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quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:46:57 -!- confab [~confab@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 01:54:25 -!- Whitesqu_ is now known as Whitesquall 01:59:17 -!- rageous [~Adium@71-215-200-175.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:08:03 hypnocat [~hypnocat@unaffiliated/hypnocat] has joined #scheme 02:08:10 what's the difference between "reduce" and "fold" from srfi-1 ? 02:09:36 sharkbird_ [~sharkbird@67-220-6-139.usiwireless.com] has joined #scheme 02:12:38 (reduce f i l) = (if (null? l) i (fold f (car l) (cdr l))) 02:13:48 it is a specialisation for efficiency when f is expensive 02:13:52 -!- mmc [~michal@178-85-63-71.dynamic.upc.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:14:22 -!- sharkbird_ [~sharkbird@67-220-6-139.usiwireless.com] has quit [Client Quit] 02:15:43 I don't think I've ever had a reason to actually use it 02:15:44 thank you 02:20:52 kniu [~kniu@pool-108-3-66-83.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:21:01 jhemann 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[~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 08:41:04 zxq9 [~zxq9@FL1-119-244-165-111.okn.mesh.ad.jp] has joined #scheme 08:45:56 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-164-128.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 08:49:37 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@3ad50e34.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:59:34 masm [~masm@bl18-60-119.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 09:07:48 antithesis [~antithesi@s51476e07.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #scheme 09:15:04 -!- noam [~noam@37.142.141.69] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:15:19 noam [~noam@37.142.141.69] has joined #scheme 09:26:54 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 09:28:27 Radium_ [~carbon@117.203.13.123] has joined #scheme 09:33:48 RomyRomy [~stickycak@207.239.107.3] has joined #scheme 09:35:27 -!- RomyRomy [~stickycak@207.239.107.3] has quit [Client Quit] 09:42:50 fschwidom [~fschwidom@46.115.22.17] has joined #scheme 09:47:37 -!- zxq9 [~zxq9@FL1-119-244-165-111.okn.mesh.ad.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:59:57 leo2007 [~leo@221.223.82.57] has joined #scheme 10:09:06 -!- Radium_ [~carbon@117.203.13.123] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:09:29 Radium [~carbon@117.203.12.56] has joined #scheme 10:14:16 jhemann_ [~Jason@adsl-108-67-91-121.dsl.bltnin.sbcglobal.net] has joined #scheme 10:14:16 -!- jhemann [~Jason@99.102.184.28] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:15:31 -!- bipt [~bpt@cpe-071-070-253-241.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:19:34 ijp: Sometimes reduce is required for correctness. 10:19:51 ijp: For example, if you want to implement max/min without a sentinel value, reduce is required. 10:20:32 ijp: Also, implementing compose using reduce allows the outermost function call to be called in tail context. 10:47:06 -!- leo2007 [~leo@221.223.82.57] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.0.95.1] 10:48:14 -!- Radium [~carbon@117.203.12.56] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:50:07 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:59:21 soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has joined #scheme 10:59:22 tomobrien [~tomobrien@host-92-2-79-163.as43234.net] has joined #scheme 11:05:11 homie``` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-130-161.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 11:07:08 -!- homie`` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-137-7.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:26:08 max/min of an empty set is an ill-defined problem. So reduce would not help here 11:36:25 cdidd [~cdidd@95-28-18-117.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 11:39:49 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@3ad50e34.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #scheme 11:46:55 -!- soveran [~soveran@186.19.214.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:53:32 lolcow [~lolcow@196-209-224-100.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 11:54:40 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-209-224-100.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:02:11 amgarching: Try implementing max/min using reduce, then using fold. 12:02:18 amgarching: Let's assume the list is never empty. 12:02:33 amgarching: _Without_ using sentinels, I assure you that a fold-based max/min is impossible to implement. 12:02:45 (+inf.0 and -inf.0 are sentinels for this discussion.) 12:03:32 *without limitation 12:04:12 Arafangion` [~Arafangio@220-244-108-23.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #scheme 12:04:20 (i.e., +inf.0 and -inf.0 are not the only sentinels (other non-numbers, like '(), #f, etc. are also sentinels), but I highlighted them specifically because there's a great temptation to use +inf.0 and -inf.0 for this.) 12:05:44 madmuppet006 [~user@122-62-124-247.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #scheme 12:11:52 -!- antithesis [~antithesi@s51476e07.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: yes leaving] 12:14:35 mmalorni [~mmalorni@modemcable026.84-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 12:15:14 answer_42 [~answer_42@ip82-139-82-98.lijbrandt.net] has joined #scheme 12:17:04 -!- Arafangion` [~Arafangio@220-244-108-23.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:22:18 langmartin [~user@host-68-169-155-216.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has joined #scheme 12:22:36 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.36.104] has joined #scheme 12:25:11 -!- drumond19 [~drumond19@186.214.55.53] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:32:33 cky: I would just use foldl1 or foldr1. Any value you choose for the identity would would be arbitrary. 12:34:37 -!- didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:34:42 ijp: You've still missed my point. :-) 12:34:52 Unless foldl1 or foldr1 do what reduce does. 12:34:56 -!- dzhus [~sphinx@95-25-216-229.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:34:59 reduce does one thing extra 12:35:12 namely _require_ an arbitrary value 12:35:15 Ah. 12:35:24 Well, then, yes, foldl1/foldr1 is just fine. 12:35:28 and if we are picking arbitrary values, +inf.0 and -inf.0 aren't bad 12:35:28 antithesis [~antithesi@s51476e07.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #scheme 12:36:00 ijp: But I was speaking about the SRFI 1 universe, where fold and reduce are your only options. 12:36:04 It suddenly escapes me: is the a function for finding the index of an element in a list (index '(a b c) 'b) => 1 12:36:08 (Well, and fold-right and reduce-right.) 12:37:10 rudybot: (require srfi/1) 12:37:10 cky: your sandbox is ready 12:37:11 cky: Done. 12:37:15 -!- kniu [~kniu@pool-71-182-240-124.pitbpa.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:37:44 mgsk: list-index almost does that, but it takes a predicate instead 12:37:47 rudybot: (define (list-eq?-index lst val) (list-index (lambda (x) (eq? x val)) lst)) 12:37:48 cky: Done. 12:37:58 rudybot: (list-eq?-index '(a b c) 'b) 12:37:58 cky: ; Value: 1 12:38:20 cky: thanks 12:39:33 yes, i didn't see it in LINT* 12:40:00 (sorry folks, other channel) 12:42:09 rudybot: (map (lambda (x) (x +inf.0 +inf.0)) (list < = >)) 12:42:09 ijp: your sandbox is ready 12:42:09 ijp: ; Value: (#f #t #f) 12:44:01 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.195.55] has joined #scheme 12:44:12 well, there is one issue with using infinities as the identity, which is that they are inexact 12:44:29 and so the result will be inexact 12:46:25 -!- fschwidom [~fschwidom@46.115.22.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:47:06 -!- xwl_ [user@nat/nokia/x-xyxleevzkahgluad] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:47:24 kvda [~kvda@202.58.240.18] has joined #scheme 12:48:18 bfgun [~b_fin_g@r186-53-190-40.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 12:48:38 cky: I see the type of result for min/max as a "sum type" Fail | Number, because of the zero-length case. Fail is the sentinel and the seed to a fold in my book. 12:52:30 -!- bigfg [~b_fin_g@r186-53-144-43.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:58:16 amgarching: Okay. Which would you prefer between these? (define (min lst) (reduce (lambda (x y) (if (< x y) x y)) #f lst)) vs (define (min lst) (fold (lambda (x y) (if (and y (< x y)) x y)) #f lst))? 12:58:36 (Heh, I just realised that the fold version here isn't considerably more complicated than the reduce version. Oh well. 12:58:38 ) 12:59:15 rudybot: (define (my-min lst) (fold (lambda (x y) (if (and y (< x y)) x y)) #f lst)) 12:59:15 cky: Done. 12:59:18 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-55-233.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 12:59:22 rudybot: (my-min '(3 1 4 1 5 9)) 12:59:22 cky: ; Value: #f 13:00:20 Hmmmmm. 13:00:54 rudybot: (define (my-min lst) (fold (lambda (x y) (if (or (not y) (< x y)) x y)) #f lst)) 13:00:55 cky: Done. 13:00:57 rudybot: (my-min '(3 1 4 1 5 9)) 13:00:57 cky: ; Value: 1 13:01:04 There. Okay, that did make things more complicated. :-P 13:01:49 can anyone point me to some good examples of using iteration in scheme .. Im trying to solve one of the problems in sicp 1.11 .. I can write a recurring procedure ok but am struggling with writing it using iteration 13:02:53 Is that the F(1) = 1, F(2) = 2, F(3) = 3, F(n) = F(n-1) + 2*F(n-2) + 3*F(n-3) one? 13:03:44 min/max are supposed to choose between two, so having a placeholder is more "general" given lists of lenght 1 and 0. From a recent code: http://pastebin.com/H5WHC5Eu this can be formulated as a minimization with a castom min. It is good to have a minimization procedure that can handle such problems. 13:04:00 cky:yes 13:04:47 madmuppet006: the iter version is written to use a tail call 13:05:20 madmuppet006: a named LET would be ideal here 13:09:50 arcfide [~arcfide@c-98-223-204-153.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 13:09:58 Use a named let in three variables, storing the previous three terms. 13:10:21 Invoke the next iteration by shifting the terms up and adding a new one. Invoke it initially with the first three values 13:10:35 Ohwait four variables; need to track n :) 13:12:50 thanks guys Im gonna have another crack at it .. 13:13:17 look at the iterative fibinaci version 13:14:17 -!- lolcow is now known as leppie 13:16:00 lolcow: this is what I have for fibocanni http://pastebin.com/7T6cBXZb 13:16:20 keenbug [~daniel@p4FE3B7F7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 13:19:53 tupi [~david@139.82.89.24] has joined #scheme 13:20:46 dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 13:27:00 -!- langmartin [~user@host-68-169-155-216.WISOLT2.epbfi.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:29:56 madmuppet006: yes, now use that to hint at what you should do 13:32:59 leppie: thanks for the help .. 13:35:30 preflex_ [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has joined #scheme 13:35:43 -!- preflex [~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:35:51 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit 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17:48:43 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-244.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 17:53:49 kk` [~kk@unaffiliated/kk/x-5380134] has joined #scheme 18:00:12 Kirill [~user@108.175.227.202] has joined #scheme 18:00:12 can someone tell me why the following fails in gambit: (eval '(define-syntax foo (syntax-rules () ((_) 'hi)))) 18:00:12 18:00:20 it dies with "Ill-formed expression: ()" 18:00:52 am I missing something? 18:01:48 That () is not a constant. 18:01:56 It is a malformed function call with no function. 18:02:10 (In most Lisps, () *is* a constant, but not Scheme.) 18:02:30 Oh, sorry, knee-jerk response. 18:02:40 Kirill: define-syntax must be explicitly-enabled in Gambit: http://dynamo.iro.umontreal.ca/~gambit/wiki/index.php?title=Documentation:Special_form_define-syntax 18:02:41 http://tinyurl.com/4vmvsg4 18:03:42 evhan: but I did enable it =) 18:03:57 evhan: running this fragment using gsc -:s -i works fine 18:03:59 removing the -i croaks with the above 18:05:10 I mean, removing the -i and then running the generated executable croaks with the above 18:05:28 -!- tomobrien [~tomobrien@host-92-2-79-163.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:05:30 FreeArtMan [~fam@213.175.106.134] has joined #scheme 18:05:39 any ideas? 18:05:41 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@3ad50e34.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #scheme 18:15:49 -!- FreeArtMan [~fam@213.175.106.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:17:14 -!- choas [~lars@p5795CA92.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:21:53 cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #scheme 18:33:40 FreeArtMan [~fam@213.175.106.134] has joined #scheme 18:41:29 -!- mmalorni [~mmalorni@modemcable026.84-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:46:18 lcc [~user@unaffiliated/lcc] has joined #scheme 18:46:46 -!- bfgun is now known as bfig 18:52:14 -!- Kirill [~user@108.175.227.202] has left #scheme 18:53:59 rageous [~Adium@71-215-200-175.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 18:57:36 cswords 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