00:00:21 cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has joined #lisp 00:01:37 benny [~benny@i577A8A7D.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 00:03:34 Fade: I was already accused of planning to manipulating backing stores of people and it was for much more benign task. It would take heavy bribes to get rid of *those* people. 00:04:52 heh 00:05:46 the thing is, I was actually serious about the stuff I was accused, but they mistook who I wanted to brainwash - it was self-brainwashing research :3 00:10:29 Billantha_ [~laurifus@c-67-186-131-224.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:10:38 -!- Billantha_ is now known as billantha 00:10:45 -!- Laurifus_ [~laurifus@c-67-186-131-224.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:10:48 -!- billantha [~laurifus@c-67-186-131-224.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has left #lisp 00:15:16 palter [~palter@c-75-68-177-225.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:16:04 -!- potatishandlarn [~potatisha@79.102.2.38] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:19:22 seangrove [~user@c-67-188-2-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:24:22 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:25:00 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 00:25:44 -!- anair_84 [~anair_84@ip68-108-251-45.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:26:19 -!- attila_lendvai [~ati@catv-89-132-189-83.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:28:28 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 00:30:28 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-vspcvzbqgljhferm] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 00:31:10 -!- quidnunc [~user@70.49.123.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:32:08 -!- linus5 [~user@dyn-160-39-42-66.dyn.columbia.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:38:01 -!- htk_ [~htk_@unaffiliated/htk-/x-9867211] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:39:54 rme [~rme@pool-70-104-124-149.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:41:14 -!- davazp [~user@108.Red-79-150-170.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:45:48 -!- marioxcc [~user@200.92.176.147] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:48:33 -!- Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has quit [Quit: Adamant] 00:49:03 spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.65.78] has joined #lisp 00:56:07 rtra [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has joined #lisp 00:57:43 -!- alama [~alama@a95-95-128-109.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: alama] 00:57:53 sellout [~greg@c-24-128-48-180.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:58:17 alama [~alama@a95-95-128-109.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 01:00:34 debiandebian [~chatzilla@ntszok008047.szok.nt.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 01:02:43 -!- alama [~alama@a95-95-128-109.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Client Quit] 01:04:22 -!- Kickaha [~alex@bl14-24-33.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:05:54 clsql is in serious need to being split up 01:06:17 A monolithic database lib is of questionable worth 01:06:47 what would you gain? 01:07:15 More focus 01:07:23 I only want mysql 01:07:40 so, use only mysql 01:07:54 i get sqllite, oracle, postgres, db2 01:08:34 and that's the problem because ...? 01:09:11 Because the compile complains that I don't have the relevant libs, and I had to check if I needed them or not 01:09:29 Maybe its asdf-installs fault for wanting to compile everything 01:09:46 asdf-install, here's your problem 01:10:11 hehe, Ya it doesn't help 01:10:23 it loads all .asd files 01:10:39 that's why you were loading cffi, and now other db backends 01:10:58 it's 2010, time to forget about asdf-install 01:11:24 Its nice when it works 01:11:25 minion: please tell Guthur about clbuild 01:11:26 Guthur: please see clbuild: clbuild is a shell script helping with the download, compilation, and invocation of Common Lisp applications. http://www.cliki.net/clbuild 01:11:45 and other projects get the blame when it doesn't? 01:12:36 ok, I'm just grumpy it took along time to sort out 01:13:27 if i were using asdf-install i would be grumpy too 01:16:05 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.65.78] has left #lisp 01:16:24 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:18:07 jbirdium [~chatzilla@pool-98-114-33-48.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:23:21 -!- cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 01:28:10 -!- BrianRice [~water@c-76-115-44-87.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: BrianRice] 01:33:27 udzinari [~user@209.158.broadband13.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 01:35:29 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-167-44.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:39:53 -!- penny [~penny@f048099136.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 22.2.1] 01:41:52 -!- ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-135-10.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set yourself on fire.] 01:44:49 skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has joined #lisp 01:45:43 -!- tsuru [~user@c-174-50-217-160.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:46:22 ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-135-10.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 01:47:47 -!- leo2007 [~leo@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust596.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Quit: reboot emacs] 01:50:15 anair_84 [~anair_84@ip68-108-251-45.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 01:55:04 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:55:58 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 01:57:05 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@cpe-72-228-72-196.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: kpreid] 01:57:14 poincare101 [~poincare1@c-174-58-20-9.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:57:27 -!- bipt [~bpt@cl-851.chi-02.us.sixxs.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:58:48 leo2007 [~leo@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust596.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has joined #lisp 01:59:16 -!- coyo [~unf@99-6-151-42.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:05:03 dys` [~andreas@krlh-5f7248ce.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 02:07:20 -!- dys [~andreas@krlh-5f72e598.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:10:40 is lisp still in use? 02:10:55 or is it just for realizing the magicalness of it? 02:11:04 it's in use 02:11:15 mostly as troll bait, apparently. 02:12:22 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 02:12:30 -!- saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:12:34 -!- Xach has set mode -o Xach 02:14:01 saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:15:08 -!- palter [palter@clozure-78A0C567.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 02:15:09 palter_ [~palter@c-75-68-177-225.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:15:09 -!- palter [~palter@c-75-68-177-225.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:15:09 -!- palter_ is now known as palter 02:16:20 rabuf [~user@ip68-230-168-93.mc.at.cox.net] has joined #lisp 02:17:08 nice dosctring for CDDDDR in SBCL: "Return the cdr of the cdddr of a list." 02:20:28 -!- carlocci [~nes@93.37.214.233] has quit [Quit: eventually IE will rot and die] 02:21:11 the idea to proofread all sbcl's docstrings doesn't look so great anymore 02:22:35 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 02:24:20 kpreid [~kpreid@216-171-189-244.northland.net] has joined #lisp 02:24:32 -!- daniel___ is now known as daniel 02:31:33 nus [~nus@81.24.80.233] has joined #lisp 02:31:33 -!- nus [~nus@81.24.80.233] has quit [Changing host] 02:31:33 nus [~nus@unaffiliated/nus] has joined #lisp 02:32:12 egoz [~Egoz@114.79.55.188] has joined #lisp 02:34:25 -!- saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:34:29 saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:38:33 -!- enthymeme [~kraken@adsl-76-248-233-47.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.1.1] 02:39:36 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:40:08 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 02:42:02 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 02:43:05 -!- kwinz3 [~kwinz@85.125.182.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:52:22 -!- rtra [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 02:52:34 -!- konr [~konrad@187.88.9.235] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:55:05 kwinz3 [~kwinz@85.125.182.108] has joined #lisp 02:55:51 -!- saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: saikat] 02:56:50 huh, what a strange sbcl issue, sb-mailbox hijacked half of the dosctrings with its own 02:59:59 Infectious docstrings 03:00:58 -!- poincare101 [~poincare1@c-174-58-20-9.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 03:01:04 it is indeed 03:01:49 -!- leo2007 [~leo@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust596.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:02:10 -!- c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:04:34 huh, it's widespread (setf (documentation)) modifies something which it shouldn't 03:05:27 -!- seangrove [~user@c-67-188-2-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:06:06 -!- sellout [~greg@c-24-128-48-180.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: sellout] 03:12:00 goner [~goner@unaffiliated/goner] has joined #lisp 03:12:07 stassats: are you using threads? 03:12:19 the info-db, which stores documentation among other things, is NOT thread-safe 03:12:35 most uses are protected behind the Big Compiler Lock, but setf documentation is not 03:13:12 it's compiled with threads, yes 03:13:13 legumbre_ [~leo@r190-135-18-112.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 03:15:23 -!- legumbre [~leo@r190-135-62-154.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:15:42 -!- udzinari [~user@209.158.broadband13.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:17:56 and nobody noticed that before? 03:19:15 -!- Guthur [~Michael@host213-122-221-177.range213-122.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Computer says no] 03:19:28 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:20:02 if anybody has not the latest sbcl with threads, what does (documentation 'sb-c::optional-dispatch-keyp 'function) return? 03:20:42 as far as i see it's only concerned to structure-generated accessors 03:22:37 "A place for clients to stash things." 03:22:47 rabuf: what sbcl version? 03:22:53 1.0.37 03:23:46 thanks, (that's not its docstring) 03:23:48 stassats: I didn't mean compiled with threads, I meant whether you were *using* threads in your app 03:24:13 kpreid: plainly start sbcl and it already has mangled docstrings 03:24:20 ah, okay. 03:24:27 that's not a known bug, then. 03:24:31 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:30:55 which docstrings are mangled? 03:31:14 -!- Edward__ [Ed@AAubervilliers-154-1-46-61.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [] 03:31:41 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [Quit: Odin-] 03:32:09 of the above function, for example 03:32:38 it's a docstring from run-program.lisp: (setf (documentation 'process-plist 'function) "A place for clients to stash things.") 03:35:20 I see. 03:40:42 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:44:32 c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 03:45:28 -!- debiandebian [~chatzilla@ntszok008047.szok.nt.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:58:23 Resbaloso [~Resbaloso@ip72-207-23-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 03:58:25 It is time to put those Haitian jigaboos in their place! No matter how many times the civilized world donates money, opens schools, rebuilds their nation, and holds their little monkey paws, the damn niggers can never get it right. Mexicali had a worse earthquake than Haiti, and only about 4 people died! Even the housing of the poor generally held up! Meanwhile even the Haitian elites couldn't build decent buildings. Look at what happ 03:58:25 ened to the house of their monkey president! If you are sick of the fecal beast Join Chimpout Forum! 03:58:30 It is time to put those Haitian jigaboos in their place! No matter how many times the civilized world donates money, opens schools, rebuilds their nation, and holds their little monkey paws, the damn niggers can never get it right. Mexicali had a worse earthquake than Haiti, and only about 4 people died! Even the housing of the poor generally held up! Meanwhile even the Haitian elites couldn't build decent buildings. Look at what happ 03:58:34 ened to the house of their monkey president! If you are sick of the fecal beast Join Chimpout Forum! 04:04:33 konr [~konrad@189.98.9.61] has joined #lisp 04:05:44 -!- bgs100 is now known as bgs000 04:06:24 -!- Resbaloso [~Resbaloso@ip72-207-23-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [K-Lined] 04:07:21 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 04:11:23 -!- Taggnostr [~x@dyn57-487.yok.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:21:00 Taggnostr [~x@dyn57-487.yok.fi] has joined #lisp 04:28:30 -!- rabuf [~user@ip68-230-168-93.mc.at.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 04:37:06 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:43:55 So, my apologies for not actually understanding asdf (or CL packages in general very well), but.... 04:44:21 I want to run the dev version of weblocks. I've used clbuild to get all the dependencies, and I have the dev code in a directory. 04:44:47 How do I let asdf know that when I say "(asdf:oos 'asdf:load-op 'weblocks-demo)", I mean the stuff in the dev dir? 04:44:53 (or is that even a coherent question?) 04:47:47 -!- nus [~nus@unaffiliated/nus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:49:00 Ah. I run "clbuild install weblocks-dev". *facepalm* 04:53:20 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:53:46 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 04:53:55 Good morning! 04:54:31 spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.100.2] has joined #lisp 04:56:55 -!- skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:01:30 morning beach 05:01:50 -!- mbrookegarcia is now known as maden 05:02:49 nipra_ [~nipra@115.118.219.174] has joined #lisp 05:03:21 maden: How is learning Lisp coming? 05:03:33 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 05:03:48 just fine 05:03:52 not too fast heh 05:03:59 -!- rme [rme@clozure-74D12576.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: rme] 05:03:59 -!- rme [~rme@pool-70-104-124-149.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: rme] 05:04:50 Did you get the PCL? 05:05:03 kvsari [~kvsari@203.171.93.21.static.rev.aanet.com.au] has joined #lisp 05:05:13 it's not in yet 05:05:18 i'm guessing this monday ;) 05:07:56 -!- hagabaka_ [~quassel@cblmdm24-53-178-92.buckeyecom.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:08:31 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-35-101.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:10:52 beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-35-101.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 05:11:46 -!- astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 05:12:22 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:12:45 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 05:12:55 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Client Quit] 05:13:11 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 05:13:47 hi 05:13:54 hi 05:13:56 hello wolgo 05:14:00 hi beach. 05:14:20 Adamant [~Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has joined #lisp 05:15:01 maden: you are reading PCL? 05:15:08 I am learning lisp too. 05:15:18 I am on the collections section. 05:15:34 It is a good book. 05:15:59 I bought PAIP too. Which is an excellent book as well and it even taught me how to do integration. 05:16:08 well, kind of 05:16:14 I had to use wikipedia too. 05:16:14 PAIP is *very* good. 05:16:22 yeah 05:16:49 I am only programming in lisp for 120 days 05:17:00 to see how I like it. 05:17:18 wolgo: no i ordered it haven't received it yet 05:17:23 I like this programming the programs business 05:17:27 oh 05:17:31 wolgo: You will likely get hooked and never want to go back to the other languages. 05:17:33 I bought a copy but I like to read online 05:17:59 this is the most user friendly language I have ever used. 05:18:08 do you use emacs? 05:18:10 *wolgo* is not a computer scientist 05:18:21 yeah I use emacs 05:18:23 with slime 05:18:25 I normally code java, python and php... for which i never really used emacs. 05:18:35 oh I just started using emacs 05:18:42 so I fumble with it 05:18:49 i usually use no name IDEs or Eclipse... now I gave emacs a shot and I must admit that I am very confused by it 05:18:49 but I use the GNU manual too. 05:18:53 it helps 05:19:05 ahh 05:19:12 I never use eclipse 05:19:19 I am not a programmer 05:19:20 teachers tell me to :p 05:19:22 *stassats* is confused by all these IDEs 05:19:33 ahh 05:19:53 I would like to study CS but I am old and I would have to learn C++ 05:20:01 wolgo: Just out of interest, what are you? :) 05:20:09 I am not sure 05:20:16 a human being? 05:20:16 I'm not a programmer or a computer scientist either, which is why I was wondering. 05:20:40 stassats: On IRC, I doubt it... 05:20:47 haha 05:21:35 satisfies has-fill-pointer-p 05:21:47 wolgo: i did not have to learn C++... 05:21:53 I take it you need to pass the :fill-pointer arg to make array to change a vector 05:21:58 well, i havent yet 05:22:00 -!- redline6561 [~redline@c-66-56-16-250.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:22:05 oh okay 05:22:09 I am thinking about it. 05:22:17 I am going to take some math classes 05:22:23 hrm, I wonder what percentage of emacs capabilities I'm actually using 05:22:29 -!- c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:22:33 and I might keep going if they teach some programming I want to learn. 05:22:46 some colleges teach lisp ;) 05:22:59 Yeah, University of Bordeaux for instance. 05:23:06 not everyone is french! 05:23:13 only few teach good lisp 05:23:13 Really? 05:23:18 chittoor [~chittoor@117.204.50.169] has joined #lisp 05:23:33 really 05:23:46 Yeah, and we aren't all able to relocate half way around the world just to learn Lisp, no matter how much we want to! 05:24:21 franki^: Oh, but if you are in the USA, for instance, you could save a lot of money on the enrollment fees. 05:24:59 beach: I'm actually in Mexico at the moment. 05:25:22 But, I can't really afford to study here either. :( 05:25:29 :( 05:25:44 Maybe by the autumn... 05:25:48 *maden* loves free education 05:25:58 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 05:26:03 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:26:03 see you later guys 05:26:09 bye. 05:26:12 bye wolgo 05:26:14 I will be back tomorrow to learn more alien technology 05:26:20 ou revoir 05:26:22 hah 05:26:24 au* 05:26:26 see ya 05:26:31 sure 05:26:34 hehe. 05:26:35 I dont speak french 05:26:37 I gave it a shot 05:26:39 lol 05:26:42 see you later 05:26:50 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 05:26:55 à plus tard :p 05:27:16 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:27:55 I think if I go back to school, I'll seek out descrete math courses. 05:28:07 billstclair [~billstcla@dsl-65-219-212-221.taconic.net] has joined #lisp 05:28:07 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@dsl-65-219-212-221.taconic.net] has quit [Changing host] 05:28:07 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 05:28:26 I can teach myself any programming language 05:28:35 mandala_ [mandala@anapnea.net] has joined #lisp 05:28:52 math is what i like the less about school 05:29:14 those damn calculus class... arh 05:29:38 -!- chittoor [~chittoor@117.204.50.169] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:33:14 bytecolor: in ten years 05:37:17 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.6.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:43:14 chittoor [~chittoor@117.204.52.157] has joined #lisp 05:47:55 -!- chittoor [~chittoor@117.204.52.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:47:55 -!- maden [~maden@dsl-144-81.aei.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:51:50 _KY_ [YKY@unaffiliated/-ky-/x-0649748] has joined #lisp 05:52:20 <_KY_> How can I avoid something like (setf mylist (append mylist list2)) ? 05:52:57 don't put it in your code 05:53:03 :) 05:53:52 _KY_: write an appendf macro! 05:54:28 and more seriously, it's unclear what you want to do and what you're trying to avoid 05:54:31 <_KY_> I'm just wondering if it is the stadard idiom 05:54:46 _KY_: It is. 05:54:53 appending lists is slow 05:55:04 <_KY_> Yes I want to make it more efficient too 05:55:20 <_KY_> Basically I just need to add an element to the end of list 05:55:23 _KY_: Sometimes it is better to build the list from the start. 05:55:39 <_KY_> Yes that's what I'm doing so far 05:55:50 <_KY_> But the code is less readable that way 05:55:57 What way? 05:56:02 toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-111-248.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 05:56:02 <_KY_> Building from start 05:56:23 Kolyan [~nartamono@89-178-240-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:56:23 not using lists at all maybe more efficient 05:56:31 _KY_: Oh, that is usually just an idea in the heads of people who both write from left to right, and draw their lists that way. 05:57:10 <_KY_> So I can use nconc? 05:57:32 _KY_: Doesn't work if you list is empty. 05:57:48 _KY_: Can you give some more context? Perhaps (loop ... collect ...) will work for you. 05:58:58 <_KY_> I have a function that adds an element to a list each time it's called 05:59:07 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:59:13 <_KY_> The list just accumulates results 05:59:22 why do you need such a function in the first place? 05:59:59 <_KY_> It's too complicated to explain... but what else can I do? 06:01:06 _KY_: I suggested (loop ... collect ...) 06:01:35 <_KY_> It's not in a loop... 06:01:55 Fine. 06:02:49 <_KY_> So the quickest way to add an element to list is (nconc list1 (list element1)) ? 06:03:05 _KY_: No, push is. 06:03:10 (cons element list) 06:03:22 _KY_: Draw your list from right to left, and you will see the light. 06:03:36 <_KY_> I see... 06:04:48 <_KY_> Stassats: I have to do (setf list1 (cons element1 list1)) right? 06:04:55 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 06:04:59 _KY_: (push element list) 06:05:08 _KY_: You aren't listening. 06:05:22 <_KY_> Ok =) 06:06:20 i predict the next question: "why isn't my list modified when i pass it to that function?" 06:09:06 <_KY_> No I'm using a global variable =) 06:09:13 a{ [~usern@38.109.136.11] has joined #lisp 06:10:06 -!- astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 06:15:21 astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 06:18:38 _KY_: was it declared with defvar? 06:19:03 <_KY_> Yeah 06:22:46 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.100.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:25:00 ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 06:29:57 lhz [~shrekz@c-b9aa72d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 06:32:29 -!- mandala_ [mandala@anapnea.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:32:43 -!- palter [palter@clozure-78A0C567.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: palter] 06:32:43 -!- palter [~palter@c-75-68-177-225.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: palter] 06:42:15 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has 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[~eugen@84-114-178-94.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:22:43 ejs [~eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #lisp 08:23:06 -!- OmniMancer [~OmniMance@219-89-108-137.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:30:35 -!- SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.124.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:43:44 fiveop [~fiveop@g229065032.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 08:44:43 Suppose one wants to introduce more detailed information of functions and other objects than the standard specifies. What would be a way of doing that in a portable way? Say for instance I want to introduce "pure functions", i.e. functions that are guaranteed to return the same value each time they are called with the same argument. 08:45:12 Once could introduce a new type that would be t in most implementations. 08:45:24 Or one could introduce a new declaration. 08:48:09 hicx174 [~hicx174@211.187.100.115] has joined #lisp 08:49:17 loxs [~loxs@78.90.124.181] has joined #lisp 08:50:30 c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 08:50:33 -!- trsh [trsh@93-139-89-77.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:50:45 -!- ejs [~eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:51:13 beach: maybe we could check typing at compile time with this 08:52:15 billitch: Yes, that's the point. 08:53:08 beach: i would really love to see this, common lisp would have nothing to envy ocaml then 08:53:25 billitch: But the point is also that I want to do this in a portable way, so that an implementation that doesn't want to exploit this information can safely ignore it. 08:54:02 beach: call it defknown, and store the information in a hash-table 08:54:20 see defknown in sbcl, abcl, xcl, or proclaim-ftype in ecl 08:55:02 ejs [~eugen@84-114-178-94.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 08:55:28 -!- ejs [~eugen@84-114-178-94.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Client Quit] 08:57:04 beach: maybe this can be an abstraction layer on all implementations ? 08:57:22 -!- dys` is now known as dys 09:02:34 tcr: In SBCL, defknown is a macro, which is yet another possibility. I am asking what the best alternative would be if one wanted to make this kind of information available in a portable way. 09:03:01 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 09:03:51 tcr: And I am asking what information of this type would be portable. I doubt that ir1-attributes would be for instance. 09:05:36 tcr: So for instance, it would be more portable to separate out type information about a function into ordinaty type declarations, which could be used by any implementation. 09:05:47 *ordinary 09:05:55 josemanuel [~josemanue@214.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 09:06:42 leo2007 [~leo@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust596.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has joined #lisp 09:07:56 beach: what could you portably do beyond a hash table linking values to type attributes ? 09:08:11 beach: and what more do you need ? 09:09:22 a macro to collapse the definition of value and extra type attributes is just sugar 09:11:38 skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has joined #lisp 09:12:30 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C413.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:14:25 clhs declaration 09:14:25 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/d_declar.htm 09:15:46 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:18:12 portable but unreadable i guess 09:19:59 beach: If "portable" means "cross-implementation", you could have your DEFKNOWN expand to implementation-specific constructs. 09:20:35 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 09:20:53 beach: I actually thing the declaration route would be more "stylish", but that's not how existing implementaitons seem to do it 09:20:57 *think 09:23:23 spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.73.70] has joined #lisp 09:25:40 OK, thanks for discussing this with me. 09:27:14 billitch: I am trying to thing about what big chunks of CL could be implemented in a totally portable way, so that people who want to experiment with new implementations could just take a selected subset of those chunks and just use them with little or no modification. 09:27:20 *think 09:28:27 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.167.73.70] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:29:22 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-pvakiupzarnbvdmr] has joined #lisp 09:31:17 -!- c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:33:40 c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 09:34:13 kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 09:36:26 beach: this sounds great, what would those chunks be ? i would really like to see explicit, static type checking in cl 09:37:37 billitch: Most macros, most high-level functions on sequences, format, pretty-printer, read (almost), etc. 09:38:35 billitch: The idea is also to use compiler macros to get good performance for important special cases of high-level functions. 09:40:45 billitch: Most sophisticated implementations do type inferencing I suppose. 09:40:53 beach: so you are on the implementation side, but in a portable way ? 09:41:24 beach: by you i mean your project =) 09:42:25 billitch: Well, it is a huge task, but if one could do it in those managable chunks, then it wouldn't matter if it never gets finished, because each piece would be independently useful. 09:43:12 beach: quite gluttonous =) 09:43:49 but what is the point ? improving existing implementations or writing new ones ? 09:43:57 -!- loxs [~loxs@78.90.124.181] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:44:09 billitch: Either one would be fine. 09:44:40 SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.124.26] has joined #lisp 09:45:12 billitch: For instance, implementing the standard CL macros with much better syntax checks and much better error reporting would be useful in both cases. 09:46:04 saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:47:26 beach: ok but wouldn't this much more work than improving existing implementations separately ? 09:48:00 I considered that, but I don't think so. 09:49:06 You would have to fork some existing implementation, and you would be on your own with this huge implementation-specific code base. 09:49:38 And I seriously doubt that maintainers of existing implementations would accept modifications to the code base just to make it more portable. 09:51:35 I think it's mostly due to "Don't touch a running system" 09:51:44 Exactly! 09:51:57 not because they're satisfied with the existing code base 09:52:13 tcr: and/or not enough regression tests ? 09:52:16 Yes, so the live with the baggage of the past. 09:52:29 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:52:35 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 09:52:59 billitch: I don't there are many regressions tests for stuff like syntactically-invalid macro usage 09:53:33 another problem are bootstrapping restrictions 09:56:14 -!- astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:58:38 but what does it mean to be portable inside implementation ? where is the abstraction boundary ? 09:59:39 -!- nixeagle [~user@Wikimedia/Nixeagle] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:59:49 and how would it be the same across all of them ? 10:01:15 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:01:56 phao [~phao@189.107.133.153] has joined #lisp 10:02:12 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 10:02:20 is there any book teaching techniques of concurrent programming using lisp? 10:04:07 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-210-187-11-tbnb-esr-2.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:04:28 Guthur [~Michael@host213-122-221-177.range213-122.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 10:05:37 -!- phao [~phao@189.107.133.153] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:10:44 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@89-178-240-135.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:10:59 Kolyan [~nartamono@95-24-231-16.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 10:11:14 -!- saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: saikat] 10:15:23 -!- bipt [~bpt@cl-851.chi-02.us.sixxs.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:18:23 -!- Nshag [user@lns-bzn-57-82-249-57-158.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:18:32 nha [~prefect@250-194.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 10:19:39 does slime has a git repo? 10:19:45 s/has/have/ 10:20:41 |Soulman| [~kvirc@154.80-202-254.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 10:21:06 yes, I think it's on boinkor 10:22:30 is it official? 10:22:49 it's taking me a long time to access the repo. 10:23:04 no it's not but it's automatically updated iirc 10:23:41 ok. I have been using both cvs and git to track slime. 10:23:47 last time it was discussed, a year ago maybe, the maintainer of slime prefered mercurial over git 10:24:35 that would be a mistake. 10:24:54 -!- egoz [~Egoz@114.79.55.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:26:05 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:27:05 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 10:27:35 Them's fightin; words, leo2007... 10:29:21 who is? 10:29:38 Privileging git over mercurial. 10:31:40 Nshag [user@lns-bzn-30-82-253-170-96.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 10:32:12 how so? 10:33:25 bluewres [~bluewres@c-98-207-94-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:33:26 -!- ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.64.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:35:01 Because each has its partisans. 10:35:09 -!- Athas [~athas@82.211.209.162] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:37:38 kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 10:37:39 well, they are all better than cvs, so that's fine for me. 10:37:48 cvs is more like rcs+ 10:37:56 Yeah, that much we can all agree on. 10:38:14 And is what changeset based VC fans should be arguing. 10:38:53 hg<-->git is pretty easy. 10:40:36 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:41:49 Is there any subtle semantic difference between "to defer" and "to postpone"? 10:41:52 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-pvakiupzarnbvdmr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:46:15 cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has joined #lisp 10:49:13 -!- timor [~timor@port-87-234-97-27.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:57:49 hey, i can't connect to remote swank 10:58:46 i set up everything like in manual, but my emacs says "connection broken by remote peer", and ssh tunnel says "channel 3: open failed: connect failed: Connection refused" 10:59:13 i can connect to it on that machine though, it seems there's something wrong with tunneling 10:59:17 yet i have no idea what 11:01:37 -!- cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 11:03:28 kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 11:03:46 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-jsucjvncptscondk] has joined #lisp 11:03:50 Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-112-99.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:05:19 timor [~timor@port-87-234-97-27.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 11:06:36 -!- kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:20:55 -!- vext01 [~edd@edd-sparc.kent.ac.uk] has left #lisp 11:21:12 my current approach of adding git on top of slime cvs repo gives me a repo of 4.8m while the unofficial slime git repo is over 100M and has taken forever for me to clone it. 11:23:05 -!- lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@200.80-202-59.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:24:24 i wonder if the current "Call for discussion" on lispworks-hug might be of interrest to planet lisp. 11:28:06 <_KY_> If my tail-call is within a loop, is that still considered tail-recursion? 11:29:53 <_KY_> I guess it's not.... 11:35:30 lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@200.80-202-59.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 11:38:10 -!- bluewres [~bluewres@c-98-207-94-46.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:40:14 -!- Xach_ is now known as Xach 11:44:05 tcr: the fuzzy completion buffers leave behind quite a few overlays with 'face nil. 11:44:55 do you know why it isn't using move-overlay but creating a new one whenever from one selection to another? 11:45:30 nur [nur@83.231.91.173] has joined #lisp 11:46:12 astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 11:47:59 Good morning. 11:48:35 alama [~alama@a95-95-128-109.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 11:49:33 carlocci [~nes@93.37.222.5] has joined #lisp 11:50:49 -!- astoon [~astoon@213.141.244.246] has quit [Client Quit] 11:50:59 astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 11:54:05 hello nur 11:55:23 nur: Are you new here, or is it just a new nick? 11:55:51 leo2007: maybe because it was not written by elisp hackers 11:57:18 I wouldn't mind a rewrite 11:57:48 leo2007 pasted "slime patch" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/97952 11:58:17 OK, would you consider the patch on past 97952? 12:00:59 looks ok but I don't have time neither do I care much about fuzzy completion 12:01:55 do you have a completion better than fuzzy? 12:09:37 no I use it in fact, though I'm sometimes annoyed when it gets confused and doesn't restore the keybindings in the target buffer 12:09:39 si|p [~si|p@cpe-24-92-71-240.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:12:23 it should probably make sure to restore keybindings on C-x 1 in the target buffer 12:13:45 the elisp side of fuzzy is really not complicated so we can re-design that interface. I have made fuzzy insert completion right in current buffer and made tab move from entry to entry 12:15:05 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483C413.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:15:21 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C413.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:21:21 -!- SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.124.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:21:42 -!- josemanuel [~josemanue@214.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:28:20 -!- astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:29:12 -!- nur [nur@83.231.91.173] has left #lisp 12:31:58 ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.74.75] has joined #lisp 12:39:01 ikki [~ikki@189.247.6.214] has joined #lisp 12:43:06 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:48:53 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 12:54:09 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Quit: Changing server] 12:56:37 -!- skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:57:44 skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has joined #lisp 12:59:05 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 12:59:36 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 13:00:35 dabd [~dabd@a85-139-100-189.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 13:00:58 -!- dabd [~dabd@a85-139-100-189.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:05:44 -!- OmniMancer1 [~OmniMance@122-57-20-131.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:05:49 moah [~gnu@dslb-188-101-028-054.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 13:06:26 -!- xinming [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:06:29 xinming_ [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has joined #lisp 13:13:33 LaPingvino [~LaPingvin@82-171-137-254.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #lisp 13:13:42 -!- bgs000 is now known as bgs100 13:16:58 -!- skeledrew [~skeledrew@0177-82-27-72-DYNAMIC-dsl.cwjamaica.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:16:58 francogrex [~user@234.102-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 13:17:15 is this well optimized: (defun add (x) (declare (optimize (safety 0) (speed 3)) (single-float x)) (the single-float (+ 3.0 x))) 13:18:03 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-jsucjvncptscondk] has left #lisp 13:22:21 francogrex: Look at the assembly code. 13:22:46 -!- nipra_ [~nipra@115.118.219.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:23:47 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Quit: Changing server] 13:24:10 amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 13:24:50 beach: it's a horrible code 13:25:02 Yours or the assembly code? 13:25:10 both 13:25:33 i didn't expect it that way 13:25:51 replacing single-float with fixnum makes it much better 13:25:59 but that's not what's needed 13:27:17 francogrex: Either way, you are probably out of luck because the return value probably isn't immediate (unless you are on a 64-bit platform and they made single float 32 bits or something like that. 13:28:20 I'm on a 32-bit unfortunately 13:30:31 attila_lendvai [~ati@catv-89-132-189-83.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 13:33:30 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:33:40 Hello! 13:33:46 hello mrSpec 13:34:41 Has anyone used any C parser in Lisp? is there any? 13:34:59 I have to parse source cod of C program, and add few "printf" lines to it. 13:35:04 s/cod/code 13:35:06 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:35:58 billstclair [~billstcla@gw3.tacwap.org] has joined #lisp 13:35:58 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@gw3.tacwap.org] has quit [Changing host] 13:35:58 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 13:36:17 -!- amaron [~amaron@cable-89-216-188-154.dynamic.sbb.rs] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:37:08 merl15__ [~merl@188-22-172-177.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 13:37:40 cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has joined #lisp 13:38:10 dlowe [~dlowe@c-71-232-16-117.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:03 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-71-232-16-117.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:39:11 dlowe [~dlowe@c-71-232-16-117.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:20 somecodehere [~ingvar@16.198.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #lisp 13:40:43 -!- merl15_ [~merl@188-22-164-88.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:40:56 udzinari [~user@209.158.broadband13.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 13:46:09 -!- udzinari [~user@209.158.broadband13.iol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:47:01 *dlowe* wonders if using acond could really be so bad... 13:50:59 -!- joga [joga@unaffiliated/joga] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:51:38 joga [joga@rikki.fi] has joined #lisp 13:52:35 -!- xinming_ [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:53:43 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:54:59 xinming [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has joined #lisp 13:59:41 mrSpec: i would be interested too, gccxml seems interesting, and this thread too : http://coding.derkeiler.com/Archive/Lisp/comp.lang.lisp/2005-04/msg00663.html 14:01:24 billitch: xml hmm I'll read this thread, thx 14:04:18 potatishandlarn [~potatisha@c-5eea0d86-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has joined #lisp 14:04:32 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 14:06:35 -!- xinming [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:06:58 astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has joined #lisp 14:07:37 /join #bluebream 14:07:37 14:07:49 -!- si|p [~si|p@cpe-24-92-71-240.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:12:31 xinming [~hyy@125.109.76.43] has joined #lisp 14:13:31 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:18:21 -!- kwinz3 [~kwinz@85.125.182.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:18:49 TimoT [~ttossava@cs161225.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 14:21:42 knobo [~user@90.149.5.35] has joined #lisp 14:22:31 Odin- [~sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 14:22:58 during http requests to hunchntoot I get a lot of SIGSEGV (Segmentation fault) @ 0 (0) 14:23:06 When I look at the process with strace 14:23:17 Is that wrong? 14:24:14 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.6.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 14:24:37 quick sbcl question: I'm doing a bunch of computations that need a ton of small matrices (varying sizes) as intermediate results and high-performance. The simplest way to represent them is 2D simple arrays. Is there any way to avoid consing the arrays, while keeping the code that produces the arrays simple. I'm also trying to avoid preallocation, because there are a whole lot of intermediate results and since the sizes are varying, 14:24:38 pooling is tricky. 14:25:00 ikki [~ikki@189.139.98.228] has joined #lisp 14:27:11 knobo: I believe sbcl uses SEGV as part of its memory management system 14:28:00 In lack of better knowledge I'll consider that funny. 14:28:30 Timot: you could allocate a large vector and manage the allocations manually 14:28:35 would displaced arrays work for this? 14:28:57 I guess I could pool the array headers.. 14:28:57 knobo: it's quite useful since it's automatically generated by a page fault 14:29:25 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 14:29:46 TimoT: I mean, the difference between a 1D and a 2D array is just some arithmetic 14:30:47 sure, but I guess the compiler would produce better code for declared 2D arrays than some emulation of such. 14:31:02 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7558ca.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:31:19 TimoT: you'll probably get better code by doing the index computation yourself, actually. 14:31:50 Some trick with malloc might work nicely. 14:32:31 pkhuong: (struct offset stride pointer-to-simple-array)? 14:32:42 spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.166.153.177] has joined #lisp 14:32:42 hagabaka [~quassel@cblmdm24-53-178-92.buckeyecom.net] has joined #lisp 14:32:42 -!- hagabaka [~quassel@cblmdm24-53-178-92.buckeyecom.net] has quit [Changing host] 14:32:42 hagabaka [~quassel@unaffiliated/hagabaka] has joined #lisp 14:32:51 -!- ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.74.75] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:33:01 TimoT: I was more thinking a struct of stride and a SAP. 14:33:25 well, that would work too. 14:34:28 malloc/free should be pretty good at handling different allocation sizes. 14:34:45 More expensive than bump allocation, of course. 14:35:47 nurv [nurv@62.32.131.195] has joined #lisp 14:35:57 I can bound the memory use beforehand. It's basically compiling a function graph into straight code to evaluate jacobians. 14:37:03 Evening. 14:37:12 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@122.166.153.177] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:38:00 TimoT: well, if you know memory use won't be too large, I'd go with foreign allocation in an arena that's only freed at the end. 14:38:08 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-akdcipsptzpzfnql] has joined #lisp 14:38:11 lots of small ones to put in a huge sparse matrix :) 14:38:22 And you can pun them into SBCL vectors too. 14:40:02 -!- mgr_ [~mgr@psychonaut.psychlotron.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:41:36 kwinz3 [~kwinz@213162066158.public.t-mobile.at] has joined #lisp 14:46:12 rtra [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has joined #lisp 14:53:12 -!- Zephyrus [~emanuele@unaffiliated/zephyrus] has quit [Quit: ""] 14:54:03 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:56:59 Lis [~Lis@dialbs-092-079-130-087.static.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 14:59:52 -!- p_l [plasek@gateway/shell/rootnode.net/x-mmiszrwsthxgehqd] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:06 davazp [~user@83.57.37.58] has joined #lisp 15:01:12 -!- davazp [~user@83.57.37.58] has quit [Client Quit] 15:06:35 -!- adeht [~death@bzq-84-110-249-55.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:06:42 mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-72-83-118-99.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:07:56 pkhuong pasted "Runtime compilation is still simpler than static analyses" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/97959 15:10:21 -!- debiandebian [~chatzilla@ntszok008047.szok.nt.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:12:08 adeht [~death@bzq-84-110-249-55.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 15:12:40 -!- francogrex [~user@234.102-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:14:25 pkhuong: nice! 15:16:11 -!- legumbre_ [~leo@r190-135-18-112.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:16:13 pkhuong: are serializable closures somehow limited or otherwise special compared to regular ones (that is, what would, in theory, prevent any closure from being serializable)? 15:16:55 cmm: there's some badness with mutability, but otherwise you just have to type slambda/sfunction instead of lambda/function. 15:17:23 I'm still trying to see how to fix said mutability and hook that in ir1-tran. 15:17:30 -!- astoon [~user@213.141.244.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:18:26 pkhuong: mutability of what, closed-over things? 15:18:37 mutability of bindings, sorry. 15:18:50 The closed-over stuff is fine as long as you stick to the same image. 15:19:16 Obviously, object identity won't survive a print/read roundtrip. 15:20:08 ah 15:20:50 legumbre [~leo@r190-135-26-162.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 15:20:51 I'd imagine the result of build-expr-of is not guaranteed to be very human-readable :) 15:21:40 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-akdcipsptzpzfnql] has left #lisp 15:23:33 pkhuong annotated #97959 "build-expr-of" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/97959#1 15:24:03 not too bad, but pre-macro-expanded. 15:25:28 It's my old stuff from common cold, but with a weak hash table instead of a funcallable class. 15:26:22 cool stuff indeed 15:27:10 vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.89.153] has joined #lisp 15:29:14 ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 15:34:31 abeaumont [~abeaumont@84.76.48.250] has joined #lisp 15:36:11 -!- kwinz3 [~kwinz@213162066158.public.t-mobile.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:38:37 -!- cmsimon [~chatzilla@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 15:46:42 *attila_lendvai* could use serializable closures in hu.dwim.delico (CPS stuff) 15:46:54 I just looked at cliki for anything current/vital in the lisp OS category and did cursory google due diligence, nobody knows of anything going on in that context? 15:47:36 pkhuong, are you coming to els'10? 15:47:51 nope. 15:48:12 too bad 15:49:30 p_l [plasek@gateway/shell/rootnode.net/x-xvqpjlvuinurkhlm] has joined #lisp 15:52:00 -!- Lis [~Lis@dialbs-092-079-130-087.static.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 15:58:48 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:00:34 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-112-99.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:01:38 JuanDaugherty: You can see my lisp-project page. http://dept-info.labri.fr/~strandh/Lisp-projects/ but activity is low. 16:01:54 JuanDaugherty: That also has a link to nyef's LispOS site. 16:02:07 JuanDaugherty: What kind of things are you looking for? 16:02:39 JuanDaugherty: An, of course, there is Movitz. 16:02:58 -!- sepeth [~user@78.180.73.7] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:28 maden [~maden@modemcable068.120-20-96.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 16:03:45 thanks will check it out;did see movitz, was looking for something higher level. 16:04:12 In what way? 16:05:23 .... like SICl? 16:05:25 SICL, too. 16:06:25 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:07:58 dnolen [~dnolen@ool-18bc2fa9.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:09 Elench [~jarv@unaffiliated/elench] has joined #lisp 16:08:27 -!- seangrove [~user@c-67-188-2-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 16:08:54 well in the broad category of concepts like: http://www.lisphacker.com/projects/sbcl-os/project-map/ 16:09:19 drwho [~drwho@c-71-225-11-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:09:22 JuanDaugherty: OK. 16:09:27 didn't find anything lisp related for "SICL" 16:09:54 JuanDaugherty: Don't worry about it. It is not quite related to the kind of LispOS stuff you are looking for. 16:10:07 Besides, I have been blabbing about it enough today I think. 16:10:09 ah, OK, thx 16:10:31 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.64.202.69] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:11:06 cmm [~cmm@bzq-109-64-202-69.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 16:11:19 -!- spearalot [~spearalot@192.165.126.74] has quit [Quit: -arividerchi] 16:11:30 oddly the thing I did find for "sicl" is relevant to something totally unrelated (to lisp or my query) that I'm doing so thanks for that 16:12:19 JuanDaugherty: http://dept-info.labri.fr/~strandh/SICL/ 16:13:10 JuanDaugherty: There is some stuff to read if you clone the GIT repos and go to the Specification subdirectory. 16:13:34 With the sbcl-os roadmap, can't the WM requirement be ticked off with stump? 16:13:52 -!- somecodehere [~ingvar@16.198.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:14:05 just installed stump in my nixos instance 16:14:26 at first was disappointed it wasn't sbcl but I guess clisp makes more sense in this case 16:14:41 Is it bad to use stump with sbcl? 16:15:07 I do. 16:15:10 or at least would make merging elements of another c based wm into it easier 16:15:30 you ported it to sbcl? 16:15:44 I just downloaded the git archive and ran it on sbcl 16:15:45 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f7558ca.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:47 are we talking stumpwm? 16:15:53 it works fine under sbcl JuanDaugherty 16:16:05 i see, it may be that the nix packager chose clisp 16:16:06 it's just that the image is quite smaller with clisp I think 16:16:49 great, glad to hear that acieroid 16:17:25 tic yes, stumpwm 16:17:37 JuanDaugherty, was broken in the past with threading and sbcl, not anymore. 16:17:59 tic: make that *less*. 16:18:03 ah, good. beach: will pull the git repo when I get back 16:18:08 *JuanDaugherty* afk 16:18:09 palter [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:21b:63ff:fe96:e1ff] has joined #lisp 16:18:14 pkhuong, oh? what in particular? 16:18:33 the issue wasn't fixed, only papered over with a larger constant-size buffer. 16:18:47 *lalallala* =) 16:18:48 -!- darkestkhan [~darkestkh@109.243.95.238] has left #lisp 16:21:41 BrianRice [~water@c-76-115-44-87.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:23:34 -!- mbohun [~mbohun@ppp115-156.static.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:26:00 iiuc, the problem is architectural. If you have to use threads and signals, every thread but a dedicated sig handling thread should block signals. That thread can then use block signals and wait for signals via signalfd. 16:26:37 I don't remember what the portable (non-linux) equivalent is. 16:26:43 retupmoca` [~retupmoca@adsl-76-236-188-125.dsl.klmzmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:27:38 block signals, sigsuspend and a nearly no-op handler, I suppose. 16:29:31 -!- anair_84 [~anair_84@ip68-108-251-45.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:30:18 -!- retupmoca [~retupmoca@adsl-76-235-193-239.dsl.klmzmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:30:30 Davidbrcz [~david@ANantes-151-1-112-99.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:31:10 nipra_ [~nipra@219.64.167.208] has joined #lisp 16:33:01 -!- retupmoca` [~retupmoca@adsl-76-236-188-125.dsl.klmzmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:34:31 -!- yacin [~yacin@tyr.gtisc.gatech.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:35:39 -!- TimoT [~ttossava@cs161225.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:38:08 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:39:15 -!- ShadowChild is now known as lukjad86 16:44:25 quidnunc [~user@70.49.123.43] has joined #lisp 16:45:36 toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-111-248.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 16:47:39 retupmoca` [~retupmoca@adsl-76-236-188-125.dsl.klmzmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:51:25 If a condition is raised in slime is there a way to continue by dynamically specifying a return value or modifying the input parameter for the exceptional function? 16:52:18 that depends on the condition 16:52:40 quidnunc: frames displayed in green can be restarted 16:53:14 SB-INT:SIMPLE-PARSE-ERROR is the condition 16:54:00 dmsh_ [~dmsh@ppp91-78-75-217.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 16:54:45 tcr: The question is whether I can do something more than the restarts that slime provides to me in the "Restarts" list. That is, can I "RETRY" but with a different input argument? 16:55:16 -!- dmsh [~dmsh@ppp83-237-214-48.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:55:49 -!- dmsh_ [~dmsh@ppp91-78-75-217.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Client Quit] 16:56:03 -!- retupmoca` is now known as retupmoca 16:56:14 ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 16:56:47 ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-135-10.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 16:57:47 you can restart a _frame_ in which case the function above that frame is called again. before restarting you can redefine that function to do whatever you want to do 16:58:26 i guess quidnunc wants something more higher-level 16:59:07 rabuf [~user@ip68-230-168-93.mc.at.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:59:30 fisxoj [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban1.inka-online.net] has joined #lisp 16:59:44 -!- schme [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:59:48 schme [~marcus@c83-254-196-101.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 16:59:48 -!- schme [~marcus@c83-254-196-101.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Changing host] 16:59:48 schme [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 16:59:48 Yeah, I just want to specify a return value for the failing function so it can continue 17:00:13 you can't do that unless that was provisioned by the function 17:00:24 stassats`: Thanks, that's what I was afraid of. 17:02:22 there's sldb-return-from-frame (R) though I never used it 17:07:39 -!- nurv is now known as nurv|off 17:09:52 skeledrew [~skeledrew@72.27.205.90] has joined #lisp 17:15:32 well, that's one year's worth of work for a negative result. I wonder how the prof'll take it. 17:15:34 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:17:07 rtra_ [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has joined #lisp 17:19:27 Joreji [~thomas@90-144.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 17:21:13 -!- rtra [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:23:11 -!- c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:25:17 -!- hagabaka [~quassel@unaffiliated/hagabaka] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:25:26 c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:25:45 kwinz3 [~kwinz@d86-33-115-52.cust.tele2.at] has joined #lisp 17:26:47 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@84.76.48.250] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:27:45 hagabaka [~quassel@cblmdm24-53-178-92.buckeyecom.net] has joined #lisp 17:27:45 -!- hagabaka [~quassel@cblmdm24-53-178-92.buckeyecom.net] has quit [Changing host] 17:27:45 hagabaka [~quassel@unaffiliated/hagabaka] has joined #lisp 17:31:11 lhz [~shrekz@c-b9aa72d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 17:34:41 -!- nurv|off [nurv@62.32.131.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:43:07 -!- quidnunc [~user@70.49.123.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:44:44 nixeagle [~user@Wikimedia/Nixeagle] has joined #lisp 17:45:24 palter_ [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:217:f2ff:fee7:72d7] has joined #lisp 17:46:46 -!- toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-111-248.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:46:53 -!- ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-135-10.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set yourself on fire.] 17:50:32 ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has joined #lisp 17:51:52 ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-135-10.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 17:52:44 saikat [~saikat@c-71-202-153-244.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:55:42 -!- maden [~maden@modemcable068.120-20-96.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:59:14 -!- Draggor [~Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:08:09 ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.81.195] has joined #lisp 18:12:11 abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 18:12:37 -!- ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.81.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:15:58 -!- adeht [~death@bzq-84-110-249-55.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:16:14 bipt [~bpt@cl-851.chi-02.us.sixxs.net] has joined #lisp 18:16:53 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082C7BC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:20:23 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5082C5CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:20:56 redline6561 [~redline@c-66-56-16-250.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:25:15 marioxcc [~user@200.92.179.204] has joined #lisp 18:26:34 pkhuong, ouch. what was it about? 18:28:31 mejja [~user@c-68b6e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 18:28:43 francogrex [~user@234.102-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 18:28:57 computing lower bounds (aggressive approximations) for a problem. 18:29:04 what's a way to find the root/home directory? 18:29:26 clhs u-h-p 18:29:26 USER-HOMEDIR-PATHNAME: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_user_h.htm 18:29:36 Turns out the latest version of CPLEX (an industry-standard black box for integer linear problems) is pretty good at that. 18:30:04 thx 18:30:05 At least the heuristic we developed mostly during my undergraduate degree are still better. 18:31:02 pkhuong: I share a certain amount of your frustration... I put in a (rejected) funding bit for a call a year or so ago. The research programme that was funded and flagged as being the ideal for this call is going to attempt to duplicate a commercial product which is purchaseable off the shelf 18:33:06 Krystof: duplicating CPLEX would actually be good for the research world (even if probably useless in the real world). Everyone depends on this hugely complex (and reliable) black box with dozens of vaguely-explained parameters. It's also never going to happen. 18:34:07 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@95-24-231-16.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [] 18:36:05 -!- benny [~benny@i577A8A7D.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:36:43 -!- LaPingvino [~LaPingvin@82-171-137-254.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:38:14 -!- necroforest [~jarred@pool-71-191-247-161.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 18:41:01 -!- attila_lendvai [~ati@catv-89-132-189-83.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:49:57 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@216-171-189-244.northland.net] has quit [Quit: kpreid] 18:50:26 -!- rtra_ [~rtra@unaffiliated/rtra] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:51:46 pkhuong: in this case, the research programme that was flagshipped will not be desperately useful to many people at all 18:54:02 Sad. 18:57:31 -!- francogrex [~user@234.102-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:59:20 well, I shouldn't complain too much 19:04:40 maden [~maden@modemcable068.120-20-96.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 19:05:30 benny [~benny@i577A7543.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 19:05:48 billitch_ [~billitch@rob92-1-82-67-155-88.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 19:06:06 nurv|off [nurv@62.32.128.30] has joined #lisp 19:06:24 -!- leo2007 [~leo@cpc1-cmbg13-0-0-cust596.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:08:10 -!- nurv|off is now known as nurv 19:11:07 -!- palter_ [palter@clozure-78A0C567.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: palter_] 19:11:07 -!- palter_ [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:217:f2ff:fee7:72d7] has quit [Quit: palter_] 19:14:43 fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban.inka-online.net] has joined #lisp 19:14:59 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban1.inka-online.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:20:11 yacin [~yacin@tyr.gtisc.gatech.edu] has joined #lisp 19:21:39 prxq [~mommer@g226147190.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 19:21:45 hi 19:23:03 hi 19:25:48 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 19:32:32 -!- fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban.inka-online.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:33:48 poincare101 [~poincare1@c-174-58-20-9.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:34:03 what are some major projects lisp is used for (aside from Emacs and GIMP)? 19:36:21 ITA (software behind Orbitz) 19:36:43 poincare101: Take a look at "By application domain" here: http://www.cliki.net/index 19:37:30 anair_84 [~anair_84@ip68-108-251-45.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 19:37:53 palter_ [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:217:f2ff:fee7:72d7] has joined #lisp 19:37:57 ejs [~eugen@109.167.119.165] has joined #lisp 19:39:07 -!- palter_ [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:217:f2ff:fee7:72d7] has quit [Client Quit] 19:39:22 gimp uses lisp? 19:39:30 scheme 19:39:59 I see. 19:41:23 -!- maden [~maden@modemcable068.120-20-96.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:42:41 fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban.inka-online.net] has joined #lisp 19:42:44 davazp [~user@83.57.37.58] has joined #lisp 19:42:51 -!- billitch_ [~billitch@rob92-1-82-67-155-88.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: billitch_] 19:43:03 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 19:43:22 pkhuong: haha look at that kludge for osx nanosleep 19:44:44 oh wait it seem that was a private reply 19:45:57 too bad (: 19:46:04 *stassats`* is trying to exploit slime 19:46:32 (define-symbol-macro delete-all-files (print 'HELLO)) and (in-package #.cl-user::delete-all-files) causes to print hello 19:46:43 but you need a symbol macro beforehand 19:47:31 poincare101: Also a "major" app is Maxima. 19:47:45 minion: ACL2? 19:47:46 ACL2: ACL2 (A Computational Logic for Applicative Common Lisp) is a theorem prover for industrial Applications. http://www.cliki.net/ACL2 19:48:08 -!- fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@gw-fr-vauban.inka-online.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:48:46 fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@80.153.54.203] has joined #lisp 19:49:51 -!- nipra_ [~nipra@219.64.167.208] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:50:53 -!- vu3rdd [~vu3rdd@122.167.89.153] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:51:31 attila_lendvai [~ati@catv-89-132-189-83.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 19:55:37 Draggor [~Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 19:57:07 minion: mirai? 19:57:07 Sorry, I couldn't find anything in the database for ``mirai''. 19:57:44 Hezy [~Hezy@62.56.254.178] has joined #lisp 19:58:01 Here anyway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirai_%28software%29 20:03:43 -!- abugosh [~Adium@216-164-114-53.c3-0.tlg-ubr3.atw-tlg.pa.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:06:09 -!- davazp [~user@83.57.37.58] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:08:02 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.98.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:08:02 -!- freiksenet [~freiksene@hoasnet-fe29dd00-202.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:10:25 -!- lhz [~shrekz@c-b9aa72d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:10:53 -!- gl_ is now known as gl 20:10:53 -!- rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:11:56 rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has joined #lisp 20:15:42 -!- guaqua [gua@xob.kapsi.fi] has left #lisp 20:18:42 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 20:18:59 -!- moah [~gnu@dslb-188-101-028-054.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:19:39 OmniMancer [~OmniMance@122-57-20-131.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #lisp 20:31:38 tcr: oh yeah, I remember that patch. 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[~smanek@static-71-249-221-129.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:58:38 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 22:58:50 -!- palter [palter@clozure-78A0C567.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: palter] 22:58:51 -!- palter [~palter@2002:4b44:b1e1:0:21b:63ff:fe96:e1ff] has quit [Quit: palter] 22:59:25 -!- |Soulman| [~kvirc@154.80-202-254.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:01:42 dnolen [~dnolen@pool-70-19-69-201.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:05:16 ichernetsky [~ichernets@195.222.64.45] has joined #lisp 23:07:53 Lis [~Lis@dialbs-092-079-130-087.static.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 23:08:10 hi all. Is there a diff3 lib for lisp? 23:08:27 what's diff3? 23:10:25 stassats` http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diff3 23:11:11 why does it have to be written in lisp? 23:11:55 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:12:30 stassats` originally I asked a question and it isn't answered right now 23:12:52 Not that I know of. RUN-PROGRAM might be close enough. 23:13:31 If you have a really good reason to want it in lisp (e.g. to work on data structured as a list or something), looks useful. 23:14:38 -!- merl15_ [~merl@188-22-162-198.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:15:59 -!- brookeGarcia is now known as maden 23:16:07 -!- billitch [~billitch@rob92-1-82-67-155-88.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: billitch] 23:16:55 pkhuong hm I try to implement some sort of version control with list. My first goal is to automaticly create backups by copying the files to a different location. My next step will be to implement a fullbackup/incremental backup system. The easiest way would be to create some script wich starts rcs on every file.... 23:16:57 -!- maden is now known as brookeGarcia 23:17:26 -!- fisxoj_ [~fisxoj@80.153.54.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:17:53 pkhuong I really do not want to implement it completely in lisp but I htought someone would have already done some work 23:18:26 I have to doubt that the best way to represent revision control data internally is as a diff. 23:19:38 There are a couple successful systems that only use hash to avoid redundant copies. With HD prices constantly going down, the trade offs can only get better. 23:20:33 Lis: why not implement a content-addressable store and then make datastructures on top of that? 23:21:07 minion: paste 97959 for p_l 23:21:07 p_l: have a look at Paste number 97959: "Runtime compilation is still simpler than static analyses" by pkhuong in #lisp. http://paste.lisp.org/display/97959 23:21:17 I think you might find that interesting 23:24:21 mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.73.124] has joined #lisp 23:26:26 troussan [~user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:27:03 -!- Lis [~Lis@dialbs-092-079-130-087.static.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 23:27:34 -!- grouzen [~grouzen@91.214.124.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:37:50 *p_l* wonders how people deal with IRC "acquaintances" when writing down "foreign contacts" lists for stuff like security clearance... 23:38:21 p_l: can't be much worse than pen pals. 23:38:22 -!- mejja [~user@c-68b6e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:39:24 pkhuong: at least one opinion I heard would suggest that I should write down drewc and beach on mine -_-; 23:40:06 despite how ridiculous all of that sounds, since the clearance isn't even for me (it's done by family member...) 23:40:34 carbocalm [~user@75-119-224-86.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 23:40:56 -!- WOG [~OsamaBinW@adsl-75-27-148-74.dsl.wlfrct.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:41:01 -!- carbocalm [~user@75-119-224-86.dsl.teksavvy.com] has left #lisp 23:43:38 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 23:52:11 -!- lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@200.80-202-59.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:52:57 fortunately, someone excluded "internet communication". I got off easy :) 23:54:35 -!- alama [~alama@a95-95-128-109.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: alama] 23:58:09 :p 23:58:53 pinterface [~pinterfac@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net] has joined #lisp