00:02:38 sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:53 -!- sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:07:04 -!- danlei [n=user@pD9E2FE24.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:07:24 -!- holycow [n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:07:44 -!- Jabberwockey [n=Tumnus_@dslb-082-083-072-254.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:07:49 danlei [n=user@pD9E2FE24.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 00:10:07 Soulmann [n=kae@gatekeeper.vizrt.com] has joined #lisp 00:10:19 -!- Soulman__ [n=kae@gatekeeper.vizrt.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:10:47 -!- lnostdal [i=lnostdal@149-191-122.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no] has quit [lem.freenode.net irc.freenode.net] 00:11:30 lnostdal [i=lnostdal@149-191-122.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no] has joined #lisp 00:14:24 dreish [n=dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 00:16:12 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 00:17:39 -!- Cheshire [n=e@amcant.demon.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:20:04 -!- trebor_home [n=user@dslb-084-058-243-178.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:20:13 bhr [n=chatzill@unaffiliated/bhr] has joined #lisp 00:20:53 i am learning lisp on clisp interpreter, is there a built in pretty print function 00:21:07 where do I find out about that and other built in functions 00:21:58 -!- b4|hraban [n=b4@0brg.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving"] 00:23:22 sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:26:34 -!- kroger [n=user@66.134.142.83] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:28:45 bombshelter13__ [n=bombshel@209-161-235-37.dsl.look.ca] has joined #lisp 00:34:05 Lou__ [n=lat@125.162.205.66] has joined #lisp 00:34:13 hmm. I can't figure out how to start a specific slime-lisp-implementation from within .emacs 00:34:14 -!- Lou_ [n=lat@125.162.205.66] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:34:42 -!- bombshelter13_ [n=bombshel@209-161-227-20.dsl.look.ca] has quit [Connection timed out] 00:35:34 dbalcer [i=dbalcer@151.80.206.12] has joined #lisp 00:35:48 -!- dbalcer [i=dbalcer@151.80.206.12] has left #lisp 00:36:19 clhs pprint 00:36:20 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_wr_pr.htm 00:36:43 bhr: here is pretty print function and where to look for built in functions 00:37:26 pstickne [n=pstickne@69.166.35.201] has joined #lisp 00:39:11 -!- The-Kenny [n=moritz@p5087CCE6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:40:28 Does anyone know how late the ILC events will be on Mar 25 (Wed.)? 00:40:52 sohum: (slime 'sbcl), i guess 00:41:09 stassats`: I tried that, didn't seem to work 00:41:58 stassats`: it started slime, but not with the appropriate implementation 00:42:18 well, maybe you specified the wrong name 00:42:35 nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 00:43:32 -!- danlei [n=user@pD9E2FE24.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:43:49 stassats`: nope. 00:44:01 danlei [n=user@pD9E2FE24.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 00:44:43 then, perhaps you specified the wrong implementation with the right name 00:44:53 -!- kib2 [n=kib2@bd137-1-82-228-159-28.fbx.proxad.net] has quit ["When two people dream the same dream, it ceases to be an illusion. KVIrc 3.4.2 Shiny http://www.kvirc.net"] 00:45:51 -!- nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:49:50 stassats`: I have two implementations specified, sbcl and bot. M-- slime "bot" works, but M-: (slime 'bot) does not. 00:53:23 ml`_ [n=milan@port-92-192-9-18.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 00:55:34 -!- roygbiv [n=blank@pdpc/supporter/active/roygbiv] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 00:55:54 does it specified "bot" (with quotation marks) in your slime-lisp-implementations? 00:56:12 s/does/is/ 00:56:33 stassats`: thanks, but I also want to pretty print a definition 00:56:40 like (pprint rule1) 00:56:48 where rule1 is my defun 00:57:13 -!- Yuuhi [i=benni@p5483FFEB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 00:57:49 stassats`: sorry, M-- M-x slime bot is what works 00:58:13 clhs 22.2 00:58:13 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_b.htm 00:58:28 bhr: here pretty printer is described 00:58:30 thanks 00:58:32 -!- bombshelter13__ [n=bombshel@209-161-235-37.dsl.look.ca] has quit ["Where is the glory in complying with demands?"] 00:58:42 -!- ml` [n=milan@port-92-192-10-181.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:58:51 sohum: all right, can you show me your slime-lisp-implementations? 00:59:02 -!- Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [] 00:59:31 -!- hkBst [n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 01:00:13 or better, post your relevant .emacs piece to lisppaste 01:00:16 lisppaste: url? 01:00:16 To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/lisp and enter your paste. 01:00:34 relevant to slime, that is 01:01:31 -!- slyrus__ [n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:02:18 -!- macdice [n=macdice@78-86-162-220.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has left #lisp 01:02:23 tritchey [n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:05:19 sohum pasted "slime-lisp-implementations" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74892 01:05:49 so yeah, not that complex 01:06:10 been trying to get the autoload working, which doesn't seem to be for whatever reason 01:07:34 may be not a problem, but it's better to specify absolute pathname for :directory 01:08:24 -!- tritchey [n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [] 01:08:58 stassats`: emacs is started from screen, which is started at shell startup, so it shouldn't be, no. 01:11:09 -!- ginkgo [n=user@chello084113198244.17.14.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:11:16 besides directory, what's the difference? 01:12:43 stassats`: zip. I was attempting --load lines and :init-function to load load.lisp automatically, but didn't work 01:13:20 blbrown [n=Berlin@c-71-236-25-127.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:13:47 in what fashion it didn't work? 01:15:45 stassats`: well, --load just didn't seem to have any effect, and :init-function #'(lambda () (slime-load-file ... gave me an invalid function error 01:16:59 (setf slime-lisp-implementations '((bot ("/usr/local/bin/sbcl" "--load" "/home/stas/load.lisp")))) works for me 01:17:16 ..oh. hm. 01:17:28 karvus [n=thomas@193.213.35.168] has joined #lisp 01:18:44 that's interesting, it waits for the server to return before starting swank 01:18:58 in that case I'd have to load it from the client side 01:19:40 tritchey [n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:21:06 -!- jgracin__ [n=jgracin@82.193.210.126] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:21:15 by the way, what this bot is for? 01:23:17 ah-ha, I got init-function working 01:23:41 it's just an ircbot for a channel I frequent 01:24:42 sohum annotated #74892 with "with init-function" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74892#1 01:25:12 ok, so now the (slime 'bot) problem 01:25:39 it is? 01:26:03 it is what? 01:26:16 problem 01:26:27 does it still fire up the wrong implementation? 01:26:46 yep 01:27:14 that's strange, you must be missing something 01:27:59 that's my slime-lisp-implementations, and I'm testing by running M-: (slime 'bot) 01:28:41 akcom [i=akcom@rrcs-67-79-132-149.se.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:29:11 rvirding [n=rvirding@h40n5c1o1034.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 01:29:30 the directory that comes up is ~, the slime-load-file isn't executed, and the buffer's named *slime-repl sbcl* 01:30:00 I don't know much about lisp, or the construct I'm trying to describe so please bare with me. Does lisp provide the ability to return from a sub procedure to somewhere further up the call stack, instead of to the calling procedure? 01:30:08 the immediate calling procedure* 01:30:15 and if so, what is this construct called? 01:30:24 throw/catch 01:30:28 clhs throw 01:30:28 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/s_throw.htm 01:30:30 clhs catch 01:30:30 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/s_catch.htm 01:30:37 that's not exactly what I was thinking 01:30:46 perhaps I described this improperly 01:30:48 thank you anyway 01:31:47 akcom: I'm a newb too, but conditions maybe what you're looking for? 01:31:56 can you give an example? 01:32:21 http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/beyond-exception-handling-conditions-and-restarts.html is the condition introduction I used 01:33:22 -!- dysinger [n=tim@cpe-75-80-200-182.hawaii.res.rr.com] has quit [] 01:34:44 -!- pstickne [n=pstickne@69.166.35.201] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 01:36:39 -!- bohanlon [n=kg4qxk@pool-71-184-223-212.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:37:31 is there any way to simulate hitting M-- and typing bot afterwards from emacs lisp? 01:37:38 ml` [n=milan@port-92-192-46-8.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 01:38:32 M-- argument M-x function is a simulation for (function argument) 01:39:31 well, not exactly 01:39:42 (function (- argument)) 01:40:05 -!- jfrancis [n=jfrancis@pool-71-112-112-231.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [] 01:40:12 -!- amnesiac [n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac] has quit ["Leaving"] 01:40:40 what about just M-- M-x function? 01:41:06 IIRC by default it's -4. Let's try. 01:41:38 dysinger [n=tim@cpe-75-80-200-182.hawaii.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:41:48 -!- sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [] 01:42:12 nope. normally, M-- M-x slime prompts for the implementation to start. M-: (slime -4) does not, just starts the default 01:42:20 p -> -1 P -> - 01:42:44 (it depends on the interpretation given by the interactive arguments. 01:42:58 Tordek_ [n=tordek@host110.190-137-199.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 01:43:04 -!- pjb [n=t@81-66-196-92.rev.numericable.fr] has quit ["need to restart erc..."] 01:43:25 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host35.190-227-44.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 01:44:05 snomobeil [n=lindem@dslb-084-058-236-147.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 01:44:18 -!- parodyoflanguage [n=kevin@mmds-216-19-46-146.sqpk.az.commspeed.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:44:28 pjb [n=t@81-66-196-92.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 01:46:58 -!- jlf` [n=user@209.204.171.109] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:47:28 can anyone tell me if it is possible to get ECL working with clsql? 01:47:31 schmx [n=schme@c83-249-80-232.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 01:48:52 sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:49:06 -!- ml`_ [n=milan@port-92-192-9-18.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:49:47 sure it is, but what amount of work does that take, i don't know 01:50:10 oh, I have reached some amount already 01:51:11 I just would like to know if anyone has actually done it yet. 01:51:36 -!- sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 01:51:42 hmm. tried (let ((prefix-arg -4)) (slime)), with '-, and -1, none worked 01:52:44 aha! (let ((current-prefix-arg '-)) (slime)) does work! 01:53:29 now to figure out how to feed the name into the prompt.. 01:53:43 you are on the wrong path 01:53:43 gonzojive [n=red@fun.Stanford.EDU] has joined #lisp 01:54:25 stassats`: hm? what would be the right path, then? 01:54:33 calling (slime 'bot) 01:54:50 stassats`: ... which still doesn't work 01:54:52 and figurign out why it doesn't work 01:55:16 what's the age of your slime? 01:56:21 uh. not sure 01:57:05 -!- fisxoj [n=fisxoj@149.43.108.20] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:58:12 -!- schme [n=schme@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:59:18 hmm. 01:59:54 poikilothermic [n=tell@c-76-124-254-86.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:00:38 old slime: http://www.agry.purdue.edu/turf/tips/2006/slime.jpg 02:01:21 M-: (slime-start* (slime-lookup-lisp-implementation slime-lisp-implementations 'bot)) actually works, but trying to stick that in a (defun bot ..) (bot) in .emacs gives me a Wrong number of arguments error 02:02:04 slime-protocol-version tells age 02:02:24 well, you need to calculate it 02:03:17 sohum: that's still the wrong way, that's what (slime 'bot) is doing under the hood 02:03:17 should do 02:03:17 and does for me 02:03:48 perhaps your slime is too old and it doesn't do that, then update it 02:03:50 JuanDaugherty [n=juan@cpe-72-228-150-44.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:03:56 I had a look at the code - that's not anything like what it's doing 02:03:58 yea, maybe. 02:04:07 -!- homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-68ed3795b42abb01] has left #lisp 02:04:12 bhz- [n=resm@c-98-198-231-207.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:05:17 -!- dv_ [n=dv@85-127-204-206.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit ["Verlassend"] 02:06:46 -!- rvirding [n=rvirding@h40n5c1o1034.bredband.skanova.com] has left #lisp 02:07:07 sellout [n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:14:24 jsoft [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has 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[n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #lisp 06:39:09 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:40:07 -!- ozy` [n=vt920@pool-71-184-104-97.prvdri.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["absquatulating"] 06:40:55 -!- eno [n=eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 06:42:25 beach: the 'usual tricks' seem to have worked out quite nicely! 06:42:45 100x slot-access speedup, 10x method dispatch speedup, just from memoization :D 06:45:09 make that 35x method speedup. 06:47:44 benny [n=benny@i577A060F.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 06:49:33 -!- Jarv2 [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:50:43 trebor_home [n=user@dslb-084-058-246-235.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 06:50:56 Jarv2 [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #lisp 06:53:06 eno [n=eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 06:55:22 -!- Jarv2 [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 07:03:04 -!- eno___ [n=eno@adsl-70-137-149-247.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:06:25 gonzojive [n=red@c-24-130-53-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:15:37 ecraven [n=nex@140.78.42.103] has joined #lisp 07:16:55 -!- cheatcountry1 [n=cheatcou@cpe-72-177-217-220.satx.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 07:21:49 -!- cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit ["The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity."] 07:23:33 -!- patmaddox [n=pergesu@ip68-4-201-9.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [] 07:26:49 jdz [n=jdz@85.254.211.133] has joined #lisp 07:31:05 -!- dmiles_afk [n=dmiles@c-71-197-210-170.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 07:37:26 vy [n=user@213.139.194.186] has joined #lisp 07:38:50 workthrick [n=mathrick@0x55529153.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #lisp 07:40:43 dwave [n=ask@084202073202.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #lisp 07:41:04 -!- trebor_home [n=user@dslb-084-058-246-235.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:43:36 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has joined #lisp 07:43:59 reaver__ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has joined #lisp 07:47:07 mvilleneuve [n=matthieu@che33-1-82-66-18-171.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 07:47:27 good morning 07:48:41 morning 07:48:42 slyrus_ [n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 07:50:26 Jabberwockey [n=Tumnus_@dslb-082-083-072-254.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 07:52:31 stathis_ [n=stathis@ppp118-76.adsl.forthnet.gr] has joined #lisp 07:52:54 -!- Beket [n=stathis@ppp118-76.adsl.forthnet.gr] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 08:01:54 Aankhen`` [n=Aankhen@122.162.171.149] has joined #lisp 08:02:15 rindolf [n=shlomi@bzq-219-139-216.static.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 08:03:55 fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has joined #lisp 08:04:09 -!- cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 08:06:17 reaver___ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has joined #lisp 08:09:12 -!- stathis_ [n=stathis@ppp118-76.adsl.forthnet.gr] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 08:09:18 eno__ [n=eno@adsl-70-137-129-148.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 08:10:56 mega1 [n=mega@4d6f4fab.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 08:11:16 -!- manic12 [n=manic12@c-98-227-25-165.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 08:11:26 manic12 [n=manic12@c-98-227-25-165.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:12:57 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:20:22 wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has joined #lisp 08:20:37 well. Having clisp simply crash isn't very helpful. 08:21:14 -!- eno [n=eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:21:51 eevar2 [n=jalla@56.80-203-45.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 08:23:03 H4ns1 [n=hans@p57A0E0C4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:23:34 Soulman [n=kvirc@42.84-48-88.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 08:24:07 <_8david> where are all the SBCL/amd64 porters coming from suddenly? 08:25:40 thin air 08:28:00 lyte [n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte] has joined #lisp 08:28:31 -!- dwave [n=ask@084202073202.customer.alfanett.no] has quit ["Be back later"] 08:30:03 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 08:30:28 -!- reaver__ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:31:00 homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-703ab41171440662] has joined #lisp 08:33:14 binarin [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 08:36:19 -!- H4ns [n=hans@p57A0E0C4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 08:39:39 -!- fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@89.202.147.22] has quit ["Valete!"] 08:44:15 -!- gonzojive [n=red@c-24-130-53-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [] 08:44:47 binarin` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 08:52:17 gonzojive [n=red@c-24-130-53-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:52:38 -!- tiesje [n=user@202.63.242.211] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 08:53:44 dwave [n=ask@213.236.208.247] has joined #lisp 08:59:31 -!- jlf` [n=user@netblock-68-183-235-250.dslextreme.com] has quit [Connection timed out] 09:01:51 -!- binarin [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:04:38 -!- sohail [n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 09:04:57 -!- ia [n=ia@89.169.165.188] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:05:18 aerique [i=euqirea@xs2.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 09:06:12 -!- leo2007 [n=leo@sl392.st-edmunds.cam.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:06:14 ia [n=ia@89.169.165.188] has joined #lisp 09:06:41 request-method dispatching considered harmful 09:06:58 _8david: well, Josh Elasser has been a SBCL porter for a while 09:07:05 the solaris one does come out of left field a bit 09:07:19 kiuma [n=kiuma@83.103.127.195] has joined #lisp 09:07:32 this makes quite a lot of unmerged ports; Somebody needs to get merging... 09:07:55 lambda-avenger [n=roman@adsl-63-197-150-112.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 09:08:04 (ISTR there being netbsd-$foo ports lurking somewhere too; maybe they got merged?) 09:10:06 daniel__ [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has joined #lisp 09:10:58 binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 09:12:38 hola lispers 09:13:39 -!- mrsolo__ [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-223-135.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:14:49 -!- gonzojive [n=red@c-24-130-53-246.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [] 09:19:38 -!- binarin` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:23:02 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has quit [Success] 09:24:36 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has joined #lisp 09:25:33 -!- daniel_ [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:27:02 -!- daniel__ is now known as daniel 09:29:12 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 09:29:56 Draggor1 [n=Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 09:30:52 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has joined #lisp 09:33:57 binarin [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 09:35:10 brandelune [n=suzume@pl080.nas933.takamatsu.nttpc.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 09:35:36 -!- Draggor [n=Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:38:48 binarin` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 09:41:25 Draggor2 [n=Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 09:43:08 -!- rudi [n=rudi@z118l194.static.ctm.net] has quit ["Client exciting"] 09:45:05 -!- binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:45:08 -!- binarin [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 09:51:22 -!- Draggor1 [n=Draggor@216-80-120-145.alc-bsr1.chi-alc.il.static.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 09:54:51 hey kiuma 09:57:37 http://www.cliki.net/Sheeple My first cliki project. Exciting! 10:00:56 kennyd [n=ston@58.56.87.2] has joined #lisp 10:01:28 hello. whats wrong here: (defmacro (exp) (nth 0 exp)) 10:01:41 I'm getting exp is not a symbol error. not sure how to get it working 10:02:03 what are you trying to do? Just mess around? 10:02:19 Macros are not supposed to be used like functions :) 10:02:23 -!- dysinger [n=tim@cpe-75-80-200-182.hawaii.res.rr.com] has quit [] 10:02:40 -!- lambda-avenger [n=roman@adsl-63-197-150-112.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 10:02:59 kennyd: also, you're forgetting the name of the macro, if you really have to ask 10:03:12 just learning, i want to write equivalent of (defmacro (exp) (reverse exp)) that reverses all the child lists 10:03:12 (defmacro macro-name (exp) (nth 0 exp)) 10:03:31 kennyd: that's a job for a function, not a macro. 10:03:32 kennyd: why macro instead of a function? 10:04:17 jdz it's an example from book. (backwards ("hello" print)) 10:04:31 what book is this? 10:04:49 practical common lisp 10:04:59 can't be 10:05:08 huh. I don't remember seeing that in PCL. Strange. 10:05:30 its there.. http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/practical-a-simple-database.html 10:06:02 oh so it is 10:06:13 well anyways, your problem was that you didn't give the macro a name :) 10:06:20 jewel [n=jewel@dsl-242-170-32.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:06:24 glhf. I'm going to bed. Good book, hope you enjoy it. 10:07:01 thanks, sorry for stupid question. don't know how i forgot macro name 10:07:19 colouragga [n=simon@89.18.164.214] has joined #lisp 10:09:23 kennyd: a good way to run through examples is to make sure you type them in char-by-char when in doubt :) 10:09:54 sykopomp: nooooice! and it's even on github :-P 10:10:50 fusss: Hey. I have standards. I don't vaporware garbage on cliki (which is why nothing else I've written has shown up there..) 10:11:23 fusss: but it runs damn well now, although clisp seems to explode now. 10:14:03 your download button is broken though; i thought github did that for you automatically 10:14:26 oh hey. It is. 10:14:41 I thought it was automatic, too. Boo :( 10:16:04 fusss: http://support.github.com/discussions/site/9-ziptarball-buggy Yeah. Seems to be a bug. 10:16:27 i think large-scale shared-hallucination might have to wait til later 10:16:45 fusss: the zip download works, actually :) 10:16:56 fusss: why so? 10:16:58 slash_ [n=Unknown@whgeh0138.cip.uni-regensburg.de] has joined #lisp 10:17:50 well, i usually get my sheeples in a zipper bag, discreetly :-P 10:17:55 tomsw [n=user@94-224-218-240.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 10:18:08 snort 10:18:48 gotta go, crap awaits .. 10:19:01 bon appetit 10:20:50 anyone going to Fosdem? 10:21:07 fosdem? 10:23:00 plage [n=user@serveur5.labri.fr] has joined #lisp 10:23:02 g'day 10:23:10 reaver__ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has joined #lisp 10:23:14 plage: mornin' beach 10:23:20 hello plage 10:23:30 I should go to bed. :( It's 5:30am 10:23:49 -!- reaver___ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 10:24:35 sykopomp: nowhere near Brussels I guess 10:24:47 tomsw: no. Not in the slightest :) 10:25:37 Surely, there must be a town in some US state named Brussels, no? 10:25:53 I imagine there's probably a few dozen, at least. 10:26:36 H4ns [n=Hans@p57BBA651.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 10:27:34 Brussels has an identity problem though, people are more likely to name their home from home something unambiguously Flemish or Walloon 10:27:50 -!- kennyd [n=ston@58.56.87.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 10:28:12 unless they're nostalgic for beaurocrats 10:28:22 kennyd [n=ston@58.56.87.2] has joined #lisp 10:31:12 or moules frites 10:31:54 plage: http://www.cliki.net/Sheeple \o/ yay 10:32:03 -!- aja [n=aja@S01060018f3ab066e.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 10:32:23 it runs (much) faster than clisp's CLOS. I'm content :) 10:32:59 sykopomp: congratulations! 10:33:41 :D 10:33:42 uh, sheeple makes common lisp web 3.0 ready! 10:33:47 thanks 10:33:55 H4ns: pfft. web3.0 is so last-week. 10:34:17 I'm going straight for Semantic 3.5.28-WEB 10:34:17 sykopomp: it's clearly stated on the page you just referred to 10:34:31 H4ns: That makes sense. I wrote that part last week. 10:36:32 -!- kennyd [n=ston@58.56.87.2] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 10:37:26 sykopomp: anything like CLON? http://www.cliki.net/Clon 10:37:55 -!- weirdo [n=sthalik@c144-107.icpnet.pl] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 10:38:14 tomsw: Not too much. CLON is very different in a number of key ways :) 10:38:15 is there such a thing as "Clisp's CLOS"? 10:38:29 most lisps reuse either PCL or TinyCLOS 10:38:58 fusss: Clisp's implementation of CLOS, to be more clear. I'm not sure what they use. 10:39:10 some lisps use Closette ;) (ECL, iirc, does?) 10:39:47 that's what i meant. closette from amop. kizcales et al later wrote tinyclos as a port. 10:39:52 sykopomp: meaning I will have to look at /both/ of them. Damn 10:39:56 Corman does for sure 10:40:00 ahh, I see. 10:42:13 tomsw: CLON uses reader macros to do things like slot accesses and method calling. It also does the single-inheritance single-dispatch thing (so it has concepts like self, etc). Additionally, it has this interesting message queueing system that I don't quite understand, but it seems neat. 10:44:07 Sheeple, on the other hand, tries to look and feel as much like CLOS as it can. The Clone macro follows the defclass syntax, and Sheeple also does the whole defgeneric/defmethod combo (with defbuzzword/defmessage instead). Message definitions can dispatch on built-in lisp types, though, as well as any lisp object (which is autoboxed, and slapped into the prototype hierarchy) 10:44:34 (defmessage synergize ((foo =string=) (bar =string=)) (concatenate 'string foo bar)), for example. 10:44:52 ignas [i=Ignas@88.119.114.93] has joined #lisp 10:45:04 binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 10:46:14 Lou_ [n=lat@125.162.205.66] has joined #lisp 10:47:48 -!- Lou__ [n=lat@125.162.205.66] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 10:47:57 sykopomp: defbuzzword? this i must see 10:48:43 tomsw: I did my best to make every name as groan-worthy as I could. I figure if I'm going to pick variants to avoid naming conflicts, I may as well go all the way. 10:48:59 double the groan or triple your money back. Guaranteed. 10:49:59 sykopomp: you're safe, I'm groaning already. Add a few puns and I'll expire 10:51:14 I am correct in thinking that rucksack, cl-prevalence and the bknr datastore are the only cl object databases that don't need an externel rdms? and that the bknr one is the only one being actively developed? 10:51:40 sykopomp: but seriously, you were after the speed improvemnt, or you genuinely can't live without prototype-based oop? 10:51:43 aerique: pretty much, although there seems to be some work going into a native lisp datastore for elephant. 10:52:07 sykopomp: i read that, but that is not available yet is it? 10:52:23 aerique: that's the impression I get from skimming their ML. 10:52:35 sykopomp: same here, thanks :) 10:52:50 somehow I think "crashy and unusable, load at own risk" probably means you don't want to use it in an app quite yet. 10:53:28 correct 10:53:37 tomsw: I wanted its behavior for the game I'm working on. There's stuff that CLOS doesn't do that I really wanted. 10:53:43 <_8david> it's a lot of work to implement an OODBMS, at least if it's meant to fast and have ACID 10:54:04 <_8david> I'm told that AllegroCache is good. 10:54:55 tomsw: for example, you can define a prototype object, say, Standard-elf, which defines the basic characteristics of all unexceptional elves. All elves in the game have standard-elf as their parent (or one of their parents). 10:55:19 -!- binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 10:55:46 If you want to cascade a *value* change across all elves, you simply change the property value in standard-elf, and all descendants automatically use that value unless they overrode it themselves (or a parent with higher precedence did) 10:56:20 that means that builders can just maintain a bunch of prototypes, and change the game on-the-fly. There's a lot more to it, but that's one of the things I wanted it for. 10:57:20 _8david: i haven't got acl so allegrocache is not an option for me (this is for a personal project) 10:57:55 aerique: bknr is an excellent system if you can fit stuff in memory. I had a great time playing with it :) 10:58:32 sykopomp: yeah, i'll give that one a try and see how it compares to my experience with rucksack 10:59:06 aerique: bknr is an *in-memory* object store! i hope your cloud has backup generators. 10:59:15 fusss: ? 10:59:40 H4ns: bknr is a memory cache, iirc 10:59:54 fusss: no. you don't. it is a transaction logging system. 11:00:18 so it keeps diffs? 11:00:20 fusss: it does keep all data in memory and logs changes to disk. 11:00:32 -!- binarin` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 11:00:48 riiight, i wanted to use it as a drop-in replacement for elephant and the two are nothing alike 11:00:52 sykopomp: that sound nice, tweaking elves on the fly 11:00:54 fusss: it also has a snapshot facility which is used by its object store to provide faster snapshots. 11:01:03 sbcl hackers, do you think it's good style to indent nested, C preprocessor directives like this: "# ifdef"? 11:01:07 binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 11:01:15 lispm [n=joswig@g224121012.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 11:01:28 (faster restores, but anyway) 11:01:43 tomsw: it's meant to be really easy to modify on the fly. messages, buzzwords, properties, parent-lists, etc can all be modified on the fly with relatively little cost. 11:05:19 it's bedtime, though. Good night, @lisp. 11:05:21 #* 11:06:00 hkBst [n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:06:57 -!- Jabberwockey [n=Tumnus_@dslb-082-083-072-254.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Verlassend"] 11:08:39 matley [n=matley@matley.imati.cnr.it] has joined #lisp 11:09:00 ramkrsna [n=ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 11:09:35 -!- binarin`` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 11:12:09 -!- Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 11:12:38 Yuuhi [i=benni@p5483C5FE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:17:09 -!- lyte [n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 11:18:19 ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-151-233.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 11:19:03 attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-132-189-132.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 11:20:25 -!- plage [n=user@serveur5.labri.fr] has left #lisp 11:23:59 -!- kpreid [n=kpreid@216-171-188-181.northland.net] has quit [] 11:25:23 kpreid [n=kpreid@216-171-188-181.northland.net] has joined #lisp 11:28:12 -!- ignas [i=Ignas@88.119.114.93] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 11:30:56 jgracin [n=jgracin@93-138-237-148.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 11:36:22 yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 11:37:38 aundro_ [n=aundro@90.98-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 11:39:59 mega1: I'm not an sbcl hacker, but I consider such indentation to be in good style. :) 11:42:06 I'm undecided really, because on one hand it makes reading stuff easier, but on the other it creates long range indentation dependencies: add #ifdef MYHEADER_H around the whole file and you have to reindent every cpp directive. 11:42:33 oved me to Austin and they re-nigged on an offer to move me 11:42:33 into the Travel Vertical role for which I was promised before the 11:42:33 move. Its a real bummer because I loved my co-workers and there are 11:42:33 a ton of great people at Google. But the management has no power to 11:42:37 influence change because they are micromanaged by theoved me to Austin and they re-nigged on an offer to move me 11:42:40 into the Travel Vertical role for which I was promised before the 11:42:42 move. Its a real bummer because I loved my co-workers and there are 11:42:45 a ton of great people at Google. But the management has no power to 11:42:45 mega1: you can introduce some exceptions... :) 11:44:03 adityo: careful with the middle button 11:44:37 attila_lendvai: yup, I hate exceptions when it comes to indentation. 11:45:43 yep, that's what the smily was for... 11:46:00 -!- jgracin [n=jgracin@93-138-237-148.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit ["Leaving"] 11:46:09 mega1: I make an exception for the header safety-wrapping ifdefs 11:46:16 sorry..oops 11:46:19 silenius [n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net] has joined #lisp 11:46:43 really sorry 11:47:01 and the #ifndef LISP_FEATURE_WIN32 that spans half the file 11:47:03 I dunno 11:47:30 those might indicate a need to split the file in question 11:48:59 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 11:49:36 -!- jdz [n=jdz@85.254.211.133] has quit [] 11:51:46 -!- aundro__ [n=aundro@220.104-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:00:35 -!- ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-151-233.adsl.highway.telekom.at] 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#lisp 14:46:59 yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:47:14 you know how lisp code rebinds special variables to customize the behaviour of a subsystem? javascript's is ass backward; the subsystem will reach into your code, touch your private variables and customize you! 14:48:07 accidently giving a DIV a certain ID will result in unexpected features! 14:48:07 -!- workthrick [n=mathrick@0x55529153.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit ["CHECKING IF XCHAT SUCKS AS MUCH AS I SUSPECT IT TO"] 14:48:31 fusss: you cannot blame javascript for the dom 14:48:59 workthrick [n=mathrick@0x55529153.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #lisp 14:49:10 -!- adityo [n=adityo@202.87.51.241] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 14:49:12 Jarvellis [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #lisp 14:50:23 that's like saying you can not blame Larry and Curly for Moe's behaviour. as far as i know they came together :-P 14:53:42 aha 14:54:26 -!- antoni [n=antoni@219.pool85-53-26.dynamic.orange.es] has quit [] 14:56:09 madnificent [n=user@83.101.31.184] has joined #lisp 14:57:46 fusss: Actually, that's IE-specific behaviour. 14:57:52 i have nothing but good things to say about jquery though. 14:58:02 IE is bloody b0rked. 14:58:51 Aankhen``: was that crab-shoot comment? clever! it really IS a problem with IE that i was having. 14:59:03 I haven't read the argument, but jquery seems to be the most balanced :) 14:59:09 auclairb [n=auclairb@laborius1.gel.usherb.ca] has joined #lisp 14:59:55 has anyone used css-lite here? I can't find documentation/examples about it 15:00:27 I get this long stream of "mmap: Cannot allocate memory" in SBCL 1.0.22, will updating probably fix it or is it a problem with my code ? 15:00:42 madnificent: that good thing about it is that it's not a "framework"; just a clean skeleton with piles and piles of helpers and add-ons. ui.jquery is the closest thing to organized packages for it, and that too is done to perfection. 15:02:50 fusss: documentation and speed are good too (as far as I could discover) 15:02:59 -!- ia [n=ia@89.169.165.188] has quit ["...may the Source be with you..."] 15:03:20 -!- l4ndfo [n=l4ndfo@catv-89-132-93-183.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:03:28 -!- bill[af] [n=bill@208.86.227.157] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:03:31 l4ndfo [n=l4ndfo@catv-89-132-93-183.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 15:03:39 bill[af] [n=bill@208.86.227.157] has joined #lisp 15:03:41 so easy it obviates parenscript (blasphemy! :-) 15:04:16 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 15:04:30 josemanuel [n=josemanu@34.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 15:04:38 -!- elurin [n=user@193.140.230.89] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:05:21 fusss: parenscript is still handy to connect the bits and pieces together, no? 15:05:30 keeping everything in a single syntax 15:05:35 yes! 15:05:42 -!- DeusExPikachu [n=DeusExPi@pool-71-165-20-85.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 15:06:09 you still can't do multi-language stuff in emacs; if you want to edit css, javascript and html in one buffer, you will get RSI switching modes. 15:06:47 + the backend language of your choice. CL is the only language I know with uniform "web" syntax :-) 15:07:15 fusss: if only I could grasp the syntax css-lite uses ^_^ 15:07:41 fusss: "was that crab-shoot comment" # sorry, I don't quite follow you. 15:08:12 ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-145-204.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 15:08:13 madnificent: css can't be simplified further. no way. 15:08:23 Aankhen``: meant to say your guess was good 15:08:28 Ah, heh. 15:08:51 it's "crapshoot" 15:09:00 Now that one I know. 15:09:43 how good are the (free) xml libraries for cl? easy to do e.g. schema validation or transform a document using xslt? 15:10:34 -!- yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:10:38 eevar2: cxml is good. there is a relaxng schema validator for it, and a xslt library which is in the early testing stage 15:10:53 fusss: it could be done in a lispy syntax. Even though the advantages could be hard to find at first sight, having the power of lisp at hand whilst generating could proove useful. 15:11:08 eevar2: so, to sum up: no, there is no readily available open source xml library that can validate against xml schema and do xslt 15:11:14 okies. in other words, i should go for Java if i want something mature? 15:11:55 eevar2: either that, or write yourself some libxml2/libxslt ffi bindings. that is rather easy and works very well (we do it in a big project, successfully) 15:11:55 davazp [n=user@121.Red-79-152-91.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:12:05 idk 15:12:51 madnificent: I'm a little confused. What do you mean by "it" in "it could be done […]"? 15:13:25 i know the ruby libxml/xslt bindings have a few issues, so could be easy to mess that one up 15:13:42 ia [n=ia@89.169.165.188] has joined #lisp 15:13:43 Aankhen``: defining css styles 15:13:45 eevar2: there is always room for messing things up, sure. 15:13:47 madnificent: you would be right, if javascript didn't allow you to create css classes at run time. you wont get the textual representation though. 15:13:53 jgracin_ [n=jgracin@93-138-63-9.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 15:14:13 Aankhen``: be it creating a CSS file, or inline properties 15:14:38 madnificent: Yeah, that's definitely not too difficult. 15:14:55 fusss: it should be easy to nest css-lite things in parenscript... but again, I couldn't find any info about the syntax 15:14:58 -!- sledge [n=chris@pdpc/supporter/student/sledge] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:14:58 fusss: Using JS to create them is orthogonal to using sexprs for syntax. 15:15:08 -!- rpg [n=rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [] 15:15:19 eevar2: you could also use clojure, which interefaces with java xml stuff easily and has nice native facilities, too 15:15:39 Aankhen``: have you prehaps ever checked the css-lite syntax? 15:16:13 No, not specifically. Do you have a link? 15:16:32 I meant using sexprs for CSS syntax in general. 15:16:41 Aankhen``: no, I'm looking for information about it myself (which was my initial question) 15:16:58 been meaning to have a look at clojure, yes. maybe I will 15:16:58 -!- for [n=Administ@114.241.175.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:16:59 madnificent: urls please. is this a Lisp project? 15:17:02 Sorry, missed that. 15:18:31 Aankhen``: http://vsedach.googlepages.com/css-lite-0.1.tgz 15:18:34 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has quit [Success] 15:18:43 Yeah, I downloaded it, trying to figure it out. 15:18:44 fusss: I was entering the common-lisp page :) 15:20:13 sohail [n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 15:20:49 rindolf [n=shlomi@bzq-219-139-216.static.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:20 Not sure I like the syntax all that much. 15:21:23 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has joined #lisp 15:21:40 Aankhen``: what would you propose? 15:21:50 EXetoC [i=EXetoC@c-f090e155.1422-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 15:21:57 Something similar, but with better structure. Let me try pastebinning something. 15:22:24 Aankhen``: if possible, put both syntaxes in, it could proove your point better :) 15:22:25 Actually, hold on, I misread. 15:22:45 What it has currently: (p font-family "foo" font-size "bar") 15:23:04 I'd probably group the properties like so: (p (font-family "foo") (font-size "bar")) 15:23:04 -!- jgracin [n=jgracin@93-138-237-148.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:23:14 -!- workthrick [n=mathrick@0x55529153.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:23:44 Tordek_ [n=tordek@host68.190-226-117.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 15:23:48 And it special-cases :hover and :id for some reason. 15:23:56 madnificent: i'm looking at it now, seems very straightforward 15:23:59 ((p :hover) (color "red")) 15:24:16 the author chose to test for #+parenscript instead of making it a module dependency 15:24:36 fusss: it is optional 15:24:59 malumalu [n=malu@hnvr-4dbb3cab.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #lisp 15:25:18 tmh [n=thomas@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/tmh] has joined #lisp 15:25:31 Greetings Lispers! 15:26:03 athos [n=philipp@p54B8701F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:26:26 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:27:00 sledge [n=chris@pdpc/supporter/student/sledge] has joined #lisp 15:27:17 hey tmh 15:27:48 -!- dwave [n=ask@213.236.208.247] has quit ["Be back later"] 15:28:16 -!- willb [n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:28:23 Aankhen``: have you tried generating CSS from your example of css-lite? It seems to render errors here 15:28:39 Nope, just read the source and worked accordingly. 15:28:51 trumae [n=vmaciel@200.251.4.238] has joined #lisp 15:28:52 willb [n=wibenton@nat/redhat/x-e65f87e8bebd7801] has joined #lisp 15:29:55 madnificent: My bad, I missed out on what I had meant to point out: :hover comes before p there. 15:30:10 madnificent: Try this: (css (((:hover p) foo "bar")) 15:30:12 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 15:30:20 Tordek__ [n=tordek@host95.190-138-156.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 15:30:22 Plus another closing parenthesis. 15:30:38 -!- sledge [n=chris@pdpc/supporter/student/sledge] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:31:08 |jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:31:08 nyef [n=nyef@pool-70-20-58-237.man.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #lisp 15:31:18 Aankhen``: yes, thanks! 15:31:21 Hello all. 15:31:26 madnificent: NP. 15:32:09 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:33:44 -!- JuanDaugherty [n=juan@cpe-72-228-150-44.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 15:33:48 selector-to-string has the goodies 15:33:51 Aankhen``: with your syntax, you could allow for a more liberal definition. In that definition, you could say that a line holds rules (a b+) in which a is the identifier and b are the options. When the identifier is a list, it could match for multiple items (say (p h1)). b would always be a list containing a key/value(s) pair, which again would make definitions easier 15:33:55 hello nyef 15:34:41 madnificent: Pretty much. I didn't think about it in detail, though. 15:35:12 Aankhen`` is the man of the lucky guesses today ^_^ 15:35:21 Tordek___ [n=tordek@host176.190-137-197.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 15:35:22 So, this is kindof random, but... Does anyone have a lisp toolkit for manipulation of javascript code in an editing scenario where the javascript source is the source-of-record, as opposed to the parenscriptish form where the sexpr-form is the source-of-record? 15:36:00 nyef: converting from JS to parenscript is too hard? (this is literally a question) 15:36:10 trebor_home [n=user@dslb-084-058-246-235.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 15:36:12 (((p :hover) (h1 :target)) (font-family "Times New Roman" "Helvetica" "Arial" :sans-serif) (font-size (:px 10))) ; I have no idea if it makes sense to do so much magic with generic font families and length units, just throwing it out there 15:36:22 madnificent: I can't afford to lose the comments from the javascript code, for starters. 15:36:31 s/do so much magic with/use keywords to name/ 15:36:35 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host110.190-137-199.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:36:38 nyef: isn't there this continuation passing framework for js that is written in cl? 15:36:43 Aankhen``: I really like that syntax 15:36:58 nyef: jwacs 15:37:16 madnificent: Maybe someday I'll implement it. ;-) 15:37:40 madnificent: Now I'm wondering whether it's really any better to say (:em 2) rather than just "2em". 15:37:53 Aankhen``: would you help me, if I'd take make an effort towards getting the basics of it running :) ? 15:37:55 -!- willb [n=wibenton@nat/redhat/x-e65f87e8bebd7801] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:37:56 Aankhen``: (em 2) 15:37:57 The situation is this: I'm about to enter an environment which is largely scripted in server-side javascript. I want a minimal-interference layer for working with the code (which tends to be rather stylized) without disrupting any other programmers. 15:38:15 Aankhen``: let those %, em, px be functions 15:38:28 nyef: learn javascript. it is fun :) 15:38:32 server-side javascript?! 15:38:42 rsynnott: Server-side CL? :-o 15:38:44 *Aankhen``* ducks. 15:39:00 madnificent: Yea, that might make sense. 15:39:04 client-side would be rather worse in that case ;) 15:39:19 rsynnott: It'd be better than JS at least, IMO. 15:39:21 -!- Tordek__ [n=tordek@host95.190-138-156.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:39:22 H4ns: I don't dispute that. I ended up picking up javascript in just this environment a few years ago when they started using server-side javascript instead of their funky VB setup. 15:39:41 (css-lite::process-css-rule '((h1 :and h2 :font-family "Helvetica"))) 15:39:51 nyef: jwacs has a full javascript parser, so if you need that, there you are. 15:39:53 this thing looks kludgy, imo 15:40:10 madnificent: One small convenience: (when (= px 0) (return-from px "0")) 15:40:17 (No need to give a length then.) 15:40:18 fusss: Aankhen`` 's proposition is much better 15:40:19 H4ns: Do you know if it preserves comments? 15:40:27 s/length/unit/ 15:40:50 Aankhen``: these minor things can be sorted out later, but yes it would be nice 15:40:51 nyef: i'm not sure, but it is not unlikely. give it a shot. 15:40:54 gotta run 15:40:59 -!- H4ns [n=Hans@p57BBA651.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit ["Leaving."] 15:41:02 dwave [n=ask@062249177068.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #lisp 15:41:02 madnificent: Yup. 15:41:36 *madnificent* heads off for a while, thinking wether or not it would be a good thing :) 15:41:37 (css ((h1 :and h2) (:font-family "Helvetica"))) 15:41:42 \o/ 15:42:17 Heh. 15:42:21 fusss: (css ((h1 h2) (font-family "Helvetica"))) 15:42:34 -!- Tordek_ [n=tordek@host68.190-226-117.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:42:49 fusss: but allso (css (h1 (font-family "Helvetica"))) 15:43:02 (css ((h1)(:font-family "Helvetica")) 15:43:02 (((p :first-child) (+ h1 p)) (color "red")) 15:43:04 ((h2)(:font-family "Time New Roman"))) 15:43:14 (((p :first-child) (+ h1 p)) (color "red")) => p:first-child, h1 + p { color: red; } 15:43:39 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:43:46 bored bastard pasted "anotate this" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74921 15:44:52 Of course, the simple selectors would just be: (p (font-family "Times New Roman")) ; no need to put them in parentheses if there's just one 15:45:04 And yeah, using keywords for the property names might be better. 15:45:19 how do I do #foo a:hover { font-color: #1818181 } ? 15:45:52 -!- jgracin_ [n=jgracin@93-138-63-9.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:45:57 Lots of parentheses. 15:46:31 ((((# foo) (a :hover))) (:color "#181818")) 15:46:40 [10:08] madnificent: css can't be simplified further. no way. 15:47:09 ("#foo" = (# foo), "a b" = (a b), so put a = (# foo) in there.) 15:48:28 That works because you only worry about multiple independent selectors at the very top level of the selector. Once you start parsing the comma-seperated parts, you can assume that lists are used to drill down. 15:49:08 One possible annoyance: if you want to say "a > b c", you need to say: (> a (b c)) 15:49:27 -!- chaitanya [n=chaitany@118.94.92.160] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:49:29 And that generalizes to other similar cases where you use anything other a simple child selector. 15:49:40 -!- eno__ [n=eno@adsl-70-137-129-148.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net] has quit ["leaving"] 15:49:45 tsuru [n=user@66.199.17.194] has joined #lisp 15:50:12 shmho [n=user@58.142.15.103] has joined #lisp 15:51:24 avdi [n=avdi@c-71-58-195-219.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:51:27 ... So much for jwacs. It's the typical case of a parser built for an interpreter-or-compiler, not for an editing scenario, so the comments are stripped during lexing. :-/ 15:51:27 antgreen [n=green@CPE0013f7bcd3c0-CM0013f7bcd3bc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 15:51:36 ljosa [n=ljosa@gm3b6-dd5.broad.mit.edu] has joined #lisp 15:52:04 H4ns [n=hans@p57A0CD46.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:52:21 whoever wants to mess css-lite would have to be _very_ careful. css fonts names are hyphenated. caveat emptor. 15:52:42 mogunus [n=marco@173.9.7.10] has joined #lisp 15:52:49 -!- mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-98-133-128.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [] 15:53:31 Hello all. A while ago, maybe on planet lisp, I saw a tcl/tk thing similar to drScheme for common lisp. 15:53:40 Didn't use emacs for the editor, had some kind of custom coded thing. 15:53:47 Does anyone remember what that was called? 15:53:47 willb [n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net] has joined #lisp 15:53:48 mogunus: ABLE 15:53:48 -!- homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-703ab41171440662] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 15:54:21 the only tool most recommended by people who never used it 15:54:27 homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-c08fd445bbaefcdc] has joined #lisp 15:54:49 fusss: Ahh, praising with faint damnation? 15:55:11 I can't find a link to it with the google... 15:55:24 minion: ABLE? 15:55:25 Sorry, I couldn't find anything in the database for ``ABLE''. 15:55:26 (I'm trying to get one of my friends to learn CL) 15:55:27 i used it once... after i recommended it 15:56:24 mogunus: downed and renamed; http://phil.nullable.eu/ 15:56:44 ABLE is now cl-editor (shouldn't that be trivial-editor?) 15:57:09 chaitanya [n=chaitany@122.163.173.2] has joined #lisp 15:57:10 fusss, fantastic, thanks. 15:57:19 Ugh. I wonder if I can cross-compile for windows using SBCL. 15:57:21 _downed_ 15:57:38 ikki [n=ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 15:58:21 -!- eevar2 [n=jalla@56.80-203-45.nextgentel.com] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 15:58:22 -!- Modius [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-222-97.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit ["I'm big in Japan"] 15:58:41 the zip file is corrupted, mogunus 15:58:53 Cheshire [n=e@amcant.demon.co.uk] has joined #lisp 15:59:02 ejs [n=eugen@94-248-17-5.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has joined #lisp 15:59:27 That's really unfortunate. 15:59:30 danlei` [n=user@pD9E2D07F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:59:34 Oh, well, I suppose he'll fix it later? 15:59:59 there are at least two other non-emacs gui that i remember 16:00:13 the one abcl was created for, is it still around? 16:00:14 cusp? 16:00:28 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:00:37 mogunus: there is e-mail on that page 16:00:39 duh, http://www.cliki.net/IDE 16:01:01 -!- danlei [n=user@pD9E2FE24.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 16:01:05 -!- danlei` is now known as danlei 16:01:15 -!- antgreen [n=green@CPE0013f7bcd3c0-CM0013f7bcd3bc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has left #lisp 16:01:18 sledge [n=chris@pdpc/supporter/student/sledge] has joined #lisp 16:01:20 is there a reason you aren't recommending Lisp Works? i'm teaching my nephew CAPI after i got bit with PLT weirdness 16:01:26 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:01:57 nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 16:02:16 I've never used LispWorks. 16:02:23 Then, I've never used cl-editor either. 16:02:33 Isn't it disabled? The free version? 16:02:59 Tordek [n=tordek@host229.190-138-152.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 16:03:04 -!- Tordek___ [n=tordek@host176.190-137-197.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 16:03:09 While we're recommended Lisp IDE's that no one has used, how about http://www.ufasoft.com/lisp/ and http://www.daansystems.com/lispide/ ? 16:03:16 LispWorks' editor is an emacs. 16:03:20 s/ended/ending/ 16:03:38 mogunus: nah, the free version has the IDE 16:03:39 -!- dlowe [n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["*poof*"] 16:03:51 dlowe [n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 16:03:55 so if you can convince someone to use it, they're probably better served with GNU emacs and slime. 16:04:10 @Principal difference is that CLISP core implemented on C language. Ufasoft Common Lisp keeps most of CLISP's .lisp files unmodified, but reimplements the core on C++.@ - that's just weird 16:04:22 tmh: +1 LispIDE, stay away from UFASOFT! 16:04:48 ljosa: not true. you can change to Windows compatible mode 16:04:55 Liempt [n=Bevinvan@XPLR-TS-10-VAN-67-201-133-74.barrettxplore.com] has joined #lisp 16:04:59 rsynnott: No, it's awesome! C++ is double-plus better than C. 16:05:36 riiiigh, the gui features of a package-sniffer developing company that just so happens to be a GPL violator. no thanks. 16:05:41 *tmh* fires up his windows domU to check out LispIDE. 16:05:50 -!- dwave [n=ask@062249177068.customer.alfanett.no] has quit ["Be back later"] 16:07:21 -!- athos [n=philipp@p54B8701F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["leaving"] 16:07:42 fusss: Look, changing the program from compiling with a C compiler to compiling with a C++ compiler required double-plus work and entitles you to changing the copyright. 16:09:15 yeah. my company, GCC -S Inc, routinely ports hard C software to tabular assembly language format. 16:09:58 -!- H4ns2 [n=hans@p57A0E0C4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:10:21 bloody hell, LispIDE is GOOD 16:11:37 It's going to take my a while to get to it. The problem with running windows in Xen is that I often don't use it for a week at a time. Then, when I open it, my virus scanner complains and I have a crap-load of updates. 16:12:02 -!- Liempt [n=Bevinvan@unaffiliated/liempt] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:12:15 -!- matley [n=matley@matley.imati.cnr.it] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:12:37 fusss: in what ways? (can't try it myself since I don't have Windowsjust curious.) 16:12:52 wow, friken gorgeous. and it works. 16:13:15 -!- ramkrsna [n=ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:13:16 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:13:42 -!- ejs [n=eugen@94-248-17-5.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 16:13:43 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:13:44 -!- ace4016 [i=ace4016@cpe-76-168-248-118.socal.res.rr.com] has quit ["When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set yourself on fire."] 16:16:02 gonzojive [n=red@fun.Stanford.EDU] has joined #lisp 16:17:15 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:17:48 Krystof [i=csr21@158.223.51.76] has joined #lisp 16:18:10 -!- chaitanya [n=chaitany@122.163.173.2] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 16:20:27 -!- gonzojive [n=red@fun.Stanford.EDU] has quit [Client Quit] 16:20:34 Which CL implementation for Windows do you recommend? I'm using CLISP at the moment 16:21:15 EXetoC: If CLISP works for you, just use that. I wouldn't worry about changing until you have a compelling reason. 16:21:39 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 16:21:42 (fusss) whoever wants to mess css-lite would have to be _very_ careful. css fonts names are hyphenated. caveat emptor. # what are you referring to? 16:21:46 dfox [n=dfox@r5cv134.net.upc.cz] has joined #lisp 16:21:49 right. thanks 16:21:55 -!- Draggor2 is now known as Draggor 16:22:20 nyef: I could hand you my JS tokenizer if you want to build a parser on top of it. :-) I'm working on a parser but it'll take a while yet. 16:22:40 (The tokenizer keeps the comments and lets the parser deal with them.) 16:23:16 tmh, ljosa: LispIDE screenshot http://i39.tinypic.com/vxitev.jpg 16:23:22 -!- VityokOrgUa [n=user@193.109.118.130] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 16:24:45 Aankhen``: At this point, I'm thinking of doing my own if I proceed with this project, but thanks. 16:24:55 fusss: Almost neat. How well does it deal with debugging and restarts? 16:25:01 nyef: Okey. 16:25:06 Aankhen``: forget what i was saying. 16:25:14 fusss: Aye aye Cap'n. 16:25:20 fusss: what do you mean by "typing space between long symbol names WILL insert a white space"? 16:25:32 *tmh* is stilling waiting on the virus scanner to "Fix All Issues". 16:25:43 tmh: LoL 16:25:57 -!- lispm [n=joswig@g224121012.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:26:00 -!- pstickne [n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Success] 16:26:11 what an awful taskbar 16:26:27 hefner: Bah, to each his own. 16:26:32 nyef: gives you the familiar prompt and it isn't confused by nested errors (why should it?) 0 still gets you out. no #\q or #\v or slimey stuff. 16:26:47 the repl buffer has history too :-) 16:27:06 the slime repl has history as well 16:27:37 ljosa: slime repl has achieved consciousness 16:27:44 (M-p runs the command comint-previous-input) 16:28:25 -!- avdi [n=avdi@c-71-58-195-219.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:28:57 ljosa: by the above i meant if you accidently have the cursor inside a string, hitting tab will not indent it, as in emacs. it will insert a tab. 16:29:12 fusss: sorry, through you meant that LispIDE's repl history was an improvement over Slime. (perhaps you had not discovered M-p, but expected the up arrow to work.) 16:29:41 fusss: I see. what do windows users expect (e.g., from Microsoft's IDE)? 16:29:52 C-up works in slime repl 16:30:22 this is pretty much it for me. this is all the Python IDLE has, except the repl :-) 16:30:47 it looks pretty crude 16:30:47 -!- vy [n=user@213.139.194.186] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:31:02 I'll second that. But I think I've been drinking too much Emacs Kool-Aid. 16:31:04 what happens in IDLE if you press tab while the point is in the middle of the line? 16:31:06 gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-76-254-21-27.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:08 reminds me of Hutch's Masm32 :-) 16:31:22 dysinger [n=tim@cpe-75-80-200-182.hawaii.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:31:24 Bah, what's the name of the tech coop channel 16:31:33 #tech.coop :-P 16:31:40 Heh. 16:31:51 Subtly hard to remember, isn't it? 16:31:54 *gigamonkey* tried techcoop, tech-coop 16:32:03 mrsolo_ [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-223-135.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 16:32:04 postamar [n=postamar@x-132-204-240-14.xtpr.umontreal.ca] has joined #lisp 16:32:11 -!- rotty_ [n=rotty@83-215-154-5.hage.dyn.salzburg-online.at] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:32:13 -!- reaver__ [n=reaver@h15a2.n2.ips.mtn.co.ug] has quit [Connection timed out] 16:32:27 -!- trumae [n=vmaciel@200.251.4.238] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 16:32:33 one of my clients has an account there and it's always amusing to tell them the URL over the phone :-) 16:33:12 an IDE doesn't have to be very sophisticated. the bare minimum is a paren matching editor, some knowledge of packages, and a couple commands for compiling definitions and buffers 16:34:03 ljosa: pressing \#Tab randomly in a python IDE will create semantic errors :-P 16:34:03 LiamH [n=none@common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 16:34:03 hefner: as well as incremental search, symbol completion, and perhaps find-function. 16:34:49 you could live without the last three. 16:34:50 are these equivalent under the hood as well "(reduce '+ '(1 2 3))" and "(reduce #'+ '(1 2 3))"? 16:34:57 two, rather 16:35:35 EXetoC: they'll give you the same answer 16:36:26 i noticed that. should i prefer one over the other in this case? 16:36:34 EXetoC: there are circumstances (most likely with a function other than +) where they will not be equivalent. 16:36:35 EXetoC: but you should not expect that everywhere (one is a symbol the other is a function object) 16:36:45 EXetoC: the first will get the function value at run time, so if + has been redefined in the mean time, it will run the new version. 16:36:55 -!- wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has quit [] 16:37:18 ljosa: Umm... Not necessarily. 16:37:30 FZ [n=user@unaffiliated/fz] has joined #lisp 16:37:53 ljosa: Depending on the implementation, the second might also pick up a redefined function. 16:37:59 EXetoC: let's say you want to write calbacks for a GUI: passing 'foo will allow you to redefine the function foo and have the changes propagate without further update. Passing #'foo will have you to reassign them anew. 16:38:17 nyef: That's really allowed? 16:38:27 No, no... Involve local functions in the explanation! 16:38:30 nyef: you're probably right (I would need to look it up). in practice, what I wrote seem to often be the case. 16:38:41 gigamonkey: I think so? 16:38:41 Ah, if the whole thing is interpreted, or some such, I guess. 16:39:09 gigamonkey: FUNCTION special forms aren't required to evaluate at compile-time, if memory serves. 16:39:15 wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has joined #lisp 16:39:32 I know that SBCL ends up checking the fdefn every time, even in compiled code. 16:39:42 There's also the issue of dynamic vs. lexical scope. 16:40:09 ok 16:41:38 #'x will get you the same thing as (x ...) would use, so it's generally the less surprising option. 16:41:51 But if I do (defparameter *fn* #'foo) and later redefine FOO, FUNCAL'ing *fn* should always call the original function, right? 16:42:01 csmerlin [n=cameron@c-98-234-184-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:42:04 -!- wedgeV [n=wedgeV@85.31.0.85] has quit [Client Quit] 16:42:21 gigamonkey: If you don't reload the file after that point, sure. 16:42:23 gigamonkey: Right. Because the FUNCTION form is evaluated at that time. 16:42:40 -!- homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-c08fd445bbaefcdc] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:43:16 athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has joined #lisp 16:43:23 homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-ad723c8d3e1ce0b6] has joined #lisp 16:43:39 i guess i understood some of that. thanks 16:44:31 LispIDE, a 3 word review : Basic, Functional, Inferior 16:46:15 holycow [n=new@mail.wjsgroup.com] has joined #lisp 16:46:36 antgreen [n=green@CPE0013f7bcd3c0-CM0013f7bcd3bc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 16:46:36 There is zero configuration, it doesn't hint the argument list, it doesn't auto-indent, the REPL is not modified to indicate the current package. That said, it is a windows IDE that works with just about any lisp implementation. Highlights S-EXPRs. It's actually not bad. Looks like a nice base. 16:46:52 does anyone know where * is defined for CLISP? 16:47:12 EXetoC: What does DESCRIBE tell you? 16:47:15 variable or function? 16:47:38 and why do you wan't to know? 16:48:53 Nice, I just set the lisp path in LispIDE to CLISP, restarted the lisp and now I can help EXetoC. 16:49:08 Tordek_ [n=tordek@host228.190-137-196.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 16:49:09 tmh: wait, it doesn't auto-indent? do you mean that you have to use tabs or spaces to indent the code manually? doesn't that make it mostly unusable? 16:49:22 nyef: actually, now that I think about it, I'm wondering if, given (x #'foo) where X is a function and FOO is not lexically bound, if Lisp *must* get the current global definition of FOO each time this form is evaluated, even in compiled code. 16:49:58 gigamonkey: It wouldn't surprise me, however, there would be a few obvious exceptions. 16:50:02 Depends on which file it is in. 16:50:08 tmh: that's a real achievement 16:50:35 Zhivago: right, within the same file it could be inlined just the way a call to (foo) could be. 16:50:37 (Hint: Exceptions reside mainly in the COMMON-LISP package.) 16:51:02 Jarv2 [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:51:07 ljosa: Having only played with it for a couple minutes, I can't comprehensively describe the indentation behavior. But, when I hit enter, I then have to hit tab repeatedly to get to the right indentation level. I'm not sure if it is a constant tab length or if it matches the previous line. 16:51:36 Well, compilation adds an invariant that you won't redefine a function that you're calling from that file, iirc. 16:51:57 Which allows it to hard-code the call, even in the absense of inlining 16:51:58 tmh: i can't remember how to refer to the function 16:52:06 stassats: no reason. i'm just curious 16:52:07 _Pb [n=Pb@75.139.140.101] has joined #lisp 16:52:48 EXetoC: (describe #'*), but in CLISP that didn't tell me much. 16:54:30 EXetoC: So, I'm not sure in which CLISP file #'* is defined. 16:55:15 avdi [n=avdi@c-71-58-195-219.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:56:25 I'm trying to inherit from list and sbcl tells me i have to implement sb-mop:validate-superclass. What is this about ? 16:56:36 you can't inherit from list 16:56:38 cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 16:56:44 list is a built-in class and you can't subclass it 16:56:51 auclair: (class-of (class-of 'list)) might be informative 16:57:05 what do you actually want to do? 16:57:12 Xof: what are my options if I want to specialize on various kinds of lists ? 16:57:18 oops 16:57:40 you do not have any kind of options; you simply can't 16:57:55 so, what do you actually want to do? What problem is specializing on "various kinds of list" intended to solve? 16:58:21 Zhivago: yeah, that's what I meant. (I knew "inlining" wasn't quite right when I typed it. I'm slow this morning.) 16:58:37 I need to reprensent coordinates in various systems, I want thinking of using list to hold the coords 16:59:08 auclairb: just define a coordinate class. Forget about lists. 16:59:55 gigamonkey: that's what i did but accessing the coord with accessors is much slower than elt 17:00:04 so im looking for a way to speed it up 17:00:13 structures? 17:00:24 Yeah, structures come to mind. 17:00:30 Inlined accessors and all. 17:00:49 Or, depending on what the valid types for the coords are, perhaps just using complexes? 17:01:17 DeusExPikachu [n=DeusExPi@wireless-169-235-40-90.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 17:01:28 nyef: yes i'll look at complexes (dont know what they are yet) because coords are always integers 17:01:55 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host229.190-138-152.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:02:02 auclairb, it'd more be a matter if the the coords are just 2d 17:02:03 However that doesn't help with your problem of wanting to represent coordinates in different systems. 17:03:35 dcrawford, oh, nah the coords are 3d and over 17:03:45 Tordek [n=tordek@host76.190-138-152.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 17:03:47 so i guess ill look at structs 17:04:07 gigamonkeys, why doesn't it ? 17:04:07 auclairb: can't you just use classes and be done with it? 17:04:18 ljosa: too slow 17:04:23 -!- Jarvellis [n=jarv@dsl-217-155-101-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:04:47 i'll go grab a snack and get back to this 17:04:51 thanks for the help 17:04:52 auclairb: because you'll have the same problem as using lists. 17:05:05 are any of the cl.net administrators around? 17:05:05 A complex is just a complex number, i.e. made up of two numbers. 17:05:26 Good for representing a 2d coordinate but has no way of telling you how to interpret those two numbers. 17:06:07 tmh: i guess there's no lisp source for system functions? 17:06:20 -!- csmerlin [n=cameron@c-98-234-184-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 17:06:36 EXetoC: I don't know, I'm not familiar with the internals of CLISP. 17:06:38 csmerlin [n=cameron@c-98-234-184-189.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:43 -!- Thumper_ [n=Thumper@about/essy/coffeeAddict/Thumper] has quit [K-lined] 17:07:05 -!- cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit ["The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity."] 17:09:56 bgupta [n=bgupta@dsl081-214-002.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 17:14:03 A complex number is a single number to me 17:14:08 -!- shmho [n=user@58.142.15.103] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:14:30 Some say it's a pair of c = (Real(c),Imag(c)) or (theta & r).. 17:14:55 but nobody says that 7 is (cons 'succ (cons 'succ (cons 'succ ... 17:16:50 blowery_ [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:18:29 -!- mogunus [n=marco@173.9.7.10] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:18:55 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:19:25 -!- kiuma [n=kiuma@83.103.127.195] has quit ["Bye bye ppl"] 17:20:20 does anyone know how sbcl stores a two-dimensional simple-array of type (unsigned-byte 8) in memory? I'm trying to understand why it's not a simple-unboxed-array, which prevents me from calling vector-sap on it. 17:20:21 I found it interesting that both the real and imaginary part of a complex had to be of the same float type. 17:20:33 amnesiac [n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac] has joined #lisp 17:20:49 i am looking for some material on generational copying collectors 17:20:56 know any good links? 17:21:04 ljosa: The array itself is basicaly a wrapper structure with some dimension information and a pointer to an underlying vector. 17:21:21 ljosa: Have a look for something that might be named sb-kernel:%array-data-vector or similar. 17:21:33 nyef: and the underlying vector is just the bytes in row-major-order? 17:21:35 EvanR: a good starting point is Wilson's "Uniprocessor Garbage Collection Techniques". 17:21:41 Basically, yes. 17:21:42 -!- Tordek_ [n=tordek@host228.190-137-196.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:21:44 ok 17:21:44 ljosa: cffi has a portable with-vector-data or something like that 17:21:56 jfrancis [n=jfrancis@66.194.68.209] has joined #lisp 17:22:18 nyef: I think Nikodemus added an "official" interface for getting the simple-vector. 17:22:49 attila: yes, that's what I'm using, but it relies on vector-sap, which refuses to be applied to a 2-d array. 17:24:06 -!- aerique [i=euqirea@xs2.xs4all.nl] has quit ["..."] 17:24:27 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:24:47 -!- blowery_ [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:25:01 -!- envi^home [n=envi@220.121.234.156] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:25:05 nowl [n=nowl@c-66-30-79-27.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:25:15 Tordek_ [n=tordek@host89.201-253-13.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 17:25:18 nyef: sb-kernel:%array-data-vector works like a charm, thanks! 17:25:40 dwave [n=ask@212251217238.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 17:26:36 Nikodemus's array-storage-vector: http://paste.lisp.org/display/71573 17:27:14 kreuter: Maybe he did, but I started using this well before. 17:27:16 it's apparently in 1.0.24, which I haven't installed yet. 17:27:56 nyef: yeah, sure. I'm just sayin', we might as well encourage ostensibly official interfaces, right? :) 17:28:38 -!- nowl [n=nowl@c-66-30-79-27.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 17:28:46 malumalu_ [n=malu@hnvr-4dbbf38e.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #lisp 17:28:54 If we know about them, maybe. 17:29:34 -!- mrsolo_ [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-223-135.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:31:17 -!- ayrnieu [n=julianfo@c-76-30-82-6.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 17:33:44 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 17:34:15 ayrnieu [n=julianfo@c-76-30-82-6.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:34:33 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:34:37 alley_cat [i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat] has joined #lisp 17:35:46 arwed [i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat] has joined #lisp 17:36:37 arbscht [n=arbscht@unaffiliated/arbscht] has joined #lisp 17:37:21 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:37:43 -!- alley_cat [i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:38:51 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host76.190-138-152.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:38:57 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:41:50 -!- willb [n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 17:42:06 -!- Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:44:36 joshe [n=aurum@opal.elsasser.org] has joined #lisp 17:44:55 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 17:45:23 -!- athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:45:43 -!- malumalu [n=malu@hnvr-4dbb3cab.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:46:32 -!- arbscht [n=arbscht@unaffiliated/arbscht] has quit ["leaving"] 17:48:19 cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 17:49:18 rotty [n=rotty@83-215-154-5.hage.dyn.salzburg-online.at] has joined #lisp 17:50:00 -!- slyrus_ [n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 17:51:20 athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has joined #lisp 17:54:19 -!- _Pb [n=Pb@75.139.140.101] has quit ["Leaving"] 17:55:23 jsoft_ [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 18:05:45 dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:07:10 -!- silenius [n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net] has quit [] 18:11:16 Fulax [n=cyprien@pdpc/supporter/student/cnicolas] has joined #lisp 18:13:58 -!- jsoft [n=Administ@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:15:29 -!- bhz- [n=resm@c-98-198-231-207.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:16:32 -!- addled [n=addled@mail.andrewlawson.org] has left #lisp 18:18:10 -!- Cheshire [n=e@amcant.demon.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:18:40 Cheshire [n=e@amcant.demon.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:19:38 Thumper_ [n=Thumper@about/essy/coffeeAddict/Thumper] has joined #lisp 18:20:22 elurin [n=user@85.99.66.92] has joined #lisp 18:22:29 -!- Krystof [i=csr21@158.223.51.76] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 18:26:15 willb [n=wibenton@wireless93.cs.wisc.edu] has joined #lisp 18:28:07 Xach [n=xach@unnamed.xach.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:07 binarin` [n=user@62.105.145.214] has joined #lisp 18:28:35 -!- rindolf [n=shlomi@bzq-219-139-216.static.bezeqint.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 18:28:47 -!- ThomasI [n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi] has quit ["Bye Bye!"] 18:28:49 milanj [n=milan@77.46.249.251] has joined #lisp 18:31:04 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 18:31:12 dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:33:30 ehu [n=chatzill@80.120.89.230] has joined #lisp 18:33:35 evening 18:33:44 drewc, H4ns: herep? 18:33:59 Hello again friends. I'm still looking for a hotel roommate for ILC09. Anyone interested? 18:34:18 mulander [n=opera@nat-4.interq.pl] has joined #lisp 18:34:53 Xach, disclaimer: I haven't yet checked up the possibility of going at all, but what would the cost be for the room? 18:35:16 $135 total for a double-occupancy room 18:35:20 ILC09 page has more details 18:36:14 total as in for the entire stay or per night? (*no clue*) 18:36:50 *tic* makes an effort to check the page 18:37:14 Xach: You're a brave person. I applaud your faith in humanity. 18:38:19 -!- Fulax [n=cyprien@pdpc/supporter/student/cnicolas] has quit ["Leaving"] 18:38:54 ehu: ack 18:39:05 ah! great. 18:39:40 H4ns: since you set up spamassassin, could you make it catch all email claiming to be sourced from Laurence Auster? 18:39:54 Hm. Looks nice. Until tomorrow to see if I can go, though. 18:39:54 pstickne [n=pstickne@69.166.35.201] has joined #lisp 18:39:57 I keep having to moderate his mails into the bit bucket. 18:40:37 -!- attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-132-189-132.catv.broadband.hu] has quit ["..."] 18:40:41 ehu: i'm a little unwilling to act upon these kinds of requests, as handling spam on a case by case basis is a lot of work. 18:40:46 `m4dnificent [n=user@83.101.31.82] has joined #lisp 18:40:57 ehu: but it you would like to volunteer for the job, you can have it 18:41:37 I know :-) If it were possible to direct these mails to the site-wide spam-manager, it could learn to reject them. 18:42:10 I'll investigate what it takes to set up spamassassin to learn site-wide spam mails 18:42:31 would that help? 18:42:44 ehu: great, thanks. if you need access to any of the configuration files, just let me know and i'll set that up for you 18:42:53 ok. 18:43:12 I'm on holiday now, so it may take a while, but I'll get back through mail. 18:43:51 ok. 18:43:52 mrsolo_ [n=mrsolo@nat/yahoo/x-07d9b7ab0838c7b2] has joined #lisp 18:45:35 -!- binarin [n=user@62.105.145.214] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:46:09 ground7 [n=ground7@unaffiliated/ground7] has joined #lisp 18:46:38 dialtone [n=dialtone@adsl-99-136-101-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:47:08 _jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:47:19 -!- ground7 [n=ground7@unaffiliated/ground7] has quit [Client Quit] 18:47:55 -!- |jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [] 18:50:46 mrsolo__ [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-223-135.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 18:52:12 tmh: Well, there are some who would be unsuitable roommates 18:52:22 tmh: They would be eliminated by a series of increasingly difficult quiz questions 18:52:33 Xach: welcome back! 18:52:57 he's back! 18:54:43 Xach: i lived out of youth hostels while backpacking for2 years. i don't think i even look for hotels anymore. 18:55:20 fusss: will you find a hostel in cambridge for ILC09? 18:55:29 fusss: you just sleep on the streets? 18:55:30 you can get a cozy private room for $50 18:55:32 :-) 18:56:02 blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:56:46 the whole of MA is anti-fun. i crashed in NYC a few months ago for $30. 18:56:51 -!- madnificent [n=user@83.101.31.184] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:57:40 fusss: Oh, so that's the fine for indecent exposure? 8-P 18:57:45 Recently when I've discussed ILC, multiple people complained about how terrible the USA is and now you complain about how terrible Massachusetts is. 18:57:47 I wonder if it's worth it to just drive all the way over to the conference every day, or if I should just take a friend's offer to crash in her family's extra apartment thing. The site doesn't say what times of day the stuff starts. 18:57:56 I really only want to discuss it with people who want to go. 18:58:06 :) 18:58:10 (all the way from amherst) 18:58:13 Hey, what's wrong with MA? 18:58:18 sykopomp: that is quite a drive. 18:58:29 sykopomp: I live 90 miles away, but I am getting staying in the city. 18:58:31 if cheap is not a requirement, the Kendall Hotel is nice. 18:58:36 z0d: I have one thing: It's freakin' cold right now and it's keeping me holed up in my room :) 18:58:49 ljosa: i stayed there with nikodemus once, it is very nice, but the conference hotel deal is better 18:58:59 *tmh* has imposed the requirement on himself that he can't attend a Lisp conference unless he is presenting. 18:59:47 Xach: yes. It sounds like I may have to talk to my friend. I feel a bit odd imposing for 3 days, though (and I'm also driving at least two other people over) 19:00:00 tmh: I mean, it's the big 50th gathering thing in Lisp's hometown :) 19:00:54 Xach: I'm pretty excited about the conference, though. I thought I wouldn't be able to attend until they updated the pricing. I'll have to send Weinreb a thank you card or something :) 19:00:59 *ljosa* wonders if he can get his employer to pay for ILC 19:03:38 -!- athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has quit ["leaving"] 19:03:46 *Xach* is getting his wigflip.com company to pay for it 19:04:00 sykopomp: That's fine if you're the sentimental type. But, lisp is just the language I enjoy using and that works. I looked over the schedule and there are 2 presentations that are applicable to how I use lisp and a couple others that look interesting, none of which are related to the 50th anniversary. 19:04:08 -!- Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [] 19:04:10 Xach: is this close by? http://www.realadventures.com/listings/1033812_Hi-friendly-Crossways 19:04:17 athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has joined #lisp 19:04:18 -!- EXetoC [i=EXetoC@c-f090e155.1422-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [] 19:04:21 fusss: I don't know. 19:04:48 fusss: Harvard, MA is way west 19:04:49 -!- nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has left #lisp 19:04:55 tmh: it's hard to correctly value sharing a beer with some rare nerds 19:05:17 tmh: fair enough. Although you said it was a matter of principle and didn't comment at all about whether interest in the talks would influence it. 19:06:23 Xach: I had forgotten about that. It really is amazing the little nuggets you can pick up over beer. 19:07:20 you forgot about the only reason to go there? the part where you listen to some guy read his slides is going to be a waste of time 19:07:31 Xach: wigflip generating much, then? :) 19:07:44 fusss: that's still about 45 minutes away from MIT, by car. 19:08:06 -!- mrsolo__ [n=mrsolo@adsl-68-126-223-135.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 19:08:18 rsynnott: it's no findmeatune, but it does ok 19:10:06 Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has joined #lisp 19:10:07 Xach: have you thought of something that might be called "succintreply" or some such. basically a service that allows people to post a link to a blog entry and then stamp a funny photo or middle finger or some such. also, let them highlight passages to show logical inconsistencies and shit. 19:10:40 *tmh* copyrights fusss' idea. 19:10:44 fusss: stix.to does something like that 19:10:46 then they get a new URL (possibly with an address of their choice) which they can reply to and post to twitter? 19:10:48 I'm R-I-C-H ! 19:11:17 tmh: i generate them by the hundreds. i own about 20 domains, 5 of them running various useless crap for adsense. 19:12:12 fusss: That's not a bad approach. Throw them out there and see what sticks. 19:12:24 tomoyuki28jp [n=tomoyuki@w221062.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #lisp 19:14:48 Does cl have a function to replace a element of list? What I want to do is this. http://paste.lisp.org/display/74932 19:14:48 -!- Nshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-106-1-236.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit ["Quitte"] 19:14:57 ohayo 19:15:03 ohayo 19:15:08 ohio 19:15:47 wisconsin 19:16:15 and stix.to are Swedes! 19:16:25 (well, Henrik is.) 19:16:48 tomoyuki28jp: look at SUBSTITUTE and variants. 19:17:21 clhs substitute 19:17:21 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_sbs_s.htm 19:17:46 Hmm, that's almost as useful as lispdoc. 19:18:06 -!- Xach [n=xach@unnamed.xach.com] has left #lisp 19:19:17 nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 19:20:10 rpg_ [n=rpg@75.146.46.193] has joined #lisp 19:20:49 -!- rpg_ is now known as rpg 19:20:53 tmh: This is what I wanted. http://paste.lisp.org/display/74932#1 Thanks for your advice :) 19:21:21 You're welcome. 19:21:53 -!- nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:22:21 nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 19:22:57 -!- nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:23:16 slyrus_ [n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 19:23:28 nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 19:23:31 Is there a way to force garbage collection ? 19:23:40 auclairb: not portably. 19:23:46 on sbcl ? 19:23:53 auclairb: sb-ext:gc 19:23:58 thanks 19:24:02 you can use trivial-garbage for a fairly portable library, though 19:24:19 best library name ever.. 19:24:22 GC isn't in CL-USER? 19:24:32 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 19:25:32 it is exported 19:25:46 err, imported 19:26:30 Good evening. 19:26:51 evenin' beach 19:29:59 -!- Aankhen`` [n=Aankhen@122.162.171.149] has quit ["(A)bort, (R)etry, (F)ail or (T)oss computer across room?"] 19:31:05 I have massive memory allocation somewhere, I can't figure out where from looking at the code, how could i proceed ? 19:31:27 Jabberwockey [n=Tumnus_@dslb-082-083-072-254.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 19:31:36 -!- nyef [n=nyef@pool-70-20-58-237.man.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)] 19:32:14 profiling 19:33:14 TheSeth26 [n=TheSeth2@173-18-212-161.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 19:38:35 H4ns1 [n=hans@p57A0CD46.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:38:44 -!- H4ns [n=hans@p57A0CD46.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 19:38:47 -!- H4ns1 is now known as H4ns 19:39:44 -!- BrianRice [n=briantri@c-98-225-51-246.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [] 19:40:05 -!- blowery [n=blowery@rrcs-24-213-247-204.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 19:41:04 -!- ltbarcly [n=jvanwink@nc-76-0-131-184.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:44:19 nyef [n=nyef@pool-70-20-57-86.man.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #lisp 19:50:11 ltbarcly [n=jvanwink@nc-76-0-131-184.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:10 lyte [n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte] has joined #lisp 19:54:03 -!- mulander [n=opera@nat-4.interq.pl] has left #lisp 19:55:35 -!- ikki [n=ikki@201.155.75.146] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 19:55:41 ikki [n=ikki@201.155.75.146] has joined #lisp 19:56:00 -!- TheSeth26 [n=TheSeth2@173-18-212-161.client.mchsi.com] has left #lisp 19:58:38 A few hours ago I asked about how to get a pointer to the contents of a 2-D byte array in SBCL. Now I wonder the same for CCL. Is there a way to make ccl:with-pointer-to-ivector work for a 2-D simple-array of bytes? 19:59:53 nathanael [n=nathanae@1.106.113.82.net.de.o2.com] has joined #lisp 20:00:33 -!- Tristam [n=Tristam@ip98-169-227-67.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:01:40 Tristam [n=Tristam@ip98-169-227-67.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:02:45 -!- Tristam [n=Tristam@ip98-169-227-67.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 20:03:27 Tristam [n=Tristam@ip98-169-227-67.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:03:58 -!- nathanael [n=nathanae@1.106.113.82.net.de.o2.com] has quit [Client Quit] 20:08:51 ljosa: Wasn't there a "portable" interface suggested a while back based on some FFI? 20:08:55 [atxBot [n=patx44@adsl-2-249-111.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 20:09:11 mvillene1ve [n=matthieu@che33-1-82-66-18-171.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 20:10:25 Adamant [n=Adamant@c-71-226-66-93.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:11:03 mulander [n=opera@nat-4.interq.pl] has joined #lisp 20:11:57 kib2 [n=kib2@bd137-1-82-228-159-28.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:26 blowery [n=blowery@cpe-72-228-38-92.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:15:52 -!- tomoyuki28jp [n=tomoyuki@w221062.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:16:58 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 20:19:06 ejs [n=eugen@94-248-124-113.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has joined #lisp 20:19:11 -!- postamar [n=postamar@x-132-204-240-14.xtpr.umontreal.ca] has left #lisp 20:19:42 -!- mvilleneuve [n=matthieu@che33-1-82-66-18-171.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:22:54 stepnem [n=chatzill@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 20:24:20 -!- lyte [n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:25:10 stand by for a very exciting demo folks 20:25:56 fe[nl]ix [n=algidus@88-149-208-79.dynamic.ngi.it] has joined #lisp 20:26:10 nyef: cffi:with-pointer-to-vector calls ccl:with-pointer-to-ivector, which only works for vectors. I was hoping for something like SBCL's array-storage-vector/%array-data-vector. 20:26:37 -!- athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has quit [Success] 20:27:27 athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has joined #lisp 20:28:08 HAHA! 20:28:31 People in the U.S. may now call my Lisp operated phone server (a web service actually) 20:28:58 (866) 583-6913 toll freee number, then type this pin 5261-8991 20:29:00 Put it on /. 20:29:11 pasting the snippet now :-) 20:29:15 ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has joined #lisp 20:30:25 ljosa: Sounds like a good opportunity for some internals-hacking, then. :-P 20:30:42 younder [i=jpthing@084202158137.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #lisp 20:30:47 fuss: I'm finally learning how to pronounce hunchentoot :P 20:30:56 nyef: yes, I'll have to dig 20:30:56 fusss pasted "voice thinggie" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74937 20:31:39 bombshelter13_ [n=bombshel@209-161-235-253.dsl.look.ca] has joined #lisp 20:32:27 i want to offer a calculator service over the phone, where people call from their cell phones, add two numbers and perform the usual arithmetic on them. the server will do geo-tracking and the result of their calculation shipped to the express next-day mail. 20:32:56 lol fusss 20:33:00 haha 20:33:08 i'm going to steal your idea and market it first! 20:33:14 must be pretty big numbers 20:34:25 -!- ejs [n=eugen@94-248-124-113.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:40:41 -!- ljosa [n=ljosa@gm3b6-dd5.broad.mit.edu] has quit ["time to go home"] 20:43:16 -!- ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-145-204.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 20:45:04 -!- stepnem [n=chatzill@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit ["ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]"] 20:45:41 stepnem [n=chatzill@topol.nat.praha12.net] has joined #lisp 20:45:47 bhz- [n=resm@cpc2-roch4-0-0-cust792.manc.cable.ntl.com] has joined #lisp 20:46:44 back to do lead tracking and data munging :-S 20:53:58 Modius [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-222-97.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 20:54:22 Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 20:55:59 -!- josemanuel [n=josemanu@34.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit ["Saliendo"] 20:57:46 -!- pstickne [n=pstickne@69.166.35.201] has quit [Connection timed out] 20:57:48 jgracin [n=jgracin@82.193.210.126] has joined #lisp 21:02:25 Any idea what could cause (handler-case (foo) (simple-error () 0)) to leak ? (foo being a glorified aref) on sbcl 1.0.22 21:02:43 H4ns1 [n=hans@p57A0CD46.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 21:03:26 -!- H4ns [n=hans@p57A0CD46.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 21:03:27 -!- H4ns1 is now known as H4ns 21:08:03 Tordek [n=tordek@host68.190-138-172.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 21:08:22 <_death> auclairb: buggy code? 21:08:37 Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 21:08:50 -!- werdan7 [n=w7@freenode/staff/wikimedia.werdan7] has quit [Connection timed out] 21:08:59 robsynnot [n=irchon@mobileinternet2.o2.ie] has joined #lisp 21:09:33 _death: im closing in on it i'll lisp paste soon 21:13:07 -!- robsynnot [n=irchon@mobileinternet2.o2.ie] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:13:17 To "leak"? 21:13:59 auclairb pasted "This leaks on darwin sbcl 1.0.22, can anyone repro?" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74939 21:14:08 robsynnot [n=irchon@mobileinternet2.o2.ie] has joined #lisp 21:14:09 -!- jollygood [n=jollygoo@129.71.215.161] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:14:17 nyef: eats up the memory 21:14:33 hopefully its me doing something horribly wrong 21:14:53 sbcl goes to 1 gig of mem in a matter of seconds 21:15:04 i can't see whats the problem in my code 21:15:12 -!- robsynnot [n=irchon@mobileinternet2.o2.ie] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:15:17 Well, to start with, you're looking at undefined semantics... 21:16:05 nyef: not too familiar with that word "semantics" 21:16:47 Oh, I see... Have you considered that the use of HANDLER-CASE is expensive? 21:16:55 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 21:17:03 in terms of time or space ? 21:17:38 (And by "expensive", I mean "links in a new catch block and conses a new closure for each invocation".) 21:18:05 but the shown code ought to execute in constant space (wrt the dotimes limit), yes? 21:18:28 -!- kpreid [n=kpreid@216-171-188-181.northland.net] has quit [] 21:18:58 That's a fair point. 21:19:00 kpreid [n=kpreid@216-171-188-181.northland.net] has joined #lisp 21:19:03 Well, mostly fair. 21:19:33 Seriously, though, at this point I'd consider wrapping the whole thing as a lambda and passing it off to DISASSEMBLE. 21:19:57 If the aref is straight in the handler case and not ina function there is no leak 21:20:23 So... disassemble both versions and find out what the compiler is doing? 21:21:03 how would I do that ? 21:21:30 (disassemble (lambda (let ((a (make-arary '(128 128)))) (dotimes ... 21:21:35 Err... 21:21:39 (lambda () (let ... 21:22:20 forgetting the () in a no-arg lambda has been a significant source of annoyance :-\ 21:22:33 Rarely happens to me. 21:22:41 -!- malumalu_ [n=malu@hnvr-4dbbf38e.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit ["Verlassend"] 21:23:04 sykopomp: You were at the dinner after the last boston-lisp-meeting, weren't you? 21:23:18 nyef: I was, yes. Green ponytail. 21:23:26 auclairb: I can't seem to reproduce on 32-bit Intel Linux, SBCL version 1.0.24.44. 21:23:31 Remember the fortune cookies? 21:23:37 auclairb annotated #74939 with "dissasembly" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74939#1 21:24:04 nyef: yes, but I don't particularly remember their content, apart from Weinreb talking about his collection of them :) 21:24:11 auclairb: Resident set size and virtual size stay the same as the code runs. 21:24:14 Guest82189: thanks for trying 21:24:20 -!- Tordek_ [n=tordek@host89.201-253-13.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:24:41 sykopomp: I got one that said "your next interview will result in a job". I start a six-month consulting gig on monday. 21:25:01 hey, nice! Congrats :) 21:25:07 Thanks. 21:25:19 I don't remember who in particular you were at the table though :( 21:25:23 elurin` [n=user@85.99.66.92] has joined #lisp 21:26:00 I was the balding red-head sitting immediately anti-clockwise from Fare. 21:26:31 -!- elurin [n=user@85.99.66.92] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 21:26:32 ah, yes :) Hello again. 21:27:08 Didn't even really need an interview, I just got a call from an old friend "hey, I've got a spot for some integration work, it's a six month project, do you want it?" 21:27:17 chessweb [n=chatzill@g227207249.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 21:27:37 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 21:27:46 auclairb: For comparison, do a disassembly of the version that has an inlined AREF instead of calling FOO. 21:27:52 that sounds like a sweet gig. 21:28:00 -!- rpg [n=rpg@75.146.46.193] has quit ["Leaving..."] 21:29:00 We'll see. 21:29:33 auclairb annotated #74939 with "disassembly with inlined aref" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/74939#2 21:29:41 Does mean that I'm going to be away for half a year, though, so no real chance at going to the ILC or boston-lisp-meeting for a while. 21:30:38 -!- chessweb [n=chatzill@g227207249.adsl.alicedsl.de] has left #lisp 21:31:09 Did lisppaste just die? 21:31:38 all those opcodes must have depressed it 21:31:49 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 21:32:09 Ah, there we go... 21:32:13 it died an hour ago for a few minutes, too. 21:32:44 -!- Jasko [n=tjasko@209.74.44.225] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:32:55 Tordek_ [n=tordek@host157.190-227-41.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 21:34:12 Well, the inlined version obviously isn't doing as much because it actually inlines the type-error call... 21:34:48 ... Maybe this is a leak in the signal handling / error handling path on darwin? 21:35:24 ISTR that x86 darwin at the very least has some funkiness in that path due to some wierdness in the underlying OS... 21:35:56 <_8david> | You may bring a guest to the ITA-sponsored banquet on Tuesday, March 24, 2009. The cost per guest ticket is $75. This ticket is non-refundable. 21:36:09 <_8david> Is that guest ticket for the banquet or something unrelated? 21:37:05 -!- Tordek [n=tordek@host68.190-138-172.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 21:38:06 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 21:38:17 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 21:41:33 i'm getting latest sbcl using clbuild and see if i can repro 21:42:07 ... Yeah, nothing's gone in since 1.0.25 that should affect this. 21:42:50 -!- sellout [n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com] has quit [] 21:44:36 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 21:44:49 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 21:45:22 -!- jgracin [n=jgracin@82.193.210.126] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:47:01 Unfortunately it repros on 1.0.25.9 21:50:47 -!- dlowe [n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["*poof*"] 21:50:56 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 21:51:08 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 21:51:21 So ugly code until 1.0.26 i guess 21:53:19 ugly code for a lot longer if you don't fix the issue 21:53:20 Don't forget to track down the actual cause of the leak so it can be fixed. :-P 21:53:26 Heh. 21:54:13 Quite out of my capabilities for now 21:54:40 I learned how to use structs today :) 21:55:16 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Client Quit] 21:57:40 -!- roygbiv [n=blank@pdpc/supporter/active/roygbiv] has quit [] 21:59:05 did kreuter's last commit forget to bump version.lisp-expr? 22:01:29 fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 22:01:33 -!- nha [n=prefect@137-64.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:01:35 ... Looks like it might have, just from looking at the output of git pull. 22:03:39 schoppenhauer [n=css@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 22:05:17 -!- Davidbrcz [n=david@nsc.ciup.fr] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 22:06:03 it was either that or I had screwed up my git-foo 22:06:06 git-fu 22:07:14 I'm not seeing it in the gitweb on boinkor. 22:08:10 -!- blowery [n=blowery@cpe-72-228-38-92.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [] 22:08:27 Ugh. Do we have to stick with sourcefarce? It's getting worse over time. 22:09:04 I'm not seeing an update to version.lisp-expr in the sourcefarce cvsweb either. 22:13:45 ./clbuild lisp start 1.0.22 and sh source/sbcl/run-sbcl.sh runs 1.0.25, how can i tell clbuild to use the latest? 22:14:09 "install" or something 22:14:23 that's my guess 22:14:25 Modius_ [n=Modius@ppp-70-250-154-209.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 22:14:59 stassats: you mean ./clbuild install sbcl ? 22:15:18 perhaps that 22:15:28 :( doesn't do it 22:16:03 you'd better look at clbuild's documentation, it seemed to be pretty clear 22:21:03 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:22:47 -!- jewel [n=jewel@dsl-242-170-32.telkomadsl.co.za] has quit [No route to host] 22:23:43 ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-135-71.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 22:24:57 -!- homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-ad723c8d3e1ce0b6] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:25:19 homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-e5d6b96adf39e2f0] has joined #lisp 22:27:24 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 22:27:35 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:27:45 -!- davazp [n=user@121.Red-79-152-91.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:29:20 feagondpt [n=feagond@92.40.170.54.sub.mbb.three.co.uk] has joined #lisp 22:33:36 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:33:48 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:33:58 -!- Modius [n=Modius@adsl-67-67-222-97.dsl.austtx.swbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:36:20 -!- ehu [n=chatzill@80.120.89.230] has quit ["ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]"] 22:36:26 davazp [n=user@121.Red-79-152-91.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:37:07 -!- feagondpt [n=feagond@92.40.170.54.sub.mbb.three.co.uk] has left #lisp 22:39:40 ml`_ [n=milan@port-92-192-103-56.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 22:39:51 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 22:40:02 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:40:50 MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has joined #lisp 22:41:00 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Client Quit] 22:42:28 -!- dwave [n=ask@212251217238.customer.cdi.no] has quit ["Be back later"] 22:43:09 is this the standard-iterate to use: http://common-lisp.net/project/iterate/ ? 22:44:03 yes. 22:44:46 thanks. - reading 22:45:14 -!- auclairb [n=auclairb@laborius1.gel.usherb.ca] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 22:45:58 fusss_ [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 22:46:12 damn. starting gc deadlock test: WARNING: THIS TEST WILL HANG ON FAILURE! and it did :) 22:47:07 -!- fusss [n=chatzill@ip70-179-113-121.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:47:10 -!- fusss_ is now known as fusss 22:48:16 slyrus_: Too bad there's nothing automatic monitoring it to see if it's hung or not... 22:49:19 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:50:37 -!- MrSpec [n=NoOne@82.177.125.6] has left #lisp 22:50:47 dkcl [n=danderse@unaffiliated/dkcl] has joined #lisp 22:53:46 -!- Quadrescence [n=quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:54:15 Quadrescence [n=quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 22:54:23 -!- ml` [n=milan@port-92-192-46-8.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:55:06 oh, sorry about the version file. 22:55:21 borism [n=boris@195-50-199-196-dsl.krw.estpak.ee] has joined #lisp 22:55:51 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:56:03 emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 22:56:27 should I do a new commit just to bump the version (twice, I guess?) 22:56:58 -!- Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 22:59:23 -!- emma [n=emma@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Client Quit] 22:59:36 kreuter: once should suffice, if you're not making any other modifications 23:00:04 uh, what should the commit message be? 23:00:07 mejja [n=user@c-4bb5e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 23:00:31 -!- mvillene1ve [n=matthieu@che33-1-82-66-18-171.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:01:13 (should I just use the message I did last time?) 23:01:26 -!- borism_ [n=boris@195-50-197-134-dsl.krw.estpak.ee] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] 23:02:17 kreuter: look for 1.0.23.19 in the log, for instance 23:02:32 gemelen_ [n=shelta@shpd-92-101-158-218.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 23:02:50 ah. thanks,. 23:04:11 -!- kreuter [n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 23:04:19 -!- gemelen [n=shelta@shpd-78-36-164-10.static.vologda.ru] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 23:04:22 -!- gemelen_ is now known as gemelen 23:06:03 -!- hkBst [n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 23:07:32 -!- ManateeLazyCat [n=user@222.212.143.89] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 23:09:03 -!- elurin` [n=user@85.99.66.92] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:10:15 -!- homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-e5d6b96adf39e2f0] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:10:42 homoioi [n=zc155789@nat/sun/x-41f219b30a57c39c] has joined #lisp 23:10:54 rpg_ [n=rpg@67.110.61.22.ptr.us.xo.net] has joined #lisp 23:11:50 kreuter [n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:12:27 yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 23:13:59 cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:14:29 -!- dkcl [n=danderse@unaffiliated/dkcl] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:16:17 -!- willb [n=wibenton@wireless93.cs.wisc.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:18:57 -!- mulander [n=opera@nat-4.interq.pl] has left #lisp 23:20:37 -!- Jabberwockey [n=Tumnus_@dslb-082-083-072-254.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:21:31 -!- LostMonarch [n=roby@host108-177-dynamic.51-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit ["raise RuntimeError"] 23:21:57 -!- tsuru [n=user@66.199.17.194] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 23:24:26 -!- stepnem [n=chatzill@topol.nat.praha12.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 23:24:43 -!- mega1 [n=mega@4d6f4fab.adsl.enternet.hu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:24:45 -!- realtime [i=sabbath@189.72.27.133] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:24:50 realtime [i=sabbath@189.72.27.133] has joined #lisp 23:28:45 Zephtar_ [n=srusek@d57-112.icpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 23:31:11 mattrepl [n=mattrepl@ip68-98-133-128.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 23:32:01 BrianRice [n=briantri@c-98-225-51-246.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:33:38 ken-p [n=unknown@84.92.70.37] has joined #lisp 23:35:04 EXetoC [i=EXetoC@c-f090e155.1422-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 23:38:13 -!- arwed [i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 23:39:14 -!- Zephtar [n=srusek@d57-112.icpnet.pl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:39:20 -!- repnop [n=repnop@adsl-69-225-2-177.dsl.skt2ca.pacbell.net] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 23:39:36 -!- avdi [n=avdi@c-71-58-195-219.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:41:22 -!- tritchey [n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:44:13 slyrus__ [n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 23:44:46 -!- bombshelter13_ [n=bombshel@209-161-235-253.dsl.look.ca] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:47:22 -!- slyrus_ [n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:47:24 -!- slyrus__ is now known as slyrus_ 23:48:00 -!- FZ [n=user@unaffiliated/fz] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 23:52:16 rvirding [n=rvirding@h40n5c1o1034.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 23:52:36 blowery [n=blowery@cpe-72-228-38-92.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:57:22 -!- ruediger [n=the-rued@62-47-135-71.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 23:59:26 -!- bhr [n=chatzill@unaffiliated/bhr] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]