00:00:47 -!- anborn [n=anborn@host249-225-dynamic.2-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit ["Leaving"] 00:05:30 -!- puchacz [n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:06:28 -!- underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [] 00:11:36 cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 00:17:59 -!- yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 00:19:25 -!- choas [n=lars@p5B0DC9C4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:24:27 -!- Fare [n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 00:30:51 underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 00:35:51 -!- rdd [n=rdd@c83-250-142-219.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:36:11 rdd [n=rdd@c83-250-142-219.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #scheme 00:39:04 bzzbzz [n=franco@modemcable027.191-81-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #scheme 00:40:13 Fare [n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #scheme 00:47:20 patmaddox [n=pergesu@ip68-4-201-9.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #scheme 00:49:12 -!- athos [n=philipp@92.250.204.223] has quit ["leaving"] 00:57:40 -!- kuribas [i=kristof@d54C2AC3C.access.telenet.be] has quit ["ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 01:02:12 -!- ecraven [n=nex@140.78.42.103] has quit ["bbl"] 01:06:14 -!- orgy` [n=ratm_@pD9FFF038.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:10:31 gweiqi [n=greg@69.120.126.163] has joined #scheme 01:20:27 -!- fschwidom [n=fschwido@dslb-088-069-166-127.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 01:20:42 dsmith [i=a41jfuqj@cpe-71-74-230-225.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 01:20:48 -!- annodomini [n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [] 01:28:48 -!- dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has left #scheme 01:37:04 -!- jonrafkind [n=jon@wireless82.wireless.utah.edu] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 01:39:05 annodomini [n=lambda@c-75-69-96-104.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 01:53:43 dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 01:54:19 Riastrad1 [n=rias@pool-141-154-217-174.bos.east.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 01:55:36 this will sound like a dumb question; i am working through SCIP and as I understand it, (list 1 2 3) is the equivalent of (cons 1 (cons 2 (cons 3 nil))). but if I do the second, mit-scheme just says Unbounded variable: nil. Does anyone know why it is doing this? 01:55:57 (define nil '()), and worry about what that means a little later when SICP gets to quotation. 01:56:04 thanks 01:58:24 MIT Scheme distinguishes nil and '() 02:01:10 ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:01:50 The intent in SICP is that the name NIL should mean (). 02:02:15 jonrafkind [n=jon@c-98-202-86-149.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 02:03:57 JohnnyL [i=JohnnyL@ool-182ddad4.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #scheme 02:06:41 -!- Riastradh [n=rias@pool-151-203-245-231.bos.east.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)] 02:09:57 a1len [n=James@unaffiliated/a1len] has joined #scheme 02:10:43 -!- jlongster [n=user@75.148.111.133] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 02:26:44 -!- kniu [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 02:30:18 -!- JohnnyL [i=JohnnyL@ool-182ddad4.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [] 02:35:28 hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 02:35:57 -!- hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has quit [Client Quit] 02:36:06 kniu [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 02:51:43 nothingHappens_ [n=nothingH@12-226-78-3.client.mchsi.com] has joined #scheme 02:53:05 -!- attila_lendvai [n=ati@business-89-132-61-222.business.broadband.hu] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 03:02:31 jcowan [n=jcowan@cpe-74-68-154-18.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 03:06:15 -!- Deformalite [n=joe@c-68-62-76-160.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Broken pipe] 03:10:31 -!- annodomini [n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [] 03:10:32 *jcowan* unvanishes. 03:10:52 *mumble* 03:11:33 *jcowan* mumbles sympathetically. 03:12:17 *foof* mumbles sleepily 03:12:17 incubot: mumble 03:12:20 You mean my blag? 03:12:27 yes, exactly. 03:13:19 -!- dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 03:19:46 -!- Def [n=joe@c-68-62-76-160.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 03:20:01 Def [n=joe@c-68-62-76-160.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 03:20:23 incubot, is this change in nick permanent? 03:20:25 Though he's probably less of a doctor than Dr. Nick Rivera. 03:20:47 Hey, I'm a reverend. Call me "father". 03:23:27 -!- mmc [n=michal@83-103-88-29.ip.fastwebnet.it] has left #scheme 03:24:10 mmc [n=michal@83-103-88-29.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #scheme 03:26:09 Fare: ok 03:26:53 geckosenator, and I shall call you Senator, Mr Senator? 03:30:44 Fare: universal life church, eh? maybe you can play friar laurence with a good conscience, now 03:31:04 What ho, Fare. 03:31:28 -!- cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit ["The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity."] 03:36:54 cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #scheme 03:41:59 -!- hark [n=strider@hark.slew.org] has quit ["Leaving"] 03:42:31 -!- set1 [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 03:45:05 jcowan, not much. 03:45:20 what interesting hacks are you up to? 03:46:06 Plan: Hacking Dorian for Irene 03:46:15 what's that? 03:47:01 Fare: ok 03:47:16 klutometis, of course! 03:48:04 you're hacking your grandson? 03:48:10 oh dear 03:48:26 Well, not with an axe. 03:48:35 a spoon 03:48:36 see http://catb.org/jargon/html/H/Hacking-X-for-Y.html 03:48:56 Irene's my daughter 03:49:33 and she got an Initialization Vector in her hand? 03:49:59 Well, maybe not her *hand*. Anyway, that was over a year ago. 03:50:04 Dorian's 6 months old 03:50:39 maybe IV doesn't mean what I think it means. 03:51:27 http://recycledknowledge.blogspot.com/2008/06/dorian-sion-cowan.html --> the IV is in her hand 03:52:22 Ah. 03:52:32 IntraVenous tube. 03:52:36 Fare: IntraVenous = into a vein 03:52:42 yeah 04:02:00 -!- Fare [n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 04:02:24 -!- hiyuh [n=hiyuh@KD125054017176.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit ["|_ e /\ \/ i |/| G"] 04:02:39 elmex_ [n=elmex@e180068215.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #scheme 04:04:36 -!- proq [n=user@unaffiliated/proqesi] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 04:04:38 seth [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 04:05:36 hemulen_ [n=hemulen@cpe-069-134-114-252.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 04:06:23 dudrenov [n=user@c-69-181-124-154.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 04:06:25 Hello 04:07:04 What's a good embeddable scheme? Something easily embeddable in C 04:14:28 -!- mejja [n=user@c-4db6e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 04:17:32 -!- elmex [n=elmex@e180069097.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:17:36 -!- elmex_ is now known as elmex 04:17:55 vorpal [n=rhunter@pdpc/supporter/student/vorpal] has joined #scheme 04:18:28 grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 04:19:22 dudrenov: chicken? guile? dunno 04:21:55 Chicken isn't really embeddable 04:21:59 there's tinyscheme 04:22:14 *offby1* embeds chicken in a turkey, and a duck in the chicken, and ... 04:22:19 -!- hemulen [n=hemulen@cpe-069-134-114-252.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:22:34 *jcowan* ducks the flying chicken 04:23:57 I was looking for something where from C I can literally do scm = Init_scheme(); load_env(scm, env); run_script(scm, script); 04:24:38 -!- sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 04:25:00 -!- jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 04:25:38 dudrenov: I'm pretty sure Guile give you exactly that 04:25:45 *gives 04:26:14 reading up on it now 04:26:18 -!- vorpal [n=rhunter@pdpc/supporter/student/vorpal] has quit ["The incensed priests...continued to raise their voices, vituperating each other in bad Latin"] 04:42:33 dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 04:42:38 mdmkolbe [n=adamsmd@ip68-103-53-63.ks.ok.cox.net] has joined #scheme 04:42:48 jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 04:43:38 Is there any project working on converting SRFI's to R6RS libraries? Is there any convention for naming SRFI's converted to R6RS libraries? 04:45:32 http://srfi.schemers.org/srfi-97/srfi-97.html 04:46:32 The goal of that SRFI is to settle the naming. 04:46:54 Various folks are porting SRFIs to R6RS. I believe Ikarus has few ported. 04:49:16 grettke: thx for the pointer 04:54:31 -!- cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 05:00:24 -!- MichaelRaskin_ [n=raskin@gwh-1-177-mytn23k1.ln.rinet.ru] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 05:00:29 -!- grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [] 05:18:55 -!- mdmkolbe [n=adamsmd@ip68-103-53-63.ks.ok.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 05:23:36 -!- drdo [n=psykon@167.111.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:24:04 karlw [n=user@cpe-76-169-197-71.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 05:25:23 -!- Riastrad1 is now known as Riastradh 05:28:35 MichaelRaskin_ [n=raskin@chld.ru] has joined #scheme 05:29:34 Has anyone installed MrEd on Ubuntu EEE? 05:30:06 *offby1* squirts some oil into karlw's joints 05:32:18 Even though R6RS isn't *real* Scheme. 05:40:17 *offby1* squirts some ashes into karlw's mouth 05:41:10 I heard ordinary people talking about ubuntu today 05:42:21 it's a lie, I tell you 05:44:17 I thought so too 05:45:43 ramkrsna [n=ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #scheme 05:45:45 -!- gweiqi [n=greg@69.120.126.163] has left #scheme 05:46:11 dum de dum 05:46:50 -!- johnnowak [n=johnnowa@207-38-171-48.c3-0.wsd-ubr1.qens-wsd.ny.cable.rcn.com] has quit [] 05:46:51 hey hey 05:46:56 long time no see 05:46:56 a 05:47:00 hola 05:47:01 for some value of "see" 05:47:04 yeah, it's been a while 05:55:52 -!- offby1 [n=user@q-static-138-125.avvanta.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:02:46 offby1 [n=user@q-static-138-125.avvanta.com] has joined #scheme 06:03:15 -!- underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [] 06:04:29 underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:08:53 -!- karlw [n=user@cpe-76-169-197-71.socal.res.rr.com] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 06:13:26 -!- jonrafkind [n=jon@c-98-202-86-149.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:17:13 jonrafkind [n=jon@c-98-202-86-149.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:20:55 maodun [n=stopgo@c-67-180-49-1.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 06:26:35 saccade_ [n=saccade@65.78.24.47] has joined #scheme 06:39:00 -!- bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 06:41:03 hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 06:41:10 -!- hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 06:42:53 set1 [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 06:47:13 -!- geckosenator [n=sean@71.237.94.78] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 06:49:11 -!- seth [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 06:58:58 Is there a way for me to regex match a range of escaped unicode characters in mzscheme (e.g., (regexp "[#\u0009-#\u00a0]"))? 07:00:42 you probably want pregexp, not regexp 07:01:19 -!- rcy` [n=rcy@S01060002553240a8.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 07:01:24 ah, thanks 07:04:02 -!- hml [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has left #scheme 07:05:59 rcy [n=rcy@S01060002553240a8.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #scheme 07:11:03 -!- jcowan [n=jcowan@cpe-74-68-154-18.nyc.res.rr.com] has left #scheme 07:14:54 -!- dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 07:39:48 -!- saccade_ [n=saccade@65.78.24.47] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 07:43:30 wingo-tp [n=wingo@249.Red-81-39-160.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 07:47:07 topriddy [n=JAVABOY@80.255.61.29] has joined #scheme 07:50:14 Please what apps are Scheme better suited for? 07:55:18 All of them. 07:56:01 GUIs, DBs, Web Apps??? 07:56:26 Forgive me I am coming from Java okay. 07:56:48 What apps is Java better suited for? 07:56:54 Same silly question 07:58:08 sjamaan: Very silly. 07:58:46 Do you have a J2ME in scheme? Whats your library base. those are things I wanted answer too. 07:58:57 topriddy: You can't write any real apps in any Scheme standard. 07:59:16 You can write anything you want if you just choose an implementation and use its extensions though. 07:59:20 *topriddy* Pardon my rude questioning. Am trying to chose a functional program lang to learn 07:59:43 Chicken and PLT have huge library bases. 07:59:44 topriddy: Different Schemes have different libraries 07:59:57 I have erlang, scala, scheme and maybe Haskell to chose from. But I have the resources to learn just one at this time. 07:59:58 Gauche has quite a lot too. 08:00:00 There is a commonly implemented set of libraries that you can view at srfi.schemers.org 08:00:12 X-Scale [i=email@89.180.183.234] has joined #scheme 08:01:06 "Huge" by Scheme standards, like several hundred. Keep in mind that you need fewer libraries to do things with Scheme than with Java. 08:01:15 chicken ftw 08:01:46 Thank you very much all. 08:01:58 But why program Scheme over erland or Scala? 08:02:07 erlang* 08:02:13 Erlang? It's not a general purpose language. 08:02:17 why not program in all of them? 08:02:58 glogic: (smiles) 08:03:18 foof: Really? 08:03:40 learning about language is always useful 08:09:20 johnnowak [n=johnnowa@207-38-171-48.c3-0.wsd-ubr1.qens-wsd.ny.cable.rcn.com] has joined #scheme 08:19:11 hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 08:19:16 -!- hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 08:20:10 It's less useful when you consider the multiple independant dependencies. 08:20:43 what's that synx? 08:21:03 Anything I learn in plt-scheme, pretty much can't share with friends without a few dozen megabytes of dependencies they have to install. 08:21:51 i think i'm missing the overall context of what you're saying 08:21:54 Same goes for python, perl, pretty much any language. But I have to repeat the process for each one. 08:21:55 you said it's less useful 08:21:59 what is less useful? 08:22:03 scheme? 08:23:01 Learning about language is less useful, because of the complications with making that language useful that don't help with other languages. 08:23:12 I'm not really coherent this hour, sorry. 08:23:40 synx: cross-compile to binaries; wash, rinse, repeat. 08:24:19 klutometis: 120 megabyte binaries, cross-compiling taking forever, unworkable package systems... 08:24:38 synx: heh; back to square one 08:24:48 incubot: the other option is: "fuck it, we'll do it live!" 08:24:50 and you think it's better when they hear "fuck" from someone else and wonder what it means? 08:25:27 I'm not a big fan of bundling either, but that's another debate. 08:26:04 aah 08:26:08 you misunderstood my statement 08:26:13 synx: i find scheme most useful, frankly, when it's hidden (like sisc); or server-based 08:26:17 i was referring to paradigms and semantics of language 08:26:25 linguistic anthropology 08:26:38 i'm not say you will ever necessarily use any of these languages 08:26:52 glogic: linguistic anthropology is redundant; why not just linguistics? 08:26:53 just step out of your box and learn something new about programming you would have missed before 08:27:06 yes I'm a big fan of algorithms 08:27:11 it's not redundant if your goal is to study it's affects on culture 08:27:35 I find it fascinating that almost any algorithm may be computed in almost any language, yet the specifics of two languages make them mutually incompatible in many ways. 08:27:44 glogic: who said anything about culture? we're hacking here! ;) 08:27:58 hacking culture! 08:28:10 *glogic* is hacking culture 08:28:12 woo, social engineering 08:28:30 Don't let the Nam Shub into your Operating System 08:28:38 you can tell alot about the psyche of a group of people by the languages they use 08:28:41 glogic: yeah; but any charlatan can study the "cultural" aspects of programming without practicing the major paradigs 08:28:46 paradigms* 08:28:56 i'm suggesting that you practice them 08:29:05 hence my original point 08:29:18 glogic: but then you're no longer merely an anthropologist; which is to say, an observer 08:29:20 i'm saying you should stop at say standard library 08:29:49 anthropologists rarely observe 08:29:56 O RLY? 08:30:22 i might have started in a place that's too high level here 08:30:27 and for that i'm sorry 08:30:33 did jane goodall also have sapphic encounters with primates and each their skin insects? 08:30:59 glogic: no, man; your high level stuff is too fuzzy, and you're leaping around as if you haven't had any philosophical training 08:31:17 this practice-anthropology thing needs fleshing out 08:31:23 the bridge isn't self-explanatory 08:31:28 actually i'm applying metaphor 08:31:38 oh, shit; we're all screwed 08:32:06 plato, after indulging in metaphor, would quickly explicate the bridge 08:32:10 the bridge, man! 08:32:15 you don't find metaphor useful? 08:32:43 desktop, icon, shell, object 08:32:44 it suffers from coitus interruptus until you bring it home, so to speak 08:33:08 *klutometis* mixeth metaphors liberally 08:33:29 what's the anthropological metaphor, then? 08:34:15 study of the view of programmers from the view of their langauges to better understand the mindset of a programmer of that language and theh community surrounding that language as a whole 08:34:29 oh, ok; and why is it interesting? 08:34:43 well for you the anthropology part isn't 08:34:45 that's clear 08:34:50 which is why we're way off track 08:34:55 not necessarily; i just need to be convinced 08:35:03 oh well that's your problem 08:35:31 what i had said originally was that learning about language is always useful 08:35:40 and i was referring to the specific case of programming lnaguages 08:35:56 even if you don't use a lnaguage it's useful to learn it's paradigms and metaphors 08:36:03 agreed 08:36:10 the rest was jsut simply a side track 08:36:14 but what's this cultural salto mortale? 08:36:15 a tangent 08:36:18 that was my fault 08:36:33 why are you invoking fault? it's discourse, man! 08:36:35 oh well that could come in useful for language design 08:36:44 -!- topriddy [n=JAVABOY@80.255.61.29] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 08:37:07 to get a view of past and present hacker culture so to speak 08:37:28 and derive a roadmap for future language design 08:38:28 i never found it very enlightening to proceed from a composer's bio to his work; and that's why i disagree 08:38:32 you may find otherwise, though 08:39:03 i.e. language -> culture, not the other way around 08:39:38 nod 08:39:45 in your case its' better to start with the works 08:39:51 different application 08:39:55 for different contexts 08:42:01 yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 08:51:43 hotblack23 [n=jh@p5B054D21.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 08:55:19 barney [n=bernhard@p549A155F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #scheme 08:59:08 fschwidom [n=fschwido@dslb-088-069-166-127.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 09:09:56 la la la 09:10:22 -!- hotblack23 [n=jh@p5B054D21.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 09:10:30 la di da di we like to party, we don't cause trouble and we don't bother nobody 09:18:00 hml [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 09:18:05 are there any fframeworks for writing facebook apps in scheme? 09:52:47 -!- a1len [n=James@unaffiliated/a1len] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 10:00:04 -!- rmrfchik [n=paul@62.117.74.154] has quit ["Client exiting"] 10:08:35 chaoslynx [n=cpehle@p57A742B6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 10:11:13 kuribas [i=kristof@d54C2AC3C.access.telenet.be] has joined #scheme 10:19:53 attila_lendvai [n=ati@business-89-132-61-222.business.broadband.hu] has joined #scheme 10:31:38 -!- ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 10:35:40 ejs [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #scheme 10:38:10 -!- attila_lendvai [n=ati@business-89-132-61-222.business.broadband.hu] has quit ["..."] 10:40:30 benny` [n=benny@i577A18E9.versanet.de] has joined #scheme 10:43:30 rmrfchik [n=paul@62.117.74.154] has joined #scheme 10:44:40 -!- benny [n=benny@i577A0579.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] 10:49:21 -!- johnnowak [n=johnnowa@207-38-171-48.c3-0.wsd-ubr1.qens-wsd.ny.cable.rcn.com] has quit [] 10:53:43 -!- fschwidom [n=fschwido@dslb-088-069-166-127.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [No route to host] 11:02:13 Nshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-105-1-128.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 11:13:27 -!- hml [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 11:31:02 kuribas` [i=kristof@d54C2AC3C.access.telenet.be] has joined #scheme 11:31:11 -!- hemulen_ [n=hemulen@cpe-069-134-114-252.nc.res.rr.com] has quit ["He rode off into the sunset. . ."] 11:34:22 yay, my LiSP has finally shipped, after 9 weeks... 11:37:11 -!- chaoslynx [n=cpehle@p57A742B6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 11:37:21 leppie: what is it? 11:37:43 tizoc_ [n=user@r190-135-31-154.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 11:37:47 it is a book with many pages 11:38:16 LiSP: LISP in Small Pieces 11:38:20 -!- tizoc [n=user@r190-135-40-179.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 11:38:23 -!- tizoc_ is now known as tizoc 11:39:11 duh, lisp is obsolete 11:39:12 *rmrfchik* hides 11:39:41 it actually discuesses scheme 11:44:46 fschwidom [n=fschwido@dslb-088-068-074-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 11:45:30 -!- kuribas [i=kristof@d54C2AC3C.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 11:47:01 -!- errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 11:54:24 xwl [n=user@221.221.157.194] has joined #scheme 12:02:18 is there any link made in Scheme-or-Lisp instead of in C# as it http://sourceforge.net/projects/categorytheory/ ? 12:05:27 sourceforge is taking it's time loading... 12:08:34 la la la 12:17:26 leppie: where'd you order it? 12:18:26 thru a local reseller, but the publisher original dispatched without shipping details, so it got lost... 12:19:21 so i am getting a well-traveled book :) 12:21:02 errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 12:30:25 I wish I'd gotten one on in the amazon.ca mess-up :( 12:35:33 chturne [n=charlie@host86-164-146-181.range86-164.btcentralplus.com] has joined #scheme 12:36:18 is there a way to evaluate every condition in a cond statement, and not exit the cond if one of them is true? 12:38:07 huh? 12:38:18 not exit to where? 12:38:32 just do not call (exit) whatever is it 12:40:18 am i right in thinking that as soon as an expression in a cond evaluates to true, it then leaves the cond not evalulating the rest? 12:42:15 chturne: yes, a cond can be implemented in terms of nested if-then-elseif expressions 12:42:55 haven't done if-else-then conditionals yet, I'll post my code on pastebin, to explain myself better. 12:45:18 dax [n=dax@hnvr-4dbb68e5.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #scheme 12:45:31 good morning 12:45:42 ok, http://pastebin.com/m79968adf -- sorry for the length! 12:46:06 -!- rdd [n=rdd@c83-250-142-219.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 12:46:31 i am looking for a tutorial for scheme macros, i want to write a swich-case-else. Any Hints? 12:49:05 "Syntax-rules Primer for the Merely Eccentric","An Advanced Syntax-Rules Primer for the Mildly Insane" might be useful 12:49:35 great, thx! 12:50:02 -!- errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:53:48 -!- chturne [n=charlie@host86-164-146-181.range86-164.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 12:54:31 errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 12:57:30 name [n=name@sburn/devel/name] has joined #scheme 13:05:30 bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 13:18:27 -!- cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit ["The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity."] 13:35:53 ski_: it works \o/ 13:37:16 athos [n=philipp@p54B8744E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 13:39:48 -!- nothingHappens_ [n=nothingH@12-226-78-3.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 13:57:07 ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has joined #scheme 14:02:23 cracki [n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #scheme 14:02:50 sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 14:07:03 bzoto [n=pradella@pradella.dei.polimi.it] has joined #scheme 14:07:23 -!- ejs [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:07:24 -!- bzoto [n=pradella@pradella.dei.polimi.it] has left #scheme 14:09:00 a1len [n=James@unaffiliated/a1len] has joined #scheme 14:16:04 -!- dsmith [i=a41jfuqj@cpe-71-74-230-225.neo.res.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 14:17:40 -!- errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 14:18:43 choas [n=lars@p5B0DD4D0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 14:18:52 errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 14:19:02 -!- maodun [n=stopgo@c-67-180-49-1.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:19:45 vixey [n=vicky@amcant.demon.co.uk] has joined #scheme 14:20:03 langmartin [n=user@75.148.111.133] has joined #scheme 14:25:28 seth [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 14:26:05 -!- underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [] 14:26:46 -!- isomer [n=isomer@CPE001310e6cb31-CM0011aec5e684.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 14:35:17 isomer [n=isomer@CPE001310e6cb31-CM0011aec5e684.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 14:41:28 -!- athos [n=philipp@p54B8744E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["leaving"] 14:41:42 -!- set1 [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:47:44 orgy` [n=ratm_@pD9FFF3C0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 14:52:08 la la la 15:19:54 sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 15:27:00 -!- sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Connection timed out] 15:27:07 eli: FFI question: is there a way to shoehorn a integer into a cpointer, and extract it at a later time? 15:27:25 (on PLT, of course) 15:27:42 (Ikarus's FFI has pointer->integer and integer->pointer) 15:29:56 -!- ejs1 [n=eugen@nat.ironport.com] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:30:54 hello rotty 15:31:08 -!- ltsampros [n=gaghiel@kelly.physics.upatras.gr] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] 15:31:48 rotty, I'm just curious why you would do that 15:31:52 is that not dangerous? 15:33:21 vixey: in general, yes. but it is the only sane way to interact with C code that expects a void* somewhere and you'd like to store a reference to a scheme object in there portably (i.e. going thru a integer <-> (weak) mapping 15:33:45 oh I see 15:33:59 -!- bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 15:34:07 bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 15:35:28 it's not sane to like, use malloc(1) as gensym, to build up a table from pointers to scheme objects? 15:35:33 You'd have to be careful not to exceed the pointer width withnyur int, and not use the resulting pointer for "pointery purposes" 15:35:50 yeah rotty that sounds really dodgy 15:36:08 vixey: yep, that would work as well, but it's kinda ugly 15:36:10 gonna be fun debugging it 15:36:26 ugly in that you have to do GC yourself? 15:37:03 ("GC" of something so simple that is not even a DAG) 15:37:36 ugly in that it adds all kinds of overhead, for no real gain against the "straightforward" solution 15:38:13 "no real gain" I do not accept 15:38:14 (except that you can do it without having integer<->pointer conversion) 15:41:19 I'll probably hack up integer->pointer and pointer->integer in mzscheme -- should be possible by operating a pointer-sized chunk of memory 15:53:25 Why not malloc an integer-sized C object? 15:53:46 (if you want a mapping between integers and Scheme objects, in order to avoid GC relocation) 16:00:04 virgil [n=virgil@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 16:01:06 -!- virgil [n=virgil@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:01:19 mike [n=mike@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 16:01:49 -!- mike is now known as Guest83525 16:03:34 drdo [n=psykon@167.111.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #scheme 16:04:09 saccade_ [n=saccade@65.78.24.47] has joined #scheme 16:11:13 -!- xwl [n=user@221.221.157.194] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 16:16:03 Riastradh: yep, that's probably the cleanest solution 16:16:32 hehe.. 16:16:38 subversus [i=elliot@loveturtle.net] has joined #scheme 16:17:17 rotty, it is cleaner than my solution? 16:18:11 vixey: according to my taste: yes (as it's the thing you'd do in C when you don't want to cast to/from pointer) 16:18:54 rotty, and how is not exactly the same thing? :) 16:19:53 vixey: maybe i've misunderstood your suggestion 16:20:39 It's probably more that I'm rubbish at explaining things 16:20:56 sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 16:21:20 grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 16:22:52 ExcelsisD [i=email@89-180-239-30.net.novis.pt] has joined #scheme 16:24:35 rotty: Why not use the GMP C library? 16:25:01 ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 16:25:02 synx: how would that help in this situation? 16:25:58 rotty: You could write C code that was a multiprecision instead of 32 bit integer. 16:26:12 synx: 32 bits are plenty for my needs 16:26:26 I think mzscheme uses gmp too, so maybe there's an easy conversion. 16:26:36 -!- sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Connection timed out] 16:27:18 would you really be saving a lot by using 32 bit integers? 16:29:19 synx: there's simply no need for bignums in this place -- if you *ever* want to have > 4 billion scheme objects referenced from Scheme chances are good you're doing something wrong 16:29:47 heh 16:29:58 rotty, there's only a market for about 4 computers worldwide 16:30:07 synx: also, the code where I've used integer->pointer in should run on Ikarus after the porting the underlying FFI abstraction as well 16:30:08 rotty, nobody will ever need more than 4kb memory 16:30:22 rotty, if you're every using 4 billion scheme objects you're doing something wrong! :p 16:30:35 vixey: At 4 billion scheme objects, I'd think the speed of light would start to play a limiting factor 16:30:43 vixey: it's trivial to switch to 54 bits, using 32bits is just an implementation detail 16:30:49 s/54/64/ 16:31:17 vixey: *scheme object referenced from C* !!111 16:37:32 replor [n=replor@EM114-48-146-36.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has joined #scheme 16:40:20 -!- X-Scale [i=email@89.180.183.234] has quit [Connection timed out] 16:41:21 -!- Guest83525 [n=mike@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 16:48:40 exexex [n=chatzill@85.101.23.237] has joined #scheme 16:51:28 annodomini [n=lambda@130.189.179.215] has joined #scheme 16:51:54 -!- saccade_ [n=saccade@65.78.24.47] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 16:55:37 -!- langmartin [n=user@75.148.111.133] has quit ["ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 16:56:11 -!- patmaddox [n=pergesu@ip68-4-201-9.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [] 16:56:27 arquebus [n=sdf@201.160.15.70.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #scheme 16:56:33 NNshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-106-3-114.w193-248.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #scheme 16:58:47 error_developer_ [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #scheme 17:10:44 langmartin [n=user@75.148.111.133] has joined #scheme 17:11:29 -!- Nshag [i=user@Mix-Orleans-105-1-128.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:13:05 -!- errordeveloper [n=errordev@78-86-1-110.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:14:39 -!- yhara [n=yhara@7.193.12.221.megaegg.ne.jp] has quit ["Leaving..."] 17:16:47 hark [n=strider@hark.slew.org] has joined #scheme 17:17:43 -!- arquebus [n=sdf@201.160.15.70.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has left #scheme 17:21:15 johnnowak [n=johnnowa@207-38-171-48.c3-0.wsd-ubr1.qens-wsd.ny.cable.rcn.com] has joined #scheme 17:23:02 -!- johnnowak [n=johnnowa@207-38-171-48.c3-0.wsd-ubr1.qens-wsd.ny.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Client Quit] 17:34:13 set1 [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 17:43:16 -!- dudrenov [n=user@c-69-181-124-154.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #scheme 17:46:34 -!- seth [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:49:55 hml [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 17:53:27 geckosenator [n=sean@71.237.94.78] has joined #scheme 17:56:56 -!- jonrafkind [n=jon@c-98-202-86-149.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Operation timed out] 18:02:39 Lemonator [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 18:05:54 -!- kniu [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:10:00 sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 18:17:13 -!- sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Connection timed out] 18:18:24 jonrafkind [n=jon@wireless64.wireless.utah.edu] has joined #scheme 18:18:45 -!- CaptainMorgan [n=CaptainM@c-24-61-150-59.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Connection timed out] 18:25:14 gr3ttk3 [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 18:25:25 -!- grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [] 18:25:28 -!- gr3ttk3 [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] 18:25:32 grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 18:31:14 hey grettke 18:35:22 hotblack23 [n=jh@p5B0568F5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #scheme 18:41:02 hey leppie, what is new? 18:41:27 not much, having a holiday, starting to work on 5 jan 18:41:39 you? 18:42:04 Work work :) 18:44:00 cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 18:59:33 dmoerner [n=user@ppp-71-139-23-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has joined #scheme 19:01:07 -!- jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:01:38 dabr [n=damian@174-234.1-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #scheme 19:03:32 -!- amoe [n=amoe@cpc3-brig3-0-0-cust346.brig.cable.ntl.com] has quit ["leaving"] 19:04:45 tizoc_ [n=user@r190-135-25-178.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 19:05:09 -!- tizoc [n=user@r190-135-31-154.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 19:05:13 -!- tizoc_ is now known as tizoc 19:06:01 -!- bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:07:26 bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 19:11:26 -!- sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 19:19:00 jeremiah [n=jeremiah@31.Red-213-98-123.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #scheme 19:21:15 -!- MichaelRaskin_ [n=raskin@chld.ru] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:28:28 -!- dax [n=dax@hnvr-4dbb68e5.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 19:38:12 -!- ExcelsisD is now known as X-Scale 19:38:34 sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 19:40:52 underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 19:45:33 -!- dabr [n=damian@174-234.1-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [] 19:45:43 -!- ramkrsna [n=ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:49:05 tizoc_ [n=user@r190-135-46-46.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 19:49:15 Fare [n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #scheme 19:49:41 -!- tizoc [n=user@r190-135-25-178.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 19:49:46 -!- tizoc_ is now known as tizoc 19:54:35 krat3r [n=krat@bl4-204-125.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 19:59:29 -!- exexex [n=chatzill@85.101.23.237] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:00:12 -!- rcy [n=rcy@S01060002553240a8.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:05:30 ExcelsisD [i=email@89.180.168.24] has joined #scheme 20:09:12 Guest19204 [n=foo@eht193.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #scheme 20:11:53 Hi! I read that it is possible to use Mit-Scheme with SLIME. Could somebody helpful post his .emacs with Mit-scheme configured? 20:12:34 or just give a hit what to do 20:12:40 I'll be thankful 20:13:33 did you jfgi? 20:14:06 i don't know the term 20:14:31 hey, i googled 20:14:43 i really tried 20:14:48 fuck yourself 20:14:56 -!- Guest19204 [n=foo@eht193.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has left #scheme 20:15:15 nice. 20:16:05 -!- set1 [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:18:07 X-Scale2 [i=email@89-180-232-16.net.novis.pt] has joined #scheme 20:18:34 -!- X-Scale [i=email@89-180-239-30.net.novis.pt] has quit [Connection timed out] 20:19:10 -!- X-Scale2 is now known as X-Scale 20:19:36 xvc [n=chatzill@82-69-45-88.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has joined #scheme 20:29:20 -!- barney [n=bernhard@p549A155F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:30:04 MichaelRaskin_ [n=raskin@gwh-1-177-mytn23k1.ln.rinet.ru] has joined #scheme 20:32:31 jgracin [n=jgracin@82.193.208.195] has joined #scheme 20:32:55 mors [n=mors@cpe-76-176-204-175.san.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 20:33:23 -!- ExcelsisD [i=email@89.180.168.24] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:37:04 incubot: "fuck yourself" is straight out of the 80s; and really shows how far we've degenerated since the witty repartee of, say, merry wives of windsor; or de re publica 20:37:07 all this witty repartee 20:38:07 incubot: socrates felt the same way about the kids of his day 20:38:09 You're an inverse Socrates. Instead of asking questions for the student to learn, you're making wild assertions in the vain hope that _you_ will learn how to defend them. 20:38:57 zbigniew: heh; except in this instance, it's true ;) 20:39:21 incubot: i know, i know; that's what they all say. it's a hideous recursive farce 20:39:23 its fragile and hideous. 20:40:12 mike [n=mike@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #scheme 20:40:39 -!- mike is now known as Guest99933 20:41:01 incubot: i sense an xkcd in the making... something vague, like 1/Socrates + e^(i*pi) = love 20:41:01 Error: unbound variable: i 20:41:05 What's with the Guest.... names? 20:41:08 heh 20:41:55 sjamaan: If a user connects with a name that's registered with enforcement turned on, and ignores the warnings to change the nick, it'll be forcibly changed to one of those nicks. 20:42:20 I see 20:44:10 tizoc_ [n=user@r190-135-13-208.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #scheme 20:44:44 -!- tizoc [n=user@r190-135-46-46.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 20:44:46 -!- tizoc_ is now known as tizoc 20:46:37 ecraven [n=nex@140.78.42.103] has joined #scheme 20:51:44 -!- orgy` [n=ratm_@pD9FFF3C0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:53:53 probably someone just forgot to enter their password, sjamaan 20:53:54 :) 20:54:00 how's everyone doing today? 20:54:13 scheming, I hope! 20:54:22 *sjamaan* was just getting to that 20:54:24 :) 20:58:56 -!- replor [n=replor@EM114-48-146-36.pool.e-mobile.ne.jp] has quit [Connection timed out] 20:59:15 no not scheming 20:59:20 -!- ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 21:00:27 hmm, how do you use "unsafe!" in R6RS code on mzscheme? 21:01:11 (or is that impossible?) 21:01:15 ejs [n=eugen@77-109-28-233.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has joined #scheme 21:01:20 -!- krat3r [n=krat@bl4-204-125.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 21:03:50 mejja [n=user@c-4db6e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #scheme 21:06:58 -!- xvc [n=chatzill@82-69-45-88.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk] has left #scheme 21:08:58 ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 21:09:22 -!- cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Success] 21:11:40 sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 21:13:21 seth [n=seth@76-191-139-155.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #scheme 21:17:34 -!- underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [] 21:17:50 -!- sam_ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Connection timed out] 21:18:20 Heooo [n=Heooo@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 21:19:24 -!- name [n=name@sburn/devel/name] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 21:24:34 -!- bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 21:25:49 bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #scheme 21:28:37 rotty: christ; PLT is like the TSA now with security theatre? i thought i'd seen it all 21:28:51 hehe 21:28:55 TSA? 21:29:49 hadronzoo [n=hadronzo@gateway.publicvpn.net] has joined #scheme 21:36:12 CaptainMorgan [n=CaptainM@c-24-61-150-59.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:36:35 krat3r [n=krat@bl9-246-208.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #scheme 21:37:00 lutometis: Security theatre? 21:37:23 proq [n=user@unaffiliated/proqesi] has joined #scheme 21:38:33 hey -- anyone in Montreal around here? 21:41:23 Fare: http://letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=anyone+in+Montreal+around+here 21:41:42 -!- Lemonator [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 21:43:53 vixey, excellent! 21:44:36 -!- jgracin [n=jgracin@82.193.208.195] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:49:06 lelf [n=lelf@217.118.90.229] has joined #scheme 21:51:23 -!- annodomini [n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [] 21:54:07 -!- grettke [n=grettke@CPE-65-31-132-59.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [] 21:54:42 r2q2 [n=user@c-24-7-212-60.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:55:49 incubot: dashing through the snow 21:55:51 it's about as related to towers of hanoi as... i dunno. consider the fact that you are given a large word list and have to match against that. first think: suppose i am a word, say 'wnos' and another word from the dictionary, say 'snow'. how do i figure out if they are anagrams of one another. 21:56:14 incubot: in a one horse open sleigh 21:56:16 or horse? 21:56:37 underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 21:56:43 incubot: jingle bells 21:56:45 It is possible to add many bells etc, but nobody feels a strong enough of an urge. 21:59:14 jpcooper [n=justin@unaffiliated/jpcooper] has joined #scheme 21:59:16 hello 21:59:29 is the current PLT Scheme based on R5RS, and is it possible to download its reference? 21:59:38 www.plt-scheme.org 22:00:46 I wasn't able to find a file to download for the documentation there 22:03:01 *mejja* sings 'white christmas' 22:04:41 *mejja* sips his glögg 22:05:18 -!- bpt [n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 22:06:51 -!- jpcooper [n=justin@unaffiliated/jpcooper] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:08:08 -!- Heooo [n=Heooo@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 22:08:28 -!- ziggurat [n=ziggurat@pool-71-244-44-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 22:11:45 Heooo [n=Heooo@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 22:13:04 cads [n=max@c-71-56-62-166.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 22:13:40 incubot: this is the third or fourth snowstorm in a row 22:13:42 Stupid snowstorm knocked out my dsl. 22:14:35 incubot: Why don't you get real broadband? 22:14:37 I should be getting broadband soon, so hopefully the point will be a moot one. 22:15:56 incubot: I'm still stuck on a 110 baud teletype. 22:15:59 (Although an intercontinental packet-switched network at 9600 baud isn't exactly responsive...) 22:17:57 incubot: #scheme is dead 22:17:59 Well, he goes on to say "This is a field in which only performance research is allowed, and every other aspect is simply dead. Namesys seeks to raise the dead, and is willing to commit whatever unholy acts that requires." 22:19:00 incubot: unholy 22:19:03 Well, he goes on to say "This is a field in which only performance research is allowed, and every other aspect is simply dead. Namesys seeks to raise the dead, and is willing to commit whatever unholy acts that requires." 22:19:13 incubot: namesys 22:19:16 Of course with things like what Reiser envisions (http://www.namesys.com/whitepaper.html) it will all get interesting :-) 22:19:21 Gosh. 22:19:27 That was a creepy quote. 22:19:52 MORE DRAMATIC IRONY 22:20:06 zbigniew: chant 22:20:24 -!- sam___ [n=Sami__@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Connection timed out] 22:20:43 *mejja* plays http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl0TVf-X6H4 for #scheme 22:23:10 annodomini [n=lambda@64.30.3.122] has joined #scheme 22:24:05 -!- annodomini [n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [Client Quit] 22:28:01 -!- ejs [n=eugen@77-109-28-233.dynamic.peoplenet.ua] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:29:24 -!- underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [] 22:30:27 Can he write software from prison? 22:32:16 underspecified [n=eric@c-66-177-249-13.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 22:33:02 "You won't be writing any software where you're going... jail!" 22:40:12 -!- lelf [n=lelf@217.118.90.229] has quit ["used jmIrc"] 22:40:28 i wonder if they gave hans a lappy 22:41:09 i guess i should read up a bit more ;p 22:42:13 X-Scale2 [i=email@89.180.207.48] has joined #scheme 22:43:32 why not let him write software? 22:44:23 is the USG afraid he will write viruses that will take over robots and transform them into maniacal killers? 22:44:42 now I know who Flight of the Concord is writing songs for! 22:44:57 give him a copy of vb3 , he needs to be punished :p 22:45:21 leppie: heh, he's got enough time to write himself a vb->C compiler :) 22:45:40 (or rather, a C compiler written in vb) 22:46:02 I'd first write a scheme interpreter, then a compiler in Scheme. 22:46:07 with no docs? 22:46:30 you don't need a whole lot of docs to write a scheme interpreter 22:46:42 especially if you skimp on the full numeric tower. 22:46:52 no, but for a compiler you would 22:47:02 yes - and you'd write that in scheme 22:47:06 Reiser's not a Schemer, is he? 22:47:26 how hard is it to smuggle a r4rs in the jail? 22:47:33 :P 22:47:36 and handle the lowlevel stuff in vb? :p 22:47:50 Fare: Mind expanding materials are banned 22:48:07 "haha, sir -- I caught the prisoner smuggling contraband software documentation!" 22:48:29 I bet the guards take it for themselves 22:48:45 I know I would! 22:48:46 even better, give him purposely modified docs that are incorrect :p 22:48:51 "Moe and I got off on the confiscated r4rs spec!" 22:48:57 hehe 22:49:17 leppie: You are truly evil 22:49:43 leppie: R6? 22:50:04 *mejja* laughs cruelly 22:50:21 mejja: And you are worse! 22:51:57 -!- X-Scale [i=email@89-180-232-16.net.novis.pt] has quit [Connection timed out] 22:54:27 just give him this: https://www.osmosian.com/ 22:59:11 -!- drdo [n=psykon@167.111.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:00:01 -!- langmartin [n=user@75.148.111.133] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 23:00:30 That's some weird shit 23:00:32 annodomini_ [n=lambda@c-75-69-96-104.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #scheme 23:00:33 Riastradh: Native backend dragon can't unparse NaNs... 23:03:16 antoszka [n=antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #scheme 23:07:25 -!- Guest99933 [n=mike@dslb-088-066-237-010.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:08:21 rudybot: eval (list->string (reverse (cdr (string->list (string-append (number->string +5i) (number->string (/ +Inf.0 +Inf.0))))))) 23:08:21 zbigniew: ; Value: "0.nan+i5+" 23:12:49 Heooo_ [n=Heooo@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #scheme 23:20:38 -!- Heooo [n=Heooo@e81-197-69-201.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:21:58 -!- ecraven [n=nex@140.78.42.103] has quit ["bbl"] 23:25:33 drdo [n=psykon@167.111.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #scheme 23:28:57 -!- kuribas` [i=kristof@d54C2AC3C.access.telenet.be] has quit ["ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 23:29:45 -!- fschwidom [n=fschwido@dslb-088-068-074-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:33:48 -!- choas [n=lars@p5B0DD4D0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit ["leaving"] 23:34:05 mejja pasted "Non native dragon speaks NaN fluently, native doesn't." at http://paste.lisp.org/display/72593 23:35:55 -!- annodomini_ [n=lambda@wikipedia/lambda] has quit [] 23:36:29 Cale_ [n=Cale@CPE001c10c70239-CM000e5cdd834a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #scheme 23:36:53 -!- Cale [n=Cale@CPE001c10c70239-CM000e5cdd834a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 23:36:59 -!- Cale_ is now known as Cale 23:37:22 hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has joined #scheme 23:37:28 -!- hml_ [n=x@unaffiliated/hml] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:38:41 Is there some archieve for working scheme codes? 23:39:31 Nope. We do have one for broken scheme codes. 23:39:44 It is called paste.lisp.org 23:41:06 Are there some cheatsheets for Scheme? 23:41:11 yeah 23:41:18 1+2 ---> (+ 1 2) 23:41:23 f(x,y,z) --> (f x y z) 23:42:20 vixey: Nice cheat! 23:43:49 vixey: nice :P 23:43:55 Elly! 23:43:59 hello 23:44:03 1 2 + ==> (+ 1 2) :D 23:44:10 postfix is a heresy 23:44:11 do you know anything about the top secret formal methods OS stuff? 23:44:24 vixey: depends what the question is and who's asking 23:44:26 Prefix is more of herecy. 23:44:31 It requires parentheses. 23:44:38 ASau: no it doesn't 23:44:56 or rather: it requires more parentheses, but less operators :P 23:45:13 Postfix doesn't require operators. 23:45:17 Variable arguments FTW! 23:45:31 1 2 + 3 + 4 + 5 + instead of (+ 1 2 3 4 5)? 23:45:53 "+" isn't operator. 23:46:01 "word", if we're speaking forth 23:46:31 Take binary function from Scheme and write fold in explicit form. 23:46:49 Note how many parentheses you need. 23:47:00 I wish I could do forth 23:47:09 I tried hard to be able to program with it but I cannot do it 23:47:24 ASau: (fold f b l)? 23:47:32 (assuming f is a binary function) 23:47:46 Do you understand word "explicit"? 23:47:53 evidently not in that context 23:47:55 do define it 23:47:58 Consider "+" is binary-only function. 23:48:02 correct 23:48:09 And your (+ 1 2 3) breaks. 23:48:14 yeah 23:48:15 Now write that summation. 23:48:24 so instead I'd say (fold + 0 '(1 2 3)) 23:48:28 How many parentheses do you require. 23:48:29 foldl, rather 23:48:35 I see two sets of parens 23:48:43 You're forbiddent to use fold* 23:48:43 one to construct the list, one to evaluate the entire expression 23:48:46 er, why? 23:48:48 Write it explicitly. 23:48:50 why? 23:48:50 -!- DuClare is now known as uguu 23:48:51 Because. 23:48:54 Because. 23:48:58 Write it in forth without using the stack 23:49:04 Write it explicitly and count parentheses. 23:49:13 it doesn't matter how many parens it has when it's written out 23:49:16 nobody writes it out 23:49:20 Write it in Scheme without lists. 23:49:30 ASau: Stop trolling, k? 23:49:32 you can't sum a list without lists 23:49:34 -!- uguu is now known as DuClare 23:49:38 Elly: oh, really? 23:49:42 yeah 23:49:44 sjamaan, how it is trolling................................ 23:49:45 1 2 3 4 5 + + + + 23:49:48 No lists. 23:49:49 sjamaan, please don't answer that 23:49:50 :p 23:49:54 ASau: that's a fixed expression 23:50:14 (+ 1 (+ 2 (+ 3 (+ 4 5)))) is same. 23:50:26 correct, and that is indeed what (foldl + 0 '(1 2 3 4 5)) expands to 23:50:30 but who cares what it expands to? 23:50:32 You only have 8 useless parentheses. 23:50:43 foldl doesn't expand. 23:50:51 You don't even know Scheme. 23:50:52 :p 23:50:58 'evaluates' and 'expands to' are the same thing happening at different times 23:51:13 Those are quite different times. :p 23:51:19 -!- certainty|work [n=david@hades.d-coded.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:51:20 ASau, well foldl isn't in scheme 23:51:34 vixey: er? 23:51:38 Yeah, it is called otherwise in SRFI-1. 23:51:40 r5rs foldl 23:51:40 > (foldl + 0 '(1 2 3 4 5)) 23:51:40 15 23:51:40 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for foldl. 23:51:46 SRFI-1 are bullshit 23:51:46 it's in plt-scheme at least 23:51:59 either R5RS or it's not scheme IMO 23:52:10 R6RS isn't Scheme :D 23:52:30 Many standards to make a good choice of. :) 23:53:52 I think you can define foldl pretty simply, though 23:54:09 in any case, the size of the AST is not particularly important to me 23:54:34 So, it makes no difference to you whether it is Scheme or C, right? 23:54:52 it does make a difference to me 23:54:53 The difference is only in AST size. 23:54:58 I disagree 23:55:03 Oh, really? 23:55:13 what are you comparing AST sizes of? 23:55:18 Does "Turing-equivalent" tell you anything? 23:55:22 implementing a correct garbage collector and the various niceties scheme provides, if I ever finished, would be extremely difficult 23:55:29 "turing-equivalent" is not the same as "equally powerful" 23:55:36 It is. 23:55:46 How do you measure "equally powerful" then? 23:56:01 ugh 23:56:12 please do not talk about "turing-whateveritis" 23:56:13 Turing and Church equivalencies are equivalent. 23:56:19 no, it's not - http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html 23:56:21 this is completely irrelevant in practice 23:56:30 Let's talk about Church-equivalent then. 23:56:42 lets not talk about complexity?? 23:56:44 church-equivalence doesn't matter 23:56:54 Elly: ever tried to check what Graham tolds you? 23:57:02 tells. 23:57:09 if you're interested in programming languages there's A fucking change a discussion you have isn't going to degenerate into a fucking complexity measure 23:57:09 ?? 23:57:10 Raynes [i=kvirc@ACA224B1.ipt.aol.com] has joined #scheme 23:57:11 are you about to suggest that all programming languages are equally powerful? 23:57:17 No. 23:57:27 if so, I look forward to seeing large software projects written in brainfuck 23:57:37 Every Turing or Church equivalent languages are equally powerful, 23:57:45 if you don't measure characters. 23:57:47 we are using different definitions of 'power' 23:57:58 ASau, REGEX and DFA are equally powerful!! so fucking what! 23:57:58 And you tell above you don't. 23:58:19 power: possession of controlling influence; "the deterrent power of nuclear weapons"; "the power of his love saved her"; "his powerfulness was concealed ... ( http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn%3Fs%3Dpower ) 23:58:20 vixey: yes, and that's the point Elly doesn't get. 23:58:21 ability to carry out equivalent computations is nice; I'm talking about the size of the AST as a rough measure inverse to "power" 23:58:26 kniu [n=kniu@pool-71-107-51-222.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #scheme 23:58:47 ASau: er? you just asserted that this should be true: 23:58:48 18:54 ASau: So, it makes no difference to you whether it is Scheme or C, right? 23:58:52 because I only care about AST size 23:58:54 ASau, algorithmic complexity and formal language is very interesting but *not relevant* 23:58:57 Elly: you told earlier "in any case, the size of the AST is not particularly important to me". 23:59:02 Elly: so? 23:59:11 ASau: the size of the *expanded* AST doesn't matter to me 23:59:15 you asked how big the expanded foldl is 23:59:18 it's large - oh no 23:59:26 Yes, I asserted that given your assumption C is equivalent. 23:59:28 the size of the AST I, as a programmer, have to produce is what I care about 23:59:33 correct, it is 23:59:37 you can compile scheme into C if you like 23:59:57 You can do reverse.