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2015-02-17T00:03:43Z drmeister: Nope, I haven't run a single cleavir-clasp function yet - soon though.
2015-02-17T00:06:08Z drmeister: It's a little slow getting everything in place.  There's a lot of threads I need to keep track of to make the changes that I'm making.
2015-02-17T00:07:49Z drmeister: I'm even contemplating writing another scraping script.  Ugh
2015-02-17T00:08:19Z drmeister hates scraping scripts
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2015-02-17T00:10:30Z drmeister: I have a bunch of low-level extern "C" functions and I'm having trouble keeping their function prototypes consistent with the representation of the prototype in my Common Lisp code.  It's the closest thing to a foreign function interface I have.
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2015-02-17T00:21:10Z akkad: apis ftw
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2015-02-17T00:40:54Z jrm: For the code below, when I set *hostname* inside the function fmt-hostname-modeline and describe-variable, it's a list, but when I copy the code to set the variable outside the function and then describe-variable, a simple-string.  Why is that?
2015-02-17T00:40:55Z jrm: http://ftfl.ca/paste/swm-hostname-modeline.lisp.html
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2015-02-17T00:50:26Z jrm: Ignore my last message.  I think I need to reload the module from where I'm calling it.
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2015-02-17T01:34:44Z nyef: ... The Mezzano GUI doesn't track non-rectangular regions? Wha?
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2015-02-17T01:57:18Z froggey: nyef: nope. it ran well enough with the single dirty rectangle that I didn't bother implementing anything more advanced
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2015-02-17T02:04:08Z nyef: I guess that makes sense.
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2015-02-17T02:25:10Z nyef: froggey: Here's a bit of a crazy thought: Can Mezzano build itself yet?
2015-02-17T02:26:26Z froggey: no, but it's close. it should be able to compile all the files, but the cold-generator is kind of tied into the cross-compiler
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2015-02-17T02:59:02Z drmeister: froggey: What's a cold-generator?
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2015-02-17T03:01:44Z froggey: it takes a bunch of compiled files (built by the cross-compiler that runs under SBCL) and links them together, producing a bootable disk image
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2015-02-17T03:10:40Z drmeister: I see.
2015-02-17T03:10:52Z jnewb: which lisp book is best for bringing you up to speed with macro use?
2015-02-17T03:11:17Z pillton: Macro use?
2015-02-17T03:12:12Z jnewb: using macros. i.e. help me develop a habit of using them to their full potential
2015-02-17T03:12:25Z drmeister: "Let over Lambda"
2015-02-17T03:12:32Z pillton: Oh I see.
2015-02-17T03:13:00Z jnewb: drmeister: thanks
2015-02-17T03:13:34Z drmeister: By Doug Hoyte
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2015-02-17T03:14:07Z pillton: I think the first thing you need is a problem where there exists a lot of redundancy in terms of code.
2015-02-17T03:15:08Z pillton: If you think about it, macros are just a way of introducing syntax.
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2015-02-17T03:22:23Z froggey: drmeister: sorry, that was kind of a vague answer. it sets up the various allocation areas, and loads functions/constants/symbols/etc from compiled files into them like the runtime LOAD function would, it sets up a few low-level things (trampolines for dealing with closures, interrupt handlers, etc) and it produces a big list of all the top-level forms that were loaded from the compiled files and need to be run when the system starts
2015-02-17T03:22:45Z pillton: jnewb: I haven't read Let over Lambda. I learnt a lot from Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence and the Art of the Meta Object Protocol.
2015-02-17T03:23:02Z froggey: it does more than that, but I can't remember anything else off the top of my head
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2015-02-17T03:50:55Z theos: jnewb On Lisp and Let Over Lambda
2015-02-17T03:51:49Z theos: and/then
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2015-02-17T04:19:17Z beach: Good morning everyone!
2015-02-17T04:20:36Z nyef: Hello beach.
2015-02-17T04:21:21Z nyef: drmeister: Mezzano's cold-generator is more or less the same idea as SBCL's genesis.
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2015-02-17T04:25:15Z beach: And what is that idea?  Can it be explained in a sentence or two?
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2015-02-17T04:26:35Z drmeister: Yeah - I'm googling "genesis" and all I get is some story about two people and a snake.
2015-02-17T04:26:52Z nyef: "Take a bunch of cross-compiled FASLs and turn them into something resembling a lisp VM image."
2015-02-17T04:27:09Z beach: nyef: Thanks!
2015-02-17T04:27:31Z beach: drmeister: Oh?  I thought it was a rock group from the 1970s.
2015-02-17T04:28:09Z nyef: ... Hunh. Thought they were '80s.
2015-02-17T04:28:18Z beach: Maybe so.
2015-02-17T04:32:06Z drmeister: beach: I'm still working towards running the cleavir-clasp code
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2015-02-17T04:32:54Z drmeister: I had to do a bunch of busy work to rearrange code and change the types of a whole bunch of variables in my argument processing code.
2015-02-17T04:32:55Z beach: drmeister: Good!  What aspect of it are you working on now?
2015-02-17T04:33:05Z beach: I see.
2015-02-17T04:33:15Z drmeister: I'm working on JITting the cleavir-clasp code.
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2015-02-17T04:35:00Z beach: So how do you like "stealth mixins"? :)
2015-02-17T04:35:11Z drmeister: I haven't had a chance to try them yet.
2015-02-17T04:35:36Z beach: They are amusing enough that we got a paper at a conference in Australia.
2015-02-17T04:35:43Z drmeister: I've spent every moment today messing with getting code rearranged to JIT the cleavir-clasp code.
2015-02-17T04:35:52Z drmeister: How do these papers at conferences work?
2015-02-17T04:35:52Z beach: That also exposed that venue to Lisp.
2015-02-17T04:35:59Z drmeister: I've only submitted papers to journals.
2015-02-17T04:36:11Z beach: drmeister: In CS, we mostly use conferences.
2015-02-17T04:36:16Z drmeister: You submit a paper to a conference and they publish the proceeds?
2015-02-17T04:36:19Z beach: The turnaround time is much faster.
2015-02-17T04:36:41Z beach: drmeister: It depends on the conference.
2015-02-17T04:36:54Z beach: Typically there is some agreement with ACM or some other orgainization.
2015-02-17T04:36:59Z beach: organization
2015-02-17T04:37:04Z beach: to publish the proceedings.
2015-02-17T04:37:22Z drmeister: But it seems like you can only talk about a paper once?  For the next conference you talk about something else?
2015-02-17T04:37:40Z drmeister: I'm sure I have a misconception.
2015-02-17T04:37:48Z beach: You can only submit it to one conference, yes.  Why?
2015-02-17T04:38:57Z drmeister: We publish papers in journals and then give talks about them at multiple conferences.
2015-02-17T04:39:28Z beach: drmeister: The ACM has battled for a long time to get CS conference papers accepted as "publications" when it comes to the career of people.
2015-02-17T04:39:48Z beach: drmeister: The battle is now won.
2015-02-17T04:40:17Z drmeister: Did many die?
2015-02-17T04:40:30Z beach: I doubt it.
2015-02-17T04:40:35Z drmeister: Good.
2015-02-17T04:40:51Z beach: drmeister: Consider it a journal paper that you get one opportunity to present.
2015-02-17T04:42:14Z drmeister: Finally - Clasp CL source code is compiling again.
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2015-02-17T04:44:13Z drmeister: I'm very glad that LLVM-IR SSA code is strongly typed.   One advantage of strongly typed languages is that you can change the type of one variable and then just keep running the compiler and let the compiler keep complaining about incompatible types as you work your way through a chain of other variables who's types need to be changed.
2015-02-17T04:44:58Z drmeister is a lazy programmer
2015-02-17T04:45:20Z beach: drmeister: Wrong terminology.  Common Lisp is strongly typed, but it is dynamically typed.  Most languages are weakly typed (like C) but statically typed.
2015-02-17T04:45:43Z beach: drmeister: "Strongly typed" means you can't interpret an object of one type as an object of a different type.
2015-02-17T04:46:10Z drmeister: Oh yeah, statically typed.   Getting the terminology wrong kinda undermines my screed.
2015-02-17T04:46:10Z beach: "Statically typed" means that the compiler must know (or infer) the types before the program can be executed.
2015-02-17T04:46:27Z Bike: funcall 'apply, funcall #'apply
2015-02-17T04:46:29Z drmeister: Brain know what it means, fingers have other ideas.
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2015-02-17T04:47:49Z beach: drmeister: Maybe this is not the case in Chemistry, but in computing, there is a "war of terminology".  Most people don't even see it, but it is important because people fall victim to it.
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2015-02-17T04:48:18Z beach: drmeister: Nobody wants to be "weak", so "strong" sounds better.
2015-02-17T04:48:30Z beach: drmeister: Nobody wants to be "static", so "dynamic" sounds better.
2015-02-17T04:49:00Z beach: drmeister: Consider also "hygienic macros".  Implicitly, then Common Lisp macros are "dirty".  etc, etc, etc.
2015-02-17T04:49:40Z Bike: lol, everyone knows chemistry terminology is immutable and unique and not confusing
2015-02-17T04:50:26Z beach hasn't studied chemistry since high school, so doesn't have a clue.
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2015-02-17T04:51:03Z Bike: well, it's not like chemistry, but there's definitely some silly arguments about whether to call something para- or 4-, or whatever
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2015-02-17T04:51:40Z drmeister: Bike: that's why we draw everything - organic chemistry is best expressed as a graphical language
2015-02-17T04:51:42Z beach: Bike: I don't see any good/bad connotation there.
2015-02-17T04:52:09Z Bike: 's why it's different.
2015-02-17T04:52:19Z beach: Got it.
2015-02-17T04:52:25Z Bike: i suppose you get good/bad names, but that's mostly for when you want to come up with a trade name for 7-bifumerolase
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2015-02-17T04:55:25Z drmeister: beach: A suggestion was made to me today in the LLVM developers mailing list on how to get LLVM JITted code to be garbage collected.
2015-02-17T04:55:58Z beach: drmeister: Does their suggestion seem workable?
2015-02-17T04:56:09Z drmeister: It's pretty hairy though.  Basically LLVM can generate JITted code and then relocate it once.
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2015-02-17T04:56:54Z beach: drmeister: Excuse my ignorance, but why can't you just put the code in a vector?
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2015-02-17T04:57:02Z beach: You can even do that in C.
2015-02-17T04:57:02Z drmeister: So they suggested caching the original JITted code and whenever the GC wants to move code you relocate the cached code to where the GC wants to put it.
2015-02-17T04:57:28Z beach: Oh, LLVM is not PIC, right?
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2015-02-17T04:59:33Z drmeister: It has PIC but apparently it's not truly position-independent.  I guess nobody wants to be "non-relocatable" code either.
2015-02-17T05:00:24Z drmeister: Yeah, their PIC code isn't freely relocatable - I don't know why, just that it isn't.
2015-02-17T05:00:35Z beach: That's really surprising.  A lot of things, like dynamically-linked libraries, depend on the code being PIC.
2015-02-17T05:01:34Z drmeister: From the sounds of it they can relocate it once and then that's where it stays.
2015-02-17T05:01:42Z drmeister: I don't appreciate the details.
2015-02-17T05:02:56Z clintm: drmeister: What os/ver do you use to work on clasp?  I tried last night to get it building on debian wheezy and got the yak about 1/2 shaved before I gave up and deleted the vm.
2015-02-17T05:05:58Z drmeister: clintm: OS X 10.9.5 and Linux (various versions) - hang on.
2015-02-17T05:06:06Z drmeister: Debian Wheezy you say.
2015-02-17T05:06:09Z clintm: yea
2015-02-17T05:07:31Z drmeister: Debian Wheezy is a bit old.   The one person who got it to work is faheem (you can find him on Freenode #clasp)   - he put a lot of time into getting it to work.  You should be able to get it running with little trouble on Jessie or Sid.
2015-02-17T05:07:45Z drmeister: Clasp is bleeding edge software
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2015-02-17T05:08:42Z clintm: Yea, I wasn't surprised that it didn't want to build easily given wheezy's age.  I'll try it on jesse.  In fact, I'll try it now.
2015-02-17T05:10:22Z drmeister: Join us on Freenode #clasp - you can get help there.
2015-02-17T05:10:47Z drmeister: beach: Did you still want to move our voluminous discussions to another IRC channel?   #cleavir-on-clasp or #clasp?
2015-02-17T05:10:56Z clintm: drmeister: I will.  Thanks!
2015-02-17T05:11:10Z Bike: they seem lispy enough.
2015-02-17T05:11:33Z beach: drmeister: No.
2015-02-17T05:11:50Z beach: drmeister: I just wanted to make sure we don't bore the socks off most #lisp participants.
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2015-02-17T05:13:14Z beach: Bike: What does?
2015-02-17T05:13:38Z Bike: your discussions.
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2015-02-17T05:14:55Z Kolt: howdy, how do you guys compile your CL source code in GNU/Linux?
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2015-02-17T05:15:18Z beach: Kolt: (compile-file "filename")
2015-02-17T05:15:19Z Bike: um, compile it in an implementation? usually sbcl
2015-02-17T05:15:28Z nyef: ... Isn't Wheezy still debian-stable?
2015-02-17T05:15:39Z clintm: nyef: affirmative.
2015-02-17T05:16:08Z Kolt: I'm sorry, I'm sleepy, wrong question. I meant write.
2015-02-17T05:16:20Z nyef: Mmm. Far be it from anybody to support debian-stable. /-:
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2015-02-17T05:16:36Z Bike: emacs.
2015-02-17T05:17:04Z nyef: (Compile-farm-as-a-service? No, that runs Unstable. Or Ubuntu, which is even worse.)
2015-02-17T05:17:11Z clintm: nyef: its gcc version is too old, which complicates things a bit.
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2015-02-17T05:18:01Z beach: Kolt: What Bike says.  You start Emacs and then SLIME, and then you start typing.
2015-02-17T05:18:43Z clintm: kolt: I use emacs as well.  There was someone here earlier today talking about using vim though, so I wouldn't rule out its usefulnexx.
2015-02-17T05:18:47Z clintm: err, usefulness.
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2015-02-17T05:19:28Z Kolt: Excellent, thank you both. I used to program in C using Mousepad, mainly just because I wanted, this will hopefully force me to use Emacs as my daily pseudo-OS
2015-02-17T05:19:39Z drmeister: Back in a few - I have to move some garbage cans in the snow or I'll be in trouble with my better-half.
2015-02-17T05:20:06Z beach: oh, right, that white suff.
2015-02-17T05:20:08Z beach: stuff
2015-02-17T05:20:12Z Kolt: So, do you execute slime inside Emacs?
2015-02-17T05:20:18Z beach: Kolt: Yes.
2015-02-17T05:20:20Z nyef: GCC 4.7 is too old now?
2015-02-17T05:20:27Z Kolt: Thanks.
2015-02-17T05:20:33Z beach: Kolt: SLIME turns Emacs into an IDE for Common Lisp.
2015-02-17T05:20:37Z clintm: Yea, clasp needs 4.8.x
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2015-02-17T05:21:33Z nyef: Ah well, at least it doesn't need EGCS or something like that.
2015-02-17T05:21:59Z Kolt: beach: Excellent
2015-02-17T05:23:00Z clintm: omg... egcs.  Wow, that takes me back.
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2015-02-17T05:25:31Z nyef has a sudden wave of nostalgia for Linux kernel version 0.99pl45.
2015-02-17T05:25:55Z iheartinet: hello friends! is there a standardized way to handle the format for the decimal point (comma instead of dot)?
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2015-02-17T05:25:59Z Kolt: beach: When I run it, it says "Process inferior-lisp not running"
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2015-02-17T05:28:07Z drmeister: Kolt: I've done some development with slime in the past weeks.  What emacs version are you running?
2015-02-17T05:28:33Z Kolt: 24.2.1
2015-02-17T05:28:37Z Kolt: 24.4.1**
2015-02-17T05:29:33Z drmeister: And did you install SLIME using emacs package manager?
2015-02-17T05:33:08Z axion: iheartinet: you could use cl-l10n's parse-number with the desired locale
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2015-02-17T05:36:53Z Kolt: drmeister: No, I downloaded a tarball (arch) and installed it with makepkg
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2015-02-17T05:37:40Z Kolt: drmeister: how do I set it up?
2015-02-17T05:38:03Z drmeister: You might try Emacs' package manager - it's probably less fuss and bother.
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2015-02-17T05:39:26Z drmeister: I use the menus in Emacs to get into the package manager.
2015-02-17T05:39:43Z nyef: Why not use quicklisp-slime-helper?
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2015-02-17T05:40:09Z Kolt: I was really confused because it didn't create a .emacs.el file
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2015-02-17T05:47:55Z Kolt: I need melpa right?
2015-02-17T05:48:41Z beach: Kolt: Install a Lisp system from binary, say SBCL.
2015-02-17T05:48:50Z beach: Kolt: Then use Quicklisp to install SLIME.
2015-02-17T05:49:29Z beach: Kolt: When you install SLIME using Quicklisp, Quicklisp will tell you what to put in your .emacs file.
2015-02-17T05:50:24Z Kolt: makepkg took care of that but there's no .emacs file adn when I created it, emacs threw that "Process inferior-lisp not running" error
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2015-02-17T05:51:16Z beach: Kolt: You really should use the method I (and nyef) told you about.  Otherwise, you will get incompatible versions of SLIME, Emacs, and your Lisp system.
2015-02-17T05:52:36Z iheartinet: axion: thank you very much <3
2015-02-17T05:52:45Z drmeister: Kolt: Yeah - it's hard to debug "Process inferior-lisp not running" there are any number of reasons that could be happening due to a misconfiguration. Do what beach and nyef suggest.
2015-02-17T05:53:03Z beach: Kolt: 1. Download SBCL binary from sourceforge.  2. Download Quicklisp from quicklisp.org and follow the instructions.  3. Use Quicklisp to install quicklisp-slime-helper.
2015-02-17T05:56:36Z Pastaf: you're going to want quicklisp anyway.
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2015-02-17T06:04:16Z Kolt: I will, thanks guys
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2015-02-17T06:15:42Z beach: So am I understanding this Debian discussion right?  In order to have some software installed on Debian, it has to be possible to compile it from source, using only a C compiler, and (I suppose) some Unix tools such as Make?
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2015-02-17T06:17:00Z clintm: beach: been quite a while since i've gone through the process, but yea, that's how it was when I did it.
2015-02-17T06:17:20Z clintm: actually I guess it's been more than quite a while.
2015-02-17T06:18:07Z beach: So I guess a Common Lisp system written in Common Lisp must then include some other Common Lisp system written in C.  That can be done of course.
2015-02-17T06:19:06Z beach: Installing such a system may take a few minutes, though. :)
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2015-02-17T06:25:32Z beach: I guess there are several ways around that.  If the system to install has a byte-code backend, then a data file containing the byte-code version of the entire system could be provided, thus allowing the native backend to be generated.
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2015-02-17T06:38:37Z impulse: anyone else get this in SBCL: "ASDF 2 is not compatible with ASDF-BINARY-LOCATIONS"
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2015-02-17T06:52:44Z beach: impulse: You must have an old version of ASDF.
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2015-02-17T06:53:38Z impulse: beach: 1.89 too old?
2015-02-17T06:53:45Z impulse: it's what's in gentoo
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2015-02-17T06:54:31Z zaproh51: hi
2015-02-17T06:54:39Z beach: hello zaproh51.
2015-02-17T06:54:49Z beach: impulse: You should install SBCL from a binary on sourceforge.
2015-02-17T06:54:50Z zaproh51: im having trouble loading uffi into my lisp
2015-02-17T06:55:10Z zaproh51: ive tried 2 different versions of lisp but without luck
2015-02-17T06:55:10Z impulse: beach: ok thanks
2015-02-17T06:55:17Z beach: zaproh51: I know nothing about FFI, but I understand that people use CFFI these days.
2015-02-17T06:55:30Z zaproh51: oh ok
2015-02-17T06:55:49Z impulse: will that binary include asdf?
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2015-02-17T06:55:56Z beach: impulse: Yes.
2015-02-17T06:55:59Z zaproh51: do u think it would be backwards compatible or what not
2015-02-17T06:56:36Z Bike: i don't think that was a design goal. are you trying to use some old software with uffi?
2015-02-17T06:57:01Z zaproh51: yeah
2015-02-17T06:57:44Z zaproh51: trying to compile lice sort of like emacs for common lisp
2015-02-17T07:00:43Z Bike: you might want to ask spacebat or sabetts
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2015-02-17T07:01:20Z zaproh51: ok thanks
2015-02-17T07:01:49Z Bike: or use something else like hemlock, i don't know
2015-02-17T07:02:36Z zaproh51: ok thanks
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2015-02-17T08:13:13Z faheem_: drmeister: i never got it to work on wheezy. i used jessie
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2015-02-17T08:14:14Z clintm: That's what I'm trying it on now.  Waiting for llvm to build... :P
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2015-02-17T08:20:21Z zaproh51: can anyone help me installing uffi
2015-02-17T08:20:47Z zaproh51: i can only get errors
2015-02-17T08:21:07Z H4ns: to help you, you need to tell us what errors.  use paste.lisp.org
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2015-02-17T08:25:51Z zaproh51: do i need to select a channel when pasting?
2015-02-17T08:25:54Z H4ns: no
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2015-02-17T08:26:39Z zaproh51: http://paste.lisp.org/+34HN
2015-02-17T08:27:16Z H4ns: how did you install uffi?
2015-02-17T08:27:30Z zaproh51: i forgot add this
2015-02-17T08:27:31Z zaproh51: (asdf:operate 'asdf:load-op :uffi)
2015-02-17T08:27:41Z H4ns: use quicklisp.
2015-02-17T08:27:45Z zaproh51: ok
2015-02-17T08:28:06Z zaproh51: oh i didnt install it
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2015-02-17T08:34:02Z faheem_: BeLucid_: no, that is not the case
2015-02-17T08:34:18Z faheem_: how do I leave a memo for beach
2015-02-17T08:34:20Z faheem_: ?
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2015-02-17T08:41:40Z faheem_: minion: memo for beach: Per "In order to have some software installed on Debian, it has to be possible to compile it from source, using only a C compiler, and (I suppose) some Unix tools such as Make?". No, that is not the case. There are plenty of counter-examples, including some CL implementations, like SBCL and CMUCL.
2015-02-17T08:41:40Z minion: Remembered. I'll tell beach when he/she/it next speaks.
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2015-02-17T08:48:20Z taylanub: ... "it"
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2015-02-17T08:48:57Z taylanub: minion: I think "they" and such is accepted for gender-neutral pronouns
2015-02-17T08:48:57Z minion: I think "they" and such is accepted for gender-neutral pronouns: An error was encountered in lookup: Parse error:URI "http://www.cliki.net/I%20think%20\"they\"%20and%20such%20is%20accepted%20for%20gender-neutral%20pronouns?source" contains illegal character #\" at position 33..
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2015-02-17T08:49:09Z taylanub: oh, a bot
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2015-02-17T08:51:04Z HisaoNakai: taylanub: cue time of eve discussion.
2015-02-17T08:51:18Z taylanub: heh
2015-02-17T08:51:48Z H4ns: faheem_: thank you so much for bringing this discussion back to life!1
2015-02-17T08:52:15Z faheem_: H4ns: hmm? what discussion?
2015-02-17T08:52:38Z taylanub: I'd totally call the Eve androids he/she though.  they observably have binary gender, being modeled by people...
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2015-02-17T08:53:47Z taylanub: (more binary than humans, since in humans natural exceptions occur, whereas the robots are designed with binary gender in mind)
2015-02-17T08:54:13Z taylanub: ...
2015-02-17T08:54:14Z taylanub goes to nerd somewhere else
2015-02-17T08:54:17Z Pastaf: taylanub, I had to re-read that too xP
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2015-02-17T09:01:09Z smokeink: i'm running an infinite loop and it takes a long time until it overflows the stack, is there any way to interrupt it before stack overflow is reached?
2015-02-17T09:01:25Z H4ns:  [
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2015-02-17T09:01:29Z H4ns: C-c C-c
2015-02-17T09:01:50Z H4ns: (assuming that you use slime)
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2015-02-17T09:02:32Z smokeink: i use slimv
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2015-02-17T09:07:01Z Ralt_: hi
2015-02-17T09:07:39Z Ralt_: it's really fun to have an irc client in the repl...
2015-02-17T09:08:01Z Ralt_: I don't really know how to handle the notifications though...
2015-02-17T09:08:32Z Ralt_: stuff like new messages or pings... in slime
2015-02-17T09:08:51Z clintm: Ralt_: which client is this?
2015-02-17T09:09:04Z Ralt_: clintm: https://github.com/Ralt/nyx
2015-02-17T09:09:25Z Ralt_: i.e. "my" client
2015-02-17T09:10:07Z Ralt_: http://i.imgur.com/xl5PgLX.png
2015-02-17T09:10:17Z Ralt_: for a screenshot of what I'm seeing right now
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2015-02-17T09:11:41Z clintm: Ralt_: i shall poke at it once I'm done building clasp.
2015-02-17T09:11:47Z clintm: thanks for the pointer :)
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2015-02-17T09:12:35Z Ralt_: well, I still need to know how to handle pings and new messages :P right now I can have multiple channels, but I need to switch manually or read the *messages* hash-table to see if there is any new message...
2015-02-17T09:12:47Z Shinmera: Why aren't you using one of the existing IRC libraries/frameworks?
2015-02-17T09:12:55Z Ralt_: pings could be handled by a simple thing like showing "you were pinged"
2015-02-17T09:13:25Z Ralt_: Shinmera: I started using cl-irc, but couldn't hook my way into its main loop...
2015-02-17T09:13:54Z Shinmera: cl-irc uses an event handler system. Why do you need to get into the main loop?
2015-02-17T09:13:57Z Ralt_: maybe I just did it wrong. I wanted to make an irc client anyway, so I gave up on it after an hour or so of trying.
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2015-02-17T09:15:54Z Adlai wonders why nobody mentions emacs's (require 'cl) when listing common lisp implementations
2015-02-17T09:16:16Z Ralt_: couldn't get it working... and I didn't try very long
2015-02-17T09:16:28Z Shinmera: Adlai: Because it isn't one.
2015-02-17T09:16:38Z H4ns: Adlai: how much of the ansi test suite does emacs pass?
2015-02-17T09:17:06Z Adlai: not much, but isn't it possible to fix that?
2015-02-17T09:17:13Z Adlai is not volunteering, just speculating
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2015-02-17T09:18:11Z H4ns: Adlai: "possible" is not a good word in this context.  i'd ask for "feasible" and the answer would be no.
2015-02-17T09:19:14Z Adlai: why not?
2015-02-17T09:19:54Z H4ns: Adlai: because it would be a huge task with little gain
2015-02-17T09:20:36Z clintm: sadly (at least in my opinion) cl is an afterthought in emacs and its use is, or at least was, actively discouraged.
2015-02-17T09:20:51Z Adlai is reading slime.el
2015-02-17T09:21:40Z clintm: it's the first thing my .emacs requires though because i'm such a reble.
2015-02-17T09:21:43Z clintm: err, rebel too
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2015-02-17T09:35:09Z Adlai: aha, there is a discrete advantage to having (require 'cl) pass as cl: you could use slime to edit slime
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2015-02-17T09:59:27Z loke: clintm: Me too
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2015-02-17T10:28:53Z HWJ: formatter with computed format string? I have a function (or macro) with computes a format string _FMT_. Calling _(formatter FMT)_ gives me an error messages I don't understand: (FORMATTER "~{~16a~}~%") fell through ETYPECASE expression. What does that mean and how to fix it? Many thanks!
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2015-02-17T10:32:45Z H4ns: HWJ: you need to supply us with more context.  use paste.lisp.org to paste the relevant parts of your code and the complete error message.
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2015-02-17T10:40:00Z HWJ: The code is at http://paste.lisp.org/+34HP
2015-02-17T10:41:11Z H4ns: you've not shown what Formattter is, but from the error message i gather that it is a macro and that it fails to correctly control evaluation of its arguments
2015-02-17T10:41:26Z H4ns: why are you trying to write it as a macro anyway
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2015-02-17T10:41:58Z H4ns: also, computed format strings can usually be avoided by using more of format in the first place.
2015-02-17T10:46:28Z HWJ: Yes, it;s the CL macro : file:///usr/share/doc/hyperspec-7.0-r2/HyperSpec/Body/m_format.htm . It expects a string. How do I get a computed string into that macro? I have even tried the macros: (defmacro gen_formatter (Fmt) `(defvar TowerFormatter `(formatter ,,Fmt))), but calling it like (gen_formatter TowerFmt) gives the same error messages.
2015-02-17T10:48:19Z H4ns: start with working through a macro writing tutorial, if you feel that you need to learn how macros work.
2015-02-17T10:48:58Z HWJ: I'm curious how that works (and I think that the formatter macro parses the format string once and generates a function for that special format string).
2015-02-17T10:50:54Z HWJ: Furthermore I failed to "use more of format" in that case, since  "~{~va~}" requires the value to <v> several times.
2015-02-17T10:51:31Z H4ns: have it your way
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2015-02-17T11:13:59Z moore33: HWJ: Why do you want to use formatter? Just pass your computed string to format.
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2015-02-17T11:20:28Z HWJ: First, I am curious how it works. Second, I believed that the formatter function would interpret the format string only once and generate a function adapted to that special format string.
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2015-02-17T11:27:03Z moore33: HWJ: That's what it does, if its argument is a constant string.
2015-02-17T11:27:16Z moore33: Maybe.
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2015-02-17T11:29:15Z H4ns: i don't quite understand why FORMATTER is defined as being a macro.  the spec is clear about it, and it is also clear about the fact that the control-string argument needs to be a format string which is not evaluated.
2015-02-17T11:30:31Z HWJ: But can't I write a macro which evaluates the string and calls formatter afterwards - that's what I am curious about.
2015-02-17T11:31:17Z clintm: sure you can
2015-02-17T11:31:18Z Grue`: is the string supposed to be evaluated at compile time?
2015-02-17T11:31:34Z Grue`: if not, then it's too late to do macroexpansion by then
2015-02-17T11:31:38Z moore33: Grue`: Yes.
2015-02-17T11:31:38Z H4ns: (defmacro x (something) (let ((format-string (format "~~A~" something))) `(formatter ,format-string))) or something like that
2015-02-17T11:31:50Z H4ns: give and take
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2015-02-17T11:33:25Z H4ns: (defmacro x (something) (let ((format-string (format nil "~~~A" something))) `(formatter ,format-string)))
2015-02-17T11:33:43Z H4ns: HWJ: that is what i meant with "control evaluation"
2015-02-17T11:34:39Z HWJ: I've tried exactly that, but SBCL (1.2.8) still gives FMT fell through ETYPECASE expression when I invoke that macro.
2015-02-17T11:34:54Z H4ns: HWJ: for me, it does not
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2015-02-17T11:35:37Z H4ns: HWJ: (funcall (x "9,'0D") t 1) => 000000001
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2015-02-17T11:45:06Z HWJ: Yes, this example works here, as well. But you cal x with a constant string. Here, I have some symbolic constant, e.g. defined by (defconstant num 7) and I want to call x with (* 3 num)
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2015-02-17T11:46:57Z H4ns: HWJ: you need to look harder and experiment more
2015-02-17T11:47:05Z H4ns: HWJ: (defmacro x (length) (let ((format-string (format nil "~~~A,'0D" length))) `(formatter ,format-string)))
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2015-02-17T11:52:12Z Grue`: HWJ: it would work as long as that constant is accessible at compile time (i.e. using eval-when)
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2015-02-17T11:53:22Z Grue`: wait, i'm saying bullshit again
2015-02-17T11:55:05Z Grue`: I think it might be possible if the constant is accessible at read time, and then using #.
2015-02-17T11:55:25Z pjb: minion: memo for psilord1: object n. 1. any Lisp datum. ``The function cons creates an object which refers to two other objects.''
2015-02-17T11:55:25Z minion: Remembered. I'll tell psilord1 when he/she/it next speaks.
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2015-02-17T11:57:12Z pjb: minion: memo for psilord1: in general, you can define methods dispatching on any object (or object class): (defmethod m ((x (eql 42))) 'hi)  (m 42) --> hi
2015-02-17T11:57:13Z minion: Remembered. I'll tell psilord1 when he/she/it next speaks.
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2015-02-17T12:00:28Z pjb: minion: memo for psilord1: it is well known that macros can be expanded several times for a give invocation (be that because the compiler likes your macro, or because it has duplicated your code while inlining is irrelevant).  Also it is obvious that a macro can be expanded with different bindings of *package*, depending when it's invoked.
2015-02-17T12:00:28Z minion: Remembered. I'll tell psilord1 when he/she/it next speaks.
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2015-02-17T12:03:06Z pjb: minion: memo for psilord1: however, I would be surprised by an implementation duplicating source code while inlining, because of the difficulties of doing that correctly with respect to the lexical environments.
2015-02-17T12:03:07Z minion: Remembered. I'll tell psilord1 when he/she/it next speaks.
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2015-02-17T12:11:56Z HWJ: @H4ns Your macro only works if it's invoked with digits (or something known at read time)
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2015-02-17T12:12:28Z H4ns: HWJ: i was not trying to solve your problem.
2015-02-17T12:13:26Z H4ns: HWJ: i was just trying to help you understand the issues, but you'll now have to actually read up on quasiquotation and macros so that you can really work with them.
2015-02-17T12:14:30Z H4ns: HWJ: and, when you say "at read time" you do not really understand what you're saying, sorry.
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2015-02-17T12:24:19Z mega1: do you know of a library of representation agnostic graph search algorithms?
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2015-02-17T12:26:33Z pjb: about chemistry, one guy spent more than 3 hours and a half saying the name of a single molecule: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFR-ADakI-c
2015-02-17T12:26:47Z pjb: mega1: what's an agnostic graph?
2015-02-17T12:27:33Z mega1: "representation agnostic", i.e. just the pure algo without forcing a particular data structure onto its user
2015-02-17T12:27:43Z pjb: What about a*? https://gitorious.org/com-informatimago/com-informatimago/source/bbd80cc42b90603a4587a219849a280f50f187d0:common-lisp/cesarum/a-star.lisp
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2015-02-17T12:29:54Z mega1: I'm not interested in A* itself, I was wondering where the beam search implmentation I wrote belongs.
2015-02-17T12:30:17Z pjb: Ah, looking for a home library…
2015-02-17T12:31:16Z mega1: Maybe I just put it into micmac ... it already has alpha-beta and UCT.
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2015-02-17T12:40:05Z pjb: Adlai: because (require 'cl) is not a CL implementation.  On the other hand, (load "emacs-cl") gives you an CL implementation over emacs lisp, but it hasn't been updated for emacs-24.
2015-02-17T12:40:52Z pjb: Adlai: https://github.com/larsbrinkhoff/emacs-cl
2015-02-17T12:41:08Z Adlai: thank you!
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2015-02-17T13:25:45Z jnewb: why do people think cl is ugly and inferior to other lisps because of its warts, but think JavaScript is cool because it has a nice fun subset
2015-02-17T13:25:52Z jnewb: seems like double standards
2015-02-17T13:26:15Z H4ns: jnewb: people think all kinds of wrong things
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2015-02-17T13:32:09Z taylanub: <troll>is there a clean substitute to JS though?</troll>
2015-02-17T13:32:17Z taylanub: <troll2>oh wait, that's also Scheme</troll2>
2015-02-17T13:32:40Z taylanub runs as fast as ey can
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2015-02-17T13:35:41Z taylanub: jnewb: jokes aside, ^this^ probably really is the reason: when talking about lisps people will contrast CL to Scheme, but people who talk about JS tend to not have much of a clue of other languages, and think JS's functional core is unique or something
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2015-02-17T13:40:03Z |3b|`: also, a lot of people's only exposure to "lisp" is a not-"nice fun" subset, the shaved down educational scheme subset they saw for a few weeks in school or whatever
2015-02-17T13:40:04Z Adlai: code is only ugly until grokked: https://github.com/adlai/scalpl/blob/master/qd.lisp#L198-L208
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2015-02-17T13:41:20Z taylanub: Adlai: yeah, thing is some code takes more than a reasonable amount of effort to grok, so it remains ugly
2015-02-17T13:42:27Z Adlai: s/code/syntax/ and most people would say that of all lisps :P
2015-02-17T13:42:53Z taylanub: sexpr syntax has actual major benefits so I don't think that's a good comparison
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2015-02-17T13:43:29Z taylanub: is 'prioriteaze' a typo by the way?
2015-02-17T13:43:39Z Adlai: it's a malamanteau
2015-02-17T13:43:54Z Adlai: prioritize offers, tease the reader :P
2015-02-17T13:44:15Z jnewb: contrasting scheme/cl so harshly can be misleading for newcomers becuase it hangs a negative cloud on each language.  When one is bad relative to the other, it makes it seem like they're absolutely bad.
2015-02-17T13:45:16Z Adlai: let us pray they have the wisdom to choose correctly
2015-02-17T13:45:24Z jnewb: I did quite a bit of googling trying to decide, and alto of what I came across left a bad taste in my mouth
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2015-02-17T13:47:45Z taylanub: jnewb: (I disconnected after your "contrasting scheme/cl so harshly can be misleading" line in case you said more)
2015-02-17T13:48:01Z taylanub: yes, agree on that, I wish people instead talked about their *strengthes* relative to each other :)
2015-02-17T13:48:23Z moore33: jnewb: How is that different from every other language comparison out there?
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2015-02-17T13:50:35Z taylanub: I think exactly the same point indeed applies to all other language or otherwise comparisons.  it's a human communication thing .. "look at how bad your favorite <thing> is in comparison to my favorite <thing>" vs. "yeah, this <thing> has these and those strengthes/weaknesses, that <thing> has these other strengthes/weaknesses"
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2015-02-17T13:52:09Z jnewb: moore33: Because to a newcomer they're both just Lisp.  If an overall negative tone between the languages is used then the feeling for an outsider is that the languages have big problems
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2015-02-17T13:53:01Z jnewb: and then maybe they think lisp isn't worth the effort
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2015-02-17T13:53:36Z jnewb: when relative to their current language, they both may be great.
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2015-02-17T13:56:40Z moore33: jnewb: Well, they are just Lisp, but you can't blame the communities for being passionate about their chosen religion :)
2015-02-17T13:58:32Z jnewb: we can if it means the number of newcomers to the languages becomes one day too few to support it
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2015-02-17T14:03:38Z taylanub: jnewb: I'm unsure whether CL/Scheme flamewars have much relevancy to be honest.  I hang in #scheme and #emacs and don't think I've ever really experienced any except for people to seem to have some biased undertones whenever Guile-Emacs is being discussed  (which is understandable because it's a big change to their favorite piece of software)
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2015-02-17T14:05:40Z taylanub: don't think I've ever seen any outright nasty "your language sucks because X" silliness about CL/Scheme.  most I see is people poking fun at the former for ugly procedure names and the latter for the sad state of standardization
2015-02-17T14:06:29Z taylanub: (I think R7RS has great potential, but some Schemers I respect a lot disagree)
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2015-02-17T14:11:22Z jnewb: yea.  It was more that most of the discussion of the two languages seemed to be: cl - ugly & pragmatic,  scheme - pretty & less useful.  A lot of forums posts agreeing and disagreeing with that view.  I think those generalisations are meant to be taken as relative to each other, but to the outside there is a strong message that cl is ugly, and scheme is not useful for a major project.
2015-02-17T14:12:27Z taylanub: ah yes, that's the simplistic view outsiders often get.  but I don't know what the source is.
2015-02-17T14:12:53Z taylanub: it's probably just spreading memetically across people who have only half a clue about lisp, by now
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2015-02-17T14:13:28Z taylanub: there's probably many people in that category.  and where's that graph about knowledge about a topic relative to the desire to talk about the topic...
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2015-02-17T14:19:14Z jnewb: I think people have read those kinds of views, dismissed learning lisp accordingly, and then regurgitated the same information at the next available opportunity
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2015-02-17T14:21:49Z taylanub: indeed.  I hope Guix will be a success and bring some popularity to GNU and Scheme. :\
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2015-02-17T14:30:16Z jackdaniel: taylanub: if make check fails, should i report it or something?(guix related) ,þ
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2015-02-17T14:31:20Z munksgaard: In emacs 24.4, should I use quicklisp-slime-helper or M-x install-package slime
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2015-02-17T14:31:25Z munksgaard: ?
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2015-02-17T14:32:59Z Shinmera: Either way should work.
2015-02-17T14:33:46Z dlowe: I pretty much always use quicklisp's
2015-02-17T14:34:00Z taylanub: jackdaniel: where/which make check fails?
2015-02-17T14:34:29Z Shinmera: And I always use melpa's.
2015-02-17T14:34:33Z munksgaard: Okay. The reason I'm asking is that I'm having trouble using slimes ,load-system with the quicklisp version... I'm getting "invalid protocol message" and "LIST-ASDF-SYSTEMS not found in the SWANK package"
2015-02-17T14:34:51Z munksgaard: (I haven't tried with the melpa version)
2015-02-17T14:34:54Z jackdaniel: taylanub: guix-git build from archlinux aur /it checks correct build with make check, and fails on some tests/
2015-02-17T14:35:01Z H4ns: munksgaard: i use quicklisp-slime-helper and that avoids the kinds of troubles that you're having.
2015-02-17T14:35:03Z dlowe: it sounds like you have an older swank than slime
2015-02-17T14:35:11Z dlowe: (or newer)
2015-02-17T14:36:09Z munksgaard: H4ns: But I am using quicklisp-slime-helper atm
2015-02-17T14:36:26Z pjb: Adlai: http://snag.gy/BwJtt.jpg  http://snag.gy/HbdFT.jpg  Perhaps you'd want to use http://paste.lisp.org instead ?
2015-02-17T14:36:54Z munksgaard: dlowe: How do I know? I don't think I've ever manually installed swank.
2015-02-17T14:37:16Z dlowe: munksgaard: you could have upgraded swank and not reloaded slime in your emacs
2015-02-17T14:37:28Z dlowe is making wild guesses
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2015-02-17T14:38:30Z taylanub: jackdaniel: running make check on latest commit on master right now...  if it passes for me but fails for you, but you don't think it's intrinsically Arch related, feel free to file a bug report at bug-guix@gnu.org
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2015-02-17T14:38:56Z Adlai: pjb: http://paste.lisp.org/+34HR you asked for it
2015-02-17T14:40:25Z Grue`: but really a browser that can't render github must be pretty difficult to work with
2015-02-17T14:41:00Z jnewb: I was recommendeded "on lisp" and "let over lambda" here.  If you could have one of them in hardcopy, which would it be? (financial restriction)
2015-02-17T14:41:13Z munksgaard: dlowe: I've upgrade both swank and slime with quicklisp now, and restarted emacs, but I'm still getting the same error.
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2015-02-17T14:41:29Z Grue`: jnewb: On Lisp is more practical of these two...
2015-02-17T14:41:34Z oGMo: jnewb: if money was an issue, i'd read the online version of PCL
2015-02-17T14:41:37Z taylanub: I thought everyone was praising Practical Common Lisp?
2015-02-17T14:41:38Z dlowe: munksgaard: do you have slime installed via package manager?
2015-02-17T14:41:45Z munksgaard: dlowe: Nope.
2015-02-17T14:42:38Z jnewb: I've read most of "land of lisp", I want something less introductory.
2015-02-17T14:42:43Z dlowe: munksgaard: try M-x locate-library<RET>slime
2015-02-17T14:42:51Z Grue`: jnewb: Practical Common Lisp it is then
2015-02-17T14:43:04Z oGMo: and maybe if you're _super_ new, Gentle Introduction which is also online
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2015-02-17T14:43:26Z jnewb: thanks
2015-02-17T14:43:26Z munksgaard: dlowe: "Library is file ~/.local/share/quicklisp/dists/quicklisp/software/slime-2.9/slime.el"
2015-02-17T14:43:33Z Grue`: definitely not Let over Lambda heh
2015-02-17T14:43:53Z munksgaard: Hm, why is it using that old version instead of 2.12?
2015-02-17T14:43:57Z oGMo: jnewb: PCL, then start coding and reading other code like halfway through, and don't forget about CLHS
2015-02-17T14:44:19Z Grue`: munksgaard: where is 2.12 installed?
2015-02-17T14:44:22Z munksgaard: (which is installed in the same directory)
2015-02-17T14:44:27Z munksgaard: Grue`: ^
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2015-02-17T14:44:54Z dlowe: munksgaard: are you loading ~/quicklisp/slime-helper.el?
2015-02-17T14:44:55Z munksgaard: That is, ~/.local/share/quicklisp/dists/quicklisp/software/slime-2.12
2015-02-17T14:45:34Z munksgaard: dlowe: Nope, '(load (expand-file-name "~/.local/share/quicklisp/slime-helper.el"))' from my init.el
2015-02-17T14:46:37Z dlowe: okay, well, same thing, I guess
2015-02-17T14:46:43Z Grue`: have you tried restarting emacs?
2015-02-17T14:46:57Z dlowe: I'm out of ideas.
2015-02-17T14:47:01Z Grue`: oh, I didnt read
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2015-02-17T14:48:27Z taylanub: jackdaniel: all 34 pass for me.  what output does it give when failing?
2015-02-17T14:48:29Z jnewb: have you set your inferior lisp program
2015-02-17T14:48:45Z jnewb: (setq inferior-lisp-program "sbcl")
2015-02-17T14:49:17Z munksgaard: jnewb: Yup, and it's starting sbcl without any trouble. I only get the error when I try to load a system through slime-asdf
2015-02-17T14:49:58Z munksgaard: Grue`, dlowe: I tried moving slime-2.9 to another directory, and now M-x locate-library points to the 2.12 dir.
2015-02-17T14:50:07Z munksgaard: But I'm still getting the error :(
2015-02-17T14:50:26Z jnewb: munksgaard:  I would move my .emacs.d and try with clean emacs to rule that out
2015-02-17T14:50:31Z dlowe: munksgaard: make sure your swank version matches
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2015-02-17T14:52:19Z pjb: Adlai: http://snag.gy/OF31N.jpg see, much better :-)
2015-02-17T14:53:10Z pjb: Grue`: that's why I don't use github but at gunpoint.
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2015-02-17T14:55:16Z munksgaard: jnewb: Still the same with a moved .emacs.d and just an init.el containing the load and inferior lisp commands
2015-02-17T14:55:30Z munksgaard: I'm trying to completely reinstall quicklisp now
2015-02-17T14:55:44Z dlowe: munksgaard: what are you actually loading to get the ,load command?
2015-02-17T14:56:16Z munksgaard: dlowe: A library I just tried creating with quickproject. It works if I use (asdf:load-system "myproj") instead
2015-02-17T14:56:39Z dlowe: no, I mean, slime doesn't come with it enabled by default
2015-02-17T14:56:46Z dlowe: try M-x locate-library<RET>slime-asdf
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2015-02-17T14:58:38Z munksgaard: Still the same error with a completely fresh install of quicklisp (including all libraries) and a fresh init.el
2015-02-17T14:59:08Z munksgaard: dlowe: It's in slime-2.12/contrib/slime-asdf.el
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2015-02-17T15:01:05Z dlowe: it's in contrib. I expect that there's been some drift
2015-02-17T15:01:19Z jackdaniel: taylanub: check priv
2015-02-17T15:02:02Z munksgaard: dlowe: I just tried using melpa to install slime instead: That seemed to do the trick!
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2015-02-17T15:06:41Z munksgaard: Well, I guess that's that, melpa it is :)
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2015-02-17T15:16:16Z jnewb: is that the same version of slime?
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2015-02-17T15:19:47Z nyef: G'morning all.
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2015-02-17T15:21:04Z drmeister: Good morning nyef
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2015-02-17T15:51:13Z munksgaard: jnewb: Seems like it :S
2015-02-17T15:51:15Z munksgaard: 2.12
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2015-02-17T16:27:08Z francogrex: what would be the conditional formatting syntax in this example: (format t "~{~a~^, ~}" (list 8 5 nil 7)) so that nil gets replace by a space in the output?
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2015-02-17T16:29:47Z Bike: ~{~:[ ~;~a~]~^, ~} maybe
2015-02-17T16:30:17Z Bike: ^or not.
2015-02-17T16:30:56Z Bike: ~{~:[ ~;~:*~a~]~^, ~} does ok.
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2015-02-17T16:33:26Z Bike: i guess i'm not totally sure what you want.
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2015-02-17T16:36:07Z francogrex: Bike: yes it's what I wanted. Thanks  million
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2015-02-17T16:36:57Z Bike: cool
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2015-02-17T16:51:19Z pjb: Bike: francogrex may have wanted:  (format nil "~{~@[~a~^, ~]~}" (list 8 5 nil 7)) ; instead.
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2015-02-17T19:13:33Z a2015214: Hello Everyone
2015-02-17T19:13:55Z a2015214: I am trying to work through https://reader.tymoon.eu/article/313
2015-02-17T19:14:15Z a2015214: I am getting an compile error ( I think) when invoking (ql:quickload 'qt)
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2015-02-17T19:14:51Z Bicyclidine: What's the error? If it's long, put it on paste.lisp.org.
2015-02-17T19:15:01Z nyef: a2015214: Did you install quicklisp?
2015-02-17T19:15:18Z Bicyclidine: yeah, is it something like "there is no package QL"?
2015-02-17T19:15:47Z a2015214: I am able to install 'chirp through quicklisp, so yes, my quicklisp installation appears to be working
2015-02-17T19:15:58Z a2015214: Bicyclidine: let me try to paste that
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2015-02-17T19:19:20Z a2015214: Bicyclidine: here it the URL: http://paste.lisp.org/display/145802
2015-02-17T19:19:40Z a2015214: Now, the article says that quicklisp's version is old (that might be the case)
2015-02-17T19:19:45Z Bicyclidine: oh, my, that looks unfun.
2015-02-17T19:19:54Z a2015214: so I also tried cd quicklisp/local-projects
2015-02-17T19:19:58Z a2015214: git clone url.git
2015-02-17T19:20:12Z a2015214: (ql:register-local-projects) ==> NIL
2015-02-17T19:20:22Z a2015214: so obviously I am going a few things wrong
2015-02-17T19:20:22Z a2015214: ;)
2015-02-17T19:20:32Z Bicyclidine: ah, i see it on the internet
2015-02-17T19:21:00Z Bicyclidine: a2015214: see https://common-lisp.net/project/commonqt/#id105941
2015-02-17T19:21:46Z Bicyclidine: i think what it's saying is that you're msising some of the dependencies you need to build smoke. i haven't used commonqt though.
2015-02-17T19:22:20Z Bicyclidine: Shinmera: may or may not want to mention this?
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2015-02-17T19:24:16Z Bicyclidine: a2015214: i don't think this article is intended to be an introduction if you're not at least somewhat acqainted with CL programming already, btw
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2015-02-17T19:24:47Z a2015214: Bicyclidine: I am aware of that (my limitations) I just wanted to copy/paste the code to see what happens
2015-02-17T19:24:55Z a2015214: and try to work through the errors
2015-02-17T19:24:56Z a2015214: ;)
2015-02-17T19:25:02Z Bicyclidine: well, try reading through commonqt's page to see if you can build it
2015-02-17T19:25:11Z Bicyclidine: it's got lists of commands on debian and suchlike
2015-02-17T19:25:20Z a2015214: will do. Thanks
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2015-02-17T19:33:24Z a2015214: Bicyclidine: got it working
2015-02-17T19:33:32Z a2015214: simply needed a few extra qt libraries
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2015-02-17T19:33:36Z a2015214: the following packages to be exact
2015-02-17T19:33:37Z a2015214: qt4-qmake libqt4-dev libsmokeqtgui4-3 libsmokeqt4-dev
2015-02-17T19:33:42Z a2015214: Thanks for the help
2015-02-17T19:33:48Z Bicyclidine: cool.
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2015-02-17T20:30:40Z Shinmera: Bah, I was out cold with a sudden attack of tiredness. Sorry that I couldn't help!
2015-02-17T20:32:05Z Shinmera: Before I head off to sleep for real I might as well ammend here that I'm working on a further extension to Qtools to get rid of the need to type Qt method names in camel case.
2015-02-17T20:32:28Z Shinmera: Good night!
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2015-02-17T23:05:14Z pillton: Shinmera: Have you seen the project cells?
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