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Well, I'm still having problems, and I was hoping somebody could help. 01:31:20 I'm having trouble with PLaneT, this is my first package I've tried to load. I'm trying to download the simply scheme package from here: http://planet.racket-lang.org/package-source/dyoo/simply-scheme.plt/2/2/, and I tried to type in this: http://paste.lisp.org/+2SNP, but it had this error: http://paste.lisp.org/+2SNQ. I'm using Windows 7, if that helps. Do you know what's going wrong? 01:35:45 -!- ijp is now known as totally_not_ijp 01:35:58 mhr : (a) next time, use the "Annotate this paste" button on lisppaste to add related information to a paste, instead of making a wholly new paste 01:36:42 Thanks. I cross-posted my question in #racket, is that frowned upon? 01:37:07 mhr : (b) sorry, i'm not sure about your specific error. -- i was just about to say you can also try #racket for Racket-specific questions, but i see you already did that :) 01:37:12 no, it's no problem :) 01:37:27 -!- totally_not_ijp is now known as ijp 01:37:30 (but we'd prefer if you also turned up here, and not just in #racket :) 01:38:22 I figured that I might try there because it was more specific, but because it has less users, maybe there might be more people to answer my question here, thus the cross-posting 01:40:55 yes, i think it's ok 01:50:54 mhr: see my answer in #racket. 01:56:44 mhr : .. another reason for using a proper IRC client would be that it's (commonly) easier than in a browser-embedded client to see when someone is directing a message to you :) 02:13:27 weechat! 02:14:37 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:15:15 copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #scheme 02:21:55 I downloaded one, it's just a bit more convenient in the browser with all my other websites 02:23:24 Fare [~Fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #scheme 02:23:57 what name to give to datastructure transformations from pure to impure and back? 02:28:26 if you had asked for verbs, taint and purify, or thaw and freeze 02:40:54 ephemerize and persist 02:42:22 or better, evanesce, since that's actually a word 02:42:52 hard to beat jao's taint and purify though 02:43:22 RiverSwain [~avery@host-74-211-31-90.beyondbb.com] has joined #scheme 02:44:38 -!- Sorella_ [~quildreen@201-58-248-86.user.veloxzone.com.br] has quit [Quit: (quit :reason 'sleep)] 02:46:17 mhr : does your browser highlight the chat tab, when i address you like this ? 02:46:31 it goes "Activity!" and flashes 02:46:46 so it gets my attention 02:47:04 oh, and it makes a sound as well 02:47:13 ok, good 02:47:40 it's my bed-time, so goodbye #scheme, see you later 02:47:43 -!- mhr [60fd6497@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.253.100.151] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:52:18 -!- RITRedbeard__ [~RITReadbe@c-68-37-165-37.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:53:01 ijp` [~user@host86-143-192-3.range86-143.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 02:54:42 -!- ijp [~user@host86-143-192-3.range86-143.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:56:38 instead of purify, linearize is good 02:56:44 since it's what happens 02:57:00 adu [~ajr@pool-71-191-174-241.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:57:03 ephemerize is kind of OK, but not satisfying 02:59:14 thaw and freeze would adequately describe something else, where the same graph cell went from mutable to immutable and back -- but that's more of taking an interface/unit/module/class and returning another class that internally uses the previous, but provides the other kind of interface 03:00:54 hi Fare 03:01:09 hi, adu 03:03:22 *ski* isn't quite sure what kind of thing Fare is thinking about 03:05:55 ski: I just got here 03:06:06 so I can't help 03:06:47 unless, perhaps, I said I know Fare from other places, and that he's an interesting person everywhere 03:06:47 take a pure dict datastructure 03:07:10 put it in a box, call it a mutable datastructure 03:07:12 "pure" meaning "immutable" ? 03:07:18 yes 03:07:28 I was just thinking about that 03:07:42 whether or not I should make strings immutable 03:07:43 make a mutable datastructure that at each operation, puts a new immutable datastructure in the box 03:07:55 adu: your own new language? 03:07:56 or if I wanted to worry about converting between mutable and immutable strings 03:07:59 Fare: yes 03:08:06 adu: literal strings should be immutable. 03:08:20 adu : i'd say make them immutable :) 03:08:23 otherwise, provide both interfaces and let users choose. 03:08:31 well, droscheme 03:08:32 (but also provide mutable ones) 03:08:57 I'm thinking of renaming it "dreme" so people stop bitching about no TCO 03:09:08 also, strings as arrays is bunk in the days of unicode 03:09:42 adu: :) 03:09:49 adu: skreme? 03:09:51 there's already a well-known dreme - some distributed scheme that shriram likes to cite 03:10:05 why no TCO??? 03:10:05 oh well 03:10:15 Fare: because it's hard 03:10:17 *ijp`* will never stop bitching about no TCO 03:10:24 rudybot: eval (let ((hello "there")) (string-set! hello 0 #\w) hello) 03:10:24 ski: error: string-set!: expects type as 1st argument, given: "there"; other arguments were: 0 #\w 03:10:24 it's not hard 03:10:30 rudybot: eval (let ((hello (string #\t #\h #\e #\r #\e))) (string-set! hello 0 #\w) hello) 03:10:31 ski: ; Value: "where" 03:10:36 Fare: it must be. van Rossum can't do it. 03:10:43 Fare: it's easy on VMs and ISAs 03:10:44 hm, maybe my criteria are faulty. 03:10:53 Fare: it's not easy with a transpiler 03:10:55 FurnaceBoy: the correct term there is "won't", not can't 03:11:02 ijp`: that's what he says! 03:11:14 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-137-133.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Client Quit] 03:11:16 *FurnaceBoy* takes his trollin' elsewhere, damn you ijp` 03:11:17 adu: it's only a trampoline away when on top of a bad language 03:11:25 rudybot: is tco important? 03:11:26 FurnaceBoy: The end made me realize just how useful TCO was, because it was quadruple mutually recursive, he result. 03:11:40 *ijp`* pats rudybot on the head 03:11:46 http://www.eighty-twenty.org/index.cgi/tech/oo-tail-calls-20111001.html 03:12:01 Fare: Go already has a trampoline, but it's not available from Go it's only available from the C variant they use 03:12:26 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-137-133.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 03:13:05 make your own ? 03:14:15 -!- ijp` is now known as ijp 03:14:27 *ijp* is not a big fan of trampolines 03:14:28 anyways, I might stick with the transpiler, and muddle through the TCO, call/cc and other issues at some point 03:14:47 so far the interpreter and the compiler are completely different languages 03:14:51 I'd like to fix that 03:15:05 this is the compiled language: http://andydude.github.com/droscheme/cmd/gos.html 03:15:22 bad days of lisp 03:15:35 bad days? 03:15:48 different interpreter and compiler ==> semantic discrepancies ==> bugs 03:16:12 Fare: Nice fr1st post on that 03:16:13 FurnaceBoy: won't do what? 03:16:40 adu: python won't optimise tail calls. 03:16:44 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-133.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 03:16:54 FurnaceBoy, on the Steele blog post? 03:17:06 -!- kk` [~kk@unaffiliated/kk/x-5380134] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 03:17:08 Fare: yeah. nice post too, thanks. didn't realise Fortress was so nice. 03:17:28 samth_away: that reminds me, I was surprised to see your name on the Fortress spec 03:17:43 Fare: I'm trying to make the two languages the same, at which point, I'll probably call both droscheme 03:17:59 I've already got let and let* in gos, which is a start 03:18:40 `dynamic-wind' ? 03:19:37 ski: I would probably implement that in C 03:19:37 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-133.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 03:20:45 -!- amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@p4FD6129C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:22:41 lcc [~user@unaffiliated/lcc] has joined #scheme 03:23:05 amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@p4FD60048.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 03:25:31 Fare: thanks for the link 03:26:21 what's the difference between let-values and recieve? 03:26:46 note that in the last comment of the original post, I provide the only good arguments I know of for lack of PTC. And I've never ever heard PTC opponents invoke any of them. 03:27:06 yes, I'm reading it 03:27:06 which proves that it's always ignorance driving lack of PTC. 03:27:22 adu: receive can only get the multiple values from one expression 03:27:48 rudybot: eval (let-values (((a b) (values 1 2)) ((c d) (values 3 4))) (list a b c d)) 03:27:49 ijp: your sandbox is ready 03:27:49 ijp: ; Value: (1 2 3 4) 03:32:04 -!- poisonarms [~poisonarm@cpe-70-116-22-88.austin.res.rr.com] has left #scheme 03:32:39 rudybot: recieve 03:32:40 adu: bremner, eli loves to recieve email :) 03:33:52 rudybot: (recieve (a b) (values 1 2) (list a b)) 03:33:52 adu: your sandbox is ready 03:33:52 adu: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: recieve in module: 'program 03:34:14 rudybot: (receive (a b) (values 1 2) (list a b)) 03:34:15 adu: error: reference to an identifier before its definition: receive in module: 'program 03:34:54 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@cable-77-221-28-174.dynamic.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:37:46 adu: (require srfi/8) 03:42:32 rudybot: (receive (a b) (values 1 2) (list a b)) 03:42:32 adu: ; Value: (1 2) 03:42:35 yey 03:43:04 good night 03:43:16 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-71-191-174-241.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 03:45:56 -!- RiverSwain [~avery@host-74-211-31-90.beyondbb.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:47:48 RiverSwain [~avery@host-74-211-31-90.beyondbb.com] has joined #scheme 03:50:06 -!- amgarchIn9 [~amgarchin@p4FD60048.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:58:40 b4284 [~user@122-117-157-82.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 04:01:15 imphasing [~Alex@97-81-80-39.dhcp.athn.ga.charter.com] has joined #scheme 04:01:18 -!- jao [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:01:43 -!- offby1 is now known as offby 04:01:44 -!- offby is now known as offby2 04:01:54 -!- offby2 is now known as offby1 04:06:28 youlysses 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[~chu@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:36:59 chu [~chu@unaffiliated/chu] has joined #scheme 07:50:00 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:54:37 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:56:34 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has joined #scheme 07:56:34 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has quit [Client Quit] 07:56:48 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has joined #scheme 07:56:48 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has quit [Changing host] 07:56:48 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #scheme 08:08:17 keenbug [~daniel@p4FDB66DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 08:12:02 tim_ [~tim@kompiler.org] has joined #scheme 08:15:33 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:33 -!- clog [~nef@bespin.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:27:38 masm [~masm@bl18-39-140.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 08:35:28 -!- mucker [~mucker@183.83.240.198] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:38:05 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 08:46:21 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-51.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:46:39 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #scheme 08:48:05 dropster [~Kim@port284.ds1-oebr.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #scheme 08:49:13 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@125-237-76-181.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:49:40 Do you prefer "stateful" or "state-based"? 08:50:38 Looking at http://www.r6rs.org/final/html/r6rs-lib/r6rs-lib-Z-H-9.html#node_sec_8.2.2 I see no way to specify whether to open a file-input-port for binary or for textual input in R6RS. That is quite surprising, so I'm likely overlooking something. Anyone know how to do it? 08:51:44 antithesis [~antithesi@s51476e07.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #scheme 08:54:07 hkBst: Or not; see William Clinger's post: . 09:02:59 hkBst, give open-file-input-port a transcoder if you want a textual port, otherwise you get a binary port 09:03:51 spionHL [~spion@95.180.197.146] has joined #scheme 09:03:57 weinholt: ah, thanks for the clarification. 09:10:34 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:10:45 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has joined #scheme 09:10:45 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has quit [Changing host] 09:10:45 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #scheme 09:12:15 -!- tim_ [~tim@kompiler.org] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:13:13 -!- Razz [~tim@46.4.112.245] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:13:43 Razz [~tim@kompiler.org] has joined #scheme 09:30:47 -!- realitygrill 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12:10:39 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 12:11:36 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has joined #scheme 12:11:36 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.90] has quit [Changing host] 12:11:36 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #scheme 12:12:42 -!- pygospa [~Pygosceli@kiel-5f77b643.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 12:12:49 -!- emma is now known as em 12:12:49 TheRealPygo [~Pygosceli@kiel-4dbec0e9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 12:13:53 fold [~fold@71-8-117-85.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has joined #scheme 12:14:06 hkBst, call-with-output-file opens a textual port, try instead (call-with-port (open-file-output-port ...) ...) 12:19:08 weinholt: thanks, that seems to have done it :) 12:19:30 -!- keenbug [~daniel@p4FDB66DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:19:41 Christ, why does I/O in R6RS remind me of Java? 12:19:47 There's something strang and cumbersome about it. 12:28:16 yeah, the open-*-file is particularly troublesome 12:30:43 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@ool-18ba55c0.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:31:32 realitygrill [~realitygr@ool-18ba55c0.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 12:41:02 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-162-38.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:44:10 b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 12:49:53 -!- TheRealPygo is now known as pygospa 12:54:21 -!- spionHL [~spion@95.180.197.146] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:56:38 mucker [~mucker@183.83.240.198] has joined #scheme 13:00:01 getpwnam [~ian@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 13:01:04 hash_table [~quassel@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 13:01:48 kunsel [~kunsel@dslb-188-108-008-128.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 13:06:30 keenbug 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[Quit: KVIrc 4.1.3 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 13:32:00 -!- samth_away is now known as samth 13:36:18 -!- jrslepak [~jrslepak@c-71-233-148-123.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 13:37:02 -!- b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:38:05 b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 13:39:08 make sure r7rs does better! 13:39:43 offby1: Otherwise, I'll feel really fucking anachronistic as a R5RS-die-hard. 13:41:05 offby1: well, it does come with a basically r5rs-compatible library, but without keyword arguments, the argument lists became to complicated in the extensions 13:41:57 r7rs uses a plist of options method which seems to me to be inferior to keyword arguments, though it does avoid this problem 13:43:12 -!- b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:46:01 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable151.155-57-74.mc.videotron.ca] has 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[~ian@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 14:54:14 hash_table [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 14:55:33 -!- ijp [~user@host31-53-23-51.range31-53.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:02:05 phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has joined #scheme 15:06:40 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 15:07:00 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:07:40 -!- langmartin [~user@host-68-169-154-130.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:08:08 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-sngcnkktnzgdeylz] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 15:12:03 aloysius21 [~user@99-123-152-51.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 15:12:55 SanderM [~quassel@vhe-le16b105.sshn.net] has joined #scheme 15:13:31 hello 15:13:37 Any Dutch Schemers around? 15:13:54 <- dutch, not yet a schemer 15:14:00 ah 15:14:01 I'm a French Common Lisper, if that's close enough? 15:14:14 LOL 15:14:34 shardz [~samantha@ilo.staticfree.info] has joined #scheme 15:14:42 I am beginning to learn Scheme this summer ... I would like to buy The Scheme Programming Language ed. 4 from someone for a fair price. 15:15:01 There's htdp and sicp for free on the web. 15:15:04 Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/full-text/book/book-Z-H-4.html http://swiss.csail.mit.edu/classes/6.001/abelson-sussman-lectures/ 15:15:11 How to Design Programs -- An Introduction to Computing and Programming http://www.htdp.org/2003-09-26/Book/ 15:15:20 answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has joined #scheme 15:16:15 Yes, TSPL 4 is also freely available in HTML format, but I would like to buy a second hand book because that reads nices / when away from my home PC 15:16:19 nicer 15:16:31 Yup. 15:16:35 thanks for the links pjb, dit not know the last one 15:16:39 *pjb* uses an iPad to read away from the PC. 15:16:40 did 15:17:00 SanderM: check http://schemers.org 15:20:07 -!- masm [~masm@bl18-39-140.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:20:39 -!- answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:20:40 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:28:40 -!- mgsk [~Mark@li357-97.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 15:29:00 mgsk [~Mark@li357-97.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 15:29:53 -!- mgsk [~Mark@li357-97.members.linode.com] has quit [Client Quit] 15:30:01 mgsk [~Mark@li357-97.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 15:32:04 -!- amoe [~amoe@host-78-147-108-222.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:36:23 langmartin [~user@host-68-169-175-226.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has joined #scheme 15:39:05 -!- abel [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:39:11 abel1 [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 15:47:33 confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has joined #scheme 15:58:33 ffs [~garland@unaffiliated/ffs] has joined #scheme 16:24:05 masm [~masm@bl18-39-140.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 16:30:07 -!- b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:33:10 -!- aloysius21 [~user@99-123-152-51.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:35:23 b4283 [~user@114-47-14-24.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 16:36:30 bfgun [~b_fin_g@r190-135-54-47.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 16:44:37 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-nvpxshhiplmtipou] has joined #scheme 16:45:37 -!- phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:46:37 phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has joined #scheme 16:54:39 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-167-88.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 16:54:52 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-189-161.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:56:07 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-189-161.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:57:49 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-167-88.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 17:01:18 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:01:48 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 17:04:13 mmc1 [~michal@178-85-66-32.dynamic.upc.nl] has joined #scheme 17:06:50 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@159.93.171.83] has joined #scheme 17:09:06 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:09:17 jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has joined #scheme 17:10:18 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 17:11:10 -!- confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:11:20 nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-144-35.w90-26.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 17:12:03 -!- nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-139-231.w90-26.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:18:59 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #scheme 17:19:54 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:22:38 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:25:46 -!- spionHL [~spion@95.180.197.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:26:07 -!- phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:26:55 phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has joined #scheme 17:29:21 -!- phao [phao@177.174.19.204] has quit [Client Quit] 17:29:30 -!- ijp` [~user@host86-143-194-173.range86-143.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:38:34 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 17:39:17 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-nvpxshhiplmtipou] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 17:40:36 -!- dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:40:54 -!- abel1 [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:43:18 can anyone help enlighten me about the issue discussed in the thread http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guile-devel/2012-07/msg00006.html ? 17:43:46 people should have stumbled over this previously, right? 17:44:55 spionHL [~spion@89.205.110.217] has joined #scheme 17:45:58 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 17:46:38 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.174] has joined #scheme 17:46:38 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.12.174] has quit [Changing host] 17:46:38 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #scheme 17:47:08 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:01:42 -!- keenbug [~daniel@p4FDB66DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:02:10 sstrickl [~sstrickl@racket/sstrickl] has joined #scheme 18:02:39 random_malice [~ian@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:03:00 bro_grammer [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:03:52 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:04:09 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 18:04:47 axe_wielder [~ian@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:05:38 -!- hash_table [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:06:05 -!- getpwnam [~ian@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:06:42 hash_table [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:06:47 getpwnam [~ian@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:07:44 Blkt [~user@82.84.189.92] has joined #scheme 18:07:54 -!- bro_grammer [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:08:03 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:08:26 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 18:08:30 -!- random_malice [~ian@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:13 -!- axe_wielder [~ian@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:13:17 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:13:44 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:14:04 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@91.119.101.47] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:15:05 -!- teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:16:43 answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has joined #scheme 18:19:28 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #scheme 18:20:33 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Client Quit] 18:25:54 -!- answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:28:17 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:29:43 -!- mucker [~mucker@183.83.240.198] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:30:06 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@cable-77-221-28-174.dynamic.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:31:27 abel [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 18:31:37 teiresias [~teiresias@archlinux/trusteduser/teiresias] has joined #scheme 18:33:26 -!- dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:34:53 anothervenue [~lucasallm@71-92-223-50.static.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #scheme 18:36:40 is there a proposal for reader macros in r7rs ? 18:37:52 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 18:39:12 dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has joined #scheme 18:39:12 -!- dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:40:23 answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has joined #scheme 18:43:22 random_malice [~ian@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:43:42 dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has joined #scheme 18:43:42 -!- dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:43:43 bro_grammer [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has joined #scheme 18:44:49 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 18:46:09 -!- getpwnam [~ian@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:46:30 -!- hash_table [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:49:18 -!- answer_42 [~answer_42@gateway/tor-sasl/answer42/x-66983568] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:50:07 -!- gf3 [~gf3@oftn/member/gf3] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:50:21 stis: I'm not sure what the question is. 18:51:07 Hygiene should just "do the right thing" here. 18:55:14 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-tztwtlkfccginxru] has joined #scheme 18:55:47 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-tztwtlkfccginxru] has quit [Client Quit] 18:58:37 follow the thread, in #`(let ((x 1)) #,(f #'x)) the passed #'x to f does not capture the binding! 18:58:56 that's the root of the issue! 18:59:28 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-fcjvwsywrfhqnxsf] has joined #scheme 18:59:53 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-fcjvwsywrfhqnxsf] has quit [Client Quit] 18:59:56 confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has joined #scheme 19:00:13 stis: well, it shouldn't. it's not the same variable. 19:00:51 yes that's what the semantic for #' and #, is .... 19:01:13 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-nqobgrgzebgoptkw] has joined #scheme 19:01:13 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-nqobgrgzebgoptkw] has quit [Client Quit] 19:01:24 stis: the way to get the first instance to bind the latter is probably to use the same #'x in both positions. 19:02:53 Yes but then you must make sure to make use of unique variables, trust me, havoc appears if you do not use generate-temporaries ... 19:03:00 gf3 [~gf3@oftn/member/gf3] has joined #scheme 19:03:46 e.g. (with-syntax ((x (generate-gensymed-variable))) (let ...)) 19:04:12 but this is not the nice macro interface you are used to, right! ... 19:05:02 I would propose a syntactic sugar #. so that #`(let ((x 1)) #.((x) (f #'x))) translates to ... 19:05:37 why change the language to cater for a bug? 19:05:39 Hmm, though actually the xs seem to be considered the same in Racket. 19:05:47 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:06:02 it is a psyntax issue 19:06:11 tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has joined #scheme 19:06:33 Yeah, nevermind then. I was wrong. 19:06:35 #`(let-syntax ((g (lambda (x) (syntax x () ((_ x) (f #'x)))))) (let ((x 1)) (g x))) 19:06:52 leppie: psyntax bug? 19:07:35 well I get the same in IronScheme, so I assume that 19:08:24 although I must say, that the usage seems questionable 19:09:33 #'x is not actually bound to anything in all your examples (except were you explicitly introduce the pattern variable with with-syntax) 19:09:42 Yeah, I experimented trying to stay away from normal macro heavy lifting and use more functions via #` for a matcher implementing racket match syntax 19:10:26 It did have a nice semantic, but the drawback was that you needed to go back writing in CL macro style .... 19:10:56 I thought that you could write it nicely in a schemier style with the proposed #. 19:14:27 dan64 [~dan64@dannyadam.com] has joined #scheme 19:29:37 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 19:47:27 -!- tcleval [~tcleval@186.213.59.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:48:22 -!- confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 19:54:52 -!- spionHL [~spion@89.205.110.217] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:57:08 -!- RiverSwain [~avery@host-74-211-31-90.beyondbb.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:02:28 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-ftvilrichyxworrh] has joined #scheme 20:03:26 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:05:32 -!- dzhus [~dzhus@95-25-114-44.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:06:19 amoe [~amoe@host-2-99-117-85.as13285.net] has joined #scheme 20:10:50 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:16:06 cdidd [~cdidd@128-68-164-252.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 20:25:18 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:30:02 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@128-68-164-252.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:30:49 -!- Quadresce is now known as Quadrescence 20:31:35 cdidd [~cdidd@128-72-105-1.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 20:36:50 fantazo [~fantazo@91.119.101.47] has joined #scheme 20:40:11 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #scheme 20:41:01 -!- antithesis [~antithesi@s51476e07.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: antithesis] 20:47:42 Aethaeryn [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #scheme 20:50:26 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@159.93.171.83] has left #scheme 20:52:13 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-ftvilrichyxworrh] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 21:03:06 -!- abel [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:04:47 -!- random_malice [~ian@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:05:14 -!- bro_grammer [~quassel@128.249.96.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:06:24 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 21:07:31 abel [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 21:09:00 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-ehnzdhwednvohuvp] has joined #scheme 21:15:06 bipt [~bpt@cpe-071-070-253-241.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 21:18:01 -!- gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:19:09 -!- peeeep [~potato@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:19:11 -!- sizz [~sizz@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:19:12 gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has joined #scheme 21:19:27 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@cable-77-221-28-174.dynamic.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 21:20:09 lcc [~user@unaffiliated/lcc] has joined #scheme 21:20:31 -!- SanderM [~quassel@vhe-le16b105.sshn.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:21:41 sizz [~sizz@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 21:22:44 peeeep [~potato@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 21:23:51 -!- bfgun is now known as bfig 21:24:03 -!- tupi [~david@139.82.89.157] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:33:21 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:42:12 psYchotic [~psYchotic@195-240-119-96.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #scheme 21:43:26 good evening, ladies and gentlemen 21:43:42 -!- ASau [~user@95-26-249-50.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:46:27 -!- soegaard [~soegaard@188.183.250.62] has quit [Quit: soegaard] 21:46:51 I have a short question, and I was hoping someone could perhaps help me out 21:47:09 psYchotic: shoot 21:47:16 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #scheme 21:47:47 it appears (apply and '(args)) is invalid (though I only tried this in guile). It says "and" is a builtin macro or somesuch 21:48:05 And is macro, yes 21:48:13 It has to be, to have the shortcut semantics 21:48:47 that makes some sense. Now, is there any way to have the intented semantics work in some other way? 21:48:53 You could try (fold (lambda (a b) (and a b)) args) 21:49:39 lemme give that a quick whirl 21:50:30 -!- abel [~austin@ool-4577ba80.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:51:07 hrm, fold's an unbound variable 21:51:13 psYchotic: I think you just want andmap here. 21:51:18 (with identity function) 21:51:42 rudybot: (andmap (lambda (x) x) '(#t #t #t #f)) 21:51:44 asumu: your sandbox is ready 21:51:44 asumu: ; Value: #f 21:52:01 It worries me that isn't called and/map 21:52:15 After all, the laziness of the `and` macro is irrelevant since you already have a list (which is eager). 21:54:03 this andmap doesn't seem to be defined either =( Perhaps I should state that I'm an utter nooblet when it comes to anything scheme 21:54:30 psYchotic: what implementation are you using? Maybe you should use one with more stuff built-in. 21:55:01 -!- jrslepak [~jrslepak@nomad.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:55:03 guile (v1.8.8) 21:56:45 though I should probably be able to load extensions that contain these things 21:57:05 psYchotic: for fold, try (use-modules (srfi srfi-1)) 21:57:44 In Guile, it's called `and-map`. 21:58:11 sweet 21:58:12 -!- langmartin [~user@host-68-169-175-226.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:59:13 getpwnam [~ian@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 22:00:01 soegaard [~soegaard@188.183.250.62] has joined #scheme 22:00:03 hash_table [~quassel@70-138-242-181.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 22:01:20 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@cable-77-221-28-174.dynamic.vinet.ba] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:01:42 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@cable-77-221-28-174.dynamic.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 22:05:30 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-ehnzdhwednvohuvp] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 22:08:48 I'm not quite sure if (and-map) is what I'm looking for. Anyhow, perhaps it's best if I show you why I'm asking this question: 22:09:05 "7. Define the logical operator nand (not and) using not and and." 22:09:35 in trying to get myself acquainted with at least the basics of scheme, I went on a quest to find some exercises on the web 22:09:51 and this one has me stumped (maybe because I'm too eager) 22:10:11 or perhaps because I'm an idiot =) 22:10:18 psYchotic: how general are you trying to make this? A two-input nand, for example, should be easy and you don't need apply. 22:10:59 asumu: exactly, a two-input implementation isn't the problem. I just wanted to be thorough, and try to make it as general as regular 'and' 22:11:21 You will probably need a macro for that. 22:11:36 (just a simple syntax-rules macro should suffice though) 22:12:01 I suppose I'll have to wait until I get how macro definition works then 22:12:02 Err, no. Actually you can just use andmap. 22:12:32 ooh, (and-map and '(#f #t #f #f)) works =) 22:12:34 Though if your exercise says you must use `not` and `and` that's kinda cheating. 22:12:57 it kinda is 22:13:19 I doubt the exercise was written with doing an n-ary nand in mind though. 22:13:25 So I wouldn't worry about it. 22:13:45 I'll try again when I understand macros 22:14:01 thanks a bunch for the help there though 22:14:15 I'll stick around for now 22:16:59 jrslepak [~jrslepak@c-71-233-148-123.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 22:19:31 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-wtqpevdhlnzuemgr] has joined #scheme 22:20:12 -!- Aethaeryn [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has left #scheme 22:20:33 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:28:42 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:41:27 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has left #scheme 22:45:44 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-wtqpevdhlnzuemgr] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 22:46:42 copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #scheme 22:47:06 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@91.119.101.47] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:47:59 -!- sstrickl [~sstrickl@racket/sstrickl] has quit [Quit: sstrickl] 22:49:32 realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-boazjxoziqmwchrs] has joined #scheme 22:50:06 -!- realitygrill [realitygri@nat/hackerschool.com/x-boazjxoziqmwchrs] has quit [Client Quit] 22:54:12 Sorella [~quildreen@201-58-248-86.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #scheme 22:54:12 -!- Sorella [~quildreen@201-58-248-86.user.veloxzone.com.br] has quit [Changing host] 22:54:12 Sorella [~quildreen@oftn/member/Sorella] has joined #scheme 23:04:57 -!- soegaard [~soegaard@188.183.250.62] has quit [Quit: soegaard] 23:07:39 confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has joined #scheme 23:12:04 -!- ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:14:54 lcc` [~user@75-173-94-202.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 23:15:04 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-51.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:16:07 -!- lcc [~user@unaffiliated/lcc] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:17:40 -!- lcc` [~user@75-173-94-202.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 23:18:49 rbarraud [~rbarraud@125-237-76-181.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #scheme 23:19:18 -!- mmc1 [~michal@178-85-66-32.dynamic.upc.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:20:30 yoklov [~yoklov@66-168-47-170.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has joined #scheme 23:29:11 -!- samth is now known as samth_away 23:31:37 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@racket/jonrafkind] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:32:05 -!- leo2007 [~leo@222.130.138.85] has quit [Quit: off to work] 23:36:58 mmc1 [~michal@178.85.66.32] has joined #scheme 23:42:52 -!- psYchotic [~psYchotic@195-240-119-96.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Quit: ]