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2018-05-01T11:13:32Z borodust: is there smth similar as sbcl's *save-hooks* (funcs invoked before dumping an image) in ccl?
2018-05-01T11:13:48Z borodust: s/as/to/
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2018-05-01T14:38:53Z rme: borodust: yes, there is ccl:*save-exit-functions*.  see https://ccl.clozure.com/docs/ccl.html#saving-applications
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2018-05-01T14:39:01Z borodust: rme: thank you
2018-05-01T14:39:25Z borodust: i'm blind :/
2018-05-01T14:39:44Z borodust: or got to different doc thru googling
2018-05-01T14:39:57Z rme: no worries
2018-05-01T14:42:51Z borodust: one more question
2018-05-01T14:42:54Z jmercouris: borodust: I have experience creating apps from CCL if you have any questions, there is also the picture frame demo application
2018-05-01T14:43:22Z jmercouris: it's a good template to go off of, not because it is a marvel of engineering, but because it shows you the workflow
2018-05-01T14:43:25Z borodust: jmercouris: thank you, i think i saw it :)
2018-05-01T14:43:49Z jmercouris: no problem!
2018-05-01T14:43:54Z borodust: jmercouris: is it macos only? i think i remember it being so
2018-05-01T14:44:00Z jmercouris: Yes, it is MacOS only
2018-05-01T14:44:05Z jmercouris: the build script is at least
2018-05-01T14:44:18Z jmercouris: and you could technically build on Linux using their fake cocoa implementation
2018-05-01T14:44:25Z borodust: alright, i have a tricky question :)
2018-05-01T14:44:43Z borodust: about reloading foreign libraries upon restoring from image
2018-05-01T14:44:49Z jmercouris: Ah, yes
2018-05-01T14:45:08Z borodust: right now eeps keep link to shlibs which keeps full path as a soname
2018-05-01T14:45:27Z borodust: so upon restoring a eep it fails to find the shlib
2018-05-01T14:45:35Z jmercouris: what is "eep"?
2018-05-01T14:45:37Z borodust: on different machine
2018-05-01T14:45:48Z jmercouris: So normally what is done is the following during build
2018-05-01T14:45:51Z borodust: ccl:external-entry-point
2018-05-01T14:46:07Z jmercouris: okay, this may not apply to your situation
2018-05-01T14:46:18Z jmercouris: but, what is done on MacOS is you copy the shared libraries into an application bundle
2018-05-01T14:46:30Z jmercouris: and then update the RPATH (I think that is what it is called) to point to those shared libs
2018-05-01T14:46:31Z borodust: i'm building cross platform app
2018-05-01T14:46:49Z jmercouris: Okay, and you probably want to just deploy it with a single file right?
2018-05-01T14:47:05Z jmercouris: then you will need to copy in your shared libs into some sort of bundle
2018-05-01T14:47:12Z jmercouris: then you must load those shared libs from the bundle
2018-05-01T14:47:52Z jmercouris: alternatively, you could make a portfile, or whatever they are called for your platform that does the compilation on each machine
2018-05-01T14:48:07Z jmercouris: fetching all of the shared lib dependencies and saving your lisp image etc
2018-05-01T14:49:01Z borodust: hmm, would #'ccl:open-shared-library find library by relative path?
2018-05-01T14:49:11Z jmercouris: that I cannot comment on
2018-05-01T14:49:20Z jmercouris: the only time I've bundled shared libraries into my application has been with ECL
2018-05-01T14:49:37Z borodust: i did that with SBCL :)
2018-05-01T14:49:38Z jmercouris: I don't see why it wouldn't be able to
2018-05-01T14:49:51Z rme: borodust: the process of restoring open shared libraries is a bit hairy, and I don't remember all the details.
2018-05-01T14:50:08Z rme: On Linux, I thought we tried to restore by soname (not just full path).
2018-05-01T14:50:11Z borodust: rme: i even close them before dumping an image
2018-05-01T14:50:24Z borodust: rme: yeah, linux works if correct soname is provided
2018-05-01T14:50:38Z borodust: rme: but on macos it uses full paths :/
2018-05-01T14:50:50Z jmercouris: Yes, on Mac is where you have a special type of path for shared libs
2018-05-01T14:51:08Z jmercouris: I wish I could find an article on it
2018-05-01T14:51:12Z jmercouris: let me look through my notes
2018-05-01T14:51:15Z borodust: rpath?
2018-05-01T14:51:38Z jmercouris: yes, beyond that
2018-05-01T14:51:38Z borodust: install_name? :)
2018-05-01T14:51:42Z jmercouris: you can do some manipulations with those tools
2018-05-01T14:51:50Z jmercouris: but the options are not documented anywhere well
2018-05-01T14:52:15Z borodust: no, the problem not in the library itself
2018-05-01T14:52:16Z jmercouris: for example, I had a neat script to automatically trace down dependencies and update the paths
2018-05-01T14:52:34Z jmercouris: yeah sure, CCL isn't loading the libs
2018-05-01T14:52:42Z borodust: the problem is that ccl keeps full path to it even after image restoration
2018-05-01T14:52:55Z jmercouris: might you save the image without the path?
2018-05-01T14:53:05Z jmercouris: and then bootstrap it in some way, adding the path?
2018-05-01T14:54:22Z borodust: this is out of my control, EEPs are created during loading
2018-05-01T14:55:08Z jmercouris: these paths, you are setting them somehow when you load CCL, no?
2018-05-01T14:55:33Z jmercouris: I'm saying, what if you load your image, WITHOUT setting these paths, and then persist it
2018-05-01T14:55:34Z borodust: jmercouris: yes, cffi does that
2018-05-01T14:56:32Z rme: borodust: I don't know if this will help you, but here is something that we have to do in order to load a bundled framework in Opusmodus.
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2018-05-01T14:57:08Z rme: install_name_tool -id @executable_path/../Frameworks/SeeScoreLib-mac.framework/SeeScoreLib-mac SeeScoreLib-mac
2018-05-01T14:57:32Z borodust: i see
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2018-05-01T14:57:54Z borodust: where SeeScoreLib-mac is the dumped app?
2018-05-01T14:58:18Z rme: That's the name of the framework.
2018-05-01T14:58:21Z borodust: ah
2018-05-01T14:58:28Z rme: That command is run in the context of "cd seescore-sdk-mac-v178/SeeScoreLib-mac.framework"
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2018-05-01T14:59:22Z borodust: rme: how do you load those libraries? via cffi?
2018-05-01T14:59:34Z rme: If we don't do that, then we get an error like "Error: Shared library not open: "/Library/Frameworks/SeeScoreLib-mac.framework/Versions/B/SeeScoreLib-mac"
2018-05-01T14:59:35Z rme: While executing: ccl::ensure-open-shlib, in process Listener-2(9)."
2018-05-01T14:59:50Z borodust: ohh, that's close
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2018-05-01T15:20:20Z borodust: oh my god, i can't beleive i'm doing that, but seems like resetting container of EEP upon image dump works
2018-05-01T15:20:25Z borodust: gonna check out the build
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2018-05-01T15:49:52Z borodust: yuss!
2018-05-01T15:50:00Z borodust: it works
2018-05-01T15:50:14Z borodust: forcibly resetting EEP container, that is
2018-05-01T15:50:32Z borodust: rme jmercouris, thank you anyway! :)
2018-05-01T15:50:57Z borodust: i would burn in hell for this code, but if it works... ;p
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2018-05-01T15:56:09Z jmercouris: no problem!
2018-05-01T15:58:07Z borodust: the code in question: https://github.com/borodust/bodge-blobs-support/blob/master/utils.lisp#L33
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2018-05-01T16:01:50Z jmercouris: if it works, it works
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2018-05-01T16:09:02Z rme: borodust: Would you be willing to write up a GitHub issue describing your situation and the workaround that you used?  I don't promise to do anything about it (at least right away), but I'd like to have a note of your use case.
2018-05-01T16:09:14Z rme: Maybe someone else will need something similar.
2018-05-01T16:09:42Z rme: https://github.com/Clozure/ccl/issues/new if you want to
2018-05-01T16:10:47Z borodust: rme: yup, sure, gimme a moment
2018-05-01T16:15:23Z borodust: actually, i need to run an errand, i'll make an issue after
2018-05-01T16:16:09Z rme: thank you
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2018-05-01T17:17:27Z borodust: rme: is this one good enough: https://github.com/Clozure/ccl/issues/125
2018-05-01T17:17:39Z borodust: i mean more like, does it make sense :)
2018-05-01T17:27:48Z jmercouris: good enough? why of course it is good enough!
2018-05-01T17:28:37Z borodust: jmercouris: cool, thanks!
2018-05-01T17:29:25Z rme: thanks, borodust, it looks good
2018-05-01T17:29:41Z rme: i.e., it makes sense
2018-05-01T17:29:50Z borodust: rme: :) thanks
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2018-05-03T09:22:43Z hhdave: rme: Hi. I’m sorry for what’s going to be a really vague error report and I understand if it doesn’t give you much to go on, but I though I’d reach out just in case… We have a production web system running on CCL (presently version 1.10) on Solaris (though I think the same problem occured on Linux). Every now and then it drops into CCL’s kernel debugger and has to be restarted. The error message is usually ‘exception occured executing
2018-05-03T09:22:44Z hhdave: code’ (or words to that effect - we disabled the kernel debugger to make it auto restart). The only other clue I have is that if I’m connected in via SLIME I very often get a series of errors like ‘The value #<BOGUS object @ #x30203083429D> is not of the expected type PAIPROLOG::VAR.’…
2018-05-03T09:24:56Z hhdave: it seems that something in some threads which rebuilds certain cached bits of information using the PAIPROLOG package (Norvig’s prolog->CL compiler) triggers it somehow. It’s very tricky to reproduce reliably, otherwise I would be able to give you a less vague error message. It seems (from the stack trace) that the various prolog predicates keep being called with those #<BOGUS object …> things when it goes wrong. If you can’t make any sense
2018-05-03T09:24:57Z hhdave: don’t worry and when I have more time I’ll try again to see if I can consistently reproduce it on a small test case.
2018-05-03T09:25:29Z hhdave: (s/less vague error message/less vague error report/)
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2018-05-03T14:47:37Z rme: A bogus object is an object whose address appears to be outside of any memory region which is expected to contain Lisp data.  One common case is that some stack-allocated / dynamic-extent object has escaped from its enclosing scope.
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2018-05-03T15:33:41Z kolb: Second that: the only time I have seen this kind of "object" was with a dynamic extent issue related to IIRC returning a handler to outside its extent
2018-05-03T15:34:41Z kolb: Sth like (handler-bind ... (find-restart ...)) -> bogus object
2018-05-03T15:35:18Z kolb: Eh s/handler/restart
2018-05-03T15:55:48Z hhdave: - sorry, forgot to check back here. OK, that’s interesting. Is there a simple way I could trigger it with some CL code? What happens if you then try and do things with a bogus object?
2018-05-03T15:57:40Z phoe: hhdave: as mentioned above, returning restart objects is always a bad idea
2018-05-03T15:57:47Z phoe: since restarts are always dynamic-extent
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2018-05-03T15:59:31Z hhdave: Is there any other possible way to get bogus objects in CCL?
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2018-05-03T16:00:55Z hhdave: I did find there were problems invoking the PAIPROLOG compiler form multiple threads. I had to put a lock around that.
2018-05-03T16:07:49Z rme: Well (safety 0) code could clobber something, or maybe some foreign function call might clobber something or I suppose there could always be a ccl bug.
2018-05-03T16:08:32Z rme: But stack-allocated / dynamic-extent objects escaping is the most common cause.
2018-05-03T16:11:20Z rme: https://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/776
2018-05-03T16:16:12Z hhdave: Aha. I don’t see any declarations of dynamic-extent in our codebase though. The prolog code doesn’t seem to have any ‘find-restart’ in it either. I guess I need to try and reproduce it more reliably…
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2018-05-05T01:37:43Z sjl: do I need to do something special to run an external program that uses curses beyond `(ccl:run-program "vim" nil :output t :input t)`?  It just appears to hang instead of letting the program take over the tty
2018-05-05T01:38:10Z sjl: I'm running /usr/local/bin/ccl64 --no-init, so no rc files or rlwrap to mess with anything
2018-05-05T01:38:44Z sjl: tried other things like w3m, same result.  run-program runs basic stuff like ls just fine
2018-05-05T01:40:09Z sjl: (sb-ext:run-program "vim" nil :output t :input t :search t) seems to work, so maybe there's something else I need to do in CCL?
2018-05-05T01:41:18Z sjl: ps shows the external process is getting run, I just can't see its output
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2018-05-05T02:34:13Z sabetts: sjl: presumably vim's output is being piped into a stream instead of to the tty?
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2018-05-05T07:54:29Z pjb: sjl: since you often run from slime, in emacs, you'd better launch xterm to run curses programs: (ccl:run-program "xterm" '("-e" "vim") :output t :input t)
2018-05-05T08:06:30Z pjb: sjl: but it's true that (ccl:run-program "vim" '() :output t :input t) doesn't work, even in ccl launched directly in an xterm… or with :wait t or :pty t (which is ignored according to the documentation).
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2018-05-05T14:47:09Z sjl: pjb: I'm attempting to make a standalone command line utility that shouldn't rely on a separate terminal emulator being installed to work
2018-05-05T14:47:30Z sjl: pjb: I can use SBCL and it works fine, I was just hoping to make it a little more portable
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2018-05-05T15:40:20Z pjb: sjl: you may want to jump into ccl stream code; perhaps there's an easy hidden option, or an easy patch to make it work?
2018-05-05T15:41:43Z pjb: sjl: I find ccl stream code to be a tad hairy…
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2018-05-10T07:05:36Z jdz: rme: re. CCL version: I don't think it would be cheating to do something similar to what is done in SBCL to combine CCL version with Git describe.  SBCL has its "standard" 3-part version, followed by number of commits from the branch it was built, and a git commit hash at the end.
2018-05-10T07:07:37Z jdz: For instance, the version I'm currently running is "SBCL 1.4.7.98.local.3-ca2c190f8", which means version release 1.4.7, 98 commits on master branch (which my local branch is branched off of), and 3 commits in my local branch.
2018-05-10T07:08:39Z jdz: My $0.02.
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2018-05-21T14:44:47Z Guest60246: Minere BTC enquanto navega e trabalha  sem deixar o pc lentão Bitcoin consegue aos poucos mesmo!  https://getcryptotab.com/718967 Video tutorial https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luzqQN3kL4g&t=166s
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2018-05-26T09:14:21Z jmercouris: what is the CCL equivalent of CCL::COMMAND-LINE-ARGUMENTS?
2018-05-26T09:14:51Z jmercouris: trying to use: https://github.com/libre-man/unix-opts
2018-05-26T09:15:08Z jmercouris: and the repl complains to me, you can see the github issue here: https://github.com/next-browser/next/pull/101
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2018-05-26T18:57:00Z rme: looks like that was a bug (now fixed) in the unix-opts library
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2018-05-28T21:32:11Z Guest60591: Minerar BTC while surfing and working without leaving the pc slow Bitcoin gets even gradually! https://getcryptotab.com/718967 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luzqQN3kL4g&t=166s
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2018-05-29T01:20:22Z consolers: cffi defcstruct is completely broken with ccl 32 bit on intel, it gets the alignments wrong
2018-05-29T01:20:43Z consolers: how do people even use the pos cffi??
2018-05-29T01:21:32Z consolers: apparently it doesn't go through ccl::define-foreign-type but computes its own field offsets and gets them wrong
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