00:00:03 sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-81-153.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:01:42 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@166.137.104.11] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:02:09 -!- Code_Man` [~Code_Man@192-177.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:02:13 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-81-153.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:02:13 -!- desophos [~desophos@n163h87.dhcp.oxy.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:05:03 -!- sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-81-153.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:06:08 Bike_ [~Glossina@wl-nat99.it.wsu.edu] has joined #lisp 00:06:39 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@92.110.20.203] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 00:07:09 -!- Bike [~Glossina@wl-nat101.it.wsu.edu] has quit [Disconnected by services] 00:07:11 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 00:08:31 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@64.215.161.70] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:09:05 cmack` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-25-21.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 00:09:31 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-81-153.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:10:25 -!- cmack [~charlie@adsl-74-179-28-220.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:11:35 -!- antonv [5daba1b0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.171.161.176] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:12:58 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:13:52 blacklabel [~user@c-76-21-124-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:14:19 bitonic [~user@xdsl-188-155-179-93.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 00:16:29 drmeiste_ [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:17:01 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:20:50 -!- vaporatorius [~vaporator@84.Red-83-42-198.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:21:15 kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-213-168-108-223.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 00:22:58 CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has joined #lisp 00:26:09 -!- nug700_ [~nug700@71-35-64-7.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:29:53 -!- normanrichards [~textual@cpe-24-27-51-104.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [] 00:31:17 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-198-255-198-157.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:38:08 zRecursive [~czsq888@183.13.198.51] has joined #lisp 00:39:31 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 00:41:52 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-76-75.w90-35.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:44:43 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:47:29 bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:48:06 -!- dcxi [~dcxi@11.Red-81-32-228.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: dcxi] 00:48:41 mathrick: Are you still online 00:49:39 -!- CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:49:41 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:50:23 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 00:50:30 drmeiste_: yes 00:51:33 So I'm attempting to do this really basic analysis of whether to put variables on the stack or the heap. 00:51:42 hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@109.120.33.13] has joined #lisp 00:52:30 I was just analyze top level forms and look to see if they contain FUNCTION and then say all variables need to go on the heap of enclosing lexical scopes. 00:52:50 Bike pointed out that a lot of top level forms contain FUNCTION so it's not going to get me much. 00:53:01 right 00:53:03 And he's right about that when I think about it. 00:53:19 strictly speaking, you could model LET as LAMBDA 00:53:27 though I dunno if you do 00:53:50 I think I do. I'd have to look at the code again to say exactly. 00:53:58 CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has joined #lisp 00:54:32 I still haven't found a good description of how to perform escape analysis. I've read Appel's book on compilers and he says it's necessary but doesn't go into any details. 00:54:42 Do you have any pointers on how to figure this out? 00:54:47 Escape analysis that is. 00:54:58 seriously, just start with finding free variables. 00:55:16 Bike: Hi - I didn't see you there :-) 00:55:23 drmeiste_: not offhand any literature, but last time we had this talk, there were several URLs, and I outlined a simple analysis method too 00:55:42 hello. 00:56:21 I downloaded those papers - I'll look at them again. It's been a couple of weeks (writing grant proposals and teaching) - I'm just getting back to it. 00:57:06 Bike: So I just find free variables and put those on the heap and the rest on the stack? 00:57:10 for example, say you only have lambda. then in (lambda (x) (lambda (y) (+ x y))) you can anzlyze that x is free in the inner lambda, and thus "escapes" 00:57:43 Yup, I get that. 00:58:12 So "x" goes on the heap, and in this case "y" can go on the stack. 00:59:42 compiles as something like "[outer lambda start] mov arg to heap; allocate_closure(ptr_to_inner_lambda_fn, y on the heap); return closure" 00:59:51 which is, uh, very bad pseudocode, but hopefully makes sense. 00:59:57 I was digging through the ECL compiler, they make a note if variables are defined and used on the opposite sides of a FUNCTION special operator. These are the free variables. 01:00:22 desophos [~desophos@n163h87.dhcp.oxy.edu] has joined #lisp 01:00:36 yep, that works. 01:01:05 One example is (lambda (x) (list #'(lambda (y) (+ x y)) #'(lambda (y) (- x y))) Both lambdas need to refer to the same binding of x on the heap. 01:01:51 -!- jk121960 [~jk121960@108-89-22-112.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:02:03 all i'm saying is that for this analysis you really only need (ignoring specials for a second) to look at the inner lambda - (lambda (y) (+ x y)) is going to need x on the heap no matter where it is. 01:02:24 "it" being the lambda. 01:03:19 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@109.120.33.13] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 01:04:04 |JRG| [~user@dynamic-adsl-94-34-137-211.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #lisp 01:05:19 -!- aptenodyte [~mtm@paetec24-124.hampshire.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:09:40 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 01:10:21 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 01:10:40 -!- synacktic [~jordyd@unaffiliated/jordyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:18:57 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:21:57 -!- oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-191-126.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:27:33 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:30:41 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 01:35:01 QwertyDragon [~chatzilla@pool-71-174-212-30.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:37:03 -!- Bike [~Glossina@wl-nat99.it.wsu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:37:50 abunchofdollarsi [~abunchofd@l33t.csail.mit.edu] has joined #lisp 01:38:02 Are there special rules for how I can use declare in a macro? 01:38:07 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:38:59 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-185-207.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 01:40:04 -!- stepnem [~stepnem@internet2.cznet.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:40:20 afaik nothing outside of remembering when a macro is executed, and that it's essentially a function that returns s-expressions 01:40:54 -!- kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-213-168-108-223.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:41:18 https://gist.github.com/burrows-labs/7609715 01:41:20 How would you do that? 01:41:28 Not sure what I'm doing wrong. 01:41:44 kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-212-248.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 01:42:08 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:42:09 Bike [~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu] has joined #lisp 01:42:16 try macroexpand-1 on the function you put the macro in? 01:44:32 How do I make macroexpand-1 expand a function? I only understand how to get it to expand an expression. 01:44:50 hmmm 01:45:38 I think the problem is that DECLARE is not a function or macro, which means it's not picked up by defun when it's hidden by a macro 01:45:52 (as for macroexpand, like this (macroexpand '(defun ...)) 01:45:53 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@247.94.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:45:57 ) 01:46:10 I see you have to type the whole function. 01:46:24 unfortunately 01:46:36 anyway, it seems that you can't use macros this way, not for declare 01:46:40 abunchofdollarsi: what problem are you having with declare? 01:46:46 Did you look at my gist? 01:46:50 that code won't compile/run 01:46:57 oops, missed in the log 01:47:08 ah, no, you are not allowed to expand into declare forms 01:47:13 I see. 01:47:44 That's annoying. 01:47:51 well, it would mess everything up 01:48:09 if you're writing a macro that you want to be sensitive to declares, you'd have to keep macroexpanding all your body forms until you find a non-declare 01:48:26 Yes I see. 01:48:40 -!- gmcastil [~user@75-145-122-2-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:49:38 abunchofdollarsi: you can use read time evaluation to create declare forms if you really want to 01:50:52 I have 10 special variables and I want to use them in 10 functions, how would you go about doing this without enumerating them in each function? 01:51:08 A reader macro is probably okay. 01:51:20 use how? 01:51:44 They are binded to functions I want to call. 01:51:53 is declaiming them not an option? 01:52:04 What does that mean? 01:52:12 (declaim (special ...)) 01:52:23 Is different than (declare (special ..)) how? 01:52:35 it's global, basically. 01:52:39 (defmacro spec-2 (name lambda-list &body body) `(defun ,name ,lambda-list (declare (special *a*)) ,@body)) ; This might work, actually 01:52:45 I see, no that won't work. 01:52:52 They change depending on the caller. 01:53:08 Change what, value? 01:53:14 the important bit is that (declare) is actually evaluated by logic inside (defun) and other forms that implement it 01:53:20 -!- Pullphinger [~Pullphing@c-24-13-69-42.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [] 01:53:27 They become binded to different functions. 01:53:39 that's fine. declaim just says that they're special not what their values are. 01:53:43 I see. 01:53:47 That is probably fine then. 01:54:14 if that doesn't work, i'd just write a with-vars macro that expands into (locally (declare (special ...vars...)) ...body...) 01:55:12 thanks p_l 01:59:13 -!- cools [~user@CPE0026f32ba2b0-CM0026f32ba2ad.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has left #lisp 01:59:26 fder [~user@190.48.17.40] has joined #lisp 01:59:31 hello 02:01:11 I have a C library that works with callbacks and I'm trying to use it in common lisp. I'd like to define a callback in lisp and pass it to the library. 02:01:21 what would you recommend? 02:01:37 -!- bitonic [~user@xdsl-188-155-179-93.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:01:48 -!- abunchofdollarsi [~abunchofd@l33t.csail.mit.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:02:29 hiyosi [~skip_it@247.94.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 02:02:42 It's just like a GUI binding. I've already checked out projects like cl-gtk2, but even in sbcl it's kinda slow... 02:02:51 cffi 02:02:57 -!- TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:04:36 the way I see it, I have two options: 02:04:49 1) check for events in CL 02:04:57 2) call lisp code from C 02:04:58 iwilcox_ [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has joined #lisp 02:05:03 -!- iwilcox [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:05:09 -!- iwilcox_ is now known as iwilcox 02:05:20 what would be more feasible? 02:09:50 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:10:13 is it possible to call lisp code from C? 02:12:12 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:15:36 Bike: cffi spec doesn't say anything about calling lisp from C. 02:18:31 -!- fder [~user@190.48.17.40] has left #lisp 02:18:58 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-101-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 02:21:55 tigger314159 [~tigger314@c-50-148-128-159.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:24:13 minion: memo for fder: there is a selction literally titled "Calling Lisp from C" in the manual: http://common-lisp.net/project/cffi/manual/html_node/Tutorial_002dCallbacks.html#Tutorial_002dCallbacks 02:24:14 Remembered. I'll tell fder when he/she/it next speaks. 02:28:35 Karl_dscc [~localhost@p5DD9F64F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 02:30:58 -!- Emi [~Emi@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:30:58 -!- ORGANasm [~ORGANasm@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:20 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:32:52 -!- jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 02:37:09 -!- iwilcox [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:37:24 iwilcox [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has joined #lisp 02:37:25 -!- milosn [~milosn@user-5af50e24.broadband.tesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:38:02 strobegen [~Adium@188.168.72.236] has joined #lisp 02:39:06 jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has joined #lisp 02:39:45 KarlDscc [~localhost@p5DD9FFD0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 02:41:05 -!- Karl_dscc [~localhost@p5DD9F64F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:41:09 -!- tigger314159 [~tigger314@c-50-148-128-159.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:46:05 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-36-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:48:19 -!- KarlDscc [~localhost@p5DD9FFD0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:49:06 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:49:09 zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 02:49:26 p_nathan1 [~Adium@173-160-167-74-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 02:50:15 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 02:51:02 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 02:51:17 -!- QwertyDragon [~chatzilla@pool-71-174-212-30.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Iceape 2.7.12/20130119143918]] 02:52:36 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.241] has joined #lisp 02:59:12 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 03:01:51 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:04:04 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:04:28 -!- ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:12:16 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:15:18 -!- desophos [~desophos@n163h87.dhcp.oxy.edu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:20:37 -!- iwilcox [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:20:46 iwilcox_ [~iwilcox@unaffiliated/iwilcox] has joined #lisp 03:21:07 -!- iwilcox_ is now known as iwilcox 03:22:23 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 03:22:45 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-101-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:22:58 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-101-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 03:23:46 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:24:33 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 03:27:43 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 03:31:11 synacktic [~jordyd@unaffiliated/jordyd] has joined #lisp 03:32:45 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:34:38 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 03:35:31 Emi [~Emi@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:35:32 ORGANasm [~ORGANasm@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:41:41 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:44:12 I've got a problem when I'm bootstrapping my common lisp compiler that I can't figure out a way around. 03:44:24 I load source code files into my interpreter and then load the compiler. 03:44:44 Then I compile the source code files and the compiler source files and reload the compiled FASL files as I compile them. 03:45:08 This replaces the slow interpreted functions with fast compiled ones and the system gets faster and faster. 03:46:04 anyone know how to get decent syntax highlighting in slime while keeping the repl features? (lisp-mode seems to disable them) 03:46:06 But if a file defines a package like (make-package "FFI") - it loads into the interpreter and makes the package the first time, then the source file gets compiled and then the FASL file gets reloaded and (make-package "FFI") get's called again throwing an error. 03:46:31 -!- kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-212-248.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:46:51 akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has joined #lisp 03:47:15 So I'd like the (make-package "FFI") to be executed the first time it loads, not the second time it loads from the FASL but I need it to be run if I load the FASL file into a fresh system. 03:47:56 Is there some EVAL-WHEN magic (I don't think so) or *FEATURES* #+/#- magic I could use for this? 03:47:58 (sorry to interrupt you drmeiste_ ) 03:48:17 ahungry: No problem. IRC is asynchronous and parallel 03:48:31 :) 03:49:52 And your question is probably more answerable than mine. 03:54:50 ahungry: I just use plain font-lock in lisp files. Works fine for me. I don't go for the angry fruit salad look though. 03:55:38 ahungry: You mean in a slime repl? 03:55:39 drmeiste_: Maybe eval-when :load-toplevel? Or :execute? I can never remember when each happens. 03:55:55 ahungry: I dont, but I would be interested. 03:55:57 why use make-package in the first place? 03:57:18 instead of defpackage 03:57:26 -!- ircbrowse [~chrisdone@unaffiliated/chrisdone] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:57:29 yea, I want my slime repl to have vibrant colors 03:57:32 I made a new emacs color theme 03:57:36 and want in my repl too 03:57:42 (https://github.com/ahungry/color-theme-ahungry btw) 03:57:48 needed one that made emacs look good in -nw mode 03:57:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has joined #lisp 03:57:49 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has quit [Changing host] 03:57:49 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 03:58:03 ircbrowse [~chrisdone@2a01:4f8:150:5307::2] has joined #lisp 03:58:12 desophos [~desophos@n163h87.dhcp.oxy.edu] has joined #lisp 03:58:20 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:59:10 but if you really need that for bootstrapping reasons, then it seems that you'd want (eval-when (:compile-toplevel :load-toplevel :execute) (or (find-package "FFI") (make-package "FFI"))) 04:01:45 drmeiste_: I suppose you don't need a variable, but if I think defvar gives those semantics 04:03:04 Vivitron: Would (defvar ffi-package (make-package "FFI" :use '(:CL))) be a reasonable thing to do? 04:03:41 That sounds like a simple way to achieve what I'm looking for but I've never seen that idiom before. 04:03:53 marsam [~mario@190.222.203.103] has joined #lisp 04:04:38 -!- ircbrowse [~chrisdone@2a01:4f8:150:5307::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:05:48 it doesn't sound reasonable to me at all. I 04:05:57 'd like to understand why defpackage isn't an option 04:06:40 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:06:55 zeebrah [~zeebrah@unaffiliated/zeebrah] has joined #lisp 04:07:22 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:07:43 if you don't have enough of the system running to be able to macroexpand defpackage, why can you do it for defvar? 04:08:15 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-81-153.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:08:53 seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has joined #lisp 04:10:03 ircbrowse [~chrisdone@2a01:4f8:150:5307::2] has joined #lisp 04:10:05 sellout- [~Adium@75-166-108-196.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 04:10:33 pranavrc [~pranavrc@122.164.167.94] has joined #lisp 04:10:33 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@122.164.167.94] has quit [Changing host] 04:10:33 pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has joined #lisp 04:10:43 -!- zRecursive [~czsq888@183.13.198.51] has left #lisp 04:12:53 stardiviner [~stardivin@112.10.119.193] has joined #lisp 04:18:56 I don't have DEFPACKAGE at that point - does it only get defined once? DEFPACKAGE is pretty complicated - it gets defined pretty late. DEFVAR is very early. 04:20:07 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 04:21:13 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has joined #lisp 04:21:13 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has quit [Changing host] 04:21:13 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 04:22:31 -!- drmeiste_ [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:22:48 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 04:23:26 beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-225-37.w83-193.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 04:23:37 Good morning everyone! 04:23:55 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:24:36 jleija [~jleija@50.15.142.21] has joined #lisp 04:26:00 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 04:26:31 drmeister: ok, interesting if your defpackage requires a lot more stuff than make-package. even so I'd rather define an early-defpackage with an expansion like above rather than a dummy defvar 04:27:00 -!- stardiviner [~stardivin@112.10.119.193] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:27:21 protist [~protist@226.224.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has joined #lisp 04:27:31 drmeister: I read the logs. Why don't you just put your make-package in a separate file and only load it the first time? 04:28:39 beach: That is my work around but I was looking for a way to put it in the file that defines some FFI macros. 04:29:10 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:29:12 Here is the code for defpackage https://gist.github.com/drmeister/e54bac168963c5260e9b 04:30:27 Here it is for defvar. https://gist.github.com/drmeister/761c1f8105653d078ee5 04:30:38 defpackage uses loop which uses a lot of stuff. 04:31:06 CL is like one of those Russian nesting dolls. 04:32:11 I see what you mean. 04:34:11 mathrick: Thanks for taking the time to write up all those issues. 04:35:14 akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has joined #lisp 04:36:09 -!- marsam [~mario@190.222.203.103] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 04:36:49 -!- Emi [~Emi@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:36:49 -!- ORGANasm [~ORGANasm@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:37:23 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:40:17 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:43:15 -!- strobegen [~Adium@188.168.72.236] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:46:54 _tca [~user@h151.25.91.207.static.ip.windstream.net] has joined #lisp 04:48:02 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 04:49:19 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 04:50:08 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:50:14 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 04:52:37 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Client Quit] 04:53:24 akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has joined #lisp 04:54:47 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has joined #lisp 04:54:47 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has quit [Changing host] 04:54:47 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 04:57:48 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:59:39 -!- p_nathan1 [~Adium@173-160-167-74-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:07:49 kaydarla [~user@223.237.34.219] has joined #lisp 05:08:55 -!- kaydarla [~user@223.237.34.219] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:09:12 kaydarla [~user@223.237.34.219] has joined #lisp 05:09:12 akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has joined #lisp 05:13:33 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:13:39 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:14:15 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:15:34 teggi [~teggi@123.21.198.146] has joined #lisp 05:17:04 akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has joined #lisp 05:18:20 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:23:41 -!- synacktic [~jordyd@unaffiliated/jordyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:25:39 -!- _tca [~user@h151.25.91.207.static.ip.windstream.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:25:41 seangrove [~user@pool-71-119-101-193.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:29:51 hefner [~hefner@c-69-255-61-87.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:35:19 jasom: You are not the only one thinking that the dependencies between SICL modules are confusing. 05:36:04 jasom: This is because there are different kinds of dependencies. Most of the code is designed to be compiled by the file compiler. And the file compiler could be a cross compiler. 05:36:37 jasom: And in that case, you can assume that a full Common Lisp implementation is available at compile time. 05:37:02 alezost [~user@128-70-197-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:38:07 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 05:39:01 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.15.142.21] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:39:12 sohail [~sohail@69-196-154-168.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 05:39:12 -!- sohail [~sohail@69-196-154-168.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Changing host] 05:39:12 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 05:46:56 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:47:15 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has joined #lisp 05:47:15 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@178.89.176.211] has quit [Changing host] 05:47:15 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 05:51:52 kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has joined #lisp 05:51:55 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@user3-234-171.wireless.utoronto.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:56:15 -!- Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-193-178.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:56:15 -!- kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:57:47 Codynyx [~cody@c-75-72-193-178.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:00:37 -!- CrazyEddy [~CrazyEddy@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:03:28 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:08:42 kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has joined #lisp 06:09:19 -!- hefner [~hefner@c-69-255-61-87.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:10:50 -!- sellout- [~Adium@75-166-108-196.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:13:03 p_nathan1 [~Adium@174-21-83-115.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:13:04 -!- bgs100 [~nitrogen@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: bgs100] 06:15:01 -!- seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:15:09 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 06:15:33 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:19:57 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:21:05 breakds [~breakds@c-24-0-147-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:26:03 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:27:01 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.128.215] has joined #lisp 06:27:39 seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has joined #lisp 06:27:40 -!- seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:28:53 Ryan_Burnside [~ryan@63-153-68-220.hlna.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:29:32 I need to ask a question if anyone has time. It is about a value scope problem... 06:30:20 go ahead 06:30:34 I'm trying to set the value of a local instance using LET through a lambda function. Let me post my code with a brief explanation. 06:31:15 -!- breakds [~breakds@c-24-0-147-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:32:24 http://pastebin.com/0Urh31BW You can see I define a scrolled-text text modify function set in lines 39 - 62. Then attach them to a button press event in lines 76-87. It looks like they are not setting the text values properly. 06:33:03 It is as if the functions get called but fail to set the text. 06:34:11 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:34:22 text is an accessor? 06:34:42 Yes, it is the place for the scrolled-text's internal text string. 06:34:42 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 06:35:21 what's the definition of (setf text)? 06:35:32 seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has joined #lisp 06:35:40 -!- nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:36:59 OH! 06:37:04 I think I know what is going on. 06:37:24 The scrolled-text has a slot for a text field, I need to get the text value of it's text field. 06:38:54 No, looks like I was doing it right. 06:39:04 Bike, where do you see (setf text) ? 06:39:24 (setf (text widget) ...) 06:40:22 Well (text widget) is how you get to the text the widget has. I don't know if there is a variable called "text" anywhere. Maybe I misunderstand. 06:40:40 I'm just wondering if it's strictly a CLOS accessor 06:41:17 You can actually use (setf (text widget) "Hello") to make "Hello" appear in the scrolled-text widget. 06:41:24 Does that answer your question? 06:41:46 Something just seems to fall out of scope or not get set with my lambdas... 06:42:11 Line 76 for example. 06:42:22 well, i mean, this failure would make sense if the setfer worked on the variable and not an object instance 06:43:32 Actually the function called in line 76 does work. It is the functions like trim-list-strings that fail to modify when the widget is passed into the lambda in line 77. 06:44:53 yes. that is why i'm wondering. 06:44:59 have you tried trim-list-strings in isolation? 06:46:13 I believe it worked before just fine. Let me do a quick test to refresh my memory. 06:47:39 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:49:02 It does indeed work when used alone. 06:49:23 I'll post the code where it works so you can see. 06:50:35 http://pastebin.com/XqPwzEbq Lines 91 and 92 DO set the text and then trim it and set it once more. 06:52:39 well, i got no idea then, sorry 06:52:43 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:52:56 I appreciate the effort! 06:53:01 Thanks for taking a look. 06:53:19 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:53:21 GUI programming is kind of a mysterious thing sometimes. 06:53:40 LTK has done a very nice job for the most part. Little thin on documentation. 06:55:23 -!- seangrove [~user@pool-71-119-101-193.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:59:26 synacktic [~jordyd@unaffiliated/jordyd] has joined #lisp 07:01:30 Hurray got it! I needed to access a subclass stored in a slot. Odd, composite class problem. 07:03:47 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:04:44 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 07:14:39 maxpeck [~a@unaffiliated/maxpeck] has joined #lisp 07:14:44 -!- doomlord_ [~servitor@host86-184-9-9.range86-184.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:15:53 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 07:17:20 Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 07:19:04 -!- heddwch [~yoshi@76.8.3.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:20:04 Gooder [~user@218.69.12.194] has joined #lisp 07:20:23 heddwch [~yoshi@76.8.3.189] has joined #lisp 07:20:51 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 07:22:38 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:24:20 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 07:24:42 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #lisp 07:25:38 stepnem [~stepnem@internet2.cznet.cz] has joined #lisp 07:27:33 -!- seg [~seg@fsf/member/seg] has quit [Quit: adios amigos] 07:28:53 -!- synacktic [~jordyd@unaffiliated/jordyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:30:08 -!- kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:35:52 -!- Tribal [tribal@rcfreak0.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:38:32 Tribal [tribal@rcfreak0.com] has joined #lisp 07:39:15 -!- kaydarla [~user@223.237.34.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:40:12 resttime [~rest@c-50-158-65-143.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:40:14 -!- |3b| [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:43:23 mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has joined #lisp 07:45:11 prxq [~mommer@x2f6b214.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lisp 07:48:36 -!- blacklabel [~user@c-76-21-124-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:50:54 ydiscover [~Omnivora@113.52.233.162] has joined #lisp 07:51:03 -!- ydiscover [~Omnivora@113.52.233.162] has quit [Changing host] 07:51:03 ydiscover [~Omnivora@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has joined #lisp 07:51:50 -!- lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@148.4.11.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:56:02 stardiviner [~stardivin@112.10.119.193] has joined #lisp 07:58:33 Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 07:58:43 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-101.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:59:30 -!- Ryan_Burnside [~ryan@63-153-68-220.hlna.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:00:54 -!- pranavrc [~pranavrc@unaffiliated/pranavrc] has quit [Quit: Ping timeout: ] 08:07:51 -!- protist [~protist@226.224.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:07:58 pavelpenev [~quassel@130-204-14-33.2075264485.ddns.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 08:11:53 vaporatorius [~vaporator@84.Red-83-42-198.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:13:17 morning all 08:15:37 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:16:38 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 08:16:50 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 08:19:49 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:20:26 -!- p_nathan1 [~Adium@174-21-83-115.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:21:57 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:23:27 nug700 [~nug700@71-35-59-231.phnx.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 08:24:14 ggole [~ggole@106-68-8-76.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 08:25:25 -!- stardiviner [~stardivin@112.10.119.193] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:26:11 foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 08:27:40 Hello vaporatorius. 08:28:12 -!- CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:28:29 CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has joined #lisp 08:28:34 -!- CADD [~CADD@12.227.104.109] has quit [Client Quit] 08:31:18 vaporatorius: You seem to be relatively new here, right? 08:31:47 -!- vaporatorius is now known as Vaporatorius 08:37:45 -!- foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Yaaic - Yet another Android IRC client - http://www.yaaic.org] 08:37:57 foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 08:39:50 ya, last week I think that it's the first time that I joined to this channel, beach 08:41:35 OK, welcome then :) 08:45:17 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 08:48:15 thx :) 08:49:51 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:49:51 MrWoohoo2 [~MrWoohoo@pool-74-100-140-127.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 08:53:16 blacklabel [~user@c-76-21-124-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:57:47 -!- foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:58:54 hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@109.120.33.13] has joined #lisp 09:02:48 alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-76-75.w90-35.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 09:10:52 -!- nug700 [~nug700@71-35-59-231.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 09:16:11 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 09:33:19 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 09:33:33 bitonic [~user@xdsl-188-155-179-93.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 09:34:15 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 09:34:30 -!- maxpeck [~a@unaffiliated/maxpeck] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:35:56 can somebody provide me with reasoning for "Use iteration rather than recursion to scan a sequence one element at a 09:35:57 time. (Reserve recursion for situations where you _require_ a stack.)" ? found here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/comp.lang.lisp/xSvcQqVKSIo/kMbGX2Z4DgMJ 09:40:40 my noob knowledge can only think of efficiency by lessening function calls 09:40:47 tail call optimization isn't guaranteed in CL 09:41:20 so using recursion for an iterative process can blow the stack 09:41:48 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:42:05 so i'm half right :D ? 09:42:06 thanks. resttime, is the cost of calling a function significant, minus the stack level? (sorry if that was bad terminology) 09:42:10 worse, it can happen unpredictably. so everything works with your test data, but not with production data. or works on one implementation but not another 09:42:19 Code_Man` [~Code_Man@192-177.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 09:42:19 -!- Code_Man` [~Code_Man@192-177.5-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:43:10 impossible to say, depends on the implementation and the function 09:43:43 kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has joined #lisp 09:43:57 jsnell: how about a simple function that computes a fib 09:44:17 i remember i wrote that quickly and it was slow without memoizing 09:44:47 nenorbot [~ronen@bzq-79-183-117-215.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 09:44:51 oh wait scratch that, unrelated 09:44:52 that's because of all the redundant calls with the same value it makes, not because of function call overhead 09:45:00 lol yeah 09:45:37 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit 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[~ronen@bzq-79-183-117-215.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:11:43 36DABTV8K [~hiro@p210079202073.cnh.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 12:12:04 vi1 [~vi1@93.92.216.186] has joined #lisp 12:12:51 -!- akersof [~akersof@unaffiliated/zoroaster] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:16:06 munge [~user@cpe-075-178-033-080.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:17:06 zeebrah [~zeebrah@unaffiliated/zeebrah] has joined #lisp 12:17:27 akersof [~akersof@unaffiliated/zoroaster] has joined #lisp 12:25:37 beach: sure. I'm not fully done looking through our logs to see if there isn't something we've discussed that I forgot, so I'll add more if I find any 12:27:31 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:32:31 mathrick: OK, sounds good. 12:32:31 klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has joined #lisp 12:32:44 cmack`` [~charlie@adsl-98-87-45-108.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 12:34:40 -!- cmack` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-25-21.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:36:53 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:39:08 Bardamu [~Bardamu@unaffiliated/bardamu] has joined #lisp 12:39:12 Hello 12:45:39 hi 12:49:11 -!- vi1 [~vi1@93.92.216.186] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:49:36 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.128.215] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:50:50 Bardamu: It looks to me like you have been away for a year :) 12:54:20 -!- hiroakip [~hiroaki@ip-178-202-201-114.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:02:20 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:02:33 TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has joined #lisp 13:04:20 beach: really ? :D 13:04:33 who are you ? 13:08:08 Bardamu: I just know to read the channel logs. 13:08:18 .... which I do whenever I see a nick that I don't recognize. 13:08:27 Don't worry. I don't know you and you don't know me. 13:08:43 you are french too so I thought maybe you know me 13:09:10 piano_slut [~slut_tits@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:09:13 hi 13:11:10 Bardamu: Oh, well, then maybe I do. :) 13:11:15 Pheizi [~other@188.162.64.25] has joined #lisp 13:11:18 hello 13:11:35 Hello Pheizi and hello piano_slut. 13:12:06 how can o create keyword programmatically? Basicly i want to create new keyworkd and eq it with something like :foo. 13:12:32 ugh, sorry for spelling. 13:12:43 Pheizi: What will you create if from? The name (a string)? 13:12:56 clhs intern 13:12:57 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_intern.htm 13:13:35 beach: nah, (eq :foo (intern "foo")) => nil 13:13:55 Pheizi: Two things. 13:14:07 Pheizi: First, you need to intern it into the keyword package. 13:14:20 Pheizi: Second, by default, names are uppercase. 13:14:36 Does my nick offend anyone? 13:14:44 Pheizi: (eq (intern "HELLO" '#:keyword) :hello) => T 13:14:47 ebre csdf 13:15:03 thanks 13:15:12 /quit 13:15:17 piano_slut: No, it could be Swedish "piano ending" 13:15:25 Pheizi: Anytime. 13:15:40 -!- Pheizi [~other@188.162.64.25] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:17:13 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-36-35.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:20:00 Haha 13:20:09 It seems to be offending a lot of people 13:20:13 thinking of making a NSFW channel 13:20:15 a refuge 13:20:16 ! 13:25:35 ccorn [~ccorn@92.110.20.203] has joined #lisp 13:29:29 -!- TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:34:45 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:35:01 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-82-201.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:36:13 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-52-166-24.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:40:33 -!- oleo [~oleo@xdsl-78-35-185-207.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:41:00 oleo [~oleo@xdsl-87-79-196-135.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:41:00 LiamH [~none@pool-173-73-122-143.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:51:02 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@92.110.20.203] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 13:51:40 -!- matko [~matko@ip82-139-127-72.lijbrandt.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:52:22 matko [~matko@ip82-139-127-72.lijbrandt.net] has joined #lisp 13:52:25 smokeink [~sm@183.156.26.238] has joined #lisp 13:53:15 STilda [kvirc@37.139.166.54] has joined #lisp 13:54:54 kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-212-248.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:56:50 -!- smokeink [~sm@183.156.26.238] has left #lisp 13:57:34 TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has joined #lisp 14:01:31 doomlord_ [~servitor@host86-184-9-9.range86-184.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 14:03:03 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-82-201.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 14:04:34 -!- piano_slut is now known as harpsichord 14:13:49 someone know if a function exists to add an element to a list only when the element is not already in ? 14:14:22 I can write this function but I prefer to use a standard function if it does exist 14:15:20 -!- ydiscover [~Omnivora@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:15:47 sellout- [~Adium@97-118-116-71.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 14:16:04 dcxi [~dcxi@124.Red-83-33-87.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:16:18 clhs pushnew 14:16:18 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_pshnew.htm 14:17:31 -!- |JRG|` [~user@dynamic-adsl-94-34-128-147.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 14:17:59 Bardamu: In fact, you asked this same question a year ago. Does this mean you have not been able to finish your code for that long? 14:18:19 sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has joined #lisp 14:18:33 ahahahhaha 14:19:06 beach: no I'm writting another code 14:20:09 OK, well you can use pushnew or you can use adjoin. 14:20:14 Depending on your situation. 14:20:17 clhs adjoin 14:20:17 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_adjoin.htm 14:20:41 yes I remember now, I used adjoin! 14:21:51 beach: I write lisp only once by year ^^ 14:21:57 in lisp* 14:22:00 Got it. 14:22:20 It's shame though. You should do it more often. 14:24:25 beach: Xmas is near, i suspect Bardamu might be some kind of Lisp Santa writing lisp once in a year and then he gives it to good kids. 14:24:48 That would explain it I guess. 14:25:05 -!- kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-212-248.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:25:34 kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-96-50.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:27:48 bgs100 [~nitrogen@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 14:28:32 actually I'm a student and I'm writting an inference engine order 0+ 14:34:08 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.128.215] has joined #lisp 14:35:22 Bardamu: you could use lisp to code your other projects too. 14:35:52 If the teachers requires absolutely that you deliver sources in other languages, just write a code generator in lisp to translate your lisp program into the language expected by the teachers. 14:36:11 There are also several such code generators. linj for java, parenscript for javascript, clicc for C, etc. 14:43:15 CrazyEddy [~unappenda@113.52.233.162] has joined #lisp 14:43:20 -!- CrazyEddy [~unappenda@113.52.233.162] has quit [Changing host] 14:43:20 CrazyEddy [~unappenda@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has joined #lisp 14:44:21 -!- kaydarla [~user@106.197.220.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:49:17 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-82-201.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 14:50:32 antonv [5daba1b0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.171.161.176] has joined #lisp 14:50:38 |3b|` [bbb@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:5b65] has joined #lisp 14:51:29 -!- bitonic [~user@xdsl-188-155-179-93.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:52:29 -!- |3b|` is now known as |3b| 14:55:15 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@2602:306:36c6:db10:3ea9:f4ff:fe31:5798] has joined #lisp 14:56:55 -!- harpsichord [~slut_tits@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 14:56:58 lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@113.116.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 14:57:28 harpsichord [~harpsicho@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:58:53 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:59:18 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 15:00:04 What is the point of the THE special operator? ECL has a TRULY-THE - what's the point of that? 15:01:03 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 15:03:41 drmeister: I can't tell you about TRULY-THE, but THE allows the compiler to generate code that assumes that the result has the correct type. 15:04:09 It's defined (defmacro ext:truly-the (&rest args) `(the ,@args)) - so it doesn't seem to do anything beyond THE - why would it be there? 15:04:50 (the fixnum (+ a b)) --> no need to test if a+b is fixnum, the programmer told the compiler it was. 15:04:58 Ok, so it's more of a compiler hint. 15:05:30 With low safety levels, it can make the code unsafe, given that the weak link in this chain is the human programmer 15:05:46 ie. as an implementer, you're free to ignore it. 15:06:05 (defmacro the (type expression) (declare (ignore type)) expression) is a perfectly good implementation. 15:06:52 I wouldn't say "good" :) "conforming" perhaps? 15:07:02 But if you want to keep it in the spirit of C++, you can instead generate: (fixnum)(a+b), even if char* a="hello"; float b=3.14; 15:07:18 beach: that's what I mean, yes :-) 15:07:38 -!- TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:07:54 Thank you. 15:08:07 The haunting C spirit inside C++ :-) 15:08:34 TheShrubber [~jonas@ip123021.directconnect.no] has joined #lisp 15:10:48 drmeister: There is an ir1-translator for TRULY-THE 15:11:15 Check ir1-translators.lisp (line 956) 15:12:57 |JRG| [c209f2f0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.9.242.240] has joined #lisp 15:15:12 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 15:15:39 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 15:16:15 -!- yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:17:10 loke__`: Where is ir1-translators.lisp? 15:17:16 drmeister: ecl doesn't really have truly-the, it's from sbcl and cmucl, it's a type declaration without a type-check 15:20:00 stassats: I just realized I've struggled with TRULY-THE several months ago and made it a special operator (I made it an alias for THE) But I put it in the :SYS package rather than the :EXT package where ECL expects it and all heck broke loose. 15:20:00 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@130-204-14-33.2075264485.ddns.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:20:26 i retract saying that ecl doesn't have it, it does 15:21:02 I'm switching to a two stage bootstrapping process - bootstrap a minimal CL environment without CLOS and then use that to compile the complete CL environment with CLOS. It's revealing some new problems. 15:21:32 -!- hiyosi [~skip_it@247.94.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.1] 15:22:36 That's ok, I wasn't sure what you meant by "doesn't really have truly-the" - ECL defines truly-the as a macro that I've used #- to ignore because I just define truly-the as an alias. I'm repeating myself. 15:23:17 no, it handles truly-the as a special form 15:25:51 hiyosi [~skip_it@247.94.30.125.dy.iij4u.or.jp] has joined #lisp 15:28:07 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 15:29:58 stassats: At the very bottom of the ECL source file: evalmacros.lsp it defines (defmacro ext:truly-the (&rest args) `(the ,@args)) Do you know why they do this if they also define truly-the as a special form? I'm not arguing, sometimes things are done for subtle reasons that I don't appreciate at first. 15:30:20 for the interpreter? 15:31:02 And you are correct: in compiler.d is {@'ext::truly-the', c_the, 0} 15:31:25 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:31:47 I'm just dealing with interpreter/compiler issues. Why would one define a special operator ext::truly-the and a macro ext::truly-the? 15:32:07 akbiggs [~akbiggs@24-212-189-181.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 15:32:12 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 15:32:33 non-standard special operators should always have a macroexpansion 15:32:41 -!- sellout- [~Adium@97-118-116-71.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:32:51 for code walkers 15:32:57 Because I defined a SYS::TRULY-THE special operator and ignore the EXT::TRULY-THE macro. 15:33:43 jsnell: There you go - I now can smell when there's a special issue even if I don't understand it yet. 15:35:22 So non-standard special operators need a macroexpansion for code walkers... That's because a code walker needs to implement a function for every special-operator and if it doesn't know about the special-operator then it will treat it like a function application - is that your point? 15:36:26 right 15:36:46 drmeister: special operators, like macros, handle their arguments however they want. function calls always get their arguments evaluated. Not so with macros and special operators. 15:36:46 Wow, not in a million years would I have figured that out on my own - thank you. 15:37:47 drmeister: some arguments to macros or special operators may be ignored, some may be code (&body), and some may define local variables or functions or macros, or the macro or special operator may even define local variables functions or macros that are not named in the operator call. 15:38:08 pjb: I understand special operators/macros and function applications. It's the more subtle issue that if I implement a non-standard special operator that code walkers will run into problems if I don't also implement a macro for it. It makes perfect sense in retrospect. 15:38:11 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@24-212-189-181.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:38:44 drmeister: to let the code walker know about that, a non-standard special operator need a macro that expands to a form containing only standard special operators or function calls (macros are expanded automatically), so the code walker can know what's a new local variable, function or macro, and what's code. 15:38:45 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-101.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:39:10 pjb: I understand - thanks. 15:39:34 _tca [~user@h151.25.91.207.static.ip.windstream.net] has joined #lisp 15:40:42 is ther a #not lisp channel? 15:42:20 Emi: #lispcafe or #lisplab ? 15:43:04 #lisp-lab actually. 15:44:14 Emi: I don't know what you are asking. 15:45:28 I interpreted that as a channel about lisp but not Common Lisp. #lisp-lab is that. 15:46:08 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-006-107.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 15:49:01 akbiggs [~akbiggs@24-212-189-181.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 15:49:18 Like a #lisp-offtopic thing 15:49:30 I like people that know lisp 15:49:32 bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:49:34 but I know nothing about it 15:49:35 sttrange huh 15:49:51 You can learn. 15:49:59 Since the head of a form is first checked to see if its a special operator and then if there is a macro with the same name as a special operator, the macro will be ignored except in the case of a code-walker. 15:50:18 lisp off topic is #lispcafe 15:51:08 drmeister: exactly. 15:51:08 surrounder [~surrounde@095-096-032-026.static.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 15:51:52 Ok, I'm just checking if that is the case in my system and adding macros for my other two non-standard special operators. 15:53:19 Notice that often those macros don't need any sophistication: they may just expand to some system function call with a lambda: (defmacro truely-the (type expression) `(system::truly-the ',type (lambda () ,expression))) 15:54:12 pjb: Yep - I see that. 15:54:25 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@24-212-189-181.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 15:54:44 What's the deal with code-walkers - my understanding is that they are notoriously difficult to make portable and every time I've suggested writing one people say "don't". 15:55:14 I'd love to have a MACROEXPAND-DAMMIT macro. 15:58:18 I ran into that yesterday. I was trying to get the PSET macro to compile and it uses DO and DO uses PSET and I was in infinite loop macroexpansion hell. So I expanded the PSET macro with SBCL by hand, modified the code and inserted it into my source code. 15:59:25 Actually, MACROEXPAND-DAMMIT (fully expand all macros) would have gone into an infinite loop anyway - never mind. 16:00:07 -!- munge [~user@cpe-075-178-033-080.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:05 sellout- [~Adium@97-118-116-71.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:11 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:06:15 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-76-75.w90-35.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:06:26 lyanchih [~lyanchih@220-134-193-4.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 16:07:42 -!- sellout- [~Adium@97-118-116-71.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:09:07 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-006-107.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:10:56 pnpuff [~ff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 16:13:23 Joreji [~thomas@172-212.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 16:13:56 fantom_ua [~x3User129@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:02 breakds [~breakds@c-24-0-147-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:19:35 -!- fantom_ua [~x3User129@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:19:59 Pullphinger [~Pullphing@c-24-13-69-42.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:33 alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-61-104.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:22:02 zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 16:24:38 hydan [~user@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 16:26:41 mirpa [~spock@ravys1.infos.cz] has joined #lisp 16:26:58 -!- lyanchih [~lyanchih@220-134-193-4.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: lyanchih] 16:27:28 fantom-ukraine [~fantom_ua@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has joined #lisp 16:27:57 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-61-104.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3-dev] 16:28:23 -!- dcxi [~dcxi@124.Red-83-33-87.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: dcxi] 16:28:59 lyanchih [~lyanchih@220-134-193-4.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 16:29:03 lisp users 16:29:06 hi 16:29:19 hello 16:29:25 Emi: Hello (again). 16:29:52 yep 16:29:53 I am back 16:30:59 -!- zeebrah [~zeebrah@unaffiliated/zeebrah] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:31:56 alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-61-104.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:38:12 munge [~user@cpe-075-178-033-080.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:39:55 drmeister: What is your motivation for doing the project? Seems interesting from what you are saying, by the way. 16:42:06 foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 16:42:28 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:43:43 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:44:44 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:45:18 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:46:37 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-101.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 16:48:59 -!- fantom-ukraine [~fantom_ua@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has left #lisp 16:49:34 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:50:14 davazp [~user@178.167.254.185.threembb.ie] has joined #lisp 16:50:48 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-61-104.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3-dev] 16:51:53 -!- foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:52:17 foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 16:53:01 NikolaiDante [~nikolaida@unaffiliated/knighterrant] has joined #lisp 16:53:02 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-58.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:53:37 -!- foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Client Quit] 16:53:51 foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 16:53:51 -!- foobartze [~yaaic@p4FFEFA65.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Client Quit] 16:54:28 -!- samskulls [~user@S0106001111de1fc8.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:55:43 teggi [~teggi@123.21.198.146] has joined #lisp 17:00:30 drmeister [~drmeister@166.137.104.11] has joined #lisp 17:02:32 -!- kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-96-50.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:04:11 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@166.137.104.11] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:05:55 -!- NikolaiDante [~nikolaida@unaffiliated/knighterrant] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:06:08 drmeister [~drmeister@166.137.104.11] has joined #lisp 17:08:54 lc0dd0cl2 [~thisismyu@113.116.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 17:11:09 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.128.215] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:11:52 -!- lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@113.116.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:16:17 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-225-37.w83-193.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:21:48 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has joined #lisp 17:21:55 beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-225-37.w83-193.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:26:09 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:27:30 -!- klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. 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What language is it? 18:42:29 older lisp i guess 18:43:04 Hard to know what it means without knowing the language. 18:43:31 siod 18:43:35 siod90 18:44:00 OK, let's see. SIOD is Scheme, so you could check the Scheme report. 18:44:20 Let's see if specbot knows... 18:44:29 scheme eq? 18:44:31 resttime [~rest@c-50-158-65-143.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:44:44 r4rs eq? 18:44:53 Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 18:45:03 I guess specbot doesn't know. 18:45:42 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:45:43 black_13: A wild guess would be the identity predicate of Scheme, but I have forgotten all my Scheme. 18:46:01 black_13: Like EQ of Common Lisp 18:46:17 ok 18:46:30 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 18:47:57 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:49:17 beach: i believe that is it 18:49:33 (set! x (list 1 2 3)) 18:49:43 (eq? x x) -> t 18:49:45 -!- lc0dd0cl2 [~thisismyu@113.116.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:49:48 OK, it looks plausible. 18:50:12 siod90 is 1234 lines of code sans startup scm file 18:50:31 lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@28.2.11.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 18:50:49 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@46.233.194.202] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 18:52:30 black_13: I can believe that. 18:53:26 -!- stuckie [~stuckie@88.208.208.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:56:03 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has joined #lisp 18:56:54 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@128-68-255-53.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:58:06 -!- alexherbo2 [~alexherbo@APlessis-Bouchard-154-1-61-104.w90-3.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3-dev] 18:58:11 black_13: So, you seem to have a thing for implementations of Lisp-like languages with few lines of code in C, right? 18:59:44 -!- diogenes_ [~anon@a89-155-11-217.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:00:36 slarti [~anonymous@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:33 yeah 19:02:08 i have the crazy idea of putting lisp into an arm processor with a small memory footprint 19:02:16 black_13: There is also a thing called lisp500, but I suppose you know about it, then? 19:02:24 Oh, I see. 19:02:54 i may have its hard to read 19:03:04 do you have a link 19:03:22 Nah, that was just from memory. 19:03:53 -!- |JRG| [c209f2f0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.9.242.240] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:03:53 siod is not hard to understand if you have a mid-level understanding of ascii C 19:04:10 "ascii C"? 19:04:11 also it supports floating point operations 19:04:19 ANSI C? 19:04:23 sorry 19:04:28 your correct 19:05:24 Maybe so, but you sort of get what you pay for. You can probably get it arbitrarily short if you skimp on functionality. 19:06:03 As you pointed out, SIOD also needs a startup file in Scheme in order to obtain a reasonable level of functionality. 19:06:30 Vivitron [~Vivitron@c-50-172-44-193.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:07:23 diogenes_ [~anon@a89-155-11-217.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 19:09:24 when i want a bicycle i want bicycle ... not a car 19:09:49 siod is a really nice 1 speed bike 19:10:10 Good for you then. 19:10:15 good for me 19:12:07 Inside every large program, there is a small program trying to get out. --Tony Hoare 19:12:28 -!- diogenes_ [~anon@a89-155-11-217.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:13:01 Yeah, I get it. As long as you know what you are doing, no problem. 19:13:50 this going to run in microcontroller it kind of needs to be small 19:14:46 i was have whopping 256k for static memory and 64k for dynamic if i understand it 19:14:54 i have i mean 19:15:07 -!- lyanchih [~lyanchih@220-134-193-4.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: lyanchih] 19:15:35 -!- black_13 [46729910@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.114.153.16] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:22:06 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:24:08 fridim_ [~fridim@bas2-montreal07-2925317577.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 19:24:51 mathrick [~mathrick@94.144.63.208] has joined #lisp 19:29:54 nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 19:31:39 -!- beach [~user@ABordeaux-651-1-225-37.w83-193.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:31:51 -!- sohail [~sohail@unaffiliated/sohail] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 19:32:51 -!- slarti [~anonymous@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:33:30 -!- oxum [~oxum@122.164.154.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:34:47 optikalmouse [~omouse@69-165-245-60.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 19:35:06 pnpuff [~ff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 19:38:04 oxum [~oxum@122.164.184.8] has joined #lisp 19:52:24 Sikander [~userid@2001:981:9847:1:120b:a9ff:fea3:6380] has joined #lisp 19:53:55 Hi guys, LTK question: I see that tkwait is not implemented. How can you create a toplevel dialog and wait until the user closes it to get the resulting values? 19:54:56 kristof [~kristof@162-236-113-137.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:55:26 Hi Sikander, long time no see! (sorry, no answer to your question) 19:56:17 Hi LiamH! I've been really busy with non-lisp-related matters; I now have a new (non-academic) job and therefore more free time :) 19:56:42 What's your job? 19:57:03 -!- echo-area [~user@111.196.4.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:57:22 I'm working for ASML, the market leader in photolithographic scanners 19:57:47 *LiamH* googles photolithographic scanners 19:58:08 The stuff Intel, Samsung and TSMC use to make chips 19:58:14 They're also our clients 19:58:31 Oh, good. I got an ad for scanners on sale at Walmart. 19:59:08 They probably contain chips made in our scanners! 19:59:12 -!- kristof [~kristof@162-236-113-137.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 19:59:12 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 19:59:16 So it's all good! 19:59:36 Probably so does my computer, and everything else with a chip. 19:59:59 The estimate is that we have 80% of the market 20:00:08 But that doesn't answer my question, though... 20:00:33 I am on the ltk mailing list, but I've never really used it. 20:01:49 I don't understand: cliki puts LTK on the recommended list. But if you can't make a modal dialog... 20:02:12 Tkinter (python Tk bindings) does allow it, but all my other code is in cl (and I prefer cl) 20:02:33 I meant, Tkinter does implement tkwait, so modal is possible 20:02:38 The mailing list is pretty quiet, I'm not sure how many users there are. 20:03:01 -!- akbiggs [~akbiggs@24-212-189-181.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:03:27 Hum, any alternates for guis that also work under windows? 20:03:36 alternatives 20:05:31 Not being a GUI person, I've heard of things but can't say what works where and what's good. 20:06:57 I'm not really a gui person either... But this time I need to be able to visualize something. 20:07:09 <|3b|> browser, ltk and common-qt seem to be the most popular 20:07:16 Are you just plotting? 20:07:35 I've used cl-plplot for plotting with some success, though my most recent attempt failed. 20:07:50 For plotting I use gnuplot actually 20:08:43 I usually use Tikz/PGFplots, but when I want instant output, I use cl-plplot, even writing two versions of the same function. 20:09:42 I'm using gnuplot with cl 20:10:02 Is there a CL system for that? 20:10:14 There are several, but *ahem* I rolled my own 20:10:44 -!- gigetoo [~gigetoo@c83-250-61-4.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:10:55 I'm not familiar with using common lisp libraries, but I have read more than a few times that some people get frustrated with the libraries and just right their own. 20:11:10 Sikander: because it's better than all of them, right? 20:11:44 *write. That's either a compliment to Common Lisp as a language (for being able to effectively write good libraries in a short time), an insult to the libraries that exist, or both. 20:11:55 LiamH: not really necessarily; for some calculations I was using gsll and wanted to be able to directly plot the resulting foreign arrays 20:12:53 LiamH: and plot it alongside a lisp function, which was used to fit the data 20:12:54 Sikander: Exactly what I do. But I have no general purpose library (yet) to drive any plotting package/library. 20:13:00 kristof: or neither (for completeness :)) 20:13:07 gigetoo [~gigetoo@c83-250-61-4.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 20:13:26 antonv: It's probably that option. :) 20:13:49 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:13:54 Well, the thing is just that I wanted a lispy interface for plotting, plotting styles etc 20:14:18 antonv: I'm coming from using Clojure for about a year, and I was pretty impressed with it the whole way through. Drank the kool-aid and sang the songs. And yet, now that I'm learning Common Lisp, I, uh, don't quite like the taste of the kool-aid anymore. 20:14:34 And most of the libraries were too bare 20:14:36 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 20:14:44 hahaha 20:14:55 Sikander: At the moment, I'm in the process of dividing Antik up into separate systems, so that e.g. you can load grid without physical-dimension. 20:15:43 antonv: The thing I hear repeated over and over again is that Clojure is a "modern" lisp and yet that's never really explained in detail. I get vague references to functional programming as a paradigm, immutable data, "orthogonal features", and "modern platforms". But the more I learn about CL, the more it looks like that it's not missing anything modern at all. 20:15:49 LiamH: That's good to hear! The whole thing is quite a beast to load 20:16:35 kristof: I am glad you enjoy CL :) 20:16:58 Sikander: it's trickier than I imagined, but I think I've got it in a decent place now. I'll need to use it myself for a while before I merge it into master. 20:17:29 What I dislike is how long it takes for e.g. SBCL to boot 20:17:30 antonv: I'm starting to come to the conclusion that Clojure is merely a strict subset of CL, with an 'enterprise-worthy' host, and access to lots of libraries. Which is all important, or at least useful, but it doesn't actually say anything about Clojure as a language. 20:17:50 Sikander: huh? SBCL comes up instantly for me. 20:17:54 And it says even less about CL or its "modernity". 20:17:57 LiamH: Really? 20:18:12 not when you load loads of libs.... 20:18:17 Sikander: you do make a core with all your definitions, right? 20:18:27 Yes 20:18:28 hugod [~user@65.94.29.121] has joined #lisp 20:18:53 But it always takes a second 20:18:55 stuckie [~stuckie@88.208.208.174] has joined #lisp 20:19:05 Yeah, a second. That's long? 20:19:10 Comparing with e.g. guile... 20:19:34 You live in a fast-paced world 20:19:48 I have no patience for these things, dammit! 20:20:00 I don't want it in a second, I want it NOW! 20:20:01 Except when I'm debugging, I start SBCL maybe once a week or two. 20:21:27 Perhaps it's because I'm still doing a lot in the shell; so when I run an (sb)cl program from the shell (with a specialized core), the start-up always annoys me 20:22:11 Is there an LTK user around? 20:23:46 :( 20:23:57 anyone using cl-cffi-gtk? 20:24:46 Did I kill all conversation? 20:24:52 Sikander: the startup times of sbcl with your application dumped as core file annoys you? 20:25:06 Sikander: are you maybe doing too much in your sbclrc? 20:25:27 H4ns: There's nothing there :( 20:25:42 Sikander: no, I think you asked questions that no one has an affirmative answer to. 20:25:53 :( 20:25:53 gendl_ [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:28 when you dump an image make sure you compiled all stuff before.... 20:26:31 Which gui library do people generally use? 20:26:36 ? 20:26:49 Sikander: starting and exiting sbcl takes something like 10 ms for me. is that too slow for you? 20:26:55 Wow 20:26:58 or libs still get loaded ? 20:27:02 yacks [~py@103.6.159.103] has joined #lisp 20:27:51 or you are still loading libs which are already loaded ? 20:28:13 or rather have been dumped onto the image ? 20:28:49 <|3b|> Sikander: browser, ltk and common-qt seem to be the most popular guis 20:29:11 If I use the default core and --no-userinit --no-sysinit, and run/quit the first time, then it boots fast 20:29:30 Sikander: ok, and what do you do to make it slow? 20:30:00 H4ns: What I'm saying is that even with that core and those options, the first boot is on the order of a second 20:30:05 H4ns: Next boot is blazing fast 20:30:18 |3b|: any pointers to how to use the browser? 20:30:48 <|3b|> Sikander: run a web server, connect to it from browser 20:32:30 |3b|: which server typically? And which lib to generate pages/interaction? 20:33:00 <|3b|> hunchentoot is probably most popular server, i've been using it through restas lately 20:33:13 -!- davazp [~user@178.167.254.185.threembb.ie] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:33:39 |3b|: thanks, I'll have a look 20:33:45 <|3b|> lots of libs for generating html or expanding html templates (cl-who, sexml, yaclml, etc) 20:34:27 <|3b|> or you can have a minimal html page and do most of the work in js, possibly using parenscript which compiles something resembling cl to javascript 20:35:02 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:38 drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has joined #lisp 20:35:46 *|3b|* would probably try common-qt first for something that is only accessed from 1 (desktop) machine, though i've heard it is a hassle to get running on windows 20:36:00 <|3b|> (possibly easier now though, i think someone built binaries for the libs it needs) 20:36:33 Hey 20:37:41 Corvidium [~cosman246@c-24-143-118-11.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #lisp 20:37:52 |3b|: actually, the browser is a nice idea; it would allow accessing my applications from computers that don't even have a lisp installed 20:39:33 <|3b|> yeah, i have some browser-ui things i access from a tablet, which would be harder with a standalone lisp program 20:39:45 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-28.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 20:40:00 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:41:50 |3b|: holy crap, and making some snappy graphics with raphael.js should be possible from lisp and parenscript? 20:43:18 slut_tits 20:44:10 classy 20:44:16 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@94.144.63.208] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:44:27 *|3b|* would assume so 20:44:38 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has joined #lisp 20:45:20 drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has joined #lisp 20:51:12 l_ [~l_@84.233.246.170] has joined #lisp 20:52:25 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 20:52:28 gendl has built-in lenses for raphael.js. 20:52:34 -!- pnpuff [~ff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [] 20:52:48 as well as pdf, jpeg, png, x3d, x3dom 20:54:54 forgot ... 20:55:22 -!- l_ [~l_@84.233.246.170] has left #lisp 20:56:33 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-198-255-198-157.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:58:47 gendl: is this it: http://70.33.254.76/sessions/36ad63b963c/index.html ? 20:59:08 that site talks about the commercial Genworks GDL product 20:59:26 Gendl is the open-source project: http://github.com/genworks/gendl 20:59:34 also available as (ql:quickload :gendl) 20:59:39 got it 20:59:49 also available in some pre-built bundles like http://gendlformacosx.com 21:00:05 (working on bringing those up to date with automated builds for mac, linux, windows) 21:00:57 gendl: quickloading fails: Symbol "INITIALIZE!" not found in the PDF package. 21:01:45 do you have a local cl-pdf somewhere? or did november quicklisp regress its cl-pdf somehow... there should be an initialize! function in cl-pdf (checking...) 21:01:58 lemme check 21:02:18 btw what platform/OS are you on? 21:02:27 and can move this to #gendl 21:03:47 -!- hugod [~user@65.94.29.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:06:30 AlterSid [~sid@altersid.net] has joined #lisp 21:07:05 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-5d81595f.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:09:54 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:10:50 -!- zacharias [~aw@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 21:11:33 -!- optikalmouse [~omouse@69-165-245-60.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:11:48 -!- klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:12:34 -!- dtw [~dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:13:16 optikalmouse [~omouse@69-165-245-60.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 21:13:54 hugod [~user@70.24.177.56] has joined #lisp 21:15:34 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.128.215] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:17:56 -!- hydan [~user@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:24:44 -!- stepnem [~stepnem@internet2.cznet.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:25:07 -!- oxum [~oxum@122.164.184.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:31:25 -!- alezost [~user@128-70-197-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:33:00 cory786 [~cory@75-22-101-128.lightspeed.dblnoh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:36:42 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 21:38:32 -!- STilda [kvirc@37.139.166.54] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 21:38:52 -!- sfa [~sfa@208.66.156.12] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:43:57 capitaomorte [~capitaomo@66.207.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 21:45:17 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:51:01 -!- kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:52:30 quesebifurcan [~fredrik@xdsl-87-78-0-206.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:54:43 fisxoj [~fisxoj@24-212-142-77.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 21:54:52 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@24-212-142-77.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:55:00 sirdancealo2 [~sirdancea@194.228.11.188] has joined #lisp 21:55:51 mathrick [~mathrick@94.144.63.208] has joined #lisp 21:56:39 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:14 drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has joined #lisp 22:00:37 -!- mirpa [~spock@ravys1.infos.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:00:42 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-8-78.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 22:02:08 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@155.247.96.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:02:41 Karl_dscc [~localhost@p5DD9FFD0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 22:02:49 kristof [~kristof@unaffiliated/kristof] has joined #lisp 22:03:39 kobain [~sambio@unaffiliated/kobain] has joined #lisp 22:03:47 oxum [~oxum@122.164.20.73] has joined #lisp 22:06:27 Well, time for me to call it a night 22:06:35 bye 22:06:50 -!- Sikander [~userid@2001:981:9847:1:120b:a9ff:fea3:6380] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:06:52 ASau` [~user@p54AFFE7B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 22:07:13 -!- optikalmouse [~omouse@69-165-245-60.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:07:42 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-101.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:08:02 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@2602:306:36c6:db10:3ea9:f4ff:fe31:5798] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:08:04 -!- ASau [~user@p5083DBB8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:09:53 Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 22:10:28 fantom-ukraine [~fantomcsm@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has joined #lisp 22:10:59 minion: memo for drmeister: the needs of code walkers are not only needed by code walkers. See for example cl-stepper. It's not a code walker per se, but it has the same requirements. https://gitorious.org/com-informatimago/com-informatimago/source/common-lisp/lisp 22:10:59 Remembered. I'll tell drmeister when he/she/it next speaks. 22:11:20 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 22:11:48 Oh, that's an excellent bot 22:12:37 -!- archonix [~none@78.90.30.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:12:42 -!- fantom-ukraine [~fantomcsm@213-227-249-50.static.vega-ua.net] has left #lisp 22:13:45 -!- arenz [~arenz@37.17.234.253] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:15:39 -!- protist [~protist@42.224.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:16:57 -!- nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:25:07 <|3b|> what should (format nil "~<~a~:>" (list 1 2 3)) return? 22:25:26 all the elements in that list 22:25:41 -!- thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:25:50 1:2:3 ? 22:26:18 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 22:26:28 thelorax123 [~nodebot@165.225.138.217] has joined #lisp 22:26:31 no wait you don't have the iterator.... 22:26:34 *|3b|* gets "1" from sbcl, ccl, ecl, and "(1 2 3)" from clisp, but doesn't understand why either of those would be correct from looking at spec 22:27:16 <|3b|> ah, maybe i see now 22:27:58 *|3b|* wasn't reading "applied to the elements of the list ... as a whole" right, i think 22:29:37 -!- cory786 [~cory@75-22-101-128.lightspeed.dblnoh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:33:43 kaygun__ [~kaygun@78.180.237.103] has joined #lisp 22:35:33 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@88.115.137.88.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:40:01 -!- strobegen1 [~Adium@188.168.72.236] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:41:54 -!- harpsichord [~harpsicho@cpe-76-176-71-218.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:42:18 -!- lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@28.2.11.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:42:38 lc0dd0cl [~thisismyu@28.2.11.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 22:45:21 Pullphinger 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