00:07:10 davazp [~user@83.54.164.142] has joined #lisp 00:08:02 -!- clop [~jared@moat3.centtech.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:17:02 tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:20:29 clop [~jared@moat3.centtech.com] has joined #lisp 00:20:43 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:21:34 -!- tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:22:03 -!- ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@84.93.175.16] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:23:34 -!- srolls [~user@167.216.131.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:23:35 abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:23:54 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-67-1.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 00:26:35 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-34-240.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:31:11 xyxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.13.12] has joined #lisp 00:36:01 -!- bgs101 is now known as bgs100 00:36:33 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-30-208.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:36:37 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-194-110.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 00:38:05 -!- Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-67-1.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:39:06 -!- retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:41:44 -!- ][V][ICHAEL [~user@207.178.208.5] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:42:38 -!- abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:44:36 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-30-208.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 00:44:36 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl13-205-37.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 00:45:38 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483C18A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:48:25 -!- sykopomp [~user@c-66-41-249-30.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:50:13 sykopomp [~user@c-66-41-249-30.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:50:44 -!- fatblueduck [~chris@rrcs-67-52-188-98.west.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:50:59 fatblueduck [~chris@99-188-214-127.lightspeed.grgvca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:51:28 -!- fatblueduck [~chris@99-188-214-127.lightspeed.grgvca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:52:52 -!- sykopomp [~user@c-66-41-249-30.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:52:52 sykopomp [~user@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 00:53:48 pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 00:55:10 Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 00:55:47 fatblueduck [~chris@rrcs-67-52-188-98.west.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:59:14 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 01:00:08 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:00:43 Do I need to use flexi-streams or babel to read unicode characters with read-sequence? 01:01:02 jonSmith [~JSmith700@ip24-250-13-137.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 01:01:30 I don't want to read by lines, but I would like utf-8 characters to be interpreted as single tokens 01:01:53 And the way should preferably be portable. 01:02:15 -!- em is now known as emma 01:03:32 You can't even portably depend on the implementation supporting unicode code-points for its characters. 01:03:45 -!- aidalgol [~user@202.36.179.65] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:03:46 Or should I just loop with read-char? 01:04:09 Ok, say I want it to work with sbcl and ccl... 01:04:23 At least 01:04:33 Just specify a unicode external-format when creating the stream? 01:05:43 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:06:12 -!- echo-area [~echo-area@114.251.86.0] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:06:27 I tried that, but I get invalid external-format: "utf-8" 01:07:14 http://paste.lisp.org/display/113687 01:07:54 This is a very quick hack... I just wanted to get started to get some data in 01:08:35 abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:09:16 in sbcl, what is an 'unaligned function object'? 01:09:48 And the buffer type is (SIMPLE-BASE-STRING 1024) 01:09:53 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 01:10:41 jonSmith: Where and how did you find that concept? 01:11:08 peterhil: in ccl, the usual way to specify an external format is as a keyword. e.g., :utf-8. See http://ccl.clozure.com/ccl-documentation.html#Unicode 01:11:24 jonSmith: Because I'm not even sure how to disalign a function object while having it still be recognized by the system. 01:11:40 well, i've been messing with the python internals, and i've got it buffering instructions, except when i compile/load a fasl, it comes out unaligned 01:11:52 but when i compile it to core, it seems fine 01:12:20 peterhil: Same applies to SBCL. Use a keyword. 01:12:55 does it just mean that i missed emitting a byte somewhere in the function header 01:12:56 jonSmith: That seems odd. What exactly are you trying to do? 01:13:03 or is there a deeper issue? 01:13:16 retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has joined #lisp 01:13:23 well i was trying to break up the compilation process into an extra step 01:13:47 so you emit your vops, you emit 'instructions' then you emit machine code 01:13:56 right now you go straight from vops to machine code 01:14:01 This is one of those things where you have a symptom that could have a vast number of causes, and there's no real way to tell which applies without digging into it. 01:14:40 yeah, i know, it was kind of a shot in the dark asking 01:15:05 One thing you might try is hitting the fasl with a hexdump utility. 01:15:10 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl13-205-37.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 01:15:54 ooh good idea 01:15:59 i will try that 01:16:06 (Somewhere in my possible-future-projects list is rewriting the fasloader/dumper to use a more declarative format description, making it easier to write utilities to inspect and manipulate fasls.) 01:16:24 jonSmith: there's already a peephole and scheduling pass. 01:16:38 You might also try grabbing a code-component in memory that isn't broken, and hexdumping that. 01:16:52 It's disabled by default on x86, but you may not have to rewrite it all. 01:17:08 well, no peephole, really, but scheduling. 01:17:11 -!- rdd [~user@c83-250-48-164.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:17:20 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 01:17:43 yeah, i'm using primitives from the scheduler to buffer the emitted instructions 01:17:44 Having a peephole optimization pass is a sign that your code generator sucks. 01:17:48 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@212095007032.public.telering.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:17:48 hargettp [~anonymous@pool-71-184-181-149.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:18:26 idk, seems like most compilers have that pass 01:18:40 nyef: yeah, well, it's cheap and effective. 01:18:40 nyef and rme: Thanks, now it seems to work. 01:19:19 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:19:25 pkhuong_ can you point me at the peephole code (if there is any) 01:19:28 pkhuong_: Not disputing that. 01:20:04 jonSmith: it's the scheduler. ISTR some stuff about peepholing with it, but I might be confused with an old local branch. 01:20:25 oh ok 01:24:58 hi, a question about pathnames :-) 01:25:19 davazp: The answer is "oh, god. don't do that." What was the question again? 01:25:20 can I assume parse-namestring will return the same pathname from which was generated with `namestring'? 01:25:44 ... Probably not, no. 01:25:47 not generally, no. 01:26:25 -!- legumbre_ is now known as legumbre 01:26:26 Specifically I would like a enough-pathname function 01:26:42 Similar to enough-namestring? 01:26:51 yes, to avoid work with namestrings 01:26:52 Something doesn't seem right there. 01:28:34 probably, I don't know very well pathnames certainly. Let me explain that I try to do 01:29:00 tcleval [~funnyguy@186.213.58.231] has joined #lisp 01:29:22 what do you guys use for GUI on common lisp? 01:29:36 tcleval: emacs? 01:29:53 Occasionally something involving CLX, but usually emacs. 01:30:05 davazp: if that had any importance, you could internalize your pathnames. 01:30:24 I have a absolute pathname pointing to a directory [unix], and other one pointing to a file in a subdirectory from the previous 01:30:49 what do you mean by emacs? I didnt know you could use emacs to draw windows and buttons 01:31:08 I want 'rebase' the second pathname to other, replacing the parts of the path which match with the first 01:31:12 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:31:34 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 01:31:35 so you want merge-pathnames? 01:31:55 davazp: couldn't you use logical pathname and logical pathname translations? 01:32:09 Emacs has a huge number of features, true, but there's also the possibility that you don't -need- such things in your interface. 01:32:16 debiandebian [~chatzilla@ntszok008244.szok.nt.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 01:32:17 jonSmith: I would like, but I would replace only part of the directory component. I don't know :-) 01:32:39 Mesh [~Mesh@216.201.34.14] has joined #lisp 01:32:40 pjb: maybe, I don't know logical pathnames.. , if you think it could work, I will try 01:32:51 davazp: You have two absolute pathnames, or one absolute pathname and one relative pathname? 01:33:23 -!- abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:33:23 davazp: well, it depends on what you want to do. You with logical pathname, you would have to start from logical pathnames, not from a unix pathname. That's the question. Couldn't you have logical pathnames to begin with? 01:33:36 both absolute. For this reason I wanted enough-pathname 01:33:38 tcleval: now you know! 01:33:40 nyef: so you can do with emacs things like you do with tk/gtk/qt? or are you restricted to draw inside the editor area? 01:34:22 i think there is a tcl/tk library for common lisp 01:34:26 tcleval: Typically, inside the editor area, with bitmapped images. But that gets you quite a bit. 01:34:27 pjb: I don't believe, I begin with pathnames from a asdf system 01:34:47 Again, for a whole lot of things, just using emacs + slime + a bit of elisp gets you quite far. 01:34:48 jonSmith: yes there are some 01:34:49 nyef, stassats: can you give an example of some application done that way? 01:35:02 Slime? 01:35:32 slime itself is an example, yes. 01:35:45 A lot of my stuff can just be run from slime-repl. 01:36:05 and a great one! some more? :) 01:36:09 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Ping timeout: 259 seconds] 01:36:19 Some of what I have planned could be run from slime-repl if the bloody presentations weren't so anemic. 01:36:24 likewise it is not very important, I will use a non-portable solution then 01:36:27 Hey, struct question. Does an instance of a structure have a means of refering to itself, like with this-> in C++? 01:36:33 thanks! 01:36:43 Or is it bad practice to have an instance alter its own state..? 01:36:48 Mesh: no 01:37:16 Mesh: you are completely wrong. 01:37:17 Mesh: An instance is data, not code, so the very concept of a "this" pointer does not apply. 01:37:18 instance can't alter its state, it's inanimate 01:37:26 Mesh: methods are not attached to objects, but to functions in CL. 01:37:32 Mesh: And that applies both to structure instances and class instances. 01:37:59 abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:38:13 pjb: So if I'm storing a lambda function in an instance, for whatever reason, and I want that lambda function ... 01:38:23 Mesh: moreover, CL has multiple-dispatch,so there cannot be a single 'this'. 01:38:52 Mesh: Now, if you're implementing your own object system similar to C++, yes, you could implement a 'this'. 01:39:05 Mesh: http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/object-reorientation-generic-functions.html 01:39:08 Mesh: If you're storing a closure in an instance, and want the closure to know which instance it's stored in, just close over a variable that holds the instance. 01:39:13 Nevermind, I figured it out. 01:39:19 yes. 01:39:21 (That's a bit impenetrable of me, I know.) 01:39:21 that's what I was trying to do 01:39:38 Mesh: this means you'd write your own method defininition macro, and in it, you could bind the object 'receiving' the message to a variable named 'this'. 01:39:58 Actually there's no reason why I couldn't just pass the instance to the functions I was storing in it. 01:40:06 But the closure thing was more what I was going for. 01:40:40 -!- jgrant [~user@daath.imagine27.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:40:55 Yes, it will grow old soon to do it manually. You'll write a define-method macro to set these closures. 01:40:57 stassats: About slime gradually slowing down, it's happened again, and I have some data from elp-instrument-package. 01:41:12 rtoym: can you paste it? 01:41:35 stassats: Sure. Hold on.... 01:41:49 Yeah, I'm realizing that now, though I think i'll write it without macros first because I don't know what the exact pattern I'm looking at is yet 01:42:20 Of course. 01:43:10 -!- abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:43:54 stassats: http://paste.lisp.org/+2FQ0 01:45:39 nyef: also there is gtk-server http://www.gtk-server.org/, I had forgot it.. nice way to do GUI, no c bindings necessary and work on many platforms 01:46:28 rtoym: is that a long running profiling? because it's quite hard to analyze. can you reset it and see the results after some slow operation? 01:46:28 So, essentially, there are several options, depending on precisely what you're hoping to accomplish. 01:46:49 tcleval: i'm using CommonQt for GUI 01:48:56 though i can see one potential source of slow downs on large buffers 01:51:59 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:52:15 ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 01:55:52 tltstc [~tltstc@192.207.69.1] has joined #lisp 01:56:14 -!- Quadrescence [~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: omghaahhahaohwow] 01:58:35 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 01:58:37 Quadrescence [~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 02:00:25 -!- tltstc [~tltstc@192.207.69.1] has quit [Client Quit] 02:01:16 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@apn-94-44-1-78.vodafone.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:01:28 stassats: Yeah, that was from some long running session. Let me reset and I'll paste again. 02:03:10 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-76-254-23-78.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:03:26 franki^ [~frankie@unaffiliated/franki] has joined #lisp 02:04:40 stassats: Updated the paste. 02:05:00 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:05:30 that's more interesting 02:05:48 stassats: Yeah, I've noticed a slowdown with large buffers. It gets progressively slower as more output is produced. Clearing the buffer doesn't seem to help. Oh, and this is xemacs, not emacs. 02:06:20 rbarraud_ [~rbarraud@118-92-30-208.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 02:06:34 well, indeed, the slowing down due to number of buffers is xemacs-specific 02:07:13 The number of buffers in total or the number of slime-related buffers? 02:07:35 in total 02:07:38 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-30-208.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:08:04 though, slime-related buffers are contributing more 02:08:08 Ok. I think I've tried reducing the number, but it doesn't seem to help. Or maybe I didn't get rid of enough. 02:09:03 -!- retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has quit [Disconnected by services] 02:09:17 retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has joined #lisp 02:09:53 i don't know why it's trying to recomputing modelines of all slime buffers on xemacs 02:10:30 Let me change that and see what happens. 02:11:07 -!- kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-25-54.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:11:11 just comment out the body of slime-recompute-modelines 02:11:13 kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-25-54.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 02:12:45 I did that. No real perceptible change, but elp shows much faster times now. #1 is now slime-indent-and-complete-symbol, taking 1.5 sec, called once. 02:13:34 Would you like to see the top 10 from elp? 02:13:46 wouldn't hurt 02:17:22 Done. 02:19:14 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:19:26 ok, i can see another possible source 02:23:24 rtoym: try evaluating the definition i annotated the paste with 02:24:06 -!- dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has quit [Quit: dreish] 02:24:51 AndroUser2 [~androirc@77.17.152.193.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 02:25:16 That causes an elisp error. Let me see what's causing it. 02:26:39 oh, remove NIL from re-search-backward call 02:26:40 -!- lnostdal-android [~androirc@77.17.25.244.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Read error: Protocol not available] 02:26:46 Hmmm. If I use the new ASDF2 source-registry foo, SLIME can no longer tab-complete system names. 02:26:53 Is there some easy way to fix that? 02:27:25 stassats: Wow! It's basically instantaneous now! 02:28:56 -!- hargettp [~anonymous@pool-71-184-181-149.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: hargettp] 02:29:49 stassats: Paste updated with new elp results. This is fantastic! 02:30:12 ok, i'll commit it 02:32:40 What do you think the effect of an empty slime-recompute-modelines be? 02:33:08 BTW, I'm running a fairly old slime: 2010-04-17. 02:33:24 -!- nyef [~nyef@pool-71-255-129-229.cncdnh.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Quit: G'night all.] 02:34:12 stassats: Also, pathname completion has been broken for some time. I'll look into that and send a patch or something. 02:34:27 ikki [~ikki@201.144.87.40] has joined #lisp 02:36:10 i guess modelines wouldn't be recomputed then 02:36:42 though i don't know why it's done only for xemacs 02:37:49 though it can be made snappier 02:38:43 ok, that's because XEmacs lacks some features 02:39:59 What feature is missing? 02:40:41 being able to specify a function which will be evaluated when needed to produce a modeline string 02:42:38 Bummer. I'll look into that. Thanks for your help! 02:44:29 http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/elisp/html_node/Mode-Line-Data.html :eval item 02:45:20 Thanks. 02:46:43 i guess i can make it update only for visible buffers 02:47:56 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 02:48:48 That would help me quite a bit because I don't usually have more than 2 or 3 buffers visible at any time. 02:48:50 though if you switch to a previously invisible buffer it won't be updated 02:49:23 What does slime update? Mostly just the package, right? 02:49:49 package, uncompleted requests and number of open debuggers 02:50:48 package should be the slowest 02:52:04 My windows are usually too narrow to display more than the package. :-) Sometimes even less. 02:52:36 stassats: But it the newly visible buffer would get updated on the next slime operation, right? 02:52:59 yes 02:53:43 That's probably ok. I've posted a question to the xemacs list about this. If I get anything interesting back, I'll let you know. 02:54:36 Good morning everyone! 02:54:48 i'm figuring caching of the package info will be good, not only for this problem, but in general 02:55:39 beach: ... morning 02:55:41 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:57:08 jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] has joined #lisp 02:57:17 hello all 02:57:49 xach: (herep) 03:01:16 stassats: In slime-maybe-complete-as-filename, xemacs doesn't like the call to comint-replace-by-expanded-filename. It works better on xemacs to use comint-dynamic-complete. 03:01:18 -!- jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] has quit [Client Quit] 03:02:02 (Well, based on testing a couple of completions.) 03:03:00 The current function signals an error about the last search not being a buffer. 03:04:07 Er, last thing matched was not a buffer. 03:04:13 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:04:50 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 03:05:00 whoop, my emacs crashed 03:05:42 Gotta run. Aloha, everyone. 03:06:01 -!- trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:10:25 -!- Guest71620 is now known as xrisos 03:10:27 -!- xrisos is now known as xristos 03:11:12 jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] has joined #lisp 03:13:42 -!- jonSmith [~JSmith700@ip24-250-13-137.ri.ri.cox.net] has left #lisp 03:15:26 -!- vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.70.212] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:27:41 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 03:30:13 -!- rme [~rme@pool-70-106-132-29.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: rme] 03:33:06 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-bftzfhvdyvrlsnpw] has joined #lisp 03:34:02 -!- TheLolrus [~Xarver@cpe-75-83-191-189.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:41:48 -!- nullman [~nullman@c-75-73-150-26.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:42:35 -!- metasyntax [~taylor@72.86.89.174] has quit [Quit:  In our sky there is no limits, and masters we have none; heavy metal is the only one! ] 03:43:13 nullman [~nullman@c-75-73-150-26.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:53:10 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-87-79-167-57.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:53:35 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-87-79-167-57.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:57:02 -!- Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:57:17 TraumaPony [~TraumaPon@131.181.102.96] has joined #lisp 03:58:20 Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 03:58:37 -!- rbarraud_ [~rbarraud@118-92-30-208.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:00:50 rbarraud_ [~rbarraud@118-93-181-54.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 04:05:26 -!- rbarraud_ [~rbarraud@118-93-181-54.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 04:10:39 rbarraud__ [~rbarraud@118-93-177-123.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 04:11:26 fusss [~chatzilla@cpe-184-59-235-159.new.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:11:36 I am seriously gaga over ABCL 04:12:03 i haven't been so excited about software in ages 04:12:20 all it took for me to try it is to go over my fear of java; having been forced to use it by work recently 04:12:33 best thing since .. 04:12:36 Congratulations! 04:13:00 thanks beach 04:13:56 -!- peterhil [peterhil@a91-153-120-132.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:14:28 -!- rbarraud__ [~rbarraud@118-93-177-123.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:14:39 fusss: no stack-trace nightmare etc? :) 04:15:06 -!- davazp [~user@83.54.164.142] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 04:15:10 none that I can tell; if I wasn't so conscious about this being a java thing, i would have thought it was sbcl tucked under slime 04:15:29 try it 04:15:43 rbarraud__ [~rbarraud@118-92-7-107.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 04:16:15 every time i am about to evaluate a largish form i get this tingly, weary feeling. but a C-M-x later, it's all gone and turns to glee 04:16:25 -!- TraumaPony [~TraumaPon@131.181.102.96] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:16:48 was considering trying for a while, held away for the same reason. definitely going to do that now :) 04:17:10 TraumaPwny [~TraumaPon@131.181.102.96] has joined #lisp 04:17:12 fwiw, ediware loads clean; and that's 50% of what i use 04:17:30 oh, I know; will try it with quicklisp! 04:18:05 ediware ftw! 04:19:33 oh, I am so gonna blog about my abcl adventures! 04:20:08 that would be very nice of you! 04:23:08 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-93-168-225.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 04:25:06 its possible also the d-m-c long form is working in ABCL now.. if this is the case (easyE?) then I wonder what features left that it's missing 04:25:39 -!- jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] has quit [Quit: jhalogen] 04:26:17 for the CLOS impl 04:26:26 -!- rbarraud__ [~rbarraud@118-92-7-107.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:26:29 -!- marioxcc [~user@200.92.172.158] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:31:42 dmiles_afk: know of a way to pass it an init file upon invokation? 04:36:17 --noinit --eval
04:36:40 the form to call (load ...) i was thinking 04:37:32 but if you mean to get some *.abcl files as part of boot processes.. you can with myf.abcl (load "myf") 04:38:13 just need to pre-populate asdf:*central-registery*; I am on win32 and symlinks and default paths are broken 04:44:20 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:44:33 yeah.. i wwanst sure if they fakes symlinks yet 04:45:24 *sykopomp* has fun using anaphoric macros sometimes. 04:45:35 -!- Mesh [~Mesh@216.201.34.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:47:11 hmmm, "CLOS" shouldn't be a package name. seems like LISA hasn't aged well. 04:53:11 puddingpimp [~dave@118-92-157-222.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 04:53:17 dmiles_afk: heh, closer-mop works fine too 04:53:59 -!- Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:54:23 I'm getting this error while trying to checkout clbuild: Couldn't parse file http://common-lisp.net/project/clbuild/clbuild/_darcs/patches/20100625105124-e47ce-00707ce999bf312e325b4510b2469cab54d41334.gz 04:56:22 using darcs 2.4.4, also the previous copy of clbuild I have checked out in another directory shows similar errors when trying to install anything, hence why I decided to checkout a fresh copy 04:59:11 ok awesome fusss! now if :hu.dwim.partial-eval starts working on it with this closer-mop now working then it wont be too hard i bet to get partial-eval to do enough type analysis to pants sbcl 05:00:19 dmiles_afk: i am so ambitious, i will have postmodern working by tomorrow :-) 05:00:35 might need to send a tiny fix for bordeaux-threads 05:00:40 fusss: your pretty good at java to right? 05:00:50 because there is already a "threads" package 05:01:15 dmiles_afk: NOPE! read-only java guy here. haven't written much in it since 1999 05:01:34 -!- AndroUser2 is now known as lnostdal-android 05:01:59 pretty much the worse thing (which is not very bad) is ABCL's precompiler might make compiled closures a little more often than needed 05:02:26 not too worried about performance 05:02:44 (sort of a side conversation on ABCL.. (my point is really nothing is actualyl too bad!)) 05:02:48 batch work, reporting 05:03:16 no, please go on; i will soak as much info as I can :-) 05:04:16 right on.. i really like ABCL .. i just havent been able to play with uit for 4 months now ;( 05:05:19 "#-(or sbcl allegro cmu clisp openmcl lispworks) ..." <-- deliberately breaking minority lisps? well, thank you trivial-gray-streams! 05:05:28 but i am really jazzed as you are on the whole .NET/JVM + LISP.. no mater much everyone dilikes VMs 05:06:02 -!- mjonsson [~mjonsson@cpe-98-14-173-5.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:06:23 yeah, the whole thing too a tasty morbid flavor; runs on my mobile phone AND Oracle is suing the world for it? sign me up! 05:06:25 i been runing ABCL from C# so my slecondlife bots can do CL 05:06:45 external process? 05:07:01 *fusss* hasn't managed to get a 1st life yet 05:07:07 nope i use IKVM its a .class to .dll convertor 05:07:25 you are /brave/ 05:07:32 that runs under mono and ms.net 05:07:38 wow 05:07:47 way way too many layers of abstraction 05:07:50 so i dont even use a jvm 05:08:04 ow, ok 05:08:36 well ikvm emulates a jvm when you load form classbytes and JNI 05:09:00 form/from 05:11:10 well that's funny (and by funny I mean totally broken), when I type the url darcs is trying to fetch into firefox I get back the uncompressed patch, when I wget the same url, I get a 0 byte file 05:11:53 I'm guessing this means common-lisp.net's web server is messed up somehow 05:18:03 vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@164.164.250.10] has joined #lisp 05:22:28 SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.160.41.129] has joined #lisp 05:22:37 -!- Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:22:58 -!- gigamonkey [~user@adsl-76-254-23-78.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 05:24:00 -!- emma [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:26:38 Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-109-7.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 05:27:20 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 05:36:30 Stattrav [~Stattrav@202.3.77.41] has joined #lisp 05:39:33 Raynes [~macr0@unaffiliated/raynes] has joined #lisp 05:40:33 -!- spaceface [~spaceface@c-76-105-169-123.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [] 05:40:48 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:41:33 jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] has joined #lisp 05:43:01 spaceface [~spaceface@c-76-105-169-123.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:43:52 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-197-217.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:46:17 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-194-110.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:47:37 well this is fun, the combined brokenness of darcs and my isps fraudulent transparent proxy server mean I am unable to use clbuild ! 05:50:30 -!- nixeagle [~user@Wikimedia/Nixeagle] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:53:02 -!- Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has quit [Quit: Adamant] 05:54:25 -!- leviathan [~quassel@c-82-192-226-27.customer.ggaweb.ch] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 05:54:27 leviathan [~quassel@c-82-192-226-27.customer.ggaweb.ch] has joined #lisp 05:56:14 -!- TraumaPwny [~TraumaPon@131.181.102.96] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:03:19 trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #lisp 06:03:43 jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-132.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:04:45 -!- SegFaultAX [~SegFaultA@c-98-234-1-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:06:32 emma [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 06:10:14 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-93-168-225.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:10:16 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-16-132.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:14:12 http://paste.lisp.org/+2FQ3 06:14:47 -!- plediii [~plediii@nat-168-7-229-149.rice.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:15:39 nite all 06:15:40 -!- fusss [~chatzilla@cpe-184-59-235-159.new.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716]] 06:20:18 -!- Stattrav [~Stattrav@202.3.77.41] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:27:43 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-16-203.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 06:27:44 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 06:29:13 -!- Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-197-217.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:30:19 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-177-178.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 06:30:32 -!- coyO is now known as coyo 06:35:09 tcr [~tcr@81-233-246-97-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lisp 06:39:32 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-48-164.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 06:39:43 -!- gonzojive [~red@128.12.169.254] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 06:40:20 -!- puddingpimp [~dave@118-92-157-222.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:42:53 -!- emma is now known as em 06:44:14 ruepel0r [~rue@91-66-87-219-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 06:45:53 -!- Avisch [~Avisch@cpe-24-93-16-141.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:51:27 Athas [~athas@82.211.209.226] has joined #lisp 06:54:38 -!- dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:59:54 aerique [euqirea@xs2.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 07:00:50 dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has joined #lisp 07:01:41 MetalDust [~metaldust@75-32-203-61.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 07:01:47 mega1 [~quassel@catv4E5CABA2.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #lisp 07:04:18 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:06:05 sabalaba [~sabalaba@119.57.31.105] has joined #lisp 07:06:22 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 07:10:30 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl13-205-37.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 07:13:46 zomgbie [~jesus@213.235.232.110] has joined #lisp 07:13:56 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 07:14:31 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:16:09 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 07:16:40 -!- dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:18:54 -!- xristos [~x@2001:470:8859:cafe:20c:29ff:fec5:e30a] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:23:18 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:24:13 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-20-145.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 07:29:45 Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has joined #lisp 07:30:33 puddingpimp [~dave@118-92-20-145.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 07:31:16 Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 07:32:49 -!- scode_ [~scode@hyperion.scode.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:33:36 galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@64.62.114.42] has joined #lisp 07:34:46 So, now you tweet about things and they get made into books: http://www.amazon.com/Sh-t-My-Dad-Says/dp/0061992704/ 07:35:11 -!- galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@64.62.114.42] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:35:29 galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@64.62.114.42] has joined #lisp 07:37:06 timor [~timor@port-92-195-7-242.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:39:34 dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has joined #lisp 07:42:47 -!- ruepel0r [~rue@91-66-87-219-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:47:53 scode [~scode@hyperion.scode.org] has joined #lisp 07:48:00 -!- dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:48:11 -!- galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@64.62.114.42] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:48:25 galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@dsl081-171-192.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:21 -!- galaxywatcher [~galaxywat@dsl081-171-192.sea1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Client Quit] 07:50:16 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@119.57.31.105] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:51:07 malfeas: is the book about lisp? 07:52:06 jdz: Not at all, unfortunately. You might like www.gigamonkeys.com/book/index.html however. 07:52:32 fiveop [~fiveop@erft-4d07ffcd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:53:03 You might also like Successful Lisp www.psg.com/~dlamkins/sl/index.html 07:53:18 jdz: Both of them are freely available, so you should be on your way to learning lisp in no time. 07:53:28 Bbiaw 07:55:14 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:55:20 -!- lnostdal-android [~androirc@77.17.152.193.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:56:43 hello everybody 07:57:09 hello kiuma 07:57:40 serichsen [~user@f048041147.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 07:59:02 Good morning! 07:59:13 lnostdal-android [~androirc@77.17.101.123.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 08:00:56 Hello serichsen. Don't worry, I'm working; just taking a break. 08:01:30 In fact I am working on SICL today. 08:04:00 are there any users for SICL yet? 08:04:22 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@213.235.232.110] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:04:31 mal__: Well, it doesn't really exist yet. But I think _3b is using some of the conses module. 08:06:50 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-91-47.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 08:08:09 <_3b> cons-high, conditionals, iteration, and setf expanders i think (or at least parts of them) 08:08:34 Hey, that's more than I thought. 08:09:28 legumbre_ [~leo@r190-135-1-61.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 08:10:40 _3b: on what implementation are you working? 08:11:14 -!- legumbre [~leo@r190-135-7-214.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:11:23 <_3b> i'm trying to write a lisp for flash VM 08:12:23 dmiles [~dmiles@c-67-161-117-56.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:12:41 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-67-161-117-56.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:13:09 _3b: Very nice. 08:13:17 _3b: Do you have a github or something? 08:13:39 <_3b> http://github.com/3b/3bil <- is it 08:14:08 _3b: Excellent. 08:15:15 -!- timor [~timor@port-92-195-7-242.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:35 <_3b> it is still pretty rough, but more or less usable within its limitations 08:21:03 dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has joined #lisp 08:22:07 jmbr [~jmbr@26.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 08:22:49 xan_ [~xan@121.166.57.42] has joined #lisp 08:23:37 -!- Krystof [~csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:24:08 peterhil [peterhil@a91-153-120-132.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 08:27:45 tfb [~tfb@92.41.176.17.sub.mbb.three.co.uk] has joined #lisp 08:32:20 -!- lnostdal-android [~androirc@77.17.101.123.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:34:07 -!- Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-109-7.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: REALITY IS TEARING ITSELF ASUNDER, BUT I MUST RACE] 08:39:17 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 08:39:52 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@26.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:40:12 -!- xan_ 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joined #lisp 08:53:38 is it correct if I have understand byte like this: (byte 5 3) == 00001000 ? since the rightmost bit have the weight 2^3? 08:55:24 Goodnight. 08:55:55 -!- Athas [~athas@82.211.209.226] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:55:58 lnostdal-android [~androirc@77.19.205.43.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 08:57:27 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 08:57:46 Davsebamse: BYTE defines a shifted mask. 08:59:06 the form you used is 5 bits wide, 3 bits to the left 08:59:24 antifuchs: ahh so it is more like 11111000 ? 08:59:35 so more like 11111000, yeah 08:59:54 ok great thanks, now I get it :-) 08:59:55 also, LDB will then shift the result of ANDing that mask to the right by 3 bits 09:00:38 ahh ok thanks explains the result that I was given .-) 09:01:24 -!- drewc [~user@S01060013101b6ddb.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:01:55 cool 09:02:01 you're welcome 09:03:17 I really like the cookie-cutter approach that LDB/BYTE takes there. leads to way more readable bit-banging code for me (the results may be different for somebody who has all bit manipulation shortcuts memorized, though) (: 09:04:10 zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-211-70.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 09:08:15 Dodek [~xyzzyz@77-253-122-97.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #lisp 09:11:32 dym [~dym@217.20.175.226] has joined #lisp 09:12:35 antifuchs: he :-) now that I now that it makes a mask can I use it! but it you want to match with a pattern like: 0001000 then you would have to use two times ldb or could you go with (byte 1 3) ? 09:12:59 sounds good. 09:13:24 daniel_ [~daniel@p5082AD0B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:14:55 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5082A6DA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:15:29 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:17:35 varjag [~eugene@35.187.202.84.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 09:19:42 -!- jhalogen [~jake@customer-74.203.304.pdchawaii.com] 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[~charlie@c-174-50-217-160.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:01:33 Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-109-7.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:30 -!- foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:05:55 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:06:17 -!- dcrawford [~dcrawford@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:09:58 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-34-102-231.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:10:06 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-78-34-102-231.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:10:30 -!- ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@84.93.175.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:11:01 ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@87.114.18.54.plusnet.thn-ag3.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 16:14:04 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-160-61.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:20 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-16-203.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:16:23 Good evening everyone! 16:16:31 heya, beach! 16:16:36 how's clim3 coming along? :) 16:16:56 hmm... I'll have to look again into clim3 soon 16:17:00 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:17:08 sykopomp: I have been concentrating on SICL this past week, so I haven't done anything about it for a week or so. 16:17:40 beach: how's SICL going, then? :) 16:17:50 Quite well, thank you! 16:18:17 any interesting developments in this week of work? 16:18:30 the floats are now imbued with extra beach magic 16:18:33 i think 16:18:51 sykopomp: I successfully implemented the Burger & Dybvig algorithm for printing floating-point numbers efficiently and accurately. 16:19:42 And I implemented the special case of Gay's algorithm for reading floats quickly and accurately. 16:20:04 oh nice. 16:20:39 Now I have to adapt my implementation of Burger & Dybvig so that I can print fixed-length fields in FORMAT. When that is done, FORMAT is pretty much ready to go. 16:21:46 And I have evidence that my implementation of Gay's algorithm makes reading floats significantly faster than is the case if you just use FLOAT to convert from a rational to a float. 16:22:08 qbomb [~qbomb@firewall.gibsonemc.com] has joined #lisp 16:23:10 But then, using read-from-string in SBCL suggests that the time for converting from decimal to float is dwarfed by something else, probably the implementation of the reader algorithm itself, so that got me thinking about possible improvements to it. 16:24:37 For instance, in the description of the reader algorithm, states 8 and 9 (even and odd number of multiple escapes) could be split up to determine what kinds of tokens have been seen so far, and integer values could be accumulated along the way. 16:26:53 I suspect most implementations just accumulate a token and then run some expensive tests to see how to interpret it. 16:28:28 konr [~user@201.82.129.247] has joined #lisp 16:31:50 -!- Krystof [~csr21@158.223.51.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:32:36 peterhil [peterhil@a91-153-120-132.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 16:33:36 beach: Erik Naggum wrote a bit about that 16:33:58 accumulating along several possibilities during processing, that is. 16:34:17 no code that i know of, just some passing mentions. 16:34:29 Still, interesting! 16:34:40 *Xach* will find the reference 16:34:58 Thanks! 16:35:24 It's not very hard. One just has to figure out all possible states of the reader, and accumulate the right thing in each state. 16:35:38 http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3244110661811327@naggum.no.html 16:35:45 And especially, quit accumulating stuff for tokens that are no longer possible. 16:35:45 "I have been working on and off..." 16:35:58 Thanks! 16:35:59 beach: the context of his comment makes me smile. 16:36:18 ][V][ICHAEL [~user@207.178.208.5] has joined #lisp 16:37:43 Xach: What part of it? 16:38:06 he was working on implementing the reader, also 16:38:15 Oh, yes, I see. 16:38:22 Erik is probably right in that doing it manually is hard. 16:40:36 Anyway, I think it would be cute if SICL had the fastest reader around. Not that I am in any way sure that I will be able to do that, though. 16:45:37 vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.101.170] has joined #lisp 16:46:34 ziarkaen_ [~ziarkaen@87.112.50.200.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 16:48:52 milanj [~milanj_@212.200.223.215] has joined #lisp 16:50:08 -!- ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@87.114.18.54.plusnet.thn-ag3.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:50:23 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-91-47.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 16:52:10 slash_1 [~unknown@p4FF0A460.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:52:42 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:52:50 -!- slash_ [~unknown@p5DD1CD28.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:53:15 foom [~jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 16:53:19 ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has joined #lisp 16:58:55 sonnym [~evissecer@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has joined #lisp 17:03:54 -!- Elench [~Elench@unaffiliated/elench] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:04:18 -!- ignas [~ignas@78-60-73-85.static.zebra.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:05:18 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-76-254-23-78.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:34 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 17:09:27 josemanuel [~josemanue@31.0.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 17:09:51 -!- hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw229253.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:14:25 If you have a function that collects &rest args and &key some-keyword, and I want to pass ARGS to another function, without some-keyword -- how would you guys do that? 17:15:21 sykopomp: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3247672165664225@naggum.no.html has one idea 17:16:51 Xach: nice! Thanks. 17:17:50 hugod [~hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279440822.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 17:19:37 -!- jleija [~jleija@user-24-214-122-46.knology.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:20:15 scooter_ [~scooter@chello087207068228.chello.pl] has joined #lisp 17:20:28 -!- scooter_ [~scooter@chello087207068228.chello.pl] has left #lisp 17:22:43 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:24:26 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 17:25:49 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 17:29:57 -!- billitch1 [~billitch@2a01:e35:8b7c:5ce0:e2cb:4eff:fea3:82c4] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:30:25 Elench [~Elench@unaffiliated/elench] has joined #lisp 17:34:41 -!- milanj [~milanj_@212.200.223.215] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:36:00 -!- josemanuel [~josemanue@31.0.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: Saliendo] 17:36:30 -!- steven_t [~steven@unaffiliated/steven] has left #lisp 17:39:08 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-82-69.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 17:39:58 -!- trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:41:36 -!- qbomb [~qbomb@firewall.gibsonemc.com] has left #lisp 17:41:40 abhinav [~abhinav@nat/cisco/x-mwaeoxonjsqmvdek] has joined #lisp 17:43:04 -!- abhinav [~abhinav@nat/cisco/x-mwaeoxonjsqmvdek] has quit [Client Quit] 17:43:38 abhinav [~abhinav@nat/cisco/x-vxogivfotqwkzprk] has joined #lisp 17:45:07 Hmm, Erik Naggum's posts are a refreshing read. :-) 17:45:47 peterhil_: There's a lot more where that came from. 17:46:33 Yes, I noticed. I just read the XML rant. 17:51:50 What the hell is the difference between dpb and deposit-field? 17:53:10 Or is the shallowness of the difference in their description a mere easter egg? 17:53:30 <_3b> looks like deposit-field uses the bytespec on both numbers 17:53:42 udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-viijmxbwdayqbdth] has joined #lisp 17:54:17 -!- vtz [~user@router2-border.mreja.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:55:11 Are you sure? It doesn't so appear to me.. 17:55:12 -!- udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-viijmxbwdayqbdth] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:55:49 -!- astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has quit [Quit: astoon] 17:55:54 Actually, I don't understand what you mean.. 17:55:55 <_3b> 'contains the bits of newbyte within the byte specified by bytespec' 17:56:10 <_3b> (format t "~x" (deposit-field #xabc (byte 4 4) 0)) 17:58:18 Oh, thanks a lot! 17:58:42 jleija [~jleija@adsl-91-3-153.chs.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 17:58:56 Interestingly, CLQR appears to is mistaken here, as it seems to equate DPB and DEPOSIT-FIELD. 17:59:04 *be 17:59:50 Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 17:59:51 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@apn-94-44-5-152.vodafone.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:00:24 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:26 Nah, it just compresses the description. 18:00:38 Ok, too much coffee. 18:05:15 udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-yoiahucsrklwdhze] has joined #lisp 18:06:55 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:08:15 gravicappa [~gravicapp@91.78.230.112] has joined #lisp 18:12:15 -!- udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-yoiahucsrklwdhze] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:13:16 udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-pbudeisodjavspwq] has joined #lisp 18:14:19 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 18:14:30 -!- astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:15:21 Holcxjo [~holly@home.sinclair-durer.net] has joined #lisp 18:19:02 __Ginko__ [~faust@pppoe-42-075.prtcom.ru] has joined #lisp 18:21:15 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:23:23 -!- __Ginko__ [~faust@pppoe-42-075.prtcom.ru] has left #lisp 18:26:08 lye [~ask@unaffiliated/romani] has joined #lisp 18:26:09 hi 18:26:23 Machine language statistically the same speed as any modern high level lang 18:26:25 ? 18:27:00 lye: depends. 18:27:04 schmrkc on? 18:27:54 ie the execution speed is about the same but it takes WAY longer to write machine language 18:27:54 lye: on your code. For some things you could write faster assembler code than a good compiler could dream up. But for bigger projects most likely the higher level languages will result in faster code. 18:28:24 lye: well sure. but there are good use cases for assembly so .. 18:28:43 lye: and it usually takes way longer to write, ya. 18:28:43 lye: also, depends if the language you're comparing to actually compiles to "normal" native code, threaded code, interpreted bytecode, or doesn't compile at all (Ruby MRI <1.9) 18:28:53 lye: Modern architectures are not exactly made for humans to write 18:29:16 modernism - taking the fun out of programming. 18:29:37 tcr: depends... modern assembly can be fun, especially with good macro assembler 18:31:15 -!- zophy [~sy@host-242-6-111-24-static.midco.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:31:44 but having said that I dont understand how anyone can really understand programming if they dont use pointers and memory directly as you can get away with in some modern high level langs 18:32:12 lye: oh, you don't need to use them, but you need to understand them. that's the difference :) 18:32:23 lye: programming is about creating programs. You don't need to understand anything to do that. 18:32:23 How is programming about using pointers and accessing memory directly? 18:32:33 when you don't understand how addressing works, you will fuckup even in Java... 18:32:43 papouyt [~khgreezmp@41.248.207.184] has joined #lisp 18:32:44 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:32:47 (because you will forget about stuff like dangling references) 18:33:16 memory leaks? 18:33:18 you don't need direct memory stuff, but you need to understand how *any* kind of references work, and in GC'd languages, how GC deals with them 18:33:20 mapour [~mapour@linux.utu.fi] has joined #lisp 18:33:25 Why? 18:33:41 I know quite a few people working as programmers that have no idea about anything. 18:33:57 tcr: yeah. One of the worst things one can encounter is dealing with code written by someone who wrote *only* java and was never taught about how references and memory management works... 18:34:18 reading any kind of java sounds like pain 18:34:28 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:35:02 oh, you smug lisp weenie! 18:35:11 tcr: yeah, but at least the stuff that is more-or-less debugged and soundly written (not necessarily "pretty" in source code) *might* not force you to read it source code :> 18:35:45 otoh, there's stuff like applications getting much much faster after reading the source code and fixing all cases of opening files to use buffered I/O 18:35:54 I've been writing Lisp programs with lots of direct memory access lately, and oh boy how easy it is to get an offset or length wrong, and the resulting mess is just a plain PITA to debug 18:36:20 tfb [~tfb@restormel.cley.com] has joined #lisp 18:36:56 GC, and heap allocation by default definitively is a HUGE productivity gain 18:37:25 plus tagged pointers :-) 18:37:52 tcr: cant you write your own mem allocation method? 18:38:27 lye: that's where the problem is, I think :) 18:38:46 lye: What do you mean? 18:38:48 Krystof [~csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:38:59 howdy Krystof 18:39:03 write your own memory allocation method 18:39:06 can't you just do that? 18:39:13 What do you mean by that? 18:39:21 evening 18:39:46 Hello Krystof. 18:40:56 tcr: what do you mean? 18:41:00 tcr: At the same time that GC is helpful, it's a royal pain to debug when it goes wrong... Like if you somehow lose a set of roots, or screw up an interior pointer, or... 18:41:08 you do know what a memory allocation method dont you 18:41:16 so you can deal with memory that way 18:41:26 You mean like a GC? 18:41:38 Luckily someone else, smarter than me, wrote it for me 18:41:39 lye: I think you're the one missing the point here :) 18:41:52 what am i missing 18:42:00 if he's got memory issues an allocation method should do it no? 18:42:25 In my case I'm dealing with memory mmapped from kernel space 18:43:13 allocation is a non issue, it's referencing that's hard 18:43:36 ah 18:44:23 tcr: So, what are you actually doing? 18:44:49 And can you "just" paper over all the offset stuff with a macrology or something like sb-alien? 18:45:03 slyrus [~slyrus@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:45:58 Yeah turns out our macros do not leviate you as much as we'd thought they'd do. But then I guess it's hard to get that stuff right without actualy usage 18:46:43 nyef: We wanted to avoid consing 18:46:53 not sure if that was a good thing to start out with :-) 18:47:17 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:47:20 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has left #lisp 18:47:31 wait, you wanted to avoid consing in a luke-project? 18:47:46 Heh. Last time I had an absolute moratorium on consing, I'd taken out the allocation overflow routines, so if the compiler ever -did- CONS, it'd fail to load. 18:48:15 -!- lye [~ask@unaffiliated/romani] has quit [] 18:48:31 fusss [~chatzilla@cpe-184-59-235-159.new.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:48:43 nyef: interesting 18:49:02 greetings 18:49:09 slyrus_ [~slyrus@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:49:25 gz [~gz@209-6-40-245.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 18:49:32 -!- gz [~gz@209-6-40-245.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has left #lisp 18:49:39 lichtblau: We wanted to deal with the firehose, and we had no idea how problematic that would turn out to be. No problematic at all so far. 18:50:11 -!- abhinav [~abhinav@nat/cisco/x-vxogivfotqwkzprk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:50:42 (Actually, I still think having a POLICY setting that caused the ALLOCATION macros to bomb would be useful.) 18:51:16 I'd prefer calling a user customizable hook 18:51:23 jdz [~jdz@host208-16-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 18:51:24 oh wait 18:51:29 you're talking compilation time 18:51:33 Yup. 18:51:36 Yeah I totally want that 18:52:02 A must-not-cons declaration or similar. 18:52:17 I had some such proposal on launchpad, iirc 18:52:55 -!- papouyt [~khgreezmp@41.248.207.184] has quit [] 18:53:07 flip214 [~marek@h081217084238.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 18:53:16 I suspect that anyone who has both hacked on SBCL and done bits-and-bytes level raw memory access has come up with the idea, but I haven't heard of any implementations. 18:53:59 *tcr* needs to go, having deadline on sunday, and #lisp is too distracting. 18:54:03 -!- tcr [~tcr@81-233-246-97-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has left #lisp 18:54:55 I've got a two questions regarding asdf, eval-when, reader-macros, defpackage ... 18:55:03 There's a snippet at http://paste.lisp.org/display/113708 18:55:24 The first question is - I can't get the cl-interpol #? reader macro to work. 18:55:38 flip214: #. executes at read time... 18:56:08 Yes ... that's needed so I can compile, isn't it? at least that's what IRC in the link in the paste says ... 18:56:21 -!- udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-pbudeisodjavspwq] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:56:27 Stattrav [~Stattrav@202.3.77.206] has joined #lisp 18:56:34 The other question is - are these eval-whens required so that compilation works? 18:56:36 flip214: you should consider using ASDF for your own project. 18:56:50 I get "package hunchentoot not found" if they're not ... 18:56:53 make a myapp-web.asd file, put in an asdf:defsystem. 18:57:01 I tried . I've got a myapp.asd file 18:57:04 -!- Stattrav [~Stattrav@202.3.77.206] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:57:06 with an defsystem 18:57:06 paste that? 18:57:08 ok 18:57:16 udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-tspxtwrmimbwqeej] has joined #lisp 18:57:34 eugu [~Miranda@213.141.157.147] has joined #lisp 18:58:26 sykopomp: http://paste.lisp.org/+2FQK/1 18:58:32 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@h081217133138.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:58:38 flip214: use :depends-on 18:58:59 in your defsystem, add :depends-on (hunchentoot cl-who cl-ppcre cl-interpol) 18:59:01 I've got :depends-on ... but maybe not the way it should 18:59:08 for the whole system? 18:59:29 I tried putting "hunchentoot" in the "web" :depends-on, but that didn't work either. 18:59:39 needs to be at the top level, yeah. 18:59:58 is there a portable way to find out what can be (require:'ed ..)? 19:00:00 And remove the eval-when (asdf: ...) things from web? 19:00:06 correct. 19:01:13 fusss: no. 19:01:38 gggg*** slyrus_ (~slyrus@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) has joined channel #lisp 19:01:38 *** gz (~gz@209-6-40-245.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com) has joined channel #lisp 19:01:38 *** gz (~gz@209-6-40-245.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com) has left channel #lisp: 19:01:38 #lisp 19:01:41 lichtblau: We wanted to deal with the firehose, and we had no idea how problematic that 19:01:44 would turn out to be. No problematic at all so far. 19:01:47 *** abhinav (~abhinav@nat/cisco/x-vxogivfotqwkzprk) has quit: Read error: Connection reset by 19:01:50 peer [13:50] 19:01:51 -!- sykopomp [~user@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:01:53 ack 19:02:23 that's how going down in flames looks like 19:02:27 sykopomp: with (enable-reader-macro) I get "#?" not defined; with #.(enable-reader-macro) it's " The function ENABLE-INTERPOL-SYNTAX is undefined." 19:02:45 sykopomp [~user@c-66-41-249-30.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:02:50 sykopomp: with (enable-reader-macro) I get "#?" not defined; with #.(enable-reader-macro) it's " The function ENABLE-INTERPOL-SYNTAX is undefined." 19:03:43 flip214: #.(cl-interpol:enable-interpol-syntax) 19:04:11 Xach: do I have to force the loading of an specific module then? (defpackage .. (:import-from #+mylisp (progn (require :module-that-has-package) :package))) or is there a cleaner way? 19:04:32 flip214: sorry, read macros still confuse me sometimes... 19:04:39 NNshag [user@lns-bzn-44-82-249-207-231.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 19:04:55 qbomb [~qbomb@firewall.gibsonemc.com] has joined #lisp 19:04:58 fusss: I don't know what you're talking about. 19:05:20 ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has joined #lisp 19:05:29 Readtables sufficiently confuse me that I'm probably going to bind *readtable* around my calls to compile-file and call it done. 19:05:53 fusss: packages and modules are completely orthogonal concepts 19:05:58 I need to import-from a package. that package is available in most lisps, but in this lisp, it's in a module that needs to be REQUIRE'd first. 19:06:20 fusss: so require it. 19:06:31 -!- PuffTheMagic is now known as PuffTheMagic__ 19:06:47 -!- Nshag [user@lns-bzn-25-82-254-165-76.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:06:51 fusss: ecl ? 19:06:57 flip214: all set? 19:07:08 the GRAY-STREAMS package that ABCL uses is not loaded by default. I have trivial-streams to patch, so is i safe to #+abcl (progn (require :gray-streams) :gay-streams) or does a module get loaded if its package is used (that's what I was asking, and now see the answer :-) 19:07:42 fusss: what are you using abcl for? 19:07:57 sykopomp: yes, that seems to do the trick. Thank you very much. 19:07:57 I already feared that I'd have to go back to BASIC or something like that ... 19:08:04 sykopomp: Java XML libraries 19:08:15 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:08:41 flip214: :) 19:08:47 ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has joined #lisp 19:09:32 sykopomp: I think so ... I'll try to go on. If there's any further trouble, I'be back. thank you very much! 19:09:38 -!- rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:10:04 flip214: remember that #. executes code at _read_ time. Your #. was executing before (in-package ...) actually did its thing. 19:10:20 abhinav [~abhinav@122.172.105.88] has joined #lisp 19:10:36 Yes, and more importantly, before (defpackage) could :use cl-interpol - so the function was not found. 19:10:49 right 19:10:50 fusss: sounds like you're confused. 19:11:01 rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has joined #lisp 19:11:20 -!- slyrus [~slyrus@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:11:25 Xach: not anymore; just needed to put #+abcl (eval-when (..) (require :gray-streams)) on top 19:11:31 phew. 19:11:43 -!- slyrus_ [~slyrus@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:11:58 -!- Jabberwockey [~Jens@port-14408.pppoe.wtnet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 19:12:31 hey, if I am running through ~/site-systems and testing things on abcl, on my own weekend, i deserve some slack. Mr. I sound awesome on audio :-/ 19:12:54 btw, that was very professional video btw. 19:13:48 Thanks. All the pros start off with 17 seconds of blank gray. It's hip! 19:14:01 fusss: if i were you, i'd just test with quicklisp. 19:14:06 jmbr_ [~jmbr@125.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 19:14:07 it works fine with abcl. 19:14:09 Sikander [~soemraws@5356ECA7.cable.casema.nl] has joined #lisp 19:14:15 go through all systems and try to quickload 'em. 19:14:29 will do 19:14:43 i am making a shit-list of things that depend on cffi 19:15:07 *Xach* is going to instrument cffi to be able to provide that info as quicklisp metadata 19:15:23 woah 19:15:36 cffi:who-uses-me? 19:15:39 -!- benny [~user@i577A7595.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 19:15:47 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:16:00 more like (ql:foreign-libraries-needed-by "vecto") => nil 19:16:07 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has left #lisp 19:16:08 :-o :-o :-o! 19:16:17 benny [~user@i577A10EA.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 19:16:18 o_O 19:16:30 nice 19:16:35 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@26.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:16:43 well, someday. i see how to do it, but not in the 1.0 timeframe, sorry. 19:17:53 Would this somehow compare to the portage tree in gentoo? 19:18:45 "somehow", I suppose. 19:20:32 Hmm, perhaps what I mean to say is, would this be globally kept metadata as well, or would this only be tracked on the local machine for installed libs? 19:20:59 Hm, never mind, stupid question 19:21:01 -!- hargettp [~anonymous@pool-71-184-181-149.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: hargettp] 19:21:59 -!- jmbr_ is now known as jmbr 19:23:02 hargettp [~anonymous@pool-71-184-181-149.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:24:49 slash_ [~unknown@p5DD1C7E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:26:56 -!- slash_1 [~unknown@p4FF0A460.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:28:49 jleija_ [~jleija@adsl-91-31-47.chs.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 19:29:06 prima [~user@95.158.0.250] has joined #lisp 19:30:39 -!- prima [~user@95.158.0.250] has quit [Client Quit] 19:30:48 prima_lux [~user@95.158.0.250] has joined #lisp 19:31:14 -!- zfx [1028@gouda.underthedesk.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:32:17 -!- jleija [~jleija@adsl-91-3-153.chs.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:37:02 -!- jleija_ [~jleija@adsl-91-31-47.chs.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:37:16 jleija [~jleija@adsl-91-31-47.chs.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 19:39:06 -!- tcleval [~funnyguy@186.213.58.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:40:53 ...is drakma very much not thread-safe? 19:41:53 -!- Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:41:59 *sykopomp* has killed CCL twice trying to generate lots of traffic using drakma 19:42:31 -!- Holcxjo [~holly@home.sinclair-durer.net] has quit [Changing host] 19:42:31 Holcxjo [~holly@pdpc/supporter/active/hdurer] has joined #lisp 19:42:46 -!- carlocci [~nes@93.37.211.229] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:42:48 locci [~nes@93.37.211.229] has joined #lisp 19:44:10 -!- ziarkaen_ [~ziarkaen@87.112.50.200.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:46:34 -!- slash_ [~unknown@p5DD1C7E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:46:55 slash_ [~unknown@p5DD1C7E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:48:40 -!- simplechat_ [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:49:53 zfx [1028@gouda.underthedesk.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:49:59 Hmm, if I want to load a system known to be defined in a specific .asd file, what's the best way to do that/ 19:50:16 Load the .asd file, then load the system? 19:50:27 At least, that's what I tend to do. 19:51:28 Then again, my first line of defence is to not use asdf in the first place whenever possible. 19:51:56 I'm wondering if that falls into the category of "likely to work as expected" or "guaranteed to work as expected". 19:52:17 Probably closer to "likely". 19:52:45 The practice of having .asd files include a defpackage form stems from people loading them directly rather than having asdf itself do the loading. 19:52:56 ah yes 19:53:24 Xach: are you talking about things like (asdf:defsystem foo ...) (asdf:defsystem foo-test ...) in the same file? 19:53:28 -!- vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.101.170] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:53:51 sykopomp: not necessarily. 19:53:57 Xach: I usually do slime-open-system, but that might not be what you mean. :) 19:54:35 dcrawford_ [~dcrawford@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 19:54:55 -!- dcrawford_ is now known as dcrawford 19:55:03 Another option would be to symlink the .asd with the desired system name somewhere in the registry, then asdf will naturally "do the right thing", for some amount of "right thing". 19:55:31 I'm never symlinking another asd file as long as I live. 19:56:27 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:57:54 gonzojive [~red@128.12.169.254] has joined #lisp 19:57:55 -!- PuffTheMagic__ is now known as PuffTheMagic 20:00:02 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@205.233.9.181] has left #lisp 20:01:54 tritchey [~tritchey@205.233.9.181] has joined #lisp 20:02:27 -!- Blkt [~user@93-33-132-244.ip44.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Error: do not makunbound t please!] 20:03:11 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-91-47.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:03:25 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 20:03:49 -!- tfb [~tfb@restormel.cley.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:15 -!- sonnym [~evissecer@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:04:20 Hmmm, any ideas? When I'm asdf-loading my newly defined system "(asdf:operate 'asdf:load-op 'myapp)" 20:04:26 the last message I get is "STYLE-WARNING: Implicitly creating new generic function WRITE-HEADER-LINE." 20:04:40 but there's no REPL, and the hunchentoot port isn't open either. 20:04:51 are you using clisp? 20:05:02 CTRL-C doesn't work - I'd expect the debugger with a signal-interrupt 20:05:02 -!- metasyntax` [~taylor@12.132.219.7] has quit [Quit: Be seeing you.] 20:05:07 the style-warning suggests SBCL 20:05:10 no - sbcl, debian unstable 20:05:10 sbcl on windows? 20:05:19 no, linux amd64 20:05:41 CPU usage is low - so it's not compiling anymore 20:06:08 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@205.233.9.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:06:18 A lot of messages "registering .... as ..." from asdf 20:06:27 some "unable to optimize" 20:06:40 it's unclear what your code is doing or not doing 20:06:54 *Xach* guesses there is a toplevel call to hunchentoot's start server function 20:07:02 *Xach* also guesses sbcl is singlethreaded 20:07:15 a few style-warnings "implicitly creating generic function" 20:07:33 well, yes ... I'm starting hunchentoot. 20:07:53 but in my previous, small, interactive tests I got the REPL back and could use http 20:08:02 AFAIK it should be multithreaded 20:08:05 Don't put calls like that at the top level of a file. Put 'em in a function and call the function from the repl. 20:08:22 drewc [~user@S01060013101b6ddb.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 20:08:55 that wouldn't cause any problems 20:10:00 legumbre_ [~leo@r190-135-28-134.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 20:10:42 does that make a difference? 20:11:07 You tell me. 20:11:14 No ;-) 20:11:38 I've now put a format t "running ~%" in my main file - and got that output when loading interactively. 20:11:59 REPL here, too. Then I did the (defvar ... (start-server)) thing - and it goes .. 20:12:04 Now HTTP is working ... 20:12:09 are we going to play "guess what my code looks like in 20 questions" game or you will paste your code? 20:12:26 -!- legumbre [~leo@r190-135-1-61.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:12:56 -!- Aisling_ [ash@blk-222-192-36.eastlink.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:13:17 Is that one of the 20 questions? 20:14:31 strange ... 20:15:02 very strange .... 20:16:12 statement! 1-0 20:16:59 ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@87.112.50.200.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 20:17:12 contradiction isn't an argument! 20:17:35 but as I recall, there is a particular problem with loading fasls with hunchentoot:start-server in them from the slime repl 20:17:51 I'm using slimv - from vim 20:17:52 Aisling [ash@blk-222-192-36.eastlink.ca] has joined #lisp 20:18:00 but maybe there's a connection 20:18:10 -!- drewc [~user@S01060013101b6ddb.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:18:10 I don't really care about you; I'm mostly talking to Xach 20:18:41 flip214: you know that re-evaluating a defvar does not change the value, right? 20:18:58 the screwup goes load fasl -> call to start-server -> spawn threads -> call to some generic function -> compute discriminating function (in non-REPL thread) -> deadlock 20:19:40 sykopomp: yes, i should know. for testing now I always restarted sbcl afresh, so it shouldn't matter. 20:19:42 dlowe [~dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 20:19:43 drewc [~user@S01060013101b6ddb.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 20:19:45 Ok, 20 questions time 20:20:44 flip214: or you can paste some code. 20:21:01 http://paste.lisp.org/+2FQQ 20:21:17 The comments show the various things I've tried 20:21:22 moocow [~new@poco208-2.fredcanhelp.com] has joined #lisp 20:21:32 this is main.lisp - I've omitted the (defpackage...) and similar things above. 20:21:41 the "running" output is given 20:21:42 what is the problem, again? 20:21:57 the "tunning" output not, and the TCP port isn't available, too. 20:22:18 -!- holycow [~new@poco208-2.fredcanhelp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:22:30 If I'm doing (asdf:oos 'load-op 'main) from my repl 20:22:41 I can use all of these things to start my server 20:22:55 even the (original) (defvar ... (start-server)) just works 20:23:13 running without REPL doesn't work 20:23:26 this needs to be in /r/lisp http://www.cawtech.demon.co.uk/clos/define-method-combination.html 20:23:59 Or, to be a bit more exact, directly starting from within the asdf-load op doesn't work 20:24:06 fusss: It's not off to a promising start. 20:24:13 Hmmm ... Maybe I need a (eval-when)? 20:24:50 flip214: do you have a main.asd file somewhere to go with your (asdf:oos 'load-op 'main)? 20:25:08 of course, in the same directory as all my other files for this project 20:25:24 and the asdf:oos line is in a debug.lisp, which I load for testing 20:25:30 Xach: it looks weak, but we need to encourage purely technical content. anything to drawn the opinions. 20:26:00 flip214: how do you know "it doesn't work?" 20:26:09 the tcp port isn't open? 20:26:16 -!- udzinari` [~user@nat/ibm/x-tspxtwrmimbwqeej] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:26:26 and normally the "tunning" line isn't printed. 20:26:40 I've now put a (eval-when :execute) around the start-server ... 20:26:53 now I get both output lines, but it doesn't work either. 20:26:58 Thanks, gotta go! 20:27:00 bye! 20:27:02 -!- flip214 [~marek@h081217084238.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:27:15 *hargettp* sighs 20:28:03 -!- TomJ [~tomj@78.148.49.136] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:28:33 so, I think flip214 was seeing the symptom I was describing 20:29:38 TomJ [~tomj@78.148.49.136] has joined #lisp 20:31:06 Krystof: was it that, or that all code except the format calls had been commented out? ;) 20:31:20 Krystof: although your scenario makes sense 20:32:28 fwiw, I run hunchentoot from the SLIME REPL all the time...no issues, so I guess I've been lucky (multi-threaded SBCL OS X) 20:33:58 ah...all of my code has been pre-loaded, before the call to start Hunchentoot...probably why I never hit your scenario... :) 20:34:14 syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:35:44 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 20:35:49 holycow [~new@poco208-2.fredcanhelp.com] has joined #lisp 20:35:54 -!- moocow [~new@poco208-2.fredcanhelp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:36:24 fusss: Now that I've read more, I'd downvote it. It's garbage. 20:36:42 hmm 20:39:23 Xach: BC liked it, or at least thought it was a good start http://bc.tech.coop/blog/050801.html 20:39:38 He's too kind. 20:39:58 stokachu` [~user@nat/redhat/x-faqrhbwphilxfgjb] has joined #lisp 20:40:06 -!- stokachu [~adam@nat/redhat/x-zyfvwxbjystzgkjw] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:40:39 Mesh [~Mesh@216.201.34.14] has joined #lisp 20:41:39 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:42:35 -!- stokachu` is now known as stokachu 20:42:57 -!- syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:44:29 fusss: are you going to ILC? 20:44:47 Xach: oh no, too busy with work 20:45:04 i only met 1 lisper all my life :-P 20:49:29 *nyef* realizes that he's just hit the point where he needs to start figuring out how to use the pprinter. 20:50:51 bgs101 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 20:51:45 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-215-177.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:52:38 -!- bgs101 is now known as bgs100 20:52:38 -!- navigator [~navigator@p5489555C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.3] 20:53:22 tcr [~tcr@81-233-246-97-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lisp 20:54:18 -!- symbole [~symbole@216.214.176.130] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:55:52 s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-213-149.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 20:57:16 fusss: ah, c'mon. it's practically local to you. 20:57:35 I am in Green Bay WI 20:57:50 commute to chicago twice a week 20:58:44 Nevada? 20:59:33 -!- eugu [~Miranda@213.141.157.147] has quit [Quit: eugu] 21:00:34 America's back yard. 21:01:08 I'm allowed to say (set-pprint-dispatch '(and symbol (satisfies my-kind-of-symbol)) ...), right? 21:01:26 And it'll override printing symbols IIF they're my kind of symbol? 21:04:05 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@apn-94-44-3-60.vodafone.hu] has joined #lisp 21:05:22 Well, half of the invited talks at ILC2010 look interesting. Hopefully recordings will be available... or at least attendee reports. 21:08:36 Xach: the conference is not on til October; now that looks attractive 21:08:46 i thought it was in <2 weeks 21:13:48 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:15:30 claymore_ [~chatzilla@host81-131-219-189.range81-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 21:15:44 -!- claymore_ [~chatzilla@host81-131-219-189.range81-131.btcentralplus.com] has left #lisp 21:15:52 -!- PuffTheMagic is now known as PuffTheMagic__ 21:16:03 -!- PuffTheMagic__ is now known as PuffTheMagic 21:18:29 Hello 21:20:57 -!- varjag [~eugene@35.187.202.84.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 21:24:31 xristos [~x@2001:470:8859:cafe:20c:29ff:fec5:e30a] has joined #lisp 21:25:34 why is lexical scope so important? What am I missing, in practical terms, using a lisp that supports only dynamic scoping 21:25:51 s/scoping/scoping\? 21:26:07 konr: besides closures? 21:26:54 konr: there's also the issue of "oops, something else redefined the value of this variable!" 21:26:59 dynamic scoping was a source of a lot of heisenbugs in the old days iirc. 21:27:12 spooky action at a distance. 21:28:45 (let (list) 21:28:45 (my-mapping-function 21:28:45 (lambda (item) 21:28:46 (if (my-predicate-p item) 21:28:49 (push item list)))) 21:28:53 list) 21:29:03 You better hope my-mapping-function doesn't use a variable called 'list' 21:30:02 uhm 21:30:08 pastebot, pls 21:30:16 fe[nl]ix, you need to update clbuild such that iolib pull in its deps 21:30:19 it has no deps right now 21:35:23 and i think bordeaux-threads is missing a dep to trivial-garbage 21:36:27 pdponze [~pdponze@144.85.124.96] has joined #lisp 21:36:58 -!- pdponze [~pdponze@144.85.124.96] has left #lisp 21:37:52 -!- konr [~user@201.82.129.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:38:17 konr [~user@201.82.129.247] has joined #lisp 21:38:53 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 21:40:07 b-t only depends on alexandria 21:40:57 hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw229253.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 21:41:37 -!- ][V][ICHAEL [~user@207.178.208.5] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:43:44 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:44:03 -!- Sikander [~soemraws@5356ECA7.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:45:36 ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 21:45:49 -!- hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw229253.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:45:58 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:49:32 -!- slash_ [~unknown@p5DD1C7E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:50:43 -!- PuffTheMagic is now known as PuffTheMagic__ 21:55:23 any bordeaux-threads maintainers/commiters around? 21:55:38 -!- prima_lux [~user@95.158.0.250] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:55:56 if I wanna send a patch, is `git diff > abcl.diff` enough or is there preferred format? 21:56:24 abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:56:40 another way is to publish your repository 21:56:54 svn diff might be better for them 21:57:09 so they get the exact -r it was patched agaisnt 21:57:20 ok, svn it is 21:57:27 -!- level300 [~some@purpletree.org] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:57:28 what ? 21:57:28 -!- abugosh [~Adium@pool-74-103-38-231.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:57:38 svn is hardly better for git 21:57:45 but they use giterous 21:58:06 who do? 21:58:15 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109-93-82-69.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:58:17 THEY 21:58:24 fusss: just use git diff, and send me the patch 21:58:56 oh bordeaux-threads .. sorry i was thinking ABCL 21:59:07 Ionescu and whoever else maintaining bt:http://gitorious.org/bordeaux-threads/bordeaux-threads 21:59:19 fusss: that would be me 22:00:21 fe[nl]ix: oh, awesome. can I email you a patch at your cddr account? 22:00:48 yes 22:02:47 Xach: Thank you for writing this about packaging small projects: http://xach.livejournal.com/130040.html?thread=221432 22:03:06 It is very helpful as the first comment says 22:04:30 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:04:32 -!- Raynes [~macr0@unaffiliated/raynes] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:06:23 fe[nl]ix: sent 22:07:12 dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 22:08:56 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:09:19 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 22:10:02 -!- konr is now known as foobar` 22:10:10 -!- foobar` [~user@201.82.129.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:46 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:11:53 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-9-12.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 22:13:53 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@91.78.230.112] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:16:02 -!- PuffTheMagic__ is now known as PuffTheMagic 22:18:18 hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:19:30 -!- cinch [~cinch@unaffiliated/cinch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:19:34 fusss: pushed 22:19:40 :-) 22:19:43 -!- Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-109-7.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: REALITY IS TEARING ITSELF ASUNDER, BUT I MUST RACE] 22:19:55 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 22:20:01 now working on arnesi, let's see if marco is around .. 22:21:12 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl13-205-37.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Get MacIrssi - http://www.sysctl.co.uk/projects/macirssi/] 22:23:00 -!- qbomb [~qbomb@firewall.gibsonemc.com] has left #lisp 22:23:58 konr [~user@201.82.129.247] has joined #lisp 22:25:02 Hi, I just installed metabang-bind (can't believe I didn't like its style when I was a newb), I'm trying this, I think it really should work: 22:25:08 (bind (((:values (test this) stuff) (values (list 1 2) 3))) 22:25:10 (values test this stuff)) 22:25:41 if you like its style, then you're still a "newb" 22:26:24 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@apn-94-44-3-60.vodafone.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:27:00 -!- Mesh [~Mesh@216.201.34.14] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:27:09 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-9-12.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:27:20 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-9-12.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #lisp 22:27:45 ... you don't know what you're talking about. You don't even know me. btw I'm generally against this kind of macro. But that specific one is very well-designed. 22:29:05 -!- ziarkaen [~ziarkaen@87.112.50.200.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:30:05 how do you check for the existance of a directory? 22:30:22 "existence" 22:30:32 depends on the implementation 22:30:39 fe[nl]ix: thanks, but that was not the answer I was looking for 22:30:43 clhs e-d-e 22:30:43 ENSURE-DIRECTORIES-EXIST: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_ensu_1.htm 22:30:45 ah, you can't portably do so? 22:30:53 not so subtle check 22:31:25 stassats: yeah, I was looking for the value that would *not* create the directory, just probe for it 22:31:51 ah well, no big deal 22:32:08 hargettp: it's so well-designed that it doesn't work for you? 22:32:12 errr 22:32:19 that was meant for hexstream 22:32:56 madnificent: depending on the implementation, cl:probe-file may or may not work 22:33:07 it doesn't work on... Clisp 22:33:28 clisp has probe-directory 22:33:35 Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 22:33:39 no, I want it to be portable, but thanks 22:33:40 stassats: Can't it both have a good overall design and a specific bug/lacking/ommission? Your tone is needlessly derisive. 22:33:41 it may well be for the best 22:33:46 in this specific case 22:34:17 Why? 22:35:15 madnificent: there's cl-fad:directory-exists-p. iolib too has something similar 22:38:20 -!- Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:38:56 -!- tcr [~tcr@81-233-246-97-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:39:19 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:43:37 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 22:45:34 Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 22:46:50 Raynes [~macr0@unaffiliated/raynes] has joined #lisp 22:47:17 -!- hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #lisp 22:50:37 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:51:49 -!- Joreji [~thomas@94-103.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:53:37 TheLolrus [~Xarver@cpe-75-83-191-189.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:56:32 -!- retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:57:54 retroj [~retroj@unaffiliated/retroj] has joined #lisp 23:00:38 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-48-164.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:07:02 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:12:49 stassats: hello? been a while for bit... :) 23:13:03 *away 23:13:11 hargettp: i miscompleted your name 23:13:15 sorry 23:13:23 stassats: lol! np :) 23:17:14 -!- legumbre_ is now known as legumbre 23:20:50 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 23:20:56 -!- locci [~nes@93.37.211.229] has quit [Quit: eventually IE will rot and die] 23:23:01 GrayMagiker [~steve@c-174-56-26-27.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:25:50 nixeagle [~user@Wikimedia/Nixeagle] has joined #lisp 23:27:28 Hmm, there's a new lisp book 23:27:38 billitch1 [~billitch@men75-12-88-183-197-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 23:28:02 http://nostarch.com/lisp.htm 23:28:32 it's an old new book 23:28:56 That's why it says October 2010 23:29:26 it's been "will be released soon" for quite some time 23:29:48 Great 23:33:38 Maybe I should contact the author 23:34:49 ikki [~ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 23:35:39 -!- billitch1 [~billitch@men75-12-88-183-197-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:35:44 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:36:01 billitch1 [~billitch@men75-12-88-183-197-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 23:41:27 -!- jdz [~jdz@host208-16-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:41:30 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@208.78.149.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:41:42 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-42-211.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 23:43:14 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-160-61.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:43:28 -!- fusss [~chatzilla@cpe-184-59-235-159.new.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:49:24 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 23:52:20 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]