00:01:29 gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-76-254-20-231.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:01:56 Okay, what's the stylish way to test whether all the elements of a list are the same (for some "sameness" predicate)? 00:02:14 -!- meltingwax [n=meltingw@unaffiliated/meltingwax] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:02:35 holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has joined #lisp 00:03:07 (apply (function same) list) like in (apply (function equal) list-of-elements) 00:03:32 Otherwise: (every (lambda (x) (samep x (first list))) (rest list)) 00:03:43 pjb: Yeah. Though that loses some style points given the limitations on number of args. 00:03:55 pjb: The second one is the one I was just writing. 00:04:04 -!- stepnem [n=versme@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:04:04 So there's some concensus... 00:04:12 -!- tttsssttt [n=pussycat@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:04:14 Though that's less cool if list is computed--then you have to bind it in advance. Which also loses style points. :-( 00:05:16 tttsssttt [n=pussycat@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 00:05:47 nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 00:06:12 can't you use reduce? 00:06:20 stepnem [n=versme@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:34 Phoodus: that was my first thought but I'm too dumb to make it work, apparently. 00:06:49 it will traverse all list even if it encounters first non equal element 00:07:11 Though this may be moot, because what I really want is to know what the mismatching element is, if there is one. 00:07:13 well, I'd do a recursive function then 00:07:30 it's too unstylish 00:07:50 what? recursive functions are the epitome of functional stylishness, especially for early terminatino 00:08:34 who needs functional stylishness 00:08:45 (reduce (lambda (r e) (list (and (first r) (samep (second r) e)) (second r) (cons e (third r)))) list :initial-value (list t (first list) '())) -> (samep first-element list) 00:09:00 -!- elias` [n=me@unaffiliated/elias/x-342423] has quit [Connection timed out] 00:10:01 You may also vary it to return (cons samep list) so you don't duplicate the first element in the result. But indeed, if you want to optimize it you'll have to write your own tail recursive function. 00:10:54 stassats: I do not know what "stylishness" you're going for then 00:11:05 gigamonkey: sounds like you want... 00:11:13 clhs: mismatch 00:11:14 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_mismat.htm 00:11:14 common lisp stylishness 00:12:14 -!- ausente is now known as dalton 00:12:21 -!- slashus2 [n=dex@173-25-18-77.client.mchsi.com] has quit [] 00:12:41 nikodemus: with an looped list for one of the sequences? 00:13:31 slashus2 [n=dex@173-25-18-77.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 00:13:45 -!- prip [n=_prip@host134-123-dynamic.32-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:14:02 -!- Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [] 00:15:38 oh, i misread your question. sorry 00:15:38 -!- slashus2 [n=dex@173-25-18-77.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Client Quit] 00:16:10 nikodemus: with additional VOPs for complex arith in addition to packing in SSE regs, we get sensible speed-ups (often nearly 50% as much time). Is that worth the additional complexity? 00:16:11 -!- jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:16:26 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 00:16:27 jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has joined #lisp 00:17:07 pkhuong: is it just complexity, or is it actually hairy? 00:17:27 no hairiness; it's all straightforward code. 00:17:37 definitely worth it, imo 00:17:39 just extra VOPs. 00:17:56 we don't have a gui, so we can be performance focused... 00:18:21 prip [n=_prip@host134-123-dynamic.32-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 00:18:24 -!- Soulman [n=kvirc@42.84-48-88.nextgentel.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:19:15 pkhuong pasted "Complex arithmetic benchmarks" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/80464 00:20:00 Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 00:20:07 And what are your thoughts on constant-folding EQ of non-comparable types to NIL? ;) (or at least style warning about that) 00:20:47 -!- dysinger [n=tim@32.177.51.225] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:21:07 slashus2 [n=dex@173-25-18-77.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 00:21:54 you mean (eq 1 1.0)? 00:22:26 any EQ involving non-fixnum numbers. 00:23:07 i might see the point for giving a style-warning about numbers, yes 00:23:49 the spec also allows constant folding to NIL, but that's probably a bit extreme. 00:24:20 Vegan [n=sdfpme@119.128.75.221] has joined #lisp 00:24:32 Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 00:24:41 as long as we don't stop constant-folding to NIL when either or both are non-numbers 00:25:08 -!- Modius [n=Modius@adsl-70-240-15-80.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:25:43 Modius [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 00:26:34 gigamonkey: (let ((x (elt seq 0))) (every (lambda (y) (eql x y)) seq)) 00:27:20 not list specific, which may or may no be a bonus 00:29:36 -!- Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:29:44 beach` [n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-19-62.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 00:29:46 Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 00:30:39 -!- amnesiac [n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac] has quit ["Leaving"] 00:31:16 -!- MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has quit ["BB"] 00:31:19 -!- DeusExPikachu [n=DeusExPi@wireless-169-235-58-205.ucr.edu] has quit ["Leaving"] 00:31:32 -!- holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 00:31:37 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:32:12 bombshelter13_ [n=bombshel@209-161-225-42.dsl.look.ca] has joined #lisp 00:32:44 -!- Modius [n=Modius@ppp-70-244-121-32.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:33:41 -!- lnostdal [i=lnostdal@149-234-40.oke2-bras6.adsl.tele2.no] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:33:43 dysinger [n=tim@71.216.13.30] has joined #lisp 00:35:17 lnostdal [i=lnostdal@149-234-40.oke2-bras6.adsl.tele2.no] has joined #lisp 00:35:46 *gigamonkey* hates file open dialogs with a white-hot burning passion 00:36:19 C-x C-f for the win? 00:36:39 stassats: Yeah. Doesn't help with #@$@#$% Microsoft Word though. 00:37:02 *gigamonkey* is at that very unhappy part of the book publication process where Microsoft Word comes into play. 00:37:17 holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has joined #lisp 00:37:28 -!- rdd [n=user@c83-250-152-109.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:37:45 my condolences 00:38:22 The good news is it's also the happy part of the book publication process where I'M ALMOST DONE!!! ;-) 00:39:48 Aha! I just figured out how to invoke Word from the command line. Life is marginally better. 00:40:12 nikodemus: where would you put VM-specific stuff that needs the assembler? bottom of insts.lisp? 00:43:07 insts.lisp, system.lisp, or vm.lisp maybe. dunno 00:46:45 -!- beach [n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-27-178.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:47:14 -!- Corun [n=Corun@94-194-29-31.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has quit ["Leaving..."] 00:48:45 HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 00:49:05 slacks21 [n=ckuttruf@ip68-101-220-87.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 00:49:53 -!- The-Kenny [n=moritz@p5087A5D3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:50:06 hey all. quick question. I'm using cl-html-parse to convert html to s-exps, and then later using those expressions with allegroserve (html generator function 00:50:23 but for some reason, it's not evaluating it when it's not being literally entered in the source code 00:50:44 slacks21: are you sure that generator isn't a macro? 00:50:54 -!- tttsssttt [n=pussycat@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:50:55 -!- stepnem [n=versme@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:51:08 (html (:html (:head ... works , but not (html (parse-html's return) 00:51:17 I think it is 00:51:22 but should it make a difference? 00:52:40 tttsssttt [n=pussycat@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 00:53:00 it could 00:53:07 stepnem [n=versme@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 00:53:29 Vegan_ [n=sdfpme@119.128.75.221] has joined #lisp 00:54:40 -!- Vegan_ [n=sdfpme@119.128.75.221] has quit [Client Quit] 00:56:27 -!- rullie 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["http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"] 01:48:16 -!- HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 01:49:16 -!- sh10151 [n=user@cpe-76-181-82-14.columbus.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:56:25 -!- maxote [n=eldragon@84.79.67.254] has quit [Connection timed out] 01:59:54 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@119.128.94.37] has joined #lisp 02:00:31 -!- dreish [n=dreish@minus.dreish.org] has quit [] 02:02:29 -!- cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-167-159.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 02:02:45 cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-167-159.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 02:08:43 -!- fisxoj [n=fisxoj@ool-4356ce50.dyn.optonline.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 02:08:44 -!- nego_ [n=nego@c-67-173-168-255.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 02:12:10 conspiracy theory: UML was secretly designed by Sun's Java team to boost java and further surpress those ever-threatening CLOS hackers 02:12:31 eno [n=eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 02:14:04 -!- eno__ [n=eno@adsl-70-137-165-65.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 02:17:04 MasochisticLibra [n=Masochis@c-24-2-191-235.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:23:53 jlf` [n=user@netblock-208-127-247-67.dslextreme.com] has joined #lisp 02:28:56 derekv: I think it was Ada folks, at least in part. 02:30:48 -!- mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-100-82-124.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [] 02:30:50 See also this: http://www.csc.lsu.edu/~gb/csc4101/Reading/gigo-1997-04.html ;-) 02:36:11 "we don't have a gui, so we can be performance focused..." -> Fascinating. :) 02:36:23 -!- Axioplase_ is now known as Axioplase 02:38:24 spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-d85d94d06e9f28e0] has joined #lisp 02:38:49 hefner: nearly 50% speed-up on complex-complex multiplication, more than 100% on addition... that ought to help with FFT? (: 02:39:29 that would be wild. 02:40:05 man i'm going to print this out, walk to coney island, and read it over a coney special :) 02:40:40 -!- ikki [n=ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit ["Leaving"] 02:41:41 gigamonkey, did you see that ereader company i linked to yesterday? they are expensive, but run on linux and you can draw on them. seems to indicate you can annotate pdfs. 02:42:10 -!- kleppari1 [n=spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 02:42:22 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@119.128.94.37] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 02:42:22 Their large ones are super expensive and it does say you can annotate pdfs with handwriting, but doesn't say they run on linux. :/ 02:43:42 echo-area [n=user@nat/yahoo/x-7b606885d01eedde] has joined #lisp 02:43:55 an X server running on an ereader with wifi , all sorts of fun :) 02:47:34 -!- slashus2 [n=dex@173-25-18-77.client.mchsi.com] has quit [] 02:49:01 -!- MasochisticLibra [n=Masochis@c-24-2-191-235.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 02:51:42 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 02:51:46 -!- gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-76-254-20-231.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 02:52:35 i think this should be a standard pattern/stock-answer to people wondering how to remove mutual dependency in the case of two classes each of which has a slot of the other's type 02:53:04 lemonodor [n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-24-169.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:53:35 break up one of them by deriving it from an abstract class. 02:56:16 (defclass A (x) ((slot :type B))) (defclass B (x) ((slot :type A))) ==> (defclass B% (x) (())) (defclass A (x) ((slot :type B))) (defclass B (B%) ((slot :type A))) 02:56:50 am I wrong? 02:58:09 it might be, if anyone had ever had that problem before 02:58:30 I believe you mean (slot :type B%), in which case I wonder what's the advantage over (slot :type T)? 02:58:54 pkhuong: yes, that's what I wrote in the less than gibberish code ;-) 02:59:26 hefner: there is a guy going unanswered on usenet. would have replied if i wasn't afraid of spam. decided to email him instead. 03:01:56 -!- Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 03:03:28 -!- madnificent [n=user@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 03:03:54 madnificent [n=user@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 03:07:48 -!- S11001001 [n=sirian@pdpc/supporter/active/S11001001] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 03:08:53 CrazyEddy [n=caddiced@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has joined #lisp 03:08:53 lat [n=lat@125.167.140.159] has joined #lisp 03:09:50 -!- dalton_aus_CQC is now known as dalton 03:11:56 What is the best free, open source CL GUI? Mcclim? Ltk? 03:12:11 best for what? 03:12:21 Must work on SBCL. 03:13:55 mcclim works on sbcl. can't say otherwise :) 03:14:55 kpreid, best for creating project management software, and general use. 03:15:16 general use by yourself, or other people? 03:15:58 kpreid, both. 03:16:29 hm, well, mcclim MIGHT turn out a bit too peculiar 03:16:41 lat: just do a web app already (IME though, lambda-gtk looked gorgeous on both win32 and linux sbcls) 03:17:31 i can show you screenshots to see how you like it (win32/XP) 03:18:51 hefner: re FFT, have you tried copying the coefficients so that they're always accessed contiguously? That'd only use twice as much space for the coefs. 03:18:56 fusss, please show. 03:19:16 iirc, i attacked it with the C Gtk manual and gotten a good chunk of the controls to work with no lisp documentation. it's a 1:1 FFI api. 03:20:13 fusss: good stuff! I'll keep that in mind if I ever need a GUI. 03:20:41 kpreid, what is peculiar about mcclim? 03:21:18 the ui model it works with by default is unusual. think of it as a repl with extra graphics and mice 03:21:32 but you can also build buttons'n'fields interfaces 03:22:09 http://i39.tinypic.com/2dc94zl.jpg 03:26:12 BrianRice-mb [n=briantri@c-98-225-51-246.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:26:15 kpreid, are there some free programs somewhere that use mcclim, so I can see for myself? 03:26:31 minion: clim-desktop? 03:26:32 clim-desktop: CLIM-desktop integrates several McCLIM apps to make a Common Lisp development environment. http://www.cliki.net/clim-desktop 03:26:37 minion: climacs? 03:26:37 climacs: Climacs is an Emacs-like text editor written in Common Lisp. http://www.cliki.net/climacs 03:27:03 fusss, nice. 03:27:04 lat: http://mcclim.cliki.net/Application 03:27:43 -!- echo-area [n=user@nat/yahoo/x-7b606885d01eedde] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 03:29:22 -!- lemonodor [n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-24-169.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 03:30:22 all the lambda-gtk screenshots that i could find http://70.179.113.121:8080/screen-shots 03:30:48 lat: take a look :-) 03:35:18 aja [n=aja@S01060018f3ab066e.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 03:35:52 -!- beach` is now known as beach 03:36:01 -!- aja [n=aja@S01060018f3ab066e.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 03:36:12 Good morning. 03:36:25 heya beach 03:36:48 minion: tel lat about Gsharp! 03:36:49 does torturing a poor bot with things beyond its comprehension please you? 03:36:59 minion: tell lat about Gsharp! 03:36:59 lat: please look at Gsharp: Gsharp is a graphical, interactive score editing application for standard Music notation. http://www.cliki.net/Gsharp 03:39:13 fusss, your screenshots file is corrupt. 03:39:56 i'm serving it with mime-type "application/x-tar" and works for me locally 03:39:57 slackaholic [i=1000@187-25-181-96.3g.claro.net.br] has joined #lisp 03:40:56 accept the DCC then, it's tiny 03:43:00 lat: what kind of application are you planning to write? 03:44:02 -!- BrianRice [n=briantri@c-98-225-51-246.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 03:44:34 -!- photon [n=photon@unaffiliated/photon] has quit [Connection timed out] 03:45:18 beach, project management. 03:45:35 lat: so you want to draw Gantt charts and the like? 03:47:15 beach, Yes, and easy db management is important. 03:47:35 Sure, I was thinking of the GUI aspects. 03:49:32 what is the trendiest new system definition facility for CL, is it still asdf? 03:49:45 beach, me too. The GUI must make it fast and easy fol the end user to enter and edit data. 03:49:54 manic12: it might be xcvb 03:50:06 How do I enter hexadecimal literals again? 03:50:08 ok, thanks 03:50:19 Phoodus: #x... 03:50:22 ah, k 03:56:57 lat: I have little experience with other toolkits, but I find it incredebly easy to write a GUI using CLIM in very little time. And of course it gives you all the advantages of presentations and presentation types. 04:00:40 Gsharp is impressive. 04:00:50 lat: Thanks! 04:01:29 lat: http://70.179.113.121:8080/screens/basic-gui.png http://70.179.113.121:8080/screens/drakma.png http://70.179.113.121:8080/screens/empty-dialog.png http://70.179.113.121:8080/screens/list-all-packages.png http://70.179.113.121:8080/screens/split-pane.png 04:01:47 i broke my hunchentoot *dispatch-table* and had to fix it :-P 04:02:44 is there some sort of behavior where your current directory is automatically checked by ASDF? 04:02:46 *fusss* note to self, make define-easy-directory-lister 04:04:39 lat: NB, win32-sbcl signal handling has a funky funky rhyme with a funky funky style (et gpled gtk issue) 04:04:42 ramus`: consult asdf:*central-registry*, see if it contains some name for the current directory 04:05:08 -!- borsman [n=quassel@76.177.217.216] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 04:06:00 i see the difference now, but i've been checking my config files on the machine where it works correctly, and can't find where such things are done 04:06:42 fusss, you went to a lot of trouble for me! Thanks for those nice screenshots. 04:07:47 beach, did you code Gsharp? 04:07:58 np 04:09:29 -!- slackaholic [i=1000@187-25-181-96.3g.claro.net.br] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:09:54 lat: Yep, most of it. 04:10:17 lat: and a significant chunk of McCLIM and Climacs as well. 04:11:04 REPLeffect [n=REPLeffe@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 04:11:20 lat: Gsharp is only about 10kLOC, of which 1/4 is the font, so it is very compact to use Common Lisp and CLIM for that. 04:13:21 beach, would you say that mcclim allows easier access to the strengths of lisp then the other gui's available? 04:13:51 lat: That is my impression, yes. But like I said, my experience with other toolkits is limited. 04:14:36 gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-76-254-20-231.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 04:15:08 derekv: thanks for pinging me about the ereader thing. Looks cool. 04:15:31 (Somehow yesterday you linked directly to their copy of the GPL and I didn't quite manage to find my way to the info about the products.) 04:16:37 gigamonkey, oh sorry i had realized after i posted the link and didn't want to repost. irc etiquette fail 04:17:02 I've got a string with a number of lines in it. How do I split it into a list of strings easily? 04:17:14 splitting on EOLs 04:17:46 minion: tell Phoodus about split-seuqence 04:17:47 Sorry, I couldn't find anything in the database for ``split-seuqence''. 04:17:51 neat, there's protocol buffers implementation for lisp. maybe i can try it out now :) 04:17:54 minion: tell Phoodus about split-sequence 04:17:55 Phoodus: look at split-sequence: SPLIT-SEQUENCE (formerly known as PARTITION) is a member of the Common Lisp Utilities family of programs, designed by community consensus. http://www.cliki.net/split-sequence 04:18:00 I wonder how serious those "Windows XP or Vista" system requirements are. 04:18:15 beach: so nothing in CL itself then 04:18:47 Phoodus: It is a semi-simple loop, but split-sequence is not part of Common Lisp, though it is what most people use, so you are safe. 04:19:30 Wow, $859 is a bit steep. I wonder how many pages of paper w/toner that is. 04:19:33 it's just yet another .asd across multiple installs and CVS checkouts to keep track of :-P 04:19:50 beach fusss and everyone, thanks! This has helped. 04:19:59 lat: No problem.. 04:20:06 cheers! 04:20:14 saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 04:23:10 *Phoodus* uses string-stream and read-line 04:24:24 One more question. I'm using ubuntu. When I installed sbcl and slime I did not use synaptic. If I now upgrade or add mcclim using synaptic, will I mess things up? 04:24:29 -!- Buganini [n=buganini@security-hole.info] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 04:25:55 gigamonkey, the cost is a bit of a showstopper 04:26:16 lat: You should probably not use standard packages for those things anyway. 04:26:27 Yeah. Though that "scribble notes on the screen" feature is the one I really want. 04:26:29 minion: tell lat about cl-build. 04:26:30 Sorry, I couldn't find anything in the database for ``cl-build''. 04:26:32 Buganini [n=buganini@security-hole.info] has joined #lisp 04:26:34 minion: tell lat about clbuild. 04:26:34 lat: direct your attention towards clbuild: clbuild [common-lisp.net] is a shell script helping with the download, compilation, and invocation of Common Lisp applications. http://www.cliki.net/clbuild 04:26:51 Probably only a couple years until the prices come down a bit and everyone offers that feature. 04:27:22 The kindle does let you annotate docs but, it looks like, by selecting text and then adding a note via the keyboard. 04:27:34 Which sounds too awkward for my purposes. 04:32:02 beach and minion, you guys have been very helpful. Many thanks again! I've been called to eat. But I look forward to coming back here. Bye for now. 04:32:13 Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has joined #lisp 04:32:17 so long lat 04:35:46 slashus2 [n=dex@74-141-105-89.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 04:39:33 -!- dalton is now known as ausente 04:40:05 fph [i=joe@adsl-75-14-202-212.dsl.renocs.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 04:40:43 Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 04:41:45 -!- leo2007 [n=leo@smaug.linux.pwf.cam.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:43:46 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 04:44:07 Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 04:46:18 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Success] 04:46:39 Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 04:48:31 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:48:33 xtronrayzor [n=peregrin@z220.124-45-179.ppp.wakwak.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 04:51:11 semyon421 [n=semyon@217.67.122.44] has joined #lisp 04:58:27 -!- Modius_ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-223-100.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:59:35 Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 05:05:56 umbrella2 [n=Owner1@c-68-33-89-21.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:09:01 -!- nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@adsl-75-36-204-63.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 05:10:18 danlei` [n=user@pD9E2EEB7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 05:13:32 attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-132-189-132.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 05:14:46 -!- Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 05:17:30 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-219-207.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:17:36 KingThomasIV [n=KingThom@c-76-122-25-195.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:17:49 -!- KingThomasIV [n=KingThom@c-76-122-25-195.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 05:18:47 tsuru` [n=user@c-69-245-36-64.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:19:40 -!- tsuru [n=user@c-69-245-36-64.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 05:19:57 Modius [n=Modius@99.179.99.8] has joined #lisp 05:22:20 -!- Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:23:15 mikezor [n=mikael@c-ede270d5.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 05:24:52 nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 05:26:24 Nshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-106-3-214.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 05:26:39 -!- attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-132-189-132.catv.broadband.hu] has quit ["..."] 05:28:18 -!- danlei [n=user@pD9E2EEB7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:33:50 kiuma [n=kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 05:34:55 ltriant [n=ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 05:38:01 morning 05:38:08 hello nikodemus 05:40:41 -!- fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@88-149-208-166.dynamic.ngi.it] has quit ["Valete!"] 05:42:04 gah. imagemagic pulls in half of xorg with it 05:42:18 ...i only wanted a command-line tiff->png converter 05:42:20 tis to better exploit ya 05:42:26 xv 05:44:10 myrkraverk` [n=johann@85-220-122-60.dsl.dynamic.simnet.is] has joined #lisp 05:46:08 -!- dysinger [n=tim@71.216.13.30] has quit [] 05:46:16 S11001001 [n=sirian@74-137-151-39.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 05:46:20 -!- ASau [n=user@193.138.70.52] has quit ["Off!"] 05:46:40 it would have probably been faster to hack one up in lisp... 05:47:03 -!- ASau` [n=user@193.138.70.52] has quit ["Off!"] 05:48:53 wee, unboxed constants (just appended after *elsewhere*)! 05:49:17 oh, clever 05:49:17 the command-line interface to 'xv' works fine 05:50:08 i'm pretty sure xv would have pulled in *all* of xorg... 05:52:00 needs Xt and tiff, png 05:53:14 Xt pulls in a bit 05:53:44 Xach doesn't have some package for that? 05:57:35 -!- myrkraverk [n=johann@unaffiliated/myrkraverk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:57:51 -!- gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-76-254-20-231.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:57:57 jmbr [n=jmbr@248.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 06:01:25 dysinger [n=tim@71.216.13.30] has joined #lisp 06:02:56 -!- cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-167-159.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:03:10 cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-167-159.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 06:03:28 abeaumont [n=abeaumon@84.76.48.250] has joined #lisp 06:05:58 Ogedei [n=user@78.52.235.87] has joined #lisp 06:10:35 ehu` [n=chatzill@82-170-33-173.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #lisp 06:11:13 Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 06:14:24 Athrufee [n=narayan@crj95-3-82-237-151-159.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 06:17:42 tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 06:18:35 -!- Foofie [n=innocent@86.80-203-225.nextgentel.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 06:18:53 jdz [n=jdz@85.254.211.133] has joined #lisp 06:20:05 MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has joined #lisp 06:21:02 hello 06:21:08 hello MrSpec 06:21:44 -!- abeaumont [n=abeaumon@84.76.48.250] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 06:23:14 Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has joined #lisp 06:25:11 -!- Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has quit [Client Quit] 06:27:36 i can't think of anywhere else to ask this. does anyone know what   means? 06:28:14 i tried to translate it with online tools and came up with nothing much but untranslated references to ancient greek works like the septuagint 06:28:41 -!- ehu` [n=chatzill@82-170-33-173.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 06:30:24 Davse_Bamse [n=davse@4306ds4-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 06:30:38 dwave [n=ask@084202072029.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #lisp 06:32:26 Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has joined #lisp 06:37:17 -!- holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 06:38:39 nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@adsl-75-36-204-63.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 06:39:20 -!- saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 06:39:34 saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 06:39:38 mvilleneuve [n=mvillene@ABordeaux-253-1-119-58.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:40:13 good morning 06:41:12 holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has joined #lisp 06:41:34 -!- boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 06:41:55 -!- holycow [n=new@64.151.208.1] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:43:33 dto: "Where should I stand?" 06:43:53 or something on that line, I forgot the possible aspects of a conjunctive aorist 06:44:20 hmm. 06:44:27 What's the context? 06:44:41 -!- Axioplase [n=Axioplas@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit ["bbl"] 06:45:46 epistemology 06:48:12 -!- Ogedei is now known as mjh 06:48:24 "Immediate qualia constitute the ultimate denotation in experience of our concepts, and the specific character of the given plays its indispensable part in any verification. It is difficult, if not impossible, to express the content of the given without importing what is not given; and our awareness of it has not been called "knowledge," because with respect to it there can be no error. Nevertheless, it functions as an absolute   06:48:24 for the knowledge of nature." 06:49:27 boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:50:01 ASau [n=user@77.246.230.151] has joined #lisp 06:50:27 perhaps my font is weak because I read "pou stw", but it could also be "pon stw" 06:50:43 Though I don't know what "pon" would mean, "pou" means "where" 06:50:49 But I must go. 06:52:27 -!- dwave [n=ask@084202072029.customer.alfanett.no] has quit ["Be back later"] 06:52:31 -!- jmbr [n=jmbr@248.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:55:54 -!- Patzy [n=somethin@coa29-1-88-174-11-170.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 06:56:35 Patzy [n=somethin@coa29-1-88-174-11-170.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 06:58:04 -!- tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has quit ["Leaving."] 06:58:22 Soulman [n=kvirc@42.84-48-88.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 07:02:51 -!- fph [i=joe@adsl-75-14-202-212.dsl.renocs.sbcglobal.net] has quit [" "] 07:02:56 -!- ASau [n=user@77.246.230.151] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 07:03:43 g0wda [n=shashi@61.1.139.148] has joined #lisp 07:03:59 mega1 [n=mega@53d83b38.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 07:06:46 -!- sohail [n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 07:07:29 -!- semyon421 [n=semyon@217.67.122.44] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 07:11:48 abeaumont [n=abeaumon@85.48.202.13] has joined #lisp 07:13:33 -!- nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@adsl-75-36-204-63.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 07:14:24 ASau [n=user@77.246.230.151] has joined #lisp 07:18:11 dwave [n=ask@213.236.208.247] has joined #lisp 07:19:01 dwave_ [n=ask@pat-tdc.opera.com] has joined #lisp 07:20:01 blandest [n=blandest@softhouse.is.ew.ro] has joined #lisp 07:20:25 demitall [i=dem@world.anarchy.com] has joined #lisp 07:20:41 -!- demitall [i=dem@world.anarchy.com] has left #lisp 07:20:41 splittist [n=dmurray@25-64.2-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 07:20:44 morning 07:20:52 daniel_ [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has joined #lisp 07:20:53 alinp [n=alinp@86.122.9.2] has joined #lisp 07:21:56 -!- dwave_ is now known as asksol 07:24:06 -!- MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 07:24:44 Fufie [n=poff@Gatekeeper.vizrt.com] has joined #lisp 07:25:59 -!- ltriant [n=ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit ["leaving"] 07:28:48 -!- boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:30:51 boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:31:11 legumbre [n=user@r190-135-13-71.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 07:33:13 rtra_ [n=user@unaffiliated/rtra] has joined #lisp 07:34:45 fullets [n=fullets@202-180-72-93.callplus.net.nz] has joined #lisp 07:35:05 -!- dwave [n=ask@213.236.208.247] has quit [Success] 07:37:07 -!- daniel [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:37:30 bun_bun [i=dem@world.anarchy.com] has joined #lisp 07:41:52 -!- ia__ [n=ia@89.169.189.230] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 07:43:30 Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has joined #lisp 07:44:09 -!- g0wda [n=shashi@61.1.139.148] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 07:47:06 -!- legumbre_ [n=user@r190-135-39-41.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:47:58 -!- rtra [n=user@unaffiliated/rtra] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:48:14 Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-218-221.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:52:11 Modius__ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:54:48 mrsolo [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-209-44.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:54:53 -!- Modius [n=Modius@99.179.99.8] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 07:55:17 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 07:55:39 Modius__ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:55:48 -!- bkudria [n=bkudria@kudria.net] has left #lisp 07:56:30 -!- Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-67-67-218-221.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Operation timed out] 07:57:10 klausi [n=klausi@port-92-193-63-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:58:03 ia__ [n=ia@89.169.189.230] has joined #lisp 07:58:03 Is there a standard way to use Lisp as a stdio pipe program? ie, get all the startup & load spam not to show? 07:58:32 yes, there is a way. rtfm. 07:58:45 kuwabara [n=kuwabara@cerbere.qosmos.eu] has joined #lisp 07:58:51 what section of tfm? :-P 07:59:02 which lisp? 07:59:07 clisp, ecl, sbcl 07:59:21 I don't think we're using acl anymore 07:59:34 Phoodus: no standard way. sbcl --noinform ..., for example 08:00:10 michaelw: yeah, I feared as much 08:00:33 possibly also --noprint, but see "man sbcl" 08:00:39 Modius_ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 08:01:37 Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 08:02:05 Modius [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 08:05:24 -!- Modius__ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 08:10:49 -!- xtronrayzor [n=peregrin@z220.124-45-179.ppp.wakwak.ne.jp] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 08:11:42 hkBst [n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 08:16:54 ejs [n=eugen@77.222.151.102] has joined #lisp 08:17:21 ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #lisp 08:17:46 fiveop [n=fiveop@pD9E6F75C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:17:53 -!- klausi [n=klausi@port-92-193-63-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit ["Leaving"] 08:19:06 -!- Modius_ [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 08:22:43 -!- ejs [n=eugen@77.222.151.102] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 08:23:59 -!- spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-d85d94d06e9f28e0] has left #lisp 08:24:10 -!- cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit ["The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity."] 08:26:48 -!- projections [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has left #lisp 08:27:14 -!- Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 08:27:41 -!- mrsolo [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-209-44.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 08:29:17 -!- mega1 [n=mega@53d83b38.adsl.enternet.hu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:29:48 ThomasI [n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi] has joined #lisp 08:31:22 ejs2 [n=eugen@77.222.151.102] has joined #lisp 08:37:22 nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@adsl-75-36-204-63.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 08:37:32 Axioplase [n=Axioplas@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 08:37:39 -!- Axioplase [n=Axioplas@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has left #lisp 08:37:44 Axioplase [n=Axioplas@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 08:39:22 mega1 [n=mega@3e70d668.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 08:39:47 is there an equivalent of getf that operates on strings? 08:39:49 -!- Axioplase [n=Axioplas@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit [Client Quit] 08:40:50 how should that work? 08:41:06 setf is magic 08:41:19 -!- ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:41:25 rdd [n=user@c83-250-152-109.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 08:41:34 michaelw: instead of comparing with #'eql, it would compare with #'string= 08:42:42 use a hash-table 08:43:16 nikodemus: no, I already get an alist like structure from an external source :) (and I'd rather not use a hash-table for 5 items) 08:43:37 I only need the getting actually... and it is easy to write (disregarding the special cases). I simply wouldn't 've liked writing if it was already present 08:43:40 oh, _alist_ 08:43:49 -!- slashus2 [n=dex@74-141-105-89.dhcp.insightbb.com] has quit [] 08:44:00 (assoc string alist :test #'string=) 08:44:17 yvdriess [n=yvdriess@progpc35.vub.ac.be] has joined #lisp 08:44:56 i was going to mumble about efficiency, but for 5 items... you're right, there is no point 08:45:40 nikodemus: ah! thanks :D 08:46:45 (getf is for plists, not alists, though) 08:47:29 ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #lisp 08:54:46 -!- ejs2 [n=eugen@77.222.151.102] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:59:52 spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-d4af10b0582e89fb] has joined #lisp 09:00:23 -!- saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [] 09:01:41 -!- ThomasI [n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi] has quit ["Bye Bye!"] 09:04:22 ejs [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #lisp 09:12:51 -!- alinp [n=alinp@86.122.9.2] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 09:13:26 alinp [n=alinp@86.122.9.2] has joined #lisp 09:15:25 jewel_ [n=jewel@dsl-247-202-125.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:18:22 -!- ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:19:40 athos [n=philipp@92.250.250.68] has joined #lisp 09:20:23 puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 09:21:26 mrsolo [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-209-44.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 09:24:30 ignas [n=ignas@78.59.166.221] has joined #lisp 09:25:03 elias` [n=me@resnet-pat-254.ucs.ed.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 09:26:11 -!- Zenton [n=user@212.166.192.129] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 09:28:44 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 09:34:20 -!- ignas [n=ignas@78.59.166.221] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 09:41:37 -!- rstandy` [n=rastandy@net-93-144-64-40.t2.dsl.vodafone.it] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 09:41:46 borism [n=boris@195-50-199-195-dsl.krw.estpak.ee] has joined #lisp 09:43:59 drafael [n=tapio@ip-118-90-128-209.xdsl.xnet.co.nz] has joined #lisp 09:53:33 frozsyn [n=FrozSyn@wafer.futurs.inria.fr] has joined #lisp 09:53:57 -!- spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-d4af10b0582e89fb] has left #lisp 09:54:07 Hi every body 09:57:54 Hello! 09:58:16 frozsyn: Are you doing chips with lisp? 09:58:41 spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-47bf591c639593bd] has joined #lisp 09:58:49 I would like to use common lisp in a project involing graphics. I've tried cl-sdl but is there some famous and efficient librairy for this task ? 09:59:26 Ragnaroek [i=54a63d23@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-03ed5d7deea41d77] has joined #lisp 09:59:33 matimago, chips with lisp ? I should try for sure :) 09:59:44 I'd say it would depend on the kind of graphics you want. Have a look at the first to hits on http://www.cliki.net/admin/search?words=graphics 09:59:52 frozsyn: *wafer.futurs* ;-) 10:00:21 ignas [n=ignas@78.59.166.221] has joined #lisp 10:00:24 jsoft_ [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 10:00:51 -!- jsoft [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 10:03:48 matimago, i've already seen this website, but it didn't help me to understand what is the "trend" or famous library... maybe I didn't search enough 10:04:42 and i'm talking about low-level graphics, not GUI, more about rectangles, lines and so on 10:04:49 frozsyn: in the lisp word, we don't really follow trends. 10:04:56 We do what we have to do, and use what works. 10:05:04 Even if it's 50 years old. 10:05:19 For low-level, X11 is often used. CLX (package XLIB). 10:05:39 sorry for my english, I don't know what word to use 10:05:47 frozsyn: let's go to #lisp-fr 10:06:17 matimago, ok 10:09:53 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 10:13:25 Dodek [n=user@wikipedia/Dodek] has joined #lisp 10:13:45 hey, which OpenGL binding would you recommend for Common Lisp? 10:14:09 <_3b> try lispbulider-sdl instead of cl-sdl, and cl-opengl for GL bindings 10:14:19 <_3b> *lispbuilder-sdl 10:14:28 is it asdf-installable? 10:15:04 <_3b> cl-opengl doesn't appear to be 10:15:32 lispbuilder-sdl seemingly is 10:15:33 <_3b> clbuild can install it, or download with darcs 10:15:43 -!- mrsolo [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-209-44.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 10:16:26 -!- ace4016 [i=ace4016@cpe-76-168-248-118.socal.res.rr.com] has quit ["night"] 10:19:09 mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-100-225-108.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:36 rstandy [n=rastandy@net-93-144-64-40.t2.dsl.vodafone.it] has joined #lisp 10:20:47 -!- yvdriess [n=yvdriess@progpc35.vub.ac.be] has quit [] 10:20:55 cpape [n=user@host16084.pik-potsdam.de] has joined #lisp 10:27:08 fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has joined #lisp 10:27:15 hello 10:27:54 tombom [i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp] has joined #lisp 10:28:31 -!- Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [] 10:40:28 -!- fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 10:44:21 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:48:04 What's the state of support of ipv6 in popular lisp packages? (like socket packages, hutchentoot, ucw, drakma and such?) 10:48:22 (excuse the misspelling) 10:54:35 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 10:55:40 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit ["ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.10/2009042316]"] 10:56:15 you just missed fe[nl]ix, antoszka .. i think IOLib has some support for ipv6, but he could have answered this for sure 10:56:28 From what I gather only IOLib does ipv6 support for sockets. 10:56:33 But don't know about the apps. 10:56:37 yeah 10:57:20 OK, will catch up with him when he's around. 10:57:33 -!- nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 10:57:36 if you're doing web-stuff i think it would be trivial to place something like hunchentoot behind a ipv6-supporting front-end 10:58:19 hunchentoot <--ipv4--> some-http-front-end <--ipv6--> users 10:58:25 ..don't know for sure though 11:00:02 fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has joined #lisp 11:00:05 ..you probably want or have a setup very similar like this anyway; going via the mod_proxy of apache, nginx or lighttpd 11:03:58 Right. That's highly probable i'd end up with that. 11:04:30 Still it would be comforting to be able to do a quick natively ipv6ish test setup one day. :) 11:04:41 yeah 11:05:06 silenius [n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.NET] has joined #lisp 11:05:10 fe[nl]ix, pingpong .. someone's wondering how ipv6 support is in lisp libraries/packages etc. 11:05:11 And for writing client-side test I'm only left with IOlib. 11:05:34 Still, I'm just beginning to learn all this stuff, so this is just looking at my future options. 11:05:56 antoszka: if you need help, I'm on #iolib 11:06:58 fe[nl]ix: Thanks. Just want to get a view on the general state of support of ip6 in the cl world. 11:07:10 fe[nl]ix: No particular IOlib questions (yet). 11:15:12 CyberBlue [n=yong@60.26.114.159] has joined #lisp 11:15:47 -!- tombom [i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp] has quit ["Peace and Protection 4.22.2"] 11:19:27 -!- mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-100-225-108.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 11:20:27 jao [n=jao@74.Red-80-24-4.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:24:50 -!- sexybaaron [n=sexybaar@jetfire.ece.unm.edu] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 11:26:42 projections [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has joined #lisp 11:33:56 -!- spradnyesh [n=pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-47bf591c639593bd] has left #lisp 11:36:20 -!- umbrella2 [n=Owner1@c-68-33-89-21.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving."] 11:37:49 -!- Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has quit ["leaving"] 11:40:57 schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 11:46:12 boyscare1 [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:52:01 photon [n=photon@unaffiliated/photon] has joined #lisp 11:55:33 -!- boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 11:55:47 Samy1 [i=Argus18@92.84.5.100] has joined #lisp 11:55:50 jao` [n=jao@90.Red-79-155-246.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:56:28 jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has joined #lisp 11:59:11 -!- projections [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:01:07 antoszka: Hunchentoot (and thus everything that uses it) afaik doesn't do ipv6, as it runs on usocket (I guess the same goes for drakma) 12:01:50 speaking of usocket, it still doesn't compile on HEAD? 12:02:58 sexybaaron [n=sexybaar@jetfire.ece.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 12:07:52 aLeSD [n=alex@161.72.27.220] has joined #lisp 12:09:15 MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has joined #lisp 12:11:55 nikodemus 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Zenton [n=user@212.166.192.129] has joined #lisp 13:28:01 -!- stassats [n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 13:32:45 roidrage [n=roidrage@dslb-084-058-190-245.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 13:33:09 rjack [n=rjack@adsl-ull-6-39.51-151.net24.it] has joined #lisp 13:33:10 mattrepl [n=mattrepl@hq-users.caci.com] has joined #lisp 13:34:09 thomas_ [n=thomas@41-071.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:37:23 -!- danlei` [n=user@pD9E2EEB7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 13:40:54 -!- photon [n=photon@unaffiliated/photon] has quit [] 13:41:56 mega1, see attila_lendvais post on sbcl-devel 13:42:06 "1.0.28.34 broke some inlined functions" 13:42:23 wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has joined #lisp 13:43:37 envi^home [n=envi@220.121.234.156] has joined #lisp 13:44:52 what's up with google .. i had a paste related to this but i can't find it 13:46:28 davazp [n=user@56.Red-79-153-148.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:47:42 -!- puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 13:48:16 p_l: Thx. 13:50:27 http://paste.lisp.org/display/80286 13:51:26 hugod [n=hugod@modemcable086.138-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 13:54:39 piksi [i=piksi@pi-xi.net] has joined #lisp 13:54:47 -!- jdz [n=jdz@85.254.211.133] has quit ["Somebody booted me"] 13:55:35 -!- Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has quit ["leaving"] 13:55:47 g0wda1 [n=shashi@59.92.187.38] has joined #lisp 13:57:10 -!- chrnybo [n=user@148.122.202.244] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 13:57:32 sepult_ [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:57:39 -!- sepult_ [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 14:01:15 boyscared [n=bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:01:33 REPLeffect [n=REPLeffe@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 14:01:41 alec [n=aberryma@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 14:04:32 -!- schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 14:05:20 schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 14:09:19 -!- rpg [n=rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [] 14:10:31 kmcorbett [n=Keith@c-76-119-215-57.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:11:44 sohail [n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 14:11:44 -!- xinming_ is now known as xinming 14:12:40 Tordek__ [n=tordek@host151.190-138-169.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 14:12:40 -!- sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-72-56.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:14:04 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host19.190-137-194.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 14:14:05 -!- Tordek__ is now known as Tordek 14:15:23 nyef [n=nyef@65-125-125-98.dia.static.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 14:15:27 G'morning all. 14:16:19 HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 14:16:33 nyef: Good afternoon :) 14:16:39 Hunh. UNC pathnames. 14:16:57 What's next, device file support? 14:17:34 I recommend you do all native pathnames in UNC form :P 14:17:51 and then only write something to change DOS-style ones to NT :) 14:18:19 (Oh, and be careful about case - NT *is* a case sensitive system, it's just disabled by default) 14:19:14 hi nyef 14:20:50 milanj [n=milan@93.86.55.2] has joined #lisp 14:21:06 Yuuhi [i=benni@p5483F208.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:22:05 Elephant clsql/sqlite says 'Couldn't load foreign libraries "libsqlite3", "sqlite3".', what files are really needed? 14:23:08 meingbg: what OS ? 14:23:16 Linux 14:23:18 -!- Davse_Bamse [n=davse@4306ds4-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has quit ["leaving"] 14:23:25 -!- jlf` [n=user@netblock-208-127-247-67.dslextreme.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:23:35 I have sqlite3.o there. 14:23:46 meingbg: you need sqlite3.so 14:23:53 meingbg: look for libsqlite3.so 14:24:03 it's /usr/lib/libsqlite3.so here 14:24:51 S1100100` [n=sirian@74-137-151-39.dhcp.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 14:24:58 fe[nl]ix: ok, maybe I didn't install correctly... 14:25:08 p_l: case-sensitivity is the least of our worries on windows... 14:25:49 -!- S11001001 [n=sirian@pdpc/supporter/active/S11001001] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 14:26:30 isn't '((:foo . "bar") (:baz . "bang")) a plist? 14:26:48 madnificent: No, that looks more like a quoted alist. 14:26:48 nikodemus: unless someone hardcodes device paths assuming they will be case-insensitive... 14:27:11 *madnificent* mixed up the meaning of plist and alist then 14:27:14 p_l: Still the least of our worries, given fixed memory maps. 14:27:29 -!- ejs [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:27:54 *nyef* would go so far as to put SB-ALIEN problems ahead of case-insensitivity on the list of worries for Win32. 14:28:02 -!- dalton is now known as ausente 14:28:07 nyef: Yeah, but you mentioned pathnames :) 14:28:21 nyef: and (list :foo "bar" :baz "bang") is a plist then, right? 14:28:35 madnificent: No, but it returns one. 14:28:48 nyef: yeah, good enough, but you're right :) 14:28:50 thanks 14:29:08 fiveop_ [n=fiveop@pD9E6CF92.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:30:15 -!- frozsyn [n=FrozSyn@wafer.futurs.inria.fr] has quit ["Leaving"] 14:30:34 -!- fiveop [n=fiveop@pD9E6F75C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 14:32:22 sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:33:11 fiveop [n=fiveop@pD9E6BCDB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:34:38 -!- fiveop_ [n=fiveop@pD9E6CF92.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 14:36:16 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:39 jollygood [n=jollygoo@pool-72-65-142-31.chrlwv.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:15 -!- Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 14:45:27 Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has joined #lisp 14:45:42 -!- jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 14:45:58 jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has joined #lisp 14:49:10 are there any good bindings for qt4 in lisp and how hard generally is binding to such stuff? i only came up with some outdated projects when i googled around 14:49:26 Binding to C++ is not always straightforward. 14:49:47 -!- chessguy_work [n=chessguy@67-130-43-2.dia.static.qwest.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 14:49:50 (I presume Qt is still C++-based.) 14:50:18 minion: tell piksi about commonqt 14:50:18 piksi: look at commonqt: a Common Lisp binding to the smoke library for Qt. http://common-lisp.net/project/commonqt/ 14:50:45 piksi: if you are using mudballs, there's also cl-smoke 14:50:50 What's the smoke qt4 library? 14:52:15 antoszka: it's a weird thing conjured in KDE project to make bindings easier ;-) 14:52:38 nikodemus` [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 14:52:57 it creates an introspection interface to C++ classes, so that with little work you can create, call, destroy etc. C++ classes from other languages 14:53:08 http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Languages/Smoke 14:53:32 -!- nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 14:55:11 p_l: thx 14:55:18 dwave [n=ask@062249178014.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #lisp 14:59:15 -!- nikodemus` [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 14:59:48 bobbysmith007 [n=russ@one.firewall.gnv.acceleration.net] has joined #lisp 15:00:43 projections_ [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has joined #lisp 15:01:06 hippee-lee [n=hippee-l@sta-206-168-218-28.rockynet.com] has joined #lisp 15:01:09 -!- asksol [n=ask@pat-tdc.opera.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:02:09 stassats [n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 15:02:17 -!- dto [n=user@pool-98-118-1-212.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:04:34 tmh [n=thomas@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has joined #lisp 15:04:40 Greetings. 15:06:16 jmbr [n=jmbr@10.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 15:06:18 -!- pkhuong [n=pkhuong@24.201.189.110] has quit ["Reconnecting"] 15:06:20 pkhuong [n=pkhuong@modemcable110.189-201-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 15:06:30 rpg [n=rpg@75-146-46-193-Minnesota.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:06:56 shmho [n=user@58.142.15.103] has joined #lisp 15:07:34 -!- alinp [n=alinp@86.122.9.2] has left #lisp 15:09:32 Is there a clsql wizard available? I have a view class which gets populated by rubbish when I use it against a data base (mysql) that seems to query just fine... 15:17:12 -!- projections [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:18:14 -!- schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:19:20 cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 15:20:30 existentialmonk [n=carcdr@64-252-60-75.adsl.snet.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:55 -!- drafael [n=tapio@ip-118-90-128-209.xdsl.xnet.co.nz] has quit ["Leaving."] 15:23:08 -!- konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:23:20 -!- ASau [n=user@77.246.230.151] has quit ["Off!"] 15:26:21 fph [i=joe@adsl-75-14-202-212.dsl.renocs.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:26:45 -!- projections_ [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has left #lisp 15:27:53 is there a NOP in lisp? I have a case expression, I need to catch a "do-nothing" case to avoid the error-trap at the end of the case expression 15:29:41 NIL does nothing 15:29:52 what "error trap"? 15:30:19 I just stuck t in, will switch to that if a problem : the "t" at the end of case 15:31:29 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:31:38 (values) does even more nothing than NIL. 15:32:48 fph: You can have empty bodies in a case statement. 15:32:58 well, it does more, since it should tell that it does nothing and it's nevertheless NIL when used 15:34:03 (case *run-line-sign 15:34:04 nyef: but paradoxically, using (values) might require more CPU instructions (both callee and caller sides) than just NIL. 15:34:06 (0) 15:34:14 (t blah) then ok 15:34:32 fph: CASE has OTHERWISE clauses. 15:34:35 clhs case 15:34:35 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_case_.htm 15:34:42 same as t 15:34:51 Not at all. 15:34:56 This is not COND. 15:35:21 And if you expect "problems", perhaps you shoudl use CCASE or ECASE. 15:35:26 oh really, eval t => isn't t ?? 15:35:58 (case 42 (t :never-come-here)) 15:36:20 t can be used as an alternative to otherwise in case. 15:36:20 => :never-come-here 15:36:33 interesting, since it already worked fine 15:36:37 I don't recommend it, but it is legal. 15:36:42 Ah true, I forgot that. Sorry. 15:37:10 So it's (case 42 (t :come-here)) -> :come-here 15:37:12 'otherwise' just seems for readability 15:37:13 (case t (t 1) (t 2)) :) 15:37:18 (case 42 (t :never-come-here) (t :come-here)) => :come-here 15:37:20 heheh 15:37:25 damn 15:37:37 no, it takes the first exit 15:37:45 -!- ignas [n=ignas@78.59.166.221] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 15:37:50 stassats: in that case clisp gives: CASE: the T clause must be the last one 15:37:52 oops -- forgot that you need (t). 15:37:54 newlisper [n=wschroed@128.252.233.244] has joined #lisp 15:38:01 Silly, imho :) 15:38:47 dkcl [n=dkcl@metabug/dandersen] has joined #lisp 15:38:54 -!- rjack [n=rjack@adsl-ull-6-39.51-151.net24.it] has quit ["leaving"] 15:39:15 Just wanted to report a bug with the deployment of trivial-gray-streams... http://common-lisp.net/project/cl-plus-ssl/download/trivial-gray-streams.tar.gz.asc doesn't exist (the gz does), so asdf-install cannot install it right now. 15:39:15 -!- OberWork` [n=user@32.97.110.63] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:40:05 -!- thomas_ [n=thomas@41-071.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 15:40:28 newlisper: you may "ignore" that problem selecting one of the restart when the error occurs. 15:40:57 Oh, it didn't give me that option. It simply wanted me to abort. 15:40:59 Read closely the error message and the following menu. 15:41:08 This isn't the usual GPG error. 15:41:26 touch the needed file 15:41:52 OberWork` [n=user@32.97.110.63] has joined #lisp 15:42:15 Bah, I have the option now. Sorry to waste your time. 15:42:21 Indeed, it's strange, it just let you abort... 15:44:13 kmcorbett1 [n=Keith@c-76-119-215-57.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:46:21 -!- blandest [n=blandest@softhouse.is.ew.ro] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:50:52 -!- kmcorbett [n=Keith@c-76-119-215-57.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:56:01 -!- newlisper [n=wschroed@128.252.233.244] has quit ["Leaving."] 15:56:33 -!- roidrage [n=roidrage@dslb-084-058-190-245.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [] 15:56:59 ruediger [n=ruediger@62-47-137-103.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 16:00:34 Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:01:19 -!- dysinger [n=tim@71.216.13.30] has quit [No route to host] 16:02:20 -!- abeaumont [n=abeaumon@85.48.202.13] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:02:54 schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 16:05:31 -!- aLeSD [n=alex@161.72.27.220] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:05:47 -!- mvilleneuve [n=mvillene@ABordeaux-253-1-119-58.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 16:08:54 slyrus_ [n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:19 -!- wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has quit [] 16:15:23 -!- fph [i=joe@adsl-75-14-202-212.dsl.renocs.sbcglobal.net] has quit [" "] 16:15:26 ikki [n=ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 16:15:29 -!- envi^home [n=envi@220.121.234.156] has quit ["Leaving"] 16:15:56 dysinger [n=tim@76.164.46.79] has joined #lisp 16:17:02 amnesiac [n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac] has joined #lisp 16:19:01 ASau [n=user@193.138.70.52] has joined #lisp 16:20:15 -!- dialtone [n=dialtone@adsl-71-138-130-18.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:21:35 -!- proq` is now known as proq 16:22:06 trvlr [n=trvlr@117.193.201.42] has joined #lisp 16:25:32 -!- HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:25:36 brnhck [n=hrk@acurwa001181.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:26:30 dialtone [n=dialtone@adsl-99-136-101-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:26:40 -!- splittist [n=dmurray@25-64.2-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit ["""""""] 16:27:15 -!- g0wda1 [n=shashi@59.92.187.38] has quit ["Leaving."] 16:27:25 link to LIJOS seems to be dead in cliki. anyone here have lijos source code ??? 16:27:32 -!- dkcl [n=dkcl@metabug/dandersen] has left #lisp 16:28:05 -!- dwave [n=ask@062249178014.customer.alfanett.no] has quit ["Be back later"] 16:28:10 leo2007 [n=leo@smaug.linux.pwf.cam.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 16:30:55 tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 16:31:29 -!- shmho [n=user@58.142.15.103] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:32:00 Fare [n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 16:34:07 daniel_ [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has joined #lisp 16:35:05 -!- Cowmoo [n=Cowmoo@static-70-108-241-27.res.east.verizon.net] has left #lisp 16:35:41 ASau` [n=user@193.138.70.52] has joined #lisp 16:35:49 HG` [n=wells@xdslec201.osnanet.de] has joined #lisp 16:36:22 -!- daniel [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:38:26 Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has joined #lisp 16:39:29 saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 16:42:00 -!- brnhck [n=hrk@acurwa001181.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Client Quit] 16:42:01 -!- ruediger [n=ruediger@62-47-137-103.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit ["Leaving"] 16:42:17 brnhck [n=hrk@acurwa001181.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:44:25 -!- sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has quit ["KVIrc 3.4.0 Virgo http://www.kvirc.net/"] 16:44:39 sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:45:26 -!- sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:46:16 sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:47:15 konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has joined #lisp 16:49:22 tombom [i=tombom@86.6.95.126] has joined #lisp 16:49:26 -!- konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:50:14 -!- Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 16:50:56 Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has joined #lisp 16:52:27 rread_ [n=rread@nat/sun/x-c8ece3b4b00e0a1f] has joined #lisp 16:54:21 -!- jao` [n=jao@194.Red-81-32-187.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit ["leaving"] 16:55:49 puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:58:24 -!- rread [n=rread@c-98-234-219-222.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:01:01 dysinger_ [n=tim@76.164.46.79] has joined #lisp 17:01:33 -!- HG` [n=wells@xdslec201.osnanet.de] has quit [Client Quit] 17:06:23 god! no one have idea about LIJOS? 17:06:54 _3b, are you here? 17:08:16 trvlr: I had no idea what it was and looked it up out of curiosity. 17:08:34 konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has joined #lisp 17:09:07 TDT [n=user@191.16.63.69.dyn.southslope.net] has joined #lisp 17:11:05 why WOULD they? :) 17:11:16 even java people don't use the objectstream thing very much, do they? 17:11:18 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 17:12:13 -!- jewel_ [n=jewel@dsl-247-202-125.telkomadsl.co.za] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 17:13:13 trvlr: there are a couple of java interop libs about that might help you accomplish the same thing 17:15:25 -!- silenius [n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.NET] has quit [] 17:16:30 -!- jao [n=jao@74.Red-80-24-4.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:17:11 <_3b> manic12: nope, not here 17:17:11 Aankhen`` [n=heysquid@122.162.166.58] has joined #lisp 17:17:56 -!- dysinger [n=tim@76.164.46.79] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:22:01 -!- kiuma [n=kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit ["Bye bye ppl"] 17:22:24 mrsolo [n=mrsolo@nat/yahoo/x-94c6eaf89e267a7b] has joined #lisp 17:22:54 slacks21 [n=ckuttruf@ip68-101-220-87.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:22:54 hi _3b 17:23:37 hey all. I'm having a rather frustrating problem with not being able to invert the html process with phtml and html-generator. I feel like I'm missing something simple 17:23:39 http://pastebin.com/m3e7e9deb 17:23:51 _3b are you the maintainer and/or creator of cl-opengl? 17:23:56 -!- jmbr [n=jmbr@10.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:23:56 help would be much appreciated. Cause it doesn't make sense why this wouldn't work as intended 17:24:01 samlt [n=sam@17.218.193-77.rev.gaoland.net] has joined #lisp 17:25:45 <_3b> manic12: i've made some patches for it, but don't have commit access to the main repo 17:26:02 ah 17:26:17 do you use opengl 3.1 or 3.0? 17:26:45 <_3b> i've used 3.0 a bit, not gotten around to trying 3.1 yet 17:27:52 I'm trying to re-swig for opengl 3.1, but I am confused about versions of header files 17:28:19 the opengl channel is useless 17:29:20 nikodemus` [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 17:30:12 I want to do it such that functions that are common to all versions appear in the `gl' package, and then any functions added at each version level get put in `gl21', gl30, gl31 etc 17:31:09 <_3b> 3.1 mostly removed things, so that doesn't work very well :/ 17:31:24 i'm starting to realize that 17:31:26 <_3b> also it is hard to separate things out usefully when you add in extensions and such 17:31:29 :( 17:32:22 are context' compatible between 3.1 and 2.1 ? 17:32:39 <_3b> depends on what you mean by 'compatible' 17:32:59 <_3b> and whether you mean according to the spec, or inpractice 17:33:13 Corun [n=Corun@94-194-29-31.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:33:15 for instance if I make a context with a 3.1 extension, can I (in general) call stuff that is no longer in 3.1? 17:34:01 <_3b> if you make a 3.1 context, it has a bunch of stuff from 2.1 missing, except when the backwards compatibility extension is present, in which case the removed stuff is added back in 17:34:21 abeaumont [n=abeaumon@84.76.48.250] has joined #lisp 17:34:50 ah, so why *wouldn't* you want to use the backwards compatibility extension? 17:34:54 -!- samlt [n=sam@17.218.193-77.rev.gaoland.net] has left #lisp 17:35:11 <_3b> you have no choice, it is either there or not 17:35:21 http://pastebin.com/m3e7e9deb (so does someone know why this process wouldn't be invertible?... Is there some difference between the input I pass to the first function and the input that is generated by the second function?) 17:35:29 *_3b* wouldn't use it, since the whole point of 3.1 was to get a clean api :) 17:35:54 projections [n=projecti@88.235.101.2] has joined #lisp 17:35:59 by the second function I mean the (car (phtml....)) 17:36:28 <_3b> slacks21: what doesn't work? 17:36:46 wow so 3.1 is making people completely rewrite their programs 17:36:48 on line 8... I expect the output to be the generated html 17:37:10 which works when I use (net.html.gen:html (:html ... )) 17:37:59 and I'm curious as to why this would be... I'm aware that I'm passing in a list during the second call, but should this be treated any different from the source code I passed in with the first call 17:38:02 <_3b> slacks21: oh, i'd guess :net.html.generator:html is a macro or something that only works on the actual list, not code that generated the list 17:38:13 hmmm... any way around that? 17:38:33 and yes, the html is a macro in allegroserve 17:38:39 <_3b> no idea, haven't used that lib 17:38:50 okay, well thanks for looking at it 17:38:53 <_3b> maybe see if there is a function version 17:39:41 <_3b> manic12: probably not, since it will probably be there, and you can still use 3.0 for backwards compat 17:40:08 <_3b> manic12: and you should mostly be writing it that way anyway, if you want any sort of performance :) 17:42:56 HG` [n=wells@xdslec201.osnanet.de] has joined #lisp 17:43:36 CLSQL question --- I keep trying to use a view-class, and on my selects, I keep getting errors that look like "the value is not of type STRING." Alas, the debugger is giving me only : so I'm not getting much of anywhere... 17:46:33 rpg, the debugger probably shows a stack-trace? .. if you can reproduce the problem again and again (reliably) then you could sprinkle the cl-sql code with some calls to FORMAT etc. based on locations shown in the stack-trace 17:47:09 compile with higher debugger settings? 17:47:34 rpg, oh, and using slime you can press 'v' on one of the stack-frames .. that'll take you directly to the location(s) that lead up to where you are now 17:47:42 lnostdal: Yes, it does. I could possibly do some tracing.... I think the problem is probably I have gonked the view class description so that it's trying to decode an integer as if it's a string.... 17:48:34 stassats: Interesting suggestion. I bet the clsql folks must crank up the optimization setting. I didn't... 17:48:44 ..don't need to trace .. just jump from stack-frame ---> code locations 17:48:45 _3d: I have a dilemma then: I need to continue writing this GL-based test harness for my app and using the new api makes sense there, but I wanted to be able to pick up chunks of it and run it in Mirai when I get that 17:48:54 jenkins_ [n=jenkins@ixa148.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:49:14 rpg: well, you still can increase it 17:49:21 even if it wasn't lowered 17:51:24 lnostdal: Yes, I can go to the source locations, but if I can't see the local variables, the source location is of only very limited value. 17:51:59 rpg, pressing enter on the stack-frame (instead of pressing 'v') will "expand it" and you'll be able to see and/or examine variables etc. there 17:52:33 rpg, ..and if you can't, well, you know _where_ to insert debug-code (FORMAT, PRINC etc.) which will print out the stuff you need to see to be able to understand wtf. is going on 17:52:41 <_3b> manic12: yeah, best i could come up with was making a small 3.1 style api, and then adding the option to load in the rest of it 17:53:00 <_3b> manic12: not really sure i'm happy with that yet or not 17:53:15 -!- anekos is now known as awayekos 17:53:28 I just swigged the whole 3.1 api, it's not very big 17:53:42 lnostdal: I think they were compiled away, but I am pessimizing the code. 17:53:49 ;-) 17:53:55 ok, rpg 17:53:56 but the problem is the contextes 17:54:05 jbjohns [n=chatzill@52-45.3-213.fix.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 17:54:08 or whatever the plural of context is 17:54:26 looks like there may be troubles with tinyint.... 17:55:22 if I'm calling gl commands which use 3.1 in a M-geo window, it probably won't work 17:55:45 i better just stick with 2.1 :( 17:56:16 -!- slacks21 [n=ckuttruf@ip68-101-220-87.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 17:56:35 <_3b> well, don't forget about the extensions they added to 2.1 that match new features of 3.0 17:57:10 ok 17:58:09 -!- Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:00:20 -!- dcrawford [n=dcrawfor@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- dmiles_afk [n=dmiles@c-71-197-210-170.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- spiaggia [n=user@armadillo.labri.fr] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- thijso [n=thijs@83.98.233.115] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- BeZerk [n=MrEd@about/apple/iPod/BeZerk] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- wasabi__ [n=wasabi@nttkyo1000205.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- Maddas [n=Maddas@tardis-b23.ee.ethz.ch] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:20 -!- gz [n=gz@209-6-18-72.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:21 -!- authentic [n=authenti@85-127-20-51.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:21 -!- Khisanth [n=Khisanth@pool-141-157-237-196.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 18:00:25 Maddas [n=Maddas@tardis-b23.ee.ethz.ch] has joined #lisp 18:00:26 -!- Phoodus [i=foo@ip68-231-38-131.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:00:27 Khisanth [n=Khisanth@pool-141-157-237-196.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:00:28 spiaggia [n=user@armadillo.labri.fr] has joined #lisp 18:00:29 thijso [n=thijs@83.98.233.115] has joined #lisp 18:00:31 gz [n=gz@209-6-18-72.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 18:00:33 authentic [n=authenti@85-127-20-51.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 18:00:33 BeZerk [n=MrEd@about/apple/iPod/BeZerk] has joined #lisp 18:00:38 dcrawford [n=dcrawfor@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 18:00:43 wasabi__ [n=wasabi@nttkyo1000205.tkyo.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 18:03:00 Yes, AFAICT the tinyint sql type broke things for me. 18:04:25 ehu` [n=chatzill@82-170-33-173.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #lisp 18:05:14 dmiles_afk [n=dmiles@c-71-197-210-170.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:05:28 -!- enn_ is now known as enn 18:05:28 mcspiff [n=user@DC7CB.WPA.Dal.Ca] has joined #lisp 18:05:42 fullets_ [n=fullets@202-180-72-93.callplus.net.nz] has joined #lisp 18:06:14 Hun [n=hun@p50993726.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 18:06:38 rpg: In the debugger, you can use C-u C-c C-c to recompile the function behind a frame with maximum debug information 18:06:54 rpg: You can then restart from some prior frame, or invoke some retry or try-again restart 18:08:04 There are even special faces for restartable frames, but they do not have default values. I'll change that. 18:08:23 that's a nice feature. 18:08:37 a screencast or tutorial on debugging /w slime would be v.cool. 18:09:06 Are there any implementations that differentiate short-float from single-float and double-float from long-float? 18:09:46 It's a reason why you should always have a (declare (optimize (debug 2))) in your application's event loop function, so you can restart when you get an error from nowhere 18:09:55 tmh: Clisp, iirc 18:10:07 Indeed. 18:10:17 -!- konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:10:33 -!- fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has quit ["Valete!"] 18:11:03 I feel like in the debugger im limited to just selected a restart. I realize this isnt the case, but thats where im at with slime 18:11:11 -!- jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:12:06 jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has joined #lisp 18:12:13 tcr: Thank you very much for the pointer. 18:12:16 mcspiff: Press C-h m in the sldb buffer, look at functions named sldb-foo, and try out 18:12:48 Hmm, LispWorks differentiates short-float and single-float on Win32, but not double-float and long-float. 18:13:04 rpg: On allegro frames are restartable when functions are compiled with default settings 18:13:37 -!- fullets [n=fullets@202-180-72-93.callplus.net.nz] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:13:46 rpg: Have you seen the slides of my slime presentation yet? 18:14:30 Jabberwockey [n=jens@dslc-082-083-077-205.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 18:15:43 tmh: So what? This is allowed, therefore to be expected. 18:15:57 -!- mcspiff [n=user@DC7CB.WPA.Dal.Ca] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:16:33 -!- Jarvellis [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Dead socket] 18:16:43 mcspiff [n=user@DC7CB.WPA.Dal.Ca] has joined #lisp 18:16:55 silenius [n=jl@f053014152.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 18:17:55 -!- kami- [n=user@193.218.18.18] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:18:05 kami- [n=user@193.218.18.18] has joined #lisp 18:18:20 konr [n=konrad@201.82.132.33] has joined #lisp 18:22:02 -!- HG` [n=wells@xdslec201.osnanet.de] has quit [Client Quit] 18:22:19 robsynnot [n=irchon@87-198-231-166.ptr.magnet.ie] has joined #lisp 18:22:24 octoberdan [n=dgreen@64.206.6.254] has joined #lisp 18:22:24 -!- robsynnot [n=irchon@87-198-231-166.ptr.magnet.ie] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:22:38 I just installed stumpwm :-) 18:22:42 hiya 18:22:51 Hun: Hello :-) 18:23:34 -!- Aankhen`` [n=heysquid@122.162.166.58] has quit ["Log this!"] 18:23:50 stumpwm is nice. i use it since about 2 years now :) 18:27:28 -!- dysinger_ [n=tim@76.164.46.79] has quit [] 18:27:41 octoberdan: expect some time to get used to it 18:28:30 madnificent: I think I'm starting to, but I don't think I'm using it to its full potential... or even close 18:28:46 madnificent: I just have my monitor split into 4 windows 18:29:08 some people talked about implementing auto-tiling, maybe you could help there :) 18:29:51 -!- davazp [n=user@56.Red-79-153-148.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:30:18 Hun: sounds like a reseach-topic 18:30:38 dwm implements this already, i think awesome and xmonad does it, too 18:30:51 the initial stage would be larswm like 18:31:05 Hun: that's hardly a challenge... I was thinking about intelligent tiling :) 18:31:13 :D 18:31:30 What /is/ autotiling? 18:31:45 admittedly, I don't know the stumpwm internals, I'd rather work in other areas than stumpwm for now 18:31:48 on new window, split somewhere reasonable and place it there 18:32:14 octoberdan: automatically creating a place for new windows... xmonad has a very rudimentary (yet fairly decent working) way for that. 18:32:18 it crashes not too often anymore (for me stable for 2 months now) 18:32:54 octoberdan: on the contrary to stumpwm (and many others) all windows are visible at all times. Not always in a scaling that's handy though. 18:33:11 *madnificent* found xmonad to be lacking in that respect (joy for stumpwm) 18:33:36 finding a good layout for e.g. qtdesigner would be nice 18:34:02 xmonad sucks at floats 18:34:11 making eclipse tag its windows correctly would be good too 18:34:14 it's okay as long as you don't need any 18:34:36 guaqua: its support for it is better than stumpwm's 18:34:47 madnificent: still sucks :) 18:35:15 Hun: if the windows are tagged, you can store them... then bind keys to loading that layout 18:35:16 What's wrong with trying to compile a file with interdependent functions? 18:35:19 a good place for stumpwm would be hacking up the float support 18:35:31 madnificent: true. but i haven't found a working layout yet :) 18:35:38 Hun: admittedly, it would be nice if it were auto-triggerd... again something that should be thought of... A programmable way of ordering tiles could be good 18:35:42 Foofie [n=innocent@86.80-203-225.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 18:35:42 why isn't this #stumpwm? 18:36:39 I require a package that has a function defined with a macro that calls another function in the same file... compiler complains about the latter one being undefined. 18:36:59 you may want to look at eval-when here 18:37:21 dys [n=andreas@p5B315E91.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:37:25 Ragnaroek [i=54a670c0@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-e5bf91083dda0fa9] has joined #lisp 18:37:45 Hun: oh, ok. 18:40:50 Hun: Ah, this answers my question yesterday about how lisp programs can be compiled at all. 18:41:42 -!- tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has quit ["Leaving."] 18:41:59 ruediger_ [n=ruediger@62-47-137-103.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 18:42:12 tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 18:45:54 jao [n=jao@194.Red-81-32-187.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:46:36 warptrosse [i=be1eec46@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a5a33726ebb654b5] has joined #lisp 18:46:42 hi 18:46:47 -!- mjh [n=user@78.52.235.87] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:47:01 how can i concatenate an string with a variable... like http://pastebin.com/m1296d656 18:48:07 that looks like emacs lisp. try in #emacs 18:48:20 ok thx 18:48:29 -!- jao [n=jao@194.Red-81-32-187.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:49:37 -!- slyrus_ [n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:50:12 -!- jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:50:34 jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has joined #lisp 18:51:14 -!- Jabberwockey [n=jens@dslc-082-083-077-205.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:53:16 -!- nikodemus` [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 18:54:55 -!- galdor [n=galdor@bur91-2-82-231-160-213.fbx.proxad.net] has left #lisp 18:55:02 -!- sepult [n=sepult@xdsl-87-78-27-73.netcologne.de] has quit ["KVIrc 3.4.0 Virgo http://www.kvirc.net/"] 19:05:44 dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 19:08:59 toro` [n=nonamme@cpe-74-64-125-220.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:09:03 hi 19:09:54 -!- s0ber_ [n=s0ber@118-160-160-199.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:10:21 -!- jenkins_ [n=jenkins@ixa148.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 19:10:59 jenkins_ [n=jenkins@ixa148.internetdsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 19:11:19 mehrheit [n=user@lan-84-240-55-160.vln.skynet.lt] has joined #lisp 19:11:34 how long takes practical common lisp to complete? 19:11:38 loxs [n=loxs@83.228.122.198] has joined #lisp 19:12:21 took me a week to get half-way through 19:12:36 i did maybe 3 hours a day? 19:12:41 ok 19:12:56 it takes a while to grasp the deeper concepts (like conditions, restarts, macros and loop) 19:13:13 yeah. conditions and restars are not easy 19:13:25 i found macros to be a much simpler concept 19:13:39 and a lifetime to master 19:13:45 -!- ruediger_ [n=ruediger@62-47-137-103.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:13:46 that too :) 19:14:23 I am struggling with the describe-foo object-foo. I started giving those random names but apparently is not like that. 19:15:19 -!- jollygood [n=jollygoo@pool-72-65-142-31.chrlwv.east.verizon.net] has quit [] 19:18:02 s0ber [i=pie@118-168-239-141.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 19:18:50 jikanter [n=jikanter@32.137.204.42] has joined #lisp 19:18:52 -!- gemelen [n=shelta@shpd-78-36-164-83.static.vologda.ru] has quit ["I wish the toaster to be happy, too."] 19:19:49 -!- jikanter [n=jikanter@32.137.204.42] has quit [Client Quit] 19:20:36 DeusExPikachu [n=DeusExPi@wireless-169-235-47-123.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 19:20:52 ejs [n=eugen@10-224-124-91.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 19:21:29 jikanter [n=jikanter@32.137.204.42] has joined #lisp 19:22:22 thomas_ [n=thomas@41-071.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 19:23:10 Hey guys, is there like some sorta sigslot/observer library for clos slots? 19:24:27 nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 19:24:37 thomas_: like before/after/around methods on accessors, or something more fancy like Cells? 19:24:58 -!- silenius [n=jl@f053014152.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:25:06 well, with before/after/around I only really get one possible listener 19:25:18 -!- jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:25:31 *thomas_* googles cells 19:25:34 jthing [n=jthing@212.251.244.254] has joined #lisp 19:25:38 davazp [n=user@56.Red-79-153-148.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 19:26:05 Zenton` [n=user@80.29.232.44] has joined #lisp 19:26:27 thomas_: not really. (defmethod accessor :after (foo) (trigger-observers foo 'accessor)) 19:27:09 then you can manage your observers and subscription however you like 19:27:52 Yeah, I thought about that too. But I didn't find a way to store any old :after methods inside the obervers 19:28:11 -!- mcspiff [n=user@DC7CB.WPA.Dal.Ca] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:28:18 observers-list*. 19:28:25 "old :after methods"? 19:28:58 dto [n=user@pool-98-118-1-212.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:29:10 Yes - for example if there had already been an :after method defined *before* I do (defmethod accessor :after (foo) (trigger-observers foo 'accessor)) 19:29:23 legumbre_ [n=user@r190-135-10-233.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 19:29:34 I'd overwrite the :old method - losing its functionality. 19:29:40 -!- stassats [n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:29:40 old* 19:29:51 By old, do you mean specialized on a super-class? 19:30:28 Not in particular. I simply mean any other :after definition on that method. 19:30:31 well, sure. that's why you would define the :after method on a subclass of foo's class 19:31:02 pitui [n=pitui@135.207.174.197] has joined #lisp 19:31:11 gemelen [n=shelta@shpd-78-36-164-83.static.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 19:31:22 stassats [n=stassats@ppp78-37-164-195.pppoe.avangarddsl.ru] has joined #lisp 19:31:39 Hmm. 19:32:09 michaelw: That sounds like a plan - I'll think about it. Thanks for the input. 19:32:14 access to an element of a property list with GET O(1) or O(n)? 19:32:22 it's a list. 19:32:37 -!- BrianRice-mb is now known as BrianRice 19:32:40 -!- schoppenhauer [n=mdd63bi@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:32:42 *froydnj* gripes and slime for throwing up when evaluating perfectly reasonable forms 19:32:43 thomas_: Do you have a copy of 'Object-Oriented Programming in Common Lisp' by Keene? 19:33:18 tmh: No. 19:33:36 froydnj: hm? 19:34:03 DeusExPikachu: it's O(1) if the plist is of bounded size; and it should be anyway 19:34:13 thomas_: Take a look at it, at least check it out from the library, but I think it is also worth purchasing if you are going to be using CLOS. 19:34:16 dysinger [n=tim@166.129.190.208] has joined #lisp 19:34:28 tmh: http://www.amazon.de/Object-Oriented-Programming-Common-LISP-Programmers/dp/0201175894 ? 19:34:45 That's the one. 19:34:57 michaelw, is it possible that it could be implementation dependent or is it specified in the standard? 19:35:02 tcr: I C-M-x a form and get the error Connection to Emacs lost. condition: junk in string "..." 19:35:09 tcr: very irritating 19:35:19 froydnj: encoding issue? 19:36:01 tmh: Cool thanks. I'll take a look at it. 19:36:03 pinterface [n=pinterfa@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net] has joined #lisp 19:36:28 tcr: don't think so. looks like streams are getting crossed somewhere. the backtrace has (PARSE-INTEGER "x i)\n ") in it 19:36:48 (or PARSE-INTEGER on whatever other text happens to be there when things go wrong 19:36:55 -!- srcerer_ is now known as srcerer 19:36:57 Oh that's weird, indeed 19:36:58 DeusExPikachu: has nothing to do with implementation, that's how O() Notation works 19:37:08 tcr: *inferior-lisp* says "encoding: NIL style: :FD-HANDLER dedicated: NIL" 19:37:38 michaelw: O(1) is a subset of O(n), so both would be right ;) 19:37:57 froydnj: I can't judge without looking at the code, and I don't feel like doing that now :) 19:38:12 michaelw, I should more correctly say then, does the time it takes to find an element using GET grow linearly with number of elements n? 19:38:35 tcr: heh. 19:38:38 -!- loxs [n=loxs@83.228.122.198] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:38:38 pkhuong: pfeh, tighter bounds are preferred, otherwise it's completely meaningless 19:38:45 DeusExPikachu: yes, it does 19:38:52 thank you 19:38:56 but O() sometimes depends on the calcuation model 19:38:57 Actually, it's still bounded by the finite patience of the user. 19:40:24 michaelw: that's what Theta's for. 19:40:35 michaelw: I don't understand the schema of the index links in your cl-dot documentation 19:40:45 michaelw: e.g. http://www.foldr.org/~michaelw/projects/cl-dot/#index-print_002dgraph-13 19:41:00 the _002d are for the hyphens, but what's the number at the end? 19:41:15 Do you have an idea? 19:41:44 Ragnaroek: sure, but if not otherwise stated, unit-cost RAM is assumed 19:42:08 tcr: texinfo weirdness, I didn't try to figure it out 19:42:40 Well, that's not what comes out from texinfo for the cffi manual, or my parse-declarations documentation 19:42:41 jmbr [n=jmbr@10.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 19:44:18 Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has joined #lisp 19:44:32 tcr: I call it like this: makeinfo --html --css-ref style.css --no-number-sections --no-split 19:44:56 -!- legumbre [n=user@r190-135-13-71.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:45:03 I used the gendocs.sh that comes with cffi/doc/ 19:45:16 makeinfo (GNU texinfo) 4.13 19:45:57 tcr: ah, hyperdoc work? 19:46:05 I have 4.11; it would suck badly if that's version dependent 19:46:08 yes 19:46:13 -!- trvlr [n=trvlr@117.193.201.42] has quit ["Java user signed off"] 19:47:28 -!- Modius [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-221-181.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [No route to host] 19:47:57 nikodemus: Your entry in slime's ChangeLog is garbled; would you mind fixing that? 19:48:36 argh, slime 19:50:29 it wasn't enough to arbitrarily kill my lisp sessions, now you have to lock up emacs instead. 19:50:51 tcr: texinfo.info appears to document how the URLs are generated 19:51:01 a cautionary tail of overly ambitious tools. 19:51:29 froydnj: Are you on HEAD? 19:51:48 michaelw: Not sufficiently. 19:53:58 tcr: I see; no mentioning of the -13 suffix... 19:54:19 tcr: *slime-repl* says 2009-05-01. I hate upgrading slime, because it seems like something breaks every time I do. 19:56:02 froydnj: Yes that was a very bad time to update 19:57:28 jsoft [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 19:57:54 fiveop_ [n=fiveop@pD9E6BCDB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:57:55 -!- fiveop_ [n=fiveop@pD9E6BCDB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:00:09 -!- jrockway [n=jrockway@stonepath.jrock.us] has quit ["I HATE IRSSI"] 20:00:15 tcr: :( it's not just "bad times to update"...it's useful bits of functionality disappearing and I have to spend 30 minutes discovering they've been moved to some contrib or I have to set a new variable, or whatever. 20:00:24 jrockway [n=jrockway@stonepath.jrock.us] has joined #lisp 20:01:03 -!- nikodemus [n=nikodemu@cs181129202.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:01:26 -!- mega1 [n=mega@3e70d668.adsl.enternet.hu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:01:55 -!- jikanter [n=jikanter@32.137.204.42] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:02:14 -!- Yuuhi [i=benni@p5483F208.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:04:33 tcr: it appears to be just a running number, IOW not predictable 20:05:30 (see texinfo-4.13/makeinfo/index.c:249) 20:08:08 tcr: hmm, CFFI has these, too: http://common-lisp.net/project/cffi/manual/html_node/Other-Types.html#index-g_t_003aboolean-71 20:10:16 -!- mattrepl [n=mattrepl@hq-users.caci.com] has quit [] 20:10:18 froydnj: If you use the slime-fancy contrib this should mostly not be the case 20:12:08 froydnj: just wait, in the next update, it won't do anything at all without a contrib loaded. :) 20:12:32 heh. 20:12:44 the contrib-ness breakage was a while ago, I think. 20:13:48 yea 20:14:01 fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@88-149-208-166.dynamic.ngi.it] has joined #lisp 20:16:28 I'm going to start a Top-X list of errors that are difficult to debug. Today's is accidentally using SET instead of SETF in the definition of a SETF function. 20:17:04 clisp issues a style-warning on the use of SET 20:17:18 froog [n=user@c8B7747C1.dhcp.bluecom.no] has joined #lisp 20:17:21 it recommends (setf symbol-value) 20:17:23 -!- saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [] 20:17:38 -!- ia__ [n=ia@89.169.189.230] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:17:41 That would have been helpful. 20:17:58 -!- jsoft_ [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Connection timed out] 20:20:12 -!- sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 20:22:00 slyrus_ [n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 20:23:12 -!- warptrosse [i=be1eec46@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a5a33726ebb654b5] has left #lisp 20:24:24 -!- rpg [n=rpg@75-146-46-193-Minnesota.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [] 20:24:44 klausi [n=klausi@port-92-193-63-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 20:25:37 -!- puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:26:14 puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 20:26:41 sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 20:27:05 tmh: Passing - instead of #'- when modifying the compiler. "Why do I get the source instead of the compiled function!?" 20:27:17 pon][ [n=pon][@c-e132e253.516-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 20:27:52 Jasko2 [n=tjasko@c-98-235-105-148.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:27:58 -!- cpape [n=user@host16084.pik-potsdam.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:29:17 -!- Jasko [n=tjasko@c-98-235-105-148.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 20:30:27 -!- dysinger [n=tim@166.129.190.208] has quit [] 20:30:31 eni4ever [n=admin@79.114.45.43] has joined #lisp 20:33:07 how about.. wondering about an "Invalid initialization argument: :BAR in call for class #." error when (make-instance 'foo) and the form is actually (defclass foo () ()) and there aren't any methods specialized for `foo' 20:33:32 then you realize it's because you had (defclass foo () ((bar :initarg :bar)) (:default-initargs :bar 42)) 20:33:55 -!- bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:33:56 then you feel stumped 20:35:30 bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has joined #lisp 20:38:17 (defclass foo () () (:default-initargs)) seems like the good work-around 20:39:04 pkhuong: I'll add it. 20:42:02 -!- ehu` [n=chatzill@82-170-33-173.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:43:55 any torrent client in lisp? 20:44:23 I am using rtorrent and see stuff I wanna change but might as well do it on a lisp pragram 20:44:29 -!- dabd [n=dabd@85.139.101.251] has quit [Client Quit] 20:45:35 -!- Spyderco [n=nash@194.45.110.65] has quit [Connection timed out] 20:48:07 toro`: you could try to connect to libtorrent (which is the backend of rtorrent, if I'm not mistaken) 20:48:09 -!- bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:49:26 tritchey_ [n=tritchey@c-68-58-88-241.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:49:27 how can I do this in lisp? http://tmux.sourceforge.net/tmux4.png 20:49:46 -!- rread_ [n=rread@nat/sun/x-c8ece3b4b00e0a1f] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:49:57 rread [n=rread@nat/sun/x-523fb54f240278fe] has joined #lisp 20:50:14 -!- awayekos is now known as anekos 20:50:15 bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:34 same way they did it in perl, I'd guess. Or use the CLIM listener, and spare yourself mucking with funky terminal control codes. 20:50:50 yes is the backend for rtorrent 20:51:32 *toro`* needs some sort of example of code 20:51:44 -!- Nshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-106-3-214.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit ["Quitte"] 20:52:02 I'd give you example code in CLIM, but it wouldn't help you :) 20:52:03 ia [n=ia@89.169.189.230] has joined #lisp 20:52:39 like (defun foo '...) does this and (setq `(list ...)) does something else 20:52:47 mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-100-82-124.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:52:58 hmm, those "system colors" are in an odd order. classically, blue was the low bit, not red. 20:53:02 hefner: why? is not sbcl compat? 20:53:55 well not exactly that, but something similar where I can see the system colors. 20:54:13 all you have to do is figure out the right magic bytes to print. 20:54:25 I'm sure that will be clear if you read the perl code. 20:54:32 yes, looks like 0 4 2 6 [kinda] 1 5 3 7 20:54:37 mmm.. oh, is like Casting SPELS but instead of text code and direction colors!! 20:54:42 how do I even remember that stuff 20:55:03 adeht: yeah, 6 was brown. EGA is weird. 20:55:09 I guess that predates EGA. 20:56:05 -!- dlowe [n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Leaving."] 20:56:27 plutonas [n=plutonas@c-83-233-152-13.cust.bredband2.com] has joined #lisp 20:58:10 ok in Casting Spels starts of by setting some objcects (setq objects '(whiskey-bottle bucket frog chain)) 20:58:46 so change that to (setq objects '(box1 box2 box3 box4)) 20:59:27 hi 20:59:44 -!- Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 20:59:48 -!- jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has quit [Success] 21:00:24 does lisp know system colors? How are system colors told to lisp? 21:00:33 -!- Ragnaroek [i=54a670c0@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-e5bf91083dda0fa9] has quit ["http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"] 21:01:25 toro`: well, you can interrogate terminfo or termcap 21:02:04 -!- bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:02:31 and it'll return the color on the screen? 21:02:40 we'd all be better off if we'd terminated all this terminal nonsense a decade ago. all the world is xterm, I say, or at least it should be. 21:03:34 hefner: I don't have a X running. I am in framebuffer 21:03:42 bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has joined #lisp 21:04:06 hefner: Plan9 terminated it :) 21:04:07 Why? 21:05:00 oh.. just thought about something. 21:05:09 -!- S1100100` is now known as S11001001 21:05:16 -!- eni4ever [n=admin@79.114.45.43] has quit [Client Quit] 21:05:22 it's a disaster, and terminal apps never work right anyway unless they've been kludged to work with the specific terminal emulator you're using. 21:05:28 -!- bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:05:47 Even with termcap and terminfo? 21:05:59 -!- tritchey [n=tritchey@c-68-58-88-241.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:06:00 danlei [n=user@pD9E2F66C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 21:06:39 I'll stop before I invite the wrath of someone who knows what they're talking about. 21:06:49 Well, Plan9 doesn't have terminals (even though it uses text-based interface) 21:07:24 hefner: everyone uses xterm. See? simple! 21:07:56 bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has joined #lisp 21:07:57 *p_l* uses urxvt-unicode. And no, sometimes the control codes seem to be different from xterm 21:08:38 p_l: no, you use xterm. 21:08:41 p_l: that would be either urxvt or rxvt-unicode 21:08:48 fe[nl]ix: right 21:09:25 -!- bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:09:37 pkhuong: urxvt is rather nice, actually 21:10:00 xan_ [n=xan@cs78225040.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 21:10:24 Does it provide presentations? 21:10:25 after testing every terminal emulator available in Gentoo, I settled on urxvt 21:10:26 fe[nl]ix: I use rxvt when not on OS X. But just like everything is an x86, everyone uses xterm. 21:10:29 bdowning [n=bdowning@mnementh.lavos.net] has joined #lisp 21:10:36 tcr: no 21:10:43 bummer 21:12:15 fortunately, it has no presentations 21:12:25 otherwise it couldn't do redisplay as fast as it does 21:12:27 HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 21:12:49 *hefner* never remembers how to set the pad character with format. 21:12:51 So, how long until we have a terminal emulator in Lisp? 21:13:17 nyef: depends on your schedule 21:13:25 Busy, unfortunately. 21:13:29 jewel_ [n=jewel@dsl-247-202-125.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:13:44 dysinger [n=tim@32.177.5.90] has joined #lisp 21:14:28 would you run a peephole pass (IR2) back-to-front or forward? 21:15:25 -!- gemelen [n=shelta@shpd-78-36-164-83.static.vologda.ru] has quit ["I wish the toaster to be happy, too."] 21:17:35 -!- jkantz [n=jkantz@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 21:18:01 -!- sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit [] 21:18:44 everyone *needs* to pretend to be xterm whether or not they actually support it all, because nobody ever got around to inventing a way to transmit terminal data across telnet/ssh. 21:19:04 sometimes I wish putty were a little better at being xterm. 21:19:35 xterm isn't even xterm 21:19:43 it changes drastically between versions 21:19:53 it can do that; it's the gold standard. 21:20:10 unless you ssh between an older one and a newer one 21:20:10 Clearly, the real answer is to not use terminals and just have GUI applications. :-P 21:20:14 then random things don't work 21:20:28 -!- puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:20:33 -!- ejs [n=eugen@10-224-124-91.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 21:20:37 in a sane world, putty would tell the remote host that it's putty, with terminal description 21:20:41 clearly, the answer is to have no applications at all. 21:22:16 -!- davazp [n=user@56.Red-79-153-148.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:24:00 -!- Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:24:47 saikat [n=saikat@adsl-68-127-162-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 21:24:53 slash_ [n=Unknown@whgeh0138.cip.uni-regensburg.de] has joined #lisp 21:26:32 -!- brnhck [n=hrk@acurwa001181.adsl.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [] 21:26:59 -!- tombom [i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp] has quit ["Peace and Protection 4.22.2"] 21:27:21 ugh, maxima internals are disgusting... 21:27:54 -!- xan [n=xan@cs78225040.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:29:12 smithzv: got yet to the point where the code is MACLISP compatible? 21:29:37 p_l: no, looking forward to that... :P 21:30:04 -!- froog [n=user@c8B7747C1.dhcp.bluecom.no] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:30:20 hefner pasted "Colors for toro`" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/80512 21:30:57 p_l: It's even new stuff, though, I don't get it. It's like these people don't know about LET. 21:31:47 Sorry, needed to vent a little. All better now 21:33:24 jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has joined #lisp 21:34:04 smithzv: Literally? 21:34:16 smithzv: Or are there just a bunch of setfs running around? 21:35:24 -!- mehrheit [n=user@lan-84-240-55-160.vln.skynet.lt] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 21:35:27 octoberdan: setq. I expect most (new) maxima hackers learn exactly the CL they need to implement what they want, and probably most of it by reading maxima's source. 21:35:39 octoberdan: I don't know if literally, but there seem to be a heck of a lot of setfs/qs. 21:39:07 -!- abeaumont [n=abeaumon@84.76.48.250] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:39:51 isn't some code converted from fortran? 21:42:17 neat. if I export TERM=xterm-256color, my emacs color scheme becomes usable with emacs -nw again (not nearly correct, but pleasant and legible) 21:43:32 stassats: Not sure, I seem to remember something like that. 21:44:10 -!- jewel_ [n=jewel@dsl-247-202-125.telkomadsl.co.za] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 21:45:23 I get "Unknow list item seek transform...probably bug in SBCL itself." 21:45:41 meingbg: how? lisppaste the code. 21:45:41 -!- TDT [n=user@191.16.63.69.dyn.southslope.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 21:45:49 pkhuong: ok 21:46:54 rolly1975 [n=rory@5ad09348.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 21:49:26 meingbg pasted "Unknown list transform" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/80513 21:50:01 -!- DeusExPikachu [n=DeusExPi@wireless-169-235-47-123.ucr.edu] has quit ["Leaving"] 21:52:13 -!- jmbr [n=jmbr@10.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 21:52:22 Is it allowed to pass :test and :test-not? 21:52:33 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 21:52:42 Never thought about that possibility 21:53:11 davazp [n=user@56.Red-79-153-148.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 21:53:13 no, they are mutually exclusive 21:53:17 -!- nyef [n=nyef@65-125-125-98.dia.static.qwest.net] has quit ["Leaving the office."] 21:53:51 It is :test or :test-not, there is no :try 21:54:31 clhs 17.2.1 21:54:31 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/17_ba.htm 21:55:04 -!- elias` [n=me@unaffiliated/elias/x-342423] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] 21:55:37 jmbr [n=jmbr@68.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 21:55:53 hmm ok, mea culpa 21:56:48 -* 21:56:52 oops 21:57:46 -!- hippee-lee [n=hippee-l@sta-206-168-218-28.rockynet.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:57:53 MasochisticLibra [n=Masochis@c-24-2-191-235.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:58:50 meingbg annotated #80513 "Seems to work now, with test and test-not mutually exclusive" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/80513#1 22:00:06 _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:01:09 -!- _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:01:29 _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:02:33 timmy_ [n=timmy@thbh-ip-vsat-2-p254.vsat.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has joined #lisp 22:04:36 -!- thomas_ [n=thomas@41-071.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 22:05:33 -!- nyati [n=timmy@thbh-ip-vsat-2-p254.vsat.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 22:05:41 jimi_hendrix [n=user@unaffiliated/jimihendrix/x-735601] has joined #lisp 22:06:31 -!- hugod [n=hugod@modemcable086.138-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has quit [] 22:08:33 syamajala [n=syamajal@c-75-68-104-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:09:35 -!- ausente is now known as I_like_Turtles 22:11:04 -!- cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-167-159.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 22:11:20 Jarvellis [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #lisp 22:11:25 -!- alec [n=aberryma@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:13:22 -!- klausi [n=klausi@port-92-193-63-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:14:42 dreish [n=dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 22:15:12 vsync [n=vsync@174-24.202-68.tampabay.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:17:28 dysinger_ [n=tim@166.129.93.222] has joined #lisp 22:19:09 -!- HET2 [i=diman@xover.htu.tuwien.ac.at] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:19:42 Jabberwockey [n=jens@port-1362.pppoe.wtnet.de] has joined #lisp 22:24:25 -!- MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has quit [] 22:25:56 -!- araujo [n=araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:26:40 -!- tcr [n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de] has quit ["Leaving."] 22:30:31 nyef [n=nyef@vcwl1-61.daktel.net] has joined #lisp 22:33:18 -!- existentialmonk [n=carcdr@64-252-60-75.adsl.snet.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:33:28 -!- benny [n=benny@i577A0405.versanet.de] has quit [Connection timed out] 22:36:53 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:40:08 -!- jimi_hendrix [n=user@unaffiliated/jimihendrix/x-735601] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:41:26 -!- Zenton` [n=user@80.29.232.44] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:42:41 X-Scale2 [i=email@89.180.145.177] has joined #lisp 22:43:46 -!- jmbr [n=jmbr@68.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:44:16 -!- rolly1975 [n=rory@5ad09348.bb.sky.com] has quit ["The computer fell asleep"] 22:46:56 -!- rdd [n=user@c83-250-152-109.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:47:03 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 22:47:48 -!- dysinger [n=tim@32.177.5.90] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:48:07 -!- athos [n=philipp@92.250.250.68] has quit ["leaving"] 22:52:37 hugod [n=hugod@modemcable227.146-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:53:27 existentialmonk [n=carcdr@64-252-60-75.adsl.snet.net] has joined #lisp 22:54:39 which is a more fashionable way to name slots? (defclass foo () ((datum :accessor datum-of))) vs (defclass foo () ((datum-of :accessor datum-of))) or something else? 22:55:13 Go with the former. 22:55:26 If it were the latter, the accessor should be datum-of-of. 22:55:35 true. :) 22:57:29 -!- Jabberwockey [n=jens@port-1362.pppoe.wtnet.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:00:25 -!- milanj [n=milan@93.86.55.2] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:01:20 -!- X-Scale [i=email@89.180.135.232] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:04:52 -!- _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [] 23:05:42 derekv: I use (datum :accessor datum) 23:05:56 pjb, I see that also 23:06:51 strictly speaking I guess foo.datum would be legal also 23:06:52 -!- hugod [n=hugod@modemcable227.146-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [] 23:07:13 foo.datum is not so good when you have subclases. 23:07:22 ah yea 23:07:32 so thats why i'm not using it :) 23:08:35 -!- fiveop [n=fiveop@pD9E6BCDB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["humhum"] 23:09:16 -!- BeZerk is now known as obsethryl 23:09:33 -!- obsethryl is now known as erk 23:20:01 -!- jophish [n=jophish@dial-80-47-3-226.access.uk.tiscali.com] has quit [Connection timed out] 23:21:01 -!- Jarvellis [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:22:31 -!- manic12 [n=manic12@c-76-29-88-103.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 23:24:00 _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 23:28:26 hi? 23:28:58 no 23:29:46 -!- _JFT_ [n=_JFT_@modemcable183.11-202-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [] 23:30:33 -!- Soulman [n=kvirc@42.84-48-88.nextgentel.com] has quit ["KVIrc 3.4.0 Virgo http://www.kvirc.net/"] 23:31:58 manuel_ [n=manuel@HSI-KBW-082-212-032-239.hsi.kabelbw.de] has joined #lisp 23:32:47 lemonodor [n=lemonodo@dsl092-045-116.lax1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 23:33:08 -!- bobbysmith007 [n=russ@one.firewall.gnv.acceleration.net] has quit ["Leaving."] 23:33:26 Adamant [n=Adamant@c-76-29-188-22.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:38:22 -!- adeht [n=death@bzq-84-110-250-121.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 23:42:23 pinterface1 [n=pinterfa@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net] has joined #lisp 23:42:55 *nyef* blinks. 23:43:07 WTF is up with nil-array-accessed-error in src/compiler/generic/array.lisp ? 23:44:00 It's just pandering to gratuitous x86oidisms instead of fixing the actual issue. 23:44:21 -!- pinterface [n=pinterfa@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 23:44:23 wtf indeed. 23:44:24 -!- pinterface1 is now known as pinterface 23:45:44 I guess I'd better put that on my list to fix at some point. 23:48:09 hugod [n=hugod@modemcable227.146-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 23:49:16 -!- hugod [n=hugod@modemcable227.146-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Client Quit] 23:51:39 -!- syamajala [n=syamajal@c-75-68-104-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving..."] 23:53:32 mm. Yeah, I should also create new features to conditionalize on instead of the ubiquitous and not very useful (or x86 x86-64)... 23:55:15 Right, but actual real features. 23:55:36 Like :no-separate-number-stack and such. 23:55:54 Vegan [n=sdfpme@113.77.206.50] has joined #lisp 23:56:22 -!- amnesiac [n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:57:09 -!- thijso [n=thijs@83.98.233.115] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:57:13 (Or should that be :control-stack-is-number-stack ?)