00:05:09 -!- Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: [TalkSoup] Get it today: http://talksoup.aeruder.net] 00:06:52 When we come up with a new data structure that is just a collection of pairs organised in some meaningul way to us, is there a standard way or convention for naming the methods that we create later to operate on this data structure? Is it a better idea to create an object type with messages for this purpose? ( like demonstrated here: http://www.scheme.com/tspl4/examples.html#./examples:s60 ) 00:09:28 -!- hohoho [~hohoho@ntkngw229253.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:16:06 -!- hafeed [8258a8e1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.130.88.168.225] has left #scheme 00:16:50 -!- Intensity [~Intensity@unaffiliated/intensity] has quit [Quit: Intensity] 00:20:18 saccade [~saccade@209-6-54-113.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #scheme 00:27:42 -!- z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:32:31 pjb: você consegue falar portugues também? 00:41:47 -!- fradgers- [~fradgers-@5adafe9d.bb.sky.com] has left #scheme 00:42:04 -!- MrFahrenheit [~RageOfTho@users-33-101.vinet.ba] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:44:32 -!- masm [~masm@bl15-77-102.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:54:34 -!- aidalgol [~user@202.36.179.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:56:38 Elench [~Elench@unaffiliated/elench] has joined #scheme 00:57:51 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-152-155.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 01:14:54 Riastradh: Weak references are on the plate for WG2. 01:16:09 How can it take O(n^2) time to handle ephemerons? o_O 01:17:13 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:26:12 Thomas_H [~Thomas_H@66.183.224.178] has joined #scheme 01:42:25 Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 01:52:15 -!- kniu [~kniu@pool-71-106-0-142.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:57:14 kniu [~kniu@pool-71-106-0-142.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:02:35 -!- atomx [~user@93.112.81.240] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:10:39 If you have just normal pairs and weak pairs (both car and cdr are weak refs), can you implement a key-weak lookup? 02:11:02 foof, here's the easy way that I think XEmacs uses (or used): 1. (set! modified? #f) 2. For each ephemeron, is its key live? If so, (set! modified? #t) and trace its datum. 3. Go back to step 1. 02:12:45 Here's the easy way that SBCL uses: Scan all ephemerons (weak hash tables) after every increment of the Cheney newspace scan. 02:12:52 I'm assuming no hooks into the GC beyond the weak reference resetting to some default value. 02:13:28 Define `key-weak lookup'. 02:15:14 (SBCL's generational garbage collector also spends O(n^2) time for n weak hash table entries, but the reason is slightly more complicated.) 02:15:25 An alist/hash-table/dictionary mapping keys to values, where the keys are preserved iff traceable through some non-weak object, and the values are preserved iff they are likewise traceable or the key is preserved. 02:16:10 No, because mere weak references can't express conditional liveness. 02:17:18 That's what I thought. 02:17:26 Hmmm... 02:19:40 Also, note that ephemerons drop the datum when the key is gone, whether or not the datum's storage has been reclaimed. 02:26:03 You can express an object that goes away when both components go away, using ephemerons, of course. (define (make-bothwise-ephemeron frob nozzle) (cons (make-ephemeron frob nozzle) (make-ephemeron nozzle frob))) 02:34:08 hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 02:37:00 -!- dfkjjkfd [~paulh@7-13-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 02:40:13 -!- hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:44:14 -!- fod [~fod@92.251.255.7.threembb.ie] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:48:41 hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 02:53:02 mjonsson_ [~mjonsson@cpe-98-14-173-5.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 02:53:15 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-63-152.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:56:41 -!- timj [~timj@e176192171.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:02:45 leppie [~lolcow@196-215-63-152.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #scheme 03:03:23 -!- hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 03:03:49 hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 03:06:35 -!- Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: I bless your computer, my child.] 03:07:02 Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 03:07:19 -!- mmc [~michal@93-39-48-42.ip74.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:09:49 -!- Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 03:10:42 timj [~timj@e176192133.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #scheme 03:16:01 -!- `26 [~kvirc@unaffiliated/26/x-1186543] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:17:29 `26 [~kvirc@216.252.81.166] has joined #scheme 03:17:29 -!- `26 [~kvirc@216.252.81.166] has quit [Changing host] 03:17:29 `26 [~kvirc@unaffiliated/26/x-1186543] has joined #scheme 03:28:27 dfeuer [~dfeuer@wikimedia/Dfeuer] has joined #scheme 03:41:33 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-152-155.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:54:01 Dawgmatix [~dman@c-76-124-9-27.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:05:46 -!- Thomas_H [~Thomas_H@66.183.224.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:22:41 -!- Dawgmatix [~dman@c-76-124-9-27.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 04:24:45 jonrafkind [~jon@c-67-172-254-235.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:26:56 -!- mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.75.235] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:33:37 R3cur51v3 [~Recursive@96-42-84-114.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has joined #scheme 04:33:49 mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.75.235] has joined #scheme 04:46:09 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:48:05 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #scheme 05:13:16 -!- hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:15:32 hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:26:20 -!- hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:27:10 hosh_office [~hosh@c-71-204-27-0.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 05:27:44 -!- R3cur51v3 is now known as Wvm\R3cur51v3 05:28:00 -!- Wvm\R3cur51v3 is now known as R3cur51v3 05:28:04 -!- R3cur51v3 is now known as Wvm\R3cur51v3 05:30:10 hohoho [~hohoho@p67f6db.tokynt01.ap.so-net.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 05:37:35 homie` [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 05:37:40 wbooze` [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 05:38:36 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-87-79-53-253.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:38:50 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-87-79-53-253.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:39:11 -!- homie` [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 05:39:16 -!- wbooze` [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 05:40:18 -!- soupdragon [~quantum@unaffiliated/fax] has quit [Quit: soupdragon] 05:42:11 homie [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 05:42:26 wbooze [~user@xdsl-87-79-161-21.netcologne.de] has joined #scheme 05:56:03 ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has joined #scheme 06:03:13 What would one call X1...Xn in the following: (cond (X1) ... (Xn) (else foo)) 06:03:27 Or even (cond X1 ... Xn) 06:03:56 Is it fair to call them conditions? Strictly I'd say no, but I can't think of a better word 06:04:29 that's the same as (or (X1) (X2) foo) 06:04:39 in which case I'd call them alternates 06:05:06 foof: When I say X1, I mean, for example "(foo bar) biz" 06:05:12 (in the first instance) 06:05:19 That probably wasn't clear 06:05:44 (cond X1 ... Xn) where Xi is of the form (boolean result) 06:05:50 What would you call Xi? 06:06:37 they're usually called "clauses" 06:06:57 you mean claws(es) ;) 06:07:23 But yeah, okay, that works 06:07:37 -!- vect [brains@ca7-losangeles-1911.dsl.wiredcom.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:10:15 -!- Checkie [8259@unaffiliated/checkie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:11:47 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #scheme 06:17:39 kar8nga [~kar8nga@78.104.80.203] has joined #scheme 06:24:47 dfkjjkfd [~paulh@7-13-ftth.onsnetstudenten.nl] has joined #scheme 06:24:56 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-152-155.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 06:25:19 -!- Wvm\R3cur51v3 [~Recursive@96-42-84-114.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:28:15 Wvm\R3cur51v3 [~Recursive@96-42-84-114.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has joined #scheme 06:44:27 hkBst [~hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #scheme 06:47:55 -!- e-future [~e-future@unaffiliated/sergio/x-8197433] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:52:21 why, oh why, does mysql assume everything in the whole world is latin-1? :( 06:53:36 -!- incubot [~incubot@klutometis.wikitex.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:54:35 -!- jonrafkind [~jon@c-67-172-254-235.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:55:35 incubot [incubot@klutometis.wikitex.org] has joined #scheme 06:56:27 -!- kar8nga [~kar8nga@78.104.80.203] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:58:19 -!- IJP_ [~Ian@host86-174-99-238.range86-174.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 07:00:05 IJP [~Ian@host86-174-200-168.range86-174.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 07:05:41 -!- Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:08:33 ... and the default collation for latin-1 is swedish, wtf? 07:08:54 foof: Get rid of it while you still can 07:08:58 MySQL is nothing but trouble 07:09:12 http://i.imgur.com/kIb0n.jpg 07:10:32 sjamaan: I don't have any say in the matter. 07:10:39 Poor foof 07:10:46 foor poof 07:10:57 I have always used postgres in my own projects. 07:12:42 But really, I'm using a en-utf8 LANG on a ja-utf8 machine, selecting from a utf8 table on a utf8 database. What do you think mysql chooses for the connection locale? 07:12:57 Latin-1 of course! o_O 07:13:01 latin1-swe 07:13:14 You can change that default in my.cnf, according to legend 07:13:31 I've never been able to make that work properly though 07:13:43 (but that may just have been broken software) 07:14:10 really, the docs say change it at compile time or with "set names 'utf8'" (whatever _that's_ supposed to mean) 07:14:30 yeah, that too 07:15:19 -!- Wvm\R3cur51v3 [~Recursive@96-42-84-114.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:18:36 rbarraud_ [~rbarraud@118-93-71-27.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 07:18:55 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #scheme 07:20:39 -!- rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-152-155.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:23:03 bohunm [~mbohun@202.124.74.161] has joined #scheme 07:23:40 atomx [~user@93.112.81.240] has joined #scheme 07:24:27 -!- mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.75.235] has quit [Ping 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djjack [~djjack@cpe-098-026-029-215.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] 20:59:14 cpr420 [~cpr@unaffiliated/cpr420] has joined #scheme 21:01:20 femtooo [~femto@95-89-188-171-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #scheme 21:04:48 -!- femtoo [~femto@95-89-188-171-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:07:47 Thomas_H [~Thomas_H@66.183.224.178] has joined #scheme 21:10:30 jcowan [c6b912cf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.198.185.18.207] has joined #scheme 21:11:38 coi 21:21:58 -!- Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:27:02 choas [~lars@p5792CE14.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 21:27:40 mikehershey [~smh86@ws32.cs.drexel.edu] has joined #scheme 21:28:14 -!- choas [~lars@p5792CE14.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:29:02 whew; after months of hiatus in R, finally back in the scheme saddle. 21:30:04 mejja [~user@c-14bee555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #scheme 21:30:46 -!- mikehershey [~smh86@ws32.cs.drexel.edu] has quit [Client Quit] 21:31:38 Guest33409 [~smh86@ws32.cs.drexel.edu] has joined #scheme 21:32:13 the world is strange when travelling abroad from the forest of scheme-wood and our merry band of scheme-yeomen. 21:33:09 it turns out that king john and the sherrif of nottingham all program procedurally, and with liberal mutation. 21:33:54 Azuvix [~Azuvix@174-19-234-140.bois.qwest.net] has joined #scheme 21:35:02 sheriff* 21:35:42 Yes. When they don't like your behavior, they mutate you until you don't do it any more. 21:36:46 which is to say: short shrift and long rope. 21:37:48 -!- kar8nga [~kar8nga@78.104.81.239] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:40:22 Short rope. 21:40:34 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:40:52 "Up the long ladder and down the short rope / Huzza for King Billy and to Hell with the Pope." --Orange Order slogan 21:41:20 -!- saccade [~saccade@BRAIN-AND-COG-THREE-TEN.MIT.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:41:25 -!- josephholsten [~josephhol@216.16.128.242] has quit [Quit: josephholsten] 21:47:37 -!- jcowan [c6b912cf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.198.185.18.207] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:47:59 jcowan [c6b912cf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.198.185.18.207] has joined #scheme 21:48:34 -!- jcowan [c6b912cf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.198.185.18.207] has quit [Client Quit] 21:48:46 -!- Guest33409 [~smh86@ws32.cs.drexel.edu] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 21:49:11 -!- femtooo [~femto@95-89-188-171-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:50:32 -!- incubot [incubot@klutometis.wikitex.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:32 -!- MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:32 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [*.net *.split] 21:50:54 fod [~fod@92.251.255.7.threembb.ie] has joined #scheme 21:52:30 -!- leppie [~lolcow@196-215-63-152.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:55:44 -!- bweaver [~user@75-148-111-133-Chattanooga.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 22:02:45 incubot [incubot@klutometis.wikitex.org] has joined #scheme 22:03:46 MichaelRaskin [~MichaelRa@195.91.224.225] has joined #scheme 22:05:55 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #scheme 22:06:59 -!- pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:08:04 saccade [~saccade@BRAIN-AND-COG-FIVE-THIRTY-SEVEN.MIT.EDU] has joined #scheme 22:10:48 Mohamdu [~Mohamdu@CPE00222d53fe20-CM00222d53fe1d.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 22:16:25 -!- stis [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:21:58 -!- fowlduck [~fowlduck@2002:4547:f82e:0:fa1e:dfff:fed7:9dc1] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:25:03 -!- Thomas_H [~Thomas_H@66.183.224.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:26:31 e-future [~e-future@unaffiliated/sergio/x-8197433] has joined #scheme 22:34:32 -!- mejja [~user@c-14bee555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:40:34 -!- saccade [~saccade@BRAIN-AND-COG-FIVE-THIRTY-SEVEN.MIT.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:45:25 saccade [~saccade@dhcp-18-111-82-90.dyn.mit.edu] has joined #scheme 22:53:10 rotty: you can use them, you just won't be able to serialize them 22:57:10 Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #scheme 23:01:15 -!- saccade_ [~saccade_@COMBINATOR.MIT.EDU] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:03:09 saccade_ [~saccade_@COMBINATOR.MIT.EDU] has joined #scheme 23:06:41 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #scheme 23:09:40 rbarraud [~rbarraud@118-92-144-201.dsl.dyn.ihug.co.nz] has joined #scheme 23:13:37 -!- Elench [~Elench@unaffiliated/elench] has quit [] 23:13:56 Elench [~Elench@unaffiliated/elench] has joined #scheme 23:15:05 cthuluh: Did I happen to mention that I worship you? 23:17:05 please don't 8) 23:17:28 Why, gonna eat me? 23:17:32 That'd happen anyway. :P 23:18:02 I am now a vegan 23:19:03 ... 23:19:14 Why I ever adored you in the first place, I'll never know. 23:19:23 *Azuvix* is dramatically disillusioned 23:20:54 good. you're now on the way to self-determination ;) 23:21:34 Hard to do when you don't know who you are anymore. O_O 23:22:23 I got a friend that may help you to replace me. it's called google. much more scary than I could ever be 23:23:24 Ah yes, keeping my search history forever, spying on me, showing everyone what I do and where I live... 23:23:31 I think I'd take being eaten over that. 23:24:48 I use scroogle and ixquick 23:26:22 How perfectly subversive. 23:39:39 -!- ysph [~user@24-181-93-165.dhcp.leds.al.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:41:56 mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.73.116] has joined #scheme 23:51:56 -!- fradgers- [~fradgers-@5adafe9d.bb.sky.com] has left #scheme