00:00:01 I have no idea if the :purify to save-lisp-and-die applies to alien memory. Highly doubt it 00:01:55 chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has joined #lisp 00:02:18 Yeaaaaa stuff blows up >:] 00:03:32 Bike [~Glossina@71-222-56-127.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 00:07:27 Shozan [~shozan@fsf/member/shodan] has joined #lisp 00:08:01 -!- SHODAN [~shozan@fsf/member/shodan] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:08:23 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:08:32 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85.130.70.65] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:11:28 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 00:11:31 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-36-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:15:38 mile-ton47 [~mile-ton4@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:18:37 arademaker [~user@232.Red-80-33-21.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 00:19:00 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:19:07 someone figured out how to make slime send trace output to the trace buffer? 00:19:52 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 00:22:25 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 00:24:21 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-36-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:25:23 -!- bitonic [~user@2.216.147.33] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:28:42 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:31:30 nialo [~nialo@ool-18bbb124.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 00:32:26 NimeshNeema [uid2689@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iktllgmlorjnkjol] has joined #lisp 00:34:20 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 00:35:19 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-109-67-119-85.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:36:06 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-177-123-220.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 00:39:21 breakds 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has joined #lisp 06:00:44 wchun [~wchun@81-232-46-25-no38.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lisp 06:01:42 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-77.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:04:27 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:06:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:07:28 -!- nightfly [~sage@sagenite.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 06:08:36 -!- lolcathost [~user@unaffiliated/dijkstragroupie] has quit [Quit: Sitting in front of a computer 20 hours a day is not healthy, so I am going to reduce it to 19.] 06:10:00 nightfly [~sage@sagenite.net] has joined #lisp 06:11:33 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:12:17 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:12:27 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5DCA3092.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:12:50 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:13:34 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:15:35 *Xach* hyped for ELS 06:15:51 -!- tfan [~tarik@bas2-montreal29-1177924872.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 21.0/20130511120803]] 06:16:13 Xach: were you at the mocl talk? :) 06:17:37 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:18:20 MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-108-38-175-139.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 06:18:22 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:20:27 p_l: i failed to wake up in time :( i feel terrible about it. i strongly encouraged wes to come to eclm and then missed his talk. 06:20:33 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:20:36 glad i got to chat with him at the dinner at length. 06:20:57 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 06:21:18 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:21:30 I have quite big hopes on it, but I strongly suspect licensing will kill them 06:22:43 MonoDroid pricing left a bad taste 06:23:29 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:23:48 remember, you gotta spend money to lose money 06:24:46 Xach: commercial lisp environments are pricy, yet I feel better about their prices than the MonoDroid one 06:25:03 mrSpec [~Spec@153.Red-81-44-172.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 06:25:03 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@153.Red-81-44-172.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 06:25:03 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:25:26 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:27:27 Now, if mocl offered similar prices but for full platform coverage, I'd find it definitely interesting 06:28:17 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-160-232.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 06:30:01 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:31:15 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:31:54 -!- ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:31:58 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:32:43 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:35:26 ehaliewicz [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 06:35:41 agumonkey [~agu@52.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 06:36:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:37:10 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:39:18 springz [~springz@123.151.195.1] has joined #lisp 06:43:23 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:48:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:48:45 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:48:48 has anyone gotten lispbuilder-sdl running on os x? 06:49:32 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:50:51 zickzackv [~faot@port-92-198-30-130.static.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 06:51:06 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:52:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:52:23 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.180.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 06:52:56 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:53:35 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:54:17 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:54:22 -!- springz [~springz@123.151.195.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:54:43 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:55:30 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:56:12 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:57:10 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 06:57:13 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 06:59:14 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 06:59:17 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:00:40 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 07:01:26 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:05:29 varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 07:09:13 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-197-102.dsl.mweb.co.za] has quit [Quit: Harag] 07:11:50 kiuma [~kiuma@host148-131-static.28-87-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 07:12:19 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 07:12:25 xificurC [xificurC@nat/ibm/x-guifovercqkhfgtw] has joined #lisp 07:15:19 ck`` [~ck@dslb-088-068-141-194.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 07:15:55 ehaliewicz: i know it can be done, though i haven't done it myself. 07:18:55 Xach: yeah, it's supposed to work, but all I'm getting is a blank white screen. I might just use openGL and glfw instead 07:19:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:20:02 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:21:08 -!- mutley89 [~mutley89@host31-54-196-149.range31-54.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:21:31 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 07:21:45 -!- zRecursive [~czsq888@171.217.161.85] has left #lisp 07:22:17 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:24:38 -!- kobain [~kobian@unaffiliated/kobain] has quit [Quit: l'unica verità.. è la morte stessa!] 07:25:25 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-6-119.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:28:07 -!- gavilan2 [~Gavilan2@198.144.156.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:28:25 -!- Lis [~Lis@p3E9E916C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:28:35 -!- keppy [~Luca@c-67-183-145-239.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:29:00 gavilan2 [~Gavilan2@184.75.213.170] has joined #lisp 07:29:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:29:54 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:32:48 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:32:53 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:34:32 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:34:37 jewel [~jewel@105-237-24-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:35:43 b9.com services seem damaged 07:36:33 ugh. 07:37:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:38:11 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:41:07 zorkmoid [c2ed8e14@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.237.142.20] has joined #lisp 07:41:35 ;Good morning! 07:42:25 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:42:40 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 07:43:26 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:43:54 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:44:18 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 07:49:06 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 07:51:45 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@93-80-5-216.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:53:11 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:53:55 atamagawarui [~user@unaffiliated/dijkstragroupie] has joined #lisp 07:53:56 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 07:55:42 ogamita [~t@77.104.4.54] has joined #lisp 07:55:58 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:56:36 nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 07:57:10 leoc`` [~leoc.git@p5DDBA34A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:58:07 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:58:25 -!- leoc` [~leoc.git@p5DDB92A3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:58:30 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 07:59:17 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:01:40 hmm, perhaps it's just a dns issue 08:01:56 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:02:41 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:03:12 _dlnx [~divinelyn@77-254-34-123.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #lisp 08:03:27 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-249-67.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 08:04:52 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:09:06 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:09:48 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:11:11 astalla [~alexkidd@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:11:19 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:11:53 -!- spearalot [~maca@194.218.229.107] has left #lisp 08:12:26 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 08:13:02 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Client Quit] 08:13:05 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:13:25 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:13:47 przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 08:13:50 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:15:32 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:15:35 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:17:18 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:17:48 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:18:11 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:18:25 pavelpenev [~quassel@85.130.70.65] has joined #lisp 08:19:06 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 08:23:06 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 08:23:39 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:24:06 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:24:29 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:25:11 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:26:07 mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has joined #lisp 08:28:16 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:28:58 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-160-232.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:28:58 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:29:58 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:30:02 (loop for my-symbol in *list* for my-number = (my-func my-symbol) ...) what's the simplest way for me to make this LOOP return (values my-MAX-number my-corresponding-symbol)? 08:31:15 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-249-67.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:32:13 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 08:32:38 mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has joined #lisp 08:33:17 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:33:40 robot-beethoven: there isn't a simple way 08:34:23 statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-229-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 08:34:45 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:35:04 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:35:19 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:35:22 przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 08:35:41 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:35:48 (loop with max-s = nil with max-n = nil for s in *list* for n = (f s) when (or (null max-s) (< max-n n) (setf max-s s max-m m)) finally (return (values max-s max-n))) 08:35:52 something like that I guess 08:36:07 -!- zacharias_ [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:36:10 -!- nug700 [~nug700@184-98-117-112.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 08:36:17 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:36:19 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 08:36:24 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:36:24 drats... i was hoping LOOP had a magic keyword for exactly what i needed 08:36:49 kisp [~kisp@91-65-128-25-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:37:15 cl-utilities has EXTREMUM, but it does not return the key separately 08:37:38 I don't think there's something to get key/value pairs maximizing value 08:37:49 I mean in loop 08:37:51 iterate? 08:37:52 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:38:36 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:39:04  Clause: finding expr maximizing m-expr &optional into var 08:40:26 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:41:44 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 08:42:34 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 08:47:02 /quit 08:47:06 -!- chr [~user@148.122.202.244] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 08:47:24 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 08:47:45 dim: doplus :) 08:50:10 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003034.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:50:44 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:52:09 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 08:54:34 ok I'm so tired than I'd rather play with lisp than work, but then it seems I can't get iterate nor do+ do anything else than error out 08:55:01 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:55:26 (doplus:do+ ((for x (in (list 1 2 3 4)))) (collect x)) 08:55:29 that's not supported? 08:55:58 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Quit: kcj] 08:56:18 (doplus:do+ ((for x (in '(1 2 3 4)))) (collect x)) 08:56:25 -!- namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:56:29 same error, unsupported iteration form 08:56:47 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:57:36 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:59:06 marijn` [~user@p5DDB251B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 09:00:44 namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:02:01 what do you want to do? 09:02:07 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:02:34 have a taste of do+, then do what robot-beethoven asked about 09:03:22 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:04:07 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:07:39 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 09:07:59 -!- ryoshu [~kamil@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:08:25 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:08:25 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:09:41 przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 09:10:34 Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 09:11:56 Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 09:13:28 hlavaty [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has joined #lisp 09:17:08 araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 09:17:08 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Changing host] 09:17:08 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 09:17:57 Morning 09:18:02 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 09:18:27 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 09:18:31 dim: for, in, collect... are symbols in the doplus package 09:18:57 dim: so you either USE the package, or you have to prefix them with doplus: 09:19:01 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:19:20 I see 09:19:54 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 09:25:21 Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-136-120.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:25:38 dim: what you were asking would be something along the lines of http://paste.lisp.org/display/137441 - with proper symbol imports, that is 09:27:03 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:27:47 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:28:25 (do+ ((for k (in '(3 1 4 2))) (finding x (maximizing (* -1 k) :saving k :in mk)) (returning (list mk x)))) 09:28:25 (1 -1) 09:28:27 ok 09:29:55 oh multiple returning clauses look nice too 09:29:59 (do+ ((for k (in '(3 1 4 2))) (finding x (maximizing (* -1 k) :saving k :in mk)) (returning mk) (returning x))) 09:30:01 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003034.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:30:33 still a little strange to read, but well, I can't say loop was that natural to read at first 09:34:03 I just realized there's no reason you couldn't have a single returning clause with both forms... (returning mk x) 09:34:16 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-136-120.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:34:19 that would be perhaps slightly better to read 09:34:43 -!- alch___ [~michael@pb6abea75.tokyff01.ap.so-net.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: alch___] 09:35:41 yeah but the multiple values are lost on me 09:36:12 my first try was (returning (values mk x)) 09:36:31 the (returning mk x) appears not parsable by the macro yet 09:37:34 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:37:43 no, it's not supported yet, I just thought about it 09:38:13 hmm, and also (returning (values ...)) ought to be supported too... 09:38:24 bitonic [~user@2.216.147.33] has joined #lisp 09:39:37 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:40:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:41:09 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:42:27 cdidd [~cdidd@93-80-113-239.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 09:42:53 maxm: ping 09:44:00 Sagane_ [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 09:44:36 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 09:45:20 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:46:15 -!- marijn` [~user@p5DDB251B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #lisp 09:46:45 -!- Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:47:48 -!- arbscht_ [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:47:53 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 09:48:37 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:49:01 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 09:49:46 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 09:51:50 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 09:51:57 pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 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[craigs42@c-67-182-143-216.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:21:02 Foxboron [~root@46.246.93.106] has joined #lisp 10:22:49 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 10:24:52 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:25:20 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:25:25 -!- zulu_inuoe [~quassel@184.89.111.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:26:04 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 10:26:33 Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 10:26:47 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:26:50 francogrex [c14be4fc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.193.75.228.252] has joined #lisp 10:27:19 Hi, is there a way to print for me all the slot values of an object? 10:27:36 inspect is not sufficient 10:27:52 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:28:20 in what sense not sufficient ' 10:28:22 ? 10:28:48 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 10:28:52 it doesn't show me all the possible slots 10:29:08 It does for me. 10:29:18 Which inspect are you using? 10:29:47 mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has joined #lisp 10:29:58 -!- chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 10:29:59 (inspect object) -> The object is a STANDARD-OBJECT of type CL-WIN32OLE::DISPATCH. 0. PTR: #.(SB-SYS:INT-SAP #X0027BEC4) 1. FINALIZER: NIL 10:30:18 I expect it to show me things like: width, height, etc etc 10:30:40 Why do you expect that? 10:30:52 so that (slot-value object 'width) gives me what I am loking for 10:31:27 I cannot see all the possibilities (slot-value object ???) 10:31:31 use the slime inspector 10:31:38 ch077179 [~ch077179@unaffiliated/ch077179] has joined #lisp 10:31:50 or cl:describe 10:31:59 fe[nl]ix: is it fgoing to make any different than plain (inspect ? 10:32:09 ok I will try describe 10:32:58 same result, it's a pointer... 10:32:58 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 10:33:25 it's going to be tought looking into something like #.(SB-SYS:INT-SAP #X0027D1D4) 10:33:57 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 10:34:41 probably the library is playing with slot-missing and those are not actual slots 10:35:00 francogrex: if it doesn't show any other slots, then there isn't any 10:35:26 there isn't any. The slots are within that pointer 10:35:47 then your question is not correct 10:36:34 how to inspect the pointer 10:37:16 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 10:37:54 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:38:32 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:39:18 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 10:40:09 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 10:40:18 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 10:41:03 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 10:41:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 10:42:01 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@105.21.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:42:06 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 10:42:10 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:44:07 -!- Harag 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davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:48:15 -!- varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:48:18 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.86] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 12:48:26 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 12:48:46 hi 12:49:21 is there a way to check correctness of a date in a string? 12:49:48 there is some pretty extensive library for dealing with date/time.. I think :local-time? 12:50:22 maxm: date-check library? 12:50:31 maxm: from a string? 12:50:49 knob [~knob@76.76.202.244] has joined #lisp 12:51:16 sorry date-calc 12:51:23 Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 12:52:20 No library name was local-time.. (local-time:parse-timestring) looks to have lots of options related to validity 12:53:41 ok tx 12:59:33 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 12:59:43 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-173-48-164-128.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:00:02 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:00:21 rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.87] has joined #lisp 13:00:28 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:00:47 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 13:02:44 echo-area [~user@114.254.101.235] has joined #lisp 13:03:05 -!- davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:03:24 -!- developernotes [~Nick@ec2-23-23-158-237.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 13:03:33 davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:04:11 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 13:04:19 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 13:08:53 Posterdati: i find that (ql:system-apropos "time"), or "date" coupled with http://blog.quicklisp.org/2011/11/project-download-statistics.html is, by example, a good heuristic for finding useful libraries. 13:09:24 bhyde: anyway I use system-apropos 13:09:40 mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 13:10:17 -!- mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:11:56 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Quit: i will be back...nvm] 13:13:24 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 13:14:02 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-63.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:14:21 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:14:40 -!- bitonic [~user@2.216.147.33] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:15:05 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 13:17:22 -!- banjara 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[~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:45:16 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 13:45:52 Thra11 [~Thra11@105.21.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 13:46:05 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 13:50:04 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:51:13 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105-236-136-120.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:51:54 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 13:52:18 wingo [~wingo@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:52:24 ahoi 13:52:35 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:52:54 hi wingo 13:53:25 *wingo* watching samth's typed racket thing at els 13:54:26 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:55:06 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 13:55:20 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 13:56:28 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 13:56:51 cross [cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net] has joined #lisp 13:58:30 anyone here know red/black trees well? 13:59:55 quazimodo: what does well mean? 14:01:12 zorkmoid: I can understand some things about them, but I'm looking at a particular case and want someone who knows them practically to help me understand 14:01:27 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:03:02 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:03:10 quazimodo: i guess, ask away ... depends on the question .. 14:03:48 I have a case where, if I add an extra black leaf, I'll need to create a new node and a new vertical layer, to add the new leaf plus the existing leaf that the node replaced 14:04:23 but if the previous layer was red, then that node must be black, and the new leaves will have n+1 black nodes in the simple path to root 14:04:36 whereas the other existing leaves hhave n black nodes back 14:04:44 does this mean we have to reevaluate the entire tree?? 14:05:10 I can draw it 14:06:22 breakds [~breakds@cpe-74-79-147-26.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:06:29 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 14:06:30 ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has joined #lisp 14:06:53 please do ... i don' think you need to reeval the whole tree... that sounds wrong, you need to rotate a few neighbouring nodes, or recolour them but that should be all.. 14:07:28 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:08:11 ryoshu [~kamil@83-144-107-246.static.chello.pl] has joined #lisp 14:08:15 -!- ryoshu [~kamil@83-144-107-246.static.chello.pl] has quit [Changing host] 14:08:15 ryoshu [~kamil@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has joined #lisp 14:08:22 ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has joined #lisp 14:08:56 aftershave [~textual@h-123-171-229.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 14:09:21 antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 14:12:41 http://flockdraw.com/1skpd1 14:12:58 did I get it wrong? 14:14:06 lol quit scribbling 14:14:11 -!- chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 14:14:46 -!- wingo [~wingo@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:14:47 i don\t see anything.. 14:15:05 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-160-232.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 14:15:15 anything?? 14:15:48 nothing... blank canvas 14:18:03 http://i43.tinypic.com/ao7rdv.png 14:18:04 here ya go 14:19:21 -!- nahiluhmot [~nahiluhmo@70.42.157.22] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:19:33 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:19:36 I've read the relevant section of the ASDF manual. There doesn't seem to be any information on about how to make ASDF first search for .asd files in the current working directory. I want to be able to cd into any directory containing .asd files and build. I was able to do this with an older version of ASDF, but I'm unable to figure out how to do so with ASDF3. Any ideas? 14:20:16 quazimodo: are you rotating the nodes properly? 14:20:20 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:20:36 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 14:20:48 zorkmoid: i dno? am I supposed to do that before any insertion? 14:20:59 <- only read about these trees like 15min ago 14:21:18 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:21:27 quazimodo: what did you read? 14:21:49 whoops ok im retarded 14:21:51 jangle [~jimmy1984@dsl-162.7-238.gtb.net] has joined #lisp 14:21:52 leaves have no info 14:22:03 that changes everything 14:22:13 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003034.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 14:22:37 ok cool zorkmoid :D 14:22:37 dlind [~dlind@h-184-111.a322.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 14:22:39 cheers 14:23:12 -!- gendl [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: gendl] 14:23:27 I'm currently adding .conf files in ~/.config/common-lisp/source-registry.conf.d/ per project. I'll have to add a .conf every time I want to build a certain project. 14:23:40 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:23:52 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:24:06 zorkmoid: turns out these things are far more complicated than I initially thought 14:24:08 hlavaty` [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has joined #lisp 14:24:13 zacharias_ [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 14:24:15 thank you for considering it dude 14:24:18 quazimodo: rb trees? they are triviall.. 14:25:33 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 14:26:14 everything is trivial until you go try implementing it :-) 14:26:24 its the rule #1 of programming 14:26:28 -!- hlavaty [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:26:55 i disagrre on that.. 14:27:19 zorkmoid: more complicated than looking at a diagram and thinking I know it all now 14:27:22 :P 14:27:24 It needs actual reading 14:27:30 samebchase: the source registry computed once, or on demand; so it doesn't know you have changed working directory. 14:27:43 bitonic` [~user@2.121.145.83] has joined #lisp 14:27:43 imu96 [~imran@91.140.176.78] has joined #lisp 14:29:36 -!- bitonic [~user@2.216.147.33] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:29:48 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:30:06 -!- pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:30:34 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:30:58 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:30:59 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 14:31:00 nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 14:31:28 -!- alch___ [~michael@68-233-247-240.static.hvvc.us] has quit [Quit: alch___] 14:31:43 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:32:19 -!- davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:33:09 fenton1 [~fenton@ppp-124-121-19-100.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 14:33:23 -!- imu96 [~imran@91.140.176.78] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:36:22 -!- zacharias_ [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:36:42 -!- agumonkey [~agu@52.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:37:06 -!- Sagane_ [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:37:57 bhyde: I normally cd into a dir and then run sbcl, 14:38:48 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 14:38:59 hi 14:39:06 is there any way of computing it based on the cwd 14:39:23 samebchase: I have my source registry setup to include entire few subtrees of ~, when I make a new .asd I call asdf:clear-source-registry  which works ok, except for the scenario where I have two copies of the same project i don't have a solution for that I'm happy with yet. 14:40:37 miql [~miql@ip68-98-19-126.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:42:31 ahungry_ [~null@66.184.106.97] has joined #lisp 14:42:36 bhyde: I have tried adding a (:tree ...) entry. So, you're okay with the fact that asdf doesn't really allow you to build a system from any arbitrary dir containing an .asd? 14:42:46 anymore 14:44:59 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:45:12 nahiluhmot [~nahiluhmo@wsip-68-15-43-240.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:29 it does allow me 14:45:46 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:46:36 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-248-11.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 14:49:19 stassats`: how do you do it? 14:49:49 by simply putting *d-p-d* into *central-registry* 14:49:58 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:50:54 the symbol 14:51:12 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 14:51:29 davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 14:52:38 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:53:04 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:53:08 the manual says *central-registry* is deprecated. There's no new ASDF3 way of doing it? 14:53:42 I guess I'll have to do this, until a newer method 14:53:48 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:53:56 ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has joined #lisp 14:54:01 -!- bitonic` is now known as bitonic 14:54:33 samebchase: I'm delighted that the source registry mechanism can search are huge number of directories; and I'm unsurprised that a consequence of that is that find-system doesn't redo that search :) 14:55:14 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 14:55:23 -!- breakds [~breakds@cpe-74-79-147-26.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 14:55:57 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 14:56:10 ASDF3? 14:56:55 samebchase: who cares what the cabal declares deprecated! 14:59:18 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:00:31 mishoo [~mishoo@93.113.190.121] has joined #lisp 15:00:33 i doubt anybody would disagree that the source-registry mechanism is now so complex that it has become a barrier to entry for most people, so many choices, so little consensus about what best practice is, etc.  so yeah, i care that it's deprecated - since that is almost the only advice available about what might be a good habit to adopt. 15:00:41 -!- xificurC [xificurC@nat/ibm/x-guifovercqkhfgtw] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 15:00:41 smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has joined #lisp 15:01:32 stassats`, Xach: yay. that works! 15:02:04 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:02:22 I use the local-projects mechanism almost exclusively. That is part of Satan's plan! 15:03:07 heh. saw that blog post. 15:04:11 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 15:04:23 Xach: I like the Satan's plan 15:04:24 this may help to address quick lisp most serious deficiency 15:04:33 quicklisp's 15:04:39 which is? 15:05:04 lack of a good logo, of course 15:05:19 ah, of course ;) 15:05:50 The Q logo thingy looks alright 15:05:51 I kinda like the whole typography thing 15:05:51 big Q with satan's horns? 15:05:54 yeah 15:06:20 and then (since any PR is good PR) we can orchestrate a trademark dispute with freebsd 15:06:45 _d3f [~gnu@ip-static-94-242-252-66.as5577.net] has joined #lisp 15:06:54 or a Q with an inverted pentagram and goat skull, but id software may take issue 15:07:38 samebchase: I don't find very pratical to cd into dirs to run or build my projects. 15:08:08 I local-projects/. Boot up emacs+slime and I've got everything I need for world domination :) 15:08:15 *I use 15:08:17 bhyde: so you're saying that this new configuration method is to move away from the complicated source-registry method? 15:08:59 *bhyde* stopped using working directory and *default-pathname-defaults* some time ago 15:09:02 Kenjin: I don't usually do that. For my personal projects, I do ~/projects/ 15:09:42 samebchase: if you put the directory in ~/quicklisp/local-projects/ (or symlink the .asd there) it can automatically be visible to (ql:quickload ...) 15:09:49 samebchase: why don't you just symlink ~/projects in local-projects/ ? 15:10:06 samebchase: nope, i think that the current source registry design is unlikely to get less complex - "Backward compatibility is a cruel master." 15:10:09 That won't work as automagically - it would require (ql:register-local-projects) for each new project. 15:10:18 Xach: the symlink? 15:10:26 arademaker [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 15:10:28 Yes. I did that yesterday, but it seems a bit of pain to have to configure something for everyhitng 15:10:42 Kenjin: yes, or a real directory. the magic works only on one level. 15:10:52 Xach: understood. 15:11:51 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@dhcp140.dmi.ens.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:11:56 *bhyde* was amused that at Faré's recent talk he studiously avoided invoking quick lisp. Thus I learned about asdf:load-system. 15:12:20 Hey dudes whatever 15:12:34 Okay. Now that I know what I wanted to do. I think I should keep with the times and either symlink or put stuff in local-projects. 15:12:40 samebchase: I can see you're a bit resistant in using local-projects/. That's fine. It's a convenience mechanism though. I suppose you have your reasons for wanting your projects somewhere else. 15:13:27 samebchase: between ~/projects and ~/quicklisp/local-projects is not that big a stretch :P 15:14:02 Kenjin: There is no technical reason. It's just that it adds that one more dir for me to quickly navigate to. I should learn to adjust lol 15:14:12 ql:register-local-projects and asdf:clear-source-registry are a fine example of how we have a abundance of tools for any given problem 15:14:18 Xach: are there any inherent issues or its a design decision? The magic, I mean. 15:14:49 you could symlink ~/projects to local-projects :p 15:14:55 Kenjin: i made a tradeoff between convenience (it works in a very common situation) and performance (it does not have time to scan the entire tree for changes all the time) 15:15:20 Kenjin: checking only one directory's timestamp is fast. 15:15:36 przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 15:16:50 maxm: ping 15:17:27 yea I'm here 15:17:40 jangle_ [~jimmy1984@dsl-162.7-238.gtb.net] has joined #lisp 15:18:00 -!- jangle [~jimmy1984@dsl-162.7-238.gtb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:18:00 -!- jangle_ is now known as jangle 15:18:01 Xach: Makes sense. 15:18:43 he's a shinny object  https://github.com/stassats/inotify  maybe a library you can load onto of asdf  for giggles 15:18:48 maxm: I talked with luis about turning 5am tests into functions and we'll probably want to do it a little differently so I'll go ahead and release now without it 15:19:04 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 15:19:08 fe[nl]ix: ah ok, thats fine. It was more proof of concept 15:19:16 he's -> here's 15:19:48 but I can't convert my test suite without that functionality, as it uses test calling other tests calling other tests as defuns very extensively, to run the pattern layout through its motions 15:20:00 p_nathan [~vlion@98.145.133.23] has joined #lisp 15:20:30 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-222-56-127.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:20:37 nymo [~user@67.137.177.90] has joined #lisp 15:20:52 LiamH [~none@pool-173-48-164-128.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:17 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:21:57 Bike [~Glossina@67-5-248-17.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:59 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:22:34 fe[nl]ix: I'm actually more interested in some iolib functionality, that I want you to sneak in :-) 15:22:57 what ? 15:23:29 fe[nl]ix: basically I want to implement ZMQ zero copy, and there is this stone wall, of SBCL unable to run callbacks from threads started by foreign code 15:24:00 go on 15:24:18 -!- joe9 [~user@c-71-236-20-61.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:24:24 fe[nl]ix: all I need, is some kind of free() type function, whos address I can give to ZMQ, that would free a block, and change it pointer t 0. This way with trivial-garbage, its easy to implement pool of zero copy buffers 15:24:51 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 15:24:59 I don't see what this has to do with iolib 15:25:09 -!- jangle [~jimmy1984@dsl-162.7-238.gtb.net] has quit [Quit: jangle] 15:25:35 it seems silly to go roll my own C library, just for 2 functions and 1 struct 15:25:38 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:26:11 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 15:26:15 thought maybe a generic "foreign membuf" thing, with 2 calls membuf_alloc(), and membuf_free(), can be added to iolib. 15:26:35 as the "give me buffer, and a function to call when i'm done with it", is very often used pattern with async type libraries these days 15:27:20 fe[nl]ix: idea is like this.. allocate buffer with cffi call to iolib:membuf_alloc(). It basically mallocs a block + (void *) in front of it pointing to the block 15:27:27 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@105.21.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:28:28 fe[nl]ix: and iolib:membuf_free() when passed pointer to the data, steps back sizeof (void *), frees the memory, and sets pointer to 0. (Well now that I'm describing it I realize I need 2 blocks actually) 15:28:31 maxm: sbcl can do that if you compile with :sb-safepoint :sb-thruption :sb-wtimer 15:28:48 stassats`: hmm have to investigate this 15:28:57 billstclair [~billstcla@p-69-195-58-109.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has joined #lisp 15:28:57 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@p-69-195-58-109.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:28:57 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 15:29:03 (calling callbacks from foreign threads) 15:29:24 but imho would be useful to have this type of low-level membuf pool thing in the Lisp echosystem... Somewhere around cffi/iolib area 15:29:26 stassats` saving the day 15:29:53 thruption? 15:29:59 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 15:30:00 aio works this way too, so it opens whole bunch of possibilities 15:30:06 maybe safepoints aren't needed, i'm not sure 15:30:22 Xach: thread interruption, i presum 15:30:22 e 15:30:32 Xach: blame lichteblau for that name :) 15:30:46 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:31:26 its just that we need to call free(), and change a cell to 0 in diff block, to let Lisp side know its safe to reuse or free it. No need to even use any kind of swap-and-compare, coz Lisp simply not gonna touch it unless it derefs to zero, meaning C lib called the free func 15:32:02 there are some wrinkles to be ironed out with it, but i'm using this features all the time, the only places where they can fail is sb-sprof with heavy allocation 15:32:08 but anyway, if there is no traction for this idea, i'll just roll my own C lib thing 15:32:12 i need to look at that some day 15:32:33 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 15:33:17 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 15:33:42 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:34:02 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:34:52 fe[nl]ix: what about cffi patch for constants on :int sizes and such? 15:35:01 -!- gavilan2 [~Gavilan2@184.75.213.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:35:15 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 15:35:26 maxm: let me finish releasing fiveam first 15:35:48 -!- sad0ur [~sad0ur@ip-89-102-144-158.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:36:15 what if you have portable fasls and change the machine to something that has different int width? 15:36:21 kobain [~kobian@unaffiliated/kobain] has joined #lisp 15:36:21 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 15:36:40 stassats`: you don't do that 15:36:56 well anyway, its free, and i'm greatful for whatever you can find time to release.. Without commonqt to spark my interest into a certain direction, I'd probably still be working office job now :-) 15:37:27 commonqt/cffi etc... 15:37:39 fe[nl]ix: naturally, if it'll be broken, i won't be able to do that 15:38:03 s/'ll/ is/ 15:38:12 agumonkey [~agu@52.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 15:38:51 sad0ur [~sad0ur@ip-89-102-144-158.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 15:41:54 ferada_: ping 15:44:49 Thra11 [~Thra11@105.21.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 15:45:30 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:45:33 stassats`: portable fasls only make sense on a jit-oriented implementation 15:45:38 stassats`: yeah that almost works on CLISP 15:45:51 I think only clisp quelifies 15:45:52 fe[nl]ix: abcl? 15:46:10 not quite 15:46:12 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:46:22 at least, not with ASDF 15:47:13 fe[nl]ix: if you commit maxm's patch, prefix it with #-cffi-sys::portable-fasls 15:47:37 what ? 15:47:43 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:48:51 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.188] has joined #lisp 15:49:26 luis: I must conclude that was a joke 15:49:29 przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 15:50:07 not really, but maybe it's a useless idea 15:50:34 I'll just create an lp bug mentioning how we break portable fasls at the moment 15:51:16 we can't make it work unless there's a way to have compiler-macros run at load-time 15:52:03 -!- astalla [~alexkidd@79.Red-88-26-248.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Sto andando via] 15:52:09 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:53:09 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:53:54 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:54:07 well, we can start by making it work /then/ worry about performance 15:54:13 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:54:26 *stassats`* is always glad to suggest more work 15:54:31 I learned that lesson with jamesjb :-) 15:54:39 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:54:53 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:55:30 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 15:55:38 -!- blackwol` is now known as blackwolf 15:56:32 you can probably change the patch to use something like (aref *built-in-type-sizes* ,(built-in-type-index)), with (defparameter *built-in-type-sizes-table* (loop for x in '(:int :long ..) for idx from 0 collect (list x idx (foreign-type-size idx)))) and (defparameter *built-in-type-sizes* (map 'simple-vector ...munch-the-table ...) 15:57:11 poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has joined #lisp 15:57:14 which will solve the potential foreign FASL problem, at the cost of 1 extra array ref 15:57:23 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 15:57:30 s/foreign fasl/portable fasl/ above 15:57:56 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:58:06 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 15:58:45 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:00:52 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:01:36 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:01:53 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:02:39 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:02:50 luis: as long as it doesn't slow down cffi on sbcl and clozure, I'm fine with it 16:02:55 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:03:40 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:03:42 -!- davazp [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:07:00 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:07:33 fe[nl]ix: basically the initial approach would be to disable the optimizations when portable fasls are needed 16:07:46 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:07:58 anyway, nobody has ever needed this feature (or at least nobody has ever complained) so it's not really a priority or anything 16:09:32 *maxm* raises hand.. then drops it, oh well :-) 16:09:45 fe[nl]ix: do we only care about speed for those two implementations? 16:10:14 My use case for CFFI is probably not typical anyway, shuffling a lot of very tiny messages via ZMQ really fast 16:10:17 madnificent: other implementations are so slow, it doesn't make sense to care 16:10:25 except maybe for lw and acl 16:10:31 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 16:10:33 coz to really get advantage of ZMQ, you want to build whole pipelines of them 16:10:37 but they are hard to care about either 16:11:34 madnificent: not "we", I do 16:11:42 stassats`: it seems that you condemn them that way. either case, i was interested in the opinion the CFFI maintainers 16:11:45 those we the platforms I develop iolib on 16:11:51 *are 16:11:57 and my case easily solveable by just writing a tiny C wrapper, and groveling it anyway, which I'll have to do for the zero copy thing 16:12:19 *maxm* just dislikes forking yet another ZMQ lib, this will be the 4th one I guess 16:12:34 fe[nl]ix: ok 16:13:00 maxm: this is where nanomsg is nice ... 16:13:11 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:13:27 maxm: zmq wasn't meant to be zero-copy 16:13:54 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:13:55 last time I looked at it it copied every message at least once, sometimes twice 16:14:10 boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:14:18 brucem: never heard of it, how does it compare to zmq? I kind of really like the stability, and say what you want, real life usage by morgan stanley or whoever are their sugar daddy, really inspires lots of confidence 16:14:52 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:15:40 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:15:42 maxm: one of the original authors of zeromq (Martin Sustrik) is doing nanomsg. he says not yet ready for production but it doesn't seem that far off in some my previous testing  the API is simpler, it has better zero copy, the implementation is a lot nicer  16:16:08 fe[nl]ix: hmm, I looked at the source, and with the free func thing its zero copy. You give it buffers, and each buffer has free func, buffers go directly to syscall, assuming syscall does zero copy, or mmaps network card address space or whatever high-perf linux drivers do, then ZMQ calls free function (that marks buffer as done), once its sent, and you can reuse the buffer 16:16:16 -!- arademaker [~user@195.Red-88-5-174.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has left #lisp 16:17:05 brucem: I'll take a look thanks for mentioning it 16:17:12 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:17:40 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:17:41 ah it seems it has compatibility bidings for zmq 16:17:54 so I'm not losing anything by developing my wrapper with zmq3 api for now 16:19:03 brucem: I don't see mention of multicast transport, is it in the plans? 16:19:58 maxm: not sure. You could join #nanomsg and ask! 16:20:27 maxm: although msustrik isn't there at the moment. You could ask on the list though or on Twitter. 16:20:30 -!- Bike [~Glossina@67-5-248-17.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:20:49 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:20:50 brucem: thanks, i'll read through mailing lists and stuff first 16:21:06 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-21-139.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:21:28 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:21:47 -!- ahungry_ [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:22:07 Bike [~Glossina@174-25-32-249.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:23:06 what's a nanomsg 16:23:21 bhyde: nanomsg.org 16:23:29 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:23:32 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 16:23:36 bhyde: my first read so far.. "reboot of zmq with lessons learned", extremely unstable with hello world examples not working according to mailing lists 16:23:57 maxm - thanks 16:24:01 will re-check it later 16:24:03 do I need something like swank-client to connect to a swank-server from the command line? 16:24:06 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:24:28 ahungry_ [~null@66.184.106.97] has joined #lisp 16:24:55 maxm: reading it over, it looks a better fit for what I use zmq for, if it ever becomes stable 16:25:19 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:25:49 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 16:26:30 -!- poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:26:46 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:26:50 ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has joined #lisp 16:27:48 -!- xan__ is now known as xan_ 16:28:06 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BD2BC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:29:01 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:33 -!- zickzackv [~faot@port-92-198-30-130.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:32:19 maxm: someday I'll get around to playing with https://github.com/scymtym/network.spread 16:34:31 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:34:32 poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has joined #lisp 16:35:06 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 16:35:14 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:35:27 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:36:05 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:36:17 antgreen [~green@64.56.254.79] has joined #lisp 16:36:20 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:36:24 heh there is more messaging libs then xml parsers these days. 16:37:11 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:37:20 madnificent: I think CFFI should be as fast as it can be on all implementations. I can't recall a situation where we had to trade off speed on one impl for speed on another. In any case, all we're discussing (I am anyway) is that /if/ we want to support portable fasls we should start by disabling those optimizations 16:37:40 -!- boogie [~boogie@ip68-101-218-78.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:37:47 in my mind, that'd be controlled via some global flag or something 16:37:55 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:37:56 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:38:09 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:12 AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 16:38:25 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@host148-131-static.28-87-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:39:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:39:51 Lis [~Lis@p3E9E916C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 16:39:56 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:40:12 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:42:14 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:42:59 Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 16:43:03 -!- xan_ is now known as xan__ 16:43:44 -!- antgreen [~green@64.56.254.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:44:34 -!- xan__ is now known as xan_ 16:44:50 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.176.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:45:06 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.176.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 16:45:43 sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:45:52 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:45:58 luis: ping 16:46:08 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:35 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:48:10 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:48:21 fe[nl]ix: sup 16:49:33 luis: could you take care of maxm's cffi patch ? 16:50:31 maxm: it doesn't appear at https://github.com/cffi/cffi/pulls 16:50:35 where did you push it ? 16:50:58 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:51:00 fe[nl]ix: sorry I just sent a patch to a mailing list 16:51:04 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 16:51:42 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:51:54 ah, right 16:55:22 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@c-98-208-36-36.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:55:26 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Write error: Broken pipe] 16:56:03 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 16:56:10 eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 16:57:48 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 16:58:24 -!- paddymahoney [~patrick@198-84-186-52.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:58:34 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:03:08 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 17:03:34 -!- poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:03:54 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:04:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 17:04:35 seangrove [~user@208.80.69.42] has joined #lisp 17:04:57 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:05:12 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 17:05:57 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:06:33 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 17:06:51 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 17:07:37 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:08:33 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Client Quit] 17:09:25 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:11:58 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 17:12:52 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:12:59 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:13:25 -!- jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has quit [Quit: Emacs must have died] 17:14:20 Kenjin_ [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 17:14:32 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:15:27 Myk267 [~myk@unaffiliated/myk267] has joined #lisp 17:16:51 antgreen [~green@out-on-151.wireless.telus.com] has joined #lisp 17:17:43 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:19:41 jaimef [jaimef@dns.mauthesis.com] has joined #lisp 17:21:06 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 17:21:31 mutley89 [~mutley89@host31-54-196-149.range31-54.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:22:34 -!- Adeon is now known as Adeonicorn 17:23:27 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 17:23:44 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-173-48-164-128.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:24:00 Ue [~Ue@unaffiliated/ue] has joined #lisp 17:24:15 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:24:58 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:12 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:26:31 joe9 [~user@c-71-236-20-61.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:29:27 hi 17:30:03 somebody got me in doubt, today 17:30:06 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:30:13 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:30:31 is there a way of knowing if a given 3rd party library in my program is producing side-effects? 17:30:51 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 17:32:07 svs_ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has joined #lisp 17:32:16 by side effects you mean changing global variables and such? 17:33:12 yes 17:33:17 one can probably obtain entire list of all specials out of SBCL internals, then, bind them all inside a thread with (progv), following by running library through the motions inside, and see if any of them got changed 17:33:27 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 17:33:30 because it is easy to know if a function is changing the value of one of its parameters 17:34:19 as easy as solving the halting problem 17:34:21 hard to suggest ideas without more expanded info 17:34:23 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.184.117] has joined #lisp 17:34:23 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.184.117] has quit [Changing host] 17:34:23 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 17:35:11 Denommus: this question is rather meaningless. 17:35:34 As soon as you cons one cell, or operate one number, you've mutated the memory of the computer. 17:35:42 stassats`: I haven't thought about that. I was just thinking about testing how the function work in the REPL and see if any parameter was changes, but you're right 17:35:42 what do you suspect? usually you'll have a "symptom", from the symptom you bisect in various ways to come up with a minimum scenario, that use your favorite debuggging techniques.. I personally just spread tons of printfs (well using log4cl actually) everywhere, to nail it down 17:35:50 pjb: how so? 17:35:55 Even if you don't do anything as in (loop), you're constantly mutating the PC! 17:36:18 pjb: and how is this relevant to my program? 17:36:30 Your program is constantly mutating the memory! 17:36:43 mutation = side effect/ 17:36:47 putting it in another words, "what exactly is a problem, and can you see if problem happened or not" 17:36:48 i/o = side effect 17:36:52 yes, it is. But how pragmatic is it to care about that? 17:37:02 it's not how side effects are defined 17:37:05 as pragmatic as asking that question. 17:37:34 *maxm* starts to lean towards "trolling" now, out of this convo 17:37:44 In lisp, (cons 1 2) and (cons 1 2) can produce different results = definition of side effect. 17:37:55 I simply want to avoid problems with changing values accessed by multiple threads 17:38:04 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has joined #lisp 17:38:17 And by different results, I mean the first may return a fresh cons cell, while the other may signal an out-of-memory error. 17:38:19 -!- statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-229-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:38:49 Denommus: that's an entirely different question. The answer is to write your threads so that they don't write the same memory. 17:38:50 ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has joined #lisp 17:39:05 pjb: but how do I know if a 3rd party library is doing that? 17:39:25 libraries are qualified "thread-safe" when they are. 17:40:02 Alternatively, you could develop a theory of CL multi-threaded programs, and feed it along with a model of the library to ACL2 to get a proof that it's thread-safe or not. 17:40:07 fe[nl]ix: I will look into it. 17:40:37 while ACL2 is computing the result, you may want to read about RAX. 17:41:50 -!- aftershave [~textual@h-123-171-229.a336.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 17:42:41 Denommus: there's haskell 17:42:59 LiamH [~none@pool-173-48-164-128.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:03 statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-229-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 17:45:28 I know Haskell exists, but I'd rather use Lisp ;) 17:46:09 przl [~przlrkt@p5DCA3092.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 17:46:15 pjb: this seems like a good project to finish my university 17:46:28 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:47:36 -!- nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:48:44 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:49:37 Denommus: exploit processes. 17:50:44 svs__ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has joined #lisp 17:50:55 -!- antgreen [~green@out-on-151.wireless.telus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:51:40 poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has joined #lisp 17:52:52 -!- svs_ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:53:30 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-160-232.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:53:43 -!- Kenjin_ [~kenjin@gw-isr.deec.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:54:38 paddymahoney [~patrick@24.137.221.230] has joined #lisp 17:55:36 <_schulte_> anyone know how to change the default active package from cl-user to something else in a `read-from-string' invocation? 17:55:49 clhs *package* 17:55:49 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/v_pkg.htm 17:56:09 and better not use read-from-string for anything untrusted 17:57:45 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-173-48-164-128.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:58:18 <_schulte_> stassats`: not getting what I expected, http://sprunge.us/WKhe 17:58:42 you need to also evaluate it 17:58:55 <_schulte_> ugh 17:58:58 and binding *package* to *package* doesn't make much sense here, since it's already *package* 17:59:02 *rszeno* is more not expected what i get? :) 17:59:08 <_schulte_> my bad, thanks 17:59:26 <_schulte_> yea, with just evaluation I was getting foo bound in cl-user 18:01:15 <_schulte_> I need to investigate a little more 18:01:28 (eval (read-from-string "(defvar foo 'O0)")) 18:01:33 -!- dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: dcooper8] 18:01:35 urandom__ [~user@ip-88-152-207-21.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #lisp 18:02:10 <_schulte_> yea, that's exactly what I was doing, but somehow my-pack::foo worked where as foo didn't work 18:02:19 -!- namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:04:01 antgreen [~green@64.56.254.79] has joined #lisp 18:04:18 <_schulte_> oh, never mind, figured it out, I was confused about active packages when running an executable compiled w/build-app, sorry for the noise 18:04:22 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:04:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:05:31 -!- ck`` [~ck@dslb-088-068-141-194.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:06:15 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:06:47 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-179-54.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 18:08:10 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:09:45 billstclair [~billstcla@p-216-227-83-183.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has joined #lisp 18:09:45 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@p-216-227-83-183.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has quit [Changing host] 18:09:45 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 18:09:47 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:10:55 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:11:11 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 18:11:33 namtsui [~user@c-76-102-34-148.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:11:47 AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 18:12:19 On sbcl is a struct going to be the most compact way to store heterogenous data? 18:12:21 -!- pchrist_ is now known as pchrist 18:12:53 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-248-11.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:13:27 what kind of data? 18:13:46 stassats`: it's a tree, where each internal node needs some extra information 18:14:27 on sbcl, structs have two storage vectors, one for untagged objects, one for tagged 18:14:30 stassats`: specifically it's a crit-bit tree so each internal node stores a fixnum as well as the left/right pointer 18:15:07 stassats`: it hasn't been that way for ages. 18:15:30 jasom: fixnums happen to be both, so, you can just use short vectors 18:16:07 jasom: vector or struct will take the same amount of space. I think a struct will be clearer. 18:16:12 stassats`: you mean a (vector t)? 18:16:24 jasom: right 18:16:47 pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 18:17:49 pkhuong: so, it's just interspersed? 18:18:05 for 3 elements conses would be more compact 18:19:01 stassats`: no. Unboxed slots are indexed from the end of the instance. 18:19:28 ah, so it's just two logical storage vectors 18:19:53 man SBCL is clever 18:19:53 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for SBCL is clever. 18:20:03 and specbot isn't 18:20:30 clhs doesn't suffer from the same thing, though 18:20:40 (at least I think so. 4 words, while a vector would be 6) 18:20:45 obvious fix is to look for single word and no spaces (for specbot) 18:20:54 ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has joined #lisp 18:20:57 jsnell: I see the same here. 18:21:04 clhs lookup does that, except for glossary/entries 18:21:10 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:21:23 man uses the old lookup way 18:22:03 or rather, the old spec format 18:22:28 jasom: although, really, you could encode all that in 64 bits, and just have a vector of words ;) 18:23:20 pkhuong: and then do my own gc for nodes? 18:24:16 you can have nodes be offsets into the vector 18:24:26 one giant vector for the tree 18:24:28 stassats`: right, but what happens when I delete a node? 18:24:28 jasom: if you're really looking for space efficiency. A specialised GC for crit bit tries wouldn't be hard: it's a DAG. 18:24:57 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-203-29-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 18:25:34 outxie [~outxie@86.Red-79-159-6.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:25:38 -!- pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 18:25:39 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [] 18:25:49 *jasom* was just hoping for not > 2x the size of C 18:26:18 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 18:26:36 7 words vs. 3 (granted the C implementation does its own tagging, which is slightly cheating) 18:26:47 how do you get 7 words? 18:26:59 pkhuong: not sure, just what (room) told me 18:27:03 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:27:36 pkhuong: I allocated a million and got an increase 56.02M bytes of "dynamic objects" used 18:27:36 like jsnell said, 2 conses would take 4 words. And you forgot to include malloc overhead. 18:27:49 true 18:28:02 TIME could do a better job at measuring 18:28:03 -!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:28:46 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:30:28 jasom: SBCL only allocates even numbers of words at a time. 18:34:07 anyway I'm seeing 4 words with the cons implementation 18:34:57 spion [~spion@31.11.65.198] has joined #lisp 18:34:57 -!- spion [~spion@31.11.65.198] has quit [Changing host] 18:34:58 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 18:36:40 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:38:05 -!- sellout-1 is now known as sellout 18:38:10 aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #lisp 18:39:28 ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has joined #lisp 18:40:10 -!- dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: dcooper8] 18:40:18 ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has joined #lisp 18:45:26 -!- ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has quit [Quit: ManAmongHippos] 18:45:49 zacharias_ [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 18:46:16 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:46:30 -!- zacharias_ is now known as zacharias 18:47:16 -!- ryoshu [~kamil@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:49:16 ryoshu [~kamil@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has joined #lisp 18:50:23 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:51:38 bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:39 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:54:11 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:57:28 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:57:32 ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has joined #lisp 18:59:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:59:44 -!- fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:00:03 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.173.4.86] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:00:26 Anybody know why sorting an array of fixnums is 4x faster in ccl vs sbcl 1.0.55? 19:00:55 *jasom* hasn't tried newer sbcl yet 19:01:41 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 19:02:15 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-203-29-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:03:59 SBCL's array sort is a heapsort. It sucks very hard compared to quicksort (or even merge sort) on medium/large inputs and contemporary machines. Stable-sort might do better. 19:04:45 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:06:13 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04dc04.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz] 19:06:55 jasom: not here. SBCL is faster (at least using lists) 19:07:07 also, the optimization settings on the call-site matter in sbcl since sort is declared maybe-inline 19:07:11 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 19:07:22 -!- smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 19:07:23 Denommus: sorting lists is completely different than sorting vectors 19:07:32 smazga [~acrid@64.55.45.194] has joined #lisp 19:07:57 I just noticed that he was talking about arrays now. Sorry 19:08:00 let me try 19:08:03 -!- logand_ [~tomas@e179157013.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:08:12 -!- atamagawarui [~user@unaffiliated/dijkstragroupie] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:08:23 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5DCA3092.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:09:25 almost the same with 10000 elements 19:09:31 perhaps someone should change it to a timsort :) 19:10:40 dlowe: I'm thinking the new dual-pivot quicksort, with a linear-time pivot selection when we recurse too deeply. 19:10:56 jasom: so declare either (inline sort) or (optimize speed (space 0)) 19:11:07 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:11:17 still almost the same with 100000 elements. In fact, SBCL is a bit faster 19:11:20 meeting 19:12:03 It's a lot less code than timsort, and isn't as tuned for slow comparisons as timsort seems to be. Also, it's unstable. 19:12:28 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:12:54 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:12:56 vive le tabasco sort 19:12:58 cpt_nemo [cpt_nemo@rfc1459.de] has joined #lisp 19:13:34 atamagawarui [~user@unaffiliated/dijkstragroupie] has joined #lisp 19:13:52 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:14:19 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:14:43 foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has joined #lisp 19:15:53 -!- Lis [~Lis@p3E9E916C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:17:16 (space 0) fixed it 19:17:43 nug700 [~nug700@184-98-120-139.phnx.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:18:35 AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 19:19:00 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.36.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:19:19 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 19:20:50 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:23:07 nilsi_ [~nilsi@c-5eeaaa7e-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has joined #lisp 19:25:19 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 19:27:56 poppingt` [~user@212.49.88.98] has joined #lisp 19:28:04 -!- poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:28:13 hi, I would like to pass around key arguments like here: 19:28:15 http://paste.lisp.org/display/137449 19:28:17 -!- zorkmoid [c2ed8e14@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.237.142.20] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:28:24 but I would like to avoid using apply 19:28:28 and call functions directly 19:28:56 (clhs had an example with apply so I followed it) 19:29:03 -!- paddymahoney [~patrick@24.137.221.230] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:29:05 -!- poppingt` is now known as poppintonic 19:29:05 -!- poppintonic is now known as poppingtonic 19:29:20 what's the problem with apply? 19:29:31 jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has joined #lisp 19:29:46 -!- poppingtonic [~user@212.49.88.98] has left #lisp 19:31:18 -!- nalaginrut [~nalaginru@61.14.130.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:31:45 -!- danlentz [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:31:46 pkhuong: ugly...? 19:32:02 I am accustomed to (f1 ...) 19:32:22 but if there is no other way, then ok 19:32:37 probably I don't understand these allow-other-keys keywords either 19:33:54 breakds [~breakds@cpe-74-79-147-26.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:34:58 -!- dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: dcooper8] 19:35:31 -!- stokachu [~stokachu@ubuntu/member/stokachu] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 19:35:38 danlentz [~danlentz@c-68-37-70-235.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:36:42 stokachu [~stokachu@li313-53.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 19:36:44 how do you expect that to work? 19:37:09 is there any way to get asdf to explain why it's doing something? 19:37:09 automagically figure out which was your intention, to pass a list or to pass multiple arguments in a list? 19:37:58 i'm tempted to say "because Satan told it to do so", but i won't, since it's a yesterday joke 19:37:59 I want to have functions f1 and f2 that have the same keyword parameters and when f1 calls f2, it is able to pass its parameters to f2 19:38:00 I have a situation where's it's recompiling some files but I'm not sure why it thinks that's necessary. 19:38:06 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:38:41 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:38:44 Denommus` [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has joined #lisp 19:38:48 foom: it assumes that all result files should be newer than source files 19:39:10 Yea, but, afaict, that ought to be the case. I haven't touched them afaics. 19:39:12 sometimes that assumption fails, when, say, you modify the .asd file, on which things depend too 19:39:33 I'd like to know what it was that it decided had changed. 19:39:59 and when you call make from .asd, make won't recompile things, causing asdf always to recompile everything 19:40:18 -!- Denommus` is now known as Denommus 19:40:36 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has quit [Changing host] 19:40:36 Denommus [~user@unaffiliated/denommus] has joined #lisp 19:40:36 -!- Denommus [~user@unaffiliated/denommus] has quit [Changing host] 19:40:36 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has joined #lisp 19:43:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:44:17 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:49 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:45:25 it gets partway through reloading a (:serial t) system of only cl-source-file components, then decides to recompile one of the files. After that, of course, everything else needs to be recompiled too. 19:45:33 I can't figure out what the trigger for the first one is, though 19:45:48 the source file hasn't been touched. 19:45:49 file in the future? 19:46:25 -!- dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: dcooper8] 19:46:28 nope, "written 21 JAN 2013 11:34:07 PM" 19:46:43 though, asdf should cope with futuristic files 19:47:25 foom: and is your clock correct? 19:47:46 yep. 19:47:50 nalaginrut [~nalaginru@61.14.130.226] has joined #lisp 19:48:16 is asdf travelling with a different speed than the files it tries to compile? 19:48:23 Perhaps. 19:48:37 It'd be nice if I could somehow figure out what it thinks it's doing. :) 19:48:39 *stassats`* remembers being some sort of trace 19:48:53 but now with a gazillion of asdf packages, i can't apropos 19:49:12 -!- Ue [~Ue@unaffiliated/ue] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:49:21 asdf/plan:traverse? 19:50:18 (asdf/plan:traverse 'asdf/lisp-action:load-op 'cl-ppcre) shows what it will try to do 19:52:39 yes, that definitively says that it plans to ASDF/LISP-ACTION:COMPILE-OP that file. :) 19:52:59 -!- _d3f [~gnu@ip-static-94-242-252-66.as5577.net] has quit [Quit: :E] 19:54:02 Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:54:35 pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 19:56:58 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-32-249.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:57:50 kanwei_ [~kanwei@107.194.88.155] has joined #lisp 19:57:54 are there any errors? 19:57:59 or warnings 19:58:10 or whatever asdf decides to not like on this day 19:59:37 Bike_ [~Glossina@174-25-32-249.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:00:18 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:00:18 -!- kanwei_ is now known as kanwei 20:00:48 -!- kanwei is now known as Guest4024 20:01:15 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 20:04:22 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:04:42 and is that asdf3? it solved a bunch of spurious recompilations (while introduced some other) 20:04:53 yea, 3.0.1. 20:05:06 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 20:05:31 well, we need a Fare-signal 20:06:22 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:06:35 in the form of large ASDF letters 20:06:58 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 20:07:03 hmm people were talking about sorts; in my experience mergesort beats quicksort except when the working data is between 2/3 and 1x of available RAM 20:07:28 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:07:57 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abov45.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:08:11 nilsi__ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 20:10:24 -!- gemelen [~gemelen@gemelen.net] has quit [Quit:    .    ...] 20:11:08 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@aboh159.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:11:31 -!- nilsi_ [~nilsi@c-5eeaaa7e-74736162.cust.telenor.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:11:34 gemelen [~gemelen@gemelen.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:13 I have 128 GB of RAM, and 48 MB of L3 on this box. I don't think that rule of thumb scales to contemporary very NUMA machines. 20:12:16 -!- jewel [~jewel@105-237-24-43.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:13:46 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:14:00 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 20:14:16 -!- Guest4024 [~kanwei@107.194.88.155] has quit [] 20:14:59 -!- pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 20:15:05 I also wonder how well merging two vectors works when memory can't hold the input vectors and the result. Seriously though, I think you're right. if you *really* care about sort performance, you usually end up working with fancy multi-way merge sorts. 20:15:25 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abov45.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 20:15:41 AeroNotix [~xeno@abov45.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:16:14 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:17:14 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:18:07 -!- ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:18:08 -!- Bike_ is now known as Bike 20:18:53 -!- nilsi__ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:19:18 -!- Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:21:11 Hydan [~hydan@ip-89-103-110-5.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 20:26:27 Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:48 nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 20:27:13 pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 20:28:17 pkhuong: I just wrote a simple "mmap size *1/2, and stack-allocate from that" mergesort in C and it was very fast as a general purpose sort 20:29:41 -!- pnpuff [~name@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 20:30:04 pkhuong: and I tested it on ~30GB of data on a machine with 4GB of RAM 20:30:17 pkhuong: it was quite fast 20:31:21 milanj [~milanj@cable-94-189-145-213.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #lisp 20:31:32 Ah, for out of core sorting. Sure. "quite fast"? I'll assume that means "fast enough for my needs." 20:35:55 -!- nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:38:36 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:38:50 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 20:38:56 ASau` [~user@p5797F121.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 20:41:11 nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 20:42:49 -!- ASau [~user@p5797EE7C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:43:39 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:46:30 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 20:50:08 -!- dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: dcooper8] 20:50:46 mrSpec [~Spec@153.Red-81-44-172.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:46 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@153.Red-81-44-172.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 20:50:46 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 20:51:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:55:11 pkhuong: faster than qsort on all tested data 20:55:11 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:55:15 (glibc qsort) 20:55:25 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 20:56:31 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has quit [Quit: I tend to be neutral about apples] 20:57:47 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.163.182] has joined #lisp 20:58:28 -!- agumonkey [~agu@52.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:01:09 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003034.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 21:01:39 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-179-54.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:02:19 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.208.168.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:05:54 -!- knob [~knob@76.76.202.244] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:07:19 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-50-157-244-41.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: G'night all.] 21:08:00 -!- ahungry_ [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:08:05 -!- keepishop [~keepishop@c-67-161-105-176.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:10:05 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:10:50 -!- statl [~statl@dslb-094-218-229-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:11:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:11:46 -!- eni [~eni@gob75-5-82-230-88-217.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:12:35 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:12:54 -!- ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has left #lisp 21:13:00 ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has joined #lisp 21:13:02 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:13:32 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:13:34 sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:16:20 -!- ManAmongHippos [~ManAmongH@164.111.213.168] has quit [Quit: ManAmongHippos] 21:16:39 kanwei [~kanwei@unaffiliated/kanwei] has joined #lisp 21:20:23 -!- copec [copec@schrodbox.unaen.org] has quit [Quit: checkity check out.] 21:20:47 pierpa [~user@host126-61-dynamic.41-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 21:20:59 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:24:05 Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@177.224.213.26] has joined #lisp 21:24:08 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 21:24:23 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:24:56 jasom: the qsort that spends most of its time in indirect calls or in memcpy? ;) 21:25:00 copec [copec@schrodbox.unaen.org] has joined #lisp 21:25:53 stassats`: okay, figured it out. It was a "bug" on my side. I had done a parallel compilation of a bunch of files, and then did a serial loading of them. Older ASDF didn't care about the fasl timestamps, except that they were newer than the .lisp timestamps. 21:26:15 Modern asdf wants each fasl to be the same or newer than the previous fasl in a serial system. 21:26:21 Which...makes sense, of course. :) 21:26:59 dcooper8 [~dcooper8@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:27:05 maybe 21:28:29 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.163.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:28:51 Well, okay, at first glance it seems to make sense. 21:29:47 i'm trying to think when would the time of the fasls matter 21:30:21 (in relation to each other, that is) 21:30:47 -!- nahiluhmot [~nahiluhmo@wsip-68-15-43-240.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:30:47 when you compile a file manually 21:31:09 I was just thinking of the dependency tree, not the resultant behavior. 21:31:11 fe[nl]ix: but then you supposedly change the date of the source file 21:31:34 It makes sense that each lisp build step depends on the outputs of the previous steps 21:31:35 not necessarily 21:31:44 think of what bordeaux-threads does 21:31:45 maybe you compile some other file, and put it in place of the old fasl 21:31:57 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 21:32:05 with fboundp and the default definitions 21:32:12 or the fasls has load-time side-effects 21:32:26 exactly 21:32:27 that said, such tricks are probably not a good idea 21:32:45 fisxoj [~fisxoj@c-24-12-190-29.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:32:55 The up-to-date-ness of a given fasl depends on its inputs, and dependencies. The dependencies seem to me to be the previous fasls, not previous sources. 21:33:35 so, it's transitive to the sources that way 21:34:08 what does poiuyt do? 21:34:10 poiu 21:34:36 well, in poiu, it won't do parallel builds of things that have a dependency relationship (e.g. :serial t) 21:35:15 The issue i'm having is due to having a seriously messed up build system that uses poiu to do some builds, and then a serial asdf system to do some loads in a different image. 21:36:05 nahiluhmot [~nahiluhmo@wsip-68-15-43-240.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:36:26 so not everything is perfect in the land of Google 21:37:53 mrSpec [~Spec@179.Red-79-153-206.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 21:37:53 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@179.Red-79-153-206.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 21:37:53 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 21:38:20 fe[nl]ix: This is all code inherited from an acquisition. :) 21:38:41 -!- nahiluhmot [~nahiluhmo@wsip-68-15-43-240.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:38:58 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:39:41 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:39:51 -!- sellout-1 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:40:37 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:41:01 davazp [~user@213.37.200.68.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 21:41:30 "keyboard-named build systems, making life harder since 2000" 21:41:52 or was it 2001 21:42:45 Is that the alternate name of fare's tomorrow's talk :)? 21:43:52 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:44:02 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-3-228.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:44:04 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:45:54 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:46:59 -!- zacharias [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2-dev] 21:47:31 antoszka: might as well be :D 21:49:34 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:50:26 two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:50:45 davazp` [~user@213.37.200.68.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 21:50:52 -!- davazp [~user@213.37.200.68.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:51:35 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 21:51:39 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 21:53:19 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:53:24 -!- breakds [~breakds@cpe-74-79-147-26.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:54:15 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:54:21 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 21:54:29 -!- developernotes [~developer@173-18-189-145.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Quit: developernotes] 21:56:32 -!- davazp` [~user@213.37.200.68.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:59:24 chord [322f5788@gateway/web/freenode/ip.50.47.87.136] has joined #lisp 21:59:42 why do I hear about the global interpreter lock problem for Python but never for Lisp? 22:00:53 chord: not sure, but I would say that's because Lisp is older and has encountered this problems decades ago 22:00:58 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c0575.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:01:22 so why should Lisp not have the problem but Python should? 22:01:23 chord: because common lisp is not usually interpretted? 22:01:57 there's the big compiler lock in sbcl 22:02:01 chord, and additionally, there are just restrictions on parallel file compilation with some implementations 22:03:13 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has quit [Quit: going to my classes] 22:04:01 and because python was written by some whippersnappers trying to emulate lisp 22:04:14 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:04:28 (just kidding) 22:05:07 -!- mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Parting is such sweet sorrow...] 22:06:02 vseloved [~user@24.Red-88-23-249.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:06:10 stassats how would you feel if someone said Erlang > lisp :) 22:06:24 i would roll my eyes 22:06:41 are you doubting my smugness or what? 22:06:42 and Haskell > Lisp ? 22:07:06 i think your > is crooked 22:09:21 Scheme > Lisp 22:09:38 I don't think the global interpreter lock problem is inherent to Python. It's just part of CPython. 22:09:40 chord: you sound like a broken string 22:09:55 -!- nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:10:40 -!- stokachu [~stokachu@li313-53.members.linode.com] has quit [Changing host] 22:10:40 stokachu [~stokachu@ubuntu/member/stokachu] has joined #lisp 22:11:17 -!- stokachu [~stokachu@ubuntu/member/stokachu] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 22:12:19 stokachu [~stokachu@ubuntu/member/stokachu] has joined #lisp 22:12:22 nilsi_ [~nilsi@94.234.170.126] has joined #lisp 22:12:22 and chord is now sending me funny pms, fascinating 22:12:56 -!- leoc`` [~leoc.git@p5DDBA34A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:16:11 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:16:42 -!- ch077179 [~ch077179@unaffiliated/ch077179] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 22:19:48 -!- banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:20:03 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:20:24 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 22:20:54 -!- nilsi_ [~nilsi@94.234.170.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:21:05 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:21:11 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o p_l 22:22:06 lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has joined #lisp 22:24:02 -!- ChanServ has set mode -o p_l 22:27:06 stassats`: whatever happened to the efforts of getting rid of the big compiler lock? Why am I thinking that it had already been removed? 22:27:56 wishful thinking, perhaps? 22:28:27 I thought Krystof was working on it or had posted news about having a patch. 22:28:27 i think nikodemus wanted to remove it and then the whole indigogo debacle happened 22:28:36 nikodemus rather* 22:28:57 *sykopomp* wants some more of this stuff he's clearly smoking. 22:28:57 What's this indigogo debacle? 22:29:21 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:29:59 lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has joined #lisp 22:31:46 Bike_ [~Glossina@71-214-84-152.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:32:01 -!- chord [322f5788@gateway/web/freenode/ip.50.47.87.136] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:34:12 nilsi_ [~nilsi@host-95-199-199-75.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 22:34:51 -!- Bike [~Glossina@174-25-32-249.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:36:31 -!- Bike_ [~Glossina@71-214-84-152.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:36:45 -!- Sagane [~Sagane@177.100-226-89.dsl.completel.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:36:45 <_schulte_> any pointer for how to investigate the memory usage of an object in sbcl? 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