00:00:09 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 00:00:11 -!- pnq [~nick@AC816CF5.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:00:18 -!- carlocci [~nes@93.37.210.62] has quit [Quit: eventually IE will rot and die] 00:08:15 cbp [~cesarbol9@189.247.121.82] has joined #lisp 00:09:24 -!- tshauck [~tshauck@99-109-59-35.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: tshauck] 00:09:34 -!- Joreji [~thomas@89-228.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:12:03 -!- razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has left #lisp 00:13:38 sacho [~sacho@87-126-43-140.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 00:14:01 -!- plorasg is now known as haha 00:14:07 -!- haha is now known as plorasg 00:14:27 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.31.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:25:14 -!- naiv [~quassel@ARennes-652-1-90-211.w2-11.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:34:57 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.21.175] has joined #lisp 00:39:08 xxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.1.251] has joined #lisp 00:41:50 -!- littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 00:43:43 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:44:15 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:45:23 -!- tsuru [~charlie@adsl-74-179-25-40.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:50:11 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 01:05:49 -!- rvirding [~chatzilla@c213-89-147-188.bredband.comhem.se] has left #lisp 01:05:59 cafesofie [~cafesofie@ool-18b97779.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 01:08:41 joekarma [~joekarma@S01060026f3e2a647.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 01:10:37 amaron_ [~amaron@greenzone.copyleft.no] has joined #lisp 01:11:06 -!- ubii [~ubii@207-119-123-149.stat.centurytel.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:12:35 -!- amaron [~amaron@greenzone.copyleft.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:16:08 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:17:03 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 01:24:47 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:37:21 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.42.35] has joined #lisp 01:39:07 pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 01:41:57 jingtao [~jingtaozf@117.79.232.139] has joined #lisp 01:42:45 -!- loke [~elias@bb220-255-108-49.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:42:56 jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:43:25 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@smrw-91-193-87-5.smrw.lodz.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:45:21 -!- derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:47:19 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-98-113-194-183.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 01:48:57 loke [~elias@bb121-6-159-164.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 01:52:35 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:00:10 plage [~user@113.161.72.9] has joined #lisp 02:01:49 centipedefarmer [~centipede@97-125-189-198.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:02:17 tshauck [~tshauck@99-109-59-35.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:04:32 Yuuhi` [benni@p5483B092.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 02:06:10 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483BCA1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:06:33 Quiet here today. 02:07:14 Well, it used to be ... 02:10:58 -!- sabalabas [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:11:26 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 02:12:43 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:14:01 -!- joekarma [~joekarma@S01060026f3e2a647.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: joekarma] 02:15:41 -!- jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:17:27 -!- fihi09`` [~user@pool-96-224-39-171.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 02:17:37 derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:18:41 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:31:11 -!- derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:32:41 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl14-85-146.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:34:22 BrokenCog [~bc@ip98-162-173-207.pn.at.cox.net] has joined #lisp 02:37:29 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:38:11 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-206-245.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:40:56 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:41:00 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:41:29 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:42:00 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 02:42:58 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:43:35 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:48:09 -!- loke [~elias@bb121-6-159-164.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:48:58 loke [~elias@bb219-74-244-83.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 02:50:56 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:51:33 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:53:31 -!- entrix [~entrix@95-28-100-104.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:54:32 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-81.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:54:32 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:54:53 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:57:55 -!- plage [~user@113.161.72.9] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:58:21 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 02:59:43 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 03:00:36 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has joined #lisp 03:03:51 Deathaholic [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 03:04:10 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:04:43 -!- jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:05:15 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 03:06:21 -!- Kruppe [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:12:08 -!- tshauck [~tshauck@99-109-59-35.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: tshauck] 03:16:24 -!- pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: from my iPad] 03:17:17 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-htbcmhupevvuxhbl] has joined #lisp 03:18:42 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.36.121] has joined #lisp 03:18:49 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-120-123.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 03:18:58 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-86.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:18:59 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 03:23:18 -!- nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev] 03:28:14 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 03:28:32 http://elliottslaughter.com/2011/06/blackthorn-3d goes open source. 03:36:44 -!- jingtao [~jingtaozf@117.79.232.139] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:40:01 stlxv [~chatzilla@113.90.19.100] has joined #lisp 03:43:20 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@97-125-189-198.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 03:47:08 somnium [~user@adsl-184-42-9-132.dab.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:49 sabalabas [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:51 -!- loke [~elias@bb219-74-244-83.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:56:41 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-159.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 03:58:11 -!- Deathaholic [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:58:32 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 04:00:16 loke [~elias@bb219-74-244-83.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 04:00:27 -!- loke [~elias@bb219-74-244-83.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:03:58 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 04:05:33 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:05:55 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 04:06:10 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.42.35] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:08:00 -!- hugod [~hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279442192.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:08:41 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:12:17 hugod [~hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279439938.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 04:14:37 -!- somnium [~user@adsl-184-42-9-132.dab.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:15:14 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has joined #lisp 04:24:49 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 04:30:07 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:30:47 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 04:33:30 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:38:55 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:42:01 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-6-159.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 04:42:45 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:43:23 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.36.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:48:32 -!- cafesofie [~cafesofie@ool-18b97779.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:50:05 -!- p_l|backup [~plasek@pp84.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:51:29 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 04:53:32 Vivitron [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:00:47 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:02:19 -!- gor[e] [~svr@gw2.masterhost.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:02:42 ubii [~ubii@207-119-123-149.stat.centurytel.net] has joined #lisp 05:11:33 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:20:56 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:27:09 tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has joined #lisp 05:27:25 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has quit [Client Quit] 05:31:43 derekv [~derekv@195.sub-174-252-245.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 05:34:32 Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 05:38:10 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.36.121] has joined #lisp 05:38:22 jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has joined #lisp 05:38:29 -!- benny [~benny@i577A30B5.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:38:35 Its a little backwards me reading so much about macros funs that write code in lisp a language im really not that proficient in nor use much... 05:39:42 Could have something to do with why I have to study each one for a little while 05:39:46 -!- BrianRice [~water@174-31-157-30.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: BrianRice] 05:39:48 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 05:40:10 BrianRice [~water@174-31-157-30.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:35 -!- Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:45:36 jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:47:14 -!- qlife [~qlife@alumni.cs.nctu.edu.tw] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:47:21 qlife [~qlife@alumni.cs.nctu.edu.tw] has joined #lisp 05:47:54 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 05:48:22 -!- plorasg is now known as plorasgo 05:51:38 -!- plorasgo is now known as scamlander 05:51:48 -!- scamlander is now known as plorasgo 05:54:43 jmbr [~jmbr@234.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 05:56:53 -!- plorasgo is now known as scamlander 05:56:57 -!- scamlander is now known as scamlander2 05:56:58 -!- scamlander2 is now known as scamlander3 05:57:01 -!- scamlander3 is now known as scamlander4 05:57:04 -!- scamlander4 is now known as plorasgo 05:58:09 -!- lanthan [~ze@p54B7B585.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 06:00:30 -!- jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:02:21 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 06:07:05 -!- jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:07:09 zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-168-202.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 06:07:11 p_l|backup [~plasek@pp84.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 06:17:35 flip214 [~marek@2001:858:107:1:7a2b:cbff:fed0:c11c] has joined #lisp 06:17:35 -!- flip214 [~marek@2001:858:107:1:7a2b:cbff:fed0:c11c] has quit [Changing host] 06:17:35 flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has joined #lisp 06:19:41 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:22:39 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-168-202.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:22:49 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@234.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 06:23:17 paul0 [~paul0@201.86.197.192.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 06:23:43 leo2007` [~leo@114.247.10.65] has joined #lisp 06:24:44 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.36.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:25:48 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 06:28:31 zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-168-202.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 06:28:41 -!- stlxv [~chatzilla@113.90.19.100] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:29:25 dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 06:29:44 stlxv [~chatzilla@113.90.19.100] has joined #lisp 06:30:57 -!- leo2007` [~leo@114.247.10.65] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 06:31:02 pjb, this is excellent news, indeed! 06:35:11 kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-epxtezmkmkbgujqz] has joined #lisp 06:35:11 -!- kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-epxtezmkmkbgujqz] has quit [Changing host] 06:35:11 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 06:40:41 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:42:06 -!- qlife [~qlife@alumni.cs.nctu.edu.tw] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:42:15 qlife [~qlife@alumni.cs.nctu.edu.tw] has joined #lisp 06:44:13 -!- sabalabas [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:48:51 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:49:04 good morning 06:49:40 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:50:07 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has joined #lisp 06:50:14 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 06:51:31 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:57:31 mishoo [~mishoo@82.137.10.238] has joined #lisp 06:58:32 -!- paul0 [~paul0@201.86.197.192.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: paul0] 06:58:45 Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 07:02:32 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@boccacio.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 07:03:36 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 07:04:58 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@82.137.10.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:05:02 peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 07:07:04 I've got a piece of code that gives me "(SB-KERNEL:TWO-ARG-= NIL 1)": "Argument X is not a NUMBER: NIL" 07:07:17 ehu [~ehuels@109.33.218.178] has joined #lisp 07:07:29 flip214: and? 07:07:32 Why does that surprise you? 07:07:44 I changed optimize debug, put that into a separate file to compile and load it, etc. 07:07:56 so what? 07:08:02 stis [~stis@host-90-235-77-23.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 07:08:05 But the next stack frame is " 1: ("no debug information for frame")" and I cannot figure out where that does happen 07:08:21 flip214: then try with another optimize debug! 07:08:28 (debug 3) ? 07:08:32 already used 07:08:34 Yes. 07:08:59 You have to compile the code corresponding to the stack frame with no debug information with (debug 3). 07:09:40 Since you said you didn't know what it was, obviously you need to compile EVERYTHING with debug 3... 07:09:46 That's why I have it in my rc files... 07:09:47 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 07:10:09 Yes, I've got that in my .sbclrc, too 07:10:31 Who called this debugless frame? 07:10:45 -!- Quadrescence [~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:10:47 A function that got build by a macro 07:10:50 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:10:56 What does this function call? 07:11:03 which I already thoroughly looked at, via macroexpand (-1) 07:11:08 some other functions 07:11:31 but these functions are in a file that has (declaim (optimize (debug 3))) at the top, too 07:11:32 oconnore pasted "closer-mop" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122760 07:11:48 might it be a problem if that file gets loaded via asdf? 07:11:49 Why doesn't closer-mop redefine slot-value to use slot-value-using-class? 07:12:01 is there any reason it shouldn't have something like my paste? 07:12:04 Do I need an (eval-when) around the declaim? 07:13:03 or even better, is there any reason that clozure and sbcl both don't define slot-value in terms of slot-value-using-class? 07:13:52 flip214: did you read the documentation of DECLAIM? 07:14:11 jdz: yes - what am I doing wrong? 07:14:16 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: malbertife] 07:14:17 flip214: yes, to be sure, you might want to (load (compile-file "those-files.lisp")) or even just (load "those-files.lisp") 07:14:30 "If a call to this macro appears at top level in a file being processed by the file compiler, the proclamations are also made at compile time. " 07:14:38 that's what declaim says 07:14:42 flip214: i'm only replying to your question about wrapping DECLAIM in EVAL-WHEN 07:14:46 ok 07:15:02 since asdf might be loading a different file... 07:15:37 still ("no debug information for frame") 07:16:42 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 07:17:38 Some frames are internal frames generated by the compiler, without any source, and of course no debug information. 07:18:10 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-168-202.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:18:29 add^_ [~add^_^@h52n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 07:18:51 hmm 07:19:37 another strange thing ... at the end of the function of stack frame 2 I put an (format t "end"), which gets printed - and the error comes _after_ that ... 07:19:50 but there's no code there anymore ... 07:21:01 -!- stlxv [~chatzilla@113.90.19.100] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:21:07 stlxv [~chatzilla@113.89.69.14] has joined #lisp 07:21:19 -!- kennyd_ [~kennyd@93-138-240-213.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:21:32 Is there a swank/sbcl function to get the EIP of the offending addresses on the stack, so that I can see in the disassembly what's wrong? 07:22:27 -!- p_l|backup [~plasek@pp84.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:22:48 lakatosi [557a1e03@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.122.30.3] has joined #lisp 07:22:52 p_l|backup [~plasek@pp84.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 07:23:08 Hey guys 07:23:22 Is it possible to edit mp3 files using common lisp? 07:24:09 For example I would like to add a beep sound every minute to an audio file 07:24:24 Is there a library for this? 07:24:44 Or do I have to do this manually by altering the bits? 07:25:06 kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-34-152.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 07:25:25 lakatosi: it's possible, but I don't know of a library. Shuffletron is the only thing CL project I know of that does anything with MP3 files, and it calls out to a C library. 07:25:46 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-155-168.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 07:26:14 I see 07:26:44 So I'd say your best bet would be to look at what it does and see whether you can extend that in a sane way; failing that, methinks you'd be faced with implementing it from scratch. 07:27:30 Cliki points me to a couple of related projects: http://www.cliki.net/cl-madhl and http://www.cliki.net/Mixalot - the latter is what Shuffletron actually uses for the actual audio work. 07:27:35 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-210-13.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:27:57 I guess I now know what my summer project will be :) 07:28:10 it will almost certainly be easier to link into an existing C library than write one yourself. but perhaps less fun. 07:28:15 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:28:21 lester- [~lester@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 07:28:59 what kind of data structure would you use to represent chess table? 07:29:05 The easiest way is to use 3 commandline programs - mp3-to-wav, mixing, wav-to-mp3 07:29:11 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 07:29:18 and chess pieces 07:29:32 All I want to currently do is to put in some noise every couple of mintes or so into my music so I know how much time has passed when I'm running 07:29:58 lester-: I guess a 2 dimensional array would be a safe bet 07:30:12 lakatosi: depending on your OS and sound system it might be possible to have arbitrary auxillary data get piped into your audio, too - then a cronjob would suffice 07:30:19 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:30:23 Or a hash table where the keys are the coordinates n the table 07:31:21 what about pieces? just symbols or classes 07:31:34 flip214: Yeah, but I guess I'll do this manually :) I always wanted to understand how mp3 compression works 07:31:57 lester-: Well, you could use classes 07:32:15 But since pieces don't really need to keep any state, symbols should work just fine 07:32:33 depending on what you want to do 07:34:55 lakatosi: I see a small potential problem in what you describe. If you're injecting the beep into individual songs, your timing will go way the heck out of whack, because very few songs are integer multiples of a minute in length. Or are you planning to stream an entire playlist through this? 07:35:47 The entire playlist 07:35:58 Ah, that's more viable, then. 07:36:41 Although this does mean that I won't be able to shuffle any more 07:37:23 -!- stis [~stis@host-90-235-77-23.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:38:18 The hacker in me is intrigued by the challenge of implementing this in CL. The engineer in me suggests finding a simple way of generating a .mp3 consisting of silence punctuated by beeps at 1-minute intervals, then multiplexing both streams through a mixer and back into a compressed file, though the audiofile in me is horrified by what the decoding/recompression will do. 07:39:03 jfleming: if I understand lakatosi correctly it's not about recompressing but hearing at that point 07:39:05 The pragmatist in me thinks that if the playback device is a smartphone, the thing to look for is a very small app that emits a beep at configurable intervals - like a metronome. 07:39:13 My first thought was just to buy a stopwatch... 07:39:49 Bike: Unfortunately I can't afford a stopwatch :P Because I just bought myself an iPod 07:40:09 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:40:11 Once you've found out how you mix a 1sec bip to a mp3 (without decompressing it!) please tell me, I've got a bridge to sell^W^W^W nice video application for that! 07:40:13 a Shuffle to be more exact 07:40:13 ah. 07:40:29 Ah, so you're stuck with decompression/recompression, then. 07:40:37 Duh! 07:40:37 So I have no means of tracking time 07:40:40 Yeah 07:41:15 pjb: I'll inform everyone! 07:41:34 flip214: my point was that, to mix a beep into the soundtrack, you actually have to play back the sound (transcode from .mp3 to .wav or similar), mix in the beep, then recompress back to mp3. 07:41:44 But seriously, if you can generate meaningful data in compressed mode (instead of generating uncompressed and compressing it), they you could have very nice photorealistic 3D games. 07:42:20 jfleming: that's what I suggested, too 07:42:21 plage [~user@116.118.0.95] has joined #lisp 07:42:23 lakatosi: I recommend just getting a watch and glancing at it from time to time. It'll be vastly less painful. 07:42:24 I don't think it's impossible, but instead of working with "textures" you'd have to work with the compression transformed data, and know what you're doing... 07:42:59 well, if it's just to get _any_ noise, it's simple - just patch a few bytes in the vicinity of the given time, and you'll likely get some garbage (= noise) out 07:43:11 Or just play the beep stream and the other audio file at the same time (which avoids recoding, as well as keeps shuffleability). 07:43:15 of course, a nice, round sinus-beep might be harder 07:43:51 -!- StephenFalken [email@2001:470:1f08:b3d::2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:43:53 pjb: Yeah, I know, but I guess it will be so computationally intensive that it won't be playable 07:44:17 Compressed movies are quite playable... 07:44:27 Why not just arrange for both sounds to be played in parallel? 07:44:44 I'll see what I can do in the summer 07:45:02 Zhivago: I can only play one sound at a time. 07:45:03 Hmm... lakatosi: do you have the original files from which these songs were ripped? I'm also seeing the potential in hacking an mp3 encoder in such a way as to have it inject a beep into its own input stream at regular intervals, and to aggolomerate all the input files into a single .mp3 while it's at it. 07:45:37 Can you interrupt one playing for another? 07:45:48 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-53-18.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:46:24 jfleming: I was thinking of that myself. But I want to do something in CL to hone my skills 07:47:09 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-7.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:47:35 Zhivago: I don't know, it might be possible. But I don't want to mess with the firmware of my shuffle 07:47:35 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-31-78.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:48:05 Well, your first task is to implement mp3 encoding in CL. Your next is to wrap that in something that will accept an abitrary number of input files, and a timer and beep-injector follow after that :) 07:48:05 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-19-192.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:03 I have to go. 07:49:10 I'll se what I can do :) 07:49:14 -!- lakatosi [557a1e03@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.122.30.3] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:50:11 I still think they should buy a watch and find another project, but I'll be intrigued to see what they come back with. 07:50:20 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.100.177] has joined #lisp 07:51:42 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:54:35 ericbb [~user@blk-224-153-99.eastlink.ca] has joined #lisp 07:55:19 Guthur [c0c1f50f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.193.245.15] has joined #lisp 08:01:34 lanthan [~ze@p50992b91.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 08:01:36 -!- andelf [~andelf@2001:da8:9000:a142:215:afff:feef:8095] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:01:47 drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 08:02:50 malbertife [~marcoalbe@193.136.122.17] has joined #lisp 08:05:42 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@193.136.122.17] has quit [Client Quit] 08:06:24 -!- ericbb [~user@blk-224-153-99.eastlink.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:08:00 -!- xpf [~xpf@78.31.74.25] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:14:45 malbertife [~marcoalbe@gw-alunos-dmat.nat.fct.unl.pt] has joined #lisp 08:16:32 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: it's 4 AM :|] 08:16:55 why is my editor highlitning "type" keyword? it doesn't seem to be a function, macro, variable, class 08:18:36 andelf [~andelf@2001:da8:9000:a142:215:afff:feef:8095] has joined #lisp 08:20:23 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:20:55 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-159-184.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: G'bye] 08:21:49 -!- ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has quit [Quit: brb] 08:23:21 drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 08:23:26 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-159-184.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:30:25 -!- plage [~user@116.118.0.95] has left #lisp 08:30:40 lester-: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Front/X_Mast_T.htm 08:31:21 e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-cvrosrituvdnzmtj] has joined #lisp 08:31:33 In particular, I'd say it's because of this: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/d_type.htm 08:31:46 Harag [~Harag@dsl-242-240-240.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:32:26 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d002146.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:33:07 greaver [~DCA@94.126.185.1] has joined #lisp 08:33:32 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has joined #lisp 08:34:08 hlavaty [~user@91-65-223-81-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:35:15 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:42:48 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 08:46:30 jingtao [~jingtaozf@117.79.232.139] has joined #lisp 08:46:32 a 08:46:48 thanks jfleming 08:47:59 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 08:50:33 -!- Amadiro_ [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:57:41 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:58:44 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-172-100.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 08:59:29 benny [~benny@i577A7D86.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 08:59:37 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-nqwpxtkdegfftogh] has joined #lisp 09:02:03 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 09:05:47 Amadiro_ [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 09:06:11 -!- koollman [~samson_t@sp1.kooll.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:10:28 Inachos [57d4a2eb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.212.162.235] has joined #lisp 09:12:20 join #clsql 09:12:59 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.100.177] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:16:26 koollman [~samson_t@sp1.kooll.info] has joined #lisp 09:17:45 Inachos: If you are wondering about getting a 404 when trying to emerge clsql, the server seems to just hold the next version (.3 instead of .2 at the end) 09:18:38 You can seemingly fix this by just copying the old ebuild to have the new version (again, .3 instead of .2 in the filename) and run 'ebuild digest' 09:18:51 At least it emerges fine, haven't tested it, though 09:18:56 misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has joined #lisp 09:19:08 phryk: Thanks, that't not the issue. Got a really weird issue getting some floats from a mysql database 09:19:24 Ah okay. In that case, I sadly cannot help you^^ 09:19:49 too bad.. 09:20:08 But maybe someone else recognises the problem: 09:20:49 using sbcl and clsql I get some integer results in a float format where the database really contains floats... 09:21:26 the strange thing is, it works on the development laptop, demo server, test server, only on the production server the issue arises. 09:22:21 all code and libraries are stored in a git repo. 09:22:24 perhaps the production data is corrupted ... try dumping and loading into the dev server? 09:23:18 s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-175-71.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 09:23:41 directly issueing a query on the mysql db returns correct results. same query from within lisp with clsql returns wrong results. 09:24:11 any non-ascii characters involved? ie. not \x20 - \x7e? 09:24:30 no... 09:26:01 i.e. mysql> select * from coords where place="myplace"; --> longitude 5.1234 , latitude 52.01325 09:26:34 what does clsql say? 09:28:03 on development server sbcl:> (clsql:query "select * from coords where place='myplace';") --> (("myplace" 5.1234d0 52.01325d0 ) ("place" "longitude" "latitude")) 09:28:32 on PRODUCTION server sbcl:> (clsql:query "select * from coords where place='myplace';") --> (("myplace" 5.0d0 52.0d0 ) ("place" "longitude" "latitude")) 09:28:33 perhaps a different locale setting, so that "," instead of "." is returned or something like that? I don't know whether string translation should even enter into that question, though 09:29:34 :flip214 maybe a locate setting ^^^ indeed. 09:29:48 but that seems strange. 09:30:16 well, there seems to be a float => string => float issue somewhere ... the columns are numeric, or string? 09:30:36 the db columns are float 09:30:45 ie. numeric 09:31:47 strange ... perhaps mysql transmits them as strings, for "compatibility"? 09:32:05 -!- Euthydemus` [~euthydemu@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:32:36 -!- aoh [~aki@85.23.168.115] has quit [Quit: Changing server] 09:33:17 :flip214 Could be. really don't know what it can be :( 09:34:16 Euthydemus [~euthydemu@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 09:34:43 locale could be the issue. 09:35:25 -!- stlxv [~chatzilla@113.89.69.14] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 4.0.1/20110413222027]] 09:35:31 i'll try to change that and observe the results. 09:45:01 hm... changed locale on the test server, test server still returns correct results... 09:46:29 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h52n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:47:26 database locale is the same? ie. the locale in the mysql database definition? 09:48:48 hm... I'll have a look. 09:55:09 ymas [~ymas@unaffiliated/ymas] has joined #lisp 09:56:12 ok, production has: utf8 - default collation test-server has: latin1 - default collation. 09:56:15 eriix [~user@96.26.249.127] has joined #lisp 09:57:07 -!- eriix [~user@96.26.249.127] has quit [Quit: None, really.] 09:57:36 i'd suggest instead of random guessing to check what exactly is it that the database returns before CLSQL gets the data 09:58:03 if that's what is expected, the problem is in CLSQl, if not, it's mysql 09:59:34 Inachos: how about using wireshark? 09:59:50 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has joined #lisp 10:00:26 flip214: yeah, that's sure easier than TRACE 10:00:59 jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.38.75] has joined #lisp 10:01:10 ignas [~ignas@78-60-36-123.static.zebra.lt] has joined #lisp 10:02:04 like, (trace clsql-sys:read-sql-value clslq-sys:update-slot-from-db) and probably a couple more if needed 10:02:15 :jdz some good ideas. 10:02:45 haven't thought about wireshark yet. 10:03:45 never worked with trace. so i'll give that a try too. 10:09:09 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-172-100.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:11:30 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-146-20.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 10:13:48 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-159-184.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:18:24 daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 10:19:02 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181058025.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 10:19:20 Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 10:23:52 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-172-100.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 10:24:39 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@gw-alunos-dmat.nat.fct.unl.pt] has quit [Quit: malbertife] 10:28:27 -!- jingtao [~jingtaozf@117.79.232.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:32:34 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-16.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:32:43 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-16.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 10:33:22 ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 10:39:26 malbertife [~marcoalbe@gw-e-U-EdII.nat.fct.unl.pt] has joined #lisp 10:40:56 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:42:14 daniel__1 [~daniel@p5082B1BC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:44:33 -!- daniel___ [~daniel@p5082AD06.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:46:29 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-172-100.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:48:13 BlankVerse [~pankajm@121.243.181.99] has joined #lisp 10:48:48 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:50:08 Hmm... seems SWANK-BACKEND:ADD-FD-HANDLER is not implemented in CCL. 10:50:18 (on OS X) 10:50:50 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-16.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:50:59 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-16.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 10:51:49 Wonder, what does FD stand for? (other than Fire Department) 10:51:50 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 10:51:51 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 10:52:50 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 10:52:50 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 10:52:50 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 10:52:52 jtza8: file descriptor, most porbably. 10:53:19 smorbamrobam 10:53:27 thought so. 10:55:31 sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:56:01 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 11:04:07 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.1.251] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:11:35 xpf [~xpf@78.31.74.25] has joined #lisp 11:17:37 Daev [~KAPITAL@nc-184-3-67-31.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 11:21:03 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-nqwpxtkdegfftogh] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:28:11 -!- Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:29:31 -!- Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:31:09 mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:31:09 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:31:09 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 11:33:49 So, after a lot of tinkering ... setting locale to en_US.utf8 fixed the problem... 11:35:46 thankyou flip214 for the hint. 11:36:03 you're welcome! 11:36:09 -!- nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev] 11:36:37 -!- Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:38:44 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:39:28 -!- sacho [~sacho@87-126-43-140.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:39:46 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-ahakveqpqrwgnefa] has joined #lisp 11:39:51 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@boccacio.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:41:09 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:44:00 Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 11:49:04 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-htbcmhupevvuxhbl] has left #lisp 11:52:40 -!- sonnym [~evissecer@rrcs-184-74-137-167.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:56:32 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 11:58:18 Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 12:01:47 -!- nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: nicdev] 12:02:33 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@121.243.181.99] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:04:21 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:05:05 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has joined #lisp 12:05:15 -!- StrmSrfr [~user@208.72.159.205] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:05:24 StrmSrfr [~user@208.72.159.205] has joined #lisp 12:07:31 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-68-82-87-23.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:07:57 pdo [~pdo@217.33.254.141] has joined #lisp 12:11:32 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-19-192.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:11:33 -!- Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:12:52 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:15:34 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-68-82-87-23.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:16:15 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:17:57 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:18:25 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.154.152] has joined #lisp 12:19:41 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 12:23:56 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:25:00 taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has joined #lisp 12:25:21 Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 12:26:54 netfrog [~netfrog@109.66.26.91] has joined #lisp 12:31:38 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 12:33:17 jingtao [~jingtaozf@114.248.165.95] has joined #lisp 12:34:41 pnq [~nick@AC8308C1.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 12:35:37 sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has joined #lisp 12:36:22 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 12:38:05 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:40:14 -!- netfrog [~netfrog@109.66.26.91] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:43:17 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:43:28 kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.235.8.175] has joined #lisp 12:48:40 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 12:51:36 -!- ubii [~ubii@207-119-123-149.stat.centurytel.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 12:54:32 jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:00:46 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@gw-e-U-EdII.nat.fct.unl.pt] has quit [Quit: malbertife] 13:02:09 -!- xpf [~xpf@78.31.74.25] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:03:31 razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has joined #lisp 13:03:33 hi 13:03:37 a doubt 13:03:56 why (let ((var (read)))) does work but (let (var (read))) doesn't? 13:04:07 why do I have to place extra parenthesis? 13:04:26 becase the reader expects a fixed format 13:04:27 because every paren has a meaning 13:04:38 ie. a list of lists 13:05:26 z0d: well, in this case syntactically both forms are valid 13:05:35 syntactically yes 13:05:44 but the second one doens't work as expected 13:05:59 jdz: hmm, acutually this is true <-: 13:06:00 yes, because you are binding two variables (VAR and READ) to nil 13:06:09 I think I'm understanding 13:06:26 if you do not provide a value for a variable, it defaults to nil 13:06:33 the second one is allocating var but it's reading any var 13:06:48 but the first one, is applying read to var 13:06:52 am I correct? 13:07:03 the second form is not reading anything 13:07:22 have you read any introductory material on lisp? 13:07:24 yes, ok ok, now I understand 13:07:28 jdz: I'm on it 13:07:32 I'm with land of lisp 13:07:35 chapter 6 13:07:55 and I seen that but I didn't understood well why the extra parens 13:08:08 I've seen* 13:08:17 clhs let 13:08:17 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/s_let_l.htm 13:08:26 -!- derekv [~derekv@195.sub-174-252-245.myvzw.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:08:27 so, it's just a let issue 13:08:34 razieliyo: check ^ this for exact syntax of LET 13:08:46 razieliyo: it is not an issue, really 13:09:14 well, yess, I know, but I didn't explain very well 13:09:47 (let ( (var (read)) )) 13:09:52 that way I understand it better 13:10:25 obviously I'll never code that way 13:10:26 soon you will not need any extra whitespace 13:10:31 hahaha yes 13:10:33 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:10:40 but well, I'm just starting 13:10:45 and I need to see everything 13:11:07 that's good, just remember: every paren counts! 13:11:37 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:11:47 jdz: ;) ;) 13:11:49 so (let ( (var (read)) (do-something) (do-other-something) )) 13:11:53 ok ok 13:11:55 probably if you understand that let can introduce many bindings, it will make more sense 13:11:55 I understand 13:11:58 thank you really 13:12:10 (that was a paren in a comment, with a meta-smiley, btw ;) 13:12:16 yes, I know that, but I really didn't notice 13:12:22 ;(because the paren didn't count ;) 13:12:41 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-68-82-87-23.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:13:05 I though it was re-evaluating the result of the read operation, and I was getting mad 13:13:19 well, thank you again 13:13:27 this channel is being really helpful 13:13:30 razieliyo: i hope you don't have the code like that on a single line in your file 13:13:42 jdz: hahaha no no 13:13:55 razieliyo: generally you can use lisppaste to show us code you have trouble with 13:13:56 but it's cleaner for pasting in erc 13:14:02 oh, nice 13:14:07 I'll search that 13:14:12 check topic 13:14:28 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 13:14:31 fine, jdz 13:14:41 -!- pnq [~nick@AC8308C1.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:15:02 I'll keep that docs in mind too 13:15:09 from lispworks webpage 13:15:21 razieliyo: that's basically the Common Lisp standard 13:15:22 -!- greaver [~DCA@94.126.185.1] has left #lisp 13:15:42 razieliyo: what's written there is the law for all Common Lisp implementations 13:16:05 I see 13:17:11 so that will be my best friend from now on 13:17:58 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:18:07 well, it might be hard to process at first, but whenever you have doubts about something, that is the place to go to figure it all out 13:18:47 razieliyo: also, using an editor that counts parens for you helps a lot 13:19:15 that webpage has a very fancy index, cool 13:19:19 jdz: I use emacs 13:19:21 mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:19:21 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 13:19:21 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 13:19:22 I think it'll fit 13:19:42 razieliyo: it fits perfectly! 13:19:45 http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Front/X_Symbol.htm this is great 13:19:54 sorry for the multiline pasting 13:20:07 jdz: I was thinking about learning emacs lisp instead of common lisp 13:20:17 razieliyo: check out paredit-mode (http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/ParEdit) 13:20:23 but finally I got to clisp 13:20:32 jdz: I'm on it 13:20:49 razieliyo: you're also using SLIME? 13:21:01 jdz: no, I'm just using emacs for editing files 13:21:06 and then, load them with clisp 13:21:12 with (load "file.lisp") 13:21:26 can I use slime with clisp? 13:21:30 razieliyo: that mode of working will work for some time, but there is a better way 13:21:41 razieliyo: yes, slime works with clisp as far as i know 13:21:47 oh, ok ok 13:21:58 I thought it worked with emacs lisp or something 13:22:04 -!- foocraft [~ewanas@178.152.115.82] has quit [Quit: So long, and thanks for all the fish!] 13:22:13 I'll think about it and setup slime 13:22:24 SLIME is for working with Common Lisp (but some people have ported it for other things, too) 13:22:48 i'm pretty sure LoL has some pointers on how to set up SLIME 13:23:13 razieliyo: which operating system are you using? 13:23:28 well, it just teach you how to use the command line, but I'm parsing everything to a file 13:23:31 jdz: archlinux 13:23:38 and there's a slime package at repositories 13:23:40 slime-cvs 13:24:28 using distribution packages for common lisp is known to cause problems 13:24:35 probably not relevant for you at the moment 13:24:46 ok, anyway I prefer it clean so I'll install it manually 13:24:58 razieliyo: but since you're on Linux, i'd suggest using SBCL as the common lisp implementation 13:25:26 arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 13:25:57 jdz: which is the difference? 13:26:03 (that's my personal opinion because many years ago i had troubles deciphering clisp backtraces and did not succeed) 13:26:16 oh, ok 13:26:23 but slime configuration is the same, isn't it? 13:26:32 almost the same 13:26:38 i think SBCL is the best supported SLIME implementation, with all the cross reference and other features working 13:26:46 yes 13:27:00 you just have to start up SBCL instead of clisp 13:27:31 I'm installing it 13:27:36 from dist-pack 13:28:32 but jdz, is it the same implementation? 13:28:34 sbcl and cl? 13:29:43 SBCL is an implementation of Common Lisp (CL), Clisp is another implementation of CL; also there are some more, like Clozure CL, ECL, GCL and ABCL 13:30:02 but syntax, scopes and so on are the same? 13:30:06 i'm not sure what cl is in your question, though 13:30:14 I mean that 13:30:15 meant 13:30:18 those are all implementations of Common Lisp 13:30:25 ok ok 13:30:31 so, they'll work the same way 13:30:34 and they all implement the standard 13:30:42 nice, my question has been answered 13:30:46 well, as far as the standard is concerned, they work the same (sans bugs) 13:31:03 thanks for the help really 13:31:06 but each implementation has additional stuff (extensions) 13:31:55 lots of stuff you might expect to be standard is actually extensions 13:32:08 replore [~replore@ntkngw256114.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 13:32:14 -!- misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:32:20 TeMPOraL [~user@static-195-114-183-51.devs.futuro.pl] has joined #lisp 13:32:43 mstevens: really? 13:33:10 sacho [~sacho@87-126-43-140.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 13:34:15 iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:2e10:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has joined #lisp 13:34:29 jdz: well I was thinking sockets. And IIRC files are only standardish 13:35:08 mstevens: which other programming language standard has sockets in the standard? 13:35:12 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-78-36-183-118.static.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 13:35:33 C? 13:35:39 I mean, unix C 13:35:40 nop 13:35:51 well, I don't know if it's standard really 13:35:58 jdz: nobody would do a java implementation without the standard libraries, which includes sockets 13:36:35 _mo_ [~mo@112.207.189.144] has joined #lisp 13:37:46 mstevens: yeah, and nobody would do CL implementation without some kind of socket support nowadays, so what exactly is your point? 13:37:55 misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has joined #lisp 13:38:05 jdz: yes, but they might all do sockets differently 13:38:14 in java there's One Standard API 13:39:09 -!- Salamander_ is now known as Salamander 13:39:11 mstevens: really, _one_ standard API? 13:40:09 mstevens: not that i care much, but there are compatibility libraries for CL, too 13:40:15 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 13:41:51 offtopic: I like this song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEOhR3hrSPQ 13:43:37 -!- flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:46:06 timjstewart [~tims@159.182.183.6] has joined #lisp 13:46:33 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 13:46:57 -!- lester- [~lester@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Session timeout)] 13:48:22 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:49:01 -!- timjstewart [~tims@159.182.183.6] has quit [Client Quit] 13:51:56 timjstewart [~tims@159.182.183.6] has joined #lisp 13:56:25 after defining a C struct in cffi-grovel with cstruct, how can you 'use' it? what does it generate? 13:57:12 jdz: sbcl debugging is better than clisp one 13:57:20 it shrieks everything 13:58:28 razieliyo: also, you can jump directly to the source code of a frame with 'v' key (with high enough debug optimization, it will actually jump to the exact form) 13:59:15 jdz: but it doesn't have parens detection from rpl 13:59:18 repl I mean 13:59:27 and if I press up, it doesn't show me the history 13:59:31 felideon [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 13:59:35 I think slime will do the job 13:59:38 razieliyo: what doesn't? 13:59:55 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 13:59:59 razieliyo: in slime repl, M-p is for going backwards in history 14:00:04 ahh 14:00:06 its a wonderful day 14:00:14 jdz: in clisp, when I close a paren, the partner paren is highlighted 14:00:27 in sbcl repl it doesn't 14:00:42 but I still need to install slime 14:02:02 quicklisp is your friend, for setting up slime/swank 14:02:35 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@boccacio.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 14:02:47 razieliyo: yeah, you definitely want to install SLIME first 14:05:41 bot-8723 [3e6d0164@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.109.1.100] has joined #lisp 14:07:49 jdz: how to eval some expression written in *inferior-lisp* buffer? 14:07:50 muhdick [~qle@74.92.196.145] has joined #lisp 14:08:03 razieliyo: you do not use *inferior-lisp* buffer at all 14:08:25 razieliyo: you should have got *silme-repl sbcl* buffer 14:08:34 that's why I'm getting so mad 14:08:46 I have *sldb sbcl/1* 14:08:50 razieliyo: that's good 14:08:58 that's a debugger buffer 14:10:18 but I can't find slime-repl sbcl buffer, but inferior-lisp works now 14:10:25 I'll have to take a walk around slime and get used to it 14:10:54 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:11:22 razieliyo: in your slime setup, add slime-repl to the list of contribs in the slime-setup call 14:11:36 razieliyo: or just put slime-fancy there 14:11:45 i think that's the right name 14:12:08 so you should have (slime-setup '(slime-fancy)) 14:12:51 I had just slime-setup 14:12:51 thanks 14:12:54 I'll try that 14:13:15 I'll reset my emacs 14:13:18 -!- razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:13:50 razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has joined #lisp 14:13:57 jdz: NOW IT WORKS BETTER!! 14:13:59 thanks =) 14:14:16 now I can see a nice REPL 14:14:28 -!- bot-8723 [3e6d0164@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.109.1.100] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:15:15 and CTRL keys for history 14:18:16 lester- [~lester-@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 14:18:27 hi. (defun foo (s) <- if you wanted to upcase string argument before using it, would you do (let ((s ...)) or (setf s ...) ? 14:18:31 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.21.175] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 14:18:55 lester-: it depends 14:19:07 on what? 14:19:13 chld 14:19:23 i don't need the non-upcased version of s if that's what you mean 14:19:30 clhs let 14:19:30 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/s_let_l.htm 14:20:00 lester-: it depends on how many times you will be using the upcased value in the body of function 14:20:31 lester-: also, there is this: (defun foo (string &aux (string (string-upcase string))) ...) 14:20:39 i don't understand why it would depend on that 14:21:08 ah interesting 14:21:47 that will kind of clutter the argument list though if i have many arguments 14:22:04 why would setf vs let depend on the number of times im using the value btw? 14:22:57 jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has joined #lisp 14:23:01 lester-: it doesn't. They do different things. Definition and assignment aren't the same thing. 14:23:07 lester-: well, if it's only once, you just use (string-upcase s) and end of story 14:23:31 i'm using it a couple of times 14:24:52 so which one would you prefer? let or setf 14:24:59 and why 14:25:28 let when in doubt. 14:25:55 (because it's easier to think about and read). 14:25:56 why though? they seem to do the same thing in this context and i save horizontal space 14:26:05 okay 14:26:20 milanj [~milanj_@79-101-76-217.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 14:26:21 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:27:02 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 14:27:32 how are they different though? they seem the same in this context 14:27:36 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-185-197.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 14:28:28 *Guthur* can't really think of a time when let and setf are the same 14:28:43 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 14:29:32 lester-: I know what the scope of the LET is. With SETF, I have to remember that it's assigned for the rest of the function; it just uses more context to reason about the code. 14:29:32 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:29:56 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 14:31:18 -!- Inachos [57d4a2eb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.212.162.235] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:33:26 Guthur when setting function argument to a value that's used for the rest of the duration of the function. but yeah I guess let might be more readable 14:36:17 not sure how that's really the same though, because setf destructively assigns a value where as let just binds a value within the body of the let 14:36:46 Guthur: because then you have to remember it's not the same value as the one bound in LET 14:36:46 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 14:37:03 which requires more context to remember what you're doing 14:37:13 practically it's the same as I'm not using old value of the argument afterwards 14:37:13 and thus is harder to reason about the code 14:37:44 sometimes when I have a lot of conditional preprocessing, I feel that when/setf is clearer. 14:37:59 lester-: but you can give it a new, more descriptive, name. 14:38:14 upcased-string, instead of s. 14:39:11 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.249.45] has joined #lisp 14:41:22 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:42:09 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 14:42:12 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-155-168.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 14:42:36 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:44:39 add^_ [~add^_^@h187n3c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 14:45:00 -!- plorasgo is now known as sharkasgo 14:46:53 homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-155-168.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:51:53 good point. also with setf i can accidentally set special 14:51:59 -!- jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:53:49 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:54:06 cracauer [~Adium@74.125.60.1] has joined #lisp 14:56:56 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 14:59:40 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:00:03 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 15:02:15 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-37-16-233.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: kpreid] 15:03:55 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:10:05 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:11:33 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 15:14:02 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:14:24 pdlogan [~patrick@174-25-37-137.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:14:26 rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 15:16:33 -!- sacho [~sacho@87-126-43-140.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:16:36 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:18:45 sacho [~sacho@95-42-74-185.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 15:18:52 jarmond [~jarmond@makkar.csc.warwick.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 15:18:52 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:21:55 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:21:56 -!- razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has left #lisp 15:22:37 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 15:22:56 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-ahakveqpqrwgnefa] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:26:32 mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:26:32 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:26:32 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:28:24 _KY_ [YKY@unaffiliated/-ky-/x-0649748] has joined #lisp 15:28:39 <_KY_> Can I read a function like it's a list? 15:29:36 _KY_: Depends on what you mean with reading it.. but yeah. 15:29:36 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:29:50 <_KY_> Say I defined a function 15:30:06 <_KY_> I want to access it's statements 15:30:07 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 15:31:37 where's the grammar police!? 15:32:34 _KY_: you cannot access the source forms of a function portably 15:33:04 <_KY_> I see... 15:33:24 _KY_: but you can define a macro that will store the body of a function somewhere, and expand into CL:DEFUN 15:33:47 _KY_: CLHS defines FUNCTION-LAMBDA-EXPRESSION, but it's allowed to return NIL in conforming implementations 15:36:02 jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has joined #lisp 15:36:52 <_KY_> Ah... that's good... 15:38:32 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:40:41 HG` [~HG@p5DC04E33.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:42:03 taiyallica [d8c385bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.195.133.189] has joined #lisp 15:43:01 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 15:43:15 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:43:50 tsuru [~charlie@adsl-74-179-25-40.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 15:47:20 -!- Amadiro_ [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:48:12 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 15:48:43 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:49:10 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has joined #lisp 15:49:57 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.123.236] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:50:46 razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has joined #lisp 15:51:22 my question will be a bit obvious for you 15:52:04 zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.73] has joined #lisp 15:52:06 well, I'm using slime, and I'm wondering if I'm writing some code on a file, could I load or compile it directly from that buffer? 15:52:23 sanjoyd: &rest should do it 15:52:54 razieliyo: yes, you can use C-c C-k to compile&load the file 15:53:06 antifuchs: thanks! 15:53:10 sanjoyd: sorry long way back in the backlog and didnt realize 15:53:14 C-c M-k just compiles it (IIRC, don't use that often) and C-c C-l will load 15:53:23 Kruppe [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 15:53:44 razieliyo: be sure to check out the slime manual, lots of cool things are in there (: 15:54:02 I always find something pretty spectacular that I didn't know about / forgot about (: 15:56:28 -!- cracauer [~Adium@74.125.60.1] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:56:45 -!- jsfb [~jon@unaffiliated/jsfb] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:59:20 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:59:29 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:00:09 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 16:00:30 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-185-197.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:00:53 -!- ehu [~ehuels@109.33.218.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:01:16 -!- milanj [~milanj_@79-101-76-217.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:01:31 Jasko2 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 16:01:35 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@boccacio.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:02:31 -!- TeMPOraL [~user@static-195-114-183-51.devs.futuro.pl] has quit [Quit: kolos] 16:03:02 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:2e10:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:03:51 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:04:36 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 241 seconds] 16:05:59 milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 16:07:01 is SLIME an IDE for CL or Emacs Lisp? 16:07:15 taiyallica: CL 16:07:20 dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:07:59 guess I ought to learn Emacs 16:08:12 it's recommended, yes 16:08:37 taiyallica: it's not the only way to program Lisp. 16:09:08 I ought to learn it anyway, I generally use nano/pico at this point 16:09:15 that is true :) 16:10:28 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nc-184-3-67-31.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:11:10 kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has joined #lisp 16:11:32 felideon: well, to be fair, I hear that allegro and lispworks deploy some pretty swell ways to program in lisp. :) 16:12:10 antifuchs: thanks again 16:12:31 -!- e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-cvrosrituvdnzmtj] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:12:36 you're welcome (: 16:12:45 morphism [~Nevermind@113.190.200.99] has joined #lisp 16:12:55 antifuchs: http://common-lisp.net/project/slime/doc/html/ and dancing, lots of dancing 16:13:47 taiyallica: at first is a pain, but when you get used to it, it becomes holy 16:14:20 sounds like Lisp 16:14:46 haha 16:14:52 it does 16:15:16 but learning emacs is easier than learning lisp 16:15:27 so if you know lisp, you'll eat emacs 16:16:01 just make sure the docs are installed and working 16:16:19 and get any cheatsheet 16:16:27 print it and paste it on your front wall 16:16:34 I've got one and it helps a lot 16:16:57 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.154.152] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:18:16 enthymeme [~kraken@96.31.242.194] has joined #lisp 16:18:46 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@76.226.112.131] has joined #lisp 16:19:25 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-120-123.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:19:25 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 16:21:08 -!- taiyallica [d8c385bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.195.133.189] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:23:26 Daev [~KAPITAL@nc-184-3-67-31.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 16:23:58 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 16:24:32 -!- pdo [~pdo@217.33.254.141] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:26:00 -!- martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:26:56 -!- misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:28:21 ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.42] has joined #lisp 16:29:44 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:29:53 add^_^ [~add^_^@h131n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 16:30:13 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl4-155-124.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 16:30:50 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h187n3c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:30:50 -!- add^_^ is now known as add^_ 16:31:19 -!- ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 16:31:26 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has quit [Quit: Offline] 16:32:03 pnq [~nick@AC83231C.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 16:32:13 -!- lanthan [~ze@p50992b91.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 16:34:09 -!- _KY_ [YKY@unaffiliated/-ky-/x-0649748] has left #lisp 16:36:43 kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has joined #lisp 16:37:42 catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-nydcrxptctkgqxnr] has joined #lisp 16:38:01 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 16:38:08 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has quit [Client Quit] 16:38:15 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h131n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:40:16 -!- Guthur [c0c1f50f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.193.245.15] has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:40:24 kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has joined #lisp 16:40:27 Guthur [~Guthur@cpc11-belf9-2-0-cust855.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 16:40:38 -!- jarmond [~jarmond@makkar.csc.warwick.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:41:41 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@70-36-146-70.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 16:41:49 martinhex [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:44:27 add^_ [~add^_^@h131n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 16:45:01 -!- Yuuhi` [benni@p5483B092.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:45:11 -!- ignas [~ignas@78-60-36-123.static.zebra.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:45:24 cracauer [~Adium@nat/google/x-ehecjggbymgjjksa] has joined #lisp 16:57:03 -!- katesmith_ is now known as katesmith 16:57:29 -!- catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-nydcrxptctkgqxnr] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:58:07 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.73] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:05:30 bsod1 [~sinan@31.141.20.2] has joined #lisp 17:05:44 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0073.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 17:05:47 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-7.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 17:05:48 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:201:4aff:fef3:f0d4] has joined #lisp 17:07:35 sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:07:44 tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 17:07:58 -!- enthymeme [~kraken@96.31.242.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:10:02 MoALTz_ [~no@92.18.2.182] has joined #lisp 17:11:17 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0073.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:11:27 -!- sacho [~sacho@95-42-74-185.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:12:45 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-9-77-82.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:14:37 markskil1eck [~mark@host81-152-165-23.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:16:24 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:16:59 barryfm [~barryfm@fl-67-232-203-96.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 17:18:37 add^_^ [~add^_^@h162n5c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 17:20:23 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h131n1c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:20:23 -!- add^_^ is now known as add^_ 17:22:14 -!- Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:23:25 -!- markskil1eck [~mark@host81-152-165-23.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:24:30 -!- PuffTheMagic [~PuffTheMa@unaffiliated/puffthemagic] has left #lisp 17:24:31 sacho [~sacho@95-42-74-185.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 17:25:42 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 17:26:41 add^_^ [~add^_^@h20n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 17:28:37 why, by everything that's good and proper, doesn't ASDF apply :SERIAL T specified at DEFSYSTEM model to subcomponents too? 17:28:41 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h162n5c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:28:42 -!- add^_^ is now known as add^_ 17:29:45 it'd be hard to come up with a more counterintuitive behaviour for something with such an immense GOTCHA! potential 17:30:35 *workthrick* just spent about an hour building and rebuilding his system before realising what was going on 17:30:45 workthrick: ouch 17:30:53 workthrick: yeah, that's really counter-intuitive 17:30:58 bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-206-245.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:31:01 workthrick: I can understand that the misunderstand could happen, but I also understand how the current behaviour makes a lot of sense, and can even be useful 17:31:03 (now that you mention it, I remember being bitten by this, too) 17:31:42 pkhuong: I find it very hard to come up with a situation where you'd want that to be the default 17:32:04 yes, you might want _some_ subcomponents to be non-serial, and then you can always override with :SERIAL NIL 17:32:27 but having to re-specify it for each and every component? That's pure madness 17:32:43 enthymeme [~kraken@96.31.242.194] has joined #lisp 17:33:19 workthrick: I think :serial t was intended for people who don't use modules 17:33:56 Yuuhi [benni@p5483B092.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:34:50 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.249.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:35:32 but I think if you use your own system class, you might be able to override the module behavior somehow. 17:35:45 antifuchs: but there's no other option to descend into subdirs that isn't completely obnoxious 17:36:04 specifying pathnames. 17:36:13 it's the only way that really works 17:36:24 but hey, I'm agreeing with you: asdf is highly annoying (: 17:37:25 -!- naryl [~weechat@213.170.70.141] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:37:47 while it allows things like quicklisp to do their thing, it makes things that should be easy pretty hard. 17:38:31 catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-tadnxxapltlodgkt] has joined #lisp 17:39:07 yes, and even thinking about customising it is a fast-track to being housed in places with soft-padded walls and no doorknobs 17:39:44 ok, it's not /that/ bad 17:41:50 antifuchs: I only have any experience with ASDF before 2, but I recall it as one of the most inaccessible pieces of software I've ever come into contact with 17:42:30 I've had less success modifying ASDF than modifying CL-PEREC's MOP machinery, and that speaks volumes 17:43:03 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 17:43:14 asdf1 is highly undocumented and has buggy parts 17:43:16 and by "modifying", I really only mean writing a wildcard component 17:43:33 but I didn't find it very hard to finish projects based on it. 17:43:52 (I wrote poiu and asdf-dependency-grovel (-:) 17:43:54 (:module "foo" :serial t :components ...) 17:44:34 nikodemus: I know that _now_, but it won't get me all the hours I've lost having to rebuild after mysterious failures, and the hour I spent debugging it 17:44:35 frustrating, sure. but it's not inaccessible. 17:44:56 i've been pretty happy using :serial in modules, and explict deps between modules in one project 17:45:07 antifuchs: dunno, I wasn't even able to find any way to use the supposedly-standard wildcard module code 17:45:31 how can I get address of the object? 17:45:36 nikodemus: that's pefectly fine. But it's NOT what you'd expect when you say DEFSYSTEM :SERIAL T 17:45:39 what's the wildcard module code? 17:45:40 kennyd: mu 17:45:49 workthrick: no disagreement there 17:46:07 kennyd: what are you doing and why do you think you need some object's address? 17:46:17 kennyd: unportably 17:46:47 i don't *need* it, just thought I'd print it out in print-object like lisp does it by default 17:47:07 unless you're doing something extremely specific that either tries to exploit highly voodoo locality effects, or interacts with non-Lisp world, your question is nonsensical and suggests deep confusion 17:47:18 kennyd: CLHS PRINT-UNREADABLE-OBJECT 17:47:42 clhs array 17:47:42 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/t_array.htm 17:47:43 kennyd: (print-unreadable-object (obj stream :identity t) ...) 17:47:46 ah, so it works 17:47:59 *workthrick* was sure it was broken and not coming back 17:48:06 thanks 17:48:27 (and you probably want :type t too) 17:48:41 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-223-81-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:49:50 works nicely 17:50:01 -!- MoALTz_ is now known as MoALTz 17:54:21 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181058025.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:54:24 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h20n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has left #lisp 17:54:35 markskil1eck [~mark@host81-152-185-252.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:55:32 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:56:54 -!- pnq [~nick@AC83231C.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:58:22 jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.56] has joined #lisp 17:59:24 drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 17:59:24 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:59:26 -!- npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:59:39 npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has joined #lisp 17:59:59 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:03:39 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-146-20.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:03:51 mutewit [~mutew@c-68-48-11-23.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:06:01 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:06:14 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:08:42 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:09:26 oconnore annotated #122760 "untitled" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122760#1 18:11:02 Hi, can someone look at my paste? I am using closer-mop and slot-value and (setf slot-value) are still not using the correct slot-value-using-class methods. Is this a reasonable thing to add to my program? 18:11:07 sabalaba [~sabalaba@adsl-75-23-56-157.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:11:15 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:11:21 or is there some reason that sbcl, clozure, and closer-mop all choose not to do this? 18:11:25 oconnore: absolutely not. 18:11:34 how are you specialising s-v-u-c? 18:12:25 with an :after that stores to a database 18:12:34 why is that not reasonable? 18:13:03 the redefinition? There's no way for you to tell how many internal assumptions you're breaking. 18:13:15 Right, you're adding an :after method. How are you specialising it? 18:13:43 You could paste a small test case that doesn't behave as you expect. 18:14:05 I am specializing on class 18:14:18 ((class my-metaclass) object slot) 18:15:00 carlocci [~nes@93.37.198.120] has joined #lisp 18:15:16 I still can't replicate your case. 18:15:38 foocraft [~ewanas@178.152.115.82] has joined #lisp 18:16:09 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-150-32.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 18:17:35 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0016.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 18:18:02 naryl [~weechat@213.170.70.141] has joined #lisp 18:18:06 -!- morphism [~Nevermind@113.190.200.99] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:19:20 pkhuong: so is there any way to specialize on slot-value? or can you only do it for readers and writers? 18:20:15 yes you can. But I can't help you with the information you gave me. Maybe someone better versed in the MOP or in telepathy can. 18:20:26 -!- Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:20:57 is there a way to force :initarg during (make-instance ..) ? 18:22:29 pkhuong: I'm not sure what other information to give you. I want some code to be triggered after a slot access by slot-value. CLOS does this with the :after qualifier. 18:22:36 slot-value is not a CLOS method 18:22:50 you could paste code. 18:23:38 ok, hold on 18:23:42 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@adsl-75-23-56-157.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:25:03 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:25:33 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:28:34 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:28:48 pnq [~nick@ACA40B3D.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:50 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0016.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:29:15 timor [~timor@port-92-195-93-37.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 18:29:18 -!- n2kra [~n2kra_ham@ool-45733acd.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:29:39 -!- milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 18:30:47 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:30:48 pkhuong: Sorry, I must have been going crazy when I wrote that last night. 18:30:52 *oconnore* is enlightened 18:31:24 so, I wonder. what's the ipv6 supportedness status of lisp socket libs these days? 18:31:24 milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 18:31:25 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:31:43 Vivitron [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:36:33 emehrkay [~emehrkay@pool-74-107-100-63.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:37:19 I just got The Little Schemer because EVERYONE says it is a must read. Which version of lisp should I use to go along with the examples? I'm using OS X 18:38:03 ... Scheme ? 18:38:31 emehrkay: scheme is sufficiently different from common lisp that it has its own channel (: 18:38:38 emehrkay: try #scheme for suggestions 18:38:51 emehrkay: Join #scheme and download Racket in all likelihood. :P 18:38:56 Gmind [~nevermind@113.190.200.99] has joined #lisp 18:39:01 ahhh, I'm new to this, obviously. Thanks 18:40:02 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:40:04 -!- emehrkay [~emehrkay@pool-74-107-100-63.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 18:41:00 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:42:46 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:43:05 Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 18:52:00 ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has joined #lisp 18:52:45 -!- cbp [~cesarbol9@189.247.121.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:53:04 -!- milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 18:53:31 milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 18:56:37 -!- daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:56:41 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:57:33 Guys! Why didn't you advised emehrkay to use pseudo, a r4rs scheme implementation written in CL and running on any CL implementation? We're losing newbies! 18:59:48 -!- HG` [~HG@p5DC04E33.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:59:49 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:00:32 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:23 pjb: well he's still in #scheme . . . 19:03:37 pjb: Seems all the mirrors I can find are dead though. :P 19:05:20 Nevermind... just google "pseudoscheme" 19:05:43 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0079.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 19:06:45 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl14-81-10.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 19:09:01 tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has joined #lisp 19:09:04 ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.46] has joined #lisp 19:10:44 pjb, is that emergency ? 19:11:48 bugQ, oh, if he is in #Scheme, then we should convince him to our #lisp:P 19:12:11 perhaps some simple macro can attract him 19:12:21 long shot in here i guess, but anyone know of anything like paredit for eclipse. C-M-f, C-M-b, C-M-t would be the killers. 19:12:25 -!- milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 19:12:50 you use eclipse for lisp ? 19:12:57 sorry I'm dialect-agnostic 19:13:00 -!- tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:13:01 and don't use eclipse either 19:14:01 bugQ: that was to wivlaro, I guess 19:14:34 ehu, exactly 19:14:56 just explaining that I'm no help to either 19:16:11 oh.. why I hate the package system , don't really want to pack anything in a package before finishing 19:19:50 -!- Gmind [~nevermind@113.190.200.99] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:21:54 anvandare [~anvandare@78-21-49-236.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 19:22:49 salutations 19:22:50 tcr2 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has joined #lisp 19:23:50 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:23:50 -!- tcr2 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:24:21 addresses 19:24:23 sabalaba [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:24:28 tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has joined #lisp 19:29:09 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@89.108.255.33] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:29:19 Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has joined #lisp 19:30:30 -!- ebw [~ewolf@krlh-5f727039.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:31:48 -!- kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.235.8.175] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:34:25 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:40:29 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA40B3D.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:41:31 ch077179 [~urs@xdsl-188-155-1-133.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 19:41:35 daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 19:41:52 -!- Patzy [~something@bro29-1-82-245-180-56.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:41:58 -!- daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Client Quit] 19:43:17 daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 19:43:49 -!- daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Client Quit] 19:44:31 daimrod [~daimrod@ANantes-556-1-326-23.w90-59.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 19:45:13 ebw [~ewolf@krlh-4d021e9f.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:46:56 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-179-10.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:47:34 parenscript question: I use the :parenscript readtable (which has :invert-ed case) at the beginning of my source file via in-readtable. Function names and variables come out as expected (eg. someSYMBOL). However, when using (logior tESt Test) it produces "test | test". Any idea what could be wrong? 19:48:23 lanthan [~ze@p54B7C0C5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:49:29 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-155-168.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:52:17 -!- lester- [~lester-@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Session timeout)] 19:53:19 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-215-113.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 19:53:54 disumu [~disumu@p4FFC94F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:55:07 Patzy [~something@bro29-1-82-245-180-56.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 19:58:50 gozoner [~ebg@ebg-10004083621.jpl.nasa.gov] has joined #lisp 19:59:46 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:00:08 -!- foocraft [~ewanas@178.152.115.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:00:41 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 20:02:19 ah nevermind something else borked, it seems 20:02:35 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@70-36-146-70.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:11:36 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@70-36-146-70.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 20:13:41 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0079.fh-trier.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:13:46 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:201:4aff:fef3:f0d4] has quit [Quit: Some days you're the pigeon, some days the statue...] 20:13:55 foocraft [~ewanas@78.100.182.131] has joined #lisp 20:14:15 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw256114.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:14:43 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:15:13 Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 20:15:41 -!- razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:20:20 pnq [~nick@AC8337B2.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 20:21:18 -!- barryfm [~barryfm@fl-67-232-203-96.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has left #lisp 20:21:35 ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has joined #lisp 20:21:46 -!- sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:22:39 taiyallica [d8c385bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.195.133.189] has joined #lisp 20:23:40 MoALTz_ [~no@host-92-8-254-109.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 20:24:41 -!- MoALTz [~no@92.18.2.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:25:59 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-68-82-87-23.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:27:32 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 20:28:57 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:29:47 -!- MoALTz_ is now known as MoALTz 20:31:27 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0043.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 20:32:23 milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 20:35:31 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-206-245.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:36:22 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d002146.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:36:29 iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:2e10:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has joined #lisp 20:40:21 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:41:08 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-212-194.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:42:13 -!- taiyallica [d8c385bd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.216.195.133.189] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:42:53 -!- disumu [~disumu@p4FFC94F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ...] 20:46:11 what would be CLOS equivalent of a static member function in C++? 20:46:56 something like this: (generic-function 'class-name args) 20:47:09 how do I define generic-function ? 20:47:31 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:2e10:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:48:19 kennyd: with defun. 20:48:51 or if you really need to dispatch on the first argument, you can also use defgeneric. 20:49:23 (defgeneric thing (class arg) (:method ((class (eql 'my-class)) arg) (do-something arg))) 20:50:21 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-78-36-183-118.static.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:50:57 kennyd: don't try to apply "static member" from C++ (those are actually simple function packaged inside a struct), just make a normal function or rethink your protocol 20:52:11 if i make it a normal function it would have to be modified to add support for other classes. not what I wanted 20:55:08 kennyd: hence my second suggestion! 20:56:11 kennyd: but you may also consider: (defun my-class-thing () ...) (defun other-class-thing () ...) etc. Since it's STATIC, there's no point to report the dispatch at run-time! 20:59:11 kennyd: that's why I suggest you drop the concept of "static" member function 21:00:21 its direct, literal equivalent would be a field containing a function reference, placed in a class metaobject :) 21:01:01 ah, sorry, not that. that would be a virtual one 21:01:33 static member funtion in C++ is "class_name_function_name_signature(...);" 21:01:42 (mangled apropriately) 21:02:19 And what difference is there with my-class-thing and other-class-thing? 21:02:37 the manging isn't automatic? 21:02:40 mangling* 21:04:00 pjb: less fumbling with unknown magic, requires actual knowledge of the magic you call upon? (using SICP and Sorcerer's Apprentice ;-)) 21:06:04 *p_l|backup* remember more about internals of C++'s object model than it's healthy to know 21:07:20 -!- bsod1 [~sinan@31.141.20.2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:07:21 -!- xale [~xale@2001:4b98:dc0:51:216:3eff:fef2:58dd] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:07:28 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 21:08:33 -!- kanru [~kanru@kanru-1-pt.tunnel.tserv15.lax1.ipv6.he.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:12:22 xale [~xale@2001:4b98:dc0:51:216:3eff:fef2:58dd] has joined #lisp 21:12:28 tcr1 [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has joined #lisp 21:12:53 kanru [~kanru@kanru-1-pt.tunnel.tserv15.lax1.ipv6.he.net] has joined #lisp 21:14:27 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 21:14:53 -!- foocraft [~ewanas@78.100.182.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:15:16 foocraft [~ewanas@78.101.180.142] has joined #lisp 21:15:27 Hunden [~Hunden@e180101224.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 21:17:45 in sbcl 1.0.48, I got style warnings every time I re-evaluate a function 21:17:55 that's incredibly annoying and useless when developping in slime 21:18:08 galdor: yes, sbcl is increadibly pedant. 21:18:11 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0043.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:18:15 is there something I can do to disable this exact warning (not others) ? 21:18:31 galdor: you could try to use muffle-warnings 21:18:40 I'm sure there's a reason behind it, but interactive developement is central in lisp 21:18:54 sure, but muffle-warnings is gonna muffle all warnings, not just this one right ? 21:19:00 lot of warnings are useful 21:19:07 Something like: (declaim (sb-ext:muffle-conditions (or style-warning SB-EXT:COMPILER-NOTE)) (optimize (speed 0) (space 0) (debug 3) (safety 3))) 21:19:23 If that style warning has it's own class, you can muffle only it. 21:19:30 mhh ok 21:19:36 and if it doesn't, I'm screwed 21:19:42 No, just use clisp. 21:19:48 I'd love knowing the logic behing this precise warning 21:19:54 I use sbcl only to compile a fast executable, never for development. 21:20:07 galdor: to catch typoes. 21:20:09 for development I could try ccl, it's very fast at compilation 21:20:26 but yeah, that's not a bad idea 21:20:33 and using several implementations is a good way to catch mistakes 21:20:40 thank you for the idea 21:24:26 optimizing for compilation-speed might help too, with SBCL HEAD and largish functions 21:25:56 also, newer SBCLs don't have the redefinition misfeature 21:26:43 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:26:48 oh nice 21:27:00 I need to update to 1.0.49 then 21:28:04 It's older than 1.0.48, though. IIRC, you should only see them when the source location isn't the same, and never at the REPL. 21:28:50 Mm. Nope, doesn't work for the REPL. 21:29:19 I'm seeing a single warning line at the repl for redefinition in 1.0.48, which doesn't bother me 21:29:29 yep, it's a simple warning line 21:29:39 but it's useless for interactive developpement 21:33:41 cools [~user@CPE0026f32ba2b0-CM0026f32ba2ad.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 21:34:00 Ah, so it looks like it needs both a > 1.0.48 SBCL and a recent slime. 21:34:47 pnq1 [~nick@AC810CD8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 21:34:54 I really need to update my slime version 21:34:59 at least to get the indentation updates 21:35:19 -!- pnq [~nick@AC8337B2.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:35:20 hi, is there a way to get the version of system loaded with asdf? 21:36:07 -!- pnq1 is now known as pnq 21:41:20 super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 21:41:27 amaron [~amaron@greenzone.copyleft.no] has joined #lisp 21:42:22 -!- ace4016 [ace4016@adsl-98-64-82-40.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 21:42:23 Atomsk [ace4016@adsl-98-64-82-40.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 21:42:30 acieroid` [~acieroid@wtf.awesom.eu] has joined #lisp 21:42:37 Kruppe` [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 21:42:39 Vivitron` [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:43:00 tempire_ [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:43:31 redline6561_ [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 21:43:33 felideon` [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 21:45:20 johanbev_ [~johanbev@138.80-203-27.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 21:45:24 -!- acieroid [~acieroid@wtf.awesom.eu] has quit [Disconnected by services] 21:45:28 -!- acieroid` is now known as acieroid 21:45:30 yroeht_ [yroeht@server5.tonbnc.fr] has joined #lisp 21:45:43 theBlack1ragon [~dragon@83.101.80.121] has joined #lisp 21:45:53 akkartik_ [~akkartik@akkartik.name] has joined #lisp 21:46:07 timjstewart1 [~tims@159.182.183.6] has joined #lisp 21:46:36 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:48:52 setmeaway2 [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has joined #lisp 21:49:26 locci [~nes@93.37.198.120] has joined #lisp 21:50:22 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-215-113.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-150-32.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- carlocci [~nes@93.37.198.120] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-tadnxxapltlodgkt] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- Guthur [~Guthur@cpc11-belf9-2-0-cust855.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.112.131] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:22 -!- Kruppe [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- felideon [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- timjstewart [~tims@159.182.183.6] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- amaron_ [~amaron@greenzone.copyleft.no] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- vert2 [vert2@newshell1.bshellz.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:23 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- yroeht [yroeht@server5.tonbnc.fr] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- eli [~eli@winooski.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- deepfire [~deepfire@80.92.100.69] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:24 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@83.101.80.121] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- wtetzner [~wtetzner@c-174-62-239-154.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- johanbev [~johanbev@138.80-203-27.nextgentel.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- akkartik [~akkartik@akkartik.name] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:25 -!- vsync [~vsync@24.173.173.82] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:32 -!- theBlack1ragon is now known as theBlackDragon 21:50:39 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-112-131.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:51:09 sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:51:12 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 21:51:25 rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 21:51:28 -!- milanj [~milanj_@79-101-149-130.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:52:57 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 21:54:45 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:54:54 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:55:01 -!- rotty [~rotty@nncmain.nicenamecrew.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:05 peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 21:57:13 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-150-32.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 21:57:18 Guthur [~Guthur@cpc11-belf9-2-0-cust855.2-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 21:57:25 foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 21:57:36 vsync [~vsync@24.173.173.82] has joined #lisp 21:57:44 wtetzner [~wtetzner@c-174-62-239-154.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:58:07 rotty [~rotty@nncmain.nicenamecrew.com] has joined #lisp 21:58:56 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-119-83.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:58:57 catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-pmiqxbskvmwkkhvv] has joined #lisp 22:00:00 -!- Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 22:00:14 Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has joined #lisp 22:00:53 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-112-131.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:00:55 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 22:02:35 -!- jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.56] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:03:30 -!- sacho [~sacho@95-42-74-185.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:06:22 -!- catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-pmiqxbskvmwkkhvv] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:06:29 catphive [~brenmill@nat/cisco/x-dbpilklhsxmcwasf] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 kpreid [~kpreid@216.239.45.19] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 vert2 [vert2@newshell1.bshellz.net] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 22:07:33 jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has joined #lisp 22:07:37 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 22:08:35 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-214-227-8.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:08:59 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-124-242.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 22:09:03 joshmc [~josh@c-98-248-16-132.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:09:21 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 22:10:18 -!- _mo_ [~mo@112.207.189.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:11:43 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-119-83.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:11:43 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 22:15:01 -!- Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:21:02 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 22:21:58 elderK [~dgw@pdpc/supporter/active/elderk] has joined #lisp 22:23:05 sonnym [~evissecer@rrcs-184-74-137-167.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:23:08 slyrus [~chatzilla@dsl081-060-042.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 22:23:39 Anyone here from Christchurch, NZ? 22:23:42 mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:23:42 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:23:42 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 22:26:34 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:27:38 _mo_ [~mo@112.207.189.144] has joined #lisp 22:30:47 bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-206-245.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:35:53 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:36:18 eli [~eli@winooski.ccs.neu.edu] has joined #lisp 22:36:33 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:38:14 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:38:18 -!- Zephyrus [~emanuele@unaffiliated/zephyrus] has quit [Quit: ""] 22:39:01 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-53.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 22:39:54 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.38.75] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:40:28 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:41:02 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 22:41:11 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-124-242.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:41:11 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 22:42:14 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 22:43:13 elderK: Try #lisp-nz 22:43:18 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@dsl081-060-042.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:44:02 thanks antoszka 22:44:32 elderK: np 22:47:00 -!- ymas [~ymas@unaffiliated/ymas] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:49:42 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 22:51:10 Good morning everyone! 22:52:17 Early morning, certainly. 22:52:35 Haven't even gone to bed yet :) 22:54:41 MoALTz_ [~no@92.18.28.120] has joined #lisp 22:57:36 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-8-254-109.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:59:13 antoszka: It is 6am here. Normal time for me to be up. I am sure elderK has been up for a while if he is in NZ. 22:59:39 Unless he likes to sleep in :) 23:01:38 ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has joined #lisp 23:02:38 Just to make sure I'm not crazy, (apply #'append (loop .. collect ..)) is equivalent to (loop .. append ..), right? 23:02:53 Qworkescence: no. 23:03:10 -!- ch077179 [~urs@xdsl-188-155-1-133.adslplus.ch] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 23:03:13 The former will signal an error when there are more than call-argument-limit elements, while the later won't. 23:03:13 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:03:43 pjb, err, yes. Equivalent if call-argument-limit is infinity? 23:03:50 yes. 23:04:01 pjb, (in any case that is a good point) 23:04:05 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 23:05:27 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-53.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:05:28 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-53.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:05:52 -!- Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:07:58 Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 23:11:34 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:12:30 -!- Kruppe` [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:12:56 mindCrime [~chatzilla@nat/redhat/x-ofezhdkjygtmdkrd] has joined #lisp 23:13:41 -!- realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-53.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:14:43 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-214-227-8.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:15:24 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-74-67-199-254.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:15:51 -!- pdlogan [~patrick@174-25-37-137.ptld.qwest.net] has left #lisp 23:16:18 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:16:24 -!- jweiss_ [~user@cpe-069-134-063-238.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:16:47 elderK: depends on how strictly you define "from" - I grew up there, and visited recently, if that counts. 23:17:20 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 23:17:52 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-214-227-8.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:19:05 -!- felideon` [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:19:06 :D hey jfleming! 23:19:13 :) thanks for suggesting vivace! 23:19:25 My pleasure :) 23:19:41 *beach* thinks the question "where are you from" is complicated. 23:19:58 beach: you're not kidding. 23:20:34 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-53.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:21:42 jfleming: I come from the kitchen where I made myself a pot of tea. 23:22:20 pjb: excellent answer! 23:22:38 I'm from the IT department; I'm here to help. 23:23:07 davazp` [~user@63.Red-88-12-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 23:23:18 :-) 23:27:33 Quadrescence pasted "Turning a positive integer into bytes" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122776 23:27:43 Anyone want to take a stab at optimizing that? 23:28:10 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ebg-10004083621.jpl.nasa.gov] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:28:11 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:28:38 Qworkescence: ash -8/logand. 23:29:03 phryk: No, ldb is faster on bignums. 23:29:17 s/phryk/pkhuong/ 23:29:20 pjb, How about if they'll be fixnums? 23:29:20 true. 23:29:39 Qworkescence: if they're fixnums, then you can generate the fixed number of ldb at compilation time. 23:29:40 well... actually, it depends on the implementation. 23:36:39 -!- fmu [UNKNOWN@unaffiliated/fmu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:36:45 Mococa [~Mococa@187.58.183.42] has joined #lisp 23:38:16 fmu [UNKNOWN@unaffiliated/fmu] has joined #lisp 23:38:16 gz [~gz@209-6-49-85.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 23:39:51 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has left #lisp 23:41:02 replore [~replore@ntkngw256114.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 23:42:41 -!- replore [~replore@ntkngw256114.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 23:42:55 -!- kruhft [~burton@S0106002401f331bd.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:45:02 jfleming: "I'm with Anonymous, I'm here to help" is a phrase I hold dear for the next time I visit Edinburgh... though the hype dropped off :/ 23:45:08 fourier [~user@h-1-88.A176.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 23:46:55 p_l|backup: I just fondly remember the days when the IT version of that phrase struck almost as much terror into corporate hearts as the "from the Government" one did. 23:48:09 jfleming: depending on the job and exact dept you hail from, it might have a delayed but much more horrifying effect :3 23:48:10 MoALTz__ [~no@host-92-8-148-44.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 23:49:10 p_l|backup: I used to work in a *very* tall and shiny building :) 23:49:22 deepfire [~deepfire@80.92.100.69] has joined #lisp 23:49:42 "Office network support" showing up is an annoyance. if the guys that make sure your business actually delivers show up, now that is baaad :D 23:50:30 jfleming: mine wasn't very tall, but we didn't need more and it had less annoyances to loading big racks :) 23:51:57 -!- MoALTz_ [~no@92.18.28.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:52:38 I never joined the auditing team; regarded them as a mindless nuisance. Nowadays, I think I'd want to be part of the team that drives them. How experience changes a person... 23:53:13 jfleming: what they were auditing (and how?)? 23:54:04 quite a lot of audits go on like "ask question, check or don't check the box on audit form" (told me by a guy who just ran an audit, non-IT though) 23:55:34 Our internal practices and standards. The financial sector is prone to paralysing quantities of regulation, and we had regular internal audits to keep us in shape for the external ones. They were mostly just asking questions and requesting evidence; I didn't object to _how_ they were doing it, but _what_ they were required to check. 23:56:28 Lots of corporate CYA - they were more interested in having an official support contract and "somebody to scream at" (yes, that's a quote) than in having infrastructure that didn't break in the first place. 23:56:47 ah, true. Pity that sometimes fails to work 23:57:41 -!- locci [~nes@93.37.198.120] has quit [Quit: eventually IE will rot and die] 23:59:12 phadthai_ [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has joined #lisp 23:59:14 -!- phadthai [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]