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[~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #scheme 01:02:39 znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 01:02:53 lazyden [~lazyden@58.185.121.38] has joined #scheme 01:06:14 b4283 [~b4283@1-173-96-33.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 01:07:01 -!- znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:07:20 znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 01:08:56 bipt [~bpt@cpe-071-070-253-241.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:14:53 jao [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 01:14:57 -!- jao [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 01:14:57 jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #scheme 01:17:31 znode_ [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 01:21:06 -!- znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:36:20 -!- Fare [~fare@216.239.55.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:49:58 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 01:50:06 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:53:37 -!- agumonkey [~agu@32.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:54:30 -!- znode_ [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:54:59 znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 01:58:33 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:00:11 znode__ [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 02:00:15 -!- znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:03:39 jcowan [~jcowan@mail.digitalkingdom.org] has joined #scheme 02:06:50 znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has joined #scheme 02:08:38 -!- znode__ [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:09:50 hoi hoi 02:10:50 polloi polloi? 02:11:21 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 02:12:37 Our lordly style / You shall not quench / With base canaille / (That word is French) 02:12:53 Distinction ebbs / Before a herd / Of vulgar plebs / (A Latin word) 02:13:12 'Twould fill with joy / And madness stark / The hoi polloi / (A Greek remark) 02:13:25 A Greek remark, a Latin word, and one that's French. 02:14:58 speak english, man 02:16:06 I can speak well the English tongue. 02:16:06 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:17:05 I think he means "speak American" 02:17:28 no, that would be unpatriotic 02:17:54 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 02:21:38 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:27:52 -!- pyro- [~pyro@unaffiliated/purplepanda] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:28:07 pyro- [~pyro@chopstick.dcollins.info] has joined #scheme 02:32:00 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@71-82-133-188.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: I tend to be neutral about apples] 02:35:55 -!- znode [~znode@61.143.60.83] has quit [Remote host closed 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[~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has joined #scheme 05:59:41 -!- jcowan [~jcowan@mail.digitalkingdom.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:00:04 -!- BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@cpe-75-187-45-52.columbus.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:02:30 is there any Scheme that has good support for reading binary structures (like ELF headers or X11 over-the-wire messages)? 06:07:13 BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@cpe-75-187-45-52.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 06:10:26 amoe [~amoe@host-92-26-163-85.as13285.net] has joined #scheme 06:11:46 -!- sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Quit: ragequit] 06:12:18 cantcode [~cantcode@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #scheme 06:13:23 -!- amoe_ [~amoe@host-92-26-161-86.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:31:53 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:33:02 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #scheme 06:36:04 amoe_ [~amoe@host-78-147-146-98.as13285.net] has joined #scheme 06:37:48 -!- preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:38:52 -!- amoe [~amoe@host-92-26-163-85.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:39:26 preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has joined #scheme 06:40:45 -!- taylanub [tub@p4FD932F5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:41:14 taylanub [tub@p4FD932F5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 06:41:16 amoe [~amoe@host-92-24-168-33.ppp.as43234.net] has joined #scheme 06:41:36 -!- SeySayux [SeySayux@libsylph/developer/seysayux] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:42:52 -!- amoe_ [~amoe@host-78-147-146-98.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:43:26 -!- z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:43:43 SeySayux [SeySayux@libsylph/developer/seysayux] has joined #scheme 06:43:56 z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has joined #scheme 06:53:27 hiroakip [~hiroaki@77-20-78-82-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #scheme 06:59:51 amoe_ [~amoe@host-78-147-152-61.as13285.net] has joined #scheme 07:00:18 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.165.89.11] has quit [Quit: ...] 07:02:53 -!- amoe [~amoe@host-92-24-168-33.ppp.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:15:06 Chicken would probably be a reasonable choice for that. 07:18:25 This egg in particular looks pretty handy: 07:18:32 http://wiki.call-cc.org/eggref/4/bitstring 07:20:31 anything with sockets and a way to read and write byte vectors should be enough, assuming you don't mind writing the parsing part 07:21:02 at least core X11 protocol can be handled pretty easily with a few parsing functions and macros 07:21:22 Well, that should be obvious; I assumed he was asking for something that provided a bit more convenience. 07:24:04 jao [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 07:24:07 -!- jao [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 07:24:07 jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined 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[Quit: z____z] 09:34:14 finishingmove [~finishing@dynamic-78-8-149-172.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #scheme 09:34:18 -!- finishingmove [~finishing@dynamic-78-8-149-172.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has left #scheme 09:34:49 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #scheme 09:56:21 WackOnline [da68c8b6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.218.104.200.182] has joined #scheme 10:03:38 -!- jrapdx [~jra@c-76-115-235-187.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:03:38 -!- jao [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:03:56 Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined #scheme 10:06:44 -!- Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has quit [Client Quit] 10:07:03 garjola [~yaaic@139.202.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #scheme 10:09:15 aoh: that's the point, I'd prefer to use something available than re-invent the wheel another time 10:15:56 ecraven, ok. you might want to have a look at http://funarg.nfshost.com/r2/code/scheme-xp/scheme-xp-0.01/ 10:16:45 hehe, that seems like what i have done 10:16:59 though i've implemented all core messages and a few extensions too 10:18:51 iirc xlib has a machine-readable description of the messages nowadays so you don't need to write everything manually from specs 10:19:07 i didn't, i wrote a couple macros and used sxml descriptions of the protocol :) 10:19:18 xcb-xml is what you mean :) 10:20:58 good. i hadn't noticed it and used the specs. man that sucked :) 10:21:36 You reeeally don't want to use Xlib these days. XCB is the new hotness 10:22:35 Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined #scheme 10:29:33 jrapdx [~jra@c-76-115-235-187.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 10:31:59 LeoNerd: well, xlib does a lot of bookkeeping that you have to do yourself with xcb :) but xcb *is* more efficient 10:34:34 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 10:36:54 -!- jrapdx [~jra@c-76-115-235-187.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:39:22 basdirks [~basdirks@185.6.205.4] has joined #scheme 10:46:57 amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@theo1.theochem.tu-muenchen.de] has joined #scheme 10:59:13 -!- WackOnline [da68c8b6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.218.104.200.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:16:06 -!- zacts [~lcc@unaffiliated/zacts] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:16:55 zacts [~user@unaffiliated/zacts] has joined #scheme 11:20:16 -!- garjola [~yaaic@139.202.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:23:21 wackOnline 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[~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:08:58 -!- agrocery [~agu@32.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:10:36 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has joined #scheme 15:14:24 przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has joined #scheme 15:17:00 juxovec [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has joined #scheme 15:32:58 adiii [~adityavit@c-76-117-52-187.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 15:43:57 ecraven: http://planet.racket-lang.org/package-source/tonyg/bitsyntax.plt/3/2/planet-docs/manual/index.html 15:43:59 http://tinyurl.com/ct8zn7q 15:43:59 ecraven: http://planet.racket-lang.org/package-source/kazzmir/x11.plt/2/2/doc.txt 15:46:35 -!- nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-137-64.w90-26.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:59 nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-137-64.w90-26.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 15:48:12 -!- PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:50:37 -!- Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:54:28 PuercoPop [~user@190.222.252.106] has joined #scheme 15:55:17 stamourv: thanks! i'll read these later ;) 15:59:36 -!- jaaso [~user@178.239.31.151] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:00:58 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:02:22 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.211] has quit [Quit: phunq, sandwich store loop, WHAT NO UNIVERSE] 16:12:34 Sgeo [~Sgeo@ool-ad034ea6.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 16:14:33 If I just read SICP and don't do the exersizes, will it still be valuable? 16:17:53 Sgeo: I don't think so. 16:18:01 :/ 16:18:22 It's very easy to think you understand something without actually understanding it if you don't ever try to practice it. 16:24:49 -!- basdirks_ [~basdirks@185.6.205.4] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:29:45 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-182-237.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 16:31:27 agrocery [~agu@32.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #scheme 16:31:41 jaaso [~user@178.239.31.151] has joined #scheme 16:32:17 -!- civodul [~user@pluto.sophia.inria.fr] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:32:39 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-eklkkuhnqmiyyolx] has joined #scheme 16:34:08 -!- agrocery is now known as agumonkey 16:36:24 -!- bipt [~bpt@cpe-071-070-253-241.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:46:31 basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #scheme 16:47:36 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-eklkkuhnqmiyyolx] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:50:53 Sgeo: It will be eye-opening perhaps, but you won't have nearly as much understanding. 16:51:06 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:51:25 I think if I don't just read it plain it won't end up getting read at all :( 16:53:45 I don't think there's any harm in reading it plain without doing the exercises at first. 16:57:12 -!- basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:57:33 Ok 16:59:58 -!- hiyosi [~hiyosi@75.18.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:02:11 Getting some benefit out of it is better than getting no benefit out of it by not reading it. 17:03:10 bipt [~bpt@71.70.253.241] has joined #scheme 17:04:07 int0x80 [~chatzilla@180.151.40.145] has joined #scheme 17:04:11 Woah, woah; is someone reading SICP without doing the exercises? 17:04:50 That's worth than worthless! The hubris of: "I 'read' SICP" will prevent one from taking the time to do it right. 17:05:03 s/worth/worse/1 17:06:24 Where's the hubris in having read a book? 17:08:06 kk` [~kk@unaffiliated/kk/x-5380134] has joined #scheme 17:08:53 -!- bipt [~bpt@71.70.253.241] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:11:18 -!- int0x80 [~chatzilla@180.151.40.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:11:41 levi: The false sense of accomplishment it brings. 17:13:40 -!- wingo [~wingo@cha74-2-88-160-190-192.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:15:06 -!- b4283 [~b4283@1-173-96-33.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:21:18 klutometis: It's only a false sense of accomplishment if your concept of what the accomplishment was is false. 17:22:27 joast [~rick@76.178.135.192] has joined #scheme 17:25:28 -!- hiroakip [~hiroaki@77-20-78-82-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:27:15 basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #scheme 17:30:23 -!- m4burns_ is now known as m4burns 17:30:39 -!- leppie [~lolcow@105-236-92-117.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [] 17:34:25 int0x80 [~chatzilla@122.167.4.201] has joined #scheme 17:34:34 leppie [~lolcow@105-236-92-117.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #scheme 17:34:39 -!- int0x80 [~chatzilla@122.167.4.201] has quit [Client Quit] 17:35:30 Sgeo: Just read the first chapter and do those exercises, then come back for chapter 2 whenver you're ready for it. I'm not sure what the exact problem is, though? 17:37:19 -!- amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@theo1.theochem.tu-muenchen.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:37:28 amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@theo1.theochem.tu-muenchen.de] has joined #scheme 17:38:27 hiroakip [~hiroaki@p4FCC4DD1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 17:38:40 jrapdx [~jra@c-76-115-235-187.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:39:21 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:42:16 -!- amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@theo1.theochem.tu-muenchen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:42:24 juxovec_ [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has joined #scheme 17:42:54 -!- juxovec [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:46:22 ASau [~user@46.115.44.40] has joined #scheme 17:59:53 jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has joined #scheme 18:01:19 It's a book. Read it however you want to read it. 18:01:49 Do the exercises you want to do. You will derive benefit according to the effort you expend. 18:02:22 It's a good book, not a magical talisman or something. 18:04:40 peterhil` [~peterhil@cs181251246.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 18:08:36 Fare [tunes@nat/google/x-pvowawpaxclaqvke] has joined #scheme 18:09:00 -!- Fare is now known as Guest58449 18:09:35 -!- jrapdx [~jra@c-76-115-235-187.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:15:16 rmathews_ [~roshan@122.174.34.223] has joined #scheme 18:16:18 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.178.0.84] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:16:19 -!- rmathews_ is now known as rmathews 18:19:35 -!- zacts [~user@unaffiliated/zacts] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:20:00 amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@p4FD60AD9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 18:20:54 zacts [~lcc@unaffiliated/zacts] has joined #scheme 18:22:09 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:33:03 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.174.34.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:34:29 -!- Guest58449 is now known as FareTower 18:35:36 rmathews [~roshan@122.174.6.114] has joined #scheme 18:39:56 rmathews_ [~roshan@122.174.30.233] has joined #scheme 18:40:24 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.174.6.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:40:24 -!- rmathews_ is now known as rmathews 18:55:08 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@cs181251246.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:59:03 Guest52818 [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 18:59:03 -!- Guest52818 [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 18:59:03 Guest52818 [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #scheme 19:01:14 peterhil` [~peterhil@cs181251246.pp.htv.fi] has joined #scheme 19:01:15 -!- FareTower is now known as Fare 19:05:42 BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@75.187.45.52] has joined #scheme 19:09:48 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@cs181251246.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:24:39 jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.211] has joined #scheme 19:26:39 Black0range [~Black0ran@c83-191-74-166.cust.tele2.se] has joined #scheme 19:27:07 hai guys do anyone know of any good premade password protection algorithms for scheme? 19:31:15 -!- hiroakip [~hiroaki@p4FCC4DD1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:34:16 bipt [~bpt@cpe-173-095-170-102.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 19:37:17 snearch [~snearch@89.204.138.79] has joined #scheme 19:37:59 -!- snearch [~snearch@89.204.138.79] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 19:39:46 snearch [~snearch@89.204.138.79] has joined #scheme 19:40:21 -!- snearch [~snearch@89.204.138.79] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 19:48:42 -!- BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@75.187.45.52] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:53:52 MIT/GNU Scheme has md5 for example.. most others probably have SHAx or MD5 or something like that.. though these aren't necessarily safe 20:02:28 Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined #scheme 20:05:12 rudybot: (require file/sha1) 20:05:14 stamourv: your typed/racket sandbox is ready 20:05:15 stamourv: Done. 20:05:21 rudybot: doc sha1 20:05:21 stamourv: http://docs.racket-lang.org/file/sha1b.html#(def._((lib._file%2Fsha1..rkt)._sha1)) 20:05:25 Black0range: ^ 20:06:07 ah hai guys thanks will have a look at it! :) 20:06:40 http://planet.racket-lang.org/display.ss?package=crypto.plt&owner=vyzo 20:06:49 http://planet.racket-lang.org/display.ss?package=digest.plt&owner=soegaard 20:06:56 http://planet.racket-lang.org/display.ss?package=mulkrypt.plt&owner=mbenkard 20:06:57 http://tinyurl.com/c6s83hh 20:17:24 -!- Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:18:06 Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined #scheme 20:23:48 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@95-25-30-172.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:28:44 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-189-101.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:35:35 -!- dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:36:13 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.174.30.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:41:40 -!- Icarot [~Icarot@199-188-193-9.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:43:32 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:45:29 -!- Mining|away is now known as MiningMarsh 20:45:48 Gorb [b8010df3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.184.1.13.243] has joined #scheme 20:47:50 I want to pack all the arguments of my lambda into a list, ie (lambda ( . args) ...), but this is invalid? (lambda (first . rest) ...) works. Any help? 20:48:43 Gorb: it is invalid, but you can do (lambda args body ...) 20:49:30 ah okay, thanks! 20:50:09 Gorb: the reasoning is that (foo bar baz . quux) is an improper list, and an improper list of length 1 is a non-list value 20:50:18 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 20:51:05 hm, why isn't it called an "improper list of length 0" ? 20:54:37 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.211] has quit [Quit: I tend to be neutral about apples] 21:01:25 -!- juxovec_ [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:03:34 William [~William@108.85.16.151] has joined #scheme 21:03:58 -!- William is now known as Guest56672 21:08:51 -!- Fare [tunes@nat/google/x-pvowawpaxclaqvke] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:09:00 -!- Black0range [~Black0ran@c83-191-74-166.cust.tele2.se] has left #scheme 21:12:39 jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has joined #scheme 21:13:38 mutley89 [~mutley89@188.30.69.106.threembb.co.uk] has joined #scheme 21:16:06 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-182-237.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 21:17:38 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-182-237.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 21:18:25 -!- evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:23:08 Fare [~tunes@216.239.55.82] has joined #scheme 21:23:32 -!- Fare is now known as Guest92657 21:24:06 -!- Guest52818 [~jao@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:26:13 ijp: Aren't all improper list non-list values? And what do you mean by length 1 improper list? Isn't ( . x) simply syntax error? 21:27:26 evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has joined #scheme 21:28:10 Euthy: perhaps I should have said "just a non-list value" 21:29:54 ski_: I wasn't sure whether to say 0 or 1, but I erred on the side of 1 since there is a value 21:30:01 -!- Guest92657 [~tunes@216.239.55.82] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:30:25 I'm not sure if srfi 1 agrees or disagrees with me here 21:31:01 *ski_* isn't sure either 21:31:31 rudybot: (require srfi/1) 21:31:32 ijp: your sandbox is ready 21:31:32 ijp: Done. 21:31:38 rudybot: (length+ '(1 2 3)) 21:31:39 ijp: ; Value: 3 21:31:40 rudybot: (length+ '(1 2 . 3)) 21:31:41 ijp: ; Value: 2 21:31:51 "Note that the zero-length dotted lists are simply all the non-null, non-pair values." at appear to agree with my terminology, though 21:32:24 Euthy : anyway, yes ( . x) is a syntax error 21:32:27 well there you go then 21:32:48 rudybot: eval '(0 1 . 42) 21:32:48 ski_: your r5rs sandbox is ready 21:32:48 ski_: ; Value: {0 1 . 42} 21:32:49 guile actually allows (. x), to my dismay 21:32:50 rudybot: eval '(0 . 42) 21:32:50 ski_: ; Value: {0 . 42} 21:32:53 rudybot: eval '( . 42) 21:32:53 ski_: error: #:1:3: read: illegal use of `.' 21:33:00 rudybot: eval (cons* 0 1 42) 21:33:00 ski_: error: cons*: undefined; cannot reference an identifier before its definition in module: 'program 21:33:20 huh ? 21:33:24 and I'm not very keen on fixing it because the ports code is not particularly nice 21:33:30 rudybot: eval (require srfi/1) 21:33:31 ski_: error: require: undefined; cannot reference an identifier before its definition in module: 'program 21:33:35 So (1 . 2) is an improper list of length 1, and 42 is an improper list of length 0? 21:33:46 Euthy: yes 21:33:56 rudybot: (lenth+ 42) 21:33:56 ijp: error: lenth+: undefined; cannot reference an identifier before its definition in module: 'program 21:34:02 rudybot: (length+ 42) 21:34:02 ijp: ; Value: 0 21:34:12 Weird! :) 21:34:41 I suppose one argument for this is that length+ has the same range as length 21:35:00 Well, it makes sense and all. It's just weird. :) 21:35:18 rudybot: when all options are equally bad, flip a coin 21:35:20 ijp: it depends on whether it's a fair coin 21:35:34 `length+' gives the number of cons-cells on the chain til the final non-cons, non-nil ending 21:35:47 nah, then you just need to flip it until you get either HH or TT 21:36:44 Euthy : anyway, i meant to ask rudybot to evaluate the following expressions : (cons* 0 1 42) (cons* 0 42) (cons* 42) 21:36:48 s/non-nil// I think? 21:36:48 -!- evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:37:05 (compare with the invalid '( . 42) above) 21:37:09 er, HT and TH, not HH and TT 21:37:25 -!- ivan\ [~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:37:26 those would just give you an even more biased coin 21:37:26 Euthy : "non-nil" was assuming an improper list was passed 21:37:43 -!- Guest56672 is now known as ter3l 21:38:04 ivan\ [~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001] has joined #scheme 21:38:27 Guest52818 [~jao@c-24-22-80-19.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:38:42 evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has joined #scheme 21:39:17 Hm, I suppose I should get more familiar with srfi-1. 21:39:22 ijp : flip until you see the same coin side in two adjacent flips ? or flip twice, repeatedly, until you get the same side in a pair ? 21:39:42 ski_: flip repeatedly until you get a HT or TH 21:40:07 BossKonaSegwaY [~Michael@cpe-75-187-45-52.columbus.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 21:40:11 same question, mutatis mutandis 21:40:22 Giomancer [~gio@107.201.206.230] has joined #scheme 21:40:51 I want to say it wouldn't matter, but probability has a way of messing with your expectations 21:41:09 +1 21:41:33 rather, (+ x 1) 21:42:11 error: x: undefined; cannot reference an identifier before its definition in module: 'program 21:42:20 lol 21:42:42 surely, +1 is + being partially applied to 1? so then the correct version is (lambda (x) (+ x 1)) 21:42:48 (cut + <> 1) :D 21:43:03 *ijp* high fives ecraven 21:43:22 *Giomancer* laughs 21:43:24 -!- evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:43:35 i still don't understand why CUT doesn't recursively search for <> :( 21:43:47 (cut (+ 1 (* 3 <>))) or something like that would be great :-/ 21:43:56 evhan [evhan@pdpc/supporter/active/evhan] has joined #scheme 21:44:07 hm, maybe code walkers are considered problematic ? 21:44:23 (cut if <> 1 2) is also disallowed (though not by the reference implementation) 21:44:36 why is that disallowed? 21:44:47 is cut a function or a macro? 21:44:47 because it is 21:45:08 because `if' is not an expression 21:45:23 Why is (cut if <> 0 1) etc. illegal? 21:45:30 It is specified that a must be either the slot symbol or an in the sense of R5RS, Section 7.1.3. As if is no , the above case is illegal. The reason why cut and cute are restricted in this sense is the difficulty of defining the meaning of such generalized expressions. Please refer to the discussion archive for details. 21:45:32 21:45:48 ijp: thanks ;) will do that later 21:45:52 proper entity encoding is left as an exercise 21:47:17 ecraven : it's a syntax 21:48:47 -!- ter3l [~William@108.85.16.151] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:53:59 rudybot: eval ((cut <>) values) 21:53:59 ski_: Done. 21:55:02 ski_: anyway, I was thinking of the "flip twice" repeatedly 21:55:19 ok 21:55:20 the other way won't work 21:59:51 -!- mutley89 [~mutley89@188.30.69.106.threembb.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:05:31 mutley89 [~mutley89@188.30.69.106.threembb.co.uk] has joined #scheme 22:06:23 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #scheme 22:06:52 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Client Quit] 22:07:15 ccorn_ [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #scheme 22:08:05 -!- jaaso [~user@178.239.31.151] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:48 -!- ccorn_ [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:11:04 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #scheme 22:12:01 juxovec [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has joined #scheme 22:16:28 -!- juxovec [~juxovec@88.103.13.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:24:41 -!- fadein [~Erik@c-67-161-246-186.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:27:40 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #scheme 22:28:21 -!- basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:29:28 Oh, this is weird 22:30:05 Apparently, truth = #t 22:30:21 I figured true would = #t 22:30:37 ? 22:31:07 At least in guile 22:31:11 *stamourv* is confused. 22:31:28 guile does not bind the identifier 'truth' 22:31:35 well 22:31:39 basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #scheme 22:31:48 nor 'true' for that matter 22:32:55 But they're both true as a symbol. :P 22:32:55 ..possibly because I was doing it wrong. Dammit. -.- 22:33:04 Let's all use 'true instead of #t. 22:33:28 gabot: slap taylanub 22:33:28 *gabot* slaps taylanub 22:33:44 taylanub: I have (define true #t) and (define false #f) in my (utils), but I went off it 22:35:24 *LeoNerd* proposes a function, (true? x) 22:35:51 (define true? (lambda (x) x)) 22:36:01 ijp: But the "?". 22:36:12 (define (true? x) (not (not x))) 22:36:15 Hush, I was trying to make a simple incrementor based on earlier 22:36:38 -!- basdirks [~basdirks@5352A1E5.cm-6-3c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:36:41 ijp: I was thinking (define (true? x) (if x #t #f)) 22:36:42 Apparently, self-referential is not the way to go? 22:37:14 Giomancer: I don't understand your statements 22:37:34 ijp: That's probably why sceme doesn't either 22:38:10 it's okay, I defined truth-plus-one. I am happy. 22:38:18 What the heck ? 22:38:27 *ijp* **** Type Error 22:38:39 It's more truthy than truth :) 22:38:46 *stamourv* is even more confused than before. 22:38:46 lol 22:38:51 Slashdot 22:38:59 rudybot: Any idea what Giomancer is doing? 22:38:59 stamourv: so Giomancer by working out such a recipe you could be doing a public service. 22:39:00 news for nerds, stuff that matters? 22:39:10 +1 for truth? 22:39:18 -.- 22:39:18 *ijp* dumps core 22:39:34 I want an `if' whose else defaults to #t. 22:39:49 Just so I can do (assert (if foo bar)). 22:40:06 I want to say it wouldn't matter, but probability has a way of messing with your expectations 22:40:19 ergo, truth-plus-one 22:40:45 taylanub: (if foo (assert bar))? 22:42:23 ijp: *Mind-blow.* For some reason I feel `assert' should be as top-level as possible, but I guess there isn't really any reason for that. 22:43:57 rudybot: Any idea what Giomancer is doing? <- I'm so saving this quote. 22:44:26 yours_truly [~yours@mc-189-127.IPReg.mcmaster.ca] has joined #scheme 22:44:44 mind blow? it's simple programming algebra. 22:45:51 I tend to think of `assert' as something compile-time. Don't ask me where I got that from, I know it doesn't make sense in Scheme. 22:46:04 assert is always runtime, even in C 22:46:20 *taylanub* shifts some neurons around. 22:46:30 it's just that they can be toggled off by the preprocessor 22:46:49 Aha. 22:47:02 taylanub: sounds like you want (assert (implies foo bar)) 22:47:18 Implying I have `implies'. 22:47:26 It's implied. 22:47:27 :P 22:47:31 *ijp* smacks taylanub upside the haid 22:47:41 Well, what you're describing is implication, not "if". 22:47:58 Which is what I meant, but not exactly what I said. 22:49:17 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #scheme 22:49:22 -!- yours_truly [~yours@mc-189-127.IPReg.mcmaster.ca] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:49:28 Hrm, is it really never called `if' in mathematics ? 22:50:27 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Material_conditional OK, so "if .. then .." is just how it's converted to English. 23:06:22 -!- agumonkey [~agu@32.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:07:20 .. hm, `( foo -> bar )' in Prolog fails in case `foo' fails 23:14:21 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:15:40 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 23:24:52 Hermit [~hermit@unaffiliated/grpala] has joined #scheme 23:35:35 hiyosi [~hiyosi@75.18.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #scheme 23:38:06 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-182-237.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:42:20 -!- bipt [~bpt@cpe-173-095-170-102.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:46:30 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@69.62.254.124] has joined #scheme 23:49:32 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-132-174.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 23:54:41 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]