00:00:10 -!- catmtking [~catmtking@dhcp-138-23-59-162.dyn.ucr.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:02:58 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:05:11 kanru` [~kanru@1-171-64-70.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 00:05:54 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:07:50 -!- mhr__ [60fd75c2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.253.117.194] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:07:59 lars-_: that doesn't really match up with history. 00:08:14 catmtking [~catmtking@wireless-fac-staff-wpa-138-23-66-200.bulk.ucr.edu] has joined #lisp 00:08:35 -!- catmtking [~catmtking@wireless-fac-staff-wpa-138-23-66-200.bulk.ucr.edu] has quit [Client Quit] 00:12:04 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:15:14 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:15:25 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.147.41.32] has joined #lisp 00:16:13 Snaffu [~Snaffu@oh-69-34-16-39.sta.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 00:17:59 -!- booguie [~booguie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:18:19 -!- huangjs [~huangjs@69.84.244.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:21:22 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:21:26 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:21:42 -!- antonv [5d7d31f9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:23:00 PCChris [~PCChris@dhcp-199-74-100-143.res-hall.northwestern.edu] has joined #lisp 00:24:17 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:28:39 -!- lars-_ [~lars@95.168.125.233] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 00:30:24 ThomasH: there is an Issue 00:30:56 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:31:20 *Xach* scratches head 00:31:37 cl-base32-tests doesn't work with the latest update to lisp-unit but i'm not sure why not. 00:32:18 -!- cornihil` [~user@nfmv001164002.uqw.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:32:45 "The variable PACKAGE is unbound" 00:32:50 cornihilio [~user@nfmv001164002.uqw.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 00:33:01 https://github.com/hargettp/cl-base32/blob/master/tests.lisp is the code 00:34:02 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:38:51 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 00:40:51 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:43:42 Xach: smells like a macro became function 00:44:09 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:44:10 or isn't exported anymore 00:44:37 did you clear the fasl cache? 00:46:46 I think so. 00:47:58 aha 00:50:08 Natch [~Natch@c-1dcce155.25-4-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 00:50:24 it looks like bad macro 00:50:54 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:51:00 -!- ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@216.113.168.141] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:54:27 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 00:55:55 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 00:57:44 -!- gigamonkey [~gigamonke@adsl-99-169-81-5.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: gigamonkey] 00:59:55 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:00:27 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:02:40 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.147.41.32] has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:03:34 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:06:44 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:07:28 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 01:09:25 brandonz [~brandon@24.38.179.215] has joined #lisp 01:09:37 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:09:55 billitch [~billitch@men75-12-88-183-197-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 01:12:47 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:13:09 AlbireoX [~AlbireoX@76.78.168.65] has joined #lisp 01:14:08 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-149-246.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:14:30 -!- homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-149-246.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:16:01 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:18:24 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:18:50 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 01:19:00 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:19:11 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 01:21:55 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:27:58 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:28:26 Xach: Back. I'll look at it. 01:29:09 *Fare* considers sending mail to the maintainers of each and every datastructure library, and offering to merge into lil. 01:30:20 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-vuxhxbanscdwcypw] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:31:12 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:31:44 ynniv [~ynniv@z69-94-206-168.ips.direcpath.com] has joined #lisp 01:32:13 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:32:24 -!- marcux [~marco@177.32.185.235] has quit [Quit: marcux] 01:32:36 -!- Sorella [~quildreen@oftn/member/Sorella] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:33:06 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:33:43 -!- user123abc [~sally@c-67-171-79-251.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:34:56 Sorella [~quildreen@oftn/member/Sorella] has joined #lisp 01:35:28 -!- Snaffu [~Snaffu@oh-69-34-16-39.sta.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 01:37:25 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:37:55 ThomasH: run-all-tests looks glitchy to me. shouldn't it use ,package? 01:38:22 Xach: Yes, caught that, I'm checking for other things before pushing another glitchy commit. 01:38:24 Well, I'll leave you to it. 01:38:40 I can run another test when you're ready and report on the results tomorrow. 01:39:53 Xach: Ok. Sorry to have created this headache. I made 2 bad assumptions. (1) Few people use lisp-unit and (2) Everyone uses run-tests, run-all-tests, etc. from the REPL and will easily adapt to the new interface. 01:40:06 pirateking-_- [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has joined #lisp 01:40:27 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:41:21 No problem! I like to think of the fun things would have been pre-quicklisp, where you'd find out about problems months later. 01:42:20 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 01:42:56 Xach: Pre-quicklisp, these issues would have dribbled in one at a time as people randomly updated their version of lisp-unit. I could have easily told them, "Just use the new interface, you're the only one doing it that way." Now you've ruined it! 01:44:55 ha 01:45:39 Found a slightly unrelated issue. Quick poll, if you (remove-all-tests) and then (run-all-tests :package), should you get an error or a warning signalling that there are no tests defined? 01:46:27 -!- urandom__ [~user@p54B0E772.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 01:47:04 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:49:40 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 01:51:04 -!- Sorella [~quildreen@oftn/member/Sorella] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:52:24 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 01:53:09 foreignFunction [~niksaak@94.27.88.70] has joined #lisp 01:53:58 Error it is 01:55:27 -!- Forty-3 [~seana11@pool-71-191-38-245.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:55:59 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:58:37 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:00:19 ThomasH: probably warning, unless you want people defining bogus tests. 02:01:17 -!- ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has left #lisp 02:01:31 ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has joined #lisp 02:01:38 Wrong window. 02:01:48 -!- SHUPFS [~hercules@S0106001111de1fc8.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:01:57 pkhuong: I just pushed the version with error. I'll make a note of that for version 0.9.0. 02:03:25 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 02:05:32 SHUPFS [~hercules@S0106001111de1fc8.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 02:05:51 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:09:00 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:15:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:15:36 Xach: If you're still working, give it another shot. At the very least, you should be able to get Quicklisp out the door, now. 02:16:38 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:16:45 DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.147.41.32] has joined #lisp 02:18:41 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:23:33 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-57-229.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:23:59 setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.168] has joined #lisp 02:24:10 -!- DataLinkDroid [~DataLinkD@1.147.41.32] has quit [Quit: Bye] 02:25:29 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:26:04 -!- pirateking-_- [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has quit [Quit: pirateking-_-] 02:27:42 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:27:50 gko [~user@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 02:31:33 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:31:46 better'] 02:32:11 -!- brandonz [~brandon@24.38.179.215] has quit [Quit: gotta run, bye all.] 02:33:22 -!- billitch [~billitch@men75-12-88-183-197-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:33:50 Good deal. 02:34:39 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:37:52 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 02:40:10 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:40:48 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 02:41:09 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:42:03 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 02:42:09 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:42:42 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@user-0c999kc.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 02:44:30 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit 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[~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:28:51 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 05:32:49 lolprog [~let@94-225-44-126.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 05:33:27 -!- Jubb [~ghost@pool-108-28-0-134.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:35:39 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:36:13 Is there some nicer way to get innerHTML in parenscript than writing "inner-h-t-m-l"? 05:37:22 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 05:37:30 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 05:37:49 if you create a directory from a namestring that ends with a slash... such as (pathname "/dir/subdir/")... how portably can you rely on this pathname being in 'directory form'? on my happy-arch-linux-sbcl-lisp-box, it works nicely. 05:39:23 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-164-110.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 05:40:09 -!- phax 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[Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:44:30 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:44:49 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 09:48:38 -!- kanru [~kanru@kanru-1-pt.tunnel.tserv15.lax1.ipv6.he.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 09:49:15 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 09:50:08 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn902-9.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:50:21 mstevens [~mstevens@2001:ba8:1f1:f1ef::3] has joined #lisp 09:50:39 bitonic [~user@dyn902-9.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 09:50:53 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:50:56 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@2001:ba8:1f1:f1ef::3] has quit [Changing host] 09:50:56 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 09:52:08 kanru [~kanru@kanru-1-pt.tunnel.tserv15.lax1.ipv6.he.net] has joined #lisp 09:52:13 mathrick_ [~mathrick@94.144.63.82] has joined #lisp 09:53:34 so i'm trying to get rid of some packages, but i'm getting conflicts with generic functions/accessors of the same name, http://paste.lisp.org/display/132487 09:53:45 maybe someone has a good idea how to handle this? 09:53:55 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 09:56:24 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.134.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:58:04 milanj [~milanj_@79.101.230.161] has joined #lisp 10:00:14 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:01:16 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:01:40 Odin- [~sbkhh@erudite.anarchism.is] has joined #lisp 10:01:50 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:03:07 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 10:05:33 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn902-9.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:07:39 ferada: i'd handle it by not getting rid of packages in the first place :D 10:09:38 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:10:16 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:11:51 -!- chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:12:04 ferada: i.e. you have a problem that you have because you are trying to get rid of the solution. 10:12:13 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 10:13:00 qptain_Nemo [~qN@81-235-52-30-no79.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 10:13:46 add^_ [~add^_@m212-152-1-150.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 10:15:30 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 10:15:59 dmiles [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:16:19 bitonic [~user@dyn903-187.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 10:18:22 -!- lggr 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seconds] 10:48:27 -!- dmiles [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:49:24 sry, was eating 10:49:31 -!- zodiac1111 [~zodiac111@124.90.137.180] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:49:54 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-164-110.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:49:55 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@c-24-21-251-38.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 10:50:03 H4ns: so, you'd opt for the (other) hard solution, moving definitions into the "correct" packages, exporting symbols etc. 10:50:08 *sigh* though so 10:50:10 *t 10:50:45 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 10:50:58 ferada: that is what i'd suggest. 10:52:46 well, i certainly agree with a proper cleanup; so i'll that goes i guess :) 10:52:52 thx 10:54:03 -!- bitonic [~user@dyn902-9.eduroam.ic.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:55:42 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 10:56:42 -!- lggr 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That something that might be accepted back into the official version? 14:45:26 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- stat_vi [~stat@dslb-094-218-027-003.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- wccoder [~wccoder@S01060026f3c6bad7.no.shawcable.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-qaasfkmcmozybbsl] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- prip [~foo@host59-127-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- SHODAN [~shozan@c-f7b2e253.011-86-73746f30.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- jakk [jakk@ddosking.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@musicbrainz/user/ianmcorvidae] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- howeyc [~howeyc@199.229.255.169] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- BeLucid [~belucid@cpe-066-057-034-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- cods [~cods@tuxee.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- theconartist [~tca@thewired.me] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- literal [hinrik@w.nix.is] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- kyl [~kyle_dev@deathstar.tyrfingr.is] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- ``Erik [~erik@pool-108-3-186-191.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- __main__ [~main@c-67-180-22-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- samebchase [~samuel@codesurfers.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- Adeon [juolam1@kosh.org.aalto.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- phadthai [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- ineiros_ [~itniemin@li271-145.members.linode.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:26 -!- pareidol1a [~michaelk@voncosel.xs4all.nl] has quit [*.net *.split] 14:45:49 -!- RJ3000_ [~uid1@109.231.228.146] has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 14:45:49 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:45:55 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:46:17 _main_ [~main@c-67-180-22-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:46:27 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 14:46:27 RJ3000_ [~uid1@109.231.228.146] has joined #lisp 14:46:43 -!- cods_ is now known as cods 14:48:10 -!- aoh_ is now known as aoh 14:48:27 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 14:49:55 -!- _main_ is now known as __main__ 14:50:59 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 14:52:12 varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 14:52:29 prip [~foo@host59-127-dynamic.55-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 14:53:00 -!- yakov [~yakov@ip-83-149-3-4.nwgsm.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:53:31 slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:53:39 Khisanth [~Khisanth@50.14.244.111] has joined #lisp 14:53:56 _d3f [~d3f@46.183.216.234] has joined #lisp 14:54:33 -!- Adeon_ is now known as Adeon 14:54:37 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:55:00 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-bqxddayhqwjimjxz] has joined #lisp 14:56:11 yakov [~yakov@ip-83-149-3-4.nwgsm.ru] has joined #lisp 14:56:17 -!- yakov [~yakov@ip-83-149-3-4.nwgsm.ru] has quit [Client Quit] 14:57:09 zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has joined #lisp 14:57:21 jbaker19 [~joshua@ip-64-134-229-56.public.wayport.net] has joined #lisp 14:58:06 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 14:59:10 huangjs [~huangjs@69.84.244.131] has joined #lisp 14:59:39 H4ns: I think this might be useful in postmodern. https://gist.github.com/3866151 14:59:42 -!- theconar1ist is now known as _tca 14:59:45 sbenitezb [~sbenitezb@186.136.23.25] has joined #lisp 15:01:01 -!- spacefrogg is now known as spacefrogg^ 15:02:54 -!- slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:03:04 arnsholt: using screen or tmux was done in earlier versions; please look at the changelog. 15:03:12 using swank is much better - inspect, debugging, etc. 15:03:33 using emacs is even better! 15:04:15 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:05:51 -!- steffi_s [~marioooh@bas5-montreal28-1178025755.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Quit: zzzz] 15:07:44 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:09:03 Vim is nice too. 15:09:05 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 15:10:46 chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 15:11:59 flip214: I mean instead of starting the Swank server in "xterm -iconic" 15:12:32 -!- kyl_ is now known as kyl 15:12:41 Although now that I look at the very latest version on bitbucket, that seems to have been implemented since last I looked 15:12:47 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-57-229.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 15:12:48 -!- minion [~minion@tiger.common-lisp.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:13:03 -!- specbot [~specbot@tiger.common-lisp.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:13:09 Never mind me, then 15:13:50 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:16:38 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@94.137.36.107] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 15:17:19 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:19:19 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:21:07 huangjs: possible, but please realize that i'm not the maintainer 15:21:50 specbot [~specbot@tiger.common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 15:21:50 minion [~minion@tiger.common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 15:22:01 -!- jbaker19 [~joshua@ip-64-134-229-56.public.wayport.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:22:22 -!- hkBst [~marijn@gentoo/developer/hkbst] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 15:22:31 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-2-129-105.as43234.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:23:00 MoALTz [~no@host-92-2-118-50.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 15:23:02 you're not? :) 15:23:31 Marijn Haverbeke is 15:23:47 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:23:57 huangjs: please send a pull request to him, but don't forget to add some documentation 15:24:04 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.64.220.85] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:25:23 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has joined #lisp 15:26:34 hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@94.137.36.107] has joined #lisp 15:26:59 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:27:27 -!- zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:30:26 H4ns: i see... i thought you're the maintainer :) i'm not sure similar functions are already in the source, so i want your opinion first 15:30:41 paul0 [~user@189.115.62.98] has joined #lisp 15:30:43 -!- treyka [~treyka@77.109.79.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:30:48 huangjs: i'm not aware, but i'm just a user :) 15:30:55 Is there's an alternative to clisp's "system::input-character-char" in sbcl? I need to get exactly one char as an input. How to do this? 15:31:11 arnsholt: just redefine a variable for that. eg. I have let g:slimv_swank_cmd = '!nohup setsid /usr/bin/xterm -e ~/.my-sbcl > /dev/null 2>&1 &' 15:31:21 H4ns: i'll contact the author 15:33:09 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:33:13 flip214: That works, but I wanted to be able to specify that without setting up the lisp command manually 15:34:00 slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:34:13 I just want to run this under sbcl: http://distractionandnonsense.com/zombies/ 15:35:00 hitecnologys: your easiest bet is to call "stty raw" and then use read-char 15:36:41 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:37:08 arnsholt: the current version seems to auto-detect windows/osx/screen/tmux/X, so it should "just work" 15:37:44 so, how would one go about enhancing that zombies game with graphics? 15:38:13 -!- ``Erik_ is now known as ``Erik 15:38:14 maybe it'd be easier to do with a browser based UI, HTML5 / Ajax talking to a server? 15:38:32 dim: and then it would be easier to just write it in javascript entirely 15:39:17 good thinking 15:41:35 ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has joined #lisp 15:41:41 Greetings lispers 15:42:32 H4ns: I'm interested into doing 2D little games in Common Lisp as a way to teach programming, an example of what to achieve would be that swf example http://www.gamedesign.jp/flash/chatnoir/chatnoir.swf --- do you know of libs to help doing that? 15:42:38 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:43:18 maybe the most promissing things I've seen until now would be http://hop.inria.fr/, which is scheme based 15:43:19 dim: i think most people use sdl for that kind of stuff, but i have no experience myself (other than having failed to get sdl to run a few times) 15:43:36 too bad 15:43:39 dim: boo. hiss. 15:43:40 -!- slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:43:48 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:43:53 treyka [~treyka@77.109.79.78] has joined #lisp 15:44:03 blocky.io it is in CL then 15:44:16 -!- jack_rabbit [~kyle@c-98-212-128-247.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:44:36 or a browser based thing, can I have a CL implementation in javascript? :) 15:44:56 or a CL programmable webkit maybe, as in CCL on macosx 15:45:03 the question is "should", not "can" 15:46:06 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:46:37 that's a good question too yes 15:47:05 I want an easy to use platform to draw 2D games, it looks like HTML5 is that nowadays, and I want Common Lisp... 15:47:18 a cl that compiled to js would be cool. 15:47:21 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:47:25 dim: I started working on a really simple wrapper for lispbuilder-sdl that abstracts away the game loop, so all you have to do is implement a couple methods to write a game: https://github.com/deliciousrobots/platform 15:48:46 slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:49:36 steffi_s [~marioooh@x-132-204-243-254.xtpr.umontreal.ca] has joined #lisp 15:50:23 that looks nice :) 15:50:59 H4ns: thanks! There is a half-implemented breakout clone in src/example.lisp 15:51:00 H4ns: really? what's the point? Am I the only person who doesn't mind coding in javascript (certainly less so than debugging generated JS)? 15:51:16 -!- Guest97984 [~sam@74.113.160.197] has left #lisp 15:53:22 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:54:04 -!- ianmcorvidae|alt is now known as ianmcorvidae 15:56:48 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 15:57:09 -!- gko [~user@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:57:21 H4ns: "Couldn't execute "stty raw": No such file or directory." What's wrong? In terminal all is fine. 15:57:38 the command is "stty" and the argument is "raw" 15:57:50 daniel1 [~ANDRES1@201.209.38.229] has joined #lisp 15:58:00 Xach: aww. I'm idiot. =( 15:58:44 -!- slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:58:44 pkhuong: i'm not bothered by javascript either, but i can understand people who want to write lisp. 15:58:57 Lol, "Couldn't execute "stty": No such file or directory" 15:59:11 hitecnologys: you'll figure that one out 16:00:13 -!- daniel1 is now known as ANDRES1 16:01:00 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-57-229.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:01:03 howeyc [~howeyc@199.229.255.169] has joined #lisp 16:01:48 hitecnologys: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:paste.lisp.org/display/131166 16:02:21 -!- ArmyOfBruce [~textual@waywardmonkeys.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 16:02:24 -!- ``Erik [~erik@pool-108-3-186-191.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:02:24 -!- Alice3 [~Alice@cpc3-grim12-0-0-cust856.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:02:32 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:02:45 save for the typon in the name and some wrong parameters 16:02:52 ArmyOfBruce [~textual@waywardmonkeys.com] has joined #lisp 16:04:17 kennyd [~kennyd@93-139-107-120.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 16:05:07 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:05:08 -!- Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:05:18 stassats: omg, it works. Thanks a lot! 16:06:26 -!- paul0 [~user@189.115.62.98] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:06:33 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 16:06:56 hitecnologys: http://paste.lisp.org/display/132488 16:06:59 should be better 16:08:22 stassats: Thanks again, but I'll try this one tomorrow. I really want to sleep, I'm so tired. 16:08:40 Alice3 [~Alice@cpc3-grim12-0-0-cust856.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 16:09:14 Goodbye everyone. Have a nice day! 16:09:41 -!- hitecnologys [~hitecnolo@94.137.36.107] has quit [Quit: hitecnologys] 16:09:54 urandom__ [~user@p548A3AFE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:11:04 pkhuong: I don't think javascript is a suitable first programming language 16:11:19 jbaker191 [~joshua@ip-64-134-229-56.public.wayport.net] has joined #lisp 16:12:15 -!- jbaker191 [~joshua@ip-64-134-229-56.public.wayport.net] has left #lisp 16:12:23 booguie [~booguie@wsip-98-172-168-236.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:12:32 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:12:57 -!- paolo_m [~user@2-228-95-110.ip190.fastwebnet.it] has left #lisp 16:13:19 daniel1 [~ANDRES1@201.209.38.229] has joined #lisp 16:13:31 postfuturist: looks cool, I'll have to try it sometime later :) 16:13:42 -!- ANDRES1 [~ANDRES1@201.209.38.229] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:14:13 is lispworks any good 16:14:14 ? 16:14:22 cryptic: yes. it is any good. 16:14:40 H4ns: is it worth buying? 16:14:55 cryptic: that depends entirely on what you want to do. 16:15:51 learning lisp 16:16:04 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 16:16:44 cryptic: if you want to learn a lisp that allows you to create cross-platform gui applications, lispworks is for you 16:17:07 -!- treyka [~treyka@77.109.79.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:17:09 cryptic: you might want to use the personal edition, which costs nothing, to learn it and then decide whether you want to buy it. 16:17:35 treyka [~treyka@77.109.79.78] has joined #lisp 16:18:41 H4ns: I'm just not sure how ig of a deal the 64-bit edition is 16:19:14 cryptic: what do you mean, "big of a deal"? 16:20:37 I don't know if it enables you to develop 64-bit applications or if the lispworks application is designed to fully harness the power of a 64-bit architecture, irrespective of the target platform for which you're development 16:20:40 ``Erik [~erik@66-118-151-70.static.sagonet.net] has joined #lisp 16:20:48 developing* 16:20:57 cryptic: why don't you first learn lisp, then decide on the tools? 16:21:29 cryptic: "fully harness" the "power" is completely meaningless to me. 16:21:52 I'm just curious, that's all 16:21:55 I do sometimes kinda wonder where the market for commercial lisp comes from 16:22:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:22:09 my theory is that there's some incredibly profitable niche lisp apps out there somwhere that I've never heard of 16:22:11 for commercial software 16:22:36 software is rarely advertised by the language it's using 16:22:52 true 16:22:54 mstevens: that is entirely the case. many lisp users have been lisp users for a long time and are not part of the internet-based lisp community. 16:23:21 http://www.lispworks.com/success-stories/index.html 16:23:39 H4ns: I suppose I'm so used to internet based programming communities that it seems very weird that people are making lots of money with lisp, but I don't hear about it 16:23:58 http://www.franz.com/success/ 16:24:02 steffi_s_ [~marioooh@x-132-204-243-254.xtpr.umontreal.ca] has joined #lisp 16:24:16 H4ns: but, as I say, the continued existence of companies like lispworks suggests it does occur 16:24:27 mstevens: you also hear rarely about cobol, visual basic, delphi, yet they are big in commercial environments. 16:24:44 H4ns: I actually hear about people using those things commercially much more than lisp 16:24:48 -!- ferada [~ferada@dslb-088-068-135-193.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:25:14 mstevens: that is because so many people use these things that it is hard to not hear some of them :) - lisp is a niche market, after all. 16:25:45 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 16:26:31 I don't understand why lisp isn't taught sooner in computer science programs 16:26:45 I've only just started learning it, but it's by far the best language for artificial intelligence 16:26:47 -!- steffi_s [~marioooh@x-132-204-243-254.xtpr.umontreal.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:26:47 -!- steffi_s_ is now known as steffi_s 16:26:56 learn more 16:27:48 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-67-180-195-131.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:28:28 -!- daniel1 is now known as ANDRES1 16:29:04 sabalaba [~Adium@c-67-180-195-131.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:00 -!- chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:32:05 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:33:05 Is there any kerberos native/binding client? I couldn't find anything in cliki. 16:35:10 I don't think I remember anything like that. 16:35:24 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 16:35:41 chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:37:25 -!- treyka [~treyka@77.109.79.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:38:27 kushal [~kdas@114.143.164.150] has joined #lisp 16:38:27 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.164.150] has quit [Changing host] 16:38:27 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 16:38:30 zeissoctopus [~zeissocto@183178133120.ctinets.com] has joined #lisp 16:38:39 -!- findiggle [~kirkwood@50-194-56-154-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:38:59 -!- howeyc [~howeyc@199.229.255.169] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:39:15 howeyc [~howeyc@199.229.255.169] has joined #lisp 16:40:17 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 16:40:20 -!- bitonic [~user@146.169.24.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:41:15 -!- 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17:49:45 clop: what would you do with 1 or 0? 17:50:10 -!- nauar [~Grunt@113.Red-83-49-229.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [] 17:51:05 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 17:51:09 Depending on the range of x and y and the probability of each outcome, something like (1+ (ash (- (logxor x y)) (- (integer-length most-positive-fixnum)))) might be quicker. 17:52:07 ah yes, nice 17:52:29 but the simple IF will be faster on SBCL. 17:52:35 stassats, just whatever arithmetic things 17:53:18 clop: maybe you can do something directly without going through 1/0 17:53:21 bitonic [~user@027cae25.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 17:55:26 alama [~textual@stgt-5f702f28.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:56:42 ivan-kanis [~user@lns-c10k-ft-02-t2-89-83-137-164.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 17:57:16 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:57:39 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:59:38 killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has joined #lisp 18:00:01 -!- moore33 [~moore@ABordeaux-153-1-22-16.w92-149.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:00:22 i'm not necessarily trying to do anything in particular, it's just something that seems to come up from time to time when you're used to taking advantage of C-style expressions 18:00:38 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:02:02 clop: as opposed to lisp-style expressions? 18:02:08 slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:03:01 puchacz [~puchacz@46-65-36-47.zone16.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:04:41 Joreji_ [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 18:04:46 ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:06:42 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:15 -!- alama [~textual@stgt-5f702f28.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 18:10:18 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:11:12 i just mean, e.g., in C you can do something like (a == b) - 1 18:11:31 that's a good way to obfuscate code 18:12:43 obviously you'd only do this sort of thing when performance matters 18:12:49 yeah, better to (cons current-elt (not t)) (-: 18:12:56 clop: or when your compiler is dumb 18:13:18 -!- slyrus [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:13:59 moore33 [~moore@ABordeaux-153-1-5-197.w92-146.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 18:15:18 clop: in lisp you can do (if (= a b) 0 1). 18:16:55 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:17:15 right, but, at least in ccl that introduces a branch 18:19:03 clop: any comparisson will introduce a branch 18:19:09 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-68-174-154-238.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:19:26 clop: Have you identified this as a performance issue through profiling or are you just worrying about gnats-ass details for no good reason? 18:19:26 clop: not on SBCL. 18:19:43 i was merely curious 18:19:50 pkhuong: how's that possible? 18:20:03 such things are usually result in noise on modern CPUs 18:20:09 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:20:54 sbenitezb: conditional moves aren't branches. Otherwise, there are plenty of tricks to convert comparison into arithmetic and masks, like the expression I gave earlier. 18:21:29 sbenitezb: that's how binary search can perform fewer conditional branches than linear search. 18:21:30 pkhuong: thanks for the explanation 18:26:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:27:25 Yuuhi [benni@p5483AEB9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:29:55 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:30:03 -!- slyrus_ [~chatzilla@adsl-99-183-243-129.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:30:33 gridaphobe [~gridaphob@60-c5-47-7-a1-98.dynamic.ucsd.edu] has joined #lisp 18:31:13 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 18:33:09 antonv [5d7d31f9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.249] has joined #lisp 18:36:03 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:39:23 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:40:25 pnpuff [~aeiou@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has joined #lisp 18:41:43 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:42:18 danishman [~kvirc@62.243.156.218] has joined #lisp 18:42:57 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-67-180-195-131.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:43:40 kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has joined #lisp 18:43:50 -!- kliph [~user@unaffiliated/kliph] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:45:34 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:45:44 ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-78-211.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:46:38 -!- sbenitezb [~sbenitezb@186.136.23.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:48:53 -!- homie [~homie@xdsl-78-35-165-170.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:49:18 -!- sellout42 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:49:24 -!- wbooze [~wbooze@xdsl-78-35-165-170.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:49:39 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:50:10 sellout42 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:50:48 -!- sellout42 [~Adium@c-98-245-92-119.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has left #lisp 18:51:14 LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 18:52:12 ikki [~ikki@187.193.162.180] has joined #lisp 18:55:48 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:57:48 Forty-3 [~seana11@pool-71-191-38-245.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:57:56 -!- LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:59:13 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 18:59:16 ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.197] has joined #lisp 18:59:21 -!- punee [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:59:27 punee_ [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 19:00:33 -!- mrpat [~jackie@pool-108-52-83-154.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:03:43 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:05:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:07:42 -!- [SLB]` is now known as [SLB] 19:09:11 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:09:27 abeaumont [~abeaumont@213.Red-79-152-239.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 19:09:43 -!- punee_ [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:11:43 Fare [fare@nat/google/x-ngenlsiatkaseopt] has joined #lisp 19:12:02 I'm humbly requesting review of the following document: 19:12:08 http://google-styleguide.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/lispguide.xml 19:13:30 punee [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 19:13:34 -!- thedeadghost [~deadghost@71-84-68-72.dhcp.rvsd.ca.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:13:47 Fare: why does xcvb require a specific recent version of asdf? (can i answer questions like that by looking at commit logs or similar?) 19:14:22 Indent your code the way GNU Emacs does. <- might be too vague. I've seen too much CL with elisp-style indentation. 19:14:41 emacs+slime 19:15:13 hi 19:15:27 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:16:13 If you know the type of something, you should make it explicit in order to enable compile-time and run-time sanity-checking. <- explicit how? Declarations VS check-type do not have the same effect. 19:16:19 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 19:16:39 fare nice. do not use the word "grammar nazi" 19:17:08 Fare: the problem is that check-type won't be as nice for compile-time warnings. 19:17:38 lolprog [~let@94-225-44-126.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 19:17:46 Fare: http://www.cs.cmu.edu/Groups/AI/html/cltl/clm/node69.html has the rationale for the "P"/"-P" suffixing that I've always used. 19:18:13 -!- otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 19:18:20 what about grammar red khmers? 19:18:33 otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has joined #lisp 19:18:45 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:18:51 grammar herrings 19:18:53 stassats: a style guide is offensive enough in itself, there is no need to beef it up with stuff like that. 19:19:06 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@24.106.194.14] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:19:37 Fare: alexandria:define-constant is a bad workaround that doesn't fix the issue itself. It will mess things up in a system that exploits separate compilation. 19:21:24 -!- punee [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:21:35 Fare: EQL (e.g. in CASE) works just fine on arbitrary numbers. 19:21:43 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.211.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:23:36 Xach: I think that's because xcvb supports the :compile-check feature of asdf. 19:23:40 -!- jjkola [~jjkola@212-226-73-167-nat.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:23:41 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.155.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 19:24:07 Fare: already I heard someone saying you need a monument 19:24:21 or maybe it's just because it needed utilities that are now in asdf-utils anyway 19:24:27 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:24:33 I believe the latter, after some grepping around 19:24:37 so this can be reversed. 19:24:58 punee [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 19:25:23 Fare: i think that would be a good thing if feasible 19:25:37 -!- pnpuff [~aeiou@unaffiliated/pnpuff] has left #lisp 19:26:15 "It is possible to fake global lexical variables with a differently named global variable and a DEFINE-SYMBOL-MACRO. You should not use this trick." I'd rather see that, encapsulated in a library, than alexandria:define-constant. The former doesn't lie to the compiler. 19:26:43 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@193.136.27.164] has joined #lisp 19:27:40 -!- Fullmoon [~Fullmoon@h081217030118.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Quit: Fullmoon] 19:28:16 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:28:29 thedeadghost [~deadghost@71-84-68-72.dhcp.rvsd.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 19:29:19 pkhuong, what do you recommend instead of define-constant? 19:29:33 i recommend defparameter 19:30:24 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@24.106.194.14] has joined #lisp 19:30:33 Fare: defvar and +pluses+, or defvar and a symbol-macro (and a load-time-value if it's performance sensitive). 19:30:58 We have a few macros internal to QRes, that I'd like to publish, that do about the same as sbcl's DEFCONSTANT-EQX, which is somewhat similar to that. 19:31:18 hah, I remember those (: 19:31:27 Are you frowning upon them for the same reason? 19:31:41 nono, all good 19:31:53 I think alexandria has some that are similar 19:31:56 Fare: yes, I do. SBCL's case is different; hopefully, people who use them know what Python does to their code. 19:31:56 Fare: in "CLOS" ... "...and the initialization of Quake volatile slots..." do you mean to leak specific details of your project into the style guide? 19:32:02 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@24.106.194.14] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:32:46 Fade: probably not, though we don't consider quux or quake as trade secrets, just "stuff that we never took the time to clean up and publish". 19:32:57 *nod* 19:33:05 p_l: a monument? 19:33:09 Fare: the formatting of the code example in the end of the clos section is broken 19:33:21 rebornfisk [rebornfisk@93.102.141.36.rev.optimus.pt] has joined #lisp 19:33:30 -!- rebornfisk [rebornfisk@93.102.141.36.rev.optimus.pt] has quit [Client Quit] 19:34:17 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:34:18 Fare: yes. 19:34:44 I am also wondering what a monument is in this context. 19:35:18 Fade: statue of bronze alloy 19:35:36 *Fade* chuckles 19:35:54 no love for marble? 19:36:22 haha 19:36:40 Fare: I enjoyed your LIL paper. 19:37:07 *stassats* has a hard time reading logs when Fade and Fare are talking at the same time 19:37:24 :( 19:37:55 it's worse for me when I'm mistakenly asked about some Fare-involved abstruse thing. :) 19:38:35 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:38:55 honkfestival [~honkfesti@65.94.242.14] has joined #lisp 19:38:56 alas the set of four character asciibetical handles is a small one. 19:39:30 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@193.136.27.164] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:39:30 *Xach* is sad when he is confused for Xah and axch 19:39:59 being confused with Xah (lee) is most sad 19:40:23 I definitely get the better deal at lev distance 1 in that regard. 19:40:26 -!- mathrick__ is now known as mathrick 19:41:16 -!- KingsKnighted [~quassel@c-174-52-149-13.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:41:38 I think that the four or so paragraphs one after the other about 'no notional "protocol"' could do with a rewrite; at the moment, they're "only do this", "no wait, here's a concrete way of putting it", "no, wait, here's a better way of putting it", "here's some other refinement" 19:42:01 Fade: thanks! 19:42:37 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.99.177] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:44:41 the first paragraph under lists v. structures v. multiple values seems to argue against using alists for keys and values of different types. intentional? 19:45:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:45:33 p_l: I don't understand. What kind of monument? (If it's a joke, I'm slow) 19:45:56 I read the implication being 'for services to lisp at large'. 19:45:57 (feedback overload -- not a bad thing) 19:45:57 user123abc [~sally@c-67-171-79-251.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:46:31 NB: a lot of the document is actually stolen from a previous document private to ITA and edited by the late Dan Weinreb. 19:46:35 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 19:46:54 Xach: what version would you need? 19:47:10 is it OK to depend on 2.21, which has :encodings support? 19:48:10 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:48:19 Fare: The older the version, the more likely it will work for someone on an older implementation with whatever ASDF they happen to have. 19:48:22 -!- antonv [5d7d31f9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.125.49.249] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:48:26 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.155.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:48:40 do many people depend on xcvb? 19:48:43 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.155.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 19:49:25 Xach: since I'm not testing with old versions, and I know it breaks at some point, I'll keep it to some middle ground. 19:50:06 what's in quicklisp currently? 19:50:11 stassats, no one that I know 19:50:39 stassats, though there are many bits of code in xcvb that I use in various libraries, that others may depend on. 19:50:49 like inferior-shell depending on xcvb-driver 19:50:59 or lisp-interface-library depending on xcvb-utils 19:51:08 -!- ikki [~ikki@187.193.162.180] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:52:26 I think this document in general contains a lot of common sense that is only in common distribution to people who have been working with lisp for quite awhile. 19:53:25 mjs2600 [~mjs2600@24.106.194.14] has joined #lisp 19:54:07 -!- edgar-rft [~GOD@HSI-KBW-078-043-123-191.hsi4.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: mental blackout] 19:54:34 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:55:04 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@lns-c10k-ft-02-t2-89-83-137-164.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:56:04 -!- danishman [~kvirc@62.243.156.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:57:49 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:58:22 -!- honkfestival [~honkfesti@65.94.242.14] has quit [] 19:58:36 -!- Derk [no@unaffiliated/derk] has quit [] 19:58:38 Fare: it was in relation to the line about "Open Sourcing Code" 19:58:51 I linked the guide to few people, you see :) 19:59:49 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gatekeeper.brainalliance.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:00:54 Did you know that unsupplied optional arguments in deftype default to *, not NIL? 20:01:16 -!- gridaphobe [~gridaphob@60-c5-47-7-a1-98.dynamic.ucsd.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:01:26 that makes sense 20:01:31 I did not know that. 20:01:48 *Xach* will lisptip it 20:03:34 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:03:40 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-65-136.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:03:55 Xach: hi! release problems? 20:05:48 Xach: let me coin the idea of a lisptip for generating symbols correctly again 20:05:55 ehu: yes. lisp-unit was updated in a breaking way just before i wanted to release. 20:06:08 so maybe in the next couple days. though it's going to be a busy, busy weekend. 20:06:23 Xach: Again, sorry for that. Are you still having problems? 20:06:30 you would have an easier life if lisp were dead! 20:06:54 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:07:15 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:07:24 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.99.177] has joined #lisp 20:07:27 no problems 20:07:32 just lack of time 20:09:55 you could include text-ads during initial downloads for quickload, and a premium version without ads 20:10:02 and then support quicklisp full time 20:10:19 i have many generous supporters already 20:10:28 if i didn't have such a lavish lifestyle i could do quicklisp full time 20:11:08 i support you buy not using quicklisp and costing many cents of amazon fees! 20:11:12 mrpat [~jackie@pool-108-52-83-154.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:13:30 Fare: A question. Does an official style guide means increased acceptance of Lisp codebase at Google? :D 20:13:34 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:13:59 sabalaba [~Adium@c-67-180-195-131.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:14:53 Xach: can you backdate lisp-unit and release? (How do you handle other last-minute breakage?) 20:15:31 (surely lisp-unit isn't the first to break last-minute?) 20:15:45 VieiraN [~VieiraN@187.57.249.176] has joined #lisp 20:16:48 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:17:47 ehu: I could if I had better data and processes, but I don't. 20:17:54 last-minute breakage is fairly rare 20:17:55 ehu: lisp-unit wasn't broken, people were using it in a broken way. :-) 20:18:08 Krystof, yeah, I didn't like this part of the document. I didn't have the courage to rewrite it completely, though. 20:18:35 p_l: that's arguable. But not argued. 20:18:38 atsidi [~nkraft_@184.75.210.42] has joined #lisp 20:18:42 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:18:48 that's unexpected (to see little last minute breakage) 20:18:54 but encouraging! :-) 20:19:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:20:03 Fare: ... explain? 20:20:36 p_l: CL certainly isn't one the four official languages at Google preapproved for new projects. 20:20:55 and probably never will be one such official language. 20:21:04 heh 20:21:18 you just wait, the Great CL Revolution is coming! 20:21:34 -!- literal_ is now known as literal 20:21:43 Well, if everything works okay... I might have a certain 20% to work on making it easily integrate-able ;) 20:22:09 Are the 4 blessed languages listed online so that I may look them up. 20:22:10 ? 20:22:23 C++, Python, Java and Go? just a guess 20:22:30 ThomasH: C/C++, Python, Java, Javascript 20:22:40 dunno about proper place of Go 20:23:08 haven't talked about that one much, and my friends codebase is often C++, Python and JS 20:23:14 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:23:14 chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 20:23:44 but they work in Ads, so there's no time for FFI latency, and admin tools often get python+js 20:24:35 sams` [~sam@74.113.160.197] has joined #lisp 20:26:18 -!- angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.227.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:26:29 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:29:49 -!- VieiraN [~VieiraN@187.57.249.176] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:30:11 VieiraN [~VieiraN@187.57.249.176] has joined #lisp 20:33:47 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:34:54 -!- eldariof [~CLD@pppoe-217-100-dyn-sr.volgaline.ru] has quit [] 20:36:20 asedeno_work [asedeno@nat/google/x-fygsyqnrlfielvvi] has joined #lisp 20:36:22 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:36:50 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 20:38:15 -!- ace4016 [~ace4016@cpe-024-074-197-085.ec.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: When there's nothing left to burn you have to set yourself on fire.] 20:39:16 -!- _d3f [~d3f@46.183.216.234] has quit [Quit: _d3f] 20:39:29 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@114-36-242-228.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:39:39 -!- ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:41:04 s0ber [~s0ber@114-36-236-39.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 20:41:30 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:42:17 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 20:42:45 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:46:12 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:46:15 -!- sams` [~sam@74.113.160.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:48:07 hi 20:48:34 please, is it possible to intercept eof with a stream object? 20:48:57 clhs e-o-f 20:48:57 end-of-file: http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/e_end_of.htm 20:49:17 ace4016 [~ace4016@cpe-024-074-197-085.ec.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:51:33 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.204.174] has joined #lisp 20:52:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:52:14 -!- ehu [ehu@ip167-22-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:55:55 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 20:56:41 uselpa [~uselpa@83.99.17.62] has joined #lisp 20:58:07 stlifey [~stlifey@121.11.46.123] has joined #lisp 20:59:45 -!- stlifey [~stlifey@121.11.46.123] has quit [Client Quit] 21:00:13 stlifey [~stlifey@121.11.46.123] has joined #lisp 21:00:40 stassats: and how shall I use it? 21:01:19 by using your favorite condition-handling operator 21:01:47 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:01:49 -!- mrpat [~jackie@pool-108-52-83-154.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:02:52 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.99.177] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:03:02 and most stream-reading operators allow you to ignore end-of-file conditions 21:03:02 mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.243] has joined #lisp 21:03:34 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:05:07 for a struct { uin32_t a, union {} b} where sizeof(b) == 8, CFFI decides that the foreign type as a length of 12 if a is declared as :uint32_t, and 16 if it's a bitfield type 21:05:26 struct epoll_event is a good example 21:05:32 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:05:52 (the correct size is 12 btw) 21:06:25 so, why not report a bug? 21:06:46 stassats: I'm using with-open-file 21:06:54 and cl-csv:read-csv-row 21:07:02 -!- Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-014-070.wireless.sfu.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:07:03 Fare: Don't be so pessimistic! 21:07:07 because I just found it, it pretty late here and I'm gonna get some sleep. besides, someone could already know the problem and have a patch, who knows 21:07:23 I'm trying to quickly find out where the problem is in cffi 21:07:43 which is more productive than reporting the bug and staying with the problem until someone works on it ;) 21:07:51 galdor: did you specify the right underlying int type for the bitfield type? 21:08:36 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-163-75.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:08:53 How do I set the quicklisp directory? 21:09:00 the base-type argument is :int which is 4 bytes on Linux 64 bit 21:09:12 and what are the alignment requirements on b? 21:10:19 it has to be aligned on 8 bytes 21:10:46 -!- Fare [fare@nat/google/x-ngenlsiatkaseopt] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:10:55 how can the correct size be 12 bytes? 21:11:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:11:22 I'm asking myself the same thing 21:11:23 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.204.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:12:08 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:12:53 macrobat: http://www.quicklisp.org/beta/faq.html? 21:13:06 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:15:10 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:15:44 galdor: epoll_event is defined with __attribute__ ((__packed__)); 21:15:50 -!- lolprog [~let@94-225-44-126.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:15:50 otherwise it returns 16 21:16:02 stassats: done! tx 21:16:59 stassats: http://paste.lisp.org/display/132490 21:17:08 I'm obviously forgetting something here, but since the union has to be aligned on 8 bytes, how is it possible to pack, since the first member is only 4 bytes ? 21:17:46 galdor: packed structs don't follow the ABI. You may have to define accessors in terms of raw pointer access yourself. 21:18:10 oh ok 21:18:24 stassats: gigamonkey book was more clear 21:18:52 thank you for explaining 21:19:27 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:19:37 Posterdati: http://paste.lisp.org/display/132490#1 21:20:05 and :direction :input is redundant 21:20:31 -!- stat_vi_ [~stat@dslb-094-218-027-003.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:20:34 stassats: ah, I was wondering if handler-case has got a no error case 21:20:39 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:20:40 stassats: better 21:20:44 stassats: tx 21:20:55 you could read handler-case and not wonder 21:20:57 stassats: Lisp is every day more amazing 21:20:59 clhs handler-case 21:20:59 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/m_hand_1.htm 21:21:43 stassats: I was able to comand a pic micro via usb using a Lisp program, amazing! 21:22:12 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:22:18 stassats: a program to send command a receive answers/data from a pic18f2455 21:22:29 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@217.17.38.43] has quit [Quit: good (!) night] 21:22:31 doesn't sound that amazing, to be honest 21:22:46 well I don't have to do anything tricky, apparently CFFI's groveller detects packed structs and does the right thing 21:22:51 good news, so :) 21:22:56 stassats: the amazing thing is that a c/c++ program is longer 21:23:36 -!- atsidi [~nkraft_@184.75.210.42] has quit [Quit: Leaving, leaving, gone...] 21:25:01 Posterdati: I'm working on example of programming µC in Lisp, actually 21:25:01 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:25:28 well, more of example how to get started building the tools needed 21:25:40 p_l: would be fine to have something like arduino for Lisp... 21:26:04 p_l: using emacs as ide 21:26:19 Posterdati: well, it wouldn't run a proper lisp (except for the bigger ones, I guess) but CL would be used to generate the code 21:26:34 p_l: yes a subset 21:26:45 (the big difference with ancient machines is that they could use external devices for GC) 21:26:53 -!- gmdjm1959 [~gmdjm1959@ip70-185-115-2.ga.at.cox.net] has left #lisp 21:27:20 gridaphobe [~gridaphob@60-c5-47-7-a1-98.dynamic.ucsd.edu] has joined #lisp 21:28:29 p_l: also, people were patient 21:28:39 sytse: true 21:29:15 Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has joined #lisp 21:29:17 but I suspect magtape with same capacity as main store was cheap 21:30:24 not all garbage collection schemes require double memory space 21:30:25 sure, probably just 1000 2012 USD or something like that per tape 21:30:29 dirt cheap 21:31:35 well.. probably much less actually, those tapes did tend to have a tough time when being used for sorting 21:31:52 -!- bitonic [~user@027cae25.bb.sky.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:31:58 so I guess people having to replace tapes every two weeks wouldn't like paying $1000 21:32:18 bitonic [~user@027cae25.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 21:32:25 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:32:36 -!- uselpa [~uselpa@83.99.17.62] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:34:18 -!- Nisstyre-laptop [~yours@oftn/member/Nisstyre] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:35:14 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:35:35 stassats: the thing is, it was probably easier to do, especially on that hw 21:35:50 sytse: I don't think they would cost that much 21:35:55 but I'll check 21:36:23 check? why do you even care about such things?! 21:36:39 stassats: curiosity 21:37:15 well, that's a kind of pointless curiosity 21:37:50 that's why you still haven't got your project ready, whatever it is! 21:38:20 -!- Alice3 [~Alice@cpc3-grim12-0-0-cust856.12-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 21:39:21 hehe 21:39:45 I blame my reading OCD 21:39:54 -!- chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:40:18 surely, you mean ADD 21:40:26 p_l: I almost checked myself out of the same curiosity.. 21:40:29 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:40:59 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-173-067.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 21:41:02 stassats: wikipedia disease 21:41:02 stassats: no, OCD 21:41:12 as in obsessive reading 21:41:13 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:41:21 And internet provides untold amounts of reading material 21:41:22 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:41:36 no, ADD as in lack of attention to the relevant task 21:41:57 yes, that's different stassats 21:42:12 p_l: I find it impossible to not follow links pasted on IRC.. 21:42:22 goatse? 21:42:30 sure, hit me 21:42:32 ;) 21:42:44 well, you can follow it yourself 21:43:00 no I can't, because I'm lazy and you didn't paste a link 21:43:28 p_l: I guess stassats has ADD, he can't read a single sentence fully ;-) 21:43:43 -!- mtd [~martin@chop.xades.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:44:42 -!- gridaphobe [~gridaphob@60-c5-47-7-a1-98.dynamic.ucsd.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:45:43 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:46:58 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:47:53 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 21:50:27 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl6-62-78.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 21:50:34 -!- mjs2600 [~mjs2600@24.106.194.14] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:51:54 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:52:44 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-181.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:53:35 -!- doomlord [~ceti331@host81-157-102-115.range81-157.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:54:11 chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 21:55:12 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 21:57:03 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:59:16 -!- nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-73-171.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:59:57 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 22:00:25 -!- add^_ [~add^_@m212-152-1-150.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: add^_] 22:00:45 -!- thedeadghost [~deadghost@71-84-68-72.dhcp.rvsd.ca.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:00:53 nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-73-171.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 22:02:26 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:05:27 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:09:50 -!- punee [~punee@213-245-106-105.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Quit: punee] 22:12:54 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:14:15 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl6-62-78.dsl.telepac.pt] has left #lisp 22:14:41 If I'm using (loop for val being each hash-value in ...) and the hash-value is a list, am I getting a copy of the list or the list? 22:14:54 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:14:59 Rather, is val a copy or the list. 22:15:06 jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl6-62-78.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 22:15:30 ThomasH: lisp doesn't do magic copies, except when it doesn't matter (numbers and characters). 22:15:53 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:16:44 -!- sabalaba [~Adium@c-67-180-195-131.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:17:24 pkhuong: Thanks. By luck, I had a loop that appeared to copy-list, because an analogous loop with val = (gethash key ...) coupled with nconc took down my image. 22:18:06 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 22:21:41 alama [~jessealam@stgt-5f702f28.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 22:21:52 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:22:07 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:22:12 -!- Daisy [~Daisy@95.209.59.224.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:22:54 Daisy [~Daisy@95.209.85.155.bredband.tre.se] has joined #lisp 22:25:20 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:25:26 -!- ltbarcly [~ltbarcly@pool-71-116-78-211.snfcca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:27:21 -!- Swampert is now known as Swampert` 22:28:34 -!- ferada [~ferada@dslb-088-069-032-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:31:17 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:31:20 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@178.138.97.243] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:32:59 -!- Posterdati [~quassel@host45-237-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:34:46 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:35:56 Posterdati [~quassel@host45-237-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 22:39:53 -!- chturne [~chturne@78-105-198-180.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:40:08 -!- rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:40:55 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:42:19 mjonsson [~mjonsson@38.109.95.133] has joined #lisp 22:44:12 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:45:02 superflit_ [~superflit@63-225-247-161.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:45:58 -!- superflit [~superflit@216-160-139-119.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:45:58 -!- superflit_ is now known as superflit 22:49:07 mrpat [~jackie@pool-108-52-83-154.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:50:29 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:50:30 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-094-218-037-195.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: humhum] 22:53:28 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 22:56:27 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:58:02 Tristam [~Tristam@bodhilinux/team/Tristam] has joined #lisp 23:00:39 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:01:19 -!- bitonic [~user@027cae25.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:03:34 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:03:51 thedeadghost [~deadghost@71-84-68-72.dhcp.rvsd.ca.charter.com] has joined #lisp 23:07:06 -!- Vivitron [~Vivitron@pool-98-110-213-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: trivial-irc-0.0.3] 23:09:18 dnolen [~user@pool-108-46-109-61.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:09:37 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:11:01 pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has joined #lisp 23:13:57 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:14:25 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:15:58 -!- Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:16:00 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75d623.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:16:29 Mon_Ouie [~Mon_Ouie@subtle/user/MonOuie] has joined #lisp 23:16:57 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 23:20:06 -!- alama [~jessealam@stgt-5f702f28.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 23:20:12 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:22:48 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@119.201.52.168] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:23:20 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:24:18 -!- rvchangue [~rvchangue@unaffiliated/rvchangue] has quit [Quit: ] 23:25:33 -!- pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:26:24 peterhil [~peterhil@91-157-48-10.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 23:29:38 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:32:56 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:34:07 -!- Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-173-067.wireless.sfu.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:36:39 -!- user123abc [~sally@c-67-171-79-251.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:36:56 -!- getoffmalawn [~getoffmal@CPE-124-191-133-14.wzyy1.woo.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:37:41 sytse: the cost was $200~$300 for 9-track reel media kit (though by bit later standards - we are talking PDPs and such), but it was minuscule cost compared to the rest 23:39:40 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:40:27 pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has joined #lisp 23:43:11 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:46:13 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-250-33.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 23:47:17 -!- Daisy [~Daisy@95.209.85.155.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:47:47 marcux [~marco@177.32.185.235] has joined #lisp 23:48:23 -!- marcux [~marco@177.32.185.235] has left #lisp 23:48:46 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:50:08 Daisy [~Daisy@95.209.85.155.bredband.tre.se] has joined #lisp 23:51:47 -!- pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:52:08 pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has joined #lisp 23:52:19 lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 23:54:03 pirateking-_- [~piratekin@unaffiliated/pirateking---/x-2885143] has joined #lisp 23:56:28 -!- pspace [~andrew@17.244.168.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:56:46 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-093-147.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 23:59:26 -!- lggr [~lggr@84-73-159-126.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]