00:00:20 s/nowadays/nowadays knows/ 00:00:48 (or: the entire point of my question was to waste as much time trying to define what a unit test it as the time wasted by the gymnastics that jasom is talking about) 00:01:01 because now a lot of people don't even make these "mocks" (or stubs, or I don't know what the hell they call them) 00:01:32 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has quit [Quit: o7] 00:02:21 going home 00:02:25 -!- Denommus [~user@201.75.85.87] has quit [Quit: going home] 00:04:15 OR : http://drewc.org/interface/monads.html#sec-8-4-1 <--- I have a test suite for all my programs ... 99% of the time I use ASSERT. none are fake mockups and since I work for myself , do not get paid for wasting time by writing fake hierarchy and mock object tests 00:05:38 In fact, I get paid by having an application that runs fine and is tested to make sure it does so ... so my tests help my get paid, but not by writting them, by running them :) 00:05:57 s/my/me 00:06:39 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@61.157.41.76] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:08:49 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 00:08:56 sw2wolf [~czsq888@61.157.41.76] has joined #lisp 00:12:36 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:13:08 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:13:56 What's the best way to determine whether or not a function is called ? 00:15:24 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 00:16:00 (defvar *is-called* nil) (defun is-called () (setf *is-called* t)) 00:17:03 thx, 00:17:30 -!- k0001_ [~k0001@host169.190-224-54.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:19:09 k0001 [~k0001@host98.190-137-200.telecom.net.ar] has joined #lisp 00:19:35 (let ((is-called nil)) (defun is-called () (setf is-called t)) (defun is-called-called () is-called)) 00:20:08 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-209-90-147-198.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:24:45 -!- Myk267 [~myk@adsl-71-149-249-241.dsl.mtry01.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Ack! Hans, run! It's the lhurgoyf!] 00:24:58 awful 00:25:34 agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 00:26:10 So is your question, so trying awful answers :P fwiw I would prefer the 2nd over the first. 00:26:56 to avoid global variable ? 00:27:21 by using lexical scope 00:27:57 -!- antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 00:28:08 to make it right ... 'global' variable is SPECIAL ... and can be dymaically boundp via LET or LAMBDA etc 00:28:27 sure 00:29:14 antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has joined #lisp 00:29:51 beyond that, there are likely 1000 better ways to do things, save for exactly what I wrote which, if that is all you want/need, is not terribly fscking bad. 00:30:39 In fact i want to know why stumpw:unmap-message-window is called both in SBCL and CCL, but NOT in clisp for the same message window ... 00:31:10 you could trace it. 00:31:16 clhs TRACE 00:31:17 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for TRACE. 00:31:22 normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has joined #lisp 00:31:27 clhs trace 00:31:28 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_tracec.htm 00:31:29 it's case sensitive because... I don't know. 00:31:48 thx 00:31:50 well, I happen to have control over that bot, do I not? 00:32:01 I guess you do know then. 00:32:08 If I do, well, soon it will be 'proper' :) 00:32:22 antgreen [~green@dsl-209-90-147-198.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 00:32:30 If I do not, soon I will :D 00:35:50 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.214.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:37:08 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:38:26 STUMPWM> *trace-output*: # 00:38:27 STUMPWM> (trace unmap-message-window) => NIL , But i see no trace output 00:38:48 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 00:39:03 after the message window disappears 00:41:29 Anyway i am sure it is called according to drewc's suggestion 00:43:07 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:43:20 -!- JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: I love my HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 00:47:10 JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 00:49:00 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 00:57:15 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has left #lisp 01:01:27 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host98.190-137-200.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:02:45 -!- replcated [~user@24-217-97-210.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:05:17 -!- dnolen [~user@rrcs-208-105-4-254.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:06:06 -!- Thra11_ [~thrall@146.90.241.211] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:06:22 -!- Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@177.224.209.89] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:06:32 ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:08:18 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:08:21 leo2007 [~leo@118.186.146.133] has joined #lisp 01:08:53 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 01:12:52 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:14:30 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 01:14:44 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:16:23 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.104] has joined #lisp 01:19:29 slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-240-66.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:19:30 dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:22:57 -!- ikki [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/ikki] has quit [Quit: ikki] 01:28:58 cades [~mac@60.245.69.255] has joined #lisp 01:29:04 -!- cades [~mac@60.245.69.255] has quit [Client Quit] 01:29:48 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:29:54 cades [~mac@60.245.69.255] has joined #lisp 01:31:02 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:31:43 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:33:11 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:33:17 -!- antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:34:21 -!- cades [~mac@60.245.69.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:34:56 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 01:35:17 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 01:36:55 meiji11 [~user@d75-158-40-174.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #lisp 01:36:56 antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has joined #lisp 01:38:52 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 01:42:47 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:44:57 danlentz [~danlentz@2601:c:3680:1c:3196:b58b:7ec2:7c67] has joined #lisp 01:45:05 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:50:21 pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has joined #lisp 01:51:20 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 01:51:44 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has left #lisp 01:53:42 cades [~mac@202.169.163.205] has joined #lisp 01:53:56 so who is using clojure? 01:53:59 is it good? 01:54:42 Many people; that depends on how you measure goodness. 01:59:23 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 02:01:30 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 02:01:43 -!- agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:08:55 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 02:10:11 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:11:35 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:11:54 sabalaba1 [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:12:56 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:12:57 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:19:58 -!- benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:20:45 benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has joined #lisp 02:21:41 jerryzhou: I heard of clojure . But i always feel Java relative is its shortcoming 02:21:57 myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 02:22:13 yes 02:22:22 what about common lisp 02:22:51 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:23:16 CL is a standard alone language which has many implementations 02:23:33 jerryzhou: clojure has its own channel, #clojure 02:25:13 jerryzhou, whether common lisp or clojure is good depends first on what you want to do with it 02:25:43 jerry: Your question is so vague that the answer remains the same. 02:25:52 EvW [~Thunderbi@a82-92-190-215.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 02:25:57 Common Lisp is an excellent language for writing Common Lisp code. One of the best in fact. 02:26:09 jerry: I suggest thinking of some problem that you want to solve, so that you can ask a more specific question. 02:26:32 ok 02:26:42 jerryzhou, if i wanted to buy into the java ecosystem, there is ABCL, which i would prefer over clojure personally 02:27:11 *sw2wolf* struggling to find the trace output through SWANK stream 02:27:29 abcl? 02:27:33 i have sbcl now 02:27:45 Armed Bear Common Lisp 02:27:47 Armed Bear Common Lisp, a CL implementation. 02:28:28 SBCL can produce native code 02:30:25 as Clozure CL 02:36:17 jerryzhou, common lisp's theme song is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdj6deraQ6k 02:38:14 song? 02:38:35 yes 02:38:40 (& video) 02:38:53 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 02:39:00 yes 02:39:03 i am watching 02:39:11 -!- bitonic [~user@b01bf0a7.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:42:53 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:44:43 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 02:46:39 blake__ [~blake@cpe-24-28-26-77.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:50:13 -!- jodie [~jodie@75-31-3-145.lightspeed.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:50:15 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:50:31 jodie [~jodie@75-31-3-145.lightspeed.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:50:36 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 02:51:34 -!- jodie [~jodie@75-31-3-145.lightspeed.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net] has left #lisp 02:53:19 linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 02:54:16 -!- blake__ [~blake@cpe-24-28-26-77.austin.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 02:54:22 I fiddled with Clojure for a while and read a book on it. Clojure is what lead me to Common Lisp. It lead me here because I noticed in many ways Clojure copies Common Lisp, but Clojure is an evolving language, while Common Lisp has many things already worked out. 02:55:48 For example, the sequence abstraction for lazy programming in Clojure changed in the 1.2 or 1.3 release? I don't remember, so a lot of the info on this abstraction while seemingly new is actually outdated. 02:56:38 Also of note is that Clojure programmers don't have the philosophy of Clojure all the way down. 02:57:16 don't expect a lisp philosophy either 02:57:40 I was really impressed to see stuff like compression and decompression libraries, image readers and systems level things like that written in Common Lisp. 02:58:14 what is surprising about algorithms in lisp 02:58:19 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 02:58:34 I'm not used to that. I took a course on functional / declarative programming while getting my CS degree, and we used Haskell, and there people usually bound to C for this systems level sort of thing. 02:58:39 Same goes when I dabbled in python. 02:59:22 So I enjoy that a lot, the Lisp all the way down thing, where almost your entire stack is in this dynamic programmable programming language. 02:59:27 you can program image compression, image readers, etc just fine in Haskell or Python 02:59:53 I know you can. 03:00:34 ISF__ [~ivan@187.64.222.221] has joined #lisp 03:00:38 okay, then i suppose i don't understand the surprise 03:00:51 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 03:03:31 Well the surprise is that most over programming languages I have used just piggy back onto a C library for a lot of things, where as people who use Common Lisp seem to be more willing to do this in Common Lisp, and I think that speaks very positively for the language. 03:04:00 Alternately, it might speak something of the users. 03:04:12 Yes. 03:04:14 for python that's probably closely linked to the cpython runtime being, well, C. 03:04:49 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:05:04 One of the strengths and weaknesses of CL is that it has not traditionally played well with others. 03:05:27 Zhivago: I think someone important or something once said "A programming language is defined by its community" 03:05:46 Which is nonsense, of course. 03:05:57 But how a language is used, on the other hand ... 03:06:27 i was wondering the other day whether or not anyone has tried to use a CL library from another language, and whether or not it's even possible, and how that has affected the adoption of the language 03:07:12 well cffi has defcallback for a reason 03:07:31 I briefly tried using Scheme in a project I was working on commercially 03:07:41 defining callbacks is usually for interfacing to C libraries, not interfacing to Lisp libraries 03:08:34 I opted not to because I didn't know any one Scheme implementation / the ecosystem enough to do so, even though it would have been the right solution, it wasn't the right solution time-cost wise 03:08:42 Quad: ECL makes it straight-forward. 03:08:51 Zhivago, yes 03:10:34 the other question i ponder is how the lack of binary libraries in lisp (and lack of interface definitions) has affected the growth of the available software. It seems the best one can do is provide implementation specific FASLs to load, and some handwritten (or generated) interface documentation. 03:12:21 (but to me, that's about as good as providing someone with a bunch of .o files for C code) 03:13:37 Well, I'd point more to the lack of posix integration. 03:13:49 All a static library in C is the tool ar run on a bunch of .o files 03:14:09 Whcih puts them in one archive, hence ar 03:15:19 And has system level linker support. 03:16:12 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:17:46 teggi [~teggi@113.172.59.16] has joined #lisp 03:18:19 Its weird because a linker has to coordinate tightly with the compiler even though the compiler can be from a different vendor than the linker 03:18:36 Well, the linker has to coordinate with an ABI. 03:19:32 A lot of that is transparent when you use a C compiler though cause e.g. a simple gcc command actually runs a number of different executables 03:19:48 including the linker which is usually supplied by the OS 03:23:46 -!- cades [~mac@202.169.163.205] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 03:25:08 -!- Tanami [~carnage@unaffiliated/tanami] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:26:22 fe[nl]ix: Around? 03:28:47 fe[nl]ix, we need to talk sometime to get iolib to stop breaking on osx 03:29:16 agumonkey [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 03:30:11 -!- tenawa [~user@c-98-201-86-201.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has left #lisp 03:33:13 -!- minion [~minion@tiger.common-lisp.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:33:30 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has joined #lisp 03:34:04 minion [~minion@tiger.common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 03:38:57 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 03:42:56 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:45:16 -!- snits [~snits@inet-hqmc06-o.oracle.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:46:31 ramkrsna 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New: DRAKMA-1.3.1, CHUNGA-1.1.5, Hunchentoot 1.2.15, SBCL 1.1.5, CFFI 0.11.0, Babel 0.4.0, trivial-garbage 0.20 07:06:54 zacts` [~user@174-28-50-78.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:07:05 -!- sw2wolf [~czsq888@61.157.41.76] has left #lisp 07:07:32 -!- zacts [~user@unaffiliated/zacts] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:07:42 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:09:04 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 07:09:44 -!- eisturger [~meisterbu@static-50-43-16-216.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 07:10:01 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.211.139.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:10:48 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.211.139.62] has joined #lisp 07:12:48 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:14:40 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 07:14:46 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.79.135] has joined #lisp 07:18:48 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:26:12 -!- joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:27:27 -!- naeg|afk is now known as naeg 07:29:41 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 07:35:35 Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-221-41-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 07:36:35 -!- Eldariof-ru [~CLD@pppoe-209-190-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:38:53 -!- ohnoitsavram [~user@CPE-60-225-105-159.hhui3.cht.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:39:57 mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has joined #lisp 07:39:57 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has quit [Changing host] 07:39:57 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:47:53 -!- linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 07:48:24 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [] 07:50:06 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 07:53:19 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:54:59 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 07:59:55 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 08:01:31 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:11:31 -!- sabalaba1 [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:12:56 cdidd [~cdidd@128-69-67-61.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 08:16:06 -!- Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-221-41-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:20:04 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-221-41-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 08:24:00 -!- tjos [~tim@101.174.161.170] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:25:23 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.96.130] has joined #lisp 08:27:42 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 08:31:23 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 08:31:29 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:32:53 -!- pegu [~user@cF469BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:34:34 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@ip174-67-209-198.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:36:06 -!- paddymahoney [~paddymaho@198-84-186-52.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:37:15 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.119.253] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:38:46 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:39:28 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:40:24 _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has joined #lisp 08:43:27 dt770 [dt770@c-411ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 08:47:53 -!- _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:52:14 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-159-2.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:54:49 H4ns` [hans@netzhansa.com] has joined #lisp 08:54:49 -!- H4ns [hans@netzhansa.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:55:00 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:55:50 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 08:56:01 -!- gemelen [~gemelen@gemelen.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:56:20 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:57:16 gemelen [~gemelen@gemelen.net] has joined #lisp 08:57:42 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 08:57:54 -!- leo2007 [~leo@118.186.146.133] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:59:11 paddymahoney [~paddymaho@198-84-186-52.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 09:04:44 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 09:06:28 -!- archonix [~archonix@78.90.30.16] has left #lisp 09:07:35 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:08:16 hi! 09:08:33 H4ns`: fixed ABCL's loading of XPATH on trunk. 09:09:34 zacts`` [~user@174-28-63-105.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 09:09:43 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:09:55 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:10:01 -!- zacts` [~user@174-28-50-78.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:11:30 przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:15:55 ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #lisp 09:16:41 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:17:37 ehu: yeah, thanks! 09:17:37 H4ns`, memo from ehu: Just committed a fix to trunk which makes XPATH work for me. Please verify. 09:17:44 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:24:08 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:26:08 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:27:16 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 09:30:24 i need to define two packages. the packages use each other's functions. how do i do that? i can't define them at the same time. 09:31:07 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:32:32 ehu: turned out to be an old ticket? 09:38:31 przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:38:48 pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 09:40:28 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:42:04 -!- _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 09:43:05 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:43:29 xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-134-118.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 09:44:33 dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has joined #lisp 09:46:38 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 09:46:54 ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has joined #lisp 09:48:12 przl_ [~przlrkt@94.23.170.130] has joined #lisp 09:49:31 ck_ [~ck@dslb-188-107-118-070.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 09:50:03 ehu_ [~ehu@109.32.229.90] has joined #lisp 09:50:44 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:53:46 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:55:48 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:58:12 _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 09:59:00 cajetanus [~cajetanus@public-gprs637466.centertel.pl] has joined #lisp 09:59:00 -!- myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:59:33 mallory [~chatzilla@125.122.83.164] has joined #lisp 10:11:01 -!- cades [~mac@202.169.163.205] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:11:59 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@ip174-67-209-198.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:11:59 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:12:18 -!- cajetanus [~cajetanus@public-gprs637466.centertel.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:13:51 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:15:00 gabnet [~gabnet@ACaen-652-1-192-63.w83-115.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 10:20:11 pegu [~user@cF469BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has joined #lisp 10:24:24 -!- gabnet [~gabnet@ACaen-652-1-192-63.w83-115.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:26:34 bitonic [~user@b01bf0a7.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 10:29:43 ykm [~ykm@124.155.255.253] has joined #lisp 10:31:44 nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 10:31:46 -!- ykm [~ykm@124.155.255.253] has quit [Client Quit] 10:32:58 davorb: packages don't use functions. package intern symbols, export symbols, shadow symbols and import symbols. That's all they do. 10:34:45 (defpackage "P1" (:use "CL") (:export "F1")) (defpackage "P2" (:use "CL") (:export "F2")) (defun p1:f1 (x) (if (evenp x) (p2:f2 x) (p1:f1 (1- x)))) (defun p2:f2 (x) (if (oddp x) (p1:f1 x) 0)) 10:40:59 archonix [~none@78.90.30.16] has joined #lisp 10:42:34 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@11.115-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 10:42:34 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@11.115-244-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Changing host] 10:42:34 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 10:43:44 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:43:51 casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 10:44:21 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 10:44:44 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Client Quit] 10:45:30 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:46:55 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.25] has joined #lisp 10:48:46 -!- ehu_ [~ehu@109.32.229.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:54:45 myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 10:56:10 pjb: yeah, that's what i meant. but what if I want (:use :p2) in PI and (:use :p1) in P2? how would i do that? 10:56:18 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:57:31 or is that not possible? 10:57:54 it's not possible with defpackage, naturally 10:57:58 clhs use-package 10:57:59 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_use_pk.htm 10:58:04 but why would you want to do that? 11:01:00 davorb: you would not indeed. But you don't need to. 11:01:58 You could do: (defpackage "P1" (:use "CL") (:export "F1")) (defpackage "P2" (:use "CL" "P1") (:export "F2")) (in-package "P1") (use-package "P2") 11:03:21 Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.247.47] has joined #lisp 11:03:26 davorb: but the question is whether you really need to separate things into different packages. 11:03:51 Newbies have a tendency to make too many packages. (I did). 11:04:17 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d0020b1.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 11:05:51 minion: memo for sw2wolf: I would use my cl-stepper, and diff its output on the various implementations. <01:30:38> In fact i want to know why stumpw:unmap-message-window is called both in SBCL and CCL, but NOT in clisp for the same message window ... 11:05:51 Remembered. I'll tell sw2wolf when he/she/it next speaks. 11:06:32 for one thing, clisp is not using the same clx 11:07:16 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-221-41-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:09:04 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 11:09:30 snearch [~snearch@brln-4db938fd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 11:09:59 minion: memo for sw2wolf: for one thing, cl-stepper has its own *step-trace-output*. 11:09:59 Remembered. I'll tell sw2wolf when he/she/it next speaks. 11:10:48 stassats`: perhaps sw2wolf want to know where they start to diverge. 11:11:16 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:12:01 at the beginning? clisp's new-clx uses xlib 11:13:07 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:13:39 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:15:52 dioxriane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has joined #lisp 11:16:02 -!- snearch [~snearch@brln-4db938fd.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 11:17:44 stassats`: I guess it's some stumpwm code that calls stumpwm:unmap-message-window. But indeed it could be a callback for the X library. 11:18:19 -!- mallory [~chatzilla@125.122.83.164] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:18:48 -!- dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:21:05 mallory [~chatzilla@125.122.80.51] has joined #lisp 11:26:00 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:27:16 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:29:03 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:29:42 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has joined #lisp 11:30:01 ykm [~Thunderbi@124.155.255.253] has joined #lisp 11:31:34 -!- _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:32:09 _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 11:33:37 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 11:34:54 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-132-231.netcologne.de] has 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Bye] 12:27:46 -!- dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:28:58 Of minor interest: may be one of the few times djb posted on c.l.l (: 12:34:19 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:37:10 ehu [~ehu@109.32.229.90] has joined #lisp 12:38:33 http://xach.com/naggum/articles/search?q=bernstein indirectly links to at least one thread that got crossposted around 12:39:02 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 12:40:15 -!- przl_ [~przlrkt@94.23.170.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:42:55 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:44:46 -!- thomas_yzj [~user@175.8.20.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:45:13 -!- ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:45:48 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 12:45:58 ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has joined #lisp 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But SBCL compiles all .lisp files every time I evaluate (require :gsll) in a new sbcl session. What's wrong here? 14:22:02 ASDF 14:22:27 Where shall I start with? 14:22:59 find Fare, and ask him what to do 14:23:51 -!- Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.247.47] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:24:29 Who's he? 14:24:45 myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 14:25:39 _veer [~veer@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 14:27:29 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@109.163.163.67] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:28:59 xecycle: the asdf-devel mailing list has had some recent discussion on this topic 14:29:47 ehu [~ehu@31.137.136.79] has joined #lisp 14:30:42 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:32:16 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 14:34:08 -!- ehu [~ehu@31.137.136.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:34:32 Xach: Thanks, I'll check it out. 14:34:53 -!- antgreen [~green@dsl-209-90-147-198.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:37:10 ehu [~ehu@31.137.136.79] has joined #lisp 14:39:09 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:09 v__ [~v@61.173.89.166] has joined #lisp 14:42:55 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:43:35 -!- ehu [~ehu@31.137.136.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:43:56 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:00 The short answer seemed to be "install ASDF 3 manually" 14:45:15 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 14:45:59 gsll, or a library it depends on, may have to be adapted 14:46:18 3? I found the version bundled with SBCL is 2.26. And the latest announce on the list is 2.32. 14:46:19 asdf "3" changed the way it treats dependencies 14:46:36 xecycle: 2.32 is asdf 3 14:46:50 stassats`: Oh, I didn't know that. 14:47:17 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 14:48:34 masondesu [~textual@adsl-98-71-128-175.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 14:48:43 i'm guilty of suggesting that 2.27 should not become asdf 3.0, but be treated as a pre-release, and here we are, with 2.32 14:49:01 or was it 2.28 14:52:00 as always, upgrading asdf is a pain, half the projects do not work because ASDF broke compatibility, the other half is updated to work with the new ASDF 14:52:30 o_O So my problem is likely to be related to this half-half problem? 14:52:35 so you can't chose to stay on older version, without keeping all other code frozen, nor update to the newer, 14:52:56 stassats`: that's not true 14:53:10 very few projects have problems with ASDF3 14:53:38 if you don't consider endless recompiles to be a problem 14:54:01 I do consider that a problem. It takes minutes on my machine. 14:54:14 but very few is still not non-existent 14:54:30 i'm not saying "it's literally 50% of all projects" 14:56:29 rtoym: I am now 14:57:26 -!- przl [~przlrkt@94-23-173-29.op-net.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:58:58 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:00:53 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 15:02:26 ahungry [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:03:20 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 15:04:59 cddr [user@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:b02b] has joined #lisp 15:07:17 fe[nl]ix: You were looking for me the other day? 15:08:06 Hmm, upgrading to asdf 3 (mostly) solved my problem. Loading the library now takes just seconds, though with quite a lot of messages. 15:09:08 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 15:09:11 Does anyone know of any "active-record" style validation packages in Lisp? 15:10:18 normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has joined #lisp 15:13:05 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:15:43 rtoym: yes. can you run the bordeaux-threads test suite ? on some machines it seems to get stuck in an endless loop somehow 15:15:49 but I can't reproduce it 15:16:41 -!- nialo [nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:18:10 gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:18:47 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-229-075.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:48 blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:26 fe[nl]ix: Let me try it.... 15:22:42 fe[nl]ix: How do I run the tests? 15:23:28 przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:27:29 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 15:32:55 -!- dt770 [dt770@c-411ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Hihi] 15:33:14 jrajav [~jrajav@71-82-124-223.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has joined #lisp 15:33:14 Eldariof28-ru [~CLD@pppoe-206-121-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 15:36:52 -!- Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-197-186-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:37:32 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:37:46 Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has joined #lisp 15:38:05 -!- leoncamel [~leoncamel@219.143.150.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:38:29 -!- xecycle [~user@2001:da8:8000:e104:ca0a:a9ff:fe72:7a0d] has left #lisp 15:39:10 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 15:40:39 fe[nl]ix: the machine were you test bourdeaux-threads, is it multi-core? 15:41:03 cmucl doesn't have native threads 15:41:22 przl_ [~przlrkt@94-23-173-29.op-net.com] has joined #lisp 15:41:33 -!- akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:41:42 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:41:52 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:41:53 stassats`: so it runs in a single native thread and implements its own scheduler? 15:42:13 you have to ask rtoym for details 15:42:29 rtoym: cd ~/quicklisp/local-projects ; git clone https://git.gitorious.org/bordeaux-threads/bordeaux-threads.git 15:42:51 rtoym: (ql:quickload :bordeaux-threads-test) (fiveam:run! :bordeaux-threads) 15:42:52 Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:42:56 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:43:02 ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has joined #lisp 15:43:05 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@i52104.upc-i.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 15:43:16 antonv: I already have the code. I just want to run the tests. 15:43:24 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:43:38 (asdf:test-system 'bordeux-threads), i assume 15:43:40 rtoym: then see the second line of my message 15:43:42 bordeaux 15:43:54 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-bmnvjcclebmlxgwx] has joined #lisp 15:44:01 -!- cnl [~pony@bitdiddle.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:44:52 antonv: Sorry. I didn't see that. It's running now. 15:44:55 yes, asdf:test-system should also work 15:45:23 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:45:40 What is supposed to happen in the test? It's generating lots and lots of dots. 15:46:00 this is the problem 15:46:09 normally it should finish quickly 15:46:15 in a moment 15:46:21 Oh. ok. 15:46:21 each dot means a succeeded test, you'll get a report in a second 15:46:35 linse_ [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:47:27 Unfortunately, I know very little about the cmucl's threads. 15:47:43 nialo [nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 15:48:18 Bike: not, it hangs forever (unill CMUCL crashes with "out of heap") 15:48:29 Oh. Well. 15:49:02 But if dots mean successful check, we know it repeatedly performs some test 15:49:17 this may help to track down the point where it hangs 15:51:22 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [] 15:52:38 fe[nl]ix: btw, if fiveam store test body in the test-case object as a alexandria:named-lambda but not just lambda, it may help to have more informative backtraces 15:55:54 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:56:49 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:57:07 Fare: did you find the reason why buildapp is not working with uiop? 15:58:46 -!- ngz [~user@124.220.67.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:59:24 what the hell, asdf now eats all the compiler notes from sbcl 16:00:21 stassats`: what do you mean eats? hides them? 16:00:38 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-209-130-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 16:01:02 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 16:01:02 stassats`: is it asdf or ql:quickload? 16:03:46 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:03:52 -!- Eldariof28-ru [~CLD@pppoe-206-121-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:04:40 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:04:51 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.247.204] has joined #lisp 16:04:51 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.47.247.204] has quit [Changing host] 16:04:51 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 16:05:18 (car asdf/lisp-build:*uninteresting-conditions*) => SB-INT:SIMPLE-COMPILER-NOTE, well, screw you too, asdf 16:05:50 and is there sb-kernel:redefinition-with-defun 16:06:06 fuck, that caused me so much trouble when refactoring some code 16:06:27 *stassats`* nullifies asdf/lisp-build:*uninteresting-conditions* 16:07:19 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:07:43 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:10 spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 16:08:10 -!- spacefrogg_ is now known as spacefrogg 16:08:26 *stassats`* and enjoys the bliss of having all the notes and warnings 16:09:14 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 16:10:40 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 16:10:43 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:11:11 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:13:08 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:15:33 i don't get the logic, jumping through hoops to get undefined warnings with persisting them to files, and simply ignoring things like sb-kernel:redefinition-with-defun 16:15:46 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:19:36 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:20:03 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:52 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 16:22:25 zophy [goldenligh@gateway/shell/devio.us/x-uquewdjncyoclxwo] has joined #lisp 16:22:40 -!- linse_ [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 16:26:51 Drei dude, change your packages.lisp 16:27:02 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:27:25 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:30:36 Drei::motion uses symbol as a local function somewhere, and does not shadow symbol from the sys...... 16:31:22 -!- myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:31:41 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:32:05 i solved it by putting a (:shadow common-lisp::symbol) in (defpackage drei-motion .... 16:32:07 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:32:14 same goes for other defpackages there that use it.... 16:33:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:34:27 wbooze: (:shadow "SYMBOL") 16:35:02 wbooze: defpackage doesn't take into account the package of the symbols you put there at all. 16:35:10 ok 16:35:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:36:09 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: bleeding] 16:38:10 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:38:16 joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:37 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:39:13 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 16:39:52 #lisp is not a bug tracker for mcclim 16:40:31 I switched my object pointers from boost::shared_ptr to intrusive reference counted pointers. The code runs a little faster but not much faster - I was expecting a larger impact. 16:41:01 i blame modern CPUs 16:41:33 you spend an afternoon carefully optimizing, and the result "here's your 10ms off on 10 million calls" 16:41:56 stassats`: Something like that. 16:42:07 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:42:21 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 16:42:33 cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:43:14 The impact could be greater once I figure out how to do link-time optimization and inlining. I have a few hundred intrusive-ref-count-add and intrusive-ref-count-release calls (one for each class) that could benefit from inlining which I don't believe is currently taking place. 16:43:18 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:44:40 -!- z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:44:43 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:44:48 z0d [~z0d@q.notresp.com] has joined #lisp 16:44:48 -!- z0d [~z0d@q.notresp.com] has quit [Changing host] 16:44:48 z0d [~z0d@unaffiliated/z0d] has joined #lisp 16:45:26 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:45:52 stassats`: it will take many many many calls to pay off an evening by 10ms portions 16:46:36 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:46:40 antonv: fiveam HEAD has that already 16:46:55 I'll make a release this weekend 16:47:10 KingsKnighted [~quassel@c-98-202-60-177.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:47:35 antonv: I can't reproduce the cmucl issue on my quad core i7 16:47:51 -!- Keshi [~Keshi@unaffiliated/keshi] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:47:54 honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 16:48:05 sdemarre [~serge@91.180.79.135] has joined #lisp 16:48:06 the gain will be in not performing reference count updates. 16:48:20 -!- cades [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:48:33 fe[nl]ix: good about fiveam not so good about CMUCL 16:49:06 fe[nl]ix: have you tried on my server? 16:50:59 -!- v__ [~v@61.173.89.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:51:06 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d0020b1.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:51:28 v__ [~v@114.112.255.154] has joined #lisp 16:51:36 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:52:01 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:52:17 Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.243.40] has joined #lisp 16:53:05 antonv: trying right now 16:54:07 Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-219-38-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 16:54:28 antonv: if 10ms is the difference between responsive and unresponsive, then it pays off 16:54:39 but, 10 million calls is too synthetic 16:55:39 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-209-130-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:55:57 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:56:24 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 16:57:55 -!- Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.243.40] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:59:58 -!- przl_ [~przlrkt@94-23-173-29.op-net.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:00:35 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 17:01:26 przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:02:44 -!- joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:03:45 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:04:13 cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 17:04:44 myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 17:05:40 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abom9.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 17:05:50 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p5795BC60.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:06:36 przl [~przlrkt@94-23-174-40.ovh.net] has joined #lisp 17:09:14 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 17:09:20 joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:12:36 mac__ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 17:12:42 arnedag [~adf@dhcp-051079.wlan.ntnu.no] has joined #lisp 17:13:06 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:15:27 akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has joined #lisp 17:15:32 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 17:15:41 stassats`: if the calls are to too few targets, your synthetic microbenchmark may be completely irrelevant. 17:15:43 -!- cades_ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:16:45 pkhuong: could you take a look at on the the bordeaux-threads tests ? I suspect it's bogus but I'm not sure why 17:18:12 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:19:05 fe[nl]ix: which one? 17:19:17 condition-variable 17:19:23 -!- joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:19:33 -!- mac__ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:19:58 mac__ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 17:21:03 it runs fine on sbcl and ccl 64bit, hangs intermittently on ccl 32bit and consistently on abcl 17:22:30 -!- mallory [~chatzilla@125.122.80.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:23:02 fe[nl]ix: the test wants a broadcast rather than a single wake-up 17:23:17 joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:24:02 and the hand-rolled condition variables seems to not be sure if it wants to expose only broadcasts or only single notification... either way, it can lose wakeups. 17:24:09 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:25:40 I suggest a notification counter (or a cons to denote epochs and avoid ABA on wrap-around) instead of the "active" boolean. 17:27:08 p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.119.253] has joined #lisp 17:27:25 -!- ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:27:25 fe[nl]ix: I see how condition-notify is easier to implement on top of clozure's semaphores, but if you must expose only one, expose broadcast instead. 17:28:29 (also, arguably, the backup implementation for condition-wait should just be a noop or a yield). 17:31:16 by hand-rolled, you mean the one in impl-cmucl.lisp ? 17:31:34 sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:31:59 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:33:23 fe[nl]ix: I meant the one in condition-variables.lisp 17:33:48 snearch [~snearch@brln-4db938fd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:33:53 But impl-cmucl seems to be a copypasta. 17:34:01 indeed 17:35:42 -!- mac__ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 17:35:47 condition-notify yielding is unusual, and likely a good idea. 17:35:55 -!- myx [~myx@pppoe-206-149-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:37:03 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:37:06 mac__ [~mac@host-61-70-191-50.static.kbtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 17:37:09 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:37:14 Correct code is expected to do something like (with-lock-held (...) ... (condition-notify ...)). Yielding means that any wakeup will have to wait for another reschedule for the surrounding lock to be released. 17:37:32 blackwol` [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 17:39:10 -!- blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:39:14 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 17:39:19 *like not a good idea (: 17:40:02 ok 17:40:14 ahoops [~ahoops__@121.96.14.223] has joined #lisp 17:41:25 question about multh-threading in lisp 17:41:45 in this test, the *sbared*,. should we expect it is volatile? 17:42:08 antonv: everything is "volatile" on all current CL implementations, AFAIK. 17:42:14 -!- przl [~przlrkt@94-23-174-40.ovh.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:42:43 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:42:51 pkhuong: even local variables captured in closures? 17:43:07 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:43:40 antonv: as far as I know. 17:44:18 dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has joined #lisp 17:45:05 -!- snearch [~snearch@brln-4db938fd.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:46:57 -!- KingsKnighted [~quassel@c-98-202-60-177.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:47:23 > Correct code is expected to do something like (with-lock-held (...) ... (condition-notify ...)) 17:47:36 to simplify programmers life, it might be good to add the lock as a parameter to condition-notify 17:47:57 CL have arbitrary precision integer support inherited, anyway is possible handle an external multiple precision arithmetic library? and if yes how is possible? ths a lot for the needed help... 17:49:23 any clarification/explanation is welcome.. 17:49:59 -!- joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:50:12 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:50:22 gmp? 17:50:23 Yes, it would be with a FFI package. You will have to figure out the binary storage format for the translation 17:50:44 yes stassats` GMP , QD , MPFR etc.. 17:51:05 dioxirane: i don't get the question 17:51:39 joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:51:55 antonv: it's not required, and correct code may notify outside critical sections. 17:52:47 -!- arrdem is now known as clojure 17:52:55 -!- clojure is now known as arrdem 17:53:09 pkhuong: I am reading https://computing.llnl.gov/tutorials/pthreads/man/pthread_cond_signal.txt and indeed, thay say holding lock is only necessary if we want "predictable scheduling behaviour" - havent found an explanation what is meant by that 17:54:21 stassats`: ok, sorry, can I use an external multiple precision arithmetic library (such as GMP) to perform calculations in CL? 17:54:51 you can 17:56:39 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 17:56:50 stassats`: I have to use CFFI or what else? 17:56:53 antonv: mostly, such signals/broadcasts can be lost. 17:57:34 b) an implementation which already uses gmp c) implementation specific FFI 17:58:54 pkhuong: in case when I signal before anyone started to wait for signal? 17:59:22 antonv: right. 18:00:40 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:00:43 subtle case for programmers to remember 18:00:47 -!- nialo [nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:01:03 condition variables are an optimisation. 18:03:20 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:03:40 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:04:26 over what ? 18:05:07 fe[nl]ix: over looping around with-lock-held. 18:05:53 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@46.36.160.201] has joined #lisp 18:07:29 thanks a lot stassats` 18:07:53 -!- dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has left #lisp 18:09:14 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 18:10:11 What's the current recommended practice for setting up testing using asdf? 18:10:18 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@ip174-67-209-198.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:10:19 fe[nl]ix: also, you can disentangle the test from scheduling idiosyncrasies by randomising the "I" value. mapping over random-shuffle of iota, for instance. 18:11:19 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:11:22 ah, found it 18:11:45 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:12:10 pkhuong: fe[nl]ix randomizing tests has disadvantage - difficult to reproduce failures 18:12:24 Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 18:12:54 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:13:25 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 18:14:14 linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 18:15:02 antonv: randomise in the source then. 18:15:23 pkhuong: in the source? 18:16:07 cl:write is really awesome. 18:16:16 -!- masondesu [~textual@adsl-98-71-128-175.gsp.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 18:20:11 -!- teggi [~teggi@113.172.59.16] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:21:04 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@71-82-124-223.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: I tend to be neutral about apples] 18:21:55 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 18:21:56 xificurC [~xificurC@adsl-dyn23.78-99-63.t-com.sk] has joined #lisp 18:22:59 -!- stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:23:34 cddr: what do you mean "using asdf"? 18:23:44 Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 18:27:27 I mean I want to write my defsystem so I can say (asdf:operate 'asdf:test-op :foo) and have it run my tests 18:27:46 Is this still correct? http://blog.technomadic.org/?p=84 18:31:13 https://github.com/sionescu/static-vectors/blob/master/static-vectors.asd 18:32:55 ebw [~user@f051007110.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 18:33:11 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:35:21 cddr: is that example clear ? 18:37:00 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 18:38:58 _tca [~user@h151.25.91.207.static.ip.windstream.net] has joined #lisp 18:39:16 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 18:40:36 -!- cddr [user@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:b02b] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:42:56 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:45:47 findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:45:58 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:46:18 cddr [user@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:b02b] has joined #lisp 18:49:58 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-bmnvjcclebmlxgwx] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:51:20 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:55:50 ahh .. first Saturday past the equinox! I know where I am going today! ... Oh, hello everyone! :D 18:58:29 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:58:53 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:00:38 hagish [~hagish@p4FC0F84E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:00:48 -!- linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 19:01:22 ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has joined #lisp 19:03:17 any tips on writing a parser in cl? 19:03:32 esrap 19:04:43 Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:05:33 robot-beethoven: depends on what you want to parse. 19:06:01 simple things might work with just cl-ppcre; else look at http://www.cliki.net/parser%20generator 19:06:20 -!- paddymahoney [~paddymaho@198-84-186-52.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:06:27 of course, if you can just use s-expressions you'll be fine with just (read) 19:06:48 -!- v__ [~v@114.112.255.154] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:08:11 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:09:15 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 19:09:30 flip214: i'm looking to parse a subset of the lilypond music-notation-language 19:09:50 but know very little of parser-theory as of yet 19:10:31 what exactly do you want to achieve? I can offer code to read MIDI-files, if that helps. 19:10:56 do you want to print that, play music, or what is your objective? 19:12:16 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:12:39 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@24.130.4.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:13:25 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:13:35 i want to explore the structure of the music from lisp 19:14:48 well, my offer stands. 19:15:29 If you take MIDI files eg. from mutopia, you can get them parsed. 19:15:37 perhaps that's enough for your needs. 19:16:35 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.210] has joined #lisp 19:17:09 -!- qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.210] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:18:28 if you're interested, leave a pm with your email ... gotta go. good night! 19:20:01 flip214: thanks for the offer, but it doesn't look like midi will do for me -- i'm more concerned with the notational aspects of the music, and exporting lilypond files to midi loses the articulation and phrasing markings 19:21:15 robot-beethoven: sure about that? http://www.sonicspot.com/guide/midifiles.html talks about Modulation, Aftertouch, and some more. 19:21:24 Don't know about all that, though ;/ 19:21:41 good night nevertheless. 19:22:39 v__ [~v@61.173.89.166] has joined #lisp 19:27:36 linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 19:27:49 robot-beethoven, there's a good book on computer music in Haskell 19:27:59 there's also CM and CMN in CL 19:34:55 cabaire [~nobody@xdsl-78-35-132-33.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 19:39:19 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 19:42:25 honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 19:42:53 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:44:08 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Client Quit] 19:44:34 sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:57 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 19:46:59 robot-beethoven: you should look at gsharp (it doesn't have a lilypond mode, but it /does/ have a musicxml mode. Note that musicxml sucks in different ways from lilypond) 19:47:24 it might be possible to go lilypond -> musicxml -> gsharp, but musicxml is so badly specified that it would probably take some work 19:47:41 There's also midi read/write code in gsharp 19:51:27 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:56:21 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-55-145.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:56:52 pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 19:57:42 honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 19:58:54 -!- linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177917089.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 20:02:31 -!- zophy [goldenligh@gateway/shell/devio.us/x-uquewdjncyoclxwo] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:04:07 normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:05:51 findiggle [~user@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 20:06:30 -!- Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:09:21 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:13:08 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:13:30 eisturger [~meisterbu@static-50-43-16-216.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 20:14:48 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 20:18:52 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:19:01 Pierre? 20:19:20 Xach: what's your diagnosis? 20:19:34 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:19:42 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-avurvvslotjsdftt] has joined #lisp 20:20:03 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.104] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:21:53 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 20:22:18 Hard to say what might cause you to confuse Patrick May and Pierre (Mai?) 20:22:27 :) 20:22:33 Xach: yikes 20:22:38 A mix of old and new somethings, I bet 20:23:00 Xach: that's what i'd think. and i think i need more sleep 20:23:08 *Xach* too 20:27:52 dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has joined #lisp 20:29:47 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 20:33:13 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@219.Red-79-150-126.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:33:47 -!- xcombelle [~xcombelle@AToulouse-551-1-134-118.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 20:39:21 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:41:11 do we have some libevent like libs for CL? 20:42:00 well so we have cl-event which is a cffi wrapper, do we have something native? 20:43:00 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:43:04 dim: iolib ? 20:43:15 having a look, thanks 20:43:25 Fare: any ideas about that uiop glitch from yesterday? :) 20:43:59 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 20:45:23 I'm preparing you a paste to make it easier on your side 20:45:36 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:45:53 Fare: http://paste.lisp.org/display/136302 20:46:42 dim: you should use the same ASDF version as UIOP 20:47:18 I just use quicklisp, maybe buildapp is not loading the asdf version from quicklisp? 20:47:38 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.119.253] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:47:51 I added a --load-system asdf to the buildapp command line, no change 20:48:36 the ASDF version from quicklisp is a bit too old 20:48:57 I see nothing in iolib that's remotely libevent like... 20:49:17 fe[nl]ix: well in the slime repl it just works, that said 20:49:29 even with uiop bits (e.g. using uiop:getenv) 20:49:40 it's only with buildapp that it fails, apparently 20:50:22 buildapp doesn't load asdf from quicklisp. wht SBCL are you using? 20:50:35 version, that is. 20:51:59 old "1.0.38-3.el6" 20:52:04 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d0020b1.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 20:52:25 that is pretty old 20:52:30 indeed 20:53:15 maybe I should buildapp in a linux VM here then upload the 50MB image, it would contain whatever newer SBCL I use at the buildapp time, right? 20:53:21 and should just work, too? 20:53:24 should do 20:53:43 or is there a way to ask buildapp to please load another asdf? 20:53:58 dim: I think you could do --load ~/quicklisp/asdf.lisp maybe. 20:54:06 trying 20:54:07 I don't think I've tried that though. 20:54:43 works :) 20:54:48 cool, good to know 20:54:54 well I'm left with another problem now, but that part just works 20:55:05 use regular expressions 20:55:20 I need to (pushnew :lparallel.without-stealing-scheduler *features*) before compiling lparallel 20:55:35 dim: you could do --eval in buildapp command line 20:55:39 I guess that --eval will do 20:55:40 ok 20:55:57 b 20:56:01 err, hmm 20:56:25 i should update it so --foo "bar baz quux" is the same as --foo bar --foo baz --foo quux for certain ---foos 20:56:25 dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:56:41 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-50-60.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:56:46 I pass compiling lparallel and get some other asdf related error 20:56:54 boo 20:57:05 Fatal SIMPLE-ERROR: There is no method on # with qualifiers (:AROUND) and specializers (# #). 20:57:40 fjdw [c94c1453@gateway/web/freenode/ip.201.76.20.83] has joined #lisp 20:57:43 Is the number zero a circle or an ellipsis? In keyboards and fonts it's an ellipsis, but I guess that could be due to the need to different is from the capitalized letter "o". 20:58:12 I see Upgrading ASDF from version 2.010 to version 2.26, maybe that's not newish enough 20:58:51 fjdw: an ellipsis looks like "..." 20:59:17 fjdw: an ellipse looks like a zero (and so does a circle) 20:59:20 Meant an ellipse, sorry. 20:59:24 English isn't my mother tongue 20:59:32 -!- Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-219-38-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [] 20:59:40 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 20:59:42 fjdw: representing it as a circle, ellipse, rectangle, or square, it all means the same thing. 21:00:01 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-132-231.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:00:27 ok, playing the whole game, trying to bootstrap buildapp with http://common-lisp.net/project/asdf/archives/asdf-2.32.lisp instead of the quicklisp one now 21:01:00 dhttp://common-lisp.net/project/asdf/asdf.lisp is what i use to always find the latest asdf.lisp 21:01:05 sans the leading D 21:01:09 fail again 21:01:34 pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has joined #lisp 21:01:52 your URL leads to the same error as the 2.32 one 21:02:02 Fatal SIMPLE-ERROR: There is no method on # with qualifiers (:AROUND) and specializers (# #). 21:02:14 -!- pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:03:38 mstevens [~mstevens@81.2.103.23] has joined #lisp 21:03:38 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@81.2.103.23] has quit [Changing host] 21:03:38 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 21:03:48 ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 21:04:21 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 21:05:08 *Xach* has nothin' 21:05:27 well, you could possibly go back in quicklisp time 21:05:36 when nobody knew anything about asdf 3 21:05:52 this month is apparently awful for drakma 21:06:51 well I'm thinking that the asdf idea is not the best one, I'd better fix uiop or stop depending on it 21:07:16 maybe use the asdf-driver that comes with that old sbcl or something 21:07:41 after all I'm only using uiop:quit and uiop:getenv 21:07:46 fjdw: `computo ergo sum' even if you're using the usual DD arithmetic (: 21:08:10 derekv [~derekv@c-71-238-24-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:08:22 :) 21:10:36 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-219-98.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 21:11:18 -!- arnedag [~adf@dhcp-051079.wlan.ntnu.no] has left #lisp 21:11:33 I was thinking about the idea of having a dsl for describing turn based games by describing "rules", eg given some tree or graph of objects representing a state of a game, the rules collectively could determine if anouther state was a legal next-state or not 21:11:54 I'm doubtful this is in any way an original idea however. 21:12:22 is there some caching that buildapp does or benefits from? 21:12:33 -!- fjdw [c94c1453@gateway/web/freenode/ip.201.76.20.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:12:43 -!- dioxirane [~dioxirane@unaffiliated/dioxirane] has left #lisp 21:12:53 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 21:14:04 derekv: sounds like an automaton 21:14:25 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-181-52.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 21:14:43 just found this, this is pretty close to what I'm thinking. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_Description_Language 21:14:51 not exactly the dsl i would have invented 21:16:38 Bike, is suppose loosely i'm describing a state machine ... though without the automation part 21:18:44 ohnoitsavram [~user@CPE-60-225-105-159.hhui3.cht.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 21:20:09 i guess all you need to do is, have a way to represent states, have a rule that can say yes or no given two states 21:22:12 some way of declairing precedence between rules 21:22:36 i could just look at firewall filter rules 21:25:36 I don't understand why upgrading asdf works fine when starting sbcl from M-x slime but not when starting it from buildapp 21:27:19 AeroNotix [~xeno@aboj67.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 21:27:53 archonix [~none@78.90.30.16] has joined #lisp 21:30:38 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:31:33 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 21:33:51 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 21:36:33 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 21:37:12 Which library shall I look into for common hashing functions (like SHA variants)? 21:39:12 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-231.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:39:21 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 21:40:26 antoszka: ironclad 21:40:39 are there any dialects with json-ish syntax other than clojure? 21:40:41 thx 21:41:19 hmm i didn't realize how close fare was related to the tunes project 21:41:20 ;]]] 21:41:25 what's jsonish about clojure 21:41:34 i really enjoyed the article about metaprogramming 21:41:54 i just mean the [] for arrays, {} for maps 21:42:28 randomly, i'm quoted in one of those papers 21:43:04 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:44:36 -!- ehu [~ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:46:07 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 21:46:18 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:46:30 antgreen [~green@dsl-209-90-147-198.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 21:47:28 yea, i'm in why a new OS 21:48:01 knob_ [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 21:48:34 derekv: I think scheme could optionally use [] for bindings(let ([a 1] [b 2]) ...) etc. Or was this a Racket-ism? 21:48:51 zolk3ri [~zolk3ri@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has joined #lisp 21:49:12 also, adding such syntax to CL wouldn't be too difficult, you can define it as a named readtable. 21:49:44 I think the code to add {} syntax for hash tables was only a few lines of code 21:50:15 and arrays already have #() syntax, so you don't really need [] 21:50:19 -!- xificurC [~xificurC@adsl-dyn23.78-99-63.t-com.sk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:50:50 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:51:51 pavelpenev, Yea, probably not enough of an issue to drive choosing one lisp over anouther in any case 21:53:14 -!- knob_ [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:53:23 oh so that's interesting 21:53:43 http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3222747467111424%40naggum.net.html 21:54:15 Cybernethics is fare's livejournel 21:54:41 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 21:55:45 the data structure changeability there is pretty neat 21:56:13 ok in the linux VM with a recent sbcl ("1.1.5.11-0e62333"), buildapp fails when trying to load a completely unrelated package 21:56:14 "Creation of derivative works is permitted under two conditions: No rewrites to use if* or not to use loop are allowed," haha 21:56:23 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:56:25 I'm out of luck with buildapp it seems. 21:56:50 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 21:56:56 Xach: I remember seeing a much sorter example, and as an added bonus, it didn't have perl rockets :) 21:57:03 shorter* 21:58:30 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.180.79.135] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:58:32 <_tca> http://frank.kank.net/essays/hash.html 21:58:50 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.25] has joined #lisp 22:04:08 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:09:16 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:09:24 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 22:10:04 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 22:12:56 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:14:04 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:14:09 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:14:15 -!- v__ [~v@61.173.89.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:16:09 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 22:18:53 -!- ebw [~user@f051007110.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:23:32 -!- kanru` [~kanru@111.249.147.169] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:27:31 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:27:46 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:27:55 -!- seangrove [~user@125.142.7.125] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:27:56 -!- ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:28:10 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 22:28:10 seangrove [~user@125.142.7.125] has joined #lisp 22:28:14 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:28:38 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:28:41 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 22:29:02 przl [~przlrkt@p54BF84BE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 22:29:03 Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-176.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:29:07 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:29:27 -!- chebastian [~chebastia@c-9b72e255.015-51-7673741.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:29:56 chebastian [~chebastia@c-9b72e255.015-51-7673741.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 22:30:01 -!- otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:30:01 -!- Yamazaki-kun [~bsa3@jetalone.facefault.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:30:04 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:30:30 -!- sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:30:32 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:31:01 -!- ed_g [~quassel@75-164-249-121.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 22:31:29 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:31:57 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:32:13 ktx [~ktx@unaffiliated/ktx] has joined #lisp 22:32:48 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:33:13 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:33:38 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-32-223.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:34:06 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:34:21 -!- eisturger [~meisterbu@static-50-43-16-216.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 22:34:32 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:35:03 -!- sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [] 22:35:25 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:35:52 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:36:21 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 22:36:34 Yamazaki-kun [~bsa3@jetalone.facefault.org] has joined #lisp 22:36:45 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:37:08 otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has joined #lisp 22:37:12 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:38:05 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:38:33 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:38:45 honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 22:39:19 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 22:39:26 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:39:45 eisrger [~meisrger@static-50-43-16-216.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 22:39:54 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:40:56 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:41:00 p_nathan [~Adium@50-37-142-116.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 22:41:24 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:41:36 AndChat38369 [~AndChat38@213-67-114-221-no238.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lisp 22:42:13 jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has joined #lisp 22:42:27 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:42:54 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:43:10 I wish *I* didn't know about asdf 3. 22:43:19 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-79-181-109-90.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:43:38 two-: which article about metaprogramming? 22:43:45 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:43:54 Fare [metaprogramming and free availability of sources]( http://fare.tunes.org/articles/ll99/index.en.html ) 22:44:14 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:44:23 nutrimentus [~da@99-119-37-89.lightspeed.lsvlky.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 22:44:36 oh, that one. I liked it, too. :-) 22:45:09 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:45:19 the HTML looks pretty broken. 22:45:39 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:46:26 there was one guy who criticized my using cryptic symbols. It took me time to realize he had printed the broken HTML version rather than the PDF where it's an arrow. 22:46:34 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:47:03 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:47:48 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:47:49 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:48:17 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:49:02 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:49:29 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:50:12 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:50:30 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:50:39 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:51:06 -!- nutrimentus [~da@99-119-37-89.lightspeed.lsvlky.sbcglobal.net] has left #lisp 22:51:22 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:51:51 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:52:36 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:53:04 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:53:43 abeaumont [~abeaumont@219.Red-79-150-126.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:53:46 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:54:17 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:55:14 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:55:42 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:56:33 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:57:02 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:57:10 when should one invalidate cached regions and transformations when doing transformations and scalings to some sheet on mcclim ? 22:57:12 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 22:57:39 after scaling i see that a while on the cache is in effect, so it's not immediate... 22:57:47 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:58:14 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 22:58:44 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:59:01 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:59:29 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 23:00:03 cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has joined #lisp 23:00:14 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 23:00:19 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:00:31 -!- jerryzhou [~slackerui@58.245.253.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:00:39 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 23:00:44 after resizing my tic-tac-toe window, the board-fields are on the left of the window (hidden until i move over them with mouse) but the new-board fields are already drawn.....(inactive, as i move over them there is nothing happening) 23:01:20 and resizing back to some smaller window makes it even worse..... 23:01:24 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 23:01:49 smaller wrt the bigger window not the original window 23:01:51 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 23:02:23 La0fer [~Laofers1@66.85.140.163] has joined #lisp 23:02:28 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-229-075.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:02:30 -!- eisrger [~meisrger@static-50-43-16-216.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 23:02:37 -!- v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 23:03:07 v__ [~v@141-236-136-14.38cloud.com] has joined #lisp 23:03:55 knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has joined #lisp 23:05:13 -!- cabaire [~nobody@xdsl-78-35-132-33.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:05:48 -!- przl [~przlrkt@p54BF84BE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:06:25 cabaire [~nobody@xdsl-78-35-151-185.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 23:07:44 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@50-37-142-116.mscw.id.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:09:43 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:15:24 -!- cabaire [~nobody@xdsl-78-35-151-185.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:22:42 -!- vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:22:54 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:23:22 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:24:06 vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 23:29:48 -!- vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:30:56 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: casion] 23:31:22 vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 23:31:35 -!- archonix [~none@78.90.30.16] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:31:38 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:32:26 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 23:33:00 -!- knob [~knob@66.50.1.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:34:27 -!- Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:20 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:46:00 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@219.Red-79-150-126.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:59:14 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp