00:00:02 -!- Corvidium [~cosman246@71-217-21-238.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:00:30 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abod142.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 00:05:13 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.148.199.33] has joined #lisp 00:05:38 Common Lisp spoiled me :( 00:08:29 -!- kfoo_ [~kfoo@cable-86-56-52-189.cust.telecolumbus.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:09:01 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.102.71.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:09:01 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 00:12:31 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:12:47 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:20:27 -!- zacts [~user@unaffiliated/zacts] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:20:41 nilsi [~nilsi@host-95-199-221-115.mobileonline.telia.com] has joined #lisp 00:21:33 -!- runningskull is now known as zz_runningskull 00:26:03 Denommus` [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has joined #lisp 00:27:07 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:27:38 -!- Denommus` [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus/x-89635553] has quit [Client Quit] 00:27:59 Yes, that's the curse. 00:28:46 youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 00:29:42 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:30:34 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 00:31:31 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@87.115.32.192] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:32:15 Denommus: http://eewz0z.pen.io/?utm_source=hackernewsletter&utm_medium=email 00:32:27 (he has "lisp" on his resume). 00:33:05 already read that 00:33:39 it's not my situation, though. I'm pretty happy at my job, it's just that... C++ is worrysome 00:33:46 Another bad sign. 00:34:34 why? 00:34:42 hi guys, how can I take a keyword in a macro and prepend a package specifier? As a test I'm trying: (defmacro pack-that-shit (arg) `(list my-private-package:,arg)) 00:34:56 but that's illegal symbol syntax apparently 00:35:25 photex: (defmacro pack-that-shit (arg) `(list ,(intern (string arg) :my-private-package))) 00:35:47 photex: And might I say that this seems a fairly unlikely scenario to actually need? 00:35:55 well 00:36:10 I'm trying to refer to a cffi foreign struct slot 00:36:22 my cffi defs are in a separate package 00:36:22 Ouch. Say no more, please. (-: 00:36:27 anyway, I'm making a scene graph 2D engine in my freetime. In CL, of course 00:36:29 photex: macros simply assemble cons lists; they don't work at the textual level. 00:36:51 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-222-34-97.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:36:52 I just don't know which name to give it. Any suggestion? 00:37:08 I'm think about CLOWN (Common Lisp Object ) 00:37:21 s/I'm think/I'm thinking/ 00:37:45 Bike [~Glossina@71-222-34-97.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 00:37:46 Denommus: Working Nominaly 00:38:40 -!- nilsi [~nilsi@host-95-199-221-115.mobileonline.telia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:38:43 I just don't know if I will manage to make the engine crossplatform 00:38:59 minion: Advice on portable? 00:38:59 #12017: It doesn't need to be portable, it just needs to work on your system. 00:39:10 pjb: I liked it 00:39:19 -!- ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@fsf/member/chibapet] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:39:34 -!- youlysse` [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Quit: BED! :-I] 00:39:53 nyef: oh, I want it to be portable, though. I want to be able to create games for Android in Common Lisp, here at the company 00:40:08 as I said before my connection dropped, Common Lisp spoiled me 00:40:17 ... Good luck, given the number of CL implementations for android... 00:40:34 thanks nyef pkhuong; I was going to create a macro because I'll probably end up doing this in several places and I figured for something this small a macro would have been better than a function 00:40:35 CCL runs in Android 00:40:49 Denommus: Yes, exactly. Now name a second and third option. d-: 00:41:09 ABCL is being ported, isn't it? 00:41:30 but why would I need more than one implementation, anyway? 00:41:34 (honest question) 00:41:39 nyef: given that you only get one C++ runtime and one Java runtime; having a single common lisp runtime isn't so bad :) 00:41:43 Denommus: No idea. 00:41:43 roadt_ [~roadt@60.168.94.177] has joined #lisp 00:41:46 photex: And have you considered the value of a :USE clause in defpackage? 00:41:56 Don't forget clisp. :) 00:42:12 was clisp ported? I didn't know 00:42:28 Must we remember clisp? I've been TRYING to forget it. 00:42:54 nyef: I have... but perhaps I misunderstand it; wouldn't that pollute my package namespace? 00:42:54 the problem is... our current engine runs in basically anything under the Sun, and can be ported for what it still doesn't run 00:43:15 but... C++. I mean, it's better than Java, but I'm not even allowed to use C++11 00:43:21 I want the ffi crap to be isolated 00:43:27 ryankara1on [~rak@cpe-76-189-227-224.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:43:30 that's my motivation. I'm a spoiled kid 00:43:57 it should be a crime to not allow C++11 on a platform 00:44:18 photex: You're not allowed to use C++11 on my LispOS. d-: 00:44:29 *photex* cries a river 00:44:47 Hard to stop people from using C++11, given that if they're sufficiently insane they can write their own interpreter for it. 00:45:03 -!- ryankara1on [~rak@cpe-76-189-227-224.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] 00:45:18 the problem is that we don't know if every platform will have a C++11 compiler 00:45:50 What, gcc doesn't count? 00:45:59 Ah. The problem is that you want other people to have done all of the hard work for you. :) 00:46:35 Zhivago: no, I'm the guy who wants to create a common lisp graphics engine in his free time 00:46:53 Well, then C++11 shouldn't be a factor. 00:47:04 Zhivago: the company I'm working in does not have resources to waste on creating compilers for all the platforms we want to sue 00:47:31 An interesting approach ... 00:47:31 Zhivago: (not (eql *me* *my-company*)) 00:47:39 Is it like the patent trolls? 00:47:44 s/sue/use/ 00:49:35 if they catch me creating a C++11 compiler/interpreter instead of simply producing C++09 code, I'll be in trouble (of course, I could work on it on my free time, but why not creating one for Common Lisp instead?) 00:50:18 You could use clang to compile C++11 to javascript. 00:51:22 d11wtq [~chris@1.146.44.71] has joined #lisp 00:52:08 Zhivago: Then he could just write a JS->C++09 compiler? 00:52:44 Then check the C++09 code into the repo, and no one will be the wiser. 00:52:45 Zhivago: how would that help me? =P 00:53:26 ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@cocytus.blisses.org] has joined #lisp 00:53:26 -!- ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@cocytus.blisses.org] has quit [Changing host] 00:53:26 ChibaPet [~ChibaPet@fsf/member/chibapet] has joined #lisp 00:53:27 Well, javascript runs on all important platforms. 00:53:47 I wish mocl was released, or abandoned and the code publicly released with a permissive license 00:53:55 -!- Guest21872 is now known as eMBee 00:54:31 Well, it's still early 2013. 00:56:19 -!- zz_runningskull is now known as runningskull 00:56:30 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:57:33 -!- d11wtq [~chris@1.146.44.71] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:03:31 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.161.133.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:04:24 prxq__ [~mommer@mnhm-5f75fec2.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 01:04:33 ejohnson [~Thunderbi@c-67-181-201-173.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:05:18 -!- spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:05:30 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@ip-4761.sunline.net.ua] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:06:25 acieroid` [~acieroid@wtf.awesom.eu] has joined #lisp 01:07:23 -!- prxq_ [~mommer@mnhm-5f75d3c6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:07:24 hm, I just found out about ECL. Won't it work? 01:07:48 brucem_ [~bmitchene@waywardmonkeys.com] has joined #lisp 01:07:56 nitefli [sage@reaver.cat.pdx.edu] has joined #lisp 01:08:16 aw|sovereign_ [~aw@unaffiliated/aw] has joined #lisp 01:08:30 pok_ [~pok@tarrant.klingenberg.no] has joined #lisp 01:08:31 _schulte1 [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:08:43 -!- acieroid [~acieroid@wtf.awesom.eu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:08:43 -!- brucem [~bmitchene@waywardmonkeys.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:43 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:43 -!- aw|sovereign [~aw@unaffiliated/aw] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:43 -!- sytse [sytse@swielinga.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:43 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:43 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- pok [~pok@tarrant.klingenberg.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- ether0_ [~ether0@72.22.83.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- Yamazaki1kun [~bsa3@jetalone.facefault.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 -!- nitefli19 [~sage@131.252.210.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:08:44 redline6561_ [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 01:09:06 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 01:09:11 -!- eMBee is now known as eM|Bee 01:09:23 |3b|` [foobar@cpe-72-177-66-41.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:09:26 ASau`` [~user@p4FF97CD4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 01:09:44 -!- eM|Bee is now known as eMBee 01:09:45 sytse [sytse@swielinga.nl] has joined #lisp 01:09:54 ether0 [~ether0@72.22.83.65] has joined #lisp 01:10:08 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@static.198.240.4.46.clients.your-server.de] has quit [Changing host] 01:10:08 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 01:10:22 Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 01:10:35 fasta_ [~xchat@xs8.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 01:10:59 ECL doesn't load lispbuilder-sdl. That's a bummer... 01:11:07 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:08 -!- TML [~joey@unaffiliated/tml] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:19 -!- ASau` [~user@p4FF97CD4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:19 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:19 -!- tvaalen [~r@kinda.sorta.maybe.going.postal.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:19 -!- bind [~bind@unaffiliated/bind] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:19 -!- fasta [~xchat@xs8.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:20 -!- |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-177-66-41.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:20 -!- kbtr [~kbtr@li198-73.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:11:21 My_Hearing [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 01:11:26 -!- eMBee is now known as eM|Bee 01:11:31 -!- eM|Bee is now known as eM-Bee 01:11:37 -!- eM-Bee is now known as 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BlastHardcheese madnificent fe[nl]ix antifuchs froggey schoppenhauer maxm- JPeterson Natch keepishop Xach impulse aerique guther_ Tribal mtd rtoym ThePhoeron neena spacefrogg^ guaqua` cross_ bobbysmith0071 DrPete_ _if_ Anarch specbot dRbiG frodef sbryant sshirokov p_l|omoikane billstclair jhj runningskull Amadiro patrickwonders Nisstyre Watcher7 ahoops jaimef bolcselo phadthai hugod MrWoohoo 04:53:15 -!- runningskull is now known as zz_runningskull 04:54:48 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 04:55:19 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 05:02:36 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.164.47.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:06:55 rmathews [~roshan@122.164.84.160] has joined #lisp 05:07:54 -!- nialo [nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:10:48 hi all 05:10:53 -!- ahungry_ [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:11:10 ahungry 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[~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has joined #lisp 05:22:27 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 05:23:08 -!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Quit: ...] 05:26:53 -!- yCrazyEdd [~unluffed@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:27:23 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 05:28:30 Aethaeryn [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #lisp 05:29:50 tigranes [~richard@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 05:32:40 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:34:01 Hi! If I'm writing a function that is using a function that exists in newer version of SBCL, what would be the best way to implement it with alternative way of doing things for older versions? Would I use the #+#.(cl:if (cl:find-symbol "MAP-DIRECTORY" :sb-ext) '(and) '(or)) form I see in SBCL manual, or just do run-time checking? 05:34:30 Or maybe the run-time checking not even an option because the compiler errors on not being able to find SB-EXT:MAP-DIRECTORY... 05:34:43 yeah, that's why you'd use the read form. 05:35:11 I see, thanks :) 05:36:50 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.172.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 05:39:04 -!- zacts [~blueberry@unaffiliated/zacts] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:39:36 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-170-10.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 05:43:52 -!- ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:46:18 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:46:51 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 05:47:03 Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.242.228] has joined #lisp 05:47:22 -!- p_nathan 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[~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 09:31:46 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:34:33 abeaumont [~abeaumont@241.Red-79-156-231.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 09:40:03 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:42:20 AeroNotix [~xeno@abod142.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 09:42:40 -!- nug700_ [~nug700@174-19-142-27.phnx.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 09:43:37 -!- zz_runningskull is now known as runningskull 09:49:41 leo2007 [~leo@119.161.133.157] has joined #lisp 09:52:18 zacharias [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has joined #lisp 09:54:36 are Lisp programs often configured like emacs, i.e. with a separate file that actually is Lisp, not just a config? it seems like a cool way to configure a program. 09:55:08 lisp programs? what's that? 09:56:33 If your question is 'are lisp programs generally configured with lisp code?' then the answer is probably 'yes'. 09:57:56 okay, more specifically: if I write a package in Common Lisp with ASDF in a git repository, it seems like some parts are best separated into dotfiles in the user's home directory on Unix-like operating systems, kind of like .emacs, and I want to know if this is a newbie mistake. 09:58:38 does it work for you? 09:58:47 if so, then it's not a mistake 09:59:20 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-197-102.dsl.mweb.co.za] has quit [Quit: Harag] 10:00:16 I could need some style advice. When should I use labels over defun? 10:00:37 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:00:56 As of now, I use labels whenever I need to initialize a recursive function. 10:01:02 when you think that the chance of it being used separately is slim and it improves code readability 10:01:19 stassats`: right 10:01:20 you don't have to pass as many arguments with labels 10:01:27 Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-197-102.dsl.mweb.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:02:09 That's also a fair point. 10:02:13 Thanks 10:02:22 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 10:02:27 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:04:21 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.161.133.157] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:05:49 they also don't have to use especially descriptive names 10:05:59 -!- atrible33 [~atrible33@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:08:05 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:09:45 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:09:54 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-4d0b1774.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:12:08 pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 10:13:10 stassats`: well, there are advantages to following conventions on things like configuration. e.g. libraries. 10:13:28 libraries don't have configuration files 10:14:12 -!- pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:14:24 no, I mean the benefit in using conventions is the use of libraries that support what you're doing. 10:14:30 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-231-211.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:14:55 I am trying to be concise because I'm on a tablet, and apparently failing. 10:15:24 there's only a handful of fully featured public applications, there's no conventions 10:16:02 well, that's unfortunate. 10:18:45 pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 10:21:50 -!- zacharias [~zacharias@unaffiliated/zacharias] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:23:50 akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has joined #lisp 10:24:34 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:25:26 just stick the configuration in a place on the filesystem that: a) is not surprizing; b) is not likely to be read-only 10:26:12 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:26:16 that pretty much leaves you "dot-file in the user homedir" or, lately, "a file or subtree under ~/.config/" 10:27:27 I assume that for Unix-like OSes, that would be home for a user (or .config, yes, I've noticed that lately) or /etc for an app installed in /usr/bin 10:27:35 i.e. following Unix conventions? 10:28:17 there are more interesting questions regarding "config files" than "where do I put them", anyway. like what is allowed in them, at which point in the program's lifetime are they loaded, should "config re-load" be supported and what it should mean, etc. 10:28:33 -!- ehu [~ehu@109.33.51.86] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:28:35 Aethaeryn: yup 10:29:03 yes, which is why a library would be useful. interesting "config files" aren't trivial. 10:30:20 treating it like how emacs treats it would be interesting. makes things very customizable. except it would be in a real Lisp and not a toy language like elisp ;-P 10:30:43 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:32:45 -!- pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:33:55 -!- teggi [~teggi@123.20.31.134] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:33:57 for instance, an IRC client would be quite scriptable through a full Lisp file as its configuration. 10:35:12 I can see how it's generalizable to all sorts of plugin-capable applications, and so I assume there's already several libraries out there to do this? 10:35:40 leo2007 [~leo@li511-224.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 10:36:39 no 10:36:41 if the ~/.config/foo.lisp is capable of loading Lisp files that alter the behavior of the application, anything is possible! 10:38:10 hmm, I need a name for the set of these projects that I may wind up doing this summer. perhaps 'NIH'? :-) 10:38:25 too unoriginal 10:39:01 I'd use something mathy but literally everything along those lines has been used. usually three times. 10:41:59 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 10:42:55 I could make an acromym, e.g. Common Lisp Operating System. oops :-) 10:44:03 -!- MoALTz_ is now known as MoALTz 10:44:53 I think "hacksturbation" is probably the most accurate thing my just-for-fun ideas have been called so far, but I'm told corporations don't like those sorts of names. 10:44:55 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-231-211.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 10:45:18 wow really 10:45:24 Just Pick A Name 10:45:36 the name is SO unimportant in comparison 10:47:49 I am probably just going to write a program to write a name for me. let's hope the program doesn't need configuration! 10:51:42 pnpuff [~C62@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 10:52:12 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:52:48 prip_ [~foo@host48-125-dynamic.26-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 10:52:52 -!- prip [~foo@host194-121-dynamic.3-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:53:48 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:53:48 chenqisu [~Thunderbi@113.89.209.227] has joined #lisp 10:55:09 -!- chenqisu [~Thunderbi@113.89.209.227] has quit [Client Quit] 10:55:52 -!- SrPx [b1626582@gateway/web/freenode/ip.177.98.101.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:01:20 -!- pnpuff [~C62@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:03:09 jute [~Thunderbi@31.212.107.98] has joined #lisp 11:03:17 alaa [~alaa@92.96.49.185] has joined #lisp 11:05:10 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 11:07:14 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:08:01 -!- runningskull is now known as zz_runningskull 11:08:30 -!- zz_runningskull is now known as runningskull 11:09:42 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:09:42 chu [~user@unaffiliated/chu] has joined #lisp 11:12:45 pkhuong [~pkhuong@gravelga.xen.prgmr.com] has joined #lisp 11:14:21 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 11:14:38 araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 11:14:38 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Changing host] 11:14:38 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 11:14:49 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 11:16:17 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:19:43 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.57.66.242] has joined #lisp 11:19:43 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.57.66.242] has quit [Changing host] 11:19:43 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 11:20:16 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@a85-138-197-134.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 11:22:52 -!- leo2007 [~leo@li511-224.members.linode.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:26:30 woe-boding75 [~woe-bodin@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:26:52 -!- Nosceteipsum [~Nosceteip@e177253236.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:29:36 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:32:21 -!- stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:35:01 BW^- [~Miranda@5-15-173-36.residential.rdsnet.ro] has joined #lisp 11:35:13 what research has been made into application layer/protocol ports? 11:35:13 E.g., (make-http-client-port client-channel-port) => http-client-port , (make-gzip-decompress-port source-port) => gzip-decompressed-data-port 11:38:38 ron_reagan [4c5f3ec4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.95.62.196] has joined #lisp 11:39:03 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:40:54 pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 11:41:09 -!- jute [~Thunderbi@31.212.107.98] has quit [Quit: jute] 11:42:58 -!- akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 11:43:40 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-42-33.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:45:42 Nosceteipsum [~Nosceteip@e183232214.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 11:45:58 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:46:18 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 11:48:15 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.198.219] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:48:23 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:48:37 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 11:49:22 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.198.219] has joined #lisp 11:49:30 anyone? :) 11:49:30 give me a no please, if that's the case :)) 11:52:01 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Client Quit] 11:52:22 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 11:53:00 -!- pnpuff [~C6248@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:55:58 ports aren't a CL concept. do you mean streams? 11:56:30 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Client Quit] 11:56:49 anyone trying ningle? 11:56:52 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 11:57:47 if so, not sure what research there is to be done there. user-extensible streams are as old as the standard, and their use is well understood 11:58:33 akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has joined #lisp 12:00:21 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Client Quit] 12:01:17 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:01:24 benkard [~benkard@mnch-5d8696be.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 12:03:01 -!- cYmen [~cymen@squint.a-oben.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:05:43 -!- jsnell_ is now known as jsnell 12:06:00 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Client Quit] 12:08:15 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:09:10 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@a85-138-197-134.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:10:06 Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 12:10:21 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:10:38 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:11:07 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.165.89.11] has quit [Quit: Bye..] 12:12:56 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:13:09 jsnell_: yeah streams :) 12:13:28 jsnell_: aha intersting. so generally when you open a TCP connection on a TCP channel, you get a stream? 12:14:05 jsnell_: how generally would you apply a byte stream to a gzip decompression transformer abstraction as to get a gzip-decompressed data byte stream? 12:14:41 talas [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 12:15:29 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:17:33 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:18:00 jsnell: ^ 12:18:04 -!- |3b|``` is now known as |3b| 12:18:09 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.148.200.158] has joined #lisp 12:18:20 yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:18:29 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:18:30 -!- yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 12:18:30 yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has joined #lisp 12:18:48 CL socket APIs will generally include a way of getting a stream, yes 12:18:49 <|3b|> BW^-: chipz:make-decompressing-stream maybe? 12:19:12 aha 12:19:18 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.148.199.33] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:19:18 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 12:19:19 things like compressing streams would generally be implemented using the gray streams protocol 12:19:27 |3b|,jsnell: what's the overhead on using this stuff? 12:19:53 i.e., the streams DSL/layer/API, for byte-level or block-level accesses, what's its overhead? 12:20:06 for instance, does it impose an extra round of data buffering/copying, or an extra round through the scheduler? 12:20:18 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 12:20:29 |3b|,jsnell: could you refer me to a suuper-simple example of how you would open a TCP connection and then make a gzip stream of it, and then do some gzip-stream-level access? 12:21:10 no, but I would imagine that google can give you such an example now that you know what these things are called 12:21:22 jsnell: aha 12:21:29 jsnell: what about the overhead? 12:21:49 *|3b|* hasn't done that particular thing, so don't know details 12:22:07 -!- ron_reagan [4c5f3ec4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.95.62.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:22:21 *|3b|* would expect extra buffering 12:22:33 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:24:06 performance will vary based on the implementation, and the nature of the stream 12:25:25 a socket can ideally be directly backed by a OS fd, and would have no overhead 12:25:31 jsnell: the stream interface in itself, does it imply overhead, like copying, buffering, a round through the scheduler? 12:25:56 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.198.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:26:21 <|3b|> 'a round through the scheduler'? 12:28:21 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 12:29:53 <|3b|> using gray streams implies generic function dispatch, and using lisp implies GC (assuming the code allocates memory) 12:30:30 <|3b|> if you don't want to be calling functions for every octet, i suspect you might need to make some copies too 12:31:33 mhm 12:31:40 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:33:47 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:34:03 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:34:57 if you're going to layer multiple transforming streams on top of each other, you either need buffering, you need to be operating one element at a time (with the performance implications), or you need some kind of code transformation that fuses all of the layers into a single operation 12:35:15 gray streams certainly doesn't support the last 12:35:44 Guastatore [Guastatore@host149-85-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 12:35:49 ciao 12:35:51 !list 12:36:22 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:36:36 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 12:37:14 -!- Guastatore [Guastatore@host149-85-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has left #lisp 12:38:40 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:40:22 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:41:05 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:42:02 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.198.219] has joined #lisp 12:42:22 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 12:43:33 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:45:27 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 12:45:49 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@a85-138-197-134.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #lisp 12:45:54 -!- tali713 [~tali713@2001:0:53aa:64c:1896:64db:b3ee:137e] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:48:09 nha [~prefect@koln-4d0b1774.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 12:48:18 jsnell,|3b|: aha. what's a good place to read more about this functionality? i mean, not in nitty-gritty detail but as to get the concept and its implications 12:49:24 zerowaitstate [~dwaites@75.23.43.249] has joined #lisp 12:49:50 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:55:23 <|3b|> not really much there besides the details... there is a protocol you can implement to define a stream (basically define a class and some methods for things like reading an element or reading a sequence of elements) 12:55:56 <|3b|> the methods implementing the stream can do whatever they want to produce the requested data, including reading from some other stream 12:57:32 <|3b|> look for 'gray streams' for more info 13:01:09 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:01:13 przl [~przlrkt@p5B298C4F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 13:08:01 -!- zerowaitstate [~dwaites@75.23.43.249] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:11:33 -!- bitonic [~user@176.27.229.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:13:36 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:13:41 -!- runningskull is now known as zz_runningskull 13:16:48 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:17:42 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-137-51.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 13:19:46 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.198.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:20:58 -!- Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 13:21:19 Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 13:26:02 tsuru```` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-198-236.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 13:28:02 -!- tsuru``` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-28-37.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:28:04 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 13:28:05 |3b|: mhm, so 'gray streams' is what's interesting and any other would not be 13:29:04 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:29:25 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:29:36 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@a85-138-197-134.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:30:31 <|3b|> gray streams is the most common way to extend streams in common lisp (it isn't part of the standard, but most implementations support it), but there may be other ways for specific implementations 13:30:58 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-173-206-147-121.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:31:00 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 13:32:40 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 13:33:40 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 13:38:08 leo2007 [~leo@119.161.133.157] has joined #lisp 13:45:45 antgreen 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syrinx_ surrounder pkhuong_ miah_ 20:14:34 -!- names: NimeshNeema Faed slyrus Jubb cmm mathrick_ rvchangue EvW elliottcable scharan ryankarason nilsi_ sytse rk[imposter] saeftl daimrod otwieracz xristos n0vember kpreid pok easiere` Tanami ktx_ kiuma mgsk antoszka borism fantazo dan64 quackv5 brucem_ woe-boding75 jcazevedo ZombieChicken Euthy agumonkey tvaalen MoALTz Harag eli _schulte_ acieroid Alaa TML pierpa` balle ered-away nitefli19 s0ber tensorpudding Patzy luis weie_ ISF ivan\ rotty joast kcj 20:14:34 -!- names: victor_lowther Tarential akovalenko angavrilov madsy patrickwonders ckoch__ Aethaeryn axion dotemacs_ SeanTAllen Zhivago zz__ yan_ eak ft yroeht dpwright housel igorw clog yeltzooo asedeno zvrba nuba kyl jasom foom eichelbart_ oGMo sigjuice gor[e] ferada arkx dim pchrist bege gemelen Odin- wyan wormphlegm sklr H4ns rfgpfeiffer felipe j_king rabite_ gabot tomaw fe[nl]ix antifuchs maxm- keepishop Xach guther_ Tribal guaqua` cross_ bobbysmith0071 _if_ Anarch 20:14:34 -!- names: dRbiG frodef billstclair zz_runningskull Amadiro Nisstyre Watcher7 jaimef phadthai hugod milosn theBlackDragon lusory xpoqp Neptu capisce Subfusc_ ttm Mandus_ Ralt varjagg Tordek dlowe brendyn rpgsimmaster_ peterhil vhost- emma mikaelj_ fasta_ rking1 Yamazaki-kun Adeon Mon_Ouie gko_ jsnell flip214 xrq``` ether0 peccu1 cmbntr_ joshe tkd kfoo__ strobegen cods_ derrida youlysses ramus naeg galdor adeht jdz_ koisoke epsylon` 20:14:58 kanwei [~kanwei@107.194.88.155] has joined #lisp 20:15:40 zickzackv [~faot@13.86.199.85.ediscom.de] has joined #lisp 20:18:08 hq1 [~aerosol@ns1.insant.pl] has joined #lisp 20:18:21 rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.86] has joined #lisp 20:18:55 This seems really cool compared to eshell: http://www.totalannihilationclojurechallenge.com/2011/11/lisp-machine-command-propt.html 20:21:17 -!- dabl [~dabl@ven34-2-82-238-141-134.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:22:18 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:22:28 yes, rm foo.* -i is so much worse 20:22:31 -!- zickzackv [~faot@13.86.199.85.ediscom.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:22:46 zickzackv [~faot@13.86.199.85.ediscom.de] has joined #lisp 20:23:51 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 20:24:03 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:24:28 ckoch786 [~quassel@108-70-143-173.lightspeed.toldoh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:24:53 it doesn't seem really better than eshell, which allows you to do elisp inline too 20:25:10 stassats: well, think of a more complicated composition of tags, e.g. ls -laR (recursively list in the long format all, don't do this in / or ~) 20:25:27 well I don't use eshell for lack for documentation, but I've been told it's been fixed, so I should someday spend some time on it 20:26:06 ianmcorvidae|alt [~ianmcorvi@ip68-99-254-231.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:08 which also can be ls -l -a -R. and you can then also combine the ls -tags dir1 -tags dir2. which sometimes produces different results than eshell because of complexity (can't remember the tags) 20:26:09 Aethaeryn: M-x find-dired 20:26:58 emartenson__ [~loke@203.127.16.194] has joined #lisp 20:27:01 managing files in Emacs is best done with dired, the shell is a poor mechanism when compared to dired, IMV 20:27:13 but well, let's continue on #emacs ;) 20:28:08 eslick [~eslick@c-107-3-191-4.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:28:21 solvip [~solvip@89-160-141-139.du.xdsl.is] has joined #lisp 20:28:23 well, I would be interested in writing a (Common) Lisp shell that provides a better interface for such things by being Lisp-style rather than compatible. 20:29:05 since I find shells a good way to navigate files, but think eshell misses potential by aiming for too much compatibility. 20:29:06 have you seen termkit before? 20:29:41 zerowaitstate [~dwaites@adsl-75-23-43-249.dsl.lgvwtx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:29:43 no 20:29:47 manually managing files is so passe 20:30:10 well first google answer here: https://github.com/unconed/TermKit 20:30:15 abend_ [~quassel@75-148-54-129-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 20:30:43 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:30:46 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-170-10.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 20:31:00 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:31:01 -!- macrobat [~fuzzyglee@h-199-47.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:01 -!- loke_ [~loke@203.127.16.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:05 -!- pjb [~t@AMontsouris-651-1-105-114.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:05 -!- hpd [~hpd@46.38.234.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:06 -!- iLogical_ [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:31:09 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.160.220.52] has joined #lisp 20:31:22 -!- 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#lisp 20:33:06 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.102.65.235] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:33:06 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 20:33:16 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 20:34:24 araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has joined #lisp 20:34:47 dim: interesting. 20:35:31 k-stz [~user@HSI-KBW-095-208-250-020.hsi5.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 20:36:10 -!- ianmcorvidae|alt is now known as ianmcorvidae 20:38:26 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 20:39:48 expez- [~expez@expez.com] has joined #lisp 20:39:51 -!- zickzackv [~faot@13.86.199.85.ediscom.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:40:07 zickzackv [~faot@13.86.199.85.ediscom.de] has joined #lisp 20:40:14 redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 20:42:26 PuffTheMagic [uid3325@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session] has joined #lisp 20:42:26 of course, I think radical minimalism with vectors would fit better in a graphical terminal. more like the styles of the interface formerly known as metro. the square shapes would fit, too, since it would tile. just because you can have fancy color icons in a terminal doesn't mean you should. 20:42:26 -!- agumonkey [~agu@101.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:42:26 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.45.171] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:42:35 agumonkey [~agu@101.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:42:38 -!- Natch [~Natch@c-10cfe155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [*.net *.split] 20:42:39 -!- Bike [~Glossina@75-164-174-146.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 20:42:39 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 20:42:40 -!- redline6561_ [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 20:42:40 -!- expez [~expez@expez.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 20:43:10 -!- rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.86] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:43:31 lduros [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined 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has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:25:31 -!- cmbntr_ [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:32 pjb [~t@AMontsouris-651-1-105-114.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 21:25:32 -!- knob [~knob@adsl-64-237-234-140.prtc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:33 -!- surrounder [~surrounde@095-096-032-026.static.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:33 -!- elliottcable [~me@ell.io] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:33 Total annihilation of clojure? 21:25:54 -!- talas_ [~talas@136.144.16.62.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:54 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:25:54 -!- Thra11 [~Thra11@87.112.165.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:26:02 knob [~knob@adsl-64-237-234-140.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 21:26:09 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.148.205.54] has joined #lisp 21:26:20 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 21:26:46 surrounder 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Vutral [ss@vutral.net] has quit [Excess Flood] 21:34:59 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 21:37:15 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@a85-138-197-134.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:41:19 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-173-135.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 21:44:33 Vutral [ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 21:44:56 pjb: I'm using your symbolic programming little example with colors in my next CL article, if you agree 21:44:58 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:45:07 well you posted it on the newsgroup so I guess you will ;) 21:45:23 to show how to get compiled code for free when you write a parser 21:46:07 -!- kanwei [~kanwei@107.194.88.155] has quit [] 21:48:06 (disassemble (compile nil (parse-program))) 21:48:13 I really have a "ahah" moment here 21:49:07 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 21:49:33 kpreid 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#lisp 22:01:05 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 22:02:17 xrq```` [~user@ip67-88-213-10.z213-88-67.customer.algx.net] has joined #lisp 22:02:27 bobbysmith007 [~russ@216.155.103.30] has joined #lisp 22:02:43 deleuz [~derrida-f@www.informalcode.com] has joined #lisp 22:03:38 strz [~strobegen@64.120.223.138] has joined #lisp 22:03:44 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-147-247.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 22:03:46 mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has joined #lisp 22:04:06 Harag1 [~Thunderbi@41-135-197-102.dsl.mweb.co.za] has joined #lisp 22:04:38 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has joined #lisp 22:04:57 miah [~miah@jobsville.chia-pet.org] has joined #lisp 22:05:12 theBlack1ragon [~dragon@213.211.143.23] has joined #lisp 22:05:13 milosn_ [~milosn@user-5af501c0.broadband.tesco.net] has joined #lisp 22:05:29 zvrba_ [96456@diamant.ifi.uio.no] has joined #lisp 22:05:36 rotty_ [rotty@yade.xx.vu] has joined #lisp 22:05:42 _if [~if@94-76-243-32.static.as29550.net] has joined #lisp 22:05:43 aoh_ [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has joined #lisp 22:06:17 Subfusc_ [~Subfusc@tjenen.de] has joined #lisp 22:06:39 runningsm [~runningsk@li77-167.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 22:07:23 *maxm-* is proud of himself 22:07:56 just managed to make new log4cl load on top of the old one directly 22:08:04 hpd [~hpd@v22010117464441099.yourvserver.net] has joined #lisp 22:08:10 -!- banjara [~Adium@172-7-148-12.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:08:10 banjara [~Adium@unaffiliated/banjara] has joined #lisp 22:08:13 -!- Vutral [ss@vutral.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:08:13 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 22:08:15 Natch [~Natch@c-10cfe155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 22:08:23 despite package name and nickname changes, lots of export list changes, the structure length changes and all that stuff 22:08:31 -!- Khisanth is now known as Guest55415 22:08:32 -!- hq1 is now known as Guest38549 22:08:32 -!- abend_ is now known as Guest7995 22:08:33 -!- pjb is now known as Guest80362 22:08:34 -!- kanwei is now known as Guest99213 22:08:34 -!- lemoinem is now known as Guest22853 22:08:35 -!- tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:09:17 maxm-: Congratulations. 22:09:59 was worth it, learned some new stuff about package system, and how defvar and such work differently in CCL and SBCL 22:10:02 -!- aoh [~aki@unaffiliated/aoh] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:03 -!- miah_ [~miah@jobsville.chia-pet.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:03 -!- Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:03 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:04 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:04 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@41-135-197-102.dsl.mweb.co.za] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:04 -!- eli [~eli@racket/eli] has quit 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dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:14 -!- _if_ [~if@94-76-243-32.static.as29550.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:15 -!- bobbysmith0071 [~russ@216.155.103.30] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:16 -!- Tribal [tribal@rcfreak0.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:18 -!- zvrba [96456@diamant.ifi.uio.no] has quit [*.net *.split] 22:10:18 -!- theBlack1ragon is now known as theBlackDragon 22:10:19 -!- strz is now known as strobegen 22:10:20 -!- rszeno [~rszeno@79.114.98.86] has quit [Write error: Broken pipe] 22:10:37 -!- Subfusc_ is now known as Subfusc 22:10:50 maxm - i was was reading that code to build the log4cl package this morning, quite delightful 22:10:53 bananagram [~bot@c-76-30-158-226.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:11:25 Tribal [tribal@rcfreak0.com] has joined #lisp 22:11:53 dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has joined #lisp 22:12:25 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 22:12:51 bhyde: hmm if something does not build or such, I'd like to hear about it, what was your implementation? 22:12:54 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 22:13:03 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:13:03 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 22:13:06 Tarential [~Tarential@li472-156.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 22:13:07 coz I have not received bug reports for stable version for a while 22:14:33 maxm, no no  everything is fine, i was just trying to puzzle out why m-. didn't work on log:info etc. 22:15:27 -!- youlysses [~user@75-132-28-10.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:17:08 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:17:09 think its fixed now at least in SBCL, I changed to doing (setf (fdefinition)) rather then generating forwarders 22:17:29 heh now the hardest part is to update documentation 22:17:34 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-12.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:17:35 *maxm-* goes back to coding 22:17:43 Yay for (setf documentation). 22:18:16 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 22:18:20 no, I meant the manual and such 22:18:22 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-147-247.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:19:30 roland [~breezy@41.140.75.172] has joined #lisp 22:20:30 -!- gmcastil [~user@LTTNCOMADS0AE07.mcleodusa.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:20:32 erikc [~erikc@CPE00222d53fe78-CM00222d53fe75.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 22:21:45 -!- two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:22:38 tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 22:22:50 -!- Guest55415 [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:23:07 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 22:23:17 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-147-247.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 22:24:26 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-142-240.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 22:25:54 ryoshu [~kamil1212@unaffiliated/ryoshu] has joined #lisp 22:26:30 macrobat [~fuzzyglee@h-199-47.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 22:26:34 -!- tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:27:23 tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 22:28:53 Is there a piece of software (that doesn't use CLOS) that is considered an example of excellent style? 22:29:22 Specifically, I'm looking for error handling and when type-checking should happen, etc. 22:31:15 -!- tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:31:23 what's wrong with clos? 22:31:32 and what's wrong with waiting 180 seconds for a response? 22:31:41 seriously, people, this is IRC. 22:31:52 weekend 22:32:41 Right, it's a weekend, so we're all busy hacking on our Lisp projects instead of goofing off at the office. 22:32:43 Kids these days need instant gratification. 22:32:47 rme [~rme@50.43.144.67] has joined #lisp 22:32:55 alexandria actually not a bad example 22:33:33 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 22:34:01 Shinmera [~linus@xdsl-188-155-176-171.adslplus.ch] has joined #lisp 22:34:04 rtoym: SBCL gencgc appears to require that pinned pages not be write protected. This is probably inherited from CMUCL. Would you happen to have any idea of WHY these pages don't get write protected? 22:35:06 -!- prxq__ [~mommer@mnhm-5f75fec2.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:35:07 nyef_: Good question. Too bad I don't have a good answer. :-( 22:35:12 abeaumont [~abeaumont@181.Red-88-8-236.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:35:25 rtoym: "No, I have no idea" is a good answer. 22:35:26 I must write a 'student work' about embedding lisp languages into C code and to help parsing text files in format like CSV. Should I take every lisp evern and hack around, or would you suggest to take random from CL, some Erlang, Schema 22:36:10 ryoshu: I don't know about scheme implementations, but you might have a look at ECL for the common lisp side. 22:37:06 ryoshu: in scheme there is Guile, and you can also look at Emacs (in emacs-lisp) 22:37:14 Are Schema variants that different? the newest book from my library is from 1990 :) 22:37:37 fmeyer [~fmeyer@186.220.32.223] has joined #lisp 22:37:47 daimrod: ah 22:39:49 I will start with ecl and sbcl 22:39:54 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:40:00 thanks! 22:41:20 tigranes [~richard@static-50-53-64-118.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 22:42:03 ryoshu: You're not going to be able to embed SBCL into a C program, although you can load a C library into an SBCL process and call it. 22:42:37 nyef_: ah! 22:43:24 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-237-45-227.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 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