00:00:30 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:01:07 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-234-194.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 00:02:00 -!- walter [~walter@c-24-218-217-69.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:02:36 -!- dtm` [~dtm@adsl-69-110-2-158.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:03:46 -!- SHODAN [~shozan@c-d7b3e253.011-86-73746f30.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:04:28 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:05:00 weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has joined #lisp 00:07:26 kanru` [~kanru@111-249-147-169.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 00:08:44 nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 00:09:24 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 00:09:44 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 00:13:01 -!- boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:13:45 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:14:39 lduros` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:24:06 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:26:15 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:28:14 -!- v_ [~v@61.173.110.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:29:23 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@2602:306:36c6:f7e0:243d:ce3b:5b20:30d0] has joined #lisp 00:32:17 tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-180.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 00:32:50 Hi! Is Debian still the "preferred" Linux distro for Lispers, or have people spread to other ones? 00:33:22 I didn't know it was a preferred distro... 00:33:57 *Xach* likes the debian 00:34:06 tigranes: I don't think there is a preferred distro, but could be wrong. 00:34:53 I would not say I prefer it, but what I do prefer is somewhat odd, and I use debian almost everywhere, including lisp sites. 00:34:55 Ah, I just thought since debian has so many CL packages, many lispers use it 00:35:01 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:35:05 -!- ncw [~ncw@63.239.94.10] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:35:14 tigranes: nobody uses the built-in CL packages for the most part 00:35:29 and I can say that "never ever use the .deb's" is probably a good start. 00:35:30 yeah, i use a debian distro but all my lisp stuff is from upstream or quicklisp. 00:35:40 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-derliajxbglbkawi] has joined #lisp 00:36:37 I see, thanks 00:39:28 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 00:40:01 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-derliajxbglbkawi] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:40:41 When you got say, 10 bindings and the last one depends on the first 9, which one would be the best? (let* (a b c ... (n ..))) or (let (a b c ... n) (setf n ...)). 00:41:08 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.212.255.110] has joined #lisp 00:42:32 quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 00:42:49 -!- tigranes [~tigranes@static-50-53-64-180.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:43:32 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:45:08 cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #lisp 00:45:43 *Xach* feels a little uncertain about 10 bindings in a let 00:45:47 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:46:37 Heh ok then, how about 9? :) 00:47:36 v_ [~v@61.170.242.154] has joined #lisp 00:47:40 SeanTAllen [uid4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bdgyrdpbmshcjejy] has joined #lisp 00:48:02 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has quit [Quit: o7] 00:48:25 I am working on my math module so 9-10 bindings not so rare when 4x4 3x4 matrices involved 00:48:31 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:48:47 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:51:41 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:51:41 -!- lduros` [~user@pool-108-52-158-66.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:53:29 -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 00:53:32 -!- Thra11 [~quassel@31.185.144.104] has quit [Quit: kthxbai] 00:53:32 normanrichards [~normanric@mobile-166-147-082-133.mycingular.net] has joined #lisp 00:54:20 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 00:54:34 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:55:23 quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 00:56:04 -!- joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:56:40 nan_: let* is good. 00:56:56 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:57:05 nan_: a good compiler could see both form is the same and optimize them equally, but let* is easier on weak compilers. 00:57:34 The prefered distro for lispers is quicklisp of course! 00:58:05 googol [~matthew@airbears-136-152-39-165.AirBears.Berkeley.EDU] has joined #lisp 00:58:10 pmai [~Thunderbi@178-27-46-208-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 01:00:30 -!- ikki [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/ikki] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:00:44 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:01:23 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-cejfhhlzrjsfanea] has joined #lisp 01:03:05 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 01:06:05 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 01:08:38 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 01:09:28 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 01:10:55 -!- googol [~matthew@airbears-136-152-39-165.AirBears.Berkeley.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:11:56 pjb: let form looks somehow better to me as it is easy on the reader (programmer that reads the code that is :) and the last binding comes and steals the show! 01:14:09 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:14:40 Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 01:16:39 nan_: I think somewhere between 2 and 10 bindings I switch from LET* to LET/LET (I wouldnt use SETF). 01:17:04 googol [~matthew@airbears-136-152-39-165.AirBears.Berkeley.EDU] has joined #lisp 01:18:05 -!- seangrove [~user@182.221.39.188] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:19:12 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 01:20:29 Bike: Do you remember where in AMOP it said that the meta-class of CLASS is STANDARD-CLASS? 01:21:51 drmeister: http://www.alu.org/mop/concepts.html#inherit-struct-figure "The class of every class shown is standard-class..." 01:22:02 drmeister:  man, Bike just beat me :) 01:22:18 I define STANDARD-CLASS, STANDARD-OBJECT, CLASS and T among many others in my C++ proto-CLOS class hierarchy. I also set up the ability to define the meta-class type of any C++ proto-CLOS member. That is why STANDARD-OBJECT is already an instance of STANDARD-CLASS. 01:24:04 The one thing there that confuses me is that the metaclass of FUNCALLABLE-STANDARD-OBJECT is apparently STANDARD-CLASS and not FUNCALLABLE-STANDARD-CLASS. 01:24:24 Here is my probably too complicated CL+AMOP type hierarchy: http://sellout.github.com/2012/03/03/common-lisp-type-hierarchy/ 01:24:24 Ok, so that's the standard - is there a reason for this? BUILT-IN-CLASS and STANDARD-CLASS are siblings (they both inherit from the abstract class CLASS). 01:24:30 sellout: the "except" there is important! 01:24:34 "the classes generic-function and standard-generic-function which are instances of the class funcallable-standard-class" 01:24:43 oh, no, i see what you said 01:24:45 sellout: That's yours! Very nice, I use that all the time. 01:24:56 drmeister: Oh, cool :D 01:25:02 seangrove [~user@182.221.39.188] has joined #lisp 01:25:08 -!- v_ [~v@61.170.242.154] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:25:15 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 01:25:34 sellout: sbcl disagrees with amop here, it seems (not that that's bad) 01:26:18 Yeah, I've got it bookmarked. 01:26:49 drmeister: Feel free to send comments/corrections. 01:26:51 -!- pjb [~user@90.24.195.13] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:27:19 Bike: Yeah, probably the best course. I kept re-reading to make sure I understood. Too bad these things never get updated  01:27:20 sellout: compiled-function isn't actually a class 01:27:53 v_ [~v@61.173.105.114] has joined #lisp 01:29:27 quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 01:29:41 Bike: Hrmm, indeed  I wonder how that got there. 01:30:09 hm, i was going to guess that it was because funcallable-standard-object was abstract, but it's not. and neither is standard-object, guess i don't know mop that well 01:31:39 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@mobile-166-147-082-133.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:32:08 -!- v_ [~v@61.173.105.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:32:22 Hmmm, I don't have SPECIALIZER or METAOBJECT 01:32:58 Bike: Oh, I already fixed that in my original (along with a bunch of other things). I should push the changes, I guess. 01:33:23 Bike: I had also added a note funcallable-standard-object is not funcallable according to the spec, but in most (all?) implementations it is, because it makes little sense otherwise 01:33:47 dekuked [~dekuked@72.234.205.107] has joined #lisp 01:34:18 I do have STANDARD-CLASS, BUILT-IN-CLASS and STRUCTURE-CLASS that inherit from CLASS and that currently inherits from STANDARD-OBJECT - not good. 01:35:20 I'm trying to figure out how much of this I should have built in and how much should be created when CLOS boots. 01:36:54 When ECL CLOS boots, it loops through a list of classes (some of which are repeated) and creates them or pulls them out of a hash table called *class-name-hash-table*. 01:37:34 sellout: heh 01:37:36 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:38:15 drmeister: class is supposed to subclass standard-object, or did i misunderstand you 01:38:39 Bike: Well, with the MOP, there are intervening classes. 01:38:41 -!- Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:38:53 SPECIALIZER and METAOBJECT, specifically. 01:38:53 oh, right 01:39:27 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 01:41:20 My CLASS directly subclasses STANDARD-OBJECT, AMOP says CLASS subclasses SPECIALIZER which subclasses METAOBJECT which subclasses STANDARD-OBJECT 01:42:02 So I need to insert SPECIALIZER and METAOBJECT in there. 01:43:14 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:43:43 v_ [~v@61.173.102.229] has joined #lisp 01:43:53 But I'd love to get some advice on what I'm trying to do here. 01:43:56 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:44:02 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:44:33 I've got this proto-CLOS hierarchy already set up and I'm trying to get ECL CLOS to set up the rest of it around it. 01:46:10 sellout: In terms of your graphical class-hierarchy. I've got all the STREAM (purple), NUMBER (orange), ARRAY/SEQUENCE (magenta), CHARACTER (red) defined as C++ classes. 01:47:32 I also have a few of the green STRUCTURE-CLASS, STANDARD-CLASS and BUILT-IN-CLASS and up - except for the missing SPECIALIZER and METAOBJECT that I mentioned above. 01:47:43 It's all rooted on T. 01:48:18 Most of these are represented as instances of BUILT-IN-CLASS but I need to change a few of them to instances of STANDARD-CLASS. 01:48:34 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 01:49:06 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:49:23 ECL CLOS defines STANDARD-CLASS with something like 22 slots that store the class name, direct-superclasses, class-precedence-list etc. 01:50:15 drmeister: Yeah, Im not really sure what a good implementation strategy is. I have it on my todo list to implement something CLOS/MOPish in another language, but other than reading AMOP (forever ago), I havent thought about how its done. 01:50:26 ECL accesses these slots using an integer index using INSTANCE-REF and INSTANCE-SET. I over-rode INSTANCE-REF and INSTANCE-SET for BUILT-IN-CLASS so that they use the integer slot index to reference the correct BuiltInClass instance variable. 01:51:16 -!- v_ [~v@61.173.102.229] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:51:25 -!- agumonkey [~agu@17.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:51:38 My goal was to make BUILT-IN-CLASS look exactly like the STANDARD-CLASS that ECL creates within a structure called an "Instance". 01:51:56 I think I just discovered another problem while I was explaining all that. 01:52:44 I've implemented STANDARD-CLASS in C++ and ECL is creating them using the "instance" structure. 01:53:56 Hmmm. 01:55:04 -!- kanru` [~kanru@111-249-147-169.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:55:12 I should take over STANDARD-CLASS. 01:57:52 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 01:58:10 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 02:03:01 Is there any difference in behavior between built-in-class and standard-class? 02:04:07 v_ [~v@209.141.63.62] has joined #lisp 02:04:08 clhs built-in-class 02:04:08 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/t_built_.htm 02:04:23 basically you can't do shit with them. 02:05:06 Ok, that's pretty important. 02:05:37 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 02:05:44 when I say "you" i mean the user of course, you the implementor can do whatever you please (for instance sbcl has nonstandard subclasses of NUMBER) 02:06:38 Got it. 02:07:02 -!- kvda [~kvda@unaffiliated/kvda] has quit [Quit: z____z] 02:09:31 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 02:09:41 Ok, so what I have to do is get the subtree of the CL class hierarchy that I'm defining with C++ classes to match what CL expects and then let ECL build the rest of them around what I have already defined. 02:09:52 zeroish [~zeroish@135.207.174.50] has joined #lisp 02:10:20 cdidd [~cdidd@93-80-3-18.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 02:11:16 -!- stumbles [~stumbles@2001:44b8:41c5:9600:219:d1ff:fe10:f770] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:11:41 What was the point that sellout was asking about above when ?he said: "The one thing there that confuses me is that the metaclass of FUNCALLABLE-STANDARD-OBJECT is apparently STANDARD-CLASS and not FUNCALLABLE-STANDARD-CLASS." 02:12:25 According to the Inheritance Structure of Metaobject Classes in AMOP FUNCALLABLE-STANDARD-OBJECT should be a STANDARD-CLASS shouldn't it? 02:12:34 yes 02:12:47 which is weird, because funcallable objects usually have funcallable-standard-class 02:12:49 So I'm confused by that as well. 02:13:07 Ok, that's just how it is and it works. 02:13:13 AMOP is not perfect 02:13:15 -!- Gurragchaa_ [uid6439@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zpnboialjdxeeeyw] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:13:23 drmeister: like i said, sbcl doesn't conform to amop there 02:13:24 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:13:53 (find-class 'sb-mop:funcallable-standard-object) => # 02:13:58 Yes you did. 02:14:18 IIUC, built-in-class is there so you can hook up pre-CLOS stuff into CLOS. 02:14:52 clhs make-timer 02:14:53 Sorry, I couldn't find anything for make-timer. 02:15:28 pjb [~t@AMontsouris-651-1-93-50.w82-123.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 02:17:17 drmeister: I think most other impls do what SBCL does  AMOP isnt a real spec, so its ok to deviate ;) 02:18:21 So I'll go off and get these missing abstract classes inserted in and use the correct meta-classes to represent them and then try getting the ECL CLOS bootstrapper to create the rest of the hierarchy. 02:21:15 -!- zeroish [~zeroish@135.207.174.50] has left #lisp 02:29:10 kvda [~kvda@unaffiliated/kvda] has joined #lisp 02:29:19 -!- v_ [~v@209.141.63.62] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:30:55 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-234-194.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:31:22 hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has joined #lisp 02:31:27 Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-234-194.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 02:35:43 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:36:12 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@bl19-234-194.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:38:11 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:39:02 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:39:27 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 02:40:16 quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 02:40:24 -!- tic [~tic@c83-248-1-208.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:42:11 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-cejfhhlzrjsfanea] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:43:54 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:44:21 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-pbfbnxhfhieykbxj] has joined #lisp 02:44:34 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:44:35 -!- googol [~matthew@airbears-136-152-39-165.AirBears.Berkeley.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:47:33 Here's another reason no one has implemented CL in C++ the freaking compile times kill you. 02:48:27 tic [~tic@c83-248-1-208.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 02:49:04 The (make-timer ...) works in ccl and sbcl, but NOT in clisp ? 02:49:36 That's the problem with programmers who don't use clisp They don't make things work on clisp. :-( 02:49:54 it's implementation-specific, sw2wolf. cl-user in ccl uses ccl and in sbcl uses sb-ext 02:50:13 it is weird 02:50:15 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-pbfbnxhfhieykbxj] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:50:18 not relaly 02:50:49 -!- dekuked [~dekuked@72.234.205.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:52:12 Bike: why clhs cannot find make-timer ? 02:52:13 -!- oticat` [~oticat@36-229-163-163.dynamic-ip.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 02:52:28 It is not standard. It is specific to the CCL and SBCL implementations. 02:53:22 It happened to work when you tried the symbol unqualified in CL-USER because that package uses CCL: or SB-EXT:, both of which export make-timer. 02:53:31 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:53:42 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-cdizvunbxknfszvi] has joined #lisp 02:54:33 then http://paste.lisp.org/display/136110 should add #+(or ccl sbcl) ? 02:54:55 something like that 02:55:39 googol [~matthew@lal-99-123.ResHall.Berkeley.EDU] has joined #lisp 02:55:42 sw2wolf: http://quickdocs.org/trivial-timers/ 02:56:16 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@2602:306:36c6:f7e0:243d:ce3b:5b20:30d0] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:56:43 thx, need to find a way to make it work in stumpwm built with CLISP 02:57:28 -!- hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:00:04 -!- googol [~matthew@lal-99-123.ResHall.Berkeley.EDU] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:02:34 dekuked [~dekuked@72.234.205.107] has joined #lisp 03:05:33 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has joined #lisp 03:05:53 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-cdizvunbxknfszvi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:06:32 zeroish [~zeroish@c-69-248-213-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:09:31 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 03:10:06 ycomb [45f21715@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.242.23.21] has joined #lisp 03:10:07 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 03:12:11 cgore [~user@cgore.com] has joined #lisp 03:12:12 quazimodo [~quazimodo@d110-33-247-154.bla801.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 03:13:14 -!- zeroish [~zeroish@c-69-248-213-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:13:26 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:13:28 -!- cgore [~user@cgore.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:14:31 hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has joined #lisp 03:16:58 Alrighty then: (class-precedence-list (find-class 'built-in-class)) --> (# # # # # # ) 03:16:59 jodie [~jodie@75-31-3-145.lightspeed.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 03:17:20 I'm actually shocked that there are this many people in a channel for lisp 03:17:35 maybe i was totally wrong about this language 03:18:13 It's the One True programming language. 03:18:27 drmeister: looks a lot cleaner than SBCL's :) 03:18:28 for scientists/mathematicians 03:18:55 Every language gets translated into an Abstract-Syntax-Tree before being converted to machine language. 03:19:15 In Lisp you write in the Abstract-Syntax-Tree. 03:19:26 i still suffer from post traumatic stress syndrome whenever i see more than three parenthesis grouped together. 03:19:27 Bike: Thanks. 03:21:09 anyone else have trouble joing #c++ channel 03:21:14 -!- LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:21:14 do you have to be registered? 03:21:24 Now we'll see if ECL CLOS will bootstrap on top of it. 03:21:42 Harzilein [~harzi@harzilein.eu.org] has joined #lisp 03:21:43 hi 03:21:51 hello 03:23:16 i just went and tried to use ecl to make a c frontend for tangle.lisp from axiom. do i really need to use that cutesy c_string_to_object thing where my string gets parsed first? 03:25:56 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-87-79-255-104.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:26:04 -!- pmai [~Thunderbi@178-27-46-208-dynip.superkabel.de] has left #lisp 03:27:33 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:29:35 zeroish [~zeroish@c-69-248-213-122.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:29:58 normanrichards [~normanric@64.128.85.190] has joined #lisp 03:31:24 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@d110-33-247-154.bla801.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:31:58 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:32:17 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: casion] 03:32:42 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@198-84-183-94.cpe.teksavvy.com] has quit [] 03:32:50 hello clispers! 03:33:13 antgreen_ [~green@dsl-173-206-4-216.tor.primus.ca] has joined #lisp 03:33:24 that doesnt sound right. i need to find a better term 03:33:31 *drewc* is not a clisper at all 03:34:50 theos: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=clisp :) 03:35:23 hmm it should be CLers 03:36:23 -!- antgreen [~green@64.56.251.86] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:36:34 well, since Lisp is Lisp, and we are not very common, I would prefer 'lispers', but that is just the term i use. 03:36:46 drewc i know that clisp is an implementation of CL. saying CLers is kinda weird 03:37:20 well, what exactly do you want to express with the term you are trying to find? 03:37:23 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@71-82-124-223.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com] has quit [Quit: phunq, sandwich store loop, WHAT NO UNIVERSE] 03:38:04 v_ [~v@199.119.204.54] has joined #lisp 03:38:12 the people who use CL :) i think lispers would be okish 03:39:12 Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable194.190-161-184.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 03:39:33 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 03:39:46 well, do you mean programmers, or people who, say, use a program that was programmed using CL? Because users and developers and programmers are different things.... but yeah, I use lispers :) 03:42:00 everyone :) 03:44:00 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:44:14 any hint on why ecl's c api appears to want to get the c programmer to serialize his strings to the lisp syntax for strings? 03:45:22 (same as above question, i'm just getting desperate ;) 03:45:44 if you want to use CL:STRINGs, then you have to serialze the bytes to a CL:STRING? 03:45:57 *drewc* has no idea really 03:47:30 direct-slots are the slots that a defclass adds and effective-slots are all of the slots that an instance of a particular class has which are both inherited and direct-slots? 03:47:49 drmeister: Yeah. 03:48:05 Except a DEFCLASS doesn't necessarily need to be involved, though typically is. ;) 03:50:33 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:50:47 Tabrenus [~Tabrenus@213.211.132.86.static.edpnet.net] has joined #lisp 03:50:51 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 03:51:01 With the new version of CFFI my CFFI based systems always compiles when i load with (asdf:load-system :pkg) with or without a change to project, anyone else have this? 03:51:02 drewc: what i mean is that c_string_to_object expects object literals, and there does not seem to be a dedicated string conversion function 03:51:03 -!- Tabrenus [~Tabrenus@213.211.132.86.static.edpnet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:51:12 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:51:34 drewc: so when i want to pass in "foo" i have to write c_string_to_object("\"foo\"") 03:52:44 oh, nevermind, it appears that i want make_simple_string 03:53:28 -!- hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:54:44 oticat` [~oticat@1-164-214-135.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 03:55:07 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 03:55:15 stumbles [~stumbles@2001:44b8:41c5:9600:219:d1ff:fe10:f770] has joined #lisp 03:55:40 -!- Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable194.190-161-184.mc.videotron.ca] has left #lisp 03:56:38 -!- Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:06:25 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-192-41.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:08:28 -!- ycomb [45f21715@gateway/web/freenode/ip.69.242.23.21] has left #lisp 04:08:30 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 04:11:39 -!- PuffTheMagic [uid3325@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cjilitlszzyqvgsw] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:14:20 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@public-nat2.arc.losrios.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:15:28 Gurragchaa_ [uid6439@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bvljfbwskrqmfxnq] has joined #lisp 04:16:51 Hmms looks like it is about cffi-grovel 04:17:36 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:18:59 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 04:19:19 crap, I might no longer have the opportunity to use lisp at work :( 04:19:50 how can I go back into the cave after having seen the sun? 04:20:01 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has joined #lisp 04:21:35 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-jxzoropvsaghyqhn] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:23:03 kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has joined #lisp 04:27:03 -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 04:27:52 Vutral [ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 04:27:56 -!- Vutral [ss@vutral.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:27:56 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 04:28:11 quazimodo [~quazimodo@d110-33-247-154.bla801.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 04:29:03 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 04:30:55 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:31:27 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 04:34:07 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 04:35:19 Vutral_ [ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 04:37:47 sykopomp [~sykopomp@unaffiliated/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 04:39:28 -!- Artheist [~quassel@modemcable051.243-130-66.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:40:59 -!- Vutral_ [ss@vutral.net] has quit [Excess Flood] 04:45:39 Dalek_Baldwin: I know what you mean. 04:47:26 agumonkey [~agu@17.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 04:48:11 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 04:48:46 Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 04:49:00 cave ... lisp ? 04:49:30 a reference to plato's allegory of the cave. 04:50:50 also a reference to fukamachi's CAVEMAN library of course 04:51:12 -!- vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.9.2] 04:52:27 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-103.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 04:54:24 Bike: If clisp has no #'make-timer, then why it can build STUMPWM successfully ? 04:57:09 vhost- [~vhost@li540-47.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 04:57:09 -!- vhost- [~vhost@li540-47.members.linode.com] has quit [Changing host] 04:57:10 vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has joined #lisp 04:57:13 Ok it is my turn. it is CL not clisp! 04:57:24 -!- SeanTAllen [uid4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bdgyrdpbmshcjejy] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:59:07 unfortunately for you nan_, sw2wolf is referring to the implementation. 04:59:22 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:59:50 Bike: yes i see sbcl got #'make-timer, but i had to! 05:00:12 sw2wolf: Because it defines a timer struct itself, right there. (defstruct timer time repeat function args) 05:00:14 satyajit [~satyajit@122.169.78.137] has joined #lisp 05:00:18 sw2wolf: stumpwm does, i mean. 05:01:11 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.20.69] has joined #lisp 05:01:12 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@92.46.20.69] has quit [Changing host] 05:01:12 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 05:01:34 `grep` shows there is no #'make-timer definition in stumpwm. Maybe it is in other package ? 05:01:47 sw2wolf: do you know how defstruct works. 05:02:10 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 05:02:10 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:02:40 timer is a struct 05:03:12 the defstruct will define a function make-timer. 05:03:50 yes, i see now 05:05:41 I still donot know why the timer not schduled in CLISP ? 05:06:43 stumpwm's timer mechanism looks quite portable. 05:07:20 it works VERY well in CCL and SBCL. but NOT in CLISP 05:07:40 In what way does it not work? 05:08:22 i.e. A message window doesnot disappear automatically in CLISP 05:08:46 Some stumpwm messages time out but others don't. 05:09:08 -!- akovalenko [~user@195.18.46.21] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 05:09:25 The same message window disappear in CCL and SBCL 05:09:37 when time out 05:12:04 -!- agumonkey [~agu@17.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:15:07 teggi [~teggi@113.172.59.16] has joined #lisp 05:15:08 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:15:34 So when ECL boots CLOS it first sets the metaclass of T to STANDARD-CLASS which has been partially setup. Then once all the classes are initialized it sets the metaclass for T to BUILT-IN-CLASS. 05:16:16 This is a problem for me because my T has already been setup by my C++ code and it has the metaclass BUILT-IN-CLASS right from the start. 05:17:13 The problem comes right after T is setup ECL tries to setup STANDARD-OBJECT and calculate it's class-precedence-list at which point it tries to access slots of BUILT-IN-CLASS which hasn't been initialized yet. 05:17:26 ecls-list would probably be the best place for this 05:18:33 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 05:20:22 phadthai: I know, I'm just hoping someone with experience in bootstrapping new CL implementations (which is what I am doing) might have some thoughts. 05:21:02 I'm also trying to educate myself so I can ask Juanjo an intelligent question. 05:22:41 -!- impomatic2 [~digital_w@211.25.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:22:43 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:23:18 impomatic2 [~digital_w@211.25.113.87.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 05:28:00 cades [~mac@59-124-92-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 05:31:17 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@d110-33-247-154.bla801.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:33:05 Why not pre-initialize built-in-class? 05:34:33 xlib:window-map-state error in CLISP => http://paste.lisp.org/display/136112 05:37:31 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:39:25 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:14 springz [~springz@123.151.195.1] has joined #lisp 05:45:22 hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has joined #lisp 05:45:50 Zhivago: I'm trying that now. 05:46:23 I'm just not sure what is available at that point during bootstrapping. 05:47:27 -!- dekuked [~dekuked@72.234.205.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:52:31 axion 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[~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 08:40:32 -!- asvil [~user@91.151.182.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:41:18 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:41:59 ;Good morning! 08:42:52 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 08:43:20 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:44:10 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:44:18 hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 08:44:18 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 08:44:18 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 08:46:05 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Excess Flood] 08:46:34 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 08:46:59 arenz [~arenz@HSI-KBW-046-005-062-174.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 08:47:25 asvil [~user@91.151.182.61] has 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joined #lisp 09:18:41 dt770 [dt770@c-411ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 09:20:51 -!- tinnery24 [~tinnery24@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:23:04 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:23:43 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:24:06 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 09:24:53 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:27:34 v_ [~v@61.173.102.229] has joined #lisp 09:28:48 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:29:10 ehu [~ehu@31.137.115.111] has joined #lisp 09:32:39 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:33:05 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 09:33:57 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:34:01 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 09:38:00 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:38:23 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:38:41 great, now cl+ssl broke drakma 09:42:30 or rather, trivial-gray-streams caused cl+ssl to break 09:44:18 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:46:15 -!- ehu [~ehu@31.137.115.111] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:46:30 ehu [~ehu@31.137.115.111] has joined #lisp 09:49:23 H4ns: bug alert, drakma does not work with the latest cl+ssl: (drakma:http-request "https://google.com" :method :post :parameters '(("q" . "a"))) 09:49:54 cl+ssl wants a simple array 09:56:04 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:56:16 jaaso__ [~jaaso@178.239.31.138] has joined #lisp 09:56:47 awesome :/ 09:57:30 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:57:36 it never did want a non-simple-array, but it was broken in a way that avoided that code path 09:58:16 the latest cl+ssl is where? 09:58:18 -!- snits [~snits@inet-hqmc03-o.oracle.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:58:31 git://gitorious.org/cl-plus-ssl/cl-plus-ssl.git 09:58:35 -!- jaaso__ [~jaaso@178.239.31.138] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:58:55 -!- Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:59:30 -!- quazimodo [~quazimodo@60-241-248-205.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:59:35 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:00:02 Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has joined #lisp 10:00:09 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.56.29] has joined #lisp 10:00:09 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.56.29] has quit [Changing host] 10:00:09 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 10:00:44 mhhh, awesome code to fix!1 10:00:51 *H4ns* grabs a barf bag 10:01:06 tjos [~tim@101.174.161.170] has joined #lisp 10:02:15 H4ns: better or worse than: 10:02:22 (do ((ii 0 (+ ii 1))) ((< (- (length list) 1) ii)) (let ((el (nth ii list))) ... 10:02:22 ? 10:02:32 way better than that 10:02:39 but still 10:03:06 hmm.. hunchentoot is ncie 10:03:21 yay! my to-maintain-and-improve code is uglier! i win! 10:03:35 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-103.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:03:51 would coercing the array (which is a buffer that is witten to with flex:with-output-to-sequence) to a simple-array be the right way to go? 10:04:14 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@187.64.222.221] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:04:59 well, that would not work anyway 10:05:41 let me rephrase: how do i make some arbitrary array into a simple-array? 10:06:32 Well, which part of 'simple-array' are you interested in? 10:06:53 Zhivago: the one that cl+ssl is interested in :) 10:07:17 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@CPE-121-217-85-18.lnse1.cht.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: Bye] 10:07:24 H4ns: you create a simple-array with the same dimensions and copy contents to it. 10:07:31 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.108.223.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:07:45 segv-: where did you find that gem? 10:07:54 http://lisptips.com/post/15126780102/un-displacing-an-array applicable? 10:08:43 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-186-70.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 10:09:17 no. seems that i need to fix flexi-streams for that. 10:10:30 or pester avodonosov to dispatch between simple and non-simple arrays 10:11:48 prxq: just some very old code i'm looking at (but don't, fortunetly, have to work with too much) 10:11:54 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 10:11:58 stassats: that seems like a more promising approach 10:12:13 stassats: it does not feel right to have to worry about this on the application level. 10:12:16 Xach: trivial-gray-streams are still fetched from cvs, not the current git 10:13:07 Where is the current git? 10:13:21 -!- tjos [~tim@101.174.161.170] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:13:22 see http://common-lisp.net/project/trivial-gray-streams/ 10:13:57 ha, just noticed https://github.com/quicklisp/quicklisp-projects/issues/374 10:14:56 i guess it's the problem when the issue opener is not the author 10:15:36 przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has joined #lisp 10:17:07 sbenitezb even opened a pull-request to make it compile on ccl, which i successfully ignored for 6 months too 10:17:22 Trystam [~Tristam@cpe-72-226-124-205.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 10:17:26 good show 10:17:32 stumbles [~stumbles@2001:44b8:41c5:9600:219:d1ff:fe10:f770] has joined #lisp 10:17:50 rdd` [~rdd@c83-250-113-13.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 10:18:16 Mandus_ [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has joined #lisp 10:18:45 swap-bytes is just an experiment in: how much faster it'll be when using the bswap instruction 10:19:45 -!- Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:19:45 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.210] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:19:45 -!- hugod [~user@67.51.76.53] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:19:45 45PAABGY1 [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has joined #lisp 10:19:46 -!- 45PAABGY1 [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has quit [Client Quit] 10:19:46 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-113-13.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:46 -!- dented42 [~dented42@opengroove.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:46 -!- zorkmiod [c2ed8e15@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.237.142.21] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:19:46 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-93.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:46 -!- banjiewen [~banjiewen@184.173.74.133-static.reverse.softlayer.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- nksmith [~nate@184-106-222-160.static.cloud-ips.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- faheem [~faheem@bulldog.duhs.duke.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@quickdocs.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- naryl [~weechat@46.182.24.168] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-181-16.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:47 -!- seangrove [~user@182.221.39.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:48 -!- rfgpfeiffer [~bob@blubberquark.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:48 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:48 -!- p_l [~pl@tsugumi.brage.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:48 -!- vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:19:48 -!- |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-177-66-41.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:49 -!- Trystam [~Tristam@cpe-72-226-124-205.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Changing host] 10:19:49 Trystam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 10:19:52 -!- ck__ [~ck@dslb-178-004-015-016.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:52 -!- ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:52 -!- specbot [~specbot@tiger.common-lisp.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:52 -!- smull [~smull@port-212-202-120-50.static.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:19:59 -!- lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:20:09 What was the result? 10:20:14 vsync_ [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:14 qNemo [~qN@89.207.216.210] has joined #lisp 10:20:15 hugoduncan [~user@67.51.76.53] has joined #lisp 10:20:16 nitro_idiot_ [~nitro_idi@quickdocs.org] has joined #lisp 10:20:16 ck_ [~ck@dslb-178-004-015-016.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:16 nksmith_ [~nate@184-106-222-160.static.cloud-ips.com] has joined #lisp 10:20:17 twice as fast, iirc 10:20:19 p_l_ [~pl@tsugumi.brage.info] has joined #lisp 10:20:21 ramus_ [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:25 lemoinem [~swoog@72.53.112.90] has joined #lisp 10:20:35 too bad some people took it seriously, that's the problem with github, can't put something there without some people starting using and complaining that it doesn't work 10:20:38 smull [~smull@port-212-202-120-50.static.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 10:20:38 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-71-237-234-93.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:20:43 banjiewen [~banjiewen@184.173.74.133-static.reverse.softlayer.com] has joined #lisp 10:20:44 some even go as far as adding it to quicklisp 10:20:50 seangrov` [~user@182.221.39.188] has joined #lisp 10:20:53 -!- Expez [~Expez@expez.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:20:57 mvilleneuve_ [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 10:20:58 |3b|` [foobar@cpe-72-177-66-41.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 10:20:58 rfgpfeif1er [~bob@blubberquark.de] has joined #lisp 10:20:59 -!- dekuked [~dekuked@64-13-64-46.gsb.clearwire-dns.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:20:59 I didn't add it! 10:21:19 naryl [~weechat@46.182.24.168] has joined #lisp 10:21:28 fourOfTwelve [~dented42@opengroove.org] has joined #lisp 10:21:49 zorkmoid [c2ed8e15@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.237.142.21] has joined #lisp 10:21:53 -!- p_l_ is now known as p_l 10:22:15 -!- Mandus_ is now known as Mandus 10:22:31 -!- techlife [techlife@218.59.113.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:22:51 can :author be a list of authors? 10:23:44 stassats: now make it work with pshufb (: 10:23:48 faheem [~faheem@bulldog.duhs.duke.edu] has joined #lisp 10:24:02 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 10:24:04 tjos [~tim@101.174.161.170] has joined #lisp 10:25:16 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 10:27:00 techlife [techlife@218.59.113.120] has joined #lisp 10:28:08 if i had an application where this were a bottleneck 10:28:09 -!- nirman is now known as schatten 10:28:29 but i don't even need to swap bytes in any program 10:29:10 Xach: what's the canoical value of :license for public-domain? 10:29:14 -!- schatten is now known as nirman 10:29:47 Thra11 [~quassel@46.208.137.99] has joined #lisp 10:30:40 boost license is da best 10:30:46 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.158.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 10:30:48 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:32:36 cl-ppcre.asd doesn't have :description, :license or :author! 10:32:42 Xach: double standards! 10:33:06 -!- eataix [eataix@unaffiliated/eataix] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 10:34:31 rly [~rly@unaffiliated/rly] has joined #lisp 10:35:11 agumonkey [~agu@17.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 10:35:37 I am seeing this in SLIME: [ ] PROJECT-NAME = "alexandria". Why doesn't (SLOT-VALUE (car (ql-dist:installed-releases (ql-dist:dist "quicklisp"))) "PROJECT-NAME") work? 10:35:55 because slots are symbols, not strings 10:36:00 slot names 10:36:16 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #lisp 10:36:54 stassats: that tells me that 'PROJECT-NAME is not a valid slot or something like that. 10:37:07 because you use the wrong package 10:37:59 The ql-dist:dist call returned a valid object. Isn't the idea that I can then send messages to it such that one doesn't need to care about packages? 10:38:27 no 10:38:33 you're totally confused 10:39:34 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 10:39:49 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:39:50 A simple question: do you want to help me? 10:40:16 I don't need to hear that I am confused. I only don't know some details; I am perfectly able to program. 10:41:06 i did help you, but you're stuck in some notions of another programming language 10:41:58 -!- v_ [~v@61.173.102.229] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:42:03 stassats: yes, you helped by saying that I shouldn't use strings and that I am using the wrong package. 10:42:11 The former is a useful suggestion. 10:42:24 rly: the latter is useful, too 10:42:26 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:42:32 The second has no meaning to me. I am using CL-USER, but none of the documents I read about it talked about packages. 10:42:47 Or that these symbols live in a package name space. 10:42:54 rly: then you need to read up on packages 10:43:03 minion: please tell rly about PCL 10:43:03 rly: please see PCL: pcl-book: "Practical Common Lisp", an introduction to Common Lisp by Peter Seibel, available at http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ and in dead-tree form from Apress (as of 11 April 2005). 10:43:04 I have no doubt that somewhere on Alpha Centauri these things are documented. 10:43:18 minion: I already did, when the book came out. 10:43:19 you speak nonsense 10:43:20 rly: all of that is in the common lisp hyperspec 10:43:35 akovalenko [~user@95.72.41.20] has joined #lisp 10:43:46 rly: did you read it? 10:43:53 stassats: yes, I did. 10:44:05 Apparently, not all of the details have stayed with me. 10:44:07 rly: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/11_ab.htm 10:44:12 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:44:13 rly: you should check out the part on packages, then. Symbols are in packages and there are ways to access them 10:44:14 then read again, in particular: http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/programming-in-the-large-packages-and-symbols.html 10:44:39 and i don't understand that attitude 10:45:14 The COMMON-LISP package has as external symbols those symbols enumerated in the figures in Section 1.9 (Symbols in the COMMON-LISP Package), and no others. 10:45:23 Ok, this is what I needed. 10:45:26 -!- springz [~springz@123.151.195.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:46:06 don't read clhs, read that PCL chapter 10:47:24 How am I supposed to know that when SLIME prints PROJECT-NAME which package qualified symbol it is talking about? 10:47:57 you can inspect it 10:47:57 rly: read the packages chapter in the hyperspec. 10:48:23 This is inspect output. 10:48:29 rly: since it is not a keyword you should do what you did to the function dist, 'ql-dist:project-name, you didn't import the package. 10:48:31 Inspect only seems to work for one level. 10:48:39 i mean, you can inspect PROJECT-NAME itself 10:49:08 I am going to guess that this would tell me that PROJECT-NAME does not exist. 10:49:12 rly: no, go to the part of the inspected object and hit enter. Backtrack with l 10:49:17 (find-all-symbols "PROJECT-NAME") 10:49:34 (describe 'PROJECT-NAME) ... 10:49:35 rly: you either position your cursor on PROJECT-NAME and press ENTER 10:49:55 or you click it with the middle mouse button 10:51:12 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 10:52:26 prxq: thanks, it tooks some time to see what exactly you meant. 10:52:29 act 10:52:39 (also thanks for the other suggestions) 10:53:55 Does anyone of you use Common Lisp for development, but compile to a completely different run-time system for deployment? 10:54:12 different run-time system? 10:54:14 what do you mean 10:55:16 There are various advanced type-systems which don't have nice programming environments, but it is generally quite easy to embed those semantics in Common Lisp. These restricted languages have a faster execution because they are simpler. 10:56:07 A Common Lisp execution environment needs to be prepared to do anything, but sometimes you can leave for example a GC out completely. 10:56:27 i sure don't follow what you are asking about. 10:56:43 rly: There were some "developement environments" created in similar vein, but they usually didn't run the code in CL itself, I think 10:57:31 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:57:46 in this day and age, 5MiB is nothing,w hich is what a CL environment needs more or less.. 10:58:05 startup is also fast if you write world files 10:58:38 you could experiment with something like that for node.js, though, given that there's pretty functional JS engine in/for CL 10:59:17 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:59:31 GOAL didn't, afaik, run code in CL itself, but had debug bridge that let you send the code for execution 10:59:38 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:00:32 What I am thinking of would for example be to port ML structures to Common Lisp and then when development is "done" compile it to ML which then compiles it to one happy binary. 11:00:53 rly: commercial implementations have tree shakers and class sealing 11:01:25 stassats: the advantage I am also thinking of would be that the code still needs to type-check in ML land. 11:01:33 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 11:01:42 Although, I read some arguments that CL does more than static typing could ever do. 11:02:07 (only talking about non-dependent types now) 11:03:19 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.158.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 11:03:39 yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:03:49 -!- yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:03:49 yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has joined #lisp 11:04:21 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:04:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:05:43 gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:05:46 rly: where did you get the idea that an object's slot names are immune to package? 11:06:21 Hi, is it possible to evaluate something in a defpackage? e.g. I want to pull :documentation in from a file, but this doesn't work: 11:06:51 (defpackage :blah (:documentation (with-open-file (in "~/my/description.txt") (read in))  ) 11:06:52 pavelpenev [~quassel@194.141.47.12] has joined #lisp 11:07:03 clearly defpackage doesn't much evaluate its arguments, 11:07:06 is there a way to force this? 11:07:14 or do i have to make some wrapper 11:07:32 gendl: that's suggested by the way SLIME prints things. 11:07:34 gendl: #. 11:07:42 gendl: I did not read that in any formal documentation. 11:08:03 -!- ehu [~ehu@31.137.115.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:08:05 are you talking about the SLIME inspector? 11:08:15 SLIME could show the full name when hovering over it with the mouse of cursor. 11:08:30 That would take about 3 lines of Emacs Lisp to do. 11:08:33 rly: If you want to get the name of that object, use (ql-dist:name object) 11:09:12 how would one be able to elicit that information from the SLIME inspector? 11:09:16 Xach: the goal is to output all of the package names, such that I can install the same lists of packages on a different machine. 11:09:34 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 11:09:34 Xach: I thought project-name would accomplish that. 11:09:52 rly: I think you should be concerned with systems for what you're trying to do, not packages. 11:10:17 note that ASDF/QL systems are an orthogonal concept to CL packages. 11:10:18 gendl: I have no idea what you mean by that 11:10:28 rly: here's a thing to do: (in-package ql-dist-user) 11:10:28 rly: or you can just press the middle button, requires 0 lines of code 11:10:36 rly: (mapcar 'name (installed-systems t)) 11:10:54 That list can be given to (ql:quickload ...) on another system. 11:10:56 -!- taraz [~user@p578E7686.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:11:06 or (map nil 'ql-dist:ensure-installed ...) 11:11:07 stassats: Thank you. 11:11:14 Xach: great. 11:12:06 gendl: but i would advise against it, unless you change description twice a day 11:12:13 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 11:12:40 well in this case I have a direct mapping from the package to an asdf system 11:12:49 and i'd like to store the description in only one place 11:13:00 i.e. that description.txt file 11:13:20 i have another utility which generates the .asd file and pulls the :description from the same place 11:13:47 with that in mind do you still advise against? 11:13:56 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:14:12 then just drop the :documentation from defpackage 11:14:25 really? 11:14:40 do you expect anybody to read it? 11:14:53 i'm not gonna speculate about what people may or may not do. 11:15:06 if i wanted to read, i would be browsing the code, not doing DESCRIBE or calling documentation, and #.(read-from-file ...) is useless 11:15:33 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:15:45 these systems can be delivered in an image which is sans source code and sans ASDF. 11:16:01 having NIL for a package documentation would seem a bit strange, to me. 11:16:28 what do you mean #.(read-from-file) is "useless" ? 11:16:46 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 11:16:46 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 11:16:46 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:17:00 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:19:22 do you expect people to learn how to use your sourceless package based on docstrings? 11:19:55 No, but at least they can get a hint what some package is supposed to be, by looking at it. 11:20:32 And our documentation system does print the package description in some places (e.g. table of contents). 11:20:49 -!- BrianRice [~water@c-24-18-219-78.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:21:00 -!- Thra11 [~quassel@46.208.137.99] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:21:41 let's put it this way: do you see any legitimate uses for package :documentation, ever? 11:21:48 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:22:12 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 11:22:12 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 11:22:12 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:22:44 I try to use :documentation on defpackage all the time, now. 11:22:51 I didn't know it was an option until recently. 11:23:00 -!- bitonic [~user@b01bf0a7.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:23:19 gendl: a short description, just like for other docstrings 11:23:43 yep, that's all I'm putting in there. 11:23:45 but i primarily read docstrings with M-., so, i don't want to see glorious markups, ten pages of documentation, or #. from files 11:23:52 sorry maybe i should have been more clear. 11:24:06 i'm not using package :documentation for :documentation. I'm using it as a :description. 11:24:33 i was advising against #.(read-from-file), not against :documentation 11:24:35 just a one-liner. 11:25:12 because? 11:25:30 you mean you advise against #.(with-open-file (in  )) ? 11:25:38 for the :documentation ? 11:26:19 leo2007 [~leo@123.108.223.39] has joined #lisp 11:27:20 won't that have my desired effect of pulling the string from a file, at read-time? 11:27:33 the call to (with-open-file ..) won't happen at fasl load time 11:27:36 or any other time 11:27:50 only when compiling the source file 11:27:54 so what's the problem? 11:28:36 sorry i should have mentioned, 11:28:40 the file contains only a one-line string. 11:28:43 just a one-liner. 11:28:45 typically. 11:29:13 I agree with you, package documentations these days are not appropriate to be pages of glorious markup! ;) 11:29:19 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:29:30 because it's not nice, can't be read without compiling or searching for that file 11:29:30 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:29:38 re-enact85 [~re-enact8@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:29:52 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:30:31 I see what you mean. Someone simply browsing the static source code might be confused for a few moments. 11:31:08 I see where that might be a concern, but I expect that anyone seriously interested in this code will see the pattern quickly enough. 11:31:09 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:31:37 i won't be confused, just annoyed 11:31:55 but then again, i won't read or use your code 11:32:13 your loss. 11:33:34 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:33:39 well, no amount of docstrings can make clear to me what GenDL is doing 11:35:31 i'm not sure whether to take that as an insult or a compliment! ;) 11:36:23 anyway thank you very much for the #. tip, even if my use of it ends up repelling you. 11:38:03 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:38:43 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 11:38:43 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 11:38:43 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:39:39 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 11:39:44 -!- nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:40:20 Thra11 [~quassel@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 11:41:19 -!- cades [~mac@59-124-92-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 11:42:56 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:43:28 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:44:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:45:08 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:47:53 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:48:39 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:51:14 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 11:53:19 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-181-16.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 11:54:21 hm. 11:54:40 Thra11_ [~quassel@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 11:54:50 -!- Thra11 [~quassel@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:54:55 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:55:18 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 11:55:18 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 11:55:18 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 11:58:38 -!- rly [~rly@unaffiliated/rly] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 12:03:54 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@109.163.150.31] has joined #lisp 12:04:02 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:07:18 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.206] has joined #lisp 12:08:08 Thra11 [~thrall@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 12:08:25 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:08:32 hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 12:08:32 -!- hkBst [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 12:08:32 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 12:09:47 oGMo: you forgot the :cffi depends-on from c2ffi-cffi 12:11:11 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-159-92.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:12:04 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 12:12:27 stassats: you're following the discussion with anton, i suppose? 12:13:28 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-5d816a7c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:14:06 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:14:30 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:16:10 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 12:16:38 -!- doomlord [~doomlod@host81-159-234-112.range81-159.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:19:37 expez- [~expez@expez.com] has joined #lisp 12:20:13 so, is there bitfield support in cffi? (besides the misleadingly named defbitfield... I'm looking for bit-length struct members...) 12:21:50 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.108.223.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:22:33 quazimodo [~quazimodo@c27-253-100-110.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #lisp 12:23:00 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:24:39 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 12:24:58 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-173-59-25-70.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:26:59 -!- Thra11_ [~quassel@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:28:51 nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 12:29:10 clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:30:20 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 12:30:24 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 12:31:54 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:32:12 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 12:34:06 leo2007 [~leo@106.120.137.137] has joined #lisp 12:34:18 -!- antgreen_ [~green@dsl-173-206-4-216.tor.primus.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:35:48 -!- knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:37:22 H4ns: i am, not paying it full attention, though 12:38:06 -!- nialo [~nialo@ool-44c53f01.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [] 12:39:25 stassats: tl;dr: the problem is within cl+ssl's support for clisp which i cannot fix. 12:39:39 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 12:40:33 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:42:41 does anyone have a sensible routes hack for hunchentoot? 12:43:34 something equally stupid like define-easy-handler would be nice, but with some means of parsing parts of the URI 12:44:02 i take it that restas is not what you're looking for? 12:44:26 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 12:44:53 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@194.141.47.12] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:45:37 *zorkmoid* looks. 12:46:49 i suppose this could wokr. 12:48:23 yes. 12:48:25 thanks! 12:49:26 sheeet, found another quirk in my understanding....i thought each global variable was special too....meh 12:50:26 -!- stumbles [~stumbles@2001:44b8:41c5:9600:219:d1ff:fe10:f770] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:51:18 H4ns: i like how get and put requests are different forms 12:51:37 wbooze: it is special 12:52:29 -!- segv- [~mb@dslb-188-102-168-176.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:52:39 stassats: touretsky's book tells otherwise..... 12:52:42 if i got it right 12:52:55 he says there are global lexicals....non-special.... 12:53:00 -!- leo2007 [~leo@106.120.137.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:53:04 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:53:10 no, there's no such thing 12:53:14 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-kaqaumqizrmypfst] has joined #lisp 12:53:18 oh 12:53:20 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:53:25 you must be misreading it 12:55:12 it is perfectly legal to have a lexically scoped globla (unspecial) variable..... 12:55:16 page 308 12:55:28 footnote 12:56:00 was about defvar 12:56:04 and setf i think 12:58:01 that's total nonsense 12:58:07 i dunno how the implementation handles it tho.... 12:58:22 defvar proclaims it special, setf not.... ? 12:58:50 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:59:25 it's unspecified what setf does for undefined variables 12:59:50 and there's no such thing as "global lexical" 13:00:27 -!- dt770 [dt770@c-411ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Hihi] 13:00:29 pmai [~Thunderbi@2001:470:1f15:3df:7ccd:ea94:1862:8f08] has joined #lisp 13:01:04 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 13:01:31 H4ns: hmph, i'd need to rewrite my hunchentoot code blech, is there something liked efine-route that works without having to do all kinds of magic stuff? 13:01:38 wbooze: so, it's entirely illegal to do so 13:01:53 zorkmoid: i don't know restas at all, i just know that it provides routes 13:02:40 xzpeter [~xzpeter@117.79.232.170] has joined #lisp 13:03:35 mm.. 13:04:32 (setf plonk 'hi), (describe 'plonk) => PLONK names an undefined variable Value:HI 13:04:34 i would have thought that something like this would be extremeley common 13:05:39 Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 13:06:47 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:08:27 axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:09:24 jaaso [~user@178.239.31.138] has joined #lisp 13:09:54 -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 13:11:18 ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has joined #lisp 13:11:45 Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has joined #lisp 13:14:43 suppose i could rip apart cl-routes ... 13:15:05 taraz [~user@p578E7686.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:16:41 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@2602:306:36c6:f7e0:243d:ce3b:5b20:30d0] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:20:25 pavelpenev [~quassel@194.141.47.12] has joined #lisp 13:21:16 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 13:23:55 cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has joined #lisp 13:25:50 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:26:16 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:27:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 13:27:53 nha [~prefect@koln-5d816a7c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 13:28:47 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.29] has joined #lisp 13:30:20 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 13:31:21 patrickwonders [~patrickwo@user-38q42ns.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 13:33:46 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:34:33 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 13:34:37 hlavaty` [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has joined #lisp 13:35:16 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 13:36:05 -!- hlavaty [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:38:17 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:39:09 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 13:39:30 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 13:39:36 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 13:41:23 -!- [SLB] [~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:42:06 [SLB] [~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua] has joined #lisp 13:42:46 or not, terrible code. 13:43:05 -!- xzpeter 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seconds] 14:11:09 -!- foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.12] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:11:44 -!- sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:12:36 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:12:58 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 14:13:32 -!- techlife [techlife@218.59.113.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:13:32 -!- SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:14:31 techlife [techlife@218.59.113.120] has joined #lisp 14:15:17 -!- leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.29] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.3.1] 14:16:30 leo2007 [~leo@182.48.109.29] has joined #lisp 14:17:06 whartung_ [~whartung@wsip-70-183-27-154.oc.oc.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:18:48 -!- whartung [~whartung@wsip-70-183-27-154.oc.oc.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:18:48 -!- whartung_ is now known as whartung 14:20:30 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 14:26:37 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 14:26:45 hi 14:27:09 hi! 14:27:25 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:28:29 I wish CL was more popular. I'm starting to work on a game, and the only reason for me not choosing CL is because I'll work with others, and I'm the only one that scratches CL's surface 14:28:38 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 14:29:02 Denommus: such decisions is what makes CL less popular. 14:29:13 people always try to find a reason not to write things in CL 14:29:20 hence, it is not as popular as some other languages. 14:29:49 good riddance to them 14:30:01 Denommus: you could use abcl, and they could use java. 14:30:57 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 14:31:42 zorkmoid: I wish I had the power of making decisions on this instance. I'm just a Jr. Developer. If I were more "important", I would say "fuck it, let's learn Lisp" 14:32:09 Denommus: you have the decision, it is you who is starting to work on something, you got to make the choice right there and then. 14:32:32 jr developer or whatever doesn't matter. 14:32:36 Denommus: just make a development tool in lisp or something 14:32:45 -!- varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:32:50 xzpeter [~xzpeter@117.79.232.245] has joined #lisp 14:32:56 ok, thanks 14:33:52 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has quit [Quit: phunq, sandwich store loop, WHAT NO UNIVERSE] 14:34:17 "boss, i understand that you want me to write ruby but i'm writing it in common lisp instead, ok?" 14:35:27 mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:35:44 H4ns: sounds like a brilliant idea. I wonder if there's anyone with the opportunity to apply it in reality. 14:35:49 see how it works out 14:35:56 *sykopomp* is optimistic! 14:36:10 -!- vsync_ is now known as vsync 14:36:30 No quite the same context, but I'm using Lisp for network programming for my master thesis :P 14:36:36 thomas_yzj [~user@175.0.168.73] has joined #lisp 14:36:50 a long long time ago, back in the web 1.0 days, i got a request to rewrite a e-zine backend front end article thing 14:37:13 i wrote it in emacs, and cl 14:37:25 sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 14:37:29 thing is, bosses don't care what language you write stuff in 14:37:32 it is not their job 14:37:43 i made the same [bad] decision for my game project in python. a couple years later, devs lost interest and i decided to do it myself in CL, accomplishing more than my team in python 14:38:13 maybe you can find 1 cl programmer for every 1000 python/java programmer, but does it matter? 14:38:21 get some univ. student to learn cl 14:38:23 be done with it 14:38:30 axion: I find that sometimes it's easier to get stuff done, specially prototypes, when you don't have to deal with anyone else's opinion. :) 14:38:41 indeed 14:38:50 thanks for pulling me away from python btw, sykopomp :) 14:39:00 Lisp is a good way to make sure no one else decides to chime in with their opinion. 14:39:24 -!- mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Client Quit] 14:39:35 not sure i agree with that, but maybe it is so 14:39:37 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:48 been working solo for the past several decades :-) 14:39:49 Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 14:39:55 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 14:40:02 H4ns: are you here? 14:40:48 antonv: ack 14:41:23 alama [~jessealam@stgt-4d02c655.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 14:41:39 H4ns: what URL fails for you with drakma https? 14:41:51 antonv: https://google.com/ 14:42:17 antonv: you need :method :post :parameters '(("a"."b")) or some such 14:42:48 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:43:29 sykopomp: other people's opinions are usually horrible. Imagine a bunch of senior developers that never did any language besides Java. Try to explain to them that the command pattern is just a poor man's first class function 14:43:32 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:44:03 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@194.141.47.12] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:44:16 H4ns: got the error with :method :post :parameters ... 14:44:33 antonv: sorry that i've missed to say that :/ 14:44:38 moai [~m@fp-192-52-27-208.mobile.uni-freiburg.de] has joined #lisp 14:44:50 Anyone successfully installed ECL 12.12.1? It looks to me like 'sockets.asd' references package ASDF-1.0 which it can't find. 14:45:02 Denommus: what does that have to do with the language? 14:45:07 kanru` [~kanru@111-249-147-169.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 14:45:42 Denommus: i haven't programmed in anything other than CL in over several decades, would you automatically assume that my opinion about a paradigm is "useless" just cause i've never programmed in java? 14:46:07 -!- hugoduncan [~user@67.51.76.53] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:46:28 patrickwonders: I have installed ECL 12.12.1 14:46:29 zorkmoid: yes 14:46:34 fe[nl]ix: hehe :-) 14:47:00 antonv: Hmm not sure what I missed then 14:47:56 patrickwonders: I did nothing special, just build it 14:48:06 I can start it with '-norc', but then when I try to load quick lisp, it does other stuff that wants "SOCKETS". 14:48:12 hi, I'm new to lisp and I'm trying to figure out an error message. When I try to load a *.lisp file, the debugger is invoked, but fails with the following error message: http://pastebin.com/jCf0z6Wi 14:48:12 bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:48:13 Denommus: well, my point about opinions wasn't so much that their opinion would be horrible... more that I think the cost of discussing opinions is too heavy sometimes, and it's better to let yourself do things the wrong way if it means doing *something* 14:48:17 H4ns: I have just removed (check-type ...) and the error has gone 14:48:29 H4ns: it now says "Method Not Allowed" 14:48:32 zorkmoid: it's not so easy, even if you are university teacher, to have any significant number of students learning AND then using lisp, scheme or CL. 14:48:36 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:48:42 antonv: right. that is what it needs to say 14:48:52 ogamita: i think it is easy enough, time consuming, but easy. 14:48:56 i use the standard cmucl package from the official archlinux repositories, if that helps 14:48:56 antonv: maybe the array check can stay in there. 14:49:04 antonv: (as in my patch) 14:49:05 moai: what does the error say? 14:49:06 A lot of student get a few lessons of lisp and forget everything before leaving university. 14:49:12 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 14:49:26 connection dropped. Anyone said anything else? 14:49:30 Nope. 14:49:34 the debugger fails, it seems. 14:49:40 ogamita: the same case is for any other language when a student graduates from univesity 14:49:46 H4ns: no, stream-read-sequence is specified to work with various sequences, if user says (cl:write-sequence '(1 2 3)) it must work too 14:49:49 moai: the error message says "NIL is not of type HASH-TABLE" 14:49:57 antonv: ok. 14:50:32 ...actually I'm confused, nevermind. 14:50:35 zorkmoid: strangely enough, it doesn't seem to be the case for java, C++, C#, javascript, python, ruby. 14:50:44 you have no debugger :\ 14:50:51 *sykopomp* goes back to his corner. 14:50:53 I'm an Android developer, tired of working with android, and tired of working with Java. My boss promissed to transfer me to the games division, but... nothing. So I'm starting my game independently 14:50:55 But perhaps we are overestimating knowledge people have in those languages. 14:51:02 H4ns: luckily that the stream-read-write sequence code seems working. I wasn't used before, so there were probability it may have some other bug 14:51:14 ogamita: i've had students who went to "programming schools" where they "learnt" a single language but couldn't write anything in them .. 14:51:22 easye: ping 14:51:22 sykopomp: ok, i can see that. I have no idea where this error comes from. can i see what function caused it? 14:51:33 and I have seen hackers with german philology degrees 14:51:50 Thra11_ [~thrall@146.90.243.224] has joined #lisp 14:51:53 p_l: what about film degrees? :D 14:52:02 p_l: where ? 14:52:07 i have an art degree, does that count? :-) 14:52:19 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Client Quit] 14:52:22 sykopomp, can I disable the debugger and just get the error message of my failed load function? 14:52:24 It's a good thing, programming is an art anyways. 14:52:30 no idea why i don't have a debugger 14:52:41 fe[nl]ix: a guy from Poland, now in London afaik 14:52:51 moai: I don't know either. Why are you using cmucl, anyway? 14:52:56 he didn't call himself hacker, but definitely qualified :) 14:53:00 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 14:53:03 no specific reason. 14:53:05 anyway, back to fighting hunchentoot 14:53:12 is it not recommended? 14:53:16 moai: can you try running the code in sbcl? 14:53:26 ok, I'll try that 14:53:37 mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:54:00 *sykopomp* doesn't use cmucl, so doesn't really know what's going on with the debugger. 14:54:12 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@29.115.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:54:33 possibly something stupid with the arch package. The SBCL package from [extra] may not give you a much better error, but it's worth a shot. :) 14:54:44 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has joined #lisp 14:55:07 -!- ramus_ is now known as ramus 14:55:42 H4ns: for a long time a want to add a trivial test suite for drakma, just fetch one URL 14:55:56 H4ns: now maybe two URLs: http and https 14:56:16 I hope to do it one day 14:56:18 Quadresce_ [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 14:56:32 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Disconnected by services] 14:57:08 antonv: the hunchentoot test suite tests drakma 14:57:17 antonv: not that i'm proud of that :) 14:58:19 is there a recommended lisp implementation (for beginners)? 14:58:30 moai: any implementation. 14:58:42 moai: you'll get best support here when you use sbcl or clozure cl 14:58:47 moai: and ignore zorkmoid 14:58:51 Quadresce__ [~quad@c-24-6-135-91.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:58:59 -!- Quadresce__ [~quad@c-24-6-135-91.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 14:59:08 H4ns: I considered the hunchentoot test suite for inclusion into cl-test-grid, but had impression that it is intended to be run manually. Am I mistaken? 14:59:22 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 14:59:29 rly [~rly@unaffiliated/rly] has joined #lisp 14:59:32 antonv: "intended" is the wrong word, but it is currently not run automatically, yes. 14:59:48 cades [~mac@114-32-245-7.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 15:00:16 I had quicklisp in $HOME, now I have it in /home/bar, what do I need to modify for that to work as before? 15:00:55 moai: I believe most people here use either SBCL or clozure cl, as h4ns said. A few use clisp and abcl, as well, but imo those are more specialized. 15:01:02 rly: You might need to modify your lisp initialization file (e.g. ~/.sbclrc) to load setup.lisp from the new location. 15:01:03 H4ns: what? any cl implementation will do fine for a beginner 15:01:09 Xach: I missed a /. 15:01:09 -!- Quadresce_ [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:01:19 rly: quicklisp performs everything relative to from where setup.lisp is loaded 15:01:22 H4ns: for drakma we could add something really trivial. If we had such a test suite, cl-test-grid would soon collected results from various lisps/OSes and we see how drakma is supported. I saw it failing sometimes 15:01:36 Xach: if you want the instructions to be better change your FAQ regarding this with an example. 15:01:52 zorkmoid: that's not true 15:02:12 stassats: i find it true 15:02:22 debugging facilities vary widely 15:02:37 pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has joined #lisp 15:02:44 antonv: i'm open to that. 15:02:50 a beginner wouldn't want to use slow, buggy implementations, with bad debuggers and on which a good part of software isn't working/wasn't tested 15:03:18 unless you want the beginner never to come back 15:03:28 stassats: you are making a strawman. 15:03:52 i'm describing ABCL, ECL, and CLisp (to some degree) 15:04:00 as for debugging facilities, sbcl has quite some catching up to do there. 15:04:28 bitonic [~user@dyn903-152.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 15:04:32 -!- thomas_yzj [~user@175.0.168.73] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:04:34 zorkmoid: support varies widely 15:04:49 zorkmoid: which one is better for a beginner? 15:04:55 moai: pick one you like. 15:05:01 m| 15:05:02 rly: SBCL or Clozure CL 15:05:04 jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has joined #lisp 15:05:06 H4ns: I am thinking what URLs to choose for that - desirable that the URLs were stable and don't change with time. Maybe the best way is to upload something to S3. It will work for GET tests. As for POST and other things - I don't know 15:05:08 i prefered the verbosity of CCL over SBCL when beginning. i have not tried others. 15:05:09 rly: i like cmucl. 15:05:32 antonv: i can run a server for that. 15:05:34 the debugger is much saner, clearer warnings and errors than in sbcl. 15:05:37 though i still use SBCL on x86 15:05:42 zorkmoid: are you kidding? 15:05:44 antonv: as long as i am the maintainer, it would be stable. 15:05:54 stassats: he's living in his own, lone world. 15:05:55 stassats: are you trolling? 15:06:06 I find CCL friendlier to the sort of interactive development than I do. It's much nicer about package renamings/changing exports and imports 15:06:13 it DWIM 15:06:14 I suspect that few people who have started using CL in the past 10 years use CMUCL. 15:06:35 I saw someone's proposal to make shared libraries that implement part of the CL spec in order to simply compilers. 15:06:43 I think that's a good idea. 15:06:54 zorkmoid: please, you can keep your opinion, but don't spread misinformation to the true beginners, who don't know better 15:07:25 rly: The way that works in practice is that new implementations copy CL code from an existing implementation to support big chunks of the standard. 15:07:26 stassats: i suggest you do as you preach before you start telling me what to do. 15:07:31 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Xach 15:07:33 -!- Xach has set mode +b *!*c2ed8e15@*.194.237.142.21 15:07:36 -!- zorkmoid [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has been kicked from #lisp by Xach (Go away.) 15:07:38 Everyone working on their own little island (=Run-time system) is quite a waste. 15:07:40 -!- Xach has set mode -o Xach 15:08:02 rly: some implementations have different goals 15:08:03 Xach: thank you 15:08:13 rly: it's try to cover them all with one code base 15:08:19 it's ahrd 15:08:32 H4ns: monoculture successfully protected 15:08:32 eh, "it's hard to try" 15:08:32 ;) 15:09:38 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 15:09:41 i'm surprised zorkmoid didn't suggest opengenera 15:09:47 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f75589e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 15:10:45 that was yesterday 15:11:16 akovalen` [~user@95.72.41.20] has joined #lisp 15:11:18 This argument would suggest then that we don't know how to build composable systems that run efficiently with a wide variety of different goals. 15:11:20 Bike [~Glossina@67-5-254-59.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:11:21 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:12:01 Natch_s [~Natch@c-fecee155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 15:12:11 rly: yes, and what? 15:13:09 stassats: I find it surprising to hear that from a Common Lisp user. 15:13:18 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:13:19 rly: maybe you want to study a few implementations to learn how modular and composable they are 15:13:46 rly: i don't see a suggestion on how to rectify this "problem" 15:14:02 do you know how to build such systems? 15:14:45 I believe I do. 15:14:59 Knowing would mean that I had already done so. 15:15:02 df_ [~df@aldur.bowerham.net] has joined #lisp 15:15:02 ramus_ [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:15:05 KingNato_ [~isildur@c-e9eee253.012-31-73746f43.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 15:15:36 emma_ [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 15:15:40 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 15:15:48 H4ns: I have seen some SBCL code before and I found it looking complex. 15:15:53 aoh_ [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has joined #lisp 15:16:07 H4ns: Scheme48 was much easier to understand and even that had some undocumented parts. 15:16:13 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@64.128.85.190] has quit [] 15:16:35 i presume sbcl produces much more performant results 15:16:53 I have no doubt that it does. 15:17:17 -!- stokachu [~stokachu@50.58.87.197] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 15:18:08 we could argue for eternity how to make perfect systems, or instead use "good enough" systems and concentrate on solving other problems 15:18:13 xorp_ [~xorp@ec2-50-16-219-79.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 15:18:47 hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 15:18:47 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 15:18:47 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:19:06 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 15:19:12 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:19:20 yeah. and understand lisp symbols and packages in the mean time 15:20:15 kranius_ [~kranius@lafitte.pro] has joined #lisp 15:20:33 H4ns: what, no, it's better to shame common lisp implementers instead 15:20:44 stassats: right. 15:21:30 stokachu [~stokachu@50.58.87.197] has joined #lisp 15:21:40 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-181-16.netcologne.de] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- akovalenko [~user@95.72.41.20] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- PuffTheMagic [uid3325@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pqszzucqvdjualou] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- kranius [~kranius@lafitte.pro] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- Posterdati [~antani@host98-231-dynamic.2-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- emma [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- xorp [~xorp@ec2-50-16-219-79.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- df___ [~df@aldur.bowerham.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- Natch [~Natch@c-fecee155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:40 -!- KingNato [~isildur@c-e9eee253.012-31-73746f43.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [*.net *.split] 15:21:52 -!- xificurC [xificurC@nat/ibm/x-komqslruibkzapuv] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! 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[~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 16:16:20 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:16:34 oGMo: can you also comment on the two pull requests you opened for cffi ? 16:16:53 ed_g [~quassel@71-214-120-151.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:17:23 fe[nl]ix: heh k i'll take a look 16:18:03 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:20:46 joe9 [~user@c-24-98-97-215.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:55 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:23:13 mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has joined #lisp 16:23:14 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has quit [Changing host] 16:23:14 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 16:23:55 -!- ck_ [~ck@dslb-178-004-015-016.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:25:59 -!- m4dnificent is now known as madnificent 16:26:34 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7] 16:27:46 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:30:03 oGMo: and the one for static-vectors too 16:30:34 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:30:46 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:30:58 fe[nl]ix: yeah i need to make a test case for that .. i'm not sure it's easily demonstrable that a compiler-macro is being expanded without just manually checking though 16:31:28 but, i can provide an example 16:31:32 use slime-compiler-macroexpand 16:31:56 slime-compiler-macroexpand-1 16:32:26 sure, but that's what i qualify as a manual check 16:32:39 that's fine for me 16:32:47 I just want the test case 16:32:50 sounds good 16:33:55 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:35:58 vert2_ [vert2@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-lxhwszcukitiqegd] has joined #lisp 16:36:31 -!- vert2 [vert2@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-fzhevlicaeyfjqox] has quit [Read error: 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256 seconds] 16:41:59 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 16:42:28 -!- fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has quit [*.net *.split] 16:42:28 -!- sweet_kid [~Unknown@irc.upasna.in] has quit [*.net *.split] 16:42:28 -!- antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 16:42:28 -!- nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 16:42:40 nuba [~nuba@pauleira.com] has joined #lisp 16:42:54 antifuchs [~foobar@boots.boinkor.net] has joined #lisp 16:43:06 fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has joined #lisp 16:43:21 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:43:48 antonv: thanks! 16:43:59 -!- teggi_ [~teggi@113.172.59.16] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:44:00 H4ns: welcome 16:44:18 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:44:38 H4ns: what server you can host for drakma test suite? Just static files? Or it can handle POST methods? 16:45:08 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:45:26 -!- emma_ is now known as emma 16:45:32 antonv: i can do both, no problem. 16:46:10 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:45 H4ns: I am just thinking what would be the minimal solution. When someone else will take over maintenance that we can host this server too. What type of server you have in mind? Apache? Or maybe Hunchentoot? 16:46:56 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 16:47:09 antonv: i have apache running, and i think it makes sense to use it. 16:47:23 antonv: i'll set up a simple upload cgi 16:47:24 start up hunchentoot! 16:47:30 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 16:47:31 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:47:50 i would assume that cl+ssl is also broken for hunchentoot, is it not? 16:47:50 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 16:48:01 hrmbl 16:48:12 throstur [82d0f702@gateway/web/freenode/ip.130.208.247.2] has joined #lisp 16:48:18 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 16:49:09 I am thinking also about starting some snapshot of hunchentoot at Heroku 16:49:14 johnstorey [~johnstore@12.218.85.246] has joined #lisp 16:49:39 stapshot, so that we know it is working and will not become broken unexpectingbly 16:50:05 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:50:10 heroku is free hosting, so noone needs to maintain the server... 16:50:11 i don't have the time to think it through myself right now, but i can host whatever you want me to host. 16:50:14 if hunchentoot breaks, then this will as a hunchentoot as well 16:50:24 -!- vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:50:26 will double 16:50:43 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 16:51:05 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 16:51:06 vsync [~vsync@wsip-98-175-216-162.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:51:20 sweet_kid [having@irc.upasna.in] has joined #lisp 16:51:27 H4ns: ok 16:51:39 stassats: what do you mean? 16:52:09 anyone know why this results in a runtime error? http://pastie.org/6628999 16:52:26 car : expects a pair, given 1 (in duplicate) 16:52:46 throstur: try #scheme for scheme questions 16:52:52 thanks H4ns 16:53:00 hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has joined #lisp 16:54:15 spare schemers some pain, remove the dangling parenthesis 16:54:57 SanderM [~quassel@vhe-400104.sshn.net] has joined #lisp 16:55:01 define: expected an open parenthesis before define, but found none 16:55:04 :( 16:55:36 throstur: Sounds like one too many ) 16:55:43 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:55:49 throstur: Also, those ) on their own lines is bad style. 16:56:38 throstur: And again, #scheme is better for this. 16:56:56 throstur: not remove as in literally delete them, but tuck them with other ) 16:57:00 they don't want to be alone 16:57:07 Ah I see thanks 16:57:22 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:00:07 -!- johnstorey [~johnstore@12.218.85.246] has left #lisp 17:00:19 -!- hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:00:50 ISF_ [~ivan@143.106.196.194] has joined #lisp 17:03:50 Artheist [~quassel@modemcable051.243-130-66.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 17:04:29 -!- przl [~przlrkt@46.231.183.162] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:06:53 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 17:08:38 -!- jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has quit [Quit: phunq, sandwich store loop, WHAT NO UNIVERSE] 17:08:57 -!- moai [~m@fp-192-52-27-208.mobile.uni-freiburg.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:09:07 -!- oconnore_ [~eric@38.111.17.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:09:40 N3RG4L [~N3RG4L@192.210.208.231] has joined #lisp 17:09:46 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 17:10:37 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:12:15 -!- SanderM [~quassel@vhe-400104.sshn.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:12:26 Hi folks 17:12:50 archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has joined #lisp 17:13:09 N3RG4L: from what galaxy are you ? 17:13:19 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:13:25 Planet earth ? 17:13:25 *jasom* has $5 on Andromeda 17:13:29 durn 17:13:32 lol 17:13:34 I lose more bets that way 17:13:36 Solar galaxy 17:13:46 -!- clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:14:01 -!- mvilleneuve_ [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:14:02 So far everyone has been from the Milky Way, so I figure Andromeda is due 17:14:13 what kind of nerd are you? it's called the Galaxy 17:14:42 clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:14:47 oconnore [~eric@38.111.17.138] has joined #lisp 17:15:13 ikki [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/ikki] has joined #lisp 17:15:42 -!- zickzackv [~faot@port-92-198-30-130.static.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: Using Circe, the loveliest of all IRC clients] 17:16:06 MoALTz_ [~no@host86-142-161-168.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:16:48 -!- clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has left #lisp 17:17:22 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-kaqaumqizrmypfst] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:17:36 -!- MoALTz [~no@host86-138-29-192.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:18:13 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:18:53 clox [~user@rrcs-208-125-109-116.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:19:01 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:19:13 oGMo: thanks 17:19:54 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:20:17 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:20:17 fe[nl]ix: np 17:20:29 -!- yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:20:36 -!- cades [~mac@114-32-245-7.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 17:21:47 PuffTheMagic [uid3325@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-amtifxrjqrsmhfka] has joined #lisp 17:23:16 (if (> *read-base* 2) (expt *print-base* 2) "What's the result then ?") 17:23:29 yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:23:33 can someone please explani me what does this ? 17:23:39 -!- yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 17:23:39 yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has joined #lisp 17:23:50 I'm new in lisp 17:24:01 then why are you messing with *read-base*? 17:24:01 where do you see that code? 17:24:03 read-base is the input ? 17:24:12 *read-base* is a global variable 17:24:20 it's a school lab 17:24:23 minion: please tell N3RG4L about PCL 17:24:23 N3RG4L: look at PCL: pcl-book: "Practical Common Lisp", an introduction to Common Lisp by Peter Seibel, available at http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ and in dead-tree form from Apress (as of 11 April 2005). 17:24:36 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:24:39 N3RG4L: please don't ask us to do homework for you. 17:24:59 even if it wasn't homework, surely you can run it and see what it does 17:24:59 -!- Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:25:05 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 17:25:31 sykopomp, Im not asking you to do my homework, I m just asking for help to understand lisp 17:25:42 N3RG4L: please ask your fellow students or your ta 17:25:47 ^ 17:25:55 or read the book above 17:25:55 is this a good guide on CL style? http://google-styleguide.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/lispguide.xml 17:26:00 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:26:04 N3RG4L: or read the book minion posted 17:26:06 *read-base* is a variable with numbers from 2 to 36, so is *print-base* 17:26:24 with integers 17:26:43 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f75589e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:52 I ask here to get fast replies, as reading a book will take time.. 17:27:15 N3RG4L: yes. learning takes time. 17:27:18 learning takes time 17:27:26 H4ns: :| 17:27:30 :D 17:27:55 "I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you." 17:28:02 and that's a really weird assignment 17:28:04 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:28:12 -!- spacefrogg is now known as spacefrogg^ 17:28:16 ok 17:28:21 thanks anyway :) 17:28:25 you gave me time 17:28:34 any base in base will be 10, so any base squared print in that base will be 100 17:29:06 thank you stassats 17:29:17 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:29:30 stassats: great explanation 17:29:54 SHODAN [~shozan@c-08b7e253.011-86-73746f30.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 17:29:55 knob [~anon@76.76.202.244] has joined #lisp 17:30:17 but that's making assumptions, is that result of that expression printed? is the printer using the same value of *print-base*, etc. 17:30:19 Hello everyone =) 17:30:23 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 17:31:22 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:31:48 MoALTz [~no@host86-142-161-119.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:32:19 but the question is about the result, not about printing, i guess the teacher is just as confused as his students 17:33:19 -!- MoALTz_ [~no@host86-142-161-168.range86-142.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:33:20 -!- expez- is now known as expez 17:33:29 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@37.203.78.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:33:48 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 17:33:57 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.147.145] has joined #lisp 17:33:59 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 17:35:31 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-217-185-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 17:35:55 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:37:41 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:38:18 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 17:39:44 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 17:40:24 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-bbwoqnmivbtmsdty] has joined #lisp 17:43:05 -!- archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has quit [Quit: Read error: Connection reset by beer] 17:43:43 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:43:46 -!- taraz [~user@p578E7686.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:44:10 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.147.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:45:08 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.189.226] has joined #lisp 17:47:06 antgreen_ [green@nat/redhat/x-gjidhjdanllxfnyw] has joined #lisp 17:48:56 and verlig 17:49:10 sry, wrong window :( 17:49:59 -!- knob [~anon@76.76.202.244] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:51:05 -!- sambio_ [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:51:36 hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has joined #lisp 17:52:22 H4ns: I've sent a pull request to drakma with trivial test suite 17:52:33 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.189.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:52:45 While coding this trivial test suite I faced a dilemma: 17:53:24 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-192-67.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:53:29 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.181.86] has joined #lisp 17:53:35 drakma source code has MIT license comment in every source file 17:53:46 it says: Copyright (c) 2005-2008, Dr. Edmund Weitz. All rights reserved. 17:54:20 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 17:54:29 H4ns, did you get my pull request for cl-unicode ? 17:54:31 I was not sure what should I put for new files I' ve created: Copyright (c) 2013, Anton Vodonosov 17:54:47 why would you copyright tests? 17:55:07 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:55:20 antonv, at some point, we should run more tests against quicklisp -- and then try to reenable readtable enforcement, warnings enforcement, etc., and see what breaks 17:55:43 archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has joined #lisp 17:55:57 i can't deal with this right now. i will be back later tonight 17:56:48 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:56:51 -!- pegu [~user@cF469BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:56:54 stassats: just followed style of other files. What if someone will want reuse the tests but will not know what are the license terms... 17:57:07 Fare: how fare are we from that point? 17:57:36 how far 17:57:54 fare enough 17:58:22 (sorry) 17:58:36 jrajav [~jrajav@198.179.137.210] has joined #lisp 17:59:21 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:59:24 antonv: but, not fair enough, i was just exploiting Fare for puns, tests are not really code, who would want to reuse them? 17:59:53 are the examples in documentation copyrighted too? so if i call a function in the only way it's possible, can it be copyrighted? 18:00:01 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 18:00:09 pegu [~user@cF469BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has joined #lisp 18:00:31 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:01:01 i guess with GPL, if you call a function under GPL, you're hosed anyhow 18:01:43 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-bbwoqnmivbtmsdty] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:02:05 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 18:02:28 -!- antgreen_ [green@nat/redhat/x-gjidhjdanllxfnyw] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:02:33 stassats: other edi libraries tests are copyrightted (hunchentoot, flexi streams) 18:02:34 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:02:52 maybe someone will want to test other http client and want to reuse our tests 18:04:06 cades [~mac@114-32-245-7.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 18:04:41 but then again, i release things into the public domain, so i may be not getting the beauty of copyrighting 18:06:18 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f75589e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:07:00 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 18:07:13 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:07:21 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:08:16 moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has joined #lisp 18:08:16 -!- moai [~m@141.70.23.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:08:17 stassats: people care about this, there should be something significant about this. 18:09:39 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:09:44 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 18:10:35 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-hlovfrutzqigaqfp] has joined #lisp 18:11:00 spacefrogg_ [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 18:11:00 -!- spacefrogg_ is now known as spacefrogg 18:11:32 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:12:25 -!- Natch_s is now known as Natch 18:12:28 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 18:13:14 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 18:13:48 -!- SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:13:53 -!- asvil [~user@91.151.182.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:14:56 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.181.86] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:15:08 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@31.176.148.247] has joined #lisp 18:15:54 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 18:18:14 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:18:34 antgreen_ [green@nat/redhat/x-bdczlyfigkjbcnoe] has joined #lisp 18:19:08 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn1222-237.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:21:56 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:22:58 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:23:45 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 18:24:28 -!- hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:29:50 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 18:30:57 bhyde [~bhyde@c-76-118-23-40.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:34:25 -!- pmai [~Thunderbi@2001:470:1f15:3df:7ccd:ea94:1862:8f08] has quit [Quit: pmai] 18:34:30 pmai [~Thunderbi@2001:470:1f15:3df:7ccd:ea94:1862:8f08] has joined #lisp 18:35:34 AeroNotix [~xeno@abor127.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 18:36:28 agumonke1 [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 18:38:10 antoszka: your copyright is ok. 18:38:17 aehm. antonv i mean 18:38:44 it is the license that defines how the software can be used. we do not require you to transfer the copyright 18:39:32 -!- agumonkey [~agu@17.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:39:48 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 18:40:18 -!- ikki [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/ikki] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:41:10 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 18:42:20 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:44:00 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:45:15 -!- ncw 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[~nasenblut@customer-46-39-102-2.stosn.net] has joined #lisp 18:56:45 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-dyrebvrgevpwoneb] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:56:53 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: trivial-irc-0.0.4] 18:58:10 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:58:25 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:23 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:02:44 -!- doomlord [~doomlod@host81-159-234-112.range81-159.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:06:50 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:07:08 nan_ [~user@178.233.216.230] has joined #lisp 19:07:34 tic-tac 19:07:35 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:08:48 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:09:33 i could change clim:window-inside-size in tic-tac-toe.lisp to bounding-rectangle-size with success.... 19:09:36 seems to work 19:09:43 Eldariof-ru [~CLD@pppoe-208-165-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 19:09:47 -!- nasenblut [~nasenblut@customer-46-39-102-2.stosn.net] has left #lisp 19:09:48 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 19:10:01 at least i no longer get that bloody message anymore, that window-inside-size or so is not implemented.... 19:11:08 casion_ [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:11:25 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 19:11:32 youlysses [~user@75-132-7-80.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com] has joined #lisp 19:11:48 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-186-70.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:12:44 -!- casion [~AdmiralBu@pool-71-99-141-240.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 19:12:45 -!- casion_ is now known as casion 19:12:48 -!- eldariof 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[~thrall@146.90.243.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:25:43 Do you update asdf manually? I got latest sbcl-git and ecl on archlinux, updated quicklisp but still i might be using older version of it. http://www.mail-archive.com/cffi-devel@common-lisp.net/msg02300.html 19:26:31 can i push a list onto a hash ? 19:26:46 you can put anything into a hashtable 19:26:50 (push *wlist* (gethash tag *config-hash*)) 19:26:55 it seems to work 19:26:56 yes, you can do that. 19:27:31 push pushes elements in front of a list, not "pushes a list" 19:27:32 (gethash...) is a place, and those are what push deals with 19:28:05 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:29:32 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:29:38 -!- Eldariof-ru [~CLD@pppoe-208-165-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:31:20 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:31:50 -!- bobbysmith0071 [~russ@216.155.127.74] has left #lisp 19:32:36 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.168] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:32:41 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-187-245.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 19:32:50 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.206] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:32:58 antgreen_ [green@nat/redhat/x-htrxdgsyurfvohat] has joined #lisp 19:32:58 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:35:36 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 19:35:53 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 19:36:24 Bike: Hi. Your patch got merged in no time :) 19:37:04 after stassats unfucked it, yes 19:37:34 haha 19:38:47 well, finding the culprit and making an almost right solution is the hardest part anyway 19:39:15 :) 19:39:45 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 19:40:14 -!- iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:40:18 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-248-88.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:40:54 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 19:43:12 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:43:16 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 19:43:40 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:44:23 -!- Kenjin [~kenjin@isr-dhcp-35.isr.uc.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:45:41 bitonic [~user@b01bf0a7.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 19:46:28 nan_: you probably need to update ASDF manually 19:47:20 put it in quicklisp/local-projects and add a (asdf:load-system :asdf) in your init file 19:48:39 -!- ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-prdmsogxigwgyroz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:50:08 -!- re-enact85 [~re-enact8@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:50:24 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 19:50:45 -!- esr [~chatzilla@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:52:15 -!- archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has quit [Quit: Read error: Connection reset by beer] 19:52:36 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:52:37 any other or better alternative ? 19:53:15 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-76-118-23-40.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 19:54:10 fe[nl]ix: compiler init file, right? 19:54:16 snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 19:55:00 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 19:55:25 cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.25.200] has joined #lisp 19:56:00 yes 19:56:04 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:56:10 re-enact85 [~re-enact8@c-67-182-147-102.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:56:20 mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has joined #lisp 19:56:20 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@80.123.140.214] has quit [Changing host] 19:56:20 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 19:56:45 dt770 [dt770@c-411ee755.05-23-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 19:56:56 oGMo: try macroexpanding (static-vectors:make-static-vector 5) now 20:00:58 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Excess Flood] 20:03:43 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.206] has joined #lisp 20:05:20 -!- throstur [82d0f702@gateway/web/freenode/ip.130.208.247.2] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:07:43 -!- bitonic [~user@b01bf0a7.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:09:45 tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined 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timeout: 264 seconds] 20:22:10 welcome everyone, nice to see you here :) 20:24:27 -!- cdidd [~cdidd@93-80-3-18.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:25:17 -!- hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:26:29 (every (lambda (you) (and (eql you *one*) (herep you))) *welcome*) 20:27:06 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:30:54 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:31:09 -!- ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:31:14 Adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 20:32:12 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 20:33:24 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:34:01 ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has joined #lisp 20:35:29 trillions [~paying@adsl-76-237-179-18.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:35:37 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 20:36:00 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@aboq170.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:38:55 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abor127.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:39:48 SKC [~shimoco@109.66.59.155] has joined #lisp 20:40:04 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@conference/pycon/x-jnrvfpchwgrldjig] has joined #lisp 20:40:05 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@conference/pycon/x-jnrvfpchwgrldjig] has quit [Changing host] 20:40:05 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 20:40:05 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Changing host] 20:40:05 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@conference/pycon/x-jnrvfpchwgrldjig] has joined #lisp 20:43:09 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:43:26 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:44:19 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:45:23 Nisstyre [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 20:45:41 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:45:47 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:46:18 fe[nl]ix: manually installing asdf 2.32.24 did the trick, thanks! 20:46:22 weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has joined #lisp 20:46:32 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 20:46:50 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 20:47:10 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:47:53 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-229-130-252.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:50:43 Bike_ [~Glossina@63-229-130-252.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:49 unknown_1 [~unknown@sahnehaschee.unix-ag.uni-kl.de] has joined #lisp 20:50:54 -!- unknown_1 is now known as eak 20:52:29 -!- trillions 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now known as Bike 21:16:24 nan_, what was it that required the bleeding edge of ASDF? 21:16:35 (and yes, the commit message is misnumbered :-( ) 21:17:40 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@conference/pycon/x-jnrvfpchwgrldjig] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:17:43 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:17:47 Fare: i had problems with cffi-grovel http://www.mail-archive.com/cffi-devel@common-lisp.net/msg02300.html 21:19:22 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@conference/pycon/x-mrxtayfijxmnhcsv] has joined #lisp 21:20:51 ncw [ncw@conference/pycon/x-uzgktwdpwmbkonyh] has joined #lisp 21:20:52 -!- gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:21:09 gabot [~eli@racket/bot/gabot] has joined #lisp 21:21:20 fe[nl]ix, does that mean the latest CFFI requires a recent ASDF? 21:21:31 yes 21:21:37 cffi-grovel at least 21:22:03 in the sense that old ASDFs recompile the grovel files each time 21:22:23 not that they behave incorrectly 21:22:25 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.146.119.134] has joined #lisp 21:22:28 ok 21:22:56 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@114-25-198-238.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:23:58 weie_ [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has joined #lisp 21:24:06 s0ber [~s0ber@114-25-192-202.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 21:24:28 hugod [~user@199.223.125.130] has joined #lisp 21:25:09 -!- Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:25:26 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-187-245.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:25:34 -!- weie [~eie@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:25:48 Mandus [~aasmundo@oroback.simula.no] has joined #lisp 21:26:24 kcj_ [~casey@205.197.252.27.dyn.cust.vf.net.nz] has joined #lisp 21:28:45 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:29:55 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.234.206] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:31:02 patrick [~patrick@2.173.61.70] has 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quit [Quit: mrSpec] 22:18:50 -!- nha [~prefect@koln-5d816a7c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:19:41 stumbles [~stumbles@2001:44b8:41c5:9600:219:d1ff:fe10:f770] has joined #lisp 22:21:41 -!- bhyde [~bhyde@c-24-61-81-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bhyde] 22:25:02 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:25:07 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:26:40 -!- axion [~axion@cpe-67-242-88-224.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:29:16 -!- _d3f [~gnu@nl2.ovpn.to] has quit [Quit: gute nacht!] 22:29:20 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.8] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:32:01 -!- zophy [goldenligh@gateway/shell/devio.us/x-jbbhyrpsepmpjffl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:32:28 fe[nl]ix: nice, thanks :) 22:33:46 -!- mgile [~mgile@74-92-220-177-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Parting is such sweet sorrow...] 22:35:02 -!- LiamH 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has quit [Quit: bhyde] 23:34:46 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-171-211.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:35:35 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:35:48 LiamH [~none@pool-74-96-4-63.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:37:07 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-45-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 23:39:15 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@146.90.71.5] has quit [Quit: kthxbai] 23:39:56 SKC [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 23:40:18 hi 23:43:15 clox [~user@static-76-161-84-50.dsl.cavtel.net] has joined #lisp 23:44:05 -!- tsetumel_ [~shimoco@bzq-109-66-59-155.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:45:17 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.146.119.134] has joined #lisp 23:47:26 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:48:48 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@143.106.196.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:49:47 -!- agumonke1 [~agu@8.158.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:52:52 knob [~knob@66-50-170-105.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 23:54:21 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-253-60-75.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:54:26 Good evening everyone =) 23:55:39 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:56:33 -!- Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:58:49 Denommus [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/denommus] has joined #lisp 23:59:03 knob: o/ 23:59:48 -!- Tanami [~carnage@9ch.in] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]