00:02:00 -!- stopbit [~stopbit@static-108-48-124-82.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:02:11 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-014.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 00:04:43 -!- mutley89 [~mutley89@62.255.129.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:06:09 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-185-82-146.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:06:36 iLogical [~iLogical@unaffiliated/ilogical] has joined #lisp 00:08:55 What is a quick way to get all the keys in a hash-table? I'm always writing (let (keys) (maphash #'(lambda (k v) (push k keys)) XXXX) keys) - which I guess is pretty short. 00:09:37 that's basically what alexandria does 00:10:01 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.145.10.177] has joined #lisp 00:11:41 alexandria:hash-table-keys 00:15:17 normanrichards [~normanric@64-132-13-2.static.twtelecom.net] has joined #lisp 00:17:31 k0001 [~k0001@186.153.78.224] has joined #lisp 00:18:13 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has joined #lisp 00:18:25 mutley89 [~mutley89@cpc1-swin14-2-0-cust274.3-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 00:21:14 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:23:31 Jubb [~ghost@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:23:47 -!- Jubb [~ghost@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:24:00 Is there already a function to test if all elements in two sequences are the same? Right now I'm doing: (reduce (lambda (x y) (and x y)) (map 'list #'eql "abcd" '(#\a #\b #\c #\e))) 00:24:25 mismatch? 00:24:33 duh 00:25:10 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:25:49 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 00:26:18 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:26:32 -!- benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:30:08 -!- aajmakin [aajmakin@130.233.224.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:32:06 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 00:38:49 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 00:40:21 -!- Thra11_ [~thrall@87.112.174.214] has quit [Quit: kthxbai] 00:40:45 -!- brandonz [~brandon@206.169.144.70] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:42:14 -!- bitonic [~user@b0f86210.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:42:21 codekoala [~wheaties@216.51.73.42] has joined #lisp 00:42:42 -!- segv- [~mb@94.222.240.212] has quit [Quit: segv-] 00:42:55 bitonic [~user@b0f86210.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 00:42:58 smithzv [~smithzv@c-71-201-59-76.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:44:15 Is there a way to query the repo url of a package on QL (you know, where it came from)? 00:47:50 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 00:48:59 masondesu [~textual@adsl-98-71-136-44.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 00:49:26 -!- paul0 [~paul0@177.16.207.105] has quit [Quit: paul0] 00:53:45 -!- codekoala [~wheaties@216.51.73.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:55:03 -!- wakeup [~wakeup@xdsl-89-0-75-199.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:00:48 cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 01:02:20 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.140.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:03:15 francisl [~flavoie@bas3-montreal42-1168076900.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 01:03:49 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@64-132-13-2.static.twtelecom.net] has quit [] 01:06:47 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:08:37 codekoala [~wheaties@216.51.73.42] has joined #lisp 01:09:12 "The specializers argument has length 1, but # has 0 required parameters."  thats news to me. 01:09:23 So, we don't quite have Quid Pro Quo on ABCL yet. 01:10:38 dnolen [~user@pool-71-183-189-14.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:12:32 -!- CatMtKing [~chrono220@108-224-122-111.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:12:40 seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:13:52 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.140.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 01:13:54 -!- Vivitron` [~Vivitron`@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:14:42 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:17:20 -!- dnolen [~user@pool-71-183-189-14.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:17:59 tensorpuddin [~tensorpud@99.102.70.51] has joined #lisp 01:18:29 dnolen [~user@pool-71-183-189-14.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:20:04 -!- tensorpudding [~tensorpud@99.102.67.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:20:32 -!- tensorpuddin is now known as tensorpudding 01:21:34 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 01:21:55 ABCL: still a bit sluggish 01:23:49 sellout-: is there a new version? 01:24:10 sellout-: it was about as fast as clisp last time I tried stuff on it 01:24:19 jasom: 1.1.1, with MOP support  darcs Closer-MOP added ABCL support, too. 01:25:30 -!- codekoala [~wheaties@216.51.73.42] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 01:26:15 -!- francisl [~flavoie@bas3-montreal42-1168076900.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: francisl] 01:26:57 -!- milanj [~milanj_@82.117.199.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:28:16 bitonic` [~user@b0f86210.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 01:28:35 -!- bitonic 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has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:20:51 mathslinux [~user@221.122.32.18] has joined #lisp 02:27:12 -!- MrWoohoo [~MrWoohoo@pool-173-67-109-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 02:31:31 -!- francisl [~flavoie@bas3-montreal42-1168076900.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: francisl] 02:35:33 -!- mathslinux [~user@221.122.32.18] has left #lisp 02:38:57 stopbit [~stopbit@c-68-50-168-116.hsd1.dc.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:39:33 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.140.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:40:25 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 02:42:21 jordonbiondo [~user@64.85.131.86] has joined #lisp 02:43:48 -!- keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:47:41 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:50:24 -!- jordonbiondo [~user@64.85.131.86] has left #lisp 02:52:46 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 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-!- k0001 [~k0001@186.153.78.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:29:22 -!- ldionmarcil [~user@unaffiliated/maden] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:31:50 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 03:32:12 -!- duko [~duko@static-72-87-239-154.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:32:14 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:32:29 leoncamel [~leoncamel@1.202.63.179] has joined #lisp 03:35:20 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-185-82-146.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:57 keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has joined #lisp 03:55:24 gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:55:36 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@209-188-122-100.taosnet.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:56:15 Hi, when saving an image which has quicklisp (and asdf) in it, what all should be done in order to clear the output-translations? 03:56:30 so that on a target machine, there will not be any path residue from the machine where the image was built 03:56:53 and the output-translations will be initialized to the standard location for the user on the target machine? 03:57:42 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@u-0-013.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:58:45 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-014.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:59:39 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.146.194.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:01:09 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.146.194.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has joined #lisp 04:01:45 -!- spaceships [~spaceship@72.174.137.126] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:03:31 -!- boredomist is now known as bdmst 04:05:02 Eldariof28-ru [~CLD@188.168.241.129] has joined #lisp 04:05:25 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-013.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 04:07:38 Guthur` [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 04:07:54 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.164.132.85] has quit [Quit: ...] 04:08:01 -!- Guthur [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:08:15 -!- Eldariof93-ru [~CLD@pppoe-201-40-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:08:59 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:09:35 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 04:11:50 -!- k0001_ [~k0001@host243.186-125-115.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:12:17 -!- dnolen [~user@pool-71-183-189-14.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:12:39 benny [~user@maidenhead3.tunnelr.com] has joined #lisp 04:13:07 eliyak [~eliyak@c-24-13-247-120.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:13:08 -!- eliyak [~eliyak@c-24-13-247-120.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:13:08 eliyak [~eliyak@wikisource/Eliyak] has joined #lisp 04:13:25 slyrus [~chatzilla@209-188-122-100.taosnet.com] has joined #lisp 04:17:36 -!- pnq [~nick@unaffiliated/pnq] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:18:56 -!- Guthur` [~user@eth2845.sa.adsl.internode.on.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:22:25 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-163-93.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 04:24:02 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@pool-71-163-43-88.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 04:24:25 When using SLIME and SBCL - is there a way to evaluate arbitrary code within the frame of a particular level of the backtrace? 04:25:46 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:25:46 I can see the local variables and their values but I need to interrogate them. 04:26:14 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-013.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 04:27:23 Oh wait, "e - eval in frame" 04:27:31 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:27:34 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:27:42 e? 04:27:43 yeah. 04:39:29 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-195-226-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 04:40:03 clintm [~user@c-76-121-226-80.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:41:20 -!- justdit [justdit@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-iiehbqlbwnxqcgvn] has left #lisp 04:41:27 -!- keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:42:42 -!- Eldariof28-ru [~CLD@188.168.241.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:44:39 What is the/is there a right way to pass the value of a var in a quoted list? http://paste.lisp.org/display/135575 04:45:10 clintm: (list variable-one variable-two) 04:45:20 or if you actually need quotation, `(,variable-one ,variable-two) 04:45:27 weird, that's what I thought, but it didn't work. 04:45:40 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:45:54 ok, I'll keep poking at it. Good to know I'm on the right track. 04:45:59 thanks, Bike 04:49:06 p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has joined #lisp 04:52:51 rmathews [~roshan@122.165.89.11] has joined #lisp 04:55:30 dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:58:41 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 04:58:41 -!- bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:59:09 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 04:59:44 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 05:00:22 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 05:01:05 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 05:01:06 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:04:36 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:10:14 holycow [~holycow@pdpc/supporter/bronze/holycow] has joined #lisp 05:10:28 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:11:23 p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has joined #lisp 05:11:29 hey guys, can someone help me with this? http://sprunge.us/SaWd 05:11:49 If I attempt to connect and enter in something like "chicken" via telnet, it never hits any of the 3 cond's I have 05:13:12 ahungry_: have you tried flushing the output stream 05:13:55 ahungry_: also, you might be getting #\Return too, if you're testing with telnet 05:14:08 I haven't, that code is as far as I've made it and after tinkering with it and small tweaks for 3+ hours now I can't figure out whats happening 05:14:17 (and I'm fairly certain #\0 isn't going to appear ((:) 05:14:27 yea that was a weak attempt when it wasn't working to remedy it haha 05:14:42 oho, and I believe you're not passing the stream to (read-line) 05:15:03 ah sorry that was a test thing 05:15:06 I had it read-line stream 05:15:11 and I confirmed a standard read-line 05:15:17 from the actual slime repl 05:15:20 did match the word chicken 05:15:23 mhm 05:15:24 just not when its sent via telnet 05:15:40 telnet isn't a pure serial protocol, fyi 05:15:51 sooo, I think one place to start is to check what you do get when reading from the stream (: 05:16:56 it was \#return 05:16:58 solved it 05:16:59 tahnks all 05:17:18 I thought \#newline was supposed to get both \#linefeed and \#return, but maybe it just means whichever is default 05:17:21 on the os being used 05:19:12 ahungry_: not is I read this correctly (: 05:19:38 there may be external-format translations going on when reading from character streams 05:19:54 (that "is" above should be an "if") 05:20:04 ahh 05:20:11 anyway - glad that solved it (: 05:22:33 anyone had trouble with CFFI and functions with varargs? I am attempting to pass an opaque pointer to a function that takes several parameters and also happens to have variable arguments, and the value of the first parameter not getting passed correctly. 05:24:16 The value of the pointer before passing it will be something like 0x7fffec0c35a0, but the function I am calling reports receiving a value that is close but slightly off like 0x7fffec0c3510 05:24:48 -!- sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has quit [] 05:26:03 other C functions in the same library receive the pointer value correctly, the only difference I can see with this particular function is that it has varargs and the others don't--and I'm wondering if it is a calling convention problem. I'm using SBCL on 64 bit Linux. 05:26:52 -!- breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-163-93.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 05:30:20 gigamonkey [~user@50.1.48.160] has joined #lisp 05:31:28 -!- eliyak [~eliyak@wikisource/Eliyak] has quit [Quit: That's it, I quit!] 05:33:17 Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.246.160] has joined #lisp 05:36:50 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-195-226-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:41:17 -!- stopbit [~stopbit@c-68-50-168-116.hsd1.dc.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:45:01 In processing #n= and #n# SBCL crawls through conses, arrays, instances and funcallable-instances to replace #n# (actually it uses GENSYMd symbols) with the objects referred to by #n=. 05:46:53 Why aren't they crawling through hash-tables as well? Is this an oversight? 05:47:13 ubii [~ubii@unaffiliated/ubii] has joined #lisp 05:47:19 <|3b|> no literal reader syntax for hash tables? 05:47:21 where would you use #n= syntax for hashtables? 05:47:38 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.145.10.177] has quit [Quit: Bye] 05:48:30 I'd have to come up with an example but couldn't I build a hash-table within a #. reader macro? 05:49:17 I'm asking because I just finished adding compilation of literal objects and I ended up having to crawl through conses, arrays and hash-tables to compile them properly. 05:49:18 trebor_home [~email@dslb-178-004-222-145.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 05:49:41 drmeister: somehow you'd need to get the #1# in the hash table somewhere. Where would you put it in? 05:49:54 And compiling literal objects and handling #n= and #n# seemed to be very similar problems. 05:50:19 Ok, I'm coming in unprepared. Let me come up with an example. 05:50:44 drmeister: they're not quite similar, like with reading you know the referenced objects ahead of time 05:52:30 akovalen` [~user@95.72.96.91] has joined #lisp 05:52:47 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:54:23 -!- akovalenko [~user@95.73.121.213] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:55:01 -!- linse [~marioooh@70.53.149.200] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 05:56:06 irpanech6 [~user@24.68.147.45] has joined #lisp 05:56:12 Ok, heres an example and I'm trying to understand why it works. http://pastebin.com/WPTEMFpf 05:57:35 because at the time the make-hash-table form is evaluated, #1 is already known 05:57:46 If I understand the code, the read will substitute a GENSYM for #1# and once the read is finished the SBCL code will crawl through the SEXP that is returned and substitute the GENSYM for the value 1. 05:58:28 read is recursive. #.text has to read text before it can be evaluated, and during that read #1 is already established above. I think. 06:00:02 I mean, so the #1# is replaced before the m-h-t form is evaluated. 06:02:42 Bike: Ok, The evidence is that I'm wrong about this and I'm trying to figure out why the code is doing what its doing. Here are the sharp-equal and sharp-sharp reader macros from SBCL. http://pastebin.com/Y1htfVTX 06:03:29 The way I read it is when #n= is hit, a GENSYM is generated and ASSOCiated with n in *sharp-sharp-alist* 06:04:52 And when sharp-sharp is when #1# is hit the GENSYMd symbol is returned, not the object associated with #1= 06:05:54 That's for actual recursive #=. Beyond that, though, once #= reader returns, *sharp-sharp-alist* is still modified. 06:06:17 *sharp-equal-alist* then maps/substitutes the GENSYM symbol to the object after the read is complete. 06:07:08 erm, *sharp-equal-alist* is modified, I guess. 06:07:23 Oh - dynamic variable magic? Let me think on that. 06:07:32 no, no 06:08:02 Basically I haven't looked at the rest, but I imagine that the circularity table is established at the last non-recursive READ call 06:08:24 and recursive READ calls like the #.(make-hash-table ...) do circle-subst as they return 06:11:09 or at least i'm guessing that, i'd need to look closer. 06:12:46 -!- ahungry_ [~null@99-40-10-216.lightspeed.livnmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 06:13:25 I'm reading it more closely, I may be confusing by the handling of the recursive #n= with the non-recursive case? I'm not sure that makes sense. I'm thinking on this. 06:15:08 Slivka [~Slivka@81.4.242.0] has joined #lisp 06:16:22 It looks like *sharp-sharp-alist* only gets extended for recursive #n= cases. *sharp-equal-alist* gets extended with PUSH for every #n= that is hit. 06:18:12 yeah, that's what i meant. I think. 06:18:14 Ok, I'd missed that. Line 44-45 (if entry (third entry) ... will return the #n# object, not the GENSYMd tag. 06:18:58 fsvehla [~fsvehla@h081217181184.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 06:19:20 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@209-188-122-100.taosnet.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:19:33 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 06:20:20 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.172.94] has joined #lisp 06:20:23 has anyone made a de facto standard package for literal hashtab syntax? 06:20:47 If the #n# label "n" isn't in *sharp-equal-alist* then the n label is looked up w/ ASSOC in *sharp-sharp-alist* for the recursive case and the GENSYMd symbol is returned which will be substituted just before the enclosing #n= call returns. 06:21:20 right, but in this case we're not dealing with the #n= call, which returns pretty fast since it's just #1=1. 06:22:18 zolk3ri [~zolk3ri@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has joined #lisp 06:26:01 Oh, I was overthinking it. 06:26:17 In sharp-sharp it first checks in sharp-equal-alist and just returns the value (not the tag) if it's there. 06:26:22 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has joined #lisp 06:27:39 -!- joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:28:51 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@086.112-30-64.ftth.swbr.surewest.net] has joined #lisp 06:28:55 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-71-185-82-146.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:29:43 -!- Eldariof-ru [~CLD@188.168.246.160] has quit [] 06:30:11 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-108-52-166-246.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 06:31:06 -!- svs_ [~svs@104-252-AGAVEBB-NM.abq.nm.agavebb.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:31:13 Dang nab it - I got disconnected. 06:31:31 So then I came up with an even more pathological example and it fails because I think they should be walking hash-tables. Is this not valid (albeit pathological) common lisp code? http://pastebin.com/Zb0ZmYah 06:32:13 drmeister: "Oh, I was overthinking it. In sharp-sharp it first checks in sharp-equal-alist and just returns the value (not the tag) if it's there." 06:32:33 How do you think that that example could ever work? 06:32:54 The whole form has to be read before it can be evaluated, so there's certainly no value to substitute... 06:33:10 Isn't it forbidden to have cyclic source code in CL? 06:33:33 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@static-217-133-17-91.clienti.tiscali.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:33:35 The lexical variable "a" is bound to a hash-table that contains itself - that's ok isn't it? 06:33:55 Not if it's constructed like that. 06:34:21 Like, consider... #1=#.(list (print #1#) 4) 06:34:41 -!- Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:35:17 Ok, #1=#.(list (print #1#) 4) fails as well - I thought that would work. 06:35:25 What would you think it would do? 06:35:34 How is #1# supposed to exist at the time that form is read? 06:35:38 Send is back in time. 06:35:41 -!- holycow [~holycow@pdpc/supporter/bronze/holycow] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 06:35:51 teggi [~teggi@123.21.159.152] has joined #lisp 06:36:03 i was surprised to see #1=#1# Does The Right Thing in SBCL 06:36:12 It's directly dependent on its own value, is what I mean. Not delayed or anything. 06:36:13 Even ignoring that, the cycle in the source isn't guaranteed to work, afaik. 06:36:49 You mean the less crazy earlier example? 06:37:27 p_nathan1 [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has joined #lisp 06:37:30 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:37:32 *|3b|* thought circular source is OK, as long as it doesn't try to evaluate all of it 06:37:40 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.172.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:37:42 -!- p_nathan1 is now known as p_nathan 06:38:08 <|3b|> so #1=(print '#1#) is ok, #1=(print #1#) is bad 06:38:48 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:38:48 -!- trebor_home [~email@dslb-178-004-222-145.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:40:02 #1=(print '#1#) fails with "reference to undefined label #1#" - I thought that should work from looking at the sharp-sharp SBCL code - argh. 06:40:23 Sorry sharp-sharp code. 06:40:36 <|3b|> works here 06:40:49 What do you mean it fails? It works fine here. 06:41:39 Whoops, I'm in SLIME and C-c C-p only evaluates (print '#1) 06:41:43 #1=(print #1#) gets me a stack overflow, which is about expected. 06:42:19 (print #1=(print '#1#)) gives me a stack overflow as well 06:42:45 <|3b|> did you set *print-circle*? 06:42:49 -!- [SLB] is now known as [SLB]` 06:43:19 Hey, #1=(print '#1#) is a nice quine :) 06:44:35 So is the difference that #. starts a new top-level read with an empty *sharp-sharp-alist* and *sharp-equal-alist*? 06:44:54 Is that why (print #1=#.(list (print #1#) 4 ) ) doesn't work? 06:45:02 It doesn't empty *sharp-equal-alist* or else your hash table thing wouldn't work. 06:45:07 <|3b|> #. needs to be able to evaluate the form, so it has to be completely defined 06:45:38 <|3b|> and can't depend on the results of its own evaluation 06:45:52 I don't understand what #1=#.(list (print #1#) 4) is expected to mean. 06:46:01 Which one? The latest hash-table thing doesn't work. 06:46:18 http://pastebin.com/WPTEMFpf <-- this one 06:46:54 sharp-dot does a (read stream t nil t) which is recursive-p-->t 06:47:22 <|3b|> for example what should #1=#.(if #1# nil t) be? 06:47:24 Oh yeah, that #1# has to cross #. 06:49:48 Maybe I'm tired and loosing my focus. What was wrong with the second one? http://pastebin.com/Zb0ZmYah Is it that #1# isn't defined when the (setf (gethash 'c ht) #1#) is evaluated? 06:49:49 drmeister: i just went through and looked, and outside of sharpm.lisp the only reference to sharp-equal-alist is in %read-preserving-whitespace (which is called from ('s reader), which binds it to null if recursive-p is /false/. 06:49:53 <|3b|> there might still be a bug in sbcl, you just can't trigger it with #. 06:49:59 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@81.4.242.0] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:50:43 <|3b|> drmeister: #1# depends on the results of the evaluation from #., so can't be used while evaluating the #. 06:51:15 <|3b|> or rather the value to be substituted for #1# 06:51:28 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:52:32 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [] 06:52:41 I'm more interested if it's more correct to walk hash-tables when fixing up #n#'s because then I can create one walker that I'll use for #n=/#n# and compiling literals. 06:52:53 <|3b|> and you can't just substitute a gensym, evaluate the #. then replace the gensym, since the value of #1# might have been stored elsewhere, printed, or whatever during evaluation of the #. 06:53:00 It's not a lot of code though. 06:53:49 *|3b|* suspects walking the hash table might be more correct, but it would add some complications, like if multiple keys were replaced with the ame value according to the hash table test 06:53:52 drmeister: Basically when you have #.thing thing has to be /fully/ read, with no unresolved references, because it is CL code that has to be evaluated as CL code. 06:54:41 <|3b|> would require a custom reader macro to add a literal hash table syntax though, and then for someone to make a circular literal hash, so probably doesn't matter either way very often anyway 06:56:00 raila [423af66b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.58.246.107] has joined #lisp 06:56:16 I'm going to have to sleep on this one. The SBCL circle-subst code does walk through (typep XXX 'instance) and (typep XXX 'funcallable-instance) - please forgive my ignorance - what are those? 06:56:52 what do you mean what are they? what are what? 06:59:25 The function is defined (defun circle-subst (old-new-alist tree) where tree is tested with (consp tree), (arrayp tree), (typep tree 'instance) and (typep tree 'funcallable-instance). 06:59:53 Oh, you mean what are instance and funcallable-instance? 07:00:10 So tree can either be a CONS, an ARRAY or something else. I guess (typep tree 'instance) means its an instance of a class. 07:00:16 Bike: Yes. 07:00:59 Instances are about what you'd expect (instances of classes), funcallable-instances are the same but for funcallable-standard-object. Both SBCL-specific of course. 07:01:36 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-46-85.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:01:59 Ok, I was much less sure about the funcallable-standard-object. I'll have to read up on that. 07:02:04 guys, in CLtL3, vectors are going to be funcallable-standard-objects and there's nothing you can do about it 07:02:20 drmeister: it's a MOP thing 07:02:37 drmeister: they're just instances you can funcall, like generic functions 07:02:54 So these are walked because in SBCL there is a way of specifying instances and funcallable-instances so that #n= and #n# circular references have to be resolved? 07:03:43 I'm not sure if I'm using the correct terminology 07:03:47 #S and #', maybe? 07:04:30 Ok, so all I really need right now is to walk CONSes and ARRAYs. 07:04:50 Bike: what sorts of stuff do you code? any open source stuff? 07:04:55 -!- gigamonkey [~user@50.1.48.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:05:01 _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has joined #lisp 07:05:08 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:05:40 Quadrescence: honestly i'm mostly just a dabbler who read the spec too closely... I have a github at http://github.com/Bike but there's nothing terribly interesting. 07:07:33 -!- kcj [~casey@unaffiliated/kcj] has quit [Quit: kcj] 07:07:54 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 07:08:14 -!- yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:08:48 yacks [~yacks@180.151.36.169] has joined #lisp 07:09:07 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@178.77.26.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:10:21 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has joined #lisp 07:10:35 Bike: Thank you again for your help. 07:10:46 np 07:11:44 Bike: you should talk to me about your compiler-macro code 07:12:31 Quadrescence: ok? what about it 07:12:36 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:12:42 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:12:54 Quadrescence: actually your m-of-n post was one of my motivators, heh 07:13:02 :) 07:13:17 what does it do, how does it work, what is a use-case 07:14:05 are you inventing a portable DEFTRANSFORM 07:14:36 VeryBadMan [~csyrup@71-221-113-207.clsp.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:14:40 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:14:44 -!- raila [423af66b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.58.246.107] has left #lisp 07:15:08 -!- JPeterson [~JPeterson@213.103.210.215] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:15:14 that was the idea, yeah. the original motivator was tabasco-sort, but arrays turned out to be hairier than I realized. I still think the concept's pretty solid, user-writeable compile-time optimizers for certain cases 07:15:21 tcr1 [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 07:15:35 i was thinking about writing something very similar 07:16:04 it's really not much code, it just has a thin wrapper around CLTL2 in some implementations to get declaration info (like types of variables, also optimization qualities) 07:16:48 So you can say things like "given (sort x #'<) if speed > space and x is a list, fold out into this" 07:17:22 Bike: yes this is almost precisely what i have wanted 07:18:37 I've written a good amount of code where I write slow but easy/correct versions and fast but unsafe versions, and I always want to keep them both, but never want to write "foo-slow" and "foo-fast" 07:19:02 It's not enough for many kinds of optimizations (like type inference stuff) but I think it could be pretty useful for many cases. in my fanciful dreams, users can define their own declarations, and use something like THE to refer to values with declarations generally. 07:19:19 yeah, it seemed like something that would come in handy. unfortunately as you can see I don't really have use-cases myself. 07:20:42 hey guys. so is there anything like a crash course to programming in lisp, but aimed at the C programmer? I have some idea how lisp is diffrent, and why I would want to use lisp 07:20:56 minion: tell VeryBadMan about pcl 07:20:56 VeryBadMan: please look at pcl: pcl-book: "Practical Common Lisp", an introduction to Common Lisp by Peter Seibel, available at http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ and in dead-tree form from Apress (as of 11 April 2005). 07:21:32 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@178.77.12.33] has joined #lisp 07:21:32 Quadrescence: the paper "Increasing Readability and Efficiency in Common Lisp" I found seems to do similar things, motivated by some Brazilian AI project 07:21:41 minion: it is really aimed at the java programmer (i.e. some oo knowledge is assumed), but should work for c people, too 07:21:44 i don't know what you're referring to 07:21:44 or at least describe them, the project seems very dead 07:21:56 VeryBadMan: i meant you, not our bot :/ 07:22:02 Quadrescence: also https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/comp.lang.lisp/Ji8Lu7a3K7w 07:22:42 Did I mention these in the readme, I should have if not... 07:27:52 I don't think so 07:27:59 I'm reading the brasiliano paper now 07:29:10 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 07:30:50 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:32:57 ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has joined #lisp 07:33:06 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 07:35:13 Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 07:35:50 sw2wolf [~czsq888@118.112.159.193] has joined #lisp 07:36:08 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.56.202] has joined #lisp 07:36:08 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.56.202] has quit [Changing host] 07:36:08 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 07:37:00 -!- ASau [~user@46.115.113.187] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:38:06 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 07:38:24 ooh, I missed another #n=/#n# discussion 07:39:12 you guys may have indirectly answered my question about why forward references are not allowed 07:39:33 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:40:54 -!- jeppy` is now known as jeppy 07:42:07 something like (list #.(+ 5 #1#) #1=4) simply wouldn't work 07:47:27 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-223-182.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:48:18 -!- ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:52:43 kmels_ [~kmels@frbg-4d028183.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 07:54:07 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.181.16] has joined #lisp 07:56:20 -!- kmels [~kmels@frbg-5f731cd4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:56:58 morning 07:56:58 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:57:14 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 07:57:21 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:59:16 kiuma [~kiuma@static-217-133-17-91.clienti.tiscali.it] has joined #lisp 07:59:53 -!- 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get my loop fusion macro system to work, but I convinced myself to go back and finish working through "on lisp" 09:28:46 -!- Bike [~Glossina@63-229-134-7.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:28:58 cfy` [~ilisp@220.191.186.26] has joined #lisp 09:29:15 which is also fun 09:30:48 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:31:09 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 09:31:12 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.165.89.11] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:31:26 rmathews [~roshan@122.165.89.11] has joined #lisp 09:33:32 segv- [~mb@dslb-094-223-009-175.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 09:37:03 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:37:06 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 09:38:21 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 09:39:23 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has 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DamienCassou [~cassou@193.51.236.44] has joined #lisp 12:06:19 hi 12:06:30 why are '() () nil and 'nil all equivalent? 12:07:33 DamienCassou: why would they not? 12:07:57 leoc [~leoc.git@p57B9B971.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:08:10 (1) is different from '(1), so why are () and '() the same? 12:08:35 well, '(1) is also different from '(), so that argument does not work 12:08:55 Consider (+ '1 '1) 12:09:09 '() is not really equivalent to () 12:09:15 I'm talking about the quoted versus unquoted forms. I don't understand why the reader consider they are the same 12:09:42 the reader doesn't consider them the same, the evaluator does 12:10:14 stassats: ok, but the variable nil points to the symbol 'nil. And I don't understand that 12:10:27 prxq: yes 12:10:30 there's no symbol 'NIL, only NIL 12:10:40 Guest99805 [~ilisp@115.195.138.22] has joined #lisp 12:10:49 ' doesn't denote symbols, it's a way to prevent evaluation 12:11:03 DamienCassou: quote stops evaluation. But if you stop evaluation of something that evaluates to itself, then you get..? 12:11:54 -!- Guest99805 is now known as cfy` 12:12:17 most things in Lisp evaluate to themselves; the normal exceptions are symbols (variables) and lists (function applications) 12:12:34 but some variables evaluate to themselves anyway, as do some function applications 12:13:29 '"aaa" => "aaa"; '1 => 1 12:13:29 DamienCassou: have you looked at ''nil? 12:14:28 first do (setf *print-pretty* nil) 12:14:37 ''nil => '(quote nil) which is just a list with 2 elements 12:15:38 but (quote nil) evaluates to nil, and nil also evaluates to nil. That's all 12:16:31 and (quote anything) evaluates to anything 12:16:45 and nil is also an empty list 12:16:48 (eq '"a" "a") ==> nil 12:16:56 (eq "a" "a") => NIL 12:16:57 heh 12:17:03 (eq "a" "a") => NIL, too 12:17:18 DamienCassou: same but different :) 12:17:36 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 12:17:38 (let ((x "a")) (eq x (eval x))) 12:17:40 (eq '#1="a" #1#) 12:17:49 DamienCassou: that is logical, you create two strings, that happen to have the same content. 12:18:15 DamienCassou: the reader creates two different strings when reading each "a", so that they are not the very same "a". 12:18:28 DamienCassou: so, basically, don't worry about it too much; you'll internalise the rules in a while 12:18:29 like two copies of the very same magazine. 12:18:34 ok, got it, sorry, bad example :-) 12:18:58 no, that was a good example. 12:19:40 DamienCassou: EQ compares the object, not the content of the object, string= would compare the content of the object for example. 12:20:17 and (eq '1 '1) is implementation dependent. 12:20:33 or even (eq 1 1) 12:20:39 yup 12:20:40 ' ==> without executing it 12:20:53 without evaluating it 12:21:21 no 12:21:22 so quote returns the data 12:21:45 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-231-032.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:21:56 or you mean without evaluating while evaluating? 12:22:20 DamienCassou: quote is a special form that returns it argument without evaluating it. 12:22:44 evaluating ' ===> without evaluating the program but only considering to be data 12:23:03 that's correct 12:23:43 DamienCassou: and then there are self evaluating forms (anything not a symbol or a cons -- fixnums, strings, ..) 12:23:43 though things can be evaluated at read-time, '#.(+ 1 2) => 3 12:24:22 cfy`` [~ilisp@125.119.5.92] has joined #lisp 12:25:11 DamienCassou: (quote 123) --> 123, but (quote (quote 123)) == ''123 --> '123 == (quote 123) 12:25:42 and then there are keyword symbols. (eq ':a :a) ==> T 12:26:52 DamienCassou: (car ''123) --> quote 12:27:02 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:27:11 (car (read-from-string "'1")) => QUOTE 12:27:16 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 12:27:35 -!- cfy` [~ilisp@115.195.138.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:29:22 X_x28 [~X_x28@2.147.153.49] has joined #lisp 12:30:26 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.140.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:33:01 ikki [~ikki@187.208.247.35] has joined #lisp 12:33:47 -!- Indecipherable [~Indeciphe@41.31.59.51] has quit [Quit: used jmIrc] 12:34:48 -!- fsvehla [~fsvehla@h081217181184.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Quit: fsvehla] 12:41:48 ok, I think I managed to understand. Thank you all 12:45:24 -!- Guest61191 [~bubo@91.224.149.58] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:46:00 -!- ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:47:08 normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has joined #lisp 12:48:40 ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has joined #lisp 12:50:35 -!- cibs [~cibs@218.211.32.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:51:09 masondesu [~textual@adsl-98-71-132-70.gsp.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 12:51:25 _main_ [~main@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 12:54:02 -!- __main__ [~main@c-67-180-22-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:54:06 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:55:21 -!- _main_ is now known as __main__ 12:56:15 adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:58:28 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: nuclear meltdown] 13:00:03 -!- adelgado [~TomSawyer@c-66-229-185-165.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:02:26 keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has joined #lisp 13:03:50 -!- doesthiswork [~Adium@75.87.251.5] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:04:33 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.208.247.35] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:07:59 -!- nha [~prefect@rn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-212.net.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:08:16 -!- DamienCassou [~cassou@193.51.236.44] has left #lisp 13:08:36 -!- masondesu [~textual@adsl-98-71-132-70.gsp.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 13:09:45 -!- keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has quit [] 13:10:04 keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has joined #lisp 13:11:45 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-018.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has joined #lisp 13:13:26 hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 13:13:40 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:17:26 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 13:19:00 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-018.vpn.rwth-aachen.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:19:01 <_d3f> anyone knows the best way to fetch a website in CLISP? (not via system-command `curl') 13:19:22 _d3f: darkma is nice 13:19:34 should work on clisp, works in cmucl at lest.. 13:19:50 it is called 'drakma' 13:20:11 sorry, typo. 13:20:20 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:20:22 Fare [~fare@173-9-65-97-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 13:22:03 <_d3f> zorkmoid: I tried that, works with SBCL but not in CLISP. `*** - Condition of type USOCKET:TIMEOUT-ERROR.' 13:22:40 why are you using clisp? 13:23:27 -!- X_x28 [~X_x28@2.147.153.49] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:23:58 hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 13:23:58 -!- hkBst__ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:24:18 the biggest drawback fo CLISP? having to justify using it every single time . (then again, its naming draws in newcomers, and it's arguably not the best start) 13:24:56 <_d3f> stassats: Because I prefer their repl. I use SBCL now for that, I am just wondering why darkma isn't working in CLISP. 13:25:07 drakma. it is called drakma. 13:25:33 _d3f: it is probably not working because clisp is not very popular 13:26:00 _d3f: because you have an old version of drakma/usocket 13:26:13 _d3f: mentioning it on the usocket mailing list is probably your best bet 13:26:31 stassats: I've seen the same (USOCKET:TIMEOUT-ERROR) on clisp with recent quicklisp 13:26:37 _d3f: unless what stassats's said is true, and you haven't tried updating your libraries, in which case it's just a waste of time :) 13:26:47 akovalenko: well, i'm not using quicklisp, so it works for me 13:26:54 s/'s// 13:27:43 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@pool-108-52-166-246.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:27:44 Guest42587 [~Alexander@dnm.220.97.124.92.dsl.krasnet.ru] has joined #lisp 13:27:48 ! 13:27:50  ? 13:27:58 Guest42587: nobody, wrong language 13:28:04 <_d3f> usocket-0.6.0.1 & drakma-1.3.0 13:28:06   13:28:07  13:28:07   13:28:08  13:28:11    13:28:12  13:28:14  13:28:15 -!- ChanServ has set mode +o Zhivago 13:28:19 lol 13:28:22 <_d3f> Should be up to date 13:28:23 -!- Zhivago has set mode +q Guest42587!*@* 13:28:59 <_d3f> quicklisp 2013-02-17 13:29:01 and clisp? 13:29:07 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@70.114.215.220] has quit [] 13:29:10 -!- Guest42587 [~Alexander@dnm.220.97.124.92.dsl.krasnet.ru] has left #lisp 13:29:41 drmeister [~drmeister@pool-108-52-166-246.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:29:43 <_d3f> GNU CLISP 2.49 (2010-07-07) 13:29:56 i have 2.49+ 13:31:50 -!- __main__ [~main@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:32:32 _main_ [~main@c-67-180-22-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:32:50 <_d3f> stassats: self-buit? neither debian or arch have a newser version in their repos. 13:34:02 self-built 13:34:13 *madnificent* was surprised with arch having sbcl 1.1.4 13:34:27 -!- bitonic` 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[~cibs@219-87-142-18.static.tfn.net.tw] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:48:31 cibs [~cibs@218.211.32.194] has joined #lisp 13:50:35 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:51:13 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 13:52:38 what do you use for sending mail? cl-smtp seems to be broken with newest usocket version 13:52:55 i'd unbreak it 13:56:12 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:57:14 masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has joined #lisp 13:58:51 ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has joined #lisp 13:59:32 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 14:01:38 -!- cfy`` is now known as cfy 14:01:40 -!- cfy [~ilisp@125.119.5.92] has quit [Changing host] 14:01:40 cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 14:02:33 stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-030-162.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 14:04:36 thoto [~thoto@e181166136.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 14:05:42 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:07:35 -!- varjagg [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:09:11 green_ [green@nat/redhat/x-lkwqtyyduxuqyfkj] has joined #lisp 14:10:20 wondering if I should release a 2.30 now... 14:11:18 the main breakage in 2.29 is iolib release (as opposed to iolib head). 14:11:32 Jubb [~Jubb@pool-108-28-62-61.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:12:30 nha [~prefect@rn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-212.net.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 14:13:31 -!- ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:14:02 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c0d5b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:14:18 Stewie [~Stewie@2.147.153.49] has joined #lisp 14:14:47 -!- cibs [~cibs@218.211.32.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:16:10 ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has joined #lisp 14:16:12 cibs [~cibs@219-87-142-18.static.tfn.net.tw] has joined #lisp 14:17:31 -!- ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:20:12 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 14:21:24 cdidd [~cdidd@95-26-233-178.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 14:21:53 victor_lowther [~victor.lo@rrcs-108-178-99-190.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:22:38 lduros` [~user@hntvlan569.0893.wlan.wireless-resnet.upenn.edu] has joined #lisp 14:22:38 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 14:22:49 and iolib can't be released without a cffi release 14:22:56 -!- lduros` [~user@hntvlan569.0893.wlan.wireless-resnet.upenn.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:22:56 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:23:03 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:23:52 dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:23:53 debian has 1.1.4 in experimental, too. 14:23:55 when _is_ the new cffi going ot be released 14:23:57 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 14:24:28 and clisp 1:2.49-8.1 14:24:51 adelgado [~TomSawyer@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 14:25:51 rmathews [~roshan@122.174.59.104] has joined #lisp 14:27:10 -!- linse [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1177916872.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 14:27:42 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:35:21 fsvehla [~fsvehla@chello084112185050.3.11.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 14:36:14 xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has joined #lisp 14:37:55 -!- jdz [~jdz@85.254.212.34] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:38:51 jdz [~jdz@85.254.212.34] has joined #lisp 14:42:56 -!- aajmakin [aajmakin@kosh.org.aalto.fi] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:43:06 -!- Stewie [~Stewie@2.147.153.49] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:43:39 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:43:40 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:44:07 aajmakin [aajmakin@kosh.org.aalto.fi] has joined #lisp 14:46:05 -!- keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:46:07 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:47:49 masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has joined #lisp 14:48:36 DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has joined #lisp 14:49:00 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.14] has joined #lisp 14:50:43 -!- cibs [~cibs@219-87-142-18.static.tfn.net.tw] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:51:08 -!- silenius [~silenius@217.111.70.211] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:51:43 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Client Quit] 14:53:04 i wish declare was more flexible, sighs. 14:57:31 keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has joined #lisp 14:57:32 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:58:18 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 14:58:19 cibs 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[~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-215.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 15:17:57 Thra11_ [~thrall@87.115.252.230] has joined #lisp 15:18:43 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:19:17 lduros` [~user@2607:f470:24:3:16da:e9ff:fed9:34e2] has joined #lisp 15:20:30 -!- lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:20:39 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 15:20:52 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:20:53 hdx [hdx@36.76.190.125] has joined #lisp 15:21:00 kpreid [~kpreid@50-196-148-102-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:03 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@56.238.125.91.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:21:48 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:22:59 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.181.16] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:25:59 -!- eichelbart [~eichelbar@91-66-228-114-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:26:08 Thra11 [~thrall@46.208.31.189] has joined #lisp 15:28:31 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:28:38 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:29:02 hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has joined #lisp 15:29:02 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@79.170.210.172] has quit [Changing host] 15:29:02 hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has joined #lisp 15:29:05 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:29:08 -!- Thra11_ [~thrall@87.115.252.230] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:29:39 blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-4574e84c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 15:30:23 anyone got any fancy macros for making type checking a bit easier? 15:30:48 -!- keppy [~keppy@2600:100f:b014:89aa:8adb:d8fb:dc66:dcd3] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:31:21 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:33:01 hlavaty [~user@friedrichstrasse.knowledgetools.de] has joined #lisp 15:35:06 breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-163-93.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has joined #lisp 15:35:58 is check-type that hard? 15:37:54 it's tedious 15:39:07 writing good software is tedious, yes 15:39:17 -!- cfy [~ilisp@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:41:00 Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@187.240.223.195] has joined #lisp 15:41:31 -!- sirdancealot7 [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:42:00 stassats: when you have multiple types, and arguments, yes, it is hard. 15:42:00 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:42:11 i'd rather spend time on other things. 15:42:22 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 15:42:29 -!- cobra [~cobra@218.26.228.247] has quit [Quit: ] 15:42:37 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:43:52 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-030-162.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 15:44:51 eichelbart [~eichelbar@91-66-228-114-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 15:45:23 [1]JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 15:45:42 -!- JPeterson [~JPeterson@s213-103-210-215.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:11 sirdancealot [~sirdancea@98.82.broadband5.iol.cz] has joined #lisp 15:48:13 -!- nha [~prefect@rn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-212.net.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:49:13 mattrepl [~mattrepl@71.163.43.88] has joined #lisp 15:49:13 am0c_ [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 15:49:27 -!- am0c_ is now known as am0c 15:50:16 brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:51:00 -!- victor_lowther [~victor.lo@rrcs-108-178-99-190.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:52:59 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:54:59 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:55:49 -!- snowylike [~sn@91-67-171-156-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 15:56:57 loke [~elias@bb115-66-85-121.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 15:57:12 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:57:22 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 15:57:56 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-74-64-61-245.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:58:37 mal_ [mal@ks24170.kimsufi.com] has joined #lisp 16:00:22 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:04:29 you do know that you don't have to check for types? 16:04:58 unless you're using safety 0 or something 16:07:35 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:08:14 or processing is delayed in some way 16:09:49 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:10:43 CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@138.23.59.162] has joined #lisp 16:11:27 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:13:26 Thra11_ [~thrall@31.185.215.17] has joined #lisp 16:13:51 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c0d5b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:15:45 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@46.208.31.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:16:01 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 16:16:41 Thra11 [~thrall@87.113.182.195] has joined #lisp 16:16:59 nha [~prefect@cn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-71.net.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 16:17:47 -!- Thra11_ [~thrall@31.185.215.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:19:02 Thra11_ [~thrall@46.208.41.149] has joined #lisp 16:19:56 Hi all. I have a question while learning common lisp ... is it a good practice to use read-macro a lot? 16:20:03 for example 16:20:04 http://www.azraelplanet.org/wikipages/doku.php?id=temp:code_paste 16:20:47 This piece of code read all the lines out of a file an concatenate them as strings. 16:21:10 it's better to limit the usage of reader macros 16:21:14 in which I use ,@ to expand the list of string 16:21:24 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@87.113.182.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:21:26 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:22:01 Is it for readability of code? 16:22:01 (eval string) => string 16:22:33 what are you trying to do? 16:22:39 -!- hkBst_ [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:23:27 masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has joined #lisp 16:23:28 breakds: that is quite non cl code, using eval is generally shunned .. 16:23:50 I want to read all the content of file and bind the content as a string to a variable 16:24:07 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 16:24:25 (setf *variablie* (alexandria:read-file-into-string file)) 16:24:33 yeah, it seems quite non cl to me as well ... 16:24:43 silenius [~silenius@e179083050.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 16:24:47 bitonic [~user@dyn1221-239.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 16:25:19 stassats, thanks! 16:25:44 also since the file itself is just a template 16:25:54 which is static 16:26:20 can I write (setf *variable* #.(read-file-into-string file)) 16:26:30 so that the file will only be accessed once 16:26:40 even if the function is called multiple times? 16:27:00 that'll happen at read-time 16:27:11 breakds: for that you want (defvar *variable* (read-file...etc)) 16:27:12 why not just (defvar *variable* (read-file-into-string file)) then? 16:27:15 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:27:30 -!- Thra11_ [~thrall@46.208.41.149] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:28:31 oh that is because I have many of those template files 16:28:56 and I would like to load them inline 16:29:17 meaning if some piece of code wnats to get access to a template called "template1" 16:29:36 it just calls (function-name "template1") 16:29:53 and in-order to save the file-access 16:30:05 I think it might be better to write #. 16:30:12 #.(function-name "template1") 16:30:14 are you sure that that is an issue? 16:30:31 all your templates will be in memory, btw. 16:30:49 you could as well use a hash-table to store them. 16:31:14 and load them when needed. 16:31:37 breakds: what are you really trying to do? 16:31:41 alagabes_ [~me@dhy36.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 16:32:02 That's true, I think hashtable is a way better solution. 16:32:35 Oh I am writing something that generates javascript code based on backbone.js 16:32:52 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:33:08 Hello Everyone, I've refactored this a little bit: https://bitbucket.org/samebchase/millipode/src Comments are most welcome. 16:33:33 and templates are just strings ... but if I put them inline, the editor won't recognize them as html 16:33:52 since emacs will be in "lisp mode" 16:34:09 that's why I want to store them in external files and load them when needed. 16:34:26 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:34:32 I 16:34:39 I'll use a hashtable then 16:34:47 hi everybutty 16:34:54 -!- alagabes [~me@aczb72.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:35:02 thank you, all! 16:36:07 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.89.127] has joined #lisp 16:36:10 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.89.127] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:36:37 browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.89.127] has joined #lisp 16:36:52 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 16:38:45 yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:51 -!- yrk [~user@c-50-133-134-220.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:38:52 yrk [~user@pdpc/supporter/student/yrk] has joined #lisp 16:38:55 -!- loke [~elias@bb115-66-85-121.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:39:56 Wondering if anyone's seen this in SLIME: I have gotten into a state where slime-attempt-connection runs over and over, repeatedly failing to poll successfully. 16:40:36 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-223-182.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:40:39 Looks suspiciously like it doesn't have the privileges to read the /var/folders subdirectory that it has created. 16:40:59 s/read/write/ 16:41:03 /var? slime doesn't use /var 16:41:08 unless your tmp is there 16:41:37 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:41:40 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:41:43 Hm. Wonder if this is a symlink.... 16:42:46 stassats: not obviously.... 16:42:59 This looks like some Mac oddity, but I have never seen it happen before. 16:43:27 At any rate, the file it's trying to poll definitely does not exist. 16:44:05 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 16:44:30 [hard to debug, because slime is taking over the minibuffer and splatting repeated warnings there...] 16:45:06 M-x slime-abort-connection 16:45:55 and look in *inferior-lisp*, why it failed to create it 16:46:20 masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has joined #lisp 16:46:49 stassats: Doesn't successfully terminate with slime-abort-connection, for some reason. Interestingly, *inferior-lisp* seems to be correct. 16:46:57 S11001001 [~sirian@gw1.mcgraw-hill.com] has joined #lisp 16:47:26 -!- S11001001 [~sirian@gw1.mcgraw-hill.com] has quit [Changing host] 16:47:27 S11001001 [~sirian@fsf/member/S11001001] has joined #lisp 16:47:28 I think what's wrong is somehow Aquamacs has decided that temporary-file-directory should be "/var/folders/xq/ll1d80qs7hnbw3253yc1_x6m0000gn/T/" Looks like probably an aquamacs bug. 16:49:11 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 16:49:11 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:49:17 you can just change temporary-file-directory 16:49:22 drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 16:50:00 Yes, I'll do that. 16:50:13 I don't know why I cam unable to make the abort-connection work, though. 16:51:11 polling does not stop after calling that. 16:51:32 i see how that can happen 16:52:42 ASau [~user@46.115.123.20] has joined #lisp 16:52:53 I will report the aquamacs issue; thanks for the help with work-around. 16:54:23 -!- masondesu [~textual@216.59.46.254] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:54:26 -!- rvchangue [~rvchangue@unaffiliated/rvchangue] has quit [Quit: ] 16:55:06 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@wirelessNAT188.wireless.temple.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:55:20 hm. Even after setting temporary-file-directory to "/tmp" I still get message echoes about polling. The polling doesn't seem to fail, but it still eats my minibuffer. 16:55:34 and abort-slime-connection does not turn it off. 16:55:44 is the file created? 16:56:18 no 16:56:50 but *inferior-lisp* is live. 16:57:06 first, for endless polling, can you replace the second 0.3 on the line 1412 with NIL? 16:57:15 It looks like something borked in the middle of loading slime-indentation; I wonder if that's it.. 16:57:42 don't fix anything else, i need to know if that makes slime-abort-connection work 16:58:09 stassats: ok, done... 16:58:31 seems not to fix the problem. 16:58:38 ok, C-M-x it and try connecting again 16:59:02 or rather, restart emacs 16:59:24 stassats: OK, will do --- wrestling with that a little. Hard to save modified files with slime writing all over my minibuffer.... 16:59:54 it shouldn't interfere with C-x C-s 17:00:44 <_d3f> another question, when I am parsing websites I sometimes just get numbers back (no problem thx to code-char) - but when I get letters, the function breaks. Is there a way to see if I get chars or code? 17:01:17 clhs stringp 17:01:17 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_stgp.htm 17:01:23 stassats the problem is that I can't see what files it wants to save.... 17:01:45 stassats: it prompts me to save or discard changes, but all I can see is that polling message.... 17:01:46 do you have any open? 17:01:54 you can save them from C-x C-b 17:02:07 stassats: Yes, that's right --- I'm looking at the buffer menu now. 17:03:08 <_d3f> thx stassats. 17:04:23 stassats: OK, restarted and restarted slime. 17:04:52 bound temporary-file-directory to /tmp 17:06:28 yes, "error in process filter: Symbol's function definition is void: slime-update-system-indentation" 17:07:03 slime setup args include slime-fancy slime-asdf slime-tramp and slime-indentation 17:07:50 Is there any chance of a race condition where we try to configure slime-indentation before it's loaded? 17:08:01 Indecipherable [~Indeciphe@41.13.0.119] has joined #lisp 17:08:28 drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has joined #lisp 17:08:31 do you load slime-indentation at all? 17:08:46 edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 17:09:50 but are you able to abort the connection? 17:10:50 stassats: I haven't gotten myself into that wedge yet.... 17:11:07 I was trying to see if I could figure out what was wrong with the initialization first. 17:11:12 if you go back to two 0.3, can you reproduce it? 17:11:26 I got wedged when I tried to lookup a definition. 17:11:41 stassats: so restore that definition, and see if I get wedged again.... 17:11:49 yes 17:11:57 you can start a new emacs, don't restart the current one 17:12:06 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:13:07 OK, hang on for a minute... 17:13:11 p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has joined #lisp 17:15:07 I'm afraid I'm no longer getting the polling problem... 17:15:11 -!- leoc [~leoc.git@p57B9B971.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:15:21 alright 17:15:25 but I still don't see the slime file... 17:16:03 I see a polling message, but this time it tried just four times, and then gave up. 17:16:13 Interestingly, the slime-find-definition failed.... 17:17:00 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-191-78.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 17:17:32 -!- breakds [~breakds@ppp-70-226-163-93.dsl.mdsnwi.ameritech.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 17:17:35 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:17:37 well, i think it should be 0.3 nil anyhow, i'll try to think of any hypothetical situations where it can break and will change it if i don't find any 17:17:37 Hm. Seems like defstruct is just not being find-able. Classes, functions, etc., are ok. 17:17:42 -!- nha [~prefect@cn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-71.net.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:18:24 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:18:35 stassats: thanks for all of the help. I think temporary-file-directory problem messed things up so badly that I got a lot of other symptoms just as side-effects. 17:18:56 -!- fsvehla [~fsvehla@chello084112185050.3.11.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: fsvehla] 17:19:01 maybe i can reproduce it if mess it up too 17:19:42 -!- spacefrogg is now known as spacefrogg^ 17:20:00 not really 17:22:53 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:23:16 natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 17:24:01 -!- Indecipherable [~Indeciphe@41.13.0.119] has quit [Quit: used jmIrc] 17:24:37 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003512.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:26:07 -!- findiggle1 [~kirkwood@67.40.30.237] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:27:57 boogie [~boogie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:28:07 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.56.66.144] has joined #lisp 17:28:07 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@95.56.66.144] has quit [Changing host] 17:28:07 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 17:28:22 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:30:33 -!- bjorkintosh [~bjork@ip68-13-229-200.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:30:47 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 17:31:03 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:31:55 findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 17:33:36 ok, removed the repeat timeout, will look at indentation problems later 17:35:24 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Client Quit] 17:35:42 findiggle [~kirkwood@173-10-106-172-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 17:35:59 -!- p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:37:54 Bike [~Glossina@63-229-134-7.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 17:38:17 -!- CatMtKing [~CatMtKing@138.23.59.162] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:47:05 -!- wccoder [~wccoder@S01060026f3c6bad7.no.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:48:31 breakds [~breakds@wifi-116.cs.wisc.edu] has joined #lisp 17:49:01 splittist [~splittist@99-21.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 17:49:04 morning 17:49:24 night 17:53:41 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 17:56:02 cornihilio [~cornihili@ip-64-134-147-63.public.wayport.net] has joined #lisp 17:58:56 AeroNotix [~xeno@abok215.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 18:00:40 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 18:00:45 jaaso [~jaaso_@effic.me] has joined #lisp 18:00:51 -!- k0001 [~k0001@host233.190-226-195.telecom.net.ar] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:02:32 sambio [~sambio@190.57.227.109] has joined #lisp 18:05:27 fsvehla [~fsvehla@h081217181184.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 18:10:37 -!- silenius [~silenius@e179083050.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:11:55 Thra11 [~thrall@157.39.112.87.dyn.plus.net] has joined #lisp 18:18:57 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:19:23 nha [~prefect@cn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-71.net.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 18:20:22 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 18:24:24 sh42 [~sh42@chello212186122149.11.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 18:24:48 -!- sh42 [~sh42@chello212186122149.11.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Changing host] 18:24:48 sh42 [~sh42@fsf/member/zeroSignal] has joined #lisp 18:26:54 ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has joined #lisp 18:27:26 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:27:32 hello 18:27:47 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 18:29:00 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:37:27 eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-204-88-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has joined #lisp 18:38:15 gigamonkey [~user@50.1.48.160] has joined #lisp 18:39:29 antifuchs: herep 18:41:12 two- [~1@c-67-171-131-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:25 -!- rmathews [~roshan@122.174.59.104] has quit [Quit: ...] 18:51:44 hi, slime internals please 18:51:54 (swank::inspect-object xxxx) 18:52:09 seems to be the function that returns structured object information as lists 18:52:22 so what something like this means? (:VALUE "CALLING-COMPONENT" 2) 18:52:27 this number 2 for example 18:55:00 an index 18:55:05 -!- VeryBadMan [~csyrup@71-221-113-207.clsp.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:55:22 -!- [SLB] is now known as [SLB]` 18:55:33 stassats: and actions? do these indices refer to closures somewhere? 18:55:44 (:ACTION "[ ]" 0) 18:56:09 what are you trying to do? 18:56:17 action is for buttons and things 18:56:23 add debug mode to web app 18:56:31 -!- seangrove [~user@c-69-181-197-122.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:57:02 and? 18:57:21 I want web links to work roughly like emacs inspector 18:58:56 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:59:07 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn1221-239.wlan.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:59:47 sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:59:58 stassats: first problem I see is that :VALUE has string representation, not actual object 19:00:41 so I cannot convert them to web links calling swank::inspect-object on them 19:01:06 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:01:20 sabalaba [~Adium@c-76-21-4-232.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:01:27 -!- sh42 is now known as zeroSignal 19:02:22 m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.184] has joined #lisp 19:02:51 VeryBadMan [~csyrup@174-24-93-83.clsp.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:04:38 huangjs [~huangjs@114.84.156.28] has joined #lisp 19:05:58 how is (loop :for value1 =(form) and value2 = (another form) ...) evaluated? does it work like (let*..) so i can have something like this (loop :for var1 = (form1...) and var2 = (form2 var1) ...) 19:06:02 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Quit: Segmentation Fault] 19:06:21 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 19:06:41 -!- xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has quit [Quit: xaxisx] 19:06:44 i think it's like let*, yeah 19:08:33 -!- green_ [green@nat/redhat/x-lkwqtyyduxuqyfkj] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:08:37 -!- browndawg [~browndawg@117.201.89.127] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:08:55 that's what i thought and i wrote some code with such a behavior but after updating Lispwork to 6.1, the code seems broken.... steping through the code, the call to (form2 var1) is happening before the assigment to var1 19:09:16 i do not have sbcl at the moment to compare the code but will do later 19:09:25 -!- gigamonkey [~user@50.1.48.160] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:10:16 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has joined #lisp 19:10:32 nicdev: you want for/for, not for/and 19:11:02 nicdev: the for/and initializes in parallel. 19:15:05 snits [~snits@inet-hqmc01-o.oracle.com] has joined #lisp 19:15:18 sellout-: thanx, for some reason i think LispWorks 6.0 did not differentiate between the two...might be wrong tho and don't have the old copy to verify this 19:17:30 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-204-88-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [] 19:18:30 fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has joined #lisp 19:20:26 nicdev: I don't use LW, but maybe it was a bug they fixed *shrug* 19:20:36 i think so! 19:21:56 anyone familiar with lispworks's defsystem? 19:22:22 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 19:22:27 I want to have answers before I start to diss it as having the same bug as mk-defsystem, ASDF1, ASDF2 19:22:49 (apparently, allegro's defsystem doesn't have the bug) 19:24:56 -!- huangjs [~huangjs@114.84.156.28] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:25:02 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 19:25:12 how can I specialise for all CLOS objects in method parameter pls? 19:25:48 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has joined #lisp 19:25:51 puchacz: If you omit the specializer, it defaults to T, which means "all classes" 19:26:00 standard-object? 19:26:35 X_X85 [~X_X85@2.147.153.49] has joined #lisp 19:26:39 sellout-: but it will include stuff like numbers, strings or conses 19:26:59 -!- X_X85 [~X_X85@2.147.153.49] has left #lisp 19:27:00 Bike, yes, it works. thanks 19:28:15 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 19:28:17 X_X85 [~X_X85@2.147.153.49] has joined #lisp 19:28:17 huangjs [~huangjs@114.84.156.28] has joined #lisp 19:28:39 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 19:28:47 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:31:54 does lisp have some sort of identity function? let's say that I send in "hello" to a function and want it to return the string "hello", how do i do that? 19:32:05 davorb: IDENTITY 19:32:13 lol. i'm a retard. 19:32:21 was looking for "id", like in haskell :P 19:32:28 thanks sellout- 19:32:28 cabaire [~nobody@p5DCD1FAA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:32:47 davorb: It's cool  I always end up typing "identity" in Haskell ;) 19:34:33 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:34:55 davorb: just remember lisp uses easy-to-read unabreviated names, like car, cdr, and terpri 19:37:16 lol 19:37:38 rplacd is my fav abbr., I think. 19:37:43 You mean FIRST, REST, and (WRITE-LINE "")? 19:39:41 huangjs_ [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has joined #lisp 19:39:55 -!- huangjs [~huangjs@114.84.156.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:40:41 names? you mean "CAR" "CDR" an "TERPRI" if we are talking about names! 19:41:07 *drewc* happens to be on #emacs where symbol-name is being discussed :P 19:41:39 (or (not x) (null x) (endp x)) 19:41:46 -!- huangjs_ [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has quit [Client Quit] 19:41:52 -!- reb` [user@nat/google/x-ktnveayemzarviun] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:41:53 doesthiswork [~Adium@75.87.251.5] has joined #lisp 19:42:05 reb` [user@nat/google/x-qcboltpkqfuwvjov] has joined #lisp 19:42:10 huangjs [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has joined #lisp 19:42:20 jasom: (or x ...) 19:42:29 endp signals an error on non-lists! 19:43:11 (or (and (typep x 'list) ...) ...) 19:43:32 (typep x 'null) 19:43:35 stassats: ah, I forgot that; I never use it so... 19:44:47 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:45:13 -!- spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:45:30 -!- Posterdati [~antani@host160-215-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.1.3 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 19:46:57 -!- ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 19:48:05 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-151-215.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:49:31 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:09 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@71.163.43.88] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 19:52:34 -!- huangjs [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:52:47 huangjs [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has joined #lisp 19:53:30 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:54:12 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 19:59:24 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 20:05:26 ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has joined #lisp 20:05:47 -!- huangjs [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:06:12 wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-21.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:06:12 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 20:06:24 huangjs [~huangjs@199.180.254.36] has joined #lisp 20:06:39 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:08:22 -!- [SLB] [~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua] has quit [Quit: Close the world, Open the nExt] 20:08:46 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:08:58 ebobby [~fms@199.21.86.106] has joined #lisp 20:09:56 gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has joined #lisp 20:09:57 [SLB] [~slabua@unaffiliated/slabua] has joined #lisp 20:13:36 -!- gendl [~gendl@c-98-250-10-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has left #lisp 20:14:20 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-149-172-63-75.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: lifeform experiment terminated] 20:20:48 ravster [~ravi@66.207.222.14] has joined #lisp 20:20:54 hello all 20:21:06 -!- brandonz [~brandon@c-71-202-142-243.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bbl] 20:21:21 silenius [~silenius@p54BF9AB8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:21:30 does this server support ssl 20:21:37 segv: still there? 20:21:43 gna. sry. e_chan 20:22:59 jtza8 [~jtza8@105-236-78-116.access.mtnbusiness.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:23:37 spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 20:24:58 AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abod230.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #lisp 20:25:42 -!- pavelpenev [~quassel@85-130-11-8.2073813645.shumen.cablebg.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:27:40 -!- AeroNotix [~xeno@abok215.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:28:21 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@50.1.48.160] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:31:37 -!- Juanito-Jons [~jreynoso@187.240.223.195] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:32:31 foeniks [~fevon@p5091F8A7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:34:39 joneshf-laptop [~joneshf@mail.concordusapps.com] has joined #lisp 20:34:49 -!- silenius [~silenius@p54BF9AB8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:35:31 -!- breakds [~breakds@wifi-116.cs.wisc.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:35:34 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@78-1-151-163.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Quit: bye] 20:39:27 -!- qptain_Nemo [~qN@89.207.216.208] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:40:47 Posterdati [~antani@host160-215-dynamic.11-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 20:44:18 archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has joined #lisp 20:46:00 Indecipherable [~Indeciphe@41.13.24.68] has joined #lisp 20:46:43 mattrepl [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has joined #lisp 20:46:56 -!- Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:55:27 -!- archonix [~unknown@78.90.30.16] has quit [Quit: Read error: Connection reset by beer] 20:56:13 ok, so should I use with-standard-io-syntax or not? 20:56:34 what for? 20:56:40 http://lists.common-lisp.net/pipermail/asdf-devel/2013-February/002953.html 20:56:57 -!- foeniks [~fevon@p5091F8A7.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 20:57:25 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 20:58:20 why do you need with-standard-io-syntax there at all? 20:59:17 so that the meaning of an .asd file depends as little as possible on io syntax variables set by other systems loaded in an uncontrollable order. 21:00:08 what about the .lisp files? 21:00:08 .asd files would be written in a data language, not full common-lisp. 21:00:30 the .asd file would specify the environment they use. 21:00:55 the fact that .asd files are not broken wouldn't really matter if .lisp are hosed 21:01:32 -!- hdx [hdx@36.76.190.125] has quit [] 21:01:58 sometimes "interesting" things happen when I use named-readtables, btw. 21:02:38 especially reloading old systems with a readtable the system of which depends on them, dumping .fasl's that have bootstrap issues. 21:03:10 if you're not going to use full cl, why not write a custom reader then? 21:03:19 backward compatibility, for now. 21:04:01 -!- m7w [~chatzilla@178.172.204.184] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:04:15 which is why I realize that what's currently checked in needs to be modified -- it's either not backward compatible enough or too much, but unsatisfying both ways. 21:04:43 migrating from here to there will take years - if it's done. 21:04:55 -!- cabaire [~nobody@p5DCD1FAA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:04:58 a custom reader - wouldn't that be a tiny little bit excessive? 21:05:04 well, i say, as always, less magic, let it be simple and let it break if people abuse it 21:05:10 that's an old reported bug, btw https://bugs.launchpad.net/asdf/+bug/541562 21:05:24 *prxq* agrees with stassats 21:06:12 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:07:06 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 21:07:27 OK, but does that mean "bind all the variables you can, except *readtable* and *print-pprint-dispatch*" or "bind none at all" ? 21:07:45 or "always bind with copy-pprint-dispatch and copy-readtable" ? 21:08:00 Vutral [ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined #lisp 21:08:56 sdemarre [~serge@109.134.172.94] has joined #lisp 21:09:54 if there were an option to error out on readtable modification, i'd choose it 21:11:02 unhappily, that's not an option. 21:11:08 portably least of all. 21:11:28 and yes, copy-pprint-dispatch is relatively expensive, at least on sbcl 21:11:43 -!- Indecipherable [~Indeciphe@41.13.24.68] has quit [Quit: used jmIrc] 21:11:44 so I'm reluctant to use it around each evaluation 21:12:28 (yes, I'd vote yes on making read-only objects a part of the standard) 21:12:48 (with error checking unless safety 0) 21:13:48 antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has joined #lisp 21:14:02 and at least on SBCL, so is copy-readtable relatively expensive 21:15:21 -!- zeroSignal [~sh42@fsf/member/zeroSignal] has quit [Quit: sysctl sleepMode=1] 21:15:29 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 21:15:50 I'm committing "rebind all variables except those two tables" for now, as a step in the "right direction". 21:16:19 I'm open to removing the rebinding altogether, if many people voice that opinion. 21:18:37 mattrepl_ [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has joined #lisp 21:19:30 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:19:30 -!- mattrepl_ is now known as mattrepl 21:20:25 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-175-21.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: none] 21:20:36 xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has joined #lisp 21:21:07 Fare: in my 64-bit Darwin CCL, (copy-readtable) conses 1648 bytes, and (copy-pprint-dispatch) conses 2192 bytes 21:21:36 antgreen [~green@209.117.47.248] has joined #lisp 21:21:57 that's a good portable benchmark. Using loop repeat 1000 to overcome the granularity, I find that on SBCL, the numbers are more like 5900 and 10300. 21:22:13 keppy [~Luca@75-151-97-182-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 21:23:15 xaxisx_ [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has joined #lisp 21:24:10 s0ber_ [~s0ber@114-36-239-125.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 21:25:08 xaxisx__ [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has joined #lisp 21:25:35 -!- xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:25:35 -!- xaxisx__ is now known as xaxisx 21:26:24 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@114-36-231-175.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:26:32 -!- xaxisx_ [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:26:34 -!- s0ber_ is now known as s0ber 21:26:59 -!- Slivka [~Slivka@81.4.242.0] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:30:03 -!- b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@178.77.12.33] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:30:06 bjorkintosh [~bjork@ip68-13-229-200.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:30:48 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.146.106.27] has joined #lisp 21:33:38 -!- xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.137.208.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:36:57 -!- sepisultrum is now known as sepi 21:37:05 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@213.129.230.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:37:24 normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 21:37:40 entrix [~entrix@93-80-30-80.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 21:37:40 -!- entrix [~entrix@93-80-30-80.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Client Quit] 21:41:00 b1rkh0ff [~b1rkh0ff@178.77.12.33] has joined #lisp 21:41:21 -!- lduros` [~user@2607:f470:24:3:16da:e9ff:fed9:34e2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:42:50 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has quit [Quit: mattrepl] 21:43:57 ldionmarcil [~user@unaffiliated/maden] has joined #lisp 21:45:49 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:48:24 p_nathan [~Adium@98.145.116.195] has joined #lisp 21:48:43 impomatic [~digital_w@87.113.152.173] has joined #lisp 21:51:07 -!- antgreen [~green@209.117.47.248] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:56:08 -!- Harag [~Thunderbi@105.225.39.241] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:56:31 bananagram [~bot@c-98-198-236-112.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:58:38 qu1j0t3 [~qu1j0t3@kvm5.telegraphics.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:59:31 -!- _d3f [~freedo@46.183.216.234] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59:38 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:00:36 xaxisx [~xaxisx@24.246.29.17] has joined #lisp 22:02:15 -!- sdemarre [~serge@109.134.172.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:06:23 -!- easye [~user@213.33.70.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:06:47 -!- X_X85 [~X_X85@2.147.153.49] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:07:15 puchacz_ [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 22:07:34 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:07:34 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:08:28 Is anyone familiar with the WITH-ARRAY-DATA macro in SBCL? In the general, multidimensional array case, can I replace it with a loop from 0 to below ARRAY-TOTAL-SIZE and index each element with ROW-MAJOR-AREF? 22:09:08 -!- ahungry [~null@66.184.106.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:09:30 -!- AeroNoti1 [~xeno@abod230.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Uploading hax.....] 22:11:42 -!- ehu [~ehu@93.82.250.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:14:14 -!- clintm [~user@c-76-121-226-80.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:15:03 -!- zolk3ri [~zolk3ri@unaffiliated/zolk3ri] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:18:48 -!- antonv [5d7d2a66@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.42.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:20:35 tcr1 [~tcr@84-72-21-32.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:21:32 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has joined #lisp 22:24:17 -!- VeryBadMan [~csyrup@174-24-93-83.clsp.qwest.net] has quit [] 22:25:11 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.146.106.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:25:28 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22:42:02 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:44:53 X_X852 [~X_X852@2.147.153.49] has joined #lisp 22:45:41 -!- X_X852 [~X_X852@2.147.153.49] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 22:45:42 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.187] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:48:21 victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has joined #lisp 22:50:58 lduros [~user@fsf/member/lduros] has joined #lisp 22:51:40 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c0d5b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:51:40 pyx [~pyx@d24-141-100-35.home.cgocable.net] has joined #lisp 22:52:17 -!- alagabes_ is now known as alagabes 22:56:03 -!- drmeister [~drmeister@farnsworth.chem.temple.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:56:04 releasing 2.29.9 as 2.30 22:57:42 -!- Thra11 [~thrall@157.39.112.87.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:58:59 -!- fsvehla [~fsvehla@h081217181184.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Quit: fsvehla] 23:01:37 -!- qu1j0t3 [~qu1j0t3@kvm5.telegraphics.com.au] has left #lisp 23:01:45 netgod [goldenligh@gateway/shell/devio.us/x-prcvwhzektvdrlcg] has joined #lisp 23:02:23 -!- netgod is now known as zophy 23:03:56 sohakes [~sohakes@186.207.75.185] has joined #lisp 23:05:46 -!- sellout- [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:06:06 -!- nha [~prefect@cn-nat2-uw-129-97-124-71.net.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:07:03 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-11.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:07:35 pierre1_ [~pierre1@186.205.209.165] has joined #lisp 23:07:45 -!- cornihilio [~cornihili@ip-64-134-147-63.public.wayport.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:09:01 -!- zophy [goldenligh@gateway/shell/devio.us/x-prcvwhzektvdrlcg] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:10:30 mattrepl [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has joined #lisp 23:10:53 Thra11 [~thrall@31.185.136.63] has joined #lisp 23:12:46 -!- Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@71-84-34-33.dhcp.mtpk.ca.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:13:34 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003512.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 23:14:04 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:16:21 ikki [~ikki@187.208.247.35] has joined #lisp 23:17:57 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@101.171.58.194] has joined #lisp 23:18:23 -!- vert2 [vert2@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-cixxfagmeukcgupe] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:18:29 vert2 [vert2@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-dfvozbffuykjsdfg] has joined #lisp 23:18:57 -!- DrCode [~DrCode@gateway/tor-sasl/drcode] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:23:16 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 23:24:30 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-191-78.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:26:25 Dalek_Baldwin [~Adium@108-225-26-178.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:28:50 bitonic [~user@b0f86210.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 23:30:21 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@101.171.58.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:31:04 sw2wolf [~czsq888@171.212.202.33] has joined #lisp 23:31:15 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:33:10 -!- natechan [~natechan@50-192-61-46-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 23:37:26 Slivka [~Slivka@81.4.242.0] has joined #lisp 23:37:51 -!- victor_lowther [~victorlow@143.166.116.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving IRC - dircproxy 1.2.0] 23:38:18 -!- Onii-san [~Casstango@2604:2880::67c0:651b] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:38:58 Onii-san [~Casstango@2604:2880::67c0:651b] has joined #lisp 23:39:11 -!- agumonkey [~agu@58.217.72.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:40:34 -!- mattrepl [~mattrepl@SSID-Mason.wireless.gmu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:41:50 Does ~^ not work with ~:{ ? 23:42:30 slyrus [~chatzilla@209-188-122-100.taosnet.com] has joined #lisp 23:44:06 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 23:44:38 I guess I need to use ~:^ 23:45:22 -!- S11001001 [~sirian@fsf/member/S11001001] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 23:48:01 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.150.134.169] has joined #lisp 23:59:33 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:59:37 -!- normanrichards [~normanric@rrcs-108-178-120-144.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit []