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07:16:31 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-126-167-134.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 07:16:48 why does (format t "~,2f" 9.575) output 9.57 not 9.58 ? 07:17:23 I guess 9.575 isn't perfectly representable as a floating point number 07:17:54 so the compiler picks the closest one, which might be 9.574999999999 something 07:17:58 -!- capisce_ is now known as capisce 07:18:50 but (format t "~,4f" pi) => 3.1416 07:21:14 capisce: in haskell printf "%.2f" 9.575 => 9.58 07:22:42 fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 07:23:34 -!- fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has quit [Client Quit] 07:23:58 fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 07:24:21 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 07:24:27 zRecursive: what is printf in Haskell? 07:24:31 -!- fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has quit [Client Quit] 07:24:48 fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 07:25:02 -!- nbouscal [~nbouscal@c-67-168-113-48.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:25:15 zRecursive: if I do ":t 9.575" in Haskell it tells me Fractional and not Floating as for pi for instance 07:25:15 import Text.Printf (printf) 07:25:31 zRecursive: so Haskell apparently operates at a higher precision for decimal numbers 07:25:45 gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:28:18 capisce: i have to (format t "~$" (+ 9.575 0.005)) :( 07:28:54 that will lead to other numbers being rounded up that you'd want rounded down 07:29:17 that's bad 07:29:55 seems hard to find a good solution ? 07:30:08 for 9.575 ,etc. 07:30:46 not really 07:30:59 or well, where do those numbers come from? 07:31:38 capisce: in haskell, printf "%.2f\n" (9.575 :: Float) => 9.58 07:33:47 (+ 8.15 (* (- 11 8.15) 0.5)) => 9.575 07:34:57 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:35:53 interesting 07:37:14 then if it isnot fixed, i will never use CL to real calculation in the future. it is awful 07:37:50 especially for finantial calculation 07:38:24 ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 07:38:36 well, everything I've read about financial calculation has recommended not to use floating point numbers 07:38:59 but to use decimal fixed point arithmetic 07:39:05 it cannot be avoided sometimes though 07:40:11 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f755ef9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 07:40:17 -!- nug700 [~nug700@174-26-159-207.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 07:42:28 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d013ed9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:42:55 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:47:19 C also gives 9.57 07:47:29 not sure what magic Haskell is doing :) 07:49:23 walter [~walter@c-75-73-211-125.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:53:22 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:53:35 let x = (9.575 :: Float) 07:53:38 capisce: haskell is great :) 07:54:30 can i declare 9.575 double in CL ? 07:55:36 maybe could be useful: http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/a-few-format-recipes.html 07:55:52 -!- harish [~harish@119.234.158.147] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:56:03 -!- fenton [~fenton@ppp-110-168-21-245.revip5.asianet.co.th] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:56:47 pnpuff: just see it, seems not fix 9.575 problem ? 07:56:54 9.575d0 is double-float 07:57:54 (format t "~,2f" 9.575d0) => 9.57 07:58:01 oudeis [~oudeis@95.35.60.102] has joined #lisp 07:58:11 which is what I'd expect 07:58:31 i need 9.58 here 07:58:50 maybe (+ least-positive-single-float 0.9575) ? 07:58:50 as 0.005 > 0.004 07:59:26 Haskell's printf seems to behave a bit strangely imo 07:59:50 printf "%.20f\n" (pi :: Float) 07:59:56 3.14159270000000000000 08:00:05 zRecursive: sometimes 0.005 < 0.004 08:00:29 hitecnologys: sure, weird floating number 08:00:32 or single-float-epsilon 08:04:01 xani [~user@178.183.144.209.dsl.dynamic.t-mobile.pl] has joined #lisp 08:04:22 -!- p_l [~pl@tsugumi.brage.info] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:07:25 capisce: printf "%.20f\n" (pi :: Double) => 3.14159265358979300000 08:07:36 odd ? 08:09:23 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:12:13 peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-131-116-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #lisp 08:12:49 -!- walter [~walter@c-75-73-211-125.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 08:15:25 Wukix`` [~user@76-198-128-124.lightspeed.mtvwca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 08:15:26 srcerer_ [~chatzilla@dns2.klsairexpress.com] has joined #lisp 08:16:21 -!- ivan\ [~ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:16:27 -!- wchun [~wchun@81-232-46-25-no38.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:16:48 -!- 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loke [~loke_@42.61.218.195] has joined #lisp 08:39:38 walter [~walter@c-75-73-211-125.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:39:51 pierpa` [~user@host204-228-dynamic.51-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 08:41:03 -!- walter [~walter@c-75-73-211-125.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 08:41:18 MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-108-38-175-139.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 08:42:23 -!- mtd_ is now known as mtd 08:42:43 jewel [~jewel@105-237-9-188.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:46:42 -!- ehu [~Erik@static-42-194-112-80.thenetworkfactory.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:49:02 -!- kanru` [~kanru@114-36-4-154.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:50:02 zRecursive: sorry for the OT, anyway, seems that in Fortran you have even to keep track of the kind of you real constants ( http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty//j/h/jhm/f90/lectures/21.html :) 08:50:58 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.56.79.173] has joined #lisp 08:50:58 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.56.79.173] has quit [Changing host] 08:50:58 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 08:53:15 -!- chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:55:42 Is there a way to automatically load all missing dependencies for some system? Normal (ql:quickload "thing") fails. 09:00:27 -!- zRecursive [~czsq888@171.88.19.227] has left #lisp 09:00:36 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 09:02:09 setmeaway [setmeaway3@119.201.52.138] has joined #lisp 09:02:19 redSnow [~Thunderbi@113.96.152.49] has joined #lisp 09:03:55 to what kind of "system" are you referring? (and the system is supposed to be in what "environment"?) 09:05:32 pnpuff: I mean :defsystem-depends-on in asdf system. 09:06:52 -!- whist [~whist@c-98-232-204-76.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 09:08:13 When I load libraries that already in quicklisp, then it loads all stuff that it needed, but when I load mine libraries, it doesn't. 09:10:14 statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-227-068.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 09:10:52 josemanuel [~josemanue@47.188.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 09:11:52 -!- josemanuel [~josemanue@47.188.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Client Quit] 09:16:40 -!- jewel [~jewel@105-237-9-188.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:18:39 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-77-150.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:21:26 ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 09:22:59 -!- wbooze_ [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-232.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 09:23:15 wbooze_ [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-232.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 09:23:46 -!- wbooze_ [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-232.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:27:39 redSnow1 [~Thunderbi@113.96.152.49] has joined #lisp 09:27:39 -!- redSnow [~Thunderbi@113.96.152.49] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:28:26 corni [~corni@drupal.org/user/136353/view] has joined #lisp 09:28:30 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-232.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 09:28:40 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:30:38 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-131-116-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:34:22 -!- redSnow1 [~Thunderbi@113.96.152.49] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:36:18 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 09:38:23 -!- michaeljmcd [~michael@ip70-178-95-137.ks.ks.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:54:31 -!- jangle [~jimmy1984@dsl-164.7-238.gtb.net] has quit [Quit: jangle] 10:01:02 Xach: I found out that there's no puri-unicode in quicklisp. It's fork of puri with unicode support, consider adding it. 10:01:13 pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 10:01:20 why not open a ticket? 10:01:25 stassats: where? 10:01:31 on github 10:01:44 stassats: oh crap, I didn't know there's github repo, sorry 10:02:00 https://github.com/quicklisp/quicklisp-projects/issues 10:06:15 -!- n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:09:59 nagume [~nagume@159.Red-79-154-73.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:11:13 -!- robot-beethoven [~user@c-24-118-142-0.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 10:18:13 p_l [~pl@tsugumi.brage.info] has joined #lisp 10:18:57 skrue [~asdfjkl@34.90-149-118.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 10:20:14 n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has joined #lisp 10:21:09 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:23:27 -!- n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:24:19 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 10:24:34 peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-131-116-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #lisp 10:26:08 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.141.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:26:21 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-131-116-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:32:14 klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has joined #lisp 10:40:11 Aiwass [~user@unaffiliated/aiwass] has joined #lisp 10:40:56 -!- Aiwass [~user@unaffiliated/aiwass] has quit [Client Quit] 10:41:09 n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has joined #lisp 10:52:42 -!- namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:55:42 namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:57:34 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@2-230-138-74.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:00:48 killerboy [~mateusz@195.225.68.249] has joined #lisp 11:01:37 -!- aajmakin_ [aajmakin@kosh.org.aalto.fi] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:03:38 Kenjin [~kenjin@pa7-84-91-183-73.netvisao.pt] has joined #lisp 11:09:30 CrazyWoods [~nowolfer@27.154.170.20] has joined #lisp 11:10:21 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-109-156.lns20.bne4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:11:26 redSnow [~Thunderbi@113.96.153.108] has joined #lisp 11:13:33 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@pa7-84-91-183-73.netvisao.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:15:34 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 11:17:46 -!- redSnow [~Thunderbi@113.96.153.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:20:29 minion: memo for zRecursive: you need to read What Every Computer Scientist Should Know About Floating-Point Arithmetic http://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19957-01/806-3568/ncg_goldberg.html 11:20:29 Remembered. I'll tell zRecursive when he/she/it next speaks. 11:21:05 ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 11:21:48 Nothing replaces a formal CS education 11:24:30 Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 11:27:09 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@119.201.52.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:30:13 pjb: wow ... still cited into the Arnaud's technical recipes... 11:30:52 (sorry for the OT) 11:32:49 -!- ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:33:39 i have the following situation. On one machine (debian), when running sbcl --script, asdf uses different output translations (no use of .cache) than if I'm running under slime. On the other machine, an ubuntu box, they both use the same. Asdf is 2.26, sbcl 1.1.9, and the code is the same 11:33:49 any ideas what might be happening? 11:34:45 --script means --no-userinit 11:35:31 which is stupid, if you ask me 11:36:41 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 11:37:25 rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.73] has joined #lisp 11:37:49 oh i forgot to mention - I (load "~/.sbclrc") 11:38:48 it also means --no-sysinit 11:39:45 ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 11:39:54 hm - ok 11:40:15 if you're using a debianised sbcl, this may be different 11:42:41 no, compiled from sources 11:43:02 but you could have a previously installed one 11:43:19 It is a good thing that --script implies --no-userinit. Otherwise your scripts in /usr/local/bin wouldn't work for other users. 11:43:23 stale files somewhere? 11:43:29 Just set all your environment in your script. 11:43:39 prxq: which is easy to check: /etc/sbclrc 11:43:52 That also means, don't use $HOME/.cache in a public script: compiled libraries may be different versions and break your script! 11:44:00 Use /usr/local/lib/my-script/ instead. 11:44:14 stassats: no such file around 11:44:27 i don't have root on that box. 11:44:36 pjb: i don't want some script writers to assume how i want to configure my lisp 11:44:48 Yes, that's why scripts must configure lisp themselves! 11:44:58 prxq: then, how different is different? 11:45:00 For some reason it's a hostile box. Lots of stuff does not work the way it usually does. This included 11:45:21 pjb: i just said that's why they shouldn't 11:45:38 stassats: using .cache/.. or not. 11:45:45 or not means? 11:45:45 I just said that you just said that's why they shouldn't. Full agreement here! 11:45:57 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 11:46:00 no, full misunderstanding 11:46:22 the script configuring itself won't know how i want my lisp to be configured 11:46:34 a script is not your lisp. 11:46:37 It's a script. 11:46:48 it's my computer 11:47:10 And you have say in saying how a script is to configure itself. Unless it's a documented parameter of the script to configure. 11:47:25 You're not alone, check /home/* 11:47:35 what? 11:48:07 and i won't run your scripts anyway, since they probably will delete all my files 11:48:07 This is my computer too, however: ls -1d /home/* | wc -l --> 14 11:48:07 11:48:28 davazp [~user@112.Red-88-15-121.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:48:59 what the presence of other users is supposed to imply? 11:49:00 No, it's because it's AGPL3. 11:49:32 stassats: it implies that a script cannot depend on a user's rc or .cache files, because other users will have incompatible files. 11:49:35 pjb: you have 14 users for yourself? 11:50:00 Well, admintedly some of the other accounts are for myself yes, but there are also accounts for friends and family. 11:50:06 prxq: he may share computer with someone else 11:50:20 actually, i don't care since my sbcl is saved-lisp-and-dead with my .sbcl.rc 11:50:42 pjb: i don't see the relevance of this 11:50:47 *hitecnologys* agrees with stassats 11:50:51 you're still running from a single user at a time 11:50:59 it refuses to use the .cache when run with --script. Which means it recompiles everything 11:51:08 For example, with some other software. It's a classic way to manage access rights, to install each application or server it its own user account, therefore with its own home and rc files. Running scripts forked from those applications will break if they rely on your specific environment. 11:51:15 prxq: it doesn't save any fasls? 11:51:42 -!- davazp [~user@112.Red-88-15-121.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:51:59 Already, when you use a GUI and a terminal, you can have great fun with the difference of environment between them. 11:52:17 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-232.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:52:25 So even for personal scripts (in ~/bin/), it's waky to rely on your rc and .cache. 11:52:45 Scripts that depend on environment are pure evil. 11:53:15 ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 11:53:29 so, the scripts should download quicklisp and install everything themselves, i take it 11:53:55 stassats: what I build from slime is stored under .cache/..., but when I load the sytems frrom the --script variant, it looks for the fasls in the project source dirs 11:54:20 stassats or rely on a pre-installed version, they don't have to download at run-time. 11:54:30 prxq: and when it compiles, it puts them there? 11:54:37 yes 11:55:05 prxq: and (list (lisp-implementation-version) (asdf:asdf-version)) on both is exactly the same? 11:55:11 I even ran initialize-output-translations 11:55:37 let me check again, but the asdf is the same, 99.999% that it's the same sbcl 11:56:03 -!- lifeng [~lifeng@218.22.21.23] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 11:57:00 same version of everything 11:57:23 and sbcl images are without modifications? 11:57:36 no mods at all 11:58:16 fresh source from git, checked out sbcl-1.1.9. built and installed 11:59:11 does (asdf:asdf-version) stay the same after you load something in --script? asdf can inexplicably upgrade itself 11:59:16 ph88 [5597cc14@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.151.204.20] has joined #lisp 12:00:11 also, compare asdf::*output-translations* 12:02:27 they are identical 12:02:36 and the version stays the same 12:02:38 across all four options? 12:02:52 slime/no-slime*debian/ubuntu 12:03:16 that was under debian 12:03:24 le t me check ubuntu 12:03:49 this may be the time to use asdf-3.0.2 12:04:22 which is in sbcl-1.1.9.1 12:06:24 -!- jerkbot1 [~jerkbot@pool-72-78-234-97.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:06:55 well, on the ubuntu machine, it's sbcl 1.1.5 12:07:14 that would have the same asdf 12:07:20 stassats: sbcl-1.1.9.1 - is that a tag? 12:07:24 no 12:07:26 stassats: it does 12:07:34 it's the revision after sbcl-1.1.9 12:07:35 just HEAD 12:07:44 ok 12:07:51 let me try 12:09:04 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:09:37 you can of course use HEAD, since it has a couple of other fixes 12:10:11 anyway, other than the sbcl version, it has the same output translations, etc in slime and in --script. In ubuntu, however, the cache is used by the --script version. 12:10:20 i'll go for that 12:13:45 -!- ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:15:14 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 12:18:39 -!- dfox [~dfox@178.248.252.211] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:22:25 knob2 [~knob@adsl-64-237-232-189.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 12:24:54 breakds [~breakds@cpe-74-79-147-26.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:28:37 -!- knob is now known as Guest31515 12:28:50 -!- knob2 is now known as knob 12:28:59 pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 12:29:00 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-132-52.dsl.mweb.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:31:27 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #lisp 12:33:59 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:35:19 benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #lisp 12:37:31 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-177-146.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:38:06 -!- rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.73] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:39:48 -!- antgreen [~green@207.112.101.211] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:42:42 still does not work 12:42:47 *prxq* scratches head 12:47:49 gienah [~mwright@gentoo/developer/gienah] has joined #lisp 12:48:35 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 12:51:41 pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 12:52:47 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Client Quit] 12:56:52 ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 13:04:49 hsiaovin [~user@219.150.58.151] has joined #lisp 13:10:03 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@1-164-211-116.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:10:37 s0ber [~s0ber@1-164-211-116.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:11:33 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 13:12:25 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@1-164-211-116.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:12:47 s0ber [~s0ber@1-164-211-116.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:12:50 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has left #lisp 13:13:15 nyaruhodo [~nyaruhodo@FL1-122-133-219-222.kng.mesh.ad.jp] has joined #lisp 13:14:59 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 13:21:05 pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 13:21:58 harish [~harish@cm32.zeta224.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #lisp 13:25:01 minion: memo for Recursive: check first: echo "11 8.15 - f" | dc and after that: echo "0.50 11 8.15 - * f" | dc 13:25:01 Remembered. I'll tell Recursive when he/she/it next speaks. 13:26:01 -!- klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 13:26:02 josemanuel [~josemanue@47.188.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 13:31:17 klltkr [~klltkr@unaffiliated/klltkr] has joined #lisp 13:34:04 nha [~prefect@koln-5d815884.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 13:38:18 -!- ``Erik [~erik@pool-74-103-121-45.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:38:32 ``Erik [~erik@pool-74-103-121-45.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:23 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:40:31 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 13:44:17 -!- knob [~knob@adsl-64-237-232-189.prtc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:44:21 Hello, anybody here? 13:44:22 I am a chinese (bad english) beginner for learning lisp throught Paul Graham's Ansi Common Lisp. When i learned the chapter 3 "lists", i saw a question in exercises. 13:44:22 why does (member '(a) '((a) (b))) return nil? 13:44:22 I had made me understood why, but i have another question. 13:44:22 why (member 'a '(a b)) return t. i think this is similar to the above question. However, why 'a is eql (not equal) to (car '(a b)), but not the '(a) and (car '((a) (b))). 13:44:22 Besides, the (member '(b) '((a) (b)) :test #equal) return ((B)), but (equal '(b) (cdr '((a) (b)))) return NIL. why? 13:44:23 If somebody can tell me why, i will very appreciate. 13:47:00 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 13:48:43 mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-126-167-134.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:49:16 yesminister [~mariner@adsl-99-106-108-20.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:50:12 -!- Guest31515 [~knob@adsl-64-237-232-189.prtc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:50:14 -!- hsiaovin [~user@219.150.58.151] has left #lisp 13:50:23 hsiaovin [~user@219.150.58.151] has joined #lisp 13:51:03 hsiaovin: It's probably due to the function that member uses by default to test equality 13:52:38 hsiaovin: member uses #'eql to test equality, (eql '(1) '(1)) => nil. 13:52:41 hsiaovin: with (member '(a) '((a) (b))) the cons given as the first argument may be different (not EQL) from the cons in the second argument.. but (member 'a '(a b)) the symbol A is the same symbol 13:52:55 hsiaovin: if you try (member '(a) '((a) (b)) :test #'equal) you get the result you expect 13:54:18 hsiaovin: ((a) (b)) is equivalent to ((a) . ((b))).. so cdr of it is ((b)), not (b) 13:55:09 ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 13:56:58 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 13:57:43 seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:58:18 guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has joined #lisp 13:58:57 minion: memo for zRecursive: anyway it's right: echo "3 k 8.15 0.5 11 8.15 - * + f" | dc ==> 9.575 ... 13:58:57 Remembered. I'll tell zRecursive when he/she/it next speaks. 14:06:00 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-163-126.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 14:06:50 -!- bitonic [~user@ppp-93-137.27-151.libero.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:09:48 peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-131-116-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #lisp 14:10:38 -!- hsiaovin [~user@219.150.58.151] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:13:47 -!- xani [~user@178.183.144.209.dsl.dynamic.t-mobile.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:13:52 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-172-117.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 14:24:07 -!- n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:27:54 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.141.51] has joined #lisp 14:28:43 hsiaovin [~user@112.90.229.112] has joined #lisp 14:29:44 Thank you very much. I have understood the second question. 14:29:44 But i still don't understand the first question. 14:29:44 what's the mean of (member 'a '(a b)) the symbol A is the same symbol. 14:29:44 i think the eql is used to compare the two pointers.is it the same points between 'a and (car '(a b)) 14:37:32 hsiaovin: Are you trying to understand what member does? 14:38:30 jerkbot1 [~jerkbot@pool-72-78-234-97.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:45 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f755ef9.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:14 i just want to understand is it the two same pointers and why? 14:41:08 hsiaovin: There aren't any pointers. I think you're referring to symbols. 14:41:35 hsiaovin: that's a C/C++ question. we can't answer that question in a lisp environment. 14:41:38 hsiaovin: interned symbols are ... interned. There is only one symbol with the name "A" in the current package, and every time that symbol is read, the same symbol datum is retrieved. 14:41:54 equality is about object identity and similarity. 14:42:04 -!- benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 14:42:33 benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #lisp 14:44:47 -!- benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Client Quit] 14:44:52 aajmakin [aajmakin@kosh.org.aalto.fi] has joined #lisp 14:45:27 Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:49 bitonic [~user@ppp-93-137.27-151.libero.it] has joined #lisp 14:47:08 -!- guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 14:47:40 guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has joined #lisp 14:49:29 chameco [~samuel@cpe-67-241-240-138.stny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:51:23 Each time you call cons, Lisp allocates a new piece of memory with room 14:51:23 for two pointers. So if we call cons twice with the same arguments, we get 14:51:23 back two values that look the same, but are in fact distinct objects: 14:51:23 > (eql (cons ' a n i l ) (cons ' a n i l ) ) 14:51:23 NIL 14:51:24 in Paul Graham's Ansi Common lisp chapter 3 14:52:02 n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has joined #lisp 14:52:07 Are there any known issues with interaction between cl-opengl, sbcl, and/or the proprietary catalyst drivers? 14:52:47 hsiaovin: a cons is not room for two pointers. 14:52:51 It's room for two lisp objects. 14:52:57 I've tried with SDL, glop, and glfw, and though drawing *sometimes* works, I get frequent memory corruption 14:53:06 due to segfaults in non-lisp threads. 14:53:06 It is unspecified how lisp objects are implemented. 14:53:35 hsiaovin: perhaps you want to ask questions about how to implement cons, or how it is implemented in a specific implementation? 14:53:56 hsiaovin: cons can be implemented as: (defun cons (a d) (lambda (k) (funcall k a d))) 14:54:02 hsiaovin: where are the pointers there??? 14:55:09 chameco: With graphics, executing drawing code in anything but the main thread tends to be a chancy proposition. You might try to run everything in *inferior-lisp*, if you're working with SLIME. 14:55:19 hsiaovin: Unless you ask a specific question, you'll get a lot of answers you won't understand. :) 14:55:45 hsiaovin: Try it: (shadow '(cons car cdr)) (defun cons (a d) (lambda (k) (funcall k a d))) (defun car (k) (funcall k (lambda (a d) (declare (ignore d)) a))) (defun cdr (k) (funcall k (lambda (a d) (declare (ignore a)) d))) (car (cons 1 (cons 2 nil))) (car (cdr (cons 1 (cons 2 nil)))) 14:55:46 -!- statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-227-068.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:55:50 pkhuong: I'm already running in a single thread, and just calling back into slime every tick of the main loop. 14:56:16 single thread, but is the initial thread? 14:56:42 stassats: Now *that* is a possibility. I'll do some tests. 15:02:40 p pjb I can't understand your implement of cons 15:04:17 hsiaovin: take a look here: http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/LispBook/ ... it's a good book. 15:04:25 thanks 15:05:04 so what the differents between eql and equal 15:05:14 clhs eql 15:05:16 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/a_eql.htm 15:05:17 clhs equal 15:05:18 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_equal.htm 15:05:23 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 15:06:06 wchun [~wchun@81-232-46-25-no38.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lisp 15:06:09 -!- ffilozov [~user@246.197.18.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:08:22 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 15:08:28 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:10:36 Okay, I tested my graphics code in both a normal CLI repl and in slime. It runs in slime, but gets memory corruption errors in background threads (probably created by slime itself), while in the repl it crashes with sigabrt. 15:11:50 francogrex [~user@91.182.171.69] has joined #lisp 15:12:45 pnpuff_ [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 15:12:50 -!- macrobat [~beep@h-199-47.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.1] 15:12:53 hsiaovin: that's ok. Take note of it, and come back to it when you'll learn about closures. The point is that there may be no pointers. You have to think at a higher level, in terms of lisp objects, and references to lisp objects. 15:14:43 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:15:04 Sagane_ [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 15:15:56 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:16:40 -!- pnpuff_ is now known as pnpu 15:16:44 -!- pnpu is now known as pnpuff 15:16:53 -!- Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:17:38 thanks 15:18:12 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:20:01 hsiaovin: notice for example, how EQ is defined. It is a low level operator (you should not use it in general, use EQL). (eq 1 1) may be nil, as (eq #\a #\a). That means that 1 and 1 can be stored in two different memories, and refered to with two different pointers. Or they may be represented by two different instances of Church numerals. Or something else. 15:20:19 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-126-167-134.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 15:20:43 hsiaovin: on the other hand, if (eq 1 1), then may be (cons 1 2) won't contain any pointer, but just copies of the values of 1 and 2. 15:21:27 It all depend on the implementation, that's why as a CL programmer, you should not really be concerned by those details. As a CL implementor, on the contrary, it's up to you to decide how you do it. 15:21:56 -!- seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:22:52 -!- nagume [~nagume@159.Red-79-154-73.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: nagume] 15:24:29 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:25:19 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 15:30:53 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 15:35:04 benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #lisp 15:35:32 -!- pnpuff [~wff@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:37:00 bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:38:31 mcspiff [~user@bas16-ottawa23-1242330134.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:43:16 -!- hsiaovin [~user@112.90.229.112] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:47:59 Bike [~Glossina@75-164-171-252.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:48:41 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f755ef9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 15:49:42 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:50:56 seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:54:23 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:54:45 -!- benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. 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ZZZzzz] 16:36:00 -!- gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:36:04 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 16:36:10 gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has joined #lisp 16:39:05 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:39:07 -!- Sagane_ is now known as Sagane 16:40:39 guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has joined #lisp 16:52:02 mcspiff [~user@bas16-ottawa23-1242330134.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 16:52:37 Hey, has anyone used the cxml-types package? The docs seem outdated and I can't quite wrap my head around it 16:54:02 -!- Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:54:59 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 16:56:03 -!- _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:58:16 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 16:58:30 Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 17:03:39 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 17:04:08 kpreid [~kpreid@50.196.148.102] has joined #lisp 17:05:56 peterhil [~peterhil@85-76-146-110-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #lisp 17:07:20 walter [~walter@c-75-73-211-125.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:10:00 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:12:55 -!- guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. 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19:55:55 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:57:56 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@h165043.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 20:00:18 -!- Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:00:52 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 20:12:46 -!- guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 20:13:34 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:18:10 -!- seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:19:35 Xach: around? 20:19:39 dkordic [~danilo@178-222-116-84.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 20:20:15 Xach: loliveira tells me the UFFI package from CFFI is blacklisted by Quicklisp. However, UFFI doesn't support ABCL. 20:21:18 a quick "fix" for UFFI support on ABCL would be to stop blacklisting the UFFI.asd in CFFI. 20:21:39 also, that's code already written and saves duplication. 20:22:11 can you do something implementation specific like that? 20:22:36 mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-126-167-134.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:23:33 ehu: perhaps you can fork, make the updates, and try to get the forked code into quicklisp? 20:24:12 you mean fork uffi? 20:24:19 that's another option indeed. 20:24:47 just let uffi die in peace 20:24:51 I was just wondering if I can deliver a uffi.asd which doesn't do anything but forward to cffi-uffi.asd 20:25:13 stassats: I want to. However, there are still packages depending on it. 20:25:41 and those show up in the test failures in cl-test-grid. 20:26:16 there are some libraries to deal with: metatilities and uffi being the major ones now. 20:27:07 I'm expecting that any contributions to metatilities will be dealt with in due course. However, with UFFI I don't. 20:27:28 That's why I'm looking to use the alternative route and use the CFFI-UFFI compat package. 20:32:03 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 20:32:38 pnpuff` [~FF@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 20:36:04 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:36:14 -!- Artheist [~quassel@bas11-montreal28-1176352432.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:36:43 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:36:48 the problem with cffi-uffi is that it's not entirely compatible with uffi 20:36:50 guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has joined #lisp 20:36:54 pnpuff_ [~FF@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 20:38:27 -!- pnpuff_ is now known as pnpuff 20:40:24 -!- pnpuff` [~FF@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 259 seconds] 20:40:30 -!- pnpuff [~FF@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Client Quit] 20:40:45 -!- Borbus_ is now known as Borbus 20:42:43 ehu [~Erik@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 20:43:46 namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:47:33 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: conversation mismatch] 20:48:43 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 20:50:34 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:53:33 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:53:52 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@195.225.68.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:54:15 killerboy [~mateusz@195.225.68.249] has joined #lisp 20:56:33 -!- dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:57:12 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:02:41 dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has joined #lisp 21:02:53 -!- inkjetunito [~hf999@unaffiliated/inkjetunit] has quit [Quit: qQQQQQQ] 21:08:33 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.211.143.23] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:09:18 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.211.136.54] has joined #lisp 21:12:24 petrounias_ [~petrounia@ppp-2-85-29-3.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 21:12:28 Praise- [~Fat@unaffiliated/praise] has joined #lisp 21:13:21 -!- Praise [~Fat@unaffiliated/praise] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:14:51 -!- EvW1 [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:15:11 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-95-223.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 21:15:43 -!- petrounias [~petrounia@ppp-2-85-31-27.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:15:43 -!- petrounias_ is now known as petrounias 21:16:33 -!- Praise- is now known as Praise 21:17:36 -!- guilhon [~textual@177.42.170.134] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 21:17:41 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 21:19:44 -!- JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Po-ta-to, boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew.] 21:20:43 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:23:18 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:24:14 -!- robgssp [~user@cpe-24-93-28-218.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:27:06 -!- dkordic [~danilo@178-222-116-84.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 21:27:52 JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 21:28:00 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.141.51] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:28:12 -!- corni [~corni@drupal.org/user/136353/view] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 21:29:04 corni [~corni@drupal.org/user/136353/view] has joined #lisp 21:29:48 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:34:45 seangrove [~user@208.80.69.42] has joined #lisp 21:35:49 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:37:02 -!- josemanuel [~josemanue@47.188.221.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: Saliendo] 21:37:48 homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-191-134.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:47:45 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-107-55.lns20.bne4.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 21:55:04 do retrievals of member values from instances of structs have O(n) lookup time the way getf on a property list would? or is it that answer entirely implementation-dependent? 21:55:30 it's implementation-dependent but very probably constant time 21:56:06 good to know. thank you 21:56:37 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:02:28 -!- tankrim [~user@pdpc/supporter/active/tankrim] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:19 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.164.188.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:11:43 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:12:11 -!- nagume [~nagume@167.Red-81-35-179.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: nagume] 22:12:16 Sagane_ [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 22:14:31 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d013ed9.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:14:49 nug700 [~nug700@174-26-159-207.phnx.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:15:09 -!- Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:15:17 -!- statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-230-163.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:17:20 ikki [~ikki@201.164.188.53] has joined #lisp 22:19:14 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:19:49 -!- nbouscal [~nbouscal@c-67-168-113-48.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:23:19 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 22:29:10 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-5d815884.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:29:27 -!- n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:31:34 nagume [~nagume@167.Red-81-35-179.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:35:32 -!- seangrove [~user@208.80.69.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:36:39 jagaj [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:57 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-36-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:37:50 -!- schoppenhauer [~quassel@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:39:09 -!- Bike [~Glossina@75-164-171-252.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:47:03 n1x [~n1x@unaffiliated/n1xnc0d3] has joined #lisp 22:54:55 schoppenhauer [~quassel@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 23:01:08 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 23:04:39 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:07:40 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-77-150.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:10:51 benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #lisp 23:10:56 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-63.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:11:22 -!- nagume [~nagume@167.Red-81-35-179.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: nagume] 23:19:44 -!- ph88 [5597cc14@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.151.204.20] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:33:49 -!- doomlord [~doomlod@host86-180-26-144.range86-180.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:35:10 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@198.199.88.224] has left #lisp 23:39:01 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:42:36 -!- benkard [~benkard@ppp-188-174-183-89.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 23:45:50 -!- segv- [~mb@95-91-241-76-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:45:55 holycow [~holycow@pdpc/supporter/bronze/holycow] has joined #lisp 23:45:56 hi all 23:52:22 -!- Corvidium [~cosman246@c-24-143-118-11.customer.broadstripe.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]