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[~user@oteiza.siccegge.de] has joined #sbcl 18:06:51 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-92.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #sbcl 18:22:39 nikodemus [~nikodemus@37-219-147-87.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #sbcl 18:22:39 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o nikodemus 18:31:18 o/ 18:32:54 http://paste.lisp.org/display/129593 # does this look right? 18:33:22 i feel like i'm forgetting something obvious 18:33:24 oh god. ENOCAFFEINE 18:33:37 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-60.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:34:15 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-60.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 18:36:13 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-60.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:36:56 maybe if i distrust the result SAFETY 3... :p 18:37:13 -!- borkman [~user@S0106001111de1fc8.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:38:33 or possibly conditionalize it on (setf sb-c::*use-weak-assed-escape-analysis* t) ... 18:39:07 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-60.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 18:42:10 alright, another round of run-program fixes is in 18:46:46 ... Is anyone doing anything about the long-neglected ENABLE-INTERRUPT vs. deferrable_sigset / blockable_sigset damage this month? 18:50:16 what's that? i don't remember 18:51:21 what i would really love is callbacks from foreign threads and signals inside foreign thread being untouched 18:51:39 If we don't have a lisp-side handler for a signal, we don't need to defer it. If we have a lisp-side handler for a signal, we need to defer it. 19:00:56 I'm already forcing SIGTERM to be blocked on my system, Fare has a copy of the code I used so that he can try to do the same for SIGCHLD. We'd need to do the other way if someone wants to handle, say, SIGWINCH from Lisp. 19:02:04 what other way? 19:11:09 To handle SIGWINCH or some other currently-not-deferred signal from Lisp, we need to ADD the signal to the deferrable_sigset. 19:12:50 So, other way-as-direction, not other way-as-method. 19:32:54 -!- antgreen [~user@CPEf0def1ad1e4e-CM0019477f82fc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:41:06 nikodemus: why does typep cons? 19:44:00 stassats: because our hash-caches use non-local exits that are checked at runtime because the compiler isn't smart enough to prove they won't escape 19:44:33 just sent a patch for review :) 19:47:01 i see 19:47:10 *stassats* isn't qualified enough to review it 19:56:41 ASau` [~user@95-26-251-179.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #sbcl 19:59:02 ... This code is unfamiliar... Even though I know I've done work surrounding escape analysis and value cells at some point. 20:00:27 -!- ASau [~user@95-28-124-123.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:03:43 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.153.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:33:16 rpg [~rpg@c-98-229-120-236.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 20:37:44 I'm having a very strange compilation bug. I have a file with a form like this (defparameter otherpkg::varname '(foo bar baz)) and when I try to load the compiled file, SBCL complains that otherpkg::varname is UNBOUND-VARIABLE. 20:38:00 Any idea why defparameter would lead SBCL to read before defining? 20:38:52 rpg: does the current package :USE CL? 20:39:23 hey, what is this, eveyone-else-do-psychic-debugging day? 20:40:13 that's my job 20:40:47 pkhuong: what do you mean by "current package"? The package of the fasl file, or the package of the REPL? The repl is C-L-U, and the fasl file's package is PDDL, which does /not/ use CL. 20:41:26 *rpg* hadn't realized that the "C" in SBCL was "Crystal Ball," not "Common" 20:41:35 if the fasl's doesn't use cl, then why should "defparameter" work? 20:41:46 the package in which the fasl was compiled. 20:41:52 *Kryztof* looks at his apostrophe key in disbelief 20:41:55 Kryztof: yes, I was wondering that myself, now that pkhuong pointed this out. 20:42:12 This is one of those bugs of the class "why did this EVER work?" 20:42:22 because you were using another implementation 20:42:27 that defaults to using CL 20:42:27 in some implementations defpackage without any :use defaults to (:use :cl) 20:42:38 -!- jsnell_ is now known as jsnell 20:42:40 traitor! 20:43:54 jsnell: Yes, that is right. DWIM considered harmful 20:44:15 thank you all. I could have banged my head on that forever. 20:44:43 Do I recall correctly that the spec gives license to implementations to include any set of packages they like when using DEFPACKAGE without a :USE clause? 20:44:44 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c1898.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:45:01 yes 20:45:04 It was rarely being used, because it was in the test code, and the tests for some reason hadn't been run under SBCL. The /library/ worked, but the tests were busted. 20:45:50 and if you want to create a package without any uses, you need to explicitly provide an empty :use 20:47:00 stassats: Thanks. Will fix that now. 20:47:28 Kryztof: scooped (: 20:48:10 only sbcl appears to provide no default use 20:48:35 oh, and abcl as well 20:48:49 How about providing a STYLE-WARNING? 20:49:15 how many people will it make angry? 20:49:49 stassats: I always specify empty :use clauses when I need it, because I know it'll break randomly elsewhere, fwiw. 20:49:51 we need to do an angriness-benefit analsys 20:54:10 "this doesn't make nearly enough people angry. for just a little bit more effort we could silently default the :use list to a random set of packages" 20:55:53 stassats: I would put my gratefulness against several pounds of angriness. 20:56:48 some people will argue "why not make it default to :cl, sbcl again screwing everybody over" 20:57:34 my retort would be "it's not sbcl screwing everybody, that's implementations which include things beside :cl" 20:57:39 -!- rpg [~rpg@c-98-229-120-236.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:57:46 rpg [~rpg@c-98-229-120-236.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #sbcl 20:57:48 so, if all implementations agreed to only include :cl, it would be fine 20:57:55 "STYLE-WARNING: Failure to supply a :USE option allows brain-eating zombies to fill your package's use list." 20:58:29 i'd merge a patch with brain eating zombie warning 20:59:04 on ccl it's (mapcar 'package-name (package-use-list (make-package (gensym)))) => ("CCL" "COMMON-LISP") and on lw, ("COMMON-LISP" "HARLEQUIN-COMMON-LISP" "LISPWORKS") 20:59:16 for others it's either NIL or COMMON-LISP 20:59:27 then we could remove the cats-are-nice warning, and balance of professionalism would remain about right 21:02:21 pfft, so we just have to wrap it in punsterly latin to be professional? 21:05:09 CULTUS-LOREM: Pulvinar supplementum :USE bene permittit cerebrum-manducans zombies implere tua sarcina usum album. 21:05:35 i think i just found a valid use-case for adding l10n support to sbcl 21:05:53 we could make the default messages google-translated latin 21:05:58 ahahaha 21:06:15 You could have a default restart, "Translate into Latin" 21:07:29 tcr1: hey, is the handler-bind thing something you have a current use for as non-consing? 21:08:58 VERITAS ETERNAM 21:09:13 ; captus CULTUS-LOREM: De variabilis Y definitur sed numquam. 21:09:33 ; Scribendarum unitas complevit 21:09:45 local profanities directed towards the users would be useful 21:09:52 Well not really. I once had to change a macro expanding to handler-case + error into an explicit tagbody. 21:10:02 ; Captus I CULTUS-LOREM statu 21:11:49 *rpg* has patched his library. Thanks to all for psychic debugging support. 21:12:31 COMMUNES-BALBUTIO-USUFRUCTUARIUS 21:12:57 were we allowed to add nicknames for CL-USER? 21:13:45 ^.^ 21:14:17 -!- ASau` [~user@95-26-251-179.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:14:18 maybe this calls for a CDR... 21:15:38 -!- drl [~lat@110.139.229.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:15:45 ok, maybe i should just head to bed before the jokes get any worse. good night 21:16:13 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@37-219-147-87.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:29:14 drl [~lat@110.139.229.172] has joined #sbcl 21:35:29 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:58:23 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:29:02 stassats: thanks for fixing my typo! 22:29:15 thank flyspell 22:30:48 i should somehow turn it automatically for NEWS 22:31:38 which is already done for commit logs 22:32:24 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178-164-243-68.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #sbcl 22:32:25 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178-164-243-68.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [Changing host] 22:32:25 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #sbcl 22:48:09 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-60.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:49:20 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-28.netcologne.de] has joined #sbcl 23:10:11 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-tnfvopbvkjdjnwkb] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:13:36 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vlxrzugyujwvwrec] has joined #sbcl 23:15:13 ASau [~user@95-26-251-179.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #sbcl 23:23:33 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vlxrzugyujwvwrec] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:46:47 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:56:26 kanru [~user@61-228-146-139.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #sbcl