00:04:12 -!- EarlGray [~dmytrish@inherent.puzzler.volia.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:06:10 -!- El_Diablo [~Aaron@adsl-68-88-204-61.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:11:51 blist 00:11:53 ops. 00:13:28 zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 00:16:47 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:17:09 -!- Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:17:55 phao [phao@189.98.157.164] has joined #lisp 00:18:54 hey.. what is the difference between normal macros and compiler macros? 00:19:17 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:19:24 compiler macros share the same name as functions, and are -optionally- used by the Lisp compiler. 00:19:40 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.154.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:20:13 So you write a regular function first, then 'help' the compiler with a compiler macro, but it's more of a hint than anything else. You're not supposed to rely on their syntactic capabilities to alter how the function works. 00:21:13 macros are meant to do compile-time syntax manipulation, and they're required to be expanded. 00:21:23 so the idea is to have a function X and a compiler macro X 00:21:31 so that they work together? 00:21:53 correct, with compiler macro X -possibly- being the one invoked, so that you can do some special optimizations. 00:22:17 but there's no guarantee they'll actually execute, iirc. I hope I'm getting it right. 00:22:24 right... 00:23:13 oh interesting. It looks like the compiler macro name can name a macro, as well. 00:23:57 You can read more about compiler macros in clhs http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/m_define.htm 00:24:24 clhs 3.2.2.1 00:24:24 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/03_bba.htm 00:24:29 There too. 00:24:33 ok 00:24:33 thx 00:24:39 zfx- [~zfx@host86-145-64-98.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 00:28:10 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:29:03 -!- Kajtek [~user@host-62-141-197-82.swidnica.mm.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:33:12 zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 00:37:22 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:40:36 -!- phao [phao@189.98.157.164] has quit [Quit: Fui embora] 00:42:49 hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has joined #lisp 00:48:47 ldunn [~ldunn_fn@unaffiliated/ldunn] has joined #lisp 00:50:08 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 00:50:27 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:57:03 doc_who [~doc_who@pool-108-28-6-47.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:58:12 sykopomp: compiler macros always execute but may defer. it's permitted to ignore stuff like (declare (inline ...)) 00:58:39 -!- ldunn [~ldunn_fn@unaffiliated/ldunn] has left #lisp 00:59:18 <_3b> implementations can ignore compiler-macros, and i think notinline declarations disable them as well 00:59:26 hmm 00:59:30 3.2.2.1.3 seems to say implementations can ignore them. 00:59:34 -!- GrayMagiker [~steve@c-174-56-88-247.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 00:59:43 hba [~hba@187.171.200.6] has joined #lisp 01:00:14 Ok, thanks. 01:00:18 *Xach* stands corrected 01:04:39 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-170-163.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:05:41 -!- MimiEA [~Mimi@97-88-6-2.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:05:53 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA22750.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:06:03 -!- tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:07:26 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-170-163.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 01:11:22 man how does one combine features again like #-quicklisp #+maxima etc... ? 01:11:35 i seem to have forgotten it 01:11:59 <_3b> #+(or foo bar) 01:12:16 <_3b> #+(and maxima (not quicklisp)) 01:13:40 oh thank you 01:17:30 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:19:18 zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 01:24:20 zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 01:24:27 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:25:04 pjb: sorry for screwing up the name of your projects. I will fix it for August. 01:28:50 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-123-113.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:29:24 zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-125-177.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 01:29:55 MimiEA [~Mimi@97-88-6-2.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has joined #lisp 01:30:54 -!- hypercube32 [~hypercube@231.125.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:32:06 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:32:16 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 01:33:15 wtf, i get can't create directory /root/.cache from sbcl backend on maxima 01:33:54 <_3b> why would you run maxima as root anyway? 01:34:02 i don't that's it 01:34:05 no, it's a problem with the build environment lingering into the runtime environment 01:34:22 asdf's output translations from the build environment specifically 01:34:27 <_3b> ah, sorry... missed a word or 2 01:34:31 homie: i discussed the problem on the maxima list a while ago 01:34:37 oh ok 01:34:38 6 months maybe? or fewer 01:35:46 -!- Modius_ [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: "Object-oriented design" is an oxymoron] 01:36:06 Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:37:24 sounds like someone is trying to hack his way forcefully by exploiting /root 01:37:26 lol 01:37:40 source contamination... 01:37:47 almost 01:38:36 Vicfred [~Vicfred@189.143.126.253] has joined #lisp 01:38:40 genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has joined #lisp 01:39:20 if it were to succeed i mean... 01:42:51 ok i got around that now with --no-sysinit --no-userinit in --toplevel-options in my maxima script 01:45:41 Xach: I dedicate this song to you http://dl.dropbox.com/u/734346/MBHMYY.mp3 01:45:58 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-125-177.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:46:33 not a real solution tho for sbcl itself.... 01:48:10 zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-119-131.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 01:51:48 Xach: ok. 02:04:38 tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:11:05 zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-119-131.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #lisp 02:12:48 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483A6DA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:13:48 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C7AB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 02:13:57 -!- ravster [~user@184.175.28.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:13:57 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@189-47-119-131.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:23:04 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:23:13 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:24:16 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A51DE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:24 -!- tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:44:42 pnq [~nick@AC811661.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 02:48:14 Good morning everyone! 02:48:56 beach: Good night. 02:49:07 s/night/evening/ 03:04:27 hm, where is the right place to get slime? The cvs repo seems to be down. 03:08:11 -!- MimiEA [~Mimi@97-88-6-2.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:09:41 -!- acelent [~user@2001:690:2100:4:200:1aff:fe19:ddfc] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:12:29 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:13:03 -!- Simul [~user@97-93-224-156.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 03:21:09 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:24:37 alexandria: a subset of common lisp 03:24:39 correct? 03:25:42 lucca: quicklisp has slime. 03:25:47 tempire: wrong. 03:26:04 Alexandria is a library, just like Cesarum (or Boost in C++). 03:27:03 tempire: strangely enough, there are not a lot of Lisp implementations that claim to be a subset of Common Lisp. Despite the size of the standard, it seems all the implementers have no difficulty implementing the whole of it, plus extensions. 03:27:23 tempire: From the top of my head, the only implementations that's incomplete as of today, is emacs-cl. 03:28:03 acelent [~user@2001:690:2100:4:200:1aff:fe19:ddfc] has joined #lisp 03:29:36 <_3b> pjb: i think it is more that people don't use incomplete implementations than that there aren't any 03:30:09 <_3b> though i'm not sure any of the incomplete ones are actively trying to be subsets 03:31:16 -!- bandu [~furfag@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Quit: I need my meds... >.<] 03:32:20 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:33:10 Eataix [~Eataix@CPE-121-223-190-167.lns2.civ.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 03:34:22 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-220-99.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:40:16 _3b: that's true. But specifically, it's surprizing. One could design an implementation of a subset of CL that is very optimized, or very small (targetting "micro"-controllers), or other special uses. 03:40:39 -!- Eataix [~Eataix@CPE-121-223-190-167.lns2.civ.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 03:40:40 -!- Vicfred [~Vicfred@189.143.126.253] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:41:16 There's lisp500, but I don't remember if it's a subset of CL. 03:41:58 That said, intersections of CL with other lisps are subsets of CL, and often not ridiculous either (cf my intersection r5rs, emacs lisp and CL ;-) ) 03:42:46 pjb: thanks; looks like it was built from a similar snapshot. 03:43:04 -!- foocraft [~ewanas@78.101.5.164] has quit [Quit: default SIGPORTAL handler] 03:46:12 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@189-47-119-131.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:49:23 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:51:27 morphism [~Nevermind@113.190.225.18] has joined #lisp 03:52:02 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 03:52:32 ells [~ells@c-69-180-236-216.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:56:10 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.207] has joined #lisp 03:57:19 -!- ells [~ells@c-69-180-236-216.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has left #lisp 04:00:55 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-58-167.lns3.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 04:03:45 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:03:46 I think anyone who'd be interested in a subset of Common Lisp would be more interseted in a new Lisp. 04:04:21 ells [~Adium@c-69-180-236-216.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:06:51 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 04:09:27 -!- pnq [~nick@AC811661.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:10:14 sorry to double post (from #lispcafe, but seems quiet over there) i'm curious to find interesting and active open source lisp projects. is it more typical to consider a place like http://cliki.net/ or github for that sort of thing, or another channel i haven't thought of? i poked around a bit on github but saw http://cliki.net/ has a lot more projects listed 04:12:12 -!- hba [~hba@187.171.200.6] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:12:14 nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 04:13:06 pnq [~nick@AC816EA1.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 04:14:55 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:17:23 -!- Hundenn [~Hunden@e180099102.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:21:20 Hunden [~Hunden@e180098105.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 04:21:26 -!- Joreji [~thomas@83-096.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:23:56 Phoodus [~foo@ip68-231-47-70.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 04:27:48 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 04:32:34 -!- ells [~Adium@c-69-180-236-216.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has left #lisp 04:32:40 ells: Buth cliki and github might be good starting points. 04:33:00 Or just hang out here. 04:33:57 That said, I'm struggling to think of any projects that have many contributors. Maybe SLIME. 04:34:20 And Alexandria perhaps. 04:36:56 -!- hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:43:10 -!- anthracite [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/anthracite] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:53:26 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-13-79.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 04:57:55 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw133234.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:09:32 hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has joined #lisp 05:10:13 hussaibi_ [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has joined #lisp 05:13:56 -!- hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:20:31 hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has joined #lisp 05:22:25 -!- hussaibi_ [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:24:27 Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has joined #lisp 05:26:12 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 05:35:28 -!- am0c [~am0c@218.51.169.84] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:42:39 -!- syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 05:44:05 syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 05:44:14 -!- morphism [~Nevermind@113.190.225.18] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:46:26 -!- M-x_slime [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:46:56 MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:54:32 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has joined #lisp 06:01:09 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:01:16 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:01:45 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 06:15:46 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.226] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 06:23:21 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has joined #lisp 06:28:41 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:29:55 -!- Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:31:49 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 06:34:22 El_Diablo [~Aaron@adsl-68-88-76-89.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 06:42:51 benny [~benny@i577A1D92.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 06:48:17 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:48:33 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 06:57:12 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.116.187] has joined #lisp 06:57:37 -!- pnq [~nick@AC816EA1.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:03:10 am0c [~am0c@218.51.116.50] has joined #lisp 07:08:58 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-152-40.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 07:15:10 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:18:48 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 07:19:09 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:19:16 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 07:23:03 kushal [~kdas@114.143.163.225] has joined #lisp 07:23:03 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.163.225] has quit [Changing host] 07:23:03 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 07:26:05 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 07:26:34 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:29:18 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-152-40.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:33:16 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-152-40.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 07:34:20 insomnia1alt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 07:37:34 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:37:34 -!- insomnia1alt is now known as insomniaSalt 07:41:00 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:41:58 z0d [~z0d@artifact.hu] has joined #lisp 07:41:58 -!- z0d [~z0d@artifact.hu] has quit [Changing host] 07:41:58 z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has joined #lisp 07:42:31 hello 07:46:43 gravicappa [~gravicapp@p57A401AE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:51:10 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 07:51:15 ngz [~user@209.141.80.79.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 07:57:07 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:57:16 _6502_ [4e0cf7f7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.12.247.247] has joined #lisp 07:58:01 <_6502_> yo! ... is it legal (let ((x `(1 2 3))) (setf (first x) 42))? 07:58:54 <_6502_> in other words... what is returned from backquote is a list or a literal list? 07:59:10 SuChek [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has joined #lisp 07:59:26 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 08:00:20 tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 08:00:31 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-156-210.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:02:42 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.54.41] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 08:03:12 zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 08:03:25 _6502_: it is legal, backquote result is specified to be "fresh" 08:08:30 <_6502_> ok thanks, so the issues is only that multiple runs of the same backquote expression can share parts... 08:09:39 jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-133.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:10:44 that they might, yes (if there are literal parts) 08:10:58 <_6502_> in other words (defun foo () `(1 2 3)) is allowed to return always the same list (even if that is of course different from returning '(1 2 3)) 08:11:14 <_6502_> hmm 08:11:54 <_6502_> with (defun foo () `(1 2 3)) can be that (eq (foo) (foo)) is true? 08:12:21 <_6502_> yes 08:12:27 <_6502_> it's true in SBCL 08:12:43 <_6502_> but it's not the same as '(1 2 3) (because that cannot be modified) 08:13:27 -!- Onyxyte [~Onyxyte@r75-110-112-109.rmntcmtc02.rcmtnc.ab.dh.suddenlink.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:29 no-no, each call to (defun foo () `(1 2 3)) has to return a fresh list 08:15:53 unless I'm beyond rusty 08:16:19 <_6502_> hmm 08:16:28 <_6502_> it doesn't return a fresh list in SBCL 08:16:49 <_6502_> (defun foo () `(1 2 3)) (eq (foo) (foo)) gives T 08:17:02 yeah, for me too 08:17:10 <_6502_> to me makes sense 08:17:23 <_6502_> it must be a modifiable list, but is not required to be a fresh list 08:17:37 <_6502_> so `(1 2 3) is neither '(1 2 3) nor (list 1 2 3) 08:17:40 I guess the backquote is optimized to quote (actually load-time-value) 08:17:50 in emacs there is combination for reformatting the function - Ctrl+C + M-q. What is M? 08:18:02 ahriman`: Alt 08:18:13 <_6502_> @ahriman: META -> ALT on PC keyboards 08:18:21 -!- Eyes|Sleeping [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:18:41 -!- genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 08:18:43 daniel_ [~daniel@p5082B4AD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:18:48 thank you. :_ 08:19:39 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 08:21:06 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5082A213.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:23:04 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:41:52 EyesIsMine [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has joined #lisp 08:42:27 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.17.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:44:57 anthracite [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/anthracite] has joined #lisp 08:46:03 -!- anthracite [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/anthracite] has quit [Client Quit] 08:46:36 anthracite [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/anthracite] has joined #lisp 08:51:04 <_6502_> after reading a bit I'm even more confused... looks like the point of fresh-ness of back-quoted expression is quite hairy 08:52:20 <_6502_> according to some interpretation even (defun foo (x) (cdr `(,x b))) (eq (foo 1) (foo 2)) could be T 08:52:41 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has joined #lisp 08:53:13 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 08:53:24 <_6502_> and indeed it's T for sbcl 08:54:44 <_6502_> so `(,x b) is different from (list x 'b) 08:56:58 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:00:21 <_6502_> it can be equivalent to (cons x '(b)) 09:01:59 <_6502_> (this conses less, so seems SBCL choice is indeed smart) 09:04:51 <_6502_> so the lesson is just avoid mutating results from backquote... :-) ... easy enough to remember 09:08:27 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:08:51 Vaaal [~Vaaal@host6-199-dynamic.18-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 09:08:59 hi 09:09:06 i've a strange problem with adw-charting 09:09:25 the problem seems rise for the height 09:09:49 but it's really strange. If someone could help me please see this: http://paste.lisp.org/display/123674 09:15:26 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-061-198.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 09:16:21 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:17:09 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:17:24 Night-hacks [~nullpoint@95.38.52.69] has joined #lisp 09:17:29 hi 09:19:47 i have (defvar *test* nil) 09:20:17 will assigning object to *test* causes problem ?! 09:20:41 while reading it's slots 09:21:23 why it should causes problem? 09:21:55 you will assign an istance? 09:22:06 i've faced problem just wanted to know 09:22:14 yeah an instance 09:22:50 it shouldn't causes problem 09:22:58 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 09:23:21 ok 09:23:41 zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 09:33:23 infact i get it : 09:33:44 When attempting to read the slot's value (slot-value), the slot NAME is missing from the object 0 09:34:12 ? 09:34:15 strange 09:34:18 i try it now, wait 09:35:06 ymas [~ymas@unaffiliated/ymas] has joined #lisp 09:35:40 works here... 09:37:22 maybe the slot NAME is unbound? 09:38:08 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:38:39 no it has value 09:38:57 can you please post the error? 09:39:32 i posted it in top 09:39:34 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 09:39:42 When attempting to .... 09:40:44 you have done this step?---> (defvar *object* nil) 09:40:59 (defvar *object* (make-instance 'instance :slot 'slotname)) 09:41:10 (slot-value 'instance 'name) ? 09:41:18 just to be sure i undestand the problem 09:42:00 infact *object* is nil at first 09:42:10 yes it's not a problem 09:42:17 you can rebound a defvar if it's nil 09:42:25 you couldn't if it was t 09:42:34 ok 09:42:42 and then i setf it with the other object 09:42:51 agspathis [~user@ppp-94-64-131-191.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 09:42:55 let me post the setf code 09:43:00 yes 09:43:02 i think problem there is 09:43:12 you can post it here: http://paste.lisp.org/ 09:43:29 and then give to me the link. 09:44:39 yeah 09:46:15 http://paste.lisp.org/display/123683 09:46:55 hakem is that global object that's nil 09:47:19 and where it doens't work? 09:47:24 seems fine to me 09:47:32 for example : (defvar *you-object* (make-instance 'player :name "you" :cards nil)) 09:47:40 it's one of those. 09:49:05 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:49:21 but after this assignment i cant read *hakem* slot's values ! 09:50:10 mmm 09:50:24 i've just tried it on my emacs and it works 09:50:27 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:50:29 i think the problem isn't the defvar 09:50:40 why it should be? 09:50:54 the problem could be in someother place 09:51:08 because i couldn't be suspect any other part 09:51:38 try the defvar in a simple versione of your program 09:52:01 what you mean by simple ? 09:52:07 such as: (defun SIMPLY (object) (slot-value object 'name)) 09:52:50 it works this way also if previously why did (defvar *object* nil) and (defvar *object* (make-instance ...)) 09:53:07 or (defvar *object* nil) and (setf *object* (make-instance ...)) 09:53:20 *previously we did, sorry 09:53:51 yeah i think should review it once again carefully 09:56:21 koning_robot [~user@s5597d50c.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #lisp 09:57:41 -!- ngz [~user@209.141.80.79.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:00:39 holymoo [~chatzilla@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 10:00:53 shit 10:00:54 -!- _6502_ [4e0cf7f7@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.12.247.247] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:01:02 found the problem 10:01:36 i've forgot that everything in CL is call by value ! 10:01:52 i was setf the function arg !! 10:02:08 so the global var never changed ! that was still nil 10:03:16 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 10:05:45 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:06:16 sorry 10:06:19 i'm here now 10:07:00 ah yeah 10:07:01 :D 10:07:05 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.207] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:07:27 right, change an argument is a bad style in lisp 10:07:39 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.184.185] has joined #lisp 10:08:17 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.184.185] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 10:09:04 yeah C syntax was the reason !!!! 10:09:30 setf didn't remained me "=" !! 10:11:10 anyway thanks for helps. 10:11:34 -!- Night-hacks [~nullpoint@95.38.52.69] has left #lisp 10:15:19 drake01__ [~drake01@115.246.184.185] has joined #lisp 10:15:22 -!- drake01__ [~drake01@115.246.184.185] has quit [Client Quit] 10:15:35 realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:16:33 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:16:56 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 10:18:48 -!- El_Diablo [~Aaron@adsl-68-88-76-89.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:36 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:36 plage [~user@ABordeaux-552-1-119-240.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 10:20:58 -!- nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev_] 10:24:04 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 10:24:37 -!- hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:26:54 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-170-163.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 10:28:30 -!- agspathis [~user@ppp-94-64-131-191.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:33:40 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.32.247] has joined #lisp 10:33:41 -!- guaqua [gua@xob.kapsi.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:33:46 guaqua [gua@xob.kapsi.fi] has joined #lisp 10:34:11 -!- johs [~johs@hawk.netfonds.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:34:20 johs [~johs@hawk.netfonds.no] has joined #lisp 10:42:01 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-170-163.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 10:47:36 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.183.237] has joined #lisp 10:52:24 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 10:54:18 nefo [~nefo@61.184.205.41] has joined #lisp 10:54:18 -!- nefo [~nefo@61.184.205.41] has quit [Changing host] 10:54:18 nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has joined #lisp 10:55:28 H4ns`` [~user@p4FFC8870.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:55:34 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:55:45 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 10:57:06 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 10:58:07 -!- tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:58:51 -!- H4ns` [~user@p4FFC8BF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:00:30 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Client Quit] 11:01:55 Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-203-248.w2-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:06:20 SuChek_ [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has joined #lisp 11:06:42 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 11:09:00 -!- plage [~user@ABordeaux-552-1-119-240.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:09:11 -!- SuChek [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:09:46 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:10:08 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 11:12:46 -!- Vaaal [~Vaaal@host6-199-dynamic.18-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: http://irc2go.com/] 11:14:13 mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:14:13 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:14:13 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 11:17:03 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-203-248.w2-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:17:11 dbushenko [~dim@93.125.24.118] has joined #lisp 11:17:42 trigen [~MSX@87.209.144.213] has joined #lisp 11:18:58 -!- nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:21:07 -!- zfx- [~zfx@host86-145-64-98.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Be back later] 11:23:58 vaaal [~vaaal@host6-199-dynamic.18-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 11:24:16 sorry, i've a problem with adw-charting, who can help me? I've upload the code here http://paste.lisp.org/display/123674 11:24:36 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:32:10 oudeis [~oudeis@46-116-184-50.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 11:39:01 Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-203-248.w2-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:39:29 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 11:40:22 -!- anthracite [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/anthracite] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 11:45:33 I am consistently getting an "unhandled memory fault" error when I run my code in sbcl. I have recompiled everything with optimize safety and debug, but that doesn't get me much further (except that I now know at which point this happens). What can I do to track it down? Could it have to do with my type declarations (I assumed fixnums in some places, but optimize safety should do type checks, yes?)? I'm not messing with FFI or any 11:45:33 of that, and I don't think any of the systems I use do (alexandria, fset, f-underscore, cl-utilities). 11:49:18 -!- vaaal [~vaaal@host6-199-dynamic.18-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:52:51 -!- housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:55:05 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:55:22 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 11:55:56 tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 12:00:11 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-6-95.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:01:49 nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 12:03:31 Joreji [~thomas@83-096.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 12:09:26 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-191.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:09:49 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-191.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:11:08 -!- nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev_] 12:11:37 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 12:12:21 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.183.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:12:21 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-191.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:12:30 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-170-163.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:12:54 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-191.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:12:55 carlocci [~nes@93.37.216.47] has joined #lisp 12:14:24 What the heck is that mystery going on re. lispgamesdev and dto? 12:14:36 http://cryptome.org/0005/dod-lisp-sol.htm 12:18:45 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-191.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:21:26 dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:23:11 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@46-116-184-50.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 12:23:21 hi. several things have been happening at once. 12:25:20 i'm basically ok 12:25:27 that's good 12:25:51 i have not looked at the internet in a week. 12:25:56 pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 12:26:33 so you were busy 12:26:38 PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has joined #lisp 12:26:43 -!- PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has left #lisp 12:26:52 well, 12:27:00 paper marathon ? 12:28:26 i've been ill. i am doing ok at the moment though.\ 12:28:37 oh ok 12:28:48 well, illness sucks.... 12:30:09 i'm going to send out an email a bit later 12:33:04 dto: hey dto! 12:35:25 rfg [~rfg@dsl78-143-208-44.in-addr.fast.co.uk] has joined #lisp 12:35:34 -!- holymoo [~chatzilla@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Iceape 2.0.11/20110429083448]] 12:38:52 bandu [~furfag@pool-71-164-242-237.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:38:52 -!- bandu [~furfag@pool-71-164-242-237.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 12:38:52 bandu [~furfag@unaffiliated/bandu] has joined #lisp 12:39:11 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.199.70] has joined #lisp 12:41:33 -!- dto [~user@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 12:42:09 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.199.70] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 12:42:24 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-220-99.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:43:36 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.199.70] has joined #lisp 13:01:16 sugarshark [~ole@p548840E7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 13:01:49 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 13:02:28 antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-2925097352.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 13:03:27 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-128-121.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:03:28 -!- jimmy1980 [~jimmy@112.224.2.100] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:03:56 jimmy1980 [~jimmy@112.224.2.100] has joined #lisp 13:12:29 zvrba [96456@diamant.ifi.uio.no] has joined #lisp 13:12:36 hello 13:14:23 hello zvrba 13:15:08 let's say that I'd like to learn lisp or scheme. so there's common lisp, scheme, clojure, + some odd lisp dialects like picolisp 13:15:19 how do I choose? 13:15:21 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:15:57 i don't intend to develop "products", i.e., i want to just experiment / have some fun. 13:16:37 the top priority for is having well-organized library documentation, such as Perl's. 13:17:02 (cltl/hyperspec is *very* confusing; is there a better reference for CL?) 13:17:02 clojure is your choice. it is easier to learn and it has modern simplified syntax 13:17:37 clojure kinda fails at the docs requirement :/ 13:17:47 have a look at clojuredocs.org 13:17:54 dbushenko: what about clojure makes it easier to learn? 13:18:13 Knowing Java, I suspect, would make it easier. 13:18:24 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-165-188.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:18:53 i can write java programs, but I don't feel very comfortable with Java APIs. 13:19:01 zvrba: it is easier due to its tools like leiningen. it does all the dirty job for you like setting the environment variables or package management 13:19:19 also the language itself is simplier 13:19:21 Yes, but you have internalized large chunks of the java class ecology. 13:19:35 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:19:45 plage [~user@ABordeaux-552-1-119-240.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 13:20:30 I had a similar experience with javascript in android. 13:20:49 Being able to access the java classes without java was a huge improvement. :) 13:21:01 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.32.247] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 13:21:06 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 13:21:46 Zhivago: oh, ok :) 13:22:14 Lisp would probably be nicer than that. 13:22:38 Although I'm coming to appreciate the value of having an 'undefined' value. 13:22:48 btw, clojure has ClojureScript which is a clojure compiler which compiles to javascript 13:23:31 dbushenko: i don't even want to think about the debugging nightmare :) (it holds for any source->source compiler) 13:23:53 Zhivago: why is having 'undefined' along with null an advantage? 13:25:05 shaggy- [~shaggy-@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 13:28:37 zvrba: the hyperspec becomes wonderful once you have a bit of context 13:29:01 Night-hacks [~nullpoint@95.38.52.69] has joined #lisp 13:29:07 hi 13:29:25 is there any convention in writing TODO in lisp codes ? 13:32:11 are if/else,case,cond etc language primitives, or constructs written as macros? 13:32:32 Night-hacks: I like ;;; TODO: ..... 13:32:58 shaggy-: You can consult the hyperspec about this :) 13:33:20 same here but ;TODO 13:33:52 Night-hacks: I suppose one could do some nice emacs hackery with some specialised tags or what heck :) 13:34:29 is there any Slime support about it ? 13:34:49 *schme* has no idea. 13:35:35 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:36:04 -!- jamief [~user@harrison.doc.gold.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Terminated with extreme prejudice - dircproxy 1.0.5] 13:37:10 pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:38:01 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:38:17 nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 13:40:03 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:40:06 taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has joined #lisp 13:42:29 -!- Kryztof [~user@csrhodes.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:44:51 -!- chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-58-167.lns3.dea.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 13:45:38 -!- lundis [~lundis@dyn56-31.yok.fi] has quit [Quit: Fear not, I will return] 13:45:50 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.207] has joined #lisp 13:46:32 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:46:58 is there any practical difference between `(1 3) and `(1 ,(+ 1 2)) ? 13:47:09 when is (+ 1 2) executed? 13:47:58 pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:49:30 genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has joined #lisp 13:49:36 shaggy-: of course the second one has one more step in evaluator. 13:49:57 -!- morphling [~quassel@84.38.68.108] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 13:49:57 is it evaluated at compile time? 13:50:33 morphling [~quassel@84.38.68.108] has joined #lisp 13:50:57 are you writing in REPL ? 13:51:18 does it matter? 13:52:01 i think it can be implementation dependent 13:52:03 jamied [~user@158.223.51.80] has joined #lisp 13:52:33 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.199.70] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:52:44 knob [~knob@adsl-64-237-169-16.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 13:52:56 Good morning everyone! =) 13:55:15 Night-hacks: org mode 13:55:51 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:55:59 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:56:22 Fade: yeah thanks 13:57:03 -!- rfg [~rfg@dsl78-143-208-44.in-addr.fast.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:57:07 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:57:57 Anyone care to suggest a macro character to denote (the fixnum X)? 13:58:29 % 13:58:30 =) 13:59:57 -!- nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev_] 14:00:08 :) 14:00:32 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 14:02:25 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:04:33 shaggy-: i tested it in SBCL with (time ... ) 14:04:54 and it obvious it evaluates at runtime 14:05:02 it's* 14:05:39 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 14:05:58 anyway it's not good way of understanding that 14:06:07 then you're saying that (defmacro ... () `(... )) is executed at runtime as well? 14:06:26 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:06:29 i didn't meant that 14:06:35 the , portions of `(..) 14:07:10 you know macro expansion time and runtime are different 14:08:13 so the portions of '(...) are already expanded but not evaled ? 14:08:55 backquote protects from evaluation by the reader. ',' escapes the backquote and causes the form it escapes to be evaluated. 14:08:57 arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 14:09:33 anyhow, this is described far better than I can in the hyperspec. 14:09:34 Setting a macro character modifies *READTABLE*. Hence, after I set a macro character, I can save the readtable (say to R2), and restore the old/standard one, and then use R2 around only what I need, yes? 14:09:36 use it. :) 14:09:51 Fade ah. so when it's evaluated depends where backquoted list is located? 14:10:10 if it's part of a macro it will be evaluated at compile time? 14:10:24 no, a backquoted list is protected from evaluation, but any comma escaped element of that list will be evaluated. 14:10:26 Quadrescence: best to use named-readtables library or similar 14:10:46 Xach: Okay, I'll take a look. 14:10:46 rfg [~rfg@dsl78-143-208-44.in-addr.fast.co.uk] has joined #lisp 14:11:44 Xach: Oh yes, this is much better 14:11:57 so to answer shaggy's question, '(1 3) and `(1 ,(+ 1 2)) have the same result, although the first case it's a literal and in the second case it's assembled by evaluating (+ 1 2) 14:13:15 when is (+ 1 2) evaluated though? 14:13:26 when the form is read. 14:13:40 backquote and comma are reader syntax. 14:14:05 read-time is run-time 14:14:20 srsly, look at the hyperspec. 14:14:21 :) 14:15:09 in case of a macro (+ 1 2) would be evaluated at compile time? 14:15:29 nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 14:15:42 see above 14:15:47 check the hyperspec man. 14:15:57 read lol man 14:16:15 check the hyperspec on what? 14:16:26 there's compile-time macros, there's runtime-macros or so.... 14:16:32 ` 14:16:45 that's kind of hard to google 14:16:55 and the comile-time-reader-macros..... 14:17:05 shaggy-: don't google. read the whole thing. 14:17:18 http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/02_df.htm 14:17:31 -!- Night-hacks [~nullpoint@95.38.52.69] has left #lisp 14:18:17 `(+ 1 ,(+ 1 2)) in a macro body is evaluated when the macro is expanded, so when you use the macro to define the body of a function, it is evaluated when the function is defined, not when it is called 14:18:18 shaggy-: l1sp.org 14:19:02 (incf daimrod) 14:20:58 Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has joined #lisp 14:22:06 http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/03_.htm, is about evaluation 14:22:44 ok makes sense now 14:23:49 BixNood [~usuario@189.220.55.78.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #lisp 14:26:48 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 14:29:24 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 14:30:35 Davidbrcz_ [~david@ANantes-151-1-230-178.w90-54.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 14:31:38 So the Men in Black caught dto and erased all his work? 14:32:05 Then they connected to freenode to say that he was "ill"? 14:32:12 spies all around.... 14:34:12 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-203-248.w2-8.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:34:51 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:36:09 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:36:13 -!- zvrba [96456@diamant.ifi.uio.no] has left #lisp 14:38:54 -!- nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev_] 14:43:01 LiamH [~healy@65.199.61.222] has joined #lisp 14:44:45 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82C881.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:45:41 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 14:45:51 Is lisppaste borken? 14:46:30 Quadrescence: kind of. 14:47:00 Quadrescence: the problem is the reader has to read everything *before* it evaluates any of it. 14:47:06 I see what I pasted did paste, just no bot and no "here is your paste" 14:47:23 Xach: That is what I suspected 14:47:25 Quadrescence: it's a little like why (progn (load "foo") (foo:bar 42)) doesn't work. the reader hasn't evaluated the LOAD before it has to try to read FOO:BAR. 14:47:36 (context http://paste.lisp.org/display/123688 ) 14:48:29 Xach: Is there a solution to what I'm apparently trying to solve? 14:48:59 Adding more read macros might help. 14:51:26 e.g. (with-syntax ~my-syntax ...) with a readmacro on ~ that switches 14:51:38 this has also been discussed on comp.lang.lisp a few times with ideas 14:52:35 In that case, with-syntax would essentially be a progn of sorts, whose only value is readability? 14:52:46 cl-syntax-sugar has facilities for doing something like {with-some-syntax ...}. 14:53:05 dnolen [~davidnole@pool-71-183-181-36.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:53:11 it seems to me that's exactly the problem that named-readtables were created to solve. 14:53:51 Fade: What exactly? 14:54:18 Fade: not quite. 14:54:31 Fade: they're good for naming a readtable and file scope 14:55:19 Xach: File scope? So (in-readtable foo) will only affect the current file? 14:55:25 ah. I thought it was for locative syntax in some specific region. 14:58:36 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.194.51] has joined #lisp 14:59:27 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-061-198.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:59:57 Quadrescence: yes. 15:00:06 Quadrescence: because of how LOAD is specified. 15:00:29 Ah, okay 15:00:31 maxm- [~user@p84-72.acedsl.com] has joined #lisp 15:00:47 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.194.51] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:01:37 fgump [~fgump__@openvpn-124-140.inf.ed.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 15:02:10 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.194.51] has joined #lisp 15:02:23 -!- genieliu [~genieliu@59.78.62.120] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 15:02:51 -!- maxm- is now known as maxm 15:03:07 Hello. 15:03:27 What is the difference between :foo and :|foo|? 15:03:32 -!- doc_who [~doc_who@pool-108-28-6-47.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:03:33 -!- maxm is now known as maxm- 15:03:33 || means something special? 15:03:45 || is a symbolic quote. 15:04:00 So, in this case it remains in lowercase. 15:04:19 Is there any option to make :foo and :|foo| mean the same? 15:04:28 urandom__ [~user@p548A20F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:04:35 Ask the reader to preserve case or downcasse. 15:05:03 or :foo and :|FOO| 15:10:02 -!- LiamH [~healy@65.199.61.222] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:10:32 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 15:12:04 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:12:58 -!- dbushenko [~dim@93.125.24.118] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 15:17:18 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 15:18:38 zort- [~eitan@bas1-toronto07-1176122518.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:21:40 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483C7AB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:26:25 PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has joined #lisp 15:26:35 -!- PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has left #lisp 15:30:08 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:31:20 csdwifi [~csdwifi@76.177.215.56] has joined #lisp 15:34:17 timepilot [~timepilot@c-24-91-16-174.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:39:57 http://paste.lisp.org/display/123689 can anyone reproduce this? 15:41:17 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-128-121.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 15:41:27 koning_robot: function types aren't checked. 15:41:45 nauar [~kvirc@70.Red-213-4-38.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:41:59 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C7AB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:42:29 koning_robot: 32 bit platform? 15:43:22 I think so 15:46:40 the computation comes out correctly, without a type error, if I use float instead of single-float; I suppose this has to do with how the numbers are represented? 15:50:14 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-165-188.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:50:30 koning_robot: see the annotation 15:51:15 Float doesn't provide enough information to single out the right path for the multiplication, so it goes through the generic routine. 15:51:16 ugoubuntu [~ugoubuntu@175.191.1.84] has joined #lisp 15:51:36 pnq [~nick@ACA2FE14.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 15:52:03 Does sbcl cache "stuff"? (Like compiled code because I am getting the output of a line which i commented out) 15:52:24 phryk: did you recompile the function? 15:52:50 -!- Elench` is now known as Elench 15:52:57 Xach: Honestly, I have no clue. I stopped sbcl and did sbcl --load lizardsnot.lisp again 15:53:28 phryk: in SLIME? 15:53:37 in my terminal 15:53:44 sbcl loaded the fasl 15:53:51 doubtful 15:53:56 phryk: maybe the file on disk does not reflect the changes you see in your editor? 15:54:13 fasls are compared by time, but that would be quite the race condition to trigger manually. 15:54:33 Xach: I did save the file. 15:54:59 The weirdes thing of it is that in some places there seems to be the new version working and in some the old 15:55:05 which is really confusing 15:55:20 Or your FS is mounted to ignore mtime/ctime as well? 15:55:34 oh wait a second 15:55:51 I think I'm having problems with scopes, because my code sucks. 15:55:54 --load "foo.lisp" should not involve the fasl at all. 15:56:01 --load "foo" might. 15:56:13 Then everthing works fine, i just gotta fix my stuff up. 15:56:54 ah, right. 15:58:56 pkhuong: thank you, this clears up to me why the type declaration in the let didn't cause a type check, and that declaim and declare are relevantly different. I also wrongly expected the function type declaration to cause a check of the arguments upon entrance and a check of the return values upon exit. 15:59:27 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@pool-71-183-181-36.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 15:59:32 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-181-173.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 16:03:33 koning_robot: it could. There has been some discussion about that in the past. Basically, the general case is hard, and checking around calls can introduce a huge slowdown (but that can always be predicated on safety > 1 or 2) 16:05:22 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:09:08 -!- Elench [~user@unaffiliated/elench] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:09:39 Elench [~user@unaffiliated/elench] has joined #lisp 16:15:26 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:18:46 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2FE14.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:19:57 -!- BixNood [~usuario@189.220.55.78.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [K-Lined] 16:20:01 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-99-116.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:06 -!- fihi09 [~user@pool-71-190-67-127.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:20:23 fihi09 [~user@pool-71-190-67-127.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:40 -!- seangrove [~user@c-69-181-192-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:21:33 -!- ugoubuntu [~ugoubuntu@175.191.1.84] has left #lisp 16:22:16 -!- mindCrime [~chatzilla@cpe-076-182-089-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:22:51 zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-217-153.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 16:22:52 seangrove [~user@c-69-181-192-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:25:53 doc_who [~doc_who@pool-108-28-6-47.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:28:31 Xach: It really was/is a scope fuckup on my side. Cleaning out all those setf's right now :) 16:29:34 syrinx__ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 16:29:38 -!- syrinx__ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Client Quit] 16:31:43 -!- Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:35:21 Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:46:52 housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has joined #lisp 16:47:06 -!- timepilot [~timepilot@c-24-91-16-174.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: timepilot] 16:47:18 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has joined #lisp 16:57:47 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-99-116.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:57:51 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@p57A401AE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:00:28 oudeis [~oudeis@IGLD-84-229-233-203.inter.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:02:19 oudeis_ [~oudeis@IGLD-84-229-233-203.inter.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:04:47 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@IGLD-84-229-233-203.inter.net.il] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:07:11 oudeis__ [~oudeis@77.126.218.121] has joined #lisp 17:07:15 -!- oudeis__ [~oudeis@77.126.218.121] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:07:30 How do I loop through a list and concatenate the results of the :collect as string? 17:07:37 (without using setf/setq) 17:07:38 ggh [~None@cpe-69-204-61-161.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:08:06 -!- oudeis_ [~oudeis@IGLD-84-229-233-203.inter.net.il] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:08:18 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:08:30 phryk: collect into an intermediate variable, then use a finally clause to construct the string? 17:09:25 easyE: Okay something like that I searched for But how do I set an intermediate variable? The only way I know to set a variable is setf/setq 17:09:57 Use a "with" clause 17:10:30 (loop :for x :in list :with result = nil :collecting x :into result :finally ...) 17:11:15 *easyE* waves hand, "Or something like that" 17:11:49 :] 17:12:47 If struct S is copied with COPY-S, and one of the slots of S is an array, then that array won't actually be copied, will it? 17:13:20 "Only the structure itself is copied; not the values of the slots." 17:13:25 I guess that answers. :) 17:13:58 easy enough to prove to yourself at the repl. :) 17:15:23 oudeis [~oudeis@77.125.109.127] has joined #lisp 17:16:08 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@77.125.109.127] has quit [Client Quit] 17:16:15 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:20:24 dbushenko [~dim@93.125.20.213] has joined #lisp 17:24:29 phryk: (loop :for x :in '("this" "that" "the other thing") :collecting x :into result :finally (return (format nil "~{~A~}" result))) 17:24:43 Or with-output-to-string. 17:25:46 mindCrime [~chatzilla@97.66.43.218] has joined #lisp 17:26:30 err, you actually don't need LOOP in that case, do you? 17:27:53 easyE: yes the result thing would be the same as the initial list, i believe 17:28:24 but it's not a list of strings exactly 17:28:30 so I'll stilll need that loop 17:29:46 oudeis [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:30:07 -!- gz [~gz@209-6-49-85.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has left #lisp 17:31:36 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 17:32:37 -!- dbushenko [~dim@93.125.20.213] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:37:51 realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:39:04 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 17:39:31 oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:41:28 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:42:47 *Fade* regards husk-scheme and scratches his head 17:44:24 Fade: why the head scratching? 17:45:54 it just seemed like an unusual target language for a developer who knew haskell well enough to accomplish the task. 17:50:31 Fade: source language? 17:50:40 I don't see what's strange about this, but sure. 17:50:41 -!- Davidbrcz_ [~david@ANantes-151-1-230-178.w90-54.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:51:12 perhaps it's just the general antipathy I've seen among my haskell using friends toward lisp. 17:51:24 idk. the response is likely wholly subjective. 17:52:28 kisp [~user@e179070188.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 17:55:38 pnq [~nick@AC81CFD2.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 18:00:05 kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-181-173.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:03:46 -!- koning_robot [~user@s5597d50c.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:10:13 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:12:39 -!- am0c [~am0c@218.51.116.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:13:45 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 18:13:58 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 18:14:05 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 18:14:05 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 18:14:05 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 18:14:18 would would be the most efficient way of implementing a get-pixel function, that fetchs a pixel from a bimap? it shoul work with 8, 16, 24, 32 bit images, and I'd like to avoid checking the bit depth every time I'm fetching a pixel 18:15:23 and I'd like to avoid code duplication, instead of having a different function for every bit depth 18:15:59 the very best way is to work with higher-level operators. 18:16:05 Davidbrcz_ [~david@ANantes-151-1-230-178.w90-54.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 18:16:32 not sure i understand 18:16:55 as in get-line/get-row instead of get-pixel? 18:17:26 but you could do something like (with-pixel-accessor (bitmap accessor) [use accessor here]), and hoist the type dispatch up. 18:17:57 shaggy-: I suppose that you want to do something with the result of get-pixel. 18:18:12 You could also look at opticl for ideas. 18:18:30 yes. I have the inspect the image on a RGB level 18:19:10 I'll take a look. btw with-pixel-access create a get-pixel function based on the bit-depth of the image, or you had something else in mind 18:19:11 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:20:02 and one more thing, should I return a struct instead of a class? not sure if there's overhead in allocating class 18:21:06 there are two ways that I can see re with-pixel-accessor: either duplicate the body or select the right get-pixel at runtime 18:21:27 and I really like multiple values for that sort of things. 18:26:07 Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:28:03 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:30:49 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:31:35 ska` [~user@ppp-61-90-45-249.revip.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 18:34:51 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:38:11 ok still curious is there an overhead in creating a class vs a struct? or defmethod vs defunc. I guess I should profile it 18:38:41 a class is (basically) a struct with the slots in a vector. 18:42:43 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 18:42:48 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:42:56 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 18:44:39 nicdev_ [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 18:47:36 PokeTron [~PokeTron@66.119.109.245] has joined #lisp 18:48:09 -!- PokeTron [~PokeTron@66.119.109.245] has left #lisp 18:50:24 Vicfred [~Vicfred@189.143.126.253] has joined #lisp 18:51:05 -!- pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:55:15 HG` [~HG@p5DC05082.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:34 as opposed to a struct that has slots where? 18:59:28 -!- oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:00:09 oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 19:01:32 shaggy-: in the struct. 19:02:02 pdn [~user@76.178.165.160] has joined #lisp 19:02:16 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.194.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:02:31 shaggy-: an implementation can potentially inline accesses to struct slot members (i.e. using literal indexes in a vector), but access to CLOS slots is more complex; it must also be possible to modify classes at runtime, which results in dangerous/undefined behaviour for structs 19:02:32 -!- ska` [~user@ppp-61-90-45-249.revip.asianet.co.th] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:03:09 -!- tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:03:42 ska` [~user@ppp-61-90-45-249.revip.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 19:03:44 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:07:10 SuChek [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has joined #lisp 19:08:04 -!- shaggy- [~shaggy-@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 19:09:40 http://paste.lisp.org/+2NFW Can someone tell me how I can do this properly within a let o_O I've been searching/reading for like 45 minutes and haven't found a way 19:09:41 -!- SuChek_ [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:10:39 Do what? 19:11:13 oh wait a second, I think I'm just retarded again 19:11:28 I can put the whole thing into the variable declaration in the let, right? 19:11:43 you want to slurp everything into one string, right? 19:12:10 try WITH-OUTPUT-TO-STRING 19:12:15 tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:12:20 -!- kisp is now known as Guest53947 19:12:41 -!- doc_who [~doc_who@pool-108-28-6-47.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:12:59 http://paste.lisp.org/display/123693 19:13:06 that's my slurp code 19:13:56 I would suggest to use a WITH macro so that in case of error the stream really still gets closed 19:14:01 you should resize more 19:14:16 resizing is inefficient 19:15:12 his array is already large enough for the whole file 19:16:25 with-macro, hurr, thats a smart idea. >.> 19:17:57 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:18:04 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has joined #lisp 19:18:49 what's the best scheme for type inference in dynamic-typing languages like cl? 19:18:55 constraint propagation like sbcl does? 19:19:00 or is there something better? 19:19:11 looked into qi? 19:19:27 yes. but qi is optionally statically typed 19:19:33 codelurker [~codelurke@c-24-91-16-174.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:19:39 besides 19:19:46 Mhh; I can't seem to do it How would I get a concatenated string of all lines in a file within a let, without setf/setq? 19:19:52 Ah, wasn't aware it was statically typed. :-/ 19:19:59 i'm looking into recursive data types, which cl doesn't have at all 19:19:59 phryk: reduce? 19:20:28 phryk, WITH-OUTPUT-TO-STRING and (write-char (read-char ...) ...) 19:20:47 reduce will be hella consing 19:21:01 phryk: also why not suck in everything at one slurp? seems inefficient to do multiple reads without reason. 19:21:29 pdn, because there's this byte/character duality 19:21:39 and file-size doesn't correspond to the number of characters 19:21:50 -!- tcr [~tcr@77-58-246-74.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:22:20 Eh... seems that it would be better to use the layer above the file access to manage that... 19:22:20 shaggy- [~shaggy-@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 19:22:34 bin read -> decode -> usable string 19:22:38 you can read bytes, and then convert them using babel 19:22:43 yes 19:22:44 drake01 [~drake01@115.246.215.214] has joined #lisp 19:22:46 or sb-ext 19:22:57 i have a #+sbcl macro in my fastcgi lib 19:22:58 :) 19:23:28 it's funny though that people still write fastcgi libs once mine came out 19:23:35 which is perfectly portable 19:23:40 they also never report bugs 19:23:41 You should get a marketing budget. :) 19:24:28 :P 19:24:33 pdn: I can read the whole file at once? 19:24:54 phryk, yes, but as bytes 19:24:59 I searched for a function/macro that does that, but didn't find it 19:25:32 phryk: check out my code. I do a binary slurp. 19:25:36 weirdo: Can I simply call string on the result? 19:25:46 then I do a conversion to text. BUT that's going to barf in non-ascii land. 19:25:51 phryk, no, but you can call babel:octets-to-string 19:25:55 with a suitable encoding 19:26:03 or sb-ext:octets-to-string, which is faster 19:26:12 pdn: I'd like for it to work in unicode 19:26:35 phryk, that's exactly what babel does 19:28:24 serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f763dd9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:28:26 Hello! 19:30:18 pdn: I have no clue what exactly your code does It seems complicated 19:30:44 -!- nauar [~kvirc@70.Red-213-4-38.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/] 19:30:52 anvandare [~anvandare@78-21-50-15.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 19:31:12 :o 19:31:47 I think I'm beginning to understand it 19:33:28 pirxs [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has joined #lisp 19:35:05 -!- bandu [~furfag@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:40:08 -!- oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 19:40:33 -!- pnq [~nick@AC81CFD2.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:41:30 oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 19:41:56 sbalousek [~sbalouse@ip174-67-214-212.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 19:42:31 bandu [~furfag@pool-71-164-242-237.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:42:31 -!- bandu [~furfag@pool-71-164-242-237.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 19:42:31 bandu [~furfag@unaffiliated/bandu] has joined #lisp 19:43:32 srid [~srid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 19:43:32 -!- srid [~srid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Changing host] 19:43:32 srid [~srid@unaffiliated/srid] has joined #lisp 19:50:35 Kryztof [~user@csrhodes.plus.com] has joined #lisp 19:51:24 drdo` [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 19:52:58 Hrm, Lisp seems to have some magical power causing me to subconsciously write more robust, portable code than I would in, say, Perl. 19:53:49 that's because the syntax is so clean :> 19:53:52 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:54:30 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 19:55:45 -!- codelurker [~codelurke@c-24-91-16-174.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 19:56:25 -!- mindCrime [~chatzilla@97.66.43.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:56:34 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-217-153.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:56:54 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 20:01:37 -!- nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:03:38 -!- scrimohsin [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/scrimohsin] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:03:42 psilord [~psilord@76.201.159.108] has joined #lisp 20:03:45 -!- shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:03:47 -!- ozzloy [~ozzloy@unaffiliated/ozzloy] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:03:53 -!- psilord [~psilord@76.201.159.108] has left #lisp 20:06:15 shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has joined #lisp 20:08:09 -!- sbalousek [~sbalouse@ip174-67-214-212.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:12:07 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-165-188.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:26 -!- Posterdati [~tapioca@host245-214-dynamic.7-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:12:47 -!- srid [~srid@unaffiliated/srid] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:13:06 sbalousek [~sbalouse@ip174-67-214-212.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:13:41 -!- sbalousek [~sbalouse@ip174-67-214-212.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:14:07 ozzloy [~ozzloy@ozzloy.lifeafterking.org] has joined #lisp 20:14:07 -!- ozzloy [~ozzloy@ozzloy.lifeafterking.org] has quit [Changing host] 20:14:07 ozzloy [~ozzloy@unaffiliated/ozzloy] has joined #lisp 20:14:11 sbalousek [~sbalouse@ip174-67-214-212.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:14:20 Posterdati [~tapioca@host245-214-dynamic.7-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 20:14:35 nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has joined #lisp 20:15:02 gravicappa [~gravicapp@p57A401AE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 20:20:25 -!- Guest53947 [~user@e179070188.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:21:19 advaita [~alex@chello084114039189.14.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 20:21:45 -!- oudeis_ [~oudeis@93-172-103-38.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:22:12 ISF [~ivan@187.106.54.41] has joined #lisp 20:27:25 -!- dostoyevsky [sck@oemcomputer.oerks.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:27:33 dostoyevsky [sck@oemcomputer.oerks.de] has joined #lisp 20:28:37 hmmm... So I implemented Tail RC optimization in my scheme project... And now I can do loops, like 20.000 times and it only takes three seconds without stack overflow... 20:30:33 But I had to optmize the GC for that... before it took 20s for 20000 iterations... 20:30:46 what went wrong? 20:31:02 oh wait, i see 20:31:18 -!- zmv is now known as |- 20:31:25 dostoyevsky: did you implement it in CL? 20:31:37 Xach: No, in C... 20:31:41 -!- |- is now known as zmv 20:33:57 pnq [~nick@ACA249D8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 20:35:08 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:36:35 psilord [~psilord@71.150.252.22] has joined #lisp 20:37:22 Maybe there's a reason that CL has complicated loop statements... and not just tail RC optimization... I create/destroy a lot of objects on the heap when I iterate that way... 20:38:30 maybe you could improve your compiler and not cons for tail recursive loops. 20:39:26 pkhuong: Something like that... 20:40:36 -!- ska` [~user@ppp-61-90-45-249.revip.asianet.co.th] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:41:09 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-133.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:41:16 lanthan [~ze@46.253.54.75] has joined #lisp 20:42:21 -!- lanthan [~ze@46.253.54.75] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 20:43:24 pkhuong: I want to write an to asm compiler in the language itself once the interpreter works... 20:45:36 lanthan [~ze@46.253.54.75] has joined #lisp 20:46:10 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1311.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 20:46:40 hi 20:49:15 steampunkey [4e868a03@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.134.138.3] has joined #lisp 20:49:28 dostoyevsky: Maybe #scheme can give you some pointers? 20:50:28 schme: Ah, didn't know about this channel. :) 20:50:54 dostoyevsky: this channel is specifically for Common Lisp. See /topic. 20:52:01 -!- fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:52:08 fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has joined #lisp 20:52:33 oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-32-182.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 20:52:47 taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has joined #lisp 20:53:12 sykopomp: well, that's a little unfortunate. I mean, great that scheme has its own channel, but at least I would prefer a bit more openness here. 20:53:32 prxq: "We were here first"? 20:53:58 just think of it as shorthand for #commonlisp :) 20:54:05 -!- pirxs [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:54:11 sykopomp: fair enough, but frankly, we have little to fear from the "competition" 20:55:08 -!- advaita [~alex@chello084114039189.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [] 20:55:09 prxq: compiling scheme and CL are very different challenges. 20:56:30 pkhuong: I am sure that you are right 21:03:37 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:06:41 pirx_ [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has joined #lisp 21:06:41 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:06:59 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@93-173-32-182.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:07:17 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:07:51 -!- pirx_ is now known as pirxs 21:09:24 zfx [~zfx@host86-145-64-98.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 21:09:24 -!- zfx [~zfx@host86-145-64-98.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Changing host] 21:09:24 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 21:10:05 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 21:13:51 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 21:15:49 alexmagnus [~anonymous@2001:888:10f4:0:318e:4844:3622:1372] has joined #lisp 21:21:30 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has joined #lisp 21:25:53 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-152-40.vologda.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:26:46 Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has joined #lisp 21:27:55 -!- sugarshark [~ole@p548840E7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:30:43 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-165-188.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:32:34 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:37:49 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.70.89] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 21:38:27 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.54.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:41:44 -!- shaggy- [~shaggy-@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 21:43:23 pkhuong: i am not 21:43:28 :-P 21:43:42 pkhuong: ignore me, i can't read 21:43:51 -!- Davidbrcz_ [~david@ANantes-151-1-230-178.w90-54.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:44:07 pkhuong: actually... why? 21:45:21 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-13-79.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:46:11 very different coding styles and ways to express intent. Also, CL is significantly more static-compilation oriented. 21:46:48 *prxq* thought it was the other way around 21:46:57 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-27-15.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 21:47:05 at least wrt the last point 21:47:15 prxq: when was the last time you (defun cl:+ ...) ? 21:48:11 pkhuong: heh. I keep shadowing it quite frequently, though 21:49:28 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 21:49:29 good night 21:49:32 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1311.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:50:07 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:52:47 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 21:57:03 -!- pirxs [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:23 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:00:06 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:01:59 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@78.185.216.43] has joined #lisp 22:01:59 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@78.185.216.43] has quit [Changing host] 22:01:59 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 22:05:33 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 22:06:55 shaggy- [~shaggy-@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 22:07:00 -!- samebchase [samuel@pi.nipl.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:07:46 samebchase [samuel@pi.nipl.net] has joined #lisp 22:09:33 ISF [~ivan@187.106.54.41] has joined #lisp 22:09:37 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.50.239] has joined #lisp 22:13:22 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:14:11 how safe is it to assume TCO support? I've tried a couple of simple examples on sbcl, ccl and clisp, and they worked on all three implementations. 22:15:04 iirc, it's not required by the standard, so it's not safe to assume for all cl-conformant implementations. 22:15:46 otoh, I'd assume any product-oriented compiler would at least make a gesture in that direction. 22:17:39 is there any commonly used implementation that doesn't support it? 22:17:52 I know it's not guaranteed, just wondering how well support it is in practice 22:18:08 supported 22:19:19 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@p57A401AE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:20:34 -!- SuChek [~SuChek@unaffiliated/suchek] has left #lisp 22:22:31 also would more complex examples possibly break even on three implementations I listed above? 22:25:02 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.50.239] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 22:27:39 -!- steampunkey [4e868a03@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.134.138.3] has left #lisp 22:32:13 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 22:35:54 -!- psilord [~psilord@71.150.252.22] has left #lisp 22:38:31 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA249D8.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:42:14 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 22:50:21 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.116.187] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:52:38 superflit [~superflit@71-208-207-48.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:52:41 -!- superflit [~superflit@71-208-207-48.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:54:04 xyzzy- [~isis@c-24-20-223-247.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:55:44 PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has joined #lisp 22:55:52 -!- PokeTron [~PokeTron@unaffiliated/poketron] has left #lisp 22:59:59 shaggy-: an implementation that supports TCO might not do so under certain circumstances, such as declares/declaims with debug 4 and/or safety 4 23:00:11 -!- zort- [~eitan@bas1-toronto07-1176122518.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:00:49 shaggy-: i'm not sure of this, but an implementation that supports both interpreted and compiled code might not TCO in interpreted code 23:03:00 -!- drake01 [~drake01@115.246.215.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:04:26 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:04:47 -!- ggh [~None@cpe-69-204-61-161.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ggh] 23:05:58 -!- xyzzy- [~isis@c-24-20-223-247.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:06:08 hypercube32 [~hypercube@231.125.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:06:25 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 23:08:07 hussaibi [~hussaibi@wirewall.cs.toronto.edu] has joined #lisp 23:11:27 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:15:39 taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has joined #lisp 23:15:49 mindCrime [~chatzilla@cpe-076-182-089-009.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:25:39 acelent you're correct, I needed to compile function in clisp 23:25:53 for TCO to work 23:27:49 that's not usually a problem though since functions loaded from a file are automatically compiled 23:27:52 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:28:16 fbass [~fbass@75-173-81-122.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:31:29 -!- HG` [~HG@p5DC05082.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:41:27 Not true. 23:47:26 -!- Jubb [~ghost@68.34.79.50] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:48:27 realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:49:37 Xach can you explain? 23:49:55 -!- Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:49:58 I was talking about clisp in particular btw 23:50:15 sral [cfed80fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.207.237.128.254] has joined #lisp 23:50:33 is there any lisp machine alive now? 23:50:56 sral: sure. 23:51:09 which one? 23:51:15 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Quit: Be back later] 23:51:35 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:52:57 sral: What do you mean by "alive"? 23:53:06 shaggy-: By default, clisp does not compile functions loaded from a file. 23:53:30 Xach: we can play with 23:56:47 -!- benny [~benny@i577A1D92.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:56:52 Xach hmm you are correct 23:57:15 loading asdf system will compile it, but plain (load ..) won't 23:57:56 sral: Yes, people still do keep and sell Lisp Machines. 23:58:33 benny [~benny@i577A10EE.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 23:58:46 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-106-156.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:59:19 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:59:24 Xach: is there any virtual machine for that?