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dircproxy 1.2.0] 01:56:08 -!- dfkjjkfd [~paulh@210-11-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 01:57:48 myu2 [~myu2@v077103.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #lisp 01:58:07 M-sprite [~M-sprite@122.236.246.66] has joined #lisp 02:02:49 -!- opoku [~opoku@static-96-235-41-86.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: opoku] 02:05:14 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-177-100.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:07:03 -!- nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-148-200.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:09:47 -!- kaelol [~b@c-f0cbe253.97-16-64736c12.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:11:53 troussan [~user@c-24-245-15-191.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:13:05 -!- Axioplase_ is now known as Axioplase 02:16:33 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@adsl-75-42-224-167.dsl.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:21:50 Saturnation [~dsouth@72.95.91.35] has joined #lisp 02:23:40 troussan` [~user@c-24-245-15-191.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:25:14 -!- troussan [~user@c-24-245-15-191.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:25:22 Using quicklisp slime-helper and I'm getting an error on first use compilation. Should it be compiling swank-cmucl.lisp if I'm using sbcl? 02:25:49 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@217-162-131-235.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:26:04 no 02:26:23 OK, so that explains the error :) 02:26:48 paste.lisp.org don't seem to be working so well at the moment... 02:26:53 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 02:28:00 um, help? 02:28:49 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:29:19 I guess this time of the week is pretty dead here... 02:30:46 Or maybe I just *think* I'm running sbcl ... "CMU Common Lisp CVS release-19a 19a-release-20040728 + minimal debian patches ..." :) 02:31:07 Saturnation: looks like cmu to me (: 02:31:14 CMUCL is SLIME's preferred cl, I guess 02:31:36 Saturnation: slime runs inferior-lisp-program by default 02:31:46 and that's set to "lisp", which cmu helpfully grabs (: 02:32:26 ack, and search synaptic for CMUCL doesn't even bring up an implementation... weird 02:32:39 what does "which lisp" say? 02:33:04 also, you can use dpkg -S on that path, and it should give you the package that contains the path (after some deliberation) 02:33:29 that was my next step, just checking synaptic for lisp and found nothing for CMUCL 02:34:01 would you believe /usr/bin/lisp :) 02:34:12 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 02:34:48 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:35:35 *rtoym* names his cmucl binary cmulisp. 02:35:43 my worry is that a) I can't locate cmucl in synaptic and b) it IS installed on this system (which is old, 2-3 years maybe more) 02:35:58 *Saturnation* thinks about just nuking /usr/bin/lisp 02:36:08 or being nice and mv'ing it to lisp.not 02:36:13 Saturnation: dpkg -S /usr/bin/lisp doens't give you anythign? 02:36:27 not if I don't try it, thanks for reminding me 02:36:35 anyway, (setq inferior-lisp-program "sbcl") in your .emacs will make it use sbcl 02:36:38 even with cmucl installed (: 02:36:42 not found 02:37:05 best to probably "fix" the /usr/bin/lisp 02:37:24 don't (: 02:37:29 antifuch's suggestion is much better. 02:37:43 really, the most useful way is to set inferior-lisp-program. 02:37:51 OK, convinced 02:38:02 no need to nuke your cmucl install, and everyone will know what you're doing (because they do the same) (: 02:39:38 yeah, sbcl now, thanks 02:39:47 rtoym's just trying to save cmucl ;) 02:39:52 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@adsl-75-42-224-167.dsl.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:39:59 SsvRrwQ [~user@S0106001c1122940c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 02:40:15 Ok, ok, You guys win. 02:40:35 ack, now linedit isn't happy :( 02:41:34 -!- Saturnation [~dsouth@72.95.91.35] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 02:42:20 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has left #lisp 02:48:11 -!- cheez [~Adium@206-248-177-146.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:48:15 -!- PuffTheMagic [~PuffTheMa@unaffiliated/puffthemagic] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:49:35 mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has joined #lisp 02:49:59 icbh [~icbh@ntszok033003.szok.nt.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 02:53:29 -!- huangho [~vitor@201-66-139-157.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:58:23 huangho [~vitor@201-35-139-63.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #lisp 03:06:12 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@a91-153-127-82.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:07:09 -!- troussan` [~user@c-24-245-15-191.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:07:27 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-137-218.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 03:07:33 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: night] 03:15:50 -!- timack [~tim@hlfx57-2b-8.ns.sympatico.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:16:19 rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 03:16:28 fe[nl]ix: Around? 03:20:12 minion: What's up? 03:20:12 not much 03:20:49 cheez [~Adium@206-248-177-146.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 03:21:03 minion: memo for fe[nl]ix: I've uploaded a git repo for series to sourceforge. If you get a chance, can you tell me if it's working for you? Seems to work for me. 03:21:03 Remembered. I'll tell fe[nl]ix when he/she/it next speaks. 03:32:51 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:44:48 -!- Guest89536 [~Adium@he190123.dsl.fsr.net] has left #lisp 03:49:31 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@c-71-227-118-15.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:50:18 sabalaba [~sabalaba@c-71-227-118-15.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:55:54 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 03:59:27 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 04:05:25 Hmm. The series git repo doesn't have all the branches and labels from CVS. But my local version (that I created from cvs) does have all of that. I need to learn more about git. 04:06:36 -!- BrianRice [~water@c-98-246-165-205.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: BrianRice] 04:10:51 F [~f@unaffiliated/f] has joined #lisp 04:11:17 -!- F [~f@unaffiliated/f] has left #lisp 04:14:51 BrianRice [~water@c-98-246-165-205.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:15:29 -!- BrianRice [~water@c-98-246-165-205.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 04:31:51 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-72-75-95-153.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:35:14 -!- mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:46:58 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-130-211.lns21.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:47:35 derrida [~derrida@unaffiliated/deleuze] has joined #lisp 04:48:35 rtoym: git push --tags will push the tags 04:48:47 also, git push origin will push each branch over 04:49:43 antifuchs: why are you up 04:49:58 HET2: because it's 8:49 in the evening where I am (: 04:50:11 antifuchs: when did you manage to move overseas! 04:50:19 hah, october last year (: 04:50:24 where to 04:50:31 got a gig at franz, living in the east bay now (: 04:50:37 franz? 04:51:02 east bay of what 04:52:00 the san francisco bay area (: 04:52:03 and franz.com (: 04:52:21 yay 04:52:27 best place to live as a computer nerd 04:52:38 nerd israel, a friend once called it (: 04:52:46 awesome 04:52:47 it's really really sweet (: 04:52:55 just looking at franz.com 04:53:05 i'd totally love to do that kind of stuff 04:53:09 (-: 04:53:21 for me the option was gnowsis 04:53:24 which was a bit meh 04:53:33 so i went to cardiff to get a phd 04:53:37 neat! 04:54:06 i am not really up to date with what the guys at gnowsis are doing 04:57:06 paul0 [~user@187.112.91.27] has joined #lisp 04:59:04 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-148-91.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:03:17 -!- myu2 [~myu2@v077103.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:05:29 pers [~user@71-214-58-123.clsp.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:18:48 sacho [~sacho@95-42-75-129.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 05:19:10 peterhil [~peterhil@a91-153-127-82.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 05:19:46 is there a standard way to invoke a system command in CL? 05:21:51 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:22:02 huangho: not in standard CL, but implementations have mechanisms for this 05:22:20 I think there's a library that abstracts these away (and I forgot its name) 05:22:25 (not very helpful, sry) 05:22:44 hmm, thanks 05:23:11 it was helpful, now I don't waste time looking for it :) 05:24:16 if only I knew what the library was called. let me look in the logs. 05:24:48 -!- wol [~wol@67.174.222.215] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:25:45 sellout [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:25:52 trivial-shell? 05:26:28 could be. 05:26:33 hm. I think there was another one 05:27:59 ah. 05:28:05 there: http://common-lisp.net/project/external-program/ - sellout made that one 05:28:29 hmm, thanks 05:29:27 yw (: 05:29:42 I think both are in quicklisp - try and see which works best for you, I guess (: 05:31:15 ok :) 05:31:54 I have never used quicklisp, actually; I'll take the opportunity to install it 05:33:55 hm, I'm trying quicklisp now 05:34:09 (ql:quickload "trivial-shell") 05:34:16 this should load trivial shell, right? 05:37:00 yes 05:37:23 and it just works! 05:37:27 how bizarre :P 05:39:12 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 05:40:56 -!- La0fer [~Laofers1@64.120.233.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:45:21 external-program avoids shell expansion, trivial-shell just calls the shell (as one would expect) 05:57:10 I guess there isn't a standard way to control I/O buffering, either 06:04:43 -!- HET2 [~diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:08:11 antifuchs: Thanks for the git tips. That seems to have done what I want. Still need to do more reading up on git, though. 06:08:37 rtoym: yay (: 06:09:01 huangho: you can force output using force-output or finish-outupt 06:09:04 "output" 06:09:11 Looks like everything on sourceforge might have to move to something besides cvs sometime. 06:09:51 sounds like it 06:10:13 hmm, but I needed to "force" input 06:10:34 Harag [~Harag@wbs-41-208-211-15.wbs.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:10:38 Things were so much easier when there was only one version control system. :-) But diversity is good. 06:10:39 I wanted read-char to return as soon as a character is typed in 06:11:24 it works when I start clisp in non-interactive mode, and run 'stty -icanon', but in interactive mode even stty does not help 06:13:53 SBCL works fine (because it doesn't use readline, I guess) 06:14:06 there may be some terminal controls you can use regardless 06:18:09 it doesn't work even in raw mode; I think it has to do with Unix buffering mode (the thing that setvbuf controls) 06:18:30 fusss [~fusss@120.156.76.160] has joined #lisp 06:19:52 -!- cheez [~Adium@206-248-177-146.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:20:56 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-fwuqusmixhjygbab] has joined #lisp 06:20:58 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA21EA4.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:23:43 no, it's clisp madness; it's using readline to get read-char's input in interactive mode 06:24:09 Lymia [~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan] has joined #lisp 06:25:33 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has joined #lisp 06:27:07 -!- MetalDust [~metaldust@75-32-203-61.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 06:27:52 I'm pretty sure you can disable clisp's readline without compiling clisp without readline. Can't remember what the option is, though. Don't know if that will help you either. 06:28:26 when I start it in non-interactive mode, it doesn't use readline, and read-char works as expected 06:28:56 what I would like is a way to make read-char bypass readline in interactive mode 06:29:03 -!- pers [~user@71-214-58-123.clsp.qwest.net] has left #lisp 06:29:08 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 06:29:14 it's not a big problem, really 06:35:08 mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has joined #lisp 06:35:09 actually I would be better off using ncurses for what I want 06:36:32 cl-charms seems to be way to go 06:37:15 -!- SsvRrwQ [~user@S0106001c1122940c.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:38:10 SsvRrwQ [~user@S0106001c1122940c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 06:39:29 -!- sm` [s@77.28.122.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:39:51 -!- Vicfred [~Vicfred@189.143.99.177] has quit [Quit: ] 06:40:42 if only it had documentation... 06:44:27 varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 06:45:43 for adjustable arrays; should I handle index out of bound errors and readjust the array myself, or is there a way to do that automagically? 06:47:16 oh, so, i was talking about quicklisp 06:47:18 *huangho* learns that asdf had a run-shell-command function all along 06:47:35 I've loaded trivial-shell using (ql:quickload "trivial-shell") 06:47:45 but the shell-command isn't avaliable 06:47:51 huangho: don't better use trivial-shell instead 06:47:51 did i miss something? 06:48:21 don't depend on asdf, quicklisp or swank for your own projects; just saying. 06:48:32 unless you're trying to build development tools, imo. 06:49:38 fusss: I'll make a mental note of this ;) 06:49:44 myu2 [~myu2@58x5x224x106.ap58.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 06:49:53 paul0: symbol not interned in the current package? 06:50:20 it says "undefined symbol" 06:50:23 try trivial-shell:shell-command 06:50:23 fusss: what do you mean by "don't depend on"? 06:50:28 is there a way to print the type tree of an object? most Lisps seem to throw very platform specific conditions, while I need to dispatch on the ansi types 06:50:35 (in-package "trivial-shell") ? 06:50:39 if your project is loaded by asdf, it's pretty obvious that asdf will be present 06:50:41 or maybe it's :trivial-shell 06:50:43 herp-derp 06:51:02 huangho: oh, thanks. That worked 06:51:02 fusss: the slime inspector should give you an overview 06:51:17 huangho: is it always that way? I'm new to lisp 06:51:38 antifuchs: I had the pleasure of a web server crashing because I used some swank functions for unicode frobbing. Better use independent libraries, and not assume a certain Lisp infrastructure underneath 06:52:09 paul0: I'm not much older either 06:52:11 I get not wnating to depend on swank for coincidal functionality 06:52:21 but asdf / quicklisp? 06:52:27 paul0: but when you load a package it won't import the symbols by default 06:52:37 -!- rvncerr [~rvncerr@rvncerr.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:53:05 but how to import them is something I don't know :P 06:53:44 huangho: what do you mean? All symbols will be prefixed by the package name? 06:53:53 antifuchs: come with me, over here, that pile of turd at the CMU AI repo is what was once clever software that used Symbolic build tools, Explorer launchers, and MkDEFSYSTEM. 06:53:55 huangho: the :use clause on defpackage does that 06:54:14 antifuchs: hmm, thanks 06:54:17 fusss: so are you now giving bad advice and refusing to discuss it? 06:54:39 paul0: for symbols not imported, you have to prefix the package name 06:55:03 hm... cool 06:55:04 paul0: but you can import a symbol into the current package 06:55:06 nostoi [~nostoi@23.Red-80-39-157.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 06:55:12 anyway. it's bedtime for me. good night (: 06:55:18 antifuchs: I always give bad advice. Seriously my point is that code is often usable long past its build utilities. At the very least, you end up dumping an image for somebody, and you will have to worry about what might have leaked. 06:55:20 this seems even easier to use than the rubygems system 06:55:43 since the packages are automatically installed when the program runs 06:56:05 paul0: actually not :P 06:56:12 you have to load them first 06:56:18 antifuchs: OTOH, I am big fan of using portability layers and de facto utils; I will add an Alexandria dependency just for one function 06:56:32 antifuchs: good night :-) 06:56:57 huangho: load it by using ql:quickload, isn't? 06:57:20 hmm, yes, quicklisp does install it automatically 06:58:34 so, if I put it inside my application, it will do everything automaticall without the need for the user to install it 06:58:40 that's pretty cool 06:58:51 yes, but the user must have quicklisp installed 06:59:04 I'm amazed with it too :) 06:59:22 well, for now asdf comes with sbcl by default, for example 06:59:23 it's the first time I used it 06:59:42 I think quicklisp could come by default in the future 06:59:59 that's possible 07:00:24 but asdf is more-or-less universal currently 07:00:57 fantazo_ [~fantazo@178-190-239-85.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 07:01:04 well, it does the same thing that quicklisp does, no? 07:01:26 no, it does less :P 07:01:26 never used it, actually 07:01:30 me neither 07:01:38 but it won't install a package automatically 07:02:45 if you are familiar to Debian/Ubuntu, I'd say that quicklisp is to asdf what apt-get is to dpkg 07:02:54 yup 07:03:37 how do I use the symbols? 07:03:49 I mean, without the package name as prefix 07:04:50 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@178-190-232-86.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:05:39 if you define a package with defpackage, you can use the :use parameter to import the symbols from another package, or so I understood from antifuchs' explanation 07:05:50 but you can import an individual symbol 07:05:58 we just have to find how :P 07:06:07 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:06:17 hello lispers 07:06:39 hello H4ns``` are you online ? 07:06:53 paul0: http://www.ida.liu.se/imported/cltl/clm/node111.html 07:07:35 -!- angavrilov_ [~angavrilo@217.71.227.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:07:53 it seems you can just say (use-package 'trivial-shell), for example 07:08:17 hm 07:08:27 doesn't work 07:08:34 angavrilov_ [~angavrilo@217.71.227.181] has joined #lisp 07:09:41 here it worked; you must have the package loaded first 07:10:05 "use-package" will only import the symbols from an already loaded package 07:10:23 so that you won't have to prefix them 07:11:14 -!- phadthai [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:11:19 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 07:16:22 flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has joined #lisp 07:16:29 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-109-161.lns20.bne4.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:16:39 -!- mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:18:20 huangho: hah, I've just noticed that you're from Brazil too 07:19:20 anyway, use-package doesn't work here for trivial-shell 07:19:24 paul0: yes :D 07:20:03 hmm, what happens? 07:20:17 name-conflicts 07:20:48 http://pastebin.com/8wadcqc6 07:20:57 aaah, I think I know what is happening; it will probably work if you just restart with a clean lisp 07:21:05 but there must be a decent way to solve it 07:21:33 I've tried restarting, didn't work 07:21:58 hmm, no, it's not what I thought 07:24:06 seems that both CMUCL standard packages and trivial-shell define a symbol with the same name 07:25:03 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:25:55 -!- paul0 [~user@187.112.91.27] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:26:29 paul0 [~user@187.112.89.201] has joined #lisp 07:27:15 paul0: I think it would be simple to solve if you were defining a package with defpackage 07:28:07 but in the interactive prompt it seems that you have to resort to (unintern :symbol-name) 07:28:16 and then use-package 07:29:40 also, when the error occured, CMUCL gave a "resolve conflict" restart 07:30:41 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:31:51 hm 07:32:42 yeah, there is a resolve conflict in sbcl too 07:32:49 huangho: thanks 07:33:06 you are welcome ;) 07:33:50 -!- nostoi [~nostoi@23.Red-80-39-157.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 07:34:39 Yuuhi` [benni@p5483D7A3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:34:47 hi 07:35:10 hi 07:35:13 good morning people 07:35:57 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483AB70.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:40:22 -!- zc00gii [~zc00gii@thefacepalm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:41:10 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:41:45 zc00gii [~zc00gii@thefacepalm.net] has joined #lisp 07:42:41 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 07:42:58 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:43:31 good morning 07:44:36 is there anybody who use hunchentoot ? 07:44:47 kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has joined #lisp 07:45:27 I continue to have "Error while processing connection: I/O timeout while doing input on ..." when serving requests 07:46:57 Good morning 07:47:53 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 07:49:40 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.237.60] has joined #lisp 07:50:49 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.237.60] has quit [Client Quit] 07:50:56 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.237.60] has joined #lisp 07:54:34 tcr1 [~tcr@217-162-131-235.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 07:55:58 e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-qckrclgitjjewzrj] has joined #lisp 07:58:28 -!- gonzojive [~red@c-71-198-7-84.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 07:59:54 -!- huangho [~vitor@201-35-139-63.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:01:15 sm` [~s@78.157.15.219] has joined #lisp 08:04:37 phadthai [mmondor@66.11.161.166] has joined #lisp 08:12:53 adu [~ajr@pool-173-73-0-57.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 08:17:27 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@c-71-227-118-15.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:18:11 ehu [~ehuels@109.33.235.60] has joined #lisp 08:20:22 -!- Axioplase [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:20:29 Axioplase [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 08:20:46 -!- Axioplase is now known as Axioplase_ 08:21:17 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-158-1.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 08:27:25 rvncerr [~rvncerr@rvncerr.org] has joined #lisp 08:30:02 splittist [~John@146.93.63.81.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 08:30:04 morning 08:30:27 hi splittist 08:30:27 fe[nl]ix, memo from rtoym: I've uploaded a git repo for series to sourceforge. If you get a chance, can you tell me if it's working for you? Seems to work for me. 08:31:14 -!- fantazo_ [~fantazo@178-190-239-85.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:33:58 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-23-200.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:35:34 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-90-58.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 08:36:42 It's hard to determine the practical upshot of license legaleze. For ECL lisp, if you statically link in the core libraries (needed I assume even if you compile *your* code) can the project be commercial? 08:37:45 Commercial in the sense of distributed in a binary-only form for money? 08:37:51 splittist: Yes 08:38:16 Hun [~Hun@host-80-81-19-29.customer.m-online.net] has joined #lisp 08:39:52 Modius: doesn't the answer to FAQ 1.5 at least tell you what the authors think it means? 08:42:27 splittist: If they mean you'd have to ship your app with its non-ECL portions as libraries, yes. 08:45:31 Modius: I think I'm not understanding you. What I think they're saying is that if you ship something linked against ECL, you need to ship (make available) the ECL source (and a way of relinking to newer versions of ECL - I don't know whether this will make sense in every case). 08:45:59 Right, which I assume for shrinkwrap means you have to provide your app as libraries (or source) 08:46:10 fantazo_ [~fantazo@178-191-168-47.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 08:47:58 daniel_ [~daniel@p5B326873.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:49:47 Modius: because of the re-linking thing? 08:50:16 splittist: That's what it says right? 08:51:41 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5B32799E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:52:26 splittist: I have no idea how one delivers an ECL binary. What they say makes sense if you emphasise the E rather than the CL. Perhaps you could explain the process, what is produced, what is packaged etc. 08:52:41 (in your case) 08:52:57 Iphone app musings (nothing immediate, far off hypothetical) 08:56:23 -!- sluggo [~user@c-75-64-77-87.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:57:39 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-73-0-57.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 08:59:36 Modius: I wouldn't rule it out at this stage (: 09:04:23 -!- fusss [~fusss@120.156.76.160] has left #lisp 09:04:28 -!- fantazo_ [~fantazo@178-191-168-47.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:04:32 adu [~ajr@pool-173-73-0-57.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 09:07:27 -!- twem2 [~twem2@puma-mxisp.mxtelecom.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:17:19 ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 09:20:20 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:20:31 HG` [~HG@xdslar210.osnanet.de] has joined #lisp 09:21:26 moah [~gnu@dslb-092-073-073-135.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 09:23:27 hello, I want to avoid "float point underflow" errors in clisp by using long-floats instead of single/double, how do I turn all floats to be long-floats? 09:28:10 lirt [~user@178.46.244.176] has joined #lisp 09:28:12 -!- johanbev [~johanbev@159.80-203-45.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:28:17 johanbev [~johanbev@159.80-203-45.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 09:31:20 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 09:37:02 -!- SsvRrwQ [~user@S0106001c1122940c.gv.shawcable.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:38:55 pdelgallego_ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 09:39:01 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 09:40:10 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 09:46:04 splittist: The maintainer of ECL actually stated (in a 10 yo post) that you have to distribute your app as libraries that can be linked against a new ECL 09:47:02 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 09:47:19 Deesl [~bsdboy@2001:470:f96b:0:9227:e4ff:fefa:e9b9] has joined #lisp 09:47:41 -!- Deesl is now known as Guest70916 09:50:07 -!- EarlGray [~dmytrish@beting-proceeds.volia.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:50:12 EarlGray [~dmytrish@beting-proceeds.volia.net] has joined #lisp 09:50:22 -!- pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:50:51 pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 09:50:57 -!- pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Client Quit] 09:51:07 pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 09:53:23 -!- Guest70916 [~bsdboy@2001:470:f96b:0:9227:e4ff:fefa:e9b9] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 09:53:49 Deesl [~bsdboy@2001:470:f96b:0:9227:e4ff:fefa:e9b9] has joined #lisp 09:53:55 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@2001:470:f96b:0:9227:e4ff:fefa:e9b9] has quit [Changing host] 09:53:55 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 09:54:20 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-132-2-37.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:54:29 hlavaty [~user@95-88-27-48-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 09:55:38 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@83.1.168.198] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:55:48 mathrick [~mathrick@83.1.168.198] has joined #lisp 10:05:44 -!- mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:07:44 -!- sm`wor [~chatzilla@78.40.4.40] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:09:23 H4ns```` [~user@pD4B9E8C6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:12:50 -!- H4ns``` [~user@p579F8B6F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:14:07 s__C [~s__C@12-223.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 10:14:11 hello 10:14:33 since a few days i'm trying to et into stumpwm, but the problem is with sbcl 10:15:42 a friend of mine made a pkg for the aur repo, the installation is working for him, but for me i got a few errors : http://pastie.org/1514173 10:15:53 i'm really disappointed and need your help 10:18:18 s__C: i'm using stumpwm since a few days too, i'm also using archlinux and sbcl, and got no problems here 10:18:44 ahem 10:18:47 weird 10:19:01 perhaps my machine is lisp aware 10:20:22 s__C: hmmm, well i'm using sbcl package, not sbcl-git 10:20:36 -!- beach [~user@116.118.10.119] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:20:37 really strange 10:20:42 got errors with sbcl 10:21:09 are you using clx-new ? 10:22:28 i'm using clx 10:22:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-19-102.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:22:48 -!- echo-area [~user@114.251.86.0] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:23:46 ok 10:23:54 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 10:24:18 abeaumont: 686 or x86_64 ? 10:24:29 s__C: x86_64 10:24:33 ok 10:25:33 -!- drdo [~user@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:25:50 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 10:30:07 <_3b> character decoding errors would suggest you might need to set your locale to something 8bit or utf8, but 1 should be a valid ascii character code, so not sure if that is it or not 10:34:11 madnificent: ping 10:34:48 *_3b* isn't sure why gcc would be printing SOH characters though 10:39:57 -!- s__C [~s__C@12-223.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 10:40:53 <_3b> ah, maybe that is a bug in the c string -> ascii, and it always prints 1 instead of the octets it couldn't decode 10:41:41 *_3b* wonders if it was printing localized warning messages or something 10:41:56 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 10:42:25 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-19-102.iburst.co.za] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:43:22 -!- ace4016 [ace4016@adsl-32-14-100.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 10:43:23 Atomsk [~ace4016@adsl-32-14-100.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 10:46:36 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 10:55:14 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 10:55:32 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Client Quit] 10:56:32 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-79-157-58.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:56:59 s__C [~s__C@12-223.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 10:57:03 re 10:57:15 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 10:57:29 what's the way to find out why my laptop didn't pass the test when building sbcl ? 10:58:08 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:58:10 <_3b> s__C: might try setting a utf-8 locale 10:58:25 it is an utf-8 locale 10:58:45 fr_CH.UTF-8 10:58:48 exactly 10:59:24 <_3b> hmm, maybe temporarily set it to english for the build? 10:59:29 yes 11:03:59 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-137-218.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:06:45 -!- ilmari [ilmari@knuth.ping.uio.no] has quit [Quit: reboot for upgrade] 11:07:48 what about C-STRING-DECODING-ERROR ? 11:07:53 a locale problem ? 11:08:08 <_3b> that is my guess 11:08:22 <_3b> not sure why it isn't noticing the locale settings though 11:08:53 with export LANG=en_US.UTF-8 it's the same 11:09:37 <_3b> does gcc print warnings in some language other than english? 11:10:14 <_3b> both with normal LANG and with LANG=en_US.UTF-8? 11:10:21 yes 11:10:40 that's strange 11:12:00 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 11:13:51 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:14:10 <_3b> try LC_CTYPE instead of LANG 11:14:49 <_3b> and/or make sure LC_CTYPE is utf-8 11:15:22 moah: set *read-default-float-format* and (setf (EXT:LONG-FLOAT-DIGITS) ...) 11:15:39 <_3b> hmm, an now that i look closer, my locales are en_US.utf8, not .UTF-8 11:15:44 <_3b> not sure if that matters or not 11:18:56 dfkjjkfd [~paulh@210-11-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has joined #lisp 11:19:07 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-79-157-58.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:30:01 doesn't change the result... 11:30:05 Dranik [~dim@86.57.253.61] has joined #lisp 11:30:10 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-137-218.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 11:30:13 <_3b> which? 11:30:31 export LC_TYPE=en_US.utf-8 11:32:40 kaelol [~b@c-f0cbe253.97-16-64736c12.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 11:33:12 <_3b> LC_TYPE or LC_CTYPE? 11:35:15 -!- e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-qckrclgitjjewzrj] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:35:28 faulevel [~hpd@static.6.236.40.188.clients.your-server.de] has joined #lisp 11:35:52 erf 11:36:08 let's try again 11:36:12 <_3b> and was it set before? 11:37:16 wait plz i'm compiling the monster 11:39:10 HET2 [~diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 11:41:50 it wasn't set before, but it didn't solve the problem 11:42:07 always the C-STRING-DECODING-ERROR 11:42:23 davazp [~user@15.Red-83-57-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:42:43 really disappointing 11:43:22 <_3b> if you set LC_MESSAGES=C, does gcc print in english? 11:46:06 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:47:58 the answer is yes _3b 11:48:21 <_3b> ok, that might be enough to let sbcl build then 11:48:32 let see 11:50:50 this isn't enough *_* 11:51:17 c-string decoding error (:external-format :ASCII): 11:51:18 the octet sequence 1 cannot be decoded. 11:52:29 does the directory in which sbcl is contain non-ascii characters? 11:55:13 -!- lirt [~user@178.46.244.176] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:57:21 beach [~user@116.118.10.119] has joined #lisp 11:58:09 <_3b> hmm, maybe try LC_ALL=C ? 11:58:27 s__C: did you see my question? 11:58:47 Good evening everyone! 11:58:59 yes stassats` 11:59:06 ok, can you answer it? 11:59:06 but i'm compiling sbcl 11:59:20 e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-ejpxtfnwhhylmfpe] has joined #lisp 11:59:41 i'm doing a makepkg 11:59:43 <_3b> if it hasn't changed since the original paste, the paths looke OK 12:00:05 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:00:05 there where no change 12:00:12 *_3b* wondrs if makepkg is overriding user locale settings 12:01:07 -!- faulevel [~hpd@static.6.236.40.188.clients.your-server.de] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6] 12:01:39 <_3b> looks like it doesn't according to docs at least 12:02:03 there is no locale option in makepkg.conf 12:03:33 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:04:22 hello beach 12:05:10 mhhhh 12:05:27 no success 12:06:02 it's always the same thin 12:06:03 g 12:06:12 unhandled SB-INT:C-STRING-DECODING-ERROR in thread # "initial thread" RUNNING 12:06:15 {1002942001}>: 12:06:17 c-string decoding error (:external-format :ASCII): 12:06:19 the octet sequence 1 cannot be decoded. 12:06:21 4 times 12:06:52 for asdf-install, sb-bsd-sockets, sb-posix and sb-simple-streams 12:07:06 <_3b> with LC_ALL=C? 12:07:18 yes 12:07:40 it's like if setting those options had no effect on makepkg 12:09:37 Hello mvilleneuve. Did you see my changes? Any remarks? 12:12:03 i think i'll wait for a new release of sbcl _3b 12:12:47 it'll be easier 12:12:48 <_3b> might be easiest, if you mean a prebuilt binary 12:14:23 mk2 [~user@159.92.65.64] has joined #lisp 12:14:48 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-71-225-45-140.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:15:56 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 12:17:25 yes 12:18:35 mrSpec [~Spec@89.75.32.119] has joined #lisp 12:18:37 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@89.75.32.119] has quit [Changing host] 12:18:37 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 12:20:20 -!- HG` [~HG@xdslar210.osnanet.de] has quit [Quit: HG`] 12:22:43 beach: I'm looking at your changes right now 12:23:22 mvilleneuve: OK. 12:23:35 mvilleneuve: The tests pass now, which wasn't the case before. 12:24:11 -!- myu2 [~myu2@58x5x224x106.ap58.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:25:11 myu2 [~myu2@58x5x224x106.ap58.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 12:25:20 -!- myu2 [~myu2@58x5x224x106.ap58.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:27:50 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30:14 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30:40 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.237.60] has quit [Quit: be back later] 12:32:04 urandom__ [~user@p548A5E81.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:33:49 -!- M-sprite [~M-sprite@122.236.246.66] has quit [Quit: I need to code or sleep now .] 12:41:31 Does anyone know anything about BOS or Basic Object System? 12:43:50 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 12:44:37 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-146-248.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:45:43 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-190-151.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:49:22 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:51:43 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:54:25 Does somebody use cl-html-parse? I can't compile it: ASDF-TMP-package.fasl not found. 12:55:45 mk2` [~user@159.92.65.64] has joined #lisp 12:56:29 -!- mk2 [~user@159.92.65.64] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:59:58 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:00:17 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 13:00:32 claint [~user@212.154.81.178] has joined #lisp 13:02:06 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-109-161.lns20.bne4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:03:53 vser [~vser@78-22-154-231.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 13:03:57 -!- vser is now known as Landr 13:06:40 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 13:08:06 e-user1 [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-gmvexxvbbesybksr] has joined #lisp 13:09:38 -!- e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-ejpxtfnwhhylmfpe] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:10:36 M-sprite [~M-sprite@218.74.183.224] has joined #lisp 13:11:59 ^flying-high^ [~user@205.244.151.65] has joined #lisp 13:14:38 -!- xinming_ [~hyy@115.221.11.239] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:15:23 xinming [~hyy@115.221.8.36] has joined #lisp 13:15:38 -!- ^flying-high^ [~user@205.244.151.65] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 13:16:51 mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has joined #lisp 13:19:32 nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has joined #lisp 13:20:33 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 13:20:41 -!- nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has quit [Client Quit] 13:20:55 xan_ [~xan@245.Red-79-157-129.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:24:26 -!- davazp [~user@15.Red-83-57-38.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:27:38 gko [~gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:27:44 -!- Hun [~Hun@host-80-81-19-29.customer.m-online.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:28:26 -!- M-sprite [~M-sprite@218.74.183.224] has quit [Quit: I need to code or sleep now .] 13:28:44 sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-82-218.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has joined #lisp 13:32:25 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@83.1.168.198] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:32:33 merodach [~bagdemir@62.104.226.37] has joined #lisp 13:32:33 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:32:45 mathrick [~mathrick@83.1.168.198] has joined #lisp 13:36:28 fe[nl]ix: pong 13:37:43 madnificent: what's stopping you from releasing cl-recaptcha ? 13:38:00 I don't know, do you? 13:38:13 ymv: debian/ubuntu? 13:38:35 it runs here, but I haven't tested it on a large scale. I haven't encountered any problems with it though, so it seems safe. 13:38:43 fe[nl]ix: do you want me to tag it? 13:39:05 no, make a tarball and put it somewhere 13:39:08 -!- mk2` [~user@159.92.65.64] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:39:08 a tag is not a release 13:39:25 fe[nl]ix: I meant: add a version to it 13:39:50 *madnificent* doesn't think he ever released something in a tarball 13:39:55 *madnificent* wonders if github could do that for him 13:40:51 fe[nl]ix: ah, there it is! You can click on downloads, taht has a tarbal :) 13:41:41 it's not a proper tarball 13:42:19 fe[nl]ix: tell me what you want and how you want it, then I'll look at it 13:43:14 Xach, debian 13:43:23 fe[nl]ix: Don't know if you got my memo, but I converted series to use git. It's on sourceforge now. 13:47:33 fe[nl]ix, I suppose you were able to see it in action then :) 13:50:42 sellout [~Adium@64.134.66.121] has joined #lisp 13:50:45 rtoym: it's a bit imperfect 13:51:10 fe[nl]ix: Dang. What did I do wrong? 13:51:58 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Quit] 13:52:01 rtoym: username conversion 13:52:27 You mean the email address for the users? 13:52:34 Er, usernames 13:52:58 jweiss_ [~jweiss@cpe-069-134-009-048.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:53:16 -!- s__C [~s__C@12-223.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 13:53:26 no, in the commit headers 13:54:10 You mean where it lists the commiter as rtoy ? 13:54:20 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:54:30 ymv: Is it trying to recompile sb-grovel? 13:54:50 rtoym: yes 13:55:18 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 13:56:01 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 13:56:39 fe[nl]ix: What should it be? Something like rtoy ? 13:57:23 M-sprite [~M-sprite@122.236.241.205] has joined #lisp 13:58:30 Xach, recompiling doesn't help 13:58:37 same error 13:59:46 ymv: That wasn't really what I asked. 13:59:47 it si no "sb-grovel" in debugger output 13:59:56 s/si/is/ 14:00:14 ymv: Paste the error to paste.lisp.org? and a backtrace, maybe? 14:01:28 http://paste.lisp.org/+2JZH 14:03:46 oops 14:03:52 Ah. My advice in general would be to not use debian packages for Lisp software. 14:03:54 it's another error 14:04:00 -!- M-sprite [~M-sprite@122.236.241.205] has quit [Quit: I need to code or sleep now .] 14:04:07 Though that looks a bit weird, too. 14:05:34 ymv: Did you install it with asdf-install? 14:05:39 "site-wide installation"? 14:06:57 rtoym: "Full Name ". for example http://tinyurl.com/66svpqm 14:07:22 dlowe [~dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 14:08:21 version from tarball loaded successfully 14:08:27 thanks, Xach 14:10:00 myu2 [~myu2@v077103.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #lisp 14:10:01 fe[nl]ix: Ok. I probably don't have the old addresses anymore (and I know the address for toy no longer exists). This will probably have to wait until shell access is restored so I can upload my entire local .git repo with all of that info. 14:10:06 -!- sellout [~Adium@64.134.66.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:10:20 sellout [~Adium@gw3.tacwap.org] has joined #lisp 14:11:20 rtoym: ah, ok 14:11:59 panike [~nwp@fw.lmcg.wisc.edu] has joined #lisp 14:12:02 Well, I don't have that info in my local .git repo. I need to regenerate it from CVS with the appropriate mappings. 14:12:08 mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:13:56 -!- sellout [~Adium@gw3.tacwap.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:14:18 -!- e-user1 [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-gmvexxvbbesybksr] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 14:14:18 sellout [~Adium@gw3.tacwap.org] has joined #lisp 14:15:26 Hun [~Hun@host-80-81-19-29.customer.m-online.net] has joined #lisp 14:17:56 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:20:32 kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has joined #lisp 14:21:05 tsangpo [~tsangpozh@183.46.105.172] has joined #lisp 14:21:48 nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-148-200.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #lisp 14:22:06 -!- nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-148-200.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Client Quit] 14:22:34 nyef [~nyef@pool-70-109-148-200.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #lisp 14:22:49 G'morning all. 14:23:32 Hello nyef! 14:23:51 -!- mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:23:52 hi nyef 14:24:02 Anything happening today? 14:24:13 everything is happening today 14:24:25 -!- tsangpo [~tsangpozh@183.46.105.172] has left #lisp 14:24:29 right now. 14:24:51 pmurias [~pawel@wifi.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #lisp 14:25:14 how should a macro that defines a function that pattern matches on it's arguments be called? 14:25:43 more specifically pattern matches on it's only argument 14:26:27 define-one-argument-pattern-matching-function 14:26:32 also, "its" :-) 14:26:47 minion: Thwap? 14:26:47 Thwap: THWAP! http://www.angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif and http://www.angryflower.com/itsits.gif (see also: http://www.unmutual.info/misc/sb_itsits.mp3 ) 14:27:34 (good afternoon) 14:28:00 Hello Krystof. 14:29:29 -!- TDT [~user@74.115.254.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:29:40 charliekilo [~charlieki@70-89-224-81-BusName-panjde.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:29:53 TDT [~user@74.115.254.25] has joined #lisp 14:30:07 dlowe: http://common-lisp.net/project/local-time/local-time-1.0.1.tar.gz contains fasls 14:30:55 oops 14:31:02 local-time-1.0.1?! 14:31:07 *rsynnott* wonders what changed 14:31:07 -!- charliekilo [~charlieki@70-89-224-81-BusName-panjde.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has left #lisp 14:31:28 last time I installed it it was a pre-1.0 version last modified years before 14:31:40 dlowe: but please don't overwrite the tarball. make a new release instead 14:31:53 -!- sonnym [~evissecer@rrcs-184-74-137-167.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:32:21 hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has joined #lisp 14:33:40 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:33:43 yeah, development stalled a long time ago 14:33:59 fe[nl]ix: I'll see what I can do 14:34:58 if i want to have a macro which would enable something like (fn foo (pattern-for-first-argument arg2) ...) (fn foo (other-pattern-here...) ...) 14:35:04 how should i implement that? 14:35:56 I have no idea 14:36:17 in general, the answer is: write out the code you want to write, and the code that you want that to expand to 14:36:25 then write a function that transforms the former into the latter 14:37:11 pmurias: My guess is that you're looking for a macro that expands to a macrolet. Or some kind of code walking. 14:37:14 the general problem is that i want to combine serveral marco calls 14:37:15 dlowe: I'm more surprised it has restarted; I always thought of it as essentially a perfected library :) 14:37:30 benny` [~benny@i577A3040.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 14:38:09 really? oh, man. I see it as being entirely wartful 14:38:38 would it be possible to make generic functions do pattern matching/ 14:38:43 s/\//?/ 14:38:46 I picked it up again last month, though 14:39:05 -!- benny [~benny@i577A2BE8.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:39:09 the problem is that it's too easy to stop at the "good enough" stage 14:39:28 dlowe: what kind of warts ? 14:39:31 -!- xinming [~hyy@115.221.8.36] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:39:32 xinming_ [~hyy@115.221.15.97] has joined #lisp 14:39:39 dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-89-201.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 14:39:58 I always found that it did what's a relatively simple job well 14:39:59 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 14:40:06 but no doubt there are edge-cases I didn't run into 14:42:37 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-73-0-57.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 14:44:21 date handling, mostly 14:44:54 encoding dates as a timestamp at midnight UTC causes weird artifacts 14:45:39 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 14:47:04 *splittist* writes tests, feels virtuous 14:47:15 pdelgallego__ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 14:47:18 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-132-2-37.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 14:47:43 rsynnott: I appreciate the morale support, though :D 14:50:48 e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-itygjjgqkpdyoqwy] has joined #lisp 14:53:14 twem2 [~twem2@puma-mxisp.mxtelecom.com] has joined #lisp 14:57:09 11:26.48 minion: Thwap: THWAP! http://www.angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif and http://www.angryflower.com/itsits.gif <-- reminds me of some oatmeal comics 14:57:14 http://theoatmeal.com/comics/ie http://theoatmeal.com/comics/irony 14:57:36 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:57:48 http://theoatmeal.com/comics/semicolon 14:57:59 hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has joined #lisp 14:58:06 dlowe: any plans for adding chronologies to local-time? Or would that go into a package on top of local-time? 14:58:30 kami: what is a chronology ? 14:59:42 sorry, I mean a calendar 15:00:06 zmv [~daniel@c95334ae.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 15:00:13 yeah, but the plans are seven years old now 15:01:11 :) 15:03:40 I might have the need for at least one type of calendar other than Gregorian. 15:04:24 Are the 7 year old plans rather vague or concrete? 15:05:59 mushy? 15:06:07 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-82-218.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:06:21 -!- benny` is now known as benny 15:06:39 If you want to take a crack at it, please feel free 15:07:15 dlowe: had to look that up. A very interesting way of describing software design :) 15:07:53 -!- pmurias [~pawel@wifi.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 15:09:41 sonnym [~evissecer@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has joined #lisp 15:11:01 -!- Dranik [~dim@86.57.253.61] has quit [Quit:     (xchat 2.4.5  )] 15:11:15 Kruppe [~user@134.117.254.249] has joined #lisp 15:13:19 dlowe: is mushy spoken like pushy? 15:13:29 Xach, I'm near to the solution for dynamic updating of a project created with quicklisp :) 15:13:47 Hooray 15:13:54 kami: yes :) 15:13:58 kami: it depends where you are. If you are describing peas, probably. 15:14:14 hehe, I was watching the problem from the wrong point of view 15:14:50 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.224.57] has joined #lisp 15:19:12 Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:44 gonzojive [~red@c-71-198-7-84.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:24:02 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.224.57] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:26:12 tfb [~tfb@92.41.223.131.sub.mbb.three.co.uk] has joined #lisp 15:28:59 -!- Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:35:49 has anyone implemented software scatter and gather, or have links to a nice implementation? 15:37:55 pkhuong: as in software implementation of scatter/gather on I/O or memory? 15:39:57 pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 15:40:25 pmurias [~pawel@wifi.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has joined #lisp 15:41:30 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:41:59 fe[nl]ix: I used cvs2git to create the git repo. I didn't find anything there about mapping cvs users to something else. 15:42:07 p_l|backup: for memory. 15:42:58 Or, in a way, a sparse matrix * dense vector -> dense vector multiplication for the scatter. 15:43:41 how is cl-containers? I don't see any documentation, is it pretty intuitive? 15:44:57 rtoym: I've had a better experience with the official tool, git-cvsimport 15:45:19 pkhuong: unfortunately don't know one, though I think there were some implementations in HPC stuff 15:46:46 fe[nl]ix: Ok. I guess if I want the cvs branches, I have to do that myself? 15:46:59 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 15:47:26 -!- kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:47:32 p_l|backup: that's where I'm looking, but there's scarce little for in-memory stuff. 15:47:59 pkhuong: some of the sparse matrix libs don't have it? 15:48:36 rtoym: I don't know, I don't think I've ever tried to convert a multi-branch CVS repository 15:49:03 kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has joined #lisp 15:49:09 for sparse axpy, I'm seeing papers that say that the best way to do it is with the naive loop (assuming sorted indices, I assume). 15:49:24 So one question is whether I should try and sort the indices, and, if so, how. 15:49:47 fe[nl]ix: The man page says you have to do it by hand. cvs2git does the branches. 15:50:03 Kruppe: I don't have the impression that it is widely used. 15:50:38 pavpanchekha [~pavpanche@PAVPANCHEKHA-DESKTOP.MIT.EDU] has joined #lisp 15:50:51 hey, I've got what I guess is an ASDF question 15:51:06 I'm trying to use the split-sequence library 15:51:27 Xach: ah ok, any suggestions where to look for binary search trees? 15:51:38 and I'm trying to use it in a script (requirements) 15:51:59 so I'm calling (require :asdf) (asdf:operate 'asdf:load-op 'split-sequence) 15:52:09 that prints three unsightly lines to output 15:52:14 is there any way to avoid that? 15:52:20 -!- phadthai [mmondor@66.11.161.166] has quit [Quit: later] 15:52:30 phadthai [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has joined #lisp 15:53:31 Kruppe: have not tried it, but both cliki.net & QL reference trees for AVL & red-black trees: http://www.cliki.net/TREES 15:53:41 Kruppe: Not sure. "Trees" from nathan froyd seems promising. 15:54:39 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-fwuqusmixhjygbab] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:54:59 hargettp: Xach: thanks, I'll take a look at those, worst case I'll just write my own, won't be that bad 15:55:21 wont* 15:55:51 pavpanchekha: Things aren't generally streamlined for scripting. 15:56:16 rtoym: can you access the cvs browser ? 15:56:24 Xach: understood. Any way of avoiding ASDF to include split-sequence? 15:56:43 Xach: should I just extract a .lsp from that package and put it in the same file? 15:56:48 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:56:52 pavpanchekha: why avoid ASDF? 15:56:56 -!- flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:57:09 p_l|backup: I don't care either way, I just would like those random lines not to appear 15:57:19 pavpanchekha: when i write a program i want to run from the command-line, i load everything once and save a binary executable. 15:57:27 clhs *c-f-v* 15:57:27 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for *c-f-v*. 15:57:33 p_l|backup: I guess I could redirect standard-output, but that seems ugly 15:57:33 clhs *c-v* 15:57:33 *COMPILE-VERBOSE*: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_cmp_pr.htm 15:57:39 pavpanchekha: saves all the load output at the expense of some file size. 15:57:39 clhs *l-v* 15:57:40 *LOAD-VERBOSE*: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_ld_prs.htm 15:57:57 stassats`: If only all projects honored settings like that! 15:58:11 and :verbose nil parameter for asdf 15:58:19 Xach: mm. I'm supposed to send source, not binary, though (don't ask), so that doesn't really work for me 15:58:23 *Xach* has to watch cxml (or something) check for wide character support every time. 15:58:57 pavpanchekha: see the variables stassats mentioned, and in a pinch you can always suppress standard streams by temporarily binding them to an empty broadcast stream. 15:59:00 pavpanchekha: then ask the rceiver if they bitch about GCC's warnings as well 15:59:12 Xach: i don't see it anymore since i dump it into an image 15:59:17 p_l|backup: hahaha 16:00:07 pavpanchekha: cause that's what the "random lines" are 16:00:13 corruptmemory [~jim@96.246.167.18] has joined #lisp 16:00:43 clhs *c-p* 16:00:43 *COMPILE-PRINT*: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_cmp_pr.htm 16:00:47 clhs *l-p* 16:00:47 Matches: *LOAD-PRINT* *LOAD-PATHNAME* 16:01:07 dmytrish [~dmytrish@193.239.152.189] has joined #lisp 16:01:27 stassats`: p_l|backup Xach: Thanks, set asdf:*asdf-verbose* to nil and it's quiet now 16:02:09 -!- dmytrish is now known as EarlGray_w 16:02:23 fe[nl]ix: Which cvs browser? You mean for series on sf.net? If so, yes. 16:03:37 -!- gko [~gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:05:08 rtoym: I keep getting "connection reset" on http://series.cvs.sourceforge.net/series 16:05:15 hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:27 I think SF cvs is still down 16:05:42 I'm getting errors like that from my nightly sbcl build script 16:05:54 great time to run away from sf.net! 16:06:14 It's always a great time to run away from sf.net 16:06:33 and now it's even greater 16:06:39 fe[nl]ix: Oh, yeah, it's probably broken still. I can give you the cvs repo if you want it. 16:08:00 Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:20 how do i uppercase a string? 16:08:21 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-132-2-37.monradsl.monornet.hu] has left #lisp 16:08:27 -!- pavpanchekha [~pavpanche@PAVPANCHEKHA-DESKTOP.MIT.EDU] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:08:37 pmurias: the obscurely-named STRING-UPCASE 16:09:01 rtoym: I'd like that :) 16:09:04 gko [gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 16:09:27 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:10:03 Xach: thanks 16:10:04 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:10:39 pmurias: are you familiar with the hyperspec? 16:10:41 -!- Phoodus [~foo@ip68-231-47-70.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:11:30 pmurias: sometimes when i want to browse a bunch of related functions, i'll look up one i know (like STRING) and then click the up-arrow to get to the dictionary. http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/c_string.htm shows a bunch of string-related functions. 16:12:08 pmurias: if you're using slime and emacs (probably a good move) slime-apropos is also pretty good 16:12:18 js0000 [~js@67.208.188.68] has joined #lisp 16:12:24 pmurias: and you can look up the results in the hyperspec too 16:12:42 if you want to FORMAT an upcased string, then you can use ~:@(~a~) 16:14:00 -!- sellout [~Adium@gw3.tacwap.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:14:27 numeromancer [~tschaeffe@dramail.com] has joined #lisp 16:14:57 -!- corruptmemory [~jim@96.246.167.18] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:15:33 corruptmemory [~jim@96.246.167.18] has joined #lisp 16:15:34 fe[nl]ix: common-lisp.net/~rtoy/series-repo.tar.bz2. 16:16:13 fe[nl]ix: If you get around to converting it with branches, I might take it and upload the whole thing to sf, when it comes back. 16:16:41 ok 16:17:14 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-36-217-249.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:19:47 superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has joined #lisp 16:19:47 -!- superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has quit [Client Quit] 16:21:50 -!- Harag [~Harag@wbs-41-208-211-15.wbs.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:23:03 -!- gko [gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:23:53 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:25:22 gko [gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 16:25:22 fe[nl]ix: After you grab the tarball, let me know. I'll probably want to delete it. 16:25:33 done 16:25:59 *rtoym* needs to learn how to do cvs 2 git conversions since he will convert matlisp over someday soon. 16:26:19 superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has joined #lisp 16:27:06 rtoym: do you have any experience with sparse linear algebra? 16:28:18 pkhuong: Sorry, not really. I read a little long ago, but never really did anything with it. Most of my matrices have been relatively small that dense matrices were no problem. 16:29:10 _s1gma [~herpderp@77.107.164.131] has joined #lisp 16:30:05 -!- Kruppe [~user@134.117.254.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:30:06 rtoym: does that repository contain multiple branches ? 16:30:16 pavelludiq [57f63ac1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.246.58.193] has joined #lisp 16:31:01 fe[nl]ix: I think there are two branches. 16:32:52 fe[nl]ix: But I was careless back then. The branches aren't labeled, and I didn't set a tag for the branch point. You can see them from the revision numbers. 1.32.2, 1.32.1, 1.51.1 (s-code.lisp). 16:36:34 Kruppe [~user@134.117.27.223] has joined #lisp 16:38:06 PuffTheMagic [~PuffTheMa@unaffiliated/puffthemagic] has joined #lisp 16:38:55 -!- ehu [~ehuels@109.33.235.60] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:39:24 rtoym: any idea how to list the present branches ? 16:39:24 -!- Hun [~Hun@host-80-81-19-29.customer.m-online.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:40:26 In what way? There aren't any branch labels, so you just have the revision numbers. 16:40:49 cvs2git made up git branch names like remote/origin/unlabeled-1.51.1 16:42:59 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 16:43:34 felideon [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 16:44:49 -!- rme [~rme@pool-70-106-129-201.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net] has left #lisp 16:45:16 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 16:45:53 Can you turn that around to create suitable tags and branch labels in CVS? 16:53:27 sellout [~Adium@gw3.tacwap.org] has joined #lisp 16:53:38 Good question. I don't know. 16:55:33 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 17:01:56 brodo [~brodo@p5B0254B4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:05:14 if in an asd file I've defined a system with modules and files that don't really exist in file system. Is it possible to define a system without loading it ? 17:05:53 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:34 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:07:03 -!- kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:07:09 I don't want the "No such file or directory" condition 17:07:42 levi [~user@c-174-52-219-147.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:07:55 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:09:03 kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has joined #lisp 17:09:34 kiuma: So, you want ASDF to know /how/ to load the system, but not actually try to do so? 17:09:53 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:09:58 just LOAD the system definition file 17:10:02 I'm using the following implementations: LispWorks, clisp and sbcl and would like to setup ASDF and slime so that all work... Currently, I have multiple ASDF implementations "installed": one from LispWorks starter pack, one from quicklisp: looks like I can remove LispWorks starter pack asdf and packages, since all the systems are available in quicklisp and just keep the LW specific stuff.. 17:10:08 No, /never/ just LOAD the system definition file. 17:10:19 no? 17:10:41 No, some people put stuff in their system definitions that doesn't react well when LOADed, but works just fine when ASDF does its thing. 17:10:47 nyef: I'm LOADing a system definition file right now! muhahaha 17:10:49 nyef, I want only a system object 17:10:52 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:11:11 You can load your own system definition file, if you know you haven't been funky. 17:11:29 Most system definitions are "just fine" with being loaded, but there's no guarantee, and there's apparently a defined mechanism for doing the load properly. 17:11:35 nyef has a point though. How do you know the whole dependency tree isn't funky 17:11:56 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:12:18 a priori? "I wrote every system definition in the dependency tree, therefore I already know they're not funky"? 17:12:39 a rare condition for any non-trivial system :) 17:12:53 True enough. 17:13:18 By inspection is doable, though. "I looked at every system definition in the dependency tree, and saw that they were not funky"? 17:14:40 *dlowe* proposes funky be entered into the asdf glossary as a property of asd system files. 17:14:56 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:15:11 what if you're as funky as system definitions and can't recognize their fankiness? 17:15:21 then we can make a system property FUNKY-P 17:15:31 *kami* proposes to use the opportunity and add mushy, too 17:15:45 -!- nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:16:07 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:16:24 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.215.201] has quit [Quit: Offline] 17:16:52 -!- e-user [~akahl@nat/nokia/x-itygjjgqkpdyoqwy] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:18:10 funky-p sure is a funky way to name funkyp 17:18:18 So how do you tell asdf to load a system definition, but not the system? 17:18:29 -!- pavelludiq [57f63ac1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.246.58.193] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:18:50 Well, if it's not in the manual, start with an APROPOS? 17:18:53 -!- pmurias [~pawel@wifi.ii.uni.wroc.pl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:19:04 splittist: asdf:find-system 17:20:00 nyef, Xach: thanks. 17:20:25 huangho [~vitor@201-41-27-163.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #lisp 17:20:32 -!- huangho [~vitor@201-41-27-163.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Client Quit] 17:21:41 -!- tfb [~tfb@92.41.223.131.sub.mbb.three.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:22:39 -!- kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:24:50 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 17:27:18 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:27:39 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 17:28:36 -!- gonzojive [~red@c-71-198-7-84.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:28:37 kclifton [~kclifton@s198-166-45-245.ab.hsia.telus.net] has joined #lisp 17:28:51 gonzojive [~red@c-71-198-7-84.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:29:52 Xach, but asdf:find-system without a previous (asdf:oos 'asdf:load-op 'pkgname) doesn't work 17:30:39 Grazl_ [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 17:31:20 kiuma: it works if that system is in the load path 17:31:59 every time I run sbcl on a linux 64bit system with a grsec kernel, I get a lot of segfaults in the logs 17:32:06 typically: 17:32:08 Jan 31 18:31:30 ks358047 kernel: grsec: From 94.228.180.170: Segmentation fault occurred at 000000100014e288 in /usr/bin/sbcl[sbcl:24522] uid/euid:1000/1000 gid/eg 17:32:09 id:10/10, parent /bin/zsh[zsh:13573] uid/euid:1000/1000 gid/egid:10/10 17:32:13 is that a known problem ? 17:32:21 galdor: sbcl uses sigsegv for gc 17:32:37 oh 17:32:58 so I just need to find how to make the kernel shut up when the 'segfault' comes from sbcl 17:33:41 -!- Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:33:50 -!- Grazl_ is now known as Grazl 17:36:35 Vinnipeg [~sa1vador@pppoe-88-147-198-195.san.ru] has joined #lisp 17:37:15 -!- Vinnipeg [~sa1vador@pppoe-88-147-198-195.san.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:37:44 What should I do when I'm making a package where I have a lot of conflicts between two "used" packages, is there a way to just use fully qualified names for all the symbols I want from both of them instead? Should I just leave them as deps in the defsystem form and out of the :use clause? 17:40:25 fe[nl]ix, thx 17:40:38 Kruppe: Don't reference in a :use clause 17:41:04 hargettp: ok, so just let them hang out in defsystem? 17:41:09 Kruppe: only :use what you want imported 17:41:27 -!- pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:41:44 you can also :shadowing-import-from to selectively import symbols from certain packages 17:41:58 Kruppe: yep, having them as deps ensures they will be loaded--then you can use fully-qualified names to "find" them 17:42:33 hargettp: derrida: alright sounds good thanks :) 17:42:43 kruppe: yw :) 17:43:35 Xach, the fact is that with find-system method will give a system object, then quicklisp will be able to write missing resources 17:43:49 koning_robot: that would almost work in this situation, unfortunately there are symbols both named the same thing which I want to use from each package :( 17:46:38 I only wish you could add package-specific package nicknames 17:46:59 different from :nickname? 17:47:24 so you could, say (use-package 'foo :as 'bar) and 'bar:baz would reference 'foo:baz 17:47:37 kiuma: I don't know what you're talking about, sorry. 17:48:06 dlowe: i see 17:48:24 for instance, I don't like USE when using cl-ppcre, but I do wish I could reference it with a simple RE package nickname 17:48:36 there's no facility to set nicknames in a package :p 17:48:48 defpackage has a :nicknames clause 17:49:02 yes, but once it's done, there's no changing it 17:49:12 dlowe: it has PPCRE nickname 17:49:13 (portably) 17:49:23 stassats`: I'm aware. 17:49:23 dlowe: rename-package doesn't do what you want? 17:49:50 why am I getting this error when I try compiling CLX? " failed AVER: (AND (NULL (TN-READS TN)) (NULL (TN-WRITES TN)))" 17:49:51 Xach: I don't want to break other things that depend on the full cl-ppcre name 17:49:52 dlowe: i mean, regarding nicknames, not your orginal thing. 17:50:04 zmv: it's a bug in SBCL 17:50:12 it has been fixed in CVS 17:50:16 oh, you can set new nicknames with it 17:50:18 zmv: known bug in 1.0.45, will be fixed in .46, is not present in .44 17:50:18 :p 17:51:04 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has joined #lisp 17:51:13 Is there any workaround or I'll have to use the CVS version? 17:51:17 *dlowe* will stop griping now. 17:51:32 zmv: you could use 1.0.44 17:52:09 -!- EarlGray_w [~dmytrish@193.239.152.189] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:52:14 gozoner [~ebg@ebg-10004083621.jpl.nasa.gov] has joined #lisp 17:52:23 zmv: http://groups.google.com/group/sbcl-devel/msg/29ae5265aa551b45 17:52:34 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:52:43 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:53:02 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 17:53:36 Xach, derrida: thanks 17:53:46 zmv: Actually, the fix is hot-patchable. 17:53:53 Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:53:53 So you could apply it to a running SBCL. 17:54:10 I see. 17:54:38 That said, the underlying bug is nasty enough that you'd possibly be better off with an SBCL built with the fix from the get-go. 17:55:09 Shaftoe [~Moe111@65.94.178.89] has joined #lisp 17:55:17 -!- Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:55:36 Matt_S_G [Matt_S_G@188.55.33.99] has joined #lisp 17:55:59 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A5E81.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:57:14 if I am running SBCL on linux (and want no portability) and want to copy a directory tree over... should I simply bite the bullet and use sb-ext:run-program on "cp" ? 17:57:40 You may as well, really. 17:57:57 great, thanks. 17:58:09 No sense wasting a perfectly good file-copy program, after all. 17:58:59 that is what I thought, but was wondering if there was some library which I already used that did this trivially and that I wasn't aware of. 17:59:07 minion: cl-fad? 17:59:08 cl-fad: CL-FAD is a portable pathname library based on code from Peter Seibel's book Practical Common Lisp, providing a way to work with files and directories. http://www.cliki.net/cl-fad 18:00:07 cl-fad doesn't do exactly this. 18:00:18 or at least, not that I could figure out. 18:01:02 in any case, as nyef said, cp is a mainstay of a program. might as well use it. 18:01:07 it has copy-file and walk-directory 18:02:03 which was my first attempt, but the walk directory and copy-file functions don't like each other. what walk-directory outputs is often of no use to copy-file. 18:02:22 Phoodus [~foo@68.107.217.139] has joined #lisp 18:02:27 that can't be true 18:02:34 try it. 18:02:51 try copying over a directory with 2 files, and a sub directory and a file in that one. 18:03:01 to a third directory called "foo" 18:03:12 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:03:17 everything about the interactions is not streamlined. 18:05:08 that's a grave accusation! 18:05:23 So, they're dead wrong for each other? 18:05:33 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:05:49 3 problems cropped up: 18:05:55 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:07:13 - walk tree doesn't properly format files from directories. so you actually have to do a directory-pathname-p on the name to see if it's a directory or sb-posix:stat to check for a file 18:07:45 -!- brodo [~brodo@p5B0254B4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:08:10 2) copy-file uses non wild card names for input. So taking individual files and sending them to "foo" doesn't work, because it expects the destination name to be a fully qualified name. 18:08:15 not simply a dir to drop in. 18:08:32 Shaftoe: http://paste.lisp.org/display/119221 was the first thing that came to mind. 18:08:39 Shaftoe: WFM, YMMV, etc. 18:08:46 so you have to stop and transform "/src/foo/bar/tmp/baz.blah" to "baz.blah" and then append it to the folder 18:09:10 carlocci [~nes@93.37.215.140] has joined #lisp 18:09:14 Xach: does that recurse? 18:09:18 (which was my 3rd point) 18:09:31 Shaftoe: Yes. 18:09:47 Your point seems to be "I don't know Common Lisp," which is no problem, but not something to blame on cl-fad. 18:10:05 ahh. the name calling begins. 18:10:21 my point was that operation "take from walk-directory, feed to copy-file" is not a trivial operation. 18:10:25 darn, Xach beat me, i wrote almost the same thing 18:10:57 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:11:00 That's true, for some value of trivial. 18:11:15 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:12:20 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:12:38 Xach: here's the thing. I'm not here to implement libraries, I'm fixing a bigger issue in my professional life that needs to copy a file. I know enough about my skills to know that I'm not going to write better code than something as established as cp. 18:12:56 saying that that's not knowing Lisp is insulting not to me, it is insulting to programming in general. 18:13:03 I don't know if your code handles pipes well or not. 18:13:13 and trivial means that. 18:13:20 (I Do know cp does) 18:13:34 'pipes'? 18:13:54 Shaftoe: Now you know about enough-namestring and ensure-directories-exist, so hopefully you can move on to complaining about other things. 18:14:31 thank you Xach. You have shed light where there once was darkness. 18:14:38 -!- Matt_S_G [Matt_S_G@188.55.33.99] has quit [] 18:14:39 -!- claint [~user@212.154.81.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:14:46 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:14:59 Hopefully not things already provided by the language, though. 18:15:04 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:15:59 Anyway, if I wanted to copy unixy trees (not files created from my Lisp application), I would also probably use a Unix program to do it. 18:16:37 the easiest way to get the behaviour of cp is to run cp 18:16:46 snearch [~snearch@f053011158.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 18:16:54 tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:16:57 -!- tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:17:05 tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:17:05 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:17:05 -!- tritchey_ is now known as tritchey 18:17:12 indeed. 18:17:50 -!- ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:19:06 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:19:21 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:19:32 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-158-1.vologda.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:19:55 -!- Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:20:05 -!- Yuuhi` [benni@p5483D7A3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:20:10 Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:21:21 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-216-137.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 18:21:36 Xach: and for what it's worth, your code snippet is elegant. 18:22:44 -!- Shaftoe [~Moe111@65.94.178.89] has quit [Quit: Shaftoe] 18:27:54 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:28:13 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:31:44 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:32:03 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:34:34 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:34:53 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:35:24 brodo [~brodo@p5B023732.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:35:36 -!- brodo [~brodo@p5B023732.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:36:23 -!- sacho [~sacho@95-42-75-129.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:37:30 Zephyrus [~emanuele@unaffiliated/zephyrus] has joined #lisp 18:37:55 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:38:16 lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has joined #lisp 18:38:58 younder [~john@224.13.202.84.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 18:39:03 -!- redline6561 [~user@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:39:18 -!- sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 18:39:41 -!- zmv is now known as everyone 18:39:47 sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 18:40:23 Just installed clbuild2. Is there a way to make the libraries go somewhere else than under quicklisp in my home directory. I usually prefer them under /usr/local/src.. 18:40:39 Blkt [~user@93-33-130-17.ip44.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 18:41:12 (It took me a while to figure out what had happened to my lib's.) 18:41:13 Yes, there is. You should consult the documentation of quicklisp. 18:41:27 Or ask on #quicklisp 18:42:19 pjb: it's easy in quicklisp, but i don't know if moving quicklisp requires configuration changes to clbuild2. 18:42:35 I think _8david would know. 18:42:43 hi fe[nl]ix 18:43:07 jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-138.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:43:23 -!- tsuru [~charlie@adsl-179-29-10.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:44:14 tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:44:14 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-68-51-118-114.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:44:14 -!- tritchey_ is now known as tritchey 18:46:13 Also downloading slime using the install-from-upstream option requires a common-lisp.net password. (Should allow anonymous access.) 18:46:44 -!- everyone is now known as everybody 18:46:45 -!- Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has quit [Quit: Adamant] 18:46:54 -!- everybody is now known as zmv 18:50:40 pankajm [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 18:52:40 -!- lirt [~user@90.151.157.48] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:53:12 tsuru [~charlie@adsl-179-29-10.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 18:53:54 -!- panike [~nwp@fw.lmcg.wisc.edu] has left #lisp 18:54:03 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:55:30 -!- Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:55:42 "Undocumented [lisp] programs: too much cons, not enough prose. -- " 18:55:45 Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:55:51 c|mell [~cmell@175.106.61.122] has joined #lisp 18:56:38 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has quit [Quit: Offline] 18:57:53 -!- mahata [~mahata@e0109-49-132-11-125.uqwimax.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:57:59 -!- hlavaty [~user@95-88-27-48-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:59:38 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c067b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 18:59:54 jdz [~jdz@host48-16-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 19:01:45 hi 19:02:06 hi 19:02:22 mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:03:03 -!- gonzojive [~red@c-71-198-7-84.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 19:03:34 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has joined #lisp 19:04:25 <_8david> younder: thanks for the bug report; patch pushed 19:05:41 timor [~timor@port-92-195-88-54.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 19:06:28 <_8david> yes, clbuild2 currently assumes naively that quicklisp sits in ~/quicklisp. 19:07:16 Oh and I wrote this simple script to allow me to call clbuild anywhere: 19:07:28 http://paste.lisp.org/display/119222 19:07:57 <_8david> younder: you can symlink the clbuild script into $PATH instead 19:08:45 I put it in ~/bin and did the export PATH=~/bin:$PATH thing 19:09:54 _8david, I have noticed hat you need to be in the clbuild directory for the script to work. Has that also changed with the 2 version? 19:11:59 <_8david> No, that is not meant to be the case. More information would be needed to identify such an issue. 19:12:14 I probably tried something like ln -s /path/clbuild /abinpath/clbuild. 19:13:07 -!- daniel_ is now known as daniel 19:15:28 -!- kclifton [~kclifton@s198-166-45-245.ab.hsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: kclifton] 19:17:57 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:21:23 hi Blkt 19:22:39 <_8david> fe[nl]ix: sorry that I've not given more feedback on your nice create-process stuff. (I've started using it, but I'm still hitting some errors. Most certainly in my code though.) 19:23:34 may I see the code(or an excerpt of it) ? 19:23:55 _8david, No, you are right, the symlink seems to work now. 19:24:29 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has joined #lisp 19:25:44 -!- splittist [~John@146.93.63.81.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.2.1] 19:25:51 -!- CyberDomovoy [~cd@AToulouse-257-1-8-128.w86-221.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 19:27:24 _8david, loved the prepl option 19:28:18 _8david, also sbcl has threads enabled by default. 19:31:28 _8david, Is there a way to make the libraries go somewhere else than under quicklisp in my home directory. I usually prefer them under /usr/local/src.. 19:34:07 bsod1 [~osa1@188.56.208.154] has joined #lisp 19:35:01 urandom__ [~user@p548A72CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:35:30 -!- c|mell [~cmell@175.106.61.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:36:53 -!- Blkt [~user@93-33-130-17.ip44.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:37:13 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 19:38:05 -!- Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:38:20 Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-78-193.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:38:35 -!- pdelgallego_ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:38:42 -!- Kruppe [~user@134.117.27.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:38:47 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:38:56 -!- pdelgallego__ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:39:00 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:40:05 hello lispers! 19:41:23 -!- gko [gko@122-116-15-138.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:41:39 I'm wondering if there is an upper bound on string length? 19:42:07 there's a maximum array dimension that's relevant 19:42:20 clhs ARRAY-DIMENSION-LIMIT 19:42:20 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_ar_dim.htm 19:42:33 antifuchs: yes but its implementation dependant and possibly per element 19:43:11 strings are one-dimensional arrays. that constant gives you the maximum length a string can have on each implementation. 19:43:23 you see on the page that the minimum is 1024. 19:43:59 maximum.. 19:44:18 younder: no. 19:44:27 "which is not less than 1024." 19:44:48 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-093-090.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 19:44:54 Oh, that maximum limit is no less than 1024. 19:44:55 <_8david> fe[nl]ix: sure, although it's probably for me to figure out. 19:45:52 antifuchs: So the lower bound is that a string may always be at least 1024 elements long. 19:45:59 mon_key: that's right 19:46:10 no upper limit except the implementation-defined one 19:47:09 <_8david> It's commit 678c9b2c in the hemlock repo. 19:47:26 antifuchs: Put another way I am checking the length of each string in a list inside of a loop. I'd like to tell the compiler, "hey, this string is supposed to be of lengh ... and by the way it won't be larger than ." 19:48:16 antifuchs: likely this is nearly (unsigned-byte 29) no a 32bit x86 I'm just curious if there is any other way than `array-dimension-limit' :) 19:50:31 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has quit [Quit: Offline] 19:50:51 I don't know of any other 19:51:00 also, note that some implementations have pretty small limits there 19:52:13 antifuchs: Thanks for your help. Really my curiousity was wrt limits, i.e. what are some examples of "small" as I'm only familiar with SBCL. 19:52:15 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757944.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:52:18 vsedach [4546541a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.70.84.26] has joined #lisp 19:52:44 I forget which impl it was, either lispworks or allegro, that has pretty small limits. let me check allegro 19:53:27 16777215 on clisp 19:53:36 right, clisp was it. 19:53:44 allegro has unsigned-byte 29 19:54:29 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@catv-80-98-24-21.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 19:55:01 stassats`: OK thanks. 19:55:13 antifuchs: thanks. 19:55:31 There's CCL as well. 19:57:02 well, it's larger on CCL 19:59:49 So, Clisp allocates 24 bits for arrays. Wonder why? 20:00:02 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-138.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:00:13 mishoo [~mishoo@78.97.160.131] has joined #lisp 20:00:35 because that's how it's implemented? 20:00:39 8 bits of tag room, perhaps. 20:00:43 mon_key: Might have something to do with their fixnum width, might have something to do with the in-memory layout of arrays. 20:01:12 rme [~rme@pool-70-106-129-201.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:01:48 [: Thanks lispers. I'll peek around at the source. 20:01:51 you can ask rme why CCL has the same small array-dimension-limit 20:02:16 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has joined #lisp 20:03:18 CCL's is about each object being preceded with a header word that holds 8 bits of tag and the rest for the object's size. 20:03:42 francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has joined #lisp 20:05:03 what pkhuong said 20:05:14 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A72CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:05:50 kephas [pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-28-169.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 20:06:26 someday we should change our type tagging system in sbcl, just for fun 20:06:35 see how many we can confuse if we reimplement BIBOP 20:07:05 ... You're just trying to get me to finish up and commit wider-fixnums, aren't you?!? :-P 20:07:06 do I mean BIBOP? I think I do, though google disagrees 20:07:24 stupid musicians, taking our namespace with "bibop tagging" 20:07:31 BIg Bag Of Pages? 20:07:42 big bag of... what nyef said 20:08:19 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@206.180.155.43.adsl.hal-pc.org] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:08:25 *Krystof* will invent a tagging scheme that anacronymises to a doo-be du-wop 20:08:50 _8david: ping 20:08:51 -!- moah [~gnu@dslb-092-073-073-135.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #lisp 20:09:02 Dynamic Object Oriented-... 20:09:35 -!- nowhereman [pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-43-167.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:09:35 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:09:41 Big-Endian Doubly-Universal Wide Object Pointers 20:09:43 done 20:09:45 Dynamic Object Based Environment Delta-Update Work Optimization Procedure? 20:11:03 -!- mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:11:26 naming is the hardest part, coming up with the scheme itself should be easy now 20:11:55 doubly-universal is really nice. 20:12:09 stassats`: OHCSOAP, huh? 20:12:11 varjag [~eugene@4.169.249.62.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 20:12:52 tatatatyd: "tag and tag and tag and tag till you drop" 20:13:21 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 20:13:40 tmh^Hwygti: Tag me... well, you get the idea. 20:14:09 "A tag sale on lisp machines!" 20:14:27 minion: what does OHCSOAP stand for? 20:14:27 Oaken Hypoaeolian Coved Staphylodialysis Overclimb Apostrophize Photozincography 20:14:55 One HTML Coder Short Of A Project. 20:15:02 So clisp-2.49/src/array.d for LISPFUN make_array around this comment: 20:15:02 /* table for assignment ATYPE-byte -> vector type info */ 20:15:02 suggests maybe more room could be had? 20:15:10 nyef: that makes sense 20:15:39 mon_key: i'm sure this limit is arbitrary 20:15:43 is not arbitrary 20:16:50 Right, not arbitrary: There are constraints and a fitness function involved. 20:17:16 Dynamic Object-Based Environmentally-Deadly Utterly Wonderful Omg Porn 20:17:39 anyway, you can have larger arrays portably at some cost, just chain several arrays 20:19:03 stassats`: SBCL does that in genesis. Have a look at the "bigvec" stuff at the start of SYS:SRC;COMPILER;GENERIC;GENESIS.LISP. 20:19:18 -!- pchrist_ [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:19:54 sanely bootstrappable on insane compilers 20:19:54 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 20:21:35 -!- nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:21:37 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 20:21:44 nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has joined #lisp 20:22:34 -!- nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:23:40 urandom__ [~user@p548A30F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:23:53 clearly, there should be trivial-big-vector 20:24:13 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-166-53.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:24:48 how often is this limit a problem in practice? 20:24:56 argiopeweb [~elliot@155.31.174.160] has joined #lisp 20:25:43 i'd be a problem for me when using bit-vectors 20:25:59 s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-167-72.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:16 nyef: does it always use bigvec, even if host's array-dimension-limit is sufficiently large? 20:26:29 ok, for bitvectors. 20:26:44 nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has joined #lisp 20:27:13 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 20:27:18 pdelgallego__ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 20:27:29 pdelgallego_ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 20:27:51 -!- Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-093-090.wireless.sfu.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:28:13 stassats`: Yes, as it at least has to go through the abstraction in order to handle cases where the a-d-l isn't large enough. 20:28:55 -!- incandenza [~incandenz@ip68-231-109-244.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 20:29:44 i don't suppose it's a bottleneck 20:30:12 finish-symbols? 20:31:07 Honestly, fasl-parsing is probably more of a bottleneck. 20:34:44 kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has joined #lisp 20:39:43 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-190-151.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:39:57 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:42:37 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:42:46 -!- pdelgallego__ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:42:50 -!- pdelgallego_ [~pdelgalle@1385159852.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:44:26 -!- kamikaza [~kamikaza@80.91.125.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:46:16 incandenza [~incandenz@ip68-231-109-244.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:49:04 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.226] has quit [Quit: Offline] 20:49:34 <_8david> fe[nl]ix: yes? 20:50:39 what is the pty slot of process-connection-mixin ? 20:50:49 a boolean ? 20:51:02 <_8david> erm, yes. Bad naming. 20:52:37 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:53:09 why are there two flavors for each connection mixin ? 20:53:16 /iolib and /qt 20:54:14 ah, backend (eql :qt) 20:55:11 it seems to me that the whole connections.lisp needs a rewrite 20:55:26 <_8david> is it that bad? :-) 20:55:34 mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has joined #lisp 20:59:26 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 20:59:29 -!- Posterdati [~tapioca@host127-230-dynamic.16-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:59:54 -!- zmv is now known as everyone 20:59:57 sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-116-114.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has joined #lisp 21:00:01 _8david: maybe :) 21:01:27 _8david: what are those backends for ? i/o polling ? 21:03:28 <_8david> not certain whay you mean: 21:03:46 <_8david> the "connections" are meant to be an equivalent of emacs "processes", for socket and terminal communication which integrates with hemlock buffers and the hemlock redisplay loop. 21:04:06 <_8david> hemlock itself has different "redisplay backends" (tty, x11, qt) which each require a particular "i/o backend" (tty and x11 use iolib, qt uses qt). 21:04:52 ah, I see 21:05:09 I was under the impression that the qt display backend used iolib as well 21:05:36 Posterdati [~tapioca@host127-230-dynamic.16-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 21:05:48 gonzojive [~red@171.66.94.226] has joined #lisp 21:06:43 -!- incandenza [~incandenz@ip68-231-109-244.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 21:07:24 <_8david> No. To use qt and iolib in the same image, we'd have to move Qt calls into a thread different from the hemlock thread, and have them talk over a pipe where needed. 21:07:39 <_8david> ... and in the past, I was happy to have the qtconnections, because they work on windows. But perhaps the better strategy is to just port iolib to windows. 21:08:30 /whois fe[nl]ix 21:08:34 DOH 21:08:36 :D 21:09:02 AndroUser2 [~androirc@158.sub-174-253-216.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 21:09:47 <_8david> (As an alternative to separate threads, one could in theory try to find the xlib fd used by qt and watch it using iolib to "merge" the two event loops. Doesn't sound very attractive to me though.) 21:10:11 Fare [~Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 21:10:52 redline6561 [~user@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:11:07 Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has joined #lisp 21:11:08 Kruppe [~user@134.117.27.223] has joined #lisp 21:11:41 hi 21:11:49 Posterdati: Hello again. 21:11:54 nyef: hi 21:12:03 incandenza [~incandenz@ip68-231-109-244.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:12:06 nyef: there's a problem with the software I told yesterday 21:12:12 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.46.150] has joined #lisp 21:12:20 Only getting the first three octets from the serial port? 21:12:25 _8david: that doesn't sound that bad 21:12:28 nyef: the entire project was canceled this morning 21:12:34 Ouch! 21:12:48 nyef: the project manager told me that Lisp is not a professional language 21:12:49 _8david: IIRC, qt's loop can be embedded into glib's 21:12:54 so, no problems anymore 21:12:59 -!- AndroUser2 [~androirc@158.sub-174-253-216.myvzw.com] has quit [Quit: Bye] 21:13:16 yes I told him "fuck off" and now I'm without job :) lol 21:13:28 Posterdati: ... not a professional language? Did he man "not a code monkey" one? ;D 21:13:28 More time to chat with us on IRC, yay. 21:13:30 oops (; 21:13:34 that was... unprofessional 21:13:35 That's... possibly taking things a bit far, but... 21:13:49 nyef: but I like to solve that for myselef 21:14:13 nyef: it's a long story... 21:14:52 nyef: culture is scaring and dangerous for certain people 21:15:11 Posterdati: hmmm.. start your own company? :) 21:15:24 Sounds like the kind of story that is best told over a beer, or something like that. 21:15:28 p_l|backup: yes, I'm a freelance engineer 21:15:30 That seems to be the only solution. 21:16:10 my only guilt was try to bring new ideas for old solutions 21:16:35 Davidbrcz [david@212-198-92-25.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 21:17:00 nyef: no worries, there's no way for some casual log-reader to figure out that Posterdati is Angelo Rossi. 21:17:00 for me it's fascinating learn Lisp just to achieve more reliable projects 21:17:17 Xach: yes it is me 21:17:19 -!- everyone is now known as zmv 21:17:27 Don't tell anyone! 21:17:27 no they're not 21:17:33 lol 21:17:35 at least i'm not zmv 21:17:51 it was bitter, but this is the life :) 21:17:56 -!- Zephyrus [~emanuele@unaffiliated/zephyrus] has quit [Quit: ""] 21:18:14 I'm not a genius nor a "master of all" 21:18:36 wait, who highlighted me? 21:18:45 At least, they canceled it before starting. My project was canceled after two months, when the other programmers not on the project realized they didn't know lisp. 21:18:46 _8david: and the without-interrupts macro looks very bogus on an SMP system 21:19:00 nyef 21:19:08 nyef: would you like to take a look at my code? 21:19:51 pjb: but lisp gives you super-powers, so you don't need other programmers 21:20:16 That's probably what frighten them. 21:20:33 Posterdati: Might as well. Put it somewhere I can get at and I'll take a look. 21:20:48 nyef: ok, wait a minute 21:22:29 <_8david> fe[nl]ix: the without-interrupts in ioconnections.lisp was only used between fork and exec, and was needed so that GC doesn't run in the fork. 21:23:05 <_8david> There is an older without-interrupts sprinkled over the code base, but that one isn't my fault :-). In fact, I've removed this sort of thing when I've seen it. 21:23:19 _8david: I see that it's used in many more places 21:23:50 ah, there are tow of them 21:24:07 <_8david> ... sometimes with a bad feeling, since evidently the old codebase included a lot of effort to make hemlock debugging interruption safe, so that you wouldn't accidentally run the debugger in an inner redisplay function, where debugging can only fail. 21:24:59 -!- vsedach [4546541a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.70.84.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:26:36 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:26:45 actually, with Lisp, you can maintain your own implementation *and* deliver outstanding applications. 21:27:08 nyef: http://paste.lisp.org/display/119224 21:28:04 mouflon [skajohan@Psilocybe.Update.UU.SE] has joined #lisp 21:28:14 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-190-151.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:30:18 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@78.97.160.131] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:30:29 are sbcl cvs servers and maxima's cvs servers down ? 21:30:40 sf.net have taken cvs down for now, apparently 21:30:41 homie: sf has been down for days 21:30:52 homie: probably still is. 21:30:55 eheh, ok sorry 21:30:59 i wonderd just 21:31:05 np. 21:31:06 that i couldn't login 21:31:17 -!- stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:31:18 they "identified a direct attack vector" 21:31:24 -!- bsod1 [~osa1@188.56.208.154] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:31:27 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:31:31 Posterdati: This is output-only? 21:31:34 ah ok, so it may get back online again ? 21:31:46 someone left the server hamster cage door open 21:31:48 sure. not sure on the timelines though 21:31:56 ok that's it 21:32:06 thanks 21:32:17 Posterdati: Doesn't look like the input side is connected. 21:32:36 nyef: wait a minute 21:35:13 And what's the actual failure mode? The second UNIX-READ blocks? 21:35:47 nyef: look at get-message 21:36:00 Yes, I found that. 21:36:04 But there are no callers. 21:36:06 -!- z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:36:37 And START-COMMUNICATION doesn't hold the port open. 21:37:12 nyef: the original version has got a loop on get-essage 21:37:15 ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 21:37:16 ... And, now that I think of it, SEND-MESSAGE fondly imagines that FD is a STREAM, and it's not. 21:37:17 nyef: the original version has got a loop on get-message 21:37:33 HG` [~HG@xdslec198.osnanet.de] has joined #lisp 21:37:41 lirt [~user@188.16.143.17] has joined #lisp 21:39:02 The array-munging in GET-MESSAGE is painful to see, and ISTM that either you don't understand how CRC codes work, or the protocol is using them in an utterly bizarre fashion. 21:39:46 nyef: crc code? What's wrong? 21:41:03 machine send a crc code with every binary message 21:41:04 You're checking to see if the computed CRC for the received message is equal to the CRC checksum field in the message, where the entire point is that putting the CRC checksum into the message alters the overall checksum to be a constant. 21:41:26 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-116-114.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:41:52 So, transmitting, you compute the CRC as if the checksum field were zero, then overwrite the checksum field with the computed CRC. Receiving, you just compute the overall CRC and it should be a known constant. 21:42:05 nyef: crc16 doesn't alter the message crc 21:42:22 It's a general property of CRC codes. 21:42:58 received message has its own crc code, it isn't altered 21:43:03 csamuelson [~user@173-14-110-121-nashville.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 21:43:22 Mmm. I'm also not seeing the initializer value for the CRC codes. 21:43:35 So, either you have it wrong or the protocol has it wrong. 21:44:10 Anyway, that's not what you asked me to look into. 21:44:18 nyef: mmmh, get-message assemble byte in two arrays: one is the header, the other is the body of the message 21:44:38 You were saying that you only received the first three octets of the message, which corresponds to the first UNIX-READ call? 21:44:51 message = 3 bytes header, n bytes data, and 2 bytes crc 21:44:55 nyef: yes 21:45:17 nyef: generally int the second read I've got 11 21:45:47 Eleven octets of how many expected? 21:46:51 nyef: sorry, but '(unsigned-byte 8) does it mean unsigned-byte 8 bit? 21:47:04 Yes, 8-bit unsigned bytes. 21:47:09 good 21:47:17 then 3 bytes for header 21:47:26 n byte for body 21:47:32 2 bytes for crc code 21:47:37 tfb_ [~tfb@restormel.cley.com] has joined #lisp 21:47:38 n = header(2) 21:47:48 -!- tfb_ is now known as tfb 21:48:20 Okay. 21:48:58 -!- rme [~rme@pool-70-106-129-201.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: rme] 21:49:49 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:49:53 -!- npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:50:46 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:52:41 -!- argiopeweb [~elliot@155.31.174.160] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:53:21 jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.123] has joined #lisp 21:53:24 So, if you're typically getting 11 octets on the second read, what's the actual problem? 21:54:18 (Aside from GET-MESSAGE having a couple of silent-failure conditions, and a tendency to drop useful-looking bits of information like error codes on the floor instead of reporting them.) 21:54:57 sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-112-137.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has joined #lisp 21:55:30 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 21:56:06 nyef: I've got only three bytes at all 21:56:45 Oh. You're expecting 11, but not getting any? 21:57:27 Or are getting an error code of some sort from the second read? 21:57:48 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:57:55 second unix-read gave me sometimes error 11 21:58:04 where are you reading from? is the stuff actually sent on the other side? 21:58:13 Fare: serial port 21:58:47 Umm... What's the value of SB-POSIX:EWOULDBLOCK ? 21:58:52 (Hint: 11.) 21:59:36 -!- Landr [~vser@78-22-154-231.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59:50 nyef: it's a non blocking i/o 21:59:50 -!- jdz [~jdz@host48-16-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:59:58 -!- csamuelson [~user@173-14-110-121-nashville.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:00:03 My point exactly! 22:00:36 mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:00:52 Guest71153 [~Adium@he190123.dsl.fsr.net] has joined #lisp 22:00:55 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-216-137.vologda.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:00:55 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:01:19 -!- mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:01:24 hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has joined #lisp 22:01:30 -!- sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: I've fallen through a crack in this matrix!] 22:01:46 mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:02:49 jrope [~androirc@158.sub-174-253-216.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 22:02:56 -!- Guest71153 is now known as mynameis 22:04:28 -!- jrope [~androirc@158.sub-174-253-216.myvzw.com] has quit [Client Quit] 22:05:24 So, anyway, if you don't catch an EWOULDBLOCK on the second read, you're probably going to get a short read... And that's if you don't get a short read on the /first/ read. 22:06:18 ewould block? What is it? 22:06:32 -!- lirt [~user@188.16.143.17] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:06:44 EWOULDBLOCK is "you asked to read data, but there isn't any to give you". 22:06:44 -!- jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.123] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:07:09 If you're using blocking I/O, then it would wait until there was data instead. 22:07:13 error 11? 22:07:29 nyef: but I need non blocking 22:07:46 Right! So you need to deal with EWOULDBLOCK and short reads explicitly. 22:07:55 count = 0? 22:09:28 If COUNT is zero then either you tried to read zero bytes or the FD is at EOF, the latter of which cannot happen on serial ports or network sockets. 22:10:01 You might find it instructive to look at how non-blocking I/O works in C and posix. 22:10:12 -!- sonnym [~evissecer@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:11:03 nyef: can too, if you have cooked mode enabled on the serial port tty, a control-d will turn into an EOF. And a remote-close looks like EOF on a network socket. 22:11:11 Okay, fair enough. 22:11:55 Actually, that's a point. I can't tell that this thing is setting the port to RAW mode, so if a 4 /does/ come down the pipe... 22:12:15 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:12:29 (Might be that I just can't recognize it due to unfamiliarity with the serial port controls.) 22:13:16 nyef: is the same configuration of c program that works 22:15:11 nyef pasted "For Posterdati: The heart of a (flawed) example of using UNIX-READ for non-blocking I/O (from CLXS)" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/119225 22:16:12 This is for networking, but the basic idea is the same. 22:17:41 francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has joined #lisp 22:18:21 Lymia_ [~moe@adsl-69-149-35-99.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 22:19:36 pjb` [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 22:19:57 m4dnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 22:20:05 -!- ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:21:11 -!- Lymia [~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:21:13 -!- pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:21:13 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:22:41 -!- gonzojive [~red@171.66.94.226] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 22:23:52 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:24:53 -!- m4dnificent is now known as madnificent 22:25:25 ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 22:27:59 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-080-092.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 22:29:41 Did CFFI have a FINALIZE function at some point? 22:29:50 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@dhcp-162.mirrorimage.net] has quit [Quit: hargettp] 22:30:09 Sounds more like something I'd expect from TRIVIAL-GARBAGE. 22:30:18 I think so, and that it moved to trivial-garbage 22:30:29 but that was years ago 22:30:30 :D 22:30:33 nyef / adeht: thanks. 22:31:00 nyef: thanks 22:31:03 Yeah, I'm using this library that hasn't changed since 2007. It was trying to call finalize and crashing, figured it was something from CFFI. 22:31:16 nyef: I'll try it tomorrow 22:31:35 Posterdati: Good luck, then. 22:31:55 -!- Davidbrcz [david@212-198-92-25.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:32:08 serichsen [~user@f048169013.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 22:32:13 Good evening! 22:32:17 Posterdati: There's a good bit of context for the snippet I posted, including the use of SERVE-EVENT, but you should be able to figure most of it out from that... Or at least how to use it for your case. 22:35:03 nyef: I printed it 22:35:20 serichsen: good evening! 22:35:26 drafael [~tapio@mail.faulkner.co.nz] has joined #lisp 22:36:34 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@217-162-131-235.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:37:19 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-216-137.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 22:37:30 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.46.150] has quit [Quit: Offline] 22:38:14 tmh [639725e8@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has joined #lisp 22:38:20 Greetings lispers. 22:38:22 -!- superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has quit [Quit: superflit] 22:38:27 (herep rtoym) 22:38:43 superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has joined #lisp 22:39:02 -!- superflit [~superflit@140.226.49.148] has quit [Client Quit] 22:41:06 pavelludiq [57f63ac1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.246.58.193] has joined #lisp 22:42:06 minion: message for rtoym: CVS on sourceforge is still down and in the attack report they mention making the CVS service end-of-life. http://sourceforge.net/blog/sourceforge-attack-full-report/ 22:42:06 i agree - message for rtoym cvs on sourceforge is still down and in the attack report they mention making the cvs service end of life httpsourceforge netblogsourceforge attack full report 22:42:26 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:42:26 Ugh, memo. 22:42:33 minion: memo for rtoym: CVS on sourceforge is still down and in the attack report they mention making the CVS service end-of-life. http://sourceforge.net/blog/sourceforge-attack-full-report/ 22:42:34 Remembered. I'll tell rtoym when he/she/it next speaks. 22:42:35 tmh: Heh. I saw that. 22:42:35 rtoym, memo from tmh: CVS on sourceforge is still down and in the attack report they mention making the CVS service end-of-life. http://sourceforge.net/blog/sourceforge-attack-full-report/ 22:43:09 rtoym: Okay. Thought it might be apropos since you were thinking about migrating to something else. 22:43:23 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Quit: bye] 22:43:31 That's what started the thought. 22:43:48 (Well, besides fe[nl]ix asking about it just a few before.) 22:44:03 francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has joined #lisp 22:44:14 22:44:14 -anthony.freenode.net- *** No Ident response [23:44] 22:44:14 *** Welcome to the freenode Internet Relay Chat Network francogrex 22:44:18 *** Your host is anthony.freenode.net[208.71.169.36/6667], running version 22:44:20 Ah, okay. I just noticed it because I was trying, again, to create a git mirror of maxima and wanted to know why it was still down. 22:44:21 ircd-seven-1.0.3 22:44:24 *** This server was created Tue Feb 23 2010 at 15:01:20 PST 22:44:27 *** anthony.freenode.net ircd-seven-1.0.3 DOQRSZaghilopswz 22:44:29 CFILMPQbcefgijklmnopqrstvz 22:44:32 *** CHANTYPES=# EXCEPTS INVEX CHANMODES=eIbq,k,flj,CFLMPQcgimnprstz 22:44:36 CHANLIMIT=#:120 PREFIX=(ov)@+ MAXLIST=bqeI:100 MODES=4 NETWORK=freenode 22:44:39 KNOCK STATUSMSG=@+ CALLERID=g are supported by this server 22:44:42 *** SAFELIST ELIST=U CASEMAPPING=rfc1459 CHARSET=ascii NICKLEN=16 22:44:45 CHANNELLEN=50 TOPICLEN=390 ETRACE CPRIVMSG CNOTICE DEAF=D MONITOR=100 are 22:44:48 supported by this server 22:44:49 francogrex: stop it 22:44:51 *** FNC 22:44:54 TARGMAX=NAMES:1,LIST:1,KICK:1,WHOIS:1,PRIVMSG:4,NOTICE:4,ACCEPT:,MONITOR: 22:44:58 EXTBAN=$,arx WHOX CLIENTVER=3.0 are supported by this server 22:45:01 *** There are 464 users and 66050 invisible on 26 servers 22:45:03 *** 32 operator(s) online 22:45:06 *** 7 unknown connection(s) 22:45:09 I'm always amused by people saying use the the popular vcs. This is Lisp people. If that were the criterion, you shouldn't be using Lisp! :-) 22:45:11 *** 34692 channels formed 22:45:14 *** I have 7644 clients and 1 servers 22:45:14 *** Current local users 7644, max 8071 22:45:17 *** Current global users 66514, max 70107 22:45:20 *** Highest connection count: 8072 (8071 clients) (625845 connections 22:45:24 received) 22:45:27 *** - anthony.freenode.net Message of the Day - 22:45:30 *** - Welcome to anthony.freenode.net in Irvine, CA, USA! Thanks to 22:45:31 Operator where are you?!?!? 22:45:33 *** - Network Data Center Host, Inc. (www.ndchost.com) for sponsoring 22:45:36 *** - this server! 22:45:39 prxq: asking someone who clearly did a paste-o to stop it isn't much use, since there's not really anything they can do about it afaik. 22:45:40 *** - 22:45:41 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Xach 22:45:43 *** - ANTHONY, PIERS [1934-]. Author of many novels and short 22:45:44 -!- francogrex [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has been kicked from #lisp by Xach (francogrex) 22:45:49 -!- Xach has set mode -o Xach 22:46:19 foom: well. you never know :-) 22:46:22 who is? 22:46:23 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:46:32 rtoym: There are only so many "unpopular" tools a person can use at once. :-) 22:47:21 rtoym: there's also the question of the quality of the tool itself... if not for certain high-profile groups nor certain sites, Git's technical superiority wouldn't help it in attaining userbase 22:47:23 tmh: Or if I use this vcs, then there will be more developers! Yeah, right. 22:47:33 francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has joined #lisp 22:47:47 I remember that it took it quite a long time to get there, and SVN is still the top dog afaik 22:48:07 Alright, I'm out, just wanted to drop that piece of information. I hope they get CVS back up soon, I really would like to make a git mirror of maxima. I guess I could grab a source tarball, create a git repository and sync up with CVS when it get's back. 22:48:09 p_l|backup: Who said anything about git? 22:48:29 s/get's/gets/ 22:48:36 stupid stray apostrophe. 22:48:44 tmh: I have a maxima backup, but it was done on Jan 15. If you want it, you can have it. 22:49:11 rtoym: Thanks, don't trouble yourself, I'll just grab a standard tarball, it's no big deal. 22:49:12 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@67-194-112-137.wireless.umnet.umich.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:49:27 rtoym: you prefer cvs to git? 22:49:39 tmh: Well, it's the entire cvs repo. Just a tar and an scp. 22:50:06 rtoym: ah... I got confused in the middle of a pastestorm :) 22:51:01 prxq: Not having really used git (or hg or svn), I can most definitely say I prefer cvs. What I know is has got to be way better! 22:51:04 :-) 22:51:10 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has left #lisp 22:51:16 ok! 22:53:09 But frankly, cvs has done everything I've ever needed it to do. I do wish branches had better names, and I wish versioning of directories existed, but when you don't have those, you tend not to do things that aren't well supported. 22:53:18 i don't quite understand why ending cvs support will improve security 22:53:36 rtoym: well, that is true 22:54:02 They did say something about cvs not scaling very well to their architecture. Whatever that means. 22:54:23 but otoh, if you had the freedom to do them, you'd probably use it. 22:54:43 rtoym: that sounds pretty strange to me. 22:55:02 Maybe a dvcs means people won't bang on sf so much. 22:55:18 rtoym: what track directories ? 22:55:32 prxq: Maybe I misread the blog. 22:55:49 rtoym: no, i read that too! 22:55:57 Brodgimar [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/brodgimar] has joined #lisp 22:56:23 "due to limitations in CVS itself, cannot readily live on our scalable network storage solution." <-- yo. 22:56:27 They didn't really elaborate on why CVS did not fit into their system. 22:56:33 fe[nl]ix: What? 22:56:48 maybe they're using some sort of distributed file system that doesn't support locking very well 22:56:48 "... and I wish versioning of directories existed" 22:56:55 ...which is pretty much required for CVS 22:57:07 antifuchs: sounds plausible. 22:57:08 (lockfiles in directories, I mean) 22:57:16 antifuchs: like... nfs? 22:57:25 Nightmare File System? 22:57:26 prxq: possibly! 22:57:34 prxq: or some even more decoupled thing 22:57:52 two dinosaurs that never got along 22:57:56 Nosferatu File System 22:57:58 fe[nl]ix: cvs doesn't do a very nice job of keep track of where files get moved to or removed. 22:58:40 what does that have to do with tracking directories ? 22:58:46 rtoym: that's true. modern vcs are a relly more convenient. 22:58:55 I like using a DVCS because I can create a manage a private little branch with custom modifications. 22:59:09 s/a manage/and manage/ 23:00:13 fe[nl]ix: Keeping track of what was in a directory. But I guess that can be kept track of by what's in the directory itself. 23:00:27 Alright, I'm really out this time, have a great day/night! 23:00:28 -!- tmh [639725e8@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has left #lisp 23:00:56 kwabbles [~kwabbles@bloodyhead.wavesnake.com] has joined #lisp 23:00:59 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A30F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:01:07 *rtoym* should also stop talking about this before he gets kicked for starting an off-topic thread. 23:01:29 rtoym: btw, git doesn't track renames at all. 23:01:51 rtoym: well, what vcs cmucl will use in future is on topic, more or less... 23:01:54 rtoym: it just tracks file contents, and then it can tell you (with a bit of computation) that 60% of an older file are in that new file over there (: 23:02:00 antifuchs: no? 23:02:03 (which I think is pretty neat) 23:02:07 It doesn't? 23:02:11 nope 23:02:33 it does do removes and adds, and sanely. but there is no atomic "rename" operation 23:02:49 git mv ? 23:03:07 well, sure. as a ui thing. but it's tracked as a remove and add 23:04:02 As long as it can keep track somehow, it's ok. I'm familiar with clearcase which has a mv, but somehow I always got the feeling it was done via metainfo generated by the move. 23:04:25 right. no metainfo. bit more compute power intensive, but worth it, I think 23:04:31 (lets you track refactorings more nicely) 23:05:19 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c067b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: good night] 23:05:34 rtoym: When CVS commits a change containing modifications to more than one file, there is no guarantee that all changes will be committed together or none will be. It's a problem when multiple developers are working on the same code, since half of a set of changes can get committed to the repository. 23:06:22 So much for ACID transactions, huh? 23:06:36 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.92.34] has quit [Disconnected by services] 23:06:37 reb`: Oh, yeah. I forgot about that "feature". Fairly rare, though. 23:06:39 -!- mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:06:41 more like transactions on acid (: 23:06:47 lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.89.69] has joined #lisp 23:06:51 blitz_ [~blitz@erwin.inf.tu-dresden.de] has joined #lisp 23:08:27 Good morning everyone! 23:09:36 beach: good morning! Are you in VN? 23:10:12 Hello beach. 23:12:58 fantazo [~fantazo@178-191-161-157.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 23:13:17 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 23:13:55 -!- kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:15:15 this is lisp. aren't we supposed to right our own dvcs? outsourcing the job to the haskell folks was clearly a losing strategy. 23:15:49 s/right/write/ 23:16:37 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.89.69] has quit [Disconnected by services] 23:16:48 lemoinem [~swoog@216.252.89.217] has joined #lisp 23:18:03 *Xach* thinks back to MCVS 23:18:04 -!- Lymia_ is now known as Lymia 23:18:05 -!- Lymia [~moe@adsl-69-149-35-99.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Changing host] 23:18:05 Lymia [~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan] has joined #lisp 23:18:57 -!- varjag [~eugene@4.169.249.62.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 23:22:08 -!- Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-080-092.wireless.sfu.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:22:39 -!- corruptmemory [~jim@96.246.167.18] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:25:01 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-080-092.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 23:25:39 -!- serichsen [~user@f048169013.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Good night!] 23:25:49 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-141-167-24.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:27:05 -!- Kruppe [~user@134.117.27.223] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:28:21 sabalaba [~sabalaba@c-71-227-118-15.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:29:07 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.214.192] has joined #lisp 23:29:26 -!- HG` [~HG@xdslec198.osnanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:29:48 francogrex [~user@109.130.200.172] has joined #lisp 23:30:20 this is from ppcre to encode from string to url http://paste.lisp.org/display/119231. How to do the reverse? 23:30:48 -!- adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adamvh] 23:31:03 -!- Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 23:31:04 doing the reverse is possible but horrible to do with a regex 23:31:36 Fare: is there an easier way? 23:31:41 Grazl [~Grazl@188.Red-83-49-132.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 23:31:53 why is it horrible? 23:32:03 Surely it's not that hard? 23:32:05 -!- tfb [~tfb@restormel.cley.com] has quit [Quit: sleeping] 23:32:29 also you should be using utf-8 encoding instead of char-code/code-char (no matter what overall strategy you use) 23:32:53 Use a regex of "%[0-9A-F][0-9A-F]", and a suitable CONVERT function, surely? 23:33:58 adamvh [~adamvh@pool-71-179-82-48.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:34:10 I find myself facing the conversion issue when using CGIs 23:34:26 brb 23:34:41 -!- timor [~timor@port-92-195-88-54.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:34:49 -!- ZabaQ [~Zaba@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:34:57 mathguru123 [~mathguru1@c-24-11-171-16.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:35:03 -!- HET2 [~diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:35:06 ... CGI? In this day and age? Seriously? 23:35:59 "... Shell scripts? In this day and age?" 23:36:04 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:36:16 slyrus: Which dvcs is written in haskell? I forget. 23:36:42 rtoym: DARCS, maybe? 23:37:15 (Patch theory is interesting, but flawed in actual use.) 23:37:16 nyef: CGI it's not for regular use; but resuscitating some old programs I had 23:37:20 Sounds about right. 23:37:27 francogrex: Fair enough, I guess. 23:37:36 (DARCS, not the theory. I don't know anything about the theory.) 23:39:36 Fare: Yes, I am in VN, have been here for 7 weeks, and I will stay another 5 months. 23:40:16 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-137-218.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:43:26 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:44:06 beach: congrats. Could not make it this year. Will you be there next year and/or in december? 23:44:29 Fare: For how long? I might be here again then. 23:46:32 dunno yet 23:46:42 I'd like to go there for at least 4 weeks. 23:47:03 I wanna start an outsourcing software company at some point 23:47:26 Fare: Good plan! Do you know enough about the culture? 23:48:06 Thanks to my mom, I know about what the culture was in the 1960s... 23:48:15 does that count? 23:48:34 Fare: 'fraid not. At least it wouldn't be enough for running a company. 23:49:45 We'll see. 23:50:04 I'm still at ITA for now, anyway. 23:50:25 Fare: I see. You'll probably learn fast if you try it.. Do you need Lispers then? 23:50:31 I will. 23:50:41 That's the plan, anyway. 23:50:41 Fare: I am the person to contact! 23:50:50 I know, hence I'm contacting you! 23:50:59 Heh! OK. 23:51:49 -!- myu2 [~myu2@v077103.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:52:12 I have two good ones lined up now, and two or three that worked for me in the past, two of which did their internship for Didier Verna in Paris. Those would be very valuable to you, I would think. 23:52:37 yup. 23:55:30 Fare: After Tet, I am planning to give a series of seminars about Lisp. If there is any message you want me to pass on, let me know. 23:56:54 -!- Wraithan [~wraithan@206.125.170.2] has left #lisp 23:57:30 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 23:57:33 myu2 [~myu2@v077103.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #lisp 23:58:15 Well I'm looking for Lisp hackers in VN interested in working for me - but I don't have a start date yet - prob not until Sept 2011 at the earliest 23:59:50 Fare: Sure. I understand. 23:59:55 skalawag [~user@c75-111-102-202.amrlcmta01.tx.dh.suddenlink.net] has joined #lisp 23:59:57 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@178-191-161-157.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]