23:30:55 ccl-logbot [~ccl-logbo@setf.clozure.com] has joined #lisp 23:30:55 23:30:55 -!- names: ccl-logbot stassats pix4 syamajala Joreji schmrkc ephcon stepnem seidos dreish cmm TheLolrus benny MetalDust prip cmsimon Jasko jan247 attila_lendvai Eno_ kephas dto hugod Euthydemus wbooze homie mathrick Krystof carlocci drewc udzinari zfx potatishandlarn super__ tayloj Kolyan varjag troels ASau bozhidar Spewns cinch TraumaPwny lichtblau killerboy bytecolor Guthur tritchey Fare SandGorgon ``Erik xinming_ meder legumbre burton` curi_ PuffTheMagic manic12 23:30:55 -!- names: Buganini billitch lusory milanj Aferlak12 rme urandom__ marienz gz antoszka Yuuhi zard1989 nyef NNshag antifuchs dstatyvka jmcphers bpalmer Dodek Komi bgs100 cupe daniel_ jmbr xristos stis_ Demosthenes cthuluh rdd koollman Amadiro mrSpec derrida ragnul codewad Tordek slyrus_ sergio_ lat JuanDaugherty silenius nixeagle Xach Borkaman` s0ber pp206 fe[nl]ix WOG eno plediii oconnore ace4016 REPLeffect slyrus TomJ stettberger billstclair Dazhbog metasyntax 23:30:55 -!- names: Beetny kleppari beach AntiSpamMeta spacebat lnostdal sad0ur tcr sid3k rtoym Madsy phadthai cYmen OliverUv Tristam lisppaste specbot chiiph Patero-ng deepfire WormDrink Yamazaki-kun m4thrick Tasunteld Tanami jsnell dym_ holycow pchrist djdatavirusd627 Xantoz Xof pkhuong ve xavieran boyscared krappie BrianRice syntaxman redline6561 lemoinem [df] c|mell Odin- sanjoyd notrael ianmcorvidae Anarch dmiles_afk ecraven emma arbscht bleakgadfly minion tomaw rlb3 23:30:55 -!- names: kvsari lharc Draggor gnooth bfein foom dcrawford svitalnes sykopomp araujo hdurer_ nasloc__ rapacity mornfall az christoph_debian tessier clop srcerer slyrus__ z0d yahooooo Khisanth cods hohum delYsid eldragon pjb Holcxjo Patzy spiaggia Ralith setheus joshe rlonstein vsync ramus Salamander bougyman mal__ qebab rread tic jpanest reb djm tltstc gzip4 tsuru` johs DrForr dejones rootzlevel eli nuba kuwabara Intensity Obfuscate ineiros kloeri Revolve Fade 23:30:55 -!- names: ASau`` fmu fda314925 andreer jrockway inklesspen Tabmow joast aoh frodef acieroid Deltafire Ginei_Morioka easyE pr rlpowell zbigniew mqt ski l_a_m _3b djinni`` scode erg hc_e franki- clog turbo24prg galdor Aisling mtd p_l nullman tychoish golgotha Axioplase_ yacin codemonkeyx erk__ _3b` felipe pkhuong_ gonzojive cpt_nemo burton MrWGW johanbev hanneso kencausey amaron herbieB ojuice levene rsynnott Zhivago luis PissedNumlock qsun Pepe_ rotty tvaalen pok 23:30:55 -!- names: housel Adrinael joga 23:30:59 *Xach* hopes gigamonkey, who wrote the book, doesn't join the channel and upstage him 23:31:23 jajaja 23:31:28 Eno_: how do you configure slime in your emacs config file? 23:31:43 i use (slime-setup '(slime-fancy slime-editing-commands slime-c-p-c slime-autodoc)) 23:31:51 *Xach* can't remember now why he chose all those 23:32:02 http://pastebin.com/dhywMN2S 23:32:09 ah 23:32:18 ok 23:32:53 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:32:56 Eno_: I think slime-fancy might suffice to get you that feature. 23:33:33 *Eno_* forces himself to type "emacs .emacs" instead of "vim .emacs" 23:33:44 ikki [~ikki@189.247.80.84] has joined #lisp 23:34:14 Xach: slime-fancy includes all of these 23:35:03 Eno_: "you're doing wrong", you should be typing C-x C-f ~/.emacs 23:35:05 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 23:35:07 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109.93.193.85] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:35:32 :) 23:38:10 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:39:08 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 23:40:20 milanj [~milanj_@178.223.157.78] has joined #lisp 23:42:02 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:43:59 i tried "C-c C-q to invoke the command slime-close-parens-at-point"; no such keybinding, but i tried M-x slime-close-all-parens-in-sexp, and it worked, and it told me i could type C-c C-... is that control c, control -? it does not work 23:44:07 i guess this is emacs not lisp 23:44:18 mbohun [~mbohun@ppp115-156.static.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 23:44:32 M-x slime-close-parens-at-point did not auto-complete 23:45:12 thins have been changed in Slime since Practical Common Lisp publication 23:45:20 -!- Joreji [~thomas@86-129.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:46:19 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:47:19 Just wait until you try paredit. 23:48:07 i don't use paredit in the REPL, but i use regullarly C-RET there 23:48:41 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.80.84] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:49:48 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:50:06 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 23:52:46 ikki [~ikki@189.247.80.84] has joined #lisp 23:54:11 -!- TheLolrus [~Xarver@cpe-75-83-191-189.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host 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joined #lisp 00:12:12 awright, #quicklisp is re-opened for demo business 00:15:30 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:15:53 jhalogen [~jake@cpe-98-154-250-117.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:16:09 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 00:21:01 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-87-79-188-175.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:21:08 -!- lichtblau [~user@port-92-195-211-112.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:21:30 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-87-79-188-175.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:21:52 R3cur51v3 [~Recursive@209-20-84-78.slicehost.net] has joined #lisp 00:23:03 -!- Krystof [~csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:23:24 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483BAFC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:26:12 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 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joined #lisp 00:36:56 Krystof [~csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 00:37:16 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.80.84] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:38:13 tayloj [~tayloj@cpe-67-248-22-159.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:45:17 syamajal_ [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:46:29 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:47:00 -!- syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:47:40 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:47:52 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 00:49:38 SegFaultAX [~SegFaultA@c-98-234-1-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:50:16 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:51:40 sellout [~greg@81.253.57.202] has joined #lisp 00:52:13 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:53:55 anathemer [~androirc@117.97.76.154] has joined #lisp 00:55:28 -!- TraumaPwny is now known as TraumaPony 00:55:53 ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has joined #lisp 00:57:50 -!- syamajal_ [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:59:08 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 01:00:39 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:02:09 -!- pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:05:20 -!- super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:06:00 well, don't everyone rush at once. 01:10:05 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:10:25 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:11:00 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:11:08 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] 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[~Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has left #lisp 03:53:37 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:54:50 -!- bgs100 is now known as bgs000 03:56:38 -!- me345 [~me345@75.15.180.91] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:58:20 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:59:30 -!- Stattrav [~Stattrav@117.192.131.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:59:44 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 04:01:08 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:02:33 -!- super__ is now known as super_ 04:03:28 -!- super_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:03:50 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 04:07:23 ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has joined #lisp 04:11:07 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A4E4A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:11:58 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:13:01 sabalaba [~sabalaba@114.240.81.16] has joined #lisp 04:13:17 -!- jan247 [~jan247@unaffiliated/jan247] has quit [Quit: jan247] 04:14:45 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:14:48 -!- Fade [fade@outrider.deepsky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:14:51 Fade [fade@outrider.deepsky.com] has joined #lisp 04:15:14 ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has joined #lisp 04:16:55 Megz [Megz@76.91.53.83] has joined #lisp 04:17:20 -!- ASau [~user@83.69.227.32] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:18:52 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:19:12 I'm inclined to get rid of slime's C-M-x defvar re-evaluation magic 04:19:50 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:20:03 slime-edit-value, C-c E, is what should be used instead 04:20:38 hi 04:20:47 is there a project for Lisp similar to Love2d? 04:20:56 What's love2d? 04:21:00 http://love2d.org/ 04:21:15 minion: memo for stassats: give me a ping when you show up 04:21:15 Remembered. I'll tell stassats when he/she/it next speaks. 04:21:19 troels` [~user@0x5552ef45.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #lisp 04:21:26 it gives you graphics, sound, input, animations, image manipulation, a lot of good stuff 04:21:33 -!- troels [~user@0x5552ef45.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:21:41 packaged together with an API designed for easiest use 04:21:47 (for Lua) 04:22:02 -!- c|mell [~cmell@188-220-238-74.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:22:38 sometimes we have competitions to see who can make the best game in 100 minutes 04:22:52 dto has created quite some community efforts regarding using Lisp for games: http://lispgamesdev.blogspot.com/ 04:23:06 I think they also have a channel #lispgames or similiar here 04:23:19 I suggest to ask there :-) 04:29:19 -!- Megz [Megz@76.91.53.83] has left #lisp 04:30:41 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:33:03 arccsc [~arccsc@112.225.39.103] has joined #lisp 04:34:14 ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has joined #lisp 04:35:40 schmrkc [~marcus@c83-254-197-212.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 04:35:40 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@c83-254-197-212.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Changing host] 04:35:40 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 04:36:50 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:39:46 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:40:12 legumbre_ [~leo@r190-135-15-163.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 04:41:15 curi_ [~curi@c-67-180-28-250.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:41:42 -!- curi_ [~curi@c-67-180-28-250.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:41:43 -!- legumbre [~leo@r190-135-83-242.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:42:13 -!- legumbre_ is now known as legumbre 04:45:33 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@114.240.81.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:46:36 cmeow [cmeow@happy.happy.vhost.shellium.org] has joined #lisp 04:48:36 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:49:30 Shaftoe_ [~Moe111@bas1-montreal02-1096725148.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 04:49:37 Hello all 04:49:59 anybody here have experience using CLSQL in a highish load multithreaded application? 04:51:11 -!- bpalmer [~user@unaffiliated/bpalmer] has left #lisp 04:52:08 my connections seem to hang from time to time. Unfixable hangs. 04:52:13 ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has joined #lisp 04:52:27 abend [~alx@76.76.146.16] has joined #lisp 04:56:53 -!- huangho [~vitor@201-41-1-167.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:57:19 Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-101-39.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 04:57:43 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.139.97.228] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:57:45 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:58:35 zophy [~sy@host-242-6-111-24-static.midco.net] has joined #lisp 04:59:49 sabalaba [~sabalaba@66.220.12.133] has joined #lisp 05:00:19 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:09:55 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:11:07 -!- Toekutr [~toekutr@adsl-69-107-101-39.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: REALITY IS TEARING ITSELF ASUNDER, BUT I MUST RACE] 05:11:54 -!- asarch [~asarch@189.188.139.182] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:12:00 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:17:22 interferon [~interfero@pool-96-224-44-147.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:17:33 -!- interferon [~interfero@pool-96-224-44-147.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has left #lisp 05:17:46 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:17:48 -!- seidos [~kevin@cpe-76-168-0-89.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:18:58 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@95-27-133-126.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [] 05:19:43 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 05:21:11 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:22:14 -!- jhalogen [~jake@cpe-98-154-250-117.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: jhalogen] 05:26:13 loomer [~loomer@unaffiliated/loomer] has joined #lisp 05:29:23 -!- loomer [~loomer@unaffiliated/loomer] has left #lisp 05:30:33 seidos [~kevin@cpe-76-168-0-89.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:31:03 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@66.220.12.133] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:32:10 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 05:33:48 Good morning! 05:34:09 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:35:49 hadronzoo [~user@24.40.129.231] has joined #lisp 05:35:53 -!- hadronzoo [~user@24.40.129.231] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:36:49 asarch [~asarch@189.188.139.182] has joined #lisp 05:36:57 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:37:04 huangho [~vitor@201-41-30-31.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #lisp 05:37:51 -!- ionine_ [~ionine@ool-18b8992c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:38:21 -!- troels` [~user@0x5552ef45.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:38:24 troels`` [~user@0x5552ef45.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #lisp 05:39:25 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:39:45 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:41:53 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:45:40 -!- aja [~aja@unaffiliated/aja] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:46:12 morning beach 05:46:19 -!- asarch [~asarch@189.188.139.182] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:46:28 Modius [~Modius@cpe-24-28-30-165.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:47:21 hey slyrus, what's up? 05:47:50 hate to admit it... been hacking on an epigraph-like library in clojure the last week or so :) 05:48:04 Did you enjoy it? 05:48:09 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 05:49:34 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:49:34 it's still an ongoing process. some things about it I liked and it's good to rewire your brain every now and then. 05:50:03 Definitely! 05:50:34 -!- huangho [~vitor@201-41-30-31.paemt700.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:53:07 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:53:33 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.64.200.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:54:04 cmm [~cmm@bzq-109-64-200-182.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 05:54:27 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:59:01 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 06:00:14 ionine_ [~ionine@ool-18b8992c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 06:01:20 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 06:02:22 -!- Shaftoe_ [~Moe111@bas1-montreal02-1096725148.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: Shaftoe_] 06:02:35 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:03:28 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 06:05:20 -!- arccsc [~arccsc@112.225.39.103] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:08:26 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 06:09:50 hello lispers 06:10:12 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:10:38 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 06:10:48 why my emacs/slime autocomplete now whows completions in uppercase ? 06:14:05 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:14:34 -!- ionine_ [~ionine@ool-18b8992c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 06:15:55 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:23:14 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:24:42 schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 06:26:08 lexa_ [~lexa_@seonet.ru] has joined #lisp 06:26:28 -!- lexa_ is now known as Guest10965 06:30:20 -!- schmrkc [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:30:59 mrSpec 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[~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:58:41 quick and dirty? 10:58:41 stassats, memo from tcr: give me a ping when you show up 10:58:52 tcr: i showed up! 10:58:57 rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has joined #lisp 11:00:33 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:10:18 minion memo-tag 11:14:17 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:17:09 lichtblau: do you have the dwim.hu darcs? 11:17:44 -!- Guest10965 [~lexa_@seonet.ru] has left #lisp 11:18:01 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:18:08 -!- Stattrav [~Stattrav@2403:0:500:1:218:deff:fe54:bd88] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:18:33 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@91.78.230.193] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:21:08 -!- xan_ [~xan@5351F837.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:21:35 levente_meszaros [~levente_m@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 11:22:17 anyone knows a genetic programming library? 11:22:55 hi, levente_meszaros. will dwim.hu/darcs/ come back some day? 11:23:23 stassats: I'l be back in ~half an hour 11:23:34 Xach, yes, next week 11:24:10 prima_lux [~user@95.158.0.252] has joined #lisp 11:24:52 -!- SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.122.48] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:26:45 levente_meszaros: ok. i was hoping to use it for a demo on monday :( 11:27:15 Xach, what part exactly? 11:27:24 the darcs part 11:27:31 i'd like to fetch the archives. 11:27:47 hmm, that should be easy 11:27:47 are they available somewhere else? 11:27:51 to fix 11:27:56 no 11:28:05 if only it was a distributed VCS :) 11:29:07 hmm, I can't even login via ssh, this must be some networking problem 11:29:13 -!- rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:29:16 levente_meszaros: you could momentarily upload them to c-l.net 11:29:40 -!- Davse_Ba1se [~davse@82.103.143.161] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 11:30:13 rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-150.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has joined #lisp 11:30:23 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp85-140-117-112.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 11:30:38 Sikander [~soemraws@5356ECA7.cable.casema.nl] has joined #lisp 11:30:41 lvillani [~lvillani@fedora/lvillani] has joined #lisp 11:30:41 Xach, which repos do you need? 11:30:58 levente_meszaros: I was hoping to get all of them. 11:31:18 the network problem won't be fixed till Monday, dwim.hu is a virtual server run by our former employer 11:31:26 Is there something like an unwind-protect, but that only runs when exiting with an error? 11:31:45 Joreji [~thomas@86-129.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 11:31:49 so I don't have real world access to it :( 11:31:52 kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 11:32:00 Sikander: you could arrange something like that with handler-bind 11:32:07 salva [~salva@105.11.117.91.dynamic.mundo-r.com] has joined #lisp 11:32:10 levente_meszaros: sorry to hear that. thanks for looking into it. 11:34:09 Xach: thanks, I'll have a look. 11:35:49 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:38:52 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:40:30 -!- lichtblau [~user@port-92-195-121-212.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:41:07 I'm using cffi and have a defcstruct, but how would I go about creating an instance of that struct in lisp? I only see an example using with-foreign-object. 11:41:24 But I want the instance to live longer. 11:41:58 How long do you want it to live? 11:42:36 Well, I want to be able to create the object and pass it around to other functions. Similar to doing a make-foo etc. 11:43:34 use foreign-alloc? 11:44:16 Is there a way to foreign-free automatically (ie using the gc)? 11:44:24 Guthur [~michael@host86-148-29-214.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 11:47:37 Sikander: I'm still a little curious about why with-foreign-object wouldn't be suitable. are you experimenting in the repl? 11:47:59 stis_ [~stis@1-1-1-39a.veo.vs.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 11:48:19 Xach: wouldn't all functions on the object have to be run within the with-foreign-object then? 11:48:29 leviathan [~quassel@c-82-192-226-27.customer.ggaweb.ch] has joined #lisp 11:48:40 hi 11:48:56 does someone have a clou why this error could occur? 11:49:04 root@htcdream ~ # /usr/lib/maxima/5.21.1/binary-clisp/lisp.run 11:49:05 /usr/lib/maxima/5.21.1/binary-clisp/lisp.run: line 5: syntax error: unexpected ")" 11:50:25 leviathan: You would have to lisppaste the lisp.run file. 11:51:08 hmm, ok 11:51:24 how to I lisspaste 11:51:25 Xach: So I have a program where this object should be available for a large part of the time. That would mean that the whole program would basically be inside the with-foreign-object environment, right? 11:51:26 ? 11:51:43 Sikander: yes. is that a problem? 11:52:03 leviathan: http://paste.lisp/org/new/lisp 11:52:11 -!- lvillani [~lvillani@fedora/lvillani] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:52:39 Xach: Hmmm... But basically, I don't know before hand when the object should be created, so to speak. It depends on whether the user will need it. 11:54:03 That doesn't seem very elegant 11:54:18 To put the whole thing inside the enviroment, I mean 11:55:01 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:56:45 I guess I could just make a make-foo function which uses foreign-alloc and sets up the thing, and a destroy-foo which cleans it up with a foreign-free 11:56:46 Well, there are a lot of strategies you might use. You could, for example, have a (with-foreign-object-autoallocator ...) around your program, and have that allocator create things on demand and clean up any that happened to be created when its scope exits. 11:56:54 beach: how can I post a binary? 11:57:46 Xach: What is this with-foreign-object-autoallocator you speak of? Are there docs/example code somewhere? 11:58:06 leviathan: What would we do with that? 11:58:28 beach: you told me to post /usr/lib/maxima/5.21.1/binary-clisp/lisp.run 11:58:28 Sikander: I don't think so. Something you'd write. 11:58:37 leviathan: lisp.run is surely not a binary is it? 11:58:42 Xach: Oh, right :) 11:58:48 beach: its a binary 11:59:05 /usr/lib/maxima/5.21.1/binary-clisp/lisp.run: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.6.9, not stripped 11:59:19 Xach: Ok, thanks for the ideas. I'll figure something out 11:59:29 leviathan: Well, you can't post that, because nobody would run it anyway. 11:59:47 oh 11:59:53 I fould out why... >_< 11:59:55 leviathan: And it was generated on the platform indicated? 12:00:11 I'm try'n to run it on ARM7 12:00:13 ok, found it 12:00:13 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:00:16 sry 12:00:21 leviathan: That's why. 12:01:38 you wouldn't have that problem on a lispos. arm7 lispos can run x86-64 binaries and vice versa. 12:05:58 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 12:07:49 If anyone else would like to try out a simple demo of quicklisp, #quicklisp is still where the party is. 12:08:07 (if you saw the old demo, it's not much different from the user's point of view) 12:08:07 woots lisp 4 12:08:36 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Xach 12:08:44 -!- Xach has set mode +b *!*hp@*.slkc.qwest.net 12:08:50 -!- Patero-ng [~xach@cpe-72-227-90-1.maine.res.rr.com] has been kicked from #lisp by Xach (Not again.) 12:09:43 -!- Xach has set mode -o Xach 12:14:24 lichtblau [~user@port-92-195-121-212.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 12:15:39 Xach: lost a bit of scrollback there; did you find what you were looking for? 12:15:51 lvillani [~lvillani@fedora/lvillani] has joined #lisp 12:16:04 our dwim fork is at http://www.knowledgetools.de/tmp/temporaer/tomas/ 12:16:10 -!- sergio_ [~serj@89-181-0-62.net.novis.pt] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:16:45 thanks, i can use that 12:18:10 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:18:38 xan_ [~xan@5351F837.cable.casema.nl] has joined #lisp 12:20:07 announcing a new cool slime feature: slime-export-structure, which exports constructors, predicates, accessors etc. and adds them to :export of defpackage 12:20:18 it's a bit slow now, but i'll fix that later today 12:20:27 alley_cat [~AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat] has joined #lisp 12:20:29 and works only on SBCL 12:21:11 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:21:48 stassats, sounds good 12:22:06 actually is there such functionality for arbitrary functions 12:22:39 sort of export-at-cursor 12:23:24 sure, for a long time, C-c x 12:24:21 nice, I really should read through the bindings more carefully 12:25:39 stassats: I had the idea to make C-c E, slime-edit-value, work in the inspector on arbitrary ispecs. I think that's how the inspector should behave although I guess it's quite a stretch to get there from how it looks like now 12:26:22 i was thinking about making inline editing, like in customize 12:26:32 How long is "long time", I don't seem to have C-c x 12:26:51 Guthur: you need slime-package-fu contrib, which is included in slime-fancy 12:27:05 Also I think the defvar-reevaluation-magic part of C-M-x should be removed; C-c e is the thing people should use 12:27:25 tcr: i'd be very unhappy 12:27:37 Making C-c E support inline editing, or the inspector? 12:27:42 because i use this all the time 12:27:44 tcr: inspector 12:27:53 at least for slots 12:28:01 Me, too. I wouldn't do that; that was more what should have been done 12:28:20 I'd rather go and try to generalize C-c E 12:28:28 The commit buffer scheme is kind of neat 12:28:49 especially if you can (can you?) evaluate stuff in the commit buffer 12:29:00 you can evaluate implictly via C-u C-x C-e 12:29:14 *Xach* nearly burns his lap compiling ironclad 12:31:24 Compiling on your laptop might make you impotent ;-) 12:31:29 aren't your laps ironclad? 12:32:19 Is there a way to check what contribs has been loaded with slime 12:32:27 has/have 12:32:59 C-h v slime-setup-contribs 12:33:00 M-: slime-setup-contribs 12:33:39 cheers 12:37:12 -!- NNshag [user@lns-bzn-23-82-248-86-52.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:37:54 Jabberwockey [~Jens@port-9328.pppoe.wtnet.de] has joined #lisp 12:38:35 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:39:52 kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 12:41:25 -!- lichtblau [~user@port-92-195-121-212.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:42:35 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:43:03 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:45:41 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 12:49:55 -!- xan_ [~xan@5351F837.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:50:44 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:55:39 -!- Jabberwockey [~Jens@port-9328.pppoe.wtnet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:56:31 tayloj [~tayloj@cpe-67-248-22-159.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:00:09 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:01:06 -!- wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-34-102-157.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:02:13 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:02:30 NNshag [user@lns-bzn-44-82-249-218-89.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 13:03:14 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:04:22 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:04:30 -!- homie [~user@xdsl-78-34-102-157.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:07:48 -!- Tanami [~rlynow@150.101.97.171] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:10:13 No other takers? 13:10:33 *Xach* made some changes inspired by nyef's comments 13:11:05 manuel_ [~manuel@p54B8DE8D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:11:52 *Xach* wanders off to start the day 13:12:53 gna i get circular loading with asdf, and i don't understand why. i load my asdf normally, it register on the first, and then i get a bunch of loading system definition from /home/mnl/asds/minus.asd into # 13:12:57 -!- kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:14:05 http://paste.lisp.org/+2F0M 13:14:29 it's mildly annoying 13:15:21 manuel_: touch the .asd files 13:17:45 thx 13:17:54 god, that was irritating 13:19:03 what ASDF version is that ? 13:19:22 is there a place I can get the definitions of standard clisp functions? 13:19:26 2.111 13:19:27 -!- ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:20:25 I'm going through "a gentle introduction to symbolic programming with common lisp" and my implementation doesn't seem to treat cons and list the same way as what the author is using 13:21:16 Davse_Bamse [~davse@82.103.143.161] has joined #lisp 13:21:19 Revolve: clisp is an implementation, Common Lisp is the language 13:21:26 Revolve: paste the code 13:21:43 clhs cons 13:21:43 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_cons.htm 13:21:48 Revolve: there 13:22:06 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:22:10 Jabberwockey [~Jens@port-9328.pppoe.wtnet.de] has joined #lisp 13:22:15 Revolve: Be specific about some surprising behaviour .. 13:22:15 I'm pn that. thankyou stassats :) 13:22:32 [1]> (list (in one ear and) (out the other)) 13:22:32 *** - EVAL: undefined function IN 13:22:39 on* 13:22:59 well, isn't that message clear? 13:23:05 yeah pretty much 13:23:08 Revolve: (in one ear and) is a compound form, and the first thing is expected to be the name of a function or a macro. 13:23:35 I'll check the function definition out on the site specbot linked 13:23:39 Revolve: I doubt that "A Gentle Introduction" suggests that it might. 13:23:46 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 13:24:12 er, that it might work. 13:24:13 beach: it just implies lists builds lists out of list items or other lists 13:24:21 list builds* 13:24:40 -!- tayloj [~tayloj@cpe-67-248-22-159.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:24:59 Revolve: Can you point to a single example from that book where (list ( ...) ...) is claimed to work? 13:25:11 -!- udzinari [~user@209.158.broadband13.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:25:14 Revolve: Do you understand how quoting works? 13:25:32 tayloj [~tayloj@cpe-67-248-22-159.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:25:44 Revolve: A cons block in CL is essentially an association between two things. 13:25:53 Zhivago: should I quote the first entry to denote it as an item and not a function? 13:26:04 when using the list function 13:26:16 Revolve: A list is a chain built by associating each element with the remainder of the list. 13:26:27 beach: nowhere. it's implied that it's how it's work but doesn't explicitly state it 13:26:29 Try (list '(in one ear and) '(out the other)) 13:26:37 kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 13:26:50 problem: http://paste.lisp.org/display/112775 13:27:07 thankyou Zhivago 13:27:35 :O it works! 13:27:58 zard1989: eq compares identity. When you call subseq, you create a new object that is not eq to previous ones. Try using equal instead of eq. 13:28:05 would I be troubling you too much if I asked why prepending a single quote works, Zhivago? 13:28:21 zard1989: It might work for lists though. 13:28:30 Revolve: 'x is (quote x). (quote x) evaluates to x. 13:28:37 awesome 13:29:01 Revolve: I'm sure that your book explained this. You may want to consider a remedial reading course. 13:29:21 beach: but subseq seems to be setf-able, and this really confuses me 13:29:40 zard: That's 'places' for you. 13:29:59 it probably definitely explains this in later chapters, but it starts out heavily using imagery to convey function definitions, with almost no explanation of what's already defined 13:30:10 -!- tayloj [~tayloj@cpe-67-248-22-159.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:30:12 zard: subseq and (setf subseq) are associated only by name and intention. 13:31:13 so far, the book has only mentioned the existence of cons and list, with a simple overview of what they do. it starts out with explaining how to build new functions, but without providing any example code. 13:31:26 zard1989: The spec says "if sequence is a vector, the result is a fresh simple array of rank one ...", and since a string is a vector subseq returns a fresh string, thus not eq to any other. 13:31:33 I skipped ahead to make sure there would be example code, and there's lots, but.. this is a really gentle introduction so far :P 13:31:35 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C99A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:32:50 zard1989: In fact, it wouldn't work for a list either because it also says "subseq always allocates a new sequence for a result; it never shares storage with an old sequence". 13:32:50 beach: but in setf, subseq doesn't return a fresh copy 13:32:56 zard1989: How could you have missed that? 13:33:06 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:33:17 zard1989: But you are not using it with setf are you? 13:34:01 zard1989: using setf with subseq doesn't call the subseq function. 13:34:38 zard1989: just like a[i] = 5 in C doesn't access the existing ith element of the vector a. 13:35:02 beach: quite wierd to a newbie like me :p 13:35:21 zard1989: You have the wrong idea of what setf is doing. 13:36:10 beach: ok i guess i should read the book thoroughly, thanks :) 13:36:20 zard: Imagine you have two functions -- get-subseq and set-subseq. 13:36:28 zard1989: When you say (setf (subseq ...) ...) it is just a shorthand for invoking totally different code that does something that seems reasonable. The only purpose that serves is to avoid having separate functions such as (set-subseq ...). 13:36:47 zard: What CL does is to call get-subseq subseq, and then to call set-subseq (setf (subseq ...) value) 13:37:10 zard: That way you only have one name to remember. 13:38:42 i nearly get the idea :D 13:38:54 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-96-250-215-244.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:56 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:40:20 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 13:40:22 when using setf, subseq behaves like the left hand side of = 13:40:50 when assigning to others, subseq returns a fresh copy of the sequence 13:40:53 right? 13:40:57 Pretty much. 13:41:18 Think of places as CL's answer to pointers. 13:41:34 Except with wonkier semantics. 13:41:45 Sorry. I mean 'more flexible' semantics. 13:42:51 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:42:59 tayloj [~tayloj@clip-point-02.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has joined #lisp 13:43:53 wbooze [~user@xdsl-87-79-85-158.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:43:59 homie [~user@xdsl-87-79-85-158.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:45:24 Zhivago: :p 13:45:33 -!- _danb_ [~user@124-168-186-140.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:45:51 -!- Sikander [~soemraws@5356ECA7.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:45:59 -!- Euthydemus [~euthydemu@vaxjo7.165.cust.blixtvik.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:46:30 Well, imagine a pointer that can do your laundry for you. 13:47:52 Euthydemus [~euthydemu@vaxjo7.165.cust.blixtvik.net] has joined #lisp 13:48:27 tanami [~markovic@150.101.97.171] has joined #lisp 13:49:09 -!- tanami is now known as Tanami 13:49:12 madrik` [~user@122.168.177.251] has joined #lisp 13:54:44 -!- 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quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:12:43 -!- bgs000 is now known as bgs100 14:13:27 kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 14:16:25 madrik [~user@122.168.177.251] has joined #lisp 14:19:35 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:21:08 syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:21:45 Athas [~athas@82.211.209.226] has joined #lisp 14:23:47 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:28:55 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 14:30:57 kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 14:32:39 c|mell [~cmell@snezana-fe0.wmx.mediaworksit.net] has joined #lisp 14:33:12 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-109-64-200-182.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:34:12 -!- kejsaren [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:35:02 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@p54B8DE8D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 14:36:09 -!- kejsaren_ [~kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:36:40 cmm [~cmm@109.64.200.182] has joined #lisp 14:41:35 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 14:41:41 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:44:21 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:45:16 manic12 [~andrew@99-100-67-123.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:49:41 *Xach* looks around for testers 14:51:38 -!- madrik [~user@122.168.177.251] has left #lisp 14:52:57 xyxxyyy [~xyxu@114.93.128.117] has joined #lisp 14:54:59 Xach: here I am 14:59:24 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483C99A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:01:20 Aferlak12 [~Aferlak12@64.120.233.114] has joined #lisp 15:01:24 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:04:38 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:05:24 -!- nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:06:25 good morning 15:13:07 -!- syamajala [~syamajala@c-75-68-111-84.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:14:10 Yuuhi [benni@p5483C99A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:14:55 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:15:48 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:39 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:21:55 xinming_ [~hyy@122.238.73.13] has joined #lisp 15:23:15 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:24:50 -!- xinming [~hyy@218.73.128.40] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:24:50 dreish [~dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 15:26:12 -!- stassats 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15:50:59 -!- c|mell [~cmell@snezana-fe0.wmx.mediaworksit.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:51:47 ak70 [~ak70@80.77.204.157] has joined #lisp 15:52:09 -!- Joreji [~thomas@86-129.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:52:38 Joreji [~thomas@86-129.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 15:54:07 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 15:56:30 Shaftoe_ [~Moe111@bas1-montreal02-1096725148.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:57:07 hi all. 15:57:23 can anyone point me in the right direction for a high'ish performance counter on sbcl 15:57:42 something that get more than just the second resolution of get-universal-time 15:58:01 milliseconds would be sufficient. 15:58:12 sb-ext:get-time-of-day 15:58:28 I thank you sir. 15:58:32 -!- tsuru` [~user@c-174-50-217-160.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:41 nitor [~nitor@cpe-66-25-205-147.sw.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:07:26 -!- nus [~nus@unaffiliated/nus] has 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srcerer z0d yahooooo Khisanth cods hohum delYsid eldragon Holcxjo Patzy spiaggia Ralith joshe vsync ramus Salamander bougyman mal__ qebab rread tic jpanest reb djm tltstc gzip4 johs dejones eli nuba kuwabara Intensity Obfuscate ineiros kloeri ASau`` fmu fda314925 andreer jrockway inklesspen Tabmow joast aoh frodef Deltafire Ginei_Morioka easyE rlpowell zbigniew mqt ski l_a_m _3b djinni`` erg hc_e franki- 06:33:20 -!- names: clog turbo24prg galdor Aisling mtd p_l nullman tychoish golgotha Axioplase_ yacin codemonkeyx erk__ _3b` felipe pkhuong_ gonzojive cpt_nemo joga Adrinael housel burton MrWGW johanbev hanneso kencausey amaron herbieB ojuice levene rsynnott Zhivago luis PissedNumlock qsun Pepe_ rotty tvaalen pok 06:33:52 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@a91-153-126-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:34:25 manuel_ [~manuel_@p54B8F776.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 06:34:40 ace4016 [~jmarcelin@adsl-10-197-65.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 06:35:18 how hard would it be to port sbcl to plan 9? 06:35:42 Tanami: is there a lisp implementaion on plan 9? 06:36:02 well there is ArrowLisp 06:36:06 but it's pretty lacking 06:39:10 I don't know of any other implementations 06:41:35 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:41:39 how would you debug a segfault in a lib that uses a ffi ? http://paste.lisp.org/display/112817 06:41:51 good morning 06:41:56 in C I'd run gdb, but here, I don't know what to do 06:41:59 mvilleneuve: hi 06:42:24 lhz [~shrekz@c-dba672d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 06:42:35 -!- SegFaultAX [~SegFaultA@c-98-234-1-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:42:54 Tanami: you might be able to compile sbcl using that i guess.. I honsetly not know if there is a C version og sbcl 06:43:29 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:43:46 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 06:44:59 ephcon [~ephcon@c-24-34-195-64.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:45:15 -!- ephcon [~ephcon@c-24-34-195-64.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 06:45:25 ok, I get the segfault with sdl:fill-surface-* and not with sdl:fill-surface, so that's yet another bug 06:46:15 Davse_Bamse: well are there any c-based lisp interpreters that would be easy to port? 06:47:52 -!- timor [~timor@port-92-195-141-141.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:48:03 Soulman1 [~knute@44.84-49-150.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 06:49:18 -!- stepnem [~stepnem@88.103.132.186] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 06:49:33 clisp, probably. ECL maybe. 06:50:18 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:50:33 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 06:51:37 stepnem [~stepnem@88.103.132.186] has joined #lisp 06:52:17 Tanami: Zhivago just answered your question :-) and I know that you can build sbcl using clisp and properly using ecl 06:52:35 ok 06:52:36 cool 06:55:13 -!- fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:57:46 sellout [~greg@gar31-3-82-234-48-135.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 06:58:59 TraumaPony [~TraumaPon@124-171-193-166.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 07:02:37 vtz [~user@client-73-37-12.speedy-net.bg] has joined #lisp 07:04:07 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:04:21 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:04:36 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:06:30 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 07:08:14 SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.160.41.129] has joined #lisp 07:13:45 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:14:16 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:17:50 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:18:30 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:19:57 i almost finished my portfolio website with hunchentoot + bknr, still got a few utf8 issues to sort out 07:20:03 http://bl0rg.net:9898/ 07:20:19 slow because it's tunnelled from my local dev machine for now 07:22:31 -!- BrianRice [~water@c-71-59-208-140.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:23:05 asarch [~asarch@189.188.157.129] has joined #lisp 07:28:23 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:28:45 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:29:03 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:32:06 -!- symbole [~symbole@ool-182ffe8f.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:33:43 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:33:59 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:34:14 MetalDust [~metaldust@75-32-203-61.lightspeed.ftwotx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 07:35:48 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-tyusrhjisdobwsay] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:38:30 nibiru [nibiru@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-lxggzzmreourfgnw] has joined #lisp 07:38:35 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:39:54 pdelgallego [~pdelgalle@1503031474.dhcp.dbnet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:40:37 manuel_: that's a pretty excellent portfolio site 07:40:41 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:40:49 antifuchs: glad you like it, spent a lot of time on it 07:40:53 *derrida* nods 07:41:00 on the illustrations i mean, the html and lisp were pretty straightforward 07:41:20 the illustrations are great. did you draw them all yourself? 07:41:25 yeah 07:41:31 awesome (: 07:41:55 it's "easy". i starting drawing in march or so, and learnt from tutorials on youtube and the web 07:42:21 nowhere near what i want to aachieve though :) 07:42:30 haha, you'll get there (: 07:43:14 -!- seidos [~kevin@cpe-76-168-0-89.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:44:08 let's say I'd buy t-shirts with your stuff on them (: 07:44:28 i'm designing one for spreadshirt right now 07:44:30 lemme show you 07:44:31 yay! 07:44:59 ah, no good quality scan available 07:45:07 i'll do a lisp one if you want 07:45:14 yes! 07:47:12 i'll tell you when it's ready :) 07:48:11 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:48:43 zophy [~sy@host-242-6-111-24-static.midco.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:03 mega1 [~quassel@catv4E5CABA2.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #lisp 07:49:11 awesome, thanks! (: 07:49:51 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:50:03 btw, I'll be in berlin august 9-13 to meet up with hans & marijn. seeing as you're close by, maybe we can meet up? (: 07:50:13 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:50:28 maybe, i'm there until the 7. 07:50:34 i've got quite a lot of work sadly in august 07:50:47 -!- asarch [~asarch@189.188.157.129] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:51:07 too bad, maybe next time then (: 07:51:23 yep, maybe i can drop by for an evening though in that time 07:51:52 that'd be excellent. we'll probably be busy with allegrograph stuff during the day anyway (: 07:51:59 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 07:52:29 alright; time to hit the office, be back in 15min (: 07:53:41 HG` [~HG@xdsl-92-252-118-55.dip.osnanet.de] has joined #lisp 07:53:43 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c122-106-121-61.rivrw6.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 07:53:57 dlowe [~dlowe@c122-106-121-61.rivrw6.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 07:53:57 same here 07:53:59 cu peepz 07:54:13 -!- Axioplase_ [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:54:20 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@p54B8F776.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 07:54:48 anybody done converting from CVS to Git on common-lisp.net? Is the procedure "mail the administrators"? 07:55:42 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c122-106-121-61.rivrw6.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Client Quit] 07:55:57 dlowe [~dlowe@c122-106-121-61.rivrw6.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 07:56:56 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl6-96-251.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 07:58:26 bozhidar [~user@212.50.14.187] has joined #lisp 08:00:53 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:01:10 -!- housel [~user@217.115.14.5] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:01:41 housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has joined #lisp 08:03:13 fiveop [~fiveop@erft-4d07f330.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:08:00 ephcon [~ephcon@c-24-34-195-64.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:08:29 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 08:12:34 -!- delYsid [~user@chello084115136207.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:13:31 hlavaty [~user@77-22-102-45-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:17:30 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-ausrkhivfzmwbtjv] has joined #lisp 08:24:14 -!- silenius [~silenius@c-24-130-172-194.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:31:39 zomgbie [~jesus@chello212186106204.11.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 08:31:42 beach: I suspect sanjoyd encountered Graham's articles... 08:34:40 p_l: Could be. 08:34:52 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 08:35:18 -!- Fare [~Fare@c-24-218-127-11.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:36:06 Kolyan [~nartamono@95-27-154-56.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 08:40:17 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 08:42:20 HET2 [~diman@85.234.89.69] has joined #lisp 08:43:12 p_l: graham's articles? 08:46:16 nibiru: graham mentions in some places that he doesn't use CLOS and that he doesn't see a purpose for it etc. 08:48:21 -!- HET2 [~diman@85.234.89.69] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 08:48:22 -!- ionine_ [~ionine@ool-18b8992c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 08:50:56 link? 08:51:21 paulgraham.com 08:51:44 I can sympathize with pg's position there. 08:52:52 Zhivago: hello there :) 08:52:53 CLOS has its flaws, and the MOP is an interesting way to bootstrap generic functions, but neither are essential. 08:53:19 You can take the lessons of the MOP and CLOS and apply them in different ways to different things. 08:55:02 I think that the most interesting idea there was that classes are descriptive rather than prescriptive. 08:58:51 Zhivago: the thing is, Graham doesn't give the arguments you just used, he just condemns usage of CLOS and similar object oriented libraries (leaving just simple closure-based objects, I guess) 08:59:02 BrianRice [~water@c-98-246-165-205.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:59:42 Well, that gets back to OOP as message passing, which is an argument I can accept. 09:00:18 These days I think that objects should essentially be processes. 09:00:45 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 09:02:16 (which would really break the CLOS model) 09:02:57 Although I guess it could work within one of these 'objects'. 09:03:53 Axioplase [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 09:04:32 Zhivago: an Erlang-style system on top of threads with CLOS being used for "classic" objects? 09:05:51 Yeah, essentially. 09:07:46 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082D9F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:09:27 -!- daniel_ [~daniel@p5082F307.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:09:47 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 09:09:51 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:12:18 delYsid [~user@chello084115136207.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 09:14:26 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:14:29 -!- nibiru [nibiru@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-lxggzzmreourfgnw] has quit [Changing host] 09:14:29 nibiru [nibiru@unaffiliated/nibiru] has joined #lisp 09:14:29 -!- nibiru [nibiru@unaffiliated/nibiru] has quit [Changing host] 09:14:29 nibiru [nibiru@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-lxggzzmreourfgnw] has joined #lisp 09:15:23 -!- fe[nl]ix [~lacedaemo@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:16:48 -!- mbohun [~mbohun@202.124.73.184] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:17:54 fe[nl]ix [~lacedaemo@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has joined #lisp 09:17:56 -!- az [~az@2a01:4f8:101:4a2::9c00] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:23:53 Athas [~athas@82.211.209.226] has joined #lisp 09:24:35 troels [~user@0x5731e96e.naenxx10.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 09:29:43 -!- nibiru is now known as nibiru_ 09:29:48 -!- nibiru_ is now known as nibiru 09:30:57 levente_meszaros [~levente_m@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 09:32:44 what's the best way to draw some online figures (such as a line chart) while an algorithm is running in the REPL? 09:33:08 1 fps refresh rate would be enough 09:33:27 I think about using the web server 09:33:31 By "online figures" what do you mean? 09:33:39 In that case why not use the google chart api? 09:33:39 hydo [~cmoore@c-24-16-168-68.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:33:56 the data is changing while the algorithm is running 09:34:33 In that case why not use the google chart api? 09:35:08 you could get away with html5 canvas + javascript 09:35:17 Zhivago, for that I would still need a web server, right? 09:36:01 Didn't you just say that you wanted to use a web server? 09:36:20 Jabberwockey [~Jens@port-1163.pppoe.wtnet.de] has joined #lisp 09:36:35 oh, ok 09:36:53 -!- huangjs [~user@watchdog.msi.co.jp] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 09:37:23 levente_meszaros: What I often do in cases like that is that I fire up the CLIM listener, run the algorithm there, and use the CLIM drawing primitives in a different window. 09:37:54 beach, hmm, that also sounds reasonable 09:38:46 but I would simply use SLIME and a CLIM app to display the chart 09:39:20 levente_meszaros: The think is that the CLIM event loop must be running. 09:39:25 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-109-64-200-182.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:39:52 cmm [~cmm@109.64.200.182] has joined #lisp 09:40:17 I don't mind starting a new thread 09:40:40 nibiru_ [~nibiru@unaffiliated/nibiru] has joined #lisp 09:41:26 levente_meszaros: So you need a CLIM application, and the generic CLIM application is the listener. Otherwise, you'll have to write your own, or try figuring out how applications create panes, etc. 09:41:44 if you want dynamic chart that changes with new data from algorithm, then you need to start playing with Comet :) 09:41:46 levente_meszaros: flot is a very, very nice canvas line charting library 09:41:51 Zik [~lambert@85.69.145.12] has joined #lisp 09:42:01 levente_meszaros: I'm using it for boinkmarks, and am very happy with it 09:42:50 when you're just polling once per second from js you don't need comet 09:42:59 Nah, a 1 second refresh is ok. 09:43:20 <_3b`> don't even need a server if you only want to look at it locally, just reload a file:// url 09:43:31 I'd recommend protovis myself. 09:43:39 flot is pretty, but a bit limited. 09:44:17 _3b, wins... how about a static html file with an embedded image reloaded every sec? 09:44:27 automatically 09:44:49 levente_meszaros: you can use MJPEG-over-HTTPas well 09:45:22 -!- Zik [~lambert@85.69.145.12] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:46:17 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@95-27-154-56.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:46:18 using google chart API and the static html/js idea I only need to write a file every sec 09:46:40 and the browser is going to reload it automatically 09:46:41 Kolyan [~nartamono@95-24-241-78.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 09:46:46 thanks for all the suggestions 09:46:56 levente_meszaros: with MJPEG you don't need any JS, you just use a normal IMG tag 09:47:34 I don't want to write a chart drawing lib :) 09:47:50 I only have the numbers 09:47:52 nha [~prefect@250-194.105-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 09:47:58 and serve the url in that tag as multipart response, with each frame encoded as JPEG file and send as single part 09:48:13 -!- mqt [m@lambda.nirv.net] has quit [Quit: .] 09:48:13 Zhivago: for line graphs, flot is pretty great (you can even do error bars with a little trickery) 09:48:21 Zhivago: but protovis looks very nice 09:48:52 (thing i like most about flot is that you can easily generate json in cl that you can feed directly into flot) 09:49:07 Levenson [~Levenson@91.185.12.110] has joined #lisp 09:59:00 xan_ [~xan@5351F837.cable.casema.nl] has joined #lisp 10:02:08 -!- potatishandlarn [potatishan@c-b21e68b3-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:03:25 Guthur [~michael@host86-148-29-214.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 10:06:43 p_l: thanks, a clear winner for me. Never consider it, stopped at mpeg. 10:10:02 -!- jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:10:44 jmcphers [~jmcphers@218.185.108.156] has joined #lisp 10:13:24 ogamita [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:15:23 maetbag [~user@95-29-1-161.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 10:19:26 mbohun [~mbohun@ppp115-156.static.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:29 jmbr [~jmbr@bpcmat07.mat.ucm.es] has joined #lisp 10:21:29 yy [~simey@unaffiliated/simey00irc] has joined #lisp 10:25:52 -!- yy [~simey@unaffiliated/simey00irc] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 10:28:14 blandest` [~user@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 10:31:37 fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:32:15 -!- Axioplase is now known as Axioplase_ 10:32:43 -!- Sumpen [~Sumpen@81-232-77-93-no46.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Planned down time ^^] 10:35:33 ogamita` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:37:18 -!- ogamita [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:39:59 -!- cmsimon [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has quit [Quit: 'bye.] 10:40:28 cmsimon [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has joined #lisp 10:41:16 -!- fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:41:24 -!- Athas [~athas@82.211.209.226] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:43:04 -!- xyxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.58.144] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:43:59 -!- xan_ [~xan@5351F837.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:44:11 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@bpcmat07.mat.ucm.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:46:09 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl6-96-251.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 10:46:44 -!- jan247 [~jan247@unaffiliated/jan247] has quit [Quit: jan247] 10:48:12 -!- zeroish [~zeroish@135.207.174.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:50:46 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 10:53:39 *Xach* looks around for the Lisp excitement! 10:54:20 Guest45299 [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has joined #lisp 10:54:57 weeEEEeeEE 10:55:11 Excellent! 10:55:23 -!- Guest45299 [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has quit [Quit: .] 10:55:25 Xach: Is that noisy? 10:55:53 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:56:01 mqt` [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has joined #lisp 10:56:15 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 10:57:08 -!- mqt` [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has quit [Client Quit] 10:57:09 -!- ogamita` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:57:31 mqt` [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has joined #lisp 10:58:57 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@95-24-241-78.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [] 10:59:07 ogamita` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:59:58 -!- krl [~krl@port-87-193-235-133.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:00:08 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:02:41 -!- troels [~user@0x5731e96e.naenxx10.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:03:33 A little. 11:03:45 -!- mqt` [~m@lambda.nirv.net] has quit [Quit: .] 11:03:52 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@84.76.48.250] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:04:01 mqt` [m@lambda.nirv.net] has joined #lisp 11:04:15 Spewns [~jake@97-92-222-240.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 11:04:21 zc00gii [~zc00gii@thefacepalm.net] has joined #lisp 11:04:52 why, when I use (make-pathname and the type is included in :name, it goes to a structured format? 11:05:26 zc00gii: it's always a structured format. 11:05:33 sabalaba [~sabalaba@119.57.31.105] has joined #lisp 11:05:43 zc00gii: it prints oddly if normal printing would break print/read consistency. 11:05:43 -!- mqt` is now known as mqt 11:05:55 Xach: no, usually it returns #P"/path/to/whatever" 11:06:04 zc00gii: that is structured. 11:06:11 zc00gii: the type isn't included in the name...the name has an odd arrangement. 11:06:27 zc00gii: try (describe #p"/path/to/whatever/") 11:06:54 Xach: http://gist.github.com/490429 11:07:40 don't ask me why I chose .bat, I've been using linux for 4 years :P 11:08:26 zc00gii: the :type should be "bat", not ".bat" 11:08:33 oic 11:08:52 thanks :D 11:11:11 zc00gii: do you get that it's always structured? 11:11:58 -!- nibiru_ [~nibiru@unaffiliated/nibiru] has quit [Quit: nibiru_ has no reason] 11:15:48 Xach: yeah 11:15:50 ogamita`` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:17:48 -!- ogamita` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:18:38 xyxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.58.144] has joined #lisp 11:22:57 Yuuhi [benni@p5483DA32.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:23:42 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 11:25:56 boyscare1 [~bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:26:31 -!- boyscared [~bm3719@c-68-32-124-6.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:26:40 -!- boyscare1 is now known as boyscared 11:27:42 -!- cmsimon [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:27:48 -!- ephcon [~ephcon@c-24-34-195-64.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:29:17 ephcon [~ephcon@c-24-34-195-64.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:30:49 Kolyan [~nartamono@95-26-61-229.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 11:30:52 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 11:31:59 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:32:23 HET2 [~diman@i-195-137-95-246.freedom2surf.net] has joined #lisp 11:34:15 cmsimon [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/cmsimon] has joined #lisp 11:37:43 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-128-224.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:39:59 beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-128-224.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:40:13 Rearden [~John@209-217-211-155.northland.net] has joined #lisp 11:41:03 Guthur_ [~michael@host86-148-29-214.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 11:44:19 -!- Guthur [~michael@host86-148-29-214.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:44:22 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-223-208.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:46:01 -!- Kolyan [~nartamono@95-26-61-229.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [] 11:51:50 tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 11:55:56 xan_ [~xan@145.52.241.98] has joined #lisp 11:57:46 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has joined #lisp 11:59:45 -!- HET2 [~diman@i-195-137-95-246.freedom2surf.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 12:05:12 -!- xyxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.58.144] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:06:58 -!- tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:10:30 nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-75-53.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 12:10:34 -!- kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-11-58.w86-213.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:11:54 fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 12:16:03 tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:17:40 -!- ogamita`` [~t@60.Red-80-34-44.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:17:48 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:22:00 timor [~timor@port-92-195-141-141.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 12:22:22 hmm 12:26:12 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-kgkucrfiymhyqvcq] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:27:25 -!- SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.160.41.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:28:41 barcon332 [~barcon332@208.89.210.254] has joined #lisp 12:34:22 -!- tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:35:17 schme [~marcus@sxemacs/devel/schme] has joined #lisp 12:35:26 -!- schme is now known as schmrkc 12:36:07 tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:36:29 -!- marcus_ [~marcus@c83-254-197-212.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:37:14 -!- NNshag [user@lns-bzn-27-82-248-22-25.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:37:22 asarch [~asarch@187.132.140.196] has joined #lisp 12:37:39 Jasko [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 12:40:20 -!- metasyntax [~taylor@12.132.219.7] has quit [Quit: Be seeing you.] 12:45:05 is there a deep equals for CLOS objects? (eg that inspects all slots) 12:45:24 No. 12:45:32 Ok, thanks. 12:45:48 needing some of it if I want to use incremental-redisplay 12:46:18 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-wxjfupjpxirlqhzx] has joined #lisp 12:46:59 -!- tayloj [~tayloj@rrcs-72-43-211-117.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:48:55 -!- mbohun [~mbohun@ppp115-156.static.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:49:16 OliverUv: are you working on display/GUI stuff? 12:49:44 NNshag [user@lns-bzn-52-82-65-66-128.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 12:49:51 yeah 12:50:48 writing a GUI for a lab at my university 12:50:52 passive thing or are you interested in Lisp GUI research (I will flood you with questions if the later) 12:51:51 alright then, would you happen to know anything about ECLOS and the work done in Europe on Lisp GUIs (soon after they published a paper in a reflection book they disbanded and formed Eulisp and the research was never seen) 12:52:04 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-226-81-194.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:52:16 sorry, I'm not very aware of the work being dome on lisp gui thins 12:52:47 I am looking at "Advances in object-oriented metalevel architectures and reflectionBy Chris Zimmermann" 12:53:28 http://books.google.com/books?id=pvoefFn_lToC&dq=%22Advances+in+object-oriented+metalevel+architectures+and+reflection%22&printsec=frontcover&source=bn&hl=en&ei=BIVNTKGFBIP58AaP7YEz&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CCAQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=false 12:53:50 I am not sure if that URL contains session/location specific stuff, but read it if it works for you 12:54:04 fusss: do talk to beach, though, he implemented a lot of McClim and is currently drafting a Clim3 specification 12:54:18 woah 12:54:51 i know beach, but forgot his GUI work; will bug him 12:55:17 I needed papers on ECLOS and BOCAL, but can't find any 12:55:28 (no ACM membership here) 12:55:41 brb 12:55:55 i would be interested in lisp gui research if I thought I could ever use it again 12:56:26 sadly I think this is my only opportunity, except for hobby projects, to do some lisp-gui programming 12:58:08 -!- PuffTheMagic [~PuffTheMa@unaffiliated/puffthemagic] has left #lisp 12:58:46 lexa_ [~lexa_@seonet.ru] has joined #lisp 12:59:08 fusss: There is a lot of interesting research on interaction design. But I am not doing any myself. 12:59:14 -!- lexa_ is now known as Guest51798 13:00:20 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:00:28 fusss: The works of Jef Raskin and Alan Cooper come to mind. 13:00:33 oh beach, the McClim bugs site says "(setf frame-current-layout) does not work 13:00:35 setf-frame-current-layout-broken -- Paolo Amoroso, 28 Dec 2004" 13:00:38 -!- Guest51798 [~lexa_@seonet.ru] has left #lisp 13:00:50 OliverUv: That's correct, it still doesn't work. 13:00:58 confirm/deny? How would you suggest switching between panes instead? 13:01:03 ugh 13:01:47 Well, you can always do it manually by having a single top-level pane and change its children when you want to change layouts. 13:01:48 I guess I could just use one pane and have its drawing function draw different things based on global state 13:02:02 Yes, that's another possibility. 13:02:33 if I do have a single top level pane, how would I go about laying out its child-panes? 13:02:51 the only info I've seen on pane-placement is with layouts in a definition of an application frame 13:03:22 OliverUv: You can put a layout pane as the only child of the top-level pane and get whatever layout you like. 13:03:46 oh, I had either missed or forgotten layout panes 13:03:58 I'm reading through Clim2 user guide 13:04:20 From Franz? 13:04:34 damn mastodon document, first 100 pages were almost only about the drawing functions - talk about nati-pedagogical bottom-up approach 13:04:49 -!- xan_ [~xan@145.52.241.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:04:55 yeah rom Franz 13:05:10 The user guides are not very complete compared to the spec, but the spec is, well, a spec. 13:05:22 christ 13:05:40 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:06:35 I don't have time to read through a spec like this :/ 13:06:37 The CLIM spec is like the CLHS in that it is mainly meant for implementers and not end users. Granted, that distinction is not sharp when it comes to CLIM. 13:07:10 think I can do a decent job implementing a simple calendar application following the user guide? 13:07:44 OliverUv: I don't know. I have never tried. What kind of calendar application are you trying to write? 13:07:48 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-ausrkhivfzmwbtjv] has left #lisp 13:08:08 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:08:45 pretty simple one, much like Google Calendar but with only viewing functionality 13:09:09 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 13:09:31 a year-view in which each day is a coloured cell, a month-view which looks like an agenda, a day-view which looks like the normal days in google calendar 13:10:05 I've written a spec and stuff but it's in Swedish 13:10:15 OliverUv: Just use a top-level pane. Draw the layouts, and use presentations for clickable stuff. 13:10:31 ok 13:10:36 how about nested presenters? 13:11:11 My CLOS-objects are year, which has a list of month objects, which have a list of day objects, which have a list of meeting objects 13:11:13 relcomp [~chatzilla@83adc395.funky.Uni-Osnabrueck.DE] has joined #lisp 13:11:38 in the year-view, I'd like to say "the year presenter will show these 12 month-presenters in a table" 13:11:54 the month presenter should just be "show these X day presenters in a table" 13:12:20 and the day presenters should do some calculation depending on their meetings, and just specify a colour for that cell 13:12:37 haphazardhouse [~haphazard@pool-71-174-129-171.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:12:41 -!- haphazardhouse [~haphazard@pool-71-174-129-171.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:12:48 lvillani [~lvillani@fedora/lvillani] has joined #lisp 13:12:51 Problem might be: I want a click to go to the month, not the specific day 13:12:59 OliverUv: Mine looks like this: http://dept-info.labri.fr/~strandh/calendar.png 13:13:15 OliverUv: Nested presentations should work. 13:13:58 hargettp [~anonymous@pool-71-174-129-171.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:14:00 that is good 13:14:03 OliverUv: Don't confuse actions on model objects and the way they are laid out graphically. 13:14:18 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c122-106-121-61.rivrw6.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 13:14:21 although there isn't much info on how to do nested presenters in the user guide 13:14:42 OliverUv: What is a presenter? 13:14:55 oh, a presentation 13:15:07 g'morning 13:15:10 OliverUv: What would you like for the interaction on such a thing to be? 13:15:15 hello Spewns 13:15:47 howsit going? 13:15:58 OliverUv: If I were you, I would have a separate presentation at the same level to stand for the larger unit. 13:16:19 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 13:16:55 OliverUv: So for instance in my screenshot above, I could imagine clicking on the rectangle containing the date and the day name in order to select a day, and on the Week NN text to select a week. 13:17:03 Spewns: Fine, how about yourself? 13:17:16 i'm well :) 13:17:39 tayloj [~tayloj@clip-point-02.dynamic2.rpi.edu] has joined #lisp 13:17:55 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:19:15 OliverUv: You should be able to get nested presentations by simply using one with-output-as-presentation inside another. 13:19:24 beach: basically, in the year-view, a click on any of the days of a month (or the title of the month) should change to a pane that represents only that month 13:19:35 nice 13:20:23 OliverUv: That description in no way implies the use of nested presentations. 13:20:56 -!- bgs000 is now known as bgs100 13:21:36 beach: I guess I don't strictly need that for that context 13:21:54 OliverUv: I use view objets to do what you suggest. Then I make the display function trampoline to a different one that takes the view of the pane as argument as well. Different methods on the second function specialize on different subclasses of view. 13:22:01 I guess I never really do because I can manually iterate down the CLOS-object hierarchy building interface for each thing myself 13:22:33 OliverUv: That's usually what I do, in the display function. 13:22:46 OliverUv: Then I just use incremental redisplay to avoid flickering. 13:23:10 Or you can use the McCLIM extension :double-buffering t on your pane. 13:23:13 xan_ [~xan@145.52.241.98] has joined #lisp 13:23:46 -!- relcomp [~chatzilla@83adc395.funky.Uni-Osnabrueck.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:23:49 Can't use any McCLIM specific things, I'm migrating this to Allegro's clim later 13:24:06 rvirding [~rvirding@gamestudio.smart-lab.se] has joined #lisp 13:24:19 bobbysmith007 [~russ@216.155.97.1] has joined #lisp 13:24:30 Incremental redisplay it is then. 13:25:16 For your information, the application that generated that screenshot is 500 lines of code, including the GUI. 13:25:36 yeah, I don't expect my program to be big :D 13:25:37 But then, I have only one view. 13:25:40 which is probably my saving grace 13:25:54 it is getting my head wrapped around clim that is the challenge in this project 13:26:21 OliverUv: It's a good investment in my opinion. Now I can whip up a simple GUI in a matter of minutes. 13:26:25 For incremental redisplay I think I'll need that deep CLOS object equal function, so I can tell it if the object we are drawing is new or not 13:27:01 OliverUv: No, you won't, but you will need application-specific tests for equality. 13:27:04 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 13:27:36 well, I was just intending to write year-equals 13:27:46 which would just call 12 month-equals 13:27:54 which would call an apropriate number of day-equals 13:27:55 etc 13:28:10 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:28:15 OliverUv: Sometimes it is possible to use eq as a test, and just replace the object if some substructure has been modified. 13:28:52 I don't think eq will work, sadly 13:29:03 rvirding_ [~chatzilla@gamestudio.smart-lab.se] has joined #lisp 13:29:08 Why not? 13:29:15 problem is: I can't really put in any hooks in the legacy app because it needs to remain clean for the students who are learning from it 13:29:25 (they are implementing maybe a fifth of the calendar functionality themselves) 13:29:53 the idea is that they can have the GUI and the normal REPL interactions going at the same time 13:30:19 and that changes done in REPL will show up on GUI, mostly for debugging, feedback and understanding purposes 13:30:40 to get those changes then, I think I'll have to pull data periodically 13:30:41 -!- Rearden [~John@209-217-211-155.northland.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:31:06 That is certainly one way of doing it. 13:31:19 when I pull data I just iterate over the old data (which uses its own home-built type system that the students are using to understand the concept of types) 13:31:26 and create CLOS objects from it 13:31:36 -!- rvirding [~rvirding@gamestudio.smart-lab.se] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716]] 13:31:40 so any eq operation will probably give me false 13:31:46 -!- rvirding_ [~chatzilla@gamestudio.smart-lab.se] has quit [Client Quit] 13:32:06 You could also have :after methods on generic functions that implement the model protocols, and have those :after methods send some event to the GUI that will then go pick up the modified data. 13:32:10 when/how to pull the old data is still an unsolved problem 13:32:32 the legacy code is all defuns and defvars 13:32:35 no generic functions 13:32:52 or can I have :after methods for those in some way? 13:33:00 Nope. 13:33:06 well damn 13:33:54 OliverUv: But this is Lisp. You can change the fdefinition of the model symbols, and put a wrapper on it, much the say tracing and such works. 13:34:09 abeaumont [~abeaumont@84.76.48.250] has joined #lisp 13:34:24 s/say/way/ 13:34:45 Bronsa [~bronsa@host148-185-dynamic.0-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 13:35:12 -!- maetbag [~user@95-29-1-161.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:35:45 that went over my head 13:36:34 rvirding [~rvirding@gamestudio.smart-lab.se] has joined #lisp 13:36:40 i think i understand, actually 13:37:24 basically I rebind the relevant model function symbols to my own functions, which first call the old ones and then report to my app that it needs to update its view? 13:37:35 -!- Guthur_ is now known as Guthur 13:38:25 Yeah, (let ((fun (fdefiniton 'bla))) (setf (fdefinition 'bla) (lambda (x) (prog1 (funcall fun x) (format t "hello"))))) or something like that. 13:38:32 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:38:47 sssweeeet 13:39:13 OliverUv: You can do it better by using &rest parmeters and apply. 13:39:13 What is an apropriate way to tell the app to redraw? 13:39:34 OliverUv: The best way is to make sure it receives an event on its event queue. 13:39:55 OliverUv: That way, it will be synchronized with user interactions. 13:40:10 aha ok 13:41:25 looking through the spec quickly it seems the window-repaint-event might be what I want 13:42:59 OliverUv: Possibly, but then you would have to make sure such events actually access the model, which is not usually the case. Instead, repaints are done from the output records. 13:43:16 -!- xan_ [~xan@145.52.241.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:43:24 hold on 13:43:46 I'm gonna scroll up and jot down some notes, if you don't mind 13:44:03 minion: tell OliverUv about logs 13:44:03 OliverUv: look at logs: #lisp logs are available at http://ccl.clozure.com/irc-logs/lisp/ (since 2008-09) and http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/lisp/ (since 2000) 13:45:14 OliverUv: I just wget -N http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/lisp/10.07.{0,1,2,3}{0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9} or something to that effect. Then I have all the logs available locally for grepping. 13:45:43 Rearden [~John@209-217-211-155.northland.net] has joined #lisp 13:45:44 plediii [~plediii@nat-168-7-232-38.rice.edu] has joined #lisp 13:45:55 When I log in I then do emacs $(ls -tr | tail -1) 13:46:04 [to see recent discussions] 13:47:27 jhalogen [~jake@cpe-98-154-250-117.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:47:42 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-wxjfupjpxirlqhzx] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:50:18 SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.122.48] has joined #lisp 13:51:04 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@119.57.31.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:54:58 beach: yesterday i think you asked me how learning Lisp was going, but i was away 13:55:49 Spewns: Sounds plausible. So how is it going? 13:56:10 it's going well, if not slowly, since i'm not only learning CL, but emacs, slime... you know, all that. :) and hunting for good resources 13:56:55 Yeah, it can be a bit daunting in the beginning. 13:58:12 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-miasjhbdwexwssxw] has joined #lisp 13:58:56 relcomp [~chatzilla@pc92-e03-3.igf.Uni-Osnabrueck.DE] has joined #lisp 13:59:37 going through things like Practical Common Lisp should be useful 14:00:27 and On Lisp 14:00:52 PCL is good 14:01:22 xinming_ [~hyy@122.238.77.0] has joined #lisp 14:02:15 -!- SandGorgon [~OmNomNomO@122.162.122.48] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:02:32 good to know. i'm going to start going through it today or tomorrow 14:03:45 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:03:51 PCL is good if you already know how to program in some other language. 14:03:58 On Lisp is not for beginners. 14:04:18 Spewns, I found this very helpful: http://www.cs.gmu.edu/~sean/lisp/LispTutorial.html 14:04:30 beach, what is the best book for a totally new programmer? 14:04:31 -!- xinming [~hyy@115.221.6.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:04:52 i have been recommending pcl... 14:04:53 oops. 14:05:12 oconnore: meaning little programming knowledge at all? "Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation" 14:05:13 minion: gentle 14:05:13 gentle: "Common Lisp: A Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation" is a smoother introduction to lisp programming. http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/LispBook/ 14:05:32 ah, cool. 14:08:15 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-128-224.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:11:15 lat: thanks 14:11:38 beach [~user@ABordeaux-158-1-128-224.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 14:12:03 xyxxyyy [~xyxu@116.227.249.41] has joined #lisp 14:12:08 Spewns, u r welcome. 14:13:54 oconnore: I don't know which one is the best for beginners. 14:14:53 *OliverUv* is back 14:15:10 Got a phone call from an accountant I got acquainted with at a buddhist centre 14:15:21 beach: p_l recommended http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/LispBook/ 14:15:56 I am also logging these conversations myself, but wanted to go over what we'd discussed so far to see if there were any/many uncertainties 14:15:57 homie [~user@xdsl-78-34-194-248.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:15:58 wbooze [~user@xdsl-78-34-194-248.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:16:00 i'm not sure if you saw, since you signed off shortly afterwards. 14:16:13 I saw it in the logs, thanks. 14:16:27 I am ambivalent wrt to that book, but many people like it. 14:17:46 -!- xyxxyyy [~xyxu@116.227.249.41] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:17:57 -!- stepnem [~stepnem@88.103.132.186] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:18:48 beach: same here.. I started programming Lisp with Graham's ANSI Common Lisp.. and as long as that's not the only book you read (and are aware of Graham Crackers), should be ok.. I think it's also good for absolute beginners, but obviously don't have first-hand experience 14:18:55 I got it in dead tree version, it's quite good and explains list-related manipulation very well (including "it's not necessarily a list" stuff like creating trees out of conses etc.) 14:19:30 adeht: I learned from Graham as well. 14:19:59 beach: ah! nowadays we use haraldsson's own book, Programmering i Lisp 14:20:48 manic12 [~andrew@99-100-67-123.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:21:00 -!- HG` [~HG@xdsl-92-252-118-55.dip.osnanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:21:09 stepnem [~stepnem@88.103.132.186] has joined #lisp 14:21:19 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-52-182.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 14:21:20 oconnore: I too enjoyed it for the visualizations of list structures etc coming from two basic C++ courses... but I would also highly recommend working through PCL at the same time 14:21:32 OliverUv: I don't think I would use a book in Swedish. French is bad enough. 14:21:39 haha 14:22:31 one of the lab assistants is crazy about swedifying all terms 14:22:48 But I admit it makes it possible for some students to read the book that would not have opened it if it were in English. 14:22:51 tsuru, thanks. I will be sure to recommend it. 14:22:53 but it isn't that bad, he is very good at it and gives the english terms aswell 14:22:55 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@4d6f5d3b.adsl.enternet.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:23:28 (hvis (sant-p det) (gjøre det)) (yes, half-assed norsk) 14:23:40 OliverUv: I am in favor of translating, especially when it comes to French, because English words don't sound so good in French. 14:23:55 adeht: Not bad! 14:24:23 *mstevens* had ther dullest french lesson ever saturday 14:24:28 beach: If you don't mind, I'd like to ask some more questions now that I have a guru at hand 14:24:36 beach: cool.. been a year since I read Beginner's Norwegian 14:25:30 -!- zophy [~sy@host-242-6-111-24-static.midco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:25:45 OliverUv: Sure, go right ahead. 14:26:13 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 14:27:00 When you said repaints are done through output records, did you mean calling (queue-repaint sheet repaint-event) 14:27:03 ? 14:27:20 Oh, and as a sheet I just put my panel, I presume? 14:28:19 wait, there's a standard-repaint-mixin aswell 14:28:55 OliverUv: That is already done for you when you use certain sheets. For an application pane, I believe that when the repaint event is handled, it calls the paint function on the output records. 14:29:12 OliverUv: You don't want to mess with how standard panes handle repaint events. 14:29:35 ah ok 14:29:40 OliverUv: Repaint events are generated as part of exposure of a window after it has been hidden. 14:29:52 -!- sebi` [~nil@unaffiliated/stuhlbein] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:30:56 OliverUv: The best thing (but I am not sure how to do that) would be to define a new kind of event subclass of one of the event classes, make sure it gets queued in the application event queue, then handled by the application. 14:31:25 hm 14:31:28 -!- lvillani [~lvillani@fedora/lvillani] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:31:47 urandom_ [~user@p548A5284.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:31:47 -!- fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:31:57 there is no standard way of saying "redraw pane" then, I presume 14:32:40 fusss [~chatzilla@ip70-187-235-200.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:32:41 OliverUv: Sure there is. It is redisplay-frame-pane as I recall. 14:33:16 OliverUv: That's when your application display function gets called, and it should go through the model objects and display them. 14:33:27 OliverUv: But that's not the problem here. 14:34:16 ah, ok, the problem being then that we don't want this to happen just at any time 14:34:38 OliverUv: Right, you want it to be done by the application thread. 14:34:40 we want it to happen as part of the event queue handling? 14:34:45 Yes. 14:34:45 mm ok 14:36:15 -!- Davse_Bamse [~davse@82.103.143.161] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:37:51 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-75-55-213-29.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:02 beach: did you take that screenshot with clim-gtkairo? 14:39:10 and morning folks 14:39:19 Hello slyrus! 14:39:43 slyrus: The calendar? No just CLX backend. But perhaps I am using mcclim-truetype. 14:39:54 ah, yeah, must be mcclim-truetype. 14:42:03 prima_lux [~user@95.158.0.252] has joined #lisp 14:44:39 beach: alright, I'm going to start implementing the year-view now, will research and take care of how to throw custom events when I get to a point where I have something to redraw 14:44:55 Your help has been tremendously helpful! Big thanks! 14:45:23 OliverUv: No problem. 14:49:42 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 14:50:28 -!- blandest` [~user@85.204.33.242] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)]