00:00:35 prototrout [~steve@ip-64-255-129-222.ideaone.net] has joined #scheme 00:01:53 -!- gnomon [~gnomon@174.119.66.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:02:09 gnomon [~gnomon@CPE0022158a8221-CM000f9f776f96.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 00:13:16 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #scheme 00:15:59 leppie: :-) ("If it compiles, then it _must_ be right!") 00:16:21 leppie: I wish programming were really that simple. ;-) 00:18:19 Then you could just use randomize to generate source-code... 00:19:12 Actually I want to write a scheme program to that generates a random scheme function and calls it, just to see how long it takes before I am crashing 00:19:33 :-O 00:19:59 you're likely to hit an unbounded loop before a crash 00:20:58 pyro-: Well, no, try calling car/cdr on a non-dotted-pair on an implementation that doesn't check. ;-) 00:21:13 cat /dev/random | perl # totally works :) 00:21:17 pyro-: You instantly enter nasal demon territory. 00:21:40 ijp: Lol. 00:28:20 -!- jcowan_ [c6b912cf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.198.185.18.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:29:14 -!- yretssin is now known as Nisstyre 00:34:56 hypercube32 [~hypercube@231.125.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 00:35:51 -!- whitequark [~whitequar@dagaz.whitequark.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:41:01 fbass [~fbass@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 00:46:40 -!- hypercube32 [~hypercube@231.125.189.72.cfl.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:46:44 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:47:03 whitequark [~whitequar@dagaz.whitequark.org] has joined #scheme 00:48:23 phax [~phax@adsl-68-77-75-115.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has joined #scheme 00:48:23 -!- phax [~phax@adsl-68-77-75-115.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:48:23 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #scheme 00:49:49 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@ip24-251-16-3.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #scheme 00:49:51 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@ip24-251-16-3.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:49:51 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has joined #scheme 00:57:43 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:59:01 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 01:01:19 -!- fbass [~fbass@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:01:28 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 01:04:26 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-60-27.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 01:06:31 -!- dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:07:44 -!- zelak [~zelak@pdpc/supporter/student/zelak] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:07:52 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:08:28 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 01:08:41 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 01:11:39 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:13:48 -!- yosafbri` [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:15:32 yosafbridge [~yosafbrid@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #scheme 01:16:03 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 01:16:12 -!- ASau [~user@95-26-244-67.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:16:50 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-73-140.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 01:20:27 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 01:25:03 kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-160-12.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #scheme 01:26:19 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:26:35 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 01:36:54 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.20/20110805211839]] 01:37:46 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #scheme 01:38:09 -!- Kajtek [~paniwladc@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:43:02 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: 2017] 01:45:39 Quick show of hands: who pronounces "trie" like "try", and who pronounces it like "tree"? 01:46:10 Tree 01:47:02 permagreen: Thanks; that's N = 1, I suppose, which is good enough for anecdotes. You agree with Fredkin, then. 01:48:59 Damn, neither jcowan nor Riastradh around; have to consult later. 01:49:45 -!- turbofail [~user@c-107-3-149-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:51:08 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:51:18 I just don't pronounce it. I think all my discussions on it have been in text chats like this. 01:51:30 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.20/20110805211839]] 01:54:38 levi: Yeah, but don't you have some kind of Internal Voice of Narration (TM) that you've carried around since reader-hood? 01:54:48 How do you read if you don't implicitly sound in-head? 01:57:55 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has joined #scheme 02:04:17 leo2007 [~leo@58.22.114.132] has joined #scheme 02:04:25 I dither. 02:06:05 offby1: Meaning, you're uncertain about the pronunciation; or the noise in your head when you read internally is indistinct and garbled? 02:07:47 +1 for try 02:09:21 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:09:40 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 02:10:21 uncertain, and if I were to try to pronounce it, I'd probably say "Is it 'tree' or 'try'?" 02:10:59 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:11:21 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@pool-71-173-93-142.ptldme.east.myfairpoint.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.20/20110805211839]] 02:14:52 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 02:14:58 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:15:03 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 02:20:25 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 02:20:57 I usually say "tree, err, try." 02:21:46 You could say `radix tree'. 02:27:33 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:27:50 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 02:31:58 Sometimes I use that too. 02:33:40 Riastradh: What about your soliloquy when writing this (which was the motivation for the above discussion): ? 02:33:47 Does it say "tree" or "try"? 02:35:57 mmm ... hash browns 02:36:04 ies 02:36:26 I usually pronounce `hash tree' and `hash trie' identically. Of course, that `soliloquy' has other eyebrow-worthy parts too. 02:39:03 I ran into Ed Fredkin a few weeks ago, but the conversation never turned to this most critical issue of computational linguistics. 02:39:56 Outside the context of `hash trie' I usually do like foof does: `tree -- er, try -- err, TEE-ARE-EYE-EE, however that thing is pronounced'. 02:42:41 -!- jrapdx [~jra@74-95-41-205-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:46:09 What are you doing with that code? 02:47:50 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:53:32 Riastradh: What a wasted opportunity! I'm implementing a hang-man solver as part of an application; I was looking for a trie with fixed arity, but your code will probably do fine. 03:10:39 drdo` [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #scheme 03:12:11 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:12:31 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:18:21 Hmm... I guess the R5RS was right to leave the semantics of throws into and out of DYNAMIC-WIND frotzes unspecified, because I just tested Scheme48, MIT Scheme, and the R6RS, and they all disagree with what I expected the obvious semantics would be. 03:18:55 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:19:44 The R6RS's rationale is silent on the subject; it gives only a largely bogus remark on the utility of DYNAMIC-WIND. 03:20:20 hm 03:20:36 is there a way to force a download of the target of the current link in w3m? 03:20:40 In particular, I expected, given (define (f g) (cwcc (lambda (k) (dynamic-wind (lambda () (f k)) (lambda () (k 1)) (lambda () (k 2], that (list (f (lambda (k) 0)) (f (lambda (k) (k 0] would give the list (2 2). 03:20:45 elly: a 03:21:48 Scheme48 gives the list Scheme48 heap overflow, and MIT Scheme and the R6RS both give the list (2 0). 03:21:50 danke, Riastradh 03:22:34 Rationale for (2 2): You're guaranteed a chance to clean up, and DYNAMIC-WIND won't go into a loop. 03:22:54 -!- rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:23:10 Please explain why this is wrong. 03:23:15 -!- pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-5f76981f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:23:25 pygospa [~TheRealPy@kiel-4dbed512.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #scheme 03:25:51 (MIT Scheme's excuse for its semantics: Interrupts are disabled during the before and after thunks anyway, so you're guaranteed a chance to clean up in the important case.) 03:25:59 Riastradh: The above doesn't make sense to me, where are you using G? 03:26:13 I meant (g k), not (f k). 03:26:16 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 03:26:32 Oh, okay. 03:27:54 Come to think of it, that excuse is a better rationale, provided that `interrupts are disabled' is replaced by an appropriate higher-level concept like Racket's breaks. 03:29:01 I fully expected to get (2 0) and I would not have expected to get (2 2). 03:29:06 Here's my reasoning: 03:31:14 jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has joined #scheme 03:31:26 (let ([z (lambda (k) 0)]) (f z)) => 2 because we first enter the (lambda () (g k)) part which applies Z to K, which then returns zero, and the entry thunk is done, so we go to the body thunk, which invokes a continuation, and jumps out, invoking the third thunk, which invokes the continuation of two, and thus we've filled that continuation and we move on. 03:32:42 (let ([z (lambda (k) (k 0))]) (f z)) => 0 because when we apply Z to K in the first thunk, we subsequently invoke K on zero, returning us to the outer continuation, and we never enter the bedy, because control never entered the body, and hence, we never run either the body thunk or the final thunk. 03:32:59 s/bedy/body/ 03:34:33 That's not rationale; that's a choice of semantics. 03:34:52 As for your rationale, you haven't entered the body, so you haven't entered the region of code that should be protected. 03:35:16 You're implicitly asking for a ``clean-up'' assurance on the entry code as well as the body code. 03:37:06 With your semantics, there's no way to stop your creation code for some reason without guaranteeing that the clean-up code is run. I would want more control than that. 03:37:39 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:37:43 Sure there is. (let ((ready? #f)) (dynamic-wind (lambda () ... (set! ready? #t) ...) ... (lambda () (if ready? (clean-up] 03:38:02 Say that my clean-up code initializes a socket to make sure that I have a valid connection, but it determines that there is no network connection at all, and it needs to throw some fatal error. You don't want to run the cleanup code until you're assured that the creation code succeeded. 03:38:39 I don't want to have to share that sort of explicit state for something like this. 03:39:01 It's a choice of failure modes. Fail safe or fail sorry... 03:39:29 I would just want to be able to say (dynamic-wind (lambda () (let ([s (do socket thingy)]) (unless s (die)))) (lambda () ---) (lambda () (close-socket s))). 03:40:00 You can just wrap two dynamic-winds if you want to get the semantics you're looking for. 03:41:52 (define (f g) (call/cc (lambda (k) (dynamic-wind void (lambda () (dynamic-wind (lambda () (g k)) (lambda () (k 1)) void)) (lambda () (k 2)))))) 03:42:27 That gives you what you wanted. 03:43:03 It's clearer, IMO, to do it like that than to be surprised that the cleaner runs when you haven't created. 03:43:45 I don't know if that counts as a rationale.... 03:44:19 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:44:25 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 03:54:29 jrapdx [~jra@c-98-246-157-58.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:20:00 kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has joined #scheme 04:22:54 dynamic-wind is not appropriate for cleanup code anyway 04:26:02 State reversal, then. 04:44:11 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 04:55:45 -!- drdo` is now known as drdo 04:58:05 -!- dlila [~dlila@CPE0014d1c9243c-CM001bd71cede2.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:00:57 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-212-2.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 05:09:41 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 05:19:54 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 05:28:11 -!- prototrout [~steve@ip-64-255-129-222.ideaone.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:31:05 woonie [~woonie@nusnet-210-85.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has joined #scheme 05:52:19 dhaivat [~Dhaivat_P@14.97.49.93] has joined #scheme 05:58:07 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has joined #scheme 05:59:35 -!- woonie [~woonie@nusnet-210-85.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:02:47 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:10:31 -!- soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:12:40 soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has joined #scheme 06:13:11 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@jonr5.dsl.xmission.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:16:00 -!- soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:23:16 -!- elliottcable is now known as GONE 06:23:41 -!- GONE is now known as sephr 06:23:59 jewel [~jewel@196-210-187-83.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 06:26:42 -!- sephr is now known as elliottcable_ 06:26:50 -!- elliottcable_ is now known as sephr_ 06:27:42 -!- sephr_ is now known as elliottcable 06:29:31 -!- elliottcable is now known as system 06:29:43 -!- system is now known as elliottcable 06:38:08 -!- kilimanjaro [~kilimanja@unaffiliated/kilimanjaro] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:43:29 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-210-187-83.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:45:09 -!- arcfide [1000@c-69-136-7-94.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has left #scheme 07:12:44 Axioplase [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #scheme 07:16:05 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 07:27:53 -!- leo2007 [~leo@58.22.114.132] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 07:32:10 -!- XTL [~XTL@dsl-olubrasgw2-fe6af800-251.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:36:17 XTL [~XTL@dsl-olubrasgw2-fe6af800-251.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #scheme 07:39:44 stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #scheme 07:43:27 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 07:48:23 woonie [~woonie@nusnet-74-206.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has joined #scheme 08:00:29 -!- XTL [~XTL@dsl-olubrasgw2-fe6af800-251.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:04:07 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:06:48 XTL [~XTL@dsl-olubrasgw2-fe6af800-251.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #scheme 08:08:49 hkBst [~quassel@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #scheme 08:11:29 -!- astertronistic [~astertron@ip70-181-194-161.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:23:58 astertronistic [~astertron@ip70-181-194-161.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #scheme 08:38:16 -!- ijp [~user@host86-173-112-69.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:48:07 -!- penryu [~tanuki@unaffiliated/penryu] has left #scheme 09:11:47 leo2007 [~leo@58.22.113.144] has joined #scheme 09:25:20 zoldar [~zoldar@host130-89-206-19.limes.com.pl] has joined #scheme 09:31:09 hello. I've successfully setup a basic Kawa project compiling and installing to android - the problem is, it still takes about 30-40s from start of compilation to complete installation. Is there some alternative workflow which could allow to shorten that time? Any chance for code hot swap? 09:34:05 -!- Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:38:20 Burlingk [~burlingk@softbank221067045171.bbtec.net] has joined #scheme 09:41:04 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1385159933.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #scheme 09:45:06 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:46:49 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has joined #scheme 09:47:26 -!- woonie [~woonie@nusnet-74-206.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:02:04 -!- leo2007 [~leo@58.22.113.144] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 10:10:49 -!- rapacity_ is now known as rapacity 10:10:49 -!- zoldar [~zoldar@host130-89-206-19.limes.com.pl] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 10:25:27 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has left #scheme 10:27:21 -!- dhaivat [~Dhaivat_P@14.97.49.93] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:27:42 foof: spells is not a framework as such, it's just a namespace for various stuff, though it does follow rotty's package description format 10:28:21 foof: I think the latter is defined by dorodango, so that would be closer to CPAN-style 10:29:30 foof: and rotty does run a central repo for dorodango 10:32:40 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 10:36:58 -!- permagreen [~alex@97-120-251-46.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Welcome to the real world] 10:53:12 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-212-2.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:01:23 Kajtek [~paniwladc@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #scheme 11:06:20 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-83-98.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:11:57 Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #scheme 11:12:38 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-83-98.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 11:28:03 tupi [~david@189.60.180.75] has joined #scheme 12:10:05 scottmaccal 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realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 13:53:36 oink 13:55:32 hi 13:59:46 ohwow: hi 14:07:16 -!- hkBst [~quassel@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:09:08 tcleval [~funnyguy@186.213.63.249] has joined #scheme 14:15:34 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:16:05 -!- finnrobi [finnrobi@caracal.stud.ntnu.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:19:10 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 14:19:48 copumpkin [~pumpkin@17.45.135.33] has joined #scheme 14:19:52 -!- copumpkin [~pumpkin@17.45.135.33] has quit [Changing host] 14:19:53 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 14:25:36 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:30:15 ijp [~user@host86-173-112-69.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 14:30:37 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.178.216.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:32:05 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-164-64.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 14:32:14 wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-164-64.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 14:35:35 fantazo [~fantazo@178-190-239-166.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #scheme 14:45:54 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 14:51:05 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has joined #scheme 14:55:34 jonrafkind [~jon@crystalis.cs.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 14:55:34 -!- dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:02:43 -!- githogori [~githogori@c-24-7-1-43.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:14:25 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:21:13 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-219-205.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #scheme 15:24:47 -!- samth_away [~samth@punge.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:25:29 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-83-98.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [] 15:26:38 samth [~samth@punge.ccs.neu.edu] has joined #scheme 15:28:34 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-83-98.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 15:35:03 -!- rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:36:55 ASau [~user@95-24-215-148.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #scheme 15:39:46 rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has joined #scheme 15:42:06 Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has joined #scheme 15:43:50 leppie: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7177336/integrating-ironscheme-into-visual-studio-2010 :-O 15:43:55 http://tinyurl.com/3lurug4 15:44:28 :( 15:50:34 -!- ijp [~user@host86-173-112-69.range86-173.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:51:47 cky answered 15:52:03 was pondering wiki given my subjectiveness :) 15:54:58 pandeiro [~pandeiro@187.105.249.46] has joined #scheme 15:54:59 -!- tupi [~david@189.60.180.75] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:56:21 lol cky, did you spot that typo just now? C# override pubic member and make it private 16:04:29 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has joined #scheme 16:09:01 Lol. 16:11:39 anttih [~aholvika@backport.reaktor.fi] has joined #scheme 16:14:09 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has joined #scheme 16:17:13 tupi [~david@139.82.89.24] has joined #scheme 16:19:46 phao [~phao@pontenova.dpi.ufv.br] has joined #scheme 16:20:56 -!- jrapdx [~jra@c-98-246-157-58.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:23:04 ijp [~user@host86-162-111-128.range86-162.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 16:26:53 -!- wingo [~wingo@90.164.198.39] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:34:54 masm [~masm@bl15-132-107.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 16:35:09 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@c-24-5-7-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 16:38:17 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #scheme 16:39:51 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 16:43:29 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:43:35 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 16:58:59 soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has joined #scheme 17:00:56 jrapdx [~jra@74-95-41-205-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #scheme 17:06:29 -!- phao [~phao@pontenova.dpi.ufv.br] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:07:12 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.20/20110805211839]] 17:10:08 scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has joined #scheme 17:10:58 arcfide [1000@c-69-136-7-94.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:11:36 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:12:50 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 17:20:35 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:22:29 turbofail [~user@c-107-3-149-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 17:30:52 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 17:35:42 dsmith [~dsmith@cpe-184-56-129-232.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 17:42:49 zelak [~zelak@pdpc/supporter/student/zelak] has joined #scheme 17:49:34 rudybot: r5rs dynamic-wind 17:49:34 specbot: r5rs dynamic-wind 17:49:34 http://www.schemers.org/Documents/Standards/R5RS/HTML/r5rs-Z-H-9.html#%_idx_576 17:49:48 rudybot: r6rs dynamic-wind 17:49:48 amoe: i'm a little confused; could one not simulate continuation marks with dynamic-wind + thread-local state? and in that case, wouldn't that make the "body" of call/cm not be called from tail position? 17:50:40 just testing... 17:50:44 *amoe* vanishes 17:52:03 -!- scottmaccal [~scottmacc@firewall.portland.lib.me.us] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.20/20110805211839]] 17:55:56 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:56:52 barryfm [~barryfm@fl-71-2-133-215.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #scheme 17:56:58 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 17:58:32 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-132-107.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:59:07 -!- pygospa is now known as huesersohn 18:01:05 -!- arcfide [1000@c-69-136-7-94.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:03:47 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:04:40 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 18:04:55 jewel [~jewel@196-210-187-116.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 18:06:23 githogori [~githogori@216.207.36.222] has joined #scheme 18:09:07 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Client Quit] 18:11:49 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@infocalypse-net.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:11:56 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has left #scheme 18:13:26 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 18:16:41 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has joined #scheme 18:17:19 yretssin [~yours@infocalypse-net.info] has joined #scheme 18:29:02 HG` [~HG@p579F7BD3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 18:48:30 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:50:36 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:02:35 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 19:03:47 -!- woonie [~woonie@nusnet-188-149.dynip.nus.edu.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:04:28 wisey [~Steven@host86-150-109-116.range86-150.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 19:07:12 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:18:06 -!- huesersohn is now known as pygospa 19:20:09 -!- yretssin [~yours@infocalypse-net.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:22:30 yretssin [~yours@infocalypse-net.info] has joined #scheme 19:23:23 -!- tcleval [~funnyguy@186.213.63.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:25:58 jcowan: I am indeed the Picobit maintainer. 19:26:11 jcowan: Also, you spelled my name wrong on the wiki. It's spelled "St-Amour", with a dash. It's an easy mistake to make :). 19:26:24 whitequark: I'm back, I was on "vacation". 19:32:03 stamourv: It's an especially easy mistake to make when you're dealing with credit reporting agencies, government departments, etc. >_< 19:32:27 (Speaking as someone with a hyphenated last name whose name gets misspelled by such agencies all the time.) 19:32:39 Does Google+ believe that you have a real name? 19:32:45 Riastradh: For now, yes. 19:33:11 ` ``Saint love''? Sounds pretty fake to me.' 19:34:31 masm [~masm@bl15-132-107.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 19:34:37 stamourv: jcowan doesn't seem to be online. 19:45:23 Should be: ``Saint McLovin'' 19:45:32 That's how real names look like 19:45:52 -!- yretssin is now known as Nisstyre 19:46:16 cky: Yes, it's a pain indeed. samth has quite a few stories. :). 19:46:30 stamourv: I bet. *nods* 19:46:35 Riastradh: I didn't try Google+, I stay away from social networks. 19:47:04 As for being fake, it's actually a quite common name. 19:47:23 mario-goulart: Oops, good point. Hopefully, he reads the logs. 19:47:53 Or someone else with write access to the wiki may have seen my plea. 19:47:55 stamourv: IRC is a social network! :-) 19:48:34 mario-goulart: Well... 19:48:37 You got me. 19:49:07 teurastaja [~teurastaj@206.167.245.2] has joined #scheme 19:49:14 There's a difference, though: you don't list who your friends are. It's safer in this sense. 19:49:30 Right. 19:49:56 And everything's public all the time, so there's no headaches about that. 19:50:05 #t 19:51:32 i want to write a 'top-level-define (which i did), but i ran into some problems concerning formal list parsing. i wondered if i could actually use internal definitions to pick up the results and dynamically introduce them 19:52:35 in fact, what i want is to make it possible to use the (define (func . blah) ...) without syntax-rules (seems inefficient in this case) 19:52:44 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-132-107.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:53:59 teurastaja: ? 19:54:51 i know how to introduce those bindings: `(eval '(begin (define ,name) (set! ,name value)) (interaction-environment)) 19:56:12 ? 19:56:20 ? ? 19:58:06 teurastaja, you should start by explaining what problem you are trying to solve, and then say how EVAL and INTERACTION-ENVIRONMENT are related to it, and finally specify (1) exactly what you typed, (2) exactly what you saw, and (3) exactly what you expected to see. 19:58:33 re: "1) In delay and force, the effect of the expression returning other than 19:58:33 one value is unspecified." on scheme-reports. Is there any reason why you wouldn't want (force (delay (values 1 2))) to return two values ? 19:59:30 ijp, contrariwise, when would you want to use multi-valued promises? Multiple values are a parameter-passing mechanism, not a storage mechanism; promises are more of a storage mechanism. 19:59:43 example: (let ([funk (lambda (x) (foo x))]) (top-level-define (funk . x) (foo2 x))) 20:00:19 Use complete sentences, and describe precisely what problem you are trying to solve. 20:01:41 are you trying to define a top-level procedure in a non-top-level scope? 20:01:44 teurastaja: What you are trying to do, if I understand you, is very much against the spirit of Scheme. 20:02:01 leppie: Right, it seems so, and in a way that bypasses the normal lexical scoping. 20:02:06 leppie: (Hence the "let".) 20:02:10 my problem is actually simple: i want top-level-define to parse the formals list in define expressions 20:02:25 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 20:02:35 teurastaja, step back a moment. What is the problem you are trying to solve, of which you believe `top-level-define' and parsing formals lists to be a subproblem? 20:02:59 actually, a have to rename top-level procedures as part of a cps converter that automates the process 20:03:15 Riastradh: I think I see your point, I'm just questioning the logic of half specifying multiple values. 20:03:35 ijp, `half specifying'? 20:04:10 or perhaps overspecifying, "an expression can return MVs except here, here, and here" 20:04:55 An expression can return multiple values if its continuation expects them. A procedure call can pass multiple arguments if the procedure expects them. 20:06:03 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has left #scheme 20:06:22 If you allow (cons (values 1 2) '()) to store multiple values, rather than just one, in the car of a pair, then you've either broken your (continuation) parameter passing mechanism or you've extended the semantics of the pair data structure in a confusing way. 20:06:33 (or both) 20:07:21 Is (delay (values 1 2)) substantially different from that? What about (delay (cons (delay E0) (delay E1)))? 20:07:34 -!- elliottcable is now known as ecdysis 20:08:32 -!- ecdysis is now known as ecad 20:09:25 I'm not sure I see the comparison. I would have thought the continuation of the promised expression, was that of the call to force 20:09:38 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Quit: bye] 20:10:23 -!- barryfm [~barryfm@fl-71-2-133-215.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has left #scheme 20:10:47 In any case, as you say, this probably isn't going to be an issue in practice 20:10:48 Yes, you could argue it that way (more or less). 20:11:47 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@infocalypse-net.info] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:12:23 they might as well just remove that 'unspecifiedification' IMO 20:16:50 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:18:33 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 20:19:26 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:20:09 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-210-187-116.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:20:17 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 20:22:55 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:25:45 -!- teurastaja [~teurastaj@206.167.245.2] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:28:41 -!- HG` [~HG@p579F7BD3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: HG`] 20:31:31 -!- ecad is now known as elliottcable 20:36:11 -!- rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:38:34 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 20:38:56 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Client Quit] 20:40:43 rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has joined #scheme 20:53:39 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 21:01:02 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #scheme 21:06:53 -!- betta_y_omega [~betta_y_o@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:08:26 betta_y_omega [~betta_y_o@90.166.231.220] has joined #scheme 21:16:59 -!- soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:17:36 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Quit: bye] 21:19:03 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 21:23:09 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@178-190-239-166.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:27:42 arcfide [1000@c-69-136-7-94.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:27:55 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-219-205.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37:41 MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 21:38:16 wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-162-2.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 21:38:32 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-162-2.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 21:40:34 -!- wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-164-64.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:40:59 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-164-64.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:45:01 -!- githogori [~githogori@216.207.36.222] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:58:39 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 22:00:22 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:01:48 -!- xissburg [~xissburg@187.50.13.57] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:04:25 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 22:05:17 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-95-248.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:08:31 RageOfThou [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has joined #scheme 22:08:49 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:19:33 -!- samth is now known as samth_away 22:20:41 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:20:56 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #scheme 22:24:25 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-84-172.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 22:27:15 -!- rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:30:35 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Excess Flood] 22:34:30 -!- pothos [~pothos@111-240-176-240.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:34:57 pothos_ [~pothos@111-240-176-240.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #scheme 22:35:08 -!- pothos_ is now known as pothos 22:39:33 rvn_ [~rvn@77.107.164.131] has joined #scheme 22:39:57 It seems to be quite difficult wanting to store a 64-bit float number in 56-bits... Just shifting the bits does alter the number altogether... 22:40:20 compress it :p 22:41:16 If I just store 32-bit floats it works perfectly because I do not need to alter the floating point data... 22:44:38 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-84-172.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:47:16 -!- copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:47:55 Error: `(+ 3.000000 2.000000)' expected to be: => 5.000000, but was: 5.000000 22:48:07 Hooray for testing. :) 22:52:31 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-84-172.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 22:53:17 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-84-172.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:54:40 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-84-172.albq.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 22:54:44 dostoyevsky: I hope your testing framework is smart enough to not test floating-point numbers for exact equality. 22:54:54 Gee, Mr Jobs has resigned. 22:55:22 I mean, in your case, since 3.000000 and 2.000000 and 5.000000 have exact representation (at least in IEEE-754), this shouldn't be problematic, but in general.... 22:56:09 There aren't enough digits there to distinguish a lot of nearby floating-point numbers. 22:56:28 cky: Yep... I changed my test to ``(t (< (- (+ 2.0 3.0) 5.0) 0.001)))'' 22:56:59 Writing floating-point numbers like that is almost certainly bound to make you lose. 22:58:13 You should get exactly 5.0 out of (+ 2.0 3.0). 23:03:41 -!- RageOfThou [~RageOfTho@users-150-65.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:06:24 -!- Riastradh [~riastradh@fsf/member/riastradh] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:06:31 prototrout [~steve@ip-64-255-129-222.ideaone.net] has joined #scheme 23:06:44 Riastradh: I'd say that my CPU uses double precision internally when comparing the numbers and my code that extracts them from a unsigned long long makes it difficult for the CPU to retain the same number... I remember that the FPU may add noise when translating a 32-bit float to 64-bit float... Maybe I could do it smarter.. but for now it's ok with me... Maybe I implement some real scheme numbers later 23:11:20 Let's hope Steve made Apple a new Pixar... and not an Apple that will just self-destruct... 23:11:47 I almost got picobit to work on my ARM... and then I've got a crappy idea of updating the system. 23:12:09 now, an algorithm change in new udev crashes the kernel when I try to use JTAG. nice. 23:12:25 whitequark: You are quite fast. :) 23:12:34 dostoyevsky: Riastradh is not online. 23:13:07 dostoyevsky: udev is faster when it comes to launching blkid and eventually oops'ing deep in the sg colon. 23:15:06 soveran [~soveran@rrcs-24-43-163-86.west.biz.rr.com] has joined #scheme 23:26:28 -!- prototrout [~steve@ip-64-255-129-222.ideaone.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:28:00 copumpkin [~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod] has joined #scheme 23:38:56 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@78.96.101.240] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:43:11 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 23:48:07 aha, blkid is slayed, and my ARM finally blinks a LED guided by Scheme code!