: at best it's an unhelpful invalid type declaration bug 14:46:48 -!- ArchMonkey [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:46:49 -!- ArchMonkey_ is now known as ArchMonkey 14:46:57 i agree with _3b 14:47:31 but anyway, you can try figuring out what the problem really is, and only then report a bug (with the information you have discovered, including a test case to reproduce :) 14:49:19 *Ralith* nod 14:49:28 I've worked out the issue for now, but will try to make a formal report. 14:51:00 hm. 14:51:13 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:51:23 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 14:51:45 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:52:01 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 14:52:34 I'm looking at optimization notes, and SBCL is telling me that it can't inline a single-float truncation because "The result is a (VALUES INTEGER &OPTIONAL)" and not a "(VALUES (SIGNED-BYTE 32) &REST T)" 14:52:56 wrapping (the (signed-byte 32) ...) around the truncate call has no effect; what am I doing wrong? 14:53:40 <_3b> try (ldb (byte 32 0) ...) instead 14:53:57 <_3b> THE just adds a type check at default optimization settings 14:54:22 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:54:29 <_3b> so it does all the work to build a possible bigger than s-b 32 value, then verifies that it was in fact a s-b 32 14:54:34 ah. 14:55:22 _3b: no effect. 14:55:34 -!- paroneayea [~user@c-67-175-218-235.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:55:48 <_3b> oh yeah... signed, forgot about that 14:56:09 *_3b* was running into that problem recently too 14:56:28 -!- HET2 [~diman@cpc12-cdif12-2-0-cust276.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:57:04 ? 14:57:27 <_3b> trying to convert floats to fixed size signed ints efficiently 14:58:21 I don't actually need a signed int; the result is clamped to 0-255 inclusive 14:58:38 -!- nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:01:59 Ralith: did you declare the *float* accordingly? 15:02:13 pkhuong: I don't know what you're referring to. 15:03:12 if the result is in [0, 255], the argument is in [0f0, 256f0) 15:03:21 Declare *that*, and you'll get nice code. 15:03:33 how do I do that? 15:04:02 LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 15:04:06 (single-float 0f0 (256f0)) 15:04:12 and I don't actually know for sure the float is in that range 15:04:17 I'm just clamping the output 15:04:36 I could clamp the input to -1..1 15:04:54 clamp before conversion. 15:05:07 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:05:17 yeah 15:05:17 otherwise clamping doesn't make sense: what if you missed clamping because of overflow? 15:05:18 that did it :) 15:05:34 pkhuong: clamping isn't for that purpose 15:05:51 converting coordinate space to color space 15:06:49 ok, but unless you have a weird space that's in float by modulo-2^32, you still don't want overflow to happen before your comparison. 15:07:59 right 15:08:04 it's just extremely unlikely. 15:08:33 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Client Quit] 15:10:08 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@64.134.227.31] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 15:10:41 -!- kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:12:24 gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 15:14:32 man since amarok added equalizer back, life is so much better 15:15:20 -!- Adrinael [~adrinael@barrel.rolli.org] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:15:24 paroneayea [~user@fsf/member/paroneayea] has joined #lisp 15:19:15 spradnyesh [~pradyus@117.192.43.254] has joined #lisp 15:21:33 -!- sonnym [~sonny@rrcs-184-74-137-69.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:22:18 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:22:49 ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has joined #lisp 15:24:00 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@117.192.43.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:25:23 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.37.192] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 15:26:56 amarok is bloated, try clementine :) 15:27:42 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 15:29:03 -!- ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:29:35 -!- Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:29:47 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-orzoeurlmbssodyt] has joined #lisp 15:30:28 too invested in my tags and ratings to switch 15:32:25 maxm: ratings are overrated 15:34:21 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.126] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:35:05 Xach: thanks for the heads up. i'll see if i can fix it -- or at least make it complain nicely 15:35:34 -!- genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:36:57 re. slime. i just committed what i had locally for M-Ret into slime. for the brave: cvs up and try C-c C-j (slime-eval-last-expression-in-repl) 15:36:57 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: algal] 15:37:06 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:37:28 well I have huge collection and some of the stuff is crappy, but I don't like deleting songs from full albums 15:37:37 so ratings is the only way to indicate stuff you don't like 15:39:21 mcstar: thanks, I just deleted amarok in favour of clementine :) 15:39:36 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 15:40:41 -!- xan_ [~xan@65.Red-83-39-56.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:41:30 Spion: spion = big spy? 15:41:31 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:45:21 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 15:46:43 macro-based metaprogramming results in unmaintainable programs 15:46:45 lol 15:48:02 *felideon* agrees 15:48:10 *felideon* will not name names 15:48:16 it's so true 15:48:48 tsk. 15:48:51 vladimir sedach told this :) 15:49:21 complicated programs are complicated. 15:49:28 *sykopomp* has seen the horrors that come when macros are abused. 15:50:22 H4ns: it depends on the algorithms involved 15:50:51 H4ns: is in programming the Occam's razor? 15:50:53 and the programmers. 15:51:09 Posterdati: you do realise that vladimir's post was ironic, I hope ? 15:51:36 fe[nl]ix: absolutely not :) lol 15:51:36 was it? 15:52:29 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:52:36 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.202.190] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:52:53 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.202.190] has joined #lisp 15:53:12 in my job there are coworkers that think that a more complicated solution give them more credit to the eyes of the (ignorant) customer 15:53:25 -!- LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:53:36 a way to tell: "ehi I'm fundamental for you..." 15:55:09 is it the case in programming? 15:55:26 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 15:55:26 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 15:55:26 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 15:57:11 peculiar-xoxota [~user@margarida.lab.ic.unicamp.br] has joined #lisp 15:59:02 I just did FizzBuzz using Lisp! Woohoo! 15:59:20 what is FizzBuzz? 15:59:34 http://imranontech.com/2007/01/24/using-fizzbuzz-to-find-developers-who-grok-coding/ 15:59:49 -!- markskilbeck [~user@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:59:59 A really lame, easy thing many developers apparently can't do. 16:00:43 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 16:00:43 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 16:03:11 samebchase: is it a software? 16:03:37 Posterdati: It is a problem 16:03:51 samebchase: only one? 16:03:58 Posterdati: a guy asked interviewees to do it 16:04:10 Posterdati: and many of those so-called programmers struggled to do it 16:04:14 samebchase: I read :) interesting 16:04:17 it's slightly more than hello world 16:04:42 a coarse grained filter :) 16:04:58 yvdriess: not a Kalman filter 16:05:00 fizzbuzz has become a coder injoke though 16:05:20 some people have been making completely insane fizzbuzz implementations, for example to avoid using conditionals at all 16:05:48 -!- e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-oyivhnevdofmnrux] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:05:56 lol 16:06:44 here's a fun assignment, given an array := [ fizz, buzz, fizzbuzz ], find the seed for rand() that will give you the required fizzbuzz behavior 16:06:54 indexing that array 16:07:28 ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has joined #lisp 16:08:07 yvdriess: e 16:08:30 def fizzbuzz_rand_sequence15_0123 16:08:30 (0..99).map {|i| srand(1781773465) if (i%15).zero?; [i+1, "Fizz", "Buzz", "FizzBuzz"][rand(4)]} 16:08:30 end 16:08:35 in ruby 16:08:57 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:10:23 yvdriess: how does that work? 16:10:47 you know fizzbuzz? 16:11:13 wow, i suddenly thought i was in the wrong channel 16:12:23 yvdriess: kinda 16:13:05 LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 16:13:10 sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has joined #lisp 16:13:50 you either print the number, fizz, buzz or fizzbuzz right 16:14:08 yvdriess: yes 16:14:19 rand(4) will return an index [0,3 16:14:29 that will return either of those four 16:14:36 It maps a function of one argument, which reseeds the random number generator if its argument is a multiple of fifteen and then returns either the number+1, fizz, buzz, or fizbuzz depending on the random number generated, over the first hundred naturals? 16:14:42 and the random number generator is seeded to give the correct sequence 16:15:03 altsrid [~altsrid@remote.activestate.com] has joined #lisp 16:15:50 scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-229-99-103.inter.net.il] has joined #lisp 16:15:59 yvdriess: how did did you know to use 1781...? 16:16:06 not my code btw 16:16:11 tritchey [~tritchey@70-35-37-146.static.wiline.com] has joined #lisp 16:16:15 you brute force search for the correct seed 16:16:50 try a seed, see if it generates the correct sequences of 0,1,2 etc 16:17:13 -!- misoczki [~misoczki@2001:660:3013:3:222:19ff:fe24:d155] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:17:42 yvdriess: hmm 16:17:54 i forgot to print the numbers on the first try 16:18:30 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:18:54 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:19:14 I was struggling with cond when trying to write it 16:20:03 i forgot the last (t ()) statement :) 16:20:48 mcstar: you solved fizzbuzz now? 16:20:54 yes 16:21:02 mcstar: Congratulations! 16:21:05 now im ready for a 10000 loc software :D 16:22:05 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.155.225] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:22:08 when you guys apply for a job, do the brass make you fill out IQ tests? 16:22:16 im just curious 16:22:26 mcstar: Heh, no. 16:22:47 mcstar: they make us write silly tests 16:23:02 you have to code on paper? 16:23:33 -!- GrayMagiker [~Steve@c-68-35-43-203.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:23:43 last time I'd to write down algorithm on a c program written by others :( 16:23:46 mcstar: Sometimes  or on a whiteboard. Often there are also design questions, etc. 16:24:02 mcstar: In many universities in India, people code on paper more than on a computer 16:24:06 mcstar: It's not a particularly scientific process. 16:24:16 resu [~resu@97.72.154.166] has joined #lisp 16:24:22 mcstar: mine, for example 16:25:05 -!- serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f76284a.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: bye!] 16:25:26 samebchase: no money for computers? 16:25:56 yvdriess: now lets say n is a parameter(the upper limit) 16:26:54 Posterdati: heh 16:27:15 Posterdati: lack of interest 16:27:33 samebchase: :( India is a strange country: money for A-bomb and no money for buy computers :( 16:27:48 Posterdati: the paper stuff is because they are forced to 16:27:56 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 16:28:07 he meant to say, that people write pseudocode on paper, because theres always a guy who will code it up on the computer 16:28:24 Posterdati: most university students can afford computers 16:28:37 Posterdati: but yeah 16:28:48 Posterdati: many people can't afford computers 16:28:50 samebchase: not the university perhaps... This is unacceptable 16:29:25 samebchase: the risk is to discourage people to learn a profession 16:29:26 Posterdati: many university students who can afford computers and who are studying computer science don't code 16:29:58 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-143-111.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 16:30:07 samebchase: ok 16:30:49 mcstar: actual C/C++/java code on paper : bubblesort, linked-lists etc. 16:31:05 samebchase: computers are not cheap 16:31:06 mcstar: depending upon the course 16:31:11 Posterdati: yes 16:31:18 *rsynnott* had programming exams on paper in college 16:31:22 hadn't realised it was unusual 16:31:25 samebchase: not only hardware 16:31:28 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has joined #lisp 16:31:28 i guess you guys know these little snippets by heart 16:31:41 Posterdati: many children around the world will benefit from having computers 16:31:43 rsynnott: me too (years ago) 16:31:54 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 16:31:57 i had one paper C exam too 16:31:58 mcstar: I used to make up stuff on the spot 16:31:59 samebchase: computer alon is not the solution 16:32:13 Posterdati: education too? 16:32:18 samebchase: computer + teacher + software + ... 16:33:50 samebchase: I think that computer science is a branch of mathematics, so one must decide from study computer science or computer science applied to classes of problems like in engineering 16:34:24 oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-143-71.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 16:35:06 mcstar: I think learning a linked list implementation off by heart would be at least mildly weird 16:35:08 do you guys read the comments of that blog? interesting 16:35:13 Posterdati: people neglect the mathsy parts of CS these days 16:35:14 once you know the principle it's easy enough to implement 16:35:15 Posterdati: Why CS of mathematics and not mathematics of CS? 16:35:29 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Quit: spacefrogg] 16:35:34 rsynnott: I know people who have. 16:35:38 Euthydemus: CS is a branch of maths 16:35:42 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.126] has joined #lisp 16:35:43 samebchase: sounds painful 16:35:53 but then I was never any good at the whole learning stuff off thing 16:36:01 rsynnott: actually that's the quickest way of learning 16:36:01 rsynnott: well, my C term-work(?) was a doubly-linked lists database 16:36:11 rsynnott: I learnt by messing with gdb 16:36:23 rsynnott: painful 16:36:43 Euthydemus: does algorithm prove theorems using induction? 16:36:44 rsynnott: but I felt like I had learned something 16:37:20 see, I don't find messing with gdb, say, particularly painful 16:37:34 but I'm unable to learn off large amounts of information 16:37:41 rsynnott: then you've never used a good debugger 16:37:43 rsynnott: it took a while for me to get it 16:37:45 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:37:45 GrayMagiker [~steve@c-174-56-88-247.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:01 jasom: oh, in comparison to other debuggers, it's reasonably painful 16:38:07 but compared to learning off notes... 16:38:12 true 16:38:16 and it beats printf 16:38:43 though last time I used it I found it pretty reasonable 16:38:53 granted, this was through the Apple XCode shell on top of it 16:39:21 i particulary like the XOR solution, ive seen it before somewhere.....(but where?) 16:41:22 Has anyone here written a sudoku solver? 16:41:27 wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-153-61.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:41:34 homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-153-61.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:43:04 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:43:05 dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 16:43:39 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-143-71.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:45:50 probably im stating the obvious, but there are some good conversations on the good programmer /bad programmer topic on cliki 16:46:15 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-orzoeurlmbssodyt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:46:16 (pls confirm that its clike, ive lost my history) 16:46:21 cliki 16:50:22 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:50:25 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 16:50:59 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:52:22 jdz [~jdz@host34-109-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 16:55:25 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 16:59:34 -!- peculiar-xoxota [~user@margarida.lab.ic.unicamp.br] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:02:43 oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-143-71.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:05:35 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:06:13 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 17:09:46 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 17:10:30 -!- loke [~elias@bb115-66-85-121.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:11:07 http://c2.com 17:11:28 that is what i wanted, sorry folks, i confused it with cliki 17:11:47 the three-star programmer is an iteresting topic 17:13:09 bigjust [~bigjust@justin.caratzas.org] has joined #lisp 17:16:40 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 17:16:49 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:17:47 <_3b> mcstar: we count by , around here :p 17:18:16 yeah, nesting macros :) 17:18:54 -!- scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-229-99-103.inter.net.il] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:19:09 once i tried building lists with the `, 17:19:24 but then i realized (list is easier, and clearer 17:19:59 (outside of macros, of course) 17:20:25 scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-229-99-103.inter.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:22:06 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:24:17 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:25:47 -!- orivej [~orivej@91.79.244.48] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:26:13 antifuchs: did you write the gitweb -> rss adapter used on planet sbcl? If so, do you know how hard it would be to use commit date instead of the authorship date? 17:26:25 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:29:05 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-dcttuehnpapjyrki] has joined #lisp 17:29:53 lakatos [~lakatos@83.166.210.157] has joined #lisp 17:30:00 nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 17:30:31 Anything new in the lispverse? 17:31:56 pkhuong: doesn't it already do that? 17:32:13 pkhuong: when did you commit c1e345e9? 17:33:06 Xach: bdf6c, 0af0ff, 922399 are missing, probably off around august 15 17:34:21 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-8-252-103.as43234.net] has quit [Quit: distracted] 17:34:38 i'll check it out 17:34:51 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-143-71.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:34:58 Xach: thank you 17:35:35 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.232] has joined #lisp 17:35:52 When were they committed? 17:36:23 0af0ff on the 29th? 17:36:48 all three on the 29th, seconds before c1e345e9 17:36:50 pkhuong: that info doesn't seem to be published by the gitweb feed 17:37:10 it only has the 15th everywhere in its metadata 17:37:28 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-169-83-177.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:37:34 *Xach* tries another feed 17:37:47 Morning Lispers. 17:37:53 o/ 17:37:55 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 17:37:56 antifuchs: herep 17:39:10 morning gigamonkey 17:40:45 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.232] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:40:53 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.232] has joined #lisp 17:42:49 guess I'll just frob the dates. 17:43:37 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:47:00 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181056239.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:47:25 sacho [~sacho@46.10.17.252] has joined #lisp 17:52:28 Why can't one ask git a question such as "when was c1e345e9 commited?"? 17:52:56 Dodek [dodek@nolajf.pl] has joined #lisp 17:53:13 pjb: you mean like "git log c1e345e9" 17:53:28 pjb: I had hoped to find the data already in the feed 17:54:38 Ah yes, multiple repositories... 17:54:48 Now we need distributed meta informations... 17:55:20 -!- ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:55:32 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:55:45 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has joined #lisp 18:00:26 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 18:00:34 -!- resu [~resu@97.72.154.166] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:02:01 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:02:40 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 18:03:45 Xach, pjb FYI, I think that gitweb just uses the "short" format, so if you change the git config for the short format to have the commit date then it should work 18:04:01 but you'd need to do it on the gitweb server 18:04:05 jasom: can't we force the fuller format? 18:04:22 pkhuong: if you query git directly, yes. If you are just scraping the gitweb feed, no 18:04:42 or rather, not that I know of. I'm not super up-to-date on gitweb 18:04:50 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.232] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:05:02 but you can redefine what the short format is pretty easily 18:06:26 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:07:07 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:08:12 xan_ [~xan@65.Red-83-39-56.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:08:42 -!- msmith [~msmith@75-150-13-105-Atlanta.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:09:19 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:09:46 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:09:58 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Quit: (save-lisp-and-die)] 18:12:28 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 18:14:19 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-dcttuehnpapjyrki] has left #lisp 18:16:56 Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 18:17:33 -!- mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-134-0-42.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 18:17:36 df [~df@163.8.187.81.in-addr.arpa] has joined #lisp 18:18:40 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.231] has joined #lisp 18:20:26 -!- Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:21:57 -!- lakatos [~lakatos@83.166.210.157] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:28:36 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 18:30:53 -!- silenius [~silenius@pD4B9EC11.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:32:34 -!- sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:33:48 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:35:59 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:36:22 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 18:36:39 Does anyone in here have a clue how to just the status of a hunchentoot reply to 404? When I do "(setf (return-code*) +http-not-found+)" it also returns the standard hunchentoot errorpage (i want a custom one) 18:39:40 phryk: see *approved-return-codes* and friends in the docs. 18:39:56 http://weitz.de/hunchentoot/#*approved-return-codes* 18:40:51 Thanks a bunch, I only skimmed over that one and thought it defined *all* known http return codes m( 18:42:24 markskilbeck [~user@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 18:43:24 rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 18:43:25 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 18:46:15 -!- LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:47:00 -!- seangrove [~user@c-24-6-209-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:50:20 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:53:53 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 18:55:00 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:55:45 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has joined #lisp 18:57:15 kushal [~kdas@114.143.167.103] has joined #lisp 18:57:15 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.167.103] has quit [Changing host] 18:57:15 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 19:00:24 -!- yvdriess [~Beef@soft85.vub.ac.be] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:01:41 nhonhonho_ [~nhonhonho@201.86.42.204.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 19:02:13 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 19:02:13 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 19:02:13 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 19:05:17 -!- nhonhonho [~nhonhonho@189.26.35.221.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:05:31 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 19:07:04 msmith [~msmith@75-150-13-105-Atlanta.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:08:13 -!- scorpil [~voffka@IGLD-84-229-99-103.inter.net.il] has left #lisp 19:12:01 -!- Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 19:12:17 Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 19:13:16 ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 19:13:48 ASau [~user@93-80-104-193.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 19:13:52 markskil` [~user@host86-152-37-158.range86-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 19:15:25 -!- markskilbeck [~user@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:16:00 -!- ArchMonkey [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:16:01 -!- ArchMonkey_ is now known as ArchMonkey 19:20:33 -!- am0c [~am0c@222.235.56.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:22:36 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:25:18 -!- anvandare [~anvandare@dD5770CE8.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:33:54 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:34:06 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom26837d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:37:30 aperturefever [20164@ninthfloor.org] has joined #lisp 19:39:14 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 19:39:40 anvandare [~anvandare@dD5770DCF.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 19:40:00 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:40:27 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has joined #lisp 19:41:37 HG` [~HG@p5DC04DA0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:46:11 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:47:24 tmh [635fee93@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has joined #lisp 19:47:30 Greetings lispers. 19:47:42 What is a good use for a symbols plist? 19:47:54 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has joined #lisp 19:48:24 tmh, Usually most useful when you use a symbol as a key of some sort (list of operators in Maxima or such-like) 19:48:32 Then you can attach properties to that key 19:48:35 I don't know about good, but I've seen plists used to add namespaces 19:48:41 For example, "+" is associative... 19:49:07 e.g. (find- 'foo) looks up in FOO's plist rather than some other global table 19:50:02 Interesting. That makes sense. 19:50:17 i still wonder why that's a primary part of the language 19:50:25 i mean, it's useful... but why did they put it in? 19:50:33 anvandare, Could it be that originally there were fewer namespaces? 19:50:37 Everytime I see a NIL plist when I use DESRIBE, I think I should be doing something with it. 19:50:45 *DESCRIBE* 19:50:51 Then symbols would be closer attached to variables etc.? 19:50:57 hmm, could be 19:51:05 (er, as in namespaces used less often, that is) 19:51:43 I like the maxima example. 19:51:47 >Compatibility note: In older Lisp implementations, the print name, value, and function definition of a symbol were kept on its property list. The value cell was introduced into MacLisp and Interlisp to speed up access to variables; 19:52:00 thus why it's named property list i guess 19:52:21 Ah, that's interesting. 19:52:41 -!- nhonhonho_ [~nhonhonho@201.86.42.204.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:52:53 Ooh, I think sbcl (at least) sticks information about source-code locations for defuns on their functions' symbols' plists. 19:53:00 it seems like a good place to store extra global environment information about a symbol. i think some implementations use the plist to register compiler macros, setf expanders and types 19:53:03 Yeah, like if a symbol designated a function, it might have (&expr [lambda-expression]) in its plist. 19:53:11 (no, I have no idea where the apostrophes were supposed to go there) 19:53:18 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:54:32 i see, symbols have cells, but how those cells are implemented is... well, implementation-specific 19:55:04 rswarbrick: I don't see anything in the symbol-plist of a function I just defined in sbcl 19:55:15 Hmm. I may have misremembered :-/ 19:55:24 well, probably because you need another accessor 19:55:50 like symbol-function 19:56:12 That returns a function, not a plist. 19:56:13 hi 19:56:23 Can someone using SLIME from CVS tell me if it works on SBCL with a version lower than 1.0.51? 19:56:25 still, i dislike putting anything in a symbol-plist, because anyone can mess with with 19:56:43 Xach: it's working with 1.0.50 w32 19:56:59 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 19:57:00 Thanks. I wonder how old is too old. 19:57:40 nhonhonho_ [~nhonhonho@186.215.33.134] has joined #lisp 19:58:16 sctb [~user@S0106001a704b7fbe.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 19:58:20 Xach, Could the error message be something about "Error in timer"? 19:59:13 (in which case sbcl = 1.0.51.0-1 and slime = 20110806 in Debian unstable appears to be broken) 19:59:28 more like http://paste.lisp.org/display/124378 19:59:53 Drat. In which case I've got something else broken it seems. 19:59:53 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-84-108-104-232.cablep.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:00:57 How might I go about obtaining the stream positions corresponding to (possibly nested) forms returned by READ? 20:01:26 kami`` [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has joined #lisp 20:04:17 omegapunkt [~textual@60.234.20.206] has joined #lisp 20:05:00 Using file-position in various reader macros. 20:05:12 -!- Kaid [~Kaid@123.149.197.134] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:05:27 Notice also that file-position doesn't work on most stream from which sexps are read... 20:05:27 -!- kami` [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20:07:20 pjb: and my reader macros can just call READ recursively, right? 20:08:35 the problem with recursion is that it leads to problems with recursion 20:10:19 But surely I can rebind *READTABLE* to get around that? 20:10:23 sctb: your reader macros would have to call the original reader macros. 20:10:26 -!- tmh [635fee93@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:10:43 pjb: Can I do so by copying the original readtable and restoring it inside my reader macros? 20:11:00 Yes. Play with the read tables. 20:14:51 -!- ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 20:17:06 Harag [~Harag@dsl-242-247-181.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:17:22 fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 20:19:43 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 20:22:14 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:22:52 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:23:12 ArchMonkey_ [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 20:23:26 MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:23:44 -!- edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:23:58 TDT [~TDT@5317-nat01.eng.uiowa.edu] has joined #lisp 20:25:34 -!- ArchMonkey [~ArchMonke@S0106001b63f2b998.ok.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:25:34 -!- ArchMonkey_ is now known as ArchMonkey 20:27:00 -!- sctb [~user@S0106001a704b7fbe.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.0.50.1] 20:27:14 -!- dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:28:04 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:36:37 Xach: hey xach, I was checking the requests for projects being added to quicklisp. Some (like mine) haven't been acted on yet, how long is the turnaround time on requests like these? 20:40:21 -!- BrianRice [~water@97-126-59-7.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:40:21 BrianRice` [~water@97-126-59-7.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:40:21 -!- BrianRice` is now known as BrianRice 20:40:30 ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has joined #lisp 20:40:41 -!- ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:41:10 ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has joined #lisp 20:41:17 TDT: it varies 20:41:27 -!- ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:43:01 -!- HG` [~HG@p5DC04DA0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: HG`] 20:43:51 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:45:02 Xach: Hmm, k. 20:46:42 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 20:52:09 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has left #lisp 20:52:15 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 20:54:39 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 20:55:22 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:57:00 -!- nhonhonho_ [~nhonhonho@186.215.33.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:57:54 nhonhonho_ [~nhonhonho@201.86.47.201.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 21:00:25 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 21:07:41 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-188-77.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:08:32 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:11:44 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 21:18:39 http://blocky.io/blog/2011/08/30/blocky-lightning-talk-1/ <---- little vid with voiceover 21:18:44 of the squeak-morphic halos 21:22:31 pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 21:23:49 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:24:24 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:24:59 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:26:21 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:28:23 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:29:00 -!- sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:30:38 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:33:23 Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:34:26 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:36:46 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:36:58 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:37:26 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:38:59 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 21:40:16 -!- omegapunkt [~textual@60.234.20.206] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:41:11 -!- rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has quit [Quit: Toodle doo!] 21:41:18 rswarbrick [~rswarbric@cl-1290.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 21:41:39 -!- TDT [~TDT@5317-nat01.eng.uiowa.edu] has quit [Quit: TDT] 21:41:41 -!- fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:42:12 -!- ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:42:35 ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has joined #lisp 21:46:11 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.222] has joined #lisp 21:46:33 fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 21:46:42 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:47:11 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 21:47:30 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 21:47:53 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:49:06 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-143-111.vologda.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:49:38 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:52:06 is it flash? 21:54:05 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:55:31 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:55:57 pnq [~nick@AC813EBD.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 21:57:20 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 21:59:28 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.136.127] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:59:59 -!- ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:01:31 Fade: yes 22:02:14 I could get the video from the dailymotion at the bottom using clive here 22:03:20 s/dailymotion/dailymotion link/ 22:04:53 -!- ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:05:34 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:08:10 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 22:08:53 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 22:09:35 that's pretty sweet, dto. 22:12:27 rolando` [~user@206.145.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 22:15:10 -!- Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:16:45 optikalmouse [~user@bas1-toronto07-1176122586.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 22:18:21 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 22:19:09 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 22:19:12 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.136.127] has joined #lisp 22:19:19 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:20:55 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:22:39 -!- ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:22:52 lakatos [~lakatos@83.166.210.157] has joined #lisp 22:24:15 bombshelter13b [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has 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