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2015-01-15T23:42:13Z victor_lowther_ is now known as victor_lowther 2015-01-15T23:42:14Z drmeister: Is there a Common Lisp library that provides efficient immutable collections like Clojure is advertised as having? 2015-01-15T23:42:38Z eudoxia: fset, i think 2015-01-15T23:42:55Z aap joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:44:07Z Jesin joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:44:49Z 64MABRKDD quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-15T23:45:54Z 7YUAAFL3J quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-15T23:46:12Z sivoais joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:46:13Z Guest44440: drmeister: There are some listed in http://cliki.net/Data%20structure 2015-01-15T23:46:33Z hekmek joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:47:01Z Guest44440: I do have one myself, but I am afraid it is not battled enough. 2015-01-15T23:48:27Z munksgaa1d quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-15T23:48:52Z sivoais_ joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:48:54Z PuercoPop: drmeister: There is fset and I'm not sure how efficient it is but Fare has https://github.com/fare/lisp-interface-library 2015-01-15T23:49:01Z fridim_ joined #lisp 2015-01-15T23:49:56Z Guest44440: So prior to the firewall incident I asked about deleting directories. Did anyone respond? AFAICT it is not possible without using an implementation extension. 2015-01-15T23:54:26Z antonv quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-15T23:55:10Z sivoais quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-15T23:56:13Z PuercoPop: Guest44440: uiop, a compability, across implementation provides delete-directory-tree (You can see an example of use here: https://github.com/redline6561/coleslaw/blob/cli-commands/cli/launch/clean.lisp#L15) 2015-01-15T23:56:46Z Guest44440: PuercoPop: Thank you. 2015-01-15T23:57:52Z fridim_ quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-15T23:59:39Z Guest44440 quit (Quit: you can't /fire me, I /quit) 2015-01-16T00:00:34Z eSVG joined #lisp 2015-01-16T00:01:19Z moei quit (Quit: Leaving...) 2015-01-16T00:02:57Z bgs100 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T00:04:06Z Ethan- joined #lisp 2015-01-16T00:04:42Z zRecursive joined #lisp 2015-01-16T00:05:33Z sivoais_ quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-16T00:06:16Z sword``` quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T00:07:39Z k-dawg joined 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2015-01-16T02:43:20Z 7JTAB3J1G is now known as thomas 2015-01-16T02:54:00Z Adlai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T02:55:37Z zyaku joined #lisp 2015-01-16T02:56:04Z jgrant quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:01:14Z ikki joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:01:30Z beach joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:01:43Z beach: Good morning everyone! 2015-01-16T03:02:24Z loke: Hello beach! 2015-01-16T03:02:25Z AntiSpamMeta quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T03:02:40Z loke: beach: Look at my home speedtest result... 2015-01-16T03:02:41Z loke: http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/4061435990 2015-01-16T03:02:50Z fe[nl]ix: hej beach 2015-01-16T03:03:02Z loke: Hello fenlix 2015-01-16T03:03:13Z fe[nl]ix: hi loke 2015-01-16T03:03:16Z fe[nl]ix: impressive 2015-01-16T03:03:39Z beach: loke: Very nice. Probably comparable to Sweden. :) 2015-01-16T03:03:44Z Xach: loke: you can download all of quicklisp in just a few hours 2015-01-16T03:04:17Z loke: Xach: QL is served from S3 right? 2015-01-16T03:04:53Z |3b| quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T03:05:03Z loke: Xach: I can realistically only get >100 Mb/s from mirrors within Singapore, so if your S3 bucket is mirrored here, then yes. To the US I usually don't get more than maybe 40 Mb/s 2015-01-16T03:05:09Z AntiSpamMeta joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:05:21Z zymurgy quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:05:30Z loke: Xach: How big it all of QL? 2015-01-16T03:05:31Z huza quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8) 2015-01-16T03:06:18Z Poenikatu joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:06:18Z Poenikatu quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T03:06:18Z Poenikatu joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:06:21Z kanru joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:06:42Z kapil__ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:06:58Z ikki quit (Quit: Saliendo) 2015-01-16T03:07:02Z Xach: at least two HUNDRED megabytes 2015-01-16T03:07:10Z |3b| joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:07:12Z beach: Heh! 2015-01-16T03:07:18Z AntiSpamMeta quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T03:07:34Z svgDelux joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:07:36Z Xach: loke: there's a cloudfront edge somewhere closer than the US, but i don't remember exactly where. 2015-01-16T03:07:53Z Xach: loke: you made me look into the CDN and i tell the story whenever i talk about quicklisp to people 2015-01-16T03:07:53Z AntiSpamMeta joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:08:06Z genii quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T03:08:07Z Quadrescence joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:10:01Z zymurgy joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:10:48Z eSVG quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:11:47Z beach: loke: My nephew just graduated from a university program in game development. He refuses to go work in north America because of the slow internet. 2015-01-16T03:12:07Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:12:56Z loke: beach: I don't want to go there either, partially for Internet reasons. but the speed is not the main issue there. 2015-01-16T03:13:05Z beach: True. 2015-01-16T03:15:49Z loke: beach: Where are you? 2015-01-16T03:15:56Z beach: Bordeaux. 2015-01-16T03:16:14Z Guest10093 is now known as dtw 2015-01-16T03:16:44Z dtw is now known as Guest18561 2015-01-16T03:21:06Z eSVG joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:24:08Z svgDelux quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:26:20Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-16T03:26:34Z Quadrescence: beach, Slow or expensive? 2015-01-16T03:26:52Z Quadrescence: Does everyone consider 100 Mbps slow outside of the USA? 2015-01-16T03:26:54Z beach: Slow, cheap. 2015-01-16T03:27:05Z sheilong quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2015-01-16T03:27:42Z doomlord_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:28:19Z vdek joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:28:23Z Zhivago: I've stopped worrying about my connection bandwidth since the bottlenecks are elsewhere. 2015-01-16T03:28:56Z vdek: Q: When using the clisp repl, is there a way to indent code? 2015-01-16T03:29:31Z yenda`` quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:29:34Z loke: Quadrescence: Well, basically 100 Mb/s is what I would consider minimum acceptable. 2015-01-16T03:29:46Z loke: vdek: No. 2015-01-16T03:29:52Z LiamH quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-16T03:29:56Z loke: vdek: However, you should be using Emacs and SLIME 2015-01-16T03:30:08Z vdek: thanks 2015-01-16T03:30:27Z vdek: So I've heard, will setup one of these upcoming weekends 2015-01-16T03:30:43Z pillton: loke: Don't come to Australia then. 2015-01-16T03:31:13Z Zhivago: Comes of privatization ... 2015-01-16T03:31:19Z vdek: I'm about to move and strongly debating between 75/75 FIOS and 150/150 FIOS... 2015-01-16T03:31:22Z loke: pillton: Yeah, I was just cahtting about that with an Australian colleague of mine. Looks quite bad. He pointed me to this site: http://howfastisthenbn.com.au/ 2015-01-16T03:31:30Z Quadrescence: loke, That's very weird to me! Maybe I'm stuck in the past, but there's so much on the internet you can do just fine with even a 20 Mbps connection. 2015-01-16T03:31:32Z loke: vdek: What is a fois? 2015-01-16T03:31:51Z zyaku quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:31:55Z vdek: FIOS: verizons fiber optic plan 2015-01-16T03:32:17Z loke: Quadrescence: Well, there are certainly lots of things you can do with an even slower connection. I'm just saying it's hard to take an ISP seriously if they don't offer 100. 2015-01-16T03:32:37Z Quadrescence: loke, I see. 2015-01-16T03:32:57Z loke: vdek: I've heard about verizon. They don't seem to be the kind fo company I would ever want to do business with. Don't you have a competitor you can go to? 2015-01-16T03:33:34Z vdek: not that I know of that offers anything comparable speed and cost wise... 2015-01-16T03:34:21Z loke: vdek: Isn't verizon the guys that randomly decides to cap your connection when they deicde that you've downloaded too much? 2015-01-16T03:34:35Z vdek: no, not that I know of... 2015-01-16T03:34:58Z vdek: would be kinda silly to buy a 150Mb/s connection and get capped, lol... 2015-01-16T03:35:03Z Quadrescence: loke, That's definitely Comcast. Verizon, I don't know. 2015-01-16T03:35:19Z loke: Quadrescence: Ah yes. comcast was the other one I've heard bad things about. 2015-01-16T03:35:40Z loke: I'm glad I could choose between 4 or so different ISP's for my fubre plan. 2015-01-16T03:35:42Z loke: fibre 2015-01-16T03:36:00Z vdek: lucky :) 2015-01-16T03:36:07Z Quadrescence: loke, You are very lucky in the USA to have a choice between two comparable ISPs. 2015-01-16T03:36:30Z Quadrescence: (Comparable, i.e., not one ISP specializing in fiber, and the other specializing in dial-up.) 2015-01-16T03:36:50Z Guest72758 is now known as theos 2015-01-16T03:37:04Z theos quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T03:37:04Z theos joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:37:09Z loke: vdek: Well, the government said that everybody should have fibre to their home. Then different ISP's can sell access. Each home gets two dark fibre connections, so you can have two ISP's at the same time :-) (i had that so they overlapped while switching ISP's) 2015-01-16T03:38:26Z zyaku joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:50:35Z bgs100 quit (Quit: bgs100) 2015-01-16T03:50:48Z yeticry quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T03:51:48Z beach: [getting back to Common Lisp] In the extrinsic HIR compiler environment, I had to define DEFMACRO three times. 2015-01-16T03:51:53Z beach: First I had to fake it by creating a host function that generates a host function for defined macros. 2015-01-16T03:52:03Z beach: Second, I use DEFMACRO to redefine DEFMACRO. Now it creates target functions for defined macros, but its own expansion function is still a host function. 2015-01-16T03:52:04Z beach: The third time, I again use DEFMACRO to redefine DEFMACRO. Now its expansion function is also a target function. 2015-01-16T03:52:27Z loke: beach: Ouch. You should blog about that so I can share it :-) 2015-01-16T03:52:31Z yeticry joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:52:53Z beach: loke: My wife would agree with you. But I feel too busy to blog about it. 2015-01-16T03:53:47Z nikki93_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T03:54:10Z beach: loke: I am not quite sure how to describe what I am doing with the extrinsic HIR compiler environment. Maybe once I figure that out I will write it up. 2015-01-16T03:58:05Z beach: I need to figure out how to describe two things. One thing is what the extrinsic HIR compiler environment *is* and at the same time find a better name for it. Another thing is how I turn a host environment into an extrinsic HIR compiler environment (which is what I am doing now). 2015-01-16T03:58:52Z Pixel_Outlaw quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T04:00:09Z nikki93_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T04:03:43Z moei joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:06:14Z protist joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:07:11Z protist: HELLO!!! 2015-01-16T04:08:09Z beach: Hello protist. 2015-01-16T04:08:18Z protist: beach: hey :) 2015-01-16T04:08:36Z protist: beach: working on some array functions that behave more like APL 2015-01-16T04:09:03Z protist: beach: can make multidimensional arrays of indices and can index into one multideminsional array with another 2015-01-16T04:09:18Z protist: beach: all using standard ANSI multidim arrays 2015-01-16T04:09:28Z beach: Sounds like fun. 2015-01-16T04:09:35Z protist: beach: it is a challenge :p 2015-01-16T04:09:39Z beach: But you might share it with everyone; not just me. :) 2015-01-16T04:09:57Z protist: beach: hehe yeah maybe when I am farther 2015-01-16T04:10:22Z beach: I mean, no need to put my nick in front of your phrases. 2015-01-16T04:10:29Z protist: beach: at the moment it is messy....abusing eval-env instead of making a good setf macro....one thing is O(n^2)...needs a hash to make it O(n) 2015-01-16T04:10:34Z protist: ah 2015-01-16T04:11:15Z protist: other people can still see...or do some people really filter like that? 2015-01-16T04:11:31Z protist: and my book has like 70 pages now 2015-01-16T04:11:32Z beach: Other people can see. 2015-01-16T04:11:48Z beach: Congratulations. I was about to ask. 2015-01-16T04:11:57Z protist: thank you :) 2015-01-16T04:12:26Z beach: It is easy to get to about 50 pages. Table of contents, index, bibliography, chapter headers, front page, etc. It gets a bit harder after that. 2015-01-16T04:12:27Z tertl3-laptop joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:12:50Z protist: actually learning a bit in constructing examples...I didn't notice assoc has a :test keyword 2015-01-16T04:13:16Z protist: yeah I have about 40-50 pages of content...rest is contents etc 2015-01-16T04:13:19Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:14:25Z protist: have you ever had predicates with useful return values in cond and hated repeating the operation? 2015-01-16T04:15:42Z protist: here is a fun macro for that...can refer to the return value as $_ 2015-01-16T04:15:43Z protist: http://pastebin.com/2hnv3LC2 2015-01-16T04:15:49Z beach: You can handle that by a clause containing just the predicate. 2015-01-16T04:16:22Z protist: but sometimes you want to do more with that result afterwards...that is interesting, though :) 2015-01-16T04:16:27Z beach: ... at least for the simple case: (cond (pred pred) ...) 2015-01-16T04:16:54Z Guest18561 is now known as dtw 2015-01-16T04:17:14Z protist: imagine (cond ((assoc a b) (format nil "[~a]" (assoc a b))) ... 2015-01-16T04:17:23Z dtw is now known as Guest48315 2015-01-16T04:17:27Z beach: Yes, I see what you are doing. 2015-01-16T04:17:30Z protist: :) 2015-01-16T04:17:43Z protist: also put a progn on 2015-01-16T04:18:36Z Quadrescence quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-16T04:19:30Z protist: I should maybe optimize it to not do the let unless there is a reference to $_ 2015-01-16T04:19:49Z protist: then it would be guilt-free 2015-01-16T04:19:53Z enitiz quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T04:20:02Z protist: and no progn unless multiple statements 2015-01-16T04:22:04Z vhost- quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.0) 2015-01-16T04:22:40Z vhost- joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:22:40Z vhost- quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T04:22:40Z vhost- joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:24:48Z vdek quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T04:27:59Z beach: protist: Probably no need to optimize. The compiler will take care of that. 2015-01-16T04:28:43Z Vutral quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T04:31:52Z beach: The extrinsic HIR compiler environment now has a temporary version of ENSURE-GENERIC-FUNCTION as well as DEFGENERIC (calling ENSURE-GENERIC-FUNCTION) and DEFMETHOD. Now I need to use DEFGENERIC and DEFMETHOD to define ENSURE-GENERIC-FUNCTION-USING-CLASS, and then introduce the real version of ENSURE-GENERIC-FUNCTION which will call ENSURE-GENERIC-FUNCTION-USING-CLASS. Fun, fun! 2015-01-16T04:33:08Z scymtym quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T04:33:33Z beach: Let me know if y'all get tired of my blabbing about the extrinsic HIR compiler environment. I am just taking advantage of the relative silence. 2015-01-16T04:35:21Z Guest48315 quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T04:35:21Z Guest48315 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:35:34Z Xach: it is interrupting the discussion of broadband options in singapore 2015-01-16T04:35:39Z Xach: please quiet down 2015-01-16T04:36:03Z beach: Heh! Yeah, OK. 2015-01-16T04:38:02Z Xach wonders about a CL Compiler Summit for all the implementors to gather and talk shop 2015-01-16T04:38:16Z Vutral joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:38:20Z beach: Oooh. That would be nice. 2015-01-16T04:38:41Z beach: Live or virtual? 2015-01-16T04:39:03Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T04:40:09Z Xach: Live. I was thinking about it because of the problem of time zone overlap between you and drmeister 2015-01-16T04:40:30Z beach: Yeah, good point. I do read the logs, but it's not the same. 2015-01-16T04:40:36Z Xach: Idle speculation, though, hardly more valuable (if slightly more topical) than internet speed discussion. 2015-01-16T04:40:49Z beach: Sure. 2015-01-16T04:41:51Z REPLeffect joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:41:55Z beach: I am guessing that most implementors don't have the means to travel, however. 2015-01-16T04:42:43Z beach: In 2000, when we stared organizing LSM/RMLL in Bordeaux, we actually paid for people to show up. Those were the days. 2015-01-16T04:43:21Z beach: The result was great. SBCL threads came out of that. As did McCLIM, I assume Bordeaux threads as well. 2015-01-16T04:44:22Z beach: Invited people were given a student dorm room, but then, most of them were used to that kind of housing. 2015-01-16T04:45:18Z beach: s/stared/started/ [not awake yet] 2015-01-16T04:48:41Z MrWoohoo quit (Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]) 2015-01-16T04:50:20Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T04:52:55Z tertl3-laptop quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T04:54:22Z dagnachew quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.1) 2015-01-16T04:56:47Z beach: https://2014.rmll.info/?lang=en in case someone wonders what LSM/RMLL is. 2015-01-16T04:59:47Z loke: Xach: It's bed time for you soon, isn't it? 2015-01-16T05:00:04Z Xach: The internet is timeless. 2015-01-16T05:00:10Z loke: Very much so 2015-01-16T05:03:53Z Ukari joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:04:59Z vdamewood joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:08:36Z zyaku quit (Quit: Lost terminal) 2015-01-16T05:17:33Z Guest48315 is now known as dtw 2015-01-16T05:17:51Z heurist`_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:18:02Z brucem_ is now known as brucem 2015-01-16T05:18:15Z heurist` quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-16T05:18:36Z H4ns joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:19:52Z brucem quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T05:19:52Z brucem joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:20:23Z zeitue quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T05:21:14Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:21:57Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T05:28:28Z Harag quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T05:28:32Z Harag1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:28:33Z Oddity joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:30:51Z Harag1 quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T05:32:19Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:32:39Z loke: I'm getting hungry 2015-01-16T05:32:51Z loke: The Internet can't help with that. 2015-01-16T05:33:07Z nell quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.2-dev) 2015-01-16T05:34:34Z zeitue joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:34:51Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:36:34Z beach: Sure it can. You can order from "McDo" online. At least here you can. 2015-01-16T05:36:47Z beach: Not that I would be tempted to use that service, thouth. 2015-01-16T05:36:49Z beach: though 2015-01-16T05:38:07Z loke: You can here as well, but as you say, why would I? :-) 2015-01-16T05:39:39Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:41:48Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T05:43:03Z pranavrc joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:48:38Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:48:42Z beach: So what should I call the extrinsic HIR compiler environment? SICLette? 2015-01-16T05:48:55Z beach: Nah. 2015-01-16T05:49:11Z beach: That suggests something "light", which is not what characterizes it. 2015-01-16T05:49:23Z Quadrescence joined #lisp 2015-01-16T05:49:56Z loke: What does HIR mean? 2015-01-16T05:50:22Z beach: High-level Intermediate Representation. 2015-01-16T05:50:43Z CrazyM4n quit (Quit: sleep) 2015-01-16T05:51:49Z beach: It is characterized by the fact that all the data objects that the instructions manipulate are Common Lisp objects (though possibly unboxed). 2015-01-16T05:52:51Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T05:52:57Z loke: beach: What do you use it for? 2015-01-16T05:53:37Z beach: It is the output of the second step of the Cleavir compiler. 2015-01-16T05:53:55Z loke: Xach: Still there? 2015-01-16T05:54:12Z loke: Xach: The latest QL update doesn't seem to have picked up a change to the pooler project 2015-01-16T05:55:43Z beach: Hmm. I am fairly sure I taught minion what HIR means. Is someone making minion forget some definitions? 2015-01-16T05:59:07Z beach: Also, specbot used to know about CLIM. No longer. This is spooky! 2015-01-16T06:00:07Z isoraqathedh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:01:29Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-16T06:02:59Z jleija quit (Quit: Lost terminal) 2015-01-16T06:04:09Z isoraqathedh_l quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:05:20Z Mon_Ouie quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.1) 2015-01-16T06:05:26Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:06:30Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:07:41Z oleo quit (Quit: Verlassend) 2015-01-16T06:07:54Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:12:17Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T06:12:51Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:13:19Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:13:28Z theseb quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T06:14:09Z theseb joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:15:51Z doomlord__ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:17:27Z nikki93 quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:18:18Z doomlord_ quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:18:32Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T06:19:36Z capcar quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:19:47Z joga_ is now known as joga 2015-01-16T06:20:20Z joga quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T06:20:20Z joga joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:24:22Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:25:01Z pillton: minion tell pillton about dementia 2015-01-16T06:26:16Z protist quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2015-01-16T06:28:12Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:31:11Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T06:32:42Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:35:25Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-16T06:40:12Z TristamWrk quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T06:40:50Z TristamWrk joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:44:55Z beach: pillton: ? 2015-01-16T06:44:55Z beach: 2015-01-16T06:45:18Z beach: Oh, I see what you are doing. 2015-01-16T06:52:28Z MutSbeta joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:57:32Z teiresia1 is now known as teiresias 2015-01-16T06:57:42Z teiresias quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T06:57:42Z teiresias joined #lisp 2015-01-16T06:58:50Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T06:59:41Z beach left #lisp 2015-01-16T07:00:31Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:01:08Z zRecursive quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:03:29Z keen__________33 quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T07:04:39Z keen__________33 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:06:44Z theos: minion: tell pillton about dementia 2015-01-16T07:06:44Z minion: Sorry, I couldn't find anything in the database for ``dementia''. 2015-01-16T07:08:48Z ggole joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:10:21Z mrSpec joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:12:04Z munksgaard joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:13:15Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:16:23Z p_l_ is now known as p_l 2015-01-16T07:17:02Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:17:18Z AeroNotix quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T07:17:42Z pacon joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:17:50Z AeroNotix joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:20:49Z theseb quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T07:21:20Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:24:43Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:24:54Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T07:26:41Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:35:52Z flip214_ is now known as flip214 2015-01-16T07:35:58Z flip214 quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T07:35:58Z flip214 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:36:11Z psy_ quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T07:37:12Z cods_ is now known as cods 2015-01-16T07:38:11Z Harag quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:38:15Z Harag1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:39:33Z zymurgy quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8) 2015-01-16T07:39:50Z zymurgy joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:40:19Z zymurgy quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-16T07:40:48Z psy_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:40:51Z Ukari quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T07:41:42Z zymurgy joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:44:19Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:44:49Z grungier quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T07:45:26Z Shinmera joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:46:32Z Ukari joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:46:55Z edgar-rf_ quit (Quit: lifetime expired by mental death) 2015-01-16T07:47:41Z mishoo_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:48:02Z grungier joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:49:19Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:49:55Z Ragnaroek joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:50:28Z Colleen_____ is now known as Colleen 2015-01-16T07:50:56Z drdanmaku quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-16T07:51:09Z fridim_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:55:40Z Grue` joined #lisp 2015-01-16T07:57:56Z jbkcc joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:03:41Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:04:17Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T08:04:26Z zRecursive joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:04:44Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:06:56Z isoraqathedh_l joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:07:00Z chu quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:07:38Z chu joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:09:56Z krrrcks: dim: Thanks for the hint (cl-yaclyaml); seems to work as expected :-) 2015-01-16T08:10:30Z Beetny joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:10:36Z munksgaard quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:10:50Z Ukari quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-16T08:10:51Z isoraqathedh quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:15:59Z doomlord___ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:16:11Z angavrilov joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:17:27Z `JRG joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:18:32Z doomlord__ quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:19:06Z theos quit (Disconnected by services) 2015-01-16T08:19:18Z arenz joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:19:20Z AntiSpamMeta quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T08:19:34Z theos joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:19:52Z MoALTz__ quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T08:20:28Z AntiSpamMeta joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:20:43Z cmack` quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:22:42Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T08:24:40Z dim: krrrcks: cool 2015-01-16T08:24:46Z schaueho joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:25:31Z nee joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:26:54Z lieven quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:27:39Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:27:47Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:28:45Z isoraqathedh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:32:23Z schjetne quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2015-01-16T08:32:24Z isoraqathedh_l quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:34:08Z aap quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-16T08:34:33Z schjetne joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:35:27Z DeadTrickster quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:35:48Z schaueho quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:36:27Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:36:41Z aap joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:40:06Z psy_ quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T08:40:53Z munksgaard joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:41:01Z newcup joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:41:39Z akkad: sbcl on linux is quite a different beast than osx. :P 2015-01-16T08:41:48Z loke: akkad: How do? 2015-01-16T08:41:53Z loke: How so? 2015-01-16T08:42:30Z akkad: I've a really silly task that is ~60 seconds on osx, and like 3 on linux. 2015-01-16T08:43:06Z loke: akkad: What kind of task? 2015-01-16T08:43:23Z loke: OSX is really not a good OS, but the difference shouldn't be that huge 2015-01-16T08:43:41Z akkad: so I parse 200 mega of compressed json yank out four fields and output a string compressed with chipz generating a 132k lines of org-mode then stored with cl-store. 2015-01-16T08:44:05Z akkad: well the cl-store file on linux is 2megs vs 20megs on osx. double checking the same amount of data 2015-01-16T08:44:10Z loke: Where is the time spent on osx? 2015-01-16T08:44:19Z ndrei quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-16T08:44:24Z loke: Well, there you have it :-) 2015-01-16T08:46:08Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T08:46:18Z zRecursive quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T08:47:23Z lieven joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:47:25Z gingerale joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:48:54Z DeadTrickster joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:49:41Z Quadrescence: akkad, Are you just storing strings with CL-STORE? 2015-01-16T08:50:14Z Mon_Ouie joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:50:14Z Mon_Ouie quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T08:50:14Z Mon_Ouie joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:51:01Z Quadrescence: Or parsed JSON data structures? 2015-01-16T08:52:50Z ndrei joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:52:50Z akkad: I create a giant list 2015-01-16T08:53:13Z akkad: but I compress each string before clstore 2015-01-16T08:53:52Z akkad: purely for playing with tons of threads all updating a single object then storing with cl-store 2015-01-16T08:54:49Z akkad: https://gist.github.com/05405937629489c0ad88 total poo for learning how to do some things 2015-01-16T08:57:43Z _5kg quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T08:58:36Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T08:59:21Z xorox90 quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-16T09:03:22Z defaultxr quit (Quit: gnight) 2015-01-16T09:04:49Z Shozan is now known as SHODAN 2015-01-16T09:07:07Z nand1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T09:07:44Z eSVG quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T09:08:57Z emlow joined #lisp 2015-01-16T09:12:32Z `JRG quit (Quit: Page closed) 2015-01-16T09:13:51Z BlueRavenGT quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T09:15:31Z DeadTrickster quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T09:16:52Z taraz joined #lisp 2015-01-16T09:23:04Z splittist_: beach: when thinking about a name, you might want to explain why you refer to it as "extrinsic" (to what? compared with what?) and "compiler" (compiles what? for who?) and "environment" (you have a rich concept for this part...). Perhaps unpacking the concept will help you repack it in a clarifying (or, at least, cleverer) form. 2015-01-16T09:23:15Z isoraqathedh_l joined #lisp 2015-01-16T09:23:16Z splittist_: Or you could just call it cleverer. 2015-01-16T09:26:57Z isoraqathedh quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T09:27:33Z jbkcc quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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2015-01-16T12:21:25Z JuanDaugherty joined #lisp 2015-01-16T12:22:06Z Xach: loke: the last update i see to pooler was more than 1 year ago. https://github.com/quasi/pooler 2015-01-16T12:28:38Z jewel joined #lisp 2015-01-16T12:29:34Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T12:29:58Z Mon_Ouie quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T12:34:48Z isoraqathedh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T12:36:57Z echo-area quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T12:37:35Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T12:38:18Z isoraqathedh_l quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T12:39:43Z ndrei quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-16T12:45:51Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2015-01-16T12:45:53Z drmeister_ is now known as drmeister 2015-01-16T12:47:28Z pranavrc quit 2015-01-16T13:00:20Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T13:00:22Z drmeister: When lisp compilers compile function applications - how much error checking can the compiler do to match the function application arguments to the functions lambda list? Required arguments need too match, you can't have too many arguments if there are optional arguments, illegal keywords could be recognized ... 2015-01-16T13:00:27Z drmeister: Is there anything in the CLHS on this? 2015-01-16T13:01:13Z drmeister: My compiler currently doesn't do any compile-time checking like this but it would aid development if it did. 2015-01-16T13:01:33Z Zhivago: Within the same file or for inline functions, as much as desired. 2015-01-16T13:01:43Z lieven: it can do as much checks as it wants unless there is a notinline declaration 2015-01-16T13:02:13Z Zhivago: Otherwise you're subject to redefinition. 2015-01-16T13:02:15Z Xach: drmeister: 3.2.5 has a bit about it 2015-01-16T13:03:26Z Jirachier quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T13:03:56Z drmeister: Xach: Got it - thank you. 2015-01-16T13:04:16Z Jirachier joined #lisp 2015-01-16T13:10:05Z gravicappa quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T13:12:43Z Quadrescence quit (Quit: This computer has gone to 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host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T14:38:42Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T14:41:01Z pjb: drmeister: it can do no check: the function can be changed at run-time. 2015-01-16T14:44:27Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T14:46:57Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T14:46:57Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T14:46:57Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T14:47:02Z williamyaoh quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T14:51:06Z dlowe: well, it *could* 2015-01-16T14:51:34Z dlowe: it would just throw an omg-wtf condition if the signatures were incompatible 2015-01-16T14:52:58Z pjb: it would be a style-warning then. 2015-01-16T14:53:10Z dlowe: I think sbcl has that already 2015-01-16T14:53:53Z kons joined #lisp 2015-01-16T14:54:09Z dlowe: you have to balance the evil of having call sites and functions in an inconsistent state vs never being able to change a function's signature. 2015-01-16T14:54:36Z dlowe: it'd be a neat check after the fact though. 2015-01-16T14:54:55Z pjb: That said, "3.5.1.1.1 Error Detection Time in Safe Calls" says that errors may be signaled at compialtion time. 2015-01-16T14:55:33Z dlowe: I'd be interested in a blanket check for invalid function calls for every call site in the image 2015-01-16T14:56:05Z dlowe: It'd make a nice presubmit check 2015-01-16T14:56:08Z Ven joined #lisp 2015-01-16T14:59:44Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T14:59:49Z Denommus quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T14:59:49Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:00:13Z williamyaoh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:00:23Z pjb: Even with 3.5.1.1.1, unless you're considering flet/labels, I don't see how you can do any compilation-time checks on the argument list. 2015-01-16T15:00:36Z pjb: That is, without global analysis. 2015-01-16T15:01:24Z pjb: COMPILE and COMPILE-FILE can't do global analysis (because things may change after they're called), you'd have to have a separate tools for that anyways. 2015-01-16T15:02:08Z billstclair joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:04:03Z |3b|: compile-file is allowed to assume some things don't change 2015-01-16T15:04:37Z eMBee quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:04:50Z pjb: Yes. I guess all function calls that can be inlined can be checked at compilation time. 2015-01-16T15:05:24Z pjb: (even if they're not inlined). 2015-01-16T15:06:39Z kalzz quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:07:04Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:07:27Z Ethan- quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:07:31Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:07:48Z pacon quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T15:09:56Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T15:10:25Z dlowe: global check would be more useful, I think. 2015-01-16T15:11:30Z antonv joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:12:50Z pjb: dlowe: depends. How often do you save-image vs. usual incremental loading and running? 2015-01-16T15:13:31Z eMBee joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:13:48Z eMBee quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-16T15:14:04Z dlowe: I'd be very interested if a stock sbcl image contained such inconsistencies 2015-01-16T15:14:53Z pjb: Ah yes. You could check the current situation, yes. 2015-01-16T15:15:02Z duggiefresh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:15:26Z eMBee joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:15:50Z rhllor joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:16:28Z maeryo joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:16:33Z maeryo left #lisp 2015-01-16T15:16:36Z nell joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:17:51Z dlowe: that's as good as CL gets for code analysis, I think. 2015-01-16T15:17:52Z scymtym joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:18:21Z dlowe: which is pretty funny considering how easy it is to pull apart the code at the syntactic layer 2015-01-16T15:18:29Z bb010g quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-16T15:21:19Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:24:44Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-16T15:26:07Z Vutral quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:26:10Z sword joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:29:43Z MutSbeta quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-16T15:34:11Z zadock quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T15:35:11Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:35:57Z Vutral joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:38:07Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:39:55Z ikki joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:41:08Z gravicappa joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:41:38Z redline6561: dlowe: I do use coleslaw. Sorry I missed your message, started a new job as a Ruby instructor at a code school. Been a little distracted. :) 2015-01-16T15:41:51Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-16T15:42:06Z dlowe: redline6561: no worries. grats on the new job 2015-01-16T15:42:13Z zeitue quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-16T15:42:21Z xyh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:44:16Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:44:46Z Ven quit (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-16T15:45:05Z redline6561: Thanks. There is a list of sites using coleslaw on the wiki: https://github.com/redline6561/coleslaw/wiki/Blogroll 2015-01-16T15:45:07Z dkcl joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:45:27Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:49:12Z reb joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:50:23Z kons quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:51:57Z dlowe: ah, I didn't see that. Thanks. 2015-01-16T15:52:08Z redline6561: Sure. :) 2015-01-16T15:57:23Z Davidbrcz joined #lisp 2015-01-16T15:58:36Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T15:58:37Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:58:46Z mvilleneuve quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-16T15:58:59Z Denommus quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T15:59:39Z loke_ quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:01:35Z kapil__ quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-16T16:05:07Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:06:17Z psy_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:08:37Z Adlai quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1) 2015-01-16T16:08:57Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:08:58Z Vutral quit (Excess Flood) 2015-01-16T16:10:23Z Davidbrcz quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:11:11Z devll joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:12:19Z loke_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:13:28Z munksgaard quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:13:56Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:16:29Z mishoo quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:16:51Z joneshf-laptop quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:18:21Z Vutral joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:19:00Z Cymew joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:19:08Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:19:27Z Guest53394 is now known as sellout 2015-01-16T16:19:56Z sellout is now known as Guest25452 2015-01-16T16:20:05Z yenda`` quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:21:13Z Guest25452 is now known as sellout- 2015-01-16T16:21:24Z Cymew quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-16T16:23:41Z Kruppe quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2015-01-16T16:24:00Z Denommus quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:24:05Z beach joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:24:13Z beach: Good evening everyone! 2015-01-16T16:24:49Z beach: splittist_: Thanks for the naming advice. 2015-01-16T16:25:09Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:25:17Z Kruppe joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:25:22Z theseb joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:29:11Z nee quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T16:29:15Z beach: splittist_: I think I will call it "ParaSICL" 2015-01-16T16:32:40Z isoraqathedh_l joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:34:22Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:34:44Z Zhivago: No iSICL? 2015-01-16T16:35:13Z beach: Sure, why not, and then PopSICL. 2015-01-16T16:35:41Z Zhivago: SICLy. 2015-01-16T16:36:09Z beach: BiSICL. There is endless variation. 2015-01-16T16:36:39Z isoraqathedh quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T16:36:53Z redeemed quit (Quit: q) 2015-01-16T16:36:58Z isoraqathedh_l is now known as isoraqathedh 2015-01-16T16:38:30Z Adlai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:40:57Z scymtym quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T16:41:14Z scymtym joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:44:57Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:45:02Z eudoxia: SICL cell disease 2015-01-16T16:45:10Z eudoxia: i'll show myself out, thank you very much 2015-01-16T16:45:11Z cmack joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:46:30Z beach: eudoxia: In a bad mood today? 2015-01-16T16:46:36Z eudoxia: a SICL built on DragonflyBSD: HAMMER & SICL 2015-01-16T16:46:42Z eudoxia: get it? the HAMMER file system? 2015-01-16T16:47:02Z beach: I got it when you explained it. 2015-01-16T16:47:07Z psy_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T16:50:28Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:51:53Z psy_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T16:56:48Z devll quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T17:00:24Z devll joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:04:01Z nell quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:06:34Z psy_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T17:09:25Z qiemem joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:09:57Z sheilong joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:11:27Z psy_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:12:38Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:13:06Z mishoo joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:14:21Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:16:34Z boogie joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:17:37Z devll quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T17:17:41Z duggiefresh quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T17:17:58Z novemberist joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:19:09Z notty: say, how would you avoid the duplication here - http://paste.lisp.org/display/145260 ? I can't decide 2015-01-16T17:20:47Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:21:05Z Bike: could do a macrolet, i think it's fine as is though 2015-01-16T17:21:11Z hlavaty quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2015-01-16T17:21:34Z Shinmera: Could also do an FLET and the if inside the flet. 2015-01-16T17:21:59Z Ragnaroek quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:22:15Z pjb quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:23:48Z pt1 quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:24:35Z pjb joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:28:29Z yenda joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:31:25Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-16T17:35:57Z ThePhoeron quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T17:36:13Z ThePhoeron joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:36:26Z flash- joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:36:28Z ndrei joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:38:53Z nell joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:39:49Z ikki quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:42:27Z ikki joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:43:13Z rpg joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:43:19Z rhllor quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:46:30Z duggiefresh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:48:52Z arenz quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:50:56Z attila_lendvai quit (Disconnected by services) 2015-01-16T17:50:57Z attila_lendvai1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:50:57Z attila_lendvai1 quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T17:50:57Z attila_lendvai1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:53:23Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:55:16Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:55:51Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-16T17:56:08Z sivoais quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-16T17:56:44Z attila_lendvai1 quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:04:39Z xan_ quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-16T18:05:09Z williamyaoh quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:05:32Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T18:06:34Z williamyaoh joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:07:19Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:08:36Z slyrus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:09:02Z nand1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T18:09:05Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:09:05Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T18:09:05Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:09:20Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:09:28Z attila_lendvai quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T18:09:33Z attila_lendvai1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:09:33Z attila_lendvai1 is now known as attila_lendvai 2015-01-16T18:09:50Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-16T18:09:50Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:11:17Z beach left #lisp 2015-01-16T18:12:42Z booly-yam joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:15:16Z jasom: I don't want a pickle, I just want to ride on my motorSICL 2015-01-16T18:15:46Z Bicyclidine joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:25:27Z Adlai quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:28:27Z russmatney quit 2015-01-16T18:29:48Z AeroNotix: What do people recommend for protobufs? 2015-01-16T18:29:55Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:30:05Z jasom: AeroNotix: I swear you asked that question a few months ago 2015-01-16T18:30:18Z dlowe: it's a reasonable thing to ask after a few months 2015-01-16T18:30:20Z zacharias quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:30:52Z AeroNotix: jasom: trying to think what I would've needed it for a few months ago. 2015-01-16T18:31:19Z jasom: oh, not you, someone else with an A user name 2015-01-16T18:31:23Z AeroNotix: ah phew 2015-01-16T18:31:25Z AeroNotix: :) 2015-01-16T18:31:31Z jasom: anyway there is a cl-protobufs in quicklisp I thnk 2015-01-16T18:31:37Z enitiz quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:31:42Z AeroNotix: oh right, the project page didn't make it clear it was in QL. 2015-01-16T18:31:45Z AeroNotix: Thanks, will look. 2015-01-16T18:32:05Z AeroNotix: yay, it's there. Thanks jasom 2015-01-16T18:33:07Z jasom: I haven't used it, but most of the qitab code is pretty good 2015-01-16T18:33:33Z yenda: Have you ever thought about what lattices would be in lisp ? 2015-01-16T18:33:55Z Adlai joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:34:04Z nand1 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:35:16Z nikki93 joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:38:16Z jasom: yenda: you need to be more specific 2015-01-16T18:38:49Z jasom: are you talking troup theory, graphs, access privileges or do you want to build a bridge? 2015-01-16T18:39:24Z Vutral quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:39:30Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:42:53Z ehu quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:43:43Z williamyaoh quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:44:07Z joneshf-laptop joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:49:15Z hoosieree joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:51:17Z Vutral joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:51:36Z Denommus quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-16T18:51:47Z Denommus` joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:52:45Z booly-yam quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:53:18Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-16T18:55:42Z yenda: I'm just wondering if the concept has been implemented somewhere in a lisp system, and what use has been made of the concept 2015-01-16T18:56:22Z Denommus` quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-16T18:57:13Z nikki93 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-16T18:57:50Z Bicyclidine: which concept? there are multiple concepts. 2015-01-16T18:58:36Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-16T19:00:43Z nikki93_ joined #lisp 2015-01-16T19:01:25Z Adlai quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-16T19:02:11Z slyrus quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-16T19:02:43Z tajjada joined #lisp 2015-01-16T19:03:43Z Ragnaroek joined #lisp 2015-01-16T19:04:43Z Bicyclidine quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-25T02:52:52Z ccl-logbot joined #lisp 2015-01-25T02:52:52Z 2015-01-25T02:52:52Z names: ccl-logbot teiresias AntiSpamMeta rtra oGMo Rudolph-Miller_ lifenoodles_ yeltzooo 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hitecnologys ehu profess GGMethos LiamH nyef badkins arpunk egp_ Natch kushal Tordek nydel mikaelj josteink Colleen leo2007 moei impulse salv0 quazimodo hellofunk theos hvxgr alchemis7 Kruppe Adlai yrdz DrCode milosn rtoym ruste_ decent pjb joast DeadTrickster flip214 kalzz newcup soggybre1d CrazyEddy eazar001 karswell gko_ Jameser` ered Vivitron` tmh_ 2015-01-25T02:52:52Z names: otwieracz Patzy primafacie_ yenda smithzv segmond aerique dilated_dinosaur kons aftershave trigen cpt_nemo Posterdati gluegadget endou______ NhanH victor_lowther wenincode foom Oddity pillton __main__ ramus stopbyte Takumo sshirokov brandonz_ honkfestival Bike ggherdov jpanest minion qlkzy itakmar scymtym wooden mhd_ ck_ backupthrick Cymew REPLeffect zbigniew redline6561 Neet gregburd_ joshmcmillan_ joneshf-laptop srcerer jdz Hydan nightshade427 ski ahungry 2015-01-25T02:52:52Z names: farhaven schoppenhauer troydm vodkaInf1rno someone girrig loke z0d nauar notty Khisanth cpc26_ viaken ThePhoeron phadthai 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yorick TrafficMan nisstyre BlastHardcheese snafuchs ``Erik les clog Nshag rotty jsnell luis dtw peccu2 stokachu tokenrove ozzloy j0ni pok brent80_plow xristos eak tessier copec brucem ivan\_ johs tbarletz Fade Oladon djinni`_ MightyJoe sjl alakra 2015-01-25T02:53:16Z d4gg4d_ is now known as d4gg4d 2015-01-25T02:55:29Z nightfly joined #lisp 2015-01-25T02:56:16Z akkad joined #lisp 2015-01-25T02:56:31Z kushal quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T02:59:04Z gabot joined #lisp 2015-01-25T02:59:13Z zRecursive joined #lisp 2015-01-25T02:59:17Z mingvs joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:00:01Z beach joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:00:10Z beach: Good morning everyone! 2015-01-25T03:00:18Z zRecursive: howdy 2015-01-25T03:00:47Z nyef: Hello beach. 2015-01-25T03:01:09Z julianb quit (Quit: Goodbye) 2015-01-25T03:02:09Z fikusz joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:03:52Z zacts_ quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-25T03:04:30Z gabc_ is now known as gabc 2015-01-25T03:05:12Z blahzik joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:05:35Z K1rk quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:05:37Z gabriel_laddel joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:06:09Z Lokathor quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:07:25Z kjeldahl quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:08:09Z kjeldahl joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:09:41Z gluegadget quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:09:58Z victor_lowther quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:10:00Z K1rk joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:10:03Z NhanH quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:10:16Z gz quit (Ping timeout: 186 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:10:30Z beach: I got an email from Loïc Maury about SICL. Is Loïc here on #lisp by any chance? 2015-01-25T03:10:54Z KarlDscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T03:10:57Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:11:23Z endou______ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:11:24Z bb010g quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:12:28Z xyh joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:12:37Z xyh: how to change #P"/home/xyh/cicada/vm/common-lisp/cicada-vm.test.lisp" 2015-01-25T03:12:37Z xyh: to #P"/home/xyh/cicada/vm/common-lisp/cicada-vm.test.report.org~" 2015-01-25T03:13:38Z nyef: Some use of merge-pathnames, probably. 2015-01-25T03:13:48Z nyef: Good luck, this is one of the dark corners of the CL spec. d-: 2015-01-25T03:14:00Z Vivitron`` quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:14:11Z beach: Couldn't he convert to a string and go from there? 2015-01-25T03:14:16Z gluegadget joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:14:18Z jlongster quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:14:23Z nyef: Even "better". 2015-01-25T03:14:32Z xyh: to be able to do pathname->string and string->pathname would be ok. 2015-01-25T03:14:40Z nyef: clhs namestring 2015-01-25T03:14:41Z specbot: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_namest.htm 2015-01-25T03:14:47Z nyef: clhs pathname 2015-01-25T03:14:47Z specbot: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_pn.htm 2015-01-25T03:15:14Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:15:41Z xyh: nyef: great 2015-01-25T03:16:15Z NhanH joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:16:22Z endou______ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:17:07Z victor_lowther joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:19:22Z MarkusBarthlen joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:21:15Z bb010g joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:22:15Z MarkusBarthlen quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T03:23:21Z enitiz joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:23:37Z MarkusBarthlen joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:25:52Z Vivitron joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:26:44Z pjb: xyh: (make-pathname :type "report.org~" :case :local :default original-path) 2015-01-25T03:27:01Z pjb: xyh: but it is very imprudent to use dots in names or types. 2015-01-25T03:27:30Z pjb: I'd advise cicada-vm-test.lisp and cicada-vm-test.report-org 2015-01-25T03:28:04Z pjb: (also names ending with ~ are considered as backups by emacs (by default) and made invisible (by emacs and gnu ls and various other tools). 2015-01-25T03:30:01Z pjb: s/:default/:defaults/ 2015-01-25T03:30:29Z pjb: CLISP complains: MAKE-PATHNAME: Illegal :TYPE argument "report.org~" 2015-01-25T03:31:40Z pjb: (make-pathname :name "cicada-vm.test.report" :type "org~" :case :local :defaults #P"/home/xyh/cicada/vm/common-lisp/cicada-vm.test.lisp") seems to be more portable, but as you can see with your dots, it's harder to perform. (The first form would reduce to the later, if you didn't have dots everywhere). 2015-01-25T03:31:51Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-25T03:33:44Z sellout left #lisp 2015-01-25T03:34:11Z sellout joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:34:17Z zRecursive: v 2015-01-25T03:36:20Z Sgeo_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:37:00Z pierre1_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:37:01Z burtons joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:40:00Z Natch_d joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:03Z Plazma_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:05Z tstc` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:06Z emma_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:19Z yeticry joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:39Z Borbus joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:43Z bege joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:41:55Z xyh: ccl complains about "~" too! 2015-01-25T03:44:54Z AeroNotix_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:45:48Z pierre1_ quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:45:58Z zRecursive quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T03:46:04Z zbrown_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:46:13Z wooden_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:46:13Z wooden_ quit (Changing host) 2015-01-25T03:46:13Z wooden_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:47:05Z katco joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:47:22Z DrCode quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T03:47:34Z Xach_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:48:02Z stux|RC joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:48:09Z honkfest1val joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:48:29Z xyh: I have to get *compile-file-truename* in the macro DEFTEST's body `(progn ...) 2015-01-25T03:48:38Z xyh: but (eval-when (:compile-toplevel) *compile-file-truename*) in the body seems get me a NIL. 2015-01-25T03:50:58Z Soft- joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:51:13Z REPLeffect_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:51:49Z profess quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z keen__________41 quit (Ping timeout: 415 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z stux|RC-only quit (Ping timeout: 415 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z Xach quit (Write error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z gabot quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z Borbus_ quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z bege_ quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z tstc quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z rvchangue_ quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z yeticry_ quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z Sgeo quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:04Z katco` quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z Jesin quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z Soft quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z leo2007 quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z honkfestival quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z wooden quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z REPLeffect quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z TristamWrk quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z AeroNotix quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:05Z H4ns quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:06Z Plazma quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:06Z emma quit (Ping timeout: 628 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:06Z zbrown quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T03:52:06Z TrystamWrk joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:52:09Z Jessin joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:52:12Z rvchangu- joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:52:13Z keen__________41 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:52:19Z Natch quit (Ping timeout: 259 seconds) 2015-01-25T03:52:51Z gabot joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:54:09Z thomas quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-25T03:54:22Z thomas joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:54:28Z beach: I have a request. As part of a paper I am writing with my colleague for ELS, we are running some benchmarks. If you have time, could you please run the following program and send me the output (it creates a file called "v7-vs-v9"): http://metamodular.com/test-reverse-count.lisp indicating what OS and Lisp implementation you ran it on. 2015-01-25T03:54:53Z beach: My email is robert.strandh@gmail.com. 2015-01-25T03:55:34Z beach: It is a relative comparison so the exact clock speed etc doesn't matter, at least for now. 2015-01-25T03:55:44Z theos quit (Disconnected by services) 2015-01-25T03:55:47Z emma_ is now known as emma 2015-01-25T03:56:12Z theos joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:56:42Z pjb: xyh: it seems that it's easier to use (defparameter *p* #.(or *compile-file-pathname* *load-pathname*)) ; this seems to work in all cases. 2015-01-25T03:56:43Z beach: I am particularly interested in CCL and the commercial implementations. We already have SBCL on Linux and Mac. 2015-01-25T03:57:43Z pjb: metamodula.com is horribly slow. Already posititon.lisp took "hours" to download. 2015-01-25T03:57:52Z pjb: or to connect to. 2015-01-25T03:58:24Z pjb: Connecting to metamodular.com (metamodular.com)|206.188.193.64|:80... failed: Connection timed out. 2015-01-25T03:58:30Z beach: Wow. 2015-01-25T03:58:34Z pierre1_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T03:58:37Z beach: It is hosted at Network Solutions. They should have fast internet one would think. 2015-01-25T03:58:42Z pjb: 2015-01-25 04:52:17 (42.2 KB/s) - `test-reverse-count.lisp' saved [4518/4518] 2015-01-25T03:58:57Z pjb: it might be a problem of failing mirrors? 2015-01-25T03:59:07Z burtons: didn't take long for me 2015-01-25T03:59:08Z pjb: is there a load balancer or something? 2015-01-25T03:59:09Z beach: That is something I can't control. 2015-01-25T03:59:51Z beach: It's just a very basic web service. I didn't feel up to doing the sysadmin work for something more complicated. 2015-01-25T04:00:43Z zacts joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:00:54Z beach: Oh, one more thing: The program will very likely exhaust the heap at some point. 2015-01-25T04:01:15Z beach: That's fine. Just send me as much output as it managed to produce. 2015-01-25T04:02:10Z beach: Or, if you are not comfortable with that, change the 100000000 at the end of the file to (say) 10000000. 2015-01-25T04:02:22Z burtons: it sure takes some time to run 2015-01-25T04:02:31Z beach: That's normal. 2015-01-25T04:02:42Z beach: It might take a few minutes. 2015-01-25T04:02:50Z nyef: "printed 237 notes" Neat. 2015-01-25T04:02:58Z beach: Yeah. :( 2015-01-25T04:03:13Z nyef: Running now, I hope. 2015-01-25T04:03:25Z burtons: no notes on mine yet 2015-01-25T04:03:28Z beach: We use SPEED 3 etc. So SBCL prints a note whenever it can't optimize. 2015-01-25T04:03:45Z beach: burtons: During compilation on SBCL. 2015-01-25T04:04:01Z burtons: i'm using sbcl, no notes when i --loaded it 2015-01-25T04:04:11Z nyef: The procedure is to compile-file, then load the fasl, then (test)? 2015-01-25T04:04:11Z beach: Hmm. OK. 2015-01-25T04:04:21Z beach: Preferably, yes. 2015-01-25T04:04:31Z burtons: doesn't sbcl always compile? 2015-01-25T04:04:51Z DrCode joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:04:52Z beach: I thought it did. 2015-01-25T04:04:52Z nyef: burtons: No, these days there's an evaluator that may-or-may-not be enabled. 2015-01-25T04:04:57Z beach: Oh. 2015-01-25T04:05:01Z nyef: Better to compile-file it anyway. 2015-01-25T04:05:08Z beach: In that case, yes. 2015-01-25T04:05:16Z beach: It would also explain why it takes more time. 2015-01-25T04:05:16Z burtons: nyef: are you doing sbcl linux? 2015-01-25T04:05:31Z burtons: if so, i won't bother... 2015-01-25T04:05:35Z nyef: beach: Does the test output include (lisp-implementation-version) and such? 2015-01-25T04:05:41Z zacharias_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:05:41Z pierre1_ quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T04:05:42Z nyef: burtons: I'm doing SBCL/Linux/PPC. 2015-01-25T04:05:43Z beach: No 2015-01-25T04:05:52Z burtons: ppc, wow 2015-01-25T04:06:04Z burtons: old mac or new ibm? 2015-01-25T04:06:09Z nyef: burtons: I'd do MIPS if I had a workable MIPS box. 2015-01-25T04:06:16Z nyef: XServe G5. 2015-01-25T04:06:41Z burtons: ok, i'll do sbcl x86-64 2015-01-25T04:06:44Z nyef: ... which is currently mainly used to mediate usb-serial, dhcp, and tftp for my MIPS box. 2015-01-25T04:07:44Z burtons: i'm down to only 2 computers... 2 ibm x300's 2015-01-25T04:07:55Z burtons: and i really only use one and keep one for backup 2015-01-25T04:07:57Z tsumetai joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:08:15Z nyef: I'm up to $n$ computers. Pretty much stopped keeping track. 2015-01-25T04:08:37Z burtons: nyef: what's the fastest way to do a rebuild of sbcl? 2015-01-25T04:08:43Z zacharias quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T04:08:49Z nyef: Under my desk is a stack consisting of an HPPA, a SPARC, an SGI MIPS, the XServe, and an ALPHA. 2015-01-25T04:08:50Z burtons: i've just been running make.sh, which seems to do a clean every time 2015-01-25T04:09:13Z burtons: quite the museum :) 2015-01-25T04:09:18Z nyef: You might have a look at slam.sh, keeping in mind that it gets little love. 2015-01-25T04:09:36Z nyef: And will need the :sb-after-xc-core feature. 2015-01-25T04:10:06Z burtons: is it safe to just call make.sh after commenting out the call to clean in make-config.sh? 2015-01-25T04:10:10Z beach: In case anyone is interested, those two versions of COUNT (with :FROM-END T) are completely portable. But I have a much faster technique that requires access to the runtime stack, so any implementation of it is necessarily implementation specific. 2015-01-25T04:10:19Z nyef: And WILL break if you look at it funny or make certain kinds of changes. 2015-01-25T04:11:39Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:11:41Z nyef: beach: Wow, this IS taking a while to run. 2015-01-25T04:11:44Z k-dawg quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-25T04:12:06Z beach: When I use that technique COUNT with :FROM-END T is as fast on SBCL as (LOOP FOR ELEMENT IN LIST COUNT ..) from the beginning, which in turn is much faster than COUNT :FROM-END NIL for some reason. 2015-01-25T04:12:16Z beach: nyef: Sorry! :( 2015-01-25T04:12:16Z burtons: nyef: it's just uploading all your "secret files" to his slow web server :) 2015-01-25T04:12:35Z theos: ahoy 2015-01-25T04:12:39Z nyef: burtons: No worries, that machine has almost nothing on it. 2015-01-25T04:13:00Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-25T04:13:08Z beach: Hello theos (assuming that was a general greeting). 2015-01-25T04:13:35Z burtons: nyef: do you know know about defun-cached? any idea what the max hash-bits allowable is? 2015-01-25T04:13:45Z theos: beach it was, indeed :) 2015-01-25T04:13:56Z nyef: (Seriously, it has a tftp server, a dhcp server, an SBCL build environment, and a couple of random MIPS things.) 2015-01-25T04:14:03Z nyef: burtons: No clue, sorry. 2015-01-25T04:14:25Z burtons: k, just playing with some optimizing 2015-01-25T04:14:36Z psy_ quit (Read error: No route to host) 2015-01-25T04:16:04Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T04:16:41Z beach: nyef: Check that it didn't exhaust the heap so that it is no longer running. 2015-01-25T04:16:57Z nyef: That'd cause a drop to LDB, which I would see. 2015-01-25T04:17:07Z beach: Yes it would. 2015-01-25T04:17:13Z psy joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:17:58Z nyef: Umm... You're not doing anything with threads or signal-handling, are you? 2015-01-25T04:17:59Z oleo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:18:06Z beach: Nope. 2015-01-25T04:18:07Z nyef: Or running the profiler or anything like that? 2015-01-25T04:18:12Z beach: Nope. 2015-01-25T04:18:32Z nyef: Hrm. That's all of the vulnerabilities that I can think of offhand. 2015-01-25T04:18:56Z nyef: If it doesn't stop soon I'll give it a SIGINT. 2015-01-25T04:19:08Z oleo__ quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T04:19:15Z burtons: hasn't stopped for me yet either, but my machine is a bit slow 2015-01-25T04:19:16Z beach: nyef: You can look at the output file. 2015-01-25T04:19:18Z eivarv joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:19:26Z beach: See whether it grows. 2015-01-25T04:19:30Z elderK joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:19:32Z burtons: hasn't stopped for me yet either, but my machine is a bit slow 2015-01-25T04:19:35Z nyef: It hasn't in a while. 2015-01-25T04:19:48Z nyef: But then, it's stopped mid-line, which implies buffering. 2015-01-25T04:19:54Z beach: Yes. 2015-01-25T04:20:09Z beach: I guess we should flush the buffer. 2015-01-25T04:20:14Z burtons: mine seems hung too 2015-01-25T04:20:31Z pacon quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T04:21:15Z burtons: yikes, i quit and 40 gigs consed 2015-01-25T04:21:29Z beach: That's normal. 2015-01-25T04:21:35Z nyef: burtons: Yay for garbage collection, huh? 2015-01-25T04:21:50Z pjb: beach: as a teacher, I would have hoped you'd have a polystyrene club to hit on the head of students who don't flush their buffers… 2015-01-25T04:22:02Z beach: It allocates lists up to one hundred million elements in increments of one hundred thousand. 2015-01-25T04:22:24Z beach: pjb: Sorry. 2015-01-25T04:22:49Z burtons: beach: do you want partial results? 2015-01-25T04:22:56Z beach: Yes please! 2015-01-25T04:23:07Z burtons: what's your email again 2015-01-25T04:23:07Z beach: Any prefix of the output is welcome. 2015-01-25T04:23:15Z beach: robert.strandh@gmail.com 2015-01-25T04:24:25Z scharan joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:24:26Z nyef: beach: You realize that if it hits heap exhaustion then any unflushed buffers will be dead, right? 2015-01-25T04:24:34Z beach: Ys. 2015-01-25T04:24:35Z beach: Yes. 2015-01-25T04:24:52Z beach: I may add buffer flushing and ask you again later. 2015-01-25T04:27:09Z nyef: Well, it hasn't died yet, FWIW. 2015-01-25T04:27:17Z nyef: Oh! And there's more output. 2015-01-25T04:27:26Z beach: Thanks for helping out. I realize we are not experts in designing benchmarks. We will try to improve. 2015-01-25T04:27:35Z beach: Yay! 2015-01-25T04:27:35Z nyef: 39900000 2.23200 2.59200 2015-01-25T04:27:35Z nyef: 40000000 2.2390nyef@cf01:~$ 2015-01-25T04:27:48Z burtons: hmm, i must have deleted the output file without thinking 2015-01-25T04:27:56Z burtons: re-running, the email is in my queue 2015-01-25T04:27:59Z pjb: also, it'd be nice to have a framework to send back results by internet automatically… 2015-01-25T04:28:04Z nyef: Ah! Heap exhausted, game over. 2015-01-25T04:28:20Z nyef: Didn't Xach have something like that? 2015-01-25T04:28:28Z beach: pjb: I am afraid that's beyond what we know how to do. 2015-01-25T04:28:51Z pjb: quicklisp has a network layer working on (almost) all implementations. 2015-01-25T04:29:59Z nyef: Oops. Just shut down the machine without checking which SBCL it was. 2015-01-25T04:30:13Z beach: nyef: Doesn't matter right now. 2015-01-25T04:30:31Z nyef: ... because you're going to put together a revised test program? 2015-01-25T04:30:47Z nyef: One with (lisp-implementation-version) and whatnot, plus buffer flushing? 2015-01-25T04:30:50Z beach: That, and I am more interested in what processor it is. 2015-01-25T04:30:57Z beach: Yeah, probably. 2015-01-25T04:31:04Z tmh_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T04:31:13Z beach: I am just the intermediate here. My colleague is doing the benchmarking. 2015-01-25T04:31:27Z beach: I come up with the algorithms. 2015-01-25T04:31:42Z elderK left #lisp 2015-01-25T04:31:43Z beach: She is more systematic than I am. 2015-01-25T04:33:37Z beach: nyef: Also, I am guessing the result will be inconclusive. V7 is better on some platforms, V9 on others. And that might be good enough that we don't need any further comparisons between the two. 2015-01-25T04:35:26Z k-dawg joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:35:45Z nell quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.2-dev) 2015-01-25T04:36:33Z nyef: Sent. 2015-01-25T04:36:57Z beach: Received! Thanks! 2015-01-25T04:36:59Z beach: Speaking of which, what is the attitude among SBCL maintainers when it comes to limited platform-specific code in (for example) assembler that makes some functions MUCH faster than currently? 2015-01-25T04:37:28Z nyef: I'm not sure, TBH. What did you have in mind? 2015-01-25T04:37:54Z Zhivago joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:38:14Z nyef: Honestly, I think we'll want to know why it's faster, how it works, and then how we can teach the compiler to do it WITHOUT any special tricks. 2015-01-25T04:38:15Z beach: My COUNT with :FROM-END T is much faster than SBCL COUNT :FROM-END NIL, so it would be worthwhile for performance reasons to implement my method. 2015-01-25T04:38:34Z beach: Fair enough. 2015-01-25T04:39:07Z beach: I'll be happy to share my method and let someone else teach the SBCL compiler about it. 2015-01-25T04:39:28Z nyef: Heh. 2015-01-25T04:39:57Z scymtym quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-25T04:41:34Z beach: It is very simple really. I use a mostly implementation-independent function to break down the list into manageable sublists. Here, manageable means at most the size of the stack. The small implementation-specific method consists of pushing the elements of a sublist on the stack and then applying the test while popping them off. 2015-01-25T04:42:14Z k-dawg quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-25T04:42:17Z beach: nyef: You saw my C code where I use ALLOCA. Probably PUSH/POP would be better in the compiler. 2015-01-25T04:42:44Z nyef: I'm trying to figure out how to make SBCL do it without any further compiler changes. 2015-01-25T04:43:08Z Jubb quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T04:43:12Z beach: That's why I suggested an assembly routine. That would not require any compiler changes. 2015-01-25T04:43:24Z pjb: do you want to test this file compiled or not? 2015-01-25T04:43:24Z beach: But then, I am not an SBCL maintainer. 2015-01-25T04:43:26Z nyef: I just don't know if it's possible to coerce to an unknown-values packet like that. 2015-01-25T04:43:33Z beach: pjb: Yes please! 2015-01-25T04:43:43Z pjb: I'll have to restart… 2015-01-25T04:43:51Z beach: Oh, sorry. 2015-01-25T04:45:12Z beach: nyef: There is pseudo-code in the paper in Papers/Reverse-order/ in the SICL repository. 2015-01-25T04:45:34Z nyef: It's ringing a bit of a bell. I think I looked at it once already. 2015-01-25T04:45:46Z beach: The pseudo code uses two operations PUSH-STACK and POP-STACK. 2015-01-25T04:46:27Z Jubb joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:46:32Z beach: I am guessing that having the compiler recognize those would be enough to implement a long list of functions using this technique. 2015-01-25T04:50:44Z badkins quit 2015-01-25T04:52:22Z eivarv quit (Quit: Sleep) 2015-01-25T04:56:10Z someone quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2015-01-25T04:57:47Z urandom__ quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2015-01-25T04:58:12Z someon joined #lisp 2015-01-25T04:59:13Z cmatei quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-25T05:01:51Z leo2007 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:04:11Z normanrichards quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T05:10:14Z Natch_d left #lisp 2015-01-25T05:10:25Z Natch joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:12:29Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:12:34Z BitPuffin quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-25T05:16:55Z hellofunk quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T05:17:21Z innertracks1 quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-25T05:17:30Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T05:17:31Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:25:27Z hellofunk joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:26:27Z jbkcc joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:26:29Z bgs100 quit (Quit: bgs100) 2015-01-25T05:26:34Z beach: I need an apprentice! Not someone who is just interested in getting a degree (BS or MS student) nor someone who need to publish so many papers in 3 years in order to get a job later (PhD student), but someone who is interested in learning how to program in Lisp. 2015-01-25T05:26:40Z someon is now known as someone 2015-01-25T05:27:11Z beach: I guess there are no such individuals around. 2015-01-25T05:27:34Z beach: Better to become famous on YouTube by bicycling into the river. 2015-01-25T05:28:10Z pjb: Perhaps you could make youtube videos teaching how to program in lisp, and you'd gather hundreds of apprentices all over the world? 2015-01-25T05:28:31Z beach: You think so? 2015-01-25T05:28:42Z pjb: Yes, why not? 2015-01-25T05:28:50Z beach: Actually, one would be enough. 2015-01-25T05:28:52Z pjb: There's a lot of such things, for other programming languages. 2015-01-25T05:29:19Z beach: And there is also lots of crappy code in those languages. 2015-01-25T05:29:32Z beach: I don't know the correlation though. 2015-01-25T05:29:34Z pjb: videos came after :-) 2015-01-25T05:31:06Z hiyosi joined #lisp 2015-01-25T05:31:07Z beach: The last one why bicycled into the river thought it was a good idea to tie himself to the bike in order not to lose it. So he drowned when the bicycle pulled him to the bottom. 2015-01-25T05:31:12Z burtons quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T05:31:55Z pjb: :-) 2015-01-25T05:32:27Z pjb: But at least, he was trying something and had some theory about it, ie. had some mental model! You can see much dumber people on youtube :-( 2015-01-25T05:32:27Z beach: Luckily, he hadn't reproduced beforehand, so there is a chance such stupidity gets eradicated from the gene pool. 2015-01-25T05:32:38Z beach: Yeah. 2015-01-25T05:33:04Z beach: Sorry about the parenthetical remark. Back to Common Lisp. 2015-01-25T05:33:20Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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Employees can be fired at anytime, and have to be "saleable" at all times. Therefore, for intellectual work, like programming, slaves might be more productive. So it should not be a bad idea. 2015-01-25T06:29:30Z pjb: Zhivago: the point is that slaves are more expensive than employees! 2015-01-25T06:31:30Z jumblerg joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:32:32Z mvilleneuve joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:34:36Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:34:48Z ryankara1on quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T06:39:18Z impulse quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-25T06:40:11Z mvilleneuve quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-25T06:41:00Z impulse joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:42:25Z ryankarason joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:43:14Z quazimodo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T06:43:46Z hvxgr quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T06:44:39Z eivarv quit (Quit: Sleep) 2015-01-25T06:46:38Z innertracks quit (Quit: innertracks) 2015-01-25T06:51:01Z beach: Are there still any advantages to having NIL be a constant address? 2015-01-25T06:52:24Z beach: Yeah, I didn't think so. :) 2015-01-25T06:52:30Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 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beach: Should I still run your test that you mentioned earlier? https://filebox.tymoon.eu/file/TXpBdw== 2015-01-25T08:53:32Z beach: That would be very nice. Thanks. 2015-01-25T08:53:41Z beach: Compile the file. 2015-01-25T08:53:57Z beach: It is likely that the heap will be exhausted at some point. 2015-01-25T08:53:59Z Shinmera: Interesting that clisp and abcl immediately stack overflow-ed 2015-01-25T08:54:15Z beach: Oh. OK. Too bad. 2015-01-25T08:54:35Z beach: I think it requires a MiB or so of stack space to run. 2015-01-25T08:57:06Z Shinmera: It doesn't stack overflow when compile-file-ing first at least. 2015-01-25T08:57:28Z beach: That's good. 2015-01-25T08:58:19Z beach: It will take some time; a few minutes at the very least. More on the interpreters. 2015-01-25T08:59:10Z Shinmera: Right, I'm re-running everything with fasls. 2015-01-25T08:59:22Z beach: Yeah, that's the best. 2015-01-25T09:01:25Z Ethan- joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:02:08Z Shinmera: Reminds me to install lispworks again too. 2015-01-25T09:02:09Z aftershave quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com) 2015-01-25T09:02:20Z beach: Why did you uninstall it? 2015-01-25T09:02:22Z aftershave joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:02:43Z Shinmera: I completely wiped and re-installed my workstation the last two days. 2015-01-25T09:02:51Z beach: I see. 2015-01-25T09:03:02Z Shinmera: I got a new SSD and wanted a fresh start. 2015-01-25T09:03:25Z beach: That's good from time to time. 2015-01-25T09:03:56Z Shinmera: meanwhile, CMUCL wins the race of "who's first to heap overflow" 2015-01-25T09:04:21Z beach: Shall I give it some medal? 2015-01-25T09:04:41Z scymtym joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:05:30Z aftershave quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T09:05:44Z aftershave joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:06:09Z Shinmera: Well, it seems to have only allocated 512mb max, so 2015-01-25T09:06:28Z Shinmera: Should I send you the stdout as well, or just the file it generates? 2015-01-25T09:09:03Z beach: Just the file will be enough. We probably need to modify the test and then I'll ask you to run it again. 2015-01-25T09:09:19Z Shinmera: alright. 2015-01-25T09:14:43Z Shinmera: SBCL comes in second and lispworks joins the race. 2015-01-25T09:14:57Z beach: For exhausting the heap? 2015-01-25T09:15:18Z beach: That's not actually what I intend to measure :) 2015-01-25T09:15:25Z Shinmera: I know 2015-01-25T09:15:28Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:15:48Z Shinmera: But, I'm glad my computer's resources are finally being used. Almost maxed out on RAM and CPU. 2015-01-25T09:16:07Z beach: Great! :) 2015-01-25T09:16:50Z swedishfish joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:19:08Z Shinmera: Hm. Is it intentional that lispworks' ui runs in the same thread as its repl? 2015-01-25T09:19:24Z Shinmera: Because it's not refreshing its windows anymore now that it's running the test. 2015-01-25T09:19:44Z beach: I remember having that problem in McCLIM. 2015-01-25T09:20:31Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-25T09:21:17Z Shinmera: Seems to me like separating these would be one of my first concerns... 2015-01-25T09:21:26Z beach: I agree. 2015-01-25T09:21:45Z swedishfish quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-25T09:21:47Z zRecursive quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T09:26:41Z Shinmera: I'm surprised that no other implementation has heap-overflowed yet so far. 2015-01-25T09:26:54Z beach: Maybe they are too slow :) 2015-01-25T09:27:12Z zacharias joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:27:16Z beach: It will overflow toward the end. 2015-01-25T09:27:31Z beach: So if they are slow, the end may take some time to reach 2015-01-25T09:27:48Z Shinmera: They probably also have different default heap sizes 2015-01-25T09:27:57Z beach: Yes, very possible. 2015-01-25T09:28:17Z beach: And that might depend on whether they are single-threaded or not. 2015-01-25T09:30:07Z vdamewood joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:34:09Z xificurC joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:34:58Z kida joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:35:21Z kida quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T09:37:20Z bb010g quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-25T09:37:49Z zeitue joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:40:18Z beach: Gah! This coming week I need to come up with a CLOSy replacement for the CLtL2 macro DEFINE-DECLARATION: https://www.cs.cmu.edu/Groups/AI/html/cltl/clm/node102.html#SECTION001250000000000000000 2015-01-25T09:40:30Z robot-beethoven joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:43:34Z gravicappa quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T09:45:07Z mishoo quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T09:46:42Z swedishfish joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:50:02Z Shinmera: beach: Allegro gives an interesting error: http://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/8O# 2015-01-25T09:50:06Z kuimacro joined #lisp 2015-01-25T09:50:30Z kuimacro left #lisp 2015-01-25T09:50:45Z beach: I see. 2015-01-25T09:50:54Z beach: Do you have any output from it? 2015-01-25T09:51:11Z Shinmera: I do, yes 2015-01-25T09:51:21Z Shinmera: wait, no, it's empty 2015-01-25T09:51:22Z beach: Things like that *could* happen because we use SAFETY 0 in some places. 2015-01-25T09:51:27Z beach: Oh :( 2015-01-25T09:51:40Z beach: Don't worry about Allegro then. 2015-01-25T09:52:02Z kcj quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T09:56:02Z gko_ quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-25T09:58:37Z zadock quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T10:02:22Z Mon_Ouie joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:02:22Z Mon_Ouie quit (Changing host) 2015-01-25T10:02:22Z Mon_Ouie joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:03:04Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-25T10:04:00Z zadock joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:07:13Z vdamewood quit (Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]) 2015-01-25T10:09:00Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:11:33Z beach: Shinmera: Any progress? 2015-01-25T10:11:52Z Shinmera: ccl passed 2015-01-25T10:11:58Z beach: Excellent! 2015-01-25T10:12:02Z Shinmera: the rest are still running 2015-01-25T10:12:32Z beach: OK, I need to vanish for a while. You have the email address to which to send the result, right? 2015-01-25T10:12:37Z Shinmera: yes 2015-01-25T10:12:40Z beach: Thanks again for doing this! 2015-01-25T10:12:43Z beach: Much appreciated. 2015-01-25T10:12:45Z Shinmera: No problem 2015-01-25T10:14:39Z Soft- quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T10:16:13Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:18:52Z d4ryus__ is now known as d4ryus 2015-01-25T10:19:26Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:20:37Z Vivitron` quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T10:21:00Z rtra quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T10:21:30Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T10:21:48Z hardenedapple joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:27:00Z pnpuff quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-25T10:27:18Z Amaan joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:28:43Z pnpuff joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:28:59Z stardiviner joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:29:18Z vaporatorius quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T10:31:32Z cmatei joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:32:10Z BeLucid joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:34:51Z BeLucid_ quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-25T10:35:38Z trebor_home joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:38:17Z rtra joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:46:21Z Ukari joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:49:58Z CrazyWoods quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T10:50:48Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:51:25Z gravicappa joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:51:39Z MrWoohoo quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-25T10:51:42Z oleo quit (Quit: Verlassend) 2015-01-25T10:57:09Z CrazyWoods joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:57:51Z oleo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T10:59:45Z AeroNotix_: wow CEPL looks awesome 2015-01-25T11:02:55Z oleo: cepl ? 2015-01-25T11:03:03Z oleo: morning 2015-01-25T11:03:09Z oleo: erm, what is cepl ? 2015-01-25T11:03:42Z AeroNotix_: oleo: https://github.com/cbaggers/cepl 2015-01-25T11:03:51Z aftershave quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-25T11:09:42Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T11:12:10Z pnpuff left #lisp 2015-01-25T11:14:13Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:16:58Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:18:33Z brbblnch joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:18:38Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T11:18:55Z brbblnch: Hi 2015-01-25T11:19:09Z Davidbrcz joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:19:58Z robot-beethoven quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2015-01-25T11:20:18Z brbblnch: ? 2015-01-25T11:20:22Z brbblnch: I'm trying to implement DFAs and such (learning purposes), and I'm having troubles with quote. http://paste.lisp.org/display/145368 , could anybody tell me why the "display" works but not the second (at the end) ? 2015-01-25T11:21:29Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T11:22:26Z H4ns: brbblnch: try #scheme 2015-01-25T11:22:36Z H4ns: brbblnch: #lisp is about common lisp 2015-01-25T11:24:12Z AeroNotix_ is now known as AeroNotix 2015-01-25T11:25:03Z defaultxr quit (Quit: gnnnight) 2015-01-25T11:35:03Z brbblnch: oh, ok sorry 2015-01-25T11:36:22Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:37:32Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:40:02Z nand1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:40:39Z intinig quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T11:44:12Z jtza8 quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T11:47:54Z MarkusBarthlen quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T11:49:33Z Lokathor joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:53:17Z swedishf1sh joined #lisp 2015-01-25T11:56:01Z swedishfish quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-25T11:56:42Z quazimodo: I started to learn monads 2015-01-25T11:56:59Z quazimodo: somehow now I'm reading steve awodey's book on category theory 2015-01-25T11:57:01Z quazimodo: ffs... 2015-01-25T12:17:45Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:22:23Z vydd quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-25T12:24:01Z jtza8 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:31:04Z Beetny quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T12:34:46Z ebrasca joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:35:36Z Baggers joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:37:05Z Baggers: Hi folks, does anyone know how to destroy and observer using the cells library? 2015-01-25T12:38:35Z Baggers: (cells::*observers*) 2015-01-25T12:38:40Z Baggers: shit 2015-01-25T12:38:48Z Baggers: that's not a repl 2015-01-25T12:43:22Z mearnsh quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T12:44:51Z CrazyWoods quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T12:45:21Z mearnsh joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:45:53Z CrazyWoods joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:56:40Z Shinmera: beach: amazingly, abcl finished before clisp did. 2015-01-25T12:56:54Z Shinmera: or does, rather; it's still running 2015-01-25T12:57:09Z beach: Wow. 2015-01-25T12:57:38Z Shinmera: I now still have clisp, clasp, and lispworks churning away. I expect clasp will probably not finish before tomorrow :) 2015-01-25T12:57:40Z beach: That is really slow. Feel free to give up if you can't stand it. 2015-01-25T12:57:58Z beach: Yeah. Not so great. 2015-01-25T12:58:00Z kushal joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:58:25Z Shinmera: Nah, it's just running in the back and isn't obstructing me in any way. 2015-01-25T12:58:37Z beach: Good. 2015-01-25T12:58:44Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:58:51Z Xach_ is now known as Xach 2015-01-25T12:58:58Z Xach quit (Changing host) 2015-01-25T12:58:58Z Xach joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:59:01Z admg joined #lisp 2015-01-25T12:59:40Z beach: There must be something wrong with LispWorks. Not compiled maybe? 2015-01-25T12:59:51Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-25T12:59:53Z beach: On SBCL it only takes a few minutes to finish. 2015-01-25T13:00:03Z Shinmera: I did load the fasl 2015-01-25T13:00:13Z beach: Wow. OK. 2015-01-25T13:00:18Z Shinmera: I only have the free version of it, but I doubt that should change much? 2015-01-25T13:00:48Z beach: Yeah, that shouldn't change. 2015-01-25T13:02:46Z Shinmera: Currently the order is ACL! CMUCL* SBCL* CCL ECL* MKCL ABCL where ! is error and * is heap exhaustion. 2015-01-25T13:03:09Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-25T13:03:09Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-25T13:03:09Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-25T13:03:14Z beach: OK. 2015-01-25T13:04:33Z trebor_home quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T13:05:40Z jbkcc quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. 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"Did it lock up, or reboot?" 2015-01-25T14:43:14Z nyef: I get frustrated when I can't find any documentation. 2015-01-25T14:43:22Z beach: That too. 2015-01-25T14:43:41Z malbertife quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T14:45:22Z Xach enjoys rob warnock's two-fisted tales of hardware bit fiddling with lisp 2015-01-25T14:47:10Z beach: Haven't read that one. 2015-01-25T14:48:04Z Xach: beach: he has written of it fairly often in http://xach.com/rpw3/articles/index.html e.g. http://xach.com/rpw3/articles/BxGdnVAeZ7JqM_2jXTWc-g%40speakeasy.net.html 2015-01-25T14:49:13Z vydd joined #lisp 2015-01-25T14:49:49Z nyef: Yeah, that kind of thing can be fun 2015-01-25T14:49:50Z beach: Nice! 2015-01-25T14:50:10Z nyef: Tried doing that to the video card on one of my older machines. 2015-01-25T14:50:45Z nyef: Had to run SBCL as root in order to mmap() the register space, but it worked, more or less. 2015-01-25T14:51:46Z nyef: Hrm. User-mode NFS daemon is overkill these days, given FUSE. 2015-01-25T14:52:03Z oudeis quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T14:53:24Z Alfr joined #lisp 2015-01-25T14:55:18Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T14:55:57Z Ethan- quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-25T14:56:04Z oudeis quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T14:57:15Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:00:03Z Mon_Ouie quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:00:39Z vaporatorius joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:03:12Z oudeis quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T15:08:33Z froggey: hello, is this the right place for me to mention my Lisp OS? 2015-01-25T15:08:47Z beach: Others mention theirs, so why not. 2015-01-25T15:09:20Z froggey: oh good 2015-01-25T15:09:25Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-25T15:09:52Z froggey: I've spent the past few years working on it, and I think it's about ready for other people to see 2015-01-25T15:10:01Z beach: Wow. 2015-01-25T15:10:08Z beach: You have been fairly quiet about it. 2015-01-25T15:10:25Z froggey: I have 2015-01-25T15:10:28Z froggey: here's a fairly recent screenshot: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46753018/Screen%20Shot%202015-01-19%20at%2001.29.31.png 2015-01-25T15:10:29Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:10:29Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-25T15:10:29Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:10:42Z froggey: I don't actually remember joining #lisp... 2015-01-25T15:11:33Z H4ns: froggey: looks spiffy. can you share some technical details? 2015-01-25T15:11:44Z froggey: and here's a VirtualBox appliance, if you want to try it out: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46753018/Mezzanine%20Demo%201.ova.gz 2015-01-25T15:12:03Z Davidbrcz quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:12:15Z gingerale joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:12:29Z froggey: sure. it's almost 100% common lisp, with little bits of assembly. it runs on x86-64 computers, but missing drivers limit it mostly to virtual machines 2015-01-25T15:12:50Z H4ns: wow. what implementation do you use underneath? 2015-01-25T15:12:52Z nyef: Your own common lisp, or did you start from an existing implementation? 2015-01-25T15:13:12Z froggey: I wrote the compiler myself, but it's pretty terrible, so performance is pretty terrible 2015-01-25T15:13:29Z nyef is trying to think of what real hardware he has that might be workable... 2015-01-25T15:13:50Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:13:50Z froggey: from scratch mostly, though I'm using Closette and MIT loop and a couple of functions borrowed from SBCL 2015-01-25T15:14:02Z H4ns: awesome 2015-01-25T15:14:08Z beach: Very nice! 2015-01-25T15:14:47Z froggey: thanks 2015-01-25T15:15:07Z nyef: "Failed to import appliance" 2015-01-25T15:15:18Z beach: Do you have a GIT repository somewhere? 2015-01-25T15:15:39Z froggey: not yet, I'll be putting it up on github soonish 2015-01-25T15:15:53Z beach: Please do. 2015-01-25T15:16:08Z froggey: nyef: oh dear, any other errors? did you ungzip it first? dropbox servers raw .ova files as text 2015-01-25T15:16:23Z nyef: I did gunzip it. 2015-01-25T15:16:33Z nyef: file says it's a tar archive. tar can't find it. 2015-01-25T15:17:00Z froggey: yeah, .ova files are just tar files with a different extension 2015-01-25T15:17:25Z beach: froggey: So can you summarize the features of the OS in a few sentences? 2015-01-25T15:18:30Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:18:48Z froggey: nyef: could you try renaming it to .tar, untaring it and then importing the .ovf? 2015-01-25T15:18:59Z nyef: Just did that, and it failed the same way. 2015-01-25T15:19:57Z froggey: ok. you have the vmdk? we can create a new VM using that 2015-01-25T15:20:11Z drmeister: The same thing happens to me "Failed to import appliance" 2015-01-25T15:20:17Z drmeister: Hello 2015-01-25T15:20:17Z nyef: Just booted the disk in a new VM. 2015-01-25T15:20:37Z froggey: that's annoying. it did work, really :) 2015-01-25T15:20:43Z beach: Hello drmeister. 2015-01-25T15:21:36Z drmeister: Hi beach, nyef, froggy 2015-01-25T15:21:41Z nyef: And it just locked up. 2015-01-25T15:21:47Z nyef: Opened the file viewer. 2015-01-25T15:22:11Z froggey: you'll need to give it a virtio-net NIC and 512MB of memory 2015-01-25T15:22:34Z froggey: red line at the top of the screen, or just completely frozen? 2015-01-25T15:22:48Z nyef: Wasn't paying attention. 2015-01-25T15:23:02Z nyef: A half-gig, really? 2015-01-25T15:23:28Z nyef: Okay, trying again. 2015-01-25T15:24:03Z beach: OK, I am lost. How are you supposed to run it? 2015-01-25T15:24:05Z froggey: 256MB might be enough, currently it pages in but doesn't page out 2015-01-25T15:24:16Z nyef: Keyboard map is a bit quirky. 2015-01-25T15:24:33Z nyef: How do I type a #\" ? 2015-01-25T15:24:38Z froggey: it's a UK map, use alt-F12 to switch to US 2015-01-25T15:24:39Z oudeis quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T15:24:53Z nyef: Ah, there we go. 2015-01-25T15:25:19Z froggey: beach: sorry, it was supposed to be easy. but apparently the VM appliance doesn't work 2015-01-25T15:25:46Z beach: Even if it did, I wouldn't know what to do. 2015-01-25T15:25:50Z dim: wow, froggey, very nice work from the screenshot! 2015-01-25T15:25:51Z beach: Maybe I am just dense. 2015-01-25T15:26:06Z nyef: beach: You have to unpack the archive (it's a tarball) to get the .vmdk file, then create a new VM with 512MB of RAM and setting the network card to be a virtio-net, using VirtualBox. 2015-01-25T15:26:28Z nyef: What are you using for a GC? 2015-01-25T15:26:33Z beach: I did the untar, but I have no idea what it means to create a new VM etc... 2015-01-25T15:26:50Z nyef: beach: Do you have VirtualBox installed? 2015-01-25T15:27:04Z beach: I don't even know what it is. That might be part of the problem. 2015-01-25T15:27:05Z froggey: I'm currently feeling a bit overwhelmed, I might be a bit slow to respond... 2015-01-25T15:27:25Z froggey: ah, yeah. it's a virtual machine. it emulates (virualizes) a PC 2015-01-25T15:27:26Z nyef: froggey: This is awesome. Seems a bit rough around the edges, maybe, but still awesome. 2015-01-25T15:27:30Z froggey: thanks! 2015-01-25T15:27:40Z nyef: Are the sources online somewhere? 2015-01-25T15:27:47Z nyef: Or, failing that, are they in the disk image? 2015-01-25T15:27:53Z froggey: i'll put them up on github soon 2015-01-25T15:28:13Z froggey: I should have done that 2015-01-25T15:28:13Z drmeister: froggey: How long have you been working on this? 2015-01-25T15:28:19Z froggey: a few years 2015-01-25T15:28:31Z brucem: froggey: can you access the host's GL via virtio or similar under virtualbox? 2015-01-25T15:28:36Z beach: froggey: What % of full time? 2015-01-25T15:28:39Z drmeister: I've been implementing a new Common Lisp for the past 3-4 years. 2015-01-25T15:30:04Z beach: froggey: Not being as savvy as nyef, I would appreciate to have some more detailed written instructions for running it at some point. No rush of course. 2015-01-25T15:30:07Z nyef: Is this thing multi-threaded or single-threaded? 2015-01-25T15:30:08Z drmeister: As has beach - this is a remarkable meeting. 2015-01-25T15:30:49Z froggey: nyef: there are copyable and noncopyable objects. copyable objects use cheney-style copying, while noncopyable objects use a mark and sweep collector 2015-01-25T15:31:15Z nyef: Okay, so those obnoxious pauses are for a full GC? 2015-01-25T15:31:19Z dim: I can't get to start a VirtualBox VM given the VMDK here, too bad 2015-01-25T15:31:19Z froggey: brucem: I think virtualbox exposes something like that, but I don't touch it yet. graphics functions are partially written in asm 2015-01-25T15:31:23Z dim: ah, early dasy 2015-01-25T15:31:26Z dim: days 2015-01-25T15:31:30Z froggey: nyef: a full terrible stop-the-world GC 2015-01-25T15:31:58Z froggey: beach: not sure what %, I didn't touch it for most of 2013 2015-01-25T15:32:14Z nyef: froggey: What license are you considering for this? 2015-01-25T15:32:24Z froggey: drmeister: cool, what is your's for? 2015-01-25T15:32:30Z Shinmera: beach: I have no idea what's going on with lispworks, it's still running your test. Most peculiar. 2015-01-25T15:32:30Z froggey: nyef: MIT 2015-01-25T15:32:40Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:32:50Z beach: Shinmera: You can kill it. There is clearly something wrong. 2015-01-25T15:32:51Z drmeister: Mine uses LLVM as its backend and it's designed to interoperate with C++. 2015-01-25T15:33:03Z Shinmera: beach: Alright, I'll leave the debugging to you then :) 2015-01-25T15:33:05Z froggey: and it's multithreaded, but alarmingly short on locking 2015-01-25T15:33:12Z dim: froggey: is your UI layer usable directly from application lisp code? 2015-01-25T15:33:18Z beach: Shinmera: Thanks for all the help. 2015-01-25T15:33:28Z xyh quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T15:33:38Z froggey: beach: I'll get some proper instructions soon 2015-01-25T15:33:39Z dim: I'm thinking about how to use your OS as a base to develop graphical appliances (e.g. games) on top of it ;-) 2015-01-25T15:33:51Z Shinmera: beach: I don't know when clasp will finish running, so I'll send the rest of the files I have over for now. 2015-01-25T15:34:03Z beach: froggey: Thanks. No rush. You are going to be busy answering all these questions now! :) 2015-01-25T15:34:21Z beach: Shinmera: That would be great, yes. 2015-01-25T15:34:22Z oudeis quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T15:34:23Z froggey: no kidding. If I miss anything just ask again in a bit 2015-01-25T15:34:48Z nyef: Is there some way to interrupt the REPL? 2015-01-25T15:34:53Z nyef: A C-c or similar? 2015-01-25T15:35:09Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:35:14Z froggey: dim: currently applications only get a framebuffer and can write directly to it, and they receive normal UI events like mouse motion/clicks and key presses 2015-01-25T15:35:26Z froggey: nyef: no :( 2015-01-25T15:35:32Z dim: sounds like enough for a start 2015-01-25T15:36:23Z froggey: performance is currently bad enough that any kind of real-time game is probably not going to happen. improving (or replacing) the compiler is on my todo list 2015-01-25T15:36:40Z oudeis quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T15:36:41Z beach: That sounds familiar. :) 2015-01-25T15:36:48Z nyef: Odd, I'd've thought that a better GC would be higher on your list. 2015-01-25T15:37:12Z froggey: the GC is written in Lisp. faster compiler = faster GC 2015-01-25T15:37:14Z drmeister: Yep, that's achingly familiar. 2015-01-25T15:37:24Z froggey: but that's also really important 2015-01-25T15:37:28Z nyef: The killer for any "realtime" game isn't the speed of the output of the compiler, it's the pauses for GC. 2015-01-25T15:37:29Z dim: ok no way that I can run a VM ontop of the vmdk, that's for another day 2015-01-25T15:38:14Z nyef: No scrollback? 2015-01-25T15:38:16Z dim: the game I have in mind would be a "learn yourself programming" game where you solve levels or puzzles by writing code then see it running 2015-01-25T15:38:31Z dim: so there's not real-time parts in that 2015-01-25T15:38:35Z beach: "teach yourself"? 2015-01-25T15:38:47Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:38:48Z beach: or "learn programming yourself" 2015-01-25T15:38:49Z dim: let's say make learning how to program fun 2015-01-25T15:38:59Z dim: several implementations already exists of course 2015-01-25T15:39:04Z nyef: Is it possible to move the windows, or are they in fixed positions? 2015-01-25T15:39:09Z dim: none in CL tho, and I think it'd be better to start with CL 2015-01-25T15:39:13Z mood: nyef: alt-mouse 2015-01-25T15:39:18Z froggey: no scrollback, alt+drag to move 2015-01-25T15:40:47Z nyef: Ah, okay, I should read the README file. 2015-01-25T15:42:55Z beach: froggey: Congratulations again! Looks like you will be busy for the foreseeable future with improvements. 2015-01-25T15:43:38Z mood: Hmm, the IRC application in the VM caused it to lock up. It did actually connect to freenode though. This is awesome 2015-01-25T15:43:57Z jeti joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:44:19Z Ralt: hi 2015-01-25T15:44:27Z beach: Hello Ralt. 2015-01-25T15:44:36Z Ralt: how is it going? 2015-01-25T15:44:54Z Shinmera: beach: you-got-mail.wav, hopefully 2015-01-25T15:44:58Z beach: You missed the excitement about froggey announcing his LispOs. 2015-01-25T15:44:59Z froggey: mood: the whole thing, or just the IRC application? there's something funny going on with virtualbox and DNS 2015-01-25T15:45:03Z Ralt: oh 2015-01-25T15:45:25Z dim: ahah, turns out the .ova file works here froggey 2015-01-25T15:45:38Z froggey: I knew it worked! I wasn't crazy! 2015-01-25T15:45:38Z beach: Shinmera: Not yet. Will no doubt come soon. Thanks. 2015-01-25T15:45:39Z nyef_2 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:45:39Z mood: froggey: The IRC window turned gray-ish and the mouse stopped responding 2015-01-25T15:45:54Z nyef_2: Probably just a GC. 2015-01-25T15:45:58Z nyef_2: Or something. 2015-01-25T15:46:02Z froggey: probably 2015-01-25T15:46:17Z mood: It lasted over a minute, I reset the VM 2015-01-25T15:46:18Z nyef_2: This is STILL awesome. 2015-01-25T15:46:35Z froggey: the blinking lights in the top left indicate the current state. the purple light turns on during a GC 2015-01-25T15:46:49Z nyef_2: Although there are some interesting graphical artifacts towards the bottom of the IRC window. 2015-01-25T15:46:52Z ggole recalls stories of people starting a GC and going home for the day 2015-01-25T15:46:57Z nyef_2: And I worry about a GC interacting with the IRC server keepalive. 2015-01-25T15:47:15Z froggey: freenode has a timeout of 15 minutes. it's not *that* bad 2015-01-25T15:47:34Z Oddity joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:48:21Z nyef: froggey: Well done, though. I'm rather looking forward to having a look at (and possibly do some serious hacking on) the source. 2015-01-25T15:49:01Z froggey: thanks 2015-01-25T15:49:16Z mezzadim joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:49:26Z mezzadim: hi from Mezzanine VM ;-) 2015-01-25T15:49:29Z Ralt: good job froggey! 2015-01-25T15:49:43Z nyef: ... No disassembler? 2015-01-25T15:50:05Z doobi-sham-53143 quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:50:14Z Ralt: I have something much less impressive to ask about: I'm starting with commonqt, and would like to know what's the workflow to start/restart the app, compile functions/update the UI... without blocking the REPL 2015-01-25T15:50:42Z froggey: no disassembler. I got sick of hacking on x86 opcodes, so I skipped it 2015-01-25T15:50:52Z froggey: has anyone tried the incredibly experimental and dangerous feature described at the bottom of the readme yet? 2015-01-25T15:50:54Z Shinmera: Ralt: You should be able to compile things anew in the back no problem 2015-01-25T15:51:00Z Ralt: right now, the first quickload starts up the UI, then other (make-instance) don't bring up the UI. Also, the REPL is blocked. 2015-01-25T15:51:45Z nyef_2: Hrm. Definitely looks to be x86-64, based on the backtrace... 2015-01-25T15:51:57Z Shinmera: Ralt: Why would the quickload start the UI 2015-01-25T15:52:02Z Shinmera: Ralt: that sounds like a bad idea 2015-01-25T15:52:02Z froggey: beach and anybody else who couldn't get it working, here are slightly more detailed instructions: http://slexy.org/view/s20Pc2LaIw 2015-01-25T15:52:17Z froggey: nyef_2: you got it. all 64-bit 2015-01-25T15:52:38Z nyef_2: Okay, shutting down now. Not much more I can think of to do without access to the source. 2015-01-25T15:52:44Z nyef_2 quit (Quit: Going back to Linux) 2015-01-25T15:52:48Z beach: froggey: Excellent. Thanks! 2015-01-25T15:53:18Z wenincode quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:53:22Z gregburd_ quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:53:28Z nyef: Okay, now, what do I have for "spare" x86-64 boxes...? 2015-01-25T15:53:54Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T15:54:00Z ggherdov quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T15:54:01Z dim: like, already wanting to install that on real hardware? 2015-01-25T15:54:06Z mezzamood joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:54:07Z cpc26_ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T15:54:34Z mezzamood: Another hello from Mezzanine :D 2015-01-25T15:55:05Z Ralt: Shinmera: indeed, moving this to a main function. 2015-01-25T15:55:13Z loke_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:55:15Z cpc26 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:55:21Z froggey: I've not been able to test it on real hardware for ages. my test machine lost its PSU a while ago 2015-01-25T15:56:27Z Shinmera: Ralt: Generally you'll have a MAIN function that'll contain something similar to (qt:with-main-window ..) 2015-01-25T15:56:58Z Shinmera: Ralt: I usually don't need access to the repl while I test the UI, as I can still recompile classes and functions in the back using Slime 2015-01-25T15:57:02Z beach: Shinmera: Got the mail! Thanks! 2015-01-25T15:57:11Z Shinmera: Ralt: So I just let the MAIN block until I want to restart the UI 2015-01-25T15:57:30Z Shinmera: Ralt: I'm not sure how well behaved the UI will do if you put it into a separate thread, but you could try that. 2015-01-25T15:57:36Z Shinmera: beach: Good! 2015-01-25T15:58:09Z froggey: drmeister: your implementation is designed to interoperate with C++? 2015-01-25T15:58:19Z mezzadim quit 2015-01-25T15:58:37Z froggey: so I could use clang's C++ API, instead of the C API? 2015-01-25T15:58:50Z Raeon joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:58:52Z wenincode joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:58:54Z gregburd_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T15:59:01Z drmeister: froggey: Yes - I'm designing it for scientific computing and there are a lot of C++ libraries that I need. 2015-01-25T15:59:11Z Shinmera: beach: I'll send you another one if clasp finishes before the clock strikes midnight :) 2015-01-25T15:59:27Z dim: froggey: you're getting deserved attention on twitter too ;-) 2015-01-25T15:59:48Z Raeon: hi. 2015-01-25T15:59:49Z Raeon: :D 2015-01-25T16:00:08Z Raeon: Talking to you from inside a Mezzanine Demo 1 VM.. 2015-01-25T16:00:20Z nopf_ is now known as nopf 2015-01-25T16:01:09Z Shinmera suddenly feels pressure to resume work on Parasol again 2015-01-25T16:01:22Z nyef: ... I think my priority for getting back to hacking NQ-CLIM just got a major bump. 2015-01-25T16:01:38Z Ralt: Shinmera: ok thanks! I'll try this workflow 2015-01-25T16:01:56Z Shinmera: Ralt: you may also be interested in http://shinmera.github.io/qtools/ 2015-01-25T16:02:08Z froggey: drmeister: what's it called? I think it might be useful for me in the future 2015-01-25T16:03:16Z drmeister: froggey: github.com/drmeister/clasp 2015-01-25T16:03:36Z Ralt: Shinmera: indeed, looks interesting 2015-01-25T16:03:49Z froggey: thanks, I'll keep it in mind 2015-01-25T16:03:58Z Raeon quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T16:04:02Z dim: nyef: nq-clim being an implementation of CLIM? 2015-01-25T16:04:14Z nyef: dim: Not Quite. (-: 2015-01-25T16:04:29Z dim: hehe, not sure how to understand the implications of that part actually 2015-01-25T16:05:13Z tomvos joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:05:16Z dim: but well my quest for lisp based GUI feels vain where there's so much one can do in HTML and Javascript anyway 2015-01-25T16:07:14Z Ralt: weird. #\_ is not recognized, I have to quickload twice to get it working. 2015-01-25T16:07:36Z beach: froggey: Got it to work! Thanks! Great work! 2015-01-25T16:09:21Z froggey: great :) 2015-01-25T16:09:31Z nyef: froggey: Aside from the compiler backend, is there anything about the system that would prevent a 32-bit port? 2015-01-25T16:10:23Z pranavrc quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T16:10:45Z ggherdov joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:10:46Z mood: froggey: The "Extremely experimental whole-system transparent persistence" caused it to panic, btw 2015-01-25T16:11:00Z froggey: the memory layout is a bit funny because it assumes a massive address space, I but think that could be squashed down to 32-bits 2015-01-25T16:11:29Z mezzamood quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T16:11:32Z froggey: mood: unfortunatly that's expected, being extremely experimental 2015-01-25T16:11:37Z froggey: before or after you rebooted? 2015-01-25T16:12:27Z mood: froggey: before, while dumping 2015-01-25T16:13:08Z froggey: oh, strange. usually it just produces a broken image 2015-01-25T16:13:33Z froggey: I don't suppose you had serial output enabled? 2015-01-25T16:13:55Z mood: froggey: Not that I know of, no. 2015-01-25T16:14:22Z froggey: ok, doesn't really matter 2015-01-25T16:14:34Z froggey: if you try again it might work 2015-01-25T16:14:58Z yenda quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T16:16:14Z mood: froggey: It also panics on boot 2015-01-25T16:16:48Z froggey: you'll need to restore the disk image 2015-01-25T16:18:48Z zadock quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T16:19:06Z Shinmera: Ralt: Not recognized where 2015-01-25T16:19:18Z LiamH joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:19:25Z Shinmera: Ralt: you need an (named-readtables:in-readtable :qt) at the top of each file and in the repl once. 2015-01-25T16:19:34Z Ralt: Shinmera: oh, at the top of each file 2015-01-25T16:19:42Z Ralt: that should be it. 2015-01-25T16:20:40Z Ralt: Shinmera: indeed, that's better. Thank you. 2015-01-25T16:21:01Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-25T16:23:28Z Shinmera: Ralt: Here's an example of a Qt class thing with Qtools and without http://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/79 2015-01-25T16:25:02Z Shinmera: actually that paste is outdated, eugh 2015-01-25T16:25:04Z Shinmera: sorry about that 2015-01-25T16:25:31Z Ralt: lol 2015-01-25T16:29:09Z Ralt: Shinmera: also, it seems your website is broken on blink 2015-01-25T16:29:46Z mood: froggey: Here the log from a connected serial port when it panicked while dumping: http://paste.lisp.org/display/145373 2015-01-25T16:29:58Z Shinmera: Ralt: What does "blink" and "broken" mean? 2015-01-25T16:31:02Z eudoxia: blink is the new chrome render engine 2015-01-25T16:31:03Z eudoxia: or something 2015-01-25T16:31:52Z Shinmera: I'm using chrome and my site works marvellously, so idk what he's on about. 2015-01-25T16:32:28Z Shinmera: That's why I'm not sure what "blink" refers to in this context. 2015-01-25T16:32:45Z Ralt: Shinmera: this is what I get: http://i.imgur.com/C4ozxqB.png 2015-01-25T16:33:09Z froggey: mood: thanks! 2015-01-25T16:33:12Z Ralt: scrolling up or down doesn't show up anything... only the same shade of grey 2015-01-25T16:33:41Z Shinmera: Huh. 2015-01-25T16:33:41Z hiroakip joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:33:53Z Shinmera: The only guess I can make to that is that it's not loading resources right, but I can't say. 2015-01-25T16:34:03Z Ralt: oh 2015-01-25T16:34:07Z Ralt: a hard refresh fixes it 2015-01-25T16:34:21Z Shinmera: Might have been cloudflare mucking about with the cache. 2015-01-25T16:34:47Z Ralt: I guess so 2015-01-25T16:35:01Z Ralt: thanks, I see the code now. It does seem very interesting. 2015-01-25T16:36:04Z Ralt: although.. it seems a bit biased :-) 2015-01-25T16:36:06Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:36:10Z Shinmera: I'm not really happy with how it works though, so I've been thinking of different approaches to make things more lispy. 2015-01-25T16:36:37Z Shinmera: Biased how? 2015-01-25T16:37:07Z Ralt: I mean, the qtools version has many small define-widgets, and the without-qtools version does everything in the initialize-instance. It could be easily refactored to have small functions 2015-01-25T16:37:16Z Ralt: and be a lot clearer 2015-01-25T16:37:36Z eudoxia quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T16:37:46Z Shinmera: Well, sure 2015-01-25T16:38:43Z Shinmera: The point was more to show that it offers a more intuitive (I guess?) construct for doing it all, less than having a good comparison of "best practises". 2015-01-25T16:39:41Z Ralt: yup, and the point gets across 2015-01-25T16:39:47Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:40:07Z Ralt: refactoring the without-qtools to make it clearer would make it ~200 lines, while qtools version doesn't even have 100 lines 2015-01-25T16:40:41Z Shinmera: The biggest problem with qtools is that it's all one form and does a lot of inline compiling, so debug information is horribly lost 2015-01-25T16:40:50Z Shinmera: *with qtools' widgets 2015-01-25T16:41:18Z Shinmera: Hence why I'm looking for a different way of doing it. I have some ideas that look good, but never got around to implementing them. Maybe I'll do that tonight. 2015-01-25T16:41:21Z jtza8 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:42:18Z tomvos quit (Quit: tomvos) 2015-01-25T16:48:17Z oudeis quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-25T16:48:47Z Ralt: Shinmera: keep me informed then 2015-01-25T16:49:01Z Shinmera: Sure 2015-01-25T16:49:32Z Ralt: I'll try using just commonqt for now, to get used to it. I'll eventually use something more battery-powered after that 2015-01-25T16:50:15Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-25T16:52:44Z jtza8 quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T16:54:01Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:01:00Z yaewa joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:01:01Z Ralt: Shinmera: how do you update the GUI? Even if I compile, it doesn't update the spawned ui... 2015-01-25T17:02:52Z Shinmera: Ralt: you need to create a new instance of the object in question of course 2015-01-25T17:03:19Z Shinmera: Ralt: You can redefine overrides/slots/methods and those should take effect immediately, but it can't update existing C++ instances. 2015-01-25T17:04:17Z lifenoodles_ quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:04:21Z Ralt: yeah, I see what you mean 2015-01-25T17:05:18Z moei quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:05:57Z lifenoodles joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:06:40Z aftershave joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:07:12Z tsumetai` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:08:01Z enitiz joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:08:18Z beach` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:09:30Z ggole_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:09:30Z ggole_ quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-25T17:09:39Z oleo quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:09:44Z mingvs_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:10:42Z impulse- joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:10:45Z Evanescence joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:10:53Z zacts_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:12:10Z TDT``` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:12:40Z oleo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:12:43Z Ukari quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-25T17:13:29Z mathrick quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T17:13:40Z mathrick joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:14:49Z oudeis joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:14:52Z someon joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:15:20Z francogrex joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:15:25Z someone quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:25Z impulse quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:25Z tsumetai quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:26Z beach quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:26Z TDT`` quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:26Z Xach quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:15:48Z stardiviner quit (*.net *.split) 2015-01-25T17:15:48Z ggole quit (*.net *.split) 2015-01-25T17:15:48Z thomas quit (*.net *.split) 2015-01-25T17:15:48Z zacts quit (*.net *.split) 2015-01-25T17:15:48Z mingvs quit (*.net *.split) 2015-01-25T17:16:34Z Xach joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:17:36Z pjb quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:18:18Z splittist_ quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:18:43Z gluegadget quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:19:10Z francogrex: Hi, can anyone give me insight on this 'discrepancy' in disassembly between x86 (AMD Sempron), raspberry pi armv6l and SAMSUNG SERRANO ARMv7? is it a software (gdb) problem? http://paste.lisp.org/display/145375 I show sbcl example but the same with other lisps (ccl). 2015-01-25T17:19:30Z endou______ quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:20:15Z thomas joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:20:40Z psy quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T17:20:56Z nyef: francogrex: On the SAMSUNG, you're disassembling ARM instructions as THUMB. 2015-01-25T17:21:04Z oudeis quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:21:13Z gz quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:21:18Z Bike: the other two look the same, though, just with different syntaxes and register names 2015-01-25T17:21:24Z NhanH quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:21:52Z lifenoodles quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:21:58Z nyef: francogrex: And x86oids are a bit different from the other SBCL backends. 2015-01-25T17:22:28Z nyef: francogrex: (And the ARM SBCL backend has its own quirks as well, like keeping the control stack pointer in a symbol value instead of a register.) 2015-01-25T17:22:58Z lifenoodles joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:23:13Z francogrex: nyef: with ccl it's the same, the raspberry is the same as dissassembly but samsung unrecognizable... 2015-01-25T17:23:39Z francogrex: Bike wich other two? 2015-01-25T17:23:54Z nyef: francogrex: And it'd be the same issue: You're disassembling ARM instructions as THUMB or vice-versa. 2015-01-25T17:23:58Z Bike: x86 and the pi. 2015-01-25T17:24:01Z pjb joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:24:10Z kons quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-25T17:24:33Z francogrex: Bike: yes 2015-01-25T17:24:42Z dim: drmeister: in your blog post the text https://github.com/drmeister/demo-clasp-cxx is not a link 2015-01-25T17:25:01Z Bike: try, um, x/20wi instead. 2015-01-25T17:25:15Z Bike: should force it to be arm, according to random blog post i just found. 2015-01-25T17:25:21Z splittist_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:25:21Z nyef: Yeah, that's what I was just about to get to. Use the w modifier. 2015-01-25T17:25:28Z francogrex: ok 2015-01-25T17:25:33Z Bike: w for word, presumably 2015-01-25T17:25:40Z francogrex: yes word 2015-01-25T17:25:54Z endou______ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:26:28Z gz joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:26:48Z eivarv joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:27:35Z gluegadget joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:29:01Z psy joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:29:02Z drmeister: dim: Thank you very much - I fixed that and added a few other things that should have been links in text. 2015-01-25T17:31:36Z NhanH joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:35:14Z francogrex: i'm surprised: x /20wi 0x515DFD10 gives the same old output: asrs r1, r0, #32 ... I was pretty sure that would fix it... maybe the gdb version is messed up 2015-01-25T17:35:53Z jeti: Shinmera: hi, are you the author of south? 2015-01-25T17:36:23Z Shinmera: I am, yes. 2015-01-25T17:37:12Z jeti: i am having this immoscout24 problem, do you have any clue? 2015-01-25T17:37:42Z Shinmera: Ah, sorry, I haven't managed to look at it further yet. I've been busy setting up my workstation anew the past few days. 2015-01-25T17:37:59Z jeti: no prob 2015-01-25T17:38:30Z Lokathor quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:40:15Z Shinmera: Ach, this is giving me a headache just looking at it, haha 2015-01-25T17:40:34Z jeti: me too 2015-01-25T17:40:40Z francogrex: x /20xw 0x515DFD10: 0xe0801001 0xe1a00001 0xe59b7000 gdb disassembly instruction is spitting wrong output pff 2015-01-25T17:42:52Z phf joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:44:31Z Shinmera: jeti: I'll take a look at the server shutdown issue now, that's something I can at least debug without oAuth. 2015-01-25T17:45:18Z jeti: very good, thank you 2015-01-25T17:47:44Z bb010g joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:51:36Z mishoo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:52:17Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:54:22Z Jessin quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-25T17:55:18Z pierre1_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:56:13Z yaewa quit (Quit: Leaving...) 2015-01-25T17:56:39Z ehu quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-25T17:56:49Z moei joined #lisp 2015-01-25T17:59:11Z ehu joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:00:08Z manuel__ quit (Quit: manuel__) 2015-01-25T18:01:45Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:03:07Z manuel__ quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-25T18:03:18Z cpc26 quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:04:46Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T18:05:10Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:07:00Z pjb: I can't understand people using gmail or other big or ISP's email services. Is this still AOL age? 2015-01-25T18:07:23Z oleo: gmail ? 2015-01-25T18:07:25Z oleo: why gmail ? 2015-01-25T18:07:35Z oleo: i don't use my ISP's mail system 2015-01-25T18:07:45Z oleo: only gmail and gmx 2015-01-25T18:07:53Z oleo: gg 2015-01-25T18:08:22Z francogrex: pjb: what should they be using instead? 2015-01-25T18:08:23Z pjb: oleo: because gmail rejected a message I sent to one of his users pretexting it was spam. 2015-01-25T18:08:47Z Shinmera: jeti: I'm much too used to emacs+slime, working with lispworks is a challenge. I seem to have fixed the server issue, or at least I can initiate authentication multiple times without issue now. 2015-01-25T18:08:47Z t4nk581 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:09:05Z t4nk581: test 2015-01-25T18:09:17Z t4nk581: can someone read me? 2015-01-25T18:09:20Z Shinmera: No 2015-01-25T18:10:05Z t4nk581: ok good to know :) well I've a problem using lispbox. it used to work a few months ago, then I stopped using it and now it doesn't work anymore 2015-01-25T18:10:25Z Shinmera: lispbox is pretty outdated. Are you on windows? 2015-01-25T18:10:26Z t4nk581: when I start it, instead of getting the prompt, I get : http://pastebin.com/XAay7Pbh 2015-01-25T18:10:30Z t4nk581: linux 2015-01-25T18:11:39Z t4nk581: so I don't know how to fix the problem 2015-01-25T18:11:45Z t4nk581: nor what causes it 2015-01-25T18:12:08Z AeroNotix: t4nk581: would you consider not using lispbox and just use the underlying packages manually? 2015-01-25T18:12:11Z Shinmera: Neither do I. Seems like a rather serious failure though. 2015-01-25T18:12:12Z cpc26 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:12:20Z AeroNotix: these kits inevitably end up with some awful errors and bugs 2015-01-25T18:12:24Z Shinmera: The best way to fix it would probably be to not use lispbox 2015-01-25T18:12:25Z AeroNotix: and the users never know how to fix them 2015-01-25T18:12:34Z Shinmera: and instead use emacs and sbcl/ccl from your package manager. 2015-01-25T18:12:44Z AeroNotix: (inc Shinmera) 2015-01-25T18:12:47Z t4nk581: okay, any other suggestion to replace lispbox? 2015-01-25T18:12:51Z AeroNotix: No. 2015-01-25T18:12:59Z t4nk581: emacs ok 2015-01-25T18:13:05Z Shinmera: Well lispbox uses emacs, so 2015-01-25T18:13:22Z Shinmera: You'll get the same thing, just not as a bundle. 2015-01-25T18:13:49Z t4nk581: yeah i tried emacs first but i didn't know how to execute lisp programs with it, i guess i'll read more about it 2015-01-25T18:14:05Z t4nk581: but thanks, I'm uninstalling lispbox and installing emacs then 2015-01-25T18:14:06Z Shinmera once more wishes he had already written the setup tutorial he intended to write. But alas time machines don't exist. 2015-01-25T18:14:44Z oleo: pjb: it does not reject i think.....it goes to spam folder or so..... 2015-01-25T18:15:13Z Shinmera: t4nk581: There's this at least http://www.mohiji.org/2011/01/31/modern-common-lisp-on-linux/ 2015-01-25T18:16:09Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T18:16:37Z t4nk581: so quicklist to replace lispbox basically? 2015-01-25T18:17:19Z vap1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:17:22Z Shinmera: I suppose. 2015-01-25T18:17:34Z Shinmera: I don't know what lispbox has configured; it might have additional emacs changes. 2015-01-25T18:17:39Z vaporatorius quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:19:10Z Jesin joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:21:03Z cpc26 quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:21:40Z cmack joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:21:40Z t4nk581 quit (Quit: Page closed) 2015-01-25T18:23:39Z vaporatorius__ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:24:35Z cpc26 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:24:55Z vaporatorius__ quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-25T18:26:29Z jeti` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:26:47Z vap1 quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:27:51Z eivarv quit (Quit: Sleep) 2015-01-25T18:28:58Z cpc26_ joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:29:30Z francogrex quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T18:29:42Z zacharias quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.1) 2015-01-25T18:30:10Z beach` is now known as beach 2015-01-25T18:30:26Z cpc26 quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:33:34Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:34:03Z hiyosi quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-25T18:34:23Z nell joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:34:28Z kons joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:34:58Z stepnem joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:38:21Z someon is now known as someone 2015-01-25T18:41:36Z CrazyWoods quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-25T18:43:37Z vaporatorius joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:43:50Z beach: nyef: It is great news that you are thinking of making NQ-CLIM higher priority now. 2015-01-25T18:43:50Z minion: beach, memo from pjb: Your mail system is failing: ftp://ftp.informatimago.com/users/pjb/lisp/test-reverse-count.mail Here are the results of the test: ftp://ftp.informatimago.com/users/pjb/lisp/test-reverse-count.tar.bz2 2015-01-25T18:44:03Z beach: Hmm. 2015-01-25T18:44:11Z beach: pjb: Thanks. 2015-01-25T18:44:38Z pjb: Actually, there's one incomplete result, the test is still running. I'll complete it later. 2015-01-25T18:44:45Z pt1 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T18:44:52Z beach: That's fine. Thanks for doing that. 2015-01-25T18:44:59Z nyef: beach: Well, it's currently about second on my list, but third place is farther behind now that there's a second plausible use-case for it. 2015-01-25T18:45:50Z nyef: And with the progress I made today on my current highest priority, I'm hoping to get it mostly squared away... "soon". 2015-01-25T18:46:04Z beach: pjb: Got the results. Thanks. 2015-01-25T18:46:48Z beach: nyef: Is the current thing you are working on "on the list" or do you take things off as you start working on them? 2015-01-25T18:47:15Z nyef: It's on the list. 2015-01-25T18:47:21Z Shinmera: jeti: I have no idea what's going on -- but I get a working request if I /don't/ urldecode the access-secret. 2015-01-25T18:47:29Z beach: nyef: Good! :) 2015-01-25T18:47:42Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:48:08Z Shinmera: jeti: This is on the playground 2015-01-25T18:49:51Z burtons quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:51:08Z vaporatorius quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:52:13Z pt1 quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-25T18:52:18Z Shinmera: jeti: Can confirm for the real site too 2015-01-25T18:54:11Z elimik31 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:55:33Z trebor_home quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T18:55:47Z beach left #lisp 2015-01-25T18:56:44Z MrWoohoo joined #lisp 2015-01-25T18:59:26Z mvilleneuve joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:00:26Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T19:01:00Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:02:37Z vaporatorius joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:06:42Z arpunk quit (Disconnected by services) 2015-01-25T19:06:53Z arpunk joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:08:20Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:09:27Z intinig quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T19:16:01Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:16:02Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T19:17:03Z crichter joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:18:49Z crichter: I am having some difficulty in binding a slot-value using initialize-instance :after. I've pasted the code at http://pastebin.com/bZ7PfSCB 2015-01-25T19:19:42Z pjb: crichter: the slot may be unbound so you cannot use incf. Use setf. 2015-01-25T19:19:53Z nyef: crichter: Looks like you have two methods with the same signature? 2015-01-25T19:19:55Z Shinmera: you can only have one after method on the same speccializers 2015-01-25T19:20:11Z pjb: and that too. 2015-01-25T19:20:12Z Shinmera: the later one overrides it, so the slot never gets set. 2015-01-25T19:20:19Z Shinmera: *specializers 2015-01-25T19:20:21Z crichter: oh ho 2015-01-25T19:21:33Z Bicyclidine joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:23:29Z crichter: Hmm. I've commented out the last defmethod and reloaded, but the slot account-type remains stubbornly unbound.... 2015-01-25T19:24:00Z pjb: You must also remove the method from the image. 2015-01-25T19:24:14Z farhaven quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1) 2015-01-25T19:24:14Z pjb: Well, not in this case. 2015-01-25T19:24:39Z jtza8 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:25:03Z farhaven joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:26:10Z nyef quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-25T19:26:33Z crichter: How does one remove the image? 2015-01-25T19:26:40Z pjb: the method. 2015-01-25T19:27:38Z pjb: (remove-method (function initialize-instance) (find-method (function initialize-instance) '(:after) '(bank-account))) 2015-01-25T19:27:42Z jtza8 quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-25T19:28:22Z pjb: But since in your case, the method was overriding it, and you override it by reloading, it's useless to remove it first. 2015-01-25T19:28:43Z elimik31 quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-25T19:29:07Z elimik31 joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:31:27Z Xach: crichter: you could fmakunbound the function and re-evaluate things 2015-01-25T19:31:48Z mrSpec joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:33:17Z cmack` joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:35:05Z crichter: Xach: like (fmakunbound initialize-instance) ? 2015-01-25T19:35:31Z cmack quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-25T19:36:20Z Xach: Sorry, not quite. 2015-01-25T19:36:44Z Xach: crichter: you can use the slime inspector in #'INITIALIZE-INSTANCE to find and kill your methods 2015-01-25T19:36:54Z Xach: M-x slime-inspect RET #'initialize-instance RET 2015-01-25T19:37:30Z nyef joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:45:47Z prxq joined #lisp 2015-01-25T19:46:25Z crichter: nice. 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mood dim p_l|backup shwouchk_ The_third_man clop2 justinmcp misv nitro_idiot hratsimi1ah tkd micro finnrobi bytecrawler housel trn cjmacs`` xorpse ft samebchase enfors 77CAABXCD cmbntr ferada PuercoPop swflint gko pchrist ircbrowse abbe larme guaqua` cross gniourf sigjuice yorick TrafficMan nisstyre BlastHardcheese snafuchs ``Erik les clog Nshag mtd jsnell luis dtw peccu2 2015-01-27T07:28:58Z names: stokachu tokenrove ozzloy j0ni pok brent80_plow xristos eak tessier copec alakra sjl djinni`_ Fade johs brucem rotty jayne nicdev sbryant chameco ConstantineXVI cibs tomaw antoszka Riviera kanru |3b| zymurgy grungier schjetne aap lieven emlow tristero killmaster sivoais dfox john-mcaleely faheem_ vhost- phadthai ThePhoeron viaken Khisanth notty z0d loke girrig troydm schoppenhauer ski nightshade427 Hydan jdz srcerer redline6561 zbigniew backupthrick ck_ 2015-01-27T07:28:58Z names: mhd_ qlkzy minion jpanest Bike brandonz_ sshirokov Takumo stopbyte ramus __main__ Posterdati cpt_nemo trigen dilated_dinosaur aerique otwieracz ered eazar001 soggybre1d newcup kalzz flip214 DeadTrickster joast decent rtoym Kruppe alchemis7 Colleen josteink mikaelj Tordek GGMethos Ralt SHODAN _5kg eMBee PaulCapestany bhyde replcated_ hugoduncan bobbysmith0071 isoraqathedh jaimef Ober_ enn s_e gensym fmu eigenlicht jtz heurist nowhereman FrostyX_ oconnore_ 2015-01-27T07:28:58Z names: davor_ smull_ Tristam whartung specbot acieroid` reb`` d4gg4d Intensity edran_ sismondi c74d gabc jackdaniel nopf Cheery joga lemoinem hyoyoung_ eagleflo setheus_ anunnaki p_l kirin` White__Flame sid_cypher mmathers yeltzooo Rudolph-Miller_ oGMo AntiSpamMeta teiresias nightfly akkad fikusz blahzik kjeldahl K1rk sellout Plazma tstc` emma Borbus bege AeroNotix zbrown wooden_ honkfestival REPLeffect_ TristamWrk rvchangu- Zhivago Jubb Natch diginet H4ns Grue`` 2015-01-27T07:28:58Z names: cmatei BeLucid Soft mingvs TDT``` mathrick Xach 2015-01-27T07:29:34Z quazimodo: lol 2015-01-27T07:29:45Z quazimodo: i want to know your opinion on my further educatino 2015-01-27T07:29:56Z quazimodo: I need to learn a language that is fast, expressive and good at multithreading 2015-01-27T07:30:06Z quazimodo: ruby doesn't satisfy that at all 2015-01-27T07:30:29Z quazimodo: narrow list seems to be clojure, erlang, haskell 2015-01-27T07:31:05Z mishoo joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:31:09Z dmiles_afk joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:31:27Z Zhivago: Category error: See implementation. 2015-01-27T07:31:32Z pjb: quazimodo: Common Lisp. 2015-01-27T07:32:10Z quazimodo: pjb: no one will let me write common lisp on their codebase, what happens when i leave 2015-01-27T07:32:26Z hiroakip quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:32:29Z pjb: Leave right away, start up your own company, hire lispers. 2015-01-27T07:32:52Z quazimodo: not an option even a little bit 2015-01-27T07:32:57Z defaultxr quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:33:34Z pjb: Then learn Java or whatever your boss wants you to work with. :-( 2015-01-27T07:33:43Z Beetny joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:33:52Z quazimodo: no boss, for myself 2015-01-27T07:34:13Z quazimodo: well 2015-01-27T07:34:25Z pjb: For yourself: Common Lisp. 2015-01-27T07:34:35Z quazimodo: what I wrote was dumb 2015-01-27T07:34:42Z quazimodo: no one's gonna care that I know common lisp 2015-01-27T07:34:56Z pjb: Not even you? Then don't. 2015-01-27T07:35:38Z defaultxr joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:35:50Z axion joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:35:55Z Grue``: quazimodo: nobody is going to recommend you other languages in this channel :) 2015-01-27T07:35:59Z whartung quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:36:08Z Grue`` is now known as Grue` 2015-01-27T07:36:24Z fragamus_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:38:03Z quazimodo: pjb: it's a sad state of affairs 2015-01-27T07:38:08Z fragamus_ quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T07:38:55Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:39:00Z quazimodo: i'm not knowledgeable enoguh to ask intelligent questions 2015-01-27T07:39:05Z quazimodo: need to read more 2015-01-27T07:39:08Z zeitue quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:39:50Z pjb: quazimodo: now, my good advice: learn all of them! Common Lisp, Clojure, Erlang, Haskell! 2015-01-27T07:40:29Z pjb: You can spend 3 months on each, and by the end of the year, make up your own mind on which you want to use on any project you want to realize. 2015-01-27T07:41:25Z MutSbeta joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:41:53Z pjb: If you do that on your own time, you could use alternate Saturdays on CL and Clojure, and alternate Sundays on erlang and Haskell, so you can progress in parallel and perhaps better compare them. 2015-01-27T07:42:08Z meiji11 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:42:19Z leo2007 quit (Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.4.2) 2015-01-27T07:43:40Z akkad: Give the parasitic nature of Clojure, it's surprising there has not been a serious effort to host it on CL. 2015-01-27T07:44:47Z pjb: We have better things to do. But indeed. If there were more teachers able to impose projects written in CL, they could probably find a pair of students to do just that. 2015-01-27T07:45:55Z pjb: akkad: now, the question, if you want to promote Common Lisp, is whether it's better to have implementations of CL running in the various other ecosystems, or if it's better to have implementations of the other languages running on CL processors. 2015-01-27T07:45:59Z Lokathor quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T07:46:04Z meiji11` joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:46:05Z Guest59415 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:46:22Z Lokathor joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:46:27Z Guest59415: h' 2015-01-27T07:46:50Z pjb: akkad: I would say that until we have a LispOS with enough contributors, the former is better. Having various language implementations targetting the CL processors will be nice, when we'll have a LispOS, to let other programmers use it with the languages they like. 2015-01-27T07:47:03Z pjb: There were Fortran, Pascal, Ada compilers targetting the Lisp Machines. 2015-01-27T07:47:33Z xach quit (Ping timeout: 183 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:47:46Z akkad: CL has had a lot longer window than the JVM. one could say the same for "promoting java" :P 2015-01-27T07:48:24Z clog quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:48:24Z pjb: Definitively. 2015-01-27T07:48:47Z pjb: But we wouldn't want to promote Java. Hence ABCL, and not Java2CL. 2015-01-27T07:49:26Z meiji11 quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:49:31Z quazimodo: popularity will come with hiring 2015-01-27T07:49:31Z quazimodo: who's hiring lispy guys, and how does that increase? 2015-01-27T07:49:31Z quazimodo: pjb: i'm thinking haskell is the way to go 2015-01-27T07:49:31Z quazimodo: at least for most of my attention 2015-01-27T07:49:43Z eivarv quit (Quit: Sleep) 2015-01-27T07:49:43Z pjb: quazimodo: Lispers hire lispers. 2015-01-27T07:50:08Z pjb: quazimodo: and also, people who think that lispers are superior programmers, will try to hire lispers to do something else. 2015-01-27T07:50:16Z pjb: A lot of lispers are unhappy. 2015-01-27T07:50:24Z quazimodo: maybe 2015-01-27T07:50:30Z flip214: Is there a fixed-point library for common lisp? I'd need a range of +2^15 to -2^15, with 16bit after the comma, so 32bit fixnums are large enough. 2015-01-27T07:50:48Z pjb: quazimodo: recently: http://www.ravenpack.com/company/careers/ (Spain). 2015-01-27T07:50:52Z Guest59415 left #lisp 2015-01-27T07:50:56Z quazimodo: pjb: yeah i saw thath 2015-01-27T07:51:11Z Joreji quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:51:13Z eivarv joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:51:15Z pjb: flip214: I've got some code implementing arithmetic on devises using integers. 2015-01-27T07:51:40Z k-dawg joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:51:48Z quazimodo: pjb: do we have immutable data types? 2015-01-27T07:51:54Z quazimodo: truly immutable data types 2015-01-27T07:52:35Z pjb: In CL? Yes: numbers and characters are immutable. 2015-01-27T07:52:37Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-27T07:52:55Z pjb: flip214: cf. com.informatimago.common-lisp.invoice.invoice 2015-01-27T07:53:15Z Joreji joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:54:37Z alexherbo2 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:55:18Z zeitue joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:55:44Z zRecursive joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:56:30Z Balveda joined #lisp 2015-01-27T07:56:43Z pjb: quazimodo: also, you can easily implement immutable datastructures in CL, by not providing any setter. 2015-01-27T07:59:27Z Joreji quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:00:07Z quazimodo: pjb: and any function designed to operate on them merely returns a new instance eh 2015-01-27T08:00:32Z Joreji joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:00:42Z pjb: exactly. 2015-01-27T08:00:54Z d4ryus_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:01:04Z Zhivago: The only rub is that you'll get no language-level support for it. 2015-01-27T08:01:05Z pjb: Use remove and append instead of delete and nconc. 2015-01-27T08:01:23Z quazimodo: i don't know all of lisps functions... too many functions! 2015-01-27T08:01:25Z protist_ quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:01:27Z Zhivago: (immutability by not providing mutators, that is) 2015-01-27T08:01:42Z flip214: pjb: thanks, looking. is that on github already? 2015-01-27T08:01:57Z quazimodo: Zhivago: yeah i know 2015-01-27T08:02:05Z pjb: Actually you do: (defpackage "IMMUTABLE-LISP" (:use "CL") (:export "REMOVE" "APPEND" "LIST")) (defpackage "IMMUTABLE-LISP-USER" (:use "IMMUTABLE-LIST")) (in-package "IMMUTABLE-LISP-USER") and presto you can't mutate anything anymore. 2015-01-27T08:02:31Z pjb: flip214: yes, git.informatimago.com, gitorious.org and github.com; it's well mirrored :-) 2015-01-27T08:02:31Z Zhivago: Yeah, but the implementation isn't going to take advantage of it. 2015-01-27T08:02:45Z pjb: Who knows? :-) 2015-01-27T08:02:57Z quazimodo: blehh 2015-01-27T08:03:06Z pjb: Zhivago: talk to beach when he'll implement optimizations :-) 2015-01-27T08:03:17Z pjb: bbl 2015-01-27T08:03:36Z flip214: pjb: great, thanks. now looking at LICENSE ... ;P 2015-01-27T08:03:43Z d4ryus quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:03:49Z protist_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:03:51Z pjb: you can easily take it as an example, in any case. 2015-01-27T08:05:54Z ehu joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:06:02Z zRecursive: ftpd 2015-01-27T08:06:11Z aretecode joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:08:54Z protist_ quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:08:58Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:09:19Z protist_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:09:35Z nee joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:10:57Z protist joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:11:35Z AntiSpamMeta quit (Quit: code refresh, /msg icxcnika sup dawg) 2015-01-27T08:12:50Z zacharias joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:14:33Z protist_ quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:15:30Z AntiSpamMeta joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:15:49Z nell quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.2-dev) 2015-01-27T08:16:43Z defaultxr quit (Quit: gnight) 2015-01-27T08:19:47Z ivan\ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T08:19:56Z ivan\ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:23:35Z keen__________44 quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T08:24:16Z flip214: pjb: your documentation page at http://www.informatimago.com/develop/lisp/doc/com.informatimago.common-lisp.invoice.invoice.html says " Initial value: #" 2015-01-27T08:25:38Z frkout_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T08:25:38Z keen__________44 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:25:40Z fsvehla joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:26:04Z frkout joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:27:21Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:27:22Z stardiviner quit (Quit: Weird in coding now, or make love, only two things push me away from IRC.) 2015-01-27T08:29:35Z stepnem joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:33:40Z edgar-rft quit (Quit: no meaningful message available) 2015-01-27T08:36:06Z Harag quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T08:36:18Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:36:49Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:38:27Z zacharias quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:40:49Z the_real_intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:40:52Z harish_ quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:42:24Z the_real_intinig is now known as intinig_ 2015-01-27T08:42:28Z eivarv quit (Quit: Quit) 2015-01-27T08:42:59Z ggole joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:43:08Z intinig quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T08:44:43Z intinig_ is now known as intinig 2015-01-27T08:45:38Z ehaliewicz quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:48:41Z zRecursi` joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:49:26Z zRecursive quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T08:49:46Z zRecursi` left #lisp 2015-01-27T08:50:07Z jewel joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:53:40Z redeemed joined #lisp 2015-01-27T08:59:17Z acieroid` is now known as acieroid 2015-01-27T08:59:26Z zacharias joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:01:19Z nell joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:01:22Z cmatei quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:03:01Z nell quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T09:04:27Z wp joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:05:09Z kcj quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T09:05:48Z stardiviner joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:06:57Z nostoi joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:08:40Z arenz joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:09:43Z the_real_intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:09:52Z edgar-rft joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:10:25Z krfantasy quit (Quit: krfantasy) 2015-01-27T09:11:32Z Lokathor quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:11:56Z cmatei joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:12:16Z intinig quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:16:40Z Shinmera joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:26:46Z innertracks joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:26:48Z _5kg quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:27:21Z innertracks quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T09:27:42Z the_real_intinig is now known as intinig 2015-01-27T09:30:30Z playnu_com_ar_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:31:18Z playnu_com_ar_ quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T09:32:18Z frkout quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:33:43Z xjgrant joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:34:17Z xjgrant: dim: Ping. 2015-01-27T09:35:16Z jtza8 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:39:04Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:39:28Z harish_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:39:33Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:41:16Z xjgrant: I'll try ya later. Need sleep...! 2015-01-27T09:41:20Z xjgrant: Bbl 2015-01-27T09:44:10Z meiji11` quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T09:44:57Z clog joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:45:40Z wp quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T09:46:55Z fragamus quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-27T09:51:12Z mvilleneuve joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:53:56Z vdamewood joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:54:26Z wgslayer joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:54:46Z nee quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2015-01-27T09:55:22Z kapil__ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T09:55:49Z Zhivago quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-27T10:00:04Z d4ryus_ is now known as d4ryus 2015-01-27T10:00:51Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:01:59Z akkad: The function COMMON-LISP:T is undefined. 2015-01-27T10:02:22Z H4ns: akkad: t is not defined as a function 2015-01-27T10:02:42Z akkad: just restoring a sbcl image I saved and it pops up with that 2015-01-27T10:03:04Z H4ns: how did you safe the image? 2015-01-27T10:03:06Z H4ns: save 2015-01-27T10:03:40Z akkad: (sb-ext:save-lisp-and-die "vpnmonitor" :toplevel t :executable t :compression 9) 2015-01-27T10:03:52Z H4ns: akkad: :toplevel t ? 2015-01-27T10:03:58Z jamesf joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:04:00Z zadock joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:04:48Z akkad: ahh right 2015-01-27T10:05:19Z akkad: was parsing that as "include toplevel? (t/f) 2015-01-27T10:05:24Z frkout joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:05:32Z H4ns: you're welcome 2015-01-27T10:05:50Z akkad: thanks :P 2015-01-27T10:06:02Z frkout quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T10:07:18Z frkout joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:08:55Z rotty quit (Quit: leaving) 2015-01-27T10:09:05Z rotty joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:09:22Z resttime joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:10:18Z _5kg joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:12:24Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T10:14:18Z frkout quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T10:18:39Z agumonkey quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-27T10:20:21Z angavrilov joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:21:12Z agumonkey joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:24:28Z nee joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:30:35Z zadock quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 2015-01-27T10:31:46Z nostoi quit (Quit: Verlassend) 2015-01-27T10:32:19Z gravicappa joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:33:11Z zadock joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:33:16Z echo-area quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T10:38:12Z robot-beethoven quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)) 2015-01-27T10:43:11Z Balveda quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T10:46:33Z Zhivago joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:49:38Z frkout joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:51:28Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-27T10:56:30Z ivan\ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T10:56:39Z ivan\ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:00:37Z intinig quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T11:01:15Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:01:15Z Jirachier quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:01:34Z Jirachier joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:01:54Z mishoo quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:09:37Z intinig quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:09:39Z JuanDaugherty quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T11:12:16Z wgslayer quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T11:12:29Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T11:13:27Z k-dawg quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep) 2015-01-27T11:20:29Z Baggers joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:20:34Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:22:10Z Baggers: Does anyone know of a library that implements the reader macro extensions as suggested by erik naggum here https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/comp.lang.lisp/VrcXtRUx43M/Yu5w_7lEB6wJ ? 2015-01-27T11:24:55Z BitPuffin quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:27:15Z Baggers: 'extensions' was probably the wrong term but the link gives the idea 2015-01-27T11:32:07Z c74d quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T11:32:58Z mega1 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:33:09Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:34:59Z c74d joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:35:48Z intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:41:21Z hellofunk quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:43:49Z ferada: anyone know this error while loading parenscript? http://paste.lisp.org/display/145401 sbcl, named-readtables and parenscript head 2015-01-27T11:51:12Z Oddity quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:54:11Z frkout quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T11:57:10Z eudoxia joined #lisp 2015-01-27T11:58:38Z Harag quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-27T11:59:42Z xan_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:00:03Z jtza8 quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:01:22Z jumblerg quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…) 2015-01-27T12:04:06Z chen_traveler joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:04:33Z the_real_intinig joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:05:04Z chen_traveler quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T12:05:19Z hellofunk joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:05:24Z Hache_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:06:13Z Joreji quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:06:36Z JuanDaugherty joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:08:05Z jumblerg joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:08:05Z intinig quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:08:08Z Joreji joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:09:31Z zygentoma joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:11:39Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:12:40Z wgslayer joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:12:52Z Beetny quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:13:33Z JuanDaugherty quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T12:15:40Z hellofunk quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T12:15:43Z mega1: ferada: (ql:quickload :parenscript) works here. Perhaps an old named-readtables gets loaded? 2015-01-27T12:15:57Z JuanDaugherty joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:16:04Z Joreji quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T12:16:29Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:17:16Z hellofunk joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:17:20Z ferada: right, http://common-lisp.net/project/named-readtables/ needs an update then 2015-01-27T12:17:30Z wgslayer quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:17:32Z ferada: thanks mega1 2015-01-27T12:17:34Z mega1: ahem, right 2015-01-27T12:18:14Z mega1: I should have done that, but getting access to it was thwarted somehow 2015-01-27T12:18:46Z mega1: get it from quicklisp or https://github.com/melisgl/named-readtables 2015-01-27T12:18:59Z ferada: yeah got it now, loads fine 2015-01-27T12:22:01Z Joreji joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:23:09Z Joreji quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T12:29:09Z k-dawg joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:31:39Z Baggers quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:32:44Z mega1: While we are on named-readtables, I've just merged stassat's pull request from ages ago. 2015-01-27T12:35:25Z mishoo joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:35:43Z hardenedapple joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:36:35Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:37:23Z tsumetai` joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:38:34Z tsumetai quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T12:41:06Z zadock quit (Quit: Leaving) 2015-01-27T12:42:50Z egp_ quit (Quit: Ухожу я от вас (xchat 2.4.5 или старше)) 2015-01-27T12:43:17Z enitiz joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:43:21Z egp_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:50:41Z manuel__ quit (Quit: manuel__) 2015-01-27T12:50:59Z manuel__ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:53:56Z nyef joined #lisp 2015-01-27T12:54:13Z nyef: G'morning all. 2015-01-27T12:54:13Z minion: nyef, memo from JokesOnYou77: Thanks again! 2015-01-27T12:58:12Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T13:00:08Z pt1 quit (Read error: No route to host) 2015-01-27T13:00:18Z pt1 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:02:32Z Harag joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:05:43Z enitiz quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T13:07:09Z MutSbeta quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-27T13:07:34Z gko_ quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) 2015-01-27T13:08:02Z ivan\ quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T13:08:12Z ivan\ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:09:33Z quazimodo quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2015-01-27T13:13:06Z pranavrc_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:13:52Z zygentoma quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/) 2015-01-27T13:14:35Z pranavrc_ quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T13:16:10Z pranavrc quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 2015-01-27T13:17:00Z shmr joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:17:08Z shmr quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T13:19:51Z hellofunk quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-27T13:21:51Z shmr joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:22:03Z shmr quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T13:25:37Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:28:25Z ebrasca joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:30:10Z hugoduncan is now known as hugod 2015-01-27T13:33:00Z kushal joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:39:34Z fridim_ joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:40:29Z songshuangkk joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:44:13Z hellofunk joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:47:43Z EvW joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:48:03Z Longlius quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T13:54:33Z Karl_Dscc quit (Remote host closed the connection) 2015-01-27T13:55:46Z leo2007 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:55:59Z profess joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:56:05Z quazimodo joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:56:27Z Harag1 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:56:58Z Harag quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T13:57:07Z Alfr joined #lisp 2015-01-27T13:58:55Z Denommus joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:00:29Z leo2007 quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in) 2015-01-27T14:01:23Z vaporatorius joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:03:44Z Karl_Dscc joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:03:54Z uraimo joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:05:02Z leo- joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:05:17Z badkins joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:05:46Z wheelsucker quit (Quit: Client Quit) 2015-01-27T14:05:52Z EvW quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T14:06:20Z leo- quit (Client Quit) 2015-01-27T14:08:50Z Ethan- joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:10:49Z leo2007 joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:15:50Z BitPuffin joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:20:05Z protist quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2015-01-27T14:20:43Z nell joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:23:08Z profess quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T14:25:13Z zadock joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:31:35Z profess joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:31:50Z profess quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T14:35:28Z bartol joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:35:29Z pjb: flip214: yes, readtables are not printable readably. On the other hand, writing the source expression could also not be advisable (it could be even more unwieldly). Perhaps the documentation generator could write "a readtable" instead of the readtable. 2015-01-27T14:37:59Z flip214: pjb: perhaps the source file and line number would be an idea for unprintable objects 2015-01-27T14:38:43Z attila_lendvai quit (Quit: Leaving.) 2015-01-27T14:40:10Z rhllor joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:41:11Z pjb: flip214: Don't forget you can use M-. in slime. 2015-01-27T14:41:25Z songshuangkk quit (Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-) 2015-01-27T14:41:53Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:41:53Z attila_lendvai quit (Changing host) 2015-01-27T14:41:53Z attila_lendvai joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:43:04Z hiyosi joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:44:03Z dkcl joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:49:52Z dkcl quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2015-01-27T14:50:03Z dkcl joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:55:18Z flip214: pjb: but not in the HTML sources ... 2015-01-27T14:55:25Z flip214: *HTML documentation. 2015-01-27T14:56:02Z hellofun` joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:57:06Z bartol quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2015-01-27T14:57:22Z tromey joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:58:02Z bullone joined #lisp 2015-01-27T14:58:48Z hellofunk quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2015-01-27T14:59:09Z Aranshada|W joined #lisp 2015-01-27T15:01:33Z Lokathor joined #lisp 2015-01-27T15:01:48Z rme joined #lisp